001good evening everyone uh tonight is March 10th and this is a special meeting of the Board of Education would you please stand and honor the America and join me recite to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liy and for all right we had a request that the full Board address legal council's presence as the first item for deliberation tonight so I make a motion that we have legal council present when we discuss board ethics and violations board operation and treatment of others this there second second discussion comments not sure why we to add something to the agenda supposed to do days I knew about this meeting since March 2 I just want more to do add it to theour
002because I thought about the importance of having legal council present and since we did then what we're going to discuss could have an impact on every Board number and I thought it was important that they did that we have it and as president I can set certain items on theend okay I just policy sorry just so my assumption is that we don't actually have Council here correct so if we do vote on this and it approves essentially this evening meeting is a waste of time correct we proceed we would make a motion to adjourn and then I would request Dr Douglas contact um our legal advisors and offer US states for when they I something just just so that um I can help with jul question if no member of the board can request legal
003counsel so when this came in it's a request no different than any other um board MP so in order for me or the district to seek bringing legal counsil the board the board has to decide whether or not that's part I think part policy U so I can't do anything I I can do whatever I need to do with legal counsel in the course of my business and stuff but this isn't my business so so okay thanks for asking that question because I'm like confused so if you decided to bring in legal council then we have no meeting tonight correct but we should have okay um so back in January when we were disc ing The Retreat um there was a board resolution when we were talking about wanting to have a discussion about the
004board Dynamics and issues that had taken place and there were three of us members who said that we wanted to have James Gregory come and meet with us and have a retreat and the board voted it down the board said no so essentially what this is doing is coming back on what the board already voted no against and rebr bringing it up it's also the six days past um my mom said that was a good point with the agenda not having six days prior to but also I don't believe that we're supposed to email over specific request asks um I know that we allowed to share information as it pertains or asks for certain things to be put on the agenda I know that I requested items to be on the agenda you know six
005days prior to and all of this stuff is already public information for the most part um and I think that it's very important that this meeting take place tonight that we have a discussion about it because I think that if we don't it's just showing that it's not the discussion that's happening tonight is because of how a couple of members have behaved not necessarily the whole board but it if we don't have this meeting I think that that does then start to robe in the entire board into this and and the behavior of what we're not following or what we're not doing and just continuously trying to silence like this this conversation needs to happen today it's not an easy on to have but we cannot continue to prolong this like I said going back
006and trying to undo something that was already once voted on just recently no I don't see how that makes any sense whatsoever and I also think that there's a little bit of bias in the request when the email said to protect board members I think that that's almost requesting to have an in to having the school attorney protect an individual board member that's kind of what that SS like I have never submitted request to have an attorney look over and review all of the things that happened to me in the course of this time so I I don't feel like that's appropriate I think the meeting that you were refering to when we voted majority of the board voted not to hold the retreat was because um GS had come at one time and I
007don't think things will be solved I think there was a conflict of date as to whether or not he could come the 30th was the only date out of many that were offered that was the date that those board could come so there were a lot of reasons why uh and I personally voted I can't speak for others but there were multiple reasons why I voted not to have that meeting I didn't feel that it was going to be produced um prior to the email about having legal counsel I have thought many times that I was concerned about behaviors at board meetings and so I was very happy to see that and I feel it's necessary and I don't feel comfortable pursuing what's on the agenda without legal council here we are not saying that
008this meeting will not happen it will happen but it will happen with legal council pres sorry uh so I have a few different things that I would like to say and first I would like to just reiterate what maranne said I think the difference Katrina when we voted previously it was with respect to a retreat and we wanted a facilitator I think the difference is you have called for a public board meeting and based upon the materials you provided ahead of time uh I can only assume that you will make allegations in the course of this meeting with respect to harassment or bullying which rais legal issues and potential liability for the board as well and you've said this many times in public session before and I've corrected it or tempted to you in the
009materials have characterized that the board has violating yogan meetings law right so there are things that you I believe based upon the materials you circulated intend to say which implicate legal questions and for that reason I think it makes sense to have legal council president I I don't think it's protecting any individual board member it's protecting the board James is a lawyer for the board no one individual board member is his client it's the board that's is client that's where the attorney Cent relationship exists uh with respect to this meeting um I would argue under 2320 special meetings it says business related to the call of the meeting shall be discussed or transacted by the board I think raising the question of whether a lawyer should be present with respect to um a meeting that's
010titled outside of the window um legal violation of board ethics or something to that effect I mean to me I would argue that's within the scope of what has been called and is not adding separate item but more fundamentally and I I wholeheartedly agree that we have to have this conversation I wanted to have this conversation in the Retreats we had we struggled to find a DAT at work and we struggled to find a facilitator I still think we should have that conversation Retreat I don't think a special board meeting is the appropriate for for this conversation and I base that upon the fact that board policy 2300 defines a special meeting as an official legal action meeting usually called for an emergency or urgent purpose um by definition your stated um agenda had no
011legal action assciated with it so what's the what I mean we can discuss but there's no action to be taken that under our policy is actually what's described as a work session a public meeting to plan brainstorm and discuss issues without taking formal action so I frankly have a problem with now I understand any single board member can call social Le that's what our policy says but they're supposed to call it for certain purposes emergency need to transact official business of the district and I don't think that was stated in the call of the meeting and quite frankly I considered objecting to having it but then I thought it more appropriate to be able to say these things in public and I think what we need to do is agree upon the right form to
012do this where we can be open have a facilitator and work through the issues but I do believe to the extent we're in a public meeting which is on record and you intend to make allegations of potential legal violations against any single member of the board which could then fall back to liability to the board as a whole having legal councel is important um so to to respond to that um yes I have brought up several times The Bullying that has happened in fact it began um the very first time that a special that an executive session was called and at that point it wasn't just a single person or a couple of people it was a board as a whole who was who was doing this and so and I've been and at this
013point this is just the same continuation of we wanted to have a retreat because we wanted to have a resolve there was no we could have already had Jes here in fact we asked to have that happen people said no we don't want James to be here we're calling to have a retreat but Retreats don't ever have minutes or video postings of how it is and the public absolutely has the right to see what the board is doing at all times the last two Retreats we talked about policy how policy is created how policy is supposed to be following in fact there were some things that I thought were not necessarily true but there's no public record of it the Last Retreat had a lot of conversation revolved around me I'm assuming I wasn't there
014Jamie told me that it was a public meeting for Misa and that it was recorded and it wasn't so to me all of that what you just explained to try to have a retreat like I'm not trying to implement the board at all but we all signed a code of ethics bullying is not allowed I understand that we went through a whole process and people didn't like me asking questions and everything else but to me it's starting to become really apperent that the board as a whole is trying to silence an individual member who was asking Financial questions and seeking Financial things from the district that's what it's starting to feel like and it's starting to feel like um you're trying to make it so I can't do it and to me this is almost
015a precedent if we don't have this meeting tonight and this doesn't continue I feel like I be fing a formal complaint and then going to the commissioner because I feel like at this point it's a b it's a board as a whole trying to say that members are not allowed to ask questions they're allowed to be cut off and it's not just it's not just saying you know you're like okay time whatever is happening it's the way in which somebody has spoken to being screened at is not appropriate being like all of these things is it's it's not appropriate I have had migraines I have lost sleep I shake I've had to cancel clients I cannot mentally handle this anymore it's just it's order krina I think quite frankly if you feel like you're being
016bullied what you should do is submit a formal complaint I would disagree with you that the public has a right to hear the details of what you think you're you have a point of view that you believe you're being bullied whether and I won't characterize whether that's you know that's your point of view but I don't think the public has a right to hear that public has a right to hear District business that's not District business what you know I my if you have a what do we tell staff members students family to do if they have a complaint is submit submit a formal complaint and let the processes work but quite frankly I'm not sure what you you know thought we would do tonight there's no action to be taken there's no um you
017know it would just be a session of of basically aing of grievances which is not dist strict business and I'm not in any way diminishing how you feel and I think it's important you pursue the things you can do to try to U make yourself be heard but I don't think this is the right form and I fundamentally disagree with what You' said in terms of trying to be silenced uh not letting Financial questions be asked I have wholeheartedly followed the code of ethics that we sign as board members um you know I said this in a prior meeting but quite frankly to me I think where I spoke up was because some of the financial questions seemed at a level of detail that was not appropriate for forment right so in any event you
018have rights and you can pursue those rights but I don't think any with the meeting like this with no action to be taken I'm not sure how you would be able to vindicate those in this meeting um what I'm going to read is just thoughts that I had especially concerned about the board engineer and so I'm going to ask the question it's the motion is should we have legal councel and we gone a feel from that question it seems like we have think well does anyone else want to be heard has been heard everyone has a right as an opportunity right but well I just are you going to talk about legal counsel but I understand that we that should come first okay I waited a moment so that I could hear what everybody else
019had to say but I do agree with Dan that I believe the tenant of the meeting and the topics of the meeting and even some of the things that you shared here tonight Katrina directly I feel more the input of a lawyer um or educational law because I if we are going to have this meeting in public and and I disagree with that as well I feel that those kinds of things should be happen not at a District board meeting um where we're supposed to be doing the business of the board but I would want the understanding of what the legal terminology is is for the items that you have and if we as a board meet that criteria we as a board you know are are you being bullied as as you're claiming as
020a part of what the legal jargon is for that right so I would want to have a loyer here that could be able to explain that Express that and you know really hold us all accountable into task if that is happening so that's that would be my rationale for wanting to have legal representation because um that is the person that's going to be able to tell us definitively if things are happening that would be my my rational all right a call a question all in favor of the motion motion is motion to adjourn if you can hold for a second I need direction of what you would like me to do oh so if that's the thing because I heard the meeting still needs to take place so do you want that I understand the
021board basically saying go out and get an attorney get the attorney get a date from the attorney or a couple days and then everybody's going to make themselves available it's going to be at this time because it seemed like this time 7 o' seems to be better to get people together yeah I can't promise avable we wasted 25 minutes of our time we could have had this conversation way before the Emil went out on the 1st of March today to 10 25 minutes of our sh has been wayed deliber deliberating over whether or not we need an attorney cousin and I find it very hard that the seniority of the members of this board can not had that discussion we made that determination we need ahead of time but I'm not sure that everyone's going
022to beable I mean I'm only the superintendent you guys just said you need an attorney available I've got to get dates I will get them I'm trying to Target for the next 2 weeks 7:00 and people are going to have to make themselves available if they want to have this discussion it that's the direction of the board otherwise I'm going to step away you tell me the date and that's it I don't have a problem either way but I can tell you we're looking foolish and whether you're avable or not the board meeting once established and set is a board meeting no longer a special meeting that's what I'm trying to do for you so that's what I need guidance so you're saying you're going to call a different additional board meeting or is it
023going to be well I'd have to call another I'd have to get the I I don't know when the attorney's about so so I don't I was the person who called this meeting you said that there was no action that was going to be taken at tonight there was absolutely going to be action to be taken tonight whether or not we made a motion to have somebody no longer be a position of where they are on the board is in a leadership position or whether or not someone should be remed from the board these are positions so now because I have to go through the complaint process as you said first I tried to call special meeting to talk about it so that we can have a real clear conversation about it it's very clear
024that it's not just single members so I would like to file a complaint about the board I am filing a complaint with all of the material that I sent on the agenda my intention is to now go to the commissioner because I do not believe that this conversation that we're having is a lawyer conversation what's happening right now I don't think is allowed by law to silence other board members and that's what's happening so so let me know those steps that it's not in the exhibit but I expect to have an email for board for my steps for my complaint process because I'm going to start it okay lot to unpack there yep first of all the board can't provide an individual board member unless the board says it for Action so I can't do
025anything unless the board if an individual in our community wishes to take action they do so outside of the board that's just the legal process that's all I can do and I can't give legal advice all I'm trying to do is get you guys to talk with the lawyer and I do want to clear up one thing the thing in January James was a Al for the 30th but the discussion but the discussion was we had James we want a facilitator that James was not going to be necessarily the facilitator he was going to be there to assist the facilitator we went out to look at another facility the facility ators would not or could not be available that night even after looking for a month and a half we had another one but since
026then he was involved in a lot of superintendent searches and has watched our video and said I don't think I'm going to be able to help so the only thing you have left is either yourself or the discussion or the attorney I'm being told by the vote that you want to have this discussion you want the attorney president it can be open or whatever the board decides but I want everybody understand I'm not making a decision it's you guys that have to make the decision so all I'm trying to do is just figure out when to do it I'm trying not to do it too far away hopefully I could get him and he says hey I can be there Thursday night but I don't know if he's going to be a I know so
027like on a few of the things that were just said so what TR with respect to the ability to bring the lawyer here the board had to vote on that to say we want that we can't vote outside of a public meeting that's why it had be held tonight and Katrina the official notice from the district clerk States the special board meeting is for board discussion with no official business of the district scheduled to be acted upon at this meeting there's no you know when we have a business meeting we have a list of agenda and we have things that we're going to move on and and um take action on we didn't have that full you don't think removing the president of the board wouldn't be business of the district you know I think
028that's business of the board and maybe it's different so how so if it's business of the so if it's business of the board it's an inappropriate meeting because policy uh 2300 finds a special meeting the fix a legal action meeting and it's to um sorry I just lost my place here yeah no official business schedule can be taking place right policy states that no official Contra 2300 2320 which states special meetings are for responding to quote special circumstances which may arise during District Operations the point of a special meeting is you know we have some significant equipment failure I'm have to come in and approve or repair before the next meeting the I am not trying to silence you I'm encouraging you to file a complaint that's why those processes exist what I am troubled
029by is that you're forcing a discussion on what you want to talk about through an inappropriate Channel and then characterizing as you're being silenced this is a board of nine people no one of us have any power whatsoever to act other than that specifically delegated to the president we vote and then the vote determines how we act and sometimes you're on the winning end of a vote sometimes you're on the losing endit a vote but being on losing it a vote doesn't mean you're being silen through buing that's an incorrect assumption to make you have to accept that the board has decided and it doesn't I think it's unfair for you to characterize it as other than the board silen you know that's just the decision of the board and so sorry one last thing
030I I will continue to object to this being um proposed for a special dating because I don't think that's an appropriate topic I think if we want to have a discussion around these Dynamics it's something we would do say in the course of our board board um evaluation meeting that seems to be an appropriate time to talk about how the board interacts and how we treat one another if it's board business as opposed to District business or in board retreat where we have a facilitator in legal council but this special meetings are for conducting the business of the district and you yourself just said you don't think this is District business oh Mar you want to say something do you want to your mine is just a general thoughts about how things gone I don't
031know go ahead because he just got to say what he want to say so that's way but do you want to go first no goad that's I thought about this meeting and what I've witnessed for the last year have since K been elected I will say how sad I am the board is in charge of our district we have no bullying poliy yet some feel it is okay let me read the definition of a Schoolboard M New York State School Board member is a locally elected offici who manages the public schools in their Community they are responsible for the education safety and wellbeing of their District students responsibilities that policy make decisions advocate for students oversee operations manage the district's budget personnel and properties listen the community qualifications and I guess we don't really need
032those be a citizen be at least 18 years old be a qualified voter in the school district be able to read and write English they showold this was on the New York state boards and then I went to the New York State Board Association there's another generalization about the school board nowhere doesn't say you should try to control other board members tell them how they think you race our time you talk too long I hear what you say but you're wrong on that you are one of nine you don't have you like everyone you serve with well you should be kind when you speak others are watching I have lost count of how many community members board former board members and staff that have come to me about Behavior they have witnessed when I served
033previously on the foret school board we met twice a month and most meetings were four hours or more no one ever said and believe me I asked a lot of questions no one ever said you waste our time you are respons we are responsible for the finances of this district and policy at the moment we have a $2.3 million G it is very disturbing what is happening on this board we have to talk about this we have to treat each other as we one and I really feel badly that every time someone says something that c members are said well it's not myy this wrong it's really not your place to say that to another individual I serve prev for 11 years and I've never been treated to what see some members treated on this
034it's very sad all right I want say one thing and I I don't want to H of you in any way Katrina you refer to our first executive meeting and I remember it well we thought you were being bullied my impression and what we were hoping to do was to help you to understand what the job of the board member was how to approach things because you were new you had agreed you had not agreed to meet with Dr Douglas you had not agreed to meet with Christine Dale who was presid at the time who wanted to help you get through all of these things it's a to ask becoming a it truly is it takes a lot of time but you weren't willing to listen to us and you turned it around and interpreted
035that as we were bu now you have your opinion but that was my opinion of what happened that now I've been thinking yes who has because I served before as well so that is what I'd like to say I've given a great deal of thought to what I'm about to say and I ask for the cury of reading this without an interruption I moved to heds in 1974 foras to home in 1978 my children attended foret schools from kindergarten to high school at the time my oldest was writing for school I was teaching her Corning pained post I could have chosen to send my children to Corning schools which would have provided significant savings and child care before and after school however I chose orense because of its strong reputation and excellent school district and
036I wanted my children to attend school with their neighborhood friends I never regreted the decision my children received an outstanding education they were shaped by dedicated teachers coaches choir directors marching band and Orchestra directors guidance counselors today each of them is successful in their chosen career and continue to be engaged contributing members of their Community I first served on Board of Education in the early 2000s took a brief Hiatus and then decided to run again I'm now in the third year of my third term I see this service as my way to get back to the district that provided so much for my children and continue to serve the children of our community during my tenure I worked with two superintendents Dr Ralph Marino and now Dr Thomas Douglas I've collaborated with Bo officers various
037members some of whom came to the board with a personal agenda but more often the individuals wanted to serve for the greater good of the district under Dr Douglas's leadership I have seen much needed Improvement to schools and Facilities curriculum has strengthened ensuring hense remains one of the top school districts in the region the business staff has worked diligently to keep taxes L participation sorry time so um so the question remains do we as a board want to instruct Dr Douglas to have the uh attorney offer us um Fates to have this meeting preferably as soon as possible but we can't have it Thursday because that's a normal business day or business that corre is that oh it just means you're going laid into the M but soon guar I think Dan said it would
038be his preference at not turn I think the theory be if it was Thursday we be very very can can I just clarify it's not to say I don't want it to be in public what I'm saying is under our board policy to discuss um board you know interaction and no District business it's not it doesn't fit the definition of a board meeting or a special meeting I think we have to determine what's the right form to have that discussion right and I specifically remember when came and we had an a treat talked about when there's no action to be taken when there's no District business you can have a retreat and and discuss things as a board and it's you know that's sort of the free flowing open session of of a meeting you
039know a district meeting is it's a series of agenda items we move from business we vote I just don't think that's the right I I my point is under our policy that's not the right form um terms of the policy language to have the discussion that I believe is to be had so you're saying you should have the executive session no executive session is an entirely different legal contract I didn't say anything about executive session where would you have it and a board retreat well a board retreat is done like an executive session there's no minutes taken and there no there's no minutes to be I listen there's there's only if it's a business meeting or business of the district is to be inducted and I remember you a few minutes ago saying it's not
040District business right so you can't pick and choose what you want you said it's not District business which is not District business of this I asked Dr D I had a long conversation with him on the phone about this and and she asked me you know you want to call this I understand why you're talking to me and he was one I said this is how I feel like this is what's going on it needs to be addressed because it's the issues are going back to me asking Financial questions everything I had sent over things that happened it's all about finances and at this point in time the Dynamics it it you know what when you file a complaint with the commissioner they give you a ruling to figure out what's right and what's wrong
041that's what happens so I guess we could figure it out I have letters from open meeting law several times I shared them with you guys as Bo and how we're supposed to conduct ourselves openly and make decisions and just because of the fact that if you are considering an open complaint and I understand my job is to protect the board and all board members this is a public meeting being take so anything you're saying here could be either used for you or against you out there so if you're going to do that this is not the table where we can entertain anything but the real questions at hand is to get to get the attorney to find a date and I'll ask him how he's going to end up doing remember if there is a
042discussion about any potential issues of things coming through the door it is a legal issue and the lawyer will say exactly where he will have the discussion because he represents the district and the full board he represents not a single person around this room unless the board authorizes that representation and usually that's if there's a claim made against a specific member or a couple members to the board where the board has to get legal advice uh so that's just my role is I have to protect all of you I have to protect the board I have to protect the district I feel that I'm under the assumption I have to work with the president to get the attorney to give us dates and say when can you come as soon as possible and however you
043want to be he's going to dictate it's not up to me it's going to be up to the legal councel and that's what the board left to decide if the board say he says he wants to do it this way and the board says nope we're not going to do it then you don't do it but if he says you're going to do it this way the board says yeah you're going to do it this way then the board's going to do it that way you have to understand you are the entity of the district and the district's board right now and that's all I'm working so what I would do is I will reach out to him tomorrow see if he's bable for Thursday but I can tell you I get a laer short
044hand noted right now it's negotiating it could be the following week the next week or third week he he or one of their lawyers will probably be avable within the first two weeks I just don't know I have a question on something you just said Tom And I think that might be something for us to discuss is and and to Poss we vote on is if the lawyer makes a specific recommendation for where we are to hold the meeting and how it is to be held I think I I would vote gas on whatever the lawyer says whether it's here there anywhere what the lawyer shares I I would vote to say yes I would agree with and that's something I'd like to put to the board I don't think you can do that right
045now but I think you you're stating the right thing as a member of the former Attorney John Lynch would say I'm the board's attorney when I give you a recommendation you can choose to follow it or you can choose not to but it's my wallet on the table well if I give you a recommendation and you choose not to follow it it's no longer longer my wallet it's all nine of your wallets under I think it's a step in the right direction though to say you know can we thumbs up it or whatever it is that whatever the lawyer says that we're going to take that first step to do you will have to do some type of action to do that I can't thumbs up it not by email I'm hoping look at if
046I'm hoping I'll be able to bring if they can't do Thursday at least bring whatever they need Thursday so work I'm just trying bring us to some kind of you know hey we're going to move forward with this the board already voted 5 to three have the attorney involved and whether the attorney does for that is up to the attorney I don't think we should give them any more Direction I mean I didn't agree with how it's voted but it's been voted 5 for three that you want have attorney here so whatever the attorney does with that is up to the attorney it's not up to us it's up to the the attorney that's why you guys wanted to bring the attorney in and that's fine because something does need to be done I don't
047know if you to go back to mans 101 or how we achieved this but I remember that night too Maran September first meeting because I got a call by my hysterical daughter that she couldn't even drive two blocks to give her cell phone me and my husband had to come together what is sad sad nothing whatever you were trying to do didn't work I just know how hysterical it was and it should have never happened because you're one of nine n guys the meeting I just think it's interesting to keep saying that but the hope we are one of nine but but TR is one right so that's the whole point what the board votes on you this is I've argued this before but you have to go but the board president does have specifically
048delegated duties under law and policy to say run meeting set agenda and the only thing the point I'm trying to make right and I think I want to clarify this Katrina if for example you wanted to take action and propos a motion to remove someone from an office right that's action that has to be stated on the on the agenda for the meeting like the notice purpose of the meeting is to you know consider a motion to remove person from office if it's that that's kind of um Clarity and specificity you have to have for an agenda item and you didn't have that here if that's what was in your mind I think you have to put forward those specific agenda items if we were going to have a meeting to address those but that's
049when when I say why you couldn't take actions because there's no there was no action stated as the the call for the meeting J had question what is the S MERS oh it's we pay retainers it's buil into the retainer unless we go with Britain we've actually been doing very good the past time all so um I think is that Dr Douglas will contact the attorney see if they're available and we can discuss Thursday night so I make a motion to adjourn second discussion all in favor I oppose exension for