001problem with our academic program that we're trying that caused by midrifts that we're trying to solve, right? Because so my my question is why is that the thing that's going to fix it and what are we trying to fix? What's happened? I I only know I I mean I don't have a student in the school currently, but I did have a student in the school for the first year that the dress code changed. And I can tell you from a parent perspective at that time what happened is a lot less conversation about negative relationships with staff and teachers and a lot more focus on other things including academics. >> I was going to say I remember when the dress code changed thinking that it was probably like in eighth grade because I think there was
002maybe like the last day of seventh grade she sent me this like this much. I was like, but then she's like, "Oh, guess what? The dress code changed." And I was like, "Well, from a parent perspective, it was like, the dress code may be changed at school. Here's what my expectations as a parent are what you wear to school." >> To be clear, this dress code does not prevent a parent from saying that's not okay. >> And so, it was kind of it was it was a fun family conversation that we had, too. And and rightfully so. Um, and then well, interesting. But I think that um the the other thing I was thinking about on that is um you know I get you know that whole part of like you know tucking a shirt
003in. So okay so then that's clarifying that. Um but at the same time what's the difference between you know somebody who's tall and wears the same shirt as someone who's short. And so like we we went to um well let's just say Lululemon and we bought the same shirt but you're taller than me. So now when you wear it, you know, there's this much of your midriff. I wear the same I wear your shirt the next day and there's none showing. So what may So So I think there's, you know, things like that that can >> consistency was part of our conversation and challenge and part of what led to led us to make changes and part of what both I think staff and students were struggling with back in that conversation. We had students
004who who did not just buy like they didn't go shopping together and each buy the same shirt. They shared the shirt. They were related and they shared the shirt. >> One wore it in the morning, one wore it in the afternoon, one got >> but their bodies were different and one got dresscoded and the other didn't because their bodies were different. And so I just my concern is we say we're not going to shame someone for their size or body type. I I I don't see that we could possibly do that and have this restriction. That's my Do do we know how enforced these policies are in other districts? >> That's my I think that's well that's a great question and it was inconsistently here. >> I can tell you that my daughter's belly button
005was showing every day at St. Gr. So that did not get >> and I and I just can't speak to what I I know that in another district that belly buttons are showing and it's something that is just being because of situations like this and you know having that time it's it it's on the policy right or wrong is it you know maybe like you said I was like not on the policy but not necessarily enforced um you know was that a good thing or bad thing and once again that's for those districts to decide. Um, one thing I can give I I guess I backpacks a little bit. I I'm totally okay with backpacks not being held around school. I think that's a safety issue. Um, so I do think at least my personal
006perspective should be >> Here's my question about that though because I've heard that before and I wish we I wish we would allow backpacks. I've heard that argument before that it's a safety issue. larger districts, big big districts that don't have enough lockers for kids. They don't have a place to put their bank. All of those kids carry their lockers. When you're a freshman at Monavey High School, you don't get a locker. >> So, I have a hard time with the idea that it's a safety issue here, but not there because they're all carrying their backpacks. >> Safety issue there, too. They just can't stop if they don't have blockers. >> Sure. If they had the blockers that they wouldn't give a kid, >> but >> I don't know that that's backpacks. Oh, so kids
007have been permitted to use their backpacks. >> They came back with co to eliminate the lingering next to lockers. >> Oh yeah. >> Right. To keep the distance between students so that they would be right next to their locker. That is when that change happened before co >> I think there there's a lot of like all sorts of things can be carried around in those backpacks and that it's hard um even locker searches you can't necessarily I I just feel like it could be slippery slope or it is a slippery slope but like rapes and not not even necessarily like names and stuff like that, but I like that. >> Sure. >> That that would be my concern of what I it's kind of like when I see it when a kid is consistently carrying
008their purse around with them. And I mean, I get that, you know, else, you know, for personal reasons, but um I think >> Yeah. Just >> Yeah. >> I It's not my It's not my favorite rule, but it's not >> Yeah. Um, but that's >> for for me for me, we run the risk of doing real damage to students with the with the restriction on on um on midrifts. It feels very it feels very gender targeted. It feels very random. I'm not sure what problem we're trying to fix. Um I have a lot of concerns about >> Okay. I know they address color. Is there any issues in the chemical? >> You should tell because the whole documents get approved. >> We're going to do addition >> edits. There's a couple of spots where I
009found um old policy references. So page >> and >> or did you fix those? Well, he can't. He doesn't know. I don't know the new So, this >> we'll update it with Thank you. >> So, like we'll approve it based on updates being made. >> The policies are just approved. >> Yeah. >> Five minutes ago. So, yeah, you'll get the right policy number to go with it. It's more of a placeholder for now. >> There was Okay, got it. >> John, >> um I'm trying to find what was what was it? Control >> control F. Um, >> so much learning is happening. >> Oh gosh, what can I do on my computer? I'm just >> It was the about the um >> academic academic and technical excellence. >> Um, I don't know. >> Sorry, I
010should have written it down. >> You have a page, Marcus? Yeah, technical excellence. They were right together. It probably was close to graduation. >> Uh on page 15, >> academic honors ledger and blame. I say technical excellence. This one here. >> Yeah. So, okay. So, yep. The two the bottom part. So, the Wisconsin academic excellence scholarship AES 225. So, graduating senior with the highest GPA award Wisconsin college or university could also those that student could also attend Wisconsin Technical College. So they could use that academic excellence to go to a technical college. They just have to be attending this year. So >> Oh, so good. >> So just that. >> So you want technical technical goes in here too. >> Yeah. So technical should be in here too. And then this one should not should
011only be applied to a Wisconsin technical college, not college or university. >> Does that make sense? >> That was great. >> Yeah. >> So the Yeah. So the top one it could be any Wisconsin college university or technical college. The technical excellence is only Wisconsin technical college [Music] >> and attendance. 11. >> Yes. 11. >> Maybe I just read it. >> This is online learning. >> Yep. >> Okay. What? Um, so I guess like it said like somewhere I read that they had to be in person. Is that >> students participate in just a so it just means they need to be in the school building taking those classes. >> Yeah. They have a designated area within the school. They can't just leave cuz I've got online classes, >> right? And so this is for
012like academic if like it's beyond like college or >> No, they could take a class through. So like Aselis is an online learning um platform that like some of the classes run through Spanish class online. >> Spanish. >> Yeah. So they're here. >> They're here. They might be sitting in the library taking the class, but we're saying you can't go down into subway and work on your class, >> right? >> Okay, that's But then home. >> Yeah. >> If a student student is like, let's say, suspended, are they allowed to do >> it's just like homework then? >> It's just homework, but they're not allowed to do any suspended or expelled either way. I think suspended would be they just be suspended out of school for a day or two. So then they would >>
013they still work at home if they wanted to. >> Okay. Yeah. >> But expelled that would be a separate 7. >> Anyone who's taking an online class could always work at night in the weekends on their homework. >> Okay. >> It's it doesn't mean that only during this 45 minutes time in the library can do the online work. No. >> When I've been here with the expulsion like we made it where they could do some of the academia stuff, but I guess that was through like an app. >> So if you Yeah. So if you So a student who is expelled when they're not allowed in the school building and they were assigned this then they would for sure only work on it outside of the building because we're >> okay >> they have an
014it's a different thing I was just trying to piece it all together this night sounds I was just curious >> this would be like if our children were taking an online class they say it was fourth hour at fourth hour they would go to the IM or the library or to Miss Ly's office or something and work on it so instead I was just wondering like what is this? >> So just the expectation that if they're here for all their other classes, they're going to be here in the building for the class. >> The issue is students who can drive. >> Yeah. Right. >> Take two online classes. >> No, I get it. Okay, I want to go somewhere. >> Plus, it's also good for the supervisor in there to monitor their progress. Um, quick
015question because Marcus will be updating policy stuff once we know the numbers. How does our new policy stuff affect the set of administrative rules? Because there is one administrative rule still in the administrative rules that we have on the books now unchanged by the new policy matter. >> We did not do it, right? Because they're not the administrative rules. >> We have no administrative rules. There's none of the law. >> Okay. Okay. Got it. >> But there was an administrative rule. >> Yeah, there's an administrative rule cited on page 16. So that'll I'm sure just be the retention policy now instead. >> But that'll be the new update now that the policy's been through. Got it. I just I wrote down administrative rule and then I had it in my brain to ask because I
016didn't know how administrative rules were affected by >> or if those all just go away. >> Yeah, that policy. >> Okay, got it. Anything else they have other than dress code? Because I'll put dress code back up there and we can edit it so it's approvable for you guys. So we're here. Okay. So, do we get a motion to approve it with and then recommended changes? We can do I mean >> that's probably the >> I I I guess my first question is are there other board members who want to weigh in at all on dress code Chriser Emily we haven't heard from um I hear I I remember the 2023 conversation about it as well um and Aaron I um agree with you thinking about um just uh the impact that it has on
017your students and knowing that that has been a big conversation having the kiddos effectively advocate for that as well. That's existing in my history too as far as um being in favor of removing mid drifts. But my and and my other side of it thinking about the difficulty to enforce that and the consistency across all teachers to enforce it of what that looks like. you know, if it's a shirt that needs to be tucked in, well, it can certainly get tucked in in the front. But if you have someone sitting down in a chair now, their back is showing because the shirt, you know, I think it's just makes it it sets teachers up for a very difficult situation to enforce. Um, it just because everyone's midrifts look a little bit different, pants are low,
018pants are high, you know, like it's a pants thing, too. So, I think it is a I think it's setting teachers up for um having to make this decision every day if this is something that they she they should tackle today or not tackle today or maybe I don't have the energy today, but maybe tomorrow I'll get in it. And so, yes, you may have somebody um get dress code one day with somebody not the next day because of, you know, negative interaction. So I just feel like it profuses things a little bit. Whereas um if we're very specific with the general buttocks and nipples and then of course you do have down lower on you know like the the singlets and things like that are not you know appropriate. So that covers some other
019things swimsuits and whatnot you know that is covering some basics as far as um you know what this just isn't school attire appropriate. Um and again we as a governing you know as a school body um should have the should have you know of course this baseline but every family has the ability to talk with their with their kiddos about what's appropriate for them or what's not appropriate for them and and why that should be. But as um but as a school body, we can enforce our beliefs onto um families, which I feel like that gets into a little bit as far as body goes. So that's where I'm sitting on that. I understand the hoodies um the hoods that disappoints me a little bit, but that's more of a parent thing. So um I
020understand that >> but they can wear a hoodie to school. >> Yes. >> But they wear this sweat, but they can't put the coat off. Okay. >> Because of the problem of hiding with the earbuds, >> right? But I am understanding like the way that that gets into you know in the world academics or being able to not um maybe shut down or shut out some of the world which I think is helpful for some students who maybe have some um more emotional or mental health um kind of struggles that they may be dealing with as the hood is kind of a protection for them. But I am understanding the the um kind of classroom side of that as well. So, is that um are hoods not uh allowed in hallways or just in the
021classroom? >> I I would say hoods would not be allowed in their classroom. And and I know that if students have I believe there's one student who has it in their 504. >> I just wrote that down. Yes, that's a really good >> because the student that's where I was going to go with that too. >> And just just like all things like we have to understand all things apply to all equally like you see someone with a hood and I say you take your hood off but they don't say anything to anyone else like it's just not applicable to everyone else because they have different needs than the other students do. So yeah, like hood I think in the classroom primary issue and target always is is a different story. I don't really see
022a huge issue with that. Um because it's not academic time. I think the focus on academic time. Um for me personally as as an educator, I I want all our students to feel really comfortable in the building and what they have to come to school and um and what they how they feel when they're in their classes. Um, as far as midrips go, I haven't really spoken about it. Um, my only issue that I've had here with midrips since I've been at Frederick or even in the past, I don't really think like that. I don't see students I don't I don't see that that I don't I don't have blinders for that. I don't I don't see it. I I've got kids now. Maybe now that I have my own kids, I'll I'll start seeing
023it more. Um, but like I was is a group of boys who who have t-shirts and they cut out the sides and basically are wearing a tunic is what it looks like and the side it's completely open on side. The only midrip that I've seen that bothered me was these was this group of boys and and that's that's the only time this I think the style of the day is is more like it's just the way it is. And I think in the late 90s when I was in school like it was that style was also very troubled and it wasn't really an issue. Um, everybody wore it and it became something that you just didn't really notice. Um, but I I think in my in my opinion, I think it has to do with
024intent and and we we battle with this. We want these kids to be professional versus what our view of professional is and what their view of professional is for their future world. So, so I don't know. I don't know the right answer of of it. I just know that I don't think midrips in this building since I've been here in my educator opinion has been an issue. Um I have not seen it and I think I don't know putting it in there would actually create you said my creative problem or this >> or this thing where like oh I've got okay so I've got to monitor this now so I'm really on it to monitor this. Um so and I don't know the right way. I think if midrips were in there, teachers should be
025trained properly on how to address that. I think that's like there should be a level of sensitivity there that you could you could have that no matter what it was that we had in here, we should be able to address it effectively as adults in this building that provide this safe space for these students. There should be and it should never be a shame issue. It's really sad to hear that. And I I and that's like I see that side of it and I think of my own kids and I see the other side of it. Well, we want to provide this high bar for high academics and high achieving students. So, I battle with it on both sides, but I I really I can tell you that I I don't haven't seen other than
026a group of boys that I don't know that you guys experience, >> right? They did that. >> It's very unusual. >> Do you know what that does though? You're exposing nipples, right? that is very generational and I'm like you're not covering. Yeah. >> So that's the only time I've seen a red and I think because it was purposeful. You took his garment and you you deliberately altered it to expose like to expose like I think that was >> and achieved exactly what they were trying to me but to me but >> it did not win the court. Well, I have a couple actually. That's true. Um, so I guess that's my take on dress code. I wonder if here we we but I see like pajama pants like that like what professional environment like with
027a makeup you said with the makeup and the and that how that's professional and then pajama pants and like it's just a hard it's a really hard balance but >> well and I think that >> you know I'm by a rainbow story. >> Well, I was just going to say I don't think that the dress code is our only opportunity to teach kids about opportunities to dress to dress correctly for the thing they're engaged in. We have FBLA and there's rules about what you have to wear to be part of FBA. We make efforts with our music concerts to ask kids to dress a little differently for those concerts and and that that's an opportunity to as a performer to dress differently. We have opportunities and I think we can in our relationships as and
028and modeling as adults. We can demonstrate those things to them. I I think I think we don't have to I I don't think it's giving up the lesson not to have it in the dress code is my view. I think our opportunity for teaching actually increases by not having it in the dress code. Because to me, having it in the dress code is the same thing as saying you're going to respect me because I said you're going to respect me versus I'm going to teach you how to respect me and earn that respect, which I think is different. >> I don't think we give up the professional lesson. I think we have lots of opportunities for the lesson about about um I don't know for in also partially in my mind professional is the wrong
029word because for what profession? For what profession? >> I was going to say that. >> You know, my son who works in finance in Minneapolis wears something very different than his good friend who's a lineman. >> But they both dress appropriately for their jobs and they're both it's it's the right >> wardrobe for their profession. But they but if you stood them next to each other, you would you know. So I that that word's a little weird, but but I think we have I still think we have lots of opportunities for that lesson. I don't think we're giving up that lesson if we were to strike that word from the I think it creates a lot more conflict having that word there and then just taking it out. >> Yeah. >> Well, >> like I
030think a lot more people are going to be showing up here if we have that word in next to genitalia and nipples and then we just get with the times. I mean it used to be like even you know my age going to certain schools like you know, have it where girls have to wear skirts below their knees because knees were sexualized. You know, >> I think we're past that. Like, what decade are we in? That's just me, Chris. Well, speaking to that, I was in eighth grade when they dropped the dress code saying girls had to wear dresses to school. And which was a good thing because I was wearing a dress in seventh grade that you couldn't bend over and drink water out of the fountain. I don't know why my mother let
031me wear that, but she did. Apparently, she wanted me to be cool and part of the crowd. Uh the second thing is and I don't see any academic change. We went into high school all of a sudden we're wearing bell bottoms and beads and still the people who were academically astute academically astute. The ones who weren't weren't just the way it was. >> Yeah. Um, I don't like putting something in that's going to be um, hardship for a teacher to enforce because I've been in that position as a teacher and told you we have to do this or that and then when you carry it out then you get thrown under the bus kind of thing. So if it's not enforcable, it shouldn't be in there. If it's not clear, like you say, is there
032training? Do we have a standard uh script response? If we don't, then it's it shouldn't be in there. So, and I can see it's already caused a problem. We already have someone coming in. >> That's just the tip of the iceberg, I think. And it it kind of distracts from the academics. They're worried about what kids are wearing rather than how they're performing as learners. So, so I would like to make a motion that we strike the word vidra from the proposed dress code and approve the handbook with that change. >> And would anyone oppose having um hoods? students may not wear hoods in the classroom or during academic time or can something be amended there would anyone be opposed to that >> I would be okay with that if that do you think that's
033possible Marcus word that properly in a way you think is okay >> yeah we got a motion >> yeah so my so okay so my motion then would be for those two changes to strike the word midr and to um clarify that the restriction on hoods is only during academic >> right in the what kind of >> I mean could they wear that during in the hallway can we use the word stocking camp instead of skull cap >> sure >> cuz I think skull cap literally doesn't cover the ears >> yeah it's like it's like kind of like And the beanie beanie or stocking stocking. >> I think you're right. Culturally stocking. >> It does say any head gear that covers their ears. So it doesn't matter what you call that. >> Sure. Sure. Sure.
034>> Right. Anything covered and goals do not cover ears during academic time. >> Just say yeah. >> Unless it's removed that fine. >> We got a motion. So we got to get the motion right. As far as not contention in there back in 2000s because you have the