001[Music] welcome to meet the court I'm your host Joe Johnson lead the court is brought to you as a public service by the Superior Court in Atlantic and Cape May counties as well as the Cape May Technical High School to better inform you the public of the workings of a court and the role of the judiciary in our communities today's show will begin a series of discussions about careers in the judiciary the judiciary employs over 9,000 staff members who make ready over a million cases throughout the state each year we will be dedicating several shows to the discussion of the benefits and challenges of a career with the judiciary here to start our conversation our panel of guests all court executives in the Atlantic County Superior Court Shire bland assistant chief probation officer Chris Koos
002assistant Civil Division manager and melissa magee assistant criminal division manager welcome to our program alright so let's get started tell me about your backgrounds where are you from I'm gonna go in order so sure we'll start with you tell me about your background well I'm from Camden County and before I came to the judiciary actually was the executive director of a non-profit cost of Camden County we advocated for abused and neglected children so I did that for actually ten years before coming through the judiciary oh wow so you came straight from the nonprofit to the judiciary yes in Florida and somebody told me about a clerkship opportunity so I actually started with the judiciary as a clerk in the Mercer County Superior Court I then worked a couple years for a private attorney and actually
003missed working in the court system I really enjoyed my time there so I came back as a team leader I spent some time in civil and criminal and now as you noted before I'm the assistant division manager in the Civil Division I started off in law enforcement when I was quite young about 19 years old was there for a couple of years decided to finish my degree got interested in some of the other careers in criminal justice found my way to the judiciary I have been with the judiciary now for him in my 15th year started off as a probation officer then became a team leader then assistant chief of probation in Cape May County and then now assistant Criminal Division manager in Atlantic County so how long have you been in your role as
004the assistant Criminal Division manager I have only been in my current role for approximately nine months oh wow so everything is new to you there in criminal but you bring a wide swath of experience it sounds like to that position yes yeah I started off with I was in child support child support enforcement so that has a lot of dealings with Family Division so learned a lot about family there and then learned a lot about family also in supervision as well because of juvenile and then moved on from there to crime familiar with the Family Division because when I'm not hosting the show I work as the assistant Family Division manager and so we interacted a lot within that role Chris how about you how long have you been in your role so I've been
005the assistant here in Atlantic County for two years total with the judiciary I have eight years experience now oh wow so you came back from practicing in the private sector and came back to the judiciary and you've been with judiciary for eight years so that must mean that the judiciary comparatively it's is pretty much equal and could be even a little bit better well actually I think the judiciary is much better there's a whole host of reasons why I think we'll get into a little bit later yeah we're going to dig into those how about you sure how long have you been in your role in my current role for a year before this I actually worked in Burlington County so I was a team leader with adult supervision and then before that you know
006but I've been with the judiciary for a total of five and a half years now have you been in probation the entire time the entire time probation Wow so you really have adopted to the role of probation very well from your start with the judiciary yes I think when I work in a non-profit we were actually housed in the court system so I worked a lot with family and also with probation a lot so Shara what made you come to the judiciary well the judiciary is a lot more stable than a non-profit when you work at a non-profit you hold a lot of hats so at a non-profit I was the IT person I was HR I was operations I was everything and while they give you a lot of vacation time they don't give
007you a lot of money they're also sometimes your health insurance and different things are a little bit sketchy so coming through the judiciary especially at that time the Ameri having a very young child it's more for stability well Chris you're within your journey what made you come to the judiciary well originally it was for the experience so in law school a lot of people try to get a clerkship it's a great way from the inside out to learn the law and then when I had gone private I really enjoyed the time but I kind of missed just the feel of a family that judiciary kind of has yeah it gives everyone feel so I you know kept my eye open while I was working and eventually a position did a you know open up and
008I was lucky enough to get it all right Melissa what made you come to the judiciary I was a spec to begin with but really I wanted to have more involvement with the courts I did have some involvement in my former role but was interested very much in the courts and now that I have been with the courts for many years I know what each of the divisions how you know everything runs and just you know the interaction between actually all of us I mean you would think that criminal and family are you know maybe worlds apart but not necessarily we work with one another almost every day and the work that we do with our stakeholders it's just it's it's a great position to have so being in the position that you have requires
009I'm sure education can you tell us about your educational background and how it prepared you to work with the court yes I did I got my associates degree from Ocean County College and then like I said I I did take a little bit of a break because I went into law enforcement went through the police academy and worked there for a couple years and then I wanted to continue my education and that's what had led me to the courts and a lot of things about your education do prepare you for this job you know public speaking you know business courses really anything and everything that you learn specific to writing everything in literature it's it's it's all relevant Chris you're a lawyer you went to law school tell us about how your education prepared you
010for a role in the judiciary I think law school was a great segue into this career I was able to learn you know a lot about a background of you know different things like contracts and how they work in the Civil Division we handle a lot of contracts we do small claims in special civil part small claims matters people are very familiar with because they watch you know People's Court on TV but at the end of the day a lot of those issues especially landlord-tenant come down to contracts and I you know just learned a lot in law school about you know the actual elements of those and it gave me a great background that really comes up almost every day sharra me about a minute but tell me about your your educational background and
011how that prepared you for where we are I went to st. Joe's and got a master's degree in criminology so I would probably say the best thing that prepared me was an internship because I did an internship with Polk defender's office and with being an investigator so that really prepared me to work with the court system this is meet the court I'm your host Joe Johnson we'll be back with our guests after this message you welcome back to meet the court I'm your host Joe Johnson we're discussing careers in the judiciary with our guests Shara bland Christopher coos and melissa magee so Shara how was the work with the court enhanced your career and I think it definitely enhanced my career because it actually gave me an opportunity to work with a variety of different
012people so not only do I work with people from the core but also different stakeholders different organizations community groups so it really actually gave me a chance to really network with different people and to kind of expand that network and to meet a ride different people in various jobs and also just to learn about a variety of other just organizations and clubs and everything Chris you switched careers no longer able to practice law while working with the court so how has the work of the court enhanced your career you know surprisingly I think a lot of people kind of take the feel that oh you're out of the law so you're probably not you know handling or up-to-date on things but it's actually the opposite working here we're able to review all of the cases
013that come out and routinely working with the judges to make decisions on cases that are currently pending so it's really given me a whole nother aspect of being part of the law and I've really enjoyed it and I think it's enhanced as my knowledge and the ability to continually learn has been a fantastic opportunity Melissa you've been in a variety of different divisions within the Superior Court how would you say that the work of the court has enhanced your career I have had the extraordinary opportunity of working in all three of the courthouses and the vicinage starting in Atlantic then Cape May and then Naomi's Landing and each and every single move has improved my knowledge enhanced my relationships with stakeholders and also internal you know customers but it's great because you get to learn
014different ideas from all different people so one thing that maybe we did in Cape May for example now we can implement something that's similar in Mays Landing that helps benefit us there so you've been to all three courthouses you've seen a lot of the culture within the vicinage itself and just so our guests know a vicinage is the general area that captures Atlantic and Cape May County together as one it's vicinage one in the Superior Court so you've been through that you've seen a bunch of different things what would you say the culture of the judiciary is like based on your experience the culture that I have seen in all three courthouses everyone who works for the judiciary and everyone who works with the judiciary is very hardworking and very dedicated and truly care about
015the courts and the community so I can say that that's my experience with the culture that everyone is you know just really passionate about their positions and the work that they do Chris you come to us from a different vicinage you were in Mercer County before you came to Atlantic how do you think that the culture in the judiciary is based on your experience in those two places you know I think it's a lot alike I really believe that everybody that works in the judiciary has taken that path because they want to you know help others and they enjoy the public side of working and for me it's really was seamless kind of coming from Mercer to Atlantic counties in that we do a lot of the things the same way and at the end
016of the day we're always making sure you know that we understand a lot of the people that come through that door are not happy to be there and we do everything we can to make it as pleasant as an experience as it can be so sure are similar to Chris you've worked in multiple villages please tell us same question how does the culture navigate in the judiciary's for me two different worlds because actually working in a Burlington it's just one it's one County so working in now here in Atlantic and Cape May and then while we are actually three courthouses for me and probation I'm going back and forth between Mays Landing and Atlantic City but the one thing that I have seen as far as the judiciary is it seems like we're all one
017big family so it doesn't matter if I'm in Burlington Atlantic Cape May someone from Camden it really doesn't matter I can always kind of reach out to my counterpart and if I have any questions or we're just kind of just kind of just bouncing off questions or we have issues that there's always somebody there that can kind of that's there to lend a hand there to assist and help absolutely yeah I think that that's a really good feature of the judiciary and a good place of good working environment for anybody that is in management and you know even at the entry level so how does that compare to some of the other jobs that you've held in your past so the other jobs in my past I didn't kind of have that Network we were
018all kind of in our own little silos because it is that when you come from or you run you're in the nonprofit world a lot of times we are all fighting for funding so we're all not kind of one big happy family we are all kind of competitors because we're all competing for the same amount of money so it is a very different didn't always have a person that I could kind of reach out to to say bounce off ideas or have questions so that in and of itself is very different and then also it is that you're also kind of more in like a silo because you're by yourself whereas the judiciary as you said there's like 9,000 people so you kind of can reach out and you have like 9,000 little arms you
019can reach out to so it sounds like a much more relaxing environment much more relaxing and then also just like I said it's more of I know that I can come to work every day I'm gonna work from 8:30 to 4:30 or maybe a little bit after when I worked in before this in Casas I would probably get up be at work at 8 o'clock I will leave at 5 go pick up my son drop him off and then I'm back at work so I would probably work sometimes until like 8 9 o'clock at night Chris how does that experience compare with yours when you're comparing the judiciary to other jobs that you've held well I can definitely relate to the hours part as you can imagine as a private attorney we had a lot
020our days were a lot longer I was actually working up in Parsippany New Jersey and I live in Toms River so I had about a three to four hour a day commute and then it was typical to work about a 12-hour workday so I wasn't home much but I agree with you know also which I ever said about just you know when you're at the Judiciary you you kind of know your role and you know what you're going to be doing each day because we're at the endgame so when people come to us you know the matters have already been filed but privately when I was working as a private attorney you know you're actually from start to finish so you meet these customers from you know the first time they come in and explain
021their issues so you have a lot of there's a lot of difference but at the end of the day I was still in the law so we were still filing complaints and and I've enjoyed both listen we have a minute how about the judiciary's out the jobs you've held before the judiciary I did a lot of shift work so that's a very big difference from you know the typically Monday through Friday 8:30 to 4:30 I would have to work you know Midnight's sometimes work you know multiple days in a row without having any days off so that is definitely a large difference from that to where I am presently this is meet the court and I'm your host Joe Johnson we'll be back with our guests Shara Chris and Melissa after this message you do
022welcome back to meet the court I'm your host Oh Johnson we're discussing judiciary careers with our guests shiro bland christopher coos and melissa magee so we were talking about the work Melissa and we were talking about your comparative experience two other jobs you have what's the most rewarding part of the work that you do there's a lot of rewarding components to the work that we do one I can say is definitely developing staff so seeing people come in the door seeing the potential in those people watching them grow and then watching them get promoted is very rewarding it's also extremely rewarding to see your stats improve so when you see where you are you get a plan you work with the staff everybody comes together you make improvements and you watch it improve and it's
023just it's that's something that's really exciting for me too Chris what rewards you you know I'm in charge of the mediation program for small claims in special civil part so each year we get new law clerks in and we teach them how to mediate cases and try to assist others in resolving their issues and I really do enjoy watching you know the mediators come in and in the beginning obviously they're there they're an unexperienced and they're you know starting to do this process and they're a little worried about how it's all gonna unfold and then by the end of the year you know they're really helping the public they're taking these issues that people are bringing in they're meeting with them speaking with them and by the end of the day you know we're settling
02490% of these cases and for me that's just rewarding because these are real people in the world you know and especially in our counties here that had an issue that needed somebody to step in and help and were able to do that sharra what's been rewarding about your work provision and so the most rewarding is seeing when our youth come in and then that they actually get off a probation and then when I don't see them come back that's probably the most rewarding and kind of seeing that they have changed they've grown some of them come in and they're like yeah I don't want to be here I don't know why that I'm here but in the end kind of when they're working with my probation officers they're kind of you could see kind of
025a change and you can kind of see that they have changed and we're hoping that they don't come back and when I don't see them come back so what improvements our changes have you seen that have made you most excited in your role as chief assistant Chief Probation well for me in probation right now it's exciting time because we are doing a whole big shift so the whole kind of philosophy of probation is changing we're going back to being more instead of being kind of forced or kind of like law enforcement we're kind of adding kind of a little bit of a Social Work aspect to it so that has been very rewarding because it is it's a total shift for us so it's a total shift of policies procedures forms and the most rewarding
026is I've been able to be a part of that Chris is there anything exciting and civil that makes you you know feel alive but it is a little exciting that we are catching up with the rest of the world we've moved to an E Court system so our forms especially in the law division now are available to the public you can see what's going on in the courthouse the cases are all online and it's open to everybody so it's just it's nice to finally you know become part of the 21st century that makes me feel alive Melissa how about you and criminal you've been there for nine months but how about you what is exciting that has been coming to criminal and actually it's very exciting and criminal as well we work very closely in
027probation and criminal with drug court which we call recovery court in our vicente j-- the growth that we've had the amount of lives that we've helped to see are we have a jobs program to see that expand to see the innovation with that to see how we're expanding even further to see how many folks were employed when they came in the door versus how many are employed presently and how many more will be employed by time they complete the program so you talked about growth that means you're probably gonna need new folks so what's your advice for potential job seekers I would say definitely you know say looking on the judiciary website we are changing staff constantly there's a lot of folks that are being promoted there's a lot of folks that are retiring and
028we are constantly filling positions so definitely keep an eye on the website and also on you know some of the civil service type websites - Chris any suggestions for new job seekers you know to pick you back right on that last point I think a lot of people don't understand that especially for the entry-level jobs here is that you have to go through the civil service test so I would just tell people they really should keep an eye on civil service see when those tests are available because you have to take that step before you can get hired and unfortunately I think there's a lot of people out there that don't realize that and then they'll look at a job and think it looks fantastic but unfortunately they don't have the requirements I think when
029I apply for the judiciary I applied probably to a hundred different jobs here never give up keep pushing and keep trying that if you don't first get an interview the first time just keep applying because you know right now on the market and trying to find a job is kind of hard so you really have to kind of make yourself kind of unique kind of put little things in your resume to kind of make you stand out and just keep pushing all right so they took your excellent advice and they got the job so what advice do you have for them as new court employees pay attention make sure that they're listening and make sure that they brush up on their writing skills I know a lot of people might not think this but when
030you're in the judiciary we do a lot of writing a lot of reports a lot of just just a lot of writing for me and probation they do a lot of violations of probation petitions different things like that and so to make sure that they are doing that and then also always remember that they're probably the most constant thing is change that what you start in doing might be what you it might not be what you end up doing Chris without the advice I would say you know take the opportunity to learn there's so many jobs where you're doing something very specific here but you're part of a bigger picture and I think the more that you take the time to learn you know what you do and how that moves to the next level
031really will give you an understanding of how the whole system works and then when you're looking to you know be promoted and look for a promotion you'll just have that little edge because you're going to know what that next step does Melissa I would say very similar to what Shiro and Chris said but definitely work hard you know listen to the mentorship of your supervisors your managers try to take in as much as you possibly can everything and anything is relevant so if you see a training in another you know about another division try to learn about that if you want to learn something about even anything in your division that's a little bit different definitely take the opportunity to do that if you can we are just about out of time I'd like to
032thank our guests for joining us today on meet the court and I'd like to thank you our audience for tuning in this is Joe Johnson [Music] [Applause] [Music] [Applause] you [Music]