001Hey, hey, [Music] hey. Hey. Hey. Hey. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] Heat. Hey, Heat. Heat. Heat. [Music] Heat. Heat. Hey, [Music] Heat. Hey, hey, hey. [Music] Hey. [Music] The governing board for Liberty Elementary School District called to order our meeting. General special meeting Monday, April 21st, 2025. Five board members present. Board members Zimmerman and Schmidt, Vice President Kenyon, board member Shinsion, myself, Michael Todd. Our next item official pledge of allegiance. Miss Schmidt, can you please lead us? and to the republic for it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice. Next on our agenda is item 1.3, possible action to convene an executive session pursuant to ARS 38431.03 03 A3 and A4 for the purpose of discussion or consultation with the attorneys for the public body concerning the superintendent's contract and the statuses employment
002and to instruct the attorneys about the board's position as contracts that are the subject of negotiation and or contemplated litigation. Motion to convene executive session pursuant to ARS 38431.03 03 A3 and A4 for the purpose of discussion or consultation with the attorney for the public body concerning the superintendent's contract and the status of his employment and to instruct the attorney it to instruct the attorney its attorneys about the board's position in contracts that are the subject of negotiations and/or comp contemplated litigation. I'll second have a motion and a second for item 1.3. Is there any discussion? hearing. None. When I call your name, please specify your vote. Board member Zimmerman. I. Board member Schmidt. I. Vice President Kenyon. I. Board member Sincone. I. I'm also I will show that approved five yeses, zero nos. We'll
003be convened into executive session at 5:35. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Heat. [Music] Wonderful. [Music] What's [Music] the heat? [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Wonderful. [Music] What's up? [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] That was the [ __ ] Heat. Heat. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] What's that? [Music] [ __ ] Come [Music] on. [Music] No, no, [Music] no. Heat. Heat. N. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I don't see this. [Music] [ __ ] [Music] Come on. Come on. Come [Music] on. Come [Music] on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I won't see this. [Music] [ __ ] [Music] Come on. Come [Music] on. Heat. Heat. [Music] N. Come [Music] on. Come on. [Music] What's up, [ __ ] [Music] I can't see this. [Music] Oh [Music] shoot. Hey [Music] Come on. Come on. Come
004[Music] on. Come [Music] on, heat. [Music] What's [Music] the heat? [Music] I don't see [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Wonderful. Wonderful. [Music] I want you. [Music] What's the [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] I want you. [Music] What's the [ __ ] [Music] Oh, shoot. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's [Music] the [Music] heat? Heat. Heat. [Music] That was the [ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. Wonderful. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] What's up? [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Heat. [Music] Wonderful. Heat. [Music] I want you. [Music] I won't see this. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Wonderful. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I can't see this. [Music] [ __ ] [Music] One number. [Music] Come
005on. Come on. Come on. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] Oh [Music] shoot. Hey [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] I want you. [Music] What's [Music] the heat? [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. Heat. Heat. N. [Music] What's up? [Music] me. [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. [Music] What's [Music] up? Heat. Heat. [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. [Music] What's [Music] the heat? [Music] Come on, [ __ ] [Music] Wake up. [Music] Come [Music] on. Heat. [Music] I won't [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Wonderful. [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I won't see this. [Music] [ __ ] [Music] Number one, no [Music] one. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] What's up? [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] I want you. [Music] What's [Music] the heat? [Music] I don't see [Music] Oh
006[ __ ] [Music] Wonder. [Music] What's [Music] the heat? [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] That was the [ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Heat. [Music] Wonderful. [Music] I want you. [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] Come [Music] on, heat. [Music] What's up, [Music] I don't see this. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I won't see this. [Music] [ __ ] [Music] Come on. Come [Music] on. Come [Music] on. Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up, [ __ ] [Music] I can't see this. [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] I want you. [Music] What's [Music] the heat? [Music] Oh
007[Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Wonderful. [Music] What's [Music] up? Heat. Heat. [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. Awesome. [Music] What's [Music] the [Music] heat? Heat. Heat. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Wonderful. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] I won't see this. [Music] That was the [ __ ] Heat. Heat. N. [Music] Wonderful. [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I won't see this. [Music] [ __ ] [Music] Number one, no [Music] one. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] What's up? [Music] I won't see this. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's the [ __ ] [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I want you. [Music] [ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. Heat. Heat. [Music] One, shoot. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Wonderful.
008[Music] Awesome. Hey Welcome. [Music] Hi. Time is now 7:01 by the boardroom clock. We'll move on to item 1.4 of the reconvene of public meeting. And we'll now move to item 1.5 discussion, consideration, and possibly take action concerning directions given to the attorney for the public body and executive session. I'll need a motion. Um motion to move the um move to direct the attorney as instructed in executive session. Okay. Do I have a second? Second. Excuse me, President Todd. I need that motion. Move to direct attorney as instructed in executive session. Okay. Do I have a second? One moment, please. Yes. Please proceed. Okay. Now, we'll take a second. Second. We have a motion, a second to direct the attorney to take action as instructed in the executive session. Is there any discussion hearing? None.
009When I call your name, please specify your vote. Board members Zimmerman. Nay. Board member Schmidt. I. Board member I'm sorry. Vice President Kenyon. I. Board member Stencion. I. I also I will show that approve four. Yes. One. Nay. Next on our agenda is item 1.6 discussion consideration to possibly take action concerning the superintendent status. Need a motion and a second. Mr. Mr. President, I make a motion to place the superintendent on administrative leave with pay and authorize Dr. Stephanie Mahorn to act in hisstead. Okay. Do you have that down, Miss? No, I have it written down. Is this and yes sorry it's okay or when okay motion to place superintendent on admin leave with pay and authorized I should I think I've left my glasses to ask that. Okay. Do I have a second? Excuse
010me. Who made the motion? Motion was made by the motion. Vice President Kenyon. I second. We have a motion, a second to place superintendent on administrative leave with pay and authorize Dr. from a horn to act in hisstead. Is there any discussion? Hearing none, I'll call your name for the vote. Board member Zimmerman. Nay. Board member Schmidt. I. Vice President Kenyon. I. Board member Stencion. I. I'm also I will show that proof. Four yes, one no. Next on the agenda is item 1.7, possible action to convene an executive session pursuant to ARS 38431.03A3 and A4 for discussion or consultation for legal advice with the attorney or attorneys of the public body concerning first amendment rights during government governing board meetings and on social media and to instruct its attorneys in contemplated litigation. I motion to
011convene an executive session pursuant to ARS 38-431.03. 03, A3, and A4 for discussion or consultation for legal advice with the attorneys or the attorneys of the public body concerning First Amendments, First Amendment rights during governing board meetings and on social media and to instruct its attorneys in contemplated litigation. Second. Have a motion, a second for item 1.7. Is there any discussion hearing? None. Board members Zimmerman. I board member Schmidt. I vice president Kenyon. I board member Serion. I I'm also I we will show at 706 that we are back into executive session. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Wonderful. Heat. [Music] I want you. [Music] Oh [ __ ] Yeah. [Music] No one shoot. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I don't see this. [Music]
012[ __ ] [Music] Come on. Come [Music] on. Heat. Heat. N. [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I won't see this. [Music] [ __ ] [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. Come [Music] on. Heat. Heat. N. [Music] What's up? [Music] I can't see this. [Music] [ __ ] [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. Come [Music] on. Heat. Heat. N. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's [Music] the heat? [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Wonderful. [Music] What's [Music] the heat? [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] That was the [ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] What's that? [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] No one shoot. [Music] Wonderful. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I don't see this. [Music] [ __ ] [Music]
013Heat. Heat. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's the [ __ ] [Music] I don't see this. [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. [Music] I want you. [Music] What's [Music] the heat? [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] That was the [ __ ] [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] What's that? [Music] I won't see this. [Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Heat. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up? [Music] I can't see this. [Music] [ __ ] [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. Come [Music] on. Come [Music] on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's up, [ __ ] [Music] I don't see this. [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. [Music] Come on. Come on. Come on. [Music] What's the [ __ ] [Music] I want you. [Music] That was
014[ __ ] [Music] Wonderful. [Music] Heat. Heat. [Music] What's up? [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] That was the [ __ ] Heat. [Music] Heat. Heat. Heat. [Music] Hey, we're uh now on item 1.8. at 7:42 p.m. the reconvene of the public meeting will show that we are back in session to the general meeting. Uh item 1.9 members, unless you have something that I don't know about, there will be no need to proceed with the action. Move to item 2.1, approval of consent agenda. President make a motion to approve the consent agenda. Second. Okay. Uh have a motion and a second. There's no discussion. When I call your name, please specify your vote. Board member Zimmerman. I. Board member Schmidt. I. Vice President Kenyon. I. Board member Stencion. I. I'm also I will show that approve. Five. Yes. Zero. No. All
015right. Members, we have some general business. 3.1 is trust policy transition. We're allocating two hours for that. Um, what I might suggest is that we with your concurrence, we can push that to the end. We can take on 3.2 really quick, which is our budget prioritization. I think that's what people in the audience are probably more here to see. 3.3 is the discussion consideration to approve the assistant superintendent salary. 34 I think we can get through this a lot quicker than two hours. It's up to you how you want to proceed, but if you're okay with it, I would uh I would recommend we push 3.1 to the end and we get through these other items as quickly as possible. mean push 3.1 to the end of general business correct. General business correct. I'm in
016favor of it. Is there any No, I don't think we need to take a motion. Do we cl that? We we can just move that. Correct. Cuz Okay. All right. Because we did not approve early on. This is a special meeting. It does not have an approval of agenda at the beginning. A special meeting. We've never done it for the special, but Okay. All right. Let's take a motion then. Mr. President, I have a motion that we move item 3.1 after item 3.5. Okay. Do I have a second? Second. [Music] And just to ensure your opinion is that's not any issue with dopamine, we're still going to cover it. We're just we're just sholing down. Okay. All right. So, we'll uh have a motion in a second. If there is no discussion, we'll go to
017a vote. Miss Zimmerman I. Board member Schmidt. I. Vice President Kenyon. I. Board member Sion. I. I'm also I will show it approve five zero five yeses, zero nos to move this to the end of general business. But next up now will be item 3.2 to fiscal year 26 budget prioritization followup. Good evening members of the board and members of the community. Um what I would like to do is an activity that we did maybe two weeks ago where we discussed the budget priorities and you looked at possible reductions. I have the list of everything that we discussed last time with a couple of new items for your consideration. Um, and I can also address any questions that you have up front or as we go. Uh, Mr. President, I have a question. Uh, if
018that's all right. Yes, go ahead. Okay. If you look at number um Oh, sorry. Mine doesn't have the number on the Let me just pull it up because I can't see it. Is it a blue or a yellow? It's 22. Um when the board approved its um budget priorities at the March 24th meeting, we had 2.5 reading interventionists. Um and so that that was Oh, okay. It was changed then from what I printed. I did make a change prior to the meeting to bring all the blue items to the bottom. So, your line numbers might not be exactly the same if you have a printed copy. Okay? Cuz the one I printed from this weekend had the reading interventionist at one, which is not what the board approved. So, it's now been changed correct to
019say 2.5. Yes, 2.5. Okay. That was my question prior to the discussion. Thank you. Any other questions, comments? Um, oh, I'm I apologize. Is there a way that because this is not what's attached to the agenda, is there a way that we could get this? It's just hard for me to see that far like that. So, I could pull it up on my screen. Oh, sure. I apologize. I just don't have the best eyes. Are you able to do that? She just put the new ones together at the bottom. Yeah. Can you do you have it to attach Crystal? If you just share the attachment with me, I will go ahead and upload it in Board Docs. Okay. Thank you. The attachment on board docs just has a different order, but all the items are
020the same. The numbers are the same. Okay. Are you you're going to re-upload it? You can you can I mean I'm okay if you start. I know Miss Camado will will send it to me or upload it. So I'm [Music] fine. Okay. So let me just give a little explanation of what's changed since last time. So everything in yellow is what we decided at that last meeting um where you put those as priorities for reduction. None of the amounts on those have changed since the last time we discussed this. The things that are in blue are the topics for redisussion. So if you'll see uh Dreambox Learning is on here. On the list you've seen prior there was a dollar amount of $73,000 for that. So if you want to consider not reducing that item,
021it wouldn't be a savings at all. So that's a Z amount now. Um and then things that have a dollar amount like the curriculum materials for this line 31. Um, this includes not reducing the explore learning or the gizmos program. So, it brings the savings down to a 26,000 instead of prior to this it was 35. Um, and then the other items for discussion are step increases for our support staff members. There's a little bit more detail to what this number is in the actual board item and I can bring that up too if we want to talk about those specifically. And then there's one item on here that's a negative. So I just wanted to include that because um it's not an item that we currently pay for. So, it would be an expense
022of 20,000 for next year if we wanted to uh keep LPN positions at uh the new school as well as the ones we already have. So, I can answer any questions about the new items or if you want to give me any directions. Excuse me. President Todd and board members, I have attached the uh document in board docs. If you'd like to refresh your screen, you should be able to pull it up. Mr. President, if you if I may. You may. Um I know the previous meeting we had talked about additional monies that was found or you know just considered that's not included in here. Correct? Because this was from prior. So the last meeting we discussed that items increased for consulting fees went up that is still on here at 277,000. Um memberships we
023thought we could reduce about 30,000. So those are all updated numbers from our last discussion I think Tuesday. I think there was a question about the one-time purchases and um and I think at the original March 24th it was like 50,000. Yes. But then like you did all the work to figure out what the one-time purchases were. Um and it was upwards of 400,000. Um and uh I think that there are going to be different one-time purchases. um in fiscal year 26. And so I think it would be up to the board to decide, you know, how much of that do we want to consider as a savings? Correct. We did have I want to say 50,000 on the very original discussion. So we did the work to identify those purchases and came up with
024the $400,000 amount, but we've never added that item as a reduction at this point. So we can leave that off if you're comfortable with that. um with keeping in mind that we're always going to try to reduce one-time purchases regardless. Um but you know, not assigning a specific dollar amount is is up to you, but we can add that to the list or just leave it off like it is right now. Mr. President, do you want us to share our thoughts about the blues? Um how would you like us to do this? I think that's appropriate if you'd like to. Okay. Um, you know, we did remove, uh, so I'm just going to kind of talk about the different blue things, um, dream box. And so what I had posed to staff was, you know,
025has this been communicated, uh, or excuse me, I posed to administration, has it been communicated to staff? Because I know that although us as parents didn't see a ton of, um, value, I guess maybe in the program, that doesn't mean that staff doesn't, right? I'm not trained on the program. And so my question would be, you know, is there a possible replacement? Um, and do we want to kind of have a supplemental math curriculum? Because I believe that's really what Dreambox is being used for. Um, and if we are concerned, as I am about the proficiencies and the achievement in math, you know, are we comfortable removing that? Um, and so I know on a board update that there had, you know, kind of been some pros and cons of LL, but I did not
026see a dollar amount tied to. Did you have a dollar amount that you could share with the board? Not for a math curriculum. No, we don't have a quote on that amount. Okay. Um, my son personally uses and loves it. Um, so, you know, I would be interested in seeing, you know, a quote. um because I certainly want to be able to give teachers um other options. So my concern uh you know but obviously we have to be conscious of the budget and right now um I think when we left it we were not even in the positive we were like negative7,000 and my concern then and still is now is that we need to cut in order to give ourselves some room because um inevitably in the last two years we have not been
027able to adhere to the adopted budget. Um the the curriculum, the only one that I uh the additional curriculum would be the explore learning the gizmos um and that was an 11,000. I would be in favor of bringing that um back just on the feedback I got from teachers. Um again, uh kind of what I've said previously, the step increases. Um, I do think it's, you know, would be wonderful to be able to give those, but again, my concern is giving some employees, uh, basically a raise and others not. And do we really have the funds to do that right now? um the LPN. Uh I've gotten several emails about this and people are very passionate um about their LPN at Liberty, which uh I personally know her and think she is an incredible human
028um an incredible LPN. So, it has absolutely nothing to do with her as a person. But if we allow an LPN at one school, um, then it doesn't seem equitable for other schools who don't have an LPN. There are other schools in the district, and I'm just using my own children's school as an example just because I know it. Estraa doesn't have an LPN. they just have a CNA and they have two self-contained um special education classes which you know if we talked about the need they would probably need one and so again it has absolutely nothing to do with the person but making a smart and equitable um decision as a board member so um I would I would not support you know unless the board is going to find money to have an
029LPN at every school I don't think it's fair to pick on um I would be in favor of removing as I voted at the last board meeting to remove the dockerate stipens for district level staff in particular the assistant superintendent again it has absolutely nothing to do with any person but as it is a preferred job qualification it it doesn't seem right to me personally to pay somebody to have a qualification that we want them to have um and then the executive director of school effectiveness. Um I'm not in support of removing uh supports for student achievement. Um we've already cut one educational services um coordinator position and I believe that cutting supports students is not something I'm comfortable doing. Those are my comments about the blue. Okay. Any other comments, questions? Mr. President, if
030I may. You may. Um, I'm not going to go through every line item here, but um the LPN to Loretta Zumbro um and rehiring a CNA. I do think that that deserves preschool has to have an LPN, right? It has to have an LPN and that's going to be at Laura Zumbro. So, that has to be there. Um, but I am not in favor of moving an existing one. Um, for the reasons I stated before that these nurses in particular, they know the medical needs of the kids. Um, and she's been a staple in this Liberty school for a long time. uh she knows the kids, she knows the family, she knows when somebody's off that it to me it's very scary if that's removed and somebody new goes in there not knowing and then
031something could happen these kids uh and and you know to board members in remembrance point the CNA that's over at Estrella probably knows those kids pretty well and so it's one of those things where I'm just in favor of keeping it as is and hiring a new LPN for Loretta Zumbra Any other questions? Go ahead. Not really a question, more of a comment. Um I'm still if we can still give that step increase, that's one of my priorities or if we can find the money. Um so I would rather have that than uh Dreambox and other things like that if we have the other curriculum aids out there. I know there's not another one for math on here. Um, but if I had to choose, I would go with the if the teachers could do
032without Dreambox, that's the one I would rather have the step increase. Any other thoughts, questions? Yeah, if I may. You may. Um, I just want to add in on the LPN, excuse me, the LPN at Liberty. Um, and just acknowledge like board members inside, we've gotten emails from parents who are very concerned about losing their nurse. Um, you know, specifically from parents who have children who really need help at school on a daily basis and probably multiple times a day. Um, and so I hear that and I understand that and as I said to the parent who reached out to me, I also deal with the same thing. So I completely understand why they feel that way. Um, if we if it's in the budget to do it, I support it. It's really, you know,
033like board member Zimmerman said, it's not a personal thing. It's just do we have the money? Um, which we have yet to see if we will or not. But, um, I I just want to acknowledge the fear that can be in a parent who has a child with a medical condition that really requires hands-on care. And if something even the slightest thing goes wrong, it can be a disaster. And I I just want to acknowledge that publicly that we understand. We're trying to do the best that we can with what we have. So thank you. Um if I may I to receive the emails from parents um about the nursing situation. I I do understand that. Um and I I agree. It's nothing about the person. It's it's about the need of the district. My
034concern and I'm kind of picking this up a little bit late here um due to my recent appointment but I don't feel like we had enough input from the campuses um through this process which is something I had requested last year to do a set amount of money. Last year we heard from teachers that we needed they needed to be paid more needed more stuff in the classroom. We did that. Um it did stretch the budget. It didn't put us over budget. Um, it's it's very common for school districts to come back and and do a mid-year reshuffle of of which buckets the money is coming out of and what you do. That's that's common with most businesses. They're always doing that. Same with schools. So, I I understand that. Um, I think at the
035end of the day, the the LPN's scope of care is um is is pretty limited. And if it's anything major, they're going to be calling 911. If they call 911 twice in a day for the same p the same student, chances are they're going to get a different fire truck each time they come who doesn't know that who doesn't know that student. They they do that all day. You go to the emergency room, you're going to show up to a bunch of healthcare providers that know nothing about that particular patient. um for the most part. So I get it. But at the same time, I I think to summarize uh what my colleagues at the end have said is is uh this isn't a personal thing about the teacher or about the the nurse or
036students. It's that we have a finite amount. Now, what I would suggest is that we look a little bit more um and I agree as well. We don't want to cut out of um education, but I would propose that we start looking at some positions. I cannot find another school district in the state, and I haven't called them all that has an executive director of school effectiveness. Um seems to me like we could maybe reallocate that position somehow. And that'sund looks like $155,000. Is that right? That is salaries and benefits and salaries and benefits. So what's the salary range on that? Do you know? Um I want to say when I did the calculation it's over a 100,000, right? So um we've also heard uh from some assistant principles even their concerns about um them
037having take on the athletic director role. we take that position, which again I'm not sure um we'd have to hear from staff how how much that is. But my original goal this year and I wasn't a part early on was to have each campus look at a campus budget and then start looking at how they want this to go. It's always easy to come back after the fact now we're getting all these emails and I don't know that those people were involved in the early steps of this of of where they were. And I'm not saying they weren't. I'm just saying that I don't know where they were at. But there seems a lot of people that are very surprised by this by some of the budget issues that are coming out. So I think
038we need to flush this more. I think we need to ask staff where they feel. Um there is a matter of comfort and having an LPN versus a CNA. That's a there is there is some steps of of difference there. Um as far as diabetics, ARS-15 34401 talks about diabetic management. You can have a lot of different people on the campus do that um for for diabetic management. I'm not sure it's been a long time since I heard held a CNA certificate if they're even allowed if that's in their scope of care to administer insulin any different than what 15344 says. I don't think it is. It could have changed. It's been 30 years since I held that uh certificate or license. But uh um so I I think we need to manage that. I
039think we need to look at this again. I think the board should really sit down, but we need some good representation from parents and teachers to look at where this is and then say, "Okay, we can give you this, but what do you want to give up in return?" Because at the end of the day, that's what we've got to do. We got to take we got to take from somewhere to fund other positions. Um, so I would ask staff to start looking at that a little bit more. We still have some time. It's going to require extra meetings, but I just don't think this process was as open as what it should have been. Last year, I asked for it. It was a little too late uh with the new superintendent, but I was
040assured it was going to happen this year, and I don't I don't really think it did. Secondly, as we look at our budget, I think we need to manage very closely what each campus costs because that's the way we're really going to look. That's how business does. They look at business units and you don't just look at a big bucket of money. You need to look at what each campus is costing us. That's how we can start identifying where costs are coming from, unexpected costs, and make sure that each campus is running properly. I I still haven't seen that. I've asked for that for four years. I still don't ever see in a budget where we're looking what each campus costs us. That helps us make decisions on repairs. If we're just continuing to put
041money into repairs and it just keeps breaking, it may be time to tear something down and rebuild it. That may be cheaper in the end um and and much better use of the taxpayer money. So, I would ask that staff look at that as well. Um, when we talk about pay for the assistant superintendent, the $2,500, and I think that comes up in another section as well. I asked that to be brought back up. Um, first of all, this year we've already issued contracts. I think to go back and say, "Yeah, we're going to take this money away is a dangerous situation." Um, at the last meeting, it was said that we just expect people in those positions to hold some sort of a doctorate degree, be that a PhD or an EDDD. Um, and
042I guess I would say that we would also expect those people to hold a certificate in being an assistant or being a superintendent. And our last two assistant superintendent did not even have a certification with the state to be superintendent. Um, one had a approved area of biology and physical education, but no superintendent certification. One had an endorsement for structured English emerging enrollment preK through 12, standard professional principal, standard professional crosscat, special ed, and standard professional elementary. Um, when we look at staff that currently holds the position, we see that they have superintendent certifications. So, I I think it's important that we look at that. But since the contract is issued, not at all in favor of going back to that person and telling them we're going to try to take $2,500 away from them.
043that does not seem to be the the good step. And we've never had a doctorate uh person in an assistant superintendent role. And I do think um there's a lot of people that never make it that far. They have a mast's and that's that's good. But I think the $2,500 is a small price to pay. The return on investment of getting your doctor and getting $2,500 a year doesn't it doesn't line out to me. But I do think that we should include that for others. It should be more honestly, but we don't have that um currently there. Can I make one comment? You may. Um, in terms of asking um for the school budgets, I would also like to see like the program budgets like maintenance and um special education and things like that because
044I think if we're looking at schools, we have to look at all of the programs, not just schools. I would agree. I mean, all that the other thing is with our signature programs, what does each one cost? Um, some schools require an extra uh, foreign language teacher. There's costs just to have the program and then others don't really get the same. So, I think we need to look at that. And if we're talking about being fair across the board, we should be spending the same amount of money either per campus or per student uh, on each program. And of course, we have some schools that are smaller. So, I don't think we're ever going to get an exact amount uh to equal, but I do think we need to understand again the cost of each
045campus and what that really costs. I just want to make sure I understand. Um, so you'd like to know the expenses of all of these items or the budget for these items? Well, I think I think both. We got to see how much they were costing. And that's always the the challenge with school budgets is these seem to come in late. Um, boards are expected to try to understand this, but but we have no idea where we're really at with each school. And I don't I'm I'm hesitant to pick a school and say a name because I don't want people to think we're trying to cut a program. That's not the goal. But there are programs in the district that cost us considerably more for that campus. And that drives the cost of the campus
046to exist up. So, are we doing the right thing on each of these programs? Are we spending the right amount of money? Is the program too expensive? Everybody wants to have uh something maybe better than than what they have. If we can afford it, we're all for it. But we've got to live within our means. And last year, we did look to make a lot of maintenance. We had deferred maintenance. We had a report and a company came out and told us we had some of the worst deferred maintenance reports in the that they had seen with how long we had let things go. So, we had to spend some money there. We had to get into some reserves. We had to take money out of M. Um we gave teacher raises. Now, we need
047to look at that. And that was my request last year. I'm going to request it this year. We need to look at each campus and what it really costs. Look at each campus and and then let that staff get together and start figuring out what works for them. We kind of had some discussion eight months ago about um permanent guest teachers or an instructional uh a discipline type person. The district was kind of split. I think each campus needs to be able to look at that and see and if a school wants something more than we're able to provide maybe in the case of the nurse situation then what are they willing to give up to make that happen? Is there something there that they could cut a little bit? And the best way you
048become efficient honestly is to start looking at this and and sometimes recognizing you're you're close to the limit is good because you start really looking at every expenditure. Do I really need that? when you I remember when I was much younger and I had 10 bucks left to get me through till Friday. I probably didn't buy that Thirst Buster for 99 cents three times a day because that was $3 out of the out of the pocket. So, you look at these things and you start becoming more efficient. What can I do? Maybe I don't need that pair of running shoes immediately. The one I have, they're ugly, but they still work just fine. And I think that's where we need to get each campus looking at because for some reason there's this misnomer of you
049have to do this and just go out to the, you know, Liberty Schools and a program and and maybe Miss Murray can help us figure out how to grow money trees, but so far they're not growing any of those over there and the money just does not fall off off the trees. So kind of like a retired community. We're on a fixed income and it's it's tough and we don't get to raise taxes. Other companies, cities can raise the tax. Everybody else can raise the tax except for the school district. I'm not a supporter of raising taxes, but but it's there. A hotel company just $1 more a night over the Hilton hotel chain and how many millions of dollars that bring them. We don't have those resources and people need to understand where this
050budget's at. I think the best way to do that is to have them more involved in this process and there should be multiple meetings and every teacher, every staff member should want to be here taking a part in those meetings to come up with a budget that works for they also will become educated and realize we just can't have, you know, I'm sure if you ask Mr. Young, he would love to have bigger bigger tractors. Um the budget doesn't afford that right now, but we have to look at that. If we're spending twice as much money on small tractors, maybe we just need to buy the big one. Um, and that's where we're going to get this budget process worked out as we look per campus. Any other questions on 3.2? Okay. Oh, sorry. I
051would just Can I one more? Um, I would just, you know, encourage the board to make sure that we are leaving ourselves some wiggle room in this budget as to things always come up. And so I think it would be in our best interest to cut more unfortunately in the beginning so that we don't find ourselves in the situation that we are now where we're trying to make it work at the end of the year. Thank you. Move to uh 3.3 discussion consideration to approve the assistant superintendent salary and wage schedule. I asked to bring have this brought back up. We dovetailed into a little bit in the last section. Um after understanding what we were what we were talking about a little bit more. It was late in that last meeting. Uh, and taking
052a look at um the fact that the contracts are already issued, um, speaking with legal, I think it's ill advised to take away the $2,500 a stipen for a PhD or any sort of doctorate, an ED. We kind of have both of those in education. Um, I think it's ill advised to do that. So, I ask for the board to reconsider that and and continue that through. Again, as I talked about when we talk about what's expected, and that comment was made last time, well, we just expect this person to have a a PhD um or an EDDD. I don't know that we always it's preferred, but in today's world, it seems to be a little bit more of a a bonus sometimes. And again, as I went back and I looked at past people
053that had this position, they didn't even have a superintendent certification, which by the way, just so everybody's clear, in the state of Arizona, it's not required, but uh I I would think that would be much more expected than an EDDD or a PhD. So, I just ask for that to be reconsidered. May I make a comment? You may. Um I just want to say that I didn't say it was expected. I said it was a preferred qualification. Um, and I can understand um that we did already approve the um contract language. So, um although I think that we should revisit this idea in the future, um I can understand that it uh since we issued contracts that that would be unfair to do. Mr. President, I'd like to make a motion to approve the assist
054uh assistant superintendent salary wage schedule for fiscal year 2526. And you want to in keep the $2500 stipen, correct? Yeah, as it reads. Okay. All right. Okay. I have a motion and a second to approve the assistant superintendent souring wage schedule for fiscal year 2526 including the $2500 uh stipen for a doctorate levels degree. Is there any discussion? All right, hearing none, we'll call the vote. Board member Zimmerman I. Board member Schmidt I. Vice President Kenyan I. Board member Serioni I. I'm also I will show that approved five yes zero no. Excuse me board president Michael Todd who' second that. Okay. Item 3.4 discussion consider uh the discussion and reconsideration to approve the third reading of liquidated damages policy. Mr. Sinsino you request this be brought back up. Yeah. Thank you Mr. President. Uh after
055thinking more about this uh what I want to discuss really is uh who makes that final decision. I more I thought about it. I didn't like the fact that it was with the cabinet cuz it's not very defined. And then on top of that, we're all human and I feel like the cabinet, even though they might not mean to, they work with these individuals closely and they might have a bias and or a perceived bias if somebody doesn't get uh their waiver approved. Um, so that's why I I feel like even though I hated voting on it all the time, I think it needs to come back to the the the school board or yeah, us to make that final decision if uh based on the recommendation, but it should be our decision if somebody
056has to pay money back to the district or not. Can I make a comment? You may. So, I have several concerns with this. Um, policy BE DBA states that a board member must request an agenda item in a public meeting. That was not done by Mr. Serenion. Um, so that violated policy to have it on this agenda. Um, and it al that policy also states that only if somebody can bring it back if they voted in the majority, which Mr. Serenion did. Um but it was approved at the last meeting and so this policy that is before us in a red line it it was approved the policy was approved. So if we want to bring it back then it should be as a first read with the proposed changes according to policy BCB because
057we approved this policy at the last meeting. So, I'm not honestly sure why it's on the agenda as a third read when it was approved. If Mr. Serencion would like to bring it back, that is his right. He voted in the majority, but it should be requested at the end in a public meeting as stated in policy and then it should be a first read with the proposed changes. These it shouldn't be in red because that is the policy. This is a reconsideration of just this one element. Um the who's going to actually make the determination and uh when you do a reconsideration is supposed to be done immediately after the decision was made. If you look at Robert's rules and of order the reconsideration is supposed to follow up immediately after. So that's why
058it's on there and it was accepted by the board and super or the board president superintendent for an agenda item. Okay. So now we don't have to request agenda items in public. We can just email the board president. I said, as I said, this was a special case of a reconsideration. Um, but we're we'll be, you know, we're working real hard on these policies for the trust policies. And I I would uh recommend to the board that they consider that that um that's a very labor laborious and slow process for other board members to get things on the agenda. So I would I would recommend that that be considered in in the uh adoption of new policies. Okay. But it's not our current policy. I understand that. Okay. But your point, sir, is because this
059is a reconsideration, it was okay to have on there. That's correct. Because it was brought up immediately. Okay. That's the difference. I disagree. So, um I I stand by the way I voted. I do not think that we should be going into executive session every single meeting. I think that we set the policy. If you'd like it to be five members of cabinet, I agree that there could be a conflict of interest. Mr. President, I'd like to call a question. Okay. Question's been called. I'm not done. The question was called. So, under Robert's rules, we go to the vote. No, it doesn't. And I'm going to keep going because I'm not done giving my comment. You may not silence me. I have every right to as a board member until you're done. Take 15 minutes.
060[Music] Oh [Music] [ __ ] Hey [Music] Wonderful. [Music] Oh [ __ ] [Music] No one shoot. [Music] Come on. Come on. [Music] Come [Music] on, heat. [Music] What's up? [Music] We're going to show that we're back in the session. There was a call for the question that if I was allowed to speak, I would have explained that the call for the question was out of line. There was no motion. There was no second. So therefore, the call to the question cannot be heard. That would allow Miss Zimmerman to continue. That's what we'll do at this point. Again, you can only call the question if there's a motion and a second that is already on the table. Mr. Zman, proceed. I just want to reiterate my point that as I made at the last board meeting when we already
061discussed this and it was voted on that I do think that the decision should be made by cabinet. I am open to having a discussion about how we outline the policy or if there is some sort of um appeal process possibly through the board so that it doesn't always have to come through us. I do think that there may be some um HIPPA concerns with um the assistant superintendent giving us all of the information needed to wave liquidated damages. and uh I want to make sure that I'm sensitive to that because if we are entrusted with this decision, I do feel that we need to have all of the information. So, is there something that we could do where um the decision is initially made by cabinet and as it's it's not written up there,
062but as I stated in the motion when I we passed this that it had to be made by at least three people to try to avoid the concern, Mr. Mr. Sony that you brought up about a conflict. Um, and then if there is an appeal of the liquidated damages, then maybe it come before the governing board to try to limit the amount of times that we need to go in executive session. So, I have a few things to say. First of all, HIPPA does not apply because HIPPA only applies to those who do electronic Medicare billing, healthcare providers, clearing houses. and so forth. The school district is not under HIPPA for that. Um secondly, 15502A implies that the board sets contracts and wages. Therefore would imply that any modification of that has to be approved
063by the board. We did speak to legal about this. It was legal's advice um on this. I think it's um dangerous when you start delegating authority outside on a contract that you have and it could change moment by moment. There ultimately is no reason to have anything in the contract if if three individuals, five individuals that aren't in the board that aren't writing the policy can then wave. So that's why this was uh I voted no originally for it. I still um would vote against what we currently have with the cabinet making those selections. Secondly, um you're actually asking cabinet to then discuss all of this. So, your concerns about HIPPA, which don't apply, um, but if they did, let's just talk about general HR and and customer or or employee privacy. We now have
064to expose that person's private information amongst cabinet members, which then can be disseminated everywhere. I think it's best that the HR director look at each case and make a recommendation. Miss Mahorn, you've done that for us in the past with a teacher. I remember one time that was homeless and you called us and said your recommendation was we let them out of the contract without liquidated damages because they were able to move somewhere where they out of the area where they could get get there. Um it does not require that we go into executive session for every one of these. Um, if we're aware of what it is and HR is making the recommendation, I think that's far more private than it going before a a group of cabinet members who then ultimately kind of
065becomes a public record. Uh, any notes, any discussions in hallways. It's it's more secure to have the HR director make a a recommendation to the board. I can't see too many times at all where a board would probably not recognize that recommendation um and go ahead and approve that. If every single one of them started coming back, the board may want to take a look at that. But overall, I think uh we have to trust our HR directors. Um whoever is in that position, we've hired them to do a job. If they're not doing it, then we have to make those changes. But in the meantime, if they're doing their job and they're screening these, they're the one person in this circle that can hear the the employees concerns, hear why they're trying to have
066their liquidated damage received, and then make a good determination on if that's possible or not. Mr. President, if I may, you may. Um last meeting I voted no on this because um same things as you had just mentioned Mr. President but also I had explained my concern of uh future cabinet just using this as a political tool. Um if it always comes before the board then it's the board making the decision. uh in addition to what you know the concerns that you brought forward where this is a contract that the board has agreed upon and so if that contract's going to be amended then the board should be appraised to that. Um but I'm in for I'm for changing the language in here so that the the governing board has the ultimate say. Can I
067make a comment? You may. Um I believe that the contract language says in the board's sole discretion. So if we are going to move it back to the board, I do not believe that the HR director should be re recommending to wave it or not. If it is our sole discretion, I don't feel that we should be influenced by their interpretation. You could say that it's still a conflict of interest, their decision, their recommendation. I apologize to to recommend to wave it or not. I just think, you know, it should be on there for the board to decide. The information should be given to us. And I think by them indicating whether it should be waved or not, that's delegating the authority from us if it's supposed to be fully for the board. And I
068think that's exactly what it would be, our sole discretion. It's simply a recommendation from human resources because they're screening it first. If they have questions about it, if the board has questions, then certainly they could have an executive session and discuss it further, not noticing the employee with an A1 and giving them the right to come. Again, it's only a recommendation from HR, but it would be the board sole discretion which would put us right in line with the policy that you speak of. Okay. But if if we are not given in in my past experience on the board is that the recommendation is given but there's no information um given to the board about how that recommendation was made. So how can we determine if that is an appropriate recommendation? As far as it's
069been in the past, you can speak directly to the HR director and she can tell you why her recommendation was that that does not violate any open meeting law. She's not pulling a board. She's not asking how you feel about it. She's simply giving you the facts of the information that she has. Mr. President, if I may, you may. So, in the past, liquidated damages have only applied to certain people who fall under certain criteria, which is outlined in our board policy. Um, and Dr. Mohern, correct me if I'm wrong, but that's always been the case. If somebody resigns from their position without completing their contract and you know they fall within those parameters, liquidated damages apply across the board. It's no there's no yes or no. It just they apply. That's board policy. Then
070the recommendation to wave the liquidated damages is what comes before us. Correct. Um, at the end of the day, I mean, we do appra approve the the liquidated damages and the wave liquidated damages, but they're only falling in that category if they fell within what our board policy says. And so, they're, you know, that that just comes before us. We don't need that information. It's the information where somebody it gets waved because we already have the we know why it's liquidated damages. They broke their contract. That's in our policy, right? So we don't need an individual basis on every employee that this happens with the the what in my mind is the question is not or to wave the liquidated damages. There's a unique circumstance. They they fall into that category, but now we're going
071to wave it for this individual because of this unique circumstance. So I I don't know where we keep getting off on we need to see everybody's information on everything. Well, it's in our policy. So, it's just the ones that are waved that we're really considering. Say that again. It's just the ones the the the contracts that are brought before us or the employees that are brought before us that are the liquidated damages are waved that we're really considering, right? The other ones, they they violated the policy. They broke their contract. That's why they're getting liquidated damages. I think the ones that are the most questions or the most brought up are the ones that are not waved are the ones that are the the most questioned or the most problems are the ones that are
072most waved. The ones that try to find a loophole of why they should be waved. Okay. Well, if they're saying why they should be waved, then I think that's what comes before the board, right? That Yeah. I mean that's my understanding that could be that could be you know if it's not clearcut and dry usually that's clearcut and dry more times than not it's very clearcut and dry that's kind of my point thank you I'll take a motion Mr. President, I make a motion to approve the or excuse me, I make a motion to approve the third reading of liquidated damages policy with the change that liquidated damages. All decisions to wave not wave liquidated damages fee will be made by the governing board. Yes, I'll say that again, Miss Mini. I make a motion
073to approve third reading of liquidated damages policing with uh it's the very last line. All decisions to wave slashnot wave the liquidated damages fee will be made by the governing board. Before we have a second, I'm going to just ask legal is that the proper motion? This is not a reconsideration because we did have a second read and approve. So is that the right language to do this for a reconsideration and change that language or change that policy back? Think it works. Okay. I don't I just want to make sure because this is a unique situation. I've honestly never ran into a reconsideration. So it's it was a new policy too. I think it works. Okay. All right. So, we have the motion. We have a second. Second. All right. We have the motion. We
074have the second. I think we've discussed it quite a bit. We'll go for a vote. Board member Zimmerman. Nay. Board member Schmidt. Nay. Vice President Kenyon. I. Board member Shinion. I. I'm also I will show that prove three yes to no. Can I just ask clarifying question? You may. I just want to make sure. So every time a teacher um wants out of their contract, I am bringing all the information to the governing board for you to make a decision. I just want to make sure I'm doing it correctly. My understanding is yes, you would bring that as with a recommendation to wave any liquidated damages. If they're waving the liquidated, if they're requesting a waiver of liquidated damages or those unique circumstances, then you would bring that you would bring that to us. Final
075I am bringing a recommendation. You would bring a recommendation, but the board would have the sole authority and discretion to approve that recommendation or to not. Correct. All right. All right. 3.5 discussion consideration of revised job descriptions for executive director of school effectiveness, curriculum and instructional coordinator, executive director of operations, executive director of information systems and technology, early childhood preschool coordinator, research director, special ed services coordinators, student management systems analyst, and student registration specialist Dr. Mahorn. So these are Mr. President, Mr. Vice President, governing board members, these are the remaining job descriptions that we did not get to on Tuesday during the board meeting. So, um I just have a question really quick and while everybody else thinking, if we approve all these job descriptions, does that mean you immediately start trying to hire them?
076as my concern is as we continue to look at the budget right now. We need to make changes. I don't we need to hire folks. Again, the district is way late in getting this brought forward, but at the same token, I would hate to hire somebody for a position that may change or go away as we continue to work out the budget. The one that most concerns me, and again, I'm not recommending the cut, but I am questioning the position as as it currently is, is that executive director of school effectiveness. I just don't Are you aware of any other district in your career? Have you ever had anybody that has that position? I I have not heard of exact position anywhere. No. So that's that's my only concern is if we approve all of
077these um what what happens we start hiring all we can approve some I mean again it's up to you all as a board which ones we approved just like on Tuesday we approved three we posted those three we can so we can approve all of these we can start searching but in the next few weeks if the board decides to eliminate a position or reallocate it we just would not we would either resend an offer or not fill it. Yeah. Okay. I mean, it can I would Can I make a comment? You may. Um, in terms of that particular position, I just want us the board to consider that we already eliminated the ED services and so some of those job duties went into that position. So, you know, we would need to if that
078position or any position were to be cut, then we'd need to reallocate those job duties again. So, um that is, you know, my concern with that. Um in terms of um the other job descriptions, the main thing I have is just on the executive director of operations. Um I think that we need to clarify which salary schedule they're being placed on. All of the other ones um identify which salary schedule they're on. It just says like placed on the salary schedule for the board and doesn't say administrator or director. um the other ones do. Um and the job description isn't listed here because we have eliminated the job, but I still think that that the job description that was created for the director of student services needs to be looked at because um at the
079last meeting um Dr. Monroe had talked about how all of those job descriptions or duties were already for the assistant superintendent of HR and support services. But when I looked at that job description, only one um one of the responsibilities and duties had to deal do with discipline. Um and that whole job has a lot to do with discipline. So, I just really think that we need to look at that job description and make sure that we're allocating it to other positions to ensure that um we are supporting principles um you know with discipline members. Any questions, comments? I I would point out that the um just lost my track here in this meeting. Um let me find it. The director of student services was a position that was originally introduced by our previous superintendent.
080Um that's actually what Dr. Mahorn was originally hired in for. Um because of the workload on the assistant superintendent, that position came to be. Um, so that's not a new, it is a new position sort of, but not exactly because it was introduced to our board uh, many years ago uh, prior to Dr. Monroe being here. That was a position we thought we might not need um, from the start. And so it never we we filled it initially and then once Dr. Monroe got in, he recognized that there could be some savings there and we could allocate additional money other places. So just for board members who are looking at that, we've never had that position. We we did approve it long ago under Dr. Shuff and then it went away pretty quickly. So if
081there's no other discussions, we can take a motion. Mr. President, I make a motion to approve the revised job descriptions for curriculum and instruction coordinator, executive director of operations, executive director of information systems and technology, early childhood and preschool coordinator, research director, special education services coordinator, student management systems analysis, and student registration specialist. list. So, Miss Camarado, if you're following, it's everything except for the executive director of school effective. Yeah, you you didn't excuse me. You didn't say assessment coordinator job description either. So, that one supposed to be in there. Um, no, it's not the the clean is on there, but we approved at the last meeting. Gotcha. Okay. Do I have a second, Mr. President? You may. Do do we need to make a an amendment to fix that operations one where it doesn't
082have the this the schedule that we spoke about? Um, we probably do. Yes, I think we should make that. We'll have to withdraw his motion and clean it up. Okay, I will. I'm sorry I missed that. What did you say, Mr. Since uh when he was making his motion if he wants to change it, we forgot to add to clean up the operations the director of operations one where it says so it specifies what salary schedule. Okay. Can I go ahead amend it? Yes. Okay. So do I have to repeat the whole thing or just include add your amendment. Okay. So, um to add the scal uh the salary schedule for the executive director of operations. So, we need a second. I was I'm second. I was making sure she was done typing. All right.
083So, we have a motion. We have a second. There any further discussion? hearing. None. We'll call the vote. Board members Zimmerman. Nay. And I'd like to explain my vote. Okay. At the end, board member Schmidt. I. Vice President Kenyon. I. Board member Senion. I. I. Also, I will show that proof. 4 to1. M. Board member Zimmerman. Uh, I voted nay just because we did not include the director of school effectiveness and since the board has um already voted on a majority of its budget priorities, I think that we should move forward with at least approving the job description. Thank you. Now, we'll move back up to the fun part here. uh 8:47. We've allowed two hours for our general business trust policy transition session five including chapters four and five. Miss Castanos What's that here?
084inside. No. All right. You have until 10:50. Okay. Miss Castianos. Good evening, Governing Board President Michael Mr. Todd, um, Vice President Kenyan, and governing board members, it's a pleasure to see you all again. Before we start, I would really like to, um, kind of reorient us to the process, um, and get your discussion and approval of a process for not just this read, but also for our upcoming second and third reads. The reason for this is as we move forward, we're looking to have a deadline of July 1st to have everything with its final approval. We currently have two, is that correct, Miss Camaradi? Yeah. So, we currently have two um sessions that are already set aside for some additional work. However, we do need to kind of streamline this process because we are so
085far behind. We started this process on November 25th um and we are continuing as you all know. So I just would like to and President Todd maybe you can help us out here with guiding some of this discussion. I'd like to get a process together um that is representative of what this board um with this dynamic would like to see moving forward and how we could streamline that process. Sure. Um, I think we we spoke a bit. Um, it seems like when we're adopting this much policy, we're probably going to end up with a third read just because the first time around there's a lot of changes. I think it's hard for everybody to visual. We're trying to write hand notes and and reference back and forth. So my thoughts would be that um as
086my understanding watching some previous uh boards on video board meetings on video was this first phase was just to try to see the alignment to not make any changes. So as long as we're aligned moving over we'll make some proposed changes but until we can actually see those printed out and redlined it's pretty difficult to expect to come back and just approve in a second read which I think we saw in the last meeting where we had chapters one and two but there were some additional changes. So, it feels like that would be a little more um better if we can get these into a Word document. Each board member can maybe track changes. I I talked with Mr. Dangerfield earlier about this. We track changes. We can send those to you and then you
087can bring those together into a a document that then we can view in a second read and then and then probably a third read for approval. my only reason we can do it in a second read if they're good, but I suspect once we see all the changes, there's going to be some discussion and and some more reference and so forth. So that I think we're we're probably headed on that course, but I'm open to what my fellow board members think as well. Thank you. Uh Mr. Todd, may I You may. Okay. Um, you know, my feeling is is that I think that we should all give our ideas in this first read. Um, because I think if we just look at alignment like and we're going to reread the policies again, like it's a
088lot of time, right? Like chapters one and two we already did and now it seems we're going to need to go back. So, I would really advocate for us to suggest our concerns or possible inclusions and then bring those back in a redline version so that all board members can see the suggestions and then um as Mr. Todd stated we can either vote to change those or um you know possibly go to a third read, but I would encourage us not to try to do that all in one meeting uh all all five chapters. I think that's a lot to look at in a redline version. So if we could even start with chapter one, you know, and get the red line version of of what was proposed, then, you know, potentially we could have
089a, you know, have the discussion about the red lines and then potentially have a third read. Do you mind if I propose something real quick? Okay. Um, so what I noticed when we came back to read chapters one and two, some of the discussion um, centered around something that had already been discussed and then it was our impression as we were going through that process that um, there wasn't an agreement on it. So I'm curious if it might be helpful for you all to send me your initial red lines first. Then I'll bring that to the board for discussion as our first read of chapter 5 if that makes sense. So, if you will send me whatever red lines you have or questions that you have, I can compile them into one document and then
090that's what we discuss as chapter 5. Um, and that may be a little bit more helpful. And then when we're going through the second read, the second read that I brought to you for chapters 1 and two, those were the redline versions of everything that was the board members had agreed upon. But there's going to be additional questions, of course. So, if I can send you a copy of that redline version and you can send me feedback or we can set up I've offered the board in a previous conversation um we can set up a 30 minute to one hour session with each board member and I can get whatever feedback compile that into one document and bring that to the board. Will that help streamline the process or are you I think that's what
091I was trying to suggest. You may have just said it in a better smoother way. I mean some of Yes, that could be possible. I apologize. Oh, so I I apologize, Mr. Mr. President. If I may, you may. Um, yeah, I would I'd be in favor of that. I know there's a lot here. Um, and honestly, we can be here for a long long time if we go over every little thing we want to talk about. But I think if individually we can send you our recommended changes or questions, I think that that streamlines everything. you get all that, compile it, and then we have a meeting and discuss just what the questions and the red lines are, right? Yeah. Um everything else we should be good. So, I'm I'm in agreeance. Uh may I
092make a comment? Yes, please. Uh that's okay. You may. Sorry. Okay. I was frightening. I was reading trying to read my chicken scratch. My apologies. I I'm a little bit confused um as to what you're proposing to be honest. So the policy adoption is the main responsibility of the board. So and I think that we should be making our recommendations in a public meeting. Um I'm I'm not particularly comfortable giving them behind closed doors. I think in transparency purposes we should be doing them in the public. So um I guess I'm not really understanding. So we're not going to continue the first read. We're going to send all of their changes. To me, that is a lot of like typing and things. I'd personally rather do it in a meeting and have you compile the
093list. Um, so are you proposing that we not basically do this as a first read and we just send you all the changes and then you redline our suggestions and then do a read. Correct. And and then that would still be for everybody to see because all those redline changes will be brought before the board uh or before the public as well. obviously before the board and in front of the public. So then that would that would give you the opportunity to see all those changes, see where everybody's at. You could probably even identify if there's any collisions. If somebody says red light, somebody says green light and the change, you're going to recognize that. You can kind of take us through the steps a little better than what we're currently doing. Correct. Correct. And
094I want to do what's most comfortable for the board. Of course, um I work for you all and however we can do this to streamline it the fastest way possible. I just didn't want to waste your time with coming back and having discussions on things that we might have had discussions on months back, right, months ago. Um so that's why I was looking for a new way to like streamline this process for you. I'm good with it, especially if we can spend you if you've offered time for the board. Again, I'll listen to everybody else as well and we can come up with a we can't really take a vote, per se, but I think we can come up with an idea of of what's going to work best. Okay. Again, though, if we send
095you changes, we're still going to bring this back to the public. You can even identify who made each recommended change in that red line. So, we might see four red lines under this first one, uh, section A, you might see four red lines, and you could even You'll see a list of comments along the side. Yeah, you'll see a list of comments that are along the side. And of course, I would run this past uh Clyde as well, uh Mr. Dangerfield as well, just to make sure that we are in compliance legally. But yes, the recommendations would all be compiled into one document and I can take those either a over the phone or I could take those uh you know over the phone in a meeting or through text or not text, email, but
096it would be a recorded document one way or another. And you've you and Mr. Dwood, you guys have spoke about this a little bit to keep us compliant with everything. Correct. Yes. Yes. It will all come back to the board in in a and available to the public to review all the uh all the red lines. So again, are we not discussing chapter 4 and chapter 5 tonight? We will be continuing the discussion of chapter 4 tonight so that we can get it um closed out and then it will be up to you all how you want to proceed with chapter 5. Okay, carry on. All right, so um we can start with chapter 4 on page 59. Uh it is policy 4-302.B B procedure leave and earn paid sick time. Page 59. and I'll
097open up this policy for any questions, um, concerns, considerations. All right, hearing none, we'll move on to 4-302C. Really quick, I'm sorry. I have a note here. Um, one of my concerns is, uh, payouts at the end. Currently, we acrew for as long as, as I understand it, we acrew for as long as the employee is here. Um, that's unfunded. We don't set aside money each year if somebody moves on. So, if they leave after 20 years, we've got a pretty large check. I don't know if that falls into this section or if it's going to fall somewhere else, but just most places will let you acrew time for, you know, one and a half. You if you if you get two weeks vacation, you can carry four. Um the same with sick time, it
098doesn't it doesn't gain. So we're not having a big payout at the end of 20 or 30 years. That's completely unfunded in our district. So when when the year is over, the money's gone and then 20 years later, we're having a payout on that. Yeah. And Dr. Mo, I'm seeing in here it says a maximum of 40 hours of unused EPST will be rolled over into the following year for use by the employee. So, it is only going to be for the for a maximum of two years, correct? So, if we have a 20-year employee, the max that they could be rolling over is for two years. Is that accurate? Huh? Okay. There is a cap. We'll need you to the microphone so we have the There's one right there. Was it 40 days? I
099feel like we've had this discussion. Oh, yeah. Okay. Administrators can carry up to 40. Why don't you sit down in the chair so we get in the mic closer to the mic. Administrators can carry up to 40 days. After that, they stop acrewing for that year that year until they've used down. The max they can carry is 40. Um, for other 12-mon support staff, it's capped at different terms depending on your length of employment. That that's vacation, right? That's not sick. Is um we already did vacation 120. Yes. Days. Okay. So, this is I think all that was in 4302. Just so back on page 48. And sick leave isn't paid out unless you qualify for the 365 waiver payment and you have to be here for 10 years and you have to at least
100minimum and you have to retire with the district. So sick leave isn't one that's normally just paid out. Where is that written? Which one? The 365 waiver is in the in a policy or the cert the uh handbook. Is there an employee handbook? Yep. We have a certified guest teacher and a support staff. That should probably be shared with Amy so we can incorporate it. Yeah, it should be in policy as well. There's a 360 365 waiver policy. It's on page 63, the 365. Come on. On page 63. and that's at a rate. It's not at their normal hourly rate. If you're a certified staff member, it's at the guest teacher rate. Um, if you're at an hourly staff member, it's paid at the lowest hourly rate. And it's again, it's a percentage for depending
101on how many years you've been here. I want to say it's 30, 40, and 50%. Okay. It's already here. Yeah. Yeah, it's already here. Is that G on page 63? Where's It's on page 63. It is letter G. Yes. But that policy doesn't explicitly say the part that you just said about the breakdown. Yeah. It just says um that they had to have had 365 days effective. Um but there's no information in here about the percentage or anything like that. And I would also say in this new policy, it doesn't say that they can ask for a waiver, the 365 waiver. Okay. Um, since we moved on to this policy, can I make a comment about this? A different part of it, a part of 4-302B or a part of the C? Yeah. Are we
102ready to move on to C? Well, as long as we know, as long as we're addressing the question, which I guess it's here, but then we just need to make a note. Perhaps we need to better align that with our policy in our handbook. Yeah, I will grab the um procedures from Dr. Mo. Okay, Miss Emmer, please. Oh, okay. Um it's also in G. Um it says employee shall not be entitled to use this benefit if the employee is terminated for cause or resigns in lie of termination or non-renewal of an of employment. I feel like this could be used against an employee um where they, you know, are being told they're going to be non-renewed um whether there's cause for that non-renewal or not because administrators um can be non-renewed for no cause. And
103so I feel like that could be used against our employees um by saying that they're not entitled to this if they resign in lie of a non-renewal. So I'm not comfortable with that language. So, are you suggesting that that language be removed in its entirety? Um, just that uh uh just that one sentence would be my recommendation. So, for reference, we're on page 63 under G, and it is the second sentence that uh board member Zimmerman is requesting to be removed. Commit. Comment. Yes. I uh I like it being in there because if they are fired and we go through certain things like we probably don't want to pay them out. Okay. I I would agree with termination, but could we remove the part in a resignation in lie of a non-renewal? I have no
104problem with that one. Okay. So, I I agree with your your point about termination for cause. Um so, thank you for that, but I would so not the whole sentence. Mr. President, if I may. You may. I'm actually fine with it as it reads. Um the reason being is that in many professional businesses you do sit down with somebody if you have an issue whether whatever it may be and a lot of times it's a professional courtesy to give that employee the option to resign or the option to take a termination. Um and so you know I've I've been the one sitting there and giving that option many times. And so I don't I still don't think that that if they're in that position then there's a reason they're in that position. Um so at
105this point I'm okay with leaving the language as it is. But it says in lie of termination or non-renewal. Mhm. Any anybody can be non-renewed. You know again it's going to be the will of the board. So I I thought that what we were doing is just sharing our thoughts and then this is this would be a red line. That's correct. Okay, that is that's correct. Okay, so just to clarify that um because the request in that second paragraph that requests for the waiver to be paid out um could we add that as a red line since that is a current policy? Yes, I will align current policy with this or current procedures with this policy. Thank you. But we're not changing anything right now. No. Okay. Just providing you with red lines. Any other
106questions? Uh considerations on 4-302.C. C. Moving on to page 634-302. D um just at the end that last sentence employees may be Oh, I apologize. Just to clarify, you said D correctly, right? Correct. Military leave. Yes. Thank you. Yeah. Members, if you could just specify what page two, so we know some of these policies are multiple pages so we can get to it really quick. So, moving on to page 664-302E, bereavement leave. Um, I just want to point out at the last sentence, employees may be required. We want it to be a may and not a shall. I just, you know, pointing that out for a point of clarity for the board. I have uh for 4302E what's not listed on here and I think we should include it as foster children or if there's
107a surrogate uh parent situation that still can have a pretty uh both of those can have a pretty significant impact on families if there is a need for bereavement. Are you suggesting foster or uh like in local parents guardianships? Yeah. I mean, even a family that may have a long-term foster child in their house that may be there for months at a time if there is a death. I would feel really they they become connected to them as though they're their own children. And I would hate to have this policy say, "I'm sorry, foster family. you've been raising this person for a year or two perhaps, maybe longer. And well, you can't take any time off because they were, you know, a lot of these foster children are ill. Uh, not all of them. Some
108of them just have really hard lives and they may make a a decision that's not good. Their life ends. It's really hard to tell the that family that's been raising them, sorry, you can't have any burment time. I don't think that's a good idea. I Yeah, cuz one one comment I would also have is it's it says up to 5 days, but if they have somebody passes away six months apart, does that mean they've already used their five days for the year? That means they can't use it again if somebody else dies. I I don't read it that way. It says eligible for up to 5 days with pay of briement leave per year for the death of immediate family member. I would think if you have two deaths starts over. I don't want to
109be the person to say sorry. Oh, I 100% agree with you. I just the way it's written. Yeah, I would sense says no. Sorry. Um I would agree with how Mr. Sinion is reading it that it says five days of bereavement per year. though. Um maybe it just needs to be more clear that it's you know per you don't want to say yeah event. I was going to say incident but that's the wrong word too but I'm tired. Sorry. Um so per per event or per family member just so that it is clear that if you would have two tragedies in your family in the same year, you're not expected to come to work the next day for the second one. Right. And that one is policy GCC in our current one if that helps.
110And if we're making changes, does it help if we give the current policy that we have with ASBA? Just kind of points in to where we're going or Yeah, we can look at at them. So, typically when I'm making any changes, I do look at the corresponding current policy. We okay to move on? Yeah. Just really quick for clarification. I know this is silly, but fortunately I saw this happen somewhere, not here, thank goodness, but employees may be required to provide verification for bereavement leave. A death certificate comes weeks later sometimes. Mh. Um, you just don't want somebody hung up and and saw this transpire with a friend of mine at their work. Oh, we got to have this certificate. We're not going to pay you until you show that. And that took some time.
111So, they basically ended up having to take time off without pay. They got it back retrospectively, but unfortunately APS and local mortgage companies don't work on IUS. um you know and so I think we should just make sure that the language is in there that we're not going to make people jump through hoops and you know and I really don't want them bringing their loved one here. Look, it's real. Um yeah, you know that's not but but unfortunately you get you get some rogue people. I don't believe it would ever happen in this district, right? But unfortunately I didn't think it would happen in that situation and these things do happen. So, I think we just need to make sure we clean up that language where we're not making somebody jump through hoops. It's traumatic
112enough time. We need to do everything we can for our staff to support them and not make them jump through hoops. But, so my question would be, do you want that in policy or is that the procedure? Right. So, typically I can make sure that the procedure aligns and that that procedure has really great language around it, but to put it in policy, it's so much harder to change policy than it is to change procedure. And then it makes it really thick. Yeah, that's fine. Is it okay? Certainly acceptable obituary, you know, in the paper in anything. It doesn't have to be a death certificate. Yes, certainly. I understand. I just know like I said, that's the common sense approach. Unfortunately, not every employer sees that and it's never happened here, but it shouldn't have
113happened where it did either. So, just to protect that person. Okay. Any other? Okay. Uh 4-302.f sick leave bank. Okay. I have a couple questions. Uh one, I think when we talked about this previously, we're willing to link this policy to the one that just briefly mentions the sick leave um that we talked about Tuesday. Mhm. Um my question for staff is do are people making a donation of a day once like in their you know lifetime or once a year once a year and you have to have 64 hours to be eligible to donate that you've like banked. Okay. I think it pro we probably need to make it clear in the policy that it's once a year because I couldn't gather that from this policy. That's what I was kind of thinking. On
114the bottom of page 67, it says donations are final and employees may not request refund of donation. Donations will remain in the sick leave bank upon employees separation. Oh, okay. I read it wrong. Okay. When I read it out loud, it made more sense. So, I have a question about this as well. Once you get your notes ready, ready? Yeah. Okay. So, if a person has 40 hours of sick time, and I'm just going to speak round numbers. if they're paid $5 a day and now we get into the sick bank and then somebody else wants to donate a day but they get paid $3 a day. Mhm. For the first 40 hours or whatever they have in their bank, we have that. But these are for longterm, you know, typically longer situations. Do we
115get kind of a fallout at the end because we budgeted for this person who gets $2 a day. they've donated a day, but that's not the $400 or $500 that the other person makes. So, do we have a budget shortfall that happens as a result of this where we might need to look at a scale where somebody who's makes half the money that the person's actually using it? How how do we look at that? Well, that's a what is the current process for that? it would be at their I mean it's you're at your daily rate or hourly rate for each that um we have such a surplus at the end of the year of how many people actually use the sick leave bank it's pretty minimal um in my five years six years however
116long I've been with the district I think we've done four process four applicants um so we essentially acrew a whole time but it It doesn't usually have such a budget impact unless we were to have, you know, 12 employees do it at the same year, right? But but if we do, we always have to think for the time that we do have that. We came out of a pandemic overall. We got pretty lucky with with how long people were out. But it's really tough to have this policy and set up another board for 10 years down the road. something happens and all of a sudden they get a big swoosh out of their budget at the end because this is in here. Yeah, Crystal would probably be best to speak to that just how they
117budget for that if they you know set aside funds for how many hours are in that bank um you know and move that from year to year. I and my question does that carry over because at the end of the day we don't a lot of this at the end when you retire is unfunded. We don't we don't take your days and roll them year over year over year where there's a little savings account for Mrs. Jones, Mrs. Smith, whoever. Well, when you retire, here's your here's your money. It it comes at the end. So, if we have a mass there's there's times where this happens where you have a a senior group of of employees and if they all retire around the same time, which sometimes they're just going to when they start hitting
118that magical retirement age and cities are recognizing that, wow, we we've got a problem. We have 80% of our department retiring at one time. And so, it's it's hard from a recruitment standpoint. It's also hard for a payout because that's unfunded. Once that money is each year, it goes away. So that's just my question how we balance that out. I would just say if I could add one thing right here at the bottom of 67, it says donations are final. Employees may not request refund of donations. Donations will remain in the sick leave bank upon employees separation from the district district. So they don't get these days when they are paid out of retirement. Right. No, I I understand that. But it's about the dollar amount. If we're paying you $5 a day, but there's
119also some that are donating that are bigger than the others, too. Sure. You just want to make sure that lines out. You don't want to be I don't want to set a future board up for a situation where they have this policy they go, "Wow, we just, you know, we we lost because now or people donate accounting." That's an accounting thing, but the the your business office should set it aside as a part of the budget. Okay. We just need to make sure that's happening. I have a couple more things for this particular policy. Okay. Um, at the bottom of page 68, it says the executive director of support services will attend community meeting committee meetings. We just don't have an executive director of support services. So, I think whoever is it uh you Dr.
120Mahorn. Okay. So I would just change it to assistant superintendent so that you know we reflect our current organizational chart. Um on page 69 um the fourth bullet uh for approval I'm reading the top part and then I'll read the bullet. For approval the applicant shall and then it says not be eligible for disability benefits including but not limited to social security provided by provided at the district expense. Does this mean that they can't use um short-term disability um and apply for the sick leave bank correct because you can't use both. Short-term won't approve it if you're using sick leave. Okay. Um and then the sixth bullet um it says submit an application. uh where is you know is where is the application uh you know do our employees know how to get it that
121kind of thing. It's on the staff page on the website. Okay. And then again for the appeal process be just changing the name of the you know person that is in charge. So I have a question um along those lines. If they're using short-term disability, they're ultimately going to take a pay cut, but then when they burn out of their uh short-term disability, they would then get back to their regular pay. Correct. Because then they'd be pulling off of this bank. Likely they would use a sick leave bank prior to doing short-term disability. They can do that. There's no requirement which way it goes. Okay. All right. Perfect. Thank you. And then if it got too long, they would be eligible for long-term disability. No, I just want to make sure that that was like
122if they use it at any time. I didn't want them to be disqualified from this. So, okay. Well, also if they go back to using the bank, then they break up their time off. So, you have to completely get rid of all of your short-term or all of your leave, right, prior to being eligible for short-term disability, but you have to use all the short-term disability to be eligible for long-term disability or social security. So, if there's any break that you went back on a leave bank, then you would no longer be eligible for the long-term disability. There's a lot of circles I saw. Okay. Any other questions on um this policy? Moving on to 4-41 discrimination complaints. I do have one question really quick. When we finalize this, can we do a page break
123so the 4-40 goes to the next page so we have Okay, thank you. 4-400. Any questions? Moving on to page 714-402, employee grievances. Yeah, I have I have quite a bit on this policy. So, could could maybe staff first explain the difference between a grievance and a whistleblower without having him. Mr. Dfield, can you answer that? Well, yeah. Oh, I Yeah, anybody. Sorry, I didn't mean to. A grievance is, you know, a grievance is a complaint about their own situation. If it's a if it's a complaint about something else, then it it could can be a whistleblower. It really depends on what the complaint is. But if they're complaining and bringing to the district's attention something that's they see as inappropriate in some way, then that's that's a whistleblower. Okay. So, it really depends on
124what's being presented. No, that's helpful. Thank you for putting it in that kind of terms. Okay. So the first one, first question I have is uh it's on the first page of this policy. So page 71 uh it says multiple employees may not pursue a group grievance. Um that is not in our previous policies. So, I'm curious why that was added. And uh my concern would be if if all of the employees are concerned about the same thing, wouldn't it kind of save time to be able to handle them in a group? I can't tell you exactly why it was added because I'm I need to do some research before I was able to ask and answer that qu or answer that question fully. Okay. Um if that's something that maybe you could do like
125when we come back for a red line. Yes. Um so excluded matters. Uh I kind of understand numbers one and two but three, four and five. How do employees address address concerns or a grievance with those particular things particularly numbers four and five. So if you know they're concerned about employee discipline, non-renewal, dismissal, any matter related to performance, I mean these are the things that employees would be concerned about. So if they don't agree with, you know, discipline or their evaluation, how how do they address that with the district? Just saying they can't have agreements with other person's pupil's discipline, not their own. Correct. No, this is the grievance one. So, this is their own. Right. So, that was my question if their own or not. Because we're talking about somebody else's, they should have
126no business. Well, I would agree. But from what Mr. Dangerfield explained, grievance is about their own personal situation. It is. And when you're talking about three, four, and five, those are specific actions and procedures that have their own process. and people have rights to respond to those things. So it's not the same as a grievance. A grievance process, there's a process that occurs with a grievance. Okay? These would be have their own process in responding to whatever discipline or action is being taken. Okay. But I don't believe they're in our policies. I I didn't see them in in chapter 4. So, I'm not comfortable saying they can't disagree with any matter related to their performance evaluation, improvement plans, discipline if if we don't have a policy to protect them or way for those to address
127those concerns. It may be helpful to reference the definition of grievance that is listed above as a board policy. And I will do some research as well, Miss Zimmerman, to make sure that we have um have this all situated. But I if we're looking at that definition above, we're talking about uh mislication or misapply to governing board policy or procedure related to compensation, benefits, or terms. Right. I don't know if that is helpful in reviewing this, but I do think that this does need to take I do need to be able to take this back and do some research to give you a better answer. Okay? Because it does say in related to compensation, benefits, terms, and conditions of agreement or employment that is would be non-renewal or a dismissal. Yeah, I I really think
128we need to look at that because I don't think that protects our employees. Um I also need to reference other policy to see make sure that it's not in there somewhere else, right? Like I'm sure both and uh the current policy for staff grievances is CBK-R if you wanted to look at that one. Um and then still on this first page, um a grievance must be initiated within 15 work days. Um does PTO or sick time or FMLA anything account into those or just 15 work days in general? The way that I am reading this particular policy, it's 15 work days in general without any account for PTO or anything else. So let's say a grievance happens and somebody chooses to take 3 days off for mental health reasons or whatever they choose to take
129off, right? That would still be accounted within that 15-day process and procedure. And then the last paragraph on page 71, the individual with whom the grievance is initiated is not a building administrator or a district level administrator. The individual with whom the grievance is initiated shall report the initiation of the grievance to the superintendent. Is it appropriate for it to go straight to the superintendent? What if it's a teacher? Should it or go to the building administrator? I wonder if it would just be like to their direct supervisor rather than the superintendent. Again, I'm trying not to have the superintendent involved in everything he doesn't he or she doesn't need to be involved in. If I may, I think that's what this is saying that it should go to the building administrator first. And but
130if it's not if the building administrator isn't their direct uh person they report to, then it would go right to the superintendent. If that's the way I'm reading it. Yeah. I read it as if the person making the grievance is not the building administrator or district level administrator, then you need to make the grievance to your your building level administrator. But if you are the building level administrator, then you would go to the superintendent. That's how I read it as well. Okay. Um I'm on page 72. Um I would like to see um the level one grievance shall be dated. That's the paragraph I'm on with the numbers. And I would just like to see a number seven added to what steps were taken at the informal level, the result and why the grievance continues
131its process to show the documentation of what was done at the informal level. Okay. Um, sorry. I'm just I Okay, I'm on page 73. Um, it says, you know, almost 34 of the way down the decision of the superintendent is final. Um, our policy currently states that it it it is allowed to come before the board. Um, and I would say the caveat might be that any if the grievance is filed by anyone that is directly um, supervised by the superintendent that it come before the board in order to avoid a conflict of interest. Because if the superintendent is making a ruling on a grievance that of a person that he or she directly supervises, that does seem to in my mind to have a conflict of interest. So, if I'm not mistaken, is that
132isn't that what the next paragraph talks about? Says where it initiates with the superintendent, but basically it can all come before the board then. Um, if you go back to right before that, the level three formal review. Mhm. It says if the superintendent was the individual who rendered the decision at level two, the decision of the superintendent is final at that level. I I see where you're saying that if it was initiated with the superintendent. So if if somebody who's directly under the superintendent, they initiate it with the superintendent, the grievance, correct? That's how the policyy's written. I'm going to defer to Mr. Dangerfield, but yes, that is the way that the policy reads to me. Yeah, I think that's correct. I thank you. Um, sorry, I've been thinking about something else here for a
133minute. You're referring to a net the next level of a grievance then if the grievance was initially started with the superintendent. Well, I'm just trying to kind of weigh the level three formal review and then matters where the grievance was initiated with the superintendent and in ensuring that the if the grievance is, you know, by someone that is directly supervised by the superintendent, it has the ability to come the appeal to come to the governing board, right? Isn't that in here? Okay. Isn't it that next paragraph right there? Matters where the grievance was initiated with the superintendent. I think so. I'm just trying to reread that's the process the paragraph before to ensure. Yeah, that's the way I understand it. Okay. And then on page 74, um it just talks about a hearing officer. Um
134who who is who is the hearing officer? There would be an outside person. U the board would choose. There are people out there that do hearings. I have done them for other school districts. Okay. Uh my recommendation would be to include language that said like a third-party hearing officer or someone outside the district so that it's clear to our employees that um you know it would be a neutral party or maybe a neutral party something along those lines. Okay. I think we had we used to have a list of approved hearing officers. I don't know the state department of maintains the list because that's an official title on the list, right? That's an official title though. grievance officer or hearing officer. That's an official title basically. So, it's kind It is. Yeah, that's an official
135title. But I guess it does not hurt to put third party or approved list from the state. The state generates that list. Yeah, it would not it would not hurt at all. This the Department of Ed has the list. Any other questions on this policy? If I could just if if we put the department of ed that's that box us in because we could basically use are they the only ones we can use? No. No. You can you don't have to be on the list. Yeah. The district can hire some other right? Many attorneys do this role of being an outside hearing officer. Why third third party probably is that would cover it. That would cover it. Yeah. All right, moving on to page 764-43, whist whistleblower protections. Okay, I'm on uh page 76, halfway
136down under making a disclosure. Um, it says to allow the district an opportunity to investigate alleged wrongful conduct and take necessary internal corrective action. Um, I'm not going to read the whole thing. Uh, I just wonder if this should be investigated by a third party because if someone is, you know, using the whistleblower protection, wouldn't there be a concern that the district is not being truthful because somebody's having to bring this information to light And the last sentence in that second paragraph under making a disclosure if the allegations concern the superintendent the complaint complainant may file with I think we should cross out the word president and put board because um the board president doesn't have more power than anybody else and I think that it should be made with the entire board. I think
137the reason why they limit it to one is to prevent any open meeting violation. That's what I was told. But wouldn't you wouldn't you forward that to all of us in the end for us to know that it would be agendaized? I understand it. We would agendaize that if if a board president any board president got that then they would they would make it a obviously they'd be in touch with legal and then making an agenda item either most likely in executive session to get legal advice on it. Yeah. I I don't think it's an open meeting law violation because people email us all the time. All of us. As long as we don't respond then that's what makes it an open meeting law violation. people emailing us in a group is not an open
138meeting law violation. No, it's not. Okay. Is there I'm wondering if they add the board president so there's one specific person who's now responsible for making sure it gets done because if you get to all the board then every like well who's going to action that but now it's on the onus of the board president to take action. Uh I hear you. I just I just want to make sure that you know the entire board is aware of it I guess is my concern. Well, let's make it a red line thing and we'll uh and Amy will look into it just a little bit because I think we can do with the board president and sorry I was thinking out loud. Oh, it's okay. Those are supposed to be No, it's okay. It's okay. Um
139this is more just like a note. I would like to see, you know, some training for staff about these protections because when I looked at our old policy, I didn't see anything about um a whistleblower protection unless I missed it in ASBA, but I think I looked at the crosswalk. Um and so I believe it's new. It's GBP. It's what I found. Okay, hold on. Can you tell me it again, Mr. Kenyon? Yep. G BP and also Dr. Mohorn would that be in your in the procedures the training for these protections the whistlebl protection the grievance pol pro process is that a part of the onboarding process or annual trainings that is required of the employees of the district. No require it or recall it being in our required trainings that we do yearly but
140we could look and see if vector does offer that to add it to the to the yearly trainings. Okay. Okay. And then at the bottom of page 76, it says uh false allegations of wrongful conduct. Um you know, this this policy is to protect our employees and allow them to bring concerns forward. And so by having this clause in here, I feel like it kind of negates that by saying an employee who knowingly makes false allegations of alleged wrongful conduct to a public body shall be subject to discipline. You know the the key word on that is Knowingly makes false allegations. Okay. So it's like liel or slander or that type of thing. Okay. Any other questions or considerations on this policy? Okay, moving forward to 4-403 procedures for hearing whistleblower protections. Okay, so I
141just want to clarify a statement that um was made earlier, Mr. Danefield, about the the difference between a grievance and a whistleblower protection. So these ad uh ad adverse personal action. So somebody is concerned about the termination of an employment or nonrenewal of employment of a separate person. Like all these lists of things, these are concerns that somebody else is bringing forward about not themselves, a different employee. I just want to clarify that that's what we're saying here. I don't know. This needs this one needs to be analyzed a little bit. I don't know where this language exactly comes from. Did anybody look at cross policy? So the policy I mentioned earlier GBP when the ASBA is is about four paragraphs. It's not much. Um, and this goes into a lot more detail in the
142trust. And so that's about all I can say on that. I'm just concerned that like I think we should have protections for a whistleblower, but I also think we should give our employees the opportunity to file a grievance. You know, if they have all these concerns, it seems like these would be concerns about themselves. But I mean, I could be wrong. So, so can you help formulate the question for me that I would need to bring an answer back for you? I just want to make sure that I'm addressing exactly what you're asking. I would just add also a whistleblower can be about themselves as long as it's a fits into a category where it's bringing forward an issue that's like a violation of law or or the governing board policy, that type of thing.
143They they have a right to bring those things forward. And if it's a whistleblower, it's because it can be both a grievance and a whistleblower. I guess more of my question is why are we not allowing employees to grievance like cause for termination those three things but they're listed here under whistleblowing. Okay, that makes sense. Okay. Yeah. And I'm sure it has something to do with statute, but I will research and bring that answer back to you. Any other questions on page 79 or for policy 4-403.A on page 81 in the middle of the page the paragraph that I'm referring to is if the request does not qualify. It talks about the board, you know, doing different things, reversing it, whatever. I assume all that is happening in executive session. Yes, it would. Okay. Do
144you think it's important for it to be noted or or not necessarily? It's just the assumption. Yeah, I don't think it needs to be noted specifically. Are we okay to move on to 4-44? Yes. Okay. So, moving on to page 84.4-44. Reasonable accommodations. Uh, okay. I'm at the last paragraph. What page? Oh, sorry. 84. As this is about uh like workplace protections and accommodations. So, it says as part of the interactive process, the district may request reasonable documentation that the individual has a disability and needs a reasonable accommodation. the district may seek input from a treating physician. Is that legal to to um ask to confer with um their physician about if they provide documentation of a disability? I'm not I'm not suggesting that they don't have to do that. The district may request reasonable
145com documentation. an individual has a display and needs reasonable accommodation, the district may seek input from a treating physician. I would assume that you were going to ask the employee that that information or permission to do that, but is that a requirement of getting accommodations? So, typically may seek input from an additional or from another physician may be like what types of accommodations, right? and asking for the um physician to put in writing what types of accommodations. For instance, if I am hearing impaired, um what specific accommodations would the physician see that would best accommodate my work schedule or my work life? So, it's not necessarily, oh, do you give me permission to call your physician? It's more so, hey, we need to have a more specified laidout procedure or more specified laidout accommodations. Dr.
146[ __ ] is that accurate? Yes. or if somebody is visually impaired, um we might need to speak to the doctor for the certain technology that a teacher might need um in order to help them teach the class or something like that, like specific technology that a teacher might need um something like that. Um I've had experience with that before. Um, when I had a teacher when I was a principal that needed specific things in order to teach, she needed this type of technology specifically um, in order to be able to teach her class. Okay. Thank you. Any other questions or considerations for this policy? 4-4044 this Okay. Yes, we are. We're at the end of our time and at the end of chapter 4. We have another hour. Oh, we have another hour. I vote that
147we do uh I can't vote, but I recommend that we just do chapter 5 as we stated before. Okay. [Music] takes us to item 4.1, board comments on agenda topics and items for future considerations. Uh I have two. I'd like to have uh an update from staff about how many outstanding FOYA requests that the district has and what the status of them are. And I'd like to see the staffing for next year to ensure that we're adhering to the class size ratios that um you know were voter approved in the override. Can you repeat your second one? Staffing. Uh, yeah. Staffing. Uh, you know, what's the staffing for next year to ensure that we're adhering to the class size ratios that were voter approved in the override? Anything else? All right, hearing none. That takes
148us to 5.1, the adjournment of the meeting. It's going to be 952 on the dot. We're adjourned. [Music]