001Mhm. >> Mhm. >> All right. Good evening, everyone. Good evening. Good evening. In accordance with the Open Public Meeting Act, N.J.S.A. 10:4-6, and a written notification of this meeting has been provided by advertising in the Record and the Herald News, posting notice in the Board of Education Administration Building, and filing notice with the City Clerk to ensure accessibility and interpreter services are available upon request. Please submit your written request at least 24 hours prior to the Board meeting to the School Business Administrator, Dr. Steven A. Lewis at steven.lewis l.e.w.i.s @hackensackschools.org. I hereby call to order the special meeting on Wednesday, April 8th, 2026 in the Carina building at 6:19 p.m. 6:19 p.m. Dr. Lewis, can you please do a roll call? Trustee Alston Archer. Present. Trustee Alston Archer. Present. Trustee Carroll. Present. Trustee Gilmore. Here.
002Trustee Jones. Here. Trustee Johnson. Present. Trustee Stern. Here. Vice President Martin. Present. President Harris. Present. We have a quorum. Thank you. Please stand for the flag salute. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Be seated. Okay. So, we are going to begin immediately with public comments. Public participation shall be governed by the following rules. One, if in person, a participant must sign the sign-in sheet and be recognized by the presiding officer and must preface comments by an announcement of his or her name, municipality of residence, and group affiliation, if applicable. Two, each statement made by a participant shall be limited to a 3-minute duration during the public session. Three, all statements,
003questions, or inquiries shall be directed to the presiding officer and any questions or inquiries directed by a participant participant to another board member shall be redirected to the presiding officer who shall determine if such statement, question, or inquiry shall be addressed by the presiding officer on behalf of the board or by the individual board member. And four, all board and/or acting superintendent responses to questions or inquiries shall be held until the end of public participation. At this time public comments shall be open to anyone in person. Anyone in person that would like to speak. Just step over here. Right in the middle between those two chairs, please. Yes, yeah, that is a sign-in sheet right there. Thank you. Can I sit so that they can see who I am? Sure, I guess. Hi, my name
004is Kylie Silverstein. Uh we're at 234 Pleasant Plains in Hackettstown. Uh I have like a whole thing written out. And I'm not going to read it because I think it comes across really angry and frustrated and that is not my intention. And I have a feeling because I know a lot of you and I've sat in this room with a lot of you before, I believe that we're all here for the same reasons. And that is for our kids and our families and our teachers and our schools. Uh So, being a part of the school community, I have a child who is in kindergarten at Fairmont currently. Uh Fairmont. Uh and I have another child who will be entering the school system in the fall in pre-K 3. Um I want to be really excited
005to be sending our kids here and for the first time I don't feel that way. Uh I think the big reason is because as a parent I don't feel like I know what's going on. Uh there's been a lot of talk on part of the PTA. You know, that everybody talks, right? At playgrounds, all over, and people are scared. They're pretty scared. Uh things are happening at school without notice. And especially as a parent of a young child who's in a classroom with five and six-year-olds, right? And uh the parent is not there anymore, right? And that happened overnight. And I know you're all here because you want what's best for our kids, but that's not what's best for our kids. They need consistency, they need routine, and what's developmentally right for them is to
006have the same thing happening for them every day. And I know we're in a huge crisis, and like nobody expects miracles to happen, right? But what we do expect is a little notice so that we can prepare ourselves, so that we can process in our brains and our bodies what's going on, and we can prepare our kids so that they're not totally thrown by what's happening, right? My second concern is an issue of safety, just physical safety, right? You know, in a kindergarten class, there is 20 ish kids, and if there's one adult, and I know it happens, and it's possible, and I have full faith in our teachers that they can do everything that we ask. Not that Sorry, not that they shouldn't have to, but but we have been practicing fire drills and
007safety drills and that has been like two adults in the classroom in all of those times, right? And so we're relying on two adults in the classroom to get those children out of the building if they need to or to fight them if they need to or whatever the circumstance requires. And now we're relying on one. It scares me to think what could happen with that. So, again, I believe in all of you. I believe in our school system. I believe in our kids and our staff and we all want what's best to them and I just I beg you to please consider consistency, transparency. Very important. Not just for kindergarten, our babies, but across the board. Thank you. Thank you. Anyone else in person that would like to speak? Is it we get some
008questions? I'm sorry. Will there be time for questions? Asking if she can ask questions. Ask questions. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, this is the time. Yes. This is questions, concerns, comments. Yeah, I think I'm just curious. Oh, I apologize. I live post 319 Clinton Place, Hackettstown. So, um I this is brand new to me. I just heard this this evening and I'm in shock that the paras are leaving the kindergarten and I just want to know what happened to uh the designated money that came from the council. Was that not to tide us over until the next school year. I I just don't understand what's going on. And um any and I have to echo Ali's uh opinion about being a wish we need notice. Um so I'm I'm kind of in shock and I just
009heard this this evening. So I'm wondering what's going on. I know I I'd like Ali I have total faith in you guys. Um you're my favorite people here. So I believe in you and I just want to know what you know and what can we do as a community. Thank you Tim. Okay. Thank you. Anyone else in person that would like to speak? Okay. So now that there are none in person in this poll so we're going to move to online. Hi, good evening. Um Sue A. I'm hoping I hope you can hear me. Yes. Okay. So I guess I'm kind of jumping on the bandwagon here with the kindergarten. Um I'm curious to know what your projected uh enrollment is in each kindergarten class next year. Oh, um questions will be answered at the
010end. Okay, because I know according to state statute depending on um whether we're considered an at-risk district or not, there are limits as to 21 if you're considered an at-risk district and 25 if you are not. And so I'm curious to know where we're looking at um the enrollment falling. I've also heard rumors that the district is filing waivers uh to allow larger kindergarten classes and at the same time removing the paras. Um and I'm just curious as to are we considered an at-risk district? Will we be limited to 21 or are we not? In case which case kindergarten will be 25? What you're projecting the enrollment in kindergarten to be for next year? And um if you're if you're expecting one person to have a class of five to six-year-olds, 25 of them then
011I would say clearly you've never been in the position to have to do it. I'm a retired high school teacher. There's a reason why I taught high school. I give all credit to the people who do the early childhood. And I would recommend that each of you before you make these decisions on the kindergarten, go down and help out in the kindergarten. Be the teacher for an hour by yourself. And then see if it's a wise move to remove the paras. Because I I have to echo what um Haley was saying, what Andy is saying. This is not a good move. And I realize that we have an issue with enroll with um money. But again, safety and educating kids. If you have 25 five- and six-year-olds and one teacher, nobody's learning anything and these
012are critical formative years. This is laying the foundation for success in the future. So if you could get me that information, I'd appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. Can you hear me? Yes. Good evening. Good evening. My name is Jessica Cruz, Nellie K. Parker PTA president and parent of a pre-K 4 at Nellie K. Um truthfully, I didn't sleep last night when I found out about the paras. The thought of my 4-year-old daughter being in a class of I don't know what, is it 25? Is it 20, 30? And not having any support for that teacher is devastating to me because she I I was already worried about my special needs son next year with with everything that the the district is going through, but I at least thought that, you know, my my gen
013ed kid would be okay. And thinking of my little one being in a class with other students who have maybe no school never been in school before. Um and you a lot of times in kindergarten you also have students who may need to be classified, but we don't know it yet. And having one person there to attend to all of their needs, plus my little one is is scary to me. I'm I'm worried for her for the first time, and I am Nellie K. Parker, Hackensack Public Schools heart and soul. We'll work till 5:00 a.m. if it means it's for the kids and for my family and for my community, but for the first time if if I'm going to look at my little one being in a class of 30 with one teacher I'm
014I I may have to start looking at other options. You know, my neighbor across the street has a kindergartner in the charter school. They have one teacher to powers 25 kids. That sounds better to me than my daughter being in a class of 30 with no paras. So, I I really do encourage you to consider you know, we want people to stay in district, and Nellie K. is an amazing place, and we have such amazing staff and administration, but if we don't have the tools to give them what they need to do what they need to do, our kids are going to suffer. And I I can imagine my daughter's real first foundational year in kindergarten being uh just such a such so uncertain. And I'm really really really concerned and I hope that this
015can be reconsidered and that it's not as bad as my my brain is going, but that's how the pre-K parents feel right now. That's how the kindergarten parents feel right now. And you know, I just hope that you as you have in the past been very transparent, that you continue to be transparent and there's a way to continue to give our kids continuity. Thank you. Hi, my name is Chris. Can you guys hear me? Yes, good evening. Okay, hi. My name is Christine Katona. I have a kindergartner in Hillers and I'm actually just appalled to hear from none of you guys, but from my 5-year-old son last night that his aide, Ms. Margaret, who's wonderful, is no longer in his classroom. We had no notice from the principal, no notice from the board to hear
016from my child that his teacher now has 20-plus kids alone is just completely appalling. That's no way to treat your staff, number one. They work extremely hard and now to have them completely alone with no help, I don't think any of you have been in a kindergarten class to see how unsafe that is, not only for the children's education, but for the safety. Today I had to pick my son up early and no adult walked him to the door. You know who it was? Another student helper, another 5-year-old roaming the halls because now there's no teacher to help walk him to the door. It's also a safety issue. My son fell in the bathroom last week because of water and nobody was there as it is. What if a kid is bleeding? What if a
017kid is injured? Who will help him? The teacher is trying to teach. This is not the age group that somebody should be stripped away from. And I just want to know why kindergarten. There are so many other positions if you need to make budget cuts that can be done. They are the most important people, the power professionals to our schools and you are not treating them as such. They are not disposable. So, you please need to reconsider for our children and the teachers. Thank you. Hi, my name is Gwenny Burt. Hopefully, you can hear me. Yes, good evening. Good evening. I am a lifelong resident of Hackensack, New Jersey. A um proud comment. Part of clergy in the community as well as other organizations and a kindergarten teacher. Um I have to say that it
018was very difficult to have to explain to my kindergarten class that one of our paras wouldn't be with us anymore. Um and to get them to understand that it wasn't a bad thing, which was difficult to say. Um I think my largest concern was the fact that parents were not informed. And to hear have parents hear it from their kids, I'm sure was overwhelming. Um so, I guess I'm curious as to this point how um if this is how we're handling moving people and the things that are coming up, um what kind of communication is going to be made to parents as well as the community to inform them of what is happening because it is overwhelming. Very much so. To walk in and find out that 2 days later um you're not going to
019have part of the staff that you need to help keep your classroom going. I teach an inclusion class. That is a major major major change for the kids that are in my class. And it was just very disheartening for it to be done that way. I do understand that at least I believe that it's not the principal's responsibility to inform parents. To me it sounds more like it should come from someone else. And so I'm hoping that um a light bulb has gone on and we're going to look at how we're going to communicate this information as difficult as it might be. The community and parents need to know what's going on. Thank you, ma'am. Good evening. My name is Matt Holmes. Um I'm discouraged. Um I've not had the uh most confidence inspiring experience
020so far with the administration in the school district. Um the fact that you put teachers um one in the position that you're removing resources from their classroom um and then made it their responsibility to notify families is unconscionable as a as a leader. Um if you are trained educators and administrators and professionals um the responsibility lies with you. Um not only to make the decision but also to stand behind it and to be the one notifying folks uh of the decision you've made. Um you've left notification to the classroom teacher um after you're pulling resources away from them in a classroom that's been identified as needing this resource. So, what's changed in that classroom where the once needed resource is no longer needed? You didn't put those power professionals in the classroom because there was
021a surplus. You identified a need for them. And as far as I can see, as far as the academic needs of the students, there's been no change. Uh but you're removing a resource. And I can't imagine that this decision was made this week uh or yesterday, but that's when we found out about it. So, um you need to do better. Thank you. At At this time, the public comment section is closed. Um I would definitely like to address some of the concerns that uh the public has mentioned. Um and I I would definitely say if we could just start um off with the power situation, um so that we can address that. Thank you. So, um Miss Andrea Hochman. I'm not sure how much I can share because some of it is personnel, so I'm
022not sure how much I can share. But, I do want to apologize because the last minute notice, and it was a two-day notice. You're absolutely right. There should have been more time for transition. And in terms of the communications, it's difficult to share everything because some things I just cannot share. Um but you're absolutely right with the communications. And going forward, I I I listened to what you had to say about kindergarten. There have been practices where kindergarten parents I've been in classrooms uh for years. There was a certain practice that was supposed to happen that when you got to a certain number, that's when you would get a parent educator. I was a principal at the time. And at a certain number, I was only allowed to have a parent. So, I just want
023to clarify that that every kindergarten class does not receive a parent. Uh but I guess over the years, things don't get monitored. You know, we're we're fiscally at least we thought fiscally sounds. And so, it was a luxury. But, it's no longer a luxury. And so, that's what we have to look at. And as I listened to you and many of the parents on the call saying, "Well, kindergarten is the foundation." So, we're willing to maybe sacrifice parents at the kindergarten level. And what I would say to you is when we look at this for next year, if we're going to add somewhere, we're going to have to subtract somewhere. And that's another thing that never It didn't happen, and it's no one No one's blame because we all think that we're okay. But, we're
024not okay. We take these things into consideration, but I have to be very, you know, firm to say if we add, something is getting subtracted. And whatever gets subtracted, either the teachers or the parents will be here for for that. But I encourage you and we will definitely take what you said into consideration. There's one more thing I'm I have a question about projected classroom size for kindergarten. So we I I believe that was um Sue A. Yes. And so it's a projected enrollment. There's high poverty districts and there's a certain certain stature about the number of students. 25 is correct. For full transparency, class sizes will be larger. And the reason they will be larger is because we have a budget deficit. And if we continue the way we are with smaller class sizes,
025we cannot meet the budget deficit. And that's the reality. The class sizes are going to be larger in elementary school, junior middle school, and in high school. So I want to be very transparent about that. The reason that you have not received information, aside from the kindergarten situation, that's should have received information and I take full responsibility for that. That it happened quickly. The reason you're not receiving information about everything that's going to happen is because we don't want to send out a letter and parents swear premature about class sizes, about changes because it's ongoing. When you have a situation like this where unfortunately our staff are losing their jobs and also it affects the continued staff, there's a a of moving parts. So what I don't want to do is send out one thing
026and then say, "Oops, this is going to change." Or say, "Oh, we're not going to be able to have this program now when I told you you were going to be able." So, that's what we're waiting for. Um so, I absolutely um I understand I've been in a kindergarten class that probably tell you that mistakes aren't anything. That's true. And you're right. And it's what's unfortunate is that changes is going to be different next year. It is going to be difficult. And we've been used to a certain lifestyle that I would love for us to have, but we just can't have it. So, once again, I apologize. I take full responsibility uh for the communications. Tomorrow, I will revisit this with my team and that's all I can say. Um one of the other questions
027um the money that the council gave us, uh where did that go? If that went towards the Paris, save the Paris, and what can we do as a community? So, that So, in that resolution, it said to not disrupt. So, March 31st, we were going to lose a significant amount of staff. And that was going to require changes in class size, changes in teachers, this year, uh different transfers, a lot. And that was the major disruption. But, what I think now is this is being interpreted as a disruption. Like again, this personal reasons. It's it is a disruption. It's like, but it's a reassignment. So, and I That's as much as I can tell you right now. I'm going to try to grant something for you that I can give you as much information as
028possible. So, no one is losing their position this year. That is that is in H A what was promised. But and I can't promise you that there won't be other reassignments. I would I really can't. We want you to be transparent because we just can't. There's a part where we still have to be fiscally responsible in the slight safety and not being able to have what we had, especially kindergarten, but at the same time we are still in this budget season and we still need to be fiscally responsible in this 25-26 school year. What what I don't want to happen is when we get ordered it this year that they say we left in a deficit because we're trying to do things to save money, but it's not on the backs of students. It's just
029that's what we're trying to do. All right. I'm going to I hope that you got that at least satisfied. So, right now. Thank you. Um I believe that was it with the questions. Um so, one thing I do want to mention before we go into executive so that um board members are aware and the public is aware as well. Um normally we would just go right into executive to discuss personnel, but there are some things that we do have going on that can only be discussed in public. It can't be discussed in in closed session. So, one of the things that just recently happened is yesterday, right? I keep forgetting it. Yes, it was yesterday. Um Ms. Andrea Ost Parchment did address the district staff at a staff meeting. Um it was done partially in
030person and partially um live stream live streams. Thank you. And the other thing that we also want to discuss was the um that our budget was rejected by the county superintendent. And we'll be discussing that in public today. So, I'm going to give it up to Ms. Andrea Sportsman if you could discuss first the staff meeting and what you discussed there and then um the budget. Thank you. Yeah, I forgot I remember what I wanted to say about and also any staff who are listening, especially our kindergarten teachers, uh if you were not afraid, please accept our apologies. We all understand. My apologies. So, yesterday I met with the staff because I want to always be transparent and what I said to them is that I did not want to send emails, especially at a
031time like this. Want to keep it as personal and not impersonal as possible. So, I had to share with the staff the timeline and what is going to happen now. But this we do know at the end of the year we will be um losing some of many of our qualified dedicated staff. So, what I shared with them is what's going to happen beginning next week. So, there there's no surprise. And I shared that in this letter I followed up with a written a memo to all the staff today. That next Thursday, Friday connected staff members will be notified by either their principal or their direct supervisor or the acting superintendent depending on who this affects regarding the reduction of their position for the 2026-2027 school year. Friday, all district staff, all of us will
032receive written notices because as I said to you, this is an ongoing situation and things could continue to change. Wednesday, April 22nd, the Board of Ed, it is anticipated that the Hackensack Board of Education will take action on the recommended reductions and reloads. And on Thursday, April 23rd, formal notice of the BOA action will be hand-delivered to the affected staff by a principal. And why I spoke to them now because who wants to receive, as sometimes it happens in other industries, a letter saying that you're not going to be working with us. That's That's not how we do this in Hackensack. We're different with different courtesy. And then May and June, as I said to you, it's because of the number of the reduction in force, there will be anticipated reduction in there will be
033anticipated reassignments of staff. And that's going to happen as well. That's going to be in May and June and that will be communicated by the appropriate supervisor. And I guess I'll go right into why our budget goals were rejected. >> So, before we go over to that, just so that board members know, if you have any questions that are not related to personnel, to the budget, this is your opportunity to ask. You cannot ask those type of questions in executive session. So, as much information that you can give us and as much questions that you can ask so that you have clarity. Okay, Um this is a time test. >> And then finally people and then finally I I I mentioned to the staff that throughout the situation with our budget and this may entail
034even more reductions based on what we received from the county superintendent. So, this letter was addressed to me and to our uh business administrator Dr. Lewis. Um Patrick Fletcher who was executive superintendent of schools for Bergen County. For the Department of Education, New Jersey Department of Education. Mr. Archment and Dr. Lewis, this is a follow-up to our discussion. Please be aware that our office cannot approve your budget submission as is and there were two reasons why. Number one, you all know you remember me presenting the corrective action plan and in that corrective action plan in order to make up for the deficit, we had to come up with $9.1 million. We had to borrow from ourselves, but we now have to pay it back. There was a question about whether we had to pay back
035starting next year or the following year. But it was very clear as it was on the letter, it was this year. That was that payback was not included. It's $2 million. Um it's $1.8 million each year. Mr. Archment, I'm sorry to interrupt. Do you have copies of that email by any chance? Yes, I had it for you. Yes, can we have Yes, yes. Thank you. And also the proposed budget does not contain significant reductions to adequately address the current deficit of 17 million. So, we have four cuts today. Return. So, that was the that is the status of That's our budget update. I have a question. Um Did they not tell us that it had to be paid back this year on the the reserves that we were taking out? Yes, they said it. They
036did? >> Yes. But we still factored it in? Like they prior to this, I'm saying when we took the money, were we told that it had to be paid back this year? They didn't tell us it had to be paid back when we took the money, but it was in the letter. It was The letter that they made. The letter that they sent to us initially. Initially what >> Initially it was Right, but there was a question that arose from, you know, there was a question that arose that we didn't think that we had to pay it back this year. That we had This not this year, but that's 20 26 27. Just to follow up on that, um so why was there no follow up from the business office um in terms of, you
037know, confirming whether or not that being needed to be included in 26 27 budget? We did. We we followed the business office as well as our consultant. But followed up with who? Because then it was rejected, you know, for not including We followed up with Patrick Fletcher. I think she's saying that prior prior to the meeting the budget. Yeah. We were told that the money had to be paid back this year and we didn't follow up so Right. Why didn't we follow up? Right. Before submitting the budget, why wasn't that confirmed by the business office? It was Yes, you can It was a technicality involved and that borrowed the money from ourselves. How much was it used in the 2015-2016 year? If it wasn't a substantial amount it would automatically folks follow be claimed the
038following year. Someone in Trenton came out and said no and said Trenton and that's how we got notified that we we haven't included and I had conversations and you let him present and with the board attorney that we should appeal that ruling. And we we just needed to more facts. The document on which of that money was used. So because we don't I don't I personally don't have to think we have to pay back the same year that you used the money. And they want us to pay back all the money that they they took the total amount of 9 million and change. I think and I think so it's the Bible saying that everybody you have to pay back everything every each year. So it's up to me and so we're going to send
039it to the to the commissioner. Uh and all that tax collection the commissioner know about so so But if they if they overrule us, yes we still have to pay back then. So how is that What's the timeline on something like that? Obviously the budget needs to be submitted at two but it's kind of waiting for this, right? So what is that something that they expedite because they know that? I hope so. I just started not going to have anything. But as it stands now, it's back in the incentive budget. It's for him. It's in the budget. It's in the So So, could there be a situation where we somehow make all these cuts and do all these things, taking into account we have to pay back this 9.1 million dollars, then it gets turned
040over, and then we're going back again and changing the riffs, or is that something that cuz it makes it so fluid, right? Like if it gets overturned, that changes everything, right? Well, it's in the budget now because they sent back to us so it's in the budget. The repayment is in the budget, okay? But That's the one point thing. Yes, it's it's It's in the budget and well we still the full transparency, we're still looking to make up We have more we have to We have to one way or another. You know, you will be out you will go into a deficit. And if you go into a deficit you will get a slow monitor. So I but we're working on it. This This question, does that 9.2 million So it's 5.4 million that we
041have to pay back, but a smaller of the reserves we don't. So it's 5.4 divided by 3. Okay, so 1.8. Okay, so on top of that says here number two, we also had um This um sufficient deductions wasn't adequate. What's that? So on top of that. Yes. So, how do we send in this uh budget you go to consultant with inadequate numbers. Having So, so the answer the county superintendent wants to see more cuts. Uh that's what the county advisor is. He was very clear. He said, "Your expected expenses that's under 174 million, you wanted to see 22 million dollars of cuts rather than what we did where the massive cuts and increasing revenue." He He was concentrating on the expense side and said he wanted to see additional cuts. And that's why And that's
042why he said it in the statement that they would not submit additional um reductions. Is there a question with the revenue that we put in the budget? Is that what it was concerned about the cuts? Or was it Is the revenue cut dry yet with definitely getting this money to balance out the cuts? Or was that in question? The revenue Some of the revenue identified was not guaranteed revenue. That was So, that was So, when you're building a budget you you look to see where income and revenue fall to. And just with any kind of organization or business, you have the anticipated revenue. That's when you're you're looking at what your anticipated expenses are. You can't guarantee that your expenses are going to be this amount cuz you might close the budget early. You going
043to reduce the amount of expenses and as well as you look to see what kind of revenue you can be bringing into the district. And what we did was when building this, we are sort of around 1.8 to 1.9 of anticipated revenue from a partnership with the church. And that's having open classrooms. That's looking at bringing students back into the district, reducing the amount of funds going out to external uh organizations. And that's what that was comprised of. When it comes to what the superintendent said, he didn't want us to have that cuz it's not the guarantee. So, we have to go by the county superintendent's uh suggestion. Suggestion or or what he feels that fits, and that's what we have to do. So, how much of how much of this um anticipated revenue that
044didn't work out? How How much of that was that we have to now supply? Right. That was approximately 1.9. How much? Approximately 1.9 million. On top of the 1.8 for the Yes. And And um my question uh you know, just I know that we have been communicating with the county superintendent's office throughout this time since we first submitted our our cap. Um and just wondering why some of these issues were not addressed in those conversations before we actually submitted the formal preliminary budget. Like, can we try to make up this deficit with a mix of revenue and expenses? That would have been a very simple response from him where he would have said, "I want to see that this is guaranteed revenue or you know, fixed expense cuts." Um because you know, the we already
045started off in a very precarious situation. And so, given the gravity of you know, the the preparing the budget, getting it right, I just I think that's there's probably going to be another there's general frustrations like there was a poor communication in actually preparing the budget before it was submitted to the county. The bottom line is that this this reflects the sense in this but it really was expected. Is if you have a $24 million deficit just forget the revenue. If the budget was 550 million I want to see 525 million whatever. See it reduced by 24 million bucks. You're welcome. That's that's that's just the bottom line so the and so the revenue part and I've got the lawyers can can speak to that. But I I will say though I you know just
046to kind of piggyback off of what Trustee Hamza is saying um about the county superintendent. I I I am disappointed in in the fact that our county superintendent has been involved from the very beginning in this process knowing from the moment we had a deficit that there was an issue has met with us in several different groups and committees and has explained to us what is it that we need to do, how much we need to cut, what is a liable revenue source and and I and it almost sounds as if we did not follow some of those recommendations or ignored those recommendations or kind of threw certain things in there in hopes that it would pass and now we're pushed back. And he also gave us an extension. On top of that. That that
047an additional extension. So, in terms of our Q sack, right? Because he knew we were in this issue with the deficit. So, now we have another deadline of May 6th. Where we have to present a budget and and I'm I'm concerned that we're not going to have enough time. So, I think I have to say this. We're being asked to rectify as everyone around the order to present presented a situation that has been occurring for over 4 years. And we now here are being asked to rectify this by decimating this district. There were also other options. As we went along, but we know there could have been options that as in the public forum, I think I we received what we did from the city council, but there were other options too that as we
048go along with the law were late. But we can't perform miracles. This is what we have. And this was since 2021. And now it comes to light thank God by our assistant business administrator when I first took office that we have this and it grew from a small amount of $300 to now what we have here. And what is we're doing what we can do. But this is what we were tasked and and I accepted a position to be tasked with that. And I'm here to do it. But this is what it is. And there's still a a lot of money. There's still a deficit now because of these reductions. And we're going to have to discuss what we're going to do next. So thank you. >> I I just needed to say that because
049this is not something that happened in 20 or 25 June 18th. Wait. Wait. And This happened in >> And I think we we all acknowledge, you know, that this is there is no handbook for how you deal with a massive school deficit, especially a deficit that as you said has been building up for years due to um you know, mismanagement, fiscal mismanagement, poor leadership decisions from within the administration, and from prior board leadership. Um I think everybody acknowledges that. I think there is a level of frustration because for example, you mentioned um you know, possibly um considering a public question. We were only presented with that option the day before a board meeting where we had had to vote on something that we had no information on because um because the business office did not
050know what the deadlines were that they were that week. So I want to make that very clear. That was not a decision that we automatically ruled out. We were left with no time. Um so that that just needs to be clear in the public record. Yeah. >> I I'm sorry. I do want to make it clear that was It's a business office situation. When we received the information from the county superintendent, we provided it to the board president that same day. So, it was not that the business office did not um hold anything from the board members or did not provide it when had it been not known that information or the scheduling, that is not an accurate statement. So, I just wanted to let you folks know that was all. >> But, there are
051people in the business office that have had experience with public questions, you know, in the past. So, everybody is aware that there are four deadlines throughout the year, you know, within the state for public questions. So, that, you know, How did it sneak up? >> Yeah, it definitely did. >> a calendar at home that I got from the county. It's on the calendar. You got to help me So, there there's a definite level of frustration, and I think we just need to put that out there. And we also, you know, acknowledging that this is such a complicated process, made sure that we got additional assistance, you know, by obtaining um a consultant to help throughout the budget process, and that's why we moved forward with that quickly before, you know, aggressively, you know, getting into
052the public the budget process. So, there there's a definite level of frustration, but at the same time acknowledging that this is this is not something that anyone um knows how to do, you know, to to navigate. Um you know, there was an an article just yesterday in the Star-Ledger citing 11 school districts, you know, including Hackettstown across the state that are navigating this same issue, and many are dealing with it in different ways. Some having to close entire school buildings, um you know, having to completely lay off a lot of staff, some having to go to major um you know, tax increases. Um so, you know, we recognize that there's no one way to deal with that. And if they leave but now, you know, with the the fact that we don't know what to
053do. I think at this point I I kind of know what to do. But you can't do it. Yeah. Cuz nobody would be here. I mean, we would have to have to be responsible. Yeah. What are we going to do? Layoff or riff for another 150? You can't. Have classrooms, have seminars, and auditoriums where 100 students in a high school are taking a band course with one teacher. Um This This is the reality. And it's been done in other districts. >> Right. Right. Uh so, yeah. It can be done. I'm not clear. >> And I don't even know if that would be enough. >> Yeah. Yeah. Just going back to the number one point in this letter. If the And I don't have the letter from February 27th in front of me. We approved to
054to borrow the the five points. Um That's like a round up 5.5 million. The timeline of how we had to pay it back. I'm I'm not clear. I know we had to pay it back. But if we use So, if we use enough of the 5.4 to shore up stuff from 25-26 school year, and the repayment would start in 26-27. But if we didn't use enough below a certain threshold, then the payback would start in 27-28. Is that what we're saying? Yeah, that's right. That's Okay. So, we did have We discussed but then were we under that I guess I'm I'm trying to understand another 1.8 million on top of everything else we're dealing with. We both we voted I voted on a preliminary budget, but I wasn't clear on this piece. Can you walk
055us through when we knew this was an issue? And was it before after we voted on the preliminary budget? It was March we received a letter that 25 26 27 the first year 27 28 everybody had the letter but and speaking to our consultant I said well that has to go in the budget. We have to pay it back and the and Mr. E has said I don't think you have to pay that back. True. So that's that's where we stand. How was that communicated to us either as a finance committee or as a full board before we voted on the preliminary budget? They have the finance people back. Looking. I think they I think they I think they said that then. I think this is an issue but I know I I know I
056spoke to the the the administration. I can't say I can't You have to ask them things. It was the finance committee. Well and as a board we voted on the preliminary budget but um not knowing that we would have to include in the budget uh this 3.1 whatever million dollars uh or 5.3 million dollars being next year's budget. No what did they did they expect the budget? The issue uh in in the There's no question that had uh I know I spoke with administration I know I spoke with I spoke with at the beginning I mentioned it I think uh the finance committee would that there's no question that money had to be returned. The question was what year was it returned so on. Correct. Right. So then we decided to do what we put
057together believing that we started paying it back the following year. As of we got the rule that they would find and then from Pat Fletcher who said no you got to take it you got to go to the meeting. And and and they That's what I feel we're going to be dealing with the board attorney once I get and and the board is the same for all of the county to be They're going to be required to pay back the next year following. But I don't know how it's going to work out. Right, so that's not a guaranteed option. Yeah. So should do we have I guess back to Mike's question before, are we waiting until we get approved or do we No no no we got to put it in the budget. Most likely
058it's in the budget. She's because I have a letter from the superintendent county superintendent saying It's got to be in the budget or he's not going to approve it. But best case scenario going back to Mike's question, I don't think it was answered before. Like if we find out that the state actually gives us that waiver and says you don't have to pay it back in this budget, what happens to that additional 1.8 million dollars worth of non-renewals that we need? So what happens to those staff? So that that that is that doesn't impact that this 1.8 this it's not impacting any All it's going to do is reduce the the number of cuts that he's saying to us to make in addition. Okay. Absolutely not. It would have absolutely have no impact. But here
059again, what we're going to be doing is moving it like to the next year. to 2007 eight Yeah, we're just moving the debt forward. We're not going to be in that situation. We're not going to start worrying because then we can determine where we're going as a financial district. But to say you're borrowing now to pay it back now That's why I said that. As I said and you from a finance Well, yes, we'll see. But I also want to say that and you know, our attorney will tell us this is statute. This is law, right? So if you're change something like this, you're changing and then it has an impact on everyone. So because this that's what the statute says. So if they get a waiver, I don't know what would happen. So um
060But in addition to this 1.8 billion What I just I'm sorry y'all. What I'm struggling with is as this is a lot Mhm. for everybody. The decisions that we have to make is a weight is a burden. It's a It's a weight to it. I want to make sure that I'm making and voting on the least damaging cuz there's going to be damage. So the least damaging thing that we can do if I'm understanding what we're saying here is that we now need to make 1.8 million more cuts. Might be human cuts or programmatic cuts or I don't know where it's coming from. than we thought what we voted on the the voted budget. Is that what we're saying? Yeah. So. That's part of it. Hold on. But it's in the budget now. So, now
061that's in the budget. >> I understand that, but in terms of what We said yes to a less conservative figure. What we should have said was we need to work with the more conservative figure. If we get it back, great, but if we don't And I the if the flow of information and how we as board members know what we're doing is critical because it's going to be bad no matter which way you slice it. But how the bad goes down if there is if there's food for the children with this medicine or not, those are the things I'm concerned about. Whatever decisions had to be made about parents and kindergarten is less an issue than how the medicine went down. And I think that there's some operational things that we're going to look at
062because this was going to be months and months and months coming of that. And how that bad gets digested is still important. And I and I'm I'm concerned that from a in full information point of view that if I don't know certain information, I can't answer a question. And if I can't ask questions, then I can't be clear on what I'm voting on. And there's so much at stake. The the weight of this is is almost paralyzing not just for my own child, but all of the kids and the adults and everybody being affected by this. There's some things we could that we need to do better in order to make sure that we're making the best decisions or at least damaging decisions possible. All right. So, communication. So, in terms of the budget at
063this point, how are we looking? How far are we? And do we expect to have the budget ready by April 22nd? Or do we need to look into having maybe a special meeting the week after? It's a valid Here's my concern. We've already stated a timeline that means that people are going to be informed about losing their job. But as a board member, I don't feel like I've seen the information that I would would want to see. The list of people who's leaving, who's staying, which buildings are affected. I'm not as I'm as interested in names, but are we clear on who where are these like who's going where before we start With the board member, I'm not clear that I'll know what that looks like before people get that infor- get that news. And
064if the budget's not due till May 6th, these people have to find out next week. What numbers are we basing that on if it's not final? I'm concerned that we're making moves, but the data's still not the the Just so you get to know, today we won't be discussing some of those things. Okay. Yeah, that's the situation. So, yeah. Um I I I don't know. Nothing. I do have one other question. Um Uh you know, just for purposes of our taxpayers, um just to confirm the the rate of the tax, the 8.9% total tax levy, that should not change, right? That that rate. That's I That's I got to say. We We've That's the maximum. So, just to confirm to folks, that tax rate will not change because there are a lot of people, you
065know, having just heard, you know, from from the city, you know, they just want to have a fun understanding on what they're, you know, they have to land for their bills. So, just want to confirm that that 8.9% is not going to increase, you know, for both That's the highest. So, I just want the public to know that that that is the maximum we can do and that that will not change. And I want want to be transparent again or I I have to say that based on the fact that we have to make additional cuts. And if it's not possible to make those cuts if this as you mentioned it'd be devastating. You know, make those cuts, then we'll be looking at something different. And what those what the differences will be, you would
066have to assess with the budget. There's still Yeah. And then uh And I can that the personnel matter. We believe that we'll have to discuss in closed session as well. Can't elaborate further because it deals with personnel. Um I apologize if I'm not understanding this. Can you explain to me um So, our current deficit is 17 million or I heard number 24 thrown out. Could you explain it to me? It's 24. It's 24. All right, so when we were at 17 for this year, I remember that numbers were thrown around that the amount of cuts that would need to be made were so great that it would be difficult to run the district, right? So, and and talk about transparency a lot, but every single person that calls in, I mean, for the past months,
067it's communication, communication, and people don't feel like they're being communicated with. And I'm not trying to say the sky is falling, but I think we need to talk about it, right? So, if we were at 17 million and we couldn't before the city gives us that 6 and 1/2 million, which you know, I've heard people say, "Oh, well, it's just for this year." Yeah, kept teachers in classrooms for kids, and that's continuity, and it's huge. Like, I can Well, people don't overlook that, like, what that gift did. That that that money um But if we couldn't find that number of people cut or it was too many people at 17 million and we're at 24, how how is I'm I'm just saying, like, I'm I'm not trying to say the sky is falling, but how
068are we I'm looking at Montclair, I'm looking at the other places. Schools are closing. And I'm not trying to panic people, but I think people want to know, like, what what are we looking at? Like, are these Or maybe in the time in your experience, is this something that you've seen that's that's that we can get through? Is this something Again, I'm not I'm not going to put that all on you. I know it's a lot of pressure. Okay, I apologize for the the thing Thanks for the anxiety and concern. Th- Th- this can be solved. But then it's going to take some hard decisions. And I think we can go a little bit more private because there's a lot of decisions we haven't discussed yet. I I think yeah, I think There's a lot
069of moving parts. So, a lot of the That's my understanding, but I Right. That's what we're talking about noodles. Right. Well, it's all good on the meeting. I just found out about parity of science. Okay. Are there any other questions regarding the budget that we can discuss in public? Anything that's related to personnel with the budget will be discussed in executive. But are there any other questions? Any concerns? Okay. All right. So, at this time we are going to move into executive session. Be it resolved that the Hackensack Board of Education determines it necessary to meet in executive session on Wednesday, April 8th, 2026 to discuss legal, personnel, student-related matters, HIB reports, negotiations, and other confidential matters. And be it further resolved that these matters will be made public when the need for confidentiality no
070longer exists. Can I have a motion to go into executive, please? And motion by Vice President Morgan, second second by Trustee Stein. All those in favor say aye. Anyone opposed? Any abstentions? Okay. Thank you very much. All right. So, so that the public is aware we're going into executive. Um when we come out there, no action will be taken. So, the video will be done and there will be no board comments at the end as well. Okay. Thank you all for joining us and have a good evening. Good night, everyone. >> We'll see you when we exit the session. Yeah. See you then.