001Right. I'd like to call the committee of the whole meeting for Wednesday, March 19th to order at five 5:00. Um Morris >> here. >> Shoefelt >> here. >> Westfall >> here. >> Block is excused. Fields >> here. >> Moore is here. Morarski excused. We please stand for the pledge of allegiance. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you. Let the record reflect that Mr. Murdki is here at 501. Oh, you gonna sneeze? Okay, >> maybe I'm not. >> Agenda for board and discussion item a revision for approval of the agenda. Is there a motion? >> Motion by Mel. If there is >> support by Mr. >> Miss is a yes.
002Mr. Westall >> yes. >> Miss Blackwell's absent. Miss Fields. >> Yes. >> Miss Moore. >> Yes. >> Mr. Barkski. >> Yes. >> Mr. Morris. >> Yep. >> And I will open the floor. >> Okay. Yeah. Like to just um we Yeah. Um, we just like want to schedule this meeting today. Um, as you know, we're going to we're proposing a resolution to bring down the bonds. Um, I think we've gotten the information that we need or that we've requested um with regard to moving forward with the renovation of um, Taylor High School. So, I wanted to leave this this open to for discussion on that, questions, concerns. Um, with regard to that, >> and I do just want to say, um, I Jim Crowley is in attendance. He is our attorney that handles our bond
003issues. So, in case you have any specific questions, uh, he is here to answer those. >> Any discussion? >> Well, sure. I mean, the main issue is that the public was not really notified even what we were voting on. I mean, you checked on the website, there was nothing. I mean, this morning there was a little something. Um, the bond resolution still can't be accessed by the public. The dollar amount's not even on the agenda. Um, this was basically a stealth bond attack. There's no reason the public couldn't have gotten notification of this prior. I don't even know the dollar amount. Can you please tell me the dollar amount, Mr. Bond Attorney? >> The dollar amount's been posted more than once. And >> for for this meeting? For this meeting? No, it has not. >>
004What What are you talking about? What's left in the bond? Yeah. Yeah. So, you have a resolution today that nobody could access even what the resolution was. So, nobody's coming to the meeting. So, you don't even know what's being voted on. The bond resolution we're voting on was never posted. What? >> That's it. >> That's all that's left >> for months. >> And I Yeah, but but give >> the full bond that was folded on was 30 million, not 150, 130. 30 of it was brought down. That's what it was. And and on in that bond language was also the um the redoing of the athletic fields, all of that was built into the bond. All of the renovations at two or three of the elementaryaries was built into the bond. That's what the people
005voted on. So far, they've gotten the renovations and in the elementaryaries and now that the it should be started on the athletic. What's left from all the meetings I've attended is $und00 million. When that's pulled down, I call it pulled down. I don't know what the technical term is. When those bond issu when those bonds are sold, then that's it. It's it's the hundred million. >> No, no. I I understand that. But I'm just saying the people voted four years ago for this bond issue. Part of it was issued as we know the 330 million whatever. A lot of people thought this 100 million would never be issued without a new plan. And so I just find it odd that four years 52 weeks we picked this meeting to vote on issuing the rest of
006the bonds which is going to make everyone's taxes go up probably about $200. And and most people I know were against this. So instead of giving them notice to attend and voice their concern with the plan, this was never posted correctly. That that's what we were voting on today. Nothing about this. >> Justin, you've been talking about it for months and renovating the high school and using the hund00 million to do >> correct. And we we can talk about any >> they wanted it on the agenda so they knew the community wanted it posted on the agenda so they knew what we're voting on today. That's what they wanted. I would like to remind everyone we need a level of decorum, please. Yeah, >> we're all trying to do what's best for this school district.
007Thank you. >> Thank you. >> I'm pretty sure that the community that I talked to are super excited about what we're about to hopefully do today and moving forward to give these students and our district something finally. >> I'm not sure what the confusion is. Everybody knows what the resolution is going to be. Ma ma'am. No, no, they don't. Because if you go on the website to read the resolution, if you go on the door to read the resolution, there's nothing there. It simply says bond resolution. And that was as of this morning. I'm going to tell you right now, if you went on Tuesday, there was nothing. If you went on Monday, there was nothing. If you went on Friday, there was nothing. No, you never told people this was happening today. Nobody's arguing
008that, and I've been the biggest one complaining about it for a long time, that we do not have bond updates on that website. Have I not been complaining about it, Mike? >> Well, good. I'm sorry. Go ahead. >> That That is one thing that does have to be addressed. If the if the community the community needed to be here tonight if they were all that concerned Facebook community doesn't hold a drop of water to me >> but they couldn't be here because they didn't know what was going on is my point. >> I just want to remind remind everybody that I put it out publicly last um at the last meeting on several occasions. I put it out for the people on Zoom and uh >> cow meeting in less than a year and what
009you see here is the most people we've ever gotten and they've all been about the bond about what's next about >> I I can see where you're coming from, but I don't see how you can pay architects and get prepared and have all of this in place and then pull the money down. You've got to have the money to put those things in play. >> Well, I guess I ask the question then, are these bonds callable? If we decide to not go on the project, can we call the bonds later? >> So, these are callable bonds for the record. Can you please state that? >> Oh, so they're semicolable. See, that's a problem. This board you're aware original plan has changed. So all this starts before we can complete that process whether it's >> when
010will the if it were voted on today when will the first bond sale take place >> can I ask that you come to the podium sir >> yeah yeah this is important >> something so the plan typically this is the start of the issuance process This resolution speaks to the issuance of the bonds and allows the district to spend the money on any allowable project that the voters approved. So, this particular resolution just starts the financing process. I think that the what the plan was to get these bonds issued before July 1 because we have that's a levy date for taxes. So, I think the plan was to have the bonds issued on or before July one of this year. So to to just reiterate what you said, we want to hurry up and do
011it before July 1 so everybody has to pay the extra tax. Is that correct? We want everyone's taxes to go up. >> Well, I mean, yes, it would happen. You want to attach it to the ROS, correct? >> Correct. But yeah, that's the normal process. We when we have debt, there's But the July one is your levy date. >> So for this year, you'd want to get that on the rolls for the this year. >> So they could be paying taxes on a project that hasn't even been approved yet. Correct. Well, we're not going to issue the bonds until we So, the other piece of this uh is that um these these bonds were authorized by the voters. Yeah. >> And before they were issued, these bonds are qualified with the state of Michigan under
012the school bond loan program, which is a guarantee program, but you have to go through the state and identify all your projects. And we did this that the school district back in 2021 went and we went through the whole process. There's an application that has all the projects in there. What we have to do, the other part of this is once this board decides what they want to do, we have to go back to the state of Michigan Treasury Department and get their blessing on what we're doing. And we started that process last year um based on what the plan was last year, but once this board decides what you're going to do now, we're going to go back to Treasury and get their blessing on this, which is required by law. >> No. So,
013hypothetically speaking, we approve this tonight. Okay, goes on the tax rolls after July. Let's say we still can't decide in two more years what we're going to do. Would the people's taxes go up or not? >> So, alliance, let me answer. Oh, hold on. Your first question. We're we can't issue the bonds until this board decides what they what the amended plan is going to be and the Department of Treasury has to approve it. So, we can't issue bonds. There's going to be once we Treasury blesses it, there's there's a roadmap. There's an application that identifies all the projects you're going to do. We had an original application that has all the project which included the building a new high school. You're not doing that anymore. The new application is uh renovating the middle school
014to be a high school and other stuff. So, you're going to have a a Treasury roadmap that is going to be approved by Treasury. So, there's going to be no changing that. Once Treasury approves it, then we're we can't issue the bonds until Treasury approves that. And then that's our roadmap that we have to follow. >> So, this this what you just said, the this plan with the middle school, we've already approved this or no? The current high school would be the middle school and we would make renovations to it. So within that bond language, we can use the bond money to renovate the high school. >> No, I know I understand. >> I I understand that. But this will be the final vote to issue the bonds. Once we vote yes today, assuming Treasury
015approves, it's a done deal. It happens. Correct. Or is there a second vote by this board? >> There is not under this resolution. But what happens is delegated to the superintendent ah >> to to uh close the bond issue sign all the closing documents >> right so with this resolution we give up all future power and we have no future control no more votes is that correct >> then >> no that sounds like no no once that plan is approved like you have to know like we're going to take this section of the high school we're going to rebuild the gym and and this is how much money we need and that's how much money they give us, right? Is that what you're trying to say? >> Treasury there's a very extensive application that we're
016going to have to provide to treasury and once that that's your I say that's your road map who does the application >> your design professionals do that for you. >> So if we don't agree with that it's still going to happen anyways. No, no, no. No, no. You have to >> what happens the process is we take that application, we have a preliminary meeting with Treasury, they review it. It's called a PQ meeting. We we did this originally in 21. We did it again last year in 2024. We had an amended application with what we the road map we were heading. Then this board needs to has to approve that. You're gonna you this board is going to approve that new amended treasury application >> at a future meeting >> before I can before we
017can issue bonds. That's one of the key requirements to the issuance of these bonds. >> So there will be a second vote >> on the on the application the project application >> and if that were denied then the bonds would not go. >> Correct. >> Yeah. >> Of what we're going to do with the money. >> Now you mentioned delegation to the superintendent. Can you elaborate on that? >> So, typically when we do these uh a bond resolution, um we we approve all the steps that have to be taken and then we delegate to the superintendent to close up the deal. Um it's just a normal way to do it. >> Kind of like the mayor being delegated to oversee something. >> Oh, no, no, I understand the concept. I'm not sure I want to
018do that. No, no, I understand it. I'm just questioning the utility of doing that because that seemed to be a problem with the previous bond issue. There was overdelegation and the board in a lot of ways allowed people to assert their authority and that's really what caused a lot of the problem. >> It wasn't delegation. It was oversight of the delegate. >> Well, either way they didn't do it. So, we have to be very careful in what we do. >> Yeah. My concern, Justin, is if we don't do something to that high school with this money and with the way everything is going up now in price due to tariffs and we're going to get more tariffs, by the time we go to spend the money, we may be able to afford an outhouse. So
019my concern is at least give these residents and these kids something for the money that get we're cleaning up a mess of a prior administration and a prior board. We're stuck. This is this is where we're at. The process is all minutia to me. Who's delegated? Who's what? Because when it comes down to who's who's the uh who's the boss, so to speak, we are of Mike. So if he doesn't do what we've instructed him to do, that can destroy his career. Bottom line. >> No, I understand what you're saying, but most residents I've spoken with didn't even want the second issuance to happen if they're not getting a new high school. I mean, that was really the contract voters, I think, felt was. >> I agree. I agree 200%. But the problem is is
020they voted the bond. The bond can be adjusted. The money's not there for a new high school. We can leave that money sit there till doomsday, but guaranteed when this board is replaced, the next board can pull that money and adjust the plans and do what they want with it then. And the thing is the buying power on it then is going to be a lot less than it is right now because of all the factors you had cited. >> I was not a favor of calling this money down. I was not because I too believed when you vote to have a high school bill then that's what you need to do with the money. I requested figures from another company which I which we all got and that company as well. Even with making
021a smaller building that would house 10, 11 and 12, we still didn't have the money to do a smaller building. So now you got to weigh the options. Do we want to sit back, let the money sit out there in Neverland and let somebody else handle the whole thing and we're not giving the community anything bad? The question I have is from what time that you request the bonds or you sell the bonds and the time that it hits the tax roles because I think that's part of what Justin was saying. Is that correct, Justin? >> Yes, that is correct. And I believe he said it would hit the tax roles this year if I understood you correctly. >> Well, there'll be there's already a debt levy being levied annually on your current debt. Um,
022so this would be just whatever increase to to you know pay off these bonds, >> right? It would be about four times because if we're levying about 25 million, it will go up to 100 million. It would clearly go up. >> It will, but um it stays within. So when we uh went to the voters in 2021, there was a a millage um I have it here a a promise to the voters and because we didn't issue the bonds according to the way we planned, the debt levy went down. It's going to go back up, but it's not going to go above what we told the voters it was not going to exceed back in 2021. >> Still shoot up to about $300 a house, I believe, was I don't know that the top of
023my head. >> So it's a tax increase. Can we just >> figured out at at 250? >> Yeah. Can we just say the word it will be a tax increase. Can you just say that? >> Oh, absolutely. >> Okay. So, absolutely will be tax about that. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Right. But that's >> Yes. When it was voted yes, we haven't had to pay that yet. And now we're finally at a spot where we can move forward to give our students in our district something. It's it is evident we cannot build a new high school. >> Correct. >> We have $100 million. There wasn't enough money asked for to begin with to build a high school in 2021. >> Right. >> Wasn't enough money then. I don't know where they got the dollar amount
024from. I wasn't a part of it. I didn't none of it. But there wasn't enough money then. There's nowhere near enough money now. We have enough money to give them new improved up todate modernized a beautiful building inside what we have. And so now we're going to get the tax increase. We haven't had the last four years. We haven't had it yet. So everybody knew it was coming. >> This is what the voters wanted. They wanted to give the And yes, it was for one particular item. That item was impossible to do. Impossible. I'm very disappointed that we are not getting a new high school. However, once I saw the dollar amount, the money, and it was quite clear, abundantly clear that we did not have enough to um You high school. Pardon me. >>
025You worked to get that bond. >> Yeah. But I didn't come up with the dollar amount. I wish I didn't care for the um architects from day one. Um however, that wasn't, you know, my decision. I wasn't a board member. Uh you know, the dollar amount, uh that was their job to come up with the dollar amount. And you know, we worked really hard on that bond getting it passed. >> That dollar amount then has tripled, >> right? >> Well, I don't Yeah, I don't think it was enough at the time now sitting back now. But anyway, I'm very disappointed we're not getting a new high school. However, the reality is this. So, >> even if we even if we approve it tonight to bring that 100 million in, >> right, >> it's still going
026to be two or three years before you even start ordering. >> Oh, I disagree. >> Yeah, but I don't that wouldn't be my department. Two or three years. Well, I think when we've talked with collaborative net, they're talking about a design phase of about eight months. So, that would be pretty much the rest of this year. Then you bid it. So, by finished product, it could be as long as I finished, >> but I think there would be some of it going before then. >> It is a lengthy process. >> Yes. >> Yeah. And then we're going to have a challenge with, you know, doing it while they're students, too. So, there's lots to plan. For sure. >> For sure. And I do want to say like, and I know I've put it out to
027this board, the you know, we did the polling data back uh in the spring and the polling data did show from what we had the the company Glen Gariff go out and get it. It did show that there was support for the renovation um that basically voters would not vote for more money to come in. like they would not in any way, shape, or form vote to sell more bonds, but that they would be uh acceptable to us renovating with what's in the pot. >> Well, if I may respond, no, I I mean, what you're saying is factual and true. I I just think that the voters sent the money for a new high school. You are correct. There's no money for that. I think the proper thing now is to not sell these bonds,
028but to work with the state legislators to give us the opportunity to end the authorization and come back with something new to the voters. That's the appropriate thing. I know we can't do that now, but I'm sure we could work with some of our elected folk and fix this mess. But just because we can spend the money doesn't mean we should. It's like getting a credit card and blowing it. say just let it sit there and not give our students and district anything new. >> No, we we we are giving them something new because we're giving an athletic field. But we need to represent this >> has no heat, no air. It needs lighting. >> Well, it does have heat and air. It just doesn't work correctly. But what okay what I'm saying >> but
029continue going to your pool that can't provide you >> no is that we stick with what was told to them that they're getting a new high school. They cannot get a new high school. So we we represent to them a proper dollar amount and let them vote on it up or down. That's what we do. We can't bait and switch and say you're getting a new high school. >> But you can ask them for the money. But you can ask them for the money. I'm trying to tell you. >> Are you saying that ask through another bond or are you asking through just asking the legislature to appropriate money to us? >> Well, I mean, legislative money is always a good thing, but no, I would say you I would say you cancel this bond,
030which would need legislative approval. Okay. Then you go back to the city of Taylor voters with a new plan for a new high school with a proper cost to see how they vote. >> Why? >> Well, if they're going to say no, then that's why we shouldn't be doing this. You just proved my point. The fact that the le >> that their students are going to go into that isn't over exceeding the money that we have. >> But if we canceled it, then the new levy would be zero and they'd be essentially reapproving this for a few bucks more and see if they believed in the plan. But I do want to clarify and Mr. Crowley, maybe you can answer this. The the thing is there we can't even go back to the voters to
031get them to rescend what's on the table. It these bonds are there and they are there for perpetuity purposes. He was saying that you would go to the legislature to like change that law so you could fix that. But >> yeah, the perpetuity authorization I think the I actually spoken to two state legislators on this. I'm not going to mention their names, >> but they said the perpetuity authorization was never intended and we could probably get that revoked. >> We probably >> through the legislative process of getting through the state house, the state senate, the governor. It's worth a shot because I'm telling you, people voted for a new high school. Their taxes are going to go up. They're not getting a new high school. It is just that simple. It's just that wrong. >>
032Built an existing building. They're getting a new >> They're getting a renovation. That's not what they voted for. And you know that. And here's the deal. If you look at the poll, and I went through the poll in great detail. Thank you for sharing that. There was no option of rescending the bonds. I guarantee if the option of there was rescending the bonds, right now we cannot. But if you had asked them, hey, what if we could drawing? >> Yeah, it it'd be changing state law essentially. Correct. That's what you're getting at. >> I think we'd have a lot of support for this. >> Not in my lifetime. >> So, >> this is a unique case. I think we'd have support on this. This has really never happened before in the state. So, I think
033we might get on both sides of the aisle, red and blue, that hey, you have a bond that can't be used. Let's be able to rescend it. But we do have a B. We have a use for it. >> No, we do. But the intent we all have agreed the intent was to build a new high school. >> Let's bring it down. Sorry. Let's sell it. Let's let's let's sell it. Let's redo the high school. And if the public doesn't ever want to vote for another bond, which they're not going to because I hear the same complaints you do, then so be it. Why wait? Cost more money and try to fight it at at the legislation legislature level >> simply for the reasons you stated. If we ask them again, they would say no.
034So, I personally find it unethical to do some bait and switch. >> That's an opinion. That >> No, that is my opinion. I'm not I'm not accusing anyone of being unethical. That is my opinion. Uhhuh. >> Hectic situation with the bar and we have spent I know I have spent endless hours going through scenarios. Let's try it this way. Let's do this. Let's we got money ideas for this. We got this breakdown. We got that breakdown. And in almost three, four years, we have come back to the same resolution every single time. So, we keep >> it needs to be voted on one way or the other. >> We keep let Yep. This is what we're going to do. We're going to renovate the high school and we're going to get all these plans and
035we're going to share it with everybody in the district and then Oh, we're gonna Just kidding. We lied. Just kidding. We're going to take that back just for another year to go by for us to come to the same resolution. We can't build a new high school, but we do have money to renovate and make a beautiful high school. Why do we continue wasting time? >> Well, no, no, no, no. Wait a minute. >> You may have wasted time. This is a new board, Stephanie. >> Right. >> A year ago, we ran out this same resolution. We're going to renovate the high school. >> The same. >> Why wasn't a task back then? >> Yeah. Pretty. if we can get this done with this. >> But a year has passed is my point. And here
036we sit >> four years have passed since we approved the bond and this is as far as we've got. >> But my point is like once they realized there wasn't enough money to build a high school, they looked at all these other avenues. People left, new people came in, we explored more avenues, and we're back. This is now the third time we're back to rendating the high school, the current high school since just I've been on the board. And so Justin is suggesting we stop the idea all together again and potentially waste more years just to come back to the same resolution because we're not going to get enough money. >> Well, we're all individual. We're all going to have our own opinions. We're all going to have our own vote. It It's going to
037come down to that. My vote will will depend on how the motion is made because if our employees, our directors are not from the ground up at the very beginning, my vote will be no. >> Well, it's going to work. >> Are you talking about when we get into the PQ application portion, the amended >> applications? I got you. Because we need >> that makes sense. >> Yes. From the from the from the ground floor on. >> Yep. >> So you can get your time freed up and our interests are looked after by one of our employees as Linda and I have spoken about that. >> Yep. I agree with that 100%. We should have somebody from our district. I would just like to say if we can, you know, the new this we keep
038calling it the new board, but we are the board um you know has asked for information we've been 10 weeks and so I don't think that's an exorbitant amount of time to have all the information come to us because we didn't have all the information um that you had. So, it's not a horrible amount of time. in my conversations with the the residents and the of steady is, you know, do something, you know, you know, want to say or get off the pot, but it's really a um the the feelings that I'm getting from the people and our kids deserve something um nice and >> well, I'd like to come on that behalf because it's kind of, you know, came up in the discussion like my role is I am your one employee and but
039as your one employee, my job is to advocate on behalf of our staff and our students. And I think ethically the right thing is that we provide them what we can with the money that's there. Our students are begging for it. Um we need to make a difference. And that's why as my role as being the chief advocate for those students, for that staff, we've got to do something. So yeah, I know I just wanted to respond to what you said and it was some nice comments, but ultimately the people voted for a new high school. we're not going to take their money for what they weren't promised. And that to me is just an ethical question. And when you actually talk to voters, that's what they say. And when we do this PQ app,
040let's at least have the courage to put it on the website two weeks ahead of time because I guarantee if the voters knew this was being voted on today, this would have been packed. Interestingly, >> oh, if if they knew >> Justin like the city >> Oh, but if they know because they're city voters, trust me, it would have been announced at the council meeting last night because there were people there wondering what was going on and I couldn't tell them because I didn't have an agenda. So, you know, it is odd that this was not put on the agenda till this morning when we've known about it for two weeks. >> No, I got I got my agenda on Monday and it was on there then. Not the public one. No, not the one
041that the public reads. >> Not the public one. The the board one. >> Yeah, but the public is what matters. It's not about me. It's not about you. It's about the public. It's about proper notice to the public. Well, and I are the ones paying it. I also do want to reiterate again that, you know, a lot of times we're sitting here saying like, "Oh, this is how the residents of the city feel." We do not just cover the city of Taylor. We also cover residents in Westland. We cover residents in Dearbornne Heights in um Ingster and we cover these different areas and and then even kids who come to us from school of choice. So quite honestly we are looking out for much beyond just the city itself because we truly do cover other
042communities within our boundaries. >> That is true. But the city pays for it. So I care about what the people who pay for it think. >> Wait a minute. How do you figure that? >> Yeah. >> The district pays for it. >> Yeah. So if you're living in Ingster and you're within our boundaries, they're paying the same tax. >> No, no, I understand if I'm talking referring to school of choice. So I'm just saying that the people Yes. the voters who voted for this since I'm worried about you're right. Inster did cover it, but if I'm school of choice and let's say Rochester, I'm not paying for the bond. That's what I was trying to clarify. >> Yes. Right. >> Anyone else? >> I got nothing. That was enough. >> Get enough. >> I'm good.
043>> Mr. Mr. Morris, you have anything any words of wisdom? No. Okay. >> Not of wisdom. >> Mr. Westfall? Not of wisdom. Anything to say? >> Nope. I'm good. It's >> okay. >> But what is the interest rate on the bonds real quick? Do we do have an idea? >> You have a technical question? >> Uh I'm the attorney. I'm not the finance person, but I we do these deals daily. But so the interest rates have gone up, but they're still at historically low rates. So they're tax exempt bonds. They're probably in the, you know, for three and a half to 4% range. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Well, good talk, fellow board members. All right. Now, we will move on to I believe the audience of participation is the only thing we have left.
044>> Anyone? >> Oh, yeah. I want to see if anybody's gonna for anyone in person here to address the board. How about on Zoom and entertain a motion to adjurnn >> support? We have a motion by field support by Morris to adjourn at 5:35. We will reconvene at 6:00 for the regular board meeting. >> Have to vote on that. >> Okay. No. >> Um do I had a motion? I had a support. Uh Westfall, >> yes. >> Block is excused. Fields. >> Yes. >> Morris. Yes. Morarski. >> Yes. >> Morris. >> Yes. >> Shoefeld. Okay. That passes 61. Hey, we'll reconvene at six. Thank you everyone.