MRSD School Committee Meeting 3/4/2026

001Right. I will call to order the no uh yeah of November March 4th Maskomic Regional School District School Committee meeting at 7:07 p.m. I apologize for the delay. Um we will start with a public FY27 budget hearing. Uh so you can think about this almost as uh public comment but I would ask that we uh limit the comment for this section to u budget discussions. Um we will have a broader comments from the audience section afterwards. Um, so if you have comments on anything else beyond the budget, um, by all means, we'll have we'll have time for that afterwards. Um, and I see a show of hands if who would like to make make a comment about the budget tonight. >> There's some people over here. I think three. >> All right. So, there's >>

002over here you >> Yeah, looks like four. >> See some hands up back. Sorry, folks. Can you keep your hands up and can you come from behind the bookshelves at me if you want to make a comment, please? Six, three, four, five, five, six. Okay. So, save. >> So, just keep in mind we've got 45 minutes allocated now and 10 minutes later. >> Yep. So, we're not going to use all 45 minutes. We have six people, seven people maybe. Um, let's stick to um I'll say two minutes, we'll give you a warning. Two and a half minutes, we'll wrap up. Uh, I will hold everybody to that because I sense that tonight is going to be a very long night given the two big topics we have. Um, so if you would um you can

003come up in any order you'd like. And if you could just sign in and let us know your name and the town that you're from. >> Good evening. Um, I'm Christa Hoey. I am in the science department here at the um, high school. So I just rushed here from Framingham. So my notes are on the back of a receipt. So if I stumble a little bit. Um so although I want to talk about budget, it's not necessarily like I'm not going to talk about dollars and cents. um when reading back or watching back Monday's meeting, I just want to touch on a little bit about the department head stuff and if there has to be consolidation there that I would really love to see it be a numbers game rather than I think there's this

004like misguided idea that if we're merging departments, they have to be related. Like business doesn't have to equal math and wellness doesn't have to equal science. You know, those the core four, their plates are already full. they're at 17, 18, and 19. You know, nothing else should be put on those plates. It's a plates that are half full that we maybe should look at combining. Um, in my opinion, because even in the science department, the science department head is not an expert on biology, physics, chemistry, environmental science, biotechnology. Sorry, K. Um but um you know still I feel like a competent department head would able to evaluate an educator based on their teaching strategies and how students respond to them and how they respond to students. I don't think it necessarily has to be content

005specific. So if I was a science department head and I had to evaluate Mrs. Lon's AP chemistry class. I'm I'm not going to have any idea what she's talking about, but I'm fully capable of evaluating her as an educator and her teaching strategies and things like that. So, I would really like it to see it be a numbers game because I don't think it's as important that they are related then we're not, you know, overt taxing our already taxed department heads because all of our department heads are fantastic. I think they're like the lifeblood of this school. Um, but with the last contract, now they have six evaluations, what previously it was two, and they're teaching additional classes. So, I hope that it's a numbers game focus and not a let's just put them together

006because they seem related. >> Thank you. You guys want to line up like we did Monday? That'll keep things rolling too. Yeah, just line up in front of the bookshelves here and that way you guys can just be ready to go. >> Good evening, members of the school committee. Yesterday, we asked about not cutting the Chinese program. Now, we've learned it may go online without a teacher. Respectfully, that doesn't save the program. It weakens it. Chinese is a complex language that requires real time feedback, conversation, and tone correction. A screen can't adjust when we're confused or encourage us to speak. We learned during co how isolating and ineffective online learning can feel. Why return to that model for one of the most challenging courses we offer? Our teacher brings culture to life by sharing stories

007about her own Chinese traditions and experiences. She has built a classroom where we feel supported and connected. That human connection cannot be replaced by software. Please don't reduce this to an online course protected as the meaningful learning experience it has been for us. Here I have a flyer that includes the petition that we created and it now has over 500 signatures. So I'll leave us up here so that you can view that. Thank you. Thank you. >> Thank you. Good evening members of the school committee. My name is Elizabeth Shoemaker and I'm a senior at Mask On Regional High School. I have taken Chinese for 6 years. During my sophomore year, I made that decision to leave Masco and attend Brook School. While I was there, I continued to study Chinese. While eventually returning to

008Masco as a junior, I was nervous. Everything felt different. New teachers, new classes, and a new routine. But the one thing that stayed the same was Chinese class. The same classmates, the same classroom, the same teachers. Chinese class isn't just a course. It's a community. It's become my sense of belonging during a time of transition. As someone deeply involved in Masco, playing hockey and cross, serving as president of the environmental club, and being an active member of DECA, I can honestly say Chinese class and club community is where I feel the strongest bond. Over six years, we have built relationships rooted in support and a shared eagerness for growth. Some may argue that Chinese could transition to an online format, but that would strip away what makes the program so meaningful. As students who experience

009the impact of CO 19, we know firsthand the challenges that online learning can bring. Language learning is built on connection, conversation, and culture, things that cannot fully replicated on a screen. I truly believe there are many practical solutions to help increase enrollment in the Chinese program. And we're e eager to work with mass economic to implement ideas that would strengthen and participate without requiring additional budget increases. Cutting the Chinese program would not just remove a class from the schedule. It could take away a life-changing opportunity, one that opens doors to future careers, global understandings, and meaningful relationships. I understand that budget decisions are difficult and I respect the responsibilities you carried mate into making them. However, I encourage the committee to carefully evaluate what reductions will have the least impact on students. 25 years ago,

010there were three superintendents in the district office. Today, there's eight. If the district is seeking efficiencies, I respectfully encourage you to examine administration growth over the past 25 years before reducing programs that directly impact students. When we look at Masanomics's visions values, it is clear the Chinese program directly supports what our district stands for. Our vision emphasizes interdisiplinary learning, strong adult student relationships, and preparing graduates are culturally sensitive and aware of global independency. Chinese embodies those values. Cutting it away would move us further away from that vision, not closer to it. We just can we just make sure everybody's signing in too. I know we have to get a record of everyone. If you didn't if you haven't signed in, make sure you do, please. >> Thank you. Good afternoon. My name is Natasha Batzia

011and I'm a senior at Masconomic High School. I have been a me member of the Chinese program for over for six years now and I have firsthand witnessed its importance in educational opportunities and the invigorating experience learning Chinese has been. On Monday, I stood here alongside other concerned students voicing the concerns I had on cutting this program and the meaningful experiences we have had. Again, I stand here today to urge you all to reconsider the implications and effects of cutting this vital class. I know the school committee is concerned because of the lowering enrollment rates in the program as the school enrollment rates have been decreasing. I wanted to discuss today the innumerable ways in which the masconomic community could advertise to elementary students the different languages to increase the enrollment in this program without

012requiring any funding additions. It is important for us as a community to fight and encourage programs that are important to our school diversity and global awareness instead of dismissing them. The Chinese classes have brainstormed brainstormed many different solutions and I wanted to take this time to present a few of the ideas we have had. I would also like to add that these solutions can also be utilized in the French and Spanish programs alongside the Chinese programs to create a culture of robust global awareness. The first is we believe that the elementary school should be gaining exposure to these programs early as early as fourth or fifth grade. It's not fair for young students to be forced to choose and enroll in a course when they have had no prior experience in these languages. Having trial

013runs where the students can take a week or month learning this program so they can get firsthand experience on the culture and the language would help give them background knowledge before it's making a choice that impacts them for the next six years. Additionally, parents are lacking information on whether or not Chinese would be a good program for their student to enroll in. Having information nights where students and teachers could share their experiences, what a typical classroom would look like, and the benefits of Chinese language learning would directly influenced parents to have their children choose Chinese and enroll in the course. Mandarin Chinese has um career value in the future and global business and STEM. And it also has it allows you to differentiate yourself on college applications and gain valuable SC scholarship opportunities. I believe

014if parents knew these knew this importance of Mandarin Chinese before choosing the language their student would enroll in more would consider the language. Additionally, Mandarin Chinese is definitely a difficult language and we attract very high achieving students to take this program. I believe if we offered it as an honors course similar to the way that students who are high achieving in the elementary schools are invited to enjoy the honors um middle school math courses, it would encourage encourage students to take this demanding course so that they could feel that their knowledge is being put to use. Having programs where we invite students who are high achieving would give them a sense of pride and direction as they navigate through middle school. Additionally, we would offer programs that help them to gain recognition in middle school

015and high school where we do scholars recognition cords at graduation, shoutouts, and field trips to Chinatown. Programs like these allow students to feel recognized in their hard work that they are putting in the Chinese program. And I believe valuing the harder addition to the work would help students to feel that they are putting in work that would I'm sorry that would help them to feel valuable. And I think offering these programs free of char these additions do not cost any money and would encourage students to help increase the enrollment rates because they believe their work is being recognized and counted. Thank you so much. Good evening. My name is Nicholas Wedge. I'm a junior here in Chinese foreign honors. I'm here to express my concern about the potential cut of the Chinese program. I strongly

016oppose removing the Chinese program from the masconomics curriculum because the Chinese program has been an extremely valuable aspect not only of mine but my peers learning. I feel removing the program is unfair to me and other students who are currently in the Chinese program and will impact us in negative ways. The Chinese program has been an important and beneficial part of my high school career. I have learned a great deal about the language and its culture. Because of the program, I am able to carry out conversation in Chinese and read and understand Chinese material. But the experience has benefited me beyond the language itself. Since I I am in my junior year, I'm looking into business schools for college. Having six years of learning Chinese on my resume will be exceptionally helpful on college application.

017Also, the US business are tightly intertwined with Chinese counterparts. It is inevitable that I will have to communicate with manufacturers from China at some point in my future business career. My Chinese language skills will be tremendously valuable in the pursuit of my career success. I also hope to travel to China for my senior year and possibly study abroad in China thereafter. This all requires the continue of learning Chinese at masconomic I so I can pursue my passion but but also so those can after me can pursue theirs. I'm truly devastated at the possibility of losing this pathway. I hope that you may consider any and all other alternatives. Thank you. Good evening members of school committee. My name is Eileen Mascos, a high school Chinese teacher. And on behalf of myself, the middle school Chinese

018teacher, and all the students currently enrolled in the program, I'm here once again to urge you to vote to retain the Pasco Chinese program. During Monday's meeting and tonight, the students and parents spoke volumes of this program's value at personal, academic, and career levels. We recognized the budget challenges and difficult choices you have to make. However, decisions made in times like this define the district's priorities and values. Removing a unique program that set our district apart should not be the solution. Once the program is gone, students will lose the pathway and their educational experiences will be seriously undermined and narrowed. the negative impacts will reach far beyond just the classroom, the current students and school grounds. There have been families who moved to the district because Chinese is an option for their children. It happened

019in the past and it will happen in the future. Many families send their children to private schools for the Chinese language offering. Why do we want to remove a program that that can attract such families to the district? We understand the low enrollment is your primary concern, but there are viable options to increase it without adding extra budget. When the enrollment is lower than desired, the appropriate response should be strategic improvement, not elimination. I urge you to reassess the farreaching impact of cutting this program and a vote to keep it intact. And our students deserve to have this option. Thank you. Hello. Uh, my name is Noah Bolinger. I've been a student at Masco for four years and try to have longer. Uh, I don't want to be um, critical of your decisions because I

020don't envy your position. I don't think anyone in this room does. Uh, but I urge you to understand the weight of your actions. Uh thousands of students and educators here love these programs that are on the chopping block and they don't want them to go. No matter what happens, some people are going to get mad, but I hope that you make the right decision. stay over there. >> Hello, I am Abigail Buncher. I live in Tossfield and I am in sixth grade at Proctor School. As a 12-year-old student, I want to take band first of all. I also love art. For the sake of around 50 ADHD kids joining ne joining next year, me included. I think I I can speak for all of us that we love band, art, gym, and probably more that

021we haven't discovered yet. For the sake of 50 soon to be 13 year olds, I just urge you to be wise about your decisions as they will affect me and all my classmates. >> Hi everyone. Uh my name is Zortzis. I am the a civ teacher in the eighth grade and the union president. I just wanted to very quickly um I think that uh the support of the Chinese program that's being said out loud is really important, but I think it's also important to address the uh middle school team that is being considered for reduction. I'm a middle school teacher. Uh when you tell someone that, the first reaction that most people have is why why would you choose to work with 12, 13, and 14 year olds? And I would argue that, you know,

022uh middle school teachers don't get chosen. they it kind of chooses them. Um I did not choose a junior high. I don't want to teach at junior high. It doesn't fulfill what a middle school student needs. 12, 13, and 14 year olds need community. They need a sense of belonging. They need people they can rely on. Uh they need to feel as though they're part of something. And a middle school team provides that. A junior high does not. High schoolers can handle that. High schoolers want to be independent. They want to have more time on their own. They want to feel as though they can explore their space on their own. A middle schooler, whether they admit it or not, does not. They need and a middle school provides that. A junior high does not.

023And if you cut a team, while it makes financial sense because it saves a chunk of money because there are five people that are essentially elacid bandit together, realistically for our program, it will be devastating. And while I appreciate the fact that you have financial constraints to consider, part of the conversation from the last meeting that I found disheartening was the notion that the finances should be the primary focus of your decisions. The school is the primary focus of your decisions. Financial constraints are a side effect of that and should absolutely be considered. I'm an adult. I understand the fact that you have very serious things to consider here, but that is your secondary obligation. Your primary obligation is to this school and I will tell you directly that losing a team will have a

024negative impact on this school. And it felt like from an audience member that there was a kind of acknowledgment of the fact that that could be devastating to this school, but that we have to do it because we need to save money. And I would encourage you to uncover every rock and have long conversations and do the hard work and not simply look at the easiest solution because it saves a nice round number out of our membership. Look hard, find the work, there has to be money, have the conversation. And while it again it might seem very simple to cut a middle school team, it will have long lasting devastating impact on our students that need a sense of belonging and understanding and team. It's the reason why I chose middle school. It's the reason

025why I chose me and I hope we can continue to have that. >> Thank you. All right. Good morning uh or good evening. Sorry. School committee. My name is Ros Leon. >> I'm Els >> and I'm Nathan Kaiser. >> We wanted to inform you guys that Chinese class built a sense of community within the class, the school and our friends. Our community has rallied with us and 430 people when I wrote this letter signed our petition. and now I think it's at 514. So in those six hours we have great gained an immense amount of supporters in that s that short time. Leasher is not just a great educator but she's a mentor to all of her students past and present and the testimonies on the petition speaks volumes about her character. Her past students

026have talked about how Chinese has improved their college options, career opportunities and their culture appreciation. One of her past students, Mark from the class of 2020, wrote this program numbers is an outlet for high performing students to stand out in college and job applications. While it is true that we have a smaller class size, the students that this class produces are high performing people that have become lawyers, accepted into top universities, and has gained amount amount of cultural appreciation for the Chinese culture. At the last meeting, some of you proposed the idea of finishing the course of Chinese using an online program. I know you said on Monday night that you know it would not be a true substitute for the value of Chinese class, but you don't know how deep that goes. When you

027take out the in-person connection of Chinese class, you remove a sense of belonging, connection that can only be found in that room. There's something special about this class. For many students, it's the one class they feel comfortable in to express themselves and learn about this wonderful language. Throughout all of history, language is used for communication between people, something so interpersonal, something that brings people together. It just isn't the same over the screen. You can't connect with people over an online tool the same way you can in an interactive classroom with other people who are as engaged as you are. Online learning is a tool, but it can never replace an in-class person experience. It can allow students to meet the bare minimum for requirements for language, but Masco has a tradition of excellence, and to

028uphold that trait, the Chinese program must be kept. >> We understand that the numbers in the Chinese class are low. But raising our numbers starts with keeping um all of the programs in the budget that makes Masco stand out. I would also like to note that with more information given on just how beneful uh beneficial the Chinese program could be to rising seventh graders, it is very possible that the program could see a large increase in numbers. If the Chinese program were even given one to two years more of support to see if the numbers had improved, we believe this would be more than enough time to prove that the Chinese program is worth keeping. We are prepared to show up at every meeting and keep fighting for the Chinese program. This isn't a matter

029that we take lightly. This class is extremely too important to all of us and we will continue to fight for it to stay. Thank you for your time and please consider re uh reconsider cutting the jacket Hello everyone. >> Damak and I'm a sophomore here at MASCO. My sister is a senior here. Her name is Joyce Mach and she couldn't be here right now because she's at a jazz band competition. So, she's written something that she would like for me to read to you all. Good evening. As you may know, I am a strong proponent of increasing the diversity in global based education here at Mascow. The current budget solution of cutting the Chinese programs in the language department will only be setting us as a school district back, not forward. The language department has

030already had its struggles, especially with the lack of a department head leading it, which has caused issues with students trying to switch classes, find opportunities, and take part in the global diploma program of which I myself am a part of and care deeply about, as do other students. To take more away from the language department, specifically the entire Chinese program, would deny students a unique opportunity to experience and learn a culture entirely different than what they experience at Masco. It would deny students the opportunity to build their empathy and global awareness and understand that even though there may be people out in the world who have different perspectives and backgrounds, they are human beings, too. That we are more alike than different and everyone, regardless of where they come from, deserve respect. It would perpetuate

031the ignorance that already exists at the school. Ignorance that we say we're trying to fight, yet we are considering a quote solution such as this. If you don't believe there is ignorance here, please talk to students who have experienced it. They will tell you the truth. If you believe the Chinese program doesn't have enough interest, look around you. Look at the students standing here tonight fighting to keep the program they care so much about. This has a huge impact on them and students who aren't even directly involved in the program such as I am. The existence of a Chinese program alone is enough to show that we as a school are trying and care about representation. It lets students who are Asian or people of color know that there is a safe place to express

032themselves, share a part of themselves, and allow others to open their minds and take in new experiences, which is exactly what a school is supposed to do. Additionally, the position that will be cut is a student-f facing position. Miss Lee provides so much to the students and the program. And though I may not have personally had her as a teacher, I know that the students that have truly appreciate and respect her and she deserves to stay. If Masconomic wants to boast that their graduating students are prepared for a global environment and they need to actually do that. I urge you, do not cut the Chinese program and do not cut student positions. Thank you. Good evening school committee. My name is Ava Zerena and I'm a sophomore here at Masconomic. >> Thank you Sean Sheran.

033I'm also a sophomore here at Mconomic. >> We are here on behalf of the appreciating cultures and ethnicities ethnicities club. >> We have been involved with the club for two years now. We're on the executive board as well. In preparation for this committee meeting, I read the mass economic strategic plan 2023 to 2028 and I believe that the Chinese department is a very important asset to mass economics goals in the future. The committee has written, "We believe diversity should be valued as a critical component of teamwork and aim to ensure every student is known, supported, and challenged to reach their full potential." on page 14. Cutting a Chinese department will be a massive loss of diversity through a form of language and cultural support. >> Also, according to our school's district profile, about 3.4% of

034our student body is Asian. Learning an learning Chinese and existence of a club offers our students a new perspective of different regions. Having a Chinese club is vital to Masco because they give space for Asian students to celebrate their culture. Cultural clubs bring people together with shared traditions and removing the Chinese program along with the Chinese club would destroy that. Eastern civilization and culture is very different from ours and the Chinese program helps students to not only learn the language but also be exposed to a new culture unfamiliar to them. Thank you and have a great evening. Is that all of our speakers for this session? So >> something short. >> Yeah. Yeah, please. As long as long as it pertains to budget. >> In the future, we should move the signup sheet to a

035another place prior to them getting to the speaker to the microphone. Good >> suggestion. Just a learning things down. motion. My name is Brian Dao. I teach woodshop and I teach some art classes and I've had the pleasure of meeting some of you in the wood shop and that was really enjoyable. Um, I had not expected to speak tonight, so I only have like just a couple of words just to to mention. I do want to speak on behalf of Stacy Mannheim, who's the department head for the art department. Um, what came to mind when I was hearing about the possibility of losing her position for our department, I equate it to um a ship without a helmsman at the front, right? It bound to run up on the rocks. There are so many things

036that you can't just pass that that particular job off to another crew member, right? There are certain specialties. There are certain skills that have been honed over the years. In Stacy's case, she learned from Mr. Minel, who learned from his father before him, right? It took a lifetime to build those skills up. The fact that the art department is as strong as it is is not by accident. Right. And one of the things I I I was speaking to someone about and they said, "If the position goes away, don't worry, you'll survive. As a teacher, you'll survive." Surviving is not living. And our students will survive the experience, but they won't get the most out of it. They can't. There's so many things that come from having a department head. Now, I witnessed this. I

037used to teach at a different school district and they decided also to take away the uh the art department head and I watched firsthand that there was there was lack of community. The people who were still teaching in the department were no longer a cohesive unit. They were like an individual rafts just doing their job but not not giving the students everything that they could get. Um, that's really all I have to say, but I I I know that you're in a very very difficult position, but like Nico had said, we're here first for the students that we teach. It's always that way. um that should be primary and part of that is keeping a cohesive unit who work together you know in tandem. It doesn't happen if you have different disperate parts. It won't

038work the same. Thank you very much. >> Can I ask the students to maybe just stand up behind? Not not all you don't have to all stand up. I just want to be able to see them as I address them for a moment. Can you guys come out from behind the bookshelf for a minute, please? Is that everybody? I know there's a few more hiding back there. See you through the bookshelf. Bernardo, you have some authority. Can you tell? I >> think that's it. I have no authority. So, I just want to say thank you to you guys again. I know I expressed my appreciation remotely the other night. Uh, I just want to say thank you to you guys again. Um, you know, you all live very busy day lives. You have lots of

039studies and sports and extracurricular activities you're doing. To come out and to speak your mind um really says a lot about you and the community that has helped foster you to this point. And so, I just wanted to say thank you to you guys. And maybe just one more quick thought. Um, we are off to the I've started my remarks from the chair. Um, I'll address the audience next. You know, Nico and I talk every once in a while. We we agree on some things, we disagree on some things. Uh, one of the things I agree that he said is that this will have an impact, right? We making cuts will have an impact. There's no question about it. I think we, none of us at the table want to make cuts. Um, what I'll

040disagree with Nico on tonight is the idea the the mindset of saving money was a term you used. I don't think we're looking to save money. For me, that gives me the connotation that we're putting money in our pockets and we're saving it for a future date for something. I think of this as we just don't we don't have the money. We don't have budget, right? We're looking to spend money that isn't allocated to us that we don't have that the towns don't have. Right. And we yes, we can go ask for a proposition override if we want. Um, and there are lots of considerations to to be had around that as well. And so I just want to when I hear save money, it it has a certain connotation. And I'm I'm not sure

041that that's really what we're trying to do here. What we're trying to do is be fiscally responsible within a budget that's being allocated to us. And it's painful. I know it's painful. Um, but what I will do, and I made this point to somebody that I sent an email to earlier today, is I will commit to pouring in many more hours over the next week to do the best that we can to minimize that impact. Myself and many of the school committee members have already poured in dozens of dozens of hours into trying to address this issue. Um, and I will commit to this I will commit to the community to continue to pour in ours. And so we will do our best. Um I want to thank the people that offered other suggestions. >>

042Uh we got some emails. A lot of them were in support of the Chinese program. A lot of them were in support of department heads. There was a handful of emails that offered other suggestions. Uh the teachers put together a nice summary of uh opportunities that uh I met with Nico and Melissa and Adrian before this meeting to discuss. Um, I appreciate the creativity that's going on. I appreciate the inputs. Um, and last to the school committee, uh, as we head into tonight, this is going to be a busy night with two big big topics. We have budget deliberations and we have the superintendent discussion. Um, it will be an emotional evening. These are emotional topics. I am personally going to spend a little extra effort paying attention to my emotions tonight. I'd ask you

043guys to do the same thing and I'd ask you to also come into these discussions with an open mind. Okay? We're a very strong school committee I believe and I think that we can come to some some good outcomes here or the best possible outcomes we can. Um those are my remarks for the night and so I suspect most of the budget thoughts have been shared from the community. Um but I will open it up for comments from the audience if there are topics outside of budget. Um, >> is that the president? No. >> Yeah, the budgetation. >> So, are there is there are there any other comments from the audience? >> Comments from the audience tonight. Am I ready to go? Okay. I don't know if you guys are still talking. Tonight, I speak

044to you as a resident of Toppsfield. As you all are very well aware, I've served on the school committee since 2019. I'm also a proud alumni and mom to a graduate of class of 24 and a member of the class of 2026. To say I value public service is a gross understatement. I've been serving my Topppsfield community in various capacities for the greater part of 16 years. I encourage others to serve their communities and I support those who do. I do however however recognize that roles have different requirements requirements, criteria and boundaries. A school committee serves three main roles budget setting, policym and selecting an executive officer. Further, this school committee's responsibility is emphasized that the most crucial one is to deliver the best possible education to the children enrolled in our schools. I urge

045the decision makers in the room to ask yourself, will the decision decisions you are making tonight and the next several meetings result in delivering the best possible education to the children enrolled in our schools. It is my opinion that Masco is at a great inflection point. We are 5 years postco. We are in the process of hiring a new superintendent. We approved a strategic plan several years ago. Um, and we're about to embark on major capital improvements. We need to ask ourselves, are the decisions we are making tonight going to take us in a better direction or will we remain stagnant? Do we have enough information to make informed budget decisions that will preserve and grow the treasure that is Masconomic Regional School District? Are we doing what is right for future generations of students?

046I am not an educational professional. Therefore, I need to rely on the expertise of others to inform my decisions. I am continually asking myself what additional information I need, looking for it, and and gathering what would help me make the best informed decision. I'm constantly listening and reading. I like to ask questions. I take what I hear and I filter it like we teach our students to do based on various lenses in our lives. Over the past two months, the school committee has received a lot of information related to budget and the hiring of a superintendent. A lot of voices and opinions have been heard. The school committee needs to take those and filter those using our own lenses. However, I believe it is imperative to listen to what those voices are saying. We need

047to take people at their word and listen. As a school committee, there have been numerous opportunities to listen and I believe it's incumbent upon the members to listen and understand the wise behind the words. Mascanama is a different place than when I first sat at the school committee table in May of 2019. We have different leadership. We have different school committ committee members. I'm even speaking from a different room than we're used to meeting in. But we still have students who have needs arguably more or at least different than in 2019. And we still have teachers. In fact, I'd ar I'd argue that most of the teachers who were here in 2019 are still here in 2026. Teaching our students, being trusted adults, and ensuring our students are successful once they graduate. Heck, there more

048than a handful of teachers still teaching that were on the faculty when I graduated in 1996. And there's more than a handful of teachers who came back to teach after graduating. This says a lot about the type of place that Mascow is. It is a place where people want to teach, where teachers collaborate, and where teachers go above and beyond as trusted adults to mentor and guide our children. When these trusted adults are telling the other adults making the decisions that change is desperately needed, that they want to teach at MASCO, but that things are difficult, and that they would like to work with all the stakeholders to effectuate change and make Masco a better place while using creativity to deal with hard financial decisions, we need to listen. We need to listen when a

049climate survey states that morale is low and that change is desperately needed. and we need to listen when they have opinions about who they think the best person to serve as their educational leader would be in the future. As I've looked around the room during the budget season, I see familiar faces. Faces that care. Bases that impacted my children's education. Bases that wrote recommendation letters, guided decisions, helped them discover new passions, coach them, encouraged growth and learning, and helped them overcome fear and try new things. Faces that believed in my children and made sure that they knew it. And faces that my children could count on when their lives were upended and things were scary. My children are not an anomaly. The faces in these rooms are here for every child at Masco and I

050had the same experience 30 years ago. Which is why and part of the reason why I choose to give back. I publicly thank the Masconomic educators for my family's experience. It has been nothing short of amazing. As a resident of Topsfield, I want to ensure that we have the programs, people, and budget in place to ensure that we are delivering the best possible education to the children enrolled in Masanomit for generations to come. I urge you to listen, anticipate the consequences, and then make informed decisions that you will be able to support in both the short term and the long. Thank you. Look at that seat. >> Uh, good afternoon school committee. Uh, my name is Jonah Stephins. I am a sophomore at Matthew right now. So, I've been here for four years and I'm

051from Topsfield. I have a freshman brother. I got little brother who's a freshman. I got two little sisters at Proctor, so they're going to be here in three years now. Um, I'm here for the Chinese class. I don't know if it's appropriate to be up here now and not earlier. I didn't really know. I wasn't exactly planning on coming up here tonight. I came here on Monday and I come here today to support my classmates. I supported my mom. She came up and talked and to of course to support my teachers and all the other wonderful people who have come up today from the art department, from the middle school. I just it's really hard to follow up that speech of course um with nothing prepared and I'm just sitting here looking at a pink

052paper. Um >> so of course I'm here to talk about the Chinese class in sixth grade. They came to my middle school the language departments to um you know tell us about their languages, try to get us interested. And that was the day I decided to take Chinese at the end of that day. I got a little sticker actually that said Chinese. Um, I decided to take it that day because I was not interested in Spanish or French at all. No offense to those two languages. I had taken Spanish in like second grade after school course, but languages that sort of like English don't really interest me at all. Latin languages. So, that's kind of what pulled me towards Chinese. It was a challenge. It was something new. People told me it was hard, but

053I don't really mind that too much. And I really enjoyed the class. I don't regret it a single day. Middle school was awesome. High school amazing. It's the same group of people. I've stuck with it. We've gone through all the same challenges. We've learned all the same stuff and, you know, like practicing characters, learning how to say it. It's just a lot different than the people in the French and Spanish classes. And I really love that. I come home from my meeting on Monday and I'm telling my dad all about cuz, you know, he comes home really late and I was just telling him all about the meeting cuz I was really excited. I have had a lot of fun listening to these speeches and everything. It's even though it's like my favorite courses are

054on the line here, I just love watching everyone come up and speak and especially the art department and middle school teachers who I had two years ago. Um I come home and I'm telling my dad about the course and my little sister's in the room. One of them is in Proctor. So they're going to be making the same big decision to, you know, commit to a language and expect Masco to keep up that commitment. And I'm like, I'm really worried. I don't want Chinese to get cut. And the first thing anyone says in the room is my little sister who's in fourth grade. and she goes, "Wait, Chinese are getting cut." And she was really sad about it. Even though she I asked her, "Are you going to take Chinese?" She's like, "I don't know."

055Um, I just think, you know, it's a numbers game. As people said, it's not the percentage. Even though that hasn't dwindled, it's how many students take the course. And I feel like it's got to be it's there's got to be better ways. There's got to be cheaper ways to, you know, spread knowledge about the course. I took it because I thought it was a challenge. I took it because I wasn't bold towards Spanish or French and but of course I had taken Spanish. Spanish was a thing. A lot of kids took Spanish during elementary school and in Tasha at least I had never heard of, you know, taking Chinese. And I think the pandemic affected a lot of this language course taking because my old school which I went to for fourth and fifth grade

056in the pandemic, we were all supposed to take Italian, but we never took a single class during the pandemic. >> And I think not being out there, not doing extracurriculars for these students is a big reason to why, you know, these languages haven't been getting out there. I think definitely what was said earlier, give it two years, give it one year, you can see the numbers rise. You can try something new. It's it's the students that matter. It's more than the money. But of course, I don't envy your position at all. And I think you guys are really mature and really awesome people to be, you know, making all these big decisions for, you know, my little sisters to come, my little brother, and of course me. I'm still here for two years. I'm I'm

057stuck here. But um you know I think it's pretty awesome and thank you so much for listening to my blabber on tell my stories. Thank you so much. >> All right. >> Yeah. Do before we do anymore. Can I have a show of hands? Are there any Yeah, I'll get I promise I'll get to you. So, can I just have a show of hands? Is there anybody else speaking tonight? >> Okay. >> All right. Thank you. >> I'm planning to talk today, but I just wanted to say from my experience, I'm parent. >> Can you introduce yourself? >> Oh, sorry. My name is Sky Blouse. I'm a parent of um a daughter who's taking Chinese class. And uh uh so one day when she came to me and said, "You know what? I signed up

058for Chinese class." I'm like, "What?" I was so surprised because maybe I was ignorant but I understood like Masco you know wouldn't offer that kind of class. I my impression was this is white school it's there's no diversity here you know sorry to say that but that was my impression. So I was very pleasantly surprised and she said no they offer Chinese class. I'm like what? So I'm like yeah sure you go. And uh I have to say all all you know classmates I'm so proud of them because myself I only have high school degree but I speak three languages and that's the that's the biggest thing what anybody can you know it's the biggest value that you can have learning and uh when my daughter said she's uh learning Chinese I was like what

059that's too challenging even for me I wouldn't want anything to start like that. So when I look at this new generation who are willing to do that, I see them as very dangerous for this society. Don't laugh, but it's true because you guys are up to the challenge. To learn Chinese is not easy. Trust me, I know three languages. That's one of the hardest language. So when I look at you guys, the speeches you make, you're very dangerous for this society. And even whatever happens here, like I said, I don't think any of you mean to hurt them or, you know, punish them and cut the cut the program, I know you're going to succeed because you're determined and you're fighting for what you believe. And I know if one door closes, next one will

060open. I hope it doesn't happen. I hope we can go back to diversity and encourage diversity here in the school because it's just going down the hill. What I see, you know. So, please keep this program. Please promote people who are strong and I that's the future and when they grow up and go to college or become famous engineers or doctors or whatever lawyers that they can say you know what there was my classes in the chopping board but uh committee they were strong just like us and they made hard decisions. I know. Please be inspired by them and when the challenge comes, fight just like they fought and not give up. Fight whatever we need. If we if you guys need more time, we can look for ideas, but don't give up. Fight. Fight.

061What's important to us? Fight for that. Don't give up. Thank you. >> All right, we're going to move on to the FY27 budget. Thank you everybody. So, uh, everybody's coming up to the the lectern speaking area, whatever we want to call it here tonight. >> Yeah, right up there. So, just uh the topics that um the ELT is going to present on tonight uh at um the from the school committee's requests from Monday night. uh they talk about the plan to meet the needs of students affected by the elimination of the Chinese program uh including an online course option sealed by literacy and global diploma. Uh look at a comprehensive approach to restructuring department heads uh that preserves the uh scenario two elimination of two positions uh and then review the impact of scenario two

062and the department head restructuring on teaching sessions. So turn it over to you guys. Um, so I just want to say a few words before we get begin. Before we present tonight, we would like to clarify that we are responding directly to your requests from the last school committee meeting to explore the possibility of combining department heads. We understand that two two potential reductions are currently under consideration and we want to emphasize that this is a prime preliminary draft prepared in response to the request within a very short time frame. We respectfully ask that you allow us, the experts, the opportunity to implement the budget after you have voted on it. We believe it is essential to collaborate with all stakeholders involved to determine the most thoughtful approach, one that will make the most sense

063and cause the least disruption to our school community. In fact, to follow the transition into the uh Chinese students are so well spoken. I I can't say enough about the level of engagement. Um really really impressive. So thank you. That's a credit to your to the school community. Um in terms of current enrollment, I know you asked us for the numbers uh within the current program. Uh so currently now in grade seven uh we have as you can see here nine students enrolled in the program. Um in grade 8 10 so as the middle school as a whole we have 19 uh students enrolled in Chinese courses. Um grade nine five um and then grade 10 we're up to 13 and then you can see here 11 six um 12 and 8. So we have

064a total um here of 19 um at the at the middle school um and at the high school um we have 32 eight of which are graduating um which brings us to a total number of 51. Um so I know that that was that data was asked of us uh you know so we want to at least provide those numbers in terms of where we're at with the current program. Um this here speaks to um students what a rising seventh uh grade seven student would be would be a student that's currently in the sixth grade right rising seventh. So I just want to make sure that that's clear. So for a rising grade seven student, uh they would be looking at if we were to eliminate the program either they'd have to opt into either

065um Spanish or French um in the in the seventh grade as a rising uh seventh grade obviously wouldn't we wouldn't have that option of the uh Chinese course. Um what this means for rising eighth graders um that um perhaps were enrolled in the program, right? would have been enrolled as a seventh grader, they'd be looking at they'd have to transition to either Spanish or French um if that program were to be eliminated. Rising um grade nine students um would have the option of opting into Spanish or French or a course that we're hopeful to run um in heritage heritage Spanish and heritage Portuguese. Um we did offer those courses last school year uh but we didn't have the enrollment to successfully run those courses but we are pitching those courses again. Um so those would

066be options for rising grade nine students. Um students entering grade 10 rising grade 10 um this is the virtual learning option that you've heard um a little bit about. For us we use a program called Educier. Uh this is currently we use this for credit recovery um you know situations where students may be out for extended periods of time as well. Uh this was I believe this was implemented this school year. Is that accurate? >> Yes. >> Um so you know that is our go-to program. The cost of this if a student were to opt for the virtual learning option obviously that cannot replace in-person learning but this would be the option if you want to continue in Chinese. um would be $550 a per student. Um and that is for a year-long course. Uh

067my understanding, and I'm not the expert on this because I don't handle educ, but um others could speak to it better than I can, but there is a my understanding is a personalized learning coach, uh you know, based on the research that I've done, and it's a self-based course um with check-ins along the way. Uh but certainly, you know, it's not going to replicate the um in-person experience of a Chinese teacher. Um the other option as a rising 10th grader would be um Spanish or French at that point. So you've you've completed your right there's not you've decided I'm going to move on. I'm not going to pursue the virtual option, but I'm going to opt into a different language. rising grade 11 in grade 12 students they would also have the same virtual learning

068option of educ um there is a you know the the courses are we've differentiated at different levels so depending on what the level is needed whether it's an AP or Chinese level four or you know those courses are all certainly offered through educ um you'd be looking at $550 per student um or um at that point, we uh we require two years of a of a language. Um so for those students that have fulfilled that graduation requirement, perhaps they want to opt out of the language requirement at that point. Um so that would be for the rising grade 11 and 12 students. So that's just hopefully gives you a sense of pathways. Um but obviously there's no opportunity there's just not possible to replicate obviously if we eliminate the program the inerson experience. So you'd

069be looking at a virtual learning experience um transitioning out as a whole or opting for another language. Um there were um do you want to stop there before I address the bi literacy? >> I think it's probably be a couple questions. >> Yeah. So go ahead. So are you envisioning if they do do the edges that would be their class for that period schedule? >> Yep. That's what we do with some other students. So they would not be scheduled for a full course load of seven classes. They would have their Chinese class. >> It is um at your own pace. So if some students want to do some there, do it at home, but that is their language class on their schedule and we would give you a room to do that. >> Um, you

070give them a room. Would there also be a proctor in the room? Okay. >> There's Oh, they'll be with an adult. Yeah. >> And textbooks. Is it like module based or >> It's module based. We're running not Chinese. We're running a lot of other classes right now. Spanish, we have English, math, last, not a lot, but we do have students using it right now and they're being proctored. We do have um some tutors here that if they're familiar with the subject are assisting um but they also do offer many online tutorials like action black people that you can be in contact with, but it does not replace a classroom, but there are humans on the other end. >> And then just one more quick one or hopefully it's quick. Um, for Spanish and French, is

071there capacity with the current staffing that we have now to absorb those students? >> Yes, at both the middle school. >> Thank you. >> We'd have to make change in there, but absolutely we have the capacity. >> Thank you. >> Sorry, I have one more question. >> All right. >> I'm sorry. >> I saw a hand over here. I went to, but I'll go ahead. >> Oh, back around. Okay. Give everybody a chance. I had two questions. Um these heritage courses, those aren't classes now or they are >> they were offered um they they they're new. Um they just No, they haven't run. >> They were they were offered last school year >> for the first time. >> Yes. So for this school year when we >> I'm sorry, this school year beginning >> they're

0722526. So they were offered in the spring of last year for selection. We did not get enough students to run it. Um, and there's been a lot of talk about it and we think we will have enough students and it's for heritage for native speakers for Spanish and um, Portuguese and it per DESIE will count as a foreign language for them. It satisfies their language. >> That would be, you know, you're not a native speaker, you wouldn't qualify for those classes. Correct. >> Right. >> And that's not new staff for those existing staff. >> It's just readjusting the current staff. Um, and for your current Spanish and French courses, what's, you know, what's the average, you know, student ratio at this point or student? What? I guess my question is is she has to consolidate

073those into larger classes because you said this this capacity now. >> The numbers in for the middle school, the numbers are fairly low. You only have 19 students between the two grades. So, I mean, we have quite a few Spanish teachers. So, it would be spreading them across several Spanish classes. And then for French, um, I mean, we have five sections of French available between the two grades. So, we'd be able to spread them out. >> I guess I was going a different direction. You know, if you could squeeze the existing French and Spanish, the higher student loan, and take a teacher out of that and preserve the Chinese that >> you're asking if we could reduce by a French or Spanish teacher to preserve Chinese, >> right? That's not something we've looked at, but

074we'd have to get back to about >> Spanish. Probably not. I'd say no. In Spanish, >> Spanish, I I don't have any room to lose Spanish. Our Spanish classes are >> Yeah. >> healthy. >> I mean, I in the middle school, we definitely could not lose French because we only have one French full-time French teacher. So, >> I will just add I know in the high school, I think they do combine some like honors or something at the same time. So, If you take that away, you're >> Yeah, there's 10 sections of French at the high school. Um, that's two teachers >> and there's one teacher >> Yeah. >> in the middle school. >> Thanks. I want you to come. Lisa, >> I just had a question on the current enrollment. I'm just curious because

075it said ninth grade there's only five students. Do you ever see a jump going into the next grade as to So, it's pretty much consistent. Once you hit the high school, it's extremely rare to change your line, but it's I'm not going to say it doesn't happen. >> The the major point if students were to change would be that 8th to 9th grade, but even that's >> Yeah. >> very rare. >> That was kind of the sense I was getting from the emails is like once you >> once you're in you, >> they seem to go all four years. Yeah. And I was just >> Yeah. I just didn't know if >> Typically, it's a sixy year all the way through. Um, not to say there aren't some children who change, but if statistically once

076you start in the seventh grade, we follow it all the way through. >> Yeah. Real quickly, did I hear that you're currently using Educier for credit recovery? >> Credit recovery as well as um full courses for some students who are unable for many a reason not being >> and that's going well. Would you say >> those? Yes. But >> okay. >> Yes. And yes, >> okay, >> those who are able to get online and take it are doing well. Some have roadblocks that are not because of the edgier program. >> Okay, >> those who are are able to log on it is not easy. We have switched programs this year from grat alliance to educ alliance was majority uh credit recovery. easier. This is kids. This is real. This is regular class. They're working hard.

077They have CP, they have honors, they have AP. So, we can decide. So, students are not if um things come up that are not of their control, they're not losing their honors credits. They're still able to be they're not able to be in the class, but they were an honors student. we're still able to sign them up at the honors level. >> So, does that mean that they potentially could be more or receive a more tailored program to their level than perhaps they would be in a regular classroom? >> Yeah, it's more tailored to their situation than >> Okay. All right. Fair enough. Thank you. Some some students thrive with virtual learning and others it's fallen down. You know, as you can imagine, there's a market now. >> This this part of my homework was

078easy because this is something that our team's already researched this at seer. >> Um, but as you can, you know, there's so many providers out there now. >> Yeah, it's a it's a so we also Thank you, Julie. >> It's also a Desi. It follows mass frameworks. So, it is a prescribed curriculum. It's improved which is another reason why we switched online. So this follows mass core this follows um the CD requirements competency determination requirements. So educ is following Massachusetts state requirements the standards for each class. So it is prescribed for the students. >> Thank you for the reminder. >> Just a quick point of order. Do we have a do we have any action come out of the topic Jeff brought up around what sounds like maybe the French class the impact to a

079French class or the impact to a French teacher? Excuse me. >> I wouldn't mind seeing that if it's not a ton of work. I know I missed the last meeting. >> Were you asking for middle school or high school for that? >> Yeah. How do you ask? Are you asking could you reduce >> instead of losing the Chinese teachers you take from the French >> not you wouldn't have it would not be six sections of French to eliminate to keep all the Chinese sections >> you said there's two in high school one in the middle school which means we'd move to one and one >> right which would not be enough sections really to serve all the French students >> I just think of you know future world languages. Spanish and Chinese are really place

080to be. You know, French, it's it's nice, but it's not really a global language like it used to be. >> I can tell you at the middle school, we do not have two. >> It's impossible. >> I mean, we say that, but then we have >> we're forcing the Chinese numbers. >> Yeah. >> There's clearly >> you see where the interest is. >> Yeah. >> The students, >> I don't agree with that. put the enrollment up >> taking it. Do I remember that the French program produces the most like global diplomas? >> I I'll go back to the department head. I think there >> French higher on >> I mean the point is >> I think it would be Spanish just because there will be more Spanish Yeah. more students enrolled in Spanish. Yeah. I

081I think French >> didn't French recently have a reduction in staff >> of all the languages within the last years >> didn't do it. >> Yeah, it was it was discussed last year but >> probably last year but >> but like we're going back like >> not that I remember. >> But the point I guess just the point is I think you said you have one French middle school teacher, two French high school teachers. So the only option would be a French high school teacher. And if you did that, then you'd be putting the full burden of all the French students, which I'm assuming is >> a lot more >> 150 over five sections. So >> five sections of >> talking at least. >> I don't know if it's that large, but it just it

082would be larger. >> French the the enrollment numbers are not as high as Spanish. >> Sure. But they're definitely higher than what we're looking at in Chinese. >> We want to get to the >> seal of bi literacy and global Kevin by literacy and >> yeah Kevin >> yeah we're we're um yeah sure seal of bi literacy we uh have been really offering to our seniors in the spring. We're about to uh test a actually next week. We have a large group um in Spanish. But you know what this would do in terms of u if we were to eliminate the program certainly any student um that's in grade 10 or 11 could still um they could still take the SEAL test. We could actually offer it um you know in the spring um of

083their junior or senior year. So, you know, as far as the seal of biiteracy goes, if students were to pursue and continue on with their path, um, or if, you know, if they're in a position they feel like they can, you know, they even want to take it this school year, um, they certainly could, um, as a as a junior. So, you know, we can be flexible. A lot of districts actually do offer the seal of literacy junior year. Um, I know we did at my previous district. So, you know, as far as the seal goes, that's something that that opportunity would still be there. just that obviously you eliminate the program you're looking at a narrowing you know an opportunity with a with a language obviously of Chinese so um but the opportunity would

084still exist >> so just a reminder on sale by literacy we offer the sale of bi literacy also for courses we don't offer we have students that are fluent in Russian Greek they sit for the seal of bi literacy >> so my question was do we ever see demand for students to want to take it earlier because my understanding is you can take it as early as 8th grade. >> The only time we've had kids take it super early um are transfer students come in and test out >> because Department of Ed will allow a student to sit for the seal of biiteracy and test out of a foreign language. Um and that's usually for we we've used it for transfer students um because they're like I've been taking other things you don't offer. I'm

085fluent. Um, and so they sit for the sale by literacy and bed will count that as their foreign language requirement. So yes, you can take it younger. We just haven't had kids that are typically ready to take. >> Um, which is why we offer it later. Um, but that's why I do want to remind that we do offer it for courses that or for languages that we don't teach because they're fluent at home in that language. So they, you know, will sit for that as well. >> Global diploma. Yeah. Continue. >> Um global diploma. Um as far as that goes, we have um right now, um you know, we we've had a recent committee meeting because I, you know, obviously with the timing of the transition with the department head and everything else. Um I'm

086fortunate we have a a teacher in the department that has really run with this in the past. Uh so we we have a team of educators that met uh last month. Um and we the conversation we had at the table is we're going to need to be flexible just because changes with our program of studies and courses changing and things like that. So that's something that we're looking at right now are you know different course offerings and how that might impact >> um but you know as far as uh for students that we have five students in the Chinese program now that are can also part of the global diploma. So we certainly wouldn't be we would work with them, you know, to obviously support the different requirements um that go into the global diploma

087in supporting them over the course of their high school career. Um so the track that they're on, we could continue to support them and we just may have to be um you know creative in terms of um the language requirement, right? We may have to curtail that. we may have to wave it all together um in terms of uh you know four years of the same language because we'd be depriving them of that opportunity. So we'd have to work with those but there are five currently that are part of the global diploma program. So part of it is the four years of a language uh there's you know there's a certain travel component where immersing yourself within a travel experience and a cultural opportunity uh there are cultural events that are tied to this. there's

088a global portfolio. Um there's a tie into our internship program. So they they still like I say when I say we'll support them through that process. We have mentors. We have you know through our internship program. Uh but we also have uh myself and and and Jason Tierney are like I said are you know trying to take a lead with the department on this and with a group of educators actually and administrators on this program. So, uh, this is one that, um, I, you know, I can't say enough about the teachers in the department that, you know, when when Jean handed it over to me, I guess it was, you know, was we're in good hands in global diploma because we do have a committee that's really invested here in terms of supporting the students

089and doing what we need to do. So, I I guess I personally feel good about that. >> Yeah. Those who are currently in, I would not lose it. All right. So, as far as um we're going to transition now to um the departments in terms of current staffing, you can see here science, technology, and engineering. We have refer to FTE. This is full-time equivalent. So, this is one FTE would be one teacher. Uh so science, technology, and engineering currently are at 18.4 full-time equivalent positions. Uh wellness we're at nine, performing arts 4. Um visual arts 6.6. Um and the reasoning for that is the you know the department heads have teaching components as well. Um math uh we have 17.4, business and computer science we're at four, English 18.4, 4 social studies 17.4 and world

090language English learner department we're at 14.4. So hopefully this gives you a sense in terms of numbers uh within our respective departments currently. So this is currently our FTE >> the lower the lower FT lower FTE numbers the department heads also have a teaching mode I think is what I heard you say. Yeah, it's inverse >> heads teach. >> It's an inverse class teach >> 68 says 66 there. Yeah. >> Visual art should be 68. >> Yep. >> And >> question this is across high school and middle. >> Yes. Yeah. Yeah. >> Thank you. So if we factor in scenario two with the proposed FTE reductions um you know Katie opened with a thank you Katie for the opening because obviously we've you know we left that meeting on Monday and our you know we

091said wow this is this is a quick turnaround. We can't we can't start to make decisions on how to consolidate departments without um input from our team. We just we just can't. Um you know, so this is this is just an initial like let's get something on the table. Let's start to talk about it. Um we ask please um implementation. We are the experts and uh I know Katie said that but I just want to reinforce that and I know that's how um our team fails as well. We're not I'm not prepared to, you know, speak strongly in support of what I'm putting out there tonight. >> We appreciate that. >> Yeah. I totally get it. >> Just quick >> based off your request. >> Um we really would like >> you guys to trust

092us to figure out what's >> I mean these are potential combos. Go ahead. >> With all due respect, right? I mean I we can read the chart. Can we have a dialogue around sort of the philosophy of going forward with this? >> Sure. >> Yeah. >> I mean, the idea that I the idea that we're taking the school committee out of the decision authority of figuring out which department heads to blend and which ones not to blend and which ones to the idea that we're taking ourselves out of that authority. I personally like we're not the experts. You guys are. Our job is to set a budget. Right. And I understand Bill and I had a little discussion during the meeting the other night about how precise can you make the budget if you don't

093really know what the positions are, but we assume we can get it close enough. Is that something that you guys can go execute on in a timely manner that allows us to prepare for the next fiscal for the next school year? >> You vote on the budget? >> Yeah. >> For I mean with enough time to give >> Yes. the organization the the time to to react and share our not just four of us but the department head >> with all the department heads see what is best for the school. >> So this this list that we have up here is factoring in two position cuts from the department heads that you asked us to consider. >> Yeah. >> Um so that's what this list incorporates. Um, and we would obviously stick with that if

094that's what the committee votes on is to reduce by two positions. Um, but then as far as the the consolidation goes, that's where we would do the work together after the vote. >> And also just one sec, don't mean to cut your mouse off. Um, you can see on the bottom because one of the concerns was equitable if you combine and somebody has certain amount. As we said on Monday, you do not need to be certified in that subject to be an evaluator. So, we have four other people in the district that are able to assist with evaluations that are not currently that is our three assistant principles and Kevin Zir would do some more evaluations. Kevin already does some but would help. Our three assistant principles would also help with the load and >>

095Yeah. Well, he does. He's got his own >> but we have people that Yeah, >> just allow us to do. >> We have a footnote here. We have a footnote here about evaluation. Okay, I'm going to tell you right now like evaluation is important. It's department heads, including all of us, no one understands what we just with all due respect, there is so much more that goes into a department head role than evaluation. Um there's so much more that goes into our role than evaluation. Um you know, programming, um you name it. students, student accountability, student achievement, um the the different um who knows what's walking into your door on a daily basis, supporting our educators, you know, teaching and learning, right? It's teachers and students. Um so there's just this community engagement. There's so

096much more that goes into this and um it's going to be a shifting responsibilities for all of us and um believe me this team there'll rise to the challenge and we all will but um you know we need time we need time to figure this out and and I know I think we're being hurt. I and I thank you for that. >> Yeah, we're professionals. If you give us a budget, we can get it done. >> Trevor and then Maggie. So, I have just a few and I appreciate you guys your willingness and your ability to put this together for us so we can talk about it here tonight. I do have concerns about adopting a budget with round numbers at the end because we would not know which way they were going to go

097and definitely I really don't want it to be the school committee punting on this and you know it's an easy for decision for us to punt on it. you guys are the ones that we would want to make that decision because you are the professionals in the room that deal with this every day. But there's going to be a lot of heat associated with this. And I think the the school committee is supposed to take the heat so the professionals in the building can operate at their capacity and not have to deal with some decisions like this, which it's a budget decision that ultimately rests with this body. >> Yeah. We're not going to make the decision as to what two positions are cut. We are looking to you for that, but we're more talking

098about which >> So there's two two positions identified on that list. Those aren't changing. >> On scenario two, but what this thing looks like afterwards, they want to be in charge of putting back together. I guess my point, Trevor, is >> if they can't figure it out in the next five days and they're the experts, how are we supposed to make an educated decision to figure it out? >> I understand that. But now now >> that's that's what you guys are saying, right? The two the two identified positions. >> Yeah. >> If that's where you stand, let us decide how we >> consolidation works for a little bit what Christa said. Just because people think of STEM, they think, "Oh, science and math should go together." >> Well, there are nuances in both of those

099departments, that might make it not the best mix. >> So, so we want to be able to kind of work. >> We were told our task was to make this list. >> We don't 100% agree with this list, but if you choose what's been on the list, allow us to figure out how we still run. >> It's not even just about agreement. It's the opportunity to to have those meaningful conversations with that team. Get to that point of view having those. >> I guess my question is are we going to know which way you're going to go by the time we vote on the budget on that? So >> your vote is going to be for the two positions. >> Your vote. They're saying we'll stick with >> you guys. Give us an example of

100how this might change. >> That would be helpful. >> What might change? looking at scenario two. >> So those are the consolidated departments. What you're saying is that >> and we left Monday night, right? There was these two sort of options were, >> you know, combine English and social studies or combine English and language. Well, I think what I'm hearing from the team is there might be a different way to do it than that. >> Okay. All >> right. We're still there two social studies department head and um art department head that are on the list. If the committee decides to vote that way, they're okay. You know, it's not they're okay with it. I can't say that. But they would want to then put the pieces back together after that. Okay. Decision. >> That's

101that sounds funny. >> You know, we're we're unique, right? You see, you look out there and we are unique, right? Everyone's unique. There's I've seen so many different models. It's easy to just say put English and social studies together, humanities. Maybe that's the way we'll go, but it deserves a deeper conversation. >> We want to incorporate the entire team, not just >> makes sense. My my question is bigger than that. My question is from scenario one to scenario two, we have nine FTE versus 8 FTV. To my understanding, the non salary is still 100,000 in both. Is there a scenario that we could lower the FTE in any way and raise the non salary costs? >> To me, I'd like to see a scenario where we keep teachers. Again, how you choose to pick which

102position over which position, however those decisions are being made, I can't comment on that. But what I want to see is fewer teachers being cut. So, is there a scenario three that the FTE can be lower or is this the number that we're with? >> And if it is the number that we're with, then whose decision is it to say which 9 FTE? It's my question. So, having spoken with that's a that's a hard question. I'll try to I'll try to give you my perspective on it after I've spoken with I think all of the administration in including Mike and and Jeff. There are other things there. There are probably other knobs. There's a transportation knob that we talked about, >> right? We're gathering data on the transportation knob right now. Kids that get picked

103up at 6:25 in the morning right now might end up getting picked up at 6:10 in the morning or 6:15 in the morning, right? And so are there are there department material cuts, operating cuts that we could make with, you know, a lot of non-staff? Probably. Do we want to have them really operating on a near zero budget for years to come because future years will be increases if we want to reintroduce those. Um there's things like sports fees and parking fees and um extracurricular activity fees. Excuse me. >> Not parking. >> We've not parking. >> Parking doesn't go to the operating budget. No. >> Departments have their original budget. We asked them to decrease so part of that 100,000. So the number for FTE is going to stay around eight or not. We can't

104get lower than that. >> Well, it's your decision. You can go down to 20. >> The two scenarios one 91's eight. So I'm like then it just becomes who which positions and >> that is the vast vast vast majority of the operating budget is teachers. >> Okay. So we can't raise up the nons. Okay. >> And again there's other knobs. They just have other factors and considerations that we've introduced some of them into the budget. We're continuing to research >> a couple that are still on the table. >> And and correct me if I'm wrong, but I think there was more of a difference between scenario one and scenario two than just >> one FTE. I mean, the makeup >> total. Yeah. But the Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah, different position. So it's it's kind of

105independent of like this program, this teacher, the consolidation, and that's judgment calls and numbers. Yeah. >> So I was just like to see a scenario where there's other ways to reduce the overall total from >> you'd be going to things like athletic fees, transportation, material. >> We weren't presented with a we're not being presented with a scenario where that could happen. >> Transportation was on the original one. Yeah, >> it was taken off because it was negated by the TTU. I think I described it the other night as once you get down, if you got down to 23 buses, it would be about $100,000 savings. Every bus going down after that would be, I don't know, either $50,000 savings, >> 50,000 per bus, >> but the impact on transportation would get pretty horrendous, I have

106to imagine. or you'd have to fundamentally change the model of transportation. Um, so I'm sorry I'm I'm I'm shooting up the >> coffee. I'm trying to figure out what our role is, right? And so my role is to approve a budget and the budget the two scenarios that are presented to me FTE is nine and eight non- salary operating. I know there's a lot that obviously that goes into that, but I'm not seeing a different scenario where any of those the middle school team can be saved. And again, the the judgment calls around department heads or this or that. There are so many factors why I agree with them or I don't. That's not I have nothing to say about that. I just want to see the FTE number go down and if that is

107possible. >> I think last year that was like the you know the attitude and we lost the security guard, we lost librarian, we lost you know nurse right it was everything but >> but just to clarify you said you want the FTE number to go down. You mean the FTE reduction? >> Yes. Sorry. To go down. >> I could do that. >> I have to go to Melissa, please. >> I have two things. So, the budget detail, the number of FTEEs in that don't match what these are. It's off by like 2.4 here or there, but I don't. So, I'm hoping that can be rectified. It's because those are what I have to present to a town when we're talking about it. So, I just want it to be accurate. Second, is it possible that

108we can say we want you to reduce the department heads by two and not pick positions and then you guys make those decisions. >> That's the next level of decision authority to them. You're saying that's what we agree >> because no because scenario 2 has specific department to us with two department at a time >> and I think there was some there was some rational rationale behind that but what I'm hearing is that they can work internally >> to create the new positions but I have to ask are there contractual issues that we have to deal with related to that have to go back to a bargaining table become >> um do we have to change any job descriptions that this committee would then need to approve? >> Yes. >> Uh yes, >> that one.

109Yes. >> Okay. >> Whatever happens out of this, if we're making a new combination, it's in effect a new position. >> Okay. So, >> would need to be posted, right? >> Yeah. Would need be need to be posted. >> Okay. >> Hired. Yeah. >> That's that's sort of been somewhat um >> cont like there's been differing opinions on that. Um, so but I don't want to stay here and like we're just going to get rid of our art teacher who just produced like I don't know the number two second amount of golden key awards and or scholastic at like like that bothers me um because they're actually talking about people and I know that you guys would have to do that job too but if we're giving you the the leeway to do that like

110the you're imple implementing our budget are do we have to say we're cutting these positions? >> I I just want a quick clarification. There's three there's three different approaches that are being discussed right now. One approach is the school committee dictates the positions that would be eliminated and dictates the combination of new positions. That's one that's one approach that's been that has been discussed. The next one is what Melissa just described on the other end of the spectrum, which is we set a budget. The administration figures out which positions to eliminate and then which departments to combine. In the middle there's a scenario or there's an approach that uh I think either Kevin or Katie described which is basically we would pick the two positions the school committee would identify the two positions that would

111be eliminated but then you guys would have the liberty to figure out how to combine the rema the the the departments. The benefit, sorry Phil quick second. The benefit of the school committee identifying the positions to be eliminated is that we get a very precise number in the budget which is a concern that Trevor brought up. Um the drawback is that we're taking on that authority right and not the professionals. Um so I'll pause there. Phil, >> we would advocate for that middle um scenario that you just discussed. I mean among the four of us I think that having the the solid number for the budget is important for you and then it gives us some direction as to where we're going to you know work towards after the budget is decided so that then

112we're focused on consolidating the department head positions as opposed to also trying to decide who who would lose their position. >> Sorry Adrian's been waiting over. >> That's okay. The the question I had was around um you know the department head model is interesting because we have that expertise but they also teach so we get a lot of economy out of that role and expertise as well. If we do remove a couple of those roles, you guys mentioned taking on more of the evaluation piece. Does that allow us to fully preserve and >> we would lose. >> Next slide. >> That is the section. >> Yeah, come right ahead. >> I can't. >> Before we jump to the next slide, I just want to maybe have one more comment for Lisa. You have your hand

113up? >> I did. Okay. Um, I I guess I'm not in agreement with Melissa's because I feel like that would make you guys the bad guys and and I I hate saying it, but I'm okay being the bad guy because I feel like you guys are in the school with these people all the time. and making having you guys make that decision just doesn't sit right with me because I just feel like that then turns everybody against each other to try and save their job and then so I I I guess I'm more I'm comfortable with the middle and us being the the bad people. >> I'm comfortable with the middle as well. I'll share my own opinion for a moment. I'm comfortable with the middle as well. I I'll be I'll be very honest.

114I'm I'm not comfortable. I I'm happy to be I'm not happy to be the bad guy. I am willing to be the bad guy where I need to be. We have an executive leadership team and in industry sometimes the executive leadership team has to make those hard decisions. Okay? And I don't know why we why we don't allow them to work among work with work amongst their integrated team and work with their extended teams to make some of these hard decisions. Right? I don't think that we should be afraid of allowing them to make hard decisions. That's what happens in the real world. I have to face every day people that I might make upset in my role. Jeff, sorry. So, a little bit off top a little different topic, but I totally agree what

115you're saying. Just on to Maggie's comment, something Nico said earlier, you know, this budget target we're chasing is not set in stone. So, just to Maggie's kind of bring that up. >> Yeah. So, you know, this we're we have a target we're trying to move towards with a model. We don't have to get there. Um, if you know, if we find things make sense, I'm not willing to hurt the school to make the Fidcom in Boxford happy. And I told them that yesterday. Um, you know, that's that's my job is be that guy. But, you know, I want >> But they wanted you to go deeper. >> You know, I think they were very happy where we landed. >> I think they were happy with with which was scenario two. But they also asked me

116the question, what would it take to get from 3.1% to 2.6? >> It's their job to challenge us. And I think, you know, we're doing a a good faith estimate or exercise now, but if we decide that this there's nowhere to go or things don't make sense, I'm very happy to defend that all day long. Um, you know, the world we live in, you know, we're being squeezed by the state, we're being squeezed by inflation, so we have to do something. But, you know, this number is a target just to for modeling and, you know, we'll make the right decisions. I agree with you and with all due respect to our our town official in the front row. We're not here to make our final select board happy, but we are here to make our

117our taxpayers happy. I >> say we have, you know, we have town stakeholders as well as students and >> as much as possible. >> Well said, Trevor. Please. Um I I think we've talked about kind of all three options a decent amount. I do think we it would be helpful for maybe you and the team if we kind of had a straw poll vote on it to give you guys direction and so we can start to move forward on some of these topics if the city's comfortable with it. I >> mean the three uh options in terms of that spectrum I described. >> Yeah. >> So could we just do a straw poll if we were to go down the path of eliminating um department head positions? Let's start with the middle scenario where we

118as a school committee eliminate um two positions and allow the administration to figure out how to combine the departments. Could just do a straw poll on who would support that out of the three. Okay, straw poll complete. >> It was up to >> up. Good to see you. >> Thanks, Trevor. >> All right. >> We're late. I stick I say we keep on moving right we we have one more >> thanks yeah this this is summary here is is the overall impact um but again this these are the ant you know just this take >> scenario two um looking at overall section reductions um based on these combinations right so this the part that uh we really want to you to see here too is the middle school team reduction would account for 20 of

119these sections, right? Um so that you can see the impact obviously that it has on this bottom line of 43 um total section reductions. So that does include the middle team um count as well, but I don't want to speak in too much detail to this because you giving us the sounds like you're going to give us the runway to do what we need to do with implementation. Are we giving direction? I mean like our policy is to do the best for the students. So like when we when you implement our policy, I presume which is our budget, I presume that you will provide information as to how you're going to do that and show us that it was the least impact on student. That's where we we ask for the luxury to meet with

120our full team, come up with the least impactful, least disruptive to the school and then to present that >> to present what that is. But that would be after you all >> I like it because it's not rushed. I'm timeline's not driven by the budget timeline to make those decisions. Does that timeline give you enough time to to adequately staff whatever positions you're then recreating? >> Starting um for those who want tomorrow night selection night. Um we're just starting selection so we have time and because we don't even have the numbers yet and then once we get numbers we can also get that and that will ensure that we'll have the best possible personnel in those position. We could also we would also have time to post the new positions that we would need to

121and >> necessary those. Yeah, that's necessary. But we do if you vote like soon we have the time to do it. >> So just in terms of next steps, um I'm open to suggestions of course. Um, I will tell you guys I have meetings with a few different folks on Friday. I'm taking Friday off from work. I'm going to spend some time with Mike. I spend some time u with Katie. Phil, I haven't asked you yet, but I'd like to spend some time with you. Um, and then uh a couple teachers as well that have offered to connect with me. And so um I I don't know if there are other next steps that we want to discuss. Um, otherwise I'm going to go do more homework and I' I'd welcome albe it a couple

122of you to join me if you'd like on Friday, but not not everybody for obvious reasons. Melissa, >> this time I can't support a budget that cuts a middle school team. >> What? >> That cuts a middle school team because of the projected enrollments for the next three to five years. Um, >> so I think >> you guys are they're not leaving. >> They're not leaving. >> So I am worried about making a decision in 2026 that affects students for the next five years. Um, so I'm just say that and we can do what you will, but I might not vote for a budget that has that in it. Okay. Can we go back to the subtle point that Jeff made a minute ago, which was um and I'll pose it a different way given

123the the financial landscape that we're in right now, given the MSBA project on the docket, who I mean, I I'll admit I think that we have to get to two and a half%. I don't know who shares that perspective. I'll say it a different way. Who should who who who feels like who feels it's okay to go back to the towns with an override this year? I >> mean, Top has to, >> right? >> We have to lock us in. >> What size override you talking about? >> That's that's the question, >> right? >> I think the way you asked it initially was probably better. you know, two and a half% which I think is what the the towns would like us to who wants to aggressively shoot for that then I'm I'm all for

124I think we have to do that. That's our that's our commitment our taxpayers. >> Give you a perspective. So this is the scenario two assessment by town to get to the 2 and a half% number you have to cut another $160,000. Yeah. Or is it Mike? I'm sorry. >> This is the It's what I sent you earlier. Just >> if you're going to to get to two and a half, it's another $160,000 cut. >> I think that's close enough. But >> giving you the numbers. >> Yeah. >> Sorry. Go ahead. >> So, I'll present a different perspective. Right. two other towns are $50,000 away from not having to do an override, which would, I think, improve uh improve the probability of us getting the MSBA debt exclusion approved. >> And I think that's an important

125point. We're already going to have a question on the ballot saying, "We are going to raise your taxes because we are raising and appropriating these funds." Do we want to have two questions on that same ballot saying we are going to raise your taxes to appropriate those funds? That's tough. >> So, let me just hover quickly for my benefit and probably the benefit of the people listening. If we decided to go forward with overrides, the taxpayers decide they don't want to support that funding, we then have to come back to the table, do more work. Does it go to special meeting from there or is it >> so the So if the budget were not to pass two of the three towns, the committee then has 45 days to reconsider and resubmit a budget to

126the towns. >> The if um you know if the non so the way the town's usually presented is a a two and a half% funding and then everything over two and a half%. If the school committee actually came back at that 2 and a half% number, you're done. >> Okay? >> If you came if you reconsidered and resubmitted over that, there would have to be another town meeting and another debt exclusion ballot vote. >> Okay? >> And then if that failed, >> you keep going until you until you get so deep in the summer that the commissioner takes over your budget. >> Correct. >> That's how it works. >> That's what I thought. So Joe's waving his hand. Joe, >> I think it's important to note that that work would then be done by the

127next school committee that's going to have a number of different members on it. I don't know if you said that, Mike. Maybe I missed it, but >> half of us might not be here for that. >> Yep. >> Who will? >> So, keep that in mind. >> I will point out that >> there is a redo on the bud on the on the budget. There is no redo on a failed MSBA application, >> right? Yep. >> That MSBA application fails, 40% of 70 million or whatever the number is going to be gone. >> Yep. >> So just Yeah. Again, ballparking to get to 2 and a half% is $160,000 total. It's $83,000 from Boxford, $8,000 from Middleton, and $68,000 from Topsfield. >> Yeah. >> That's how it breaks out with the the foreman. >> What

128was the top number? uh about 68. >> That's if we went with scenario two as it is right now. >> As is that's what the towns hold to their >> plan which is 2.5 and then it's actually so top is probably even more larger than that because I'm using two and a half. >> Yeah, they would split it into two votes as well. So it would be >> nice and easy. >> Yeah, >> it's so hard to >> three votes actually. It's the >> that and then the capital. Yeah. >> Melissa, >> does anyone talk to the community about our possible overrides >> every day? >> Yeah. But who is who is the community though? >> My grandparents that are on a fixed income and cannot afford to continuously vote for overrides. Melissa, >> we

129did have a we did have a Middleton uh public discussion the other day. It was not well attended. Um We met with Boxford, the select board and finance committee last night, >> right? >> Yeah. >> As I said, they were okay with the with the scenario two number um but did ask what would it take? You know, Chuck asked me what would it take to get to two and a half, you know. So, >> I think you know the specs and the fincoms aren't represented towns. They're well very well informed and they know how much work we've done. >> You know, that is a challenge is an override. People don't have the nuance of the three months they spend. checking us apart. But I do think, you know, I'm kind of on Bill's side. If

130we get close, you know, something we feel good with. I think two and a half% is cutting to the bone. >> It's it's too much. It's too far. Yeah. But I think if we get close, you something reasonable. Um more comfortable with that. But I know that Oxford tends to be sportive more so than other towns. Cfields I can never figure out. So >> it gets harder every year, I think, is is the general >> Yeah. >> consensus. The overrides are wearing everyone very thin. >> Yeah. >> So I think previously you could count on Topsfield for an override and now it is like >> get smaller. >> This will be the fourth in a row for Top Shield. >> Yeah. >> Fourth year. >> There's real fatigue there and as there should be. >>

131And Middleton's capital request for HVAC roof BMS failed last time. It was heads off. And I will say I even if we can't get all the three member towns to avoid an override, if we could get the closest, which happens to be Middleton, to avoid it, that's half of our battle right there. Only need two out of the three towns. So I I think we should do everything in our power to get there, which I will offer another position that I think the committee should consider. And I know we brought it up last year. Um, I did want to reintroduce it, which would be cutting a school counselor in or guidance counselor in the high school. Um, I did a lot of research on this and the American School Counselor Association Association recommends a case

132load of 1 to 250. Um, we are below that in both schools. Um, and in fact, we're um, even if we did cut one, we'd be getting to that 1 to 250. Um, if we cut one in the high school, we'd be based off the numbers of last year, we'd be getting to the 1 to 250 ratio, which is still hovering in the top 25 percentile in the country. So, we I think there is room there. Professionals I've talked to outside of Masco who are in this field agree that there may be room there. And I I I really think that the committee should consider it. Last year it would have resulted in $75,000 um in reductions to our budget. This year likely with the COLA increase it's probably around 80. Um so I have

133the slide if you guys want it um that explained the pros and cons that we discussed last year. I can forward that to you guys and it's just some information I gathered from the American School Counselor Association website. Please, please do. >> Yeah. >> Um, I just want to piggyback on what you're saying, Trevor, and say that as much as I do not want to make cuts in that area, I've had very similar conversations with people that I know personally, professionally, who um acknowledge that Mathco is pretty comfortable as compared to other districts. That's not to say that the job is not difficult and that, you know, the fact that we're able to serve our students in the way that we can is not important. But when we're faced with decisions like do we increase

134class sizes, eliminate an entire program that is one of the cornerstones of belonging and culture in a district that desperately needs it. and increasing case loads. Like it none of these are good decisions to make. They're not easy. It's like bad choice A, bad choice B, and bad choice C. I just want to make sure to Trevor's point, we have as many options on the table as possible to consider and consider very pragmatically because we don't want to do any of them, but we do have to do some of them. I'm gonna go to Melissa and then Maggie and then you know I'll be honest with Brad I saw you shaking your head in the audience. I'm going to welcome you to the table if you'd like for a minute because frankly like we don't

135have time to have the discussion. >> So I don't want to put you on the spot but if you do have something to share maybe you could share it after Melissa and Maggie speak. >> More chairs. >> Oh my question is just isn't this exactly what we said we weren't going to just do right? Didn't we just say we're not going to offer the suggestions of who to cut? If that was an option, wouldn't that have already been presented to us in a scenario? >> So, >> I will say to be fair, the initial ask was that we submit them >> areas that we think we could have reductions in force. I did submit that twice and it hasn't made it to a recommendation scenario. So, I am now presenting to the entire >> I'm

136just confused. We just said we would give it to those who are in it every day. We've been asked to do that. They said yes and then all of a sudden we're being like so I'm just I'm confused of >> I think I think what's happening is is um one we're still in sort of a old school mindset but two if you take that to like the extreme then we would just say your budget's 2 and a half% go do what you want right and so I think that we're probably somewhere in the middle of the old school mindset and this extreme of go do whatever you want with 2 and a half% where we're asking asking questions and throwing ideas on the table and see and getting informed as a school committee. I guess

137that's what it feels like to me. >> Okay. >> Melissa, did you get to ask your question? I don't think you did. >> Yeah. There's nowhere to squeeze anything else from any other part of budget than taking services away from our students. like there's got to be >> there has to be one of one of the areas that I think is the biggest blind spot for us as a school committee and we're we're very unlikely to solve this problem but I want to make sure that everyone is aware of it is that we don't actually see actuals to budget on any regular cadence until it's long past relevant. We have no idea where year-over-year our cost centers within the budget are running deficits or surpluses. So, we can make decisions about where we need to

138reallocate for investment or savings and move things around. This is my second year on the school committee. I've never had anything proposed to us to move between cost centers. not one penny ever, which is remarkable to me because I think it gives us an opportunity to really see how the money is moving through the district and where there might be pockets of opportunity that we as a committee could deliberate on proactively and then we'd be more informed when the administration comes forward with a recommendation. And not only that, we could partner with them more effectively to say, "We actually have some support and energy around looking at this. Could you guys go dig a little bit more and come back to like it?" I just think that would be such a an easier way to

139initiate these conversations earlier. >> Is there something we can do in the next couple days to >> I mean, I think the an's been answered before. We've asked that of Jeff and the answer has consistently been that our systems don't support doing that and that and he has said quite quite pointedly that that we need to make a serious investment in in in an application and in people to actually address that and we've >> but we've attempted that and he shot a camera said he didn't have to invest. we've have attempted what >> we've said if that's a need request it in the budget and he said I don't have time to implement that that's why I don't put it in the budget >> and to be >> and that's where >> I I I

140poked at one particular area because I actually had some pieces to put together to see a surplus running from fiscal year 23 or what I thought might be a surplus and I got a line item detail year-over-year so the the data exists It might be hard, but just because it's hard doesn't mean it's not worth doing. And it it would certainly impact our discussions and the community incredibly positively. So, I don't want to hear that we're operating in spreadsheets and it's hard. Yeah, I know. >> What do you want us to do now to >> want everyone to be aware that is the state of the state and that is why this is so difficult. >> But even the Chromebook discussion is confusing. >> Yes. because there was 900 Chromebooks in the capital request, but

141yet we are purchasing 300 with a a line item that we might not even even aware was there. >> Yeah. So, >> and so we need 1,200 like this still for that. >> My suggestion is I think everybody would love to find a way to invest in some new financial tracking and some additional detail available to the school committee in the future. You know, we can't commit a future school committee by any means, but perhaps maybe one of our subcommittees can focus on that next year as part of their charter. for tonight's discussion in terms of budget is the I think the ask is Mike are there places outside that we're not considering or that might be hard decisions >> that do not impact staff >> that do not impact teachers brought this up with

142ET yesterday morning and I I'm looking at Katie and there were no you know no real ideas that came up I mean that's that's what I think I look at you when you look at the major expense categories. Um most of what's driving the increase is coming from personnel. I mean that's really where the this the major um amount of dollars in this budget is. So I you know shutter >> and I don't think this is very I don't want to say it's not hard to understand but we were in a very similar position last year and we cut everywhere else we could to avoid this very conversation and we told the towns if you don't support our override these positions are going to be cut. Well look where we are. Those positions that we

143had to cut were cut. And now here we are with the meat. This isn't trimming fat. This is the meat. And it's not easy for anyone, but we've known that's where the only place that we could find an area to reduce our budget. Only meaningful place. Brad, I don't know if you want to join us for a minute. >> I mean, I don't know how. >> Grab a seat. >> I don't know how constructive. I'm a better writer than I am a public speaker. But >> yeah, >> I will say I obviously respect, you know, the work and the task. I >> will also say I could not disagree more with cutting a guidance counselor. I will also share with you my real disappointment that we're considering cutting another position that is expressly designed to

144support students. We've cut school adjustment counselors. We've cut nurses. We did cut a school counselor four or five years ago. Here we are again. It's just this is not this is not a Masco move that I'm comfortable with or familiar with. So, um I if we want numbers and we want data, you know, give me a few hours or a few days to put something together. But on the whole, 100% not a good idea. and I will go out to the folks at Topppsfield or Boxford or Middleton and explain you can't you can't adopt a budget that cuts another student services position. we didn't get the benefit of a student services report that and I'm not blaming you, but there's a lot of newer people on this school committee who haven't had the benefit of

145the the student services reports over the last several years and how the student services team has really built a good program to address the needs of our students from a mental health, >> emotional support perspectives and they're amazing. They have tiered levels of support. Our um I believe our I believe our our middle school counselors built the program. Is it or was it one from high school and >> few different programs? Yeah, they they've built these they have passion for it and they're only there to support our students and they prevent our students from their lives collapsing like on a daily basis. you're going to cut you're you're it sounds like you're going to you know cut teachers increase class sizes undoubtedly that's going to create some angst and when there's angst in the building

146it gets directed generally to one place I'm going to have one more comment from Trevor and then I'm going to wrap up the budget deliberations for the night because we have another major topic that we have to get through still uh but I will make myself of course available to anybody after the meeting or tomorrow to continue the discussion one-on-one. >> Thank you. >> Um and I agree with you, Brad. I think you guys do a great job, have done a great job. I just have a hard time believing that those programs would not still be able to be effective when we are operating with at the top 25% of schools in this country in terms of staffing and ratio level. the top 25% in the country is not like >> I will say >>

147that just the adjustment counselor argument this committee made a decision to hire them on grant money that was then consumed into the budget that could not afford it. So that argument is a little different. I was against it then and then we had to make a difficult decision and like I said the numbers I think speak for themselves. I appreciate your perspective um and your expertise in the area, but I really think the committee should look at that with an open mind because we're we're still running up short and that I think is an area. >> So, I think what I would offer, Brad, is I know you you shared that you'd like to spend a little bit of time gathering your thoughts like like you. I'm not somebody that can always think on my

148toes or articulate myself on my toes. So, you know, if you don't mind, um, I'd like to maybe just have a short synopsis with you, um, Monday of of um, your perspective on this. Um, and, uh, and then Lisa, if you get like real quick, >> I had a question. So the budget impact that they provided us with consolidating departments was that adding back in the world language department head >> yes >> not touching the numbers in scenario two. No I no but in my head I was like oh wait a minute that would be that savings and but no that with their scenario that's adding >> it's still scenario two you guys listed it so >> okay nope that's fine >> which which included the restation the department >> all right folks I'm I'm

149gonna move Thanks Lisa I'm going to move us on again I have meetings all day Friday if there's one or two of you or three of you that want to join me for any particular discussions By all means, if you have other ideas, please send them to me. Um, can you stick around for the meeting? >> Oh, yeah. >> And then, um, we'll pick this up Monday night some more. >> Not yet. Have a motion to go to the next article. Okay. Um, are you taking notice from the other side of that? Sorry. Uh lose that side. Second reading of policy DBJ Regional School District Transfer Authority. >> Okay. Um I know it's kind of a quick turnaround. Usually people have more time to digest um the policy changes, but like I said um we

150as a policy subcommittee felt comfortable, the administration felt comfortable with um putting some flexibility into our END policy but yet maintaining a floor um that the school committee must retain at least 3% of its budget um for END purposes and also that anything over that 3% the school committee is to um has the decision making authority um to see how much if any they would like to use as a revenue source in the next year's budget. Um so with that I feel comfortable and willing to entertain a motion to accept the policy changes. >> A motion to accept DBJ. >> A second. >> Uh Joe's still with us. We have to do a roll call. So Joe, >> Yes. Adrian, >> Yes. Lisa stepped away. Um and a zero. 890. Oh, Chris is missing zero.

151Thank you to the policy team. Thank you Trevor for leaving that and getting that through quickly. >> Thank you. I'll see you Friday. >> All right. On to our next uh topic. Votes I'm sorry. Uh yeah, votes enter contract negotiations with preferred superintendent candidate. So before we start, just a couple ground rules. I I did share uh some of the guidance that we got from um our human resources partner or one of our human resources partners in terms of how to have the dialogue. I did get a little bit of feedback that that felt a little bit constraining in in terms of having effective discussion. Uh Adrian and I did connect with council yesterday just to understand a little bit more around the language we can use when discussing the candidates. Um the feedback that

152we got from council was you can speak factually about the candidates. Um you should you should be careful about offering opinions that might be disparaging to a candidate. if you're going to say something, let's be sure that we articulate that it is our opinion and not necessarily a fact. Um, and I would just caution us about being disparaging about the candidates uh in public form. So, um, with that, I think we have our ground rules. So, next step is deliberation. >> I'm gonna Yeah. Call Um, so we don't have to do any kind of motion to open the deliberation. We know who the two candidates are. They are public. We can begin that discussion. Um, we do have to make a motion if we align on a candidate and want to extend an offer. And

153I I have a motion prepared if that's where we're headed. Um, and then we would vote on that and we would need a majority vote on that. Um, I do >> six. Sorry, that's six out of 10, right? >> It'd be six. >> Yeah, we would need six. Um it it is also like uh I don't know tradition in these scenarios in these deliberations that if you get to a majority vote um in line with like you know the our ethics policy um and just to as a show of good faith that you would maybe go back and do another vote to get to unanimous to show that the committee is supporting the will of the committee and supporting um forward movement on a particular candidate. So we can do with that what we will

154but I wanted to make sure that it was out there so that with some sense of decorum in these environments because it's all new to us. Um, and before we start, I just I just want to offer a couple of thoughts because there was such a phenomenal amount of work that went into this. And I just want to take the opportunity one more time to thank our subcommittee for what was a herculean effort. Every single one of us put in a lot of time and effort on this. I would say even maybe more so than the budget um that we traditionally do. So this is a weighty decision and the care that we're all bringing to it reflects how seriously everyone at this table takes their responsibility to this community. Um and I don't think

155that care is something to apologize for. It's something to honor. And I also want to acknowledge that we are a committee with very different perspectives and that is having dissenting opinions at the table makes us all better and tonight some of us may be confident and ready to move forward and others may still be holding genuine concerns and questions. Both perspectives deserve to be heard and I think that's incredibly important. So I have a few thoughts just to anchor us based on the community feedback. Our volume of feedback was notable. We don't typically get that level of engagement um relative to our typical engagement anyway. Um these are community members, parents, students, faculty who have entrusted this decision to us. And I think if anyone looked at that and filtered out some of the noise

156that was in there, um, they provided thoughtful and intentional feedback and very clear direction. That matters. Those voices matter and I hope you all take that into consideration. Um, we have two strong candidates before us. They're tenured professionals with potential and values and a vision that this district needs. Um, and it's worth remembering that I think every superintendent who has ever led a district well was at some point leading one for the first time. Um, and that's true for anybody in any role, including all of us on school committee. I think we've all been in the flames. So, I just want to make sure that we are noting that for ourselves. Um, and then last, I just want to remind everyone, especially broader community, we're not handing over the keys. We have the authority to

157define goals and benchmarks, performance reviews, mechanisms for support, and, you know, if warranted, a a separation um if that's something that comes up. Um, so this is not an act of blind faith. It's it's the beginning of a working relationship that we get to help shape. For as long as we have tenure on this committee, we will continue to guide that working relationship. Um, so I want to make sure that we keep that in mind as well. Um, our job tonight is to make the wisest decision that we can, similar to the budget, and then do everything in our power to really set up our next superintendent for success as well as the district. And I am confident that we can do that tonight. So, I'll get off my soap box, but I just wanted

158to level set on a few things to make sure that we can be productive tonight. Um, so with that, let the discussion begin. Sorry, it was just funny. >> Well, for Joe. Joe, I don't know if you have any perspectives that you want to share. I know you have a hard stop coming up in a few minutes. Um, in two minutes. >> Make sure you get a chance to voice your your perspective on this. Um, I don't know. I mean, I I I don't want to be critical of the process or people, and I know there's a lot of effort that went into this, but I feel like I just don't know enough to support one of these candidates more strongly than the other. um I wasn't able to attend uh sessions when they were

159in the school uh both days because I have work and a job and uh I don't think I was able we were really given the authority or the leeway to ask the kind of questions that I would have liked to ask of someone I'm trying to hire. They both seem like good people with a good resume, strong resume. I think they're very similar. Um, one of them seems to be a little bit of a better communicator to me than the other. The other one seems to have a wider uh number of experiences. So, I do not favor one over the other at this point. That's that's my honest opinion. So, I'll share a couple thoughts. Um, >> and I put some of this in the email to you guys. You know, when you're looking at

160executives, I don't think I've hired an executive in my career that checks every box. Um, for me, it's about hiring somebody that has a a good foundation, that has the core skills and surrounding them with people to make them successful. Um, you know, when I looked at I I was able to make parts of the um the events here at Masco prior to their formal interviews. Um they were I will speak to to um to Heather for a minute as a candidate that I've saw was somebody who is a relationship builder is somebody who um I feel could help build the culture. That's my opinion. um who could listen and integrate as a team as an extended team with rest of the administration. Um I thought she demonstrated uh empathy in the way that she

161answered her questions. Um, and while I think Patty brought a lot of great experiences in our current role as the assistant superintendent. Um, I think what I what really what one of the other things that really resonated with me about Heather was I my opinion is that she's going to bring a kind of a unique and clean vision for Masco. So, I'll pause there. Melissa, >> I had the pleasure of being with both candidates for the majority of their visits at Masco. Um, visa v paid time off virtually. Um, and I was impressed how Heather um interacted with every single person that she came across walking down the hall. um when she spoke with the faculty, she actually sat. So it was more of a circle. Um and I saw that as an act of

162uh unity that I really think would bring a breath of fresh air to Masco at this point. Um Heather seemed to me to be the person who would hit the ground running. Yeah. Running. um and bring an energy to our communities and be willing to roll up her sleeves. She she seemed more energetic to do that than um our second candidate who I was also impressed with and also made good connections. Um but Heather stood out to me with her interpersonal skills that I observed. So that's my comments. I'll um pick up kind of on the same messaging that Melissa um was just projecting about hitting the ground running. I think we did have a candidate with um vast experience with very specific um examples in Patricia that I think would allow her to hit

163the ground running here um with the experience and knowledge that comes with those years of serving in a variety of different roles. um she expressed um importance in communication and one example I think um the choosing instructional material example when 50% of her students were failing in I think it was algebra 1 to then go to a mere three students I think in my notes um a few years later I think is a great example of how um leadership in that situation led to the success of our students and she was able to provide many examples of concrete examples of her direct leadership leading to the success of her students and I think that would be the same if she were to come here. >> Thank you, >> Bill. Yeah, I've been wrestling with this

164for for some time now. Um, primarily because I thought they both were strong. um and wanting to be sure that I differentiated between them appropriately, you know, for our purposes. And, you know, definitely um I think Patricia has a wider range of of experience that would be very helpful, you know, for us. Um but I'm also mindful that um you know some things can be taught and some things can't be and you know everybody has to get experience somewhere for the first time. Um, so I'm I'm it's nice to have, but it's it's not a deal breakaker to me. Someone lacking a specific experience that that we may want in a role, cuz that's what, you know, mentors are are for. And, you know, you can um you could I'm sure we could find a

165YouTube video to that she could learn just about anything she would need to know. Um but otherwise we get you know some professional help. Um, but the I I have to tell you that the thing that really struck me about uh about Heather um was her engagement and and I mean it just like jumped off I mean I was doing this from home I think it just jumped off my screen as I was listening to her And yeah, I you know, I think it's it's it's no secret that, you know, that was uh you know, one of our current superintendants challenges um and in in really engaging with the community um with the staff, you know, with um you know, with with a number of of important stakeholders Um, and she really struck me as

166someone that that not only understands that, but you know, even the examples that I, you know, I've heard tonight that would really excel at that. Um, and that would really help to make us a better community than we are now. Um, so I will say, um, building off of some of this with Heather, if you look, three of her references were superintendent or former superintendent, and they all said they went from principal to superintendent. Um, so having three of those references I thought was really a very valid point. She also says in her letter that she has been mentoring with a superintendent in preparation for becoming a superintendent. I thought taking that proactive role, that step was really important. Um, the thing I re, like everybody else, I really enjoyed her energy. I, and I've

167said this a couple of times, the fact that she was out there and met everybody and remembered everybody's name was just really impressive to me. And to bring them back into that conversation cuz I am horrible at names. So, for somebody to be out in the hallway and meet somebody and then come in here and talk about them and interact with them was just really I enjoyed that. like it made it more engaging. Um, I really liked her 90-day plan and her communication and her willing to communicate with us because as we've been talking in the budget, there's a something severely lacking and her 90-day plan included us and I really thought that was important. Patty, I liked her. I'm the one that did her phone interview. I thought she was very nice. I thought

168she was very personable. It's the and I'm and trying not to say anything else. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Did you want to go next? >> Um, yeah. So for me, I I feel a little similar to how Joe felt that I I don't feel like a 100% that I I feel one way or the other, but for me, what what worries me the most is thinking about a leadership role like the superintendent and what it means and and who it's who the person is in charge of. We have a lot happening this year and next year. We have a lot of financial uphill battles. We have a lot of, you know, capital building issues. We have we have culture issues. is we have a lot of problems that we are facing. It worries me

169not just filling the superintendent role but also who that person potentially brings with them because they then can bring the the finance person, the person that sits next to superintendent, who what does that look like? So, I'm having a hard time figuring out who are the people that come. I definitely think Heather was a very good communicator. She she gave great examples. I thought Patty definitely has the experience and has the more straight to the point, you know, answers with examples and and experience in the leadership role. But for me, what I'm looking for, I think it's going to be a hard job to to come into. And like you've said many times, we've all said, being in a leadership role is hard. You have hard conversations. You have to be okay with conflicts. You

170can't be defensive. You have to be able to provide information. So, I I'm having a hard time figuring out which one would be better in that situation, which one would be able to handle difficult situations, especially coming into the next year. Um, just my personal opinion, I I do think that with Patricia's experience, that to me is is a little bit more in my opinion what we would need at this moment moving forward just because there's a lot of stuff crumbling around us. That's my only take on that. I just just my >> I'm gonna keep going around. I'm sorry. I got things I want to share, too, but >> Okay. No, that's fine. >> Maggie, Jeff, do you guys want to share anything? >> Yeah. >> Okay. I was hoping to hear what already

171said. >> I'm not going to. >> People don't have to share. >> Sure. Sure. I like to share. Um, first I just want to thank the committee. I I in the background I give people a lot of hard time just because I'm very emotionally engaged with it. I appreciate the work. Um, so it wasn't from Malice. It was more just pushing. Um, >> frustrated with the process, too. For the record. >> Yeah. Yeah. I appreciate that. So, I just want to get on the record. Um, I'm pretty much in Joe's camp, it's I I'm a data person, so you know, the process makes it very challenging the way we do this. So, I'm not feeling fully formed to make a really good decision at this point. So, my first choice would be neither at this

172point. Um, assuming that's not viable. I'm, you know, I kind of, you know, Trevor was saying, I think we have a really steep hill to climb and I felt that Patricia really has that financial background, that executive presence. Um, someone's going to hit the ground running. I think someone who's done this, has been there can really get there. I think a tritown type school, regional school is a big lift and I want someone who is willing to be that stern person. I think I really liked Heather's philosophy. I like her engagement, but I think at the same time, I want someone who's going to be, you know, a little more data driven, you know, really kind of come in with a vision and push that vision, not try to I think trying to pull everybody

173together to get is an impossible ask for the next three, four years. I think once things are sorted out, it's a different situation. But, you know, with all this capital planning going on, to me, the financial acumen is really the driver. I will I will say something because I'll be the fourth one. I do not also feel confident recommending either at this point. Um, the whole reason I became an interim school committee member was for this that I was asked multiple times. I was very clear that this was why I wanted to do this and I'm deeply disappointed in so many things about this process and it means so it's it's a vision for my children and our kids and I just there's so many parts that go into this and I just don't feel

174confident with either what we need. option. So just to clarify, so it's not a binary option like that is definitely an option that there is no decision coming out of this. >> So yes, um I do want to offer that I do understand that instinct. I do. Um, but I'd offer that we have people of very genuine quality in front of us >> and waiting for certainty that may not arrive is itself a choice too and and that carries its own cost for our schools and our students. Um, but not supporting one of these candidates tonight would move us into a new search process that would cost us time and money and would put us into the candidate pool at a time when many of the searches have already been completed. Um, so it's >>

175I'm not underelling the the work that's been put into this and the work that would take with that. >> No, I'm I'm not saying that. I'm saying >> this the clock would start over. >> Oh, yeah. >> We would have to have a new >> Right. And yeah, it's not ideal to level >> but being forced to make a decision because there's uncertainties regardless there's with any of this. So, >> yes. >> Um, and I do understand that, you know, it is throwing away a significant amount of work. Well, and we do we have >> we have contractual levers too, right? There the decision that that we make an executive session around how we want to approach a particular candidate >> is a separate >> discussion. >> So, >> no, I'm just guessing the facts

176that it's not just so just for people who may be new to the process, there's there's sort of three options, right? >> Yeah. >> Yes. >> Right. >> Yep. It's great to level it. Great. Thanks, Adrian. Thanks for laying out the what would be in front of us in the event that uh we didn't select a candidate tonight. >> Yeah. >> So, I do wonder and I know there's some more thoughts and people probably want to go around the table again and share some more thoughts. I do wonder if it makes sense to do a quick straw poll and just see where people are are sitting right now. Um and so I think that you could raise your hand for one both or neither if you wanted to. Um but I'd like to get a

177quick straw poll for those that would support uh Heather at this point. One, two, three, four, five. And those that would support Patty. One, two, three, and a half. >> So, sorry. I just I >> am comfortable I'm comfortable supporting either candidate. Okay. I do have my own thoughts on who the right person is and I can share them. But you know I I'm also willing to go with the will of the committee if we are coalesing around one or the other. I can be convinced. >> Sorry I just got me off guard. So >> yeah, you can raise your hand for one, both or none. So >> all right. So what was the tally for for the second? >> For Heather it was five. For Patty it was three right now. >> Right. So

178I'm >> It was three and >> three plus or half. >> I was I was a half or I mean >> Well, yeah. I'm gonna say I think my preference would be neither. >> Right. I assume anybody who didn't raise their hand to either of them their preference is neither. >> And I could also sway that. >> Yeah. So it's neither. >> Yes. Listen, >> I think we need to really think about the leadership void that we currently have and what we can do in a negotiate, what we can do in a contract setting versus getting the ideal candidate to have an interim even if that was an option or appoint somebody for a short time. I don't know if that's going to be the best decision right now because there needs to be some

179certainty as we go into um capital budget all the things that are happening. Um so I just want to say that like I think I think we have two very good candidates. Um, I think one provides more of what this community needs at the moment than the other. Um, and I don't necessarily >> I think they both have budget experience. None of them were budget people. Um, but they did have some um oversight over various budgets at various times. um we have to remember what their actual roles were um and what their titles were and I think you can learn those things and you can hire somebody to be the assistant superintendent of finance that's strong and it's not necessarily going to be their people I don't think um because it would be it would

180be a job that we get posted ultimately the superintendent does have that power to hire um so the reality of it is it could be somebody that's their person. Um, but there's usually a committee for those things. When we hired our current CFO, there was a committee for that. Um, I want to build off of some of the comments. Um, I think you guys have all made great points that I also share. I had the benefit of attending both site visits as well. And I'll be honest with you all, I worked really hard to wipe the slate clean after the initial search process and come into this process with a very open mind and reset and allow the site visits, the public interviews, the references, the community feedback inform my decisions. Everything else before that

181I've tried to completely divorce from. Um, and going into the site visits and the interviews, I thought I had a perspective, but the site visits really were illuminating. So, if you weren't able to attend them, I I want to make sure everyone's aware that watching the candidates interact with the people in this building, the students who gave them tours, the teachers who showed up in the dozens. And I'm going to give our teachers an enormous amount of credit here to say, y'all did not hold back. You asked some really hard questions of those candidates and both of them provided answers that they weren't able to give in that interview setting that I think you all would have benefited from hearing. And I know it was really hard to be there and some of us elected

182to take vacation time so we could be there and that was a personal choice and not everybody can make that. But I I want to make sure that you guys trust what we're bringing forward that this is like it it was a differentiating thing for I think the people in the room. Um both of them provided really strong answers but the people that provided feedback on those site visits did have a very clear direction for us to consider. So I want to reiterate that and then I also want to share one of the exercises I did during the screening process with our advisory group and the subcommittee members was to anchor us before a discussion on what kind of leadership traits we really felt strongly about for the next superintendent candidate. And we came up

183with a list of 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11. Um, but as we went around the room, people doubled down on several of them in a big way. And what came out of that was people wanted a communicator, a collaborator, and someone with relevant experience. So that's another piece of feedback from our advisory group and the work that was done there that I think is important to call out because I think one of the biggest pain points that we have had at this table is that we haven't had someone in that role that is connecting and that makes our job so much harder. It becomes a weakness for us in budget discussions, in presenting overrides, in creating momentum around MASCO, in promoting MASCO's amazing work and reputation. All of that

184gets lighter if we have someone who can effectively communicate on behalf of Mascanomit. So I'm sort of overindexing on that I think because everything else every other aspect of their role is so highly regulated and has guidelines and yes experience is important but we can put supports around people if they need them in either case I think it's easier to put some of those financial supports I think we've tried in the past to put communication supports around people and it was not very successful. So I want to learn from what we've experienced and I want to I want that to inform my choice. Um and you know for that reason I think though both candidates are strong. I'm indexing more on Heather for that because I think that momentum is what we need and everything

185else can follow. >> Yeah. I will just add real quickly and then we can go back around if we want. Um, you know, just just the other day I'm brainstorming how do we put people around, right? I mean, it doesn't have to be necessarily direct hires, right? There's people across the towns that have experience. They've got capital experience, they're project managers, there's people in the town offices that we can partner and and leverage. Um, and yes, then there are formal people that we can put around our next superintendent as well. And so I guess I'm just doubling down on what Adrian is saying. We're not going to find a perfect candidate. My opinion, it doesn't exist. >> It's it's upon us to make sure that we set up our next superintendent for success by giving

186them the resources that they need. Um particularly in the areas that can be aided. So do we want to go around again for 60 seconds each? Well, we'll go backwards this time, Jeff. >> It's it's a little I kind of laugh a little bit just because, you know, I I totally follow your logic kind of there, too. And I came out on the opposite side of the equation because I think, you know, next year we're looking at a new, you know, assistant superintendent for finance. So, that's a gap. And, you know, to me, this role is really executive leadership. I think the soft skills and I think they both have them just different styles is important but if you can't go to the towns and convey the financial acumen the business sense the executive have

187done this and sell us to the towns I don't care how nice you are and how much you engage but if you can't tell that story and get the towns on board it's a it's a very heavy lift and I think building that support structure we you know as you said we tried to do that on the socialization side of things now we're going have to do that on the business side of things and I think that's a heavier lift and I don't think as much of a leeway the next two three years to to build that. So say I your logic is the same. I think just the where we wait our scores are a little bit different. >> It's interesting that you say that though because I think very often it's us presenting

188to the towns for budget. >> Which I don't think should be we should be doing that. I I mean certainly not, but I think certainly someone who's engaged in communicating can craft more of a story with us and present with us. >> I guess I'd say someone who's has done this before and knows how to sell that story carries a lot more weight. >> Sure. Um, and I'll say that in my opinion, some of the responses that were provided during the site visit also differentiated that for me because some of the questions that were presented to the candidates were about what kind of creative solutions have you brought forward in your experience? And while they both had solutions to point to, and I I will say this candidly that I was surprised by this, but

189Heather's examples and communication of the examples and outcomes related to the examples were more relevant and wellreceived for what it's worth. And I think the answers provided by Patty were sufficient but I don't think they crossed into creative or innovative or entirely relevant which is just it it's like a hair >> I guess it goes back to the point that sorry yeah in your opinion >> in my opinion yes and I I just want to I it's hard to offer critique because I do genu genuinely feel like we have two quality people in front of us and this is a difficult discussion. >> Um but I I do this in my day job too and I have to give direct feedback. So >> but this goes back to the point that a lot of us

190didn't have the luxury to attend this and we're kind of working in the dark. So, >> no, but your trusted colleagues on the school committee are sharing their their perspective and I'm I'm doing it as neutrally and candidly as I can um so that hopefully you guys can benefit from that and it can help you bridge the gaps that you you personally have. >> Not to be cynical, but you know, trust me is it's a big ask for role like this. >> Jeff, I know you have trust to do on things. So, >> just a just a point of order, right? Um, and after that I'm gonna Lisa wanted to mention something. Trevor wanted to mention something. I I want to give everybody one more chance to to talk. Um, we have nine members present.

191We need five five yeses on a candidate. U, we did do a straw poll. We do have five. Um, so I'm not looking to sell past the close, but given the importance of this, I do want to make sure everybody's heard. >> And so, you know, I'd like to say it's it's five minutes at 10. We still have to do go into executive session assuming that we do pass a vote. Um, and so I'd like to maybe just give everybody 60ish seconds to share their their last thoughts here. So, um, so Lisa, I think you had your hand up first and then Trevor and then we'll see where we go. >> Um, so as you know, my votes for Heather. Um you're she did say she is more than happy to go between go in

192front of the fincom the select board. She is more than willing to go to the towns and meet with people. She is more than happy to stand in front of town meetings and fight with us for the school budget. Also she also as a community member did a turf project and then as the high school principal she did a um renovation to the high school. So, she does know what it takes to do those pro those capital projects and I am more than happy to have her lead us to help her help us get across that finish line because she has had that experience in the past. >> Thank you. Um there's been a lot of focus on communication. I agree that is an an essential characteristic of a superintendent and a superintendent and we

193committee members feel as though from what I'm hearing is that that may have lacked in the previous administration in one way or another but we also had the privilege of having a very experienced superintendent. So we're pointing to communication but we didn't have to worry about the experience piece. This on the other hand is quite the like if you turn it on its head, you know, you notice it because or I guess you don't notice it because it's been here the whole time, but when that gets pulled out from under us as the I mean the experience piece of it, >> it might be very apparent very quickly as we're going for a $70 million um capital request over the next few years. And I I do just because I do work in New Hampshire

194and I work in education policy up there. It is a very different environment for educators up there and how they interact with the boards and public and that might take a minute to crack open. I'm not going to lie. The Patricia has worked in New Hampshire for over since 2014. So that that's a long time. and that the culture of educating up there is very different than educating down here. So just that to break through that might take time and I don't think that that is a bad thing and I think that can be worked on as well. Um wrapping up. >> Yes. Um, and just I and I hear your points, Lisa, that the um, Heather has been a part of that those renovation projects, but and I mean no disrespect at all to

195our high school principal, but we have not worked with our high school principal on our renovation project. I'm sure there's behind the scenes stuff that we don't see, but as a board, we haven't had that opportunity. And just one more thing because I think there was a lot it was a lot clearer that I think Patricia understood her role between her office and this committee and I think that that's important as we go into these member towns governing and she although Heather said she'd be open and willing to go to the member communities to present them budgets and turf projects, there's never any experience doing that. So, we I'm happy to take her out of word, but we don't know because that experience isn't there where I think the other candidate has made it clear

196that that experience is there. >> Thank you. >> I'll give you my minute. How's that? >> Mine in a minute. Um for me, I mean, my life is communication. It's my p every day. So, I understand that your first impressions and and how you communicate with people matter because it's what they leave with, right? It's what they think about after they've had a conversation with you. But for me, for this, my my only biggest hang-up is that we're facing a lot. It seems like every year we have to cut a million and a half, million and a half, million and a half. And it's just there's a lot piling down on Masco and many schools, too, not just us. So for me it's it's more about the experience right now at the moment. I know

197the communication is huge. It is so big and I completely agree that that is important and that other skills can be can be learned but right at this moment where Masco is, I'm worried to not have somebody with a little more experience. So I am leaning more for Patricia just because of what's happening and all of the different changes that we have coming up. for >> 59 seconds until time. >> Anybody else that would like to share something new? Not much new other than um I certainly hear the comments about the Patricia's greater experience in some very key areas. No, can't argue with that. Um, but I I firmly believe that the ability to engage with the staff and our community far and away far and away uh the most important characteristic we need in

198our next superintendent. Uh, and I think that person who embodies that the best is um, Heather. >> I think for me the the deep unhappiness that I feel in my community right now with what's going on in the schools and the fear of like are we sending our kids there? Are we going to go p? Like it's real. It's you guys know we know this and it's it's palpable that we all are talking about and it I think that's what's driving my decision right now is that it's such a gamble with somebody who doesn't have experience when we are as a parent you know and even as a school committee member it's just it's so much uncertainty with a skeleton crew of leadership that I just I really worry about not having experience although communication

199is so key. So that's where I'm torn and it's like that's what's coming out of me being like I just don't know who is the right fit when I just don't see a fit >> one not on this just procedurally you know we're missing two really key members here as well which makes me uncomfortable with the process. >> Me too. >> Can we table this for a week and revisit this? >> I won't make a motion for that. the record. >> I think it is really tough to table just because they likely have other offers from other districts and we've already waited a very long time. >> I just want to Yeah, I understand. I think we'll make sure the the minutes capture that. >> Yes. >> And I will apologize if I I know

200that this was an imperfect decision to make last week. Kind of a lose-lose decision in terms of postponing this meeting. It was not strategic or anything like that. Uh I felt like we were a bit of a mess going into a very very big decision and there were some very real life situations going on with multiple school member school committee members at the time. So um you know I will take the blame for that. Um we would have been missing people last week or we would have been missing people this week and I apologize. It was lose lose. And for those that are upset, um, you can be upset with me. Um, anybody else want to share any last thoughts? And then I'm going to ask for see if there's a motion. Adrian, >> I

201just have one. I I just want to share an anecdote. Can't remember at what point this was shared with us by a candidate, but the candidate offered an experience where they needed to repair their track at the school. and there was not strong community support. And so they helped rally the students around some initiatives to bring the community in, have the parents and the community members walk the track, see the condition, and hear a presentation from the students on why it mattered to them. And it changed the whole trajectory of the situation. So if if you guys didn't have the benefit of hearing that because it happened some during like an earlier question in the session, I want to make sure that you guys hear that because that's the kind of thing that Heather shared

202with us as some of her examples. And for me, I was like, we know what we need. We know what we want to do. We have some details to iron out and we can certainly advise with other people in our community if we need financial expertise, but what we really need is someone who's going to go to the mat with us and say, "We need this and here's why. Here's why you should support it." And I think that that to me is something that someone has to have on board on day one because it's not easy to train that into someone. So I just want to make sure you guys had that anecdote because it's striking me that maybe not everybody got to hear it and it was a really great example of what's possible

203when you have a great communicator even though you're up against it. mechanics of getting a budget passed, mechanics of getting capital through, those are regulated, there's guidelines, there's steps you have to follow. But that other piece, it's important and it would certainly take a lot of burden off us. >> I promise it'll be >> Did you get a chance to speak? Do you want to speak >> for once? I think I'm going to be quiet. >> Can have Melissa's >> take my 60 seconds. No, I I just want to say I'm and I I'm pretty positive on this, but I just want to double check. My understanding is they are going to come into this role and they will have a mentor. There is somebody that will help them with this process. They will have

204another superintendent, right, that they can go to. >> That's a contractual leverage to discuss. >> So for those people that are like, "She doesn't have the experience." Huh. >> We can fund it, right? >> Which is so easy this year. But I'm just saying if they putting it out there, if you're worried about her experience, again, she had three references that went from principal to superintendent, we can put that in there that she will have a mentor that can help her through becoming a a a superintendent in her new role. I am going to >> say Mass Association of School Superintendent does offer coaching and all new superintendents can get a coach that's a old superintendent to help work with it. So that's >> a negotiation thing, but it's very typical of most superintendents get

205that. >> I um I'm going to entertain uh a motion. I move that the Mascanom Regional School Committee extend an offer of employment for the position of superintendent of schools to um Heather Galante subject to the negotiation of mutually acceptable contract terms. >> A second. >> I'll second. >> That's a second. Okay. I I'm not going to do a roll call, but I'll do a show of hands because I sense that this will be not obvious. >> Can I request a roll call? >> No. Can you suppose you can >> kind of It doesn't matter. Let's do a is is there anybody that >> like as part of discussion straw poll or >> straw? There's no straw poll. >> Well, because it's a vote, a second, and then any other discussion. >> We could have

206done the roll call already. >> We already did the roll. >> Let's Let's just do a quick roll call. Uh, Melissa, >> yes. >> Maggie, >> no. >> Bill, >> yes. >> No. Kendra, >> No. Isa, >> yes. >> Adrien, >> yes. >> Wow. Yes. So, uh, congratulations to Heather Galanti. we will uh we will move into executive session and um we will discuss the contract. So we have an attorney a motion >> make a motion to move into executive session for the purpose of discussing strategy relative to negotiations with non-UN personnel. Preferred superintendent candidate chosen in item one executive session purpose number two committee will not return to open session. This is the point at which we excuse our audience but thank you for coming. >> You have to take a roll call vote.

207>> Yeah we need a second. >> We have a second. >> Second it. We'll call Melissa. >> Yes. Yes. >> Andra. >> Yes. >> Adrian. >> Yeah. >> Yes. All right. Uh Rachel, I think we can