001All right. Good evening. Welcome to our first selectman special meeting. I'd like to call it to order. So, we're here tonight to discuss the House Bill 7067, the assessment of motor vehicles for property taxation for a couple reasons. Um, there's been a lot of news about this about this uh potential tax break that we could take as a town. Um, and there's been a lot of discussion. I think it's worth talking directly to our assessor in town. I want I want to have them walk through some of the numbers and kind of answer any questions that you may have. I'm sure there's people out there that are watching as well that want to understand how it affects them. Um and then we can kind of have a very lively discussion about the pros and cons
002and how it would affect the town in what way. So um let's get started. Uh Richie, you want to come up? Hopefully. Yeah, absolutely. Just talk loud enough for the people that are trying to hear at home. So if you can voice so partly deaf probably that's why. All right. How you guys doing today? Very good. How are you? Very good. All right. Well, I guess uh yeah, this um uh the new legislation that just passed I think on the uh March 12th basically gave the town the option to um change um the depreciation schedule for which we're going to be for which we priced our motor vehicles, you know, for assessments this year. Um, basically just to give you a little rundown, um, you know, historically we we've always priced the, uh, the Warner
003vehicles off of NADA, clean retail value, you know, every year. So there's people always saw a little bit of a, um, you know, a little bit of a depreciation, a little decrease in their motor vehicle tax bill from year to year, especially after 2001 when the state capped the mill rate out at uh, 3246 mills. Okay. So, we've been we've been holding at that mill right there for the last two grandless shares, we'll say. So, um motor vehicle values do generally depreciate. So, your tax boat will go down a little bit per year. What happened obviously is remember in the pandemic years was the um you know the with the shortage of uh new cars on the lots there all the used cars you know the value skyrocketed they went up pretty high so because
004there was more of a demand for them. So what happened with that was uh people got their tax bills and they were higher than last year and you know people so we had to really try to do a lot of public service to try to tell them hey guys it's uh really supply and demand you know we don't have control of it it's something that's an economic kind of thing it's going on. So that's when the state started to um try to reform you know the way we did you know motor vehicle valuations you know we'll say and that's the way they just passed it this year um going for the October 1st 2024 grand list a different way to value the motor vehicles. So initially what they do is basically they're saying all right
005instead of um pricing 70% of clean retail value like we we've always historically done uh the difference now is um they're just we're just taking MSRP value and they basically came up with a straight line depreciation schedule to depreciate them from you know so in other words uh like uh for like a first year would be the first year start at 85%. That includes any 2004 model vehicles, 2005 and I'm sorry 2024, 2025, 2006 model vehicles. Okay. So, so they would be depreciated at you know 85%. So, you know it' be 85% of their value and then we apply the assessment ratio of 70%. And that would be you know their assessed value that we would tax upon you know. So basically you start there, year two would be 80%, year three 75%. It goes
006down every 5%. Down to about the uh 15th year, you know, 2010 models and older they're going to bottom out at 15%. You know, so basically that's how the motor vehicle were valued for this grand list right now using that depreciation schedule. And that's what that's what the legislation has passed for October 1, 2024. So basically that's was our grand list. Now this straight line depreciation has some advantages to it. It's very simple to you know try to comprehend. I actually um we have a uh would be possible to put up the uh depreciation depreciation schedule that I sent in the email. This one that one's fine. Yeah. Good. So basically if you if you look at this spreadsheet here you can see how like the motor vehicles were kind of like you know if
007your car was you know 2015 you know basically we're going to take the um clean retail value which would be maybe you know was $20,000 and 45% you know we're going to do bring it you know down that much and then by the ratio that's kind of how you'll fall with your assessment this year you know and in general I'm seeing a lot of the assessments did go you know, from last year, you know, from the fle retail methodology of it. So, it was kind of like, you know, is it definitely took the advantage to the um taxpayer, you know, at that depreciation schedule. Only problem was was the our grandless took about a $14 million nose dive on the, you know, because of that, you know, depreciation schedule that was set. So, you know,
008the cards were down a lot. Our real estate, um, you know, we went up because I think God for, um, you know, the brain replace kind of thing. So we were able to gain some revenue on that for on the real estate end of it. But you know our grand did not go up as much as you know you would think it would go up because this motor vehicle situation that they you know that we had to do. So basically a lot of the towns most of the towns out there had this had anywhere from 15 to 20% you know decrease in the ground. So we had about 14% on ours compared to last year. And um let's see. I think I did the math real quick today and I said it looks like uh
009we you know we're talking about 477,62 in potential motor vehicle um you know revenue loss because of the you know new statute to kind of be put through on this. Are you on page two? Yeah. Sorry. Yeah. So basically, you know, it was it was a definitely a um some revenue loss with the way they were they were being valued, you know, on that. So, you know, like I said, the uh the mill rate, you know, right now proposed is proposing to be about 35.79 mills, you know, with the grand list as it is right now. So, basically, that's the impact that that um the legislation gave our town this year. Now the um you know basically as of uh you know the March 12th uh HP 770 uh 7 that's wrong 7067 passed 7067
010is the actual number there and section seven of that uh new uh house bill there gave towns the opportunity to use a different depreciation schedule the value of their motor vehicle grandless okay and it basically goes upon you the the town's legislation vote on that, you know, if decide if we want to do it or not. It's a public option or local option and then uh you know, give us an opportunity to republish our grand list by April 15th, which uh you know, wouldn't be a problem by vendors because they have the software all ready to go. They just got to get our approval, you know, and they would be able to do that. Now, the advantage of that would be well, number one, the the vehicles instead of using 85% on that year one,
011now we're going to be going to 90%. So, we're going about 5% on that. Um, you know, year two would be the 85% and so on. So, the year 15, uh, you know, the models that are, you know, about 20 years old or so, they're going to bottom out at 20% instead of 15%. Which is not a lot of, um, tax money when it boils down to, especially these older vehicles. They're they're not really being assessed for much right now. So it kind of like really uh basically it kind of takes some tax burden off of the um you know resident it puts some of the tax burden back to the motor vehicle side of it by doing this you know and basically when I when I ran the numbers basically on the new depreciation
012schedule if you can get the next one up the other depreciation schedule uh was it it was in it was in that second email or It's probably like a page two maybe. Did I get both of them? Yep. Here we go. Office off torington's website or something. What did they say? But important thing is right here. This this shows you basically the modified depreciation schedule kind of like how how we're going to you know basically what we would do to price the motor vehicles you know based upon that schedule. Um it it's not like you're taking 5% and you adding that to that motor vehicle grandless number. Um there's much more to it. And basically what it boils down to when you do the math. Um we're looking to gain um was it 9 9,842,000,
013you know, of assessment on our grand list, which you know that was going to from 14% lower is we're about 6% now lower than last year. So it makes sense. which basically all it does is kind of redistribute the tax, you know, basically the mill rate would be able to um you know, come down a little bit so not so much tax burden on the residents and the homeowners and business owners. Can I or we ask you questions as you're doing this? Oh yeah, at the end. Yeah, you guys have questions. I'm sorry if I'm going quick. Oh, no, no, no problem. No problem. Question for you, too. One of the one of the questions I'm getting asked often is is yeah, it sounds like we're shifting to the 9,000 plus vehicles we have off
014the homeowners, residential and commercial. Um, but from my understanding then the net difference is the net total tax collected is just shifting that it's not adding extra tax anyway. No, if you explain that. Yeah, basically um just kind of balances out. It makes the um B basically we're taking a tax from the residential side of it, from the real estate tax bills. We're we're taking the tax and we're putting it back towards the motor vehicle tax bills. Now, one major concern obviously people are saying, "Well, I don't want my motor vehicle tax to go up from last year." Um, even even with that 90% there there's the average tax the average car tax will still be going down. So won't be going down 10% but maybe it'll be going down more, you know, one or
015two%. You know, so you're you're you're going to see a little bit of depreciation, you know, still in your car tax on on the average car. And at the same time, our, you know, real estate and our personal property tax bills won't be have, you know, they'll have a lower tax rate, uh, lower mill rate to use. So, kind of evens out end of it. You know, I think the um Well, I think Rich, I think that part of that is um it's important for taxpayers to understand the balance and that whe if if somebody owns, you know, a home and and cars, right? the car taxes maybe go up a little bit by doing this, but the house taxes should come down. Yes. And it's not going to be one to one because it's
016going to shift. And there are other cars and people own vehicles that you know, they're all different states. So, it's not it doesn't mean that if your car taxes go up 100 bucks, your house taxes are going to go down 100, but it's going to be there is going to be an offset. Do we know what the um can you talk a little bit about what the average impact to a home would be? Yeah. So I think the next uh I think number can we go back to the uh there I think it's page number page number five that's basically demonstrating just our I think I just I I just took all the single family dwellings in town and uh you know I knocked off the you know the big ones I knocked off all
017the little stuff you know like cottage kind of stuff. So we got like more of like a good weighted meet on that and it was pretty close to 200,000 is our you know our mean or our average assessment in town 200,000. So, I took that number to to work off of. And then uh the average uh class one passenger car that's over 20 years old. I took 2004 plus. And then you have an average assessment we'll say of uh you know the the 12,000 I'm sorry. Yeah. 12 $12,490. I'm sorry. That's that's for last year's 23. I'm sorry. Yeah, that's 2023. That was last year. So, yeah. Basically, I want to compare to last year's taxes, you know. So basically, you have your single family dwelling and you're at the average of $200,000 for your
018assessment and then your average car with the grand as is right now is $11,10. Okay. You apply the uh our proposed mill rate which at the time I thought it was 3571. I think it's I'm not sure. I think it's 79 now. But anyways, if you if you're looking looking at something like your taxes for the year for your house is about $7,142 and then your car tax would be about $357. Okay? So, you got about $7,500 total of tax there. Now, compared to last year on that same car and the same house, you were paying about $7,270. So you can kind of see is about $230 difference between you know your tax will be going up just because of the new mill rate which that's about standard you know average I see in town
019as far as the mil rate how they work. Now, if we uh adopt the um the you know HP767 there, what that's going to do is it's going to bring our mill rate down for the homeowner. And you can see, you know, the the taxes will go down about $60 or so for that, you know, tax bill on the homeowner side of it. and the car tax will go up a little bit, but overall you're still talking uh you know, instead of the taxes raising right now as it stands about $230 on a person, you're 210. So it's still a little bit less, you know, so redistributing that that um tax revenue to the real estate side makes sense because the real estate values are more, you know, more valuable and obviously, you know, they're
020they're going to pay more tax on a higher mill rate, you know, when it comes down to it, you know. And um you know that that person same person's car tax last year if you notice was 405 $45 down to $494. I mean you know so let's say a little bit decrease you know it's not much but kind of makes sense when you're trying to keep your mail rate down do something like this you know having that option. So even with 67, it still over where we were going back a couple of years is still shifting more towards house taxes than cars, but making this change would actually moderate that a little bit. Yeah. It would it would equalize it out. It it brings it a little bit more towards balance from where it was.
021Exactly. Yes. Yeah. So I said right right right right right right right right right right right right right away when the state the um and I know I saw a couple different versions of that appreciation schedule and I I always thought it was going to be 90% then when they we finally saw the final version that was adopted or voted on with the Senate or with the state legislators it was 85%. So, you know, didn't right away it was uh you we saw the impact on the rail was so it's going to be a um I just I just think it's a it'll be easier to have a mill rate of uh you know 30 35 41 compared to the 3579 I think is what it's saying now we're at right now with the minimum
022um you know so you know some people won't won't see so you know, tax increase, let's say this year. Obviously, we're talking averages. There's a high low end. You know, I'm kind of just meeting in the middle right now. So, everybody's situation's a little bit different. you know, um I did have a report and this data here so you know I I took uh you know there's about 26 uh 2005,657 real estate accounts that me that met um you know that was single family home in town out of that that group right there. I grabbed that middle kind of uh you know fair market value of 285 is basically we're right in the middle with those numbers there and there about 63% of our real estate grain list and it works out the motor vehicles
023I grabbed that were 20 years and you know newer we'll say 2004 is enough motor vehicles for class one passengers that we use for an example that one is about 63% of our grand as well so kind of you know kind of state a good portion of our grandless you know that we draw this information from you So, it's not really uh too it's not going to vary too much. If you go to page four, um couple interesting things on this, you could kind of see how um even with the uh you know, HP 767 in place there on the last column there. Um you could kind of see how the class 2 commercial vehicles are going way down. this the different methodology of pricing them. Um, you know, I'm seeing, you know, any, you
024know, 10 to 20% down. This is showing 20% on average, we'll say, for the commercial vehicles in the class two combinations. Those are the trucks. It could be commercial. You know, this basically I think it goes by weight those. So, you know, you do see the reduction basically across the board in the, you know, we'll say in most of the cars, so the tax bills won't be as much they were last year. um this the class eight another on the bottom that's all that's all the little trailers and uh you know the um we see construction trailers actually and the RV kind of stuff and those ones you know generally probably just showing a they're going up but this is probably the way they pricing differently you know there's a lot there's a lot more
025to that group there people not to mention um we took off about five or 600 residential trailers off their grams this year because of the uh new legislation that exempted, you know, trailers for residential use this year. So, there's a handful of um accounts that are people are not getting tax bills this year because it's the residential use trailer. So, that's something to kind of keep in mind why that number is up because we don't have the um the numbers that we had on that one type of thing, you know, because that's because of the legislation. So, I mean, somebody can live in a trail trailer on their lot and not pay taxes. Uh um well when when uh when it says res residential use it means not being used commercially. So not not so
026much like a camper trailer. I didn't take those off. But boat trailers, you know, they they they were very minimal anyways if we assess them at all. Um boat trailers were always uh hard to price. There's a lot of them in this town. Like I remember we used to run into the issue any support of assessment with somebody that converted an old thing into a utility trailer to haul fresh to the do. Yeah. That kind of a thing. Yeah. So like I guess Yeah. You can you can go to Home Depot or Lowe's and what spend $8900 on a you know utility trailer just for your yard work then it comes to my grand list and you know I'm looking at the gross weight usually when I'm trying to price these things. You know if
027I don't know exactly what it is. So, you know, you would run into situations where it gets you overpriced or whatever. They never come in and I undervalue stuff, but something, you know, with the over stuff, they come in or talk to the board, right? That kind of stuff. They u the legislation says if it's a residential residential use trailer, meaning you're using it for your yard and you're not using it to for your business, it's tax exempt, you know, that and uh snowmobiles. And the other one was um you know ATVs, all-terrain vehicles, you know, which people don't register those anyways usually in general. So you don't see too much of those on the grand list. Um but those are technically um exempt now too as well. So that kind of had a little
028bit of an impact on the trailer side of it. Other than that um you know is what it is. And those those bills are pretty minimal as they are too. they're probably looking at um you know $500 assessed tax bill which equates out to about you know 15 $16 on your taxes for the year. That $500 is actually the new legislation did they did put in that cars are registered vehicles whether a trailer or not you know if they're on the grand list or not to be assessed less than 500 you know so that kind of helps too you know so basically you know you get a you get a lot of hey I made this trailer cost me $300 how come you assess me for 500 well now we have a statute that says
029well because we have to assess everything at least at 500 you know if it's if it's on the road it's registered your mental 500 assessment you know that's going to help out a little bit on too. Yeah. Uh just just quick observation. So line one um total total uh assessment is a you know 106 million in 2023. Uh it would drop to 90 million. Um that's where we're at right now. Right now which is a 14% drop. I get that. Under HB76 it's 100 million but the this is for all the cars in town. The 9721 all the vehicles in town. Um I'm sorry 9726 still the overall average decrease is 5.28%. Yeah even with HB. Exactly. Yes. Yeah. So even even we even if we even if we were to adopt this we're still
030looking at an overall you know decrease on the grant it's not going to boost us up over you know. So I um I really don't think that people too much difference in their tax bills. And and the only other two things that stood out to me uh was for most passenger cars uh 6,500 about that um they'll see 1.9% because you want to put five and 1.9% dedu uh reduction even with HP67. Um but it looks like the biggest decrease was the commercial two and three. Mhm. I know I had gotten a concern from some of the businesses in town that had said they're worried about what's going to happen to their truck fleets and where they would park the cars, whether they keep them in Portland or not. Um but they even with um
031even with this potential local option we could take, they're still down at a minimum 20% 21% off the car taxes this year versus last year. So yeah. Um like I said this from what I'm seeing from my report you know that I've been running um you're not the commercial fleet guys I mean the the difference of the re the the valuation on those kind of trucks this year comes down to if we're using MSRP value compared to they were based on clean retail before and the trucks really kind of tricky to price sometimes because we don't have so much at NAD value to pick from so it just kind of leave us to our own resources. is to find, you know, what would be a MSRP for this truck and then I would put like
032a a straight line depreciation on it, you know, and if um, you know, it made sense, I would just depreciate four or five% every year automatically. Um, you know, so they were kind of slowly going down now with this depreciation schedule. Now you got a truck that's five or six years old that's um or you know maybe uh even you n you know if if it's we're knocking about 50% off the top of the MSRP value. Well, they're already way below what we were previous with that other standard depreciation schedule I had on them. So they're actually making out on this because um you know they you can I I've only seen the uh the trucks I had to take a double check. back. I'm like, "Holy cow, I can't believe how much have I've
033gone down with this new methodology." And it's just because um you know the the trucks in the past, there wasn't really any value to go from. There wasn't like a clean retail value we can choose from. I would just have to try to find the value the best I could by own means. whether I'm looking at, you know, um see what they're selling for online and taking an average of what I see with the listing price on those trucks where some people brought in bill, you know, it's always helpful when I people brought in their bill of sales or kind of it identified exactly what the stuff was. Um, you know, I would I would be able to use that kind of information to develop my own pricing methodology and if it was consistent across
034across the board, it was no problem, you know, and most assess other towns did exact same thing I was doing. So, it was consistent whatever town you're in. So, that's one thing I'm seeing that these trucks now using, you know, using using the uh either depreciation schedule, you're going to see them down, you know, a lot less than what they were in. So, I think that'll be a good thing for the commercial end of it in this town. They'll save a little money in their motor vehicle tax, especially the ones with the fleets. Absolutely. Um, I passed out to all the selectmen. Um, just some samples of eight or nine of our top commercial companies in town and ones with particularly big fleets and most of them drop significantly. It kind of follows what you
035have there because they were they were concerned about the drop in there if there was going to be an increase real or not. Um, so I I I wanted to make sure that that what information I thought was true was inactive. So yeah. Um and also like we should have that in there in terms of samples and just those sheets like I said we don't have our final like you know if we were to do this we don't have the final actual assess numbers if they could not definitely need a snap so they're not really uh used to uh tell us what's exactly tax right now we don't know at this point but that was a general estimate about you know what we're looking at you know as far as what those trucks are doing
036you know people multiple trucks you know so yeah I think I I think all in all it's going to be a more of a positive thing for hotel if you were going to uh if you were going to explain this to your neighbor and that you know hey I hear I I saw the meeting last night I heard you talking about taxes and whatever how would you explain this to your neighbor? Ah, jeez. I would probably say um you know it's it's as long as as long as my my cards don't go up. You know, as long as I'm not going to increase them, they are what they are. And once after you get a year or two, most of them should be going down a little bit this year as it is, not but
037you know, once once they get once they get on that schedule, you know, every they'll be five% every year. So they'll see a standard depreciation down the rock bottom of the fence, you know, and kind of stay there, you know, for a year. And would it be fair to say that that the uh with the pandemic, right, it caused a spike which kind of put things out of balance and people saw them going up. The legislature made an adjustment to try to combat that. They adjusted too much and this is now bringing it back. That's right. Yeah. I mean that that's a good way to look at it too as well, you know. Um like I said, I thought it was going to be more originally when I first saw it. When I saw what
038they did, I said, "Oh, they they want more on it." You know, so yeah, they shifted it too much towards residential and now I think that was I think I think there was a lot of um you know feedback from communities about it, you know, that's probably why they made it special the 707 put in place. Plus, they they also had a the other thing they passed was there was a veteran exemption they put in place this year too that kind of had a little bit of impact on the real estate um for uh service related totally disabled veterans. Um that that that was something where um basically we squeeze that through on you know and that kind of had a little bit of an impact on our residential brand. you know, some towns worse
039than others. We're we weren't so bad, but I've heard some, you know, pretty there's times with a lot of veterans would say by the kind of got the run of that. But um so they basically what they did was this the um the House Bill 707, but what it basically does, it clarifies that veteran statute too as well they passed just because there was a lot of questions going on with that one too as well. So it gave talents the opportunity to go back if they had any veterans that weren't 100% disabled and they run that program they were able to readjust their grants accordingly too so they can refile their real estate one you know for us we wouldn't we wouldn't have to do any other it would only be the motor vehicle one
040that we're adjusting we're not you we're not touching the real estate numbers we're not touching personal property numbers keeping those the same um even with the motor vehicle pricing schedule with our personal properties we have such little cars on personal property that it wouldn't make that much a difference anyways. And usually uh you know I basically took the um values that they're declaring to say they realistic they look good you know so we're going to keep personal property one as it is you know because I'm not going to worry about changing that one. So Rich, have you done any review analysis of towns in our area and which way they went with this? I um she there's there's been a lot of my association has a hotline that they basically somebody brought brought that question
041up about a week or two ago. Hey, what towns are going to be adopt adopting this and you know all day long my computer's bleeping with a new email coming up by you know somebody else and it's about 5050 right now as far as what I've been seeing. I can you guys want exact numbers just shoot me an email or whatever it is. I can get that number D of the tally up to where we're at, you know. But, um, you know, as we speak, more towns are adopting it, you know, as we go. Every day you see another one coming up, you know. So, from from what I saw, I know uh know a couple of local towns have. But, um, but the towns whose mill rate was higher than the minimum motor vehicle
042uh rate seem to be adopting it in a higher level. um one if it's below it there there seems to be a less need to do that. Um but uh yeah I've heard the same numbers about half out there. Yeah. The town and not not all have and I know some towns have had more urgency in terms of the budget. Um the reason I wanted to bring it to everyone here and and have the folks at home listen is uh we're obviously in the middle budget cycle in another 20 minutes. We'll be talking about numbers and we're be talking about mill rates and how we set them. And my biggest impetus for for bringing this I think was the reason why HP767 came out that towns were saying that there needs to be a way
043to balance it out more uh because of the the amount of taxes on homeowners and commercial. So I thought it was certainly uh important to do that. Um other thing too and tell me if this is correct or not. When I've been talking to people at Adams and wherever I've gone, they I've asked everyone that I see what they think about this and um my explanation is that it's just shifting some to the motor vehicles and off the backs of the homeowners and b but the total tax that they're paying wouldn't change, right? It's it's you know whatever the increase would be overall because of uh the additional spending, it just has to be equal. But it's just a shifting of it. To me, it seems shifting it to the 9,700 vehicles off of the
0443,000 homes and other commercial properties seem to make the most sense, which is why which is why I kind of drove it on this. So, that's that makes sense to you if that's something that uh that I'm telling. Yeah, I mean definitely um it's shifting the u tax burdens to you know uh you know from from the you know residential side of it to back to the um motor vehicles where definitely was there last year already. you know, and just with the new system that we're at, um, you got to figure the real estate council, the the commercial properties, you know, million and above. I mean, they're talking big money as far as, you know, a higher mill rate goes. So, you know, to try to keep those taxes kind of more at bay with
045the, you know, amountable increase, you know, it, you know, if you can get that through your motor vehicle side of it, you know, makes sense, you know. Um again, uh as I understand the legislation allows a town, if they choose to adopt it and at the next budget cycle, they choose to revert back to the uh the old plan or the existing plan we have now. Is that allowed? I haven't seen anything that tells us not to right now. the way they change things. Who knows this time next year? But, you know, um I think um you know, whether we adopt it or not, um I think if we decided we didn't want to do it next year for whatever reason, you know, there's nothing tell us not to right now that I can see
046that I saw. You know, I know one of the selectmen also had mentioned um assessment assessment of of the homes out there starting later this year and the potential impact on that two years from now. We realist all that kind of stuff. can talk a little bit about that. Yeah, I can't give specific numbers. I know the the revaluation is um going to be for October 1, 2026 is our revaluation date. So, um depends on what the real estate market is going to be, you know, that point in time. Um you know, I'm looking at just the sales going through compared to 5 years ago in 2021. Um you know, they they vary, but you know, safe to say about 20 to 25%. You know, I've seen an increase on residential properties in town. um
047you know there's sales coming through you know significantly higher than what they were in 2021. Um who knows if we're going to be able to capture that in 2026 right now but um that's something where you know once we get our revaluation company in here you know they're going to be determining what the market is at that point in time for October 1st 6. and that would be strong see you know some increase like we did our last rebound in 2021 and that would have an impact on our residents in two years two more years from now. Yeah. Yeah. So it's it won't be um won't be this fiscal year or the next week following. So some time right now to do that, but like said start getting all that RFP and all that kind
048of stuff together within the next probably uh you know couple months or by the fall. So we'll probably go out to see if we can get a company in here to start working on the work with a readout. Um if this board should decide to do this um a question I've heard also is do you have the capability to handle the paperwork and the necessary work that you have to do in order to meet the bill's requirements? Yeah, it would it would um like I said, it's a matter of we got the approval comes out from you guys first and then I just have I think there's a form we got to fill out for for the for the state the state know that we're going to implement it and then the um other side
049of it is we just have to let my vendor um you know our tax better know we're implementing you know the new statute here and we'll um local option and you know basically they're going to do the calculation right there and see what the obviously have to check it make sure everything looks where it was or where it should be, you know, and make sure the exemptions are still there and all that kind of stuff. And once the numbers look good to me, I'll we'll run it through and we'll republish it around, you know, take I don't think it take very long to get those numbers, we'll say. Yeah. I've been asking a lot of questions. Hope hopefully I'm not taking anyone else. Anyone else have something? Can you just summarize? If we don't do
050anything, the mill rate for the cars and the personal property is going to be whatever we set it at, right? It's going to be um budget. Mill rate for the cars will still be at the at the big cap. Okay. And what's the cap number? Is that 246? 46 mills. Yes. Okay. So the personal property and the real estate tax bills will be affected by the um water mill rate would be okayed. And if we change and do this H whatever HB767 then at what rate do we tax the cars? It will still be the same fill rate. It's still the 3246. Okay. But because the depreciation schedule's different. Yeah. Less aggressive. Yeah. They'll be um you know, they'll be 5% more. We can we potentially don't need as high a mill rate for the
051on the residential property. Yeah. The extra money we're grabbing from the car taxes be going towards the um you know, real estate. Okay. Makes sense. Um, any other questions while he's up there? Everyone satisfied with what he's told you? Any concerns that anyone has? You guys ever want any more detail, you know, in my email or stop my office and show you all my mess of research on this, you know, as far as trying to get together, but it's it's like I said, it's pretty straightforward. I don't really see that much problems inadequate to say, you know, it's a positive. Rich, thank you very much. Really appreciate you explaining it. Really helpful. Thank you, Rich. No problem. And it's and it's a pretty complicated issue, right? There's a lot of juggling, a lot of moving
052parts. Yeah, there's a lot of moving parts and you know, the unknown is always the fact, you know, it's every that's every grandless cycle as it is too. Yes. Um, just a couple of last bullets and I'm going to kind of go around and see what everyone's feeling is on this, but right now as our budget is in place, that's what we've talked about. It's about 1.49 is the is the uh mill rate increase. Um, without without HB7067 with it, uh, that goes to an increase of 1.11 for a 35.41 mill rate. Um, I personally think it's in the best interest of the town. um because of the additional burden that homeowners have shouldered over the last couple years. This is Yeah. And it goes down and this is what it is right now, right?
053And it goes down to Oh, update one. Oh. Oh, 1.12. Got it. I'm sorry. Tom just said it's going to be the updated numbers. It's 1.12 instead of 1.1 1.11. Slight slight difference. Thank you, Tom. Get it right. Is that Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. Well, it may change with the budget, too. 3.27. 3.27. And this looks like this is this the updated number. So, we passed a couple of those. Now, Tom did bump some of these off earlier. the updated number of the time did present itself. So anyway, so a little bit I'm sorry. So this you just handed is with the HB7. Yes. The only difference is the one you had previous was the mill rate increase would have been 1.11, but with the numbers that Tom ran, it's now 1.12 versus the 1.49. do
054that. That's three point. That's percentage. Well, that is the new way. Oh, thank you. Oh, no. You're welcome. So, anyways, um so again, that's that's my feeling on this is I think that makes sense, but again, it's we need to decide as a board. Um, thank you, Tom. Okay. Okay. Oh, thank thank you very much. So, so if if we can go around the table, I'd love to get everyone's feeling on this, what they would like to do moving forward. If it's if the consensus is there, then I'd like to make the motion. But um all we need to do is just to agree to adopt the local option based on H bill you know HB767. But if we could start with on my left here. Um I think it's I think when you look
055at the numbers you can see when when this was implemented that there was a pretty significant shift um what is it was the higher higher jump in property taxes than reduction in car taxes. So I think moderating that a little bit is probably helpful, especially given the fact that there would be an option if we if we did note any problems with it that we would be able to revert next year. But it's a a relatively modest adjustment back to the middle from where we started where we went last year than to now and provides a little bit more balance and reduces the reliance on just pure um property, you know, house residential property taxes or commercial property taxes. John Jim pretty much said what I was going to say. Uh he does that often.
056He does that often, right? That's why we start with him. No, I I uh for all those reasons uh and and the big one for me is that if this doesn't work out, we can we have the ability to pull the plug on it next year. Um I I I have to admit I was I was wavering, but I after Rich's presentation, I think I understand it a little better and I think I'm leaning towards it. Okay, Rick. Yeah, I didn't really understand it until tonight, but I am a lot closer to being comfortable with a 3.27 mil increase than a 4.35. So, based on that, I I think I like the I like the idea. I think everyone knows how I feel about it. I think it makes sense on a number of ways,
057as Jim and John and Rick have said. Yeah, I agree. I I think it makes sense. I think it's nice to see the legislature reach back and repair something that they broke and bring it uh bring it forward in a way that it's going to equalize and make it a little bit more fair how we put that burden out there for all taxpayers. Okay, Bobby. Um I haven't decided if I yet. Okay. Okay. And Mike? Uh yeah, I'm kind of leaning towards it. Um, also with everybody else, I don't like the evaluation of the cars and I think they're over evaluating them, but I think everybody does that out there these days. So, um, and I do like the fact that everyone that we can revert back next year if it doesn't work out. So,
058all right. Well, I tell you with that, um, I'd like to I'd like to make a motion that the town of Portland adopt HB7067, um, going forward for our grandless 2024. Um, I just need someone to make the motion 25. I'm sorry. Well, it's actually for 2024. They're one year behind. Oh, okay. So, what we do today will be on the 20. The last one that was paid was the 2023. Is that correct, Rich? Yeah. Yep. I just want to make sure it sounds backwards, but yes. All right, I'll make that motion. All right, I had a second second. Um, any further discussion? I think the only other I think the other clarification, right, the same balance where you're going to see a reduction in the the buildings, if you will, right? Shouldn't you see
059the same offset for the commercial buildings just like you do in the in the in the commercial vehicles? Um because that was one of my concerns is that if somebody owns more vehicles, you know, you could see that they're tilting the other way. But it seemed like with the commercial evaluations, the way Rich presented them, um it's already providing a little bit more relief, if you will, um in terms of how those vehicles are getting eval, you know, valued versus how they were getting valued before. And that's important. We need to make sure we're taking care of our businesses, right? The only other thing I have, and it's not an amendment or anything to the motion, but um I think it's important for for clarity, for transparency, and for our Portland residents that maybe if
060this is approved that Rich could get something on the town website that will explain in layman's terms what this is all about so folks understand. Kind of getting to the question, Rich, that we asked you, how would you explain it? Yes, I'll add ahead of my stuff I made today quick enough presentable with the public or whatever. Other towns probably have them up too. So, but I think it's important that if people hear about this that they can go and look it up and and read for themselves. It'd be good to get out that it's really not we're not talking or increasing tax, but we're just kind of balancing it out a little different. Okay. Thank you. Yeah. And again, as I've said, I I agree. I think it's a good thing for the town.
061I think it it it shifts it slightly and and brings it more in balance. So, we ready for the vote? All those in favor? All those opposed? All those abstensions? N. All right. Uh the A7 the A7 motion passes. Yes. All right. Thank you very much for the questions and for spending your time with this, Rich. Thank you very much for walking it through. I know it's a somewhat complicated issue and whenever you talk about taxes and houses and cars and all that kind of stuff, it it can be confusing and no one wants their taxes going up, but I think this will do it. So, thank you very much. No pressure. We're sending everyone to you. Yeah. Oh, all right. Um, we have a minute before the 7 o'clock. Do you need a motion
062to adjourn, please? Motion to adjourn. So, we have a minute break this meeting. Second. All those in favor? I. Motion passes. We got a minute break. Thank you for quick pass.