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2023-11-29 Maricopa County, AZ YouTube / Creighton School District transcript source: youtube Governing Board Advisory Council-11-28-2023 · passage 1

oh testing one two three okay um I don't know if there's an a oh wait sorry am I able to start oh okay cool all right uh so um bringing the meeting to order and uh the first agenda item is the uh uh well I called the order and welcome the uh second order of business is to appoint a chair and possible Vice chair for uh the uh position of the U committee chair nominations for chair and or vice chair um I guess we is we do them separately right so we can go and start with uh nominations for chair Adriana is looking away don't call on me don't call yeah like I said I'm happy to nominate myself if can I do that and I'd also be interested in being chair [Music] great any other nominations competition uh okay so um I guess we uh go and vote said yeah isn't typically like the first nominee a motion second oh sorry oh gotcha got it so I nominate myself if there's a second oh no no no you go that's what I was confused too he moved he moved uh to appoint himself as chair nomin well he need a second I would need a second someone else on the committe second then okay I second thank you okay then we go vote on the nomination oh okay well if I guess if that doesn't pass then that's a hold in a show right what happens is the curse nomination oh nin oh okay sorry you have a first and a second you vote if it passes it's done if it doesn't pass then you move on to the second nominator first if they get a second then you vote it's weird it's kind of semi Robert okay um so uh nomination and seconded now we go for a vote so we go for a vote to V vote for oh say yes yes me or me I vote for myself I guess that's kind of weird I'll abstain yeah okay so motion passes okay so now we do have to go to the vice chair vote because we now have a vacant Vice chair SCH Okay so nominations for a vice chair what what every you nominate who everyone nominate we'll go I'm happy to help but I also we first Alan you go first what would you like to [Music] say uh I'll no I'd like to nominate myself Vice chair okay is there a second I can second okay we have a second and uh uh so now we move to the vote and then we go and do the roll call yes yes I vote Yes yes yes okay motion passes so we have uh a chair and a vice chair okay so now we move on to the next item of business which is the approval of agenda um give you a second to kind of look through that and see if it is in align it looks kind of similar to what we've been doing up to this point anyway so when you are ready if I could get a uh motion to approve the agenda I motion that we approve the agenda as is okay second second all those in favor yes motion passes moving on to the next one which is call to the audience do we have any calls to the audience okay all right uh moving on to the next one which is the discussion on the policies that are listed there and finalized procedure in reviewing policies um if I remember correctly we were already at a place where we were ready to kind of dig in um and go over the policies unless somebody has a different idea of that yep so um I don't do we have a a I thought if I remember correctly I thought the procedure that Brian had set up was like a Google doc and that we kind of look through it is yeah so we have the we have the Google Doc that we went through and we highlighted in pink the things that we were open or able to kind of finesse and then there were a few things that were highlighted that we thought we might merge um I have a suggestion doesn't have to be this way but I did go through and these are my own personal edits um Adam was ill and so we did not I I didn't get any of his information um and so it would be just mine but can show you what my proposed edits were and my thinking and you guys could work off of that unless somebody else has already done the same thing and then I'm happy to defer are we we good with that okay so let me do she share that with us or do I yeah do I share it with every okay you can can share I don't know if it'll get out to our streaming viewers but hopefully they can see it and is this specifically jic or is it yeah I thought well I yes but I did know we were going to go over ji so I put thoughts for that but who knows how far we get so um it's helpful and then if I could share with the team um I had a task that I was unable to complete because I was going to check with the attorney in between leavings unfortunately our attorney left town early for Thanksgiving and so the holiday I wasur but um I have Ming to connect um sorry really quick I just realized I should check and make sure be okay um so from last I saw let me share it with you guys you can see it on your own screen I forgot your last name Brin there you go that would have been easy um and then you have one for us too yeah or do you want to just look off the screen well these are just my random edits but that you could see them kind of up close um it's a whatever the thing is right I don't even know the formatting for our email what is it again it's I think it's our first name or it's our first initial and your last so yeah it's K Gibson kg M sorry I just saw you have to if you're G to Ty you have to do the whole email address let me give it to hild oh I see okay so oh there we go thank you very long yeah at least it's not cther gibon um all right so I can talk you through some of it we have this first um per this first pink was um basically about the kids would have to um listen to all rules that anybody tells them to do um and we do it a little bit differently on our campus um and so I edit it with two things basically I kept the first part and I just said students are expected to comply with any rules and expectations established by the superintendent and the governing board we also expect students to comply to appropriate requests that was kind of the addin given by any member of The Faculty or staff relating to school activities this caveat is to explain the appropriate however all students deserve the right to advocate for their needs and protect themselves from harm consequently no child is expected to comply to a request if it entails one or more of the following circumstances this is just what we tell our kids so I I could be off but one if it would cause harm to their individual person if the request would cause harm to others or if the request does in direct violation of a known rule established for this school so that that's kind of what we tell them like they wanted you to give your name like they didn't ask you to do anything that was going to be unsafe so that's kind of the process that we've shared with kids so I thought that would kind of help because I do take a bit of friction with the idea of obey any given order because kids should know there are limitations to what could be asked of you so that be I guess my first let's talk what do you guys think I like that and then question for y'all are we gonna do you want a word Smith today or do you want a Content Smith it showing my sorry is it showing my picture when you like hover it didn't Hilda I shared it with you too could you I bet yeah it's not showing up for me no it only gives me a little K for you it's probably because I've never sent you something though because I feel like you get into their address book but I sent it to you hild it's Google well I'm in like the shared with me and all I have is the one from Brian maybe it's taking a minute sorry y'all go ahead I like it I think that that's well at Mackin I think that we like that's what we that's what we say even if it's not like written down like word for word or whatever yeah I think it makes the most sense because expected to obey all rules is like a very weird state me so I think that it edits it in a way that makes sense and I think it's like I think a student would approve this yeah I think if a student heard like obey all rules like what then this is like oh okay makes sense you everything is your writing is uh purple right yeah I I tried to keep it there I did some I started doing some weird stuff because it was my own notes at first so there's like some things I struck out because I tried to conclude it with something else but you'll see as we go but yeah all of that that he just highlighted is what I wrote in there so all the the light blue text is actually was that blue oh it's supposed to be purple well there because there's this magenta pink highlighted part yeah that magenta pink is what last time we were told we could work with that was part that we were right so without anything else having think that will eventually maybe impact some of the wording here I like what you have here um before we go further than that yeah um I had couple of thoughts related to the first paragraph um so um sorry Alan just before you start talking sure do you have any reason why we would need to like color code which member wrote what in here because I'll start typing in his notes but I just want to make sure like I'll give him orange if it needs to be his idea or can it just be like an idea from all of us in the edits do you know I think from okay yeah because ultimately we're making a group recommendation so I'm G to keep it this C go ahead so um so um starting from the not from your your paragraph the the opening paragraph So the opening sentence of the superintendent will establish regulations governing the conduct of students um I would put a per so my suggestion is put a period the at the end of that first line where says students and then start off the next sentence with the phrase such regulations will primarily focus on behaviors expected of students while in school traveling to so that it's about a positive expectation and not because we a lot of what we've got is they won't do this and they can't do this and they're not allowed to do this and they won't do this and and really kind of make that positive framing do you me to re I got as far as such regulations will primarily focus on behaviors expected of students while Ed while students okay while they well not the not the they take the they out so while and then the rest of the line goes in school traveling so the rest of that stuff okay I like that that makes sense because that is I think one of the like charges is to make this more positive to them and then my other thing is actually in the magenta magenta piece um and that the word obey is a really heavy strong-handed word in my opinion and I and I mean I thought maybe a word like follows or something like that that that still communicates that we expect them to do what we expect them to do but it's not this we're the domineering adults or District I I had put comply because I was like trying to be intense but do you guys want follow instead I'm okay with comply too I just really the word obey and it comes up in these in these policies a bunch yeah we should make like a little master glossery of like what we already intend to do like if we're going to say for every obey it this I'm gonna just put at the bosom bosom bottom so instead of obey we're thinking you pick comply or umf follow because I have no skin in that game I like how comply sounds but I think a student would probably like follow so I don't know if we're like I don't know which we would want to gear towards is there any legal ramifications between the two I don't think so and and when I think of the work I think that where probably why I didn't I didn't land with comply is because it still implies this is a top- down adult like as opposed to we're helping them to build this who they will become as adults where they are supposed to be following rules and following expectations and things like that but okay okay I'm gonna put I'm gonna put follow because if it is supposed to I know it's governing board but we want it to kind of match the kids and don't get too I mean Katie has great Insight but don't get too twisted up I'm being 100% certain that is correct because we will have the we will have an attorney yeah who specializes in school offer you all before we're done with this process we wouldn't leave you twisted um oh no I didn't even uh I didn't change anything with the next paragraph a student shall Define I just added um that they additionally students are expected to follow rules and regulations if there's evidence reasonable and or consistent attempts to provide the information about the rules and regulations prior to the violation which is a mouthful but what I'm trying to get at is if you scroll down to uh I oh my gosh I was like is that an L or an i it's been a long day if you scroll down to I there's the purple one we could change and it basically was like the alleged violator has reasonable opportunity to become aware of the rules and when Adam and I sat down and talked about it it was really hard for him to get that what I was saying was like if we told you the rule you got to follow it um and so I trying to take that out but add it in like if it was in our handbook or if we did the behavior presentation to your class that was enough for you to know that it was a rule you should have so that's what I was attempting to do here but as I read it to you it doesn't sound great so that's what the goal is here so I guess first thing does that make sense to put it there or do you guys think it should still be an i and then how do we say this for it to make sense for kids is the eye what you added no the eye was there so that that language was there to begin with and and and he got it once I was like okay alleged violator you reasonable opportunity gave him opportun what those would be but something I had written as an addition to I we're talking about I um was to add to that determination of a reasonable opportunity will take into account the developmental levels of the students including the impact of any disabilities okay okay do me a favor I can paste I can copy and paste I didn't but I wanted to read out loud if everybody cool that's something everybody is like okay that kind of makes sense to add there could you read it again please sure determination of a reasonable opportunity will take into account the developmental levels of the students including the impact of any disabilities and that's in place of I or addition to add to add to the end of I I appreciate it I'll copy and paste it in there so you can read it as a whole I appreciate it being added and I am ultimately indifferent but I wonder if it it just felt odd that it was like it felt like it was context for kids and yet it's being presented as like an aside to that do you know do you know what I mean like technically that is true for a through D if I told you it was a rule already you should follow it when it comes to conduct so that's why I feel like it needed to be pulled out to be more of an umbrella statement thank you ktie I have to admit as I read I it's difficult for me to follow which I actually I will say though I definitely want us to keep this because personal experience as an AP sometimes the only way that kids would be really like open to hearing like no you broke a rule is I would be like I'm just going to pull out the dress code like read it to yourself and you remember when I did this and you remember when your teacher told you this and so they do push back I didn't know I didn't you didn't tell me that and so I feel like it needs to be like well here is what here's where we could say we told you these things does that make sense so I definitely would like us to keep it but it was very confusing for Adam I well I believe that it's also like counterintuitive because in society we talk about ignorance of the law does not excuse you from being held accountable when you violate the law and this statement actually is saying ignorance of the rules and expectations does in some way mitigate um oh was that what it say I was thinking it was in alignment with that no that's not I don't okay I'm not reading it that way so Pro proof that an alleged violator has a reasonable opportunity to become aware of such rules and regulations shall be sufficient proof that the violation was done knowingly so if you don't you like if I walk into a town I've never been into and I violate a law I can be held accountable to that law this as in the school as a student you need to show where I would have had access to learn about this rule before you can hold me accountable to it oh I'm reading it different because it's if it says alleged violator has a reasonable opportunity to become aware I thought poor Adam go fix this with him but um like if I can show that you were aware of the rules that's enough proof that you knowingly broke the rule how I'm reading it that's correct but the but the law outside in the real world is okay I don't I've never even heard the law I don't even know such a law exist I see what you're saying I'm so sorry yeah yeah I think you're reading it correctly but that's why I felt it was important to then add this this other sentence that again is thoughtful too and I thoughtful too and it's aligned to our practices like we like if a plus there's special education issues related to all this but um as well so um just yeah so then that kind of it brings us to like a different question do we want this to match like said law and take it out which I I feel like maybe it should match things better or keep it because we know that kids these are things that kids ask and push back when well this is more protective than the real world so I would say keep it if we can keep it but reward it that's more easily understood I say I would recommend that okay is it am I interpreting this correctly like it says a reasonable opportunity to become aware does that mean like if I don't so confusing the way I see that is we gave this presentation to your class whether you were there or not is irrelevant the presentation to your class was there where we went over these rules so that's sufficient proof that the violation was done knowingly I say if you were there but you weren't paying attention yeah it's probably what it means like you were there but if you weren't paying attention and you're saying you didn't pay attention then that's not enough or like when I talk with kids about it which or I didn't hear yeah or like I'm like no my dude it's on the wall like you can't do it because it's this or it's like it was on the dress code form you got the first time that I didn't see it I'm like doesn't count man it was here and it was here so that's yeah is that am I is that the way I thought so yeah you can't I think that's just written that way because you can't like prove what's in someone's brain obviously so so is this saying that a kid could use that as an excuse and say I wasn't listening or I didn't see the opposite if they were in the room and this presentation was being given about the rules then that's a reasonable opportunity that they had to become aware of the rules and there's proof that that happened they were there on that date so they should have known but if the rule was never shared like let's say was a rule that was never rolled out for students to be aware of but then it was heavily enforced then that would be problematic because the students could say it's not in this handbook you gave me I sat through and paid attention to the presentation it wasn't there it's not on the wall anywhere how was I supposed to so maybe if I there's got to be a better way to say that additionally if there is evidence of reasonable and or consistent attempts to provide information about the rules or regulations prior to a violation students are expected to to follow them look at the bottom start with start with what I attempted it's mouthful and it's probably even still confusing there's got to be a better way to say that I feel like it's like like where you okay so I don't want us to confuse this so so they're trying the second sentence on I is giving you the level or the burden of proof for the word knowingly so knowingly committing a violation of District rules and then they're telling you this is what would be enough to prove that it was done knowingly so I'm not sure that this the thing you have down below communicates that in the same way or like communicates the same idea okay so do we want to go sentence let's skip knowingly committing a violation because I think this is where we're getting confused here so proof my int my my sentence then tries to Define give some parameters to reasonable opportunity okay so let's just start with this phrase proof that an alleged violator has a reasonable opportunity to become aware is there a way we could simplify that you could change okay so instead of having it like I forget which is your choice but you could basically just say like have a subsection or something that's like the def like our definition of knowingly rather than just having that weird sentence right there knowing def yeah oh okay I see you know what I mean instead of doing this a bunch of times so like in the actual criminal code knowingly This Is Not Great itself but maybe it'll give you some other better idea knowingly means with respect to conduct uh to conduct or to circumstance described by a statute defining an offense a person is aware or believes that the person's conduct is of the nature of that nature or that circumstance exists it does not require any knowledge of the unlawfulness of the act or Omission so it's a little so that's why I'm saying this knowingly definition in here is a little bit differently than like the law okay [Music] so knowingly committing so I think it's hard would we just put like an aster like knowingly Aster and then at the bottom it would be like knowingly is defined as provided a reasonable opportunity become aware yeah okay so it's right now it says proof that be sufficient proof it's like they being redundant so I mean sounds way too leg but I was going to be like upon a showing that the alleged Violator has reasonable opportunity knowing something something upon a showing that an alleged violator has a reasonable opportunity to come award such rules and regulations shall be sufficient Pro I don't know man you say something like proof that the violation was done knowing shall consist of ver verifying the reasonable opportunity to become aware of such rules occurred or that a student had the opportunity to come knowingly shall consist yeah I don't Ty that fast um okay so my only thing with what you were saying because as I was thinking about it is if we say shall consist I feel like it creates like a it would be a really additional step you have to show like it'd be like they were you'd have to remember show every time that they got that opportunity yeah so proof of violation was done knly put May consist May consist oh what maybe not consist but like May be established there we go by don't have any any of you English teachers providing oh it's still okay so now I have proof that the violation was done knowingly may be established by providing evidence of reasonable opportunity to become aware of the rules a violation was done knowingly may be established by providing evidence of okay now so the use the word may implies that there are other ways of doing it yeah or like so can well I just wanted to point out the wording there yeah I mean this I think the way it's worded now still allows for other ways to show that knowingly is proven well except the current wording uses the word shall which is an absolute well it's it's saying shall be sufficient that enough is sufficient to prove but that doesn't mean that there aren't other ways to still prove oh fair enough you know what I'm saying yep okay so then keep in mind KN doesn't apply knowing appes to violation yeah yeah okay and then so however this spe this specific violation is a violation of any rule or regulation which is everything very yeah which is why which is why I think it's important that we be thoughtful about this one yeah which is why I was wondering do we put it outside of the bulletin numbers because it pertains to every bullet and we have it keep in mind it's differentiated from J so when you look at J J is the one like described you're right okay so in J it's engaging in any conduct basically constituting a breach of any federal state or city law or dly adopted policy of got it most most of the infractions typically to policy or statute or statute by way of Bo policy okay that okay that makes sense so let's if we're good maybe we we roll back up to the top and then because we're gonna end up doing a second read anyways does this feel okay for what we were trying to get at Yes No Maybe So okay I think so so then sorry I I diverted us so now we're back at the now it's the combining of a b c and d and e was possible I felt like a should stay there because it was like it identified like interfering with teaching interfering with administrative or disciplinary functions which was separate and so then I combined B and C which is why C's crossed out and I just said threatening an educational institution by interference with or disruption of the school including but not limited to physical about I don't know why the about say abuse abuse thank you um or threat of harm to other individuals or property I think that's good and then we didn't have c in there um E and F I did feel like they were kind of different because one e seems like it's about trespassing and D was about like if it's the if it's the teacher's car and you break the window you're still in trouble so I I thought we should just keep those in there thoughts about combining or removing D or E I think that they probably they feel like they should be separate okay yeah I like combining B and C and then d and e being separate okay James you good okay yeah um I didn't even touch the legal Contraband because illegal Contraband I was like this is confusing to me so that is still open for discussion if we want to address the pink so there's already another subsection right that's going to deal with weapons the only other thing that would be like I'm like just so the only things I can think of here are drug paraphernalia or tobacco paraphernalia or I know what we obscene materials those are literally the only things I can think of so it would be obscene materials but now I'm wondering is this like we don't let kids bring um like confetti eggs and that's not illegal oh because it's not okay yeah yeah it has to be illegal for the kid to possess it right or for the um or for whoever to do this to possess distribute or sell these things anybody so obscene material is basically the only thing missing from what you're saying I think that yeah and drug paraphernalia but dep pend I mean OBC materials well I guess what I'm saying is there's probably things that a kid can't possess that an adult can possess there's obviously certain under the Constitutional definition things adult also can't possess but I was thinking like what are things that are illegal for kids to have yeah um well like we example so and that's all listed here so is it possible that this phrase was developed as a sort of a catchall in case new new things become that's true well the the other thing and I know you mentioned weapons already yeah things like explosive devices some might not be considered a we with fireworks might true I know that are obiously regulated now but there are some that are restrict no that's true maybe it's as simple as just removing illegal into saying other Contraband on District property yeah that's true um I think the only thing we have to think of then is like or even with the IL legal either way you just have to think of who is going to you know 20 years from now I'm not saying anyone's going to come here with bad intentions but like somebody who's going to apply this in like the weirdest most strict way ever we have to think of that person and hope that that's not going to happen even and we're the best way we can to avoid whatever that weird person might do right yeah so like having the a word like Contraband is weird because there's not like a definition for Contraband in the criminal code and so it's like what does that mean and I think that's super subjective so if we just took out a legal that'd be weird but also even with a legal Contraband it still I think feels weird just because the word Contraband isn't easily defined I would see that as like you know I don't know I'm not even sure actually now that I think about it I was thinking like something that's that is not illegal but not something that we want to see on campus and so could it it fidget Spinners to be Contraband well I have two thoughts could we comma in drug paraphernalia and obscene materials because those are both things that I think definitely should be here yeah and then oh I lost it instead of putting could we just put or other items that could impact the safety of others yeah I think so or the safety or uh what's the the part interfere with teaching or the process or functions or maybe that's too much yeah like go back to that thing as well that could yeah or impact or interfere or disrupt with the school the operations of the school yeah it might did did we talk about having like a glossery for this because an another thing to point out like even under the law and this is just for an education thing but like if you've ever been to like a store around here for example there is a drive-thru liquor store at the end of my street on 32nd Street in Yale you might have seen it many times across the street from Perry Park if you walk in there at the front where you buy whatever there is a display and there are what would appear to be meth pipes foils paper or plastic straws everything you would need for your drug using needs right why can they sell it like that because it's not being sold with drugs and the law says that those things on their own do not constitute drug paraphernalia because there is no drugs with them right and so I just want to put that out there that like if a kid has any one of those items but doesn't have drugs like technically under the law you can't say that it's drug parap Familia and and that's why you also often see signage that says forb only yeah yeah so I'm just putting that out there because I could see a kid getting a hold of any of those things especially because they're so readily available but then I would hate for them to be like punished in the same way I mean That's a classic felony in Arizona to possess strug parap so is that an argument to keep the word no I think it would just be an argument to make sure that people are aware what is drug paraphenalia what legally constitutes it you know is there a difference between a kid who has like glass pipe or a glass pipe with burnt residue in it those are two different things right yes um I just put for glass year terms do we hopefully we'll remember what I'm trying to say do we need to discuss how an item could be connected to drug paraphernalia so that way we could come especially you know like a younger kid who just has something they found or you know what I mean who knows my question I guess my question with as now that we're starting to create a glossery the question I guess my question is what are we add there are we defining it in a way that if the Law changes the definition do we then have to come back into I don't want to have to come back into policy to you could just you could say as defined in um CH in Chapter 13 of the Arizona statutes you could just put that because it's never the criminal code is never going to change numbers so there's that yeah definition yeah I think that's smart because one of the other challenges that we'll have is we will so in the past the Arizona School boards Association policy is what we've adopted and so the way that that policy would be updated if the law changed is they would send out a notification policy needs to change once we step into the territory of having a custom policy then it'll be incumbent upon us to keep track up the legal changes and make sure that they're adopted into policy and so by virtue of that and we have some mechanisms for doing that but what would make that cleanest and least likely to run sideways would be what this year if we're broader in our reference to Statue then it'll Ed against becoming yeah because even if you put 13341 like you might run astray if that gets like eliminated and then they create a new thing so you could just say in Chapter 13 title okay title 13 doesn't necessarily address the other items that interfere with the safety or operations so we'll have to figure out the word smithing on where where that language actually okay um we'll remember because I although title 13 does have a definition of what it means to disrupt or interfere with those things so um and then it's always held accountable to like what a reasonable person would interpret so if it were to be contested and end up in court then it would be decided in the courtroom and it's come out different over the years depending on different sets of circumstan okay uh for G hold on I'm confused what I oh we we just had conversation about how is commonly accepted standards and no redeeming value so I thought adding very clearly that it's hate speech and threats of violence so that's why I said I don't know if I meant add or replace but participating in conduct or speech that violates the community agreements including but not limited to hate speech and threats of violence I put Community agreements because and just sorry I don't mean to I guess I don't mean to interrupt before we get there I know it's weird because speech is so broad um but speech here would actually also refer to obscene materials and so um speech is anything written communicated spoken recorded literally anything uh published that speech so the reason why they're using that is that's because that's the Constitution law standard that's like the the prevailing rule of the land right now from the Supreme Court like basically if something has no redeeming social value then it it isn't protected speech and whatever that may be whether that be spoken published written so it could be hate speech it could be obscenity it could be you know incitement I hear what you're saying yeah where I'm not sure is at first I thought you meant Okay add redeem no redeeming social value but now I'm wondering if our previous conversation we didn't need to change this at all because it encompasses what you're sharing right now yeah that's that's true that's what I'm thinking because I wasn't even I didn't even I forgot that was in there okay participating because it wasn't something that I thought we could really change um or should change me I think that's why I put ad oh but I think you're you've taught me something so we can take this out so I want to just delete it everybody but I think like regular every day folks who haven't taken constitutional law probably have no idea that speech doesn't mean just talking yeah um can not be defined in that's what I thinking yeah just so people are aware and then you're saying how does that relate to the possession of stuff I mean like from the were you saying how it goes back to the last one we were on or I guess it just it it's I don't think it's that redundant okay I think it's fine I lost where we were at um especially because you you know these cases like this from the Supreme Court were decided when people had like leaflets or like little booklets of obscene materials they're handing out not like their phone at their fingertips or whatever or even t-shirt yeah or t-shirt or something like that yeah like T yeah yeah um okay so then I didn't touch the H identify themselves because I I've kind of felt like we were addressing it in I because um I'm sorry no I I don't know how we want to ident we basically said we needed to we needed to Define what identifying themselves meant but I didn't have a thought on that so the law requires that you give your name you don't need to be giving them Social Security number so I think that there's a way to like kind of just go with that like what the law requires what could we say uh let me see if we say also um refusing to identify can we say directory information oh let me start over what also is sometimes helpful is like well what grade are you in and who's your teacher so those are the three things that I think we most commonly try to figure out about a kid could we very specifically put provide their first last name yeah grade and teacher a lar here's my thing and this is where I think these two things could be split up and this is just the public defender talking now um I think that I'd be more willing to have more information shared with a district official than with a police officer because even giving that information could be incriminating this would then put our policy as yeah in in direct conflict with what the law actually requires yeah okay so we would need a it I think yeah because yeah you're not required to tell law enforcement those things okay so I'm just going to copy it um so let's first and you'd have to say also provide their correct first and last name because there is a misdemeanor for false identification okay so so start we'll start first let's start first with the police yeah um so so failure to comply with the lawful directions of there you go yeah directions of uh any law enforcement officers what does it say acting in performance of their duties um and so that would be so then this actually just comes out right then this would be H 2.0 failure to comply with the lawful directions of District officials acting and performs their duties and provide their correct first and last name school grade and or teacher to such of officials when I guess this we don't need when lawfully requested to do so because it's just like when it happens right just change it to when requested looking at the statute now and I had added because um we have an issue where kids won't identify themselves even if they're not getting in trouble so I had added refusal to identify themselves to appropriate staff and faculty whether or not an additional violation has occurred oh yeah because it's like that makes sense like hey man I just want to say hello you know and if you're a second grade teacher and I'm an eighth grade kid so I don't know if that just goes to the very bottom of this like like this now well I don't think we need that sentence because the the first sentence I'm part of it and I put the phrase and failing to in front of provide because that's how the wording was in the original one I mean the act of failing to provide that information request to do so is in of itself a violation based on based on how this is all being coming together so I don't know that we need that that second sentence or yeah that second sentence on H2 say that one more time sorry oh because it's failure to follow request um students shall not engage in improper Behavior including but not limited to the following was at the very beginning and then this would be failure to follow requests and and then when when we when it then the original read and fail the failure to identify themselves to such officials so I added in the phrasing and failing to provide their correct person like that's so I think that I think that that that it of itself is its own violation if they if they fail to provide that information when they're asked to do so I don't think we need that second sentence okay so so let me just clarify so he's saying in a situation where no one's in trouble but they're still asking them and they're refusing to Pride their name he's saying that in itself is a violation so they're already violating this yeah okay I'm with that I just wanna just want to make sure you gotta tell me your name all right um I we already covered caring or possessing a weapon on grounds I think I tried to address pink but I didn't do it very clearly so I just added I think we probably need to discuss pink all together but I went with well I'm sorry were you you at I'm sorry I'm on now K okay so well actually it's done I thought we just leave caring and possessing um and then I put any violation of these policies and regulations will be addressed through the district's Progressive discipline policies restoration of the Learning Community Andor Community relationships will be included in any disciplinary action relative to the committed infraction lastly dependent on the committed VI a and or harm cause the district office reserves the right to inform law enforcement in accordance with ar and governing board policy I guess I did I'm sorry I did just say like Let's ignore that pink and do this instead that's what I was intending I forgot so I really didn't address the first paragraph though I personally would like to come back to this after we look at ji okay okay yeah because some because I think that there's some things related to no there is that that there and I think we that maybe if we depending on what we come up with there it might inform what the wording should be here on that particular paragraph it might also play out in other ways but um okay well we really we really rocked it out today guys because I think we're done until we come back to that one um because the rest was all that we said we couldn't take out um I think there was just wanting to change a weapon to be more in line with the Statue right on I yeah I don't know I think carrying or possessing a deadly weapon or dangerous instrument school grounds Implement is that you said dangerous dangerous instrument instrument yeah okay so then um it technically is six o'clock do we go to 6:30 we don't have to no so in that cre I it after use the reserves it probably needs to be the Super okay because if you look through not that I'm trying to put things on myself but most policy doesn't use District or district office it uses superintendent you're right where is this at I'm sorry it was the last pink paragraph in addition to generals oh okay yeah and and when when policy uses superintendent or statute us a superintendent it technically means the superintendent design in that regard the superintendent serves as a replacement because the governing board technically has one employee to enact its policies super okay okay I changed it now uh I can't remember though do we go till 6:30 oh we're scheduled till 6:30 so but on the open like on our meeting that was posted on their agenda there isn't an end time right the agenda doesn't have an end time so we're not required to go to 6:30 I would like to propose that we keep going and just do the purple edits that you gave us because that was super helpful for me to go back and start if you guys are okay with with ji I did have one you covered a lot and awesome work that's amazing I I I like I like a lot of what is on here the only thing that I was hoping to kind of just add is very beginning um and I know Jay is Awesome with this but uh Allan kind of triggered this when he was talking about shall and May in that sentence about in establishing these regulations a superintendent May consult with student or staff I would propose shall very first paragraph right before the pink starts yeah right shall or will because it's it it it it's a it's a it's a it's a process right and it's something that should involve several voices and several uh people involved so shall or will whatever is appropriate that's great there's a okay in which case I would then change the or to and yeah I think so student and you know we don't want J just meeting with the students not talking to staff or vice versa you know that was the only comment I had and I I I like that same process only asking the kindergarteners their opinion you feel good about this right okay that's great thank you [Laughter] j i i was jumping ahead to do we want to just do like a we're all good to move on like indiv where next steps is ji yeah and going through that same process of the purple thing yeah that's cool with you guys I can that sounds awesome I and I I can't remember I I think Jay kind of referred to this are we are we able to I think you talked about this at the beginning are we able to edit this like in between meetings too or that's the piece I'm still because um when I reached out to Legal she was actually on vacation for got it got it so I've got a request so I'm sharing with you all the copy and paste I made of it um in viewer and then what I did was I just made a copy of it and I said like abadaka edits which maybe now I should change to Hilda I'm going to change the these proposed edits on jic I'm just going to title it instead like committee final committee draft one or something okay so okay so now everybody has this and then so now that we've gone over this are we able to kind of look at add it on our own as well J I see or yeah I just want to know if I'm allowed to save it and look at it and oh yeah I think yeah that's totally fine so what I just did yeah because we just went all over this and then it's not like you're going to be then conversing with more than one other person about this like as long as you're not talking with one more than one other person before the next meeting about it then you're good I made so I'm I'm gonna call it a Brian copy I made this copy that I just gave you guys a Brian copy so you all viewers on it and then maybe we can just gentle person agree see again how you typed my name just so I'm sorry no noit share so then if you want to do more edits anyone maybe if you can copy it your last name draft two and that way we'll kind of keep in track oh okay all right I see so you just it my last this is committee draft did you want to did you share it to yourself I have this one where's the J oh I see JS and I yeah say it again I'm sorry this is committee draft one now is now our fi our final of what we did today so if you wanted to make further edits to what we did today make a copy of that one got it thank you noiss yeah would I mean if it's possible it would be because I'm I you're the all the little edits and changes and stuff I'm kind of processing on the Fly just kind of looking at stuff and seeing and I'm nervous that I'm missing you know there's always some like wait what about that or what about this well and we didn't get to the like real word SM smithing yet so we'll probably end up having a second draft regardless if we keep everything right um com I mean to check my thinking with both of you Hilda and Jay um what I did with Adam was we just went over current policy and I like and then my plan had been I was gonna do like an aaka edit and then have him do a like otana or Valadez edit and so we would have two separate ones but he's gonna be telling me how he would like to change it is that if you guys are doing it and it's just you two and as long as you two then aren't going to talk to anybody else that's always going to be fine okay you can keep them together can keep it together as long as it's only the two of you okay sounds good you're just limited to two members so you don't get it okay cool oh it's one last document for us um all right take it away Katie what do we oh okay so here we are let's see sorry I was like looking at what this was okay yeah this is the weird intro the first page is the intro intro paragraph and then the second page was the like actual what I thought we were planning on changing stuff I don't know if you want to start with page two yeah okay cool you're saying start it all students are entitled even further down no right there yeah oh okay I like your avatar oh thank you such environment will enhance this is written very interestingly um you know I think as far as like this this part goes obviously there's nothing here that I don't think there's anything here that requires this to be written in a certain way but let me double double check I don't yeah I don't think so oops but let me double check by going back to hold on want into the statue really quick okay 1541 if you're reading ahead ignore the part that says monist is community agreements because initially this was my notes and that was what I was going to bring up um what our Middle School does okay that one talking about the community expectations and commitments that's well even that yeah that's all like that's monov Vista stuff but I I'm a I'm a gold star kid and I was like I was given an assignment better get it I didn't want to presume anything is is that a common thing all at all schools where they use those phrasings Community expectations and Community agreements I think it's pretty common I don't know if it's univ so I I know Josh uses them I know Lauren uses it Papo because we use their PBIS um buil more it built more I think everybody uses Community agreements but I think we use it not because it was disciplined but because it was introduced with Corwin when they did the equity stuff so when they told when we were trained or like given that information about how we should talk more about a community relationship agreements as opposed to expectations schools did both so our handbook is expectations I just didn't provide that and then we made our own Middle School Community agreements but I'm almost certain everybody uses it but it wasn't a requirement everybody kind of uses to yeah kind of hover around the stuff I mean well she's kind of look at that why isn't that a district standard and expectation is it just kind of an agreed upon thing or you know it I think it's just never been formally adopted and you know it's kind of as Adriana said it came out of our deep Equity work with with Corwin and the equity teams at the sites um it is now being exposed to parents for the first time Ian not for the first time but it's being intentionally exposed because the end of each of our yes events that we've had for students over the last couple of weeks um we've had a sadly under attended but we have had some parent participation in an evening intergenerational event where the families are invited in to come learn about your students are doing parents up at another District not only received the concept of community agreements but um they've actually kind of participated in work around them that's been facilitated for the families to understand the type of work that the students are doing so you nice I don't think you would find anybody on leadership team that would have any hard standardizing around and I think too um we were aware that if the aps started being like this is blanket how we did it we might be doing exactly that like not overlapping with the or we would be maybe too far off base of like the governing board policy so we we weren't like pushing for that but I can tell you that um like the discipline flow maps that all the schools use we all shared what we were doing and making sure that they were like commonalities like a really good example is well I don't know it's really good but one example is on our discipline flow map we had um disrespect on ours and uh Josh's school is doing or Amy's school is doing um conscious discipline and they talk about its inter relation it's like inter it's a relationship problems and so now our discipline flow map says interpersonal uh issues so it was kind of like a small way where we started slowly coming together and thinking about how we're doing it but the aps did kind of give each other like feedback on what their school was doing is that a goal to have so I I would say that part of part of the part of the work that the Behavior Support committee is doing is to provide some some some semblance of coordinated effort on some of these issues as well so we've got a lot of different things happening um to try to create more consistency and commonality across the district in terms of vocabulary and terminology and then also overall practices so because one of the things think you're right that is an example and I think ASB I think that becomes a problem okay is that it's based on one school's use of one particular program that we so it's only meaningful if everybody's using that particular program right that's where some of the some of the work I'm just curi and and some people okay so there's was I think that's a really good point because some people I I our PBIS team was going to look it over anyways and they were comfortable being like we're ready for this we're we're we're there but I maybe another school was like we're not ready to redefine this for our staff we're going to hold thank you so is so is that the is that the goal then to have a should that I my so I can only speak for myself but when I was part of the AP team it was there was like a I can speak for the other APS we are all working very closely together because we wanted to make it very consistent um for everybody and so we've been trying and with like with like the mentorship of Dr dupin he also was like we're going to keep bringing ourselves together because more united schools like that makes sense um so I believe that to be true from what I've seen and what we're doing um but I I I don't think that we had like a July 15 of 2025 everyone's doing the exact same thing like we didn't formalize it in that way so we've been working there hasn't been that's working towards philosophically I how do I put this me I have zero heartburn if you know the AP team wants to ratify and make things more official to some extent Dr dup and the AP myself and several others were kind of independently moving in this direction because we didn't necessarily have the ability to have direct conversation with the board now that we've had an opportunity to have those direct conversations and we see that there is support I don't think there's anything standing in from being more formal those what would be the argument against that like saying that's not a good idea I haven't come across I mean there could be one out there but I haven't come across against which part I guess uh so I I would sometimes I feel like there's a a push and pull between like the equivalent of a site based management as opposed to a more centralized um I wouldn't say District managed but at least unified approach and it's a difference in philosophy right yeah andan I've seen our district swing wide one way and swing wide another way it's a national swing right so but it doesn't always happen the same in every District kraton traditionally at least over the last 20 years has been more individual School Independence oriented than centralized um um I think but I think this is a slightly different animal than taking away like local site decision local but 's not expl I think in this particular case what's happening is a third thing which is um collabor collaborative consistency right so rather than the superintendent coming in and saying Thou shalt make this all the same I see what we're having is we've had sort of a coaching process around it would you know we're hearing board philosophy that they'd like to see consistency we're hearing staff concern that sometimes there's not consistency is there any reason to not have consistency and so what the team's been doing and the reason that they've been working on a matrix is to create the combination of stronger consistency with still leaving a measure of independent decision making for the individual circumstance leaving individual decision making power at the site but not like um a kid said something that was obscene and so at this site they're expelled and at this site they get a two-day suspension and at this site they do a restorative project right right so trying to come K Katie's done oh great oh no it's fine um so from what I can gather the ji policy and of itself even though it references those statutes there's nothing in the actual ji policy that's written in any of those statutes so um go cool so yeah so nothing there is I think required to be there I think it's just part of the general ability we have to create policy what I can also gather is that I'm assuming whoever wrote the manual for asba which is kind of what I'm this all came from is asba has some attorneys who were like let's like get a kid like a student's Bill of Rights and responsibilities in here and that comports with the law um and so there's the there's the ji policy and then this kind of what do they call these it's like a coraly I don't know what this is It's just called jir so R is regulation a regulation but it is saying that the superintendent shall develop and promate promulgate administrative procedures so explain exp to me the regulation difference from the policy I just don't understand that yeah so so there's and so there's several things so there's policy which is the letters right yeah then there's Das e which is exhibit which might be a form there's- R which is regulation which might be District practice so and and regulation does not technically require board approval it requires board board notification because that's what I was is this something under the superintendent's perview the regulation the regulation is typically under the superintendent perview okay so I mean it's it seems like the when I looked at Phoenix L and Osborne really quickly under their jir they have the exact same thing so it looks like it's whatever was adopted that asba wrote so again I think that everything here is up for up in the a for grabs as long as you're not getting more restrictive than what the rights are for students like actual rights are for students so we straying outside of yeah the concept of yeah what would be helpful to me and see what you guys think is if we just Define what category are we going to call a right and what in the category of responsibilities let me try that sentence again rights andun resp responsibilities there's going to be different things that fall in each category I'd like to know what you're all thinking those two categories entail so that way when I'm looking I can wrap my head around it so um and that that all falls actually falls under jir correct that rights and responsibilities that's under J the regulation yeah sorry no I was just I was just clarifying yeah um because I actually have a few thoughts on Ji thank you okay so going back to we just in special that we just go with the straight letter abbreviations we don't worry about all the other punctuation I'm just roll with my best guess okay um and really my thoughts on on ji really not extensive because overall I kind of like what the message was here although um there was some verbage I'm like um I'm a college graduate I have my Master's degre ree I do not know what some of these words mean so maybe we want to rethink maybe making it more reader friendly but um basically um and deportment of students yes ex yeah I'm just saying so wait are we looking at the same document I'm on ji are you on it says the board has the I don't have because she didn't give us editing rights to this for the conduct and deportment of students so in that sentence although I would eventually like to get around to changing the word deportment if nothing else but um what does that even mean this is my point um so my first thought was in that in that specific sentence um right to say the board has Authority and responsibility to establish reasonable expectations rules and regulations because again we're trying to make this right a little more a not that we're being soft on expectations but that's really what it is it's not all just rules and regulations um and then pretty much everywhere where the word equal starts showing up um either and Equitable or replacing equal with Equitable um because equal and Equitable are not the same word yeah and um and you know I think that if our if the Preamble policy for this section is about equal it kind of implies that everything else should be about treating kids equal and I don't think that that's who we have been as a district and so I think Equitable would be a better word so I like I put my question for expert is I recognize equal access to educational program students I don't know if that's specific leg CH not because I haven't yeah well I think but barring that I'll point out idea is all about Equitable access to education program not equal access so it's kind of a I mean yeah I'm not arguing with you I just no no know somewhere in State Statute I thought oh could be so would that also include and because I I look at the the title itself student rights and responsibilities shouldn't that also shouldn't that be student rights and expectations or is that something completely different okay hold on oh maybe yeah um because that's what I I read responsibility is is the expectations that we have okay so two things really quick tell me where you're at because I I'm on the first page of ji rights responsibilities so it would' be like rights responsibilities and expectations I would delete responsibilities and replace it with expectations rights and expectations you're thinking of okay this is what you're thinking of Jay yeah I maybe in a weird space you're in a weird space but it's probably from like if you took like remember they' like make you take like an education in the law class or um but that this was like there was a case before plusy B Ferguson that God you actually very was very old Isn't that before everybody was born yes I mean it's from 1849 [Music] so so it was like that case then py berson overturned that and then Brown B board overturned py back to this Charles Sumer was a dude who sued the district in Boston back in 1849 and he argued that that that separate colored schools in Massachusetts were unconstitutional back in 1849 okay so yeah so I'll go with an I do [Laughter] play just being timekeeper it is 623 p.m yes other than my my Equitable stuff um okay wait hold on because we didn't sorry oh so really quick um your so so what I'm going to put is at the bottom word change removal equal but changing it to equal and Equitable barring case issue like case off thank you statute and then um very explicitly related to the equitability thing in the last um in the last multi-line paragraph okay like how I have to describe that so when it starts with superintendent shell uh ensure the student rights under varying conditions are properly described and equitably administered okay um and then my only my thought to what you had mentioned James was um administered administering okay thank you sorry um was if it's expectations for like their rights it feels like we're going back to the like it's not so much like maybe talk aloud I feel like expectations is being like it's really like like a synonymous with like the rule we expect you to follow but I feel like this particular thing is more about like their rights and like the responsibilities we want to like encourage them to have so that would be my only thing what's responsibilities then because that the way you described it that was the way I intended it I I thought it was more of a contrast your rights and then also your responsibilities slash expectations as a member so it's weird because when you look down at the bottom but I could be wrong no I'm I'm not sure I think that these responsibilities it's more it's still like what you expect them to do but it it's a lot about like procedurally do we need to stop this conversation because we're not at a quorum in the room right now that's correct oh yeah oops sorry that's something I should have said uh here we go so I don't so I don't so let's maybe not answer that question let's first decide what are we when we're looking at this with the rights what do we all envision that being that it's basically what's protected for them and their abilities is it like um their due process I see it as legal like they're legal they legal rights legal rights um opportunities provided to them that we like where are you at now I'm trying to Define what's right and responsibilities so I'm literally at the topic sentence I'll change this color well and maybe more than legal rights when I was reading through this I got this sense of some of these are not just legal rights but things that we as a district are considering rights at that same legal like legally protected so um when I had said before was that as long as you're not getting more restrictive than what's already out there in the regular world you can get more protective is I guess what I should say so you can enumerate more rights than what students have at other districts depending on what you would like those to be in this District okay so I got it's like the legal rights just what you get um opportunities provided for like the student like what rights we want to like bestow on children and then what we we will protect Beyond legal rights that are given But ultimately it's got to be more rights not more restrictions yeah you can't restrict most of this from what I looked at is like we're not going to be able to delete most of this stuff yeah so we can only add to this and then the other thing is oh so my delete with the rights is it it goes beyond a K8 school do we want to like it talks about married students but legally they can't get married anyways I mean not at 12 at least I was about to say maybe um an eighth grader could legally get married here I don't know I don't even remember what the with parent permission that would grader can get legally married they're 13 it's 13 right no we we have 16 we will have 16year old eighth graders at some point yeah but I'm saying like you you the cut off is an age of 13 not this doesn't this just simply says married students and so and the legal age with parent permission is 16 in this state so technically we could have an eighth grader who is married we could have a 16-year-old with parent permission oh yeah oh yeah yeah um they get retained once and there and they could there's a potential for that drive to school doesn't happen we did have I mean it's the same thing as when you have like a 21 or 22 year old at your high school because they also got retained or they're in special ed or whatever and then uh we' got two minutes everybody really quick so responsibilities what are we defining that as if you're going to like add um like is it because these are like you've got the right these are like to me protect a school it's basically like to me these are the broad Community agreements so if you look at 15 um 15 wow you scroll up and see the first statute that's listed uh yes it's 15341 let me click it yeah and you go to it you'll see that if you if you see there it says there's a section that starts to say something about student responsibilities nope that's not maybe is it not that one maybe it's the next one 342 sorry no you're fine three oh 34 341 that was one I was on 8:41 sorry not 341 841 oh yeah there right there so responsibilities of pupils so like letter a section one and two like the way they put this in here for the statute is not how they have responsibilities list out like it's kind of weird because this is what's listed as the responsibility statute but it doesn't align with responsibilities in the regulation at all so just so you all know I don't I took a quick look and it doesn't look like any of the stuff from the responsibilities list is in this because this talks about expulsion and all that stuff and that's in a different policy right okay so I think you should be able to kind of just go wild in the responsibility section okay so broad Community not involvement agreement the exposion policy is right yes yeah so for example yeah do a sense of the time frame where this was actually originally written um one of the things that I do really propose or um is like our third bullet like bullet um members are able to express their feelings and beliefs freely without fear of judgment Prejudice from others no one has the right to negatively impact the emotional mental or physical well-being I guess the first sentence that is going to be considered a responsibility when it's Wordsmith that like but no that's a right right able to express their feelings is a right responsibility is to not negatively impact others correct yeah Bingo got it um before because we're at 6:30 the only other if you'll just make a note in your copy going back to um ji um in the third paragraph it uses the word obedience oh I saw that too obedience to properly constituted School Authority and since we're making some other changes in vocabulary we can talk about that next time I just want to make sure we don't lose that agreed okay peace don't take away my ability to PR yeah once we all figure out what once we all figure out what that is we'll yeah trust me I'm gonna go wild one second wild PR like it involves a wand do you [Laughter] wanna Harry Potter so before you adjourn do you want to does is everyone good with the future dates can I make a motion I think so okay I move I move we continue with the proposed meeting dates second second oh uh second yeah it's not even an action item talking about it yeah that's just a like a information item yeah did we only schedule through January 16 I thought weren't we going to schedule future dates in January oh yeah because of people's calendars I I I think by Janu by dece by December 14th I should at least know my January February calendar so maybe if everybody can make sure to bring their calendar at our next meeting and then we can do like the next two that's fine if you would mind remind me for the folks who aren't here yeah certainly and hopefully if we do gain some replacement members they'll be here then we can hopefully include them in that discussion [Music] yeah so uh the just to kind of recap a little bit the we went over uh these the U the jic policy right yes and then our next steps are to go and look at the ji and Jr policy ji and jir to look at what you want to add to that basically and then we're still waiting for confirmation from the attorney about like somebody being able to go in there and clean up all of that based on the conversation so if we get confirmation from the attorney between now and December 14th what we'll do is um we'll go ahead and send an email out yeah send an email out and make sure that there's an editable ver that's Avil would awesome so and if that happens I I would be happy to volunteer to do some clean up we said after this one oh so I can look through it it has a bunch of stuff yeah sure right I just want to make sure JK we said after the what we did today and um what we will do at the next meeting will be our like third one to look at student discipline that was the one we okay wait could you repeat that um so to next week we're GNA do the ji and jir and then um Katie's gonna start checking out the um JK student discipline so I believe that was our next most important one to get to that's third okay yeah perfect oops you do all right unless there's anything else for the good of the order you can somebody can make a motion to adjourn I move to adjourn the advisory committee meeting I second all those in favor I I I motion passes we are

⚗ AI-reconstructed · cite from original above