001Welcome to this very small crowd this evening. Um, thanks for being here. I know there's a lot of sickness going around and I appreciate people who are not feeling well not coming and getting the rest of us sick. Um, I'm going to call us to order with the equity statement. In Asheville City Schools, we are committed to equity and anti-racist policies for all students and staff to learn and thrive. We recognize that our positions come with power, responsibility, and public service for the entire ACS community. We will model our commitment to equity through our practices and decisions. During this meeting, we invite a pause if harm has taken place, a moment to name the harm, and space to practice repair. Thank you. Um, we do have a quorum. Five of us are present in person.
002Liza is joining us remotely. Pepe is sick and is not attending. Um, but we do have a quorum. At this time, I would entertain a motion to approve our agenda. >> So moved. >> Second. >> All those in favor? >> I. The motion is approved. Um, one quick thing just for board members to note. Um, you may have noticed it's organized a little differently than usual. Um, Rebecca and Maggie and I talked about this and a couple things you're going to see is that the first thing we'll do is the courageous conversations about race protocol and then we moved some particular agenda items to follow that so that we can practice um, what we learn. And with that, we learned, excuse me, we moved other items that I by no means mean to suggest are
003less important, but things like contracts are now at the end so that our uh sort of best brains and energy can be on the things at the beginning of the agenda and push other things to the end. So, you'll see that. Um, but at this point, I will turn it over to Maggie to do our next courageous conversation protocol. the microphone. Well, good evening everyone. Um, I decided I think what would be helpful as we facilitate these conversations to give you some handouts. So, in your orange folder, you have a um a stapled handout. It's your first one. And um we're going to just quickly review the courageous conversations compass, the agreements, and the six conditions. Um and what I always like to start with is just asking meeting participants when we're um in a
004meeting, just just look at the compass and notice where you are arriving today in this space. And just notice if you're in, you know, one quadrant really strongly. Bless you. um just wondering why and recognizing that that's where you are. And then take a look at the four agreements and as you look through those, think of the which agreement you feel like you really need to lean into and focus on as we move through this conversation today. So, oops. I'm trying to fix one thing. There was I have a handout that I wanted to also get to um Liza. All right. So um as we um reviewed last time there are six conditions and that they are also progressive in nature. So your tier one conditions is about engaging in conversation. Your tier 2 which
005are your um numbers three and four those are about sustaining conversation and then tier three are the most intense and they're really how do we help deepen the conversation. So, we talked about um personal, local, and immediate at our last um work session, and today we're going to um tackle condition number two, isolating race. Um so, if you flip to the next page, um just some information on there about what it means to isolate race and um why we focus on the isolating of race um and in addition to other factors. So when we acknowledge that in the broader scope there is diversity in lots of many different factors. But when we specifically look at how do we contribute or how does our um variety of factors can also compound a racialized issue and where
006do racialized issues kind of rise above any of those other issues around different types of diversity. um and that there is a critical need to explicitly and intentionally look at race as it's an individual um category. Um by doing so, you're going to deepen your understanding about race, but you're also going to develop skills and knowledge to address other diversity related issues. Um condition number two keep center keeps race at the center of your conversation. Um when you think about if you start bringing in poverty or gender um or religion that can you can sometimes have the this tendency to blame those other factors instead of saying all right let's just actually think about what race has to do with this above any of those other factors. Um and by not centering race that allows
007you to shift that blame. Um, you'll hear you could hear someone say something like, "Well, it's not my fault. It's their parents' education." Or, "It's not my fault, you know, or that's not about race, they live in poverty, or that's a, you know, an issue based on the community that they live in or the background that they have." Um, but when we isolate race, you can really start to see how pervasive race does impact. And I put a a quick snapshot of an advertisement from a long time ago for um Volkswagen. Um and it is a picture of two cars. One is naughty, one is nice. And just thinking about in very simple terms, what is that communicating about race when you look at that advertisement? So just a couple questions for you to think
008through and then we'll talk about them. So, as you look at that advertisement, where do you locate yourself on the compass at first glance? And then taking that time to further deepen um your examination and pondering about the ad, what if any movement on the compass? Do you find yourself immediately in the thinking? And then when you start really processing it, might you move to a different quadrant or closer to the center? And then personalize that advertisement. So what does that meaning hold for you in terms of your own personal, local, and immediate racialized experience? So take just a few seconds um or minute a minute or so and just really think through those those three questions. Maggie, as we do this, [clears throat] just because we don't interact with it as much and I'm
009glad we are. Can you just remind us the basic if I how do I know I'm thinking versus believing versus Yeah, that's a great question. So thinking might be you're asking yourself questions like why why would this represent a racial um stereotype or why you know I don't understand like you may be asking what is it about this that may cause someone to feel you know triggered or um that this may be a racialized advertisement or creates a stereotype for different racial groups. So that those are would be thinking. Um if you just look at this and you just find yourself going shaking your head and go I can't believe it. This is just another example that would be um I would say that's kind of feeling like you're like just feeling defeated like this
010is just how it is. This is how it keeps going. Um believing is you might think well yeah that you know I this is what happens in our world. This is just what we should expect. Um, and then acting would you might think, well, yeah, that's not great. What are we doing to change that? What are some things we can put in place so that these types of advertisements aren't continuing to be perpetuated? >> Thank you. >> Yep. And as we kind of think about it, I'll really push you to focus on condition number one is really talking about your personal, local, and immediate experience. And when we discuss it, I may ask you to, you know, use I statements, not we, not they. really talking about your own experience. That's where it starts to
011get putting those conditions into practice. Take one and pass it down. Don't look at it. And then you're getting a sheet, another sheet, but don't look at the Just keep it turned over. >> [snorts] >> All right. So, as you saw that and just have some initial, you know, reaction to it, anyone want to share what was your initial reaction as you think about where you fell on the compass? I think every time I come here and probably the same thing with Dr. Dickerson that we are probably two of the black male figures that show up every you know during this time and sometime I'm thinking where's everybody else but I can see that within this past year um [clears throat] um there's with the hiring process and with uh we it just isolation of
012race here in this city. You can see it. I saw it during the enrollment uh at the at all the elementary schools and also at the middle school. I saw it at the enrollment. I see it every time that as city schools get together. A lot of times there's only a few of us that is uh of color that shows up. Um, and that is I'm not sure why or why it's so isolated. It could be because of the location. It could be because of the hiring of people in central, you know, in Astro City Schools if they show up or not. But I'm always looking at that. I mean, and I mean that's I think we all do, but sometimes we just just take that deep breath and say that's the way it is
013sometimes, you know. And uh that's the reason why I like to at least represent or be present so that if other do show up they will come to I mean you know people will come to where they feel comfortable. So I want a person I want people to feel I want family to feel comfortable when they come to Ashford City Schools you know especially for the first time or for the second time. I want that I want that. So feelings is always going to be my thing. It's going to be there. And sometimes, like I said, we will probably be the only ones. Um I mean, if you look at this this half of the school year right now of the board meetings, we are probably the only males of color of of that shows
014up here. It's like where is I mean do we have I mean we don't it's not in this area it's not in this location locally it's not there for us so if you want to isolate I mean if you want to talk about isolation I think we see it we see it here right now right so I mean who knows what will happen in four years from now when I'm not on the board it would be totally isolated who would know if Dr. Dixon decide to retire or leave, you know, it would be just I mean, how would people look at it? How would people have the discussion then? It probably won't even have them. What's the use of having them when you're just talking among each other, you know, when they're dealing with race,
015right? I might be off the wall on some of this, but um someone else can uh add to it. I'll take it, you know, take it from here. Oh, can't. Hey, I forgot about you, girl. [laughter] >> Hey, girl. Sorry. [laughter] [laughter] >> Okay. Sorry. [laughter] Um, I want to offer a very brief response to what you said, Jesse, but I also want to offer what I my responses to this image. But my brief response is that um I show up at leadership meetings at the US Attorney's Office, and I'm often the only woman um in the space. Not always, but often. and it's very different but I notice it and I sometimes feel isolated um on the um on this image um my first instinct was probably believing like gh you know this is
016of course right but my second very powerful feeling was a feeling of indictment um a feeling that this is what I grew up with this these are the assumptions I had um I can remember in law school a lot of talk about the black hats and the white hats and usually from prosecutors who thought they wore the white hat and it was always just this really racialized imagery. Um but mostly I just felt profound um guilt over the fact that I um you know just this was part of the world I was raised in. Not to question that necessarily though I have for a long time but still it's deep inside there are there is bias that will always exist simply because I grew up seeing something like this and not thinking much of it
017except that yeah we associate black with naughty and white with nice but it makes me want to vomit now. Um, so there's like this all of that and so then I move toward action and you know kind of what do we do? How do we respond to things like this? Um, it makes me never want to buy a Volkswagen. Um, and um, which I don't anywhere cuz I hate the local dealership. They cheated me, but that's fine. Um, [laughter] [gasps] anyway, um, yeah, that's it for me, I think. Thank you. >> [clears throat] >> I'm sitting and was sitting and feeling uh not dissimilar to what Amy was feeling like this um you know black being naughty, white being nice. Um the the culture I was steeped in for a long time or for and
018still am. Um [clears throat] and it made me think about a conversation I had with my dad when we lived in Winston Salem for a long time. Um I went to a a private school of mostly white folk and we moved to St. Louis, we live moved to St. Louis, Missouri, and we were talking about how that might be different from where we have been. And dad propo posed this question to me. He's like, let's say you're walking down a a city street in St. Louis one night and you hear footsteps behind you. [clears throat] Um, and if you turn around and the face is white, are you going to feel scared? If you turn around and the face is black, are you going to feel scared? Um, and I, [clears throat] my father and
019I still have never talked about what he was trying to get at with that question. And actually, it probably doesn't even matter what he was trying to get at at this point. It's how I perceived it and the feeling that came in over me at the time. And I wanted to say, of course, I'm not going to be scared. But culture had taught me that black was naughty. Black was to be feared. And so, um, thinking about moving into that center of the compass the best I can. Um and the opposite of [clears throat] feeling being um being I'm sorry thinking of opposite of thinking being feeling is um reminding myself of what that felt like when dad posed that question and how I immediately understood wait a minute the answer will be should it
020be and why um and so bringing in that feeling in so >> I will share that I I I wasn't sure and was grateful for the compass which has helped me to realize I went immediately to thinking and um potentially like in a way to protect myself from the other pieces of the compass and to think well you know is this an attempt to you know elevate the coolness of blackness and you know all these imaginings right and then grateful for the followup up to go back to the first condition and hold that I know that I don't know concept and being and and I appreciate right now this tier one like that these first two like holding the idea that the first two are sort of how you start what are you noticing and
021that it helped me to get out of the thinking like thinking my way to something less nefarious thinking my way to something that is less harmful, right? And just actually, well, hold on. It's not I don't need to think my way to anything. I can come to the center and be more just open to all kinds of interpretations. Um, which felt helpful. I'm just going to offer I don't actually really understand this what it says. What does it mean in terms of my own personal, local, and immediate racial experience? I don't quite get that. Um, I will share that like Rebecca, I will all day long live in thinking cuz it's safe and I can just be in my own head and not go anywhere with [laughter] that. Um, but I I don't think this
022is actually responsive. But what when I thought about this and thought about what I was trying to process was this life that I live right now and what does it say? I think about our student test scores. I mean, you're this is what local and immediate is to me right now. Now, I don't know if that's what we're supposed to talk about, but I've heard it said before um by black members of this school board and of central office that sometimes we look at our school data and really you cannot escape that it's because the kids are black and their scores are what they are and there's something wrong about that and it's they're anyway that's when I look at this you you just can't escape that they just picked black. But I don't that's
023what I that's where my head is on all that. >> Okay. >> So, >> can I add one more thing? >> Yeah. >> You know, instead of instead of these cards, if you watch professional football, >> you'll see the umpires wearing white hat and you'll see some wearing black hats. >> Next time you watch it, figure out which one is the >> head umpire. what color hat he's wearing compared to the other hats of the regular umpires. All right, check it out. [laughter] >> Okay. Um, thank you for that, Jesse. I have never thought to look at the colors of their hats. Um, so I handed you a paper that's upside down >> and it's three advertisements. I want you to take a second and look at the advertisements and then I've got two questions
024for you to think about. >> [clears throat] >> And then we'll just kind of talk through those questions about how does it feel to be characterized by these advertisements? Who benefits or who suffers from these racial representations? You know, one thing that I remember from when Jesse and I went, when David, our instructor, was talking about isolating race, a thing that stuck with me was he said that when you're looking at a challenging situation, when you're looking at any topic, right, there will be more than just racial challenges, right? That that will not be the only thing. It won't be clear and there will be um things that you it's not that you need to not think about them. They should be part of the conversation. And when I was looking at the Vogue cover
025with Jazelle and um LeBron James and thinking about I I could feel myself beginning to think about um standards of beauty and how I've compared myself for my whole life to like standards of beauty and like what that feels like. And then remembering what he was saying is all of that's welcome as long as you don't let race be the one that you say, well that's not important because what's really important is that women are held to this impossible standard of beauty. that it's kind of a way of thinking about what I think academically we'd call intersectionality and saying, "Yeah, yeah, you you can't isolate everything down to just one concept." But what you can't do is use these other problems to say, "These are the real problems." So, I'm not the the race thing
026isn't really at play anymore because this is really about masculine, you know, masculine standards versus feminine standards and no man, no woman can live up to these standards. Their whole issue like not their this actual issue of the magazine is it says it's about top models and star athletes talk about impossible standards. But the idea of courageous conversations is that we don't look for the out. We don't for look for the way to say, "Well, it's not really about race. Race isn't what's important for this. Let's leave that off the table." He said, "It always has to stay on the table that these depictions carry with them racial stereotypes. That's just what's there. Um, thank you for that, Rebecca, because um I don't know this the King Kong one in particular is very difficult for
027me to look at um for both reasons. Um, and I think all three of the ads are really hard for me to look at as a woman for not necessarily the standard of beauty, but for objectification and um harm, like physical harm. But that said, of course, the King Kong one immediately jumps out. Um, and I thought about all of the the blackface and the ads from even back in the 1800s and all the way through and then the LeBron James and the similarities between those two depictions. And of course in LeBron's case, I suppose it's supposed to be um sort of a fierce like positive athletic kind of prowess, but the similarity is painful. I just I'm I'm very much in my feelings when I look at these. It's actually really hard for me
028to get out of my feelings when I look at this. Well, with the King Kong, [clears throat] I think that's in the 1960s7s. Um, I don't think the young people ever seen that particular photo if they were born after the year 2000 unless they were looking at some old movies or old videos, covers. Uh so [clears throat] uh back off in the 1960s7s it was about race but uh King Kong was a big you know he was it was all about King Kong you know and I [laughter] I mean uh but when you look at it nowadays when you look at it at a in a different what they call different uh spectrum um it's King Kong uh LeBron 2000 Um, >> it's 2008 when that cover came out. >> 2008. What's with LeBron's? What
029our young people look at? They just look at LeBron's. And what uh uh young people look at as in women, they just look at the girl. I mean, I don't think majority of the youth right now will look at this as a I mean, it's normal right now. To them, it's normal. Uh, they don't know race like we know race. We know race because I was born in 19 I was around in 1970s, 1980s. Um, but a lot of our youth right now can understand the third picture about the American Eagle more than they could with the King Kong photos. I I mean they wouldn't even think probably our youth would even think twice about the King K photos, but they look at the American Eagle as as norm as Norm, you know. Um, but
030[sighs and gasps] I don't know. I just it's race been around. One thing about the American people, the American society, race is always going to be there. It's going to be a a play. They're going to try. Some people try to make sure that when pictures are being taken, they are taken. Thinking of focus on race, make sure that everybody >> Jesse, I'm going to bring you back to protocol. So, speak from your personal, local, and immediate. >> Oh. Oh. Oh. >> How you feel? >> Oh, no. No. How these are my feelings. Okay. Uh, >> okay. Don't use other people. >> I feel as though I feel as though when Okay. I lost my train of thought. Well, [laughter] but I feel as though it was I mean it's my feeling is it's the
031norm. [clears throat] >> How I feel is the norm. It's life itself. Yes. As I grow up in society is becoming the norm. Yes. forget about everybody else. [laughter] >> Well, and Jesse, when I when I hear that, I think about my three daughters looking at all three of these images at some point. Um, yes, my I wasn't alive when that King Kong poster probably came out. I'm familiar with it. Um, King Kong is a part of the Zeitgeist. Um, [clears throat] I don't watch a lot of professional basketball. I know LeBron James. My guess is that my daughters do, too. Jiselle as well just because of the because of the the culture the media culture that we live in. Um and [clears throat] the Sydney Sweeney image. And what I worry about is that
032the term you kept using this is the norm. And so when my children look at this and see first of all the depiction of a black man and um [clears throat] posing the same image of King Kong and in a kind of a dominating way, an arm around a white woman. um feeding into the to the old story that black men were um insatiable um were out to to get the white women. Um it was a narrative that fed the Klux Clan and and Jim Crow South for a long time. And then um a woman who fits kind of the perfect models of the cultural standards of beauty, a white woman. Um the pun on the word jeans. Cindy Sweeney has great jeans and what does that mean for my three daughters looking at that
033um but also looking at a white woman um and they are also white and saying well this is you know at least I have the skin color um and at least I have this straight hair um and um and so I sit in that in that real it's probably acting and also I don't know where it is on the compass but it really fills me with this like how do I how do I in my place as a white and [clears throat] um do my best to to make that not the norm, right? That this isn't the norm that we abide by. Like I would love it if our children and our from our kindergarteners all the way up to our high schoolers um as they move into the world, they're looking at this and
034they're saying, "Wait a minute. Something's not clicking right. This feels wrong to me." Even if they can't vocalize, sorry I'm saying they even because there are moments when I can't vocalize. Why? It gives me kind of a right. But even to say that and to have the courage to say this makes me feel I can't vocalize it and I know that it's telling me something. So what's that feeling saying to me? So that's kind of where I where I land. Um, I didn't think about it till you were talking, George, but the who benefits >> the person missing is the white man who I'm sure benefits financially from these ads, but also benefits because they are not objectified in any of these ways. And so, anyway, I I the white man's coming off looking pretty
035good. [laughter] Yeah. >> So, those were intended to kind of get a reaction. Um, so I'm thank you for taking a minute to process those and think through those. And I think you are all seeing the importance. While we have multiple aspects of diversity that we deal with all the time, we cannot minimize the impact that race has on policies and procedures and systems and and outcomes. Um, but it it is one factor that we can't say, well, it's because of this, this, and this, and it's really not because of race. We have to keep putting that up um as a as an as isolating. Um, and just thinking through if we, you know, by unpacking race, it really helps us make intentional decisions. And if we're, if you hear people say something like, "Well,
036I don't see color. I don't care if you're blue, black, green." That's a comment we hear a lot. That then also really doesn't give the value to the diversity of our um, community members and colleagues of color and our students of color. we're just saying that doesn't matter. You're you're we're minimizing that experience and the and the culture of the of our other colleagues. So that's why it is important to recognize the culture to recognize how race does impact as well as all those other things. Um but just always saying we can't minimize the impact of race. We can't say it doesn't matter because of all these other factors. It's saying, "Okay, let's look at all of these and making sure we hold that one." Um, about how race impacts. >> I do have a
037question. What group of our society are we looking at to embrace? Are we looking at the young people? Are we looking at the older ones as we are? Or are we looking at is this for deep pictures? The pictures are they for the for our generation or or you could have if you would have looked at some of the older some of the younger generation. >> Mhm. >> Right. If the younger generation was in here, you wouldn't have used these pictures right here. >> I probably would have particularly because the Sydney Sweeney one came out this summer. >> But the younger generation when you use u I'm going to help me out. Who's that basketball the white female basketball player that came out? >> Caitlyn Clark. If you would have used Caitlyn Clark and probably
038uh let's well let's use both females. Caitlyn Clark and who's the Angel Reese. If you would have used those two that would have been modern day Dave for the youth people young people look at if they would have seen that right there. If I would have seen that right there, that's more of a norm >> as we looking at it right now than us looking at these photos here because that is how the world is being seen today more or less. Well, and Jesse, I think that's such an astute thing to bring up because when Caitlyn Clark was playing in those in the tournament and against Angel Reese and the the stories we were hearing about their conflict and how to perceive each of those women based on what looked like similar behaviors, there was
039a lot of difference in how people came to characterize those two women >> like behaving in the same way right in front of our eyes. So, you're right, the examples and to to the point that here's an old one, here's a newer one, and it's showing that these images seem to be I feel when you bring that up, it's like it feels to me like a reminder that these images keep coming back. These like depictions like those two women in particular were not treated the same. >> No. Even though they behave the same and as >> that depiction in the media. >> Yeah. Very different. >> Very different. >> Sorry. I very rarely talk about race because I have my own feelings and very deep feelings about it. But um it's the same way that
040I have perceived the images of Taylor Swift and Simone Biles. They're both very highly decorated individuals, but you do not see that at a football game because Simone Biles is also married to an an NFL player. You never know when she's at a game. You never know when she's on the field. You never know when she shows up. But she's, in my opinion, way more decorated than Taylor Swift. But you know every game she's at. You know, every game, you know, every move Taylor Heather Swift makes, but not Simone Biles. And why do we accept that? Why do I accept that? Like >> society. >> There you go. >> Thank you, April. Any closing comments? >> I I was just thinking about um it was quite a a few of us were at the um
041woman up [clears throat] uh awards last week. last week. >> Mhm. No, two weeks ago. >> Two weeks ago. Um present, you know, presented by the Chamber of Commerce and um and [clears throat] on a day when the on a morning when the focus is on um women and their contributions to their communities, I couldn't help but notice how many of the um nominees and how many people in the audience were white. And um it was like there's a moment to isolate race and and just ask why why were so many nominees white. Um so just and it's so as I'm as I'm looking at these things and you're presenting these ideas to us, I'm I'm doing my best to not only keep them here in the boardroom when we're discussing policy and procedure, but
042also moving out into the broader community. Are there other places where we can be practicing isolating race? Exactly. Okay. Um, unless there's anything else, um, I want to we'll move on to the next agenda item, which is reform policy 3000. So, just keeping in mind as we talk through these things and the discussions about keeping things personal, local, and immediate. How are we isolating race and making sure we consider that as we review policy? That's the most powerful thing a board can do is write policy. Um, so as we think about that, how are we using that new perspective or that learning to create policy language that will create equitable outcomes for our students and staff? Um, so I wanted to update the board on um and then I have a a tool that's in
043your folder. Um, so in your folders also I gave you a print out of the feedback um from the educator advisory council and what I had the educator advisory council do is review the current policy 3000 that the board reviewed a while ago and asked them what we should keep in that and what they liked. And then also asked them what they want to see in an updated policy. So there were several things that they said were pretty good in the old policy. Um they like several comments about freedom for schools to do innovative things at the school level. Um they also really appreciated the community playing a role in education. One that I didn't expect them to really hone in on but they did and um probably unanimously um that students should take responsibility
044and accepting for and accepting the consequences for their own actions and academics. Um they also really appreciated the line in there about respecting and appreciating cultural and ideological differences. Um and then the next two are more about um kind of our portrait of a scholar and linked to that which is the capacity to examine and solve problems. Um having the necessary skills to move on to a post-secary um choice [snorts] and then developing those skills to be um proactive team members. Um, some things they would like to see in a new updated policy is they were they they love this idea of on time things being turned in on time in a timely manner. Um, and as we move through the conditions, we'll process what does that really mean? Um, they liked uh they would
045like language to be more about caregivers instead of always identifying parents. um they would like more language about students being active participants or productive participants in a democracy. Um they wanted the board to consider adding growth language in addition to achievement. Um they think that the goal um should be added in there about our students contributing to a better world. Um making sure we use assetbased language. They wanted to elevate descriptors that you know really bring the policy to life like it's alive, you have joy, it's worldclass. So things that really will capture um some really high level um and exciting thinking. Um they also want to make sure we include social emotional qualities. Um again working as a team um they want to keep that appreciation and um respect for differences. They did not
046like that word sufficient and believe we should really make sure we're moving that. Their example was um exemplary. Um want to make sure that we include not just academics but our appreciation for the arts, STEM, being a global citizen and that Asheville six are those six strategies that our foundation has helped us with. um they wanted to expand it not just collegebound but make sure that we're also appreciating and highlighting being um ready to go in a technical or um a career or community college. Um they believe we should be focusing on empathy and that how that makes someone successful. Technology I didn't pick up on that technology was missing out of the old one but I think that's key. Um also touching on physical um well-being or an understanding of physical health. Um, and
047then they touched on, you know, classroom instruction should foster these things. Um, so I thought they had some really good feedback. So the next process is is I'm going to draft a updated language for the policy based on this feedback. I'll bring that to the January work session for the board. Um, and then if we can come up with some, if that's okay, then I'll send that out for input in the wider community before we do a second read. Um so then second read would be in February with some input from our community and from a greater number of staff out there. Um and then we'll move forward from there. So quick update on that. Any questions about this or followup? Okay. Um so as we move into the next um agenda item which are
048policies that are up for first read um and these were two that I brought to the board in November um and that I want to also help the board frame the board's thinking of these. There's a handout in your folder. Um, as we think about creating systems that are going to generate equitable outcomes for students, there's um an emerging thought about this idea called targeted universalism. And it's a thought process and I can share more um kind of resources on this but it's coming out to basically say it you really need to focus on this assetbased and having a strong commitment of goals that are raise the bar for everyone instead of just saying hey we're focused on a deficit when you write policies or or set goals that are say hey these students are
049deficit in this and we need to address that deficit it really doesn't set your community up in the right way or their minds up in a right way to really come in and and everyone to approach that solving that problem. So, one of the tools that they have is kind of five steps to help evaluate decisions that you're making. [clears throat] So, establishing a universal goal that's broadly shared on a problem or aspiration. So, if we're thinking about the virtual comment, we I'm assuming the goal there is the board wants equitable access for every single person to feel like they have an opportunity to provide input to the board. I'm guessing that would be the goal of that policy. Yes. So, then we have to think about our general population and the performance. So then
050thinking okay have we seen times where members of our public haven't been felt like they didn't have an opportunity to share their thoughts with the board whether publicly in a board meeting or you know a way to communicate the board and share their comments or their input. Um and then after that then you would identify well are there groups that are performing differently based on this goal and what we want to accomplish. So is there one particular type of or group of people in our community that aren't like indiv you feel like that group really individually isn't having access to this public input or sharing comments and feedback with the board and are there certain groups that have abundance of access more access than other people. Um and then understanding what are the structures that
051would support or impede those groups that may have too much or not enough or not be able to get that access. And then step five is really thinking okay what are the steps we need to put in place so that we can make sure that every group has that access in an equitable way um and have the resources. And then the saying always goes high tide raises all ships. And that's kind of this idea that it's not one or the other. both and it's a total group success when we see the group getting better as a whole and setting those goals. So all you would say like everyone or each so that you make sure that when you're looking at your data to evaluate the success okay we are getting this or we're not and
052we're not going to rest. We're not going to just like sit back and wait for something to happen until we see that we've got what we set up as our goal being achieved. So something to kind of think through. So that first policy about public participation um is the removal of the virtual comment. Um so any board feedback on that or feeling that we can move that on to second read. And I also just kind of my personal input too is um that that was put in for COVID. I don't know that I've seen a different type of person coming before or after during CO to give comment um at a board meeting. my last district and in this district. Um, and that I think the other big one for me is AI really having
053an impact on what people might present during public comment. So, discussion from the board on moving that one forward without the comments about virtual. Um, I've I support it. I think that's great. Um, but this targeted universalism as it applies to receiving comment from the public and as I move through these steps makes me really think about other things we need to do. Um and um the how how how poorly we do in um in soliciting comments from those who are not the folks we hear from typically. And I know we've talked about that before, but if I isolate that specific objective, the objective that this whole policy is supposed to be about, I want to do a lot more than remove virtual comment. >> Exactly. Yep. Understood. Yeah, I totally agree. >> Ditto. >>
054[laughter] >> Um, what I'm what I'm hearing is the option for virtual comment isn't addressing the bigger problem, which the bigger problem is gathering input from a wide range of our community stakeholders, particularly those who are most impacted um by what we offer in our educational system and might be very much the best people to give the board input on what we're doing as a school system. >> Yeah. I mean, I think I feel like to a certain extent we're somewhat dancing around it. Majority of folks who come to give public comment are white. Um, and [clears throat] um, so when we're when you're talking about access, um, what are we as a district doing to better welcome a diverse range of comments? What I'm hearing is that the green mine is green language that
055would be struck. I'm feeling there's consensus that it doesn't add value and there's some risk. And so I I'm I'm hearing that it would be appropriate to go to second read um and will be a vote on it at that time. What I'm also hearing, and Maggie, I don't even pretend to know how you um as you work on the goals for the district and prioritize your reform policies, how public participation at board meetings. On the one hand, it doesn't seem to me to be real high. Yet, at the heart, it's how do we hear from people to make sure they're informing our work. And so I sort of I'm getting that we've would leave this in Maggie's hands to I mean what do you all want to do with what we talked about this
056tonight? I mean I think that moving this to second read is great and I think it illuminates um some other issues and I'd love for and I do think the board has a role in those because it's policy um potentially or maybe it's but I think it's policy because it's where we hold meetings and how we hold meetings, right? Um, and so I know there's been an effort in the past to hold meetings in some of the public housing developments, um, things like that, but I would love for us to as a board think about how we can do a better job as we move through the targeted universalism to um to accomplish the invitation and solicitation of input from a broader range. So, I mean, I think for the moment this is great, but
057when you say um Sarah about sort of just leave this in Maggie's hands, I think that's okay for the first proposal, but I also think at some point we have a role in because we are the board who wants to hear the comments. It's one of those areas that's maybe more specific to our work than the administration of the schools, if that makes sense. >> It absolutely makes sense. I think um I'm I am stuck in thinking about this. Would you see the board on its own coming up with revisions to policy that we bring forward or I was just to be clear I was saying Maggie would do that and bring it back to us. But if you're I guess that's what I'm trying to get. >> Yeah. No, I I'm happy for that.
058I think I'm more just saying, "Hey, guess what? As we look at this, we see some massive holes. So, taking out virtual comment is great. Who does it as an initial matter? I I have no strong preference on that. It may be something that when we have our board retreat in March, we want to really sort of think about, okay, as we look up to the 2627, is that right? Yeah. 2627 school year, how could we do board meetings differently? How could we solicit comments to us for the folks that aren't going to email us, aren't going to show up in person, haven't been showing up in virtual? >> And I So I'll add too that some of what I was taking away from what you shared, Maggie, is, you know, public participation at board
059meetings 2310, we we have to have it. It is it's the law. We can't not allow for public comment. And I think where I sit is public comment. The people who come, I welcome it. I'm happy to hear it. And that all this policy needs to do is that that's what this policy is. I look forward to us doing continuing the work of naming our core values which is where I see that we'll be able to uplift things like sure we'll abide by the policies and I'm in favor of not having virtual public comment anymore for all the reasons you said and sort of I see the target universalism as saying we don't need policies we don't need to get in the weeds of policies more than is what actually helps us and that if
060what this policy makes us realize is sure people can participate but then how will we do our work in other ways when we know our core values when we know when we name them and they're explicit and we're looking for the most possible participation whether taking the board meeting somewhere else or just creatively thinking about how to meet people where they are as opposed to trying to get them to do things that have been tried over over and over. But that to me, and I think I don't think I'm missing it, but that sits outside of this, >> right? >> But it's more work. >> Exactly. >> Okay. Yeah. I'm in favor of what's here, moving it forward, going to second read. Public comment is the law. We welcome it and we will be proactive
061about finding other ways to ensure that their voices were uplifting. Yeah. I mean, I I hear that and appreciate it and I think that there could still be a role in for the board to modify the policy to ensure that not only this board, but future boards take steps to um to make sure that we are doing a lot more to try to receive input. I I don't necessarily think it can't be in policy. In fact, I think it's not a bad idea to put that kind of commitment in policy, which could be in this one, could be in a different one. Um, other comment. Okay. Um and the next policy is one to put in place to help um support staff um if we have to close for emergency disasters. Um not inclement this
062has nothing to do with inclement weather days. This is well let's say we have like a landslide and one of our schools gets severely damaged. How would we respond to that? Calling employees um into work something other some other devastating event happens. you know how would our what would our response be for that um so this is also for second read meet confer collaborate also reviewed um and provided I didn't I don't I didn't get any feedback on it but they did review it >> when you say they reviewed it who reviewed >> the meet confer collaborate team which is the seven members of ACIE and seven administrators and Kim did they didn't give any feedback. >> There was I mean there was discussion they looked at it at the >> but there weren't any
063recommended changes? >> Not to my knowledge. >> Thank you for doing it. I mean I know we asked for this that was a really difficult aspect of recovery to then realize we had this missing hole. And so it's I'm glad that we have clarity on how to handle these situations. I'm slowly sitting here looking at targeted universalism and comparing it with this policy and I'm a little slow. Um, but other board members comments this would move on to second read if I'm seeing nodding heads. Okay. Thank you, Maggie, and thank you to the team that helped draft this. >> You're welcome. All right. I'm just taking over the agenda here. Keep uh next up on the agenda is >> Can I can I just interrupt here for the board to get perspective on this next
064item? Um you may recall that we've talked at the very beginning um at our board retreat that there were three things we were working to develop this year. One was a mission statement, one was a vision statement, and one was core values. And at our retreat in September, the board took the first stab at the mission statement that's been sent out. Maggie's going to report back. I am fairly certain I said this out loud at a prior meeting, but for the vision statement working with the consultant we used in September. Um Maggie had a suggestion that is that start that one with the students and come back like this was the board down and the next time we'll do the students up and then just so everybody knows we will talk about core values as
065a board in our March retreat. And the only other thing I wanted to add because I know we've talked about the um I'm going to use my word, the usefulness of a mission statement and a vision statement and core values and why are we doing this and is this important work? And I will share that when I was at the um state board conference, some of the most powerful people that I saw were superintendent who had a vision for their district. And it was super interesting. I really was like, "Oh, that's what a vision statement does." Um, so I just offer to you that that that's what Maggie is trying to help us do. So she has a vision, we have a vision and a mission and core. Anyway, I'll now turn it back to
066Maggie. I just wanted to remind the board of that context. Um, okay. So, we sent the survey out. It had the opportunity for respondents to um rate uh the four draft statements that the board came up with. I assigned the choices each points. Um so you can see the total points. Um there were 125 respondents. Um in the survey um most were parents. I I thought I had put a capture of that of it in there, but um I can share that with you. Um and then the end is the last question on the survey was um if you don't feel like these captured it, you know, draft your own. So some people drafted some options for the board. Um and some gave you some feedback. So um just for a little bit of review,
067um that second one really came in as the top I think as the clear winner. Um and some options um that were provided I al also thought were nice. Um and there was some meaningful feedback. um which just to me points to I like the language in the second one, but it's it's very lengthy for a mission statement. Um so just feedback from the board on what you would like me to do next. I think one of the observations that I'll make is that the reason it's lengthy is because as we imagine education or let me say this as we appreciate that schools have to do a hell of a lot more than simply provide education with excellence or whatever our current right that's why it gets lengthy because we're trying to um to articulate
068how we're going to serve students in a much broader way. And we want to make sure we're communicating that that um that that things like joy and safe spaces and multiple avenues of of what we might that success is whatever any individual wants to achieve or wants believes is success. Like that's what leads to this longer one. And I I would I agree that it's probably too long. And yet as I look at what I want to take out of it, that becomes a real challenge because I think it has some language in it that is really lovely in terms of like that what we aspire to um what we do, what what is our mission, but I'm all about if we can make it more concise, great. Um so I'm I'm not offering any
069help except to acknowledge why it has gotten long and >> is your mission statement. If the board is okay with length, I mean, doesn't bother me. >> I think we could use >> I think we can do some work on it. I need more time to word smith it and think about it. I can't do that in a public meeting like right this second. But yeah, I think I would say too that I think it's too long to to be I'm trying to anchor back to our facilitated session about what is a mission statement, what is a vision statement and what are core values. And I I would propose that we we see that the people who took the time to read these and give us feedback, they are also drawn to like they like
070all these things too. And I wonder if when we hear ideas of what the vision is and when we get into the core values, we may actually find that it's easier to then refine the mission statement um and and give ourselves permission to do that. I'd like us to have a shorter one. I'd like us to have one that is a little easier to just let it wash over. and like parents who are trying to learn about Asheville City Schools and they're going to our website to try to be like what what is this place about that they find something a little more pissy but um I think that the steps we're taking now will actually reveal it to us. So I would say this is where we're starting this is people are saying yeah
071we like these things too and let's let's work it out while we're also getting the vision and the core values. Does that seem reasonable? >> Yeah. >> Okay. I do understand what you're talking about, [clears throat] Rebecca, but this mission statement, a young person can read this mission statement. A senior or a freshman can read this mission statement and understand each and every word that is in I mean that's inside of it. I mean, we foster communities of trust, joy, and inquire. Those words right there, you ain't going to see them in a lot of missing statements at all. And when a kid or when a student or when parents read that for the first time, you know, we build meaningful relationship, we develop recreate confident learners able. I mean, it's everything that we wish
072that we can put pour inside of a student. I mean, I have nothing against it. You know, it's it says all the right things, but it say correct words. There's no big words in it that a kid can't read it, you know. I mean, it's uh and it's meaningful, you know. I mean, it it tells you what we are all about as an Astro City School. I mean, the first part of it makes the big difference. We commit to equity. Then after that, it just telling why we commit to equity because this is who we are. This is City School. We trying to bring joy and everything else inside of individuals inside of parents inside of families and everything else. So, and I think that's the reason why we had so many voters with that
073because of the way it sounds and the way that it's read and the way it's put together, you know. I mean, I read the rest of them, you know. It's nothing like this one. All right. It gives you joy. All right. I mean, that's my point on it. Thank you, Jesse. I like everything you said. What I like that Rebecca is saying, and I'm looking at other board members to see if they like this, is we keep this for now. >> Yes, >> we let the students keep working on their first draft of a vision statement. And I'm just making this up, but it might be that they come up with something about thinking critically, and that ends up in the vision statement, and we decide that could come out of the mission statement, right?
074like we wait and see what they say. We wait and see what our core values end up being and then if we feel it appropriate to refine this because it's said someplace else. We could do that. That's does that feel like a good like leave this this way for now? >> But we got the core values that we are going to talk about later, right? >> Those what you just mentioned for a student can be in our core values. >> You know, I mean there I mean they can be there. I mean, this >> I I think what I was just I what I'm trying to get to is I'm not hearing anybody say they hate the second one or have feel strongly that they want to take anything out at this time yet. >>
075I think I'm hearing we all acknowledge it's a little long for >> actually I'd like to >> Sorry guys, I don't know how to how to [laughter] >> raise your hand. Yes, go ahead the appropriate time. Um, but I I do have a comment that I'd like to share. I don't want to jump in front of you, George. >> Please go Liza. >> Eliza. Yeah. >> Um, I just wanted to offer that um I felt like number the the additions that were added. Um, number four, number nine, and 11 stuck out to me as really hitting on the things that we keep coming back to as a board. um and just doing it a little bit more concisely [snorts] and um also that looking at the the second from the top among our submissions for
076consideration. [snorts] Um that I I I believe that we can preserve the essence of that and also pair it down into like maybe two sentences rather than a series of semicolons. Um but I just I I wanted to elevate 49 and 11 down below. um as would strike me as as should be considered for contenders. >> Thank you, Liza. >> Thank you. And sorry to cut you off, George. >> Oh, all good, Leslie. No worries. Um, I was actually just going to uh um recognizing this might not be a popular opinion, I think we commit to equity is hollow and passionless [clears throat] because I I feel like it's just a word at this point. What does it mean to commit to equity if we're just putting it out there and that's the first thing
077that people say? or we just going to stop there and say, "Oh, we're we're doing equity." Like it it just feels um I'd rather the writer in me says show don't tell. And this is just telling we commit equity as opposed to show. And the words that come afterward to me are showing. So if we're looking to consolidate the language, I don't know why we need to say we commit to equity. It needs to be in the way we operate in our mission statement. Maggie, what do you need? You We've given you lots of input. Is this What would you like from us? >> Um I I think Liza brought up >> I think Liza brought up a good point. Um cuz number 11 as well kind of says what it says in number in
078the second one in a little bit of a more of a concise way I thought. Um but I also hear what George is saying about you know equity you know is that you know what are we doing you know when does the rubber actually meet the road? you can commit to equity all day long, but I think now it's become a term that is just it's like the term of it's just it's said so often it people just don't even think about it anymore. I will say as we bring it up though and I don't think we should find a solution tonight. We should just hold this and push forward with it as as these conversations keep happening. But um how if we let go of it, how are we isolating race in the space
079of you know all these it's almost like the inverse when we were talking earlier about there can be all these reasons that people are struggling and then you can let all those reasons cause you to say it's not racism let that one go it's these other things and then this place of all this uplift and I love these words we foster communities of trust joy inquiry I love that. Um, and then but is are we are we like hiding the thing and are we needing to hide the thing right now? I mean like I I feel like we need to call the thing the thing. There are words that get people in trouble right now. >> To what degree are we trying to do that too? Like if equity has become a hollow term, what
080do you do instead? >> I would say that saying we commit to equity does not isolate race because we you can use equity for lots of things. If we said we commit to racial equity, that would be a different story. But I don't know if this board is prepared to do that. I don't know if this right. And so, um, just saying equity to me doesn't isolate race. In fact, I think it hides race, um, behind a word that just gets overused and becomes performance. And if that's what we're here for is just to perform, then leave it in. Um, but I don't think that's what we're here. >> Yeah. I I tend to >> But I I'm sorry. I don't mean to interrupt you. Go ahead. And Rebecca, I think, you know, we don't
081have to come to a decision tonight. I just I wanted to voice it out into the room. So, >> I I appreciate that. I have Rebecca's concern as well about sort of well, if it's ab maybe it speaks volumes through its absence, but at the same time, I do think that it's become a word that um people say and don't activate. And and the other words do create. If we created all of that, we'd have a hell of a better chance of achieving racial equity than if we, you know, those are ways of doing it. But the fact that we don't say it may be a problem. I do want to say very, at least from my perspective, number 11 is not more concise. And I also >> more concise. >> I also actually like
082the semicolons, but as opposed to two separate sentences, because I think the it's very active. we we commit whether we keep that phrase or not. We foster, we build, we develop. Um I like that rhythm. And so if we although it might be a little bit long and I'm not sure if it is because it kind of depends on, you know, do we want a motto that is four words that can go on everything? Um or do we want a statement that we try to use to encompass everything that we do? But even if it is too too long, we can talk about that later and I don't mind waiting for the vision statement process and core values to to um unfold. But I I like the active we do these things. I like the
083active verbs and I like the semicolons. [laughter] And nobody should be surprised to hear me say I like a semicolon. So >> can I add one more? Can I add one more thing? M >> you know when we talk about equity you you know [clears throat] all of this here when we do our values we can put all of this our values could be easier when we have words like equity and false I mean because our values can come from the words here all right when we write our values when we write our values we can describe what we mean when we talk about equity and everything else. Once again, I understand what you said. I like what you said, but once again, if we don't include it in everything that we do, once again,
084we're going to lose it. And once we lose it over a period of time when all of this here it's only one color because people not going to you know be around it's going to be nothing but you know whiteness here it's not going to be no equity being mentioned at all right so I feel that we need to keep it we comm and and I like when you say we commit to equity we commit to trust all of that is we now if you want to ask a question who is we right is we us and everyone else that's in Astro City School. So if that's the case when we talk about we we can do our values compared to what we and who we are right and that's where the values come from
085right I mean that's the way I see it I mean >> so I this is so if this is kind of the resonating statement I think keeping a pin in this is kind of our tentatively approved it gives enough for the next steps of the action planning strategic piece to keep moving forward. Um, and then we can keep we can revisit this and say, hey, how are we feeling about this after the next steps and the core values and the vision process. >> Okay. Thanks, Maggie. Okay. >> All right. What's next? Okay. Can Can you guys hear me? Can Can you hear me? >> Liza, can you hear me, >> Liza? >> I hear you. >> Okay, great. Just checking. Okay, we need to talk about the proposal that you all got from Maggie this
086morning about a funding formula from the county commissioners. But before you look at that, like just don't worry about it. Don't look at it. I wanted to take a couple minutes for an introduction to provide perspective because there's so much about what we as a board do with the budget and this policy gets a little it's not a policy. It's a funding formula. There's a lot in it and I don't want us to get into the weeds until we first did the big picture and I was gonna do a trivia game and Allan told me it was not fun. [laughter] So, you get all we're going to get to play, but um deter it. So, we're going to start with a quiz for the board members. Okay? And then here's what I I just want
087to set the stage for the next I don't know 15 minutes or so. Um there's a quiz to help focus us. Then there's going to be a lot of talking by me and Maggie and Rebecca and a little bit by Anna to give perspective. You're just going to take notes. If you have a question, just hang on and we're going to get there. We'll walk through at that point we'll walk through the uh actual proposal which is still the draft just so you know and then I actually will stop talking and it'll be a time for you all to say what concerns you what do you like what do you not like and for us to have a discussion the way this proposal is set up is as an inter potentially an interlocal agreement and
088Anna's going to talk to us about what that means but my version of that means it will We the way our schools are funded by the county if this board and the Bunkham County School Board and the county commissioners all agree to it and sign off on it. That's the way the proposal is set up. And nobody on this board has done one of these before unless you have and I didn't know it, George. So part of this process is we're going to talk about it. There'll be public comment next week. I hope folks are listening and have questions and show up and tell us what they're concerned about or like about it. We're going to talk about it in January and there'll be more public comment in January. I don't know the timing yet
089partly because I don't we're the first board that meets and Bunkome County will the school board will meet later this week I think but I don't know what their pacing will be. I think the county hopes that by January or February this or some close version of this is approved. I think if you ask the county commissioners that's their pacing. But we're just going to see what happens. But what I want to speak into this room is that there'll be time tonight for discussion questions so that we can gather more information and then we'll just keep taking it from there and hearing about it. Does that does that make sense big picture board members? >> Yes. >> Okay. Here's my quiz. I'm so excited. >> Can Can you share with us which where the the
090link was >> in Maggie's email? I'm going to say this afternoon and it was the second one she sent, Liza. There were four links and it was the last one. >> Okay. Thank you, >> Liza. The the subject is one one email with attachments for tonight. >> Got it. Thank you. >> Okay. This is any board member can answer. What are the sources of funding that come into our budget? >> State, >> federal, >> local. >> Oh, come on. Really? [laughter] >> County. Yes. Thank >> some sales tax. sales tax >> property tax >> our understand yeah >> tax you okay grant money. >> Grants. >> Oh, yeah. There we go. >> Liza, we're just identifying federal, state, county, tax money, and grants. Some of these have >> some of these have restrictions. What are
091some restrictions on state money? They're only Am I supposed to talk? They're only uh funding for the positions that they allocate, >> right? Some state money is just for positions. What's think creatively what other ways do we get money from the state? >> Okay, think Jim Cosby and baseball lights. >> The lottery money. And the lottery money has to be used for very specific reasons. Um what are some restrictions on federal money? certain people >> very restricted people very restricted they're very restricted they're basically specific to programs >> special education title one >> um >> CTE I think is >> anybody nutrition don't we get nutrition fund by federal okay and it's a big it's a big damn deal you can't use the nutrition money for other reasons right so we have to be super
092careful um county money there I'm going to break this up to two category categories. One of it is sort of general operations, which is actually the only thing we're going to talk more about tonight, so just skip that one. Um, but how else do we get money from the county? >> Capital Commission also pretty restrictive. um the sales tax local what the auditors call local option is we get a piece because we're a taxing authority because we have a supplemental property tax just like the town of Woodin and Black Mountain and other towns we get a bite of an apple of certain sales tax revenue so that comes to us. Um, supplemental property tax is the people that live in our district pay an extra >> 11 cents. Sorry, >> is this the 11 cents?
093>> The 11 cents. That's the 11 cents. And then we have grants, which Melissa could tell us in great detail. They always have restrictions, right? They don't just come into our coffers to use how we want. So, this is why our education budget is so freaking confusing. And there's all those columns. And God bless Heidi and her people for understanding. And we all know this and I'm probably going to say it wrong and Heidi's not here to correct me, but like when the county gives us money for operations, we have to share it with charter schools. I'm Anybody correct me if I'm wrong. I'm pretty sure the supplemental property tax we get, we don't have to share. >> Oh, we do share with peak. Okay. Right. Grant money we don't share. >> It depends. Um,
094sales. >> Okay. Federal money. We don't have to share with charters, do we? Not usually. Um, state dollars. Okay, you guys get the point, right? It's complicated. None. Is this the eraser? [laughter] I've never seen one like this before. None of these is relevant. Okay, I need you to [laughter] get the point there. Um, the county gives us money for what they call operational funding. So, do not think about any other source of funding. This is just the one source that we get from them. Thank [laughter] you. And hold on, I got a little discombobulated here. Um, when the county, this is still the quiz, when the county gives us money operationally, how does anybody remember roughly the proportion that we share with Bunkham County? Like if they allocated us a million dollars, how much
095of that does Asheville City Schools get versus the county? >> 17%. >> Rough 15. >> 15. Okay. >> And it changes every year because it's based on >> ADM. Yeah. Right. And sometimes, maybe all the time, it's also based on charters because when the county gives us money and we I think this is right. Heidi's not here tonight as you all can tell, so she's just would die to hear me do this. But when we get our 15%, we then have to share that with kids in our district to go to charters, right? So, it's it's all constantly changing. Um, we are only talking about operational funding. That was the point of that. Okay. A little bit of history about how the county commissioners have allocated money to us in the past. They create their
096own budget. They have lots of things they're responsible for. Libraries and fire departments and schools and all that. And they, you know, they passed their budget July 1. They're probably working on the next year's budget by August, right? They're already underway. They look prospectively. They're trying to guess how much money they're going to bring in with taxes and other things. And they, and there's nothing wrong with this, this is just a flat statement. They treat us as one line of business. They got libraries, they got police, they got the sheriff, they got us, right? And they have told us very clearly that we are their most expensive line of business. That we get most, you know, if you if you divvy up what they spend money on apart from their own salaries, that we are
097a big part of it. they control the tax rate. So they decide how big, you know, if they want to bring in more money or not. Um, and what we have typically experienced when we go in April to watch Maggie present is we go and ask for what we need and we show up and say we need a certain number and they look at us and they say, "Wow, we didn't see that number coming." Like it's a surprise. Um, and part of that is because they've been building their budget all year and then it gets to April and here we show up and there's all this back and forth about what do we need and ultimately they create their own budget and as you would expect them to be they're pretty conservative, right? Are they
098going to assume massive growth? No. Are they going to, you know, they're going to budget conservatively, which means assume they have less revenue than they probably will and give, you know, that's how they're going to approach it. And that's how that's the world that we've lived in for the past couple years. Um, what has happened in the past is they come up with a number, they do the 1585 split, they divide our 15% by 12, and every month Heidi gets a check. It's probably not a check, but she gets that amount. And the amount was set when the county commissioners voted in June. And then Heidi knows what number to use and she plugs it in. So, what I wanted you to hear me say is I it is not that we're at the mercy
099of the county commissioners because they've been very generous to us, but they're doing their thing, right? And we go and we ask for a number. So, back to the quiz. What has been problematic about that from our perspective? Everybody here? >> We never get enough. >> Yeah. I mean, the biggest problematic part of it is that we can't levy our own taxes, >> right? And it becomes a real battle between parents and staff who want more on the one side and us, but we're kind of caught in the middle because we're also trying not to alienate the people who provide our funding. I don't know if this is an answer to your question, but I feel like we're in the middle every time. And they feel like they're in the middle because they are trying
100to figure out how to fund the sheriff's department and the fire departments and us. and they've got parents and staff and sometimes us standing up and maybe not literally yelling, but that's how it feels to them as they've expressed it to us. It's a painful process I think really for all of us. Just going to say it cuz we never get enough and they feel like we're pushing them to give more than they can >> and we can't budget. We cannot budget how many staff members we can have, how many everything else. We cannot budget from one point to the other because we don't know how much we actually getting. >> Right. Right. Nobody has loved it this system. So, as you [clears throat] know, starting in July, there were supposed to be quarterly meetings.
101They ended up being more often than that with the county manager, Aval Pender, the chair of the county commissioners, Amanda Edwards, and the vice chair, Martin Moore. Then from our district, myself, Rebecca, and Maggie, and from Bunkham County Schools, Rob Elliot, Amy Churchill, and Rob Jackson. And the idea was to start talking about how we could do this differently. So, I'm I got a little ahead of myself because I wanted actually to put a couple more numbers on the chart for you. I talked with Heidi this morning. She was very nice to talk to me when she's on vacation. And the problem is these numbers are not always apples to apples. So, I just need y'all to live with it. And if you want to take a deeper dive to get a better understanding, Heidi
102is happy to do that with you. But fiscal year ending 2025 was the school year that started August of 2024 and it took us through June of 2025. The year is done. That's the year we got the audit report for last month, right? The auditor. So, because we're always working like at the end looking back saying, "What do we get from the county and the feds and everybody else?" So, we have actual numbers for the year that ended 6 months ago. Okay, that was the year that included a hurricane, right? So, if we were in June of 2024, prehurricane, county was doing the budget the way they always do it, it was something like 122 million that they allocated to education, right? That that was roughly the number. Then came January of 2025. We were
103all there. What happened? >> They took back 4.8 was the number. Okay. And the num the math isn't always going to be perfect, but it took us to about 117 million. And if you look at the actual audited statements, our share of that operational money that our 15% what we got was 17,245. So we would have gotten more obviously before they took that back, but what it actually felt like was we had about 117 million and we saw 17 million in our budget. This is the year we're in right now. This is this school year. And so when you think back to this past April and May and the teachers came and I don't even remember the number we asked for. We kept saying we're asking for what we need and it was a big
104number. They actually gave about 117 million. And and just know them. You're just going to have to live with the numbers not being exactly right. They actually only allocated about 112 and then they added on a little bit more than four from article 39. Right? So they were able to come up with that amount. They reallocated the article 39 money so that it was 117. And we don't have audited numbers cuz the year's not done, but Heidi told me this morning we're probably right at 17 um million is our share. A little bit less actually from what the prior year was. So, so far so good. Everybody understands? So, here is next year. This is the year they're already budgeting for. This is the year that if we continued in the old ways in April,
105Maggie would show up and do a PowerPoint presentation at the county commissioners and ask for what we needed and all the things that we're used to. And so this is what they're saying. Could we try something different? Okay. So, so far so good everybody where we are with this. Um I am going to go ahead and tell you one thing about the proposal and then I'm going to stop talking and let Maggie walk you through the proposal and then I still have more to say. Don't you worry. Um, but you're going to hear some percentages and let me let me just go ahead and put this out there. We had a meeting in July. We agreed we wanted to do the budget differently. There was a meeting in September where the county showed up and
106they had a list of districts from across the state. Here's what they do in um, Brunswick County. Here's what they do in Meckllinburgg. All these different ways that counties fund their school systems. and some do very little. Bunkham County really is very generous to us. And they said to the schools, "What do you guys like? What do you want to see?" And then it was turned over to the finance people, which is Tina and um Heidi. Thank you, Heidi from our district and Tina is her counterpart for the county. And they looked into it and they brought back a lot of feedback and we can tell you more about that, but there was a lot of back and forth. You're going to hear more from Maggie when you read through the proposal, but it came
107down to a percentage. The first percentage that they offered us, I I mean, it was a negotiation of sorts, but it was 37.06% and that would have been about 117 million. That's what I wanted you guys to see. They sort of started with this formula that got us about what they've been giving us the past couple years. There were some negotiations and they have gone up and the proposal that you have in front of you is 37.86%. >> Sorry, which is about 119 million. That's the number Heidi throws around the county. We can only talk about us, but we just have to recognize Bunkham County Schools is having the same conversation. It is my understanding without being an expert at all that their budget is super tight. They don't have the supplemental tax. They don't
108have some of the resources that we have by being a taxing authority. And so they really wanted it to be is it 37 38.56? Okay, it doesn't matter because and that would have created 122 million which conveniently was back what it used to be, right? But the county is saying they're really struggling. It article 39 fund lost really I mean it's really hard for them. So they came back with this proposal. Maggie I don't know who was at the meeting last week. She'll talk about it but the county is right now holding to this. So I just kind of wanted you to know what the numbers mean when you hear them. And I am now actually going to be quiet and let Maggie talk you through the proposal. And then the last thing that's gonna
109happen is if what Maggie doesn't share, um, we have some thoughts from Heidi and then Rebecca and I have some thoughts and then we're going to be quiet. >> All right, Sarah, I think you should sign up to be a presenter for new board members on school school budgets. >> Thank you, Sarah. You do well. >> It it is complicated. Um, and I've got a a a presenting on screen shares for the benefit of everyone anyone watching because I think this is an important document as well. Oh, here you go, Sarah. [laughter] Um, okay. So, Sarah represent, you know, shared a very concise, hey, this is what we've done. This is where we've gotten to. Um, the beginning of this language is just kind of, you know, setting up the stage. Here's what it is.
110it's an agreement between all of these um and that it is you know helping sustain our educational systems and then it gets into the number one and two which is kind of the meat of the agreement. So um they're setting a base funding um or their recommendation is 37.76 that gets divided by 12 months of property and sales tax. they've picked the date March 15th to kind of assess where they are tracking on that progress. So they'll say, "Hey, we're getting collections in X amount. It's, you know, because of the reassessments, we're seeing differences." So they're they've picked that date so that we can set budgets and anticipate what's coming in for the rest of that fiscal year. even though it's before the end of the fiscal year but they're saying based we can make
111that good projection because of what we've collected so far and feel very comfortable that the you know from March what April May June that they're not going to see a huge drop in collection after that point um the other then that's what they'll use to establish the dead the kind of deadline and then it helps them kind of say here's what we're anticipating for the total tax revenue for the year so then B, uh, the sales tax preceding that and all revenues, they're basically saying in number two that the stuff that goes into article 39, 40, and 42 stays where it is. So, they won't be using those dollar those pennies that come in from those special articles for funding. Um, article 39 is capital funding for us. Um, and I have a Oh, shoot.
112It's probably in my other binder. Maggie, if while you're looking at 40, I have no idea what 40 and 42 are, but um board members, just because we learned a lot about article 39 last year, remember the bill, the local bill that got passed said that for 2 years the county could reallocate a portion of article 39, which is what they did this current year. We sat there in the room back in October and every person there, Amanda and Martin and Ail and the county manager said they they know they could reallocate this coming current fiscal year 27 from article 39, but they're not going to do it. I mean, never say never, but I am definitely under the impression that article 39 was one and done for fiscal year 26 and they will not
113do that again. So that's just to have said that what B is also saying is article 39 doesn't count. We still get the article 39 and it won't be reallocated like it was this year. Sorry. >> Correct. Correct. And just clarifying that the tax revenue that they're going to look at will not include the revenues coming into those different throw those other pots. C basically says that um those pots basically fund school capital expenditures. So, even though it's three, even though 39 is the one that goes to the capital commission, 40 and 42 fund other capital budgets um that come to the school system. Any questions on that? >> Yes. >> Um sorry. Um but B says that it will include those revenues >> statutory department which are >> so I think the idea is
114that the sale that the the amount that 37.76% comes from includes articles 39 40 and 42. No. Well that's what it says. Am I not reading that properly? No. Those are excluded. Those are going to stay totally separate from this 37.76. So it says those are statuto dispersements. um 3940 and are limited to capital expenditures and not into the county's general fund. >> So what is being >> keeping them separate? >> I think Amy >> Amy I think you have to go get to the comma where it says excluding municipal fire and supplemental. So first that takes our supplemental property tax out. Then it goes on other statutoily required distributions. Okay. I think we'll have to get clarity. >> Yeah. I mean, it's >> Maggie and I are saying the same thing. I just I
115thought >> article 3940 and 42 are statutory >> and Anna can add some clarity on that. >> Okay. Go ahead. >> So, um just this is a draft and um so Dean and I have been collaborating real hard on this to clarify that language and make it more clear. Um and we actually just sent a draft to both of the finance officers at about 4:50 p.m. today. Um, and we were waiting to get feedback from them before we pass it on, but we included language clarifying that these two things would not be. >> So, the intent is that those three things stay totally separate and aren't included in determining the 37.76%. >> Okay, that's just not I mean, I'll just say that's just not what this says. But I got you. >> New language. [laughter]
116>> Hannah, am I what I think I might I agree this language I'm glad it's got draft all over it, right? So that we can make sure that's really clear. But where number one says the base funding is the sum of 12 months of property and sales. So it's both property and sales. And then is B trying to say it's the sales tax except for the things that are statutoily required to go to capital. All the rest of the sales tax is included in this. But they're acknowledging that it's the sales tax except for the things that statutoily have to go to capital. >> I mean, they just need to add a not. >> Yeah. So, yeah, >> because it says it will include sales tax proceeding will include all revenues associated with articles 39,
11740, and 42 received by Bunkham County. So, unless I'm misunderstanding how this is written, it doesn't matter to me. This is a draft. I'm just but I'm I'm more more than anything identifying what seems to be inconsistent with what the intent of the agreement is and how I read it. But I don't draft this out of our conversations that they were not going to include these in that 37.76. That was my recollection. >> I I think we're going to get to where we all think we're headed. I when they are going to give us 37.76% of all property tax and sales tax we are not for example going to get an extra 37.76 of the supplemental city tax we already get 100% of okay like that's excluded if I guess and I don't have the
118words Amy but if it's article 3940 and 42 money that they have to give us then they're going to give it to us and we don't get a 37.76% of it. So then you end up with parts of article 40 that have nothing to do with education, right? >> And we would get 37.56. >> Okay. >> I'm hearing you say you just don't think the language reflects what we're saying. And I I'm confident that and Dean can improve. >> Yeah, I agree. I'm not I'm not challenging whether it ends up where it should. Just noting that when I read it, it's confusing. >> It's doesn't say what I think you're saying. But we get there. we'll get there. Not worried about it. Although this is to our benefit. So, just to be clear, like I
119like this language because it says that it will include um that in calculating the 37%, but I also understand that's not the intent of the parties and we should end up with a contract. Or maybe I'm completely misreading it. That's all I need to say. >> This is the purpose of among other things today is to talk about this and what's confusing to us. Yeah. Um, just before Maggie moves on to two, I want to make a big point about because one of the things Heidi would say if she were here [snorts] is that the whole purpose of sentence one is to look backward at actual collected revenue and sales tax. So we are no longer in this world where they're looking forward making conservative projections. We're looking backward. That's the number. Thank you ma'am.
120Divide it by 15% and then 12. What I'll also share is the benefit of the percentage is that we get growth. So right now we get a number and that's the number we get and they could collect you know 5% higher than what they anticipated and we don't get any of that money. With it being a percent we now get natural growth as the digest grows across the county with sales and property tax which is really beneficial for us. And with a reassessment, they're expecting the assessment to also have a pretty good amount of growth. So 37.76% was previously anticipated to be 1.9, you know, 119 million. You know, naturally, as the reassessment happens, that could grow to a much higher amount. So, >> Asheville City Schools is very happy with the 37.76% because we're
121also getting the supplemental tax. >> Can I ask a question about that that we would be we would see [clears throat] growth. Is there something in here that because I'm I'm reading it as the sum of 12 months of property and sales tax preceding March 15th. So if we see if the coffers of Buckingham County grow after March 15th, the way I'm reading this, we wouldn't see that growth until the following year, >> right? And that's what happens normally as well. >> Okay. Yeah. >> Every year you set your tax rate, it's the next year you get the benefits of the growth, >> right? But it's not like if all of the sudden it come like August, not August, November when lots of sales tax money comes back to Bunkham County due to tourism in
122October, we're not seeing that money. >> Not immediately. No. >> I think >> right. But I just want to make that clear. So So like I So I don't I don't guess I just don't see it. I mean, yeah, it's a great rate and it's nice that we're always locked into it. I [clears throat] don't see if it's that it's that different from us every year going and saying, "Hey, you guys made a little bit of money money this year. Are you going to give us some more of that money?" Right? I mean, I just it stops that conversation, but I want to be clear. To me, it doesn't feel like I just want to frame it properly. And I I think I appreciate you bringing that up because I want to make sure I
123understand it correctly that the look back instead of the projection what correct me if I'm wrong right now they're projecting revenue so they give us an amount based on what they're projecting. If they overcolct we're just left out. They overcolct it. It's theirs. With this what happens is if they overcolct the next year we get it because it's our part of the pie. like they don't get to say, "Well, we overcolcted. We'll add it to our rainy day fund." Because when they overcolct that money's on the books, it's on the books for the the then the following year where we get our percentage. It's much more transparent that when they overcolct, they can't say that's not for you because they've agreed to the percentage, >> right? And so, is this and I'm not the lawyer
124obviously. Is this written in such a way that makes that very explicit that it is dependent on the actual revenues coming in, not what's like left over or whatever. I just want to make sure you you can tell. [laughter] >> Yes, that is that is the goal of what we've kind of written here is that it is based on those actions. >> Okay, good. Thank you. >> Okay. Um, so down to number two. This is language that builds in some very some changes in the percentage based on enrollment changes. So, you know, if we drop x number of students, you know, to typically our our operating expenses should go down at by some degree. Um, so we went back and forth with this one a lot. Um and we they initially project um were recommending
125I think 1% change in student enrollment and then we got them to 1.5 2 is where we were Heidi and Tina were really able to be instrumental in getting into that change in 2% um because we felt like that was really going to be a a much safer cushion for us um as they look at that. And now how they look at that is every year they have to s we have to sign off as a school on our enrollment numbers and how many of our students go to charter, how many of our students go to other districts of Bunkham County or even Haywood. Um so then that's the number that they'll use and for every 2% drop they would adjust our or increase they'll adjust the percentage by point by 50 um points. So
126if it was 76.26 26 and we changed we went up by 2% they would adjust our percentage of their budget to be 38.26. So building in some just automatic changes based on enrollment and Heidi told me this morning that 2% currently this would both school districts is about 500 kids which would be a lot. So it would have to be that 500 kids left Bunkham County and Nashville City schools to hit 2%. That's just for perspective. One qu Oh, are we allowed? >> Go for it. Yeah. Okay. Question about this is that I have is just um the 50 basis points. Is that does that accord with sort of a 2% you know reduction in the total amount of money we're getting or where do we get the 50 basis points cuz how does that
127correlate? That's I'll have to follow up with Heidi on that one >> cuz if I did something on my on my calculator, but I really don't know what I just did and whether that makes any sense. Somebody some math person in here needs to come help me out. >> I'll follow up with Heidi on that one. I know. >> Trying to figure out how they got that. >> They were okay with it. And when they said they when they say they're okay, I think they know what they're talking about. >> Yeah, they're that's probably all I need to know actually. [laughter] >> Thank you. Well, although I'm looking at this and is that unless I misunderstand what 50 basis points is, that example is not 50 basis points. >> Oh, you're right. It's one, >>
128right? It's one or it's 100, right? >> Yeah. >> No, it's it's 50. I'm I don't know what 50 basis points is either, but it goes it goes down 50%, you know, half a percentage point >> if it goes if we drop if we drop 2% it goes down half a percentage point. If we increase 2% it goes up half a percentage point. >> Well, that goes up a full percentage point is my point >> On the example. So that's just assuming whether it goes down or up. So in other words, we're starting at 37.76. Am I should I >> I'm sorry. Y'all go back and look at the number 37.76. >> That's Yeah, >> you would either go down Y >> a half a percent which is basis. >> So it's 37.76 is your
129starting point. >> Yeah. Okay. B Yes. Thank you. Yep. Thank you for that clarification. Oh my gosh. >> Or Yep. Okay. [clears throat] >> And then the last part of that is um if something emergent or sudden or extraordinary um impacts um then we can go and ask support from the county to meet any financial obligations. Um so that's kind of the emergency language in case something happens. Um so then the language in number three um gets a little confusing based on those fi financial years, fiscal years. Um the first agreement is actually a three-year term and then it goes into an every two years. They can come back to the table and say do we need to adjust this percentage rate? The first one is three years. the rationale was about when the elections
130were happening, turnovers on the board of commissioners, and then they wanted to keep it away from that. So that was the rationale there. And we know the date of December 1st is kind of not going to, you know, obviously today's December 1st, so we know that this first year too, it's kind of moving the term. So, just so I can say this to board members, this coming spring, just pretend this was approved. We have this 37.76 system and it would be used because in theory if it can be approved before March they're going to look back at last year and apply it give us our 15% divide by 12 and Heidi can plug it in for the fiscal year 27 school year. Same formula for the next school year. And then just to be clear,
131the fiscal school year that ends in June of 28 and then it takes us to December of 28 to revisit it. Thus, we're in the third school year. So, what we would vote on would commit three years, right? >> But thereafter it would be every two years. I just wanted to make sure people understood that. >> Got it. Oh, sorry that my microphone was on. Didn't realize it when I said got it. Um, I do have a question about the emergency. U Maggie, you mentioned that the if if there was an emergency, we could ask for more. It doesn't say that if there's an emergency, they can't pull some back. It sounds like that could be also possible, right? Like if Helen happened, it's like this can be adjusted either way. Is that fair? >>
132I I mean, I would guess that's the assumption I make as well. Okay. Thanks. Could I offer this just to the board members one last thing and then I'm actually just going to open it up for conversation. Um, I wanted you to know that Maggie has shared a preliminary, well, nobody has shared this yet because we really just kind of saw it today. But the concept, same as I've shared with you, it has been shared with fax, the families of Asheville City Schools. Heidi, Rebecca, and I met with ACA people to walk through it. So, they know about this and we're working very closely with Bunkham County Schools on this. I thought if it would be helpful to you all that I might let Maggie talk just a minute about the benefits and the burdens
133from her perspective as the administrator and on Heidi's behalf and then Rebecca's going to share a bit about her perspective in the process of the benefits and the burdens and then the is what I'd love to do today is just to sort of start to get you all to talk about what you like about it, what you're nervous about, what other information you need so that we can then bring that to you. that that's that's all I was hoping to get to today. So, okay, back to Maggie. >> Um, so in in my opinion, this is a really great next step to try to come to a mutual agreement on school funding and the consistency that it will provide instead of this like questioning. we'll know in March or have a pretty good idea even
134before that um because Heidi gets the collection numbers as they come in. Um we'll be able to have a much better idea and more solid foundation to do planning um for the school district. So it gives us that number instead of this well will we get it? Will we not get it? What if we ask this big ask? Um, so to me that's the biggest benefit is it just gives us a more um solid v instead of a variable we know pretty much what we're going to get. So planning and budgeting for long term comes a lot easier. Um, you know, I still think, you know, down the road, you know, who knows if we'd ever be able to as a school board, you know, set your own millage rate, but I think this kind
135of helps us make that argument. Um, but what I will tell you is other school districts that I've worked in outside of North Carolina is you can only adjust your millage rate by so much. So you can't say our millage rate is 20 mills and we're going to go up in one year to 25. Like they won't let you make that drastic of a change. So you could only change it x percentage year after year. So even though you may say, "Hey, we need to increase our millage rate," you wouldn't be able to make a huge drastic change. So this I think process of creating an a you know at least a two every other year being able to say hey we need a little bit more you know we understand that this is helping
136us accomplish the goals that we need. I do think that to me is the big benefit. Um would I like to be able to say hey this is what we want and yes we wave a magic wand and we get it. I I would, but I also, you know, understand we've got to be good fiscal agents with the finances that we have. And then this allows us to also then adjust our internal priorities without this like other factor of will the commissioners be swayed by, you know, x y and z. Um, so I think it's a really good place for us to start and see how it goes and make progress. And we're Heidi is very comfortable with the 37.76. Um so for us and that in addition to our um Asheville City School supplemental
137tax um allows us the the budget we need to help make some really good strategic improvements. I'll share um you know as I've been participating in these meetings and so I've had a lot longer to kind of process and think about and um from the standpoint of the concept of benefits and burdens. I absolutely agree that I mean Heidi um I trust Heidi and I I think that she's really good at what she does and the idea of having a less um temperamental approach, you know, where we get we force her into and and her whole team and Maggie's team into a position of having to wait so long to find out what are we going to get and that I don't think is working well for our school district. Um, so I know that's
138a real benefit, but I I think all along the way in every conversation I've shown up wanting to make sure that we're not losing any advocacy tools in how we think about agreeing to things because and I've I I said it I think more than once in these meetings that this is a a state that Maggie shared some information publicly. We we rank 50th out of 50 states on funding effort. Like that's the latest public NC public schools forum data. And so what I don't want to give up are tools that are effective. And I think that's where I sit is not just any old tool, but effective tools for um what I think needs to be state level advocacy. I think all of us have seen over and over at the podium, at public
139comment, at county commission meetings, people acknowledging, they're highly aware that the county is in a tight spot because they're having to make up for what the state's not doing. Um, but I do think it raises awareness. That whole that whole process raises awareness. And so I think um while my I trust Heidi and so as a as somebody who's been participating and listening as all these things have been coming down um my inclination is that there are more benefits than drawbacks. But I think that it puts us in a position of needing to think carefully about ongoing advocacy because our state is still not doing what it needs to do which isn't changing with this. And just to say, we should not agree to do this just to protect the county commissioners from getting yelled
140at in public comment at their April and May meeting, right? Like they are hoping this actually does protect them a bit from that free-for-all. And I get that. I totally get that. That's not a reason for us to say yes. Because what I what we should realize is if if we go along with this funding formula, the people are going to show up at our meeting because they know what the amount is and people are going to have opinions about how we should spend it and not spend it. So I guess I just wanted to add to that that all of us as board members should be clear that part of this is to make it cleaner for the county commissioners, but it doesn't that's not our goal and there will be we have now
141more ownership of it. So just offer that. >> Sarah, could I um clarify something we talked about earlier? So when when we were talking about the sales tax, I realized I don't think it was stated clearly enough. So I went back and looked at the changes we made. Um so to clarify the amounts that would go towards school capital outlay and debt, those would be separate and not counted towards that full amount that's funded. But everything else from 39, 40, and 42 would actually be going towards making that assessment of what the entire gross revenue is to determine that 37.76%. So, I just wanted to clarify that point because I realized that got a little messy in there. So, I just wanted to make sure we were all on the same page on that. Hannah,
142do you mean to say that in the always super and crystal clear language of statutes? >> Yeah. >> That it's just sort of an unfortunate situation where the wording is the sales sales tax will include all revenues associated with 39,40 and 42 except for those that have to go to capital and debt. meaning that the we tend to think of 39 39 for us is code for capital like all of it but you're saying actually it's not all for capital a portion of 39 a portion of 40 and a portion of 42 so all of the 3940 and 42 sales tax that's not statutoily required to go >> to something else will be included in this pot >> that is correct yes >> okay >> and has that always been the case or is that
143just now because they rewrote that law last month to >> you mean has 39 have 30 39 40 and 42 always only had a percentage that goes >> yes have has 39 40 and 42 always gone to help fund our schools beyond capital >> yes >> okay well then there's okay >> cuz I'll also just note that one of the one of the options looked at I remember was where we would only get a portion of property tax and not sales tax and that's cleaner it's real simple but it would have eliminated ated the need for this crazy sounding language, but we didn't want to give up the option of a bite at the sales tax. There are districts, several districts that only do a rate of property tax, and sales tax is not part
144of funding schools at all. >> Yes. So, this one would have property and sales in it. >> Okay. Oh, okay. >> Go ahead. [clears throat] >> It can be changed after this first three years. It could change every two years. I do understand that. Um [clears throat] when we ask for incre if we ask for an amount if it enter if the amount that we are asking for has already been cuz you could we could see the amount right? Does it also include the do we put teachers pay like an increase in in their payment? Is that part of it also or or does it come from a different federal or I mean is that part of it? Would would this be part of it if we increase let's say that for the next 3
145to four years we're going to give the teachers a.5%. >> We would have to accommodate that within this 37.76. So we so when we if we agreed on the way that the county wants us to do, we have to make sure that that increase is there before we say yay or nay. Yeah. I mean we have to make sure cuz if it's not >> we just digging our own hole. Correct. >> Well it's complicated. So it's not as easy as hey we got to make sure a increase in pay for our staff is there. It's and then we can say yes or we can say no. That's I don't I mean we'd have to do a lot of work to do that. And I just like that's a more complicated than yes we need to
146say yes or no to this based on what we want to pay our teachers in 3 to 5 years. >> Okay. Is this the way that we trying to get to the county now? Is is this easier for us with the teachers pay or we go back to we keep the old way. Is that better for us to understand when we want to increase in teachers pay? >> Which way would be better? The new way or the old way? When we come to teachers pay >> I I think I understand but let me say it differently to you Jesse. If you're saying come our time we create our budget for the next year. Yes. >> We want to give teach Okay. Because let me set aside if the state comes and says everybody shall get
147a raise. we have to give one to the people we pay locally. But just for the sake of argument, if you're saying we want to pay everybody more, right? We choose to take some of our money to use it towards teacher compensation. >> Every year for the next three years, we look at it. >> The way I see it is, remember the very beginning I said we got federal money, got restrictions, we got state money, we got all this, we got supplemental property tax. We have some dollars that we could use to increase pay for teachers, right? We have a this what we get from the county for operations is not the only bucket of money that we would have available to pay teachers more. We would also have our supplemental property tax. So the
148issue would be if we want to pay teachers more, we would look at our budget as a whole and possibly say and we're no longer going to pay for this other thing. It's always going to be up to us, Jesse, to figure out what we want to do and how we're going to pay for it. I I'm just trying to say to you that whether teachers got an extra raise or not would not be fully dependent on that percentage. >> But if can I go offer something? I also think this actually gives us more money. >> So I think that that maybe that answers the question that you're the discreet question I hear you asking is does this make it more or less likely that we can offer teachers more money? >> Yes, >> it
149makes it more likely because we get more money from the county. It doesn't make it likely because we're kind of stuck with the money that we have and the obligations that we have. But to the extent that this is money we can use for any purpose we want along with the supplemental tax money along with our general fund if we want decided we wanted to like dive into debt. Not really but like if we wanted to take away money from there which we've done in the past to increase our supplement for our teachers. I know supplement I just used twice in two different ways, but anyway, that's because that's the weird language of the funding. But I I think this makes it more likely because this ultimately gives us more money over the long term,
150unless we assume that we're going to get a batch of county commissioners that suddenly decides to give us 40% of their budget, which I think is unlikely. Do you know what I'm saying? Like right now we get less than 37.76% of the budget of their of their budget. We get less than that. So I think that's right. Right. Am I right? Yes. Thank you. And not only that, but this means that instead of looking at a dollar figure every year, well, last year we gave you 122 and even though you've had, you know, an increase in your numbers and an in and we've just taken in a boatload of extra taxes. We're keeping you at 122. They can't do that anymore. They have to give us a percentage. So if they've taken in a boatload
151of taxes that they didn't predict last year, not in perspectively, but retrospectively, we get a percentage of that boatload. They can't just say no. >> Does that make sense? >> It makes sense >> because in the past they could kind of use one number, which was what we got last year. Do we want to go let them go up or do we want to just hold them steady or do we want to go down? They can't do that anymore. It's going to be dep depend on what money they bring in. >> Okay. Can we hear from Liza? I think she might have another answer to this. >> Um, yeah. [laughter] >> Thanks, Jesse. I'm I'm trying to follow along, but in full disclosure, I feel like my brain's pretty foggy at this point, and I'm
152not not totally processing all of this. >> And thank you, Liza. Just so you know, I think we're about done talking with this for tonight because I don't know that anybody can process it. But Jesse, >> that makes me feel better. [laughter] >> One thing I [snorts] just want to say cuz I think God, it's not a good way to do this. They used to give us more. Okay. When we say, "Oh, 119's better than we did last year." I I just want to acknowledge we used to get more. And so to me the question is did we get more because we showed up in April and did our thing and are we going to give that up if we agree to a formula and we can talk more about that but does that make
153sense that >> I just want to make sure that we are looking the right way when we talking about increasing our staff each and every year at least a small percentage. Right. >> Well, and Jesse, I think too, like [cough] sorry, historically that's determined by the state >> and we just have to follow suit. >> The state sets the raises and we actually find I I have sensed trepidation about that because everybody we [clears throat] pay for locally, we just what we do is give parody. We would never get state funded positions get the raise but locally funded don't. We've said everybody gets it when the state sets a raise and then sometimes we're in the position of saying that costs more than we expected. We're going to have to put more local dollars to
154that and then we'll have to decide what we can't pay for anymore because the state is the entity that has the most power in setting what those raises look like. We have the supplement which is different than raises that we get to make some choices and decisions about and we're working on that now about how to do that in a way that's fiscally responsible but honors the hard work our teachers do. So I think all of that I don't know that one or the other makes a huge difference in it that the concept of compensation and raises sits firmly in the all the buckets come with different um restrictions and luckily Heidi really knows how to do that. but that it would put us in the position to remain in control of what we what
155we give them as their local supplement and looking at what we have and how we do it that we would we never give that up. >> Yeah, I was going to offer I I do want to comment on this whole thing after I say this um at some point, but the only raise quote raise that we give is by increasing the supplement. we don't and so we've only done that once in our tenure and that was under Jim Cosby and we gave a pretty significant raise in the supplement. >> So that meant that every teacher got more money to take home every month, right, that they're paid because the supplement went up. The state determines and I know I'm saying the same thing but I want to just articulate it a little differently. The pay
156technically the pay raises are determined by the state schedule and by when they decide the general assembly decides to do something. We control really only the supplement as it as it affects teacher pay specifically. Is that right? Okay. So, so we can do that, but we don't often do it because it's a huge it's a huge outlay every time we do. And we know that while the state may be abysmal in how they fund education, they have recently been increasing teacher pay and we will have to increase that for all the positions that we pay for. So, we have to be careful. I'm I'm just Yeah, but I I don't think that this funding except for what Sarah said, which is yeah, we get less than 122, but if Okay, so my comment on this
157all is I don't think we're giving up a lot in terms of advocacy. I really don't. I don't think that I mean last year we brought some pressure to bear and I think it bore some fruit but I also feel like the focus on advocacy should be at the state level and this provides I can't imagine but the stress that this reduces in our financial team and Maggie's team and even for us I mean yeah we'll get comments about how to spend the money we have I don't think we're necessarily going to get more than we already get on that point and I think at the end of the day it provides some predictability that at least I as a board member am grateful for because I felt very much in the middle all of
158those years I spoke one year at the county another year I didn't and I never knew what I should do to be helpful because reading the county commissioners some of them were okay if we spoke some of them really hated it if county if board members got up and spoke and felt very much put on the spot in a way that felt unfair to them. We can debate whether that makes sense, but I like the predictability of this. I like the fact that as Bunkham County grows and I know we had a dip for Helen, it's going to continue to grow. We're coming back. It's a beautiful place to be. Who doesn't want to live here? So, these revenues are going to go up. And I'm also optimistic. One last point, one grateful to everybody
159who put a lot of time into this. Sarah, Rebecca, Maggie, Heidi, um, and the commissioners and other folks, but our enrollments can go up. And so, we're gonna see this continue to improve. Things like the middle school open house, we're going to start killing it. And and I think this is just going to be good in the long run. Thank you. [laughter] >> Okay, board members, I'm going to um we've fully discussed it. We will discuss it some more. If I could, I wanted Anna to take a minute or less to explain the interlocal agreement. Like if you see at the end of the proposal, how people are going to sign off on it. So, I'm going to let Anna talk and then we're moving on to the next budget item. >> Yeah, >> sure.
160Simple. I can keep it short. >> Wait. >> Oh, go ahead. >> I'd like to ask George if he has any comments. Sorry. >> Actually, I might have comments after you share what you're going to say, Anna. So, >> it's not much. I can keep it simple. It's an agreement like any other contract or agreement we would enter. Um all of the parties have to sign and agree to the terms of it. So each board would individually have to agree to it as well. Um it is legally binding as an agreement just like any other contract the board may enter. Um and so it would have the same authority as any other sort of contract that you guys might enter. Um I mean with this you are bound for the period of it at at
161least a year at a minimum because we can't bind future boards and so there are terms with regarding the potential termination there. Um one thing I always mention when we talk about agreements is things happen that aren't anticipated when agreements are entered and so it's possible that you know something will come up down the line that's unressed by the agreement and may need to be resolved. But I mean overall this is pretty much like any other contract that you guys would consider. [cough] [clears throat] >> Does this mean that every member of the board had to agree or the percentage of the board members have to agree? >> It has to be approved by the board. So not all board members have to be in favor of it, just the majority. >> Okay. Um, Anna,
162what would actually it's probably more for Sarah, Rebecca, and and Maggie. If we did not enter into this agreement, do you have a sense of how commissioners might respond in terms of funding for next year? Like, is there going to be some hurt feelings? And I mean, I don't I don't want to make my choice based on that, but I'm just curious. >> I I don't I can't I don't know. I mean, I think there's obviously the risk that I mean, Bunkham County could say that is simply still not enough for us. We can't risk it, right? Um, >> Bunkham County Schools, I'm sorry, that's what I meant. Um, George, I don't have an answer. I can say that the parties have been discussing this in good faith with a with this would make sense.
163If ultimately our board couldn't get there, we just felt like we left too much. I think as long as we're articulating why and if that is done in good faith, I don't think we're going to piss off the county unnecessarily. We just need to be careful about why we're doing it. Um could Bunkham County Schools and the county go ahead and do it without us because we just are riding shotgun with Bunkham County Schools, you know, most of the time. So I practically speaking, I don't know. I think if in good faith we get to a place where we can't, we would just be real clear about that. Does that help? >> That's very helpful. Thank you. And I I know you want to move on. I'll make my comments brief. >> Yeah. Um I
164one thing that I appreciate about this um well two things. One is just to reiterate what it takes off of everyone who's been involved with this for a long time, what that process is. Um and given how often we spend lots of February, lots of March, lots of April, lots of board time on this, what we can then do as a board with that extra time. Um, and to go back to the very start of this board meeting that we're focusing on courageous conversations, isolating race, and what we're doing for our students. So, I I I appreciate that. I am curious though, given that Bunkham County Board or Bunkham County Schools is um a little less appreciative of this percentage. Um, do [clears throat] we know if Bunkham County Commissioners have taken this quiz that
165you gave us? And what I mean by that is do they tr do they have a real deep understanding of how the state funds our schools and the allocations they they give? And I mean I understand conceptually they know they have to fill in the gaps, but do they understand what those gaps are? Because I I mean I yes I hear everyone that says we appreciate that the county does so much for the schools, etc., etc. I look at this rate and I'm actually not happy with it either because of how much unfortunately for the county commissioners and for all of us how much the county has to supplement. There's that word again but how much they have to supplement what the state does not do for us. And if the commissioners have a deep
166understanding of how these allocations work, how long it's been since the state has actually re-evaluated those allocations, would they then consider raising that percentage rate, recognizing how much we're asking them, we being all of us are asking the our county coffers to help with how we operate, right? So, I just want to say that if it ends up being 37, whatever it is, fine. like it it creates a lot more stability here. That's great. And I really, if county commissioners are listening, ask them to really deeply look at how the funding models work at the state level and what that then does to both of our districts. Um, and so I can imagine why Bunkham County is a little bit Bunkham County schools is a little bit more like concerned about this percentage. Um, and
167then finally, my um, to Rebecca's point about advocacy, I think then, and this is I don't think county commissioners are going to like me to hear me say this, but then maybe that advocacy, not only at the state level, but at the county level, becomes let's look really deeply at how the county funds everything. And if there's if they can't go beyond 37 whatever percent, I'd be curious to know where all that money is going. And it kind of it goes back to what Maggie said months ago about the way that we receive our property tax bills and it's just a single amount. I'd love to see percentage-wise what all of these what all of this money that they collect from us sales tax and property tax- wise truly goes to and then maybe once
168we reveal that then we could as a community say hey you're choosing to spend your money over here maybe that's not what our values are and maybe those values are toward education right so those are those are my points thank you >> um thank you all I really appreciate that Bunkham County Schools is going to be talking about this at their meeting. If you have a chance to listen in, we can see what they say. And then the Bunkham County Commissioners will be talking about this this meeting. So, I appreciate you all letting us kind of it's it's a little overwhelming. Okay, we are going to move on. Um, next, are you speaking for Heidi? >> Um, I'm going to turn it over to Maggie. We got some regular boring stuff coming. Yeah, Heidi had
169a couple things on there. Um, she's got the regular expenditure report for board review and an amendment summary um for a December amendment. If you have any questions, I'll write them down and send them to Heidi. I see board members reading this. Um, if you get home and are thinking about this, email your questions to Maggie and she'll ask Heidi. Um, but I think this is just an attempt to let everybody know what the Yep. >> Does any of this show up next week for >> She'll be here next week. Yes. >> But does any of this show up for our approval next week? >> Yes. both of them or just >> both the expenditure report and the amendment. Okay. And they're both results of um increased funding that she's then allocated into different spending
170categories. >> Um and then the second one for Heidi is the um budget calendar. We left this on it's technically not doesn't need board approval until the end of January, but we typically haven't had the board meetings in January. So that's why I had it in December. Um but it's pretty much just a reiteration of what we've always had. The green um text in there are things that are required at at the from the statutes. Um so just so you kind of have a tracking on when those things are required based on on laws and then when we'll what we'll do kind of in our work sessions and that doesn't need approved. It just has to be presented to the board. And Maggie, just so you know, in years past before you got here, we
171never saw calendars like this. >> Oh. >> So the fact that this is >> required to It's a law that you're supposed to [laughter] It's in law. >> Well, >> I should have said that out loud then. [laughter] >> Any other questions? >> Okay. Thank you, Maggie. >> I'm going to turn it over. policies for first read and there is a lot of them. Um so if you have any questions I provided you the like some notes in advance. Um so if you have any questions about any of the policies I'm happy to answer those. I can always come back to you [clears throat] with so many polic I mean I read some of them not all of them but I can always come back and ask you questions if I need to >> if
172you have anything that you need clarification on I'm happy to to do that for you >> now can I send the comments straight to you or do I send them to both to Maggie and to Sarah? Can I just >> If you can send them to me I'll forward them to Kim. >> Okay. Yep. >> And then also, Ken, these are all policy updates that have come out of the adjustments from the state board. >> That is correct. These were all on the fall update from the schoolboard association [clears throat] >> from you guys. >> And then Campbell Shatley, they come from the schoolboard association. Then they go to Campbell Shatley. Campbell Shhatley vets them and then sends us their feedback. >> Can I check in on policy 3,400? That's our This is Can you
173orient me? This looks like I know 3,400 is not an optional policy, but this is a place where we've been doing work, right? >> Yes, that is accurate. Thank you for pointing that out, Rebecca. And if you have questions about that, I would probably redirect those to um Dr. Ferman and um to Shannon to answer because there's some um grading updates in there as well as some um and I'll touch base on that. So um high school you have to use the 10point grading scale for high school. Um middle school you don't have to but we use that for middle school as well. We use the same at high school and middle school. elementary, we had been using a one, two, three, and we're moving to a one, two, we're recommending a move to a
174one, two, three, four. >> Okay. >> Um, and I I'm grateful to see I mean, this to me feels like where we're putting energy on student experience and how students are being supported. So, um I'll I'll trust that the adding the four is helping gain clarity and kids are supported through that. But thanks for clarifying. >> Okay. I I [laughter] did have one. Kim, can you help me out with 4120 with the way our community going right now? Can you help me with 4120? >> So 4120. Um we're the schoolboard association is still catching up on making sure that the um general statute is mirrored throughout the policies pertaining to military um families and >> it's 4120 >> thing is it >> okay okay >> it's a it's the change pertaining to military families and
175the documentation that they have to provide when they come to enroll in school and so it's get it what it does is The the general assembly has given military families more flexibility in their process to enroll in order to get students in um a classroom quickly without any delays. Um, Jessica, do you have anything else over that? Okay. I have a question about um >> I was sorry, Eliza. Does she Is that >> No, go ahead, Amy. >> Okay. I have a question about 2127. Uh, no. Strike. Yes, I think that's it. Is that the one that says you can't put Yeah, hang on. I'm scrolling down because I think this is the one that I want to ask about. Yeah. Board members should not utili utilize school system or individual school names, logos, or
176trademarks on personal social media. So, question. Does that mean that uh in the past, I don't really do it anymore cuz I'm kind of pulled back from social media, but in the past I would answer questions or say, "Yes, there's something going on at Isaac Dixon this week or you know, whatever." So, does that mean that in a board member's social media, they cannot even identify a school or provide helpful information to the public? >> So, I'm going to let Anna I'm going to defer to Anna on this one because um Campbell Sh is kind of a you can this is optional. You can accept accept that change or you can the board can decide not to accept that change. >> Okay. Yeah. So, um, where that came from was this case that like the
177policy already kind of addressed about, you know, like having to make clear that if a board member is expressing opinions on something on social media that they're making clear that it's their personal opinions, not the opinion of the board. And so, NCSBA's reasoning and including this new term was to further clarify that point um to say, you know, like this board member isn't speaking on behalf of the board when they're on social media. they're only speaking on their own behalf. Um, we felt that the policy already kind of addressed that issue itself. Uh, and so we haven't recommended that portion of it be added, but I mean it's certainly up to boards whether they want to or not. Um, it would with this, you know, it would encourage board members not to because it's a
178should not, not a must not or shall not. Anna, when I I was at the schoolboard conference earlier in November, I sat through the one about First Amendment and school board members personal social media sites. And one of the things I came away with is you, Amy Ray, could have two >> Facebooks, Amy Ray's personal in which you have to be super clear that it's just you and you don't ever speak for the school. But then you could have one, the Amy Ray school board member one, and that one could identify schools, right? I mean, is that one of the distinctions being made? If it's my official schoolboard Facebook site, would I then be able to say Claxton's having a this and the middle school's having a that? >> I mean, that sounds like it's
179a first amendment issue, which is a whole different question. So the first, just to be clear, the first amendment that all I brought that up with is regardless of whether it's personal or public, you can't shut down comments you don't like. >> Yeah, >> that was different. All I'm wanted to say is is the school board association assuming schoolboard members have a private social media and a public one and that's what this is driving at. So, I mean, my understanding is that it would be for both because they would still be speaking as an individual board member. Not like the clarification is you're not speaking for the board. Even if your public page is speaking as a board member, the clarification is you can't say I'm, you know, like is to make clear that that's
180not necessarily an opinion of the board being expressed. It's an opinion of this one public figure. I also think that that whole notion of two p I just think that that muddies it makes it more confusing in terms of who and how you're acting. Here's what I want to say. I think this is stupid. Um I like the purpose of the whole policy. 100% support that. But the notion that a board member can't go on their own social media page and advertise that there's a fall plant sale at Montford next weekend, that just seems silly to me or that you even shouldn't do that. There may be more precise ways we can get at what we want to get at with this, but this language is just so broad that I feel like um for
181those who do use social media, I I feel like everything else which says you have to say you're speaking as an individual and you can't speak for the board or whatever, I I feel like that covers it and that what this does is discourage board members from being helpful. Um, again, like it's not going to matter to me very much cuz I'm really not on it anymore. But I just think that when I was I could be useful sometimes. Um, so >> and that was pretty much why we were like we don't really recommend the adoption cuz I mean one we our big thing was that cat's kind of out of the bag already. Um, you know, people have been using social media and using school names on there. So trying to then reel all
182that back in is kind of a whole thing. But um yeah, I mean we we feel like the legal parameters are laid out elsewhere in this policy. >> Okay. Just looking at 2127 board members and Liza, were you going to say something about 2127 or about a different policy? >> About 3220. >> Okay. So just to hold on to that thought. >> Sure. Thank you. for 2127. This is before us on first read. Anna, I'm I have to say I'm a little confused. Campbell Shatley likes the purple language or they don't like the purple language. >> We have not recommended adopting the purple language, >> but the purple language Kim Deck comes from the state from the schoolboard association. >> Comes from the schoolboard association. Campbell Shhatley does not recommend it, but I wanted y'all
183to see it to make the final decision. Okay. So, this is not an official vote, Liza, so you get to have an opinion. Um, I'm looking at board members. Do we want the purple language? Do we not want the purple language? Amy's a no. >> Rebecca's a no. >> No. Okay. We have consensus to not have the purple language about. We all know what it is. So, can I also just very quickly interject that this is I don't feel like we've ever had this before that going forward if the school board's association is presenting something but Campbell Shatley actually says we don't recommend it. Can we like make that a bring that up like school boards is saying it um but our attorneys are advising against it so that we won't inadvertently just gloss over
184it. And I want to mention that you know social media can be really toxic and I do think that there may be times when we need to revisit this policy for other reasons. I just think this language is too broad. >> Can I ask why that was in there from the beginning? >> Okay, Liza, I'm sorry. Sorry. Hang on. >> Sorry, Liza. >> So, Jesse, for 2127, like every other policy in this stack, the schoolboard association read a statute, made a recommendation. This particular one came to Campbell Shatley as it always does and they were like we don't like that. So I lost the thread of your question. That's what's different about this one. >> And it it was the school board's association who said we we would recommend you add this. That's the entity
185that said add that language. >> Just Okay. >> Okay. Liza, you get to talk. >> Um, I just wanted to clarify and and recognizing that Mr. Estabbo is not part of the meeting tonight that um at our So, if we're basically saying that the purple language is a strike through and Mr. Sabbo reviews it and says, "Well, I I do want it." Does it then bump it back to first read? >> Um, okay. Okay, Anna's going to correct me. It goes on to second read. Okay, Anna, do we have a formal vote at first read? You'd think I'd know by now. It's [clears throat] just consensus. >> Yeah, you don't have a formal vote at first read. You just have consensus to move it to second read >> and then it gets voted on at
186second read. >> Yes. >> Okay. So, Liza, the answer to your question is right now I heard from a majority of you that you don't want the purple language, which means we could move on regardless. I mean, even if Pepe were here and against it, the consensus is that it moves forward and he can always vote against it on second read. >> Okay. But it remains on first read for next week's meeting. >> No. >> Um well, first read is tonight and it'll show up in January on second read. >> When we didn't want shows up on >> No, no, no. The policy 2127. >> I don't think we need to have it on at all because the only amendment is language we're not approving. I wasn't. Okay. So, sorry, Amy. >> Yes. >> Is
187that true then that if we say we don't want the purple language, we don't need to do anything. >> Well, then you wouldn't be making any policy changes. But to Liza's point, if a board member then, you know, wanted to readress that and propose changes, they can always bring that forward again um if that's something they desired to do and bring it to the board to see if the board was interested in making those changes at that point. But no, if you guys are saying you're not going to make changes to this policy, there's nothing to read. >> I mean, >> I would like to ensure that Mr. Sabbo's voice is is heard in this discussion. >> So that's that's the only reason that I asked. [snorts] >> I will offer that it would surprise
188me greatly, >> right, >> if Sabbo wanted this language in. >> I agree. I so I gota it I'm speaking this to say though Liza it he's not here and we have a majority including you who said we don't wish to include this language and so a majority of the board has spoken and he can come back and express concerns about that but I don't I don't think board members get to just have an opinion when it's not going to change the outcome personally like I I mean we can hear from him. But the majority is saying we don't like this language. >> And I'm also mindful that we've we've been in a place before where we we push something >> and then the pushing it muddles. So I'm where the only change to this
189policy is this addition where on first read >> at least we know six of seven board members don't want to see this go forward. I would hate to see this go on second read. >> Yeah. >> Because that's what would happen right now is we say let's take it off. us not have it on second read. That way we don't inadvertently push it forward. Yeah. >> Thank you. >> Other questions about first read policies? >> Question about 3220. >> 3220. Did you say Liza? >> Yes. >> Okay. Um I was curious about under section D um the bring your own technology initiative um the portion that's that has the striketh through um that says the plan should require a written agreement for the use of personal technology devices from each student and staff member who
190wishes to participate in the BYOT initiative. I [snorts] was I was curious why that part was was recommended for strikethrough. I think that one was because um that would bring your own that would require us to have an agreement for every individual who brings their cell phone including staff. I see. I can just I could see that, you know, it could be beneficial for students to have the option to use their own technology and and teachers as well. But when we talk about using cell phones, then I I know that can become really timeconuming. >> And was that striketh through recommended by the school board's association? >> That striketh through came um through curriculum and instruction. Okay. >> Yeah, it is. >> And every every state I mean we provide devices. I mean it it's
191not inhibiting them from accessing um technology for instructional purposes. >> And I don't read it. I mean I don't read that they can't bring their own device. It just I read that they just don't need an individual agreement to use their own device. >> That's right. Does that not open up the potential for using the their personal devices in ways that aren't appropriate or conducive to learning? [snorts] >> Well, they shouldn't have their device during the school day. And Anna's going to >> Well, I mean, the rest of the policy would still stand, but also all of the same firewalls and everything that we have in place would still be effective um whether they sign a written agreement or not. Um so I don't really think it would change whether they were, you know, doing
192something inappropriate or not or our response or our ability to respond if that happened. >> Okay. And I, you know, I recognize that each school has a technology agreement and I I I guess I'm just curious if that applies to personal devices as well. Liza, do you mean what like at the start of every year students and parents sign agreeing to use technology responsibly? That's what you're talking about. This the technology agreement that we all sign. >> Yes. Yeah, I know what you're talking about. And so the idea is that applies to any technology whether it's issued by the district or it's you're using it your cell phone on a school campus at lunchtime or in the halls between classes because when you log on to our Wi-Fi it can monitor where like if you're
193logged in to ours they can monitor where you are going. So >> I guess I'm I'm asking more about like responsible technology use without the without the formality of an agreement particular to having a personal device, but just that the the blanket technology agreement that Rebecca described as, you know, the the parent and student or caregiver and student signed sheet at the beginning of each school year. Does that apply to all personal devices whether they're on Wi-Fi or not? >> It's a good point. The internet access is obviously a primary component, but it wouldn't Liza's bringing up whether it whether you're on the internet. Sorry, I'm losing my words, Liza, but you're saying even if you're not on the internet, >> I mean, whether they're whether they're on the Asheville City Schools internet or not,
194if they're utilizing their own technology on a school campus or in, you know, school related activities, I forget the wording on the technology agreement that >> I signed most recently, but um you know, just ensuring that that that those agreements signed by caregivers and children at the beginning of each school also apply to their personal devices, whether they're using them for educational purposes or between classes or at the beginning and end of the school day, but that it encompasses responsible use of of personal devices as well, regardless of how they're connected to the internet. So I have the Liza [clears throat] I have the responsible technology use and internet safety agreement for students pulled up and it does represent it does reference cell phones or other electronic or digital devices. So it does make reference
195to their cell phones. >> Okay. >> Um and when it outlines specifically what students you know they will adhere to the ACS technology resource guidelines. they will communicate respectfully and appropriately using the internet and social media through cell phones or other electronic or digital devices. And then it goes I mean and then it just it there's a a series of bulleted items that that they will adhere to. >> Okay. And yeah, I just wanted to be sure that that that was covered um just after reading that strikethrough section. So, thank you. >> You're welcome. Other policies, board members, that was a lot. >> Um, can I ask a question about a read read only or information only policy? Okay. Um, [clears throat] gender, where did I go? Sorry. Gender support guidelines 7 1710p. >> Mhm.
196>> Um, just a question about language. >> [clears throat] >> the in the definitions and terminology, gender expression. Are we are we writing those definitions or is it someone else writing those definitions? >> So, these are all exactly what it said before, but because you remember a few months ago we pulled them um and so that we could review legally, but yeah, that hasn't changed. I'm not sure. The reason the reason I'm asking is under gender expression um we're working with the binary still the way a person expresses gender to others in ways that are socially defined as either masculine or feminine. Um whereas in the next paragraph down under gender identity we recognize that there are um that there is there's it's not a binary. So I just want to tee that up. >>
197Yep. Thank you for Thank you for amplifying that, George. Other questions about the information only procedures? Okay. Are we ready to move on to contracts and memorandums of understanding? I will still leave it with Kim Deckant. >> So, um you have a list of the contracts. Um one is the Asheville Middle School DC trip because of the volume of money for the trip. Um and then there's the information only and then fourus. Um, one of those is for the alumni center, the other four for our partnerships with the universities in order for us to place student teachers. And so if you have any questions about the Asheville Middle School um contract, um, Mr. Johnson is here to answer any specific questions that you might have because I know he's eager to get this going. [laughter
198and clears throat] I'm seeing no questions which I'm interpreting as approval. Liza, any questions about the Young's transportation contract? >> No, I actually No, I do I do have a question. So the the cost per student that that covers solely transportation. Uh that is a great question. That covers everything. So that is hotel, that is transportation, that is any type of like food expense on the whole trip. Um, so when we do our parent night, we tell them that if you want to send your kid with extra money, that is fine, but they can do this whole trip with what you've paid upfront. >> So this this contract requires board approval because of the the total cost of the trip, but but the contract is only with Young Transportation. >> So Liza, Young Transportation does
199more than just transportation. >> Mhm. When you contract with them, you get the tour guide, you get the tickets to the museum. Mr. Johnston's nodding at me. So I >> Okay. >> It it is not they are not just the bus. >> Okay. >> They do, >> right? I mean, so >> think of it as an all-inclusive trip. >> Yeah. >> They're acting as a tour operator, not just a bus service. >> Correct. >> Got it. Thank you. >> Yeah. >> I really love this itinerary. It's really amazing. So super cool. >> Yeah, we've added um and that was through Youngs too was their suggestion, but the um Greensboro part of the trip, that's a new addition for us this year. So we're really excited about that. >> Um Mr. Johnson, I just have two
200somewhat related questions. 225 students comprises what portion of eighth all eighth graders? >> I mean about how many are going to go? >> 80. I think that's That is exactly 90%. >> Okay. And just to because we always like to say it out loud. What if students cannot cover the cost of $592? >> Um I think the individuals I think it's going to be 602 at that rate with uh the 10 comps or the comps per 10 person per 10 students. Um but regardless um who sorry I was thinking about all those numbers. What was your question again? [laughter] >> And I didn't I said it poorly cuz >> yes >> oh scholarships right. Yeah we fund raise for all of that. Um so in a normal year it's somewhere between 15 and $25,000 that's
201fundraised so that any student can go regardless of costs. >> Thank you. >> And there'll be opportunities for board members to participate in fundraising. We can always make sure there is. >> We can go hear great music. >> I know >> that's one of the fundraisers. >> That's an easy way to support. >> So, this would be the the one contract of all the ones on the list that would be on the agenda next Monday. And I'm looking at board members. Are we okay it being on the consent agenda? And I can reach out to Pepe and if it's not okay with him, we can not have it on the consent agenda. But those that I see here seem to be in agreement with the contract. Okay. >> I am as well. >> She just
202said she was. >> Um, any other questions about the other information only contracts memorandums of understanding? All right. Board members, anything else you wish to say in open session before there's a motion to move to close session? Is there a Oh, I got to read something, don't I? The chair will entertain a motion for the board of education to enter into a close session pursuant to general statute 143-1811 for the following purposes. Under subsection A1 to prevent the disclosure of privileged confidential personnel information pursuant to general statute 115 C 319 through 321 and under subsection A3 to discuss matters protected by the attorney client privilege. >> So moved. >> Second. >> All in favor? I >> I >> um we will now move into closed session. Thank you everyone else for being here.