School Board Work Session 12/13/2022

001[Music] thank you foreign [Music] thank you [Music] foreign [Music] foreign [Music] foreign [Music] foreign [Music] good afternoon the December 13th work session is now in order Paul roll call please Mr Susan here yes right here Mr Trent here Miss Jenkins president Miss Campbell please stand for the pledge I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all hmm the first topic on today's agenda is Space Coast Junior Senior High School's additional construction Management Services Ms suhan assistant of superintendent of facilities will be presenting miss hand good afternoon everyone thank you for the opportunity to walk you through where we are with the Space Coast Junior Senior High School track as you recall the board

002approved the construction management contract for the resurfacing rubberization of the track in November however there wasn't an ad alternate option that was noted on the agenda that was to widen the track from six Lanes to eight lanes and the board gave us an opportunity to go ahead and explore that a little bit more and provide some research to you as to how we've progressed through the track Capital program and so just very briefly as I mentioned previously we have been working on renewal and rubberization of all of our high school tracks with the exceptions of West Shore and Edgewood who don't actually have functioning tracks so what I'm about to say applies to the other 14 tracks we have we have gone through the program on the theory of renewal of the track assets that

003we have and then while we are doing that as part of the sales surtax program also going in and rubberizing the tracks and so that was a big ask from our athletic directors a couple years ago and we were able to combine those two things while we're on site so we have we've gone through several projects already and I just want to let you know we have eight that are finished three that are under contract two that are under design and one satellite high school that was done back in 2017 and that was done largely with Community funding some District funds were involved in that project and that's really the case for most of these so as we have progressed through the track program the parameters around which we have done them is we the

004district will be renewing the track being rubberized in the track we'll do the interior curving and exterior curving because those are those are aspects of the project that will serve the life of the track so from the perspective of the building of the track itself that's what we have included but we're basically putting back what is there so um in the case of a couple of schools they went from seven to eight Lanes via striping the footprint of the track was wide enough to be able to do that Melbourne High School is the one exception they are constrained at six Lanes we didn't look at widening the Melbourne High School track because they're also constrained by the turf field that they have and the grandstand bleachers that they have and so there really was no

005physical way to do that without a fairly significant project in the case of Space Coast Junior Senior High School they have six lanes and our normal protocol would have been to just simply resurface what's there and then rubberize the six lanes that they have the width of the track was not sufficient to give them any more Lanes so they asked for an alternate to widen the track so we redesigned it so that it could be done and our our construction manager gave us a price for it and that's what we presented at the last board meeting at 183 000 to do that work the unique aspect of the Space Coast track is that the grandstand bleachers coincidentally were failing at approximately the same time and so the grandstand bleachers are no longer in the way

006because we had to tear them down so the opportunity to widen the track as Space Coast Junior Senior High School is present basically now and so the the ability to do the widening is is really now if we're going to make that leap in terms of how we've treated other schools the way that we have framed this is that as I said the district funds the basic track renewal and rubberization and the schools have been fundraising for some of their additional track assets that they'd like to have and those included field events so we did very few field events as part of the project unless the school wanted to fund those and we had several schools that did do a fairly significant amount of fundraising yet and certainly some of them to contribute resources to

007doing the field events so in looking at our our track inventory I believe that there are seven of them that can actually host Regional needs meaning they have the track they have correct number of lanes correct distance and all of that and they have the field events so that is not the case with all of our tracks so some of them have been improved and are not slated for hosting Regional meets like ogalli is probably an example of one of those so we're kind of all over the board with our track situation so what you have before you today is a summary of what I've just said and there is a hundred and eighty three thousand dollar cost to widen that the track if we do that concurrently with the the rubberization and renewal contract

008so the board also asked me to take a look at how we could fund the 183 thousand dollars and so I took a look at our Capital plan and we have a project in our Capital plan that relates to Mila Elementary School and we've been talking with the principal and this goes back a year or so probably a little bit more than a year about serving the ese students better at Mila and the current building in which those students are served really could use a significant upgrade and potentially a replacement but we really have to take a look at what is the best way to deal with that situation is it constructing a new building is it trying to do Rehabilitation and renovation of the existing building our initial thinking was around probably a new

009building but we really need to do an RFQ process to bring in an architect to take a look at that situation and we just hadn't quite gotten around to doing that part yet so in looking at the capital program I was pretty comfortable that we could we could proceed with the RFQ we could proceed with the initial phase where we bring in an architect to do that analysis of what is the best way to serve those students and then we backfill the remainder of the funding in the fiscal year 24 Capital plan so we actually have 250 000 that was slated 100 000 from last year 150 000 from this year's Capital plan for that project we could use a portion of those resources for the track and then when we do the fy24 capital

010plan we would simply request that money be replenished and at that time we'd probably have a better idea of exactly what project we would be doing what the scope would be so we'd have a better sense of what the design fees would be and what the ultimate project would be and whether that's an impact fee type of project or whether it's a capital project to serve those students better so that was the option I looked at for potentially funding that wide of the track and so with that I'll be happy to entertain any questions if the board had whatever the consensus of the board is if we choose to move forward then I would bring that as a formal change order request at the January board meeting but the contractor is prepared to move ahead

011if that's the will of the board thank you sue so what Sue's asking is do we first off if there's any discussion but then also if we can approve and give directions so is there any discussion does anybody want to talk about it can I ask you a question absolutely uh just to be clear on the Myla project the time frame for that has not been established yet it sounds like you're the very beginning phases of that so we don't do you know what that project is going to potentially cost us so yes we're at the very beginning stages know on what it potentially would cost a classroom Edition for an elementary school five to seven million depending on what we would be what we would actually do for an addition renovation is probably about

012the same okay um so right now if I'm hearing you correctly it sounds like 250 000 is what's been kind of carved out for that project so we're still a ways off from what we're going to need there right and the intention was just to get started because we really needed yeah a lot of work on the scoping of the project we have a similar project at West Melbourne Elementary where we're not quite sure what the answer is but we know we need some additional student stations there so that's how that we're going to pursue it very similarly to what we're doing at West Melbourne got you okay Miss Campbell uh so this is a unique situation um I you know I have a few just hesitations and then a suggestion you know hesitation is

013you know we as much as we would like for every High School to have the same facilities the fact is that they just don't they weren't all built at the same time they weren't all built in the same each each high school has a different footprint on their property um you know and I you know it's not lost to me because I've had Community reach out to me multiple times about Mile High has zero uh field events uh facilities and then we look at our two you know Heritage and not Heritage West Shore and Edgewood all they although they don't have tracks they do have track teams correct so those are having to use other schools facilities unfortunately those two schools are close by other schools that they can use but it it does create

014a potential problem my other hesitation is that um you know in the description on the second page it says the cost of widen the track is 183 000 the school is indicated they're not capable capable of this level of fundraising I totally believe that because you know Space Coast Junior Senior High is situated geographically in a place where they're not in a city um you know even some of our you know cocoa has been a high need school that we've prioritized funding for because of the um the percentage of free and reduced lunch and all that but cocoa is very supported in their Community because they're right in the middle of cocoa and they have you know I know Ms Jenkins has shared with us before you know Community County even State and you know

015International but National recognition and help Space Coast Junior Senior High being in Port St John it's just not really it's not a city they don't have the same kind of support like a Viera or a cocoa or a Mel or some things like that so I understand but I do feel like because we have this process of fundraising that there should be some um some buy-in from the school even if it's not this level so for our new board members we have a process that miss hand area overseas called the school Improvement I don't know yeah we have two sips one of them is this one school initiative project fund which is a matching fund and our we have priority schools which are Title One schools and schools that have um different you know like

016I said higher ratios of free reduced lunch they can get a bigger match so if a school wants to up to 37 500 up to 25 000 for other schools so the school wants to do a big playground thing we've had this for years they can raise whatever they want a new Marquee it's going to cost 14 000 they raise seven thousand the district matches at seven thousand if they're priority school they raise seven thousand the district matches it at like a 75 match I feel like Space Coast is one of the ones that can get the 75 match I'm not saying they need to raise up to 183 000 but I just feel like the school needs to have some buy-in here um it would it would it would be and I'm not willing

017to set an amount right this minute but I just feel like it would be it would be perceived by the rest of the schools in the district to be more fair um and because they have done the hard work of doing some fundraising like I said I don't I don't believe they're available able to do this level of fundraising but I think it would be helpful um to to have some kind of buy-in at this level and I don't know Miss Hannah if you've talked to the school leadership there to see if they would be willing or able to do that I'm Sorry Miss Campbell I had not talked to the school leadership about that but um so we've been talking with them about some other athletic facilities and so I feel like a nominal

018type of um contribution is probably within their reach okay I think oh I'm sorry Mr Susan no go ahead I'm sorry I didn't I thought you were finished and I we would certainly work with them to um to be able to move forward with the contract while they were doing their fundraising right yeah right because that you said the time is now and I don't want to necessarily put a hold on it but you know that just some kind of um you know skin in the game I guess so I agree with you miss Campbell um many of our facilities are inequity right so Mel High received a you know what I mean uh over a million dollars for their um football field and Palm Bay is the same way and school districts don't many

019schools have auditoriums many schools have many many you know what I mean so there's inequities out there unfortunately uh Viera High School doesn't have a baseball and a softball field they have to go other places so I wanted to just tell tell a story from my perspective so I taught at Space Coast Junior Senior High School for six years and I love that school um loved I coached I played coached football I coached wrestling one of the issues that Space Coast Junior Senior High School has is it was built as a middle school and so your track and many of the other facilities were built to become middle school facilities so when you have didn't have a large Auditorium they don't have a lot of the things that a high school needs and one of

020the things that you pointed out which I agree with you 100 is port's not a they're not a they're not a city so like they literally have the bagel shop and a couple other places that fund like every single uh rec league and everything else and it's a unique situation in that it's a bedroom community cornered off by basically forests and and you don't have it connected to others but at the same time where I was coming across is there's inequities across like Mel High has the the field Palm Bay has the field there's certain ones there but I would say that I would be comfortable moving forward with not making them go in because the other pieces is that we would be taking away from one of those title one schools because there's only

021a certain amount of money that's inside that fund that they fund those with so if another school was to present a funding source and they did not get it so like if your title 1 schools all apply and Space Coast comes in they'll get bumped because they're not on the priority list so then we have a problem where we're like well what are we going to do so I I feel and this is I understand 100 where you're coming from Miss Campbell but the fact that it was built as a middle school to service for a while then a high school the track was never built out every single facility they have is like not big enough for the next um and the fact that it would take away from possible Title One schools for

022the fundraising I would say that you know what I mean that would be my thought process that we would just move forward with allowing them to do it but I'm open to the board I just wanted to say that since everybody had had that part of the conversation any other comments please um I would hope that the sport yeah uses this moment to recognize and reflect the fact that inequity is rampant throughout the district and I think it would be advantageous of us to actually educate ourselves on where that inequity lies and if we're going to talk about Athletics like like let's stick there um I'm not against these students getting what they deserve and need and they're a community that can't fundraise I acknowledge that I've always said you know there was a line

023that I read that stuck with me forever where um equal means everyone gets the same Equity means everyone gets what they need and so I believe in our school district there's no way we could fund all these projects for every single school right of course um and I think it's okay and right as a society in a community for us to help those schools and communities that probably can't fund it themselves but I just want to highlight and make it very clear to everyone that this is an issue we've had for a while um and I want to make sure that we're going to if we start this precedent that we carry forward to all of our schools and and that's a precedent that we're going to be setting and I'm okay with that but

024we need to recognize that that's the precedent we're setting and I hope we follow through with it because I know it's easy to mention our schools like title ones and stuff that we say get more funding and all that um but you know when I was participating in that cocoa project the only thing I was aware of and correct me if I'm wrong um that they were getting at the time was the track like everybody else and um there's a lot of need there's a lot of need in some of our schools who can't do it themselves and so again not I'm not against this by any means but this this is going to be a precedent then we better follow through we better be doing this for all of our students who who have

025those deficits and those needs um that is my only hesitation I don't know if we're going to do that and that's expensive let's be realistic about it too I mean I understand the timeline here I understand that you know this is the right time to do this project so I acknowledge that wholeheartedly but I think if we're going to have that conversation again we need to educate ourselves and take a real hard look about where those inequities lie um I might remind the board and that we may be able to do that but I think Miss Sue didn't you spend some um aggressive time to identify all the inequities inside the District athletic facilities and other places I I wouldn't say all of them but we have been trying to look at that as in

026fact the field events is one area where we have surveyed our schools so you saw the results of that not all schools have all field events Space Coast is one where there's another piece of the potential ad alternates that's a hundred and forty three thousand dollars or so worth of improvements to the field amenities that are not part of this contract and that would typically be something that the school would fund and have schools have funded those improvements so yes we are trying to get there and we're we've looked at all of our playgrounds we know who has to and who has eight you know it's we're trying to get a handle on that and so as we're looking at conditions of assets we do have we're also comparing what assets are missing from schools

027so it's kind of an ongoing work and it's a little bit of Art and a little bit of science but we're trying to get a much better handle on at least the data so that we can make good decisions about these types of things can we clarify that real quick because I didn't want that to come across like the district and the staff isn't doing that I genuinely mean that us as board members have a responsibility to be educated about it and to make sure we understand it because we're the ones who are going to set that precedent so we need to understand it so I didn't mean that you know you're not looking into it no I understand I know you're on it there's a lot of data that we don't have and so

028in addition to what you said we are trying to gather more data about those issues so that we can present you with okay who here's who has what tracks in here has who has what field facilities and who has field houses and who has turf fields and be able to make good Capital decisions uh Capital programming decisions about our athletic facilities and our our ancillary facilities at our schools and I I think um I'm Sorry Miss can't believe you guys I was just going to make a suggestion I um Miss can you just very recently sent us the report from the school initiated projects for the fall round we do a fall round and a spring round and I believe there was about a hundred thousand dollars left over because every semester we don't always

029have all the requests and all that money gets rolled over and added to the funding for the spring we traditionally have money left over just about every time if I recall um so what I would suggest is I'm just going to toss out an amount and I'm going to keep it low keep the bar low that we asked the school to raise five thousand dollars they would qualify for seventy five hundred dollar match because they are a priority school that's twelve hundred twelve thousand five hundred dollars that doesn't have to come out of mylet and capital but it's but it's I think it's manageable um you know for a school to put that kind of fundraising effort and it just shows good faith hey we're we're gonna we're gonna at least put our part I

030don't know if the rest of the board would be an agreement of that we just ask them you know could you would you contribute that much and then some of that funding could come rather out of a capital come out of that school initiated project uh funding mechanism miss hand are you allowed to apply for that one time per one time per cycle so the next cycle opens in February and they would be able to apply and if they're successful that would that wouldn't allow the 12-5 to be used and if they're unsuccessful their 5 000 could still be a contribution to the to the cost of the track and another question real quick and then I'm sorry if I have other people that would like the question is is if they're going does it

031behoove us as a school district to if they're fundraising for the other amenities that we spoke of to have them that built at the same time as the track as they're there if they're fundraising for it or is that is that something that some of the other schools are getting added on later most of them are getting them added on at the end of the track project so they're still well they're still under construction but we work with our vendors on that and try to match the timing with the fundraising so that we can support what the school is doing and if if they apply for to pay for what Miss Campbell's saying in February they would not be able to reapply to fundraise for the internal components to their track until August of the

032next year which would then become available in like November of next year so a year from now so yes so they the cycle will open in February for the balance which is around a hundred thousand and then if the board appropriates another 300 000 through the capital cycle that that cycle opens in October and again if if we know the schools are doing this we'll we will work with them on the on the funding to make sure that we finish their project and not let the cycle affect the project execution just to be clear because I I like what you're saying with Campbell about them having skin in the game and investing in it I understand that it's just the amount of the project is so much that they can't come up with that so

033I don't necessarily oppose that I just to be clear though the 12-5 doesn't get us there we're still a long ways off right I mean right no but but it's a matter of where it's coming from oh sorry wherever it's coming from so 5000 is coming from the school 7 500 is coming from this school initiative project Grant then that's twelve thousand five hundred dollars that's not going to come from our capital budget which leads more in the capital to put towards Myla and and things like that so it's not our matter we're not going to do it it's a matter of letting them I see and even if they don't as Ms Han said even if they don't you do it through the matching if they just say you know what we're going to

034raise our 5000 and put it towards it that's you know it's still there a contribution but it's not slowing down the process it's just a matter of where the funding is going to come okay I understand and I agree I mean there are schools that need additional attention and help and I I don't think that that's wrong to say that these schools that that are under privileged that me need additional help that we we should step in and help in those aspects so um yeah I just um just so everybody knows I kind of feel you know I used to do the car washes and we would work all day for 240 dollars right and then we would um go hit up all of the local bagel stores in the Pizza Huts and and we

035would get 500 and then you know what I mean and they're and unfortunately for them to get hit all the time and and it's Unique in the fact that Titusville like you said has the Titusville and astronaut has Titusville Coco has cocoa and you start running all the way down there's many of our high schools have a city that they're a part of and Port St John's a unique thing so with that and the knowledge that I had I would like to move on just letting them receive it but if there's more direction to go um Mr Trent you've been kind of quiet on this you got you got something so if you were going to build a Nissan if you were going to build a new track for a high school would you build

036it at six Lanes or would you build it at eight Lanes eight Lanes eight Lanes it just seems like the timing is perfect that you're there doing work that's almost a bare minimum at the space and then it would allow us to get the eight Lanes in um I would I would suggest you know it looks like we have the money from somewhere and um you know the time is of essence they're there to do it now um raising five thousand dollars that's great for the schools I mean I I think having skin in the game but it looks like they're going to be doing some fundraising down the road for the other part of the project so um and again not having that downtown not having businesses abundant in the area I would I

037would I would move towards let's just get it done and and move on and Equity is a part of uh in a fact of life here in the county and I know we're going to have this conversation again and again but in this instance you know I I just would like to get this done for the for that school so the school initiated projects just to clarify and confirm if they were to apply for that they're allowed to do partial project yes ma'am okay just want to make sure and then uh Mr Susan Mr Trent I know that you uh foresee them fundraising for the next part of that project which would be those field you know you never get to sports um but the reality is they're not gonna they're not going to be

038able to fundraise and fully fund that either right so how much does that typically cost so in aggregate the number was about 143 000 okay um and the events were about 25 to 60 each okay so um and they'll have to look at the condition and what is more important to upgrade that type of thing so I'll work with Mr Flora and when I bring this back to you in January I'll have a little better feel for what capacity they have and how we might we might handle their share so the reason I'm asking that question is not to say that we're funding all those projects by any means or the reason I'm saying that is because um the likelihood of them then going to fundraise for that when they can't fundraise for this is

039honestly Slim Right um so by by applying for the school initiated project it doesn't inhibit them for those projects because they're not at all again the reality is is that's a really costly project right that they would also need support in and so I see no harm in the game for them building some pride and some buy into it um setting the bar at an achievable level and then again you know using the funds we already have set aside in a different category Miracle instead of going into Capital so I I agree with Miss Campbell on that one so miss uh miss hand what I'm seeing from the direction of the board and if you want to speak again but it's hey there's some sort of ask for some of it but you think you

040could go back to Mr floor and come back to us with a better suggestion of what they can do rather than us trying to figure that piece out yeah I mean I think you've given us given me some parameters and so I'll work with Mr Flora and then when I present the change order I'll just disclose what what we've worked out with Mr Flora as part of the the board action in January right now it's 2-2 so if you had something you wanted to say I just want to also declare this is not going to hurt Myla correct with this with moving business okay that's I want to be clear and make sure that's clarified um I like the skin in the game I think that that makes it fair and I think that the

041schools that have invested currently into their tracks that they they would appreciate the fact that we are trying to raise something so I think that that school should be able to come up with a little bit of the money and I'll help initiate some of that if they need some help knocking on doors and asking for money I'll get out there and do it with them so um but yeah I think that that's a good directive to go perfect I think you got Direction unless Miss Campbell wants to say something to anybody else we're all good Dr thady practice one little point of clarification Space Coast is a tier one school one of our priority schools and I think I heard that in the discussion so I just wanted to provide that point of clarification

042for sips I think they are so it's Title One and priority schools and they may meet the title One requirement I'm not positive off the top of my head they're not a title in school they don't but I can't remember no they're not I think they're not a part two one okay so that would be a 50 so it'd be a provide that clarification thank you I think Miss hands going to go meet with them and come back with a proposal but I think you've got what you need yes all right thank you for all your hard work thank you Miss hand next up is the topic is the Middle School financing presented by Miss hand foot high stack of papers sitting there in that green folder we've been working on this for a while

043and so um the board had taken several previous actions on the middle school that will be built next next I'm sorry I'm no longer in my office where are we that way next to Viera High School to the north and so we have we've done a number of things to bring us to this point more recently we have engaged in architect to use a prototype design and that has been ongoing for several months and they're just about finished with their design documents so ready ready to go we concurrently engaged a construction manager and so the construction manager has been working alongside the architect as the design has been developed to try to make sure that we are you know we are managing our costs we are working with our stakeholders to make sure that we're

044delivering the middle school that meets our needs here in the district and so that process has been ongoing and we realized a while back that our impact fee revenues are not sufficient in terms of cash on hand to be able to fund the project with cash and so we met with the board and on two occasions and works Workshop session talking about we believe we're going to need some Gap financing in order to start construction when we're ready to start construction and we we are ready to start construction basically now we have an early Works guaranteed maximum price proposal that will be before you this evening that is about eight million dollars and that is to cover things like buying mechanical equipment electrical equipment early lead time items and also that will allow the site

045work to get started in January and so what we have previously told the board and it remains true is that if if we start the project now we'll be able to open in August of 24 if we delay we will not be able to open in August of 24. so that was really the impetus for talking with the board about needing some some very short-term Gap financing so the board gave us direction to proceed down those lines and we issued an invitation to negotiate for certificates of participation basically short-term financing and framed it in um in about a 30 million dollar need between the cash that I estimate having on hand and the total cost of the project so in order to issue a purchase order for 50-something million dollar project we have to have

046the cash in hand to be able to do that so we can't issue a purchase order for 55 million dollars if we don't have 55 million dollars available so that was really the the key point so we issued the invitation negotiate indicated we wanted short-term financing and we wanted to be able to pay it back as soon as possible that was one of the the strong directions we received previously from the board is we want to be able to have that early payback if at all possible well several Banks gave us some very good very good proposals but one allowed us to use a line of credit which is a little bit unique in the certificates of participation realm but the line of credit allows us to borrow substantially less because as we are proceeding

047through the construction of the project basically spending money we're also receiving quarterly impact fee payments and so because we have that in and out we actually will be able to borrow much less than the total Gap so having the line of credit out there allows us to issue that purchase order but we don't actually need to draw down the same amount of resources that we would have under traditional traditional financing structure so with that we have put together a a structure that Mr Ford I think could probably elaborate on a little bit better but the the um the terms for engineers is that we basically have a line of credit and we will draw down that line of credit when we need to my estimates at this point is that we probably won't even need

048to make a draw for about another year as we do have about half of the cost of the project cash on hand ready to go and so the the cost of borrowing is significantly less than what we had previously presented to the board so we are we are ready to move forward what we have on your agenda this evening is and basically the analysis that I've just articulated that will be considered by the board there are implementing documents that go along with that that are attached to the resolution and then the board will recess will convene the leasing Corp the leasing Corp will act on a similar resolution and then following that the board will reconvene and then potentially act on the early Works proposal so that is where we are with the Middle School

049financing and I'll be happy to answer any questions thank you Sue is there anybody up here that has any questions you have a side question because you just you just sparked my memory on something I we've been over this like a hundred times so thank you thank you for re-articulating that for the public as well um but I you just reminded me of something the cost per student station and this is more of a Russell Broome question but um was that part of our legislative legislative um initiatives that we were going to discuss this year about changing okay I just wanted to I don't remember um so and just so you know fsba also made it part of their platform okay awesome and for people listening what that really means is um the state sets

050an amount that we can technically fund to build new schools and it is nowhere near the uh the appropriate amount and so then it leaves this Gap in order for us to finance and figure out ourselves so and there's many many other laws constraining that but we won't get into that so anyway thank you um and um just want to reiterate to uh not only do we want to open the school as soon as possible because the need has been here for years and years and years and the community has been crying out but just to remind everybody it also saves US money in the long run because the cost of goods has dramatically increased and will only continue and is projected to only continue to do so um So the faster we can do

051this uh the better so thank you so much for all your hard work thank you thank you Miss Jenkins I just want to jump in there and say thank you because when I was you know I was one of people was adamant about this bar as little as possible to pay us off pay it off as fast as possible I couldn't have imagined this so thank you Mr Ford thank you team um for helping us come to this solution because I think this in the long run is going to be the very best verb of our um you know as far as financially and and getting this done in a timely in timely way so I just wanted to express my appreciation Miss Wright I just have a few questions so when you calculated the

052impact fees that and realized they were not going to be sufficient enough to cover the the cost of this build when what time frame specifically did you calculate those fees how recently has it been looked at oh about a week ago okay all right so it's very recent okay good yes ma'am all right um Can is it possible for you to let us know what the total limit is of the line of credit the total limit we're proposing as of today is 30.1 million okay we have one opportunity Mr Ford to downsize that and we intend to do that when the Construction contract is before the board in March my guess is that we're going to downsize that to around 22 million okay and then uh the other question I have is in regards to

053coming from the private sector and lines of credit usually are adjustable rates this is not correct it is adjustable adjustable okay and what is that rate look like for us right now and I'm sure it's tied to time did you calculate that interest rate that right now is 0.6 and 3.7 it's based off of what's called The Bisbee index okay which is a rate published by Bloomberg okay and what what is our margins to to for the rate to rise I guess that's is it there's there's no limitations as to how far the rate can rise although I believe that there's a statute toward maximum of 12 percent in Florida okay um I would have to double check the figure but I think that applies uh the floor on this rate is zero okay so

054no events could the interest rate go okay okay the other piece of data that that you may want Mrs Wright is that we anticipate paying the note off July of 25 so it's pretty short-term financing and that will depend upon the the impact fees that come in of course so that rate can also fluctuate so there's a lot of variables but based on a pretty conservative estimate feel pretty confident that we'll be able to pay this off in a couple years so I just know that building with a a line of credit is so much better than building with a straight loan so for you to be able to secure even someone allowing us to have this opportunity is uh it's it's it's I can amend you for doing that so I know it's going

055to save the district you know lots of money so I appreciate the effort thank you I have one more question if that's okay yeah in regards to where these students are coming from um can you talk a little bit about that on the schools that these students would be pulled from possibly yes so that is going to be a process that we kick off in January with a board Workshop because there are a number of different options as to where those students can pull from and they the middle school will affect potentially adjacent schools and that would include dolora Kennedy and McNair and so that is a conversation we are going to need to have as to how to balance the enrollment the flip side of that is that we've looked at the growth projections

056in the Viera area in fact we look at it county-wide but there there is a tremendous amount of growth projected for Viera specifically like Due West of where we are and so I think over time this will stabilize but that is a that is a very important issue and we are going to be spending some quality time on that after the first of the year thank you I think we have everybody's in full support a couple extra questions and I think that's good I just have one I do have one question now that you say that um I know I know that we're constantly in talks with Vera and the growth and where they're heading um but I do know there was a weird Flip and Change for flip ends change for when there was

057supposed to be growth happening west of 95 in pinita and then it kind of shifted their plan shifted a little bit and so I just I want to just reconfirm I mean they're continuously having these conversations with us correct correct okay oh and so obviously they're going to be a part of this this conversation on table when we do talk about boundary changes because in case they decide to flip again and start developing somewhere different okay and I and I know you know they're they're booming so fast that they literally have a lottery system for new builds within their developments that are a year year and a half out and so it's pretty easy for them to project where these things are going to happen so thanks thank you I think you have Direction everybody

058okay you good to go Miss yes thank you appreciate it thank you very much um so it's now 2 43 right we have um normally we finish these up at about 4 30. um and I didn't know we have a pretty packed agenda I didn't know if you guys wanted to possibly bring some of those other items up or at least I wanted to get kind of a survey from you guys if you're okay to go to like five o'clock or something like that on the back end so first I'd like to discuss are you guys okay to move it to five o'clock as I stop so that you guys can get enough food and stuff like that and come back or is there a need to finish up at 4 30. um just like

059to kind of discuss that Campbell and she made the motion the last time just I guess I anticipating I just want I look I'm just trying to take care of you I'm trying to take care of you um no I would just suggest that we potentially gonna have a long board meeting tonight so I think getting some uh a break one mental break and some dinner is going to be very important um five to five thirties kind of tight but let's you know let's uh plow through I think we've talked about the um the public comment policy is something that we can you know even if the meeting doesn't go long I'll be an optimist for a minute tonight and we have some time we could even bump that discussion to this evening but um

060clearly the next two items are a high priority for us so I um you want to meet in the middle and say we you know Chick-fil-A only takes five minutes but I think we need a mental break as much as we need a dinner break I think um what we can do is we can about 420 make that decision and then the other thing is is that um if you guys wanted to we could go so I think that's good on time the next one is is that we could go to bring back the interim and regular superintendent search and move to the other items or we can start here um does anybody want to move some of the other items up and move this I the only reason I was mentioning that was the

061superintendent search there's gonna be a lot of people watching tonight and I thought in my mind I was like what would people in the evening want to watch and that would probably be that one over anything here so that's why I was saying if you wanted to move it up but I am open to any ideas makes no difference let's roll okay all right here we go thank you very much the next topic is the interim superintendent search um so everybody understands from the public we were I asked uh Mr Gibbs to submit to ask the board members to submit the um their rankings for the interim superintendent search so just for the public to understand we had 12 rankings I think four of them were four former superintendents one of them was a director

062over 22 schools in Orange County so we had 12 a couple of them were from the state of Florida a couple of them were from outside the state we had interim superintendent rankings um and I'll just read them real quick Miss Kitty Campbell had James Larson markandel Robert Schiller James herholtz and Cheryl Baker Jennifer Jenkins had James Larson Mariah push canister Megan Wright had Robert Schiller Mark Rendell Michael Ahern I had Mark Rendell James Larson Robert Schiller and Gene Trent had Mark Rendell so after all the points because you give 12 points to first place 11 points to Second Place the total that came out was Mark Rendell 46 points James Larson 35 points and Robert Schiller 32 points so we have um 11 points lead and then which we have three people that made

063the top three um James Larson and Robert Schiller are a little bit closer so with those in super interim superintendent rankings I think the first thing we wanted to do was see if we wanted to bring back five three or make a decision today based on what we're doing and just kind of discuss where your guys's minds are on that so I'll open up the floor to discuss how many we may want to bring back and also if the opportunity is is that you guys wanted to bring back 5-3 or make a decision today so I'm going to leave the floor open um anybody want to discuss Miss Wright um I would love the opportunity to be able to speak with each one of these individuals before we move forward so I don't know if

064that's I like the idea of the top three being okay these are our three that we kind of all collaboratively agree that they scored the highest uh do we get the opportunity now to speak with them and interview them before making any decisions on the superintendent okay the intern superintendent Miss Campbell yeah I think this was a good process for us to we use this uh I I will reiterate what I said last Monday um as far as the process I think if we I think we need to we need to do our due diligence as much as it's added to our schedules over the next week I think we need to do the interview process and be as transparent as transparent although it would you know maybe save us some time um to go

065ahead and pick someone today I personally don't feel comfortable enough having just seen intent letters and resumes and a few relative recommendation and doing you know quick Google searches to make that decision today I think this is really important it gives our community some time to um you know to give their input as well some of them are already reaching out to us but some of them don't even know who's on the list yet so this will give us some time so I think I I would be um an agreement that we just take these three and ask um you know staff to set up interview times um it sounds like you would like to have a private conversation in addition to group interview is that what you're suggesting is Right we've done that before

066with um I I would if that's if it's an option I would prefer that if we're you know I know we're up against the wire on time so if time is of the essence and we can only do group then we'll do group that's right but if we only have three it makes it much more yeah and feasible so what we did in the past just so you guys know um if the direction is that we've taken the top three is that they come in kind of like what Paul did where there's a round table of three people and we interview each one of them separately and they just kind of move between us so like they get up and run to the next room and meet with you it's like speaking only we can

067we can do that or there's an opera and Paul you may want to chime in on what that experience was like and then um but the other thing you can do is is we being the fact that there's only three we may want to just reach out to them and have a conversation with them one-on-one on our own and then come back as a group to discuss so are we allowed to do that Paul to reach out to them individually if it's individual you can um we have Thursday reserved and Friday reserved with school board meeting so you could always schedule three one hour interview group so bring them in one at a time okay as a group and then in the F take an hour break so let them go down and get lunch

068and everybody kind of relax for an hour and then set them up for a rotation and the way it looked with me was I don't remember how many total attorneys you guys had but the board members moved from room to room and so there were always three meetings going on at the same time we made us move and not them move because that's that wouldn't be nice they we and they got to stay in the same place we only had three at the time so pretty well and we didn't do hour-long age we did like 15 to 20 minutes I think it was 45 minutes like one-on-ones and then there was like 15 minute break so you could run to the bathroom or grab a snack yeah I'm not really clear on one of these

069one of these applicants I'm not sure that they're in state so um that would be phone interviews so we would need to look at that and um let's let's go let's slow that piece down real quick because we have some other let's I hear the first two people saying that they want to bring back the next three Miss Jenkins did you want to um comment on that yeah I think we told the public that that's what we're going to do and so we need to stick with it um so I am definitely in agreement with that I think we need to bring the top three back and have real conversations uh this is you know we're the 49th largest school district in the United States of America um and I don't think we hire someone

070to run it uh based off of Simply a resume so I think it's our due diligence to invite them here or via Zoom obviously and at least have further conversations all right and Miss Jenkins um are you okay so that's uh that's a that's good right so let's now that we have the top three um are we all okay with the top three that were chosen um between the points is that fair enough to you guys Fair yeah absolutely good to go Miss Jenkins all right um so we have that set up and then one of the things that we have is um it's Tuesday it's Tuesday now and one of the problems we may have is is one of those just like you said is from out of state so do we want to

071move to do one of them virtually or do we you know what I mean to allow them to interview virtually so they don't have to move travel and all that stuff and then the other one is do we want to do this on like Friday and then make the decision Friday or do we want to take Thursday and Friday together so the first thing would be are you guys wanting them to fly in and be in person or would you want them to be on Virtual I'm completely fine with virtual that's fine for me yeah and fairness to the one let them make the decision yeah yeah I mean I mean yeah you know and we have no idea there may be some life event that would prevent them from interviewing on Thursday I think

072staff can take care of it if we have those days reserved um but I would really like to do back to back to back as a group I think for fairness so we've got all fresh in our mind we do those back to back back together and then in the same day if we can if everybody's the three candidates to do the round robin individual times with them in the same day I think we can get that done the reason I was asking was a couple of things is if you if we decided to do it all on Friday then that gives them an extra day to travel tell their families tell everybody that they're going to be moving right um but the other issue that we have is is that in the event that

073we decided to have the interviews do the group and then make a decision that day it only gives us Saturday Sunday and Monday to negotiate a contract that we then Rectify on Tuesday so just so you guys know there's a little contract timing and I don't know of course these individuals what their you know contracts are but um you know what I mean it might be a little bit tight but I think that that's doable I think if they're coming in as an interim they understand that um and we could do that possibly on on Monday Paul what are your thoughts on that on the negotiating part yeah I mean a lot of it can be done over internet just paper you know I'll have a template ready for them for interim okay and then

074I'll shade it to them let them red line it in and if we need to sit down with the chair and me on a phone call to hammer out the finer details that are still up in the air we'll do that sure okay absolutely if I can go ahead so we advertised Thursday and Friday and Tuesday to be such a way that if we made a decision that we could go ahead and vote there were interviews or school board on any of those school board meetings to interview and or select Ace interim School Board attendant okay okay so so if we really kind of kind of need by the end of day Friday so that staff can negotiate and we can vote on the meeting at the latest on Tuesday so can then suggestions that

075we go ahead and try to do unless there's some reason why one of the candidates can that we do all the interviewing on Thursday and that that leaves us Friday but I hate to make the decision on Thursday because honestly I just need a little time to breathe um in between and pray and think and whatever um but then we make the decision on Friday if it's possible but like I said if it's not we have to do it all Friday we'll do it again but um wrapped around it go ahead go ahead Ms Jenkins um so first uh I think we're all in consensus that virtual is totally fine uh but just to point out you know it's customary if we were to ask them and travel here that we would pay for it

076so let's avoid that um I just want to remind everyone that we're in this position of feeling pressured and rushed for time because we put ourselves here um and so Mr Gibbs can you please just explain to me and explain to the public why we would have to make that decision so quickly on an interim yeah Dr Mullins is is still officially superintendent through December 31st that's when his contract ends and he will officially be gone and we will not have a superintendent come January 1st to run the district so if something happens there is nobody to call staff shut down schools or make those decisions day to day and just for Conversation Piece I think Dr fetty how long were you deciding to stay here in the event that we need stay in District

077is January 6th with my final date January 20th gotcha so so those are the our the pieces so Miss Jenkins do you have anything else you'd look to yeah no I appreciate Mr Gibbs for um just re-addressing that because I think it's important for the public to understand because there's going to be confusion but again we put ourselves here so I think we need to do our due diligence and make sure we're taking this seriously and do it right and do it transparently apparently as much as possible thank you Miss Jenkins um anybody else want to move in right now we have top three if they want to stay virtual and call in for their interviews they can and then miss Jenkins had mentioned pay for their travel that is customary and if you look

078in many of the um uh you know what I mean proposals from the other associations on the Travel um maybe something that we we decide to do to pay for them to come um if we should stay on it does anybody have anything else to say about the top three or virtual if not we can move on to the thing okay I think if we can have them in person I the travel two of them are local I mean they can they can be here so I would suggest they give them the option and see see what they say I I would the one that's not local obviously is probably not going to travel that's very short notice to be able to get on the plane and come down here uh so it makes sense

079for that one to be virtual but I guess we probably need to offer the same all three right we can't offer one of them virtual or the other two so we want you in person so um I think I would yeah are you okay with paying for their travel if they do to get reimbursed because that's what the other ones do if we offer we're going to be offering the superintendents that come from around the state possibly or the nation um I don't know that's another conversation right it's another conversation let's um I I think in order to save the money maybe do give them all the virtual option first but if they want to travel themselves then they can come on their own time yeah is everybody else okay with that I I'm not

080okay with that um if we're putting them as a candidate for this and we're gonna not offer to pay for it we're inhibiting one of those candidates for having the same opportunity that candidates nearby have so if we were going to open this search Nationwide then we need to do what we said we were going to do and we need to offer the money if they want to fly here I think that's the right thing to do otherwise we're inhibiting them and they're not that's not a Level Playing Field they may not have even implied then it doesn't make any sense so you're saying that you would like to what is your direction reimbursement okay um Mr Gibbs Mr Gibbs do you have a say on it I'm sorry Mr Mr Trent I'm sorry I

081don't know ask Mr Trent um extending the offer is fine I mean I've read his uh resume I'm sure you could you could afford to do it and I would be surprised if he doesn't take us up on that and get on a plane and get here yeah I think looking at his resume he's somebody that will be coming okay he will be here Friday um all right so we've got top three virtual and we're willing to pay for the opportunity if they do come I think we have a majority on all of that is that good and the top three are the points just to reiterate Mark Rendell James Larson and Robert Schiller um do you need anything else Paul from the interim piece nope okay all right we're good on that one um

082the next one that we want to move to is let me just get rid of all of these um the superintendent search and there's a couple of layers to this one the first one is is selecting possibly a superintendent search firm and then sort of set in direction for what that looks like from um from the perspective of how long may we may want to make that search and some of the input so if you guys have a second the first thing is is in each one of your folders you should have a copy and you should have received this I think it was last Friday we received these so that we could review them um each one of the proposals I'll be honest with you I want to thank the firms that actually did

083this in such a short amount of time even though it is something that these organizations do on a regular basis it does take a second to do and there was four firms that brought it Forward there was a Florida School Board Association Ray and Associates McPherson and Jacobs and Hazard young Atia and Associates I want to I want to say all four when I looked at them are very qualified firms I think that it's they all kind of Niche into a different area so depending on how you guys perceive it maybe the conversation is not more about what's here but more about what you guys see as a search and then maybe dwindling it down to what we decide based on that um so I'm going to leave the floor open one of the things

084I would like to do is hear when we do a search what are you looking for national state you know what I mean and then we'll go from there does that sound good all right uh leave the floor open anybody miss miss Wright is on the mic so go ahead uh pendant there on how long they can serve as the intern my contract proposal would say until this the new superintendent is in place okay does this doesn't that we can look back in in 60 days once we're moving past us a little bit and stabilizing things uh or do we need to start a firm search right now so that's really up to the school board's timeline so there is no it has to be done before we break for Holiday it can be something

085that you guys considered after the holidays if you want to okay and my thought process on that is if one of these interim superintendents is here and they are amazing and we love them do we need a firm and now we've hired a firm and we're spending money maybe don't necessarily need to spend if if that ends up being that way so yeah I think I think there's an argument to be made there um I think that if we were to select an interim and they did a good job that you could make that selection I think the other the other issue that you would see is is that there's going to be a lot more applications that would come in and give us some more options from the perspective of a national search I

086do want to remind everybody that um Collier Charlotte Manatee Sarasota and Broward have all decided and there there's some more that are coming Osceola just retired right so there's a there's an opportunity to wait to make sure that we do things and then there's the other opportunity that the pool will go and become smaller as we get further down the line so just with those two things I'm open to suggestions but those were the two concerns with both sides I completely understand where you're coming from is right and I can see both sides so anybody else yes that I um I too have no interest in jumping in quickly on a search I I especially where we're coming up on the holiday that gives us ample time ourselves to look at uh the companies that

087have put forth or these firms that have put forth the proposals so uh and and it's money I that's something that we have to take very serious to not jump in some kind of agreement um we have to I believe we have this is where we have time interim no we don't have time we need to get we need to get somebody in here this I think we have we have time okay um either of you would like to speak yeah Miss Jenkins um so if we don't make this decision we're sending a message to the public that can be construed any which way they want to um again we had this conversation previously and I believe we have an obligation to the community and the public to continue to do what we said we

088were going to do one of the things to consider if you don't do it yes there's the potential that you can like your interim superintendent absolutely but these timelines the shortest one I think is like almost four months up to six months and so if you delay it then you're going to delay having a full-term superintendent and then at what point do you decide you don't like your interim superintendent enough to open up the gate and then have that kind of a public conversation it's kind of a weird uh a weird thing to do um Mr Trent you bring up a good point you know it's money and it's something we need to think about and Mr Susan listed all of the school districts that have uh vacancies we're going to have to pay the

089superintendent a lot more money than we paid the last one and the longer we wait the more we're gonna have to pay that superintendent as the pool gets smaller and smaller that's just that's just a reality um and so if we're concerned about dollars then the smartest thing to do would be to jump on this um it's going to be the most cost effective we're going to secure one of these companies who may not be available anymore when we make that decision two months from now um they may raise their cost because their burden might be a little bit higher and again those candidates that are in that pool are absolutely going to be requesting a much larger salary than they probably would have requested a couple of months prior um lastly I just I

090just think it's important for my fellow school board members to uh be honest about where we're heading because I also agree if we have an idea of what's Happening then no let's not waste fifty thousand so um I want you to take a minute and think about that too thank you Miss Jenkins Miss Campbell Mr Gibson is quotes um will be this is their typical or do you have a lock in first yeah I haven't got any things and it's only good for 10 days good to hear um so I um yeah I I what it sounds like there's um not anybody who's ready I don't know if you were Miss Jenkins ready to put your preference in for these four you didn't speak to that and I am I'm sorry I just wasn't speaking

091stuff okay well did you want to do that okay sorry all right okay we weren't going there so I didn't I didn't jump there yet okay um I was trying to just so you guys know I was trying to get the everybody to say if they wanted to move quickly or or slowly we should go back into which one we want to decide Miss Campbell if you can speak to just whether you wanted to make something before Christmas or right um so I am I'm prepared to share I mean I I kind of made my own little connected with the superintendents ranking one two three four with the firms just on initial glance of looking through all the proposals um was glad to have four um to look at um I but I think you

092know when I looked at it I there were um I believe all of them gave us kind of a fast track and a and then a regular I'm I'm not interested in the fast track because I felt like we're already like we're under the gun right now um but on the other hand I think we need to go ahead and get started for all the reasons that um in particular you know Mr so Miss Jenkins have both mentioned um the way to go ahead and get started I what I feel most strongly about is that we do do this process even if we get an assistant all right interim superintendent and we fall in love with him the thing that is in this process even though it's 50 you know 40 to 50 000 depending

093on which firm we're going to go with um this process this process includes Community input public meetings where we're going to have stakeholder groups and each of them propose different their own their own flavor of doing it but all of them propose those kinds of meetings so that stakeholders whether that's um student groups teacher groups support staff administrators parents and all people from the community can can do that and it's not just the five of us making this decision we will be making the decision it is the most important decision that we as board members have to make but to make the best decision I believe we really need the whole process and we've got two brand new board members we've got you know all kinds of seismic changes going on and I think we

094need to walk the process and really hear from the community and not choosing a firm is going to not be good in our community I think we need to walk through this process and and the other thing was that we because we didn't we did this a very quick process and we just had to be quick pick the interim we may have missed some people I think you know full-time we need we're going to be able to have the time to do the Nationwide search to really all these people go out and do the jobs for us of recruiting we need we need to do this um and I don't you know if we decide to go ahead and do it if we want to wait until January or if we want to give everybody

095a few more days we've got three advertised board meetings Paul is there anything that says we can't add a vote on this to Thursday Friday or Tuesday yeah we could add it to next Tuesday and I think there'd be sufficient notice if you wanted to wait till you approved the interims contract and then that would make a decision on yeah that would slow it down a little bit if you guys need some more time I've already looked I've already picked who I you know would be my top couple I just want to jump in there you may not they I don't know how much would happen in the interim because there's going to be contracting that takes place the district completely shuts down December 22nd so there's going to be no procurement people to get

096the contract in place until January they can say hey you're the selection and you guys can start working on your contract proposals and here's our templates and stuff but it will not be before the board for approval until January if um well I think if we did approve today that we would be able to get a contract before we leave and set Direction well there we may not want to start the proposal was to move that decision to next week so if you guys don't want to discuss it now and select someone now then yeah the contracts right we would notify them hey the board selected you but you they wouldn't be starting until the January meeting when the contracts actually approved and I'll and I'll be honest with you um I do believe so

097if you're done I'm so sorry yeah I'm done thank you um thank you Miss Campbell um I agree with you Miss Jenkins that um I think that we do need to move this thing along because what we're going to end up in is a situation just like you said so I'm okay with moving forward with um you know what I mean uh selecting one um I would like to select one and then see if they can come by and just kind of present to us before we leave for break just so that we can think about over break what we would like to to do does that make sense I'm not sure if that would happen but I I truly believe in the process I believe that we should go to a search firm that

098is going to send it out nationally I think we will attract some really good names and I think that what it hopes us to do is to start thinking about just like you said Miss Campbell we need to have Community input we need to have all of those things because you're right like the superintendent is a community decision and I think that we represent the community so I agree with you 100 um and what we can start doing is thinking about hey um what we may need to do so that when we come back we can make those decisions it might even be like a virtual thing or something but I would like to throw that caveat in I think we've got board direction to try to make a decision right now but I think

099that also I would like to say hey if we can have some sort of a prep meeting saying hey before you guys go away to break these are some of the things that you should think about and then we come back and meet with them in set direction we don't have that type of meeting set up but I think we're already meeting right we have school board meetings noticed we do not have like a workshop with the potential vendors noticed so but you know minute they they're kind of given us uh I mean even just reading yes get your mind going as to what they're going to be asking us um yeah we could certainly notice them and then ask for dates in the new year and and notice a workshop that way because some

100of them have different prices based on what package you want and what add-ons you want so you could bring them in at that point and talk about it and then make your final package selections to finalize the contract and we would have time to notice that in the new year and just so everybody knows um staff and I are working on putting together an off-site work session where we can come together and kind of talk about not only some of these things but some other things that we may want to set direction for the next year so that might be the appropriate time sometime in the middle of January or earlier depending on how that plays out so I guess we have direction to make a selection now unfortunately you guys may have thought that

101you may not have to so do you guys need a minute to kind of look through all this stuff would you like that and when you move no I've already I've looked through all the all of the shade the first things I was not um thinking through whenever you know you share your your thoughts on why we would want to jump on this right now I understand that it sounds um like it is in there that we need to move forward with so I would say with that do we want to go with the ranking system like we did with the superintendent search or the interim or what how what's the best way to I think yeah I think one of the things when we're dealing with the search firm is that they are all

102kind of niched into a different area so what I was thinking is is one are we willing to try to make a decision today the second is is are we willing to say kind of like what our feel is like what do we want and then that might help or if you guys feel very interested in this we can make the decision based on a ranking system too it's either way I mean ranking system might be the quicker way to do it but I don't know I would just suggest that we just let's just start the conversation but with you know you know if we we might have consensus we might all become the same thing and that would make it easy but if we don't then maybe we do need to slow ourselves down

103and say can you add it to next Tuesday perfect we have a little more time to think about it but you know we start talking about am I well why don't we give them a minute and Miss Campbell if you want to start off sure um I you know everybody goes in and we read and different things jump out to our minds so um I don't necessarily have a one two three of why I do have a one two three of my my preference but of why um each one but I I am leaning towards fsba um every single one of these firms is going to be doing a national search and if you look at the fsba page on the second page it even tells you know how many applicants they had for each

104of the counties they've worked with in the last five years how many states are represented I mean there's the only one that says that's the lowest number is Brevard and just a little history that was the summer when you guys were hiring Dr Mullins and didn't get through not far enough into the process to get those applications more than that so but everyone else I mean people are coming from not only all over the country but all over the world even um to look into that so um I think uh cost wise it's uh you know comparable I think they're you know being in the State of Florida even though they're going to be asking candidates to come outside of the from outside the State of Florida they are familiar with you know um to

105help you know guide us and all the requirements and things we want to consider of things that are happening in the state so um that was that was my number one and then I had um like a second and I had two that were kind of tied and the only one that I just wasn't um I just I just um didn't feel as comfortable with not just don't feel I have a strong feeling against them but as McPherson I had put them last um for one thing I know they would have to adjust because based on Florida law but they they made the point of saying they were going to keep all their candidates confidential and I'm not sure in the State of Florida they actually could do that um that all that is open

106records which makes it hard to hire a superintendent in the State of Florida just so you know um but and of course they would they would be able to follow it but um I um yeah fsba was um would be my first choice okay and the other two I kind of have died for a second um Miss Jenkins would you have the opportunity I mean so number one I took a look at the cost of each of them because to be honest um they're not going to be all totally different the candidates that they're going to pull are probably going to be really similar so I looked at the cost of all of them so that was that was my number one my number two was looking at the size of districts that they've worked

107with in the past um with Miss Campbell um unfortunately uh the McPherson one doesn't really have a history of working with districts over like four thousand um and so uh just for me that was just kind of I don't really know how you're going to work with the community and really judge how the community feels about it um I also just kind of picked a top two myself I kind of was leaning towards the Ray and Associates just because of the presentation honestly um and the presentation of the commitment to community input like you mentioned uh Miss Campbell I think that's really important and their timeline was a little bit shorter um not dramatically shorter they gave you the fast track and long track too but it was just a little bit shorter uh fsba

108I put as a number two it wasn't a no for me by any means and their costs were really similar as well um so you know what something you said about me they didn't actually have any uh McPherson didn't have any in the State of Florida at all when you said that I'm like wait a minute they had a list of all the states at work where they'd actually hadn't at least in the ones that they listed for us they didn't have any from the state of Florida yeah and um the rayon Associates ones um actually had Broward so I mean if you want to talk about size I mean they've been working in Florida and then with really large districts as well and that wasn't the only one obviously um so that was important

109to me but again um I appreciate bringing up their Community input piece because I think that's really really critical not that fsba won't be doing it but it seems to be a driving Focus for them at almost equal to the input of the board members themselves and so I think that's important for us to consider um I will say that I know for a fact just dealing with these in the past that if we said we wanted a shorter or a longer time period they would be able to put that together all of them are pretty much the same they were just kind of trying to throw spaghetti on the wall for us the other thing I wanted to mention to you guys is is that much of if you look at some of the

110costs in each one of them they're kind of trying to say well depending on if you do or don't so there's an opportunity to reduce the cost I mean the flat fee of the consulting fee is one thing but many of those costs we may be able to look now but I just wanted to kind of speak to that and then come over to this side Mr Trent would you like to go or Miss Right Miss Wright go ahead I'll I'll go fsba was my top one and then I was I'm with you Jennifer on this mid Ray and Associates I like their timeline honestly I think that uh the timeline seems favorable favorable to me but I'm I'm assuming fsba can fall in that same timeline but fsba's costs do seem lower and they

111do break down kind of the menu where we can we can tweak things to to save money so that would be my number one is fsba okay uh Mr Trent not to Echo but that's exactly right I'd gone through these in the fs fsba um I did like the how clear they were on the fees and that we didn't have to utilize all of them and uh you know us being a member of SBA already I didn't see a discount but that's fine that's because if we're not a member it's a lot more expensive this system information like if we if we had to make a decision okay thank you I think one of the things that when I was looking at these to be honest with you is um somebody I think it was

112Miss Campbell had mentioned right off the bat um three of the other firms are from out of the state and they may do a great job and but they don't know our state the way fsba does they also don't know us the way the other companies do and it maybe you call it a local advantage or whatever but I do feel we've had fsba to come and do group work with us Master board training with us and I think that they understand our district fairly well as opposed to somebody who just sent it in because they got a proposal and I don't think any of these I think all of these are fully qualified but for me it was more of that homegrown they understand the back door to everything that happens in the state

113and they know all the other school board members they understand and can give us Direction sort of on how some of the other stuff's going on so my number one choice was fsba and just like you guys rain Associates was number two because I think like um Miss Jenkins had mentioned and others is they put together a great presentation and I think that they're highly qualified what it was for me was is is that fsba would do a better job just because of our local presence so um sounds to me like we have a uh a consensus on fsba with the four to one does anybody disagree with that so that we can kind of start to the next step I just want to throw one thing out there and I know you don't really

114have time to to consider this I mean I guess we're doing it tonight but the one issue that I have with fsba is there's no clear Direction about the community input and and I don't like that um it wasn't clear at all uh it sounds like they're just gonna facilitate Community meetings and what does that mean do we have to put them together are you just going to be there to listen um whereas uh Ryan Associates seemed really clear to me that they were going to contact the community in multiple forums in multiple ways and I think that's really really critical and so I think that's something that we need to to think about uh as we're making this decision because I think it's critical that our community is involved if we're going to move

115forward I think we all agree so um Paul you want to reach out to them and yeah again I like Christina and see if she can't start working on that thank you and then let's talk about when we may want to meet with them um in the month of January we have a school board meeting on the I think later on on the 28th um I think that yeah um later on in the month we also have the legislative delegation that we're going to be meeting with I think that's the 11th or 12th or 13th right in there would it be appropriate for us to ask to try to set something with staff before say the 15th of January and check our calendars with us so that we can kind of meet with them in

116set Direction I think that that would be good in the fact that we can get it within a four-month window start the process and I would say like Miss Jenkins was saying we should look at some of those engagement tools that they have and I wouldn't doubt if you guys reached out to fsba and just said hey here's my concerns that they might be able to hear that prior to coming and then listening to us you know what I mean so I think um if that sounds good with Direction uh um and everybody's kind of giving me the thumbs up Paul sometime before the 15th of January we kind of work with staff to get us the the date and then we select Florida School Board Association as our vendor and we um because we

117have we have this and um you said you know maybe uh an off-site uh time hopefully with the interim superintendent to kind of get to know you um Can Can we ask Tammy to do you know she does the doodle poll and give us can you do a doodle poll so we like give it like and put like every date in January that's a possibility so that we can kind of know because it looks like we're going to need a couple of days in January especially since we only have one board meeting yeah yeah and and so that you guys know there's a poll to come out you click yes to all of them and then they Whoever has all of them then we know those are the dates that's a great idea thank you

118are we good there Tammy thank you Miss Campbell um right now we've been at it now for about an hour and a half does anybody need to use the restroom or can we keep moving no I want to make sure that I don't drive it like I did um last Thursday okay um so the next thank you so much I I really want to just say right now that the direction that you guys came up with was not only fair to the public shows the community involvement and is not a rushed situation so I really appreciate it the next topic is the Brevard Public Schools book Review Committee this was brought up by Mr Trent so I was going to give you the opportunity kind of lay the groundwork for what you would like to

119do Mr Trent all right thank you on this um this is the perfect spot for us to talk about it in a workshop and what I'd like to see us talk about is the process in from the beginning to the end from when somebody's requesting a review of materials in our libraries who it goes to how it gets to a Review Committee if it goes to the media Specialist or the media specialist and or the building principal where they could just discuss it first and I I know there's some where they can just remove it a book out of out of the library before it even gets to a review process some of the concerns that had come through was just the effectiveness of the Committees that we had in place so if we can

120get some clarification on how these committees even came to be the amount of members the voting members was uh was a concern the concern I had was many of the voting members were paid BPS employees that had something to do with uh you know those books being in in the place in the beginning and they would have to in some cases admit that they had something to do with them there so to ask them to reconsider to have them removed seemed a little bit of a of a conflict and maybe put those employees in a particular spot and then even after some of them were not necessarily removed but age-appropriatiness was settled upon many of the media Specialists uh you know felt like now they were being burdened to be the gatekeeper of the books

121behind the uh behind the desk so really just turning this on its ear about what is the actual the best way to to review these books concern was leaving these books in our libraries for years actually before they were reviewed and not being able to just remove books and then get them quickly reviewed to put them back in um and and and that's what I'd like to talk about today and have that discussion I I would really like to see some of these boards more reflective upon on the makeup of our of our school board rather than just a school committee uh Mr Trent did you um during that conversation I was hearing you say that you may want to hear about how it is that we came up with the current process we correct

122to hear that correct um so with um who in the back row would like to come up and explain the current process of the book review who did that fall under they're all drawing straws and they're saying okay oh I'm sorry Dr Petty did you want to uh it falls it falls under Jane Klein but um Dr Sullivan has run with the process but it is outlined in our policy and policy um 2521 yeah that's how the that's how the committee came to be is the board developed the policy they outlined in the policy who would make up that committee and then the members came up thank you um yeah our goal as staff is of course to just Implement support the board policy as written in America as written um and it was a

123lengthy process in this rewrite as many of the board members recall and probably our most most Rewritten board policy over the years and so certainly at the will of the board we're happy to be initiate an alternative policy review process but as the board is aware that does take a few board meetings and so policies aboard policy we're implementing the policy and certainly open to any direction I will take a two-minute Liberty since I have the bike and you called me up um I I have a tremendous gratitude for the members of the committee and I'm really proud of the work they did in the first two meetings really thoughtful thoughtful discussions clearly um I read it each of them had read statutes they were very courteous and respectful of different decisions and thoughts and

124I think the board can be proud of of the process and how it unfolded that doesn't mean that the board certainly can't change that we're okay with that I just felt like it was really important to honor those that did the work that we asked of them with an unprecedented process before them and uh really found them to be quite thoughtful and quite engaging with a lot of really powerful perspectives and so I serve at the board as Mr Trent had asked for the pause we put it on pause and certainly are prepared to either continue with committee meetings wait till the board revision process at whatever Direction there is on any revision of it and then do that my goal is simply to facilitate and as as they mentioned Ms Klein's division owns the

125policy but I have lived the policy and so I'm certainly happy to take that so again it's you know it's a tough issue I think the folks did great everybody was thoughtful everybody read and everybody really did an amazing job and I think each of you and certainly those before would be proud of the representatives that were on the board and our staff that spend a lot of time reading some very long books prior to the meeting so I'm certainly um through direction to I don't know who really quite frankly but I would say Mr Gibbs and us so we could certainly come back within alternate draft to reinitiate it I would need direction on we're kind of Midway right now and uh would you request a longer pause or not um but I certainly

126felt that the committee members were were pretty amazing um thank you for that I agree my Committee Member is a very special person and I appreciate all of her work I think Mr Trent if I can be help out a little bit here um one of the two issues that I heard you say was is that the committee make up between whether those are going to be people from the district or not and then the other one was you kind of mentioned speed of review like how fast that's actually happening is there any other like basic major components that you'd like to discuss or is those the two just so that staff knows when they're making the changes what areas you know what I mean to change because there's a lot more to it there

127is a committee makeup and I did want to say that the committee did a bang-up job as far as our workers or media Specialists taking their time out to do that so it was no no knock on them in any way it's more of the US making up this committee sure I I truly feel to reduce the amount of voting members I I would go all the way down to our appointed member from our board is the voting body of that and have have media Specialists or whomever else we would like to have uh in the district um some admin just like we have now but it's just the voting membership there uh that I would strongly want it to reflect our board otherwise we would do it ourselves if we can work on that

128one piece right and then start moving um Dr Sullivan for the purpose of the public who's watching just so they can understand um like we have we understand these policies we're reading them can you give me the voting makeup of the committee just so that they can understand absolutely ideas Define has nine voting board members and that includes a representative of each of the board members from two media Specialists representing the age bands and an administrator and a Content specialist also familiar with the great bands so for the we knew that the requests at hand were all of secondary nature so the the committee members don't represent that so that makes nine Missy slack is our district-wide media content specialist she serves as the non-voting facilitator of of the meeting and the discussion okay um

129thank you for that uh Dr Sullivan you had mentioned age bands and I'm sure that we're going to get some calls on that can you explain what age fans mean yeah and so these are secondary uh books of questions secondary schools okay and so we have media Specialists from our secondary schools um and I use that word specifically because some cross middle in high school so secondary content versus Elementary School content we have not had a request on any Elementary School content at this point okay all right so we kind of understand the what the voting makeup is now we understand that it was a policy that was developed so um bring it back to you um Mr Trenton just kind of lay out what your needs are and then we can discuss it right

130the the important part is also the it's not an easy process to get a book review I mean the parent or the person in the county that's wanting these reviewed it's they have to do their their homework here to do that um I would strongly urge us to get that book off the shelves so we can review it just in case we are going against statute that it's not sitting on our shelves when we could possibly be someone could be at fault so that that is what I have had um you know throughout the time that you know through the campaign and through our you know talking to the public is their biggest concern was um you know getting them off review them put them back as soon as as soon as possible possibly not

131uh it's not a literary review and many parents mine it is the three or four pages or 20 Pages or whatever it is that is of concern it's not the story it's it's how they go about telling it I'm just telling you this is what we've heard for for a year now and it's extremely important to me personally to get that uh off the table get it off the shelves and review to put it back in there's no need to buy books also you know we had to buy each of these members brand new books to go over and read when we have them on our shelves if we do then that's where we get those books from okay um so if you can come back to uh we had spoken about committee makeup being

132the conversation um uh Mr Trent is there a committee makeup that you would like to propose so that we can talk about it from there and then I agree with you on some of the process um so but let's go to that one next if you can so yeah you can keep it the same makeup I just want the voting members okay I probably won't be totally satisfied until it's you know our five voting members that we okay we propose are so keeping the same committee makeup but the voting board members would or the voting members would be only board members okay so that's the the piece so board Representatives yeah so I'm sorry um so is there any discussion on Mr Trent's proposal that's right okay Miss Jenkins I question whether or not my

133fellow board members participated in any of those committee meetings um or watched any of them um I also would like to say hats off and thank you to the people who have volunteered their time to participate in this it is a Time sucker and thank you to the employees who probably were voluntold um their additional role and job um I do not agree with reducing the voting members it sounds like you just don't like the results of the votes that were taken um if we're going to only have our board representatives vote then why do we even why are we not doing it then it doesn't make any sense uh if we're going to restrict it to five people then why aren't we reading the books if it doesn't make any sense at all this

134was a extremely long process that we had to participate in uh um because of what was put in front of us it is intentionally um Thoreau the amount of time that it takes to review the books is uh really something we can control we can't control how many books get sent to us either uh who knows if tomorrow someone wants to send in 50 more books for us to review um I don't personally see any problem with this policy if I'm being perfectly honest I was probably the only one who said why are we even doing this in the first place so um I I think that this is well thought out very intentional I think it's really really critical that we have the voice of Educators administrators parents Guardians teachers and the media Specialists

135themselves to participate and then if you're going to say they can participate but we're going to take their opinion away and their ability to vote then why are they participating at all are we asking them to Lobby our board Representatives that doesn't make any sense I know Miss Wright uh when I believe it was Miss right if not I'm sorry but uh when this was brought up originally the concern was that the board Representatives aren't reflective of the new board and that yeah that totally makes sense right so you can appoint whoever you want because that's what it says here in this policy and I think that's a fair concern absolutely um but in order to shift the makeup because we don't like the results of what was happening so far in the beginning I

136think is unfair um and defeats the purpose of the process I am concerned about just removing things to remove things because it just takes a simple Google search to see how quickly that can get abused um there is a county here in the State of Florida where 3600 books were removed from the libraries from one single individual and there's no way you can redraft this policy uh to outweigh someone else's concern from another you're going to have to have the playing field be level and so I don't know how you would battle that issue if that was something that we were willing to take on okay thank you Miss Jenkins Miss Campbell um so unintended consequences and I think that's what I just heard Miss Jenkins um the last little part was you know really

137talking about an unintended consequences anytime we do policy changes we have to think about that um with this book review process I have a couple of kind of tests in my mind okay if we'd make this change would that possibly cause XYZ and trying to avoid that so um I think we got it as we're going through this when you think about that I know not very long ago another County a school board friend in a different County someone came and challenged the Bible and so they started pulling that off the shelves and you know I mean are we creating a process where you know um things that we may not you know somebody wants to come and challenge which has been challenged in the past Dr Seuss books are we going to pull the

138Dr Seuss books um so we would want to be careful I mean it seems ridiculous but listen in today's we have to think that the day that we're living in ridiculous happens ridiculous happens all the time so I um I think probably it sounds like what we need to do is have a work session because a work session when we do the policy we really get to hammer out and change and and Redline ourselves I mean staff will bring recommendations we could give them some ideas to start with but as far as the makeup of the committee and just to give a little history we've revised this twice since I've been on the board and what I would say to that is you don't know what you need until you need it and the revision

139that we made last spring was to add the district level review process because we did only have it at a school and we was put so much time and thought into putting that in there and and we'd never needed it and we never used it and then all of a sudden now we need to use them we realize oh we don't have this piece so I think um it can evolve as we see how it's working um I too am just thankful for the way the first committee I I got to watch the full first committee I would like to have if you would send us the link of the second one because I never I ever found that um did get a summary from my representative but I would like to watch that myself

140it sounds like the biggest priority is the the what are we going to do with the books until they're reviewed I agree with you when we had the process uh in part at least uh when we had the process last spring I made the request that we remove books that are specifically the complaint is the violation of the statute of you know what's harmful to minors the pornographic material State Statute is pretty descriptive with what should and shouldn't be in there I know there's some argument over um you know the definition of harmful to minors but I think with that one adjustment we can actually um you know the only thing is how do we do it to not have a random person come up and say I want to pull all Dr Seuss books

141because I think they're all pornographic well clearly they're not but how do we you know I don't know how we how we judge uh that but I think that would be a piece that I would agree with um just I don't know how what the verbiage would be that's where illegal people need to work the magic um I agree I think everybody agreed at when we first had those conversation that we do need to make a tweak to the language that says that allows for change in board members Representatives we're all in agreement with that that whoever the you know because it originally said they served for a year so it needs to say a year or until such time as a board member collects a new representative so that's an easy tweak but uh

142kind of kind of sounds like Mr system we that maybe we need to just take this to work session and um you know so Mr Trent was speaking specific to the committee makeup um did I hear you say that you would like to move to that or to the others because I think the process would be another conversation yeah so if you can focus on the um you did committee makeup are you happy with that yeah I would like to change that in any way no with the thought the process that we put in place over the last two revisions uh 2019 I think and then this one um then the intention was very specific and one to make it an odd number and two to make more board Representatives than staff so that the

143board Representatives have their priority vote um you know if you watch the first meeting it was very interesting it didn't it didn't fall it isn't because of one way or the other right it didn't fall you know everybody thinks this person's gonna vote this way I mean they were all pretty much agreement I mean it was like eight to one thinking about what they're with the decision that they were going to make so and then I think they all agreed with the solution so which was in that particular case to put it behind the counter um unless and then unless you're 18 or your parents give you permission you can't check it out so um you know I think they did really good work but I I the makeup of the committee I'm actually fine

144with I think the process of what are we going to do until we get to the committee is where my concern lies okay so miss right yeah um I can understand your your struggle with this conflict of interest because I I do understand the fact that if we have media Specialists that are responsible for what is in the library and now we're asking them to possibly say hey I messed up I put something in them that shouldn't be there that could become problematic uh the other thing I struggle with is some of these books that are in question we wouldn't allow someone to stand up there at the microphone and read them and so when we're talking about something of that nature and I'm going wait a minute we're going to give this to a

145child I don't understand the logic there so I'm like if it can't be read in a boardroom can I and I understand people don't want books removed because they're afraid that they're not going to have access to these books let's ask the manufacturer to redact these these really crazy pages and they may end up with a book that's missing four or five pages I don't know but they still have the book and in essence they're just going to miss that part that that could be harmful um for me I would always err on the side of protecting a child's innocence I don't think that we should expose them to things the book sensation has caused these books obviously to be more popular because it's very you know in the news in the media um but

146I would love this Air District move towards something that protects children as much as possible from things that could just be they don't offer any literary value so the other thing that's been brought to me is the AP material so some of these books are in our AP curriculum and and that becomes problematic for our AP teachers because they've already you know gone through the lesson plans and created a lot of work around those so I I would just if we revamp this policy I would like to see any book that is on an AP curriculum to Prior take priority over how it's how it's addressed and handled that needs to be responded to first I think because it's and you know we're using it um but again I would just err on on the

147side of protecting a child's innocence that's what I would always choose Miss Wright um if you can give some direction under the committee makeup would you like to move to the five um selected by the board or would you like to keep the current system the way it is voting with nine members I I think there is a conflict of interest if they're a paid person who is actually responsible for putting a book in a library there is a conflict of interest there um I understand wanting to have additional opinions and expertise I get that um can we pull them from anywhere else other than somebody that we're paying directly for okay um so I'm hearing you say that you do find a conflict of interest and you'd like to move to the five selected

148members of the board I don't think I'm not exactly saying move to the five I'm just saying I think that it becomes an issue when they are a media specialist in our schools and they're responsible for the books that are going in there and now again they're either going to have to recognize that hey I'm responsible for putting this in there and this is not shouldn't be in there it becomes an issue so I I don't know what the perfect solution is honestly as we work through this I think we are gonna have to work through it to some degree but I do think that that is a conflict of interest can I ask a question because I think actually first of all the the the media Specialists on the committee have to be media

149specials that can't be from the school where the book was so that's not true okay I'm thinking of the school level yeah School level is a little different and I appreciate you opening the door to that because we do need to address both halves of the policy so essentially the Four A's and all the Four B's if we're going to be discussing committee makeup so I just wanted to throw that out there um no we when the policy was drafted and board approved one of the things that we felt was relatively important and we use the terminology of year-long so that it wouldn't be bias based on a specific book right so we wanted to try to eliminate it being book specific and rather just you're serving this term this year and what will come

150will come and so we took volunteers basically you know surprisingly they weren't necessarily lining up on the door but we got volunteers so they were not volunteled so I'm pleased to share that um so basically I took the first administrator that volunteered you know and took the First Media specialist basically and then we would reconvene new folks so we felt like a year was important to where it wasn't becoming about what book so so that was where the impetus of that decision came from um in terms of you know I'm gonna have some bias here uh because again I was blown away by the thoughtfulness of the discourse between the staff members and the board members and I just thought it was super powerful um but of course again with the will of the board

151so we'll certainly support everything but I thought it was really important to have people who are trained in book selection as well but again I you know it's we're totally comfortable with whatever's decided I do want to make a point of clarification that part of the length in this time span was we were waiting on the rewrite of the policy so if you recall when the requests came in we didn't have a multi-school request period And so working with a petitioner we waited until that was changed so that the petitioner did not have to go to 15 different schools because none of us thought it was a good idea not staff not bored not parents not anybody really involved and so once the ball kind of got rolling and us getting through our new thing

152I think that time is really down to the amount of time to read the book because obviously reading the book in its entirety is something that I think we all value I don't think that's something that is up to you know that anybody disputes so in terms of timeline we were changing the policy we did wait on the policy change kind of like we are right now and I don't say that critically at all I think process is important I think policy is important um but I also think a Clarity around it we were starting to form sort of a Clarity around the process um I think it's really important if you discuss the status of the books that we're really clear on language around formal review because we don't have formal requests on the

153majority of the books that we are reviewing and so just a quick reminder for the board and for those that weren't on the board at the time um I may get an email from a parent just expressing their concern or some version of that I've gotten handouts you know all kinds of different things doesn't matter to me how they've got it at that point it's like any other concern a parent would Express to us we're going to go to the schools we're going to try to find out is it appropriate do we need to make a correction so then I reach out to the schools first I have my staff show where they're located and then we reach out to the schools because sometimes folks go missing sometimes all of the others have occurred or

154when they review the feedback they agree with the feedback and they pull the book like any other circumstance we have staff change perspectives change times change right I I don't think that I haven't seen the media specialist taking any personal and I've sent them a million emails um any person was sort of a front and so they review it sometimes they agree with the petitioner right away sometimes they make some additional decisions and so then I send that information back to the petitioner so here's where it is this is what they've reported and then the petitioner will then decide if they want to file a formal request and again we've sort of hashed this out over the school year and so for example right now I have 11 formal requests that have been through that

155process we've communicated with the petitioner and began scheduling them right so we did the first three and then um paused and so it does allow for that thoughtful review first which I think is really important um and so when discussing like the status of a book just the board's Clarity around formal review I think is really important as opposed to just any email that I might get as opposed to the actual petition and formal process being followed I would ask the board to consider that as you're discussing what you want to see in the policy and what process you want to see unfold we're also in an interesting time because the state is tackling this very topic as well so they are going through and developing training and expectations of media Specialists if you recall

156from the statute change from this past legislative session that's all due by January 1st and so there may be some language there as well um so current state is I think um thoughtful but I also think continuing to tweak those things that you know concern the board we're happy to give a draft of anything you'd like again I'll just need clarification on process because typically we would continue typically if we receive requests on this current process we would utilize the current policy so as the board knows in different issues that we have faced we did receive them under this current policy and so I would need just board Direction on that expectation since the ones that were received are under this current and typically we keep them under the current policy of which they were

157received and again I I don't really have a strong opinion I just want the board to consider we'll need clarification on that as well as you know when they come in under which policy for changing it again which one do you want me to follow so I just ask for some specificity around that as well if we're looking to Interchange entertain some changes on that and Mr Gibbs anything else related to a mid-stream policy change that I'm missing nope I think you've covered most of it yeah thank you Miss Sullivan um in regards to and thank you for that backdrop and everything else I had some questions in regard to the process eventually but it's my turn to say about how I feel about it um what it comes down to for me is is

158that I do appreciate all of the input of all of the staff but I do believe that if it's going to be our elected board positions that are in Jeopardy if we have books that are not that are inside of our schools that are inappropriate I believe that it should be our team that actually makes the decision so if we are going to be meaning that if we have books that are inside of our um elementary schools or high schools that we haven't dealt with that are in there then we may be in violation of the state statutes that falls on us not staff unfortunately so I have no problem moving to the five board Representatives being the voting members with the intent of keeping the other members on there for input just like a

159regular committee um and so I feel that very strongly about that so that puts us into a situation where you have two people who have moved that direction two people that say they'd like to keep the same direction but miss Wright you had mentioned there was kind of like this quasi thing that you were trying to come up with I wanted to give you the opportunity to try to explain that piece like those extra board members maybe there's another way that or those other employees of the district you want to explain a little bit in there yeah I mean I I agree on if if it is going to come back on us then it should be us that is responsible for who's appointing it but I do like the idea of the professional experience

160that we have from some of our media Specialists but I I just struggle with the fact that I think there is a conflict there when they are paid by BPS uh and I I can't get around that um so really I guess is going to be the majority of the board on what they decide they want to do for for the makeup of this for our current sitting members right now what happens there because we haven't Rewritten this policy right now is that correct Paul for us to be able to to appoint a person right the policy is not Rewritten um there it the policy doesn't explicitly say whether the new members get to a point and replace a member on their policy just says the board gets one appointee and the committee starts at

161the start of the school year so that's really the limiting language is they serve for a year for the school year and they start at the beginning of the school year so that's the only piece that we're drawing from um if the board wants to interpret that to allow board members to appoint new members then that's the will of the board at this point we have a consensus on that well can I ask Ms Sullivan this so are they in the middle of reading a book right this moment um what was read already but already the third title because we had anticipated having that one on the 20th okay um uh but I will but I did communicate with the team that we were on a pause and I do believe um current members understand

162right um you know the discussion on makeup um so if we were to interpret if the board were to interpret in the manner that Mr Gibbs described you I don't I don't think it would cause much conflict we would certainly take your appointees reschedule I mean give them an opportunity to read fortunately this third book is probably the shortest book out of all the ones so it would be less of a time delay then we returned to big fat ones again um so this third book happens to be one of the smallest of the titles and so they're just at the ready the other three members I'm sure have read them and would not be surprised at any of that but again it still falls under the rest of it isn't about interpretation I assume

163so if the board is choosing to interpret the new two new members that's super easy I can facilitate that once you select someone and I can get this third book rescheduled but all those other questions still remain for the board to decide I think there was consensus to allow you guys under the current definition to make that selection do you guys know apparently can are you guys in a place where tomorrow maybe you can email your representative to Paul yeah okay I can send it to Dr Sullivan's or Dr Sullivan or whoever are you in a good place to sometime this week get that to them oh absolutely I believe Tammy uh already has okay so coming back to you Miss right um we had spoken about um the uh board members selected group being

164the only voting members but you had mentioned that there might be some sort of a quasi that you might want to do or are you saying that um you know I mean I want to give you the floor there yeah I um working through this process I don't have a solution for this right this moment and and we can obviously come back to it and bring it bring somebody to add to the to this uh committee again in the future um I think for right now until I kind of wrap my brain around who that person would be that has the media experience that that we were looking for um I'm okay with it being consisting of just our appointed members for right now to make it simpler okay um so that brings us so

165um Mr Gibbs Our Miss Sullivan is that enough direction for you for the next policy to oh I have a comment on that hang on just a second um so are you and there'll be plenty of opportunity to comment Miss Jenkins but have you gotten the opportunity that three board members have said that they would like to move to that direction and they can email you their selected Representatives two separate Stories the selected representative super easy the issue at the change of policy um we're saying three-person consensus on only the board Representatives voting and then that would require a policy change which would mean the board would have to make a clarifying decision on the ones in the current process and that's what I think we can do that in just a second I just

166wanted to make sure that the problem I'm with you so far okay just trying to make sure because we're we're kind of jumping ahead a little bit on some of the conversations and stuff like that but we do have board direction that the five individuals that would be voting are going to be the individuals that we select and I think now we can move towards the process right and Miss Jenkins you can definitely have conversations in a minute about um I'd like to have a conversation just hang on just a second no sir this is a workshop and we just discussed a topic Miss Wright had multiple times to speak on that topic it is also my right to speak on that topic Miss Jenkins I am not disagreeing with you that you have time

167all I'm saying is is that we have to keep moving because it's four o'clock okay and if you have anything to say on that topic I would love to hear it when we come to the next piece but for the time purposes if we can stay on a process which is the next piece you have ultimate opportunity in a second if we can just let Mr Gibb or Mr Trent actually give us what his process is that he's doing and then I'll give you the opportunity I'm going to have to disagree with you Mr Susan we are talking about one thing right now it makes no sense to go backwards to talk about it it makes no sense at all Miss Jenkins you can definitely do that but I'm just saying that we've already given

168board direction we each had an opportunity and I have a right I have a right to speak again we're equal board members Mr Trent go ahead for us to move forward if you don't mind I'm sure Susan is I I'm going to give the time to Miss Jenkins for her to go ahead and clearly thank you very much so um I'm well aware that you gave board Direction but I'm I have to speak about some of the things that were said uh multiple times there were statements about conflict of interest and I think there is a conflict of interest but I don't think it resides within the committee members it doesn't make any sense to me it is their interest it's their job who could have more interest than our media specialists in the media

169center suggesting that they might have that book in their library and then what are what are the odds that they're going to vote to take it out well I don't know if you're well aware of how books end up in the library in the first place they don't read all of them um and so I think we can trust their critical judgment and their professionalism to come to a consensus whether or not they agree that still belongs on the shelves and we've witnessed that already um it was mentioned that uh we have to worry about the security of our elected positions because it falls on us well some of us don't operate on that and this wouldn't fall on us as individuals if there was a breach in State Statute it would fall on the

170school district we already deal with that there already have been situations where those books have been removed because it was clear as day and the point of the committee is to come to a consensus whether or not that material does not abide by that said state statute and so essentially what we're saying is we don't even want to have the committee because we're not trusting that process that we put in place also to save statements that these members of this committee shouldn't have a voting right because they're paid by BPS well guess what we're paid by BPS too should we not have a voting right it makes zero sense absolutely zero sense and I have to clarify this because the statement was made and it's critical to be addressed you cannot mess with ap curriculum

171they will pull your credentials and if you pull AP credentials out of this school system man the impact you will have for this school system for the community for the businesses for the district ratings for our students trying to get into certain colleges and they made it very clear that once you start missing messing with the materials that they suggest for their curriculum they aren't afraid to pull out so we need to be really really careful about those statements and how we address that thank you Miss Jenkins Mr Trent you have the opportunity to speak about process so the process and and the speaker then if there's an AP book that is going to be discussed it should be discussed in that manner and and dealt with not just pulling out of all AP books

172so we don't have them to be accessed so that's that's a deflection I don't want to go down the road there um Mr Trader was said yes it was said to be prioritized prioritize meaning put them in the front of the list so we can talk about them right but you cannot move we could talk about the access to that book Miss Jenkins please just the access of certain books uh it has been that already where we have challenged access to a particular age group for example in a 712 District okay so I'm confident we'll we'll deal with the uh the AP books there um are you talking about the process and how we want to get these books um yeah uh no speed the process speed the process up yeah sorry I'll do my

173my best too um totally in uh and with you Dr Sullivan on even on an email for you to do your due diligence take a look at it if it's up something egregious you get to it I'm a big proponent though of a formal request I think that um it's anyone can send an email but to actually ask a parent to put a a formal request request together will will go through some of those frivolous uh requests to look at um because there's some very good questions in here so I do believe that's that continues to need to be the process of getting them in there removing removing well one thing I will fight back or pull back on a little bit where you see we all agree on that the entire book needs to

174be read that's that's where I that's where I differ um they're they're not they're not requesting a review because they didn't like the storyline uh or the ending of the book um or if it had the story in its in itself had uh literary uh benefit for the student it's it's usually specifically uh a situation a chapter a you know we we do not need uh very many specialists to understand as a parent what we don't want to put in front of our children so yes we have to I know there's components of State Statute but they always end that with you know error on the side of of caution and and or error on the side of uh protecting an innocence of our children I will always uh go with that so I I

175really don't care where we're at in a particular book review it is the content on where the the individual parent taxpayer has a concern in that book uh we I don't see any reason why we couldn't go through a book an evening of the content of what's questioned not should we put it on a curriculum and write a report on it in our classroom so it is it is exactly the reason why some math books were pulled it wasn't the entire content of the math book or a particular chapter it was a specific reason and and we have to get back to that this is how this all started was particular reasons of why a book should be in question not the story okay we need to get these out as soon as we possibly

176can after a formal review or after you absolutely say this as something you know there's some substance here like this one slipped through the cracks so Mr Trent what I'm hearing you say is is that you would like to make it to where all the requests are formally done rather than just an email shooting staff right you would also like to set up an entire instead of reading the entire book to because um just so many of the public knows we reviewed two books in three months is what I think the schedule is uh Dr Sullivan can you verify that it's based on the length of the books sure and so um we calculated a week per 100 Pages um just just for that the state statute does say that has to be considered in

177its entirety um so you know that's certainly something we can bring back at any draft that the board's requesting um but just for clarity that is based on current state statute and they they actually use that that verbiage um so yeah that our current is based on the length of the book so that the committee has time to read the book okay and um so what you're saying uh is that you'd like to have it to where just that specific section is looked at right um and then you had mentioned the third one but if I go ahead you were just going to say something I'm just trying to clarify no you can clarify and then if if yeah I I don't believe the request is they're upset about the storyline of the of the

178book okay State Statute says that that's great but we can also again we're going to err on the side of uh of of caution uh if the book's off the shelf and that committee decides they want to read the entire book that that's fine it's just going to take that long to to get it back on the Shelf I don't think it's necessary uh to do that that's not what why these concerns are being put forth okay yeah I'll come to you because I just want to redefine it then I'm going to come to you right now I just want to clarify something I don't think that I heard him say because I think what I heard him say what I heard him say was the deformal request is what triggers this that we can

179continue to have the informal process but the formal process is what would trigger the committee the maybe potentially pulling the books off the chat yeah that everything other than of course the the decision on public is currently in practice and what we've been doing which I commended doing that is if you did get an email that didn't automatically go to the review process that you did the right thing right looking into it do the informal search but for anything to get to a review process you'll get back to them and say we did not feel it needed to be pulled you're more than welcome to fill out a formal review and then the third component is that you would like these to be immediately review removed because um they may be in violation of a

180state statute or something like that okay so we have the three pieces that he wanted to work on in the process who would like to speak to the topic Miss Campbell so the first say the first one again because that's what we were just clarifying um what do you what he was basically wanted to make sure is that if somebody sent in an email and said hey I've got this problem that yeah you can look at it and do that but in order for it to formally come before a book Review Committee they need to fill out the form because you felt very strongly about that process right and that's already in there so I think yeah I think we're good to say we're going to leave that in there yeah um as far as

181yep nope and then what you have to do is is um not to read the entire section right I uh we gotta we gotta think we need to stick with the whole thing statute does say taken as a whole right so we need to take it as a whole even if you know I understand and I think that's more of a statement to the public who are saying we're book banning all that stuff than it is necessarily I mean the committee was very thoughtful and and and and taking things in context you know and I'm thankful for my member because honestly I there are some of those books I wouldn't be able to get through and at the Clorox my eyes um sorry I'm approved um problem but I will say uh that the time

182frame of doing it there's a there is the 100 because of all the busy lives and staff the 100 Pages for a week that's reasonable but there is a way for us to speed it up because a policy currently allows for us to have multiple committees I know that would put a lot of Miss slack um but we can actually have um we can have more than one committee going at a time and so um and just you know this wasn't taking this books and these I'll take this book so we could we could go a little faster that way um if we were to get backed up that's one way already in the policy currently um I again I'll just go back to it as far as the process I I think if if

183we get if someone submits this formal request and the particular incident is especially you know um the issue is the Florida statute 847.012 then that because there are other requests maybe it's a religious issue that someone has or something else you know whatever but you know the majority of their press we've received have been based on sexual content so if that sexual content that this would trigger I might would press I'm going to go back to what I asked last spring no matter where I said today is that we do go ahead and put those behind the Shelf at the very minimum with parent permission only until they go through the process and I think that would actually help a lot of what our problems are in the meantime Miss Campbell if you can just

184explain the parent permission piece because I think people might want to know a little bit more about yourself yeah so I mean just this is what happened to the first book um the committee decided that it was an adult book um it was advertised it was written for adults it was advertised for adults it did it up on some of our shelves um and so the committee decided to leave it in the library in that particular case but the only people who could ask access it would be 18 year olds who are adults and are they specifically behind the counter right but right behind the counter so it's not like a seventh grader or ninth grader can just walk up and grab it off the shelf which is the problem with leaving them on the

185shelves out in the in the general Library so they put it behind the Shelf only 18 year olds or parents who specifically give permission you know my child has you know can access this book and just if you watch the meeting just for just you know technical technicalities sake that that was shown to be a much better process for the media specialist actually to have when they're because if they're checking out a book you know to be the art media Specialists are sometimes they're amazing how well they know they're not just their collection but their students um and so but for them to keep track of who can check out what it becomes a nightmare if you're leaving it out on the general shelf and so to have it back where you can't access it

186unless you ask for it that's it that's a little bit easier and plus than if you've got someone else let's say a student aide who's checking out the books or a substitute or something like that then you don't have to worry about them knowing who can and who can't and which books so um that was the the parent permission that's that is an option that was made available to the committee it's something they can continue to use it's something that we could write into the policy if we didn't feel comfortable you know completely pull them out we could leave it and I'm not advocating for one you know the other but that's something we could go ahead and put in there and say you know if the formal process is initiated then we will go

187ahead you know we're we're directing the school or schools if it's a required to go ahead and put that behind shelves and only allow it with parent permission until such time that the Review Committee is done okay thank you for that explanation so what Miss Campbell had mentioned is that she said that may be an opportunity for us to look at Ms Jenkins did you have something you wanted to say no I don't okay Miss Wright no I I like what Mrs Campbell is saying I think it's a compromise right now to to remove them from being accessible to Children immediately um and then it gives time for that process it's it's a compromise it's not 100 what I would like I I still stand behind the fact if the book can't be read from

188right there at the podium it shouldn't be read by our children uh and that is that is that's how I feel about that um but you know parents always have the option to buy those books for their children outside of school so it's not a book panning it's just saying it's maybe not appropriate to be in our schools for our children through taxable taxpayer-funded libraries so thank you I um we had a situation most recently where there was a book that was on the shelves that had been there since the beginning of the year it was identified and flagged as inappropriate and I just kind of want to ask um Dr Sullivan about that process if we can do that because I think that speaks to what the concern is for me and for Miss

189Campbell and others um we had a book that was called wicked that was on the shelves is that correct okay not that not anything under that with that title okay um yeah if there's a book that comes out to be currently in the schools that is inappropriate right um and it's red flag it's right it's all these things um what does the school district do in that case because it violates law right but we had it we had a similar situation earlier and um we received a concern reached out to the principals the principals and media Specialists immediately pulled it so the informal process um you know triggered that very quick resolution um and that's why there wasn't more because the informal process you know work like I said everybody wants to do the right

190thing and sometimes you know so in that case the one that I'm aware of is I received a concern shared that concern with the schools that had the title just like I was kind of hypothesizing earlier principles and media Specialists immediately pulled the book um and because that one was visually inappropriate so it didn't require you know it was obvious thank you thank you that informal process triggered in that case which is why there wasn't a formal process thank you so much Dr Sylvan I really appreciate you explaining that um and so from my perspective I agree that there are some books out there that may cause some angst um so removing them immediately is okay with me I agree with that um I like the idea of bringing forward some multiple committees because then

191we could move through the process I think we have a hump where we're trying to get through a set number of books but once we get through them we should have a system where it's pretty much done so instead of having all of The Angst over all of these books for you know what I mean the next six months with one committee trying to read 100 Pages a day I really like the idea of multiple committees it's a great idea and I want to commend you for coming up with that um the other thing that I would like to do is is uh um I just wanted to talk to you guys about um you know if this is the direction uh Mr Trent if you're okay with some of that if you want to

192respond to some of it no I I also agree with you know as soon as we get through the majority of these things should calm down a little bit and we have to use multiple committees that would be fine I'm assuming we would do it in the same makeup as our first committee so that would be okay um and just to be cleared to ask a question because I think you two are both saying if I'm hearing correctly that you want them pulled out completely is that correct and then the compromise I was saying is hey if we're going to come to a compromise we can put in behind the Librarians area there and so and I think that's where Miss Campbell was as well so then that process said I know I'm not I

193want to clarify that yeah well I mean that's where I am because of the unintended consequences because I think you know because anybody can come in and and say you know I think this and maybe maybe it is maybe it isn't maybe you know like I said we've had people say I want you to pull the Bible because the Bible has you know certain content you know I it's um love to have that conversation with whoever to explain why it's different um but uh so I I just because I was unintended consequences I think that would be a good solution to go ahead and um and make them be behind the Shelf until we get to with specific permission so people if they their children they want their children to have access to those books

194then there the parents making that choice um until such time as the committee and we may have I doubt I don't know I'm just gonna throw this out there if we have something that's still on there and then an informal process didn't resolve it for multiple schools it's probably not a situation where the committee might even say so long but you know we have different committee makeup it may I don't know how it's going to go but uh you know I'm not pushing just just so we're clear um my main thing is that those books are not sitting out on the general shelves um so I think uh whether it's calling them all or but you know putting I think it would just make sense to go ahead and at least put them back and

195and say their parent permission only until the committee couldn't make a decision so I think that there's board direction to do exactly what Miss Campbell said since both of you feel that way Mr Trent and I feel like um we would like to pull them I think that's a good compromise Mr Trent is that where you think is good if if that's going to get us to where we need to be that's fine uh I just want to I mean on record I would rather have them and out and then maybe the committee will have some leeway once they see these of of ultimately where this book needs to go okay so if we have to compromise on getting them off the floor that's fine for now okay Miss Jenkins you had passed on speaking

196I was going to give you the opportunity to speak before um we go on to the next topic um which is going to I think we're going to speak a little bit to multiple committees because I think we may want to expand some of our names to Ms Sullivan in the event that we want to expand that but I wanted to give Ms Jenkins an opportunity to speak to that real quick if you wanted to since you passed thank you so much for the opportunity I um agree with either either so I'm glad you glad you're to your own consensus when it comes to multiple committees I think that sounds really easy uh however that would require more border pointees myself or Dr Sullivan just said that there weren't volunteers banging down the doors and

197you just took away their input and their ability to even participate and vote in the process so there will be less people willing to volunteer their time for generally generally no purpose whatsoever no value to be there and participate other than to maybe get a free young adult novel to read um so I get that that's already in the policy and I'm glad you brought that up Miss Campbell just to say that it exists already and there is a solution there but it sounds a little bit easier than it probably will actually be able to be implemented um because again I don't know if Dr Sullivan wants to clarify but I don't know how many people you had knocking on the door I mean you made it sound like a little bit maybe it's more

198than I'm thinking um if all of this is part of the next policy change I I wouldn't want to speculate given the potential change in voting um so I I honestly just don't know um what that might do um not suggesting kind of an opinion on it one way or another I'm just not prepared to say uh what that impact would have on desire to participate in the process I think from an administrative lens I personally saw those requests and it was plenty of people interested in terms of another content specialist I have one English one so that gets a little tricky but it would just depend probably on the entirety of the policy change and where the board lands after the policy change process which as you know even though it seems like everybody's

199on the same page right now those drafts tend to get revised quite a bit so I couldn't speculate I know that was a long non-answer sorry that's okay I mean it was honest about how not simple this might be so thank you appreciate it thank you Miss Jenkins um in moving forward we have 10 total books that are sitting inside of the pulled referred to for the committee is that what I heard you say we have 10 torture we have uh four to six like in the in between almost stage and then about another 30 um that the potential has indicated the possibility of those formals so one of the things the policy does say is when the petitioners submitting multiple titles the petitioner will put them in order of their priority um and so

200we're going through that order right now I stack the request in the order that I receive them so it'll be sort of one petitioner for a bit potentially another petitioner back to that first petitioners because there are a couple different petitioners okay so I think if if it's okay with everybody what we may want to do is is go back and come up with three or four possible candidates that we might want to appoint to a Review Committee Miss Dr Sullivan you're going to reach out to your staff to try to see how many may want to be participatory towards this process and then when you guys bring back the policy we might be able to say okay we've got we can form a total of maybe two three committees to review these books to

201get them moved through so that we can get them I'm gonna throw one monkey wrench and I know I you hate the policy actually specifies the authority to convene another committee lies with the superintendent okay so that's just another policy thing I just wanted to mention that um how about we change that I wasn't saying that's ours to change right you can't just change it like right right now no we can we can make that and then I think I don't think that there's going to be a conflict with the superintendent I'm just sharing no I appreciate that that's a great Point Dr Sullivan so thank you um are we going because we don't I I'm not comfortable it I think if we want to go ahead and get the Committees back going with the

202new members we can do that but I'm not comfortable with us operating under the um what we have when we don't have it it's not there in writing until we have it in writing so I because um as Dr Silverman just said we don't we don't know what's going to be look it's going to look like exactly another thing is we are having this conversation without having the public input it's very important for us to get the public input which we have in the policy revision process and so if we go ahead and say doctor we want you to operate from now moving forward under what we've kind of pieced together today that is not good governance and so I think we either need to decide are we asking her to put a hole hold

203on the whole review process until we revise the policy or are we telling her go ahead and go you know start the process back up with the new two new committee members Representatives um and then once we change the policy then we'll change it then so I'm not absolutely I think we have I think we have cleared board direction to number of um voting members we have clear board direction that we want to move to a possible multiples we have clear board direction that we're going to pull the book immediately and then have the parent go that I feel is is there um and good point uh Ms Campbell what we need to do is decide now what we currently have in place if we want to let that go until the board members or

204this this policy come up and I was going to ask Mr Gibbs to give us kind of a schedule of that and then um or are we going to let them are we going to stop it until the new policies come up so Mr Gibbs can you kind of give us a formal process because we absolutely do need to hear from the public but we've done these in the past so walk me through what you think would be a respectful amount of time you've got to do it in the public because it's rule making so I usually say 60 to 90 days is what you should expect for rulemaking it's going to depend on how much back and forth once you guys start to get into the red line normally we advertise that out you

205have to have 14 days before the first public hearing which comes at a workshop you have to have 28 days notice before the final approval which is the second public hearing and then the board process includes that one meeting before the first public hearing which is usually at a workshop to go over red lines so uh I don't know so and this one what I'm hearing kind of is you guys may want an additional Workshop before we advertise so that you guys are can provide feedback and Direction on The Proposal that Dr Sullivan and I can come up with for your consideration and take back any comments and then get it on a track I think right now I can't give you a timeline you don't we don't have dates in 2023 yet so I

206can't even advertise meetings for any policies I've got all policy rule making on hold all right Mr Gibbs let me ask you this so the 14 days before we so what the direction that I thought and we can talk about that is is that we asked Dr Sullivan to bring back kind of Quasi what we're doing we at that point can either accept that and move on as the first step or we can Workshop it a little bit and then wait right so the first time that we would be able to do that the 14 days is that inhibited we would have to notice that we would actually have to wait for staff to actually bring it back to us but then the um 14 days before is a recording just based on the cycle

207of Florida today or is that state statute no that's state statute for in rule making process you have to notice the public with no less than 14 days prior to the first public Hearing in rule making that's usually held at the workshop all right then you have to provide 28 days no less than 28 days prior to the second and final public hearing where the the rules going to be adopted in the 28 days is after the 14 yeah we usually do it at the same time we usually notice it so we'll put the ad out in time for 14 days to hit and it'll be far enough out that the 28 days is met and so it's 14 and then 14 correct to a total so your first is 14. it usually is over

20828 days because of the way the board meetings fall so potentially hang on Campbell so if we do it now 14 days later we would have the first meeting we would Workshop it and everything else and you wouldn't agreed to it it's not going to be 14 days I understand but I'm just saying hypothetically 14 days later we would also have the next second one and then what is the third piece after that what is you only you only the third piece is board built you have that one because if you're in rule making so if you make a change in rule making so at that workshop and the board says hey we want to go this direction we got to start over yep so we built in that extra Workshop where the board gets

209to discuss it and say we want this tweet I go change the rule bring it back at the first public hearing and that's we're on track so for instance we have policies on tonight if the board makes a change tonight at the final public hearing those policies come off we restart the cycle I'm advertising on new dates for the 14 days and the 28 days and sometimes when we if we met for the workshop if we all agreed to it it could go to the board meeting that evening is that no and we have to wait another 14 days if you make changes you have to wait but if we didn't make any changes it could go that evening first public hearing it cannot go on the board meeting that night okay so yeah 14

210days and 14 days is it from the you have from the date of the ad running you have to have 14 days before the public hearing the first public Hearing in 28 days to the second public okay so with that just to make it because it's a lot of just to put feet to it so we could potentially have a work session on our proposed meeting day in January which I think is the 24th the first meeting in February have a workshop which would also be the first public hearing something we're not making further changes right and then have it approved at the second meeting in February great okay so by the end of February we're done potentially yeah um so with that does that sound like a good process for you guys it it

211it it does and thanks for all that clarification and so we're not going to absolutely halt everything that's what I was hoping not because I would hope to continue the process of if if uh if an email concern comes in that you still do that process that's in current policy yes that's there so that's going to stay and then encourage the the formal complaint but do that part but just the actual committee work that's what's going to be on hold until we come up with the our details on the policy that's I just wanted to clarify that perfect I'm good I need one more bit of clarification I'm almost there so it was that final discussion on you are requesting that we halt the process even though the previous requests came in under the other

212policy the current policy that's the only thing I need clarification on she's asking when you had spoken before about that yeah from the board you know oh yeah no no no I want to get clarification from him so that we can do it you had mentioned uh right the board or the review committees halted we're not going to just change it because because we're going to change policy so we didn't want her to manipulate anything on the current policy other than continue with you know receiving the requests to look in the material and then urge the formal request to go to the review and then that's where it will halt until we so Mr Trent you're saying that the process continues so that people can continue to identify books but you would like the current

213committee to stall until February yeah until the process can change and stuff like that that's that's what he wants um Dr Sullivan's asking for a different clarification yeah I I you're asking about the 11 books right now that are currently right in question under the policy as it stands correct racists are our sort of normal question of those requests were submitted formally through the current policy right and so it runs under that it that's that's the question on obviously the board can decide what it decides I just want to be clear because a petitioner submitted properly a formal request under the current process and I don't mind you know whatever the board decides on is I just want to make sure I need that clarification are we asking that to stop or I can certainly

214reach out to the petitioners I don't I don't have a problem with that I could reach out to the petitioners and ask if they are okay if you will with that pause because typically when we have requests with a due process it's related to the policy at the time of the request so to clarify on this if we're talking all the way till February what are we doing in with the books that are in that review process it does that yeah that's exactly right the ones that are going on right now what are we going to do right because normally I'll just give you an example when we we had people requesting on a different policy to change the one about changing a school name um we had to follow we had to finish that

215process with the policy as it stood right which took them 18 months and the three meetings and whatever we had to because that was the request came under that um any requests that come once we changed that policy then they follow the new policy so that's what she's asking us that's our that's our normal um so it really to me it would be a matter of going back to the requester and saying you know are you okay with holding off on your requests until we have a new policy in place because if they submitted it under the old policy and just technically if they say no I just I submitted under the old policy I want to follow through then we would need to honor that request also there's there's currently one in process right

216now so I think she's asking for clarification for that purpose too because we halted mid-process so I think that I mean mean that is the same petition I mean I I don't have a problem reaching out to any of the petitioners at all I certainly don't mind um you know if the petitioner says I want to know this current policy I'm assuming absent of course the changing of the two Representatives that I will notify the board and let them know and we will do that in good faith I'm assuming feel free to stop me if I'm assuming wrong but if the petitioner is comfortable with us waiting on this new policy we'll certainly do that as well so I don't think that the actual process that we put together from them making the formal request

217to them going through and what standards and all that stuff it's just the committee makeup so I don't know if they're saying that hey the new change is based on the voting members of the committee and if they're concerned about the book and they're making the request it's all automatically coming off so I would imagine that they would be okay with that not to policy changes right so the books are going to stay in the libraries until February that's what we're that's where we're at now correct but what she's what she's mentioning is is that if they've all gone under and somebody says no I wanted to go through the current policy that we would literally be selecting and going through with the older policy as we're trying to go with the new policy creating

218two committees one that has voters that we um from the other one in voters that we have currently so my suggestion would be that when it comes to February we just moved to the new policy but that's up to the board the petitioner would be it I have a suspicion that they're going to be fine with the halt uh until the new makeup of the try not to guess so I will absolutely reach out let them know or give them that option they feel otherwise I'll certainly let the board know absolutely yeah and I would remind the board that during any kind of statutory changes anything it's the date that it changes that it makes the difference so this is not that in our state laws that we allow laws to continue to go on

219because some applicants have been in it changes immediately depending on the statute so if it's effective immediately it changes immediately so we have that governing power to do it's just it's a it's a respectful towards the people that have applied so if you can ask them all absolutely maybe bring that back and then we'll make that decision I'll follow up but the rule wouldn't be effective until February right right right that's all okay all right are we all okay or do we speak a little bit to it kind of jumped around a little bit I think we're good but Mr Susan I'm just taking a look at the clock and we've got people coming in for right to get ready for the board meeting so I would suggest that we toss this last suggestion to

220the board meeting or a later time we actually have two left we have two yeah um we'll do that so we can take a professional dinner break that's exactly where I was going to go uh Miss Campbell so we have the implementation in payout schedule of salary agreement and the policy zero one six nine point one that we would like to move to this evening um if you guys are okay with that sounds good to me I like that we're all in agreeance okay um thank you very much we'll be back at 5 30.