Thompson BOE Budget Workshop #1 - January 5, 2026

001to order. >> It's the first time. >> How did that feel? >> All right. So, we'll start Oh, I got to I got to do that, huh? Uh, we'll start with the pledge of allegiance. Daniela, you want to lead us off? >> Sure. >> Right. Pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> All right, the next item on the agenda is citizens comments. Start in the Zoom audience if there are any citizens comments. >> Somebody else. >> I don't see any comments. Any comments from the room? Herbert Wilsonville Road. Happy New Year. >> Happy New Year. All right, no other citizens comments. We're going to move on to the educational update. >>

002Um so, welcome back everyone. Uh this is our first day back. Bill and I have been immersed in budget all day. Um we did have um a couple of glitches today. First time back. Um otherwise um attendance was much better than before the break where we had about 160 students out a lot of illness. Um today's numbers look much better. Um but I do hear that the flu is running rampid. So um we're going to have to uh keep that all in mind uh when we start to look at our attendance rate. When you get your data sheets tomorrow, you'll see that um attendance uh was significantly impacted in December. Um otherwise um everything is about budget. I will let you all know today I sent out a notice to the staff that I have

003frozen the FY 26 bud budget. As you know we usually do that sometime in October because of the late adoption of the budget and the processing of POS late this year. Uh we held it open until the end of um the first half of the school year. However, today the notification came that tomorrow uh we won't be processing any unnecessary spending. It'll be between Bill and I if someone needs something and I don't mean the typical stuff like, you know, copy paper and things that we need for consumables. But if they haven't ordered something or, you know, for supplies or curriculum resources, um I question, you know, now uh should those things should have been ordered. Um, and we just have to uh hold a line on the budget because um Monday night I'll be

004talking to you about and I don't want to waste time on that tonight, but um regarding a supplemental allocation to cover special ed costs for the current year that we're in. Um so that's basically my update. >> Okay. >> All right. 2026 2027 budget presentation. Mr. >> Nope. Starting with me. Oh, starting with >> starting with me. So, unlike every other year, um we usually present a final number at this date um to you, the superintendent's final number. Um this budget is um definitely a work in progress. I have a memo in front of you because the question always comes up when we start to look at the budget sheets um and inevitably somebody will ask you know Melinda what did you cut on your first um you know pass at the budget you know

005what did you take out what are the kids not getting what personnel have you recommended for reduction um this year uh we took two swipes um at the budget because we knew before the break uh the number um that we're gonna eventually land on is going to be a significant increase. Um I will say that um as far as personnel reductions, I was going to give you that information for the 21st meeting. That's a longer discussion because that's going to be a decision you're going to have to make whether or not you want to put those reductions forward. As you know, last year we cut what seven or eight positions. There's very little staffing uh to reduce. I've come up with some suggestions. None of them good. Um but uh I want you to take

006a look at it and have a discussion about it before we do that. Um the school budgets, I've gone through the budget book twice. I have reduced their individual budgets, but not by a significant amount. To be quite frank, what they've asked for is just their general operating supplies and materials. You know, a teacher might have asked for three CR cameras. Okay, I gave her two. Um, but you know, as I'm going through the budget, that number did not yield a big reduction at all. Um, and then this, uh, as far as technology, the only thing we pull back on is that maybe next year we would not, um, give the ninth graders going up to the high school brand new laptops because we have acquired some used laptops that Heather thinks that she can

007retrofit and implement those for the high school. remember the high school uses laptops versus uh K8 using um the Chromebooks. So that money came out and then the biggest number that we reduced is in the memo ahead of you. These were some asks from the school. Um, but I chose to take them out um because you'll see when Bill starts to go through um the budget uh that we're landing on a a number that's um significantly higher than I've ever presented to you before. Um and um tonight Bill really wants to present the budget in a way so that the new members of the board um have an understanding of how to read the sheets and how to look at object code definitions and those kinds of things. So he's going to start with that

008and then we're going to get into um some of the rationale or explanation of the changes in the budget. So that's kind of where we're at. But the number that you see before you in the increase is not the final number that I will present to you. I want to have a discussion around those personnel um recommendations on the 21st before I put forward a final number. Staglet. >> Thank you. Okay. So, for the for the veterans on the board, um this package will look uh very familiar. Uh but for for our new folks, a quick summary on how we attack the budget. Uh believe it or not, this work starts in early November, November 4th this year. Um to be specific. Um we send out um this year actually our our we try to

009enhance the budget process every year. um just trying to get more and more efficient because as you can imagine this thing's an elephant and you kind of got to eat it one bite at a time and and we really we just try to improve it this year. Um Tina Nolan has joined the team upon Eileen Deir's retirement and the the effort that Tina and I embarked on this year was to make it all electronic. So all the templates that went out well there used to be a lot of paper flying around you have a lot of version control issues with that. So we went 100% to electronic templates this time around. Kudos to Tina for her diligence on that effort and also kudos to the to all the principles and right down to the teachers,

010everyone who had to fill out those templates. It went very smoothly. There's always, you know, some hiccups. Folks in academia love their Google Sheets. They want to send you a Google sheet and darn it, I'm an Excel guy, so back it goes until we get Excel. There's a little bit of that, but it actually went very well. um and allowed us to really uh take some time out of that process at the beginning and I believe improve the quality of sort of the mechanics of putting the budget together. Um so just a little plug for for the hard work that the team did there. Um so what you see in front of you is really there's there's two sections to this. the the the first page is is a very high level summary that by

011department gives you a quick look at the total numbers and a real snapshot in the explanation of changes as to what's driving those. The second page through the last page gives you the object look. So, a little more granular on there's a there's a section in in these p in the back pages uh that really kind of goes into detail on every single one of the departments and you can see at the account level what those explanations were. The third this I guess the second packet the definition of the objects uh once again our vets will remember this but this defines the object level. So if if you're looking at um pages two and the second page on this package, you're looking you see Oregon object, the object is the second part of that number.

012It's sort of like an account number. And this provides the detail you need. When you look at a line and say, "What the heck's in there?" You can go to this sheet. Uh they're numerical in order. And you can see a quick blurb on what is captured by uh that object. Um some of these are are relatively uh um generic and others go into um some very specific detail on the account. For example, when we talk about how much we're paying for per gallon of fuel um gasoline, diesel, and fuel oil, that information is in there just to give you a feeling for how these um what what what each account entails and in some instances how the budget numbers were were actually calculated and pulled together. So, it probably would make sense to just

013walk through the cover page to give everybody a higher level feeling of how we got where we are. So, in total, this draft in capital letters budget is $23.7 million. Uh, that's up from $21.8 million in 2026. That's a $1.9 million or 8.9% increase. So, keep in mind this is was very early stages of this uh after two rounds of of cuts uh with Melinda. Now, I'll go through each of the departments. A lot of the drivers you'll you'll recognize from past years. High school up 4.1%. It's it's contractual salaries and one of our big drivers that we talk about every year is our expected increase on health insurance. Um, talking to our brokers, once again, they're expecting 10% or at least they're starting at 10%. I know you'll recall that in past years that

014generally drifts down. Uh, one year it went down to almost nothing when they started at 10%. Other years it's landed somewhere between six and eight. I'm hopeful we see the same trend, but at this moment, I would much rather start the process with the conservative estimate that the brokers have. And hopefully, we'll catch some good news later on in the budget process if that ends up at six or whatever it may be. Because, as you might imagine, you guys know, the the health insurance number is a big number. It's a it's a big driver of our budget. So, just keep in mind that 10%'s in there and you'll see it all over the place. big drivers really for all three of the schools, high school, middle, and elementary, salaries and health insurance. Um, one thing

015we did see in the elementary school, um, in instances where we've had to go out and and hire new teachers, um, the market conditions for teacher hires are are driving those salaries up to higher steps. The teachers are in demand and we're competing in the marketplace just like every other district. Um, Melinda's hinted more than once that the the tone around those negotiations and the conduct of other school districts has gotten more and more aggressive in the just the last couple of years. Uh, and unfortunately that's that's driving salaries higher. Um, pupil services, Dr. Jones's uh, area once again expecting higher outplacement tuition and contracted services. Eastcon hit us with a significant rate increase. I believe it was 8% >> uh this year which was uh was unfortunate. Uh and uh a speech pathologist was

016brought brought on board. So that all contributed to that 12.7% increase. In health services, you're looking at a $1,700 increase. Uh nurse Growler really held the line on her budget. That is that is completely salaries that she didn't move on any of her other budget lines. um districtwide um the drive one of the big drivers here we had talked in previous board of ed meetings about the board of education budget taking back 100% of cafeteria health insurance. So that's a big driver of you look at that 14% increase and say what the heck's going on there. That's a big piece of that increase. In addition, we had higher worker higher expected workers comp and liability insurance rates. Um higher severance, anticipated severance for fiscal 27 with some key retirements. Uh and uh higher VOAG tuition,

017which is an estimate. You never know how many kids are going to go to Killingly VOAG. However, from what I understand, there are a handful that are that are at least take applying and taking a look there. So, we did increase that tuition in anticipation of if those kids decide to go. As the budget process goes on, if we get more visibility to that, we might have the ability to to drop that a little bit. But once again, trying to be conservative at the beginning of the process in plant. Um, Mr. Burch uh facility transition costs can capture uh both uh the portion of Bill's salary for uh next year uh when he will be here as well as the full year for his replacement. Um with our new HVAC maintenance, uh it comes it

018will come with a rather significant HVAC um maintenance contract agreement that's in there. electricity, we're assuming a 10% increase because similar to last year, nobody, unfortunately, it's tough to get visibility around where that's going. >> Um, so we use 10% to be careful. Health insurance affects us here. Uh, partially offset by fuel savings. I'm particularly proud of this little stat. I wish it would had even more impact, but for I believe the fourth year in a row, um a combination of of what was Amy at the time, uh Bill Burch and myself, we really keep an eye on on the futures contracts on diesel, fuel, oil, and gasoline. Um so we were able to to buy down uh on all three categories, and we're for for the fourth year in a row, we're paying a

019lower per gallon cost um for all three types of fuel. Um so that it helps out a little bit. uh high uh transportation. Our contract with DATCO uh is a is for a 5% increase, but wait a minute, Bill, we're we're only up 4.3. It's because we're offset uh by bus route reductions and uh the just the lower g uh fuel cost that we just talked about. Uh high school athletics, higher liability insurance rates. This is the liability the insurance that covers uh athletes if they're hurt uh during a game. Uh, and uh, a little bit of repairs and maintenance. I mean, that's 523 bucks, but last year I tried to squeak by without putting an explanation for a small dollar amount, and you guys definitely made it clear like that. So, I even explained

020500 bucks. Technology, um, replacement of network switches. Please don't ask me what those are, but Heather assures me that that's the way to say it. um salary increases uh for for a few of the techs um partially offset by elimination of uh two software programs that the district has historically purchased. Heather kind of took a look at at as she does every year, but she took a harder look even this year on at at all the software packages that we use across the district and Lexia and Naviance were uh removed. >> We went through those. Yeah. And um those two navats we weren't using and Lexi as a reading program. And um the good news is is there's more direct teaching rather than screen teaching with um that intervention. So we're pleased about that actually.

021The next department is middle school athletics. Um up $4,000 primarily driven by higher liability insurance rates same as high school athletics above. Um curriculum uh a budget that's down. That's nice to see. Uh, and it's it's really uh Melinda taking a look at at the uh level at which she had budgeted uh certain supplies in the curriculum department uh and came up with a with a reduction of almost $14,000 there. She's even cutting her own budget. And finally, ESY and summer um contractual salaries that move just like any other any other teacher in Paris salaries as well as higher transportation costs. And that primarily is because, you know, we're part of the Horizon's program that's funded entirely by the rectory school program. Um, next year we'll have three grade levels or four grade levels are

022participating. Um, but our only cost to that whole program is provide the transportation in the summer for the six weeks for the students that participate. And we shared the cost the year before. Putnham gave us a ride. This year we picked up Putinham kids. Uh we tried to B back and forth, but um we did end up seeing an increase uh this year because of that. But six weeks of a full day program, can't beat it. So, as I mentioned at the beginning, a lot of the same challenges that we faced um in in past budgets um with a with a couple of new wrinkles like the the HVAC service agreement and and things like that. Um >> yeah, the fee for that is over 100 108,000. >> 108,000. >> Yeah, >> Jess. >> Yep.

023Justin, sorry. Yeah. I don't um the contractual salaries increases. Do we know on a percentage basis around what that percentage increase was? >> You know, I I it's make sense that we have that, but because everybody moves based on step, I I tend not to think of it total because it it varies quite a bit. There are certain step increases that are really not all that significant at all and then there are others that that are quite a bit of a jump >> depending on the year it fell. Yeah, it's 3% or a little bit over 3%. I >> I guess kind of where I'm trying to break this down, Bill, is let's say for the high school, you've got it's a 4.1% overall increase where you're saying 10% of that 4.1% is in the

024health insurance. >> Not not necessarily. It all depends. The 10% increase on the health insurance is is tough because there's a rate component, but there's also a mix component. Yep. So if you just take one school for example, uh if you if you had u 20 teachers in the high school last year who took health insurance uh but maybe someone uh a family u a teacher with family plan retired and we replaced them uh with a with a younger teacher at a lower salary who maybe is still on their parents health insurance for a couple years then al so you have a mix element that goes in. So, it's not as easy as looking at last year's health insurance number and applying 10% to it because there's a lot this happens at the town, too.

025We have a lot of back and forth at the at the town side. It goes in the other direction because a lot of folks are kind of climbing the ladder where they were single and now they're moving to family. So you might get caught, you might have the same people, but they've moved on in their life and and all of a sudden they've gone from single where where the cost to the district or the town might be, let's say, around 15,000 a year to family, which is closer to 35,000 and that's the district or the town's portion. So that's 80% of the total premium, which by the way, just in case there's anybody on the on the audience that's wondering, we do not budget for the full premium. We budget for the portion that the

026district pays. So that's net of the it's roughly 18 to 20% depending on the union that employees contribute. >> Yeah, I I appreciate the explanation. Where I'm trying to get at is of the 4.1% >> y >> what part of that is salary? What part of that is anticipated insuranceances? Right. Because although we are obligated to both, if it's 1% overall is the salary and 3.1% is the insurance. That's going to be >> something to explain. >> Let me let me clarify something there too. >> It's particularly challenging to boil down the flux explanation for a in the high school's case a $3 million budget to a a 5 inch long cell in Excel. So those are the these I I would characterize these and maybe I should label it as such as the primary

027drivers because there are a lot of puts and takes in there of of folks like let's for example let's say we bought history books last year but we may not buy history so we had 10 grand of history books in the budget. This is just an example I'm making it up last year. Let's say we had 10 grand of history books in the budget last year. We might not have history books in the budget for well this is Thompson so it might be another 15 or 20 years before we we tend to really ring out our textbooks. So there's a there's a lot of and that's really what the object view on the following pages tries to get at. And I'm sure even if I go through this again I'm sure I'll see a couple

028that that seem odd like what what the heck is going on there? But inevitably it's it's things like that that we we had a a purchase that we had to do like textbooks that only happens once in a while. So So if we were doing that this year and we hadn't for the last 5 years, the textbook line might be up 5,000%. >> And that's and that's why >> Heather, um I I have four broad brush questions. Um the first one was um under plant and you'd said that that will cover Bill and his his predecessor as his replacement with an overlap I assume. Does it also include the potential for a part-time admin to do all of that other stuff? >> No. And that's the conversation we'll have under personnel. >> Okay. Okay. >>

029Um because I think where we're going to harvest that time um might come out of the reductions that I recommend. >> Okay. Um and so my second question is when you talked about the um estimated 10% health insurance um from the years past when we know what the actual health insurance will be and when the referendum goes out usually is cart before the horse. Yes. >> Um and last year the referendum was even earlier than previous years. Do I assume we know when the referendum is and is it early again like last year? >> Same schedule as last year. Okay. >> And and that and that's really a result of us combining >> the board of finance and board of selectment meetings on the town side. >> So where we would have a series of

030selectment meetings and then a series of finance meetings. >> Those are combined for the first I think it's five, >> right? >> Um and that saves us some time. And what that allows us to do is do the referendum earlier which in this instance might be not great, >> right? But for example, with last year, if we hadn't have implemented that change, >> oh, I know. We would still be probably having budget referendums right now >> and and the cash crunch would have been >> Yeah. Right. >> It would have been even worse. So, it although it didn't pay off in the way I hoped it would pay off, it it paid off nonetheless. >> Okay. >> So, when is that date though? When is that? >> Usually the second week of April. >> April.

031>> Yeah. >> And the first >> That was later than that. >> Yeah. We approve our budget like we approve our budget in March >> because one year it did burn us the healthare it was it was higher than anticipated so we had to cut things >> that's why the 10%'s kind of safe >> yeah okay so then my next my third question is the eastcon thing eastcon was a thing that we were thinking about possibly doing in house is that right was that the one >> so no so there are some students that attend programming for special education stu uh services at Eastcon. I can't remember the numbers, two or three students. However, um they just sent us a document that said that the all of their services under special education is going up

032>> 8%. Which is a big number on the students that are there. Um and we have no control over that. >> Um and you know, they've got their own set of issues, but uh with their budget, but the reality is that's a high number to go up. >> Yeah. and they had no options for that. >> So, at this moment in time, knowing what I know about the students and the programming, um the programs appropriately match the students needs um and there's no other option because there's there's good programming there. >> And then my last question was transportation. Um I know you had mentioned that this includes the reduced the bus route consolidation, but we also took I think two buses off the road. That's what he's talking >> with penalty and that's that's all

033built into this number. Okay. >> The penalty is built in. Right. >> Right. >> Okay. >> Matt, did you ever >> um Yeah. Quick. I I'm hoping you have something of an answer. The overall health insurance that we that the board pays for. >> I know it fluctuates year to year, but is it on the order of like 3 million or 4 million? >> It's just at this point it's just under three. >> Okay. So 10% >> 2.9, >> right? >> Don't don't quote me on that, but that's it's off the top of my head. And and again, just in case for our new members and for anyone on the online audience, >> we calculate our our health insurance exposure or or or budget. Um by going employee by employee. Um so we literally have

034everybody on a spreadsheet and the level of coverage, whether it's single plus one or family or no coverage. Um and and that is what rolls up um on the town. We we add a placeholder employee um to try to capture things like people moving from single to >> to um family. Um we did not do that on the board of ed side because the pressure is the budget pressure is so tight because it would you'd be looking at a you know it's it's essentially 40,000 bucks. Um, and that's there's a lot of stuff in here that's below 40,000 that we hate to lose. >> Yeah. The the thing about hiring young teachers, right, beginning teachers is eventually um they're going to have family and then they switch from the single plus one to family plan

035and that's a significant increase. And I can tell you that we do have some potential family changes. So, so to follow that up, um, 3 million, call it 3 million out of 21,000 that's or 23,000 that's basically 18. That's 12% of our whole budget >> is is just health insurance, which we can't do anything about. Most of our budget we can't do anything about. So, but that's, you know, just to put a percentage on it's 12%. >> Yeah. So, thank you. And frankly, it's it's it's nerve-wracking because you don't, you know, sitting in my seat, you don't want to miss somebody's coverage or have somebody marked single who's actually family. I mean, that's that's 15,000 bucks right there. >> Um, so we're we're pretty diligent in going over it as as we work it into

036the model. >> Kathleen, >> yes. Once we get towards the end of it, is it possible to run this by object code so that we can roll up health insurance and salaries? Yeah. Um, you're right, Kathleen. The detail pages show it by organ object, but also by department. So, you don't have the total work, >> right? I guess I guess >> and it is good to look at totals. And to answer your question, if you go into the detail, you can see that 1% that the health insurance in the high school is 37,000, which is a little bit over 1% of that 4.1%. >> So that would line up with the estimate of about 3% on the salary side. Yes. >> Right. because I I will say there there was not a lot of movement

037on the on the things like um instructional supplies, office supplies, that type of stuff. Like the departments really held the line, the schools and the departments held the line on on those. And then and then of course Belinda has her u her pet items that she strikes immediately. Well, it's just that you have to look at what the teachers are requesting. I've been here nine years, so I know along the way. Okay. Well, that that program got x amount of dollars. You know, we'll give a little bit to the program, but um I don't think we said completely. I don't think there's anything in the budget that we completely zeroed out. Um but we gave a little piece. >> Well, some of Excuse me. Can Oh, I'm sorry, >> Justin. Go ahead. Um, so couple

038of general I once again I think this is very detailed and I appreciate it. I know where we go every year. >> Um, what was our starting number before you guys >> before you >> started crunching and dicing and slicing anything? What was that number? I would say it was about it was three to $400,000 higher. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> So plus400k we'll say >> so 241. >> Yeah. >> Well, you can see that on my memo 177,000 of it is is right here, >> right? >> Um there was probably another 50 in technology. Um I'm telling you out of the schools, not much came out. Um, we all know that our budget is just about 80% or a little bit more of salary. >> Um, and so the money is always in the

039people. And the problem is that for nine years we've been cutting people and we're down to we can't operate a school system any longer the way we have been going. And the that's why rather than me push forward my recommendations on what we should cut which is the typical thing that I do every year I think we need to have a conversation around what are the pros and cons of for example I'll throw one thing out there and let's not proverate on it but okay each school has some permanent subs right >> some of those subs take healthcare some might not um but the cost of that is a fixed cost every year. We can pull those permanent subs out. I can tell you what the downside of that is. The downside of that is

040we're not going to have people covering classes. Kids are going to get doubled up. Um we're going to have issues when we have the flu and all of that. the and this other subline is going to go up but we implemented those positions but there is some benefits and I'm I haven't figured out on the four people that we do have hired you know who takes the health care benefits and that's my next um work to be done but you know that's a conversation that we can have is this something we're willing to sacrifice and roll the dice on. Um there's a couple of other things that are a little bit more charged that I'd like to bring forward um through my brief so that you can look at it and then we can talk

041about it on the 21st. Um none of it's good. Um and I got to be honest with you, I spent a lot of time trying over the break trying to figure out, okay, you know, are there any positions that I am missing that we could reduce and still work the district? I'm going to say to you, no. Um, not without a lot of angst because we've pulled out multiple positions that I believe were key positions that we are suffering for it now, but we're making do. And I think that's what Thompson Public Schools has done. They they they make do, but we're at a breaking point where something's going to give. And you're going to have to make some. And me, too. some hard decisions around are we going to start hitting programs for kids

042and that's that's where we're at. Um and so I think that we should have a focused discussion on personnel and I am going to prepare a document for you that will give you my the the pros of taking it out and the cons of taking it out. Um but there's more cons than anything else. And I think, you know, for the board members that have been here, you know, how we've scraped down to um, you know, taking out positions and we're starting to make good gains and we're coming up. Um, so pull out reading teachers, we might as well, you know, forget the movement going forward because that'll all collapse. So there's a lot of things that, um, we've got to discuss around personnel because that's where the money is. Kathleen had her hand up

043first. >> Yeah, I did. Um, there are also for the new members, there's also teachers in here whose salaries on in here because of the federal grants, the idea grants. >> Yes. And that's actually a a great example of a a little nugget of information that shows up in the object definitions. Um I think this budget has four who are grant funed >> and that's you'll you'd find that on 50 104 I think >> four teachers we have a a career um career pathway support coordinator the um media specialist the circulation specialist and yeah those two positions are on Alliance, which is different from those four federal grants. Um, and math lab teachers are on Alliance right now. >> Okay. >> Um, other than that, that's 200 grand. I mean, that's not a lot of

044money. Um, but it does we stretched it pretty far this year. >> Heather, um, piggybacking off of the the salaries stuff. Um, is it possible, and I know we've talked about it before, and I can't remember if it was or wasn't possible, or maybe we have it somewhere. Um, one of the sticking points and things that, um, people who aren't familiar with our budget when they do look at it eventually always freak out about is when they see large numbers and it says salary and they assume it's one person. Is there any way that we can say 2.5 people or four people? Um because otherwise they see $300,000 for high school social studies and they're like, "Oh my gosh." You know, what are they paying these people? >> And then it it that it spirals

045from there. >> True. >> Um >> yeah, I know. >> It's like use your head. >> I don't know where you can put that. view. >> I I could put it in the the >> code. Yeah. Something it's in here. Is that >> account description >> even if it's a separate document that says >> the object code and then the number of >> people that are the problem like the problem with at the object code level you have the teacher object code in all of the schools. >> So for example, it's the the third one on the sheet. We'll see it says teachers account description. Like for instance, there's only going to be one middle school social studies. There's going to be one high school social studies. Do you want I can break that down

046in a document if people want to look at >> my concern is that pe people usually are looking at this >> and they've never come to a meeting and they're looking at it with much background or knowledge and then they just see you know ad admin salary $400,000 but it's for PE whatever you know what I mean >> is there a way that >> yeah account description and just a little parenthesis that says 4.5 or something >> like 926 and I just randomly picked one. There's no way that there's a single high school science teacher at $230,000 cuz I'm in the wrong profession. >> There wouldn't be another account description that would say HS science salary. That's the only one and there's three or >> so we could add a parenthetical like for example three,

047>> right? >> Yeah. >> And just pull it or can a column to it. >> That's a lot lot to update. Yeah, >> right. >> But yes, we can we can give it a go. >> But I think if if we had if we have the data for discussion, at least we have the data. Right. Right now, we don't know if that's two or three. We know it's not one. >> Right. >> But we don't we don't >> we not even us the board members know if that's two or three until we're told that that's three. >> Right. So, I think it that was and to piggyback on the back of Heather's, I just want to confirm pretty much every salary on here except for that set of salaries that we approved raises on in

048April. >> The the non-certified staff >> certified staff. Everything else in here is contracted salary, correct? Yeah. >> Right. >> Yes. There's a non ser 10 I think. >> Yeah, there's >> I think there's 10 that are outside. >> Sorry, one more. >> Go ahead. >> Do we have a revenue line somewhere? >> No, there's no revenue line on there. The the if if you're thinking of the ECS grant uh that that is on the town side, it's actually part of the town's budget. I was thinking about >> excess cost. >> No, I was thinking about the um >> Medicaid. >> Like we've got Eastcon coming in for night welding. >> They're not going to be they're not >> they're just paying some bills potentially to run the program, >> right? But those >> like

049the security officer is going to fall under this budget. If we don't have something to offset that security officer being here extra hours, >> it's going to be build separately. So, it won't be even hitting the BOE budget. >> So, you I know what you're thinking. How do you record the ins and outs? >> Yeah. Like, how are we going to show that? I mean, that's a >> we got reimbursed for it, >> right? Usually those reimbursements are relatively small. You know, every every now and then if when we rent a facility out or something like that, that I think will be >> right. But they've said that part of the agreement would they'd be paying for the gas, they'd be paying for equipment, they'd be paying for things >> that are consumables um that

050currently probably are in this budget >> that was in our budget >> right now. It is. Yes. But it Yeah. But even so regardless of that piece of it, like there's >> facility costs that we're going to incur that are going to be offset by a dollar a check that they're going to be writing to the district. How are we going to show that in this budget? I would suggest because this is a little different than any, you know, revenues that we see on the smaller rentals. They're going to have to pay for the that's different. They're going to have to pay for security. >> We could do what how we've handled kind of similar items in the past. We could set up it's not a grant, so just bear with me on the use

051of that word, but we can set up grant accounts for Eastcon Welding Program revenue. And then what we can do, so we would park that in the in the grant fund and we would offset that >> at the end of the year. So let's say we got $30,000 from them. We would take $30,000 of security salaries, consumables and we would reclass that out of the BOE budget so that it would net to zero. Uh and then and that's how because we we aren't actually allowed to have a revenue account on the BOE side and that's that's why it's handled in in >> how would we handle if the had a tuition student would >> not one but say we did say we did yeah so that would more than likely be the same thing we

052do sometimes receive funding from districts because for you know if it's a DCF placement or foster placement where the other district has to pay for special ed. We do receive checks in, but you put that against the special ed cost. >> Um I still think in this budget and Bill and I differ on this opinion, um in my former district, which seems like a lifetime ago, we always uh had a revenue line for excess cost and a revenue line for Medicaid just so it was there. Um, and I think that I still think we should call it out somehow in the budget. I don't care how. It's just that after last summer, right? Uh, with the Medicaid, um, I think we need to say these are the dollars that are projected or anticipated revenue. >>

053Um, you do that on the or you used to do that on the town side with the um, preschool tuition. you would do an anticipated um tuition um which is a whole other conversation. But um the bottom line is that I I still think that those are two income sources that should be called out in the budget. >> Well, like we know, you know, we've done in the past the ECS income source. We kind of know some of our income sources, but I think if that's going to be a thing, and we've already announced that that's going to be a thing here, >> it sounds like it's part of popularity, >> and it's got some it's got some legs. >> I know. >> Um >> y >> So, but if we can't show those ins

054and outs, I think we're going to run into a well now, are the taxpayers of Thompson supplementing this program? What are we doing? >> That question was already asked was how much is this going to cost me in taxpayers? And what we need to be able to show is is that it's not costing us money. It's >> either either a net zero or a net benefit to the district. And there's some >> and and fiscally I know it's not going to be a net benefit, >> a open book net benefit to the district, right? Where there's going to be supplies and some other stuff that are going to offset it. I think it's going to be great for district visibility, but I think net net dollar-wise, I think it looks like it's got to look

055like a zero. >> Yeah. Um I should have a better handle on that within the next couple of weeks. We have a couple of meetings lined up. um really is the the devil is in the details of that contract where we thought it was just going to be, you know, um a simple thing has now gotten really tangled up um in some contract language and lawyers, not our lawyers, but on the state side. Um so, um I'm hoping to get some clarity around what that contract is going to look like. So, and how they're going to call out. They're paying for the gas, they're paying for the steel, they're paying for the all the soldering supplies. So, >> Jess, I've got one more, but I'll >> let we'll let Matt go first. >> Excuse me.

056Um, salaries. Speaking as somebody on the negotiating committee, >> we are, you know, so salaries go up on average two and a half to three and a half% per year depending on the union, depending on the year, depending on, >> but we are the lowest in pretty much every union category in the region. And so the salaries is really, you know, yes, it goes up. It goes up. Everything goes up every year, but there's not much we can do about it. and we can't be any lower because then people just start walking out the door to go someplace else. Any place else they're already getting paid less than other places. So that's just my two cents on the salary issue and we don't pay our people enough. But >> well, we're also a binding arbitration

057state. So the union could go to arbitration and then we are ordered to pay >> right >> whatever. We do strike the best deal we can with all of our unions and the unions are generally very cooperative. Um, >> so that's that's that's my two cents on salaries. >> I've been watching the board negotiate contracts for now nine and a half years and I can say that the board members really try to hold the line but also be respectful of the staff that that are are are lowest in wages in the region. Um, and so um, yeah, it's it's a challenge. Um, but uh I want to make sure that we retain our teachers. We're fortunate that we have retained a lot of our teachers and they're willing to stay with us. I think that,

058>> you know, goes back to our principles creating work environments that um people want to stay here. So, Win Thompson is a great place to work. >> You two have been quiet. Do you have any comments before I go back to the other side of the table? I think my only thing would be so why are we not allowed to show whatever money would be coming from you know the state program with the >> we can't we just would do it in a grant fund. It's it's this this program would probably be the most by far the most significant income like that we would get >> because like we just can't put another line here that states like >> that's what we would do. another line, but I I have to think of how it

059would fit in the booksh >> and it would be it would be >> in the in the grant fund. >> Okay. >> And I we can just talk about that and it it's similar to the way we handle Medicaid >> on the Medicaid front. >> The problem there is >> the reason that isn't built directly into the budget in that particular item is because there are so many factors that drive how number one, we don't get a lot of money. I think as everybody understands now >> um very clearly um but there's so many factors that go into uh what we can >> what we can ultimately recoup and be reimbured for. >> So in some ways it would be irresponsible to say you're going to we think we're going to get $60,000 because we

060almost you never get that close, >> right? you know, so so if you did and and then you run the risk of if you under guess then >> you know might think oh you're trying to lowball and then so so I think the decision at one point was made to put it in grants to make sure that we >> hit the nail on the head >> every year >> and my other thing was the eastcon how many students >> because either two or three I'm not sure that number >> and do we know like gradewise like I can't give that information because my thought is are they seniors where they don't become our problem next year? You know what I mean? They're no longer students sort of thing, right? They >> tell you they're not

061seniors. >> You know what I mean? That's my thing because I know when we get the reports you can see how many like we have a higher number of 11th and 12th graders that are going to killingly versus lower. They're go right they're dropping off soon. They're graduating. I know it will recycle, right? Some will come and go. We hope we don't lose more students out, but do we look at those numbers and say, "Well, so if they're under 10, we're should not report that because it can identify a student." Even me making a comment that two or three students could identify those students, right? Um so typically, uh districts will put an asterisk there, um if it's anything under 10 students, whatever that number is. Um, I can say that the students that I

062know that are there are not >> we have them there for a little bit. >> We're going to have them for a while. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> And that was my thing. I got when we build this budget, are we looking at we have however many seniors for killingly oags get manipulated, they're gone and now we estimate maybe five or something. We've been holding steady around the same number between 20 and 26 students at the BOAD total, you know, grades 9 through 12. Um, last this current year, we have very few students that went in as freshmen. Um, we hear that might change next year. We don't know until the kids actually register and get accepted. Um, but if that is true, we had reduced that budget this year based on what we knew,

063>> right, >> going into going into this year for 9th graders. But we're hearing that there might be a few more students that are interested in the program there. Um, I hope that doesn't play out that way, but um, we have to have a safety net there because I don't know where we would get the money to pay that tuition. >> Right. If I if I could, Jess, because this this actually you brought up a just kind of sparked a thought >> in general, especially in pupil services. Um there's a you can look at that budget a couple ways. You say, "Boy, this seems to go up every year, so let's budget for expecting another three kids to come in." Unfortunately, those numbers are enormous. >> Yeah. and then oh well maybe maybe we could

064pick up a little budget money by thinking oh maybe a few of them will move out because that's the thing that can literally happen. >> Um last year all of all of you guys will remember at the very end of the budget process we had a few students move into town >> right as we were finalizing the budget that that affected the special ed budget by to the tune to $300,000. Um, so what we sort of settled on as a board, um, you guys have settled on the board. I'm I don't get a vote, >> just to be clear. Um, we budget for we look at our population of students right now and we budget for that next year. >> We just hold, >> right? Because because that way you can't really be accused of

065trying to pat it by adding students or trying to lowball it by cutting students. This is what we know about right now. And and last year was a perfect example. It was late in the game when that when those kids moved in and we reacted immediately in the budget and built it in for next year because we had that it was we knew we've got those guys. So let's accom let's let's make accommodations in the budget for it. >> Is Amanda on? >> She was. She >> is. She is. >> Amanda, do you have any questions? I don't want you to leave you out. I don't think that's the same Amanda. >> Okay. Um, >> not ours. Okay. Kristen, >> is there a time frame or deadline of when students have to tell you that

066they're going to killingly or can they like special ed halfway through the year? Just >> exactly. >> Ellis now figures it in the same way too. Ellis is a transportation cost, but uh for QMC and um Killingly um it we're on the hook if they register there prior to October 1st and we're build for that. If they transfer to Killingly after that date and Killingly accepts them, we're not charged for the year we're in. >> Well, >> okay. >> Can't we just encourage our students to do that? Just just to lay out a couple. >> Justin, did you have anything else? >> No, I got a couple. >> Okay, go ahead. >> So, we're going to get hit as we always do. We get hit with the enrollment. Somebody does a math equation on our

067current enrollment >> versus the 23,71. You know, somebody does that math. Now, I recently on a social media side on a completely different side of the world did some math. And if you do the rough math and you take out the pupil services portion of the budget and you do the math on total enrollment versus that total school, total enrollment versus that total school, we're right around 13 or 14,000 per student, per school, right? Give or take, we're somewhere in there. You add in the special education, of course, it pops up to 21, 22, 23. But we know that that's not it. 26% I think was last month's 26% of our population has the five million and change. Six >> extra >> six million and change. Five million change extra services. the 75% of our

068enrollment population has not much left. So I think when we go through this this year, one of the things that we really need to focus on because it's going to be compared a hundred times over is our general education students budget versus what is tacked on top of that. Because people are going to turn around and say, "Oh, well Marianapolis is 19,000. Oh, Woodstock is 21,000. 20,000." Great. That's 20,000. That's without any of the people services involved in it. Any the second you tack on any of that, those are hard dollar costs on top of all of that. So, where our enrollment is today, $7.90 and change, give or take, I think somewhere around. >> Yeah. Um, you know, you figure 75% of that. If we were to figure that all 785 were general education

069students, fine. We could totally throw out a budget tomorrow that we could hold to firm. That's not the luxury that we live in. There's 25% of our enrollment population that requires some sort of additional service for the least restrictive learning environment. And that is what are is the volatility in our budget. And to that end, and I've saved this comment in the past, but I think my filter's broken. Um, to that end, this year seems to be the year that general ed is definitely going to suffer because we have to supplement by law for least restrictive environment under people services. And I can't sit on this board and say yes to a budget when that's going to happen. to 75% of our population is going to get services cut, programs cut, something cut because the

070state and the federal law prohibits us from being able to have any other movement on that budget line. >> Great. But the other kids are also being cut though. It's not just because they're also part of that 75. >> They're still getting 100% of the population gets cut. Yes. Okay. >> But it's a minority set of students that impacts the majority set of students. You know, and I'm going to use a drastic example. If there's a set of residents that move into town that consume the entire music department's salaries and budget that we have to then move numbers for. and music department goes, a 100% of the population suffers. >> We've got we this town needs to start realizing that we don't have any room in this budget to wiggle anymore. We're we're shoestring and

071duct taped as it is. >> And and we've been accused over the years of padding and moving and this that and the other thing. And enough's enough. It's about We got to be honest. And we got to be honest with each other this year because this is getting it's getting dicey. >> So So not that I want to throw this off the rails, this discussion for FY27. However, on Monday night, the discussion I'm going to bring forward is for you to allow me to go to the board of finance, write a letter, I'll draft it. Um, we need a supplemental allocation to get through this year. We know it has to go to referendum. We know it'll more than likely fail. And then the board is going to have to make a hard decision and

072take the advice of our attorney and start to look at what legal aspects we have because we can't make that budget. And I think this is going to be your pivotal year. Um because in the past when we froze budget lines um you know we gave up whatever. Um and and somehow not that we had the money, we did away with things that we desperately needed, we just never got. And so we've done that time and time and time again. And this year, because we stripped everything we could think of out of the budget, um there's the freezing the budget right now is going to do nothing to that bottom line number for special ed. It is going to do nothing. Um and sure, maybe we get a break and somebody moves out, right? That's

073a high cost. But I don't I want the board to also focus on that we do have a 26% uh population of students with uh identified disabilities. You forget about the 40% of kids that have reading disabilities, right? And then the other percentage of kids and I don't know what that comes to for ELLL services, right? And then, believe it or not, under special ed, I mean, under pupil services, any enrichment programs, which we stopped to talk about, maybe AP classes and those kinds of things. Um, that's another certain population of students. So, when you look at it, it's just not pinpointing. Uh, we love to do that because it's a high number, but we also put a big investment in reading in this district. Why? Because our students aren't where they needed to be.

074We're starting to see all that work have a significant positive impact on our kids outcomes. It took us years to get here, but there's some big salaries there um just around reading. Um and so I this is the year that um the general budget will never offset the overage in special ed. It's just not. Daniellea had her hand up first. >> Um, not that I want to ever do it, but do we have to allow our children to go to killingly or anywhere? Like I don't know how that works. >> Okay. >> So, it's mandated. We don't we can't say sorry. >> And I would like to point out that they are only required to take one course to go there >> Per semester. garages >> and I've pulled transcripts to make sure that's happening

075and it is >> and that same thing for Ellis and everything we have to give them. >> We have to provide the transportation. >> Um QMC we pulled back on transportation years ago. We don't have a partnership with them but if a student goes there and we think we have three or four this year um we still get charged the tuition. So um >> but it's something required that we >> it's required. It's in in state regs and I have argued till I'm blew in the face about it. Um there's not much we can do even though they don't have a pathway to agriculture, >> right? >> They exploratory um similar to what we do with our career pathways, right? Um it's just that I feel like um they don't have a clear pathway with

076a series of classes that they have to take. they can pick and choose. Yeah. >> Um each semester, but the state is okay with that because and we should be too, I guess, is because this is the year students try out things to decide what career they're going to go down. So, um and um yeah, that number is insignificant when you think about special ed, reading disabilities, ELLL, all of that. I mean, what is it, 83,000 this year? I mean, it's a small number um compared to um the high population of students that need specialized instruction in Thompson public schools. Um and there's a lot of correlations you can look up in research why that is. Um SCES is a big thing. You know, so socioeconomic status has a direct correlation to special education and

077um reading disability. That's why Title One was developed back in the day. Um but and we've benefited from that, but we don't even get that much money for Title One. It doesn't even fully cover a a reading teacher salary. Um so I think this is a pivotal year for it's going to be a a challenging year for the members of the board and I apologize to the new members, but um we have to ask for a supplemental allocation. We're not going to make it this year. Um, and it's not like we could put the brakes on spending. We There hasn't been anything that's come through that's really been an extra expense. It's basic stuff, crayons, paper, um, that that's coming through. Repairs, um, building repairs and things that are breaking down are happening more frequently.

078Um and uh that'll flush out in budget when Bill gets here when he starts to talk about um facilities. Um talk about the alarm system. Let's talk about the aging camera system. You know, after the uh school shooting at Brown, cameras are important, right? I need to go on record telling you that our cameras are not are need to be upgraded. We have to do that. We have to put it somewhere in the five-year plan. We're still waiting for some security grant money to come along. We haven't seen it in two or three years now. >> So, it just seems like everything is starting to line up in a bad way. Um, and I, you know, I've been doing this for a long time and I that's why I want to have a discussion with

079you folks because I'm at a point where all those places that we typically look for to make reductions over the nine and a half years, we've already done it. Um, so I'm at a loss, Max. >> So I've been on the board for four years or so, give or take. It's all a big blur, but I've been but I've been involved >> in the board for a long time and and sat there for a long time and I've been watch and it's kind of the same thing every year, but every year it's like we just keep whittling away at the at the muscle, whittling away at the tendons and there is nothing but bone left and it's >> it's sad, >> you know, and every year you come up with some kind of magic. Oh,

080well, we got this. Oh, well, we got this. Oh, we really don't need this. Well, we are down to we need everything that's left and there's not much left and we need it all just to keep the building standing and keep the >> and remember what our charges, right? Our charge is to provide >> so >> an education for these kids. Pretty >> unfair. But and we keep the the budget has to go to a vote. But and it's it's the same >> Yep. >> we keep pandering to the same people that are going to say no regardless. And it's no. And that's the only answer that they have is no. And so we need >> I don't know how. I wish I knew how. I really almost want to cry. I I I we

081we need to get the people that are the may and the yeses to show up and I don't know how to do that. Uh we have an amazing communications uh committee and they do a fantastic job, but >> I I I don't know I don't know what it is other than dragging people out of their homes to to to vote. I don't and honestly I I kind of How many voters do we have in this town? 5,000 6,000. >> Like 6,200. >> Okay. 6200. The fact that 1,000 people vote >> is a problem and then 3,000 complained. If if you don't show up, you don't you know I I don't know. I I am to the point of of tears basically. I because I don't know. I want I want this town to be successful

082and we can close the schools. We can close the fire departments and the kids are going to be running around burning things down and where will that be? So, it's it's really heartbreaking. >> I know it's incredibly frustrating and along the way, you know, we've done some really miraculous things. I think, >> you know, somehow we fell into some grant money. We made the right connections. We we've done a great deal that a lot of people are noticing. >> Yeah. >> Um and we should be proud of that work. Um but the very basics of you know teaching students to read and write um has to still be there and um there's not much else. Um you know I'll bring you some suggestions. We can talk about the positions. We can talk about the pitfalls

083of those positions being eliminated. Um and then when we come to you give me some kind of guidance. I'll go back and and give you my my final number before you stop to look at the budget line by line. But um I can't come up with $2 million. >> No, >> Kathleen, >> you've just when that schedule that we have in the package or the presentation where it shows how much they cut year after year after year. And I realize that the board of finance has to cut because their duty is to get a budget passed, >> but they cut us below our contractual costs. >> How are you going to run? How are we going to operate year after year after year below the inflation rate, below our contractual cost? And as you said,

084last year we cut six positions. We can't continue to do that. And yes, our Our our enrollment has declined. >> It has. >> And we have cut positions >> to match that decline. >> But you still have to teach the three Rs. And we still have to offer enough courses up in the high school to pass to get your get >> 25 credits. >> Yeah. The the credits to get your degree. And it's just I don't know where you go. And I think Melinda, I will support you 100%. Um, we have to give a shock to this town. Hey, wake up guys. You cannot keep doing this. And unless you find a school to regionalize with, which no school wants to regionalize, there is no the answer. >> Ma'am, >> so whether Mr. Herbert was

085sitting here or not. I wouldn't say I No, I I would honestly say that the current board of finance I think is working with >> us a lot better than previous boards of finance and I appreciate that and that's whether you're sitting here or not, Steve. I really do appreciate that. Um and if if it was up to me and I had the independent financial wherewithal to do it, I would go and sue the state to get money. You know, it's not feasible. The town doesn't have the money, but the state is not holding their end of the bargain. It's but and I can say that I can say that every >> suing the town, right? You never sued the state. I've never heard of a case of no, >> but no, but I mean

086something something has got to give. The town the the the town doesn't have the money to to the state is not doing their job. >> No. Absolutely. >> And and I don't know unless one of us sitting here runs for governor, it's not going to happen. Um, and I our current administration is not going to deal with it. And the current uh legislature has no spine to do it either. And it's really unfortunate and those that do just seem to be in the minority. Um, so it's it's really they've abregated their duty to educate the students in the state. Heather, >> is there any creative way that we can because one of I think the untapped um portion of voters or maybe even not registered voters is our parents. Um you know, the parents may

087or may not be registered. The parents may or may not be going out to vote. Um theoretically, if they every single mom and dad to every single student we have actually voted, um I think the tide would turn. >> Sure. Um, I know we can't legally um plead for a yes vote um as the board of ed. However, is there any creative ways that we can um interact with our families at um events or parent teachers or something on a more um generic uh standpoint like getting them registered to vote? um are you know like having that availability at parent teacher nights. Oh, are you a registered voter? Um you know, budgets, you know, get passed by those who vote. Here's a registration, you know, like trying to like um at least uh make people

088aware because like I I think I've explained this scenario once before, but it literally blew my mind. This was a college educated nurse who had a child who who I my children were of the same age um and they were in their teens the child so they'd lived here for 12 13 years at this point and I nonchalantly had mentioned oh don't forget to vote you know at a birthday party or something to her and she goes oh there's a budget vote >> when is that and I'm like oh well it's every April or May you know every year we have to pass a budget She didn't even know where her polling place was. She's lived in town for 15 years, a parent of two children in our district. So, I know there's a population

089of people in our town that um probably aren't registered and definitely aren't voting. And I just don't know if if we can tap into that at school functions while we have a captive audience in a creative way that is not >> you know basically registration campaign can be happening in every school. There can be something at every event that we can call out and making them aware statement if you are new to town. Yeah, >> you know here is the voter registration. I mean we can generically do that. >> I think we especially need gearing up to like anytime be basically now to budget vote day. We should be taking an opportunity to let people know that the the boat, you know, the budget vote will be this date. Have you been registered? If not,

090it's very easy. You know, this these is this is how you can do it and and just kind of keep keep harping on it almost at every chance we get because at least they know the date, they know how what to do and if it's on them then at that point, okay? You know, >> I mean, I can certainly put my mind to that reminder constantly >> and making some posters and having them, hey, are you registered to vote? Right. >> You know, here are the forms, right? >> Danielle and I can do that. >> And I don't know like Frank or Eileene, you know, in the voter off the register. >> They're very they're very helpful and obviously with getting students registered that are eligible. You know, I don't know if there's any creativity

091that we can get with them to to have them be present at key things like a parent teacher night or something to have a table. You know, >> they come they come for the students. So, I would imagine they would do that. >> I'm just wondering if if they knew in advance of some dates, you know, like this the spring parent teacher, whatever it is, March, February, whatever it is. >> Well, the you know, an upcoming event in a couple of weeks is the mystery dinner theater, right? >> Right. or the when is the big when is the big show the Willy Wonka or March March. >> Okay. So like Willy Wonka. Can they come to Willy Wonka? >> Here's your golden ticket >> and stay like be at the concessions table, you know, and

092be like registering people to vote. >> Yeah. I wouldn't even >> I don't know. >> But I think as much as I apologize for interrupting, as much as there's getting registered to vote, it's just educating people on what is going on. There's so many people in this town >> that think this is closed doors. Well, not only think that this is closed door, but think that this budget is >> take 23,711,294, divide it by 785 and and that's what we're paying per student. And that's it's not there's so many other aspects of this budget. I mean, we're going to spend the next three months every Monday. Hi. >> sitting here talking about this and at the end of the day it's going to come down to a vote in April that's going to go yes

093or no based on somebody saying 23,711,000 divided by 785 and that's where we're at. Look, these districts are doing it cheaper. Move on. Vote no. It's I hate to say it. We've been Matt you you've said it every year and I was naive the first year and I said no you know we got to really at this point let's put I motion to approve. >> Yeah. >> I'm not my time on Monday my time on Monday nights your time administrator's time. Bill's time on Monday nights, you know, shoot, add the 400,000 into it to give the board of finance something and the town's people to think they cut something special this year. >> Motion, you know, motion to send this budget forward. >> Yeah. Hold on. >> Because Daniela didn't have her hand up. >>

094Serious. >> Second. >> I will say multiple times, Melinda, you have announced at everything I've been to about coming out to vote. So, you you're already doing great. I am shocked at how many parents and community members didn't know to vote or where to vote um that I have met. And I'm like, "What? Huh?" Even this past fire one, there were a few people. They were like I'm like, "Oh, they saw my daughter had the vote sticker on." And they're like, "What did she vote for?" And I was like, "You got to go out today and vote about the fire." And they're like, "Huh? What?" Like, I don't know why people don't know. I don't know how we get people to know. And it's not just us. It's everywhere. It's everything. It's the whole town.

095Um, I know someone made a comment. They said, "Oh, yeah. I got a call from a friend that said, did you see in the turnpike about going out to vote for the fire?" She goes, "That thing comes in the mail. I throw it in the trash." So, she had no clue because that was the only place she would have seen it. Um, we have to figure out how to get out to people in a way. I don't know what that is. Um, but I do agree with Justin that was going to be my thing. Let's just, for all I care, you can add another 100,000 to this. Go for it. It's gonna get denied no matter what anyway. So, let's just >> Well, you know, Groundhog's Day. >> So, I know that in the past,

096I don't I forgot how many years ago it was, two years, three years ago, we did try to say, "Oh, hey, you know, oh, this the special ed numbers are a little bit low. Let's let's go ahead and >> bump it up a little bit because we know somebody is gonna move into town. And but Bill, you you correctly did say, "Well, you can't do that because if you had it and blah blah blah, >> but we wouldn't if we had done that for this year, we possibly wouldn't have had that problem." And I'm not saying that, you know. >> No, it would have been cut anyway. So it it's yeah, we we can I I I will second I will second Justin's motion to to send the 23711 294 to the board of finance.

097>> There's nothing left to cut. >> I would like to have another meeting. We have to do the presentation and I'd like to review this and understand it because we have to defend it. >> We have to do the presentation. >> We have to prepare the presentation. just in Sirius. So his motion was to move the budget of 27 sorry >> 23,711 sorry that so freaking exhausted. So the feel free to edit that later. Um to the board of finance and Matt seconded it. Okay. And we'll >> well to we have to do it to a regular meeting first, right? >> To a regular board of ed meeting for approval >> because this is a this is technically a budget workshop, right? >> This is a meeting. >> Open to the public. >> It's open

098to the public. >> Yeah, it's this is a meeting. We can do this. This is a budget budget meeting. You can do this. >> And then your regular vote of bed meeting. You just do regular board events stuff. >> Okay. >> And maybe you put the emphasis on those other Oh, it's not for discussion. >> No. All right. So, we have a motion and a second on the floor. >> Go around the table. Justin, >> yes. >> Heather, >> not yet. No. >> Yes. >> Matt. >> Kristen? >> No. >> Rick? >> Yes. >> Daniela? >> Sure. Kathleen? >> Yes. >> I'm going to vote yes. >> Right. Now that doesn't mean that we still have to prepare the president these numbers. >> Right. But we'll use these numbers. >> Yep. >> Why not? >>

099Chairman. >> Yes, ma'am. >> And maybe we put the emphasis on the meetings we have on the books on how to get the word out. >> Yep. >> Yeah. If if I may raise my hand. >> Yes. >> We need to follow and step ahead on what Heather said. We need find out how to communicate to those 5,000 people. >> Yeah. That's >> and and last year as I read the shoppers guide and there were 700 that voted no and apparently that was all that showed up because every referendum failed on 700 votes. Somehow we sitting at a table at the schools uh every day or something um the shoppers guide we talked about that at our meetings. We got to find out a way to talk to the parents and the grandparents and those

100that are here in the town. And I'd love to explore how do we communicate to the state. I don't know if we have a lawyer that'll pro bono or something, but we need to find out. There was an opponent in the selectman's u vote if you would that didn't win but I sat there and tal to talked to him outside the library and he had a lot of ideas >> and I don't know why that's not coming forward because we need to find a way to get the quiet corner out because I've seen a mailer that came to me from both >> senators that that they did so much for the area or the districts for money and I'm going well where is that because I keep hearing we're not getting it and I understood

101there was more that the state had promised but then have folded on right and so I'd love to find out how we go after that >> thank you >> I think that you have to remember when you talk about the parents and the families that we're at like what 40% % poverty. So, >> not necessarily just getting every parent to vote is going to secure you the outcome that you may wish for. Like there are people in the town that they want these things and actually literally can't afford the taxes. And I'm >> Yeah, >> I'm a huge like me personally not as a board member. Yes. Person like I'm not but I think it's you just kind of have to remember >> Yeah. the like the bigger Yeah, >> it's true. >> Picture. >>

102Are we able to find out >> if poverty comes out or not? Do you know what I'm saying? Like >> like who actually shows up to vote, what the the voting demographic, >> right? Like the demographic of it. >> So we can pull the voter roles. >> We have pulled them in the past. >> We've asked the registar and they will show us who voted at every single vote. Um, it doesn't tell you how they voted, but it just says they showed up. >> And you'd be shocked to see who didn't show up. And it's a lot of parents. Sometimes some staff >> staff. Lots of staff don't show up. >> Some some Yeah. Some staff don't show up, but it's people that you would not have guessed that didn't bother to take the 15

103minutes out of their day, you know. >> Um, so it is shocking and we we we do pull those on occasion and review them to see who who is showing up and who isn't. It's tedious. We did the cross reference between not this year but last year. >> Yeah. >> Who voted >> and who are those parents that have kids in the system? >> Uh and and Heather's right. It was pretty shocking when you looked at um who didn't vote and and then I know right >> who's whose children are reaping >> some of these services that we're we're sitting here grappling. How are we going to continue to afford? >> Well, it also allowed us too to have a more targeted approach to some of the conversations we were having of explaining >> why

104those particular >> if we were voted no res, I'd be happier than voting no and nobody came out, right? If if it's the same 700 people that show up just to vote no every single time and we can only muster 600 people that come out and vote yes when we know there's a a bullpen of 2,000 more people that could vote yes if they just got off their butts. >> Every time we could win every budget every time. And yes, I there are people that can't afford it, but it's you're talking about $50 a year, $100 a year, not thousands of dollars a year when these budgets go up a little a little bit. At some point, the dam is going to burst and the building is going to fall down. And where are we

105going to be then? Because we still have to provide an education to the students that are in town. when this building falls down because we haven't spent a dime on it in 40 years, >> somebody's gonna have to pay for it and it's not gonna be the state >> come after us to say why. >> Why? >> I agree with you. I'm just >> it's not if you look at our school population, right? >> Just counting solely on parents may not be the answer. You need to reach out because that within itself may not >> and how many I met that didn't know, right? >> It was voting. I'm like, how? I see it everywhere and anywhere. How are you not seeing it? Right. >> It blew my mind. >> And there is a population

106of people left in this country, left in this state, left in this town that believe in education. >> And I I there is that core population of 600 people that are showing up to vote. Yes. But there are people that I don't I don't know the reasons. >> But the town itself, the town, not the board of ed, because it's a communication subcommittee. I've never met And I mean this in the 46 years I've been doing this, never met a welloiled machine who have put out so much time and effort to try to figure out how to get parents to vote. But on the town side, and this is a criticism, um they've done little to encourage people to vote and and they have the bigger pot of the pie, right, with the population. Heather,

107you worked with Amy a couple of years in a row to try to get more information out to the town's folks, but >> there has to be and if you're you're running into people that don't even know that something critical is up for a vote, um I think we we need to figure out and maybe with the new first selectman and and the new selectman, maybe when we have our joint meeting, that should be an agenda discussion. How are we going to work together to make this happen and get more people to have voice in the town? >> Because going for a supplemental allocation this year >> is going to be like lighting a fuse, right, Bill? It's going to be like lighting a fuse. And the problem is that the board of ed is

108going to have to do what's right by kids and you're going to have to move forward if that referendum and the supplemental allocation fails. And my in my heart of hearts, I know what's going to happen. And so, you know, are you prepared for that? Because that's going to be a a tremendous backlash. But at the end of the day, you can't keep operating like this. >> I mean, >> I'm frustrated as heck because I can't come up with an idea. That's my job, right? To guide you and and and give you some ideas. Sure, I can give you some staffing ideas and I don't agree with any of them being cut, but the bottom line is that it's a frustrating place to be right now. Um, and there's got to be another strategy. I

109agree with >> the revenue. >> You got to figure out >> We have to find the revenue. >> Go ahead, Justin. >> So, there's a method to my madness for the motion. My method to my madness of the motion is to get it out there before the supplement to get this number out before the supplemental comes out. I also think >> a little bit of a headline is, you know, Thompson board of education sends full budget to, you know, uh, board of selectmen on first meeting, right? Headline tomorrow morning. Let's get some attention on this so that when we're having the discussions and the workshops over the next three months, maybe somebody's actually going to show up from the public and pay attention. >> Right? This is what we're putting forward. Whether we slice and

110dice and move 30,000, move a 100,000 here, move 100,000 there, this number for the most part probably isn't going to move that much between now and April. So, let's let's take the pressure off of us for the next three months. I the discussions we have around this table this time of year, awesome. I love them. But the pressure is now off. This is the number we're sending to the board of select. Now, let's have the real discussions. What do we have to do to keep this district moving in a forward direction? Let the board of selectmen and the board of finance come back to us and go, you guys took that a little rash. >> Change your number, fix it. But for right now, that that's my rationale. My rationale is let's spark the fire

111that gets a little attention on us for the next three months. >> Okay, >> Kathleen. >> Well, we have to defend that. part of the problem. And you're right, Matt, we have to go at we have to continue to go after the state and you too, Rick. We have to go after the state. The economic uh cost share that we get has not been changed in over 15 to 20 years. It's $10,500 per student. That's ridiculous. >> There's nobody in the state that spends less than $20,000 or $19,000 per student. and they have not raised it in over 15 or more years. So, we continue we have to continue. I looked that number up about two months ago. We have to continue to push on the state and that means Jeff Gordon and Me Flexer

112May Flexer and we have to continue that. >> It also means rallying the other boards of education to step up as well. We can't be the only ones screaming. Oh, well, you have the form to do that with that email thing. I don't know how that there is a there is a legislative breakfast that's going to be held in Brooklyn. Um, they changed the date. >> Is it the 17? >> Oh, yeah. I didn't see a new date. >> Uh, I I'm looking for the registration link. Um, what date is it? >> Not the 17th. That's a Saturday. that. >> Hold on a minute. I I'll find it. >> Yeah, >> because I'm gonna throw it out there. I've already been making inroads with several of the local uh board of ed chairs in regards

113to the concerns with the special education formula. Mhm. >> And I have several that are willing to step up and work as a group on that >> and add that discussion to that as well. >> You know how >> so where state reps tend to go is uh to this breakfast uh January 15th 7:30 to 9:30 at Middle School. You'll be getting a link to register. we'll send that out to you or you can just let us know. You can go and we will register you. I always go to those. Sometimes you get several reps from the state and sometimes you get one. Um but we're but the good news is is that your um professional organization um CAD um uh facilitates that discussion and there's always the board chairs there or some other board

114members that go to that breakfast um and there's good conversation around the table and it could spark some ideas about networking. Um, so, >> okay, Kristen, >> so you know how we wrote the letter and we are always asking people to sign it. Can I just have one copy and get like 4,000 people to sign it and send it to them or does it have to be like 4,000 separate? >> I don't see why. >> Make a big petition. >> Just make a big petition. >> I feel like it would be easier to do that. Like I could print one in every meeting I go to, >> like events. >> Yeah. like have people sign it versus >> relying on them all to send their own out. >> Yeah, >> you do it on a

115tablet. Can you do it on a tablet where you don't have to cover a form? >> I can make Jeff make a job. The issue is going to be duplicates, right? You're just going to have to watch out for duplicates, >> right? >> Signatures. Yes. >> Okay. >> I'm sure he can AI something that will say this one's already signed and nix it off the thing. Yeah, you can make them too >> because I because I've seen people standing outside of Market Basket and they assault me. I'm not I'm not I'm not a mass res but and they they just have a tablet, I believe. So, >> yeah, I think I have a better luck getting >> Yeah, that's a good to do it that way. >> I used to do it as a a

116list because I I've signed them when I was in mass. >> Now I decline, but yeah. Yeah, we ought to get there. Go ahead. Sorry. um the timing of this supplemental ask and the timing of the referendum, right? Where where are these two going to land, do you think, in an ideal world? >> So, we're already in the hole. >> Okay. >> Um what we learned along the way, Bill and I, is that um we need to go before the and Steve actually guided us. We need to go before the board of finance. We realize right now that we are over in special ed expenditures. We also recognize that the other lines in our budget, even if we freeze it, is not going to cover that amount of money. So, we know we're going to

117run deficit. So, the I'll draft a letter to you folks um for your Monday night meeting, but basically saying I'll throw out an arbitrary number um that we need a supplemental allocation not to exceed 500,000 for um uh overages and special education costs. Um, and we're requesting a supplemental allocation for the FY26 budget. >> Right. So if that if you have that letter to us for next meeting, it will go to board of finance by when and how long do they have to react and therefore then >> So they have a meeting next week. I just got an agenda item. I asked Robert to put on the agenda as a placeholder supplemental allocation request. Okay. And told him that you would be meeting on the 12th and I would get back to him on the

11813th. Okay. >> Um because we got to get it out there. >> Right. So, so if if they had it by the 13th, is there a legal time frame in which they have to respond and then >> So that's a Steve question. >> Okay. >> Yeah. I don't know the answer to that. >> Okay. What? >> Steve >> Sedor attorney Steve >> because there would still need to be it would still end up having to go to the selectman for a town meeting, >> right? And then they have to post it >> and then it's usually two weeks and then it's a referendum. >> So we're talking at least four to possibly fiveish >> weeks out. So, a little bit more than a a month after the 13th, which would get us to midFebruary to

119maybe end of February, which would only be six weeks potentially before a refer the real referendum budget for next year. >> The problem is, right, and I'm I'm just working here so long. The problem is that um even if it did pass then the subsequent FY27 budget is going to be significantly impacted by that. Not in a good way. >> Right. >> And then we'll this cycle will keep going. >> Yeah. It's a it's just a it's a cycle. Yeah. >> Justin >> town's already over on referendums because we're already three. So that that budget's >> gone to unnecessarily >> another referendum for another budget that's another 8,000 plus the actual referendum for this year's budget that's another 8,000. So we're I would I think that we need to make sure that at least one

120of the upcoming meetings we have a line to our board of education council um for some questions on how we can get the word out legally >> and appropriately um how we as a board have to behave and act in this process. Right. We found out something recently about what we can and can't say social media wise some otherwise like >> oh >> if if we're going to get down the road of legal action state town whoever we need to be above board 100% and we need to make sure our council has our backs on that 100%. Um, and then I think we need to understand before we go down this road of even seriously considering any type of action, we need to consider any repercussions and and have that discussion with Steve as a

121board in my opinion. Understanding that we've got a $1.6 million increase >> $ 1.9 million increase coming. Sorry. um and a $500,000 supplement that we're asking for. We've got a lot of things that are coming up. I think it's important to make sure that we have counsel um at least at at the ready for some questions if needed. >> Heather, >> and to piggyback off that, we've kind of done this twice now with council and asking him, and I don't ever find his answer to be cut and dry. I find it to be kind of wishy-washy gray and I don't know if prior if we do have this meeting now for the third time to talk about this same topic um that maybe you you you both talk to him in advance on it >>

122and tell him that we've now discussed this will be the third time and I we really need legal direct advice as to what is or isn't >> the process as far as promoting the vote in that the process to address overages in the budget. He has been very clear along the way that we have to go and we have to ask for a supplemental. >> We have to, you know, whether it goes out to vote, however the town responds, if it responds favorably, great. If it does not, um, then what's the recourse? and he always cites back to the Ellington case um that you know they did go through that process of uh ter you know bringing legal action against the town. Um I think you're at a breaking point at this point. I I

123I I have not I cannot think of any other place um that you're going to see reductions in this year's budget. There's just not um without without cancelling the programming, >> right? >> Like right now, stop at all >> and it's not the right thing for students for sure. >> I sorry. No, >> go ahead. >> I think we need like Heather was saying, I think we need some clear direction on social media behavior from board members. um how we're how we are directly allowed to interact with the public. Can we sit outside of a basketball game and have a table and say, "Hey, this is our budget for the next year. This is what's going on." Or, "Hey, we're asking for a this referendum coming up. This is the supplement that we're asking for.

124>> This is what it is. I'm not telling you to vote yes, but this is why it's coming out." Um we we need to be able and have some clear direction as to whether or not we can do certain things because through the years it's been like well you can have that table but the minute you say vote yes >> right >> you just can say yes there's a vote here >> Kathleen I understand that I what I'm trying to say is we need some clear direction from the attorney I it's not only vote yes it's >> what else can't we say or where where are our voices >> what are the lines specifically You can't, you know, you can't. >> We need like the dummy version, you know, the like >> do this, not

125that, do this, not that. Right. Right. >> You know, >> like if we were to put a budget pamphlet together, right, on the upcoming referendum, doesn't say vote yes or anything on it, but say we plaster it at every school event, every sporting event, every this, every that going forward to say, hey, this is what we're looking forward to this year. What is is that even legal? Because right, we're not saying vote yes, but we're saying here's the facts of the budget. >> Well, you just voted to move forward to the town that amount, right? You just voted that. That kind of cuts you off from that because now the budget moves forward. That amount moves forward and so you've already made that decision. there's always that sweet spot, right, that um they haven't sent

126it out for referendum um that >> I tend to try to use if there's a group >> or something. >> You know, we subtly have put it in some communication around the play. There's always a page in there about voting. Um we've put an insert in there. I mean, we've we've been pretty creative along the way. You really have. >> Um >> but I think that's the question, right? Like what can we regardless of whether or not it was approved by a board of ed not approved like we need to be able to talk about the budget year round 247 365 and what can we say and and we've never gotten really clear direction as to what we can say at school events where went how why >> okay >> you know can we >>

127you and I can set a meeting with Steve >> you know what I'm Jess am I making sense >> no you're making sense I understand where you're coming from on it because there's been a set of rules of which Melinda has had to follow because of previous incidences that have occurred prior >> where she's had to hand where she's been held to a certain standard and we've kind of piggybacked off of that >> rather than actually digging into to see what are we actually allowed to see and say at specific events because she's not the one saying it, we are. And that's I think something that we need to we definitely need to be doing that. And I'd also like to pick Steve's brain a little bit because I have some ideas for the communication

128subcommittee in regards to potentially doing maybe some sort of meet and greet coffee hour style meetings um to let people come and ask the questions and have those face to face because they may not feel comfortable coming here or on Zoom but they're more willing to meet two people at wherever. Correct. >> Mhm. >> As long as it's not on school graphs. Correct. >> I think Killing Lee did something recently and their selectment. >> Yeah. They do like a >> Yeah. Woodstock board of vet did did one. I I screenshotted it like two years ago. Yeah. It was a ask almost like an ask me anything budget. Come come come talk to us blah blah blah. >> Right. And in regards to educating residents on how town government works and voting and all of that,

129I know the 250th is starting a citizens academy. I actually have a meeting for that on Friday. Um, so we're going to be doing it'll be like a seven-week program of actually educating residents on here's how town government works. Here's how you register like going all the way down to how to register to vote to where your voting precinct is. At least that's the direction I'm pushing it in. >> And we should probably leverage the the help of the alumni. >> Yes, ma'am. >> I'm wondering if like again, not saying vote yes, but just simply a date. Um if if having like a generic yard like sign and literally like 20 of them at each entrance of all of our hills and it just says referendum vote and we can handr write the new so

130it's can be reusable you know um and just say and put them out like two weeks in advance you know what I mean and just have them littered up and down the side you know side of the thing so this the parents literally at all of their parent drop off sporting events >> can't say you didn't >> see it they didn't how can you say you didn't know, you know, >> but the town could certainly do that, >> right? I'm just saying like property just posting the date, simply the date, you know, >> and a reusable generic sign that can be reused and updated every single time, you know. Matt, >> two things. Th this town level voting is our most fundamental form of the democracy that we have in this country. >> And lots

131of places don't have this level of town >> government. Um so that's this is it. I mean if you can't you can't say you want to live here and not participate. Uh, and also our taxes, for as much grumbling as people had over the um re-evaluation and the >> Mhm. >> our taxes are still some of the lowest around. And that's because people keep saying no. And yes, until at some point the buildings are going to crumble and >> yeah, it's it's but we we have to pay for things and done. Then it's only January. >> Yep. It's only January. >> Any further discussion on the budget? >> I just have the question. >> Yes, ma'am. >> So, we we will be holding the 21st. >> Yeah. We >> And so, you don't need me

132to bring forward. I'll put it in my brief of what I was thinking about just in case. >> Don't Don't cut anything else, >> right? >> We don't We can't. >> Yeah. >> I mean, we can have those, >> right? We could have still have her y provide that information, but it's not anything we need to take action on necessarily right now. >> Okay, Mr. >> Just a reminder, the 21st is a joint meeting with the board of bindings. >> Correct. >> It's a good thing. >> Huzah. >> Perfect. >> All right. If we're done with discussion, citizens comments. >> It's too early. It's okay. >> Nothing online >> in the room, >> Mr. Herbert. Sorry, Steve. >> Afraid the headline I was supposed to mention is going to be after a whopping 75 minutes,

133the board decided on the school budget of $23 million of my tax money. >> I don't think that's going to be a good headline. >> We do, we are approaching a different budget season. We don't have the rebal of the vehicles. We don't have the rebal of real property. So those things that have really made things difficult this past year are not there. But there's a big increase here. I'm afraid that the comments are based on this want to be we're paying the board of too much money obviously. It only takes 35 minutes to do this job. >> Zero. concerned about. I appreciate the frustration, but the thought is that the budget and I'm afraid that's the headline. I'm afraid that's what's going to be in the shoppers guide. Our board of bid only took

13475 minutes to figure out next year's $23 million 10% increased budget, 9% increased budget. And I don't think that's going to go for us. No, totally respect that. >> It would be nice if we had a citizen in the room or on Zoom to have comments >> besides you, Steve, to >> I'm sorry. >> I said it'd be nice if we had a few more citizens on Zoom or in the room to provide us some more feedback to help us make decision. >> I think that communication is mentioned several times is the big issue. I know everybody's trying wish there wasn't I wish I could think of some way anybody could think of some way to make make that communication if you need to get out and vote and support your kids education wish you

135the best of luck one final thing on suing the state >> unless we're being treated different >> right let's not waste our Time for motion to adjurnn. >> Motion to >> second. Second. >> Kristen's got it. Justin has the second. a big baseball. >> You can tell Steve I said >> when you take a swing like that maybe that's us. >> Oh it definitely it already has already. >> I'm not going to as much as I love sitting here every Monday with you guys just us >> we're going to be hated no matter what >> regardless it's already there. I was not trying to get rid of the sitting here every Monday. I'm trying to get more people in the room. >> Yeah, we will be here almost every Monday because we still have to

136do the presentation and we still have to review it. >> I think it's more about getting people fired up >> communication. >> Come out. >> I think I'll get my name on that list.