Public Hearing - ATESD December 18, 2025 6PM

001See what you just did. Everybody Thursday, December starting. Good evening. Today is Thursday, December the 18th, 2025. I'd like to call the public hearing for speed enforcement cameras to order. >> Troy Lamir, >> Kevin Bishop, >> Paul Harrington, >> Todd Archelashi, >> Paul Marino, [clears throat] William Hester, >> Cheryl Hefernon, McGlin, >> William Posel. >> At this point to turn it over to town manager Harrington. >> Thank you, Mr. Mayor, and good evening board, and good evening residents, those here with us, and those probably watching at home. Uh the gentleman to the right of me uh is Andrew Noble, president of Sightstream. Um if you uh would so allow, it is easier for my voice to be picked up by the microphone if I sit down and do the presentation. Um I think we do

002potentially have a a large amount of people possibly watching at home, but maybe watching after it's over and and and getting the information later. So um my legs work perfectly fine. I just think for for voice quality it's better if I uh if I sit here. Um I thought a lot about how we were going to do this presentation tonight and I think it's best that we run you through our slide deck and then of course we will open it up for question and answer period. Um we do have our chief of police here as well. Um obviously I introduced Andrew Noble. Um so let us go through the presentation. Some of your questions actually may get answered uh during the presentation which would be great but by all means if it doesn't please ask

003the question. Uh, one thing, you know, this is obviously a topic that, um, uh, has two sides of the equation. Um, if you do, come on up to the, uh, table. We're going to have you unmute the microphone. Um, so our audience at home can hear it, but be respectful. Um, that's one thing, you know, uh, we're a community first and we want to be respectful for one another, whether we agree with someone's opinion or disagree with it. The one thing that we always want to uh, remain is respectful to one another, and we'll get through it together. So, with that, we're going to open up uh the slides. So, going back to June uh 27th of 2023, Connecticut General Statute 14-307C was approved. That allowed municipalities to install what's known as automatic traffic enforcement

004safety devices, also known as ATESD. You'll see that referenced uh many times. the ordinance that's being proposed by the board of selectmen. It does include red light cameras as well. That is something that is not currently being proposed for this town. Just the ordinance is going to be a larger umbrella that if that time ever comes that we do want to employ some type of a red light camera. The ATESD uh ordinance that we're looking to pass here in town does include red light cameras as well. Um, this particular presentation will be put on our website either later tonight or first thing tomorrow morning. So, if you want to go back to it, we do reference links. So, as you can see, it says the full law can be found here. If you click on

005that from the presentation from the website, it will then bring you to actually the Connecticut General Statute that we'll be referencing tonight. Moving on, uh, the process of what we need to follow. The municipality must hold a public hearing. Hence why we are here tonight. Before submitting our plan to Connecticut DOT, the uh municipality must adopt an ordinance. In this town, we need to hold three meetings in order to finally pass an ordinance. I can let you know and you a lot of people have been probably seeing this from the sideline that we have gone through our first two meetings. The last one being on Monday night and our third meeting being on January 5th right after the new year. Um, if the board of selectment at that time, uh, with a majority vote, vote

006for the ordinance, the ordinance then passes and it does become an ordinance in in the town of Winchester. Why does Winchester need speed cameras? I'm sure some of you are in here asking that question. Um, it was a question that the board of selectman brought to me probably over a year ago and we started to talk about speed cameras because the law had passed. So, back in spring of 2025, we set up speed counters in three locations. Route 44, Main Street southbound, Route 44 Main Street northbound, Route 44 North Road. At that time, none of you knew that we were putting speed cameras up. They were disguised. In fact, one of them might have been a car parked on the side of the road that actually had the camera in there because one of the

007things that the board of selectmen had tasked me with was, "Paul, before we go down this path, what's the data?" And at that time the the city the town of Washington were the only ones and they had just employed their speed cameras about 30 days prior. There was no data. So we took the spring and the summer and we got our own data because I don't care what any other the towns are doing. I only care about what this town is doing. And what we found was that the Route 44 southbound camera and these cameras are up for about five six days. We had 55,000 uh vehicles go through that speed camera. 38,589 of them were speeding. That's almost 70%. The speed limit being 30 miles an hour. The average speed, which was great, 31.5,

00885 percentile was at 39% and the max speed being at 113 miles an hour. You can see as the data goes on, and I'm not going to kill everybody with the data points, but you can see going on to the next uh northbound side, 43,000 cars, 70% of the the the uh vehicles we're speeding, top speed, 98 miles an hour. Then we got the big outlier of of 33,000 vehicles, 76% and that top speed being 148 miles an hour. That was probably a motorcycle, >> probably in the middle of the night. If a vehicle went that fast, better be a good driver. I can't, you know, we dive right in and tell us it was a motorcycle, but that's a high rate of speed. Um, and I can tell you that these cameras, we're going

009to talk about it. We have Andrew here as well, how well they're calibrated and how accurate they are. So, another question that's come up is how much are these speed cameras going to cost the taxpayer? Let's boil it right down to what is this going to cost us? We have so many other issues that we need to fix in this town. Fix our roads, fix our sidewalks, fix schools, fix this, fix that. Well, I'm happy to report that it's not going to cost us a thing to employ these speed cameras in town. And that's not any snake oil or magic anything. We're going to walk through why that is. Back in the summer, we went out to an RFP process. proud that we were one of the only communities to actually go out to a

010formal RFP process. We uh requests for proposals were back in August of 2025. The full RFP is going to be or it still is available on our town's website, but if you want to look at what we were looking for, several pages, please when this gets loaded up on our website, click that here button and you're going to see the RFP that we listed. Um, our RFP saw a turnkey end to end uh solution to get these cameras out there. Vendor responsibility, site analysis, approval, installation, maintenance, calibration, citation process, and reporting. The town preferred a vendor that had a zerocost model that if we were going to go with it, we did not want to go out to our taxpayers and say, "We need x amount of dollars to fund these cameras." Coming back, we

011did receive four different companies that put in a proposal. Each one had various financial models, uh fixed fee models, revenue sharing models, license plate readers, add-ons, internal collection process, contracted collection. Um they had a lot of different ways that we can look at. There was an Excel sheet that I presented at the time to our board of selectmen and we whittleled it down to sight stream. um a lot of the proposals that came in left the town potentially paying out lots of money. It's a big liability um considering everything else that you know we we have to pay. So, at the end of the day, we brought in Sightstream. Um, and Sightstream, we felt the board of selectment felt was was the best option for the town. And why it is the best uh option

012for the town is there's no installation or maintenance cost, no liability for unpaid citations. Collection fees fully covered within the vendor's revenue share. Siteream is paid only after the town receives the payment for the citation. Each citation being 60 $65 $50 for the first defense $15 processing fee. Sitstream receives $35. Town receives $30. You can find out all about Sightream obviously once this website or once this presentation becomes available online. Andrew, before you you chime in because you're going to uh take over now. Um I want to let you guys know what we've done also with the process. So there were a few towns that employed speed cameras um before you know us and I had called some of those towns. I'm not going to name who they are and you can read about them

013in the paper and you could hear that in within the first 30 days this one particular town sent out $600,000 in tickets. So I talked to that mayor of that particular town. I said, "Wow, that's great. How much have you received?" Uh about 30,000. Uh oh. How much do you owe the company? About 120,000. I go, uhoh, you're upside down. So, there were some of the RFP, the proposals that came in that as soon as the particular company issued the citation, they were billing the town. Sightream does not do that. Sitream only gets paid if we get paid. With that, I'm going to turn it over to Andrew Nobo, who is the president of Sideream. >> Thank you, Mr. Harrington. Good evening, everybody. My name is Andrew Noble. It's nice to be here this evening.

014I'm hoping I can answer some questions for you as the the end of the presentation that Paul's going to give you outlines what the city is intending to do here. Um I'm based in Massachusetts just across the border. Uh I've been in the photo enforcement industry for just over 20 years now. Uh installing uh speed camera programs, red light running camera programs, school bus stop arm programs across the country. For the most part, uh, legislation in the US is about 27 28 states now, uh, for photo enforcement. I'm a committed advocate for road safety, and I'll come on to that at the, uh, at the end of my few slides here. Um, across the country, the Midwest, the eastern seabboard, the southeast states are predominantly red light and speed camera programs, and Connecticut became state

015number 26 when the legislation went to was put into place. Um other states have had photo enforcement for the last 2530 years. If you take the example of Florida, it had red light cameras uh since about 2008 2009 and then just two years ago added speed enforcement for school zones. Um and so we see photo enforcement growing across the country. Uh and I've worked across the country with photo enforcement. Now we're conscious of the way that our technology looks within a community. So [clears throat] we work very hard to make sure our cameras are blending in in the background. Um we have some great technology was extremely accurate that meets the international standards for traceability, speed, accuracy and data [clears throat] security that sadly we don't see here in the USA. But my cameras meet

016those specifications that do exist internationally to ensure that anyone that gets a ticket from any one of our cameras um is doing so because we can demonstrate the evidence we've used to gather uh against them in in process of that. So these are the cameras that will be installed here if the program goes forwards uh in Winston and Winchester. Um I said that said at the beginning I'm a committed advocate for road safety. One of my own sons was hit by a distracted driver some years ago. And so we take 1% of the money that we create from a program to cover our costs. We give it back to the community um without cost to the community for you to specifically use to give to your high schoolers to get more driving lessons, to get

017better driving lessons, to get live driving instructor driving lessons. I'm a committed advocate for that and sit here proudly today and say this will be part of the program in your community um if and when this goes forward. Happy to answer any other further questions on my company and the technology at the end of Mr. Harrington's presentation. >> Thank you, Mr. Noble. Um I think he's did a wonderful job. He's the president of the company, but he's also the creator of the cameras as well. And he can talk very extensively on the technology within the camera. when I sat down with a lot of the vendors that were out there. Um really like [clears throat] Andrew was a a great human being but could really talk shop when it came down to the camera. So

018for any of the technical people that are out there tonight and you want to get technical, we have the man here tonight that can can definitely answer your technical [clears throat] questions. Um now the allimp important stuff. Let's talk about the deployment of these cameras. So, how will I know and you know that you're entering a speed camera area? So, state law, right, going back to Connecticut General Statute 14-307C, we have to let you know a,000 ft before entering the speed zone that you are about to enter a speed limit photo enforcement zone. 1,000 ft before this thing's even coming anywhere near your car. Big sign. Not something that's going to be hidden behind a bush, a tree, another sign, big sign that says 1,000 feet from now, you're entering a speed enforcement zone. Then

019if you miss that one, we're going to give you another bite of the apple. We're going to do it at 500 ft. So one at 1,000, one at 500. And oh, full tell, I'm going to let you know where the three proposed cameras are going to go. These aren't going to be moved around town. We're going to let you clearly know where the first three cameras are being proposed. If they ever move from that location, there's a huge process and we're going to bring you in to let you know it, too. But we're going to let you know where the first three are going to be deployed. We're going to put a sign up a,000 ft before the camera. Then we're going to put up a sign 500 ft before the camera. Then, well, I'm

020jumping ahead because there's a 30-day grace period, but we're going to get to it. So, where are the locations being proposed? The first one is location one, Route 44 Main [clears throat] Street. You can see we try to spell that spell that spell that out on a Google map. You can see um exactly where we're looking to put the first camera. By the way, these camera um suggestions were not done by myself nor the board of selectment. The board of selectman said, "Let's ask our chief of police. He has the data. He knows where the speeding is." He talked to his entire team and these are the first three locations that they came back and said this is where we we should employ them. So this wasn't some random draw pick. This was done by

021our chief of police, the staff that works down there came back with these locations. And then of course we had to send them over to Andrew to make sure cameras could work there and and it all worked out. Second location, Route 44 Northfor [clears throat] Road, dry dam area. Um you can see exactly where that one's going as well. And then the third location is North Main Street, kind of right by the uh the sewer uh the sewer plant. A lot of speeding goes on down there. This one will be located roughly right around where the sewer plant's going to be. So those are the three locations that are going to start if all of this goes through. We're going to tell you where they are. We're going to tell you 1,000 ft before, 500

022feet before, no hidden. We're going to tell you every every every place that these are going to be. How much will the citations be? The first defense, $50 plus a $15 processing fee if you pay by credit card online. And we're going to talk about the online portal of how to pay these citations. Extra 3% $66.95. If you didn't learn your lesson, um, some people [clears throat] don't. Um, you get a second offense in the first 30 days. >> In the first 30 days. So, you sped through it on the first, you came back two weeks later and you still sped. We're going to up the ticket a little bit. You're going to go to $75 totaling out after the processing fee and if you pay by credit card, $92.70. [clears throat] >> If you

023really didn't learn and you speed a third time through it, we're just going to keep it at the $75. So 9270. So the highest fine, if you went through this thing a bunch of times in a 30-day period and you never slowed down, the highest fine will be $92.70. Never goes up from there. Mhm. >> How do you what? Okay, you got a citation in the mail. How do you pay it? So, it'll be a very uh [clears throat] easyto read citation that comes in the mail. You're going to click on review my notice.com. You can scan a QR code as well. You're going to enter your citation number, enter the PIN. It's all located on your document. It's also, you know, it's available on mobile or on a website if you're sitting at a

024laptop or a desktop or anything like that. and then you're going to be able to uh uh pay the ticket that way. Um how will the town how will the town use the collected revenue that is lockboxed by the state of Connecticut? So I just can't go out and you know um give the board of selectman big raises. Can't give myself a big raises. There are p specific areas that this the law dictates where any of these citation monies can go to. The first one to improve transportation mobility in the municipality. One of the loudest cheers that I hear is pave more roads, Paul. Pave more roads. This is a funding source to pave more roads. Keeping in mind, I'm letting you all know, but this is any out of town, any out of state

025um traffic that comes through. This doesn't, you know, pick up Winstead uh license plate. it picks up any traffic that's going on to invest in transportation infrastructure. Again, going back to paving more roads because at the end of the day, if you open up our budget, we put about [clears throat] $400,000 a year into pave roads. And I have some uh uh people up here on my board that can tell you it's probably close to a million dollar a mile to pave a road. $400,000 a year doesn't pave many roads. Um secondly, we can uh pay costs associated with the automatic enforcement devices themselves. Um so anything more police power uh staffing in the police department, we can pay for that through uh the citation uh uh money that is is raised. I received the

026citation. How can I fight it? You can. So part part of the law um is and and the ordinance as well is we will have a citate citation hearing officer. You can actually say well wait a minute I wasn't meas and when we send you the citation we're going to show you your license plate. We're going to show you the time of day that you drove through it. Um but let's say you let your sister drive the car. This was a big one. You let your sister drive the car. At the citation hearing, you can then transfer that citation to your sister. But after a certain period of time, if your sister didn't pay it, guess who it's coming back to? Coming back to the owner of the vehicle. So, one of the things that

027if you let a friend, a neighbor, a family member borrow your car, you can actually uh appeal the citation and ship it off to that person that drove your vehicle that time. But keeping in mind the liability ultimate rests with you if that individual that you let borrow your car did not pay it. And then if you didn't like what the citation hearing officer gave you a as a ruling, you can actually appeal it to the court system. So you have two two bites of the apple. If you didn't want to pay your citation, you can come to our citation hearing and talk with our officer or didn't like what the officer had to say, you can actually appeal it to the Connecticut general uh judicial branch. [clears throat] Um, citation enforcement, uh, police department

028employees and the local traffic, uh, local traffic authority, that's me, um, has the only rights to approve if you get a ticket. So, these machines, take a photo of your license plate. Before you get the citation, there needs to be myself. I'm going to be honest with you, I'm way too busy. It's probably not going to be me. It will be our sworn police officers that do it. Um, or anybody else that I may appoint, but they will be a very qualified individual that say, "Okay, issue the ticket or don't issue the ticket." So, it has to go through an approval process. It's just not an automatic gotcha, gotcha, gotcha. There are eyes on [clears throat] every single image to either approve it or disapprove it before you're issued any type of citation. And for

029the first 30 days, so again going back to what I had said earlier, going to tell you where the cameras are going to be. Going to put a sign up,000 ft before, going to put sign up 500 ft before. And the first 30 days when these cameras first go up, all you get is a warning. All you get is a warning. By state law, that's all we can issue for the first 30 days. So, yet another measure to just remind everybody, hey, you got to slow down in this area. You can't speed. [clears throat] What's the schedule? So, going backwards to then go forwards. Back on August of 2025, we issued the RFP. The end of August, the RFP deadline. We reviewed the proposals back in September. The town uh accepted Sightream overwhelmingly with the

030board of selectment at the time. On December 1st, the board of Selecman held its first ordinance meeting. On December 15th, just this past Monday, we had our second ordinance meeting. Tonight, December 18th, we have our public hearing required in order to submit all this documentation to Connecticut DOT. Connecticut DOT has to sign off on us putting cameras up. Not because they're going on a state road. I can put them on any road, but the DOT has to sign off. And that's the next process once we get through the January 5th meeting. On January, we're going to submit to CT DOT to get their approval to install these three cameras. They have 60 days from then to either approve or deny to put the cameras up. April 2026, roughly our timeline of when we think these

031cameras will actually be installed. And then anytime between that April May time frame, that first 30 days, um it's only warnings that get issued. And again, we're not just going to put the sign up. You're going to hear about it on social media. You're going to hear about it on our website. I'm going to make sure everybody's fully aware that these cameras are up. The clock starts now, when the 30 days is up, and then when citations can be issued. Um after the 30-day grace period, again, fines will begin. um annually, uh cameras get calibrated, reverification by certified operators. That's going to be, you know, every year. October 2027, we have to submit a report to the DOT to show the performance of the cameras. And then April of 2029, we have to submit again

032if we want to keep the cameras up to the DOT. So, we're constantly in conversations with the DOT, showing them information, everything to make sure, you know, these things are working properly and to make sure the DOT thinks these cameras are are are working properly and are slowing traffic down or or not. The DOT in April 29 can say, "Nope, you got to go move them somewhere else." We'll obviously let you all know if they do get moved. Um, but right now, we're projected for these three. Um, we can install as many cameras [clears throat] as we want. I've gotten phone calls. Can you put one on my street? >> Well, the answer is I see a gentleman out there. Is it me? The answer to that is yes. But instead of creating a colossal,

033oh wow, we got a little we got over our skis on this one. Let's get three. Let's get our feet underneath us. Let's see how everybody works it. Let's see how internally it works. And then [clears throat] from there, we can make decisions down the road if we want to employ more. Listen, school zones, who would say this is a bad idea in a school zone? I mean, we we want our kids safe. School zones will be probably the next area we go once we get our legs underneath us. It's not going to take us long to get our legs underneath us. But we install a new camera. Same thing applies. 1,000 ft, 500 ft, first 30 days. All the same metrics apply even when we install more cameras down the road. If we install

034more cameras down the road, um that's the presentation. I know one select person may be very happy because I got it done in 20 minutes. Um maybe 21 minutes. Um so uh um with that I do wanted to open up for questions and answers. I'm going to need you to come up because I think our viewing audience at home may be large or down the road when somebody has a little bit of break, kids are in bed, they may go back and watch this video. You're gonna come up. First person I'm gonna have turn the microphone on and I'm just going to leave the microphone on, but I need you to no shouting from the out. Just come on up to the table, ask your question and either I Mr. Noble will answer or possibly

035a board of selectment member can answer it as well. So who who wants to go? Come on up, sir. >> Oh, sorry. I'm sorry. >> Before you come up, actually you can start making your way up. Uh any selectman? >> Did the board want to I I'm Does the board want to make any comment to the public before we >> I just wanted to make a quick comment before we open it up to the public? And um First of all, so we the one thing we hear from our businesses in town regularly is the safety of crossing the road. All of us that patronize down here visiting the shops or the restaurants know that parking is a challenge to begin with and then crossing the road is is, you know, sometimes take your life in

036your hands, particularly if you're on one of the corners and these cars come, you know, zooming by. So, there's lots of ideas and and not surprisingly when we scheduled this public hearing, social media has been a buzz about this topic and there's been plenty of comments and plenty of things to read. So, I wanted to just maybe address a few of the things that that were on social media that you may have as a question and maybe we'll answer that for you. But first, changing Main Street, changing 44. And I for one, and this this board will take it up at some point, but I for one would certainly like to take a hard look at 44 and our main street. Could it go down to two lanes like most of what we know 44

037is? Why ours happens to be four? Well, I wasn't around for the history of that, but perhaps dieting this down back to two lanes, creating better parking. All of these things are things that we'd like to look at. The state controls it. We can ask, we can submit plans and ultimately if they agree to it, we might be able to make a change, but that is years before something like that could possibly be done. I hear about let's get lighted crosswalks. That's on our agenda. Actually, that's on our list of things to do. Again, state DOT approval. Don't know how many years or how long that would take to do, but it's something we would like to do because that will slow people down. And if you're crossing in those areas, clearly that's a a

038a a safer situation. But again, not not tomorrow. Funding from these cameras can pay for things like these crosswalks or the studies or the things that we need to do to try to improve our our main street. Um but we need to take a hard look at that and it's something that this board certainly takes to heart because we all know that there are issues with with safety. Finally, the camera ordinance that has been um written and that we are now two meetings into in tonight's public hearing goes back, as Paul pointed out, I think it was what, the spring of last year when we started this process, uh August of last year, and that was with the previous board. And I can tell you, if memory serves, this has been a bipartisan and unanimous

039um board on [clears throat] this topic. uh we all believe it's important and um it's why we're here tonight. And you know, even though and I've heard this comment, we're not going to tick it unless it's 10 miles an hour over. And that's true. We don't issue a citation unless it's 10 miles over. But the fact that the cameras are here and people become aware of it. You're not going to slow down mentally to 39 just not to get a ticket. People will slow down to the speed limit. And ultimately, that's what we're trying to accomplish here. We want Main Street to be safer. We want the people to that own businesses here to have their customers, their patrons be able to come in and visit them safely. And that's really why we're here tonight.

040So, thank you. Come on up. >> You know, Mr. Marino, if I may, you hit an excellent point [clears throat] that I actually didn't I think hit hard enough in the presentation. So, where these cameras go, um, you are not issued a citation unless it's 10 miles an hour or above the posted speed limit. So, if it's 33 miles an hour that you're you're you're driving through the speed zone, no warning, no citation, no picture of your license plate, it's 10 miles an hour or above. And whether you're with these cameras, against these cameras, I think everybody can probably agree 10 miles an hour over the speed limit, you're moving a little bit faster than you probably should. There's a reason why there's the speed limit. So, no warning, no citation unless you're 10 miles

041an hour above the posted speed limit. Um, the person doing now the the the unfortunate part. The person doing 148 miles an hour and the person doing 40 m hour in the 30 mph zone gets the same ticket. Sorry, that's the way the statute was written. But no ticket, no warning until you 10 miles an hour or above the speed. >> I'd like to just So before I became a member of the board of select men, I actually am business owner on Main Street and I along with this group, women business owners of Winstead create a petition. We went and spoke to every business owner on Main Street and every single one of them signed a petition about getting speed cameras, working on other issues, including crosswalks and parking. Every person we spoke to was

042very concerned about the safety of their own people, themselves, and their customers. This is a serious issue. Um, you know, I've seen, you know, concerns on social media saying, "Well, why don't we just have the police officer out there?" Well, I think you know, Selectman Marino can speak to his experience doing ride alongs. They're busy and to hire more police officers is going to cost a lot of money. If we're going to have them just as a presence in these high-speed areas, we we can't afford it as a town. We can't. >> That's that's the reality. Unless you want your taxes raised, which none of us want. So, this is a solution. So, I came to this board of selectman. I sat down. I told them about the statute and I said, "We can do

043this. Other towns are looking at it. Let's do it." [clears throat] They took the responsible course of action to investigate it, find a good company, and I'm on board with this even though I wasn't part of the decision-making at the time, but I agree with this. And I agree with this as a business owner, as a resident, as a person that walks walks around the streets and tries to cross the streets. It is important. We have to maintain some safety. I sit there in our in our establishment on Main Street and I see cars zipping by, zipping by so fast. Sometimes it's like and there are cars, there's motorcycles, there's trucks, there's all sorts of things that's dangerous. We have enough issues with the lighting which needs to be addressed >> and we will address

044it. But in the meantime, this is a good fix that's going to give us the ability to do [clears throat] more for the community and make our main street better and other communities. I know there's Winchester Center problems, speeding problems. There's lots of areas. We're starting with the most obvious and hopefully this will get approved and we will move forward and make all of our streets safe. >> Slman Bishop. >> Um, [clears throat] yes. So, I just wanted to say that, you know, I'm I'm new to the board and when I came on, I asked a lot of questions. Uh, Mr. Town [snorts] Manager Harrington can tell you that I asked a whole lot of questions, including at the meetings. Um, I really wanted to find out everything I could about this. Um, you know,

045I had concerns. I just want to say that, you know, the there are pros and cons to everything, but the the safety aspect of this is, you know, is paramount. I mean, I I see so much talk in the community about as as select Hefern and Legend uh mentioned about, you know, crossing the street safety. It's been an issue for a long time. I just want to say I being new here, I asked all the questions. As you know, a lot of this happened before, you know, the the current board [clears throat] I am fully in support. I mean, it's not a partisan thing. I mean, it's a safety thing. I I think we're all we're all on board. Um, you know, I got to dig in. I got lots of answers. It all makes

046sense to me. I can see no reason to be against it and it's it's a good thing for our community in so many ways. It's my hope that we pass this and sorry Andrew make zero dollars on this, [clears throat] but traffic for some reason won't slow down, especially on Main Street. With that, I'll open it up to the audience. Any speakers, please give your name. >> Gentleman in a gray sweatshirt. We've we've cut him off like five times. We got him. >> When you come up, just press the um the side of the microphone till it turns green. When a little microphone, >> a little mic's blinking at you. I I figure if somebody's got a >> Please do state your >> said it one time. >> Yeah, there you go. >> And do

047state your name and address for the record, please. >> Uh Jody Hicks, uh 134 Danbury Quarter Road in Winston, which by the way is a raceway. Just if anybody's paying attention, um I I I actually had two questions. First, I want to say that's a wonderful presentation you did. Answered 98% of my questions. the two questions I had uh will if if somebody gets a citation u is it going to count as points on their license or affect their insurance? Those are the two big slaps that people get. Uh and um the uh I forgot my second question. Uh oh, most important question is actually the reason why we're all here. In the research that you did which was very thorough was there any reduction in speeding and that's the that that's the objective of

048the entire program. >> So let me I get the fun answer you get the more technical answer. >> Um so as far as it goes [clears throat] to points on your license insurance no it is a a a local citation which does not report to your insurance. It does not report to DMV. there is no points that go on your license uh if you receive a citation. So, and as for the second one, reduction in speed, I'm going to turn it over to the expert, Mr. Noble. >> Yeah. And just to to um expand on on Mr. Harrington's answer there, all of the programs are working across the USA are civil infraction programs. None of the programs working across this country report to the DMV or on your license or your insurance companies. And in

049particular for Connecticut, the legislation was written in such a way that the data captured can only be used for the provision of the civil infraction of this particular town and this particular ticket. It cannot be used for any other purposes whatsoever. Um, as for reduction in traffic, certainly over the the 20 uh more than 20 years I've seen in this industry of running programs, typically you see a reduction of between 30 and 40% within the first four to six months of a program going live. Now, every town's different, every traffic flow is a little bit different. So, there's no one-sizefits all uh answer, but typically between 30 and 40% reduction speeding within four to six months during the warning phase. And if people are getting a normal citation, but for $0, they typically, you'd like

050to think they use it as an opportunity to start driving slower, but you really don't see the reduction in speeding until the real citations start going out carrying that $50 fine. But you do re you do get a reduction in time. >> The black coat. Come on up. >> You mind if I seat? >> Go right ahead. >> I have um a few questions and concerns. One with signage. So um two signs for each light. So that would be six signs. Correct. >> Each direction. >> Yeah, definitely in each direction. So, if you have a camera, you know, facing one direction, you're going to get the thousand feet sign, the 500 seat sign. On the opposite side, you're obviously going to get one and one. So, that would be four. I'm not sure where we're

051getting six. >> Oh, you said you three camera. >> Yes, it's four per [clears throat] camera because we'll have them going per >> because we'll have them going in both directions. >> So, it would make sense if you were heading in one direction that you would want to know that you're about to enter the speed zone. So, we have to put the sign on that side of the street and then a sign on the other side of the street when you're coming back from wherever you're going that you're entering the speed zone again. >> That excessive signage. >> So, that's one comment I had that how's that going to make the town look safety more important, but I still want that kept in mind. >> The signs are actually state statute. They require that. >>

052Yeah, I saw that. But still, so that goes along with this whole thing and that's something to consider too. And also, um, one comment I have, I don't see that much or tell tell me what has been done to slow down speeders up to this point. >> Chief, um, do you want to you're going to have to come up so they can hear you on microphone. Um, >> yeah. Chief, >> slide that way over though, Troy, because it's it's hard to Oh, there you go. There you go. Thank you. >> That's a good question. Uh we this program is not replacing our traffic enforcement efforts. It's actually supplementing it. So, um routinely we have uh supervisors assigned to the traffic function, handle all kinds of traffic matters, and we look at data just like that

053was presented here today. Where where are we getting complaints? where are we getting serious crashes, speed related crashes, and we target our enforcement efforts in those areas. So, I can tell you predominantly in the past year, we focus strictly on Main Street, Route 44, this strip right out here, and um the old Route 8 North up by the sewer uh sewer plant last week. >> Yeah. And we also have a grant, a 100% reimburseable grant that we're using. [clears throat] Um, it's called the Rural Road Enforcement Grant and we're putting officers out on overtime again because that there's only so much discretionary time they have in a day to do traffic enforcement. It's part of their daily duties and we've neglected other areas. Um, Danberry Quarter Road, um, Winchester Center. Like my phone does not

054stop ringing about speeding complaints and they're legitimate. And what this will do, it'll help us um hit some of those other areas because they're not out on these locations. Um and that's predominantly where they've been. So our our our process is is uh ongoing, constantly evaluating and um what we like about these programs are um they change behavior. They reduce people's behavior. uh they reduce uh driving behaviors, speeds, and speed related crashes come down. >> So, uh we're in 100% support of it. Um it was a no-brainer uh as far as I'm concerned in selecting Sightstream. Their staff has been great to work with and um I hope I answered your question. >> Uh more or less. But um how about this? What else besides speed cameras can work like a public campaign? Please slow

055down for one mile. One mile through Main Street. >> Yeah, there's lots of things we can do. Um but part of the thing and one of the visions we have is funding a traffic officer position that's responsible for a lot of things. Education on social media, crosswalks dedicated to just doing traffic enforcement and programs like this can actually fund that. So, >> but you don't know you're going to have money left over to fund it. So >> we don't we don't but that would be a benefit one of the benefits of it. Um the other thing is is traffic engineering if we had that dedicated position um they can work with our local engineers, high rate crews, public works to look at roadway designs, traffic calming measures and things like that. But right now, we

056don't have the staff to do that and to dedicate a full-time traffic officer to handle all traffic complaints, engineering, calming measures. >> Why is um the speed limit 35 on Raleigh Road going past a playground, ball fields, and a cemetery? Doesn't that seem a little high? >> Again, like if we So, anytime we get any type of traffic complaint, we assign an officer to investigate it. So, like if you had called and say with that complaint, someone would go out, take the report, look at it, contact the state, find out if it's a state road, local road, what can we do? Is this proper? We'd probably do speed studies. They'd have to deploy counters to see if if it justified a higher um uh a higher limit or lower limit or if it's if it's

057correct. >> One more question. >> Yeah. How do you feel about someone getting the same ticket, the same price, you know, cost, going 10 miles over the speed limit, someone going 148? That's just criminal. Come on. >> I don't think it makes a difference. Paying a fine changes behavior. >> So, um I mean, if you pass a speeding uh uh uh school bus with the stop bars out, that's like a $500 ticket. >> That that changes behavior. >> But that may not be taught on any of these cameras. this will change behavior and we we basically just have to comply with the the law. That's kind of what the law >> hasn't changed behavior in Washington. They're still going through those feeding through those red lights. That's what I heard. >> I haven't seen Washington's

058data, but um I'd like to see [clears throat] our own. >> Um and >> Oh, so some reasons why and and for our safety every time I park on Main Street, [clears throat] Sometimes you have blind spots as a driver parked that you can't even see a car coming that's about to come by when you're getting ready to open your door whether you're um they're going to speed limit or not. So, and that's just one other issue I want to mention and that's all I want to >> um you're free to I I think um you hit some um very important topics that I think a few people I had had some whispering going on that they want to expand upon even after what our chief said. Um so please feel free to stay here

059or not but they're going to even answer your questions even more with some real world stuff. So first [clears throat] >> what was your name for the record? Sylvestri >> and what street? >> Horn Avenue. >> Thank you. >> Um the first one I'm going to first first I'm going to turn [clears throat] over is Mr. Marino because he has a a real world example that just happened two weeks ago and then I'm going to turn over to uh Mr. Noble because I think you your questions were important questions. Um, and I think even some more information uh to those questions is just going to help not only you but even some of our people uh in our community as well. So, Mr. Marino, real world example if if you may. So, uh when we

060started this process and we looked at public safety in general, I uh over the last several months I've had an opportunity to ride with our police officers on three different occasions. And most recently, two Saturday nights ago, I rode the second shift, so 4 to midnight shift. and um spent the evening with our sergeant out patrolling. And what I learned is this. First of all, we don't have 20 officers on every shift. Typically at that time of day on a weekend, we have four officers on shift from 4 to midnight on on a weekend evening. And the minute we got there, the minute I got there, calls were coming in literally every 20 minutes. All four officers were deployed to different calls. I went on an assault case with the sergeant. We had two officers

061there. Um it was a dangerous situation. I went to a um a wellness check. Someone had threatened to hurt themselves and was going to commit suicide. Our night went on and on without a break. We did stop at one point and set up on Main Street to run radar. We got 10 minutes in before the next call came that we had to abandon and run to a more pressing emergency. So the police want to patrol this. Absolutely. But with four people on an average shift and and chief, you can jump in there, but your daytime shift probably has a few more than than four at night. >> Our minimum is a supervisor of two officers. That's typical of any shift. So you actually had an extra. >> So it's typically three, >> right? So we

062even had one extra that night and we couldn't we couldn't catch up. And then if you actually make an arrest and have to bring someone into the police department, one of the officers has to stay in the police department uh and keep an eye on the prisoner. They're obligated to check the prisoner every 15 minutes. Now, we'd have two on the streets. So, the challenge we have is we can't maintain enough coverage running radar and take care of the hundreds of other calls that come in. And and that experience I had that Saturday night changed my thinking completely on on how many officers we have, part of it, but also, you know, I've been asked this question a million times. Not a million, but I've been asked this question many times by lots of the

063residents. Why aren't the police out there setting up radar? they do when they can, but they're very busy with lots of other calls and serious emergencies. So, hopefully that gives you a little more insight. >> Yeah, I think um speed speed slowing the speed is going to take care of a lot of other driving kind of issues. Um, one thing that I think is a habit around this area is you take a left-hand turn, they go in a breakdown lane and go around you all the time. So, how would something like that be handled? That's not gonna be something that's caught on a speed, >> right? Yeah. I mean, and again, I'm not [clears throat] the expert on that, but my my u my answer to that would be speeding is the first thing we

064want to take care of. >> And if the officers aren't having to stop and run radar, perhaps they're going to follow those people that make those illegal turns uh and do the things that you're talking about. >> So, they are running radar now >> that when they can. Absolutely. >> Which is like how often? I can't tell you exactly how I can tell you that night that I was there, we only got 10 minutes in and the other officers had no time either. We had two motor vehicle accidents that night. So, it was just um it's what they experience often. >> Chief, 9,000 calls a year still for our officers. >> Uh I think we're over 10,000 this year. >> Yeah. >> So, for at home because the mic's not going to pick you up.

065over 10,000 calls uh this year uh for calls of uh service for our police officers. Uh Mr. Noble, I know you wanted to even just quickly, one of your uh merited questions was what else could the town do to address the speeding issue um outside of speed cams. Some time ago, Winchester put in uh flashing speed signs on Route 44, northbound and southbound. They've been there for quite some time. Um everyone can clearly see them, residents, commuters, visitors alike. And yet at those same locations we saw 70% of the cars were speeding. So I think the town and others have [clears throat] gone to a great deal of effort in some ways to alert speeding to the drivers and to reduce in town. But at some point it's the cameras that can make a difference.

066That's what >> I wonder how much those speed signs have helped. I'm sure they've helped some. >> But were those excessive speeders or just going a couple miles per hour over the speed limit? What do you think the ones you saw? >> We the analysis done by the town before before this meeting was with a different type of analysis system not from those speed signs and it was finding independently 70% of the cars going past were speeding. >> But I thought you said you were you had monitor Oh, never mind. Okay. I don't want to get [clears throat and snorts] off track. I know some other people probably want to talk. Thanks for your time. >> Thank you. Anyone else wish to speak? >> Mayor, I'm going to have to leave. I'm so sorry. [clears

067throat] >> Hello everybody. Salvatore Joseph Levet III, 103 and a half Sucker Brook Road, Winston, Connecticut. I'm here tonight to strongly urge this board to reject speeding cameras in Winston. I view it as government overreach. In the words of the great Benjamin Franklin, those who would give up their essential liberty to purchase a literal temporary safety deserve neither liberty or safety. This is a country our sixth amendment clearly states you have the right to face your accuser and be confronted with the witness against you. A machine cannot testify against you. You cannot cross-examine a machine. This is simply technology whose calibration is not constantly tested. Okay? Okay. And it's not proven to the people, it will simply take a picture of your car and issue you a fine. A fine in which that the people

068who create this camera will get a cut of, which I view as horrendous. Um, we are told these cameras will be only used for speeding, nothing more. Just just speeding. Nothing nefarious as a foot. How many people here would deny that their own cell phones, smart TVs, smart cars, and smart devices are collecting information against them, against their will? We all know they are. Okay, everybody knows that. Uh, I want to remind this board of the constant government overreach that we were told was in the name of public safety, the Patriot Act, the creation of the NSA, and so on. Uh, this is not going to protect us. it will only further oppress us into a technocracy. Um, lastly, I would like to ask the gentleman here where he's from. >> Where are you from,

069sir? >> Originally, United Kingdom. Been living here about 23 years. >> Great. So, just as a reminder to anyone in this town, anyone in this state, if you speed in Winston, you will be paying a tax back to where we came from, back across the pond. Absurd. All right. We fought the revolutionary war against this. I don't want to pay a tax or speeding to a technocrat, you know, across across the world away. That's not correct. That's not right. I fully support our police. I fully support safety in the town. I think everybody does. This is not the way to do it. Thank you very much. Who >> else would like to speak? Okay. Christopher King, 103 Spencer Hill Road. Um, some some questions. Is is Washington a a sight stream client? >> It is.

070No. >> Okay. So, I don't know if anyone can answer this question. Um, part of the parameters and criteria that have been put out is that the camera calibrations are good for a year. I was wondering, probably nobody knows, but why does Washington calibrate their cameras so often if it's supposed to be good for a year? >> I don't know the and I've talked to a lot of the mayors and first select men who have deployed it. That was uh not a question I asked because I was unaware that they were uh recalibrating them on a on a regular basis. I know, you know, speaking with Andrew who, uh, made these cameras, um, and how well they perform and operate in other communities that he is in. They're not out there recalibrating these cameras on

071a regular basis. I unfortunately forgot the company that they uh, Washington ultimately went with, but [clears throat] I have no problem picking up the phone and trying to find that answer out. >> Yeah. Because I know they're they do they have calraed multiple times within 12 months. So, um, another one is what happens, so the data that you presented, 70% of our local drivers are speeders, which means 70% of our municipal employee drivers are speeders. What happens when a municipal employee gets picked up on a camera? >> That's a great question. I'm looking forward to seeing those municipal employees get the ticket because, as we've said, that citation can be moved. be a very tough conversation for a municipal employee when I hand them the citation and said because we know who's assigned to what

072truck, right? We know everybody's assigned a truck. Truck number 14 goes buzzing down Main Street for no apparent reason. um they're going to have a nice one-on-one answer with me and I'm going to put uh citation right on the municipal employee [clears throat] because they spent just like as if if our officers pulled them over in a municipal vehicle and they [clears throat] were doing 65 and a 20. Guess who's getting the ticket? The municipal employee. I'm turning that citation right over to the municipal employee. I expect our staff to obey the loss. And if they don't pay in a reasonable time, the town is ultimately liable for it. I think they'll pay. >> I have no question about I think they'll pay. >> Just to uh clarify that you presented, >> right? >> So

07370% of driver speed, >> right? >> Seven out of 10 municipal employees speed. >> Now, now, now, Mr. thing. You you did bring up a very good example and I want to be perfectly clear on that example as well. We have our own police cruisers and fire trucks and fire vehicles that may at times be at high rates of speed. This goes back to the double check system that we can find out, okay, should we issue that municipal employee a citation or were they on their way to a medical call? >> Things we have to find out. Yeah, I'm aware that a civilian also has that same exception if they correct. They can get that. Okay. >> Um Yeah, cuz like I think in Washington again a school bus got a ticket. So who was

074wrong? The school bus or the camera? >> They decided it was the camera. Um, how did we select the vendor before we have an ordinance approving this? >> We Well, the town would be free to go up to RFP on any of them, but all the the if the ordinance doesn't get passed, the vendor goes [clears throat] away because we wouldn't have an ordinance in order to stick these cameras up. So, all of the work that Sitream has done has been free of charge. Um there has not been any invoices uh paid or been given uh from Sight Stream to us. In fact, we just spoke Tuesday. They're not even set up uh in our system as a vendor. Um we actually do want to set them up. Have absolutely zero plans of ever sending

075them a check, but we just felt that we do want to get their W9 form just so they're a vendor in the system. But in order to really get the process going, educate ourselves more, Citream came in here absolutely free [clears throat] on the dime and did all of this, including the study that was done originally that showed us our data. That was all free of charge. But again, if the ordinance doesn't pass, Site Stream goes away. >> Okay. Because you've repeatedly said you've already selected the vendor. We so we're not >> so the ordinance passes because we went to RP. We had four companies that that bid this um they were the front runner because of the program that they offered. But at the end of the day, if the ordinance does not pass,

076there's nothing that sit can do here. They can't put a camera up because we don't have an ordinance that allows it. If DOT rejects the plan, they don't have a camera to put up here. Um, in a previous meeting that I was at, you mentioned you might assign multiple people to review the large number of citations that come through. How would you ensure equal [clears throat] application of standards to people who are in different roles like one could be a sworn officer, one could be in the town manager's office or whatever um you know the school bus, you know, but how how do you ensure equal application of the standards if multiple people in multiple positions will be charged with reviewing this process? >> Those people that'll be signed will be most likely sworn officers.

077Um, as I said, uh, by nature of the statue, I do get to, uh, approve or deny it. I have news for it. It will not be me. And then, keeping in mind the citation officer is one individual that decides if the fine sticks or not, but we are going to keep this very professional. I'm not just going to bring somebody off the street to say, "All right, well, it's a random Tuesday. You approve or disapprove tickets." We're going to do this professionally and we're going to make sure that they're sworn officers that obviously have to uphold the law that they're the ones that are going to be reviewing the tickets. As I told you before meeting, I do actually oppose this, but as a good friend of mine once said, he feels the macaroni

078is already cooked on this one. So, um I may just submit a letter to you giving you my thoughts and instead of just pontificating. Thank you. >> Thank you, >> Mr. Noble. Before we bring up the next person, um, Dacch seems to be I don't mean to put you on the spot, but Dacch seems to be the camera company that Washington Connecticut went with. Don't know if you can speak to the the competitive uh cameras and the other ones that are on the market, but why theirs would might need calibration more than yours. Is there anything you can speak to on that? >> My my understanding is um Washington actually purchased the camera from a Canadian company called Logitech. Um, I believe they spent about $29,000 for that purchase and then they partnered with another

079company, Dacitech, to actually run the operating program. Um, that was my understanding of how that program works. >> Do those cameras uh Logitech need calibration more often than yours? >> I don't know much about them. It's not a camera we typically see in this industry. >> Okay. [clears throat] >> I had a question that going off of the previous speaker. Could you tell us more? I you touched on it briefly, either one of you. Tell us about the [clears throat] um how any data collected is saved, used, where it goes, the privacy concerns. >> I'm like, uh Mr. No will take it first and then if I have to chime in, I will. But I think he's going to knock it out of the park with that. >> We'll see. Um so the the the

080data has to be kept in a in a certain way and only for the use of this program. We house our data for your program at an organization called Enlets. Enletch is the national law enforcement telecommunications um system. It's where all the law enforcement information across the country is collated and kept. It's also where all the uh motor vehicle bureaus send their register owner information on a daily basis. We host our servers inside endless rather than hosting our own data in our own offices in Massachusetts or in a cloud server somewhere in Amazon web space. We actually host our data inside servers that we rent from endlets directly. So your data which can only be used for this program is housed withinlets and endlets itself is part of the criminal justice information system in the

081US governed by the FBI and Department of Justice. So that's how the data and where the data is used. >> Thank you. >> Do you know how long the data is retained? >> Data is retained for one year. >> Uh state legislation uh changed about six months ago in Connecticut and so we can keep it for one year and then we have to expunge the data >> and there'll be no comment for me because both of them just knocked it out of the park. So, um >> yeah, I wanted to touch that, um it was only for a year and they are secure server uh uh uh data centers that they're not just stored on, you know, Mr. Noble's uh uh >> laptop, >> a laptop over here. Um and he leaves it at the

082airport and now everybody's got your license plate. But I think also important to Sug Bishop's point, the only image that's captured is your license plate. That is the only image, not you driving the car. Just the image of your license plate. That's it. >> Who else wishes to speak? >> Mr. Platt. I think you all know me, but for the record, my name is Willard Platt, West Wakefield Boulevard. I have a question about the North Main Route 8 North selection for a camera site. That road has a high traffic count for out of state vehicles. New York, all kinds of place that has huge amount of trailer trucks that go on that road. A lot of them are international. What will compel these people to pay these fines if they're from out of state? >>

083I can start and then I'm going to let Mr. uh Mr. Noble. So, um we give you obviously the citation. Uh the citation's mailed to you. If it goes uh unresponsive, a collection agency is brought in um in order to uh um try and collect the the dollar amount. >> Okay. I just see a lot of out of state vehicles there and I just see a high potential for not paying and maybe another site might be a better location. >> Andrew, we spoke on and I I think we can give the data out. Um [clears throat] what's the percentage of roughly uh the collection rate? >> Uh typically um in a state with enabling legislation like this, you see the initial collection rate between 75 and 80% and it goes higher from there on second

084notices and then the third party collections company gets involved too. Uh and then some legislation across the country in some states they start adding a registration hold on vehicles for instate violations that haven't been paid. That's not the case in Connecticut at this time, but I know it's being talked about uh at the state house. >> So to repeat, it's 75% when the citations originally issued and then on the second issuance, it ticks up and then when the collection agency's brought in, it ticks up even more. So, you know, ballpark figure, you're you're you're in a 90 90% uh collection rate on these citations. >> Anyone else? Brian. Uh Brian Sunundy, 152 Spencer Hill Road. Um I'm I'm philosophically opposed to uh to these cameras. So no possible way that I'm really going to get

085one over here, but uh you know uh as the previous speaker said, it appears like the macaroni's cooked here uh coming into this. I mean, I don't know how for for the folks watching at home, I don't know how we come into a public hearing. We're talking about an ordinance and we have the vendor uh sitting at the table with us. You know, the individual is going to be making the money off this doing the presentation. Uh people who have concerns about speed cameras, people who want them, whatever. Uh how can the folks at home not feel like uh uh the macaroni is already cooked coming into this? You look at the presentation, there's a schedule, there's exclamation points. We see the document online where you've analyzed the or someone has analyzed the speeds, which

086frankly I don't find the numbers like particularly compelling. uh at all. There's a couple clickbait speeds, but the rest, you know, I'm not a mathematician, but tell me, you know, if the average speed is 32 miles an hour in in the 30 mph zone, I mean, I don't know. I don't think we need to uh have a turbocharged ticketing system uh uh to deal with that. But I I'm just, you know, I'm like shocked that that the vendor here is at the table that we It's like cart before the horse, if you ask me. Um and the more we talk about this, the more you guys about the more problems uh I have with it. Um but I am curious about the collection aspect. You know I I see online it's uh hey it's just

087like a parking ticket. No big deal. Uh we are outsourcing our public safety criminal justice process to a uh uh to an army of vendors and collection agencies. we are now going to subject people uh we're inserting aggressive collection debt collection agencies into their lives which listen uh I don't agree with. I think we have enough government in our lives. We should have less government in our lives. Uh I think a lot of the folks uh at the table who often uh run for office say things like that. But we are uh going down a major road here, a big policy decision. Um, and you know, quite frankly, I I haven't seen every minute of all of these meetings having to do with speed cameras, but I do feel like uh you guys haven't necessarily

088uh asked uh a lot of questions uh of of the police. I mean, I am glad to see there [clears throat] are some questions tonight about what have we done so far. I could be wrong. Maybe I missed something. Tonight was the first thing I heard anything about police calls. You know what I mean? There's been no discussion of what our police are up to. Why can't we do it? Uh anecdotally, I see online all the time why we need these people are dying. Pedestrians are getting hit all the time. It it sounds like we live in Beirut. Uh I I'd like some information about uh that side of things. Like what actually has happened? Are they related to speeds? These specific, you know, specific cases like what's been going on? Like I feel like

089uh and and I know this uh uh ruffles feathers when people say it. Uh, I do feel like this is a bit of a revenue grab. It's not my main concern. Okay. I understand that towns, all of you guys, everyone, you're under pressure. You need revenue to run the town. Uh, I do appreciate tonight that you did say this is a uh a source of funds to pave roads, which, you know, for me, I see that for what it is. You know, I do believe it's a revenue generator uh with the uh the cover of safety over it. Uh I could talk on this for a long time, but I I do have many more concerns. Uh so I I don't know if you have anything to say about [clears throat] the collection agency side

090of things, how you get paid. Uh what companies do you have intern in-house debt collectors? Do you contract those out? And you know, to the town manager, if you would like to just speak to the the concept of uh of choosing the vendor, having the vendor here before the public hearing before everyone's already decided. I mean, if someone's watching at home, how can you not feel like uh the macaroni is is is cooked on this. Thanks. I appreciate it. Thanks for listening. >> Um do you want to speak on collection and I'll >> uh you can go back, but I want I'll hear them all. Yeah, >> thanks. >> Yeah, we we don't have an internal collections house. Um, typically at the point uh where a debt becomes delinquent, it's ready for collections. It's turned

091over to the city or the town themselves to pass to their in-house collections or their outsource collections agency. We'll work with any company they ask us to send the data to. Um, and if they have not won a particular um uh relationship, then there's several other companies in this space that we would refer them to as well. But we don't handle it ourselves. That's past another company. And as far as uh the vendor being here present tonight, this board did something very unique going back to the spring of 2025 [clears throat] and it was select that asked me for data and I said well select poso that's going to be hard because there is no data. I then reached out to a bunch of companies to say I need some data and Mr. Noble was

092one of the only companies that stood up and said, "Well, let me get you your data. Let me put cameras out and let me present the possible pro." We didn't know we had a problem because, yep, there are people in here that say speeding is a problem here. And some people say, "Well, speeding's not a problem." Until we got the three reports back that showed 70% of our traffic was speeding, we have a problem. Okay. So then we went to RFP and to go to RFP we had four companies come in and they bid it and the one that and any company could bid this. The one that made the most sense to the board of selectment at the time was the one that wasn't going to charge us for any of the capital outlay.

093It wasn't the town of Washington that bought a camera in Canada, then had another company hook up to it, and then they got to recalibrate it every time. So, and again, people can say that the macaroni is baked. I've actually never heard that before, but I will be using that in the future. Um, but uh the macaroni is baked. Listen, we've had ordinance meeting number one, ordinance meeting number two, and I have to tell you, and I've been involved in in in municipal government for almost two decades now, showing my age. Um, I know public participation in meetings is hard, but nobody came out and has spoke at ordinance meeting number one again. And and and I get that a lot. Didn't know about it. One of the things that in in public communication is

094something that we are always going to work on and always try and better oursel. But I urge you that on our website just stay informed and you'll get anytime a board of selectment meeting is agenda is published. You'll get an email with it at 9:15 in the morning. Even though I know what's going on, I get an email from uh civic lift muni no mun something. I forgot the name of it. Um, I get an email at 9:15 of everything that's going on that day in town hall >> and do I read it? No, I already know what's going on. But at least it's in my inbox and we are trying to communicate better with our residents. I again 20 years one of the biggest complaints is I don't know what's going on. There are

095avenues for you to go and get the information. We are getting better on our social media channel. We are trying to push this out as much as we can. But going back to, you know, the macaroni being baked, there's still third meeting coming up on January 5th. Then we have to send all this information off to CT dot. They have to approve it. I don't believe that the CT do if they see the information, you don't have a problem. You're not getting the camera. I think the professionals at CT dot if they see the information and we present it and when we present it to them they're going to say, "Yeah, you have a problem. You have to put cameras up there." So, macaroni baked, not baked. Again, those are one of those where I

096think we're just going to agree to disagree. I thought we did it differently that we actually brought the professionals in to walk us through this knowing full well at any time the ordinance can fail. the DOT could say no and Mr. Noble spent a whole lot of his capital and he's out the door. >> Hey Paul, too, as I recall, this was the only company that that >> Sorry, >> I'm sorry. This was the only company that we didn't have risk that was going to cost the town money. The other companies, if they didn't get the revenue that they needed, could bill us for the difference, and we didn't want to expose the town to any potential financial risk. And secondly, to the point of having them here tonight, we looked at it as technical

097questions that you all might have that we're not able to answer. So why not have the expert here? And and you could probably tell by the presentation itself. The black slides were were made up by the town. The three or four slides that were blue, those are Mr. Noble slides. So he wasn't involved in the presentation to you all or any of that. We just wanted to bring them in to talk a little bit about Sideream to show the community how professionally how great their cameras are and all of that. But at the end of the day, this presentation was created by staff, more in particular the gentleman over there in the candy cane shirt. Um so uh and we sat and we worked on it, but [clears throat] this was not big by anybody.

098Uh Mr. Sun, you're gonna have to come up because >> can you just talk about the speeds because I am curious about the you know average speed 32 miles hour. I keep hearing the % speeders or whatever. Why Why should we Why should I be alarmed about the average speed of 31 and a half in a 30 mph zone? >> I'm not a mathematician, but why is that? >> Great question. I'm going to let Mr. Noble speak on it because he's got 20 years in the arena of this and then I may come in in the back. So, Mr. Noble, please. A big statistic that the DOT will look at in any of the justification reports from any of the cities in Connecticut is what the is the 85th percentile. In other words, of the

099people speeding at that location, what were they what were 85% of them doing? And they're showing that 85% of the people speeding were doing 39 miles an hour >> at that one location. 38 and then 59 and 59 and a half miles an hour. 39 miles per hour being only 9 miles hour over which is not taking it. Correct. >> That's correct. >> So the question I'm just going to repeat it only because people at home won't hear it. The question was somebody that was going 39 if the average the 85 percentile [clears throat] was 39 miles an hour. Those people would not be ticketed. That is correct because it's one mile an hour below the 10 miles an hour and up threshold. >> They wouldn't even know they were. They have no >> they

100would not. The question and again because that's okay. That's okay. Um >> this happens at town meetings sometimes. Um >> the question was is they didn't even know they were speeding. Well, >> no, unless they looked at their, you know, speedometer in their car because it says they were going 39 and they're in a 30. Um, but no, they they would not know the the town would not let them know that they were speeding because it doesn't check the box of 10 miles hour or above. So, you got to come up though. >> Trying to read this quicker. I won't sit down. Um, so do you want to have that revenue for road work? Hopefully. Okay. But two things I'm trying to do math in my head but I don't have all the figures citation

101officer and someone doing collections and since of these numbers only uh tickets will go to someone going over 10 miles per hour. So the numbers we're seeing here aren't reflective of the tickets that will be issued. So, I just wanted to keep please keep all these things in mind and really weigh them out, especially if there's other things. So, this is going to cost the town money. >> Um, I want to talk on all that. So, first one, collection uh uh enforcement. That's on Mr. Noble's company. >> That's not what he said. >> No. No. If people don't pay their tickets and they go to collections, he said it goes to the town or whoever you want. No, it stays with him. He employs the collection agency, everything like that. >> Um, going back to

102citation officer, um, that we are keeping inhouse and at the present time have no plans of bringing on additional staff. Again, this is why we're only starting with three cameras. We want to get our feet underneath us and see exactly what the the the load is. But right now, as the gentleman that prepares a budget, I am not going to put one item on the expense side of the municipal budget to operate this. Not one. Not unless I can cover it with any particular revenue that this. And truth be told, and I don't know which one of our select people had said this, we hope we make zero >> honestly because then I've stopped speeding. It's fine. This is it's been called a revenue grab, but if everybody is nine miles an hour and under

103the speed limit, we've corrected a problem. I hope we don't make any money. This board has said the exact same thing several times. Mr. Noble's probably not going to like that because he's got a big capital outlay. But at the end of the day, the biggest complaint, two big I got two big complaints that come in. First one, people. I sit right upstairs every single day and you would be surprised at how fast I hear cars drive by town hall. >> I have the same complaint, but is cameras and all these signs and all these unknowns going to be worth it. So, >> so here here >> maybe it's not the right time. >> That that's a great question. >> Maybe it's not the right time. and and as as a town manager, I have

104to analyze that information continuously of how do I slow traffic down? I had two choices right now. And oh, by the way, we are working with the DOT. >> Good night. Um, 20 years I'm used to it. Um, I have I I work with the DOT and we are trying to redesign Main Street. I'm going to tell you it's not going to be something that we're going to see in 6 months, in a year or in two years. It took literally a year for them to just draw those lines to do the lane diving up there on 4. >> You should talk to the folks in Stafford Springs because they got things done heck of a lot better. >> Is it a state road? >> Yeah, 190 I believe is a state road. Is it

105190 or 195? I'll look into that. But how long in in in how long was the dialogue going on before the state DOT acted on it? I don't know >> that I can't answer. >> But now let me go back as as a town manager when I'm analyzing what's the right thing to do. I'm going to throw a number out and it's going to be an arbitrarily number. But to hire more officers, right? We're not talking overtime. We're not talking but to hire an officer to pay the benefits, the medical, you're roughly looking at $150,000. And keeping in mind one thing, when that officer pulls over an individual, 75 100 more cars, have driven by, possibly speeding, and they were able to issue one ticket. >> This one captures it all with hopes that we

106can slow down traffic. This is not a all the other traffic violations that those speed cameras are going to take care of that still need to be enforced. >> You're right. You're right. And this will free up, as Mr. Marino had stated that they were trying to do radar and then they got pulled off to to to different, you know, calls and everything. This allows us to now go hit Danberry Quarter Road until we get a camera up there because right now the biggest complaints are slowed cars down on Main Street. Now, we've neglected Danberry Quarter Road. Now, if we're doing radar enforcement, we can stay off of 44 and deploy our assets elsewhere in town. >> Paul, if you could add one thing. >> Sure. >> I don't think you touched on the the

107the state contract, the longevity of these cameras. After 18 months, we see zero speeding. We we would actually have to reapply to keep these cameras in those locations. Correct. >> We can move them after 18 months and then after >> every three years every three years after we have to rejustify >> in three years our speeding has gone like that we can take these cameras out send them back the sight scream and we don't need them anymore because >> people are not speeding >> we have to rejustify to the state of Connecticut that you know there's that but in 18 months we can then petition and say hey we think we solved the problem here we want to go move them over here or we keep them where they are and employ potentially you know

108more cameras around town and again this board has been very clear in public that let's start here, but their next spot they want to be around the schools. They've already gave them my marching orders. Um, I think it was up to this board potentially. They would be like, "Well, get me six or eight of them right now, Paul." But I'm somebody that let's let's crawl before we Mr. Noble's like, "Yeah, let's go six, eight." But let's let's crawl before we walk. And I I really want to get a handle on it um and see what we're dealing with and then, you know, potentially get into our school zones immediately. Yep. >> Mr. Sunday. >> Sorry. >> That's all right. >> Sorry for the second. >> It's two bites of the apple. >> That's all right.

109>> You know, I I do want to stress, you know, I'm someone who likes to be uh positive about town. You know, I don't want to be the person who's complaining all the time, but I do feel passionate uh about this issue. >> I think you said you had another meeting coming up on this subject or no, is this is this it? >> No. So we So this is the public hearing that's required by state statute. Then in this town in order to pass an ordinance, you have to have three meetings. That meeting January 5th, 7 p.m. >> So listen, you don't have to do this for for for my benefit. uh you know, do what you want, but I you know, uh I would I would appreciate uh some level of detail or or

110information uh if you could present it at the next meeting or if the chief would present it at the next meeting uh regarding what actually has happened on Main Street where we are uh at the point where we feel like we need to uh install these cameras. How many uh have pedestrians been hit? Have there been crashes? What were what was involved in those crashes? I mean, that those are types of things that I would like to see because I it does bother me that uh people online make our main street sound like uh it is the most dangerous place on earth. And there's [clears throat] just a lot of things that are said that, you know, frankly, I don't think are true. And then when I look into the uh the things that are

111cited, I don't know that that speed was a factor. No one knows. I mean, it's not like the police that the the case details are out there. So I mean anything you guys can do to provide that information like you know I I I personally uh find beneficial. It's not necessarily going to win me over but it might help. You're a data guy. It might help. You're not a data guy but it might help shut me up you know. >> So I want to and I'm going to let you >> I listen and with that said I spend a lot of time on Main Street. I go to all the stores you know I walk up and down the road all the time. You know I'm not going to say that that people don't drive

112fast. you know, I'm not a flat earth person, but um I I do sort of want that information because I do feel like there is like a little bit of contagion in terms of hey, people are like dying out there. It's just not the case from from what I said. So, anything you can add? >> Yeah, let me see if we can get it. I uh you've challenged me. I like a good challenge. We have the holidays in between. Um but uh you know, obviously and and >> because I'm going to take this one because this was an easy one. We do show that 70% of the traffic for the five six days that these cameras were up were speeding. We can see the data there. Um but but whether that speeding uh rises to

113the level of you know the language in the document that it's it's dangerous and you know all these things I don't know. I mean we can we can agree to disagree on that. Um the the only other thing I I wanted to say to uh to to members of the board um you know if you are receptive to this is that what I see happening with these cameras and and we're hearing it now already for the folks at home. Hey, we would like six to eight of these things. These things are going to be all over the place in every town, every corner of your town. And it's just not something that that I agree with. It's, you know, I want freedom of movement. I don't necessarily want government looking at me everywhere I go.

114These things are going to be all over the place. They're going to be all over our highways. Uh we've tried to install tolls in this state. It hasn't worked. Uh mark my words, we are going to have these these types of speed gantries all over our highways in no time within the next few years. Uh we are going to have a statewide turbocharged ticketing system that you know, frankly, we can't afford. we should be able to drive uh without having to white knuckle it, being afraid that government is on us, that we're going to get tickets that frankly uh we hear all the time that people in this town can't afford things. People can't afford it. You know, I think in the document it said, "Hey, the legislaturator is keeping the fines low." I don't

115know that $50 or $75 is low. And uh for folks who follow state government, here's what's going to happen. Uh we know right now that the fine is $50. It's $75. The processing fee is $15. Uh, in pretty short order, municipalities across the state are going to be lobbying the legislature. Hey, uh, can we increase this fine to $50? Can we increase this fine to $80? Can we in can we increase the processing fee? The fees are going to go up and up without question. I I guarantee it. And the other thing, uh, municipalities, and I understand why because I am sympathetic to it, they are going to be asking to spend the money in new ways. Um, now we're talking, you know, we're talking about road repair. I don't know that road repair was

116one of the original things. I saw your testimony where you asked, "Hey, can we use it for road repair?" Maybe I'm misunderstanding it, but you know, that's step one. We're going to be using it for more and more things. And you know, the idea that after 18 months or whatever it is, hey, we can get rid of the cameras, we can move them. Uh, we're going to be married to these cameras because the money is going to be infused in our budget. If we're already talking about using this money for road repair, which you know, frankly, if you guys had led with that, maybe as your sales pitch, hey, we're going to install these and and repair your roads, uh I think more people would would would be on board. So, um again, I am

117concerned and hopefully you'll you'll take all this under consideration and uh make a decision that I'm sympathetic to what business owners have to say, but you know, for the rest of the folks in town who might not want these cameras all over the place, uh you know, please consider that. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Off the top of my head, I can answer some of your questions. >> Five incidents come to my top of the head at the Rock Cut. It's in court right now. Speeding vehicle passed a box truck, grandfather, grandson killed. North Main Street, fatal accident. One of the passengers paralyzed. I believe it was last year. They just passed away as well. The corner of Maine and Union. Individual trying to cross the street hit by a speeding truck, likely an

118oversized mirror. Severe facial injuries. Former crossing guard crosswalk at Mario's hit and killed by a vehicle. And then maybe spring or summer, we had bicyclists hit in a rainstorm on North Main Street. Another one up here hit on Main Street in the construction zone when Eversource was doing the work. I hope we make zero dollars, but we need to slow traffic down and this is what it takes. It's what we're going to need to do to slow traffic down. >> I appreciate that and I I am familiar with those. I've looked them up. I've seen people mention those. But I mean, listen, uh an individual riding a bike in a thunderstorm who gets hit by a vehicle, you know, I I don't know exactly what there. Who knows? and and you know somebody you know

119the guy with the box truck you know that story got a lot of uh a lot of respon you know a lot of news coverage of course I'm familiar with it you know I don't know that that's something that uh requires us to put speed cameras >> but it was a speeding that's what we want the speed to slow down >> but listen that was a guy who was on drugs and everything else had all types of problems so I mean I I think those I think that those those things uh are should be handled in in in isolation not you know my opinion Um, I mean, I think part of it too, Brian, is people want to feel safe, right? When I park in front of any of the restaurants across the street in

120particular, and I have to cross the street, you know, you can't really judge how fast people are coming. And most of them are coming at a pretty, you know, high clip. And and the reality is we don't want to have 20 more deaths before we go, okay, we better do something, right? And and finally, to your argument about the fines, do 30 miles an hour. You don't get a fine. Well, you can do 39. >> I think I think a big part of this thing going >> I think a big part is of this is the signs themselves slow people down because you know when you pull it when you know when when we comes on and tells me that there's a an officer ahead. What do we all do? We slow down. The signs

121will slow people down. Again, to Todd's point, hope we don't ever make any money. But if we have the majority of our our traffic doing 30 miles an hour in six months, I would consider that a massive win. >> Mr. Marina, you brought up an excellent point. So for those with fancy phones or fancy cars, um these uh locations will also be identified on Google Maps, Apple Maps, Ways, and all of the navigation systems that you're currently using. So, yet another thing, your GPS is going to tell you if you're using it that you're entering, you know, these these particular areas. Um, as far as the budget goes, budgets are near and dear to my heart. I I I enjoy budgets. I'm one of those those uh individuals. One thing that uh I've learned early

122on in my career, um, is you don't create any type of hole in your budget when it comes to operating. So, if you know there's $300,000 that this camera potentially is going to raise and I I it could be a high number, could be a low number, I'm not going to fund any operating expenses out of it. One, you can't, right? Because the state statute says you can't. But if we go down to zero, I just created a huge hole in the next municipal budget because now I have to figure out, well, there's $300,000 that's no longer there. It's not a game that I like to play because budgets are something that I enjoy doing and I try never to create any type of a fiscal cliff, fiscal hole with a with a one-time shot

123in the arm. You'll see the uh in this current year's budget. Um we sold our our electricity um to a particular solar company. This was a a good one in that um we didn't have to buy solar. They're just using the energy that we use and to justify why they're going to build a solar farm somewhere else in the [clears throat] world, particularly in the country. We didn't fund an operating expense. We fund a capital item. And we don't buy that capital item until that $400,000 check hits our kidney. So, you'll see one-time shots with this with with, you know, money, but I won't ever take money and and and put it in an operational side of things because it's a fiscal hole that I don't want to face. >> Paul, just two two final

124points and I suspect >> the macaroni is baked. >> Love it. >> I'm using it. Go ahead. Macaroni cooked if you're >> Oh, macaroni cooked. Sorry. >> Uh, >> two questions. I don't know if you know the answer to them, but you talked about the appeal process to the superior court. >> Yeah. Uh what is that process, >> Mr. Noble? >> Uh if you um contest your ticket at the local hearing here in the in the town, you get the chance to uh take it to the district one of the district courts in Connecticut. I think there are 12 of them and it goes through their judicial process from there. >> So So in other words, you need to start a legal suit of some sort. >> I don't know. I don't know how it

125works. >> Yeah. So [clears throat] I I I guess my point is, you know, for the folks at home, and I did pick up this early at at an earlier meeting, it does sound very easy breezy. Hey, you're not successful here. Hey, just go appealed at the court. It it's not it's not that simple. And on the appeal process, uh who is going to be the uh the administrative person who is handling the appeals here? I think at a previous meeting uh uh you said that hey if if we start getting tons and tons of tickets in uh maybe we'll have to hire someone but uh at the outset who's going to be that administrative officer and if you were to hire someone uh tell me about the audit process in terms of uh uh

126uh reviewing the town uh analyzing and and perhaps making the data public of uh who got their tickets uh waved. I don't think we'll ever make uh it public of who got their tickets waved or who who got a ticket. We're not going to put that out there as far as that process goes. Um again, um >> no macaroni cooked, baked screwed it up again to to go further into that that it's not we we met again on Tuesday. These are all things that we need to figure out. This isn't a a we have a process to follow, right? And and and there's just limited amount of resources. [clears throat] Until we get further along in the process, I'm not going to set up all of this until first we even know we have an

127ordinance. I mean, we still have to go through that. Once this thing becomes more and more clear and we're heading down that path and the macaroni does become cooked, baked, >> fully baked, then we're well, I'm using it. I'm screwing it up. But um >> you guys have taken all the all the life out of my I think you're >> Can I just um throw out there this isn't this isn't just a yes or no this system, right? We're not here just for like pass or fail. We're here to get the feedback so that we can take it into account in the ordinance in the next meeting and in the implementation, right? That's what we're here for. So, it's not just yes or no. We need all this feedback so that you know there's so

128much inner workings and so many ways this could work. And that's that's another reason we're here. >> And it's I'm glad you brought that up vision. So, When Andrew and I, Mr. Noble and I spoke, um, we have to include all of this into our documentation to the DOT. One of the things that I'm going to include is our YouTube link and the DOT can sit down and watch the video, watch the questions, and this is why I wanted sound so important tonight because I'm going, we all know this is available on our YouTube channel, but in our documentation to the DOT about this public hearing, they're going to have access to this meeting. Maybe not the individual that stuck up one finger at me, but >> Oh, yeah. >> They left. I'm It's 20

129years. I'm used to it. >> Mr. Sunday, four bites of the apple. >> Okay. >> Do you want to come up? >> I should have a quick one. >> Yeah, come on up. >> Hi, Dave Paliseri from Bridge Street. Thank you for taking the lines off my street finally. >> Um, I I just one ask out of this and it's kind of a data thing. It's kind of a challenge. Since municipal vehicles are also going to be caught, can that data be made public? >> So just just so that we know, hey, everybody's being held accountable. >> I let me look into that. And and the reason why I'm pausing on that. Um, a lot of our labor is involved in uh uh collective bargaining agreements, unions. >> Um, can't wait until I ask him

130that question and see and see where it goes. official acting in their public in in their in their capacity has you know we have the right to record them right >> so and a license plate is a public piece of information I'm not asking for people's names >> y >> but vehicle number plate number >> and how many we've gotten >> let me I'm not saying the police are breaking the law >> I'm not saying the town people are breaking the law but you know it would be just good to you know keep everybody honest >> I I uh 994 ZGN is my license plate um you know uh hopefully it's never on I'm gonna tell you Mike because I wanted >> but uh let me look into that. Uh you know I I think

131over you know almost two years of me being here I try and just be as open book as I possibly can but as I said earlier if you're a municipal employee and you show up uh with a ticket be a fun meeting with me that day. >> The the only other thing I would say is so you're talking about the the the appeals process and I'm not I'm I'm a business owner now in this town. Um, for larger business owners, um, I'm thinking like the roofing companies, they've got a lot of trucks running around town. Are they going to have an opportunity to streamline that? Because to have, you know, to have somebody like Homes Electric or, you know, another contractor has to go, all right, who got the ticket? Who, you know, who's who

132do I have to go tell? And basically playing nanny state on it, right? The burden of proof is now on the accused, not the accuser. I'm not going to get in the fourth, fifth, and fourth, fifth, sixth, and 14th amendment violations, but that's all settled at this point. Um, h there there's got to be way for them to just go, hey, this isn't mine. It's this person's without having to like I mean, they're going to come in probably the first month or or three, they're going to come in with a stack and go, this one's John's, this one's Paul's, this one's Mike's, and they're going to, you know, it's just it's going to be a nightmare for them. >> How do we make this easier for them? >> Yeah. as we go through the process

133and as we move further along, we're gonna finalize our process. And that was something we did talk about Tuesday is how do we streamline it? We want to streamline it. Like we desperately want to stream, we don't want to make this a burden. Um, and we do want to streamline it. We're not there yet, but we do want to make it as painless and as quick as possible for anybody that receives a citation. We do. >> All right. The only final thing is thank you all for the information you answer. I I had a list of questions. You might have seen them posted on Facebook. >> I stay off Facebook. No, I'm kidding. and so many of them are answered. So, I appreciate the information. >> Awesome. Thank you. >> And I think the 30-day

134practice time, if you will, right? If you have a company with a bunch of trucks out there for the first 30 days, if you get all the warnings in, it might give you a chance >> that that may straighten them up. >> Yeah. Peter Marshian, 188 Sucker Brook Road. Uh you could bring up the slide with the data on it. um the 85th 5 percentile I'm assuming the other 15% were all speeding over the 10 mph limit. Am I correct? >> That is correct. >> So if you look at the 244 north and southbound that's almost 100,000 vehicles that were collected. So you had 15,000 vehicles that were speeding including at citations. Correct. >> That's correct. >> That's a big number. I've been involved as a volunteer firefighter in this town for 57 years. I

135have seen too many accidents, too many deaths. And the fire department when you see them out there, they had an accident, they have to put fire truck there to protect themselves, the ambulance attendants, the police, and everybody else. And people still don't like hell. In Winchester, we have an accident. I block the road. I shut it down until vehicles removed and it's safe. And I don't think anybody wants to see that on Main Street. So, you better slow down or pay a ticket. And as far as I'm concerned, you are all elected officials who are here to represent me as a taxpayer. And keep it up. Thank you. >> Thank you. Who else would like to speak? I just have a quick question for you. What is the fail rate of these cameras and and

136the speed monitors? >> The fail rate. >> Yes. >> They're not perfect. So, what is the percentage of them failing? I don't want to be driving by at 32 miles an hour and be told I'm doing 52. >> No. So, the the cameras themselves have a selfch check uh twice a day. So there um there's an internal uh verification system intern inside of the camera and if it's not working uh it won't turn on essentially. Uh the camera also has an internal memory known the calibration date when it was last calibrated. If it is not removed and reverified for calibration within the year um it actually won't take photographs. So there's a there's a circuit breaker system in there from a software standpoint but they just don't fail. 20 years ago cameras were film based.

137They're much more analog and so you'd see failure rates there 25 30 years ago, but it's it's a lot uh like any digital product. It's uh it's kind of binary. It works or it doesn't. >> So, you're telling me, if I'm understanding you correctly, that there's 0% failure? >> 0% but very very rarely does a camera fail. Well, I'm I as this gentleman over here, I think this is a slippery slope we're going down. I honestly do. I'm opposed to this. I understand the need for it as far as you want to stop people from speeding. I too have a son that was hit by a car with severe injuries. So, I I get that, but I think you're going down a real slippery slope. You know, I I think you're saying the first three

138cameras, how many more do you intend to put up for how many more years? You may curb the behavior for a period of time, but I don't know that it's going to stop the behaviors. I think if you if for some reason, you know, the DOT or whoever it is says, "Yeah, no, you can't have them after three years." Okay. Well, it's [music] going to go back because all you've done is curbed it because you had that that stick waiting to bang on the head and they Oh, [clears throat] I don't want to get banged on the head, so I'm going to slow down. Oh, it sticks away. Let me speed up. You're you're you're just going for a real slippery slope here. I don't I think if you put them in, you're not going

139to take them out. And I think if you put them in, you're going to add more. And it's going to end up eventually the information is going to, I think, being pushed over to insurance companies and whoever else. Coupled with if I'm not driving the car, if I if I lend my car out to somebody now, I'm going to get fined for what they do because you don't even have my picture to evidence that I was the one driving it. I don't think that's right. I shouldn't be punished for what somebody else did. I just think you're going down a slippery slope. Take your macaroni out of the pot. >> Mr. Noble, um, when you do the recalibrations, >> when you do recalibrate the cameras, [clears throat] do you find they're off at that moment?

140>> No. I I I spoke at the beginning of the presentation about international standards and so the the drift rate as it's called within the radar which does the the multi- vehicle track at any one time is typically measured about 0.1 of a mile of an hour over a 10-year period. So you have a discrepancy of 0.1 of a mile an hour over a 10-year period according to international standards. And so the radars that we use in our cameras meet that standard and are tested to that standard. I think that helps answer that question. Thank you. >> Sorry if I don't sit down. I injured my back. Um J Marwell, 60 Orlook Road. I witnessed the other day. I witnessed this often on Main Street, but the other day I found a truck or saw

141a truck from Massachusetts who flew down Main Street, flew right through two red lights, never slowed down. So he got to pass ABC Pizza and then he was kind of forced to slow down because of the way the traffic was. see a lot of out of state people doing that. We have people coming up from New York, Jersey, Long Island. How do you enforce their tickets? Can you enforce that being they're out of state? >> Yeah, the the law in Connecticut is very clear. If you were speeding, then you would get a civil infraction ticket. Uh we uh our database is full pull from all of the uh DMVs and R&Bs around the country. So regardless of whether you're from Nebraska or Massachusetts or Connecticut, we'll get your registered owner information from inlets directly, which

142is where that state is stored, including the Canadian provinces. And here in the northeast of America, we know we have a lot of Canadians coming down for the summer vacations, and so we get to send tickets to Canada, too. >> The other question is, I have a friend who actually just told me this story recently. He has a combo. Uh he has a truck, so his license number is combo. And he keeps getting tickets for somebody else who has a passenger. And he finally got it straightened out. Oh, it's been a mess. I never knew myself. Maybe you can explain. Is it possible? Well, you're not DMV though. I pause. Apologize. [laughter] And that just turned my back. Yeah, I think that's again I'm not I've never used these systems before and um but from

143>> I think that's part of the vetting process. So, you're getting information back. >> Is it matching the plate? >> But the plate says, right? It says number passenger, >> but there's two sets of information. Make, model, registered owners, things like that. >> He still keeps getting these tickets. >> But I think but that may be I I don't know. >> So, my question I guess too is though when I was pointing to I apologize is that you can have like my mine I just forgot what mine is. A a 935 something or whatever it is. Okay. Somebody else can have that exact same number in Connecticut as long as >> Can a combo plate and a passenger plate be the same numbers? >> Uh, I think I think they can. They could be antique.

144They could be >> But but like the antiques are a whole different sequence. But the question is, can combos and passenger have the same number? >> I think they can. >> They can. That's Yeah, I never heard of it before until he me and his has been racking up, but they're not his. So, I want to make sure >> get a different plate, >> right? Well, they he got retired. They offered him that plate. >> He said to his wife, "Do you want to take it?" She's like, "No." Like >> money. I don't want that. >> She didn't do anything to do with it. So, okay. Just wanted to ask. Thank you. >> Who else speak one of the recent interchanges, I guess. I'll I'll tell you the secret why I really am against this.

145Uh first, I'm sorry you were offended earlier by someone else. That's >> That's okay. >> Um, >> can I just say I'm also a proud American citizen. >> I know my accent belies from another place, but like many people in this room, my family came from another place, but I'm a proud American citizen. >> Mine came from England, too. So, >> there you go. >> Um, stream is an American company, but not >> um, but it was a discussion on machine on machine. Can a machine fail fail the failure rate? Really, my biggest issue is is machine enforcement of government regulations. And a growing part of my job is helping or defending people against allegedly smart machines that are making decisions and penalizing people. And I have to help them. I have to push back

146against those machines. And the people that you contact say the machines are right. I send them regulations, state regulations, this is the law. And they say no, the machine is right. And I'm getting more and more of that. I'm getting machines feeding machines information. And now machines aren't trusting the other machines because they feel they're smarter than these. And that's really the crux of my issue here is we're now having machines doing government enforcement. And I p I experience almost daily that it's going wrong. I'm not saying that your machines are going to go wrong, but machines are going wrong in government enforcement more and more because human they're replacing humans with machines and it's causing people a lot of trouble and a lot of money. So I see a parallel here. Um, I've already

147told you I really wish this was not tied to state statute because the state's gonna if we don't say you're doing a money grab, the state's going to do a money grab. You know, if there's if there's things everywhere, they're just going to start taking the money. That's how it happens. So, really, um, when I contact people, they say the machines are right, we don't care what you say. And I know these intelligent machines are wrong, and there's nothing we can do. And sometimes we just have to feed the machine and then the people are happy but it costs money. >> I would say one thing about that to your comment about so the radar that's in the police cruisers is a machine that's calibrated much the same way that the radar in this is

148calibrated. The only difference is either a police officer reading it and testifying to the point that that was the speed you were going or in this case the camera snaps the picture identifies your vehicle has the same radar readout that the officer would have. We're just able to capture more because while an officer is off doing another duty or potentially, as Paul said, writing a ticket while 30 other cars go by that are speeding, it allows us to be more efficient. But it's the same basic technology. >> It's not because you have a human presence with that machine, >> but he's reading the same number that the camera is >> in control of that machine and we're moving towards machines [clears throat] controlling the humans. I know it sounds like Terminator, [laughter] but this this

149is my life. This is what my life is becoming is helping people fight back against machines. Believe it or not, it sounds like science fiction. Um, fascinating. >> And and you have the human interaction and the humans, this all sounds so stupid, but the humans don't even understand the machines that they're charged with anymore. >> Anyone else? >> Brian. I just have one more small question because >> I thought that was the last. That's all right >> because >> I I'd rather everybody >> I might never get in front of the uh gentleman from Syream again. Uh >> I'm not an expert on uh collection agencies, but uh >> and neither am I. >> Oh, I don't know. You use them hopefully. Uh no, probably know more than me. But uh if someone doesn't pay

150their ticket, uh you guys make money by uh sending people to collections, some type of collection initiative. Correct. So, so then why would I ever pay my ticket? >> Uh, I think it's a personal choice for people paying a parking ticket. It's a personal choice for people paying a speeding ticket or a red light running ticket. I think for a lot of people who are speeding or running a red light and it's an innocent mistake, um, there's a sense of obligation and duty to pay the ticket. For those that inherently just like speeding and feeling they can get away with it, who knows? for states that feel that the collections rates aren't as high as they should be for people who got a genuine speeding ticket from an automated camera, whether it's red light running

151camera, speeding camera, going past a school bus with a stop arm out camera. I think those states typically put in legislation to say there's going to be a registration hold at some point. >> So, we don't have to pay these tickets. You're sending people to collections. That's how you that's how you get them. So, that's my question. You send your company gets paid by sending people to collections. If they don't pay, >> I get I get we get compensated against the capital investment we made if someone pays their ticket. I don't get compensated by sending someone's name to a collections agency because they didn't pay their ticket. >> So, we don't have to pay the tickets. >> Hope you pay. >> No, but [clears throat] we don't have but we don't have to pay the

152tickets. It's optional then. >> Did I I'm bringing up the collections thing because I think you mentioned it at a meeting previously. I could be wrong about that. Um, so we So the tickets are optional. >> Why would you think a citation is optional? >> There's no teeth. What? Why? >> Go to collections. >> What? >> You're going to collection. >> So we are going to So he is sending them to colle who's who's sending me to collections if I don't pay my ticket. >> Sideream sending you to collections. >> Okay. So Sideream is sending us to collections. That's my question. >> We're we're we're physically sending the data to the collections company, but we're not doing the collections themselves and sending those letters on. >> I'm not paying your bill. So, you're sending me

153to a collection agency? >> Yeah. Right. Correct. >> Yeah. Okay. Uh, and the collection agencies that you use, are they simply just uh uh making aggressive phone calls to collect the money or are they actually reporting to credit agencies as well? >> They can't report to credit agencies. I can tell you that. Um, >> they can or can't >> they cannot. Okay. They they cannot. Um, and collections law in this country is very strict. So it's it changes from state to state where you're living, where you got the ticket. So we pass it to the collections agencies and they deal with it in accordance with the state law where you live and where you got the ticket. >> Okay. So do we know if collection agencies in Connecticut >> report to credit ra crediting agencies?

154>> They can't. They cannot. >> Okay. So really if you don't pay your ticket, it's just the harassing phone calls is your only >> Okay. It's >> like a parking ticket. >> Okay. Well, it's not like a park. You don't go to collections for a parking ticket, right? >> All right. Thank you. >> You can. >> Yes. Most people just pay them, though. >> Thank you. [snorts] >> Can you maybe just repeat my questions? Is there any live feed to these cameras? >> So, the question was any live feed to these cameras? >> And and the answer is no. There's no live feed to the camera. >> Anyone else? >> Paul, could I ask a question? only if you come up here because your staff, you can't break the rules. >> I can talk loud

155like you. Is there anybody in this room that thinks Main Street doesn't have a speeding problem? I'm just curious about that. >> No. Is there anybody in this room that thinks we don't have a speeding problem? Not to the level being [cough] >> good. That's was I go back to my normal rules of coming up to the microphone because that didn't come up on on so Mr. Pos when we adjourn this meeting everybody's got an extra five minutes because we've all been here a long time spread out on Main Street just spend five minutes and watch the traffic on Main Street tonight. I guarantee you threequarters of them I I've come out of selectman meetings here and watched them go up main street from a police station at 60 70 miles an hour. We don't

156have a speeding problem. It only takes one 70 mph car to clip somebody, bounce them off the hood. If I can put these things in a vert of those, I'm happy with it. Um, it's a very simple problem. >> Do do 39 miles an hour or less and you don't have to worry about any of this. Not going to it's not going to clip a picture of your car. Doesn't activate till you're 10 miles an hour over. >> 39. Still too fast. It it is still too fast. But but you're allowed that buffer. >> You're allowed that buffer. That's a statute. That's a state statute. Right. Correct. >> And I think most people don't go, "Oh, I got to do 39." They see the sign and go, "Oh, the speed limit on my dashboard says

15730. I better be 30." They're there. Not everybody's going to remember the nine all the time or know about it for that matter because how many people travel through that are not sitting here tonight or live in this town or watch our YouTube, you know, of these meetings? There's going to be a lot of people from out of town that are going to see the signs either slow down or not. And if they don't, we're going to capture the ticket. >> And again, I've [clears throat] been through the ones in Washington several times. I'm sorry. And I'm probably a slack nobody likes. If you get a ticket going through Washington, you 100% deserve it because those signs are huge. >> And and there's two of them before you get to the camera and they absolutely

158tell you you're about to get a ticket if you don't slow down. It It's clear as day. So, In my opinion, I 100% support these things. Um, >> I have a question that that came up and I think it's from before I was part of the board. So, um, I know you mentioned several times that, you know, that you said in in previous meetings the board has has decided that, you know, or been in favor of, you know, six to eight cameras and done. I I've not heard that. I just want to know um I know other people address this issue too. I I just want to know who decides that. Who decides like we have three cameras. Does the board of selectman decide if we add a fourth or fifth? Do you decide like

159who who gets to make that decision? >> Uh well, uh that's a a great question. Once the ordinance is passed, um it does usually rest with the the town manager, the CEO of the town. Um but as you know me, and I don't plan on going anywhere, I will always bring these type of decisions to the board. I I I don't think it's a you know I will work handinhand with our chief of police come up with a recommendation and then ultimately you know go that way but to further that the board of selectment could state a policy that any future cameras need a public hearing and uh uh a majority vote on the board of selectment. The board of selectment is a policy setting board. Um, in fact, we could talk about uh uh

160speed camera policy at our at a future board assignment meeting, but you know, to put safeguards in, those are just some recommendations from my office. >> Same sec. I just got more work to do. >> Anyone else? >> James Ferrer, 85 Crescent Street. I retired about a year ago and I've had some time and each day I have to take a walk good for my cardiovascular my joints and I travel up and down Main Street. Occasionally I go across the walking path different areas and the traffic here absolutely flies. I took a walk yesterday evening and there was a diesel truck. I watched it go around the apex past Union Street by the Y and it had to be doing at least 70 miles an hour with his foot to the floor, not backing off

161one iota. So, I'm getting here a little late. I don't know where you plan on putting these cameras. Hopefully, you're putting one right on Main Street, specifically in front of the Y where that drops down on that corner. There's elderly people that cross there. There's families with children going to the Y. And at this point, I happened to watch a little earlier and you mentioned that you wrote along with the police officers and that they're stretched thin and that they can't focus to do the speed work here on Main Street and they're getting pulled off a lot of the time. So, has anybody talked about bringing in I mean, this is a state highway. I traveled back and forth to Torington the other day. There's a state trooper on the median. When I went down

162there, I was in Torington for about an hour and 20 minutes. I came back. She's in the same spot on the media. Has anybody talked with uh state police, coordinated with them to possibly fill in here on Main Street? If we cannot put our efforts into Main Street? >> Excellent question. Um, as you can see, uh, this is the proposed location on Main Street. The particular area that you're discussing in front of the Y, we did sit with Mr. Noble, the chief. Um because of the angle the camera wouldn't function properly in terms of getting the traffic because you you you couldn't >> what are the exact words you the angle of the camera wouldn't be able to register the uh the plate because of that that bend right in that road there. We wanted

163a clear clear view. Yeah. So this is the first clear view where there is high rate of speed and this is why we're selecting that in particular. You can see I'll mention a business name Kent Pizza area. That's the clear view where we can get it, where we're hoping to slow people down before they they get up to where I I know where the speed is. And so that's where the location is being proposed on Main Street. As far as your state police uh comment goes, um yes, I have stock. So currently, right now, the state police are on a shortage of uh officers. Chief, is it 23% down? It's I I had a number. It was in the 20s. >> We're down. That's >> Well, and we're down, too. Um uh we're we're down

164and and we have positions that are excuse me unfilled, but currently right now the state police can't even handle the the the workflow that they have because they have such a shortage in their manpower as well. But there have been conversations with the state police. There are communities close by us that are looking to bring on more resident uh state troopers and they can't even uh the state police can't even fill those spots because they don't have the officers. Okay. So, I'm looking at this view of the camera where they can get a straight shot at the the plate going this way. Now, what about the opposite direction on the other side of the corner? Um, in front of like where the news building is facing going this way with the traffic going that way

165cuz I the the truck that I saw doing at least 70 miles an hour yesterday with his foot to the floor was right past the intersection over here where the IG used to be hauling back that way. And it seems like you could get a pretty clear view of a of a plate going that way. >> Mr. No, you want to speak on that? You know, obviously we can't set up camera after camera. Um, >> well, you have one going this way, one going that way. >> We're going to have them going both ways just so and that's an excellent point. I I probably should have hit that one a little bit harder. When we're suggesting this location, it is going to be both directions. We're going to get the traffic going both ways. It's

166not just a one or done. We're getting it in both directions. >> North and south. Um or some say east and west too depending on how you look at a compass. But we're going to get them coming and going from town basically. So we are going to capture it both ways. Will the cameras perfectly be lined up across the street from each other? Probably not, but we are going to capture traffic going both ways. >> So in between town hall and going back toward that corner, is there going to be any enforcement with the cameras going back that way? Yes, we're going to get a You're going to get leaving town and coming into town. You're going to get it both directions. >> I think he's referring from here up to the camera. >> Oh,

167>> right. From here to the YMC corner. >> Got it. >> No, not with these locations. You're You're going to have You know, I'll tell you what, the sign I mean, I don't I'm not the best at exactly,000 ft, but the sign's going to be close to that location letting people know to slow down. >> Signs don't stop people. And I heard with your own statement that you said here in town hall you hear them going by >> flying past. >> So if this is a section where the speed is from here by the church going down beyond 10 pizza and on that corner. We really should have a camera right out here. >> We could do another analysis. >> We can do another analysis. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> We can definitely I mean we

168can look at it. I think some of the reasoning behind it is we all know that there's the traffic light [clears throat] there. So, we are we are getting it's hard to believe because I sit up in that office every single day. It's hard to believe we are getting slower speeds here. Even though I'll tell you right now, I hear people barreling by. I've been up that end of the road and I my personal opinion the speed's actually higher up there because they've cleared the light. The light's not turning yellow. It's up there where it the severe speed up there. Um but I I'm not going to sit here and say I don't hear. It amazes me because there's a police department at the bottom of my feet and they're still flying by. Like me,

169I'm one of you see a a police car, a police station. I'm like, whoa, I'm I'm coming off the gas. But we can do another speed analysis there for sure. >> I mean, there's a lot charts, graphs, analysis, studies. Bob Dylan said, "You don't have to be a weatherman to know which way the wind blows." And if I can go out there and take a walk down here 20 minutes e each day >> and see what goes on. You don't need to have a study to see what's going on. >> True. >> You're right. Um some people of of that opinion and then there's others that are data driven. Show show me the proof proofs, you know. So I it you got to do a little bit of both. But um there's a reason I

170raised my hand. Um, there's a reason I put a lot of time and effort into it because I hear the speed meeting that's going on right outside my office window every single day. Um, and you know, my board will tell you that I jumped right on it immediately. Um, because I know we have a speeding problem in this town. Where we were going to end up with it, I didn't know, but you know, they tasked me and uh and I know we have a speeding problem and this is where we're at, you know, today. But, um, we're going to continue to, you know, try and slow down traffic as much as we can, especially in these these areas because there are a ton of people walking. If we want that walkable main street, that revived

171main street, people need to feel safe. Um, in order to to frequent our businesses, to shop, our small businesses, they need to feel safe. And I think this potentially, you know, could be something that even helps our small businesses as well. I know there's an argument on the other side of the corridor that we'll just avoid Main Street all in all. Okay, everybody has their own opinion on that, but at the end of the day, we do need to slow traffic down to have a more walkable um friendlier main street that helps our small businesses and you walk it just for health reasons and you need to feel safe. >> Okay. So, as far as studies and and such things and mentioned the striping earlier for the lane turning up toward the lake coming this

172way out of >> y >> same thing could have been accomplished with a sign up above that said right turn only >> and I mean as far as to have to take and put a study for it and everything else as far as the study going over here up across Bridge Street and the markings and everything else and going through and having it shot peened and covered back over once again. We're going through some things that can be very simple that a lot of money has been put into and then all of a sudden looked at and said, "Well, this just doesn't make sense." But I spoke my piece. And as I said, from what I see, you can go from where Kent Pizza is down below the bridge up here to [clears throat] this

173corner. Now, unless there's some enforcement through here, people are going to continue to do it. And I agree. There should be one on this side. There should be one over on this side. It should seriously be considered. All right. Well, thank you for your time. >> Thank you. Thank you. Thanks for coming out. >> So, where did the number three come from? Was it as opposed to to his point a Why not four when we put one down on this side? Where where did the three come from? >> I think it came from a prior board of selectment meeting. Um >> I don't recall us setting a number. We never set a number. >> We now I I'm just going back. Maybe we didn't set a number. um to his point if we should do

174the analysis and if four is the number to protect and again Main Street and the other locations we've talked about then let's look at this this site >> I think you got Main Street >> Mr. Nobles who said we'll do a speed analysis. Let's figure it out and if there's a fort, there's a fort. >> Because to his point, crossing the street to come to town hall to the post office to any of the businesses down on this side, we should be looking at that as well. >> Well, it makes sense because there's a bend in the road, too. Main Street's not a straight shot. So, if we're putting one up here, you're only going to get this half to the bend. And then from the bend down to Dairy Queen, you're getting nothing. Well,

175that's where we can have our officers pull cards over in that stretch. >> Yeah. >> But I don't know. >> Can I ask you another question on this? >> So, if this generates revenue, >> we can use this for pedestrian safety. This and that, correct? >> Say we try these two. We start to generate a little revenue. Can you bring an officer in on overtime and strictly put him on traffic duty? Can you put a guy over here four hours on a Thursday, four [clears throat] hours on a Friday? we use this revenue because honestly I like that idea because as Mr. Sunday said these don't have teeth. Well let me tell you you're doing 70 miles an hour on your radar. That's a different fine is it not? >> The answer to your question

176yes we can use potential revenue that's that's uh gathered with this program to bring on officers and overtime. But I think the chief really knocked it out of the park um because we've talked is if there is revenue we could potentially bring on just a traffic officer. So, it's not that 4 hour shift, it's the 8 hour shift of 40 hours a week that they're only assigned to traffic [clears throat] enforcement. They're not going to the medical calls, the wellness checks, the uh assault calls. I was just trying to name off a few that you you uh you were on the other night, but they are assigned to only traffic enforcement. So, uh, it's, you know, a possible, uh, uh, item that could be added, um, if people don't adhere to the warnings of a

177speed zone because I'm hearing from pretty much everybody, the ones for it, the ones oppos that bottom line, we have a problem on Main Street with traffic. So, we have to start somewhere. This is a good start. >> This is a good start. Let's start here. If you guys want more teeth, we can fund an officer. I say keep them out there 24/7. And and if you want teeth, well, now when you're doing 32 in a 30 mph zone, we'll give you teeth. [laughter] >> Yes. >> So June, you're thinking these cameras be going if they're approved? >> Actually, it our timeline uh is going to be middle of April. Let me get it up. >> So, if approved, the installations will begin somewhere around middle to end of April with the activation period of

178the 30-day warning period is anywhere from the April to May time frame. Again, all subject to change. You never know dates, but let's just say citations would I'm going to throw a date out there. May 15th, May 20th is when the citations warnings before that, but roughly around that date. >> So if this is so serious, let's do something now. Some kind of p at least to get started ahead of this. All right? Because it's we're not going to wait till then. Why should we wait? We've been waiting long enough for this traffic to slow down. I I remember talking to a town official few years ago. I'm like, "It's only a mile. Slow down for a mile. you know some public it could be something you got that electronic board on a town green

179slow down for a mile and smile something anything you have nothing so let's take this serious now fine if you want to approve that we all you know that could start to slow traffic down now and maybe save some some lives why you know it's so serious let's start now should have started a long time ago [clears throat] to do something Thank you. >> Thank you. >> To the point of teeth, I think I heard you say earlier that at 85% collection, >> is that correct? >> Typically, you get about 75 to 85% collections in the first second notice. Yeah. >> And they go up as time [clears throat] goes on. >> Yeah. Yeah. Once collections efforts start and or third notices go out um or people find a citation they've forgotten about, they might

180pay it and it goes up after that. So, you typically can get programs in their high 90s. >> So, it has teeth. >> Yeah. to the point. >> Most people have a good conscience. They don't like to speed. They got a speeding ticket. They recognize it's less than if they're being caught by an officer. It's not going on their license or their insurance. And so, they typically pay the ticket. >> Anyone else wish to speak? >> Not to jow. I've been here over 30 years and I have a neighbor and I want to thank you for bringing the ugly truth to the public and it's sad to have to say those statistics. Yours were very recent of the accidents and the deaths in this town on Main Street. When I moved here, my neighbor was

181a widow and her husband, now this, we're talking 50, 60 years ago, this happened to him. He merely was crossing the road here. He was hit by a motorcyclist and was killed. Left her and two children. So, it's not something that's just blossomed and it's happened. It's been happening for decades, but now it's getting more and more prevalent. And I want to give you kudos for for bringing this to the attention and having this um tool is what it is. It's a tool for us to to you know try to solve this problem. It won't solve it, but it'll give it some teeth to maybe prevent most of these happenings. So, I'm not against it. I never was. I remember when this started off, we were talking about speed camera, no uh traffic light cameras,

182and I believe those are coming down the pike as they should perhaps, but um we didn't jump on this right away because Winston doesn't do that. And I applaud you for that because I don't do that in my personal life. I always take the middle of the road anyways, but we did a thorough study. Thank you for being here. I appreciate all the input that you have put in and I can tell you quite honestly and my my gut feeling is as a citizen of this town and this board particularly, they have um they will go above and beyond and tip over the rocks and everything else to get the answers that we want to know and they want to know, but we just don't jump into it with our, you know, blindly. So, I

183know we're not going to be the first ones in on this, which is good. And the data is going to be um very helpful to our police officers. I think they're going to appreciate this as well. I think if we brought this to the town and said we need to hire 10 more police officers to man wet more avenue, Pearson school, Main Street, my street, Wallill Road, you know, all of them that this can take the burden off of, but we have to raise our taxes to pay these individuals. What do you think the results going to be for that knowing that we don't even have to pay for this? So you start off with three, maybe four, maybe we need six, whatever the you you have to decide that and we can do this,

184let it run its course and then see what comes from it. To say no, don't do it or you know, I'm not going to pay the bill. It's going to go to the collection. These are foolish foolish foolishness is what it is. I truly believe that's foolishness. And um hopefully I won't get a ticket down [laughter] street, but you know, if I do, I deserve it. You know, whoever does, whether you're an employee, and I think that if you had an employee that gets a ticket from any one of your departments, there's going to be complic, you know, there's going to be consequences for that as there should be. Should we know who that individual individual is? No. It's none of my business. But that's an HR problem [laughter] and that's up to you to

185make those regulations and those guidelines. And you know, the police department does all that they can do. You personally took the time, Mr. Marino, to go out and bring that to light to the to the public to let us know exactly what they're doing because some people don't believe they're doing anything. So you have the eyes and ears on that and you gave it to us. So moving forward, this is, you know, you spent many hours and many days and many weeks and [clears throat] many months on this. This wasn't a flash in the pan cooking macaronis. So with that said, I just want you to know you have my support and anything I can do. I'm here for you. We do have another committee, Safe Streets for All, which is funded by the state

186of Connecticut transportation for grants. And that's another avenue that was being implemented here and I think come next month if I'm not not mistaken. So that's another thing that's in the wheels are turning for safe streets for all and people have been complaining left and right about the safety of our streets and so let's give it a chance. So thank you and I'm done talking. >> Thank you. >> I just want to go ahead >> one last point. So to Mr. Marino's point took a ride along. I I I tried to do a ride along last year and I called the chief. He gave me the okay. I schedule appointment. I come in on a Friday afternoon, Friday evening. I was going to do a ride like I couldn't even get in a cruiser >>

187because all all the cops were in the station with people they had already picked up and and they the sergeant literally come out after about a half hour. He's like, "Mr. Per, I'm sorry. I I just can't get you to cruiser tonight." >> So, you got the ride along. I couldn't even get in a cruiser because they were so busy that evening. So, >> So, I think you brought up an excellent point and I'm a numbers guy. uh if you've been watching me at any of our meetings. So, let's say you throw that 10 officers uh into the budget, right? >> That's roughly $ 1.5 million. That's roughly about a 5 and a half 6% tax increase. >> That's just to pay the person. >> Yeah. That's just to pay the person, not the car.

188We're going to need more. We're going to need more vehicles. All that infrastructure. >> 10 officers roughly is about 1.5 million at today's value. Um that obviously escalates, you know, with uh with bargaining units agreements. Um, it's roughly 1.5 million on top of the the budget number already. And that's roughly going to be about a five and a half, six% tax increase. Don't ask me why I can do that math that quick, but I there are budgets often. So, >> but I mean the bottom line is a tool just like anything else. We have traffic lights, stop and go, that's a tool. Stop signs tool. Crosswalks tools. These are all >> assets for us to utilize and we take the initiative to do it or are we done? So, we're kind of doing that. We're

189taking the initiative. If it doesn't work out, I'm sure people are going to let us know. But I really thought I was going to be in the hallway tonight with the amount of people that were really so interested in this all over the social media. And for me, and I think I told this to you as well, um, Mr. Harrington that when I come down off of Walls Hill, I I don't get I don't get involved in a lot of things unless I'm passionate or it affects me personally. Not that I don't think what you do is isn't important because I do have to pay my taxes and I do go to the budgets and I do all of that. [clears throat] But I will come down my mountain as I tell everybody and I'm

190here to help and and not to hinder any processes. I truly am not. But I'm just gonna say as a citizen, I've I've been involved with you somewhat most recently and I think you're all doing a wonderful job. And Kevin, you're new. Congratulations. And you know, Cheryl's new. Congratulations. And just work together. Just work together. And if people want to know, well, I didn't know about it. There's no excuse for that. Call me. I'll tell. I will. Have a good night. >> Thank you. >> Anyone else wish to speak? So speeding is not new to just Winston. I mean speeding is happening everywhere. Uh I work north of here. We don't have any police department. We can't get state troopers to monitor our roads. So I put out speed bumps. I put out the flashing

191signs. I put up slow children playing. We've tried everything. People just speed. So, it's not just to one area, it's [clears throat] everywhere. The state knows about it because we complain as a town, every town complains to the state that there's a speeding problem. The state chooses to be silent and do nothing about it. So, it's up to us as each town to take matters in our own hands and solve the problem. >> Well, I got something different. Happy holidays everybody. Happy New Year. It's my last public appearance for this year. I think >> I hope so. >> Not cutting anybody up, but I'm just kind of segueing perhaps. Um, but I'm going to turn it over to the mayor if there's any more. [clears throat] >> Last chance. Anyone? >> I just want >>

192Sorry, Mr. Bishop. >> I I I think it's clear from from the people here and you know, even from, you know, what Marino and others have said. I think that we do want to in future meetings together maybe discuss like the process for how we would add cameras in the future like how many we're going to start with and like what the process would be for adding more so that we can be very transparent about that. So I just ask and maybe in the future we can discuss that and as a board of like what that process would be like so because I I do kind of share the concern of like oh well suddenly there could be you know 15 places around town like that you know we want to have a process for

193that. So that that's my two cents. See, told you I just gave myself more work. I said that earlier. I have no problem. We'll we'll get that on a on a >> needed >> future board of siphon meeting. I completely agree. A policy around additional c additional cameras again because we're still in the process. We don't even have an ordinance yet. I haven't thrown, you know, a ton at it yet, but we we can surely get that up uh in a in a January February uh meeting. So, not a problem. >> All right. This public hearing is adjourned. Happy holidays everybody. >> Happy holiday. >> Happy New Year. Thanks for coming. >> Oh, m