Public Art Commission 3-6-19

001all right councilmember alley you're on Molly yeah Alison buck Deb Mexica here Connie Brown here copy Coleen Rowley here David II saw your John Qatar ski they're very faithful here David's in yeah you have a quorum to approve the agenda Thank You Jonah and seconded any discussion of the agenda I'm sure I would like an addition on the agenda under new business I'd like to add addition of a work group to determine developer input all right anything else all right if that change is Amina ball all in favor great I think that what she just she took it as an assent rather than as a motion and so at that moment before and we can go back on the vote but before she moved on you could have spoken up in had you wanted to

002okay all right now is the time for public comment I'm Ian I'm here for a class of mind but I am really interested in the arts so of course I chose to come to the Art Commission one but yeah welcome yes annual here near the end of our meeting we have several working groups one of which is looking to involve youth with our Commission so that might be of interest to you on particular okay now we have to move for approval of the minutes I have some questions on a couple so maybe we'd be better off to take them individually or move to memory okay sunny one second on the November 18th minutes thank you all right any discussion I'm sorry November 18th are 17,000 1800 minor grammatical changes which I've made a note of

003to send Trina and then there was a couple I think discrepancies in Mary and Jonah's BIOS you're not the director of neutral zone and then Jonah what would you say your your turn working in it's at real estate and property robbery management management I knew there was a word missing there okay but contextually it all looked pretty good to me was there any way I'll take those changes in half and you to crack them and put them in the record anyone see any other concerns with that one I'll move the minutes as amended great thank you all in favor I'll pose for any of us all right those are approved well now we got to do the December 11th does anyone moved to approve okay um discussion I have one correction madam chair on page

004two under potential tasks it indicates the second bullet point provide advice assistance with recommendations for placements of art donated to city that cannot be placed on city property enhance project that is Allison and my workgroup actually as I understood it it wasn't that artwork that cannot be placed but rather just donated to the city period strike the work that that cannot be placed on city property or enhance project strike all of those I think that would be more accurate from what I understood so those two placing a be donated artwork anywhere great if that changes amenable to everyone we can i'll move the minutes as amended stepping out of bounds here but it does say with the roll call wish um no our minutes are you on ones from Oh November seventh nevermind okay alrighty

005now we are looking at or we have a motion to look at the minutes for January so thank you alright discussion on these ones madam chair yes I have a question yes on page two there's under the first paragraph there's an asterisk that says add Coleen Crowley to section 1 what is that I think she is part of working group and she wasn't listed in that working group on our report what are those numbers [Music] so in our report each of our working groups are put together because of something in the ordinance and those numbers relate to where they are in the ordinance so there was probably just how many uh no that didn't go back and make the same I don't know clarify that yeah maybe instead of saying numbers in the room I

006had a question about it said public comment and I says approved as presented one more comment and maybe I'm missing it but for the section where it's one in the back or for architectural enhancement page labeled page 2 of our plan I thought we were going to list the group that was working on the CIP was the CIP group supposed to be listed as one of these pieces are not I'm looking at the the annual plan on the back of it on four I thought we were talking about putting the CIP group as part of back to the question John Ray's colleagues probably the section one should be - could we just put in the name yeah doesn't sound section number but the donations go all right any other minutes I move the minutes as

007corrected thank you John hi hi any opposed great we've got approve minutes three meeting okay so we've added to our agenda report from share I may have something every meeting I may not this meeting um Romilly I will be talking about our two CIP projects that went to recently and I'm happy to report we're approved if you haven't gone in a moment to check out the link and watch it I highly recommend doing so it's very insightful to see what everyone's commentary is on the topic and see how it was received at the meeting it was a close vote six to five so that's something to note as well in response to the meeting I did send out emails to everyone on City Council thanking those who approve and those who opposed I welcomed their

008input wanting to understand their point of view a little bit more I did get a couple of responses if you're interested in seeing those I'm happy to share them one from each side so one was very nice and one was not so favorable but I was glad to get responses nonetheless and I really thank City Council for the lively debate they had and the positive outcome that we have in it I also wanted to thank Ally for speaking on our behalf at that meeting as well as Craig for being there and I know Veneto was there supporting us in spirit based on some conversations I've had afterwards she's very supportive supportive of us and what we're doing so yeah it was if I can speak I'm not sure Thank You chair it was a debate

009that went on for about 15 minutes and some people said well we're getting away from what's on the agenda here because it went to a broader discussion of public arts and state of affairs and it was a close vote six to five so you know I do suggest people go back and watch that part of the council meeting and you know see where where the you know issues are and you know I just you know it was fun to be able to come to the defense and be on the winning side and keep keep a pulse keep it going so come and ask me questions if people have questions in particular I don't want to take too much time tonight as to where counsel stands but I think there's just a lot of misunderstanding lack

010communication and so hopefully we can over time clear clear the air on that and go forward I think some of the current the concerns that were raised are things that were actually working on there was a lot of suggestion for finding for art coming from other places and we have a working group working on that so I while it was a little bit frustrating I do think it was encouraging that you know given what we're doing and with a full breadth of information I think there would have been less opposition so and one thing that on the agenda that was the preventive preventive fencing the parking garages and I think $10,000 request some council members asked you know why we haven't asked the DDA and perhaps this body has asked the DDA it is there

011you know property hey they build a manager Mike Cejka so that was a question that was brought up by council members so when it comes to working on you know those assets that belong to the DDA perhaps to asking them for the financial assistance yeah there are DDA projects on the full CIP that and the council approves the full CIP and so it's all just part of the way the city works on projects david has been working with the DDA and had conversations with them about the projects so I think and at this point when we have our list we have now identified all the ones that our DDA project so it is listed in there that we are aware that it's a DDA projects that's where that funding criticism yeah so and then you

012know of course you're working on the donation aspects and the gifting and you know that was a part of the debate that was again one of the thing that is just they're not up to speed yet and and and so once once the information gets to to the right people see that new work that's coming out of this commission and you know I think that's that'll be good obviously do you have any suggestions on how to get people up to speed so at least the debate is about the right things you know the mayor and once every couple months once a month you know something that some sort of communication allow them to know because otherwise I don't know if they're they're directly gonna get it another way I mean unless they're looking for it

013I mean it's available obviously I mean unfortunately put it on their desk a little bit more you know as they say you know put it on on their desk and you know you know some of the new stuff that's happening some of the some of the new stuff that you're doing you know so they're not you know reading yesterday's newspaper well on our full report that talks about all of our working groups and all the great work that we're doing was part of that meeting packet understanding that that packet that they get is huge so when I did email them all to thank them I it out that that's in there if they're looking for more information and want to better understand all the work we're doing you know Deb and I have talked a

014little bit about going to some city council meetings where appropriate and presenting about what we're doing we definitely don't want to ruffle feathers when it's not necessary but we do want them to know what we're doing in a positive way and also you know with Ollie being present and also at those meetings when it's appropriate to talk about what we're doing he'll be sharing what we're doing yeah please you know you know prod me poke me say you know we need you to kind of light on this its upcoming meeting you know and and you know like we've said a lot of the opposition wasn't necessarily about what we're doing it's about just public art funding in general so it was a larger debate that had nothing to do with what was currently being approved

015or not approved and more about how they felt about public funding for art so I don't know that we can do a lot about those personal ideas and opinions but I think we can continue to do what our ordinance has asked us to do and we're doing some good work and continue to hopefully share the work that we're doing with them and maybe they'll get excited about what we're doing so you know it was a positive vote we did it up six five but I just wanted you guys to be aware of it and that we should be you know cognizant of it moving forward I was just gonna point out I appreciate that you sent the link with the time to so we didn't have to watch the whole council meeting to this yeah

016there's lots of public commentary beforehand it doesn't necessarily apply to I have a question for Olli particularly and it's not clear to me I'd say the DDA projects appear in the CIP but it's not clear whether Council's approval of those projects for enhancement has any effect on the DDA whether they actually take instruction from City Council or if they're completely self you know it's just a stockist of money you know we are told I think you know I'm not sure I've never sat down to count them but over 50 buckets so where is this you know so so a lot of that quick you know reaction will be - well it's a DDA property you know what's what's their contribution to it all so make it you know some and again I have much to

017get back to you on about how it can be more helpful for this commission to to extrapolate you know how to identify and apply you know just just throwing that out there now that you know and I'll get back to you later on how we can better do that but they are gonna you know say I would focus more on you know or make a make a note that it is a DDA project and hopefully there is gonna be funding from the DDM because that's what city the City Council will be looking for is they deviate it we revived this like that yeah yeah funding for it yeah and if the DD if the Council's approval has no authority over the DDA then we should just not even include those in our recommendations or at

018least break them out separately and I would have to give back it'd be good to find out more about how that works the projects the DDA is building city assets the city owns those parking structures the DDA manages him on behalf of the city the city had let me back up and say the DDA does consider the art recommendations and they do participate I think that one is far enough out that they were they weren't thinking of that fencing as something to do artistically however I can speak that I recently talked to staff at the DDA about their planned expansion of the in Ashley parking structure and they're they're actively contemplating putting art in that expansion so it's our addition is not something they're opposed to get it's just about which projects aren't they're willing

019to put it into so the answer is it's a recommendation and the DDA considers it yeah okay are they forced to act on it no and in fact any of the recommendations you make whether yes he's gonna be appropriate it won't happen so it's a recommendation it's not a mandate yeah so and that's what we brought up at Council I mean there's a lot of things that have been identified on the CIP for targeted projects and you know we're gonna have to you know obviously there's a lot of debate there was debate going on as there is now and you know but I think you know shouldn't stop this commissioner from doing the work that it's it's got to do right now you know it's just you know I try to hopefully it's not demoralizing

020I feel like the Commission was was you know under under under attack or something and I let counsel know that hey they just came back with what we asked them for so we can't you know you know be you know accusing them of anything if there's any failure it's on councils are we're not making it clearer so there were several council members who talked very warmly about what we're doing and public art in general too so it wasn't all negative I know there's some long faces right now but you know what was gonna debate you know yeah if you haven't watched it go damn damn chair I was excited frankly and I applaud I did watch it III applaud Alison for showing up I think that's important and it was a very effective advocate frankly

021I wasn't expecting it to pass so to me it was a win and even more so even those that did not vote for these recommendations each and every one of them said they appreciate what this commission is doing and they support what the Commission is doing and I've talked with most of them and everyone supports public art so I think that we're making headway I think I consider this a success and it's do I think to the leadership of Olli on that on that council and I think that there were some opposition to it that sounded to me like just missed information they just didn't quite understand it so the more we educate but kudos to Alison Alison and Ali I think they did a great job it matters no one looks at the score

022it's a wins a win all right so now we can move on to new business we have a new meeting that we're gonna add to the calendar in August we talked about this previously there's an annual report that it's due to City Council and in order for us to include as much information as possible and get it approved by us before it goes to City Council on its due date we need to meet in August to approve it so there are four different dates here should we just take HD startled is there a handy one I'm sorry madam chair yes maybe if we could identify and there any date here that one it conflicts on your schedule with anyone scheduled believe this 7th does for me okay let's just cut the seventh out and the

02320th does for me cut that out seventh and the fifteenth twenty at 120 I'm sorry so madam chair I think the 15th doesn't work for me does the sixth work for everybody the 76 works all right looks great all right now we are on to old business No oh sorry yes John all right yes I've asked this to be put on the agenda it grew out of an incident that happened last night I attended a meeting of the downtown Citizens Advisory Council and Brad Moore was there he's the architect for the development of six sixteen Washington which is the large high-rise behind the Michigan theatre and he as I'm learning that developers come into town and and they put together a proposal and they take it to the Zoning Board and the Design Review Board

024and and they take it to various places around town the DD a Citizens Advisory Council and to seek input that a member of there were several members of that council that were at the reception and much to my delight and surprise someone brought up the fact that the front facade didn't seem to be rather played and was called a cheese grater and couldn't Brad consider public art and he said of course and then they just pointed to me and I said that we would be happy to do whatever we could do not knowing what we could do so we exchanged email in addition that last year Ron Mucha who's the vice president of Morningside that are developing the huge thing in Lower Town Maiden Lane approached me and another meeting and said I was told

025to to see you by some council members about public art in this project again I said we'd be happy to do whatever we could and he said fine let's exchange emails and I will get in touch with you when the project gets more along well that project has broken drum and it'll probably at some point they have designated an area for public art that together sort of caused me to think what exactly is that the art commission could advise developers coming into town the good news is that we are getting folks that are actually recommending to developers to consider public art so I put together an email and sent it to several folks that I invited to be on this working group to one to consider what the Art Commission might be able to offer

026to developers so when they come calling what is it that we can do I would recommend that we don't get into selecting art but we might be able to help shape them we possibly could start an artist registry we could do I don't know what we could do but that's why I've asked this working group to get together and to meet help shape the discussion and bring it back to the Commission for further discussion that I've asked David Issa and Mary fievel's and and Jonah coffee to be on that they have all agreed that Allison has suggested maybe we could discuss it here I'm open either way it just seems better my if the four of us meet kind of refine the options and try to present something to the greater board but discussing how

027the art commission relates to private development on private land or developers who are doing City related projects solely developers that come into town with a proposal and someone is going to say what do you think about putting some public art and why don't you talk to our public art Commission so it's really only pub in the sense and it's visible from the streets but it's not it's not any way related to a city official yeah there's no there's nothing official that we are the natural reference point for anything public are so that a developer's you know I mean the downtown Advisory Commission thought you know what do you got that stupid light going around you know like well what about the color of the bridge they they really give these suggestions and advice the good

028news is is our community leaders are recommending the developers also consider public art and that they come to us asking for advice well what kind of advice can we give them and how can we give it and that's what I'm asking this to set up a working group to discuss what what could the Art Commission do when developers are referred to us and you know we could promote local artists we could promote you know Ann Arbor's culture so there are a number of things that we could do but I think if it's thought through so when they do come because I know to probably will just just to check it off I don't know but we might be able to be effective in bending their project a little bit towards public art so I would

029recommend if if this goes forward that you guys look at the public art proposal that's already on our website which is where people considering public art projects to submit their projects to us it says we can provide visibility and feedback for proposals submitted and if I municipal space it is part of your project if if municipal space is part of your project city ordinance requires you to seek a recommendation first but I think that this form may or may not you guys can do debate this in your working group serve the purpose for larger projects and not just municipal projects as well so there might already be a template that would be worth looking at and considering so I guess at this point we have a motion to add a working group you're moving to

030I'll make the motion discussion so I think that this sounds like a really good idea in that having a set of sort of talking points about how one might approach the city how we might be able to offer context perhaps in what other pieces might be nearby or experiences is certain kind of media I think there are things that we could offer as sort of advisory experts or if not experts at least advisory so I think that this is a really good idea and will probably not just be informed by the forum that you that we already have in place but might also go the other way to allow us to sort of shape the forms language as well at moving forward that if whatever we might be able to offer a developer in terms

031of context culture working with the city other contacts those kinds of things that we all can share so that whoever gets approached will be able to point them at something or have something but it also seems like it could be fought what we already have so I'm I'm in favor of this proposal to move forward with a group to its one of these options any other discussion do we need the appointment of those John and Mary will this go beyond new development or just development that's being proposed to me and what about existing my path at the moment just new development these two projects and let's try to find something that we can sustain and and be have a benefit to developers but that could be the model going for redevelopment for a whole host

032of things to engage the private business owners property owners but that'll be something we can talk about the group David I can't think of anything that we would recommend that wouldn't also be applicable to an existing business owners that want a dad public I mean that's kind of what I'm hinting towards is it's having something that perhaps I mean started off as this but because that's where I think our success is gonna lie is gonna be in the private sphere public money is it's not even sometimes worth trying to get unfortunately because of of things you know fix the potholes argument every time you ask for a dollar so but the private sphere I think has got lots of money and would be willing to break off a little something okay so I think we're

033at a point now we can move all in favor of adding this working group oh yeah okay all in favor of the working group any opposed great to a point David Issa Joan and copy and Mary thief olds they're probably employers myself second all in favor all right all right you guys are in another working all right now we're on to old business in an old business what is attached here agenda is what was submitted to City Council I don't think it takes any discussion you've already discussed it earlier in the meeting yeah yep that were sent in the February meeting and you discuss it if I may go into reports from staff the general office clerk position aka this summer students who worked on the art inventory the position has been posted the there

034have been first screenings of the candidates so they're now being scheduled in for interviews for the possession so we're moving forward with it the only change from the note it is once telephone screening has been completed it is complete so now they're bringing in candidates um yes yes I don't know if madam chairman whether you want to discuss this as much as me this is the flags on Main Street approached a group wanting to in the approach DDA about on Main Street between Liberty and I believe William putting up flags between light poles it would be parallel to the street and the various students in the school system would be decorating the flags the best way to describe it is akin to prayer flags that you might see in there are flags etc and it

035would be a temporary display so be aware it's it's in your packet the information on it and it is being pursued I don't we're not necessarily looking I don't support emotional support with me welcome well I have a I have a question about this so you know we do have a youth working group that has been thinking about doing some additional programming around youth art month um so I think that there might be some natural fits here for that in terms of perhaps coordination or working with the groups that are here the other part is that in thinking about this you're talking about this being a sort of a set of flags that run parallel do we do anything the city like they do on the University of Michigan campus which is the banners off

036the light poles those are all controlled through the DDA so those are all DDA but and okay and not us do we have access to those I you do through the DDA the the banners are not insignificant and cost oh I know yeah you've probably purchased we have it yes I have actually so you would if you have a desire the group has a desire to put up either either there's the little banner arms on the poles or the full cross street banners those are all controlled through the various merchants association the Main Street Association the State Street Association under the guise of the DDA so would these four would this project then be entirely so under their purview are the light poles ours that they would be hanging from the light poles are ours

037but they would say I thought but they would be permitted through the DDA alright thank you when would they be going up Craig proposed yeah I want to say March whatever the markets this month isn't it yeah they approached us late in the late in their game I again that would be under the permit of DDA for the poles no no and the I'm trying to remember the group they're working with has already modified their certificate of insurance to have this display covered it's not in there I'll get it sent out I'll get it I mean I don't know like it's pretty cold out right now understand they're doing these banners in inside they're making on the sidelines just erecting them there's not a big deal if you want to support it support children's art

038banners all right tell us about our city art gallery it has the original contract has run out on the mayor's art gallery and mayor's office is working to renew the contract and we still have art so just a quick question it's my understand is this that gallery space that we're talking about yes so just for the people who are perhaps watching at home there is a large area in the back of chambers where and yeah excellent yeah you can see it up there where we have a great exhibit right now you know what is there showing it we should probably do this at every meeting is make sure that it gets shown a couple times thank you cameraman madam chair Craig is there going to be an evaluation of what went right over the previous

039contracts and what could be improved I would if you have suggestions for that I would have you refer to the mayor's office they're the ones whose kind of to do one I think you should evaluate it I mean just give them good feedback to I think what was what was just mentioned that you know we could be promoting this at each and every one of our meetings that during the year last year when I was chair I invited a representative the art commission to come to each and every one of our meeting and they always had a conflict with her schedule if there's anyone that really needs to understand what's going on in here it should be us and we would welcome someone coming here and explaining what is this collection about why and to

040promote it and I think that a simple you know email that we shouldn't be the less educated about this particular thing so that would be one recommendation I would suggest going forward so noted I do believe a link to the Ann Arbor Art Center's website which talks about each of these exhibitions and has information about them is on our website so if folks want to find out more about this exhibit you can go there and also common person this room is open to the public and there's a display over here that talks about what's going on here I'm in the back of the room which obviously you can't see from the camera and I'd very much like to ask perhaps even one of the audience members since we are stuck back here - perhaps retrieve

041the name of the artist so that we might mention that this evening that would be great thanks I think it's all so if you could just wire back there audience member if you could jot down the names of the artists that would be fantastic because I think that that kind of a mention yeah is what will also bring more people to sort of see some of the public art that we have in our buildings thank you and I might add Allie if you might pause during your council meetings to reflect on maybe one particular person what's going on so no I was looking tonight in fact ik because you know you can really really so Thank You Allison Franco and Jenelle Smith you should come to more of our meetings actually the whole Jewett memorial

042chair and placard the Fifth Avenue project ran into a labor dispute issue as many of our municipal construction projects did this pass late summer and fall additionally there was a material project material problem on the 5th Avenue project so they were not able to complete the work the comment is the chair is being moved over to 5th as part of that project and the placards as described in our notes will be placed next spring this coming spring this coming spring can't tell you exactly yet because there is no schedule until after the frost laws are off so that construction can start Craig could you explain what did why is there a second placards going for names for donors names and that has been an issue as to size and location yet or unresolved okay any

043other any questions on these things for correct do you want to introduce the connect fan oh wait we can take team on it if you want to start included email to you with this agenda there was a link to the canoe fan art which we don't have a visual to share I am just describing where it is so canoe fan is a sculpture near gallop or at Gallup made of canoes looks like a fan hence the name canoe van by Victoria fuller it was part of the canoe imagined art project which was a city parks project in partnership with the Arts Alliance several years ago they selected I think it's four different artists four or five I want to say five different artists to install works as part of that project they were temporary installations

044that used all the projects except for this one used recycled canoes from if I could correct you there are permanent installations they as part of the heart call they were to be turned over to the city as part of the project this particular artist either did not understand it or chose not to follow that and was wanting the city to purchase yeah well previously too and we have declined because that wasn't the original call for art was not to purchase them they were paying honorariums to the artists each of the artists received a $5,000 or their work and in turn all contracts with artists in the city you basically give up the rights of your work at that time this particular artist did not want to do so but we still wanted to include her

045work with a project and so she was given a special leasing arrangement the lease is up essentially and she I said well I'll leave it here if you guys want to buy it for $45,000 yes and and also understand if we're to buy it when we buy a piece of art we buy all the artists rights with it in that is a been a bone of contention with this artist so yeah she would have to be amenable to the general with the city type of purchase so I'm this is going to go to City Council we we will inform City Council of the status of that piece of art whether you folks wanna weigh in as to whether we want to you folks want to try to raise funds to purchase it the city should

046try to raise funds to purchase it or we let the lease end and if she comes and gets it she comes and gets it so we have an opportunity at this point to make a recommendation that would go forward to the City Council with the information that the artist wants to purchase it the lease ends and I don't remember it's midsummer I can get you the exact date but the ones so we have no reason they have an expectation of having after that she's seeking other buyers for it has the artwork been appraised at forty plus is that how we're arriving at the number she's that's a number that she's putting on us okay a little background I was on the task force I was chair of the art commission at that time and the

047recipient copied on a number of very strong emails that was sent to Craig hooping the fact as I recall Victoria filled up her answering machine one one weekend demanding a number of things so Victoria is not is is a an accepted regional artist from Chicago she has pieces all over the country she she misread this competition and what she was thinking was that she had a piece already designed that she was advertising for $85,000 and and on her website she would enter it in this competition and for the five thousand dollars she read the temporary to me that it was only to be temporarily there and she could retrieve it she didn't read below no the city was only committing to showing it temporarily because we did not know what we were going to get

048for five thousand dollars much to everyone's surprise we got wonderful art for five thousand dollars each far more than what what we could Commission so the city made permanent stands and we now have a collection if I think five Canoe type of artwork this is the only one that is problematic so when she was the top vote getter everyone loved her piece she had a great reputation it was listed on the website for 85,000 she was going to give it to the city for five so we asked Deb Pollock through the art Alliance to double check that this was the case and when she did that Victoria said oh I did not know that so the question becomes then we had picked a sixth one in case Victoria wanted to pull out she said how

049about I do this I come and I install it and for the five thousand dollars and I will let you have it for two years I think it's been a period of two or three years and we've renewed it once and you've renewed it once the idea was all along that this was going to give her exposure to be able to sell it she approached me specifically if I would sort of lead the charge and help find someone to buy it and I said we really don't have the time or the interest to do that she said she has a number of her collectors around I said you should do that then so we're at this particular point then each time it comes up the question is what's going to happen to this artwork well

050originally it was as I said valued at $85,000 it is a very nice piece of art people like the art that I'm not so sure that it is worth the forty five thousand dollars however Victoria my understanding through numerous emails that she was going to find someone locally to lead the charge apparently she has not done that that I said at the time that we would be willing to accept the donation from her and we would show it in this collection that we have she then tried to find a person to buy it and donate it to the city and then there was some discussion of how big the plaque if she found a corporate buyer so it all got mixed into this I think the city did what they agreed to do that Victoria

051misunder in the competition we had the benefit of this for four years but I really don't think it's something that we want to ask the city to lay out money for when the understanding from the very beginning was that she would find she would sell it and then and the buyer would pick it up or she would find a buyer and the seller would donate it that's the back story and that's kind of my take on it great well I really appreciate that that history of the piece it certainly does place the context so my question is you know as the public art Commission what is our recommendation moving forward it does seem as though we should have or take some position and that position could be we would like the city to purchase this

052we would like to have the opportunity potentially to have her or us attempt to find a donor a buyer or that we are very pleased with having had it for the last four years and are so happy that it's going to be taken into someone else's collection and that as long as we have it that will be great so but it does seem to me that we probably should at least start to this conversation about what kind of a recommendation we would make moving forward I agree and I would I'm sorry well I make a motion that we advise the city to let the rental contract run its course and thank Victoria for allowing us to to exhibit it for four years and it's regrettable that she was unable to find a purchaser for it

053as was our understanding and that it will be sorely missed that would be my recommendation I move that yes is there a second all right it's discussion to refine it - and to refine yes John thank you I think based on Deb's kind of three option rule and we have an opportunity to weigh in we'll start with those three perhaps I do think and even kind of in the context of the discussion that was held at City Council the a yes we should weigh in and give a recommendation and also my opinion would be to reflect kind of the current climate I'm saying it's time to maybe have a more fiscally conservative approach towards public art in this particular decision-making process so to say yes thank you very much for having the piece on display

054and we'll offer it back to you and your opportunity to do with it what you will share with somebody else perhaps yes I think I'd even add though that even if we were in a fiscally sound period maybe the artist did totally misconstrue the rules but the other artists didn't so that's kind of confusing I think it would set a bad precedent for us to allow ourselves to let the artists change the rules and then sort of push us up against the wall and force our hand to make it purchase so even if we had the funds and we were flush that I'd feel a little uncomfortable about that I second that yeah I would agree with Colleen that we've appreciated it it's been great let the contract go how it has and thank her

055and return it if I can weigh in we don't return it it's I'm sure it'll fit up that's for her to retrieve she can retrieve it and you know what if the foundation it's on may present an opportunity for another piece to be installed there there's also there's are already a foundation poured there you know I'm not an engineer so I don't can't say for sure but it might be a great place burn used to be installed in the future each of those foundations were unique to the piece being displayed it doesn't mean another piece can't be there it just means that if we were to choose a piece we'd have to be aware of the foundation that's in place yep in one of my many conversations with Victoria she said that it would cost

056her ten thousand dollars to come and disassemble it and take it back I do not think she is going to be in a hurry to come and get that I would I would advise the city not to force her to pick it up not to threaten her but just to let her know that that this is renewing or something and I suspect that she might not come and and get it for several years but I see a look on dad's face well I would I mean we welcome it as long as it's here but there's a contract and if the contract comes up it could be renewed but contracts are contracts so I just wanted to make a couple of comments certainly one is that you know if the artist does choose to you know

057pick up the the piece as was stipulated you know we will certainly do everything in our power to facilitate that and if there is a delay in picking it up we certainly will appreciate having the artwork for a little longer one thing I wanted to respond to was something that Jonah said about and also that's idea of you know we don't want to be backed into something even if we have the money but maybe we should be more fiscally you know conservative right now considering perhaps the political climate and and I certainly think that that is something that we as representatives of the community need to take into account but I do also want to speak just a moment to the the real charge that we have around bringing to our community that aspirational uplifting

058and beautifying public art that we all have been committed to and we'll be committed to in the future so for me I I will support the motion in this particular case but I think that each of us if we really thought that keeping this piece was worth the the conversation with Council I know that each of us would actually take that position and it's just in this case we have benefited it's been a great piece to have and we do wish the artist well as we move into this next phase with this piece so thank you any other discussion around this particular I don't think we amended really what John says so with our discussion any second okay all in favor any opposed great okay reports from workgroups so there are summaries of everyone's work

059groups within your packet this is an opportunity for people in groups you know you can verbally summarize them a few bit length or just assume people rent out I'm sure I'll start okay and I for those of our viewers at home an awful lot of what is online so people could go online and get copies of them as well for those at home that the promotion and public art workgroup which is Allisyn myself and Colleen and we met at cafe verde Colleen had a work conflict that we had discussion and I also work with the historic Street exhibit program and I'm familiar with Don Hammond and Don is a graphic designer that has a unique practice he belongs to the Society of the antal graphic designers these are the designers that do graphic designs for

060theme parks for malls for national parks in in large areas to try and and in fact it's now being folded into place making wayfinding these kinds of things and I I asked Don if he would be open to discussing it with me I discussed it with Allison and and I had an extended discussion with Don and asked for his his input it was eye-opening to me and I've detailed as best I can in this report basically he's suggesting that we first of all should identify our art and we understand that if for no other reason than to brand it as a cultural asset and he's saying once we do that we might want to think about combining it with other cultural assets what makes up the culture of Ann Arbor and these are sustainable projects

061and and he imagines the kind of explanation that would go into a name tag actually just being a portal to an online description that could be as broad and expansive as we would want it to be it would also satisfy a DA of requirements it could be a QR code sticker so that the tag itself would be rather small maybe 2 inch by 4 inch just the name of the piece the date and the title and then a place for a sticker and whether if the the website sends more information about this particular piece and we could put the QR sticker on so to do that he encourages us to expand the notion of public art to include public art and design and to think about it as cultural assets when we do that we

062bring in a lot of other stakeholders that might have an interest in promoting cultural assets that they have a vested interest in so I like his idea and that I he said that he's going to be discussing this with some colleagues of his and to find find out if whether there's any interest in this this isn't going to be kind of a freebie kind of thing and it's not going to be something that's going to be done overnight but it's going to be done well and it's going to be done professionally and it will give us the kind of thing that I think we're hoping for that to be able to present to both residents and visitors the cultural assets that we have here in town and some kind of description about them so I

063was very encouraged by this he did email me saying that he has spoken with some folks he has a colleague that is very excited about this and he would like to meet with me and discuss actually some recommendations of how to move this forward to get from an idea into actual an action point and that may inform our recommendation so I will do that I'll meet with our working group and we'll report out at the next at the next meeting recommendation to you guys and getting your input at that point before there's any plaques or anything going up obviously we have to do the inventory before we have an idea of where everything is and we can identify it but this is sort of just while we're in the kind of waiting period for that

064we're figuring out what makes sense for that those placards and things getting advice on that process any questions for the working group no but I'm in strong support of that John and I think connecting with tourism and connecting people with the assets of our public art is paramount and I would see that as a very should be a very strong focus of ours in this coming 2019-20 yeah one of the things that we talked about in that working group was the option to have media training for all of us and see if that was something people were interested in pursuing or if we should look into that a little bit further media training would just you know give us some talking points as we talk about public art general public art funding and talking about

065our collection so I guess just a show of hands if people would be interested in that type of input what does that mean Media training like if you were talking to the public or media like media PR and talking points like what to talk about the public is that what you're talking about okay gotcha how do address questions well one of the things that was in this report that John just said for word was discussion about the value of asking a public relations representative to address the Art Commission to suggest ways commissioners might engage published criticism or to speak in other ways either to the public or to the media especially as we roll this out so I think that this idea of having some additional media and you know talking points training for the

066Commission it's another way that we can prep that's been recommended here but that I know that Allison thinks that we might be able to get through the city as well hmm as just a show of hands if you'd be interested in getting some and you know Bonita and Craig can help us navigate who within the city would be the best person to talk to us about that [Music] media everyone thinks of social media and so will there be ways to open up channels for social media and for this commission to have an outlet for social media that's incorrect one can only hope mm-hmm the communications unit within the city closely holds the city brand social media I mean I know I am a council official but he's just you know North Korea you know you

067know what do we yeah keeping from the people like maybe through this John those cars might open up doors through that conversation I think I wouldn't be mine - how am i bringing it up you know I think - the reservations or what are the restrictions I think that there are there have been concerns you know as a volunteer commission that we definitely would want to be on the same page with city but I think that you can do that we can figure out ways to do that and still be able to communicate well with the public around our mission and the pieces and collection that we have and I think that that's been a tension in the past but one that I think that we're all interested in addressing I'm in order to be

068able to get better communication out because you know truth be told every two months we're right here on TV live and so being all on the same page is what we all want to do and having ways that we could actually work with social media or the website or any newsletter is something that I think we're all looking to explore and we would really appreciate your help could that be a part of what group well we certainly have the media I think that's like if it's in communications pretty long isn't it yeah I mean and perhaps it's worth revisiting right now you know I think that's a blank function Holly we have I have a Facebook page called Ann Arbor public art it doesn't say anti-republican Art Commission and I Allison and and David and

069David's in you all they all have access to it and post regularly particular thing we you know we have followers on that particular phase we were told by the attorney's office it cannot be the official City Facebook page for the public art Commission so we just took commission off of it and said this is not official and we continue to do exactly what we were doing before we had Commission and we said it was official so in effect we are spreading the word in social media it's not as focused it may not be as organized that I myself am able to do it sometimes more than others I would like it to be embraced and and produced by the city and not rely on volunteer so that's one key issue we started this meeting tonight

070on misinformation miscommunication you know and find out what is really possible things have changed a lot I mean I'll meet with him tomorrow in fact and if I have time and bring up the conversation but he knows it's an evolving world and I just don't see how this this Commission expected to do its job with that part without the latitude for that just I don't know what we're protecting well one of the things that's come up in several different working groups is the people want to have an ease newsletter or have a way of communicating and so Vanita just shared with Deb and I Robert Kelly's contact information and so we're gonna meet with him to talk about newsletters see where there's an opportunity for us to share information so we're starting to get those

071conversations rolling again good appreciate your support helping that I want to it reiterate that we appreciate your support in helping that and so you know whatever you can do to have those conversations as well with others would be great I also wanted to say that you know in other contexts that I've worked in where there have been you know large public organizations even just something as simple as having only a couple of people or a single person if we can work at that spokesperson through those channels so that you create that connection but you also know that you're not having to distribute the message over and over across a large board but through a spokesperson such as the chair who can actually communicate on behalf of the public Commission in a way that that the

072city can feel good about and be proud great I think we can move on to another working group the next one on the list is the CIP group sure David I saw a report for Connie and Colleen thank you for your input as we talked about earlier in the meeting the main thing was that our new recommendations went to City Council and were approved there's also in your packet a new kind of summary document some of the council we had only submitted the new items because the other ones were approved so they seemed like old news but some of the council wanted to see a summary document so they need to put that together and I added some notes about some you know how some of those had evolved in the CIP over time it

073looks like craigger Vanita has made one edit to that at least that I noticed which is item number seven the an arbor station construction I would swear Deb Gosselin's told me that all the train stations dropped out of the CIP but I guess this one just got moved to a different number in a totally different section and pushed way off to the end of the CIP term so it's a long ways off yeah but it is still officially a project it would be interesting to see I mean it's the same it's not the same number but whether the council's previous approval under the old number would still apply to the new number in the new location but I don't know about that we can maybe we want to try to remember to throw that in

074for yeah I would I mean I would suggest it's far enough off that there's no urgency yet there's no urgency or you know I don't know if you want to expend political capital on could be pushed off again next year it's it's it's it's short supply for this commission so yeah it's spending that political capital train station is what train station I think we should take yeah exactly there you go that's that's that's the better question um so those of you looking at the it's if you look at it on your computer or if you print in color the notes are in red so it's really obvious where there's updates to different items thank you for doing that to add to this Vinita has made us a spreadsheet an Excel spreadsheet that has it's starting

075to track these projects so we know when they become a project and when there's a manager assigned to it and stuff so there's more back and forth between the Commission which will be presented to the Commission so we have a better idea of where things are or her project drops off the list for some reason great yeah exciting we're honing that thank you guys fundraising group who wants to speak on our behalf I'm not the chair of any working group our fundraising group met and we we discussed just briefly what we are wanted to focus on we're looking into methods or the process of accepting donations there isn't currently one at the city so that we talked about different grant opportunities and exploring those we talked briefly about the Victoria piece as an opportunity there's

076a walkway near the river that's an opportunity that that project I think was identified within the CIP before we had our system in place so it was not identified for enhancement and likely if we move forward it would be a piece of art that would be added after the project but so that's one the ones were exploring potentially trying to get either a grant or grant with matching funds private donations something like that so lots of fun stuff we're talking about in that group anything else you guys think it's important for the group to know at this point Commission there's a lot of work that goes into that but I think it would be helpful for us there's a lot of money within the state of Michigan the National Endowment for the Arts Michigan Council

077for arts and cultural affairs and it would be silly for us not to attempt at some of these projects and just you know doing one or two things really well and starting to explore the ability to have private donations partnering with different entities outside of government Mary do you think there's opportunity to partner with someone who's maybe got that grant writing in their portfolio another arts group that would be with the city to do something like that to get grant money that's possible and if you've ever if you're setting the time like you'd mentioned with the ad and the is a tricky one I know to solve once you once you flesh out who we are what we're doing the motives behind the possible project I mean really you've got that information down and it

078can be kind of cut and pasted into a number of different opportunities which kind of led us to start backing up a little bit and think about a strategic plan for the Art Commission and think about a three-year five-year kind of possible outcome of what we are looking at and heading into especially with a lot of the new ideas on the table as a new commissioner there's a lot of information to kind of unpack from previous years and I think if we are going to move forward I think it's important that we have a clear vision and fundraising is definitely something that is attainable and viable and we're and we're looking at the Michigan Council for arts and cultural affairs as a potential place to apply because cities can apply for grants there and several

079of us have experience writing grants so we thought we'd get that experience share it at this point because we are part of the and we think that sharing that experience with city staff could potentially invigorate them for doing so in the future I don't think we're suggesting that this commission would always have that since we do right now that you could initiate something that would exactly make it a little more robust sounds grand and I'm like Mary said a lot of the pieces that go into grant writing our pieces that can be used again and again in different proposals and so making those foundational documents will be really important moving forward for the potential to there's a lot of there's a lot of new exciting things that we're talking about I mean we're talking about

080a possible app or wayfinding around you know how to how to find what assets we have that already exists we're talking about engaging young people and their ideas you know there's ways that we could kind of fold these ideas together and write a grant that stimulates that idea you know and and then brings that to the table I well I emailed Craig I mean I think that's a different one that I emailed you about those are very different I mean they're very similar as far as their pathways that go underneath the railroad was it the tunnel yeah there's two tunnels one is slated to go into construction this year I think I emailed you about recently is the one one further out well that's more nor bandanaira yeah that one's further out right they're not

081funding so is that one in the CIP well no they're both in a bullion well the one happening this year would not because it's expected to be completed before the CIP kicks in in July the banding but one should but we discussed I discussed it with their Goslin in a year or two ago yeah and it was it's something that's desperately crying out for art this is basically a concrete tunnel under the railroad tracks to reduce the floodplain and allow pedestrian access but it was entirely federal funding as I recall so it's not legally not allowed to fund public art it's so there's no potential funding yeah no it is you're correct it is either state or federal funding through yeah so it's something that would really need a donation the main fire is for

082two and art to it because we don't have any other mechanisms if I may suggest the river site of that tunnel would be out letting on the DTE project mm-hmm and that might be a developer donation Upjohn's yeah we have discussion that we just had if there's several different developers that are that you had mentioned that are not only stakeholders within that project but have also already had some financial implications with that project so it would be potential avenues for matching funds the space is really tight on the city side of the tunnel any space would be on the river side we don't put our didn't we'll just get really appreciate you bringing up the idea of DTE potentially being a donor for something like that it was just kind of a segue into what

083I was gonna ask is that we as a group did brainstorm about potential donors and grants they came up in our discussion and I would just ask the other members of this commission if you or anybody out that you know has an idea for somebody who might be a good donor please share that and hopefully we can come up with some good ideas together so and I use DTE in the very broad sense because I I don't know which unit arm corporate reincarnation that DT is doing this as already youth outreach and interaction group okay our group meant a number of times over the last couple of months and I'm gonna key in first here on a word that Mary said and that was strategic so we've done a lot of planning we're putting a

084lot of things together as a commission we've got our working groups and we've been looking at a variety of ways to achieve what the goals are for this working group and I'm just gonna read them to you briefly so everybody remembers creating mutual learning experience and a point of view Understanding between youth and general citizens three citizen used to Arts in the public arena and so our goal was to involve youth in the Commission by participating by helping work on projects and things that are going on and also to showcase what the youth are doing to and help them discover what's around an arbor so we've discussed a number of ideas that might invigorate and invite youth into we started with the questionnaire that Mary took to the neutral zone teens and talked to them

085about it and I think Joan might have gone another time and discussed stuff too so again it's trying to pull youth into it early to find out what kinds of things they're interested in and what having a voice in art means to them so we don't have any project recommendation ship because we wanted to go back to what is the strategy really where do we want this to end up and where do we want things to go as you know there's a youth art month going on right now and it would be great for the art condition if this is something that happens on a yearly basis to help flesh that out and be a part of it that there's a greater participation between things that are already going on in the community that we

086can attach to and they can attach to us to make it a more robust program so that's where we are donation and art placement yes that's Alison and myself that I want to be clear this is about donating artwork so it grew out of a friend of mine Jim Palace was moving from Michigan to Portland and he's a major Michigan artist he had three pieces that he didn't want to move so he said could you help me you know I'd love to have him in Ann Arbor so I I helped him find locations they were free that the organization's gave him a $500 honorarium but pretty much the artwork was you know well over $20,000 and and so it it made me think that there are other artists he was older than me probably in

087his mid to late 70s and he did not want to burden his kids with having to dispose of all this work and pay taxes on it because then would go on market value but he could donate them and get it in a collection and for artists they love to have they do at a certain point you want your work in a collection you know I mean the Museum of Modern Art in New York have a long list of people that just would donate freely so we have a particular demographic in a location that I think is attractive to artists if we can find the right location and find the particular artists we might be able to get some good works of art major works of our donated for nothing so that's what this working group

088was going to explore my first step was to talk with Mary Ann wilkinson she's a friend and she was the curator of Contemporary Art at the DIA for about 20 years and she moved here to Ann Arbor and was the curator of Contemporary Art contemporary art our living artists so these are the artists she knows who are who's making our right now in Michigan probably better than anyone else she she's now the executive director the Scarab Club which is in Detroit I have missed connecting with her she was out sick and then she was on vacation but I still expect to make a contact with her to explore whether this concept actually could work and how to start it she would know the artists that might be opened to some kind of a donation this

089we already have forms on the website and Allyson alluded to them that came about as a result of this giraffe donation that we wanted to be able to present it in a way that first of all wasn't just one person's taste that it actually was adding to a collection so the website tried to tease out who's the artist are they important and where do you want this artwork to happen do you have any stakeholders that's what that forum is it's it's mislabeled actually and on the report you can see from the website says get involved support local art projects with a donation I read that to mean cash donation but that's not what the forum is about the forum is about a piece of artwork that you as an artist or you that own the

090artwork want to donate it like like Victoria's fan to the city so Allison and I are going to continue to meet I still haven't connected with Marianne and I'm going to expand it to maybe talk to the director of the museum local museum to see whether this concept that we have can we actually attract some artists to be able to donate their artwork is is worth pursuing but we have a donation form if anybody wants to use it the other form that's on there is also sort of there it asks questions specifically to get to the point of the type of work that we would like to be donated John mentioned it asks are there stakeholders are there other people within the community who have support of this piece being in the communities collection and

091it also talks to the fact that if it is a sculpture and needs to have a foundation or there's installation fees that you know the donation would have to come with those costs already come up with them so a lot of those questions Oh kind of are educational in the process of donation and intentional in that way it says that you should think about maintenance and you have to have in your application you have to talk about maintenance and how much that would cost it doesn't specifically say you need to give us that money for ongoing maintenance but you do need to give a outline of what would be required in that plan and who pays for the maintenance I mean this is what is the maintenance and who are you imagining paying for it

092well once it becomes a part our collection then we would be taking on those responsibilities so that's something that we have to consider unless the donor puts in some money to pay for the maintenance I mean it's certainly possible that maintenance could be part of that donation donation but I think that's part of the reason that you approve or accept gifts into your collection is that you are taking on that maintenance whatever it might be and so I think that having you know I was just thinking about our agenda moving forward even having a place on the agenda where we would be looking to ask the city to accept such a donation in the future would also be something that would routinize and get people thinking about this donation process and again this proposal was

093specifically for one particular request that we are using it or could use it right now that Alice and I are exploring a a strategy to do this and how would we move into that strategy while we're talking about the forms there is one other form and it is called the public art proposal form and it is really kind of mislabeled and if you could pass that to Craig that's my take on what would really sort of it says to help organize neighborhood art projects volunteer to serve on an APEC subcommittee or offer suggestions for public art themes and locations that's not exactly what this was about this was about a fellow that wanted to paint a piece on a handrail for a bridge and so he came with the idea wouldn't it be neat and

094so we wanted some kind systematic way of processing these kinds of proposals for art that is to be situated on or in a public space so what this is that him pains honor I cause the public our proposals we had before us when we had money to spend this is okay this is basically saying what is your art project what do you want to do what's the budget who's going to pay for it all of these kinds of issues that would come about that it basically says that we're in the preamble the public art Commission is advisory body with a goal to improve yada yada yada we are not a source of funding any proposed projects should address the plan to fund it we can provide visibility yada yada along with this we have always

095liked the donation want to know do you have stakeholder interest and have you reached into the community is anyone other than you and your mother like this idea so we want to bring we want to get artists to think about that that if they do have a project or proposal or a donation we would like them to think about coming together and bringing partners and and stakeholders with it that's what this public art proposal was about it was to address one idea that came about it could be used for the projection of the lasers on the building it would be the same kind of thing if we have somebody that wants to do something in the city create work install work and they have a great idea we end up getting that idea and so

096this proposal this blank form was a way of collecting that information so we can review it and and and touch on things that are makes sense so I've I haven't reviewed this with Allison so maybe I should but suggested different wordings of the website donation of artwork if you are an artist or owned a work of art that you would like to donate to the city of Ann Arbor for inclusion in our public art collection please complete this online form and a story proposal for art if you would like to create an art project that uses city of Ann Arbor property you will need to submit this online form your project will be reviewed by staff submitted to the art of public art Commission for feedback and you will be notified of a request for

097changes and/or approval and so that's that identifies what those forms are change forms whatever but I just wanted to mention that are you suggesting then that you guys are gonna rework the forms to be more accurate I think we like the forms we just do not like the description on the website so I do think that the to clear differences in the forms are important but I actually when you had spoken about how you know artists will need to think about stakeholders or need to think about some of the issues in this installation and of course somebody who's donating may have other things that they want to think about there are two things that strike me there is a third group that we could probably engage that is you and your mother who have identified

098a place that they think public art would be good or the kind of public art that might be interesting to them they went to another city they saw a piece and they were interested if we could have something like that this is the kind of access point where you place a very low bar on somebody's suggestion but if that bar were such that it would trigger a conversation with someone on the Commission or start a list that we could also then say we've heard that people are interested in this area is this are there more people that might be interested in this kind of piece so I think that there's an even more accessible public forum that could be in places we won't get a ton of suggestions here but having something where the public

099can just have an interest in that wall or this artist or that area the other thing is is that a lot of times when I have an application like this I also always offer the option of a pre-application conversation with a commissioner and where you can say prior to submitting it because what do you mean by some of these things or gosh do I really have to think of every bit of installation because that's not what I do and so being able to connect them to resources or to other things to think about or to even get us thinking about it on our end I think would be a good thing as well so if we could offer some kind of pre application or preformed conversation I think that would also be helpful framing it

100as a way of you know if you want to have a pre that's a little more dynamic you know and it sort of rolled on well and you get more information because they may not know the questions to ask - so if you can help talk them through what's involved I think they have a different understanding a better understanding right so I may have that rephrased as well on the form email you that information yes that's all I have Oh madam chair I think that's the last thing on our agenda right we have a presentation meeting Oh Jonah I was constrained yeah there's usually an anything else you want to talk about regarding the youth arts be it youth outreach and interaction several people did mention the youth art month youth art month which is

101March and just even for the benefit of a young man in our public audience today some of the some of the workshops that are going on at the Ann Arbor Library caught my attention there's button making improv music tools workshop letterpress all kinds of stuff and I'm gonna try to make an effort to attend at least some of those to either engage with the folks that are facilitating those workshops or potentially some of the young people that are participating in them as well to kind of get some input from them so was it David Ian sorry you know if you know if you have input for example on ways that you think young people should be more able to get involved in public art or things like that there's actually a visual arts collective that

102meets on Wednesday next week at the neutral zone and so that was where we kind of started the conversation about some of these other potential either events or programming that would be able to highlight youth arts voices as well so there were some smaller projects that you know kind of fell through but some bigger ones on the horizon I think for the future as well so just want to let people know about those and hopefully get excited about them cool thanks anyone else have things they want to share well we have our listening ears and the public No all right well now I will say meeting adjourned you