001March 8th 2023 electronic meeting of the Ann Arbor design review board this meeting is held electronically to protect public health and safety due to the covid-19 virus and to comply with the orders issued by the governor the Michigan Department of Health and Human Services and or the Washington County Health Department we intend to conduct this meeting similar to an in-person meeting however please be patient if there are technical issues public comment will be via telephone only to speak during any of the public comment opportunities please call 877-852-5247 or 888-788-0099 toll-free an intermediate ID 974-6174-9412 uh public uh comment will be via telephone already did that this information is also available on the published agenda in Public Notices section of the city website and on the broadcast of this meeting on CTN Channel 16 at T
002channel 99 and online at www.a2go.org watch ctm the design review board is a volunteer resident board appointed by the mayor and confirmed by city council purpose of the design review board is to Foster excellence in the design of Ann Arbor's built environment and to advise applicants on how a project can meet the spirit and intent of the downtown design guidelines first the applicant will have 10 minutes to present their proposed project to the design review board then the design review board will hold a discussion on the design of the project following the presentation and discussion members of the public are permitted to come in for up to three minutes um I think I might have asked this once before Jeff but does CTN put that call in information up for people that are um looking
003remotely because if I didn't have a pencil in hand and I was watching there's no way I would have gotten that those phone numbers down and so forth I I believe that they do but I can look into that after the meeting okay good all right well then if you can do the roll Jeff uh happy too um member Perkins here remember Singleton member oh I I see I I see Lori's here um member Burns here remember Cooper member Kinley here remember Mitchell here remember Ramson here and John katarski yeah you you have a quorum all right I talked to Gary earlier today and he he said he'd be here so I would expect him to uh zoom in any minute right so on to approval of the agenda um if everybody's had a chance
004to review it if there are uh so I'll entertain a motion for approval motion to approve report moved and supported uh any discussion changes Corrections all right all those in favor signify by saying aye all right all opposed same sign agendas approved on to the approval of the minutes these are minutes from the December 14 2022 design review board meeting um so I will entertain a motion for approval motion to approve support moved and supported uh anybody have any questions Corrections uh comments all right hearing on all those in favor signify by saying aye aye those opposed same sign minutes are approved and now on to public comment um to speak during public comment please call now get your pencils out eight seven seven eight five two five two four seven or eight eight eight
005seven eight eight zero zero nine nine toll-free and enter meeting ID 974-6174-9412 anybody anymore here to be any callers at this time okay then we can move on to regular business and we are looking at a proposal for 300 East Huron Street um Jeff before we jump into that I wanted to make sure that you all had a chance to meet um Hank Kelly who is the city's new Deputy planning manager Hank is going to become more involved with the drb process as as I uh right off into the sunset and so I wanted to make sure everybody got a chance to meet uh Hank Hank do you want to say hi and tell us a little bit about yourself um I would love to and first I'm going to do something requested of Me
006by friends in the disability Community I'm going to do a quick self-description so I have a lightweight skin I have short brown hair I'm wearing a brown sweater I'm sitting in an office and um uh Jeff gave me a great mini intro I would also add that my pronouns are they them I've worked uh primarily coming from a transportation planning background so I'm excited to delve into new areas of planning as I join the the department in the city of Ann Arbor I just joined in November so there are a lot of things not just drb that are new to me so I appreciate um everyone's patience with me as I take over a very small part of Jeff's big shoes that I'll need to fill I'm uh available to any of you for for
007questions that you may have about the transition of the drb I just didn't know I know sometimes these meetings are canceled if we don't have incoming applications and so I wanted to take the opportunity to get some face time early on with you thank you thank you to meet you Hank yeah welcome thank you so much um just one other piece of business that I wanted to cover before we uh move on to the um to the first item um and and that is if if uh if a member um of the drb needs to uh recuse themselves we're going to ask that um you you do so but then to remove yourself physically from from the meeting um uh that's that's the um that that would be the appropriate um way to go about
008that that's all I think we can move on into um into our um into our first item all right well I guess we should promote the development team into the meeting thanks Jeff uh that that might take a minute or so hey Mike hey how's it going good to see you good to see you too uh can you hear me well yeah yeah I sure can I can see that Nick has joined us and I can see that um a representative from Myers and Associates is with us and um I understand that maybe Nick is going to be running the slide deck is that is that the case that's correct great and will Nick also be uh narrating Nick will also be narrating correct okay but just before he does I just want to say
009hi to everyone I know almost everybody on the um on the board so good to see you all again and Jeff you have to stay with us until we're done you can't quit mid-stream when you're actually you're leaving what your last day is but we got to get done before you go all right I'll postpone my retirement then probably not okay um Nick why don't you tell us when you're ready to start the presentation you guys will have 10 minutes and then after you're done with the presentation uh members of the board will offer feedback and then at the end I'll um offer uh some feedback myself and then I'll summarize uh the comments that I've heard um and that's um pretty much how the process is going to work okay great can you guys
010all hear us um we we can Nick you were a little crackly there do you wanna do you want to speak again a little bit yeah I just wanted to confirm that you guys can hear me okay yep that's better better you should be able to share your screen okay I need you a co-host and then I will have a havoc and I will let you know when there's uh yeah and just to just to clarify here I I have my computer running where you can see my face but then we're also connected here to a conference room computer Chris Myers is sitting across the conference room table from me as well good afternoon everyone hey hey Chris so I will pull up the PDF right now and that should be visible to everybody correct
011uh it is let us know when you want to begin all right we're ready to go okay so thanks for the opportunity to um meet with us today we have uh just a quick introductions you know first Martin Mike Martin our team I'm Nick Munoz the project manager on the project and Chris Myers our principal architect on the project and in our office um our civil engineer who I don't believe is is on this meeting at this time is Midwestern Consulting uh Tom cover who you may know as well um so just jumping into the the plan so the proposal like Jeff had mentioned is at the corner of Huron and East Huron and South Fifth uh the southeast corner and the D1 Midtown District um directly across the hall across the street uh across
012Huron is City Hall um and adjacent to the south on South Fifth is uh Bank of Ann Arbor um adjacent to the West is uh I believe it's a telephone company facility there the proposed project is six stories 139 guest rooms 79 808 total gross square feet um which is about 75 500 square feet as calculated based on the floor area ratio requirements um it's kind of a reverse L configuration with building tight to the street at Fifth and Huron and some open space for parking uh on the interior side of the site there's a pass-through for vehicular access to that parking area that's located further down fifth um so in the in the project overall floor plans we've got a a small basement area to house some utilities and service functions for the building
013which is primarily intended to free up the ground floor square footage for as much as the Public Hotel amenity space that we can get to really kind of activate the the the streetscape along those main public ways and then of course two through five are occupied by the guest rooms and then when we get up to floor six we've got a fitness facility with two guest room wings and a roof Terrace area that's out at the corner for um you know guests to kind of go out and get a view down over the city and into the surrounding landscape the elevations I'll kind of run through fairly quickly we can focus mostly on the 3D perspective views so this would be the Huron Street elevation with um a combination of brick metal panel and some
014stone paneling this is the Fifth Street elevation which has our entry point vehicular drop-off and entry point uh to the check-in area of the hotel and also that vehicle drive that I mentioned back to the interior part of the site the South elevation that this is on a property boundary a property line so it's a solid wall on a zero lot line and then the East Elevation is the same thing essentially the the part of the building that's up against the property line is right at the zero lot line um so then getting into the massing this is where you know we wanted to describe how the building is situated and how it's configured in relation to the UDC requirements for offsets at the upper floors so along Huron which is this this long elevation
015the yellow area represents what we're considering to be the street wall which is a four-story street wall along the East Huron um streetscape in relation to the larger taller buildings that are in that area then we step down along South Fifth to a two-story Street wall and the kind of break between the four-story street wall and two-story Street wall identifies where the building entrance is with this taller piece that pops up and creates a brand a facility identity uh directly above the message we've also Incorporated some some recessed areas along the street to allow for some landscaping and building related amenities to soften up the experience of the pedestrians walking along the street there so at the top of that four-story street wall we kind of jump back about four and a half feet in
016this blue area which is um Stone panels and then a little bit further of a offset if the green area which is also Stone panels with that rooftop Terrace above and a small kind of trellis Sun shading device over top of that the the South Fifth Street facade is a little more straightforward in terms of the offsets where we just transition back five feet between the masonry and the metal panel areas so then looking at that in a more kind of rendered elevation you can see that four-story street wall along here on with a brick ground first floor ground story with Windows pretty much along the whole street Frontage until we get down to the to the staircase but there's a bar dining facilities in this corner area and then we transition into some meeting
017rooms as we get further away from here on that terminates the glazing area terminates at the entry vestibule on down fifth where we transition back up to the two-story charcoal masonry the material palette is of you know three minutes remaining right it's very in line with the the brand identity with um kind of simple clean aesthetic brick and metal panel and Stone so the brick areas are we're considering to be this kind of Darker charcoal colored brick maybe not all the way black but a very kind of dark base to the building and these this volume of guest rooms making that four-story street wall is a champagne like a champagne Mica finished metal panel uh and then the white material is a very simple penalized Stone system and then looking over at the bird's eye
018view uh you could see this popped up area related to the rooftop Terrace we're thinking of this kind of high roof area potentially as a good spot for some solar panels to align with some of the cities and some of the brands uh green energy initiatives um and then the rest of the roof there's probably how some mechanical units and things like that but right now at this preliminary stage you were thinking that's a good spot for some solar panels another set of views the South elevation as I mentioned uh just a simple materiality here to relate to that zero lot line which um requires a fire rating and no openings in order to kind of maximize our site coverage there and then we've also got a couple views of this Street Frontage along Huron
019which I'm gonna give a little bit of the character of that streetscape with some recessed areas for maybe some planters and some seating areas that are directly adjacent to the sidewalk one minute remaining and then looking down towards the entry vestibule um a similar character and then the vehicular Drive kind of cuts through the sidewalk back there uh getting back over to this materials this image shows some photos of what we're thinking that I've also got I said product data on some reference to the metal panel materials that we're talking about as well as the Stone panels the stone panel system which is you know similar I think in geometry to the metal panels but just a different texture a different reflectivity a different finish and I think that's about it unless there's anything that
020you have to add occurrence you know I think we're about out of time as well Nick why don't you go back to uh one of the architectural elevations that have been rendered so people can see just in an image um at the corner and uh we'll be able to reference that uh yeah I think that that's a good one okay thank you thanks thanks for the presentation this is the point in time when members of the drb can offer uh feedback um I'll jump in this is Tamara um yes it if you read the design guidelines one of the very first things it talks about is the importance of the new development fitting comfortably into the existing fabric of the city or the community the area it's in and typically we would have seen context
021photos and there's really no nothing to show us what the context is around the building um I mean I know the area well enough I don't really see that it responds to the context so I would really like to see um something that that fits in a little better um the other point that it makes right at the beginning of our guidelines about why we exist and why the guidelines exist is that new development should be ageless and when I look at this um you know we talk about character defining features we talk about that a lot with like preservation projects but this building will age and this building will be you know 50 years old at some point what are the character defining features of this building it's just it's very Bland and um
022lacking in character and I think downtown Ann Arbor is is a lot of character in fact this area is very very diverse character um so I think I just you know the first thing I thought about when I saw the first picture of this was a mobile home park at this the the metal cladding is um just very very Bland I guess that's the best word for it um this is a gateway location um you know there's just no real focal point there's no nothing really distinctive about it um I like the I like the brick at the sidewalk um there is some you know variation in character at the at the very base where where people are walking um I think that's that works um and I guess just the other comment is um
023stairwells are just a great opportunity to introduce Windows into Assad and which brings light in um Dave's energy encourages people to take the stairwells they feel safe um you know take promotes Health taking those stairs instead of the elevators and all that so I would we always try to promote getting getting Windows into the stairwells um that's all I have for now thanks Tamara let's see if anyone else has anything they'd like to offer well as a non-architect I look at it and I agree with some of what camera said some I don't as much I'd like I'd like to see at some point a better view of the those Stone panels that looked like is promoting the notion of they look weathered so they have some texture it'd be nice if we had a
024piece to actually look at which we obviously we can't but I'd like to see more about that more concerned about the windows and maybe it's just they all look like they're flat in a flat plane and that's my first reaction it looks like they're sort of pasted in place now not being one of the Architects on board I don't know exactly what I would suggest to make it different but I don't see those windows as being a positive distinguishing feature just the way they're shown in this in this elevation that's my only comment this is Lori Singleton um I would build on camera's comments with the potential that the the three the four-story kind of three-story bar at the corner is a real opportunity to be strengthened as an important moment in this um Corridor
025this is an important intersection with um the city facilities right across the street and um the entrance to the hotel seems like it could be strengthened or the language of the entrance could be brought to or around the corner so there's kind of a moment of hierarchy there maybe that's an opportunity for identity but it's also maybe a better uh kind of sense of the expansive space that someone might be standing and waiting for a ride at the drop-off or or you know gathering at that entrance to meet folks it's a common you know demanded a hotel so it seems like that would be a place that could be strengthened in terms of the indoor outdoor connection there and the expression of the identity and the building around that corner so if if no other
026part of the building got a little extra juice I think that that three-story that starts on the second level that that component I think could be um the place where that those improvements are focused maybe richer materials or some detailing that gives a little bit more depth in the windows some Shadow and then a moment at that corner that is prominent and important I think the blank panel on the on that right above the tree that's shown there that blank section between Windows seems it like a part of a building that wouldn't be exposed to a primary corner and I'm sure there's a programmatic reason for why that's so opaque but it's architecturally that that facade in particular is one of the weaker ones on the building and it's one of the most prominent as
027a view from Main Street down here on that's I'm you know the most highly traveled course and so that's going to have a lot of exposure um I I was also thinking about the streetscape I know you're just kind of showing some things in there but that street along Huron has all been redeveloped with pavers and lighting and other things so I just want to ensure that that's all coordinated with the design and then also the brick paving that lines fifth is continuous along the entirety of that street so my hope would be as these new improvements are done and the new pavement is installed that that those kind of standards are maintained across those edges and resolved in terms of how they hit the intersection I'm not sure what the typical condition is but
028you've got newer gray kind of modern pavers I'm here on and the traditional brick ones and um Fifth and so those two streetscapes come together at that corner and with that work being redone it needs some intention and how that gets put together thanks Lori any other thoughts comments with that sorry was that question to us uh no question two um the design review board wondering if any other members wanted to offer uh some some feedback at this point yeah I have a few comments Jeff um this is Dick Mitchell um you know we we always ask for drawings real early in the process so we can give you input before much money has been spent that's our goal unlike planning that's why we come first and so I'm going to ask questions that the
029required detail that you probably don't have yet um but uh Jeff outlined some some psych questions about trash and bark biking bike parking in his report and the thing I worry most about on site and I think I'm glad that that you don't is that there's just a two-car drop-off pickup um Bay to to service the hotel and uh it I don't know how you could expand it knowing that Huron property is not available and um so I'm sure Marianne must be content that two cars is enough um but it it doesn't seem like enough to me and I I wonder if you could tell us how cars will be parked there are 17 spaces behind the building and and you may have more than that or does your Intel indicate that most people are
030arriving by taxi or Uber and cars are not an issue maybe you could talk about that yeah Mike would okay I'm happy to address that so you know the thought with the 17 car parking lot is not that it would address all the needs of the folks that would be coming here and you know our hope is with another downtown location and being in close proximity to the transit station on 4th Avenue and and spanning over the Fifth Avenue that folks could take the uh you know uh shuttle from the airport uh potentially and not have a car but the idea here is that we would run a valet in this hotel which we have experience in with our other hotel and it's simply the two-car drop-off would be a staging area to the larger
03117 car parking lot which would also be a staging area and then eventually into City infrastructure so we would look to utilize City garages for uh you know the Lion's Share of the parking needs that we have here and you know certainly agree we can't if we could have um you know parking for five cars that'd be great we just can't do that here with the site and so the idea is you get them out front and then you move them around into kind of the holding lot per se and then based on when people would need their cars um we would either leave them there in that lot or we would then shuttle them potentially to any number of the city garages that are in close proximity and like I said we have experience
032with this with our other facility yeah okay I've stayed there and it does work yeah um the the other one thanks Mike uh the other question I have which might fall in the same category is about um the mechanical system because I I worry a bit about screening of rooftop equipment I think there'll be some exhaust hoods above the elevators there's some air conditioning condenser somewhere maybe an emergency generator and I assume the rooms are going to be heated and cooled with um unit vents underneath the windows and so there'll be louvers and yeah you can see that in the drawing oh you can yeah a little bit Yeah Chris go ahead and point them out yeah sure we use v-tax well then I see they're vertical units yeah they're vertical units so there's really
033no you know there's no big condenser Farms but there are there would be a you know dedicated outside air unit and a rooftop unit on the roof but that would all be you know pushed back away from the working side so that it's screened so it's above the mechanical room and the East Wing as far south as you can get it yeah I believe so and we'll have we'll have you know potentially units at at each end because they drop down into chases that are aligned with the stairwells um but we'll you know we'll continue as that as that approach develops we'll continue to put together sight line studies and things like that and screening if necessary but uh the generator will be located back in the in the parking area on one of the
034corners as well as uh or sorry no no generally the Transformer and the secondary enclosures will be back on the site tucked in okay thank you thanks dick I saw that Wendy had um her hand up Wendy do you wanna um take a shot sure uh some has already been discussed but my initial impression of this was that even though Huron and fifth are considered secondary streets I tend to consider Huron as being the vehicular Street and there's less pedestrian activity so I guess one question is why isn't the entrance on the corner or on Huron um kind of associated with that I'm I'm wondering about that um the bump out is requiring a driver to cross on and park on the left which is not typically what people do um so I don't know
035again that that turns the Fifth Avenue Frontage into much more of a vehicular area and even though there are more pedestrians that go down there so kind of a mishmash of questions there but if you could maybe talk about why there is no entrance on Huron yeah well I think so there's a graphic there's a graphic in this drawing that should have been cut off which is this WL Line This is a one-way a one-way southbound Street the fifth so when you so there's no crossing over of the lane is if that's what you're asking about on South 5th um well if you right but if you're coming from Main Street and you're turning right you're going to have to Cross Lanes to get over into that okay it's just it's awkward right yeah I
036agree um we can I think we could we've looked at potential um entry point along Huron there's about a three foot grade change um from this corner As you move farther east and there's about a two foot or so grade change As you move from this corner South so the low point uh the first floor kind of the lowest point of fire department access is at this corner so that's where we've aligned the ground floor elevation to to stay under the high-rise requirement if we you know we push that first floor up we start to get you know perilously close to a high-rise classification which is is just not ideal for the project so uh that's you know those are two two reasons why we've maintained this location but also um we wanted to really
037have all the bar activity and the the more active public space activity aligned with Huron as opposed to fifth well if that's the case then perhaps an entrance as as someone else mentioned uh pedestrian entrance on Huron to do that and I know that's more door control but one other thing that I wanted to mention about the Huron Street side are the are the columns structural that you have shown here yes okay because you know if if you're planning to put landscape in there it won't work just look at the Michigan bell building next door and those poor little trees that have been trying to survive all those years so for me a more pedestrian friendly approach along Huron would actually be to pull those windows out and have them flush with the upper floors
038instead of having that little and I think that is yeah I would just I'll just jump in real quick yeah um uh part of what drove the columns was for visually um I think impaired there was a an area of Refuge potentially I'm sorry it was a DDA code about potentially being set back from a curb but then there was maybe conflict with a visually impaired folks and so it seemed like there was not necessarily um you know a meeting in the minds with respect to what the DDA was trying to promote and then some of the issues that it brought up I think our inclination is to as you say and I know we did this a long time ago with respect to engaging the street front I think we want to go ahead
039and look at something that does push it back out onto Huron Street um to bring that activity out and make it more focused because I totally agree that any sort of vegetation in there is not going to be very successful and it's going to end up probably being like a garbage collection or potentially people sleeping in them so um it was there's a little bit of code nuances that we were trying to work through but I think our heads are where your head is which we would likely go back to pushing out and not having those right yeah so I mean we have had that we've kind of been back and forth with that elevation of is it at at the street is it pushed back in the course of some of these Planning and
040Zoning conversations um so at the time that we made this submission we had it pushed back but we have kind of since come to the conclusion that we should be allowed to push that wall back out to the parcel line right and you know just in reinforcing that Fifth Avenue is the stronger pedestrian street it seems like you know someone else say commented that maybe that blank portion next to the parking lot opening could have some windows or some activity there I think that would be good that's it from me I have just a quick question and maybe it was I had to jump off the meeting just for a second so maybe it was addressed but and I could ask address this more to the city folks is there any potential for changing Fifth
041Avenue into two-way I think there's been some discussion of division I don't know where that goes but if division went two-way this would probably go two-way just like Ashley and first where our building is sitting right now have switched over to two-way very successfully and can I assume the configuration you have now if the drop-off would work either direction it could yeah I think it could so from the developer standpoint I think we could utilize the um the drop off or um if needed the drive aisle back to our limited parking back there uh and could figure that out I don't know what the city's intentions are I know that um I think they put infrastructure on both those streets um kind of to preserve them one way but I don't I don't know maybe
042somebody else does thanks um dick the best thing I can say is that uh the city uh being led by the DDA and our Public Services Group has as you know been in the process of of um of moving um uh the envelope with regard to uh transitioning one-way streets downtown into two ways um I I don't know what the status of uh fifth in division um is but I can certainly check in with um the capital programs manager at the DDA and and see if there happens to be anything um coming down the line in the next few years I I know I I don't believe there's anything imminent jump off this just for a moment I'll walk to the other end of my office and ask the chair of the DDA whether he
043knows that is great it seems like it actually would work better if if the streets were two-way because I'm I keep worrying about traffic coming along here on and making that left turn and now there's cars maybe there's already two cars there where do these cars Stack Up um whereas if it was two-way there'd be room to um kind of pull off to the side across your parking lot entry I wonder consideration might be to think about instead of having a 12 car staging parking lot is to turn that underneath space into a loop if it's 60 feet wide you can get passenger vehicles to come in and turn around and have a loop so that all of the arrival was happening through that zone you know it's an entirely different way of thinking of
044it but it does kind of allow that corner to be a bit more you can have trees you can have the landscape come all the way out to the edge and have all all of the basically like a portraiture scenario underneath there that would probably stage just about as many cars in queue as as it would parking so just a thought I know there's columns and other stuff in there that you have to sort through but but it's a thought because if you were to leave it where it is it's the only place you could have a drop off frankly on the whole site I can't think of any other way to skin the cat if there were if it was too too way in the other direction but you would have valet would have
045to drive all the way around the block and knowing valet drivers there would be a lot more inclined to make a U-turn in the middle of Fifth Street so to answer just the question the DDA chair just said that it isn't in a definite plan but it's certainly in their wheelhouse of con for consideration two-way both fifth and division so for whatever that's an answer thanks Bill um is there any other member of the drb who'd like to offer comments I'd like to um sort of reinforce from my perspective what Tamara had to say and that is I'm pretty underwhelmed by the overall architecture of the building um sort of jokingly thought that looking at the uh building massing strategy on sheet 13 is a better looking building than what I'm looking at on my
046screen right now um it's just Bland um so you know our purpose isn't to design the building for you but for instance the space to the right in the rendering whether it says AC Hotel down a grade level I I don't understand the massing of that wall uh at all um so I'd like I'd like to see something a little bit more uh done with fenestration do something with the openings uh same thing with the stair Towers being blank walls as they are with no windows no natural light in the stairways so for something could be done there to maybe liven that up a little bit and um from the standpoint of fitting into this block or this corner of downtown right across from City Hall uh and so forth I just I guess I'd
047like to see something with a little bit more Pizzazz and I know we can't dictate that in the design guidelines but I'm pretty underwhelmed by the by the architecture that I'm looking at John oh thank you Jeff um I'm uh the art commission representative so um Nick have you considered public art and any of the location of the building uh I know that the staff has has recommended trying to uh uh activate more The Pedestrian experience both on Fifth and Huron um do you have any plans for public art Nick I'll go ahead and take that one I think they were definitely evaluating opportunities on the building to add some public art so it's um uh certainly aware of the conversation in the community and so absolutely are looking for areas where we could potentially
048add something uh well along those lines if you're thinking of a kind of a mural sort of a a display I would encourage you to consider high pressure laminate or uh composite aluminum uh that would rather than paint on uh that um and uh and and and also try to engage our local our community um as well as if you um if if you can find an area and it doesn't have to be that large where you can have rotating art in your lobby and uh it would uh uh and it it could be a Gathering Place for for a creative community so just ask suggestions uh let me give some comments to my just my first impression of the over um overall building and um that uh I mean Jeff uh found the word
049for me underwhelmed uh I'm I'm really uh uh very underwhelmed and uh and Tamara has has it right I I think this is uh this is a gateway piece uh uh a property um and um that you know it it should should really have Timeless elements and I really don't see any um that um and I'm not so sure that public art could help you much uh I would encourage you to do solar and also live roof you know you have a huge expansive uh and and really kind of tie into that element I think it would help with rain water Reclamation um that uh south facing that facade I think that's a stairwell and um I I agree with I think Lori mentioned it letting some light in but activating that big huge space
050um but beyond that I mean just my impression of it uh is that um that this should this should look different um that this to me doesn't uh it doesn't uh it doesn't say that this is a Timeless nor a Gateway sort of project for that particular corner it's um um so in any event um and I know this is uh as as um I think Jeff and and uh um Bill had pointed out that you know this is the beginning stages so um we uh we want it to be a collaborative process and and um I think you have pretty much unanimous that um the board uh thinks this really needs a rework uh but in any event that's just uh um one one more voice thank you I'm not an entire agreement that
051it's underwhelming I I think the massing is is pretty well done and it's not that far away Bill had a really good comment about the window plane in the wall plane being very similar if there were reveals at the windows I think that would give out a lot of depth um and I thought Lori's comments about the uh panels directly above that tree at the corner um rethinking that corner might might render some benefit but I I think it's a lot closer than maybe some of the other people do I think I would agree that I support and I think uh we were I can't recall who else was saying the other diagram was Stronger the masking to me is interesting for the scale you do get enough variation it doesn't feel like you're trying
052to be three different buildings to get that scale it feels like one building but it also feels like it's broken up so it's more about the details of of the execution of it and um yeah like like I think just adding a little bit more something special or a little bit more richness at least in at this corner yeah I think it's that four-story piece at the corner that is you know if you could put more into that make that more interesting give it some more character put some more windows in and keep mentioning above the tree um do something with the windows um but that could be you know even bring brick into that that piece it's it it really needs to be anchored um and I I do agree with the massing comments
053um as it is trying to think about the building is across the street from there that got something this reminds me of that and I really like it um I think it's very interesting um but it's just it's really yeah if there's anywhere you could work on it I think it's that four-story piece at the corner yeah I think that I mean that all it all makes sense to us I think as we you know get into this next level of detailing and you know maybe some some of the articulation um to make that four-story section really stand out against the you know kind of background of the rest of the building I think we definitely have some ideas on how to do that and how to treat the windows so um you know we're
054not we appreciate the feedback and we'll uh continue like like we've said this is really a preliminary stage there's still a lot a lot of work to do so we definitely have opportunities moving forward to you know address these comments in the proper fashion great thanks Nick let's see if any other member of the design of reward has um any final thoughts we'd love to have you come back oh he definitely will yeah for sure um I I would just like to um just Briefly summarize my uh comments in the staff board I think uh the petition has had a chance to see them but for the for the record um I I thought that um uh I want to reiterate what a couple other board members mentioned with regard to solar panels on the
055roof I think that would be a big plus I also wanted to indicate that the design guidelines themselves say quote Corner sites an opportunity to to express an architectural Gateway or focal point and a dominant feature um and I think um this site as Wendy had mentioned is really sort of the crossroads of downtown um like like almost literally in the heart of of Ann Arbor's downtown and so I do think it provides a really remarkable opportunity to come up with something uh special in timeline um just a couple extra comments um the the first floor on the north side of the building doesn't didn't seem to include a lot of elements that help activate uh the project at the street level so I'd encourage you to rethink that I felt that the color of
056the Upper Floor was very muted um and my feeling is is that the building has some elements that are appealing or attractive I like the Symmetry I like the fact that the facade has some different depths and and elements but when my eye looks at this it's so neutral in color that that nothing really stands out it just sort of Blends in and um I I would encourage you to rethink color materials textures verticality um particularly at that corner um and um separately when I look at these projects I'm looking at them in terms of a design review but there are sometimes when I can't help put my putting my planner hat on and mentioning that it might be important to look at some um standards related to our unified development code when I looked
057at this my first thought was Solid Waste how is that being handled and something tells me that this isn't going to be the final version um Solid Waste is sort of sometimes can be an Achilles heel there's some projects downtown so I would encourage you to get ahead of that instead of waiting to deal with solid waste after this after the project has been submitted I I would I would really try to um dig deeper into that earlier um and not have Solid Waste be an afterthought um if now is a good time I will try to summarize um all the drb comments uh unless somebody else has any final comments to add I have just wanted because probably people are disappointed I haven't pointed out that this would be an opportune time to put
058a clock on the corner the only reason I haven't is because on the southwest corner of that intersection there already is a lot I didn't want to disappoint anybody I'm going to add that to my notes Bill okay all right here we go uh Tamara started started us off and um uh talked about the existing fabric of buildings in the area in hopes that um this project would tap into that and and try to complement that context um and um it felt that the building doesn't really do a great job in pulling some of those themes in the immediate um in the immediate vicinity and would like to see something that might fit a little better in in the context of the site [Music] um um the um Tamara felt that buildings like this in
059locations like this should be timeless or should have Timeless elements I think the term the term you'd use was ageless um and and and rethinking some of the design features uh camera also thought this was really a Gateway um and a Gateway site but there didn't seem to be a strong focal point um Bill added some comments he felt that um he would like to see some samples of the materials that are being proposed particularly the Stone panels to get a better sense about you know what this is actually going to look like um Bill also indicated he was concerned about um Windows uh in in a flat plane um Windows didn't appear to be um uh a positive distinguishing uh or distinguished feature uh Lori mentioned that um uh the fourth floor element that
060is on the North side and wraps around the West Side could be strengthened um Lori also felt that the um that the locate that the entrance Door um could be greater could be emphasized in a in a in a better manner um um just looked on the on the west elevation just off of that corner is a blank wall that's a pretty substantive blank wall in in this location Lori was hoping that you might revisit that um Lori also encourage you to rethink the streetscape particularly along um East Huron uh that that there may you you may need to um uh work with the DDA to try to um create some uh better intentions for for for what is um going to be happening there really think about how to activate that space and and
061create some some interest um Dick had some questions he wondered if the two-car pull-out space was uh was enough he was hoping that you'd describe how parking was going to work and Mike was kind enough to to share that information and Dick also asked questions about how the mechanical units were gonna or um how how mechanical was going to be handled and um Nick emphasized that um each of the rooms will have its own uh HVAC system um and um bill um suggested a clock on the corner oh no I said we don't need it I said oh okay Bill said we don't need no stinking clock on that corner um and Wendy had a number of comments Wendy pointed out that Huron really does function function as a very busy vehicular Street um wondered
062if the entrance could be rethought and maybe relocated to the north side to the to the Huron side um and um uh Wendy also wondered about the drop-off area um she pointed out that if you're East heading eastbound from North Main uh toward this site and then you turn right you're sort of in a challenged position to to park in these spaces that are very close to the intersection so she wondered if you might want to rethink that um Wendy also asked about the columns whether they're structural it sounds like they are um Wendy pointed out that Landscaping was going to be highly challenged on the North side indicating that the Michigan bell site uh just to the east is really a tough site to get anything to grow uh on on that north side
063and um um Wendy really emphasized a need to um to activate that North Side in a number of uh of different ways um Lori uh talked about um uh the the parking area and thought that you might want to consider a loop drive system that could allow vehicles to park along the loop um and um Jeff indicated that he was underwhelmed uh by the overall uh architectural design of the building he felt that uh it it looked Bland some blank walls um could be filled in to um to enliven the facade uh John uh indicated that um um he he provided some specific ideas for uh materials for types of murals um he also felt very underwhelmed uh in general with regard to the overall um feel the building the overall appearance of the building
064um didn't feel that there were any Timeless elements uh sort of felt temporary like the idea of getting solar and maybe an active roof excuse me a live roof which could handle uh some some some storm water um dick talked about um creating some reveals uh for the for the windows which would provide a little bit more depth give them a little bit more depth so it's not as as flat uh uh to the eye um Lori felt that the massing was um was interesting it was you know pretty well broken up um but details and execution it's sort of a richness needs to be rethought um maybe a richness needs to be uh brought brought in um and then Tamara uh it lastly indicated that the um that the corner is really the most
065important you know point of this building and that it should be more emphasized possibly bring brick in uh creating something of of more visual interest so let me pause to uh see if I missed anything or if I uh Mis misquoted anything I see Tamara's hand just um I think a couple of us talked about stairwells I'm trying to get some light in the stairwells and then I just wanted to um emphasize the context um comment was um not even so much about it not fitting into the context we didn't see the context that um and especially if you're coming back if we you know it's great to get pictures around the area if we don't have a chance to walk around um beforehand to and then have and also take explain to us how
066it is fitting into that context what are you picking up on um and we're not talking about matching things just how do you respond to it um and I just then thirdly I just wanted to say Jeff that um we are really going to miss your excellent summaries because you do such a good job with summarizing our comments so thank you thanks Tamara and I did get those last two down Jeff I just want to make one slight correction the comments about the streetscape along here on in fifth there's a brand new streetscape along here on and the building should have that in mind and coordinate with the existing Planters and benches and light poles and other things that are in place along that edge I don't think it'll have a significant impact but that's
067an entirely different streetscape that's older and traditional red brick and so how it fits those two pieces together is what my comment was more about it great thanks for pointing that out you okay um is this the point Jeff where we invite uh public comment or does that come I guess that comes later so yeah we can provide um I think we made an attempt to provide public comment at the front end and we'll we'll be able to do it at the back end okay all right we can see if the petitioners um uh would like to provide any uh final thoughts yeah thanks I think like like we said earlier it's been very helpful uh and we look forward to continued conversation with this group as we um continue to develop the project great
068yeah I want to thank everyone for their time and um yeah it's always good to hear people's thoughts and suggestions on how to make a project better so um you know I know it's a volunteer board and everyone was very busy so thank you for taking the time out of your day to meet with us all right well thanks gentlemen for the presentation and do we need to stick around or are we done public commentary you can be on all ranging topics right um I think it might make sense just to wait for a minute or so to see if any members of the any members of the public have have any comments about the project okay uh Court Courtney do you see anyone who um is interested in joining the conversation there do not
069appear to be any callers at this time great okay okay Jeff um I don't know if you want to look at the um so just I'm sorry Jeff real quick are we uh ready to go uh at this stage I think you I think the petitions can can can leave the meeting if you'd like yeah okay thank you all so much thanks thank you so that should conclude our regular business section let me double check the agenda yeah so we are on to regular business uh I'm sorry unfinished business don't see anything on the agenda but are there any um anything sort of hanging fire from previous meetings okay then we shall move on to Communications with anything there uh nothing nothing from staff okay all right then we are then on to the second
070section of public comment um Courtney I don't suppose anybody's jumped in in the last two and a half minutes no there are no callers at this time just sort of as a side comment I probably should have said this in front of the developer but you know sometimes I fear that some of my comment can be taken as overly critical and not constructive and it certainly wasn't meant that way um so I but since they are coming back I'm sure they will bring us something um uh that will respond to the comments so not in the way of an apology but sometimes I think my comments are a little bit too uh unconstructive so with that uh anybody got anything they want to add or I I had one thing Jeff it it has struck
071me the last several meetings that that Courtney needs to interrupt way too early in the presentation maybe we could give people you know another five or ten minutes to present um because I I feel like when she says three minutes they start to speed read their way through the presentation and we lose some things I I think we limited it to 10 minutes when we had one petitioner down on um South Main or a brew pub who went on and on about their menu and and really sort of aggravated everyone but seems like that that was a nature reaction we could give you know position like this another 10 minutes to talk about the project I agree I don't remember that we used to give them a certain amount of time we just said you
072know do your presentation and they'd usually be 20 minutes or yeah um drop that requirement and Jeff can interrupt if someone is rambling on and maybe be a better way to do it yeah part of that I think came from years ago uh when a couple of times we had more than one project to look at in one yeah meeting and so we thought we had to limit it but I agree with you dick that um I I wouldn't want if I were in the developer's shoes making the presentation and I have been many times that having to rush through at the end and then after it's all over and done with you realize hey I wish I would have said so and so but I it I forgot or I was rushed to it
073so I I totally agree with you I will say coming from the design Community I think that if we don't give some parameters then there might be a lot more content than is necessary to share that sometimes there's some just over communicators um out there and I think it's helpful to say you know if if now it's 10 and we say it's 20 at least we're clear about what the expectation is and they aren't preparing 45 minutes worth of content right would you be comfortable if I uh encourage developers uh in in their um and their design staff to limit their comments to 15 minutes about 20 20. yeah yeah especially because this group didn't have all of the contexts that would have taken up a few of those moments and um yeah yep that
074sounds good all right anybody else all right well before we adjourn Jeff I do hope we see you again um we'll miss you and Hank welcome aboard um so I'm sure you will uh for instance today I had a question about previous reviews and I couldn't remember whether we had looked at the site before and Jeff was able to respond to my email and say no you're thinking about another site so unfortunately you won't be able to bring that but if you're here long enough you'll be just as uh tuned in as Jeff is it would be impressive indeed to remain in a role as as long as Jeff be is the true veteran of the department we're going to miss him and I do rely on his knowledge a lot right all right well
075if there's nothing else and I think we can adjourn this meeting great to see everybody thanks everybody thanks everybody thanks everybody take care bye