Ann Arbor Renters Commission Meeting 3/21/24

001e in March 21st 2024 meeting of the anara renters commission the purpose of the renters commission is to advise the city council and the city administrator in matters affecting renters in the city the anara renters commission is made up of voting members who are appointed by the mayor and approved by city council two non- voting city council Liaisons two non- voting members representing different landlord perspectives and a non- voting representative from the University of Michigan Student Legal Services um there will be uh a couple uh public comment opportunities and the instructions for that will be given uh during those periods uh but you can watch through the web link at a2gov.org renters commission meeting first letter of each word is capitalized okay moving on to roll call item two so as always please state the

002city or state that you're calling from um I am here I'm calling from Ann Arbor commissioner Chen not here just check oh Jeff is here okay commissioner Kelly is absent commissioner drop man present in an arbor you know what I am having as always some internet problems I apologize um I'm going to switch over but I'll finish roll here and then I'll switch over to another Network here commissioner Els I am here in an arbor commissioner L's here in an arbor hello commissioner tibits here and Ann Arbor commissioner Rosen is not here commissioner Ratliff here in an aror welcome commissioner Thomas is abs commissioner pittz here Ann aror and commissioner good here and an arbor welcome and council member Rina here an arbor council member Harrison is not able to make it so let's see

003okay we do have six voting members my count which means we do meet Forum okay we can move on to item three approval of our agenda is there a motion to approve the agenda as presented moved okay move by Rita do we have a second second second by Jeff okay um all those in favor of approving our agenda say I I I I I suppose say nay okay great so we've approved our agenda now we can move on to item uh four approval of our minutes this is the minutes from our last meeting uh which was on February 15 do we have a motion to approve last meeting's minutes so moved by Julia do we have a second yeah by Jamie okay all those in favor of approving the minutes say I I I I

004all those oppose say Nate Okay so we've approved our minutes now we can move on to item five of the first general public comment right um public comment can be made by phone at 877 8535 247 or 888 78899 and entering meeting ID 935 941 or by joining with the web link and that is a2gov.org renters commission meeting you are calling in you can press star n to raise your hand if you are um joining with the link you can use the hand feature if You' like to address the renters commission for up to 3 minutes go ahead and raise your hand there are no um attendees thank you Kristen okay we can move on to item six old business uh we'll begin with 6-a discussion of attendance and appointments so I can give an

005update here um so a group of us were emailing uh we did re this is um our council member liaison myself and our vice chair Julia we were emailing about um proposing some recommendations for appointments to our empty seats and our my seat as well which will be empty soon um we uh have not yet submitted those recommendations but I think our goal um I think a reasonable goal is to have those positions filled by our next monthly meeting uh but I'll open the floor here if anyone has questions comments on this issue I'll share that two people emailed me to ask about how to apply um I don't think that they've applied yet but it's been in the past couple of days this week at least if not yesterday thanks Travis yeah I was

006just going to add I think I saw that the clerk's office uh shared out that there were vacancies for renters Commission on social platforms um and obviously if folks here have people in their Network that they could reach out to and share it share it with as well um you know had to do some personal Outreach last time we had vacancies um to make sure that we were getting a diverse pool of applicants and also folks from kind of different backgrounds and perspectives that could be represented here so um if there is a perspective that you feel is missing uh please make sure to reach out to those candidates and ask them to apply um and then I agree with zachar I think we're looking to move forward here quickly I will note that it

007is a two-step process at Council so the mayor would have to uh recommend and then at the next meeting appoint so um we even even with uh um our our effort here it it will likely be very close to the next meeting before they are officially confirmed thank you Rita um besides the attorney um vacancy how many other vacancies are there currently I believe that there's one current vacancy for a voting member if I'm not mistaken and we have one member who hasn't attended in some time and I don't believe he's officially been removed from the commission yet but he will be soon and then myself so that would be good soon so do we need to have a motion to remove the person who doesn't attend I think with the timeline of reappointments um

008I think and also with the timeline of trying to appoint a replacement I think that you could do that or we could leave it as not seeking reappointment um because when would his slot be up for reappointment I believe that the term ends in May and that reappointment process process is starting um it's kind of going on right now folks are submitting their applications to kind of request to be reappointed and I haven't heard anything um so either way I think it's fine I'll let you go first John so do you thinking about uh removing people or recommending that they be removed because I I've got our the bylaws in front of us and 4.6 says that there members are expected to attend regularly scheduled meetings um to if they miss more than three regularly

009scheduled meetings in a 12- month marod period the chair May notify the mayor and may recommend removal of the member and then consistent with the city code a member of the committee may be removed for cause by the mayor with approval of the city council so um that's the the way to do it unless you have a discussion with somebody and they realize that they can't do it and they they just step down okay thank you very much John I since this is the chair I can I'd be happy to send an email and CCU Christen on that um perfect I I guess it'll probably just be done at the same time that the new people are appointed rosanita then Jeff um if the let's see does it if it goes before Council then would

010it be even occur before I guess the um the person's term ends if like timing wise I don't know is it think it would be close I think the mayor would also have to decide to put that on the agenda and so I that's um not guaranteed I guess so I think the timeline is close happy to move forward with it um because he may he may put it on the agenda yeah I I think um the group of us were emailing that's uh council members Julia and I we can take a look at the timeline for the appointments and um and if it makes sense to try to remove the commissioner and rather than just let their uh their term expire then we can recommend that otherwise we'll just let it expire and appoint

011somebody Jeff uh my suggestion was just going to be um depending on when the the person's term expires we might want to expedite it just if we're going to if if the city council is going to be making appointments we might want to free up the space sooner rather than later depending on when the term expires and you know possibly you know do them all at wants versus you know peace meal yeah makes sense to me I think it might have to be well you know we'll email we'll talk about it figure out the best plan but I'm not seeing any opposition to to potentially moving this person if it means someone's can join the commission sooner um okay is there anything else on this point before we move on okay seeing nothing we'll move

012on to 6-b uh plan future commissioner education opportunities um so tonight uh obviously we have Avalon housing to come to present um there was a number of suggestions that were made uh I'll just open the floor and uh hear from all of you if there are particular ideas that you you want to explore for Education opportunities that's for us resita um since they're I guess I don't know if they're uh I'd like to know more about the N Arbor Tenants Union um I know that is it I've seen interviews or read I guess read interviews now and um so it seems like it's past the beginning of the initial organizing stage so i' just like to get brought up to date as to what's going on with that yeah that's a good idea um I

013I am involved in the tenants Union um I can ask some other members and see if we can can arrange something um I know there's a lot of history with the old Tenants Union um which went defunct I think in 2004 and actually uh Julia was a member of the old Tenants Union which I'm sure she can give us some Enlighten us on what it was like to be involved back then as well but I'd be happy to reach out also I um I just want to confirm that there was the Santa Barbara County um budsman uh yeah yeah it's the T yes it's the tenant landlord utsman okay like that yeah I was planning on moving forward with inviting them as well and C seeing you ronita if uh that's okay since you proposed

014it okay any other ideas let's do uh Jamie then rosanita yeah um I would be curious um the only organization I'm familiar with at least in an arbor um related to um tenants with disabilities is Michigan ability Partners um but I think that's an area that I could use a little more education on um issues that those renters may be facing maybe rosanita has a suggestion related to that too with your work that you do but go ahead need had to unmute um if there's Michigan ability Partners um I mean the city itself gives out its own specific set of well HUD vouchers the non-elderly disabled vouchers um and the Ned Category 2 vouchers as well um and I know know that council member gazi Edwin is um working on something with the housing an

015aror Housing Commission or Corporation ahc I can never get the whole name right um about listing um or having a master list of like accessible units which is a huge issue um not just in an arbor unfortunately um both private and you know like was it both small landlord and rental homes like actual you know single family houses but also within apartment complexes as well and the afford and the affordability aspect of that um is it the disability net network of so Monroe Wasa and linow county is that right I just I just know the initials um they're also another Resource as well um to know a little bit more about what's going on with people looking at renting and the problems that they're having within the city and um possibly looking at was it

016barrier Busters as well would be I think a good idea not just for people with disabilities but in general um and then separate from that I was curious about the Cooperative because I know they spoke at one of the City Council meetings they were in the um M live and they were talking about possible resoning to bring up um to be able to repair or some of the houses that they have um and that's one of the to me I think it's really important to know what's happening with that because that is one of the altern alternative affordable housing solutions that we have in the city um Beyond a a private developer or say private for-profit developer and I know that both it's not just for students that there are some non- students who live

017there as well a lot of great ideas thank you ranito um oh did you just put you okay [Music] yeah are any of these organizations in your opinion this is a question to everybody should they be prioritized and trying to get somebody to come and talk to the commission I would also love to have someone from Planning Commission come and talk I think that's very uh relevant to the uh to the you know the planning that they're currently engaging in comprehensive plan so I would also like to add that to the list um but if there's it doesn't I'm not seeing anyone say that there's particular one you want to hear from first so in that case I'll just we can just start sending out invitations and planning them for different months uh throughout the

018year okay go to that great anything else on uh commissioner education okay we can move on to 6-c uh this is the last item before our presentation from from Avalon here uh we um I guess I I will ask Travis if you want to introduce this since um this is directly related to City council's work this is regarding the uh the amendment oh um I think there's some issues here can can you all hear me yes okay I don't know what's what exactly is going on um that's all right uh so City Council just uh early March oh you know he has having some technical issues I guess he just sent me a message um so uh earlier this month city council did amend both sections 8530 and 8531 also known as the early leasing

019ordinance and the right to renew ordinance they combine them into one you know we one ordinance which I think clarifies the language it simplifies that that timeline that was involved and uh it also addresses the closes some of the loopholes that we have discussed in the commission we have looked at this this language before um but I thought i' just put it up here um it's important to know that this took effect as of March 14th and um actually John I have a question for you um does this affect only leases that were that will take effect after the ordinance is active or go ahead so if you go if you go to the very beginning under 8530 the new one under 8530 One D is and dog that's it so it'll in couple things

020one under B you'll see eight months total duration and that was to get around the people that do the six month skirt where they do a couple six months so that's intended to get to address that and so it applies to leases entered into renewed or renegotiated after the effective date of this section and this section went into effect on uh March 17th 2024 so that's that's when it goes into effect so it's into effect now so if a lease is being renewed or renegotiated um it's going to go into effect now um got okay um so I'm just curious if a lease were signed on March 1st but didn't start until September 1 would this still affect that lease because if the lease were signed entered into you know it's already entered into no

021so it would affect it for the next year but if it's if it's already entered into then you'd already have the lease presumably for that September start date right um but that lead okay I see I see what you're saying okay yep and then if you go down to uh under two B there's some changes there what was added here was the price of rent and any fees because remember this one of the complaints they they added parking they they kind of snuck it in under the radar and the Tenant didn't know it till later and then that's also a list of changes in the terms and condition of the current lease uh and then we ask for the date by which the landlord requires the tenant to accept the offer so we we kind

022of tightened up one through Roman numeral uh six even though there's four five and four if you if you know how to count in Roman numerals looks like there's a little scriveners there if you see what I'm talking about uh right here yeah so you see four you see how it goes IV and then V then IV again oh yeah you're right yeah was that just an error obviously okay okay gotta it's a little confused there um all right um is should someone be notified of that error yeah I'll let Jack You Know Jack Jackie the clerk gets this up to munic code so I'll I'll let her know thank you very much yeah they might they might catch that automatically but I'll I'll Kristen and I can reach out to Jackie bu the cler

023yeah do appreciate that and that uh instance where the tenants had a $100 a month parking fee tacked on and they didn't know it know about it until the last moment before they signed uh it was actually just notified that they successfully negotiated that out of their agreement so that's a um I was very happy to hear that they uh were able to get that reversed okay um I'll open the floor here um any comments questions about this change Kristen Vander has been working on a one-page guide we're gonna we're going to update the Complaint Form to to to to capture better data uh that'll help Pete held who and Janet faroh who review these and then we're also she's worked on a one-page guide uh that a draft will be ready to be sent

024out pretty soon because it it goes into effect so awesome I thank you very much Krist and I hopefully this last time this law has touched for some a good amount of time but I I really do appreciate that you were I noticed you guys took down the the old guides very quickly um that was quick thinking and I really appreciate that and um I'm excited to see the the next guide let me know if there's anything that I can do to help as volunteer Jordan yeah I just want to say thanks Kristen I was curious as to if we were getting that out when we would get that out so it sounds like soon um and then my second thing is you know just I think some of the feedback and commentary on this

025change has just been how crucial this next step of the weightless fees and things are right like how much we really need to get movement on that um I mean I think we've all been getting stories of how much money people put in holding and and there's some of those in the communication so I can kind of um I know some of those cases personally can kind of expound on on some of them too when we get to that point but I think I just want to reinforce that the um the holding deposit right to lease you know whatever they're calling all of those things um it's this just has highlighted why if we're giving this this specific time frame how it's an even bigger deal um the the fees that people are taking and

026catching and how how quickly we need to get on that so thanks everybody for working on that part too thank you George Rosita just piggy backing off of what Jordan said um thank you to Kristen for you know getting right on everything um with the form that uh the Complaint Form is there a question on there um from for perspective tenants about the weight list fees um just so that we're somehow capturing that that data is right now but I think that is definitely something we can discuss John with Janet when Janet is back too definitely thank you yeah uh I know that Student Legal Services Services has been collecting information on this this has largely affected student tenants not only of course um but they have uh quite a few documents and a list

027of uh landl engaging that in that behavior um in those policies I know also that the tenants Union is all is collecting some and if we ever if the commission ever needs examples I'm positive that we can turn to those sources and get some Rosita I just I just think that you know it's great that those two organizations and possibly others are are collecting that data but I think as as a commission we're talking about the fees and if as we know the council members are also talking about junk fees and an ordinance that having that data and starting to collect it um would be a really would be really great to have on the city Side so that we know specifically what what all those different names are that they're calling those fees um

028which would be I think helpful to the ordinance um and also like just the ranges because you know we've seen from the communications it runs the gamut so yeah totally agree all those points okay any other oh yeah go ahead CH and it let me un mute this time uh sorry about that um the the only thing I wanted to add on to that uh commissioner Ratcliffe is that um we are hoping and I I say this knowing that John is the one who will have to do some of the writing um but it is our hope obviously that it doesn't really matter what the landlord will call the fee um that we will write this in a way so that they can't simply change the name and then get back to to charging again

029and so U but certainly I think always looking for more data and obviously as um we make some ordinance changes and actual official complaints come in that will be some substantial data that we can maintain as well thank you okay anything else on this note this item okay uh we'll be looking um for that information sheet uh Kristen let us know if there's anything you know we can do to help and um I really did like the original one that you guys had made hopefully you can recycle some of that format or some of the material anyway okay we can move on to new business that's item seven let's begin with item 7-a we have a presentation from ablon housing I'm really excited uh I'm very grateful that they've um come here today so I

030just promoted Scott to uh panelist hi Scott welcome hi everyone can you hear me yes great um yeah thank you for having me I think I'll kick it off it sounds like uh it's good to see some familiar faces and for those of you who don't know me my name is Scott Ellis I use heem pronouns I'm the director of mission advancement with Avalon housing and I'll go into who Avalon housing is as a nonprofit affordable housing developer and service provider here in the community but first I kind of want to touch on why we exist so let me see if I can share my screen this will work okay that okay and if everyone can see that we'll kind of get into it so I think a lot of this first information won't be

031new to most of you that there is a housing crisis here nationally and it's been going on for a while uh in washingon County these numbers are from 2021 but um there's definitely a large number of individuals who are experiencing homelessness here in our community and it definitely disproportionately impacts uh our black neighbors and folks of color here in the community and this is due to many systemic injustices especially around the housing space history of redlining in our County and other places and that's part of what Avalon housing is here to address more recently these are the numbers from last year or kind of the jump and spike in homelessness especially for families in particular between 2022 in 2023 um this is ongoing and we're still seeing it today uh in 2024 so how did

032we get here uh the root cause of a lot of this is simply the lack of housing the lack of affordable housing the lack of housing at all levels um but especially for what we consider affordable um that's um and these are based on HUD and other data so a home is considered affordable if it costs less than 30% of household income here in our County in County more than half of renters spend more than 30% of their incomes on housing um so kind of going back to Avalon and who we serve in the community uh we have over 800 clients tenants here in the county um around 200 of them are children and youth and the majority of them um are living on less than $800 a month so kind of the average household

033income um for our tenants is about $10,000 annually um the majority of folks that we are working with are exiting literal homelessness into our affordable housing developments um and we do work with lots of folks who are experiencing um High needs as they're navigating mental health issues or other issues uh due to what they've been experiencing or that's part of why they experienced homelessness in the first place and so we come arounds side them come alongside them with wraparound support services and that's a part of our approach um move something out of the way so Avalon housing follows the housing first model if you're not familiar with what housing first is uh housing first is the concept that um this is a nationally recognized model for addressing homelessness basically saying that if somebody has uh

034an issue that they're navigating mental health physical disability um or something like that it's so much harder to address that if they are living on house and so getting them into safe and permanent housing is the first step in addressing of that and that's when you can come alongside them and start to address all their other basic needs um and we pair housing first what's with what's called Supportive Housing and so that's all the wraparound support services that help um navigate whatever those issu are and I'll kind of list some of those out here what those Support Services look like so we have um 247 crisis response for our tenants um we can assist somebody getting to appointments um we have peer support groups we have on-site Medical Care with our partner with Pate Health

035we can help somebody manage their medication and we can support somebody navigating legal issues um or just other systems in general that they might be navigating here in our community right now we have 29 properties throughout the county um so we're not just in an arbor uh we have properties in Chelsea and Dexter and we are going to be building a new property in iilani as well um and then we work with lots of tenants um who are using vouchers and living in market rate apartments with local landlords um and so when we opened a recent property that's called H way which is 70 units um in 2021 the majority of those folks were exiting emergency shelter straight into that uh housing complex and when that happened that decreased chronic homelessness in this County by

03630% so when we open these new properties and these new developments we are able to take a big bite out of the homelessness crisis here in our community um these are just some of the numbers of folks that we are able to exit from homelessness into permanent support of affordable housing um when we lease them up each year in our properties going back to that housing first model so for folks who are using housing first the retention rate so retention rate being how many folks stay house once they get house is 84% when Avalon combines its Supportive Services and wraps around folks with all those um different Support Services we hit 96% so the vast majority of tenants that we house stay housed and we started in 199 too and so there are many folks

037who back then moved in or over the years and they're still living with us or they eventually might pass away even as they age in our properties um so we are permanent Supportive Housing we are the long-term home for people in our community and I just want to move on to a couple of our upcoming properties some of those you might be aware of um and this one is already under under construction and so this is the Grove at vidiian which is right there behind County Farm Park on Plat Road and we started Construction in the fall and we plan to lease up in summer 2025 so this will be 50 units mostly families 50 units for us in this case that means kind of 114 bedrooms basically the next is Katherine Street property one

038to1 Katherine right there in KY town and we are very close to breaking ground on this property and this is a uh collaboration between us and and Arbor Housing Commission so that's kind of a 51% 49% where the 49% ownership of the property U and that's another unique thing about Avalon is that we um so we are both the developer the property manager and the service provider in a lot of our properties and then whether that's Housing Commission Properties or with local landlords we will then become the service provider for folks and the next one is uh 206 North Washington this is in ipsan this will be 22 units of support of affordable housing and we are breaking ground there pretty soon um we have there's a building that of burned down a while ago

039and so we have acquired that property from the city and then um we are going to add on to what what we call our Hikaru way complex there on South Maple with another additional 38 units of support of affordable housing um and that'll construction will start most likely next summer so for folks how do you become housed with Avalon housing um we get referrals via Hawk so the housing access of washing County through the coordinated entry system um that's kind of the way it works for anyone who wants to live in an avalan property they have to go through that system just like everybody else we don't choose who we work with necessarily some of the other things we do kind of with our tenants is um all sorts of community building activities Arts programming

040um athletic programs support programs for youth um we have food pantries at five sites throughout the county basically and those are open not just to our tenants but to local community members as well who might be meeting them um we have Community Gardens uh we have a tenant leadership program and so some of our tenants are not just in that tenant leadership program but are also full voting members of our Board of Trustees as well to provide leadership and guidance for the organization um yeah here's what some of those are and so if folks want to get involved and support Avalon volunteering is one way they can do that and so that's at the pantries service projects um in our arts program um there's all the ways to do that that's all obviously on our

041website on how to engage with us that way um and because the audience that I have today and what's going going on uh right now with some interest in the public safety and mental health millage I do want to highlight how some of the public safety and mental health millage that might be up for Renewal or change this fall is directly benefits tenants living in our community so if you're not familiar with what that millage is um the dollars are low mostly via the county but for any entity like the city of an arbor or others who have their own police force the public safety portion of it they are getting a rebate because they're not using the sheriff's services in the city um and so Ann Arbor has chosen to use that rebate um

042and support the Housing Commission properties via services and so Avalon is the service provider for those services including mental health support Medical Care the food pantries all the things we've been talking about and so basically that Mental Health Public Safety millage one portion of it is supporting 186 individuals and family households living throughout the an Arbor Housing Commission properties and kind of comes out to $588,000 so it's really important as folks are kind of talking about what's the next best use for millage dollars going forward and especially in the city side of things which you all are connected to I want to highlight that right now um this is my contact info for anyone who who wants to follow up or has other questions or wants to get involved in different ways I'm more than

043happy to connect I'll leave that up and kind of I'm open to questions or or anything else that people are interested in awesome thank you Scott oh I guess this question period here sorry I my audio cut out what was that oh no worries you can leave the question period if you'd like and just call on oh sure yeah I think rosanita see um first of all thanks for explaining the the um Public Safety and mental health millage rebate and what that means because I know that that can get kind of confusing um my question is about the um how does some how is I guess what's the process but decide how someone ends up in Rapid rehousing versus the Supportive Housing Services and if and can they move along this I guess along the

044Spectrum like if they're in Rapid rehousing and it finds out they need more can they move into permanent support of housing if there's an opening I'm not sure the answer to your second part of your question but for the first part so there's um a coordinated entry meeting and basically my understanding I haven't been involved directly in that part of the process but there sort of a matrix that um people are screened by a criteria when they call Hawk um and it's you know everything from are they currently living outside to are you couch suring are you um and there's a scoring system that happens and that kind of dictates who you know how long is your Peri of homeless has beenin those types of things and that kind of dictates where you're at on

045What's called the chip list um which stands for coordinated housing I'm not sure what what the whole chip list acronym means but the service providers get together once a week look at that list it's a buy name list so trying to know people by their name in order to track them as they're throughout that process on who gets hous first at the end of the day um in terms of the difference between rapid Ro housing and permanent Supportive Housing I don't know the answer to that that might be a question for the county thank you um thank you again Scott um I really appreciate the presentation uh and I'm very excited about the developments you're talking about especially the one on Catherine Street um which how many units is it to over 200 h 63

046it'd be nice oh my God excuse me that's okay we have 78 in our pipeline for the next couple years currently 63 at Katherine Street now half of those are for folks kind of like we're talking about who most like they're exiting homelessness based on their um income level through the coordinated entry process and half is actually for artists um so this is a project that comes out of Minneapolis called Art Space where they work to help develop affordable housing that then also can have folks who are not necessarily fully their income as artists but are artists uh living there as well who also qualify for affordable housing in order to kind of have that cultural environment that's inviting and friendly and welcoming to folks throughout that community so yeah a quick yeah thank you

047I can't I got the number so wrong the uh if you can't if Evelyn can't find you know enough artists to to fill those units I'm sure you guys have thought of a backup plan or you not are you're not concerned about that I mean what would happen in that instance Art Space the group that kind of launches these types of projects is going to be the to my knowledge they're the ones who will fill that tenant list um out of local community members but they have a criteria on how to do that and because of the town we are in community we're in I don't think they'll have a hard time finding it sure and um my question um that I want to ask is is pretty broad question which is you know you

048said that you have um is okay how many units in in the pipeline I don't want to get that wrong 100 178 that in some form of development gotcha and I think a lot of people are interested in seeing more housing like Avalon in the county in the city and so I could you tell us from your perspective what the limitations are currently that you're facing I mean under what circumstances could you really scale things up yeah that's a great question um there's a couple pieces so one is available available land and properties so for example what the city did recently looking at all the city-owned properties and lots surface Lots buildings that were available that was a big win for just upping the spaces that can be developed by the Housing Commission or us

049or both um so having the county do that as well having the townships do that as well any public entity like that there's the university obviously has lots of land um so um trying to figure out where that available land is that is desirable and meets our criteria bus lines and all sorts of things for folks to live in that's one um the funding is another big piece the millage so that not the not the public safety and mental health millage but the housing millage that recently got passed a few years ago has been a big boost in just providing the capital for these projects when we and same with the Housing Commission do these These are there's you know 10 funding streams that it takes to get one of these properties built and knowing

050that we can own it and build and have people live there forever I mean you know these are multiple hundred VI visions of properties for folks to live in um so the financing is tight always so we're raing different funding streams local state federal and private to get that so Capital dollars are a big thing obviously um and then zoning is a piece of it too going back to land so where we can build in the density that we need to make it economically viable to build affordable housing at scale that is going to house enough people to make it feasible and manageable long term um I don't think saying you know some of those are already being addressed but there's probably a lot more that can be done in terms of making certain parts

051of the city accessible to denser housing yeah thank you yeah Travis or council member um that's right Scott this is uh not directly related to your presentation but since we just had the opportunity to meet him at our council meeting uh you guys also just went through a leadership change and so I was wondering if you could maybe speak a little to that and um if that changes or keeps your organ organization kind of on the same trajectory or if you would see any major changes coming no I appreciate that so um some of you know aubert patinho was um the director of Avalon housing for many years as the second ever executive director um and on staff for 18 and leading the organization through a lot of growth especially recently um and she has

052uh stepped down and her replacement is Aaron Cooper who just started literally a few weeks ago and and Aubrey's still around kind of over overlap with some uh coordination and handing off relationships and knowledge but Aaron comes to us from the iner Housing Commission most recently as their CEO um but prior to that was in leadership positions throughout Ohio uh Cleveland and Toledo area so major metro public housing areas um organizations and um so he's bringing a sense of scale especially as abalon grows trying to maintain our consistent level of high quality service regardless of where a tenant is living um we're only growing so we're only having more tenants we're only having more staff we're 125 member staff these days and so um eron's bringing kind of a sense of scale that's very helpful

053for us as we navigate just the challenges of growth and maintaining these older Properties or figuring out what the best use of our all of our spaces and and functionality are so yeah we're excited to have them join the team thanks yeah you mentioned earlier the university um it seems like they've had a special role in helping to create this crisis um by you know bringing more people in from my perspective um I don't want to speak for you um but by bringing more people into the City and not building housing but you did point out that they have a lot of land and I was wondering um has Avalon ever come to an agreement with with the university to develop certain Parcels or um is that in the works perhaps and if not um

054how can are you interested in potentially doing that and how could we support yeah not to my knowledge is the the short answer um I think yeah we'd be open to it we're open to it with private individuals who have homes or um we're open you know we're willing to have the conversation with anybody um we have a pretty strict set of criteria on what we will accept and then also because our process and timeline is not fast as a nonprofit portable housing developer we have to go through what's known as like the liite tech process so low-income housing tax credits um which is a very laborious and lengthy process just to get the financing out of the federal government for these properties um we have to have a some a seller or donor who's

055willing to work with us on that timeline so we it's hard for us to compete out in the open market basically yeah but I think you know we are in a county with um I think this is true the two closest division one universities physically in America and so the student body populations that we have which are then unfortunately in sort of competition for what other folks who would be that income level um for housing if those universities aren't keeping pace which obviously they have it with their housing stock um it just exacerbates a problem that's already sizable even before even without the university involvement well thank you all for having me again I'm I'm pretty easy to reach um to do more ed a like this or for folks who want to volunteer get

056involved we have our own committees just like this one to navigate the work that we do um local advocacy opportunities state federal as well so uh I appreciate what you all are doing for renters in our community and it's great to be here and thank you for your time thank you so much Scott thank you yeah thank you yeah have a good night thanks thank you great well thank you everybody um as he pointed out you know you can just send them an email if you have any questions um I've met a number of people from Avalon they've all been very lovely and very open to discussing anything so we're lucky to have them here okay we can move on to next item 7-b Outreach planning discussion um so presumably if I remember correctly this

057is uh discussing um how we are going to reach out to people um is this Julia is this I I remember you brought this up is this regarding like uh to inform people about the work of the commission or is it about renters right trying to inform them about renters rights I was just kind of thinking that it's the start is I'm getting emails about street festivals and stuff that it's the timeing year if we're going to be doing tabling on either one of those issues it's that we should start thinking about it so I I'm not sure if there's a best way to proceed uh Jamie I don't know if you think we should do this in committee or um I I do think that's how we did it previously yeah so that might

058be a good idea okay yeah go ahead jul maybe it's just a call out for anybody who might be interested in doing the tabling or might want to help us prioritize like where and exactly what we're kind of doing um should come to the uh committee meeting um who will schedule that meeting I can do it okay thank you Jamie I do appreciate that um yeah um as long as I'm free I'd love to go there um I think a good set of uh actions there would be to find uh opportunity and like Julia said prioritize figure out what where would would be going when who and um what what would be what would we be doing there um we I just ordered from our State Rep representative Morgan a bunch of new uh tenants

059rights guides and I'm happy to hand some over to some Commissioners if you ever need any just email a state legislator and they'll print some off for you I personally think the state legislature want are really wellmade they're bigger than the city ones and they have it's pretty easy to use since they have all that so much space to work with but I'm happy to pass those off so um okay anything else on this note about Outreach planning I have a question Julia are you thinking about the art fair maybe doing a table during the art fair I I don't know if the art fair makes the most sense or like top of the park or any of the other things um I like top of the Park yeah we did I think green fair

060in the past too and that was that was a really well attended I mean art fair gets kind of chaotic I think it's great to try um if we can or like the townies Party part of art fair but kind of the the slower Pac things like green fair I think we get a little bit more contact with folks but I'm open to trying any of them I think we missed a deadline for Art Fair this year okay yeah I like top of the park that was that I like that okay anything else on Outreach okay okay so we'll look out for an email Jamie thank you I I appreciate you taking the time to schedule something um then we can move on to 7-c uh plan for next meeting so what would we what

061would we like to have in our agenda for our next meeting election of a new chair yes great I guess maybe a report from the education committee about what the meeting comes up with about tabling Gord well we're kind of talking about events I will just toss this out here I was hoping to come to this meeting with a date but um I think I've mentioned before that some of us um landlords wh Safe House ozone we've all kind of been meeting to try to figure out um just how to how to build community how to do better with um getting folks to understand and take Section 8 um and the other programmingsoftware April at corner Brewery most likely but we haven't fed up the date so I just want to kind of put a

062plugin that um I'll pass that along when I have it um but for anybody listening just kind of keep keep an eye out for that announcement um it will just be kind of a connection event to hear a little bit about the process to hear from other landlords who have had success doing it and who have really enjoyed and then kind of FAQ um session with wh and some of the other entities so I think it's going to be really fun but just wanted to throw that out there thank you rosanita um is it possible to get an update for how the or I guess how many people the money city council um had given to was it ah aahc for the eviction assistants um I don't have it I know uh if is it

063my screen's not showing oh there he is council member Rina um I know that Jennifer Hall had um mentioned I think at I don't know if was the last city council meeting or the budget meeting um that you guys had that they had released the funds um for that I think separate from the county is that right um I'm trying to think about the exact fun so I I think are you talking about some of the funds that we allocated from um last year's marijuana excise tax revenue I don't remember if it was the ex excise tax revenue or if it was after that um but it was I just remember there was there was F there were funds that came in that was It was supposed to go to helping with the eviction assistance

064and I I couldn't remember if it was like one set just with the marijuana funds or if it was two sets of of uh funding releases but it just it would be nice to know um how many families that that helped to keep housed here in an arbor yeah I can check in if it's the same funds that I'm thinking of um my understanding is that we um we could have used more um and and obviously and um and so it's something that uh we're already talking about as we head into kind of this next budget cycle um and this is a a midyear cycle so there won't be massive changes to the budget um but particularly those that kind of council allocated um if we want to keep them going we probably need to

065allocate them again um and so um it's something that we're talking about and whether or not we can find some additional funds to kind of bolster some of those programs that were really successful in providing some social safety net um and then particularly uh the the stuff that the city is doing you know in partnership with the county as well obviously that's that's a way for us to be able to kind of um uh multiply our our impact if if we can get the county to come in on it as well um but those programs that we went directly through um the Housing Commission on I believe uh my understanding is I think that those funds have largely run out but we can check and get an update right I I think they I mean

066or maybe it's just an assumption because I'm the weirdo that watches the tenant landlord uh court cases but it's I was just curious because I you know you see Haw at a lot of those meetings and a lot of people utilizing the funds and so I was just curious you know overall how many families the city's been been able to help um you know because it is really really important because we are keeping people from being becoming evicted from from the apartments that they're living in right now Kristen is that something that we could potentially check in with Jennifer Hall on and up [Music] thanks um I think is the program you're referencing was Nita the rising hope program no it's not that one that one was that money was spread out to kind of

067different entities to help with kind of more supportive services this one it helped people pay their the back rent that they owed I see um and so and so the amounts what kind of vary I think um but I think that it's I just think that it's something that's really important um and I know at the county level um people like they had allocated even more funding and I think it was in November and that that one people were waiting to hear like when that started but I know that Ann Arbor had given uh quite a bit of of money specifically for um eviction assistance and a number of it you know were to rig non students I guess I should say um and so I think it be good for the renters commission to

068kind of have an idea of where that where that stands sense Julia uh just another student thing um zachari I believe in the fall you had talked a little bit about um right to counsil and it maybe you could give an update on that at the next meeting or actions you think we might take as a body as you leave sure yeah that's a very good point um yeah I I had had a meeting with um an attorney from Detroit who was involved in the Coalition that got right to Council in Detroit and it was I learned quite a bit about what had happened there and what what's applicable and what's not to our situation so I'd be happy to uh uh review my notes from that from that meeting and kind of give an

069update and give some suggestions um you know there was actually something um that I'm now thinking of I don't think this is just to put on our radar I'm not sure if we should discuss at the next meeting necessarily but um I believe the inter Cooperative Council has endorsed the idea of right to uh right of first refusal so if a landlord wants to sell a rental um complex they would have to ask their tenants first if they wanted to apply for a loan and buy it before they could sell to anybody else and I think that you know Cooperative Council would be interested was interested in that because some in some cases that you know the tens can get together and form a co-op instead of um you know that continuing to be a

070regular landlord tenant situation um so you know if we ever if the commission ever does investigate that I would really suggest we talk to the ICC because I believe that that is one of their policy proposals right um of first refusal anything else for our next meeting we don't currently have a guest speaker but um I think the ICC probably could talk at the next one most likely Travis thanks uh I think that I found what Rosen was looking for um it's uh coordinated through the uh Washington account uh o um and by the looks of it the last time that we got kind of a report on it was in June of uh 20123 and so if it's an annual report we're probably not quite there yet um but we might be able to

071get an update to date um and it was I think a little under a year ago that we uh allocated $35,000 to the kind of coordinated effort through the county um but it looks like as of June 9th 2023 um um for that year it had been 182 approved um uh uh requests that went through um that were approved so um so yeah we might be able to get an update but I think that I think that's the one you're talking about um and so Kristen if that helps point you in that direction yeah unfortunately I don't remember the name but that was really helpful thank you uh it was off the top of my head so if I had done gone back I I would have known but yeah okay um if you have

072any ideas for agenda items just email me Julia and Kristen and um we'll add it let's move on then to item 8 reports 8-a report from city council is there anything you'd like to give us an update on yeah um I think we already got a bit of an update on the updates to the um ELO right to renew um obviously those went through um I am continuing conversations with our attorneys and council member Harrison on um our next ordinance um we are meeting again we are unfortunately running into the circumstance where uh folks are out of town at conflicting times and we're having having a little bit of trouble meeting but we're looking at uh reconnecting here in the next couple of weeks um but as uh zachai and I pointed out in our

073last conversation we are kind of at that time period where um fees for the previous year have have kind of been paid and so we've kind of got a little bit of of room here before folks are going to start taking on all those pre- teny fees again so um we're not kind of up against a deadline here in the next couple of weeks but obviously we want to um continue this process moving as quickly as possible um as it relates to affordable housing since we've heard a lot about that um tonight um at our meeting on Monday it was just this week uh Monday we uh the council approved selling 123 West Summit to the an Arbor Housing Commission for additional affordable housing um and so that is um kind of just west of

074Wheeler Park uh so uh hopefully another project uh moving along there relatively soon um and then we also approved um bonding up to $9 million in support of the cine Street um project and part of the reason for that is simply because uh frankly how much uh these development projects cost and um if we weren't able to kind of borrow some of that in bond for it um then the Housing Commission would essentially wrap up all of their existing resources into a single project and wouldn't be able to have mult multiple things in the pipeline at the same time um so this allows some additional flexibility for the Housing Commission to continue moving forward with other projects that are in the pipeline um while while continuing to fully fund this project um and so those

075are a couple of the the things we're working on um if there's anything else I can give an update on we are a quickly approaching budget uh uh time again for us and so that will take up a lot of our Focus over the next few weeks um so that that is likely what we will you will hear us working on a lot thank you um I have a quick question the bonding you're referencing is that the are those the bonds that are backed by the affordable housing millage or is this something different it is okay thank you any questions comments I guess I can add one additional thing since we heard about it a little bit tonight um with the uh Public Safety and mental health millage uh coming up for Renewal this fall

076um I know that there's been a lot of discussion in the past about how the city is utilizing our rebate funds um I think it's always important to address that um 100% of mental health dollars are going to mental health the city does not receive a rebate for the mental health portion of that millage um that is 100% Going to Mental Health Services uh the city receives a rebate for the public safety portion of that millage because we provide our own Public Safety Services we we don't rely on the sheriff for Public Safety um a previous Council had approved uh what is often kind of referred to as the 40 4020 plan where 40% of the resources or 40% % of the rebate goes to affordable housing 40% goes to climate action and 20% goes

077to pedestrian and bicycle safety um I will say that as we are approaching uh renewal what you will likely see from Council is again a kind of resolution promising the voters uh how we would allocate those dollars if it passes uh so that we can we can be on the record of of saying this is how we and Arbor will spend our rebate dollars um you will likely see changes to that is what I'm anticipating because since this past um as you will likely know we now have uh new millages for affordable housing climate action and uh and sidewalks and so we have additional sources of funding for each of those things um I know that I've been part of conversations about potentially uh utilizing those funds for what would be a more Public Safety

078purpose um which would be uh continuing to bolster unarmed crisis response work um which we know is going to cost more than we currently have allocated if we really want to get a robust program in place um but we also have to recognize the impact that that removing some of those funds would have on affordable housing work and so I think we still have to figure out exactly what that balance would be um and also what we think would be acceptable to voters because obviously ultimately they have to believe in the vision in order to continue voting for The millage which is really critical to pass so um so just wanted to provide that update as you'll likely hear a lot more as we approach uh this fall thank you any questions comments we can

079move on to uh h-b report from our liaison to hhsb uh hello yes um actually I had emailed Kristen I don't have a report they did not mean this month normally they would have met last Thursday uh but they um their next meeting is not until April so okay have nothing at this time thank you we move to h-h 8-c excuse me a report from staff lays on the only item I have to report was about the Complaint Form that we discussed earlier um so like we discussed we're hoping to get the Complaint Form and the guide um for the new ordinance changes up online pretty soon um I I think we could shoot for tomorrow afternoon but I think like Tuesday next week is realistic so all I have thank you uh 8-d or

080do we have any reports from Commissioners anything think we should be aware of okay anything comes up you can always send an email to the group all right then we will move on to [Music] um uh item nine you know we don't have any attendees right at the moment Kristen should we still go through the the public comment process um I will read the instructions and then if anybody calls in we can um kind of go back to it I know that we have several items of communication to to get through so um just really briefly to address the renters commission about any topic for up to three minutes you can call 877 853 5247 or 888 78899 and enter a meeting ID 935 8801 1941 can also join um using the zoom link and

081that is a2gov.org renters commission meeting and to be called on to speak you can um raise your hand by pressing star n if you're calling or using the raise hand feature if you are online so just in case anyone is watching on CTN at home there are no callers but I will anybody thank you very much Kristen okay we'll keep going to our last item item 10 communication we had a number of emails here um and I'm trying to think of the best way to go through because I think some of them are uh things that we probably should discuss others I'm not sure if we really should weigh in um although it's good to be aware of what people are emailing us of course um let's see I think we could go through each

082of them and just kind of I mean some of them it seems like it seems like the communication that was given to them is sufficient but some of them it seems like there are some more suggestions maybe sounds okay this one regarding bezac properties are you looking in order is that number because number one and two the same kind of issue and I was wondering if like ability Partners or disability Network because it sounds like maybe I I'm I'm unclear because it mentioned like fair housing or disability stuff I don't know I wonder if there's a role for them or like dispute resolution center um or also we can just say we don't have anything to do with it but I wonder if there was any other resources that um I guess I I don't

083know this situation but I think about a friend who has an autistic son who vocalizes often that's had insecurity housing security issues because of um the vocalizations and things and of course I don't want to assume in this situation but I just thought that maybe maybe it would be helpful to provide I don't know some other suggestions based on but I'm also open to that not being our role Rosita um reading it it I got a little confused on this one because it seemed like there was someone who was complaining and then they brought another tenant into it complaining about the other tenant and then suddenly it was um going into the American with Disabilities Act and I couldn't figure out if it was the original complaining a um tenant or if it was the

084tenant who possibly has the disability um on a different email like it was a little confusing yeah I was also a bit confused about that uh Christ do you was there a response given to this tenant um I can double check one of them is from February and I'm sure I believe that both Communications are from the same person um copying renters on their correspondence with their landlord so um I can follow up with them if you have um something specific to direct them to the automatic reply includes the resources on the website um so I could emphasize that or if you have another thing to share with them yeah I'll open that up to the group here is there specific suggestion uh connection we want to make um or should we just leave it

085at the resources that were already sent to them okay all right well we do have quite a few of these so let's just move on to the next one um let's see oh yeah this is the um um the be property one yeah is this AA issue I mean I don't maybe maybe somebody else can help I don't know who like is the the management on the affordable housing side through beakman beakman or who's coordinating intake if it's if it's whha or Housing Commission but it seems like referral back to whatever that entity is was appropriate for this one yeah um want to say that go ahead Julie I I think it's the county oh really yeah yeah I I think there when you had somebody had mentioned units last time beakman actually came up

086so whatever I think I was looking at wh but Kristen could verify that and just give them the resource of you know thanks for sharing your issues but here's here's who who could maybe have some oversight about this yeah rosanita well I it looks like they already emailed someone at the county because it has um the person's name it's not redacted at the top with their email address and the washt not.org is is the county um so but observation yeah it seems like they're connected with the person they must have just copied us on it is that what happens Kristen when these come to us often we're copied on it and I just looked up um Karen Newman and Karen is with Housing and Community infrastructure and he's a Community Development specialist with the county

087so I think I think that is a good resource okay um I would be happy just to um send an email I don't know if this is a you know what do you all think about this but send an email to Karen just to make sure that this person got taken care of and we might learn something about their processes in the meantime so unless anyone has an issue with that I'll just make a note okay okay thank you we can move on to the next one this is uh thank you Kristen for responding to this one and helping the T to understand this was a situation where was it the um the lease that was ending because of uh Construction I had yeah Kristen's response seemed sufficient to this one to me I mean

088she she referred them to rental housing to do a complaint and that seems sufficient yeah although you know for my my understanding is the same as yours Kristen that I don't think that the ordinance would protect the tenant in this instance since it is construction um but nonetheless thank you for affording them okay this is um an email regarding complex called the court yards they had a weight list deposit um so one thing to note is that this um I just I think for context and for our work it's a little bit important to explain these situations so the situations at these corporate highrises are that you sign you've always signed essentially a promise to lease like even before those became popular and the reason Reon being because these are these are corporate highrises they

089have different layouts you know three bedroom four bedroom whatever and they don't know what's going to be available so they predict based on kind of past experience as to what they think's going to be available they sign the promises to lease essentially for those um for that number of units and then often even prior to all of the recent leasing changes there was a oh we don't have what you want you can only have the penthouse and pay more or we don't have anything for four we're going to have to split you up and put you in in two and two or we don't have two and two we're going to put you in four and put you in with two strangers so these are individual leases typically that tenants sign and so the situations

090of like not being able to offer the space is always and has been a problem that I think um I'll be curious if we're able to do weight list fees and things like that if if that will kind of change that landscape but just to give kind of the context of this idea of not having what you thought you were going to get available has happened since we've had these corporate highrises because they've always signed not on specific unit 524 um bedroom B they have always just signed on three-bedroom um unit and if they don't have that you can't get it so just to give people some context who aren't in this world I thought that might be helpful thank you Jordan for the Conta Ro um what's a when you say corporate high rise

091what exactly do you mean by that yeah so like the the places that are owned by big National companies that have you know many different units of many different layouts but like four three bedrooms so thinking taller apartment buildings sometimes smaller not necessarily highrises I I guess I should use careful language but they're more corporate owned building so this will include places like Courtyards who is kind of a mix in students and some people that live on north campus but then also the really traditional very student geared ones Landmark zpl 611 Saga all of those kind of downtown area ones um but there are a couple that are are popping up on North Campus to kind of house those students too does that does that help clarify or is there further I think so so

092basically you can apply you know you're looking for a three-bedroom you you find two friends or two people who you're like I can live with them you apply together as a group um kind of like you're applying to a dorm I guess and yeah kind of and then at their discretion they're like well I know you want a room with them but we're going to put these two together and we're going to put you in the one bedroom that costs $11,000 more a month yeah so there's there's a couple of kinds of issues so yeah you're touching on some of them that I think in this particular place it was just that we didn't have a three-bedroom apartment available to you and so we will put you in a four bedroom with some other random

093people and this is part of the problem is there's this idea of individual leases versus a group lease and so these are individual leases so essentially you're signing for the promise of a bedroom in a specific type of unit and a hope that you will be with your friends most of these situations that happened at Courtyard within the last couple of weeks were uh I signed for a three-bedroom apartment and they have no three-bedroom apartments because everybody renewed or whatever the case is or um you know there was a higher level of renewal with three bedrooms and I think we're we're going to see more renewals with it being a housing crisis people are uh people are more comfortable tolerating a a less than perfect unit right now I think so we're not seeing as

094many people moving around as we used to we definitely have our own highest level of renewals so I think in this particular scenario it's the idea that they thought they were going to have an apartment and they didn't get one and I guess my my comment is kind of to say this has always existed I'm not saying it's right I've always had a huge problem with how this works um but this this particular situation isn't necessarily ordinance related or caused if that helps people's understandings does that make sense okay Julie I see you have a handout uh I I just want to agree with you they are kind of unique and different except that there's a lot of them now um and I do kind of they feel like private dorms to me it's a

095suite and you're getting a room as opposed to running the whole thing um but not returning your application fee you know like there can that language can be cleared up like it it is a ripoff and I was just looking again California has adjusted for inflation the maximum you can charge is $60 for an application fee California has way more corporate buildings than we do and if they can make a profit on $60 there they can make a profit on $60 here it doesn't need to be 286 totally and maybe application fee doesn't need to be a stream of profit also right like an application fee could be an application fee um I mean I think in this email I read multiple issues one issue of thinking that you had a place for months and

096not looking and not doing anything else and the other issue is kind of being split up or um having to pay these fees that then you know are are not um refundable this particular situation seems like a maybe have Gail try with them because it sounds like they're students maybe have Gail try with them to see if they can get some of that um you know the application feedback morally I think this is wrong I don't think that we should be making profits on people's um Misfortune right like this is a really crappy situation to think and and the problem is that these things have always looked like leases so with these situations unlike the promises to lease or the newer kind of iterations that we're seeing this is you actually are signing a lease

097But the lease is just kind of vague and you know maybe John has something to add too but this is a lease that says you're going to we're going to get you're going to have a shot at a three-bedroom essentially and it looks like a real lease and so I think even versus a promise to leasee this feels more leasy and so people get even more surprised when these kind of things happen if that makes sense yeah thank you rosanita I know that you're saying it's like it's not just uh students but like I'm looking you know he's a freshman right and assuming going to U ofm when with uf's uh you know student the the legal Ser sorry the um legal services that they offer can to bet she's not here because it' be

098a question for Gail um can they would the university look over um something like this before a student signs they will so the student students of the University have the option to like take a lease that they are considering signing to Student Legal Services say I think the problem is you know this is said in the lease um it says that that you're going to have a shot at this apartment um my moral qual with these has been it looks like a lease and you think you have a house and then you find out you don't have a home you know so um it says it in the lease and Student Legal Services will probably say that but the other thing is like the falling through of this is a much smaller situation than the

099success of it right like there's lots of people who are going to sign these and they're going to get an apartment with Courtyards and it's going to work out just fine and so the problem is Courtyards doesn't think there's any problem because there's only a small number of people that end up being disappointed hurt you know at the at the end but it if we you know we've now kind of said set the renewal timelines I mean I guess I'm curious to see how with our new renewal response timeline combined with whatever fee bill is coming out um I'm curious to see how that addresses this type of situation so um not to minimize this this suffering this is really really bad and really unfortunate and feels really crappy when you're on the receiving end

100of this but I guess to say for our work from the renters commission I'm I'm open to other feedback or push back on this it feels like we are setting things up for next year to to address some of this potentially Maybe makes sense um Julia was your hands still up or was that just yeah I just wanted to like clarify real quick that Student Legal Services is a prepaid Student Legal Aid plan and it is not a university program um do you like are you I guess I'm not sure exactly what your like it's it's included with your tuition you just go to them it's every student has access to Student Legal Services right but the university Michigan does not run it it exists because students vote every year to say yes we want

101to buy into this program and it's part of their student fees oh okay I get I get what you're saying you're not saying that an individual student has to choose to buy in okay that yes I get what you're saying that makes sense I don't I don't think they um take make any votes anymore I think it just keeps happening and I think that there if I'm not mistaken there is a separate there's like a student fee for student government and there's a student fee for student legle services they just assess no matter what I don't even think it's put up to a vote anymore okay uh we have a few more of these so let's keep going uh anyone have any comments questions about this email about Pine Valley Apartments Jamie um just a

102quick comment I think there was a section of that email that was missed in the redaction so maybe if we could avoid like putting that on the screen um just to protect thaty but I don't have any comments in relation to the content sorry okay um yeah looking oh yeah you're right thanks Julia uh you know I don't remember if uh Chris and you had responded on this one I mean roaches are hard but if it's really bad the building inspector can site them for it I did not um provide that information but I can if you know but it can't be the typical roaches well I saw six when I turned my lights off it's got to be like oh man those are everywhere you know because how else would the inspector see them

103yeah this is a complicated situation okay Jeff um the only thing I could think of on there is the um the option I know it's it takes some effort but to um do the whole rent escrow if there's unable condition and medically and and sanitation wise I mean that would be a I think that would apply if the The Situation's not being taken care of thanks Rita um that's the one though where they had someone living with them who wasn't on the lease correct and now the landlord I mean even if it's retaliatory the problem is still there that they had someone on the lease I mean living in the apartment who wasn't on the lease which means that they did break the lease terms right yep either way um we as the renters commission

104don't provide legal counsel so um we can't accompany them to their their meeting anyway right um I think it might be best to send them the list of resources Julia I I mean what rosanita says right we can't really help them but the fact that they broke they violated one of the lease terms by having an additional person does not negate any of their rights the landlord can give them a 30-day notice and I can comply and get back in with the lease um but yeah there's not anything more we can do yeah yeah I I I mean I would just suggest this person consider going to um legal services of South Central Michigan if they are eligible y I was just going to say that and I think the situation is actually resolved I

105think potentially okay not spend too much time on yeah okay um let's keep moving on here uh there is an email let me see to C member R yeah I can jump in on this one I think I think the initial email didn't actually there was a missing s in the email so I don't think the initial one hit your inbox um but I replied to you guys um so this was a person who um was reaching out on behalf of their daughter I believe who was a student um who along with a number of other students was looking at in a a house that is being managed by Oxford um and they put down a security deposit and application fee um and then um we notified that at the kind of that last date

106allowed that the current tenants were renewing their lease um and so they reached out to us it looks like pretty immediately um if you scroll back up to the date um of the initial email there I think um yeah so it reached out to us on the 14th so within kind of three days of of that initial process starting um I reached out directly to Oxford on this one and got a response um and so it looks like basically what happened was the timeline um the existing tenants had notified Oxford that they were renewing um the very next business day um they contacted them to let them know that it wasn't available um and my understanding is they initially offered a few other Alternatives and when those weren't um similar to kind of what um

107uh what was described earlier was some of the the bigger places that have multiple units that they can offer even though this was a house they offered some other properties that might be similar and might meet uh the criteria and when those weren't um deemed acceptable um it looks like actually on the day that we were emailed um Oxford had already dep or uh had already sent out without a uh 100% refund and so um kind of within 3 days there and so it seems like this one should be resolved um obviously pretty exorbitant fees there that that are being mentioned kind of the security deposit down despite the fact that it wasn't guaranteed yet things like that is it's a lot of money to be down um which is what we're working to address

108right now but um ultimately it does seem like this has been fully refunded at this point um she also the the original email also mentioned um something about kind of this being a kind of a profit making operation um for Oxford and Oxford noted in that first bullet point that um when they take in these funds that they're maintained in a zero interest security deposit account um required by law so um so they they are claiming that they don't make any money off of these transactions um that is truly just being held in a zero interest account um but so anyway at this point uh I think that this one should be resolved but obviously the circumstances there um might be worth discussing more um and then obviously um you can see for yourselves at

109the end there that um this is something we regularly hear from from some of the property management folks that um that some of this kind of last minute um March being a late time for somebody to kind of start this process over they they believe as a result of the the new timelines around early leasing ordinance so um something for us to continue to keep an eye on obviously I continue to believe that the market hasn't fully reset itself yet because we had so many loopholes that were being um were being utilized by landlords to get around the law um but it's something we may want to continue to keep our eyes on moving forward so that you know if we continue to hear from more renters that maybe this timeline isn't working um that

110maybe we adjust it by you know 30 days or something like that um uh but just something to keep our eyes on in the future as of right now I am only hearing that from landlords um and so um I that's not enough for me to say that we've proven there that this timeline isn't working thank you Jordan be mindful of time but I just want to put a quick I mean this just shows how we have to address these fees right like I I I'm not read I I read what you're reading Travis but like the idea that people have thousands of of money thousands of dollars of money in one place traps them they can't look for anything else they can't get on any other weight list there there's zero option um and

111it just feels like a a very destructive and abusive relationship because a lot of these students don't have this kind of money I mean obviously the the things that were in the news with Campus Management and Prime with you know $6,000 for two people like I there's no way I could have ever come up with anything like that as a tenant myself and it just limits people and locks them into one option that there's a good chance they're not going to get so I think to me it seems to be important that we continue to focus on that that piece um and not the like oh it got refunded and oh it was quick and you know I mean that's not that's not the part that's the really horrible part about all yeah I 100%

112agree with that and I think I mean we're obviously working to address that with the ordinance that will be coming so um yeah so that is the piece that we are working to address y yeah uh Jamie yeah just a quick comment it also doesn't seem clear from the emails that the landlord made any type of statement to say like we I don't know it just just um it seems a little um misleading to me and I could see why someone who's paying that much money would think that that means that they've secured a place to live so um obviously the burden is kind of on both um the renter as well but um yeah that is it's a little disturbing yeah and I was not provided any Communications from either of them about like

113what what the actual dialogue between the two were um but yeah I I mean I I agree with you completely if if I'm putting that much money down on something my expectation is that that I have something locked in and I think um what I don't know is like what was in the fine print of those original Communications right um and so that's something that we should keep our eyes on as well yeah uh Julia sorry you know I've been a bookkeeper for a nonprofit developer you know landlord and I I still can't understand why a lot of an arbor landlords want to do this like if it's really going into a zero interest account you're spending all this time Cashing and writing checks on somebody who eight months down the road you know in

114November they took the money like I they usually keep a portion is is the money piece Julia I mean for my understand I don't know this I can't speak to this ex explicit example but if they're charging 150 for a background or a application fee and then they they keep you know Five times 150 on this lease the the the whatever they're doing with that money background check whatever application putting it in administrative is a very small piece of that 150 so even though they're giving some of this deposit back they're usually keeping aart so it's become a stream of of Revenue a stream of profit for people yeah so that's why so in this particular case um they it they at least say that 100% both the deposit and the application were 100% refunded

115um but um I also have heard I mean I I think I sat down a few weeks ago now with um with Washington area Department Association but also just in conversations I've had with landlords in the past um I think exactly what um what has been mentioned here which is like this does lock people in and I think what we regularly hear is if we get rid of these fees then then the tenants have no teeth like no skin in the game like there there's nothing that so they're going to apply to every single apartment in the city of Ann Arbor and then we're going to think we're full and then we actually don't have any tenants because they've all signed somewhere else um and that's the argument on the other side um uh I

116don't necessarily believe that that will be the case considering that um there aren't a ton of vacancies all over town um but uh but that is the the argument about why they would do this um I certainly don't think that you know even if that were the case it strikes me as a little odd that they would need to take in this amount of money in order to do that um but um but that has been the argument that I have consistently heard and and it's just I'm sorry it just feels like BS the vacancy rate is not 10% the vacancy rate is beneath three and which is smaller than what the national Apartment Association says it should be so it just feels like they're making all this up thank you Julia thanks Travis Jeff

117then we should keep moving on here oh yeah I was say I I find it disingenuous that they're they express so much concern about the plight of renters and then are willing to lock them in to that that with that level of of fun I just I can't I can't buy that as a as a reason I just can't yeah when I see that I I always I privately call that like a ventriloquist act because they always are telling us what tenants are actually saying but then I don't never hear these things from tenants um I just before we move on I just want to say I thought it was interesting that they said that um signing 150 days so that's five months before the end of a lease uh is like the last minute

118they said that tenant is waiting to the last minute to sign and that's giving that's five months from the end of your lease you're just over the halfway point in in a yearlong Le I think that's very telling that to them that's the last minute but let's keep going on that that that was maybe my uh narrator putting like I think I think it was like like the last day that that was allowed under the law for them to say that they were renewing um so that's what they meant by kind of the last minute um yeah oh yeah so yeah um in my conversation it was you know it was the end of that period where they had it was the the very end of when they could say that they were renewing right

119okay um we should um go somewhat quickly here I think since it's getting late but um something very similar uh this was from Oxford also about an application fee and then a deposit fee uh which I don't think that I don't believe any law requires them to treat the deposit like a security deposit since these are not considered to be security deposits my is my understanding so they could put it in an interest account which I'm not I think that this might be the same address is this the same one same house yeah yeah same house I didn't realize that gotcha thanks okay then we'll keep moving on um H okay this is Varsity management this time same thing uh it's a $500 reservation fee on top of the $150 application fee so that's 650

120before um you would even put down a security deposit yeah I've seen that actually I don't think there's anything new in this one um Jeff I see your hands up is that just from earlier yeah looks like it okay no worries sorry about that no worries at all okay um anything else on the weight List fee uh emails okay I think we're on the same page about this being a problem um okay uh this one was from a member of central Student Government at U ofm um I'm happy to reach out to them I have been talking with some members of that organization um great and um we did receive an email I think our last meeting we talked about it from Jewish Family Services I have not yet reached out to them but I'm

121planning on doing that probably tomorrow okay any other comments questions about uh the communications or are we good to move on okay we'll move on to item 11 adjournment uh do we have a motion to adjourn I move to adjourn motion by uh rosanita do we have a second second second by Jeff all in favor say I I I I all those Post in a great with that we are adjourned thank you everybody thank you very much good night everyone good night good night good night m