February 24, 2026, Board of Education Retreat

0013 p.m. We will start with a roll call for the record. I'm the chair, Dr. Carmen Soulson, and I'm present. When I call your name, please indicate if you are present. Um, vice chairs, >> present. >> Board member Anderson, >> present. >> Board member Hearnen not present. Board member >> here, >> present. >> Board retreats offer opportunities for the board to engage in more in-depth analysis of data, engage in discussions, and access relevant information. retreats occur quarterly and are open to the public. Dr. Whitaker, please introduce the first item. The first item on the agenda is the Blue and Gold Institute. I would like to call on Dr. Dwayne Scroll, principal of the Kaylor High School. Good afternoon board chairman vice chair huts team board members student board representative Bra and superintendent Dr. Jim Whitaker,

002thank you for the opportunity to present an overview of the blue and gold institute for the 2026 27th school year. Every student in City Schools of Decar deserve not just access to learning, but access to belonging, opportunity, and a clear path to graduation. In the years following the pandemic, we expanded virtual learning to meet real and urgent needs. That decision was the right one. But over time, we learned something important. When learning becomes disconnected from school life, students can quietly drift academically, socially, emotionally, further from graduation and further from the experiences that make school meaningful. The Blue and Go Institute is about closing that distance. It's about ensuring flexibility does not become isolation and choice does not become disconnection. Our why is simple and urgent. Students will remain connected to adults, peers, activities, purpose, and

003more likely to stay engaged, persist through challenges, and graduate prepared for what comes next. While we can surely boast a 96% graduation rate, we know that all means all must be more than a mantra. It must be strategic. Blue and Gold Institute or BGI is a non-traditional structured academic intervention and re-engagement program grounded in the nine Georgia alternative education program standards to ensure excellence and accountability. It integrates rigorous standards aligned instruction and individualized graduation planning for counseling, social service, and transition transition support. All guided by clear communication and ongoing evaluation. BGI is a program, not a separate school and will function as an inclusive component of the career high school. As part of th this work, CSD is integrating the Decater Virtual Academy onto the campus of Decar High School so that students remain DHS

004students while accessing BGI for part of the year. The primary goal of BGI The primary goals of BGI are to increase engagement for full-time virtual students, provide credit recovery and online initial credit opportunities, and ensure certified skilled staff to support core academics and special education. At the heart of our purpose is the belief that the traditional classroom isn't the only path to success. Our purpose is to provide personalized pathways specifically designed for students who need to recover credits, re-engage with their studies, simply stay connected to the high school experience in a non-traditional way. We're here to ensure that every single student has the support they need to chart a meaningful route not just to graduation but to whatever incredible journey lies beyond graduation. The BGI will provide students with credit as well as the skills

005to maintain progress and community experiences to spark motivation beyond the classroom. Students will have the exposure to post-secary institutions and professional training programs that lead directly to employment after high school. This slide highlights the students the B BGI is designed to serve students whose needs are not fully met by the traditional high school setting. First, we serve secondary students 6 through 12 enrolled fully virtually, including those learning online due to the disciplinary placement or family choice while remaining enrolled in city schools indicator. Upper elementary students will continue to receive support for any online accelerated course they may take. Second, we support traditional high school students who need flexible scheduling, including those who benefit from blended or self-paced learning due to medical, mental health, or personal circumstances. Finally, we serve students who are off track for

006graduation, including those experiencing course failures, chronic absenteeism, or disengagement, and who need timely credit recovery to stay on track. Across all groups, the Blue and Go Institute is a program, not a separate school, designed to remove barriers, maintain rigor, and ensure every student stays connected and supported. Why now? Because our data show that too many students are signaling risk early and the window to respond is very narrow. Our MTSS ABC's a our MPSS ABC data for the current 10th grade class shows rising needs and attendance behavior and credit completion. Nearly half the students MPSS for behavior require targeted or individualized support. In just one month, 16 students missed six or more days of school and several are already failing multiple courses. At the same time, 68 10th graders are engaged in credit remediation, many whom

007need to recover more than one course. Social emotional screening reinforces this urgency with nearly 10% of students showing elevated or extremely elevated risk. The Blue and Go Institute allows us to respond now by providing onampus proximity, personalized support, and flexible pathways before students fall further behind. Most importantly, it ensures that what we are seeing in the 10th grade today does not become a defining story of the class of when these students should be walking across the stage confident and prepared to graduate. By absorbing the DECA virtual academy, there will be some staffing shifts that will allow current employees to continue in CSD. The DVA director, Arthia Williams, who has served 30 years at CSD, will retire at the end of the school year. The BlueGo Institute coordination includes core responsibilities of a traditional graduation coach,

008credit monitoring, recovery planning, student check-ins, and progress tracking, and expands that work to include daily coordination of instructional supports, onampus re-engagement, collaboration with counseling and communities and schools, transition planning, and overnight oversight of flexibility and virtual pathways. As a result, the DSS graduation coach role was shifted into a blue and gold institute coordination role with increased responsibilities such as summer school and modified daily duties focused on participating students. This expanded scope requires additional days and dedicated coordination time. The DHS administration will supervise the program and provide leadership to ensure alignment, accountability, and student outcomes. The current pair professional who manages the online learning room will be reassigned to another school location for a different role at the KA High School. Counseling and the relationships remain a focus as they have been a tenant of the

009Decada virtual academy. Finally, the two current DBA teacher will transition to other roles within CSD and they will be focus and and there will be a focus on finding two teachers at least one whom will have a special education background. For these roles, we'll be working looking for teachers with multiple core certifications. The process begins with family elections during which families complete the enrollment process for full virtual learning using established criteria and timelines. Next is a referral review which may be initiated by a counselor or administrator. The review includes recent academic data, attendance records, and behavior history to ensure we have a complete picture of the student's needs. We then move a student to to we then move to a student services review where the team confirmed that tier one, tier 2, and tier three

010supports have been implemented and evaluated. For any placement decisions made, we prioritize family engagement through an interview and orientation to review expectations, readiness, and student responsibilities. The process concludes with an enrollment decision based on data, space availability, and program fit. Failing receive written confirmation and clear next steps. The process ensures entry into the Blue and Gold Institute is thoughtful, data informed, and centered on student success. Just as important as the entry process is the transition back to the career high school on a full-time basis which remains the clear goal of the blue and gold institute. Once a student is back on track the expectation is high school setting. A transition meeting with the student and family will set expectations and out outline how supports will continue during this shift. Students must demonstrate sustained progress, including

011passing grades, consistent attendance, and strong self-management skills to ensure success. As part of this transition, students may enroll in one goal in the one goal program, which provides structured preparation for college and post-secondary pathways and a consistent connection to a caring adult, the one goal program director who meets with students at least three days each week. One goal supports students in exploring a range of post-secondary options including trade schools, two or four-year colleges and universities. Communitywide communication will be the next step in the process. Later today, I will briefly introduce the BGI to the staff at Car High School. We will also have a process for CSD staff to apply for the two available teaching positions. We will finalize instructional spaces that will help DJI provide future updates. All means all. This is another step

012towards providing an avenue for students to be college and career ready. Thank you for your time and I'll open the floor for questions. >> I'm totally new to this. So, >> okay. Um, so these AGI is like for students that enroll full-time, not part-time. >> No. So most of our students have not say 98% of all enrolled full-time. So it's a full-time student, but it it may be that >> they may be part parti day in the traditional high school setting. >> Credit recovery. >> Yes. Credit recovery, >> right? And it sounds like you have to be an or I'm just wondering if other students um >> you're not required to be an MTSS but that is the mechanism to kind of check to see where students are at and is an appropriate placement. Um

013give you example I think we have at times a student may have a family situation where ill parent they may be eligible as well for the GI and have perfectly good grades. um it may not be a situation where it could be outside of environment. They'll probably like under other circumstances. Okay. >> So, but the MPSS process is really for the students that have fell behind. Traditionally, what we've seen is we're not really catching those students until they're like beginning of senior year, the middle of their junior year. And that's why I went back to the data for 10th grade because we catch them a year early, get them back on track, and then they can get back into the regular high school setting. >> It's mainly for credit recovery. >> Yes. >> And because

014I, you know, I just don't know. Um, in terms of the courses that are offered, they take the courses at home like it'll be both. So, just like the virtual academy will have kids, students that come in. We also will serve students that have elected to I told the parents last night that their student won an Emma King award. He's totally virtual. I made a call to make sure they were coming to the award ceremony more and they was like, "Oh, he's totally virtual." I didn't even know he's totally virtual, but he submitted. He's still a part of the high school through the contest. He's completed. >> You can be uh partially virtual or you can be full-time in the building. That's a big change from what our virtual school has. >> They can come

015in if they want physically and lo and then the teachers are online to support >> teachers are in the room now. the difference >> and the courses. I mean, I'm just, you know, concerning. I'm just wondering, you know, if students maybe there aren't courses at the high school that they want to take, would BGI be able to serve them or is that more dual enrollment? >> So, dual enrollment is is separate very much so, but we have a Pearson which is an online platform that we use as as and Georgia virtual schools. So, all courses will run through one of those two programs. BGI does Pearson or >> right the virtual school does that currently and that's what we would incorporate. The other part of that is that um one thing that we're I want

016to I want to make sure we emphasize that students can also take virtual classes and not be in the classroom. They could do those at home at other times. So I want to make sure that's not >> unique course that they want to take that maybe it's not offered at the school. That would be through BGI or some other >> we would coordinate with them to sign them up but it would be they were taking that on their own at home >> but that would through be that would be through BGI or dual enrollment. >> So dual enrollment for college classes which really is separate total >> high school class high school level classes would still be managed with our current graduation coach who's transitioning would manage that process. >> Okay. You have the Pearson

017>> Pearson and the Georgia virtual school. >> Georgia virtual school. Okay. Got it. >> Yeah. Um just very quickly um kids that are on homebound for medical reasons will qualify for this as well. >> Yes, we will serve them through through BGI as well. >> And what is the relationship like with the middle school because it sounds like it's very uh focused towards the high school, but it does say 6 through 12. >> Yeah. So 6 through 12 because we still have students that are virtual and what we made the decision was that we would still serve those students. Um how many do we have that's not discipline related, Miss Williams? >> We have four. >> We just have four right now that are being served. we would still serve those and any student that

018is in below sixth grade and is accelerated usually in math who will serve those students so that they can take like a high school level or middle school level course and they're younger. >> So the principles would just have to work together. >> Correct. Um on slide eight you talked a little bit about enrollment and space availability. um what is our estimate of space requirements and how flexible are we on that? I I would hate to be telling a kid no because we're out of space. I would rather instead have a conversation about resources and what we can do to ensure there's sufficient space for all the students that need it. >> So right now what we did was we created >> I don't want to say it. We have a space that has a

019it's an accordion room we close up to like this room here. >> Yeah. So we have more spaces. So I I would think that anytime we could serve 30 students easily, maybe 35, >> okay, >> in that space. I don't know that um we'd have that many that are actually in the building. And then you got to remember that some kids are coming and going like in this room with us sitting here. It could be that you all out in the high school and these the folks in the back are actually in the room for for different periods. >> So yeah, I understand that it's as it's structured, we may not run into space issues in this first year, >> right? If it's a popular program and we begin to run into space issues, right,

020>> I would rather us have a conversation about resources than a conversation about restrained access. >> Well, the other part >> Yeah. >> The other part is that this the space we're moving in for this year as we have our renovations. It may be that we move somewhere else. Sure. >> But we also we will have more space in the building at that point. At the end of the day, I just want I want >> everybody, but I think the philosophy of the program should be >> accommodate the students even if that means fixing resources on our side to ensure there's this space. >> Right. Miss Wes, she's full and she's probably taking five or six more kids with the DVA since she said she was full. At least >> we'll service the kids for

021sure. to answer that as well. Um, currently we and with our staff they're in the houses and so as you know with the early learning center there is that part that is not early learning center but it is space and that's what part of what it's used for. It will be designed to serve students that cannot go because you know in virtual you have students that can't go back on campus and so right now those individuals will come to the Wilson Center and they go in a conference room and so this is where they will have designated space to serve and support students. I just want to make sure I understand some of this and I think it's piggybacking on what you were asking Hans and what you were asking Lorraine because there is clearly

022going to be a space issue. It's like enrolling for any class. Right now what I'm seeing is the priority is um for students who you know possibly for behavior issues um health reasons but what in the event that students who are doing dance athletics or anything else for which they too want flexibility is that something like I see you know families complete the enrollment then there's a referral and then there's a review so that is there going to be a limit or some type of specification of who gets first priority because otherwise what I'm seeing in many districts is like I brought up with Fulton's kind of virtual day attendance when students have athletic events a lot of students are looking like people working at home learning option so that's already in place so we

023have our tennis players we have students soccer. >> Yeah. So that is still in existence and that just rolls into this >> and they're the current virtual academy students. >> Yes, correct. entire process that we meet um instructional cabinet meets to determine if placement is um approved and that's who uses >> current DVA structure is not for just students who are there for discipline it's for all of that >> my two soccer moms want to meet with me every year their schedules and nothing really changes outside Atlanta unit deciding come into the building but they want the experience of having the virtual access, they also want the experience of coming into the building because of those connections with their friends, you know, >> and we have it for middle and high school. So, we have

024some DVA students that are in that elite sports that do that from the middle school perspective and we have it in the high school. And then I think the other thing I was confused about is I'm hearing that students can do it virtual and then they have the access to support in the building. Are students able to piece together a hybrid as well? >> And that was that the soccer player I was talking about. They both are hybrid. They have some classes with Miss Williams. They also come into the building for a few classes. It's all based on what they can get into based on their soccer schedule. >> And then I get think the final thing is the exit criteria. So in the event that it's like Georgia virtual school >> and let's say

025it's February and a student now it is passing and wants to come back to the high school >> they just pick up with the schoolbased curriculum or they continue >> the gab is probably a whole year Pearson is more separate Pearson as the recovery right Miss Yes. >> Yes. >> Also make sure that we've done that. >> Yeah. because we always >> Thank you. >> Excuse for like OSS kids who are >> No, so it won't be we have a separate So OSS if they're long-term suspended, it would be uh with um BGI. They could not come in the building because that's part of the state law. Okay. Yeah. That's what Dr. Wood was speaking about with the new facility that have space where it could come in. >> Okay. >> You can't go back

026and bring your campus to your home your home campus. >> I think that's going. >> Thank y'all very much. >> How many kids are in DVA right now? >> In the whole district. We have um acceleration your acceleration for math is something that is done through DVA if you will but it's really a local school elementary school model they know how to >> Wait can I ask one question about that then I saw there was a bill that's currently out that's guar requiring a certain number of math minutes either per day or per week. There is numer there is numerousy legislation but crossover day is it has not crossed over but today I think it's the crossover day is the next that's Friday >> but uh it hasn't crossed from one chamber to the other

027on the house floor today is being heard the literacy bill the weapons protection bill >> the other ones being heard today there's five major education bills being heard today yeah >> on the house for I'll tell you in a second. >> I think one was weapons detection. >> Yeah, weapons detection um access, cell phones, weapons detection and literacy are all being heard today on the House floor. So never and so when you think about the budget implications of what some of these pieces would be um for literacy uh there's a there are what would be uh funding coming through for instructional coaches potentially weapons detection as written is single point of entry from kindergarten all the way through 12th grade cell phones right now is bellto bell not instructional time. So that's a change for

028us. Hope access is not necessarily a budget implication, but college and careermies, we do have one, but it allows for more formalization of that. So those are what would be five bills in of itself that would have to be heard on the floor and still crossed and we don't know what it would look like in May, but continue to watch that legislation. Dr. Sproul, Dr. Whitaker, please introduce the next item. >> The second item on the agenda is whole board governance training. I would like to call on Miss Valerie Wilson, executive director of the Georgia School Boards Association, and Dr. Sam King, director of board development and superintendent search services. Both people are very familiar with City Schools of Decar. How are you? >> Good. How are you? >> Doing well. >> Yes. It's um

029very rare when um I get to be in Decator doing this because a lot of times when the cater as you all know I ought not to come to the cater and part of the reason that I ought not to come to the cater is because I never want to give the one anybody the impression that I can't give it up right that I cannot not be a school board member anymore. Uh but I think that all of you all will find that when your schoolboard service is done if you ever decide that you decide that it's done that you will feel like once a school board member always a school board member right getting someone the other day because I said I don't technically I don't go to dinner indicates like I don't go

030to restaurants indicator and a part of that is because being on the board indicator where we have what I think is one of the best communities um in the state. Um and sometimes when you're sitting in the seats, it don't it doesn't necessarily feel that way because there's always someone that's that's got a position or that is wanting something that may or may not be counter to the positions that you have or that you have to take. And a lot of times that is because they're not privy to a lot of the things that you are privy to. And quite honestly, it's not designed for them to be privy to every single thing that you are privy to. Because if that were the case, it'd be the whole community just doing it. You they elect

031you for perfect for a reason and they elect you to do that work, right? But for me, it was at the end of the day, and I'm gonna be real blunt and just say this, at the end of the day, um some of the vitriol that came didn't cease. and it was like I don't want to sit in the cater and have dinner because I want to sit and have dinner with in teeth, right? So, it's kind of stuck. I say that because it's true. And as I've watched you all go this past year through some of the things that you've gone through uh with some really tough decisions and tough decisions that I will tell you are not just happening in Decar not just happening in the state of Georgia happening all across this

032country and for various reasons right um one of the biggest with the schools and determining what you're going to do about the schools there may be some people in this room that might still be in here. Karen may be one of them. Remember when we went through this when I sat on this board, right? Uh and dealing with declining populations in schools um and being a board member and having to take a vote to close the very school that educated my husband and his siblings. But there were 99 kids in that building. 99 kids, right? And it cost just as much to open that building as it did to open all of our buildings. And having to make tough decisions was really hard. Um, but that's what you signed up for when you decided to

033put your name on the ballot to make tough decisions, but to make those decisions based on what was best for kids, best for the students in this community and not for anybody else, for the students. And that's something that I applaud you all for doing that hard work. I would not get back in your seats for all the money in the world, but I applaud you all for doing that work. So, Dr. King and I here today uh to talk with you all about your norms and protocols and kind of walk protocols with you. Um you've always heard us say that when there is a new member to the team, a whole new team. I don't care if it's just one person. I don't care if it's two people or it could be four people,

034right? Whatever. Whenever there's a change, if it's a change in superintendence, that is a new team. It's a new dynamic and that's what we are here today to kind of talk through. You all have your norms and protocols and come on up, Dr. King. Don't leave me up here by myself now. U so we're going to walk through those. Um most of you all know me and I think most of you know Dr. King. I know that your newest member met us briefly at the board meeting. Uh I've had an opportunity to have other conversations with you, but I want Dr. Kings just kind of to make sure he reintroduces himself to you so you can know who he is and what he brings to the table. >> Good afternoon everyone. Afternoon Dr. Right. Good

035to be with your governor's team. I'm Samuel King. I am a retired school superintendent as well. This is now my 42nd year in public education. Started at uh teachers level, well classroom teacher, assistant principal, principal, uh central office, superintendent, etc. So, um, I feel like the common thread throughout what we do, what we're doing to support the mission and vision of the association itself, it really centers on the calling to support public education and sure that all of the students across the state of Georgia experience a really highly effective governance experience, which results in the likelihood that they're going to move on to college or career. here in the world of work and have a quality experience in life. So, preaching to the choir here. You all know that. But, um, and that's what we're

036here to support with you. Um, Valerie mentioned your norms and protocols and having a a new member of the team and that you have to revisit things when that happens. So first thing that I would urge you to do is to think about is do a a reflection of and you might have done this but I want to make sure of what really is the role of your rituals and routines. That would be your norms and protocols. Why do you have them? How should they how should they support your work? You chose certain categories for a reason. when a new me joins the team to review each segment to make sure that you understand again to review but also to orientate your new member across those categories and have conversations and sometimes it requires that

037you tweak things and so that's what we're here to do is to support that for you uh but also to begin that first conversation around ensuring that you understand the roles and responsibility as it relates to domain Yeah. Um, and part of what we've said to you before and we'll I'll say it again because I do think it's important. As you can see, Dr. King is a former superintendent. I'm a former former school board member. When we do this work across the state with other boards, we like to pair it up like this because it is important. It's a governance team. These are your norms and your protocols as a governance team. So, it's important that we do this together because at no point ever is it good for students for the board to be

038here and the superintendent to be the recipe for the outcomes for the students in your district. You should be aligned and working collaboratively. Align does not mean that every vote is 50. Align does not mean that. have a mission and a and a belief system that is aligned and the decisions that you make will always be grounded in what you believe is best for the students. Right? And if you are aligned in that mission and the belief of what you believe is best for your students and specifically your strategic plan, what you have said along with your community and your staff and all engaged is what you want to see happen for your students. As long as you are aligned in that, it does not matter if it's a 50 vote or a 51 vote.

039So it is important. It is important that those decisions are aligned to the information and the data that you see to support your decision as it relates to that issue. Does that make sense? So, it's real important that we get to that place. But starting from this, I guess we will start with domain one and kind of talk about that. Um, do domain one is governance. Um, and I'm I'm going to say this. Um, I'm working right now. I have my board retreat with the GSBA board of directors next weekend and one of the things that we are doing is the board commitment and um operating right um best norms and protocols and I think it's important that I say that to you because I have that with my board of directors as well and

040it is about how we will operate with each other but also how we will operate in the face of our community and when we say this is who we are and You are our community, our members. And if you if we believe that norms and protocols are important for you, we have to believe that they are important for us. When I think about public education right now and I think about the attacks that's happening and trust me, they are happening on public education. The last place we need for them to be happening is within the board itself. attacks should not be coming from within this team and the way that we can help to nullify that by those attacks are to make sure that we are moving as as a team consistent with our norms

041and protocols governance. So let's make ensure that you understand that these norms protocols are linked to your standards and the domains right let's want to make sure that we all understand as a governance team those standards and domains are in state board rule those are things that are required in terms of how you do your work and these domains now nine domains. Last time we were with you, we were discussing eight domains. The ninth one is now school safety. However, we're focusing on that first one. What we want you to to remember is that that's not a that's not something that we have developed at Georgia School Boards Association uh as a curriculum that was initiated and and had as its origin with this association. Although we wholeheartly embrace it, we feel like it's the

042right stuff, but we didn't develop that. It is in state board rule that this first domain which is board governance is required in state board. Our role is to help talk for you, help you become even more effective with how you implement and deliver your services as it relates to that. So that first domain which is governance and more specifically standard D and it reads the governance leadership team demonstrates a unified approach to governing the school system in order to asssure effective fulfillment of roles and responsibilities. This should be fresh on your minds because I understand that you've uh been immersed in self assessment, right? >> Yes, I did. Um, I don't have the newest one and I know what have you, but actually I'm going to send you this. You want me to ping

043it to you via you? >> All right. So, as you do that, this um stand you should be it should be fresh on your mind because if you've been immersed in completing your self assessment, you you've you've read that you've reflected on how you're doing. The the key for us is that we work to make sure that you don't do that just to check a box of course that you really reflect and think about what you're doing extremely well and then what are some of your challenges if you feel that you have those. So you heard the latter part of what I mentioned as far as standard D that it relates to the governance team's roles and responsibilities and muted So that's the older version. >> This domain is it hadn't changed. >> It had

044changed which is >> here it is. >> Yes. You see where it says to asssure effective ful fulfillment of roles and responsibilities before you get into the norms and protocols in that discussion. We want to kind of hear from you in terms of what discuss your self assessment. But for us kind of kind of segue into that want to make sure that you you're on the same page with this. Okay. That first element says that you participate in professional development of course as a team that when you do that it mentions that your superintendent as CEO could be optional in terms of that however when you enter into whole board governance training there's not an option for the super and it needs to be with the team and so you're displaying that. Now that next

045piece where it says um terms of uh what I want going want to kind of be laser focused on would be professional development curriculum based on your results. I want to remind you that as Dr. Whitaker will move into developing a training plan moving even into the next fiscal year. What she will be doing is taking a look at the results of your self assessment, your whole your governance team self assessment and then having conversation with your board chair and then with you about what that really indicates in terms of your needs and you will jointly develop your training plan. So you're in the middle of that real time now as far as conversation. But yeah, >> I I commented on D and I think what I asked in the self assessment was maybe clarity

046on like processes for the dissemination of to result in that unified approach. And so listening to what you just said, it sounds like it starts with the board chair and then moves to the rest of us >> in terms of >> well I think like so Dr. Whitaker would obviously look at the self assessment and then based on things that you know we may have identified as themes or connect to things we need but then does it start with the board chair kind of like setting an agenda for a board meeting or does it come to all of us at the same time? >> Right. Well, typically when you're deal if we if we use self assessment and the results of the self assessment as an example, usually governance teams will come together like you

047are right now and those results then are reported out. Now there is there will be variance around how some teams would do that. Now there might have been some prior conversation between the superintendent and the chair about building that agenda. Obviously that happens as you do your agenda planning. uh you utilize your agenda planning formula that you have in place and so part of that is probably in your rituals and routines which gets us to that point. So you develop rituals and routines around how you do that. Good. And as far as the action plan of professional learning, so when you think about the professional development curriculum for the whole board individual training when the self assessment is completed, if you remember um we take a look at based upon what are the areas of

048improvement and then GSCA so Julia would suggest books to us. So she gave us community uh community strategies book was a book that was actually given to us by July as to build to that plan. But anytime we have certain professional learning segments that GSBA is facilitating for us in our whole board governance training. those sections or sessions were based upon the results of the assessment. So we look at the entire catalog and say okay what is in alignment? I will often ask if this is in alignment but we need to tweak it a little bit and I will you know of course talk with Julia about that and then when we when it comes time to set the retreat agenda that's why you will see building there is a specific one that that GSBA

049has about building engagement that's the blanket version of that GSBA module but that GSBA BA module is then tweaked for us when GSBA delivers it. And so we create that training plan every year that professional development do. So when we go SBA in the summer, I typically have that binder with me that says here is the tenative plan for next year. And so these are the things that we've seen from this assessment what I'm hearing now that we finished great on their behalf or now that we finished uh the governor's core now that we finished community and community and strategy but you know what I mean community strategy folks now here is what I'm thinking and I get your feedback on that often when we're at GSCA because that is when we're all together. um

050or or I'll give you the good readads um for like I said we could do speed of trust and I brought gave you a couple options and then we discussed and you said this is the one we're going to use. So that training, professional development and curriculum delivery is what I do. And then Melinda submits that every time all we all have to do the signatures and all that and that gets submitted to the DOE to say that you've actually engaged in that professional learning. >> I think I heard I think I heard in your >> I thought I think I heard a process question in there as well. >> Yeah. And then the process the process question I think Dr. King answered around the fact that there are there are boards who do it

051in in different ways but >> um if you were to say okay what is the better practice of that >> it it it depends upon the board but for in most instances I would say the majority of in instances now you correct me if I'm wrong Dr. King because you have one superintendent and you have five, seven, nine or 10 board members. So there are 10, God bless them, >> 10 board members, right? Um it is easier sometimes with the process because you've all participated in the self assessment. You have answered to the best of your abilities in the self assessment. how you think you are doing as a board member and your input into the process, right? And many times I'll go back to me and I try hard not to do that to

052Kate, but I'm going go back to me. Um when I was board chair, I sat in that meeting. I heard everybody's. We pulled it together. We looked at everybody's. But it was me based on the input from my members when we did that to sit down with the superintendent and to say here are the areas as a governance team that we are thinking about and then that feeds back out to you all. But when you start building the plan because it is it is you want her to do that work out there but you also need her to do the work here with the board and you don't want to consume because this could be consuming with building the board. Does that make sense? So to go to continue along that line, I want you

053to think about all of this because this is a timely conversation in that you are in the middle of probably getting to the point of discussing those results right from self assessment. So think about how you utilize it because we just talked about that the self assessment should be the core driver of what you use when you build your training plan because if if you take it serious when you are actually completing it, it's going to tell you what your strengths are, what you do at an average level, and what you feel like you're you're extremely good at. and it could help you build that plan. However, not all governance teams will use self assessment for that. Um, but we highly recommend that you do because you cover your basis when you do that. There's

054some governance teams that will take another approach to that. So, we don't we don't dictate that to you, but we do recommend now that you are in the middle of doing this. So let's think about how you are utilizing it to the what I think was part of the original question. How do you get that information out with the results and the analysis? You need to think about what works for you as a team now. But one thing that certainly is recommended is that you come together as a governance team to take a look at those results. As you do that, break it down by domain. It tells you what that analysis revealed and I don't know if you if you do you see it >> can we see each other's >> we will >>

055yeah so and then you're able to because like for example with this particular domain you would have read all of these elements and you will respond and you are on target with some satisfactory and maybe you feel like something is in need of made a comment possibly. So that gives you an opportunity to talk about that comment that that particular board member might decide they want to identify themselves to say well I that comment and here's the reason why but you don't have to right but actually it gives you a chance to talk about all of those items because the entire team might have thought that you're doing you're doing extremely well with domain one overall but there might have been a couple of comments that were there that might have might give the team

056a little bit of thoughts. So, it makes sense to talk about it but not to overreact to it, right? So, comments on what your cadence has been on that >> or this is just a new conversation now. >> We haven't seen the assembly results, >> right? I'm just saying what you were anticipated, how you anticipated utilizing this or you just hadn't had that conversation. I mean, I anticipated the way roughly you're talking about, but maybe it's because as a teacher, I'm used to every year, you've got to set goals. You've got to look, you've got multiple things that you're getting presented to you and dictated to you. So, >> we've also we've also done this in the past, >> right? with this particular domain in particular, you may have some comments like you're saying that

057deviate from what the entire will of the group looks like and it can be a topic for discussion, but does that mean that we need to make whole process change? No, >> not necessarily. And I think that the the same it's the same kind of process when we do the superintendent evaluation that the the great majority of the board scores overwhelmingly satisfactory. But then there's some comments that are topics for discussion. But does that mean that we need to change something? Not necessarily. This may be a topic where we need to discuss something. I think that's something we need to keep in mind um as we go through it. I think the way that you've explained this is that this particular domain is explaining how we educate each other and how ultimately um where we

058see areas we need to massage gets transferred out differentiation I think to your question about how day-to-day information and processes get disseminated is is different that's in another >> yeah and that's and to that point that's what I meant I said by comments governance team should not overreact to them. All right, governance is the one that all when not any I'm not picking on our new board member here, but this is the one that always pops to the top when there's new faces on the board because this I know it happened with me when I came onto the board. I had a lot of experience with city commissioners. I had a perspective that as an elected person of the community, I'm like a city commissioner and you run very very quickly into state law saying

059you are not like this is a fundamentally different role and you have to execute that role differently and so this is where uh it always this always ends up getting a lot of comment with a because it's different like this is a learning process that that we all have to go through together. I may be misremembering this one, but isn't this the standard that identifies our three roles as board members? Like you where the is it judicial? Why? >> Yeah, I agree. But then I I do feel like we have some real opportunity and I guess we're waiting till we get to the self assessment to look at it. um you I I paid a lot of attention in the language partly because I scoring PSAs and so I can't give a student a score

060without linking it to the descriptor and so I think we have the judicial role we have is it an executive role and then I can't remember the third the way it was described but >> yeah and so I think the one that I saw was more to do with policies I accept the role right like I have no business in operations. Nor do I does anyone want me or any other board member to be doing that because it'd be chaos. >> Yeah. >> Um so for whatever it's worth, I guess when we get to that part, especially looking at since we have the construction of a facility and the K through two and I started looking at policies that other districts have. So I don't know if this is the time to talk about it

061or >> me as the newest member it seems like there's been some blurring of lines between roles between the superintendent operational >> this is would be the time to clarify that okay >> because you that that is what I mentioned earlier that this conversation should happen as a segue to getting into your normal norms and protocols to session. Okay. >> But what do your norms and protocols actually say or communication norms like this one? >> Well, this would be governance. Yeah. >> Governance have a section government's roles and responsibilities. >> Oh, okay. In the common one >> because I think what is it okay if I chime in while looking? Um, so I kind of looked at the three different roles and then the actions that we are currently in the process of for those

062different roles. And so kind of like I think piggybacking on what what I mentioned at the last board meeting. So I think until November we had one facility policy, right? And I think it's kind of like the communication I said I think that question that a constituent asked at the community meeting in January was the one that really resonated with me which was effectively y'all governance team have this great process right and take something that and I think she pointed to Jarvis to say like hey there's an operational issue here and then Jarvis gets it. The question is though if you don't know board what's happening then do you know what policies to set right so I think for me with a lot of this facility stuff I started looking at facility policies because that

063is a role that we have um as one perhaps need like we have the five-year facilities plan now we have the long range facilities I saw I think Sultan has an interesting one that they just adopted about like facility design as one because to your point about the mission, you know, where I really I guess feel we can do more of that partnership with the community, right? Like you mentioned at the outset, we have a great community. Maybe because I work in a classroom, I'm just used to at times having unhappy customers, but then how do you help? And yet I understand not everyone in the community can sit at the table the whole time and tell us what to do. So for me, I see in this governance domain um perhaps an opportunity to

064look at some policies that might specifically align with some of our actions that then therefore might answer to >> yeah like you know I've only been on the board less than two months been sworn in and um it's been an interesting time of course because we've had a lot of you know pivotal conversations about the K to2 especially and for me I guess it was confusing um we talked a little bit about it at the other school, you know, the last schoolboard meeting of like ed planners roles when they were hired. I understand, you know, they were there to give us data and information on enrollment of course, but then I think that it seemed to get a little bit off track just so we can do better in the future when they were forming

065committees um with the community that I know was it just seems to me if those committees are feeding into board deliberations and to inform us about community input then we need to, you in the future hire that consultant to do that work so that we can set the scope and what information we want from them. And you know similarly to me it would mean they need the are you saying the board needs to hire somebody or are you saying >> the board would hire the com I guess a consultant to do the committee work? It seems like that would make more sense to me because the ed planners we had hired to initially get us the enrollment data then kind of you know >> but the board shouldn't be hiring any consultant for anything >>

066should not >> no >> why >> we have one employee and that's the superintendent >> but when it's work that feeds into the board's role it seems like >> there there are consultants all over the system that provide information that feeds into the board's >> they all report to her >> they all report up to this the I I from what I sometimes hire other consultants if they're doing board work. >> But if you look here under subsection D, it says hire and hold accountable the superintendent designating them as the chief executive officer. >> No, not you. I was talking about I'm sorry. >> Um with authority to provide educational leadership, manage daily operations, and perform all duties assigned by law to ensure increase student achievement for all students. So she can have consultants and

067hire them, contract them, but we as a group of five, we have one employee and that's her. >> But let me let me just say this, >> the board can have very specific criteria around what it is that the board would like to know and see. Yeah, that's >> but that goes to the superintendent to make the hire the superintendent because you don't have that authority. >> That's where it seems confusing to me if the school board >> if you don't like the recommendation that she brings to you of a consultant, you have the authority to say yay or nay to >> right. I'm not sure if that's happening. So, so another way to to think about that as a team is to consider what we all call the means versus the end, >> right?

068>> So, think about from the ends standpoint. That's where the board resides. Mhm. >> So that consultant that did a certain body of work or should do a certain body of work, what are the ends that the board wants to see from that work? That's where you reside. What what is going to be produced? So you give your superintendent those metrics, hands, that kind of thing. She determines a me, >> right? And I I mean I'm new so I'm not you know seeing maybe not seeing everything but like I know a consultant was hired for PR to help with the board communications and you know I wasn't aware of that and then I learned about it later and there was some confusing messaging that happened with the PR consultant. So to me it seems like

069we should be talking about it as a board when that consultant is hired and what scope of their work is so that we're all on the same page. >> That's also somebody hired by her. >> But they were doing board messaging. >> The communications piece was the communications piece. I'm just trying to to since we are into this, right? I'm just trying to >> was the communications or the PR person, >> was that a person that the superintendent felt like needed to be hired on behalf of the district because of the work that was happening? Because she does also as the operations person that you hire has the right to say I need a consultant to help with this. >> And then she can hire that person. She does not have to say and I

070don't know especially if it is within a certain dollar amount that you have given her the authority which I I would hope that you that you don't limit that or take that away because she has to operate the school system. But if the PR consultant is writing letters on behalf of the board or the board chair that are issued with our name on it and I'm unaware of that, then it makes me >> so I think that that's like secretary of the board, spokeswoman of the board with our names. We are job. So this is no different than any company or any board. The CEO communicates on letterhead there are things at the bottom says the board has approved this X Y and Z and what we're doing. So I again we can use two

071examples of means versus end. We say the conversation may go as far back as we want the budget to be efficient. Then Dr. Whitaker comes to us and says we we may need to look at the util utilization of some of these buildings. We say yeah you're right. we would like more information on that and then she hires a consultant that that's on >> so I get the consultant specifically because you know >> yeah I was I was going to get there in in the next sentence um she hires that consultant if we don't like them then we can provide feedback so says that was no good another job is like we want to communicate better and we're all saying like hey this the way this was communicated with Ed Planner stunk it was bad

072it was a misfire or whatever she says says, "I'm going to hire a PR person to speak on behalf of the board." Do that. >> And not just the board, right? I mean, there a whole district, the board being a small part of some of those communications, but there was an enormous amount of stuff at a district level also that that PR firm puts on, >> but heard by her is a critical part. It's not hired by us. Guess that's where it's confusing to me because I'm thinking about that January 22nd letter that was issued by the board chair and specifically seemed to be making a decision about pausing the K to2 study that I did not see I did not review it didn't seem to even you know comport with our commorms to allow

073us to look at it and see it and then you know then I'm wondering okay this is a board chair letter it's my name is at the bottom of the letter head all of us and so if it's messaging for us as I I think that that's where it got confusing to me. I know we had this conversation that the PR consultant was also doing maybe some normal comm's work but when they're like setting the messaging of the board to me that makes me question that you know who hired them what was the scope of their work what was going on here because that you know they are writing the messaging for us as a board and I think the board is I hear you we are a governance team al together but the board

074is also there you know to hold the you know we work at a symbiotic relationship. I get that and the superintendent is there to execute what we want but we are here to also you know provide clarity accountability and hold each other have checks and balances >> I think per the last discussion wait >> thank you because I >> um so I think and I'm sorry because I feel like it is communications so yes totally understand um contracts and again I wouldn't want to be um you answering to all of those but I think there are like kind of three issues I'm hearing. One I think the letter you're talking about speaks specifically to my question about dissemination of information and unified approach. So, you know, if we are talking about communication, the day that

075letter went out, I have people physically come to see me that day to say, "What is this? What is a formal action?" >> That goes back to our processes or practices because it it isn't a good feeling when you are in a decision-making role >> and you can't explain it. And it also isn't a good feeling when you're in a decision-making role and you don't feel like um and it's a feel like which I know Dr. Whitaker we've talked about because feeling shouldn't be important right but in the sense that I don't know not only how to explain it to someone but I don't know how it got here. So that's a process thing. Um, I think specific to the consultants, I like that, you know, James referenced specifically like, okay, this happened with ED

076planners and then we have this PR thing, but I think the issue there then is probably a practice or a policy and maybe that comes into our POI because at least until the new board approval of the purchasing agreement, any consultant below a certain threshold. That's kind of a non-issue and I'm really not sure what our procedure is though to either evaluate the return on that investment or evaluate the success of it and maybe that's another kind of governance issue that I need to understand because it is the superintendent's authority to do this and therefore is it the superintendent who simply determines that was or >> right I think I think so I'm I'm glad that that board member Anderson I do think the bulk of what we're talking about particularly with the examples that

077you raised are a communication norm and I I do think at the last board meeting we talked about some potential changes to our communication norms to accommodate that right if a communication is going out on behalf of the entire board we at least get the opportunity to review it in advance a couple of sensible I think things like that that we can make changes but it it fundamentally isn't a question of governance at that like that the superintendent was fully acting within the boundaries of what those roles are and us engaging to hire that consultant would have crossed the governance line. >> I see. I don't think that this is a governance issue. I think this is a communications issue and and I think that it that it is a communication around your processes. >>

078Right. >> And and I think I think that your processes need to take that into account. I heard your evaluation piece of the outcomes of that person. Um, your evaluation of anything that happens within this school system comes through your evaluation of the student quite honestly. And if there and that evaluation has to be tied to the agreements that you all make when you put her evaluation instrument in place, right? That's how you align your evaluations because that this is the only person that you supervise or evaluate. You can't evaluate any of these other people in this room, any of the things that they do as well as contract, right? That is that is through the operations of that. And your evaluation comes through how you feel like certain things happen. But it cannot come

079out and I have to go back and say this. It can't just be something you throw into the evaluation process at the end of the day has to know he or she whoever that person is on that specific area. But there's I think this example though in addition to what the team hears, you need to keep this example in mind as you have your conversations about your rituals and themes which would be your norms and protocols which is where that communication piece really I think resides in your >> norms because if you are communicating on behalf of the full board which is >> the board chair board chair. >> And so governance teams, boards would typically have steps that you all are agreed have agreed to that you're utilizing that include how your chair keeps

080everybody informed and that you're on the same page as she communicates. >> Okay. one. >> So, so that piece that went out, there were some steps that are in place, documented, understood, not understood, whatever the case might be, that reflect your rituals and routines. The last thing I'll mention, I know we got to move on, but the last thing I'll mention, too, is there there are boards that have understood norms, but they're not documented, is not discussed. They just said this is this is just what we do. And so there are missteps when you don't come together like this to have that conversation. So that's that's a piece that you need to talk to. >> You said, you know, there may be a time when a consultant is hired by the superintendent, but then the

081board will weigh in in what their role is. I guess maybe that's where I'm trying to understand where we would be able to, you know, say this, >> but that as a body you all need to talk about. Yeah. And you all need to agree if if a superintendent is in the daytoday of what's happening and she feels like there's a need for a specific consultant then she's going to move forward with it right in the operations if there is something that >> I think it's when it touches >> let her finish >> but but if it is something I think and and I'm I'm hearing you. If it is something and I'm going just say this and y'all might or might might not agree. You got to trust that the superintendent is going to

082come to this board and it it's it's a simple thing. Either you're gonna trust her or you're not gonna trust her. And I'm gonna just call it out, right? And you've got to trust that if the superintendent is going to make a hire, that has a deep deep deep impact on any one of you all. And I think Hans said the system, the district, which is more important than any one individual in this room. and she's got to move on that. But if it's going to impact the system and the board is going to be impacted because there's nothing that happens in a school system that the board is not engaged or are impacted by. But she's got to make some decisions on that and it might not be that the input. But she as

083she's doing that, she's hearing your conversations. Your issue at the end of the day is really the process. >> It is the proess, right? And you don't want to have processes and norms and protocols for you just don't that you all will be forever putting together norms and protocols if you try to do it around every policy that you have. That's that I would not advise you all to try to do that. I just I think Dr. F. I just want and I'm I think I might be reading your thoughts. I just want to James and you may have some insight too because you're more senior than I am. I I can't remember in the years that I've been a board member where I have directly reviewed the contract for the hiring or been a

084part of the hiring process of any personnel um that includes a contract, an employee um or any part of that. I can't remember any part of that at all in no form of scope of work. Um I I don't remember it other than the lobbyists because the lobbyist remembering >> because the lobbyist lobbies for the board but other than that I can't think of any point in time where um where I can remember being a part of any employee other than the superintendent where I have had where I've ever seen or been a part of their contract. I think to Val's point, if we as a board, as a unified board are thinking that this is something that we want to dig into. If we are thinking there's too many contracts on the books, this

085is not good utilization of funds, um, it's waste, whatever the case may be, we as a board need to build it into the evaluation and then give her the opportunity to present evidence. But that means that the board has to agree that that's what the board wants to. It can't be that one person with the board has to. Yes. >> I think when um our former superintendent was here, we sometimes at the tail middle or end of an evaluation process, we saw some things and then tried to decide that we wanted to evaluate them kind of mistried. And to me, that's moving the goalpost. We we have to give her the opportunity to the evaluation, work on it, and then present the evidence. But if we decide that contract personnel how contract contractors or vendors

086are hired something we want to get into we need to build an entity evaluation and what I was going to share was the lobbyist piece. So there are we have a lobbyist and the lobbyist is interviewed by the board because I am a state employee. Yes, I'm a city schools of Decator employee that is I'm ultimately a state employee. So I as a state employee can't lobby but I work on a governance team that has legislative priorities and we employ a lobby. We as a school district are a part of the Georgia Education Coalition. So, you receive updates from them. I was just able to give you all of what's being um presented on the House floor today because we're a part of the Charter System Foundation and Amanda was on their webinar today and

087then was able to give me all of what's on you know quick summary so that I will know because I'm not there. All of that to say you as an interests, values, beliefs that you do have to sign off on who will represent you at the gold zone when there was GSA at their day of advocacy. You know, advocating and lobbying are two different things. And so that is the piece that you do have a very deep determination of who will present or represent you >> at the gold zone and in some of the other conversations that are very active right now. >> I don't want to be looking at every single contract. I'm not saying that. But I guess as the new person, it seems like when consultant is hired whose work seems to

088deeply touch our you know board voice, our board direction, our board messaging, then to me that should be something that we all decide as a board like for example the ED planners like and I understand you know they they work started off as data to do the data enrollment and that seems to me purely upper view but seems like the future is going to continue that work committee work because we want to make sure we're getting that input and the community input and the feedback right so we can set the scope of what what we want and that to me seems like in the future hopefully if we have to get into that conversation that kind of community consultant that scope of work that contract will be something that we all look at and decide

089on and you're saying no. >> No. >> To me that it feeds into board deliberations and so >> but again I mean like our accountants do that are every all these other consultants feed into board >> but this is more directly related to community >> let me let me >> yeah can I because I I want to know if this is part of the process I'm talking about because to me all roads lead to policy. So, we have a board policy public relation goals and objectives that um we adopted in March. And so, am I correct in saying that if the board wanted then because clearly we're not looking at the contracts that or I'm sorry, I don't want anyone to take that out of context, but in specific regard to what we're talking about

090operationally, um it looks to me like we would simply add information here. So in the event and I want to have this clarified because I don't want to be in operations but board policy reads to promote a positive environment in CSD in which there's an awareness of involvement in and support for the system and its educational mission the board should make every attempt to one and two right keep it informed provide the means for furnishing transparent yada yada information it shall be the responsibility of the superintendent and staff to fulfill the board's intent. So, in this specific regard, it sounds like more um qualitative information in this policy could answer to the question of PR and board messaging. Or am I wrong? because I I'm not comfortable with the idea that everything goes into communications

091and norms because that's where I think there's too much room for confusion and possibly too much opportunity for a lack of five even though we have votes which are the will of the board and we have you know mechanisms for which other things have to take place quickly. So, am I correct that if we wanted to add information to the public relation goals and objectives as a board that could answer to PR messaging from the board? >> Mean tweak the policy that you just read? >> Yes. >> It's always or within the authority of the board to consider something like that. >> Sure. >> That's the work of the board. But let me comment on what I think I just heard and what you read because you get think back to this conversation around domain

092one roles responsibilities and then there's another that clearly relates to policy but they are connected because this one gets into roles because if you listen to the policy that was just read the board holds the superintendent responsible and count and accountable for implementing >> that policy. So what she has done reflects how she is implementing that policy. So to Valerie's point, then it's the board's responsibility to have clarity around what you expect of the board of the superintendent when she develops procedures for implementation of that policy. That's that belongs to superintendent and her team. Now, board many times enters into conversation about those procedures because the superintendent says, "Here's what we're going to do to to meet that policy." That could go back to what we just mentioned, but I think it goes back to

093what we said earlier. How's that communicated? What's the clarity that the board has around her procedures? >> Yeah. Want you to be able to see it. >> Yes. So, so what this I mentioned earlier about coming onto the board with an index thinking that I was similar to a city commissioner and I think from a lot of your questions you're asking questions of but we have a higher responsibility when dealing with the community than we do with these others. We don't we don't we have three jobs. Three. manage the superintendent, manage the budget, pass the budget, and set policy. There is no differential amount of responsibility on our shoulders to be directive or or owning of anything related to the community other than what we decide through policy and through our norms. And so when

094we are having a conversation about consultants that engage with the community, it is not the fact that they're engaging with the community that raises it to a board level. It's still 100% falls under the superintendent. >> That that and that was the thing that I really had to kind of divorce myself of that I'm that I'm not in this role actually representing a set of adults from a district. I am representing kids across the district and I only have three jobs. >> I understand that. But I think built in there is transparency and accountability too. And so, you know, when we're, you know, referencing back the pol to the policies and the communication norms to make sure that we all are on the same page and have a unified approach of where we're going and

095what the mission is and what our vision is. I think that's what I'm getting at is that it's been a little bumpy and it seems like not clear >> and I think >> where the you know sometimes the direction has been and that's >> and I think board member Anderson raised a in the last board meeting a an interesting norm adjustment that we might want to have a conversation about today where when communication is going out on behalf of the board the full board has the opportunity to review or at least comment or see it right so that we're all I think those are reasonable things Did we you you did maybe I'm I'm mis foretting it. But see I would roll it back one more step which is we know a vote that's easy

096right four people voted yes one voted no five voted yes >> but and that's why I was saying about this more nebulous territory of the communication norm. So I agree with you and I wholeheartedly support that >> but when it comes to these other things review is polite and that could answer to a norm but is it getting us to the most effective because this is all about operating effectively I mean that at the end of the day that's what everyone wants. So is it giving us the unified if we're going to adopt unified approaches one understanding and two being able to support it meaning even philosophically if you don't support something you can support it in your role because you have enough understanding you have enough information etc. Exactly. I just want to clarify

097that one thing because I think there needs to be another process built in there. Not just, hey, you got to review it. Unless I'm being fanic about review and because I did pay a lot of attention to this like input, review, and feedback. I've got a lot of comments there. Um, but that's more for community. So, sorry. I just wanted to make sure I clarified. >> Yeah, sure. Sure. I mean and and that's what that's what the the body as a whole will either agree or not agree or come to terms on what gets added into the norms and the documents right but but being as this started from a governance level I think the most important point to take away here is we are fundamentally talking about how we communicate to make sure that

098we're all on the same page. What we are not talking about is how do we govern differently to manage Dr. Whitaker's hiring of consultants in a part of the business that we should be >> or how she manages her team. >> Yes. >> Let me ask a question. When you say review and there should be another step, >> what step are you? >> Well, and that that's that's where I am with this. So like sorry but as you talked about in terms of a great community and then you know >> whether it's vitriol or just concern right K through2 would be a good example and so you know this isn't to litigate something that happened but use it as a learning experience so that letter specifically talked about a formal action. I have no idea

099what that means. I googled it. So fine, even if the letter had been sent to me before it was sent out to everyone. So what now? I'm just a little more versed to ideally during the day ask someone on the governance team what this means to take formal action to pause. So I think and we've done some of this well though as well. So there are times when we do it. I guess maybe we need um a clearer procedure or norm so that it works well all the time because we've had other things where it was like we all reviewed I think an email and we gave input on it. So I see times when it works. I'm just not sure. >> So your review process what does your your review process you want before

100I answer co >> I just want to say I I have initial thoughts that I had written down that were 20 minutes ago that I think respond to a lot of this. I can agree totally that using a phrase like a formal action will be taken is inappropriate. It makes no sense and how dare you say that and I could call her and fuss. I I'm in agreement. >> Okay, James, because the how dare you say it sounds like it's being dismissive and that's not how I felt. >> Okay. I want to be I want to be very clear. Okay. >> Yeah. >> For the next three seconds, you don't exist. >> Thank you. >> How discussing it? I think she screwed up. >> Okay. Thank you. very clear. I I think that that was

101a screw up on her. Whatever. We move on. That has nothing to do with the board governance training in these roles that we are we're doing anything like that. Like that is the consultant did a bad job. The the communication was sent out that used a confusing phrase without communicating with other people, raised some odd questions and that sort of stuff. Boy, I struggle to see how that's relevant to the question of like, you know, hiring a consultant or what we would do to review the board and those sorts in place to improve our communication. Yeah, probably. Uh, and provide feedback, but like we we're angry that communication has been poor. And I tried to use two examples of places where it could be both were consultant related to just come to the conclusion that

102like you hire a bad consultant that doesn't mean that the process is messed up. It means a bad consultant was hired superintendent when it comes time this year and years forward. We may need to look into that as a board. But that is not failure of policy. That's all. I don't know whe the the assumption should not be that I disagree with you that like I if I thought that something was poor or the chair did a poor job I would call her on the phone and say like hey can we talk about this and and and all that sort of that's all I was trying to say earlier and I think that's very relevant here very relevant >> I mean I guess it goes in my mind I start wondering okay if this consultant

103was hired PR consultant then you know how were they hired what was the scope of their work those raise other questions and then I guess it does relate to in terms of government because like did we we have input on the hiring of the PR consultant wonder that PR consultant should have been hired by us or them and the role seems a little bit blurry if they're writing letter >> that's because you're fully in the governance side of it you mean you're fully in the superintendent's operational role shouldn't be letters and that's where it seems to but that is interact with the communications team. She does not work for me. She does do some work for me. >> You interact with Jarvis, >> of course, but people >> when it goes to board messaging and

104vision. >> They often they often they often send out they often call often send out communications on my behalf. I don't chat GPT my own communications like she often does these things for me. Do I green light them? Yes. I think it's also important to realize that we could create like James said a couple of processes whereby everybody gets to weigh in, everybody gets to give me feedback, but then I would be getting feedback from five different people and at the end of the day it would never look like what you're looking for. So that might be a conversation for how we handle the board norms and exactly what your expectations are of me. Um it also is going to lengthen the time by where whereby I can get these things out. Sometimes some communications

105that come out on my behalf are very timesensitive. Um sometimes for a myriad of reasons. Um you can also we can weigh in on how exactly you would like me to communicate them to you. Um sometimes I am trying to get things communicated out to you in a m in a time of hours um as opposed to a day um in between my day job like when I'm actually seeing patients. So sometimes that is also some of the challenge. So we can do multiple drafts of things. We can absolutely do that. But realize that is not the same process that's going to work for every single communication that I send out. It is also to the point that we keep bringing up this one particular example that was something that was time-sensitive. So I've I've

106also it is also true for the record. It is not that I told every single board member the process by which that was going out. Was there an an a a word error that could have been communicated differently? Yes. And I completely told I've told you both that I apologize for missing that that particular communication error. It is also not true that this particular consultant works solely for us for the board. They interact with multiple other cabinet members. And just because of that, James's point, it does not mean that we need to go back and dig into their scope of work. They overlap with multiple people just like we overlap with multiple. I interact with Epson all every time I forget my password or I don't know what the hot spot is. I I I

107cannot exist. I can't find a Chromebook, but that doesn't mean that if he can't find the hotspot password that I have to go digging into his contract. I would never do that. So, I'll just I'll I'll just say this because I do think that we'll keep going around on on this one. Um, you all have to deter determine what your process is. You don't want to get over into operations. Boards don't hire people outside. the superintendent has to hire right bottom line um determine based on all the things that was said is the process and I kept hearing Dr. consultants say, "I had to do this. I It's the board chair's role." Whether you're sitting in it or Tracy sitting in it, it is the board chair's role. And she just happens to be sitting

108in it right now. And it's pretty like constricting, right? Or pretty hot for her right now, right? But she is acting on behalf of the board based on your norms and protocols which you all have as it relates to the communicating. And it sounds like she's acknowledged that the word choice was not good. But to say, okay, but I want to change the process. That is a decision of this body. The body has to decide whether the process changes. Me listening to this, just hearing this poor choice of words, I don't think your processes are bad at all. I've seen bad processes. This is not a bad process to me. that input the input is important right and she has said and and I heard you say that about review and that's why I asked

109the question about the review piece and then the other what what did you think else should >> I was you were answering you answered that right what is the other piece of it but I want to caution you all for that if there is a review piece in your processes you all have to agree to review it as soon as you get it and get it back in a timely manner and with the understanding that because you have an objection to something or you want to see something different, it might not change the outcome of the letter because you could take it, incorporate it, send it out again, it'll come back again and by the time you do get a letter done, the whole issue is already out there and a whole forest fire is

110going on about it. >> Does that make sense? >> Yeah. It's having the opportunity, >> right, provide >> So, we have to agree then. We have to agree in order to be able for you all to move forward as a board. You all have to agree that it's not it's not changing processes, not processes, norms and protocols, procedures, right? It is about understanding how you going to fix this, how you gonna move and it seems like it's been acknowledged >> but we >> making sure it doesn't happen you know and having a opportunity to provide input because if we're making a board you know decision or shift and the community wants you know it needs to be transparent okay we are shifting on this we're you know pausing or whatever then let's have that conversation

111in public >> say that again >> have the conversation about shifting the K or K to2 or whatever at a board meeting and make a vote on it. Not >> it doesn't always have to be a vote. We never voted to start it in the first place, right? Like so it wasn't it wasn't a a vote, right? We can have the conversation if you want to make things like that a vote, but it never had a vote in the first place. >> Didn't we vote to postpone a year? >> Oh, we just agree. >> There was a vote to pause it the first time, wasn't there? To pause. over in um >> no in a conversation about word choice being important the word shift is a little problematic there because the whole notion that we

112were closing school was not >> right it shifted from consolidation to utilization >> that was just the word choice at the the committee level but there was no initial board like we need to close a school there was a board conversation about are we effectively using these buildings and so what she was really asking was like how do you communicate against something that's not true or something that's not fundamentally like there had never been a vote to close a school. We had just been accused of it. So I think that that's why the language was chosen that strongly by the consultants because you're you're fighting back against >> but I I mean again I started in January so I know some of these votes happened before me and I'm trying to get up to date

113but it from what I understand I think at the board meetings there were votes because initially we were talking about you know potentially reszoning or closing a school in this you know potentially fall right 26 And then we paused it to give another year so that we could look at it more. >> Was that discussion or was that a vote taken? Was it discussion >> discussion and a vote? Is it was it discussion and they just talked about it but no action was taken? >> Yeah. I mean these Yeah. And the board meetings I guess there were discussions about the pausing the first pause and then when there was this you know decision to make the second pause and potentially ro but didn't seem to happen. That's where I got confused about the roles and

114responsibilities of >> I think and I think that's why it's really important when and I've been thinking about this a lot because not just in the city of Decar there's a whole thing around transparency transparency transparency and sometimes you can be so transparent that you cause confusion right and that might not make sense to you but when you talk about like You're confused and you're sitting on this board and privy to information now and you're confused and what you're confused about are discussions that they had as a board. You see what I'm saying? >> That there were because there was no official action ever taken. It was just discussions. So you're confused around the discussions that were had and you're thinking there was an action taken and there wasn't an action. >> I mean I

115guess that's where it gets confusing because letter says formal action. There were discussions at board meetings about pausing it, >> but they've already said the letter the the wording in the letter. They've already acknowledged to you and that's the part that I need you to let go of. They've acknowledged to you that that word was a was an in error. >> I get that and I totally hear. >> But it seems like there were prior discussions at board meetings about this 2 study, consolidation, utilization, whatever it was. And you know, we were directing it as a board in public open meetings and then a shift occurred without full input. >> We were never directing any of this as a board. >> Well, and I I think that's that goes back to the beginning of this

116discussion with our first standard because when we go to the self assessment is where you'll see my comment about at times perhaps a clearer distinction. Like I said, we have three roles because I think ultimately the K through2 example is a good example of how that seemingly blurred and I realize at times just like the public relations policy is going to be the board and the superintendent, but ultimately we are accountable. Um, so that's always where I'm going to stand. For me, the formal action isn't about a word choice and nor do I want to keep hammering this. It's about creating we still have not addressed. And when I listen to Jarvis speak over and over about the word trust, I still don't know what a formal action is. I don't I'm not asking for

117an apology. I'm not accusing anyone of doing anything. Like I said, I just want us to be operating effectively. And I so for me it's more to do with we know what we know. There's a difference between a timely communication like when we were dealing with stuff last spring and then big picture things that are making headlines and letters to dictatorish and I just think that we can act more reasonably with an awareness of being smarter about how we're communicating with things when to go back to Jarvis's point we need trust. We need to rebuild that I believe is what he said. Thank you. >> So, I do want to kind of pick out something that that Valerie mentioned around it's a real thing in in some cases too much transparency actually obfiscates as opposed

118to makes clear and we have a great example. If we just take a half a step back and look at the K2 started consolidation became utilization became whatever it became. The superintendent identified a potential need for efficiency within the system, hired a consultant after informing us that this was what was going to be happening, and that the information coming out of that consultant would potentially lead us to a position where we had to vote possibly about closing the school once that information was there. There was no vote to start that process. This was the superintendent identifying a need, hiring a consultant, and that information would have come to us for us to eventually take a vote. Right? Over the course of that process as a body before you were on the board, but we in

119open conversations were very clear that it wasn't going the way that we wanted it to go and that the information that was coming out of it and the information the consultant was bringing forward wasn't really going to help us get to a decision. So the superintendent pivoted with this consultant to make a change, right? That pivot we still felt was insufficient. That consultant working with the community groups, it did not help. >> And so the superintendent again made a pivot and put it under Jarvis. We did not engage. We did not change any of that. But the superintendent in consultation with us made adjustments to the process so that we would eventually be able to get the information we needed to make a decision. Even in that scenario, it was then determined let's put this

120into the strategic plan. That is probably where it ought to be and the superintendent made that change. And so when we talk about what the governance process is and we talk about the way that it works, if you look at it at at the 50,000 foot level, it actually worked the way it's supposed to do the work that needed to be done. It wasn't going the way that we needed in order for us to be able to make a decision and we ultimately pivoted. Right now, when you get into the weeds about what was discussed at what time and was there a poor word choice in a piece of community, like at that level of of hyperfocus at a at a five foot off the ground level, you miss the sight of the fact that

121the actual governance process worked pretty well and it did sort of what it was supposed to do. Um, this is just a a potential solution is I know like our board resolutions like how could that process work? Is that is just like the board giving a general directive to the superintendent and then that is like voted on. Is that something that's like commonly used >> boards in Georgia like a resolution purching resolution not like policy? I've never >> Yeah, typically it comes any information will come as a recommendation from >> because when you do a resolution around you're saying a specific area, right? And you're directing the superintendent to do something. Do you have do you have command of all of the data and information to direct the superintendent to do a specific thing? Like

122does the board have that? Do you have all of And is it Do you see what I'm saying? >> Yeah. I just heard it exists in other states. So I don't know. >> Other states the laws and things are real different. Georgia's Georgia is different. Trust me. >> But that's like like keep breathing, keep learning. And so I don't know if this applies to governance structure or it'll be one of the future domains. I think we have a strategic planning domain because I think Hans the last point you made. So I appreciate the overview there. But then it's that process again that now I heard you say effectively K through2 is in the next strategic plan. But when I look at the standards and the processes for that I don't agree. We haven't had any

123process to put it in there. We had a discussion, right? Not a vote. >> You will vote on it when when the time comes to develop the strategic. It's also it's it is the process. We can talk about if we want to modify this process later on. It is simply not true that all board members did not know that there was going to be a process of stopping the K to2 process as it was now and then putting the idea out there of moving this to the next strategic plan. It is simply not true that all board members did not know that. I don't want it to be out here for the collective that somehow this was something that Carmen hooked up and then proof it existed because my process is that when we're going

124to communicate something out on behalf of the cabinet or the district, I call you all each individually. If it's something that we're going to discuss in the board meeting, if you wish to add it to the agenda and it's not already on the agenda, you get the support of one other board member and then I happily add it. If it that is because we can't go changing the board agenda on behalf of one person. If multiple pe if we as a board want to address something, I will happily put it on there before the agenda is set. After the agenda is set, sometimes it's harder, but it's be it's before Hans and I set the agenda. two people send me an email and then we add and we figure out how to work it in.

125But if it's something outside of the board meeting and I need to tell you this is the way that it's going to go. It's usually around 4:00 when my shift ends and I'm sitting in traffic. Don't go in any particular order. Somebody doesn't pick up the phone. I go to the next person and I call people throughout the evening. That is the way it goes. that it's not true that it that people did not know that this was going what we were going to try to do to make sure that this issue did not fall off. That is an issue is an issue. If you have underenrolled schools, we still have to deal with it. It can't just fall off. But that this would help to make it such a that we could take our

126time and have a detailed an introspective process. So, I just want to I don't want it to I don't want it to to be said that folks didn't know because I called each and every one of them. If I'm running low on time, i.e. I'm in with a critical patient, sometimes I shift that to Hans. And I'm like, Hans, you call one person and I'll call two. If only if I'm in with a patient. Only time that that happens. I I think though, and again, I'm not trying to be pedantic here. I am trying to get us to a place where we all understand the process, the practice. So the way I understood, I agree you called me, but I would argue that was an action. The process was calling each of us to dissolve.

127>> And I'm simply saying that I'm not aware of a process in which now it sounds like the action was to end it for now. the action and then we know that we have elementary schools, we may have declining enrollment. We're still not sure if we're going to get kids back. We've got considerations with preK. So, it is possible that when we look at facilities and specific to K through2, it may go into the strategic plan if that is what the board chooses to do. I mean, is that the fairest way to explain it? Okay. because I I I agree it's not untrue that any of us didn't know K through two was stopping pausing whatever we're going to call it. Um and I I just think it's important that we recognize well we might

128find this tedious and we had a lot of people in our community invest a lot of time and we're concerned. So I just think it's important that we kind of where it's going. Any point you can call me. You are getting feedback from constituents. James calls me all the time. Hon calls me all the time. At any point you can call me if you have gotten feedback from community members. If you have heard things, if you have questions about um you know that I'm about to send out a communication because we've gotten an entourage of emails, etc., etc., and you know that something's in the hopper, you can call me and say, "Hey, this is what I would like included in said communication." It's it is often that I'm calling the two of you, but

129you can always call me. And furthermore, when I am calling you to let you know something, the conversation goes two ways. You can tell me, hey, I don't agree or hey, this is what I think and I take it into account, but as a as a voice of the entire board, I think like Val said, my communication will reflect reflect what the majority of the board thinks. It may not be that your individual voice screams. It may be in there, but it might be that the the majority of the board's voice. It's not my intent. Like I said, sometimes it's not my voice in there. what I think is hidden in there the majority of the boards. >> Sure. And I get that, you know, we have to have a process and, you know, just

130started definitely during, you know, rough times, we'll just say, um, in the middle of this K to2 discussion. And so I guess for me it's making sure that I'm not just being told or given information but I have an opportunity to like we really consult and talk about it because you know and again the last school meeting we I think we didn't have enough time to flesh out the you know where we were going really with the K to2 and if you know rolling it into the strategic plan really made sense or not you know because it seemed to be kind of just reacting to the community's push back instead of thinking about the maybe a policy or a process that needs to happen around enrollment around you know because this issue is not going

131away right we may have more students declining we may need to reason or whatever that is but when these decisions have to be made I just want to be clear that we all you know are involved and have a chance to provide input and you know action because if I'm confused like Valerie said If you're confused, you can also about a communication, you should also call me and let me >> Yeah. But if I'm told like an hour before a community meeting, that's it's just getting information I think in a timely manner when >> sometimes the things are happening an hour, right? I mean like that that you have to there's some grace here that that like that the process that you're describing was not some some secret effort that James Carmen and I did

132behind the scenes that we released 10 minutes before the community meeting. It was literally like calling to try to get out the word on where or or or to provide the information but that we were literally building the plane as we're flying it. That happens sometimes. >> It's gonna happen sometime, right? Um, and and there is some truth. I mean, it's going to, I think, get easier. There is some truth to you coming onto the board mid fight in the middle of a bunch of stuff, right? And and so, uh, some of that is coming up to speed. Some of that is us having to fill you in on communications or conversations that the board has had as a group from three weeks prior before you were on the board. Right? So some of that

133is going to modulate I think over time. So just listening to all of this in terms of what has transpired where you are now where you want to go I think what's going to be of a huge benefit is really the next step which is what is in your >> which relates to yeah it relates to communication. >> It relates to how you get information out. You even have had discussions about board chair and how you all have agreed that you're going to communicate and disseminate information. So there are emergencies and you're going to have to remember this. This is not going to be all in just lock step and black and white etc because there will be exceptions when emergency decisions must be made. When that happens that's a bound of trust that the

134team is building right. So if you can get to the point of looking at how you have or will and how you have in the past agreed to communicate and get information out then it could help you with some of these things. But that is not going to preclude that's not going to get you to a point where there might you might not experience some things that >> you go back and call it a hiccup that you're going to have to fix. That doesn't make you it's not going to make you perfect. It's going to make you effective, highly effective. And then you go back and you review. That's what you do. And so you got to think we're not going to heal right this moment, but this conversation will help with that. >> And

135um Dr. King, I think you just hit on what I think is the difference between a hiccup and a pattern. In a leadership role, you have to make the decision to say, is this out the norm? Is this a hiccup? Or is this a pattern and trend? Then if there is a pattern and trend then you then it's time to do reassess what needs to be done and so I just I wanted to say that that's >> absolutely >> because I think that as I look at your norms and protocols and you may want to take a break then we'll get into the 15 minutes >> but it but but as I look at your norms and protocols most of the things that that I've heard outside of the the I didn't get my input

136or I didn't there's what is our process for afterward. I think you cover it in your norms and protocol. I actually think it's in here. I just think that that was a situation that did not sit well and you felt out of the loop and you felt blindsided. Um, and I think that is where and you guys have to talk through that and determine that you're going to move forward from it or you could stay on it and and it could be a sore spot forever and it's just going to you're not going to be able to give it your very best for these students because you're going to be caught up on something that it sounds like everybody has apologized, accepted apologies for, and said that we don't want to let this happen again.

137But I think you do address it in here. I would caution you though, don't overpolicy yourselves. Please don't overpolicy yourselves. If there's nothing else that Bill Hartley has taught me in my role at GSBA is you don't need to overpolicy yourself. Because you can sometimes box yourself in on things when you need to have flexibility as a system to be able to move forward. you need some flexibility. So that's something that if you all are going to to determine how you address those issues that you feel strongly about policy in then that's something you all need to talk through. But I do want to caution you don't overpolicy yourself. just just don't do it because then the very thing that you are trying to move forward in an in for in an instant and you

138know that you need to move forward on but you've you've created this policy here that has you to be doing all of these other steps and you can't get to it because the policy is I just I want you to be careful about that and I want to clarify I think transparency is one of the most important things that a governing body, I don't care if it's a school board, a city council, a county commissioner, the president of the United States. Okay, let me be clear. Transparency is important. But you've got to be clear in the communications when there is transparency and everybody has and it can't be well thinking out. The staff at GSBA will tell you, I think through things, talk through things as I am getting to a place. Sometimes your conversations

139are your conversations that you have to have in public, right? And you have to recognize that those conversations in public are not your actions, are not your decisions, are not you saying, "We're going to do something right now." It is you talking through it. That is being as about as transparent as you can be. Understanding that people are going to walk away from there thinking, "Oh, they're going to do this." I will never forget sitting in a room with hundreds of people. And we had made no decision on what we were going to do in this school system. None whatsoever about what we were going to do in this school system. And there were five different decisions that people had us making when they walked out of there. And we had made none. We were

140as transparent as we could possibly be. We had shared every bit of information that we had. And people walked out of there saying, "Oh, they're going to do this. You have to recognize transparency and and make sure you manage manage your communications well. You just do because you're never going to get it right for anybody because it's always going to be somebody who feels something different. So why don't we take a break? You use the restrooms. We'll come back. We'll get into your norming protocol. From uh some of the feedback that you all have been giving to your uh chair what I wanted to ask her about. I've identified on the norms and protocols that you currently have uh some areas, but I want to give you all opportunities. I'm going to read out the

141areas that uh she's just shared with me that um she's gotten feedback from you all on and if I miss one that you all have, I want you to let me know and we'll try to to get through those. U the first one that I have is information requests for board members of board members. That was the first one that I saw that I've highlighted. Then I go over to board communications with constituents. That's a new one that that I have. >> Yep. >> Then I have constituent requests and issues as one that is highlighted. And there wasn't another one, but I have on here uh discussion around the chief executive officer and superintendent evaluation because of just some of the conversation that we've had today. Is there are there any on here that I

142did not mention that you all want to be sure that we watch >> about one? It's something that I think we talked about um not I think maybe over the phone I can't remember anymore in the fall and I think you called it board office hours. Um that's not on here. No, it's not. So that's why I don't know if this is an appropriate time if we're already off course. I can bring it up later, but I would like to revisit it because I really liked the idea and I wasn't quite sure where it ended up landing. Um, I guess I'm thinking using my own experience in a different school district as a teacher, I appreciated when the board member was hosting sessions. I think the one thing I did a lot in our self-

143assessment, bless you, of board um, and community engagement. And so I just feel like that might be an opportunity. I don't know if it's something that goes in the norms or it's something that's voted on. Okay. It's something I talked to Zinda about that she >> Yes. >> She did not. >> Okay. >> And what was the category called again? >> Board off of power. >> Office. >> And I think it would go with board um communication with constituents maybe, but I don't know. >> Okay. All right. So the first one information request of board members, >> right? Information request of board members. You have that first one that says board members will submit all requests. EG request for information, assistance, reports, etc. through the superintendent directly. Board members will go through the superintendent when

144wanting to communicate with staff unless acting in the capacity of a parent. Typically what you would do you would look at these and make sure that you are validating that this is how you function and how you will continue to function. I think heard you say that you you've already reviewed each right these. Sorry. Yes, these ones. Okay. So, everybody's on the same page with a if they were if they were not so new, we kind of pair you up and let you talk about different 45 minutes again, right? So, forgive us for reading them out to. All right. >> We're not going to read. I want you all to read it and I want you all to tell me where something stands out for you because we'll be >> yes using we gota be

145with time >> within this section specific. I think it's section D >> about information requested by one board member that requires additional resources will be directed to the board chair and then requires a support from a majority of the board to fulfill the request. So, I mean that if you know we're requesting additional information, everyone the majority of the board has to agree to that. I think what I'm hearing and and and I'm what I think and when I've heard this in other places and Hans I guess will straighten me out on this but I know when I was on the board one of the things that we said if I had a board member that was requesting a ton of information that was going to pull the superintendent off task and took a lot

146of time for her to be able to pull together for you then that was a decision that the board had to make right not you couldn't request information superintendent, you can request information. >> If it is something that pulls the superintendent off task of the work for the day and then that's something that the board has to say, all right, you need to devote this however many hours it's going to take to get that information >> and does the >> superintendent or any of their reporting, right? I mean, the concrete example I can give here is of one of my requests at the very beginning. Uh I I we were reporting in the budget operational code information, not functional code. Uh and I wanted to see it all in functional code. And it required it

147would have required Dr. Broom to do just an enormous like several days worth of work to pull all of that information together. >> It required the entire board to support it. And then it required us to be like and it can take you this number of what >> right to understand. And so I'm in very strong favor of maintaining this norm and keeping it. Yeah. >> Yeah. So I think I just want to make sure I understand. Um so like Hans I think early on I had asked for the API stuff before actually right so that would be something that was taking time and resources. But in the meantime then like if I'm asking for something like I think the five-year facilities plan that is it's information that exists and there's no so that's really

148the distinction right and then the superintendent like Dr. Wigger, you would just tell us, >> "Hey, we don't have that right now." >> And then that's when a board member would >> Yes. >> What she does now is if you have a question, you ask it. If you ask it, >> you ask it by email, you copy the rest of the board. Usually, I found she doesn't reply directly. She just puts it in POI. >> Yeah, I've seen her do that. >> But if you're asking for something or something, >> we have to decide that it's something that we want to pursue. And the way it's written, it would then it meets those things then and you have the support of the majority of the board then you move forward with that timeline. But it

149would require support of the majority >> and that's what we see done effectively in other governor's teams in the same way. So, >> yeah, I've requested some items several times and I haven't gotten them and I didn't know, you know, that it requires three people to, you know, confirm that and that just seems >> I don't know what items you requested. I don't know the timeline of it. But if there is something that you've requested and you haven't I don't know if if there is something that is example fiveyear facility plan that's a >> that's a prime example. I can pull the fiveyear facility plan >> off of what what I know we have by going back. It wasn't created when I was here, but I can control it, you know, and then be able

150to make sure if it's I want a historical look back on why X Y and Z was done and often times >> that's not >> I can't that is where the entire board has to say or majority has to say >> I need to now vote at because I am a member of the governance team, but first and foremost, I'm the superintendent for 5,500. >> Right. we don't want to pull you off of your but I guess you know I've asked for just to understand like the PR consultant hire not to you know keep hammering that and I've asked it for it just so I could understand the process and but that is >> that ends up being an operational thing that you would need the board to support choosing to get into her business

151to do and I don't think you would get it >> or like I said before if really that's a pain point for you if you were like I really want to know about the scope then if not that one person in particular because I think it's kind of a that's a different conversation I think it's tricky to start digging into one person's contract in particular but if you said generally I want to look at vendors spend outcome whatever how much we're spending then maybe we build that into our evaluation but then you would have to get the support of your fellow board members and then figure out how we wanted to tackle that you know what I mean it can't just be one person deciding that that's something they want to go after we have

152to have >> I do think you have to be very careful about asking for specific vendor information because I think you have to be careful on vendor's response to you asking for specific information. So you you have to be careful about that. I do think a a better way is to understand what the process is. Yeah. Right. So to understand what the process is for how vendors are selected, that's that's a valid question. our vendors selected. But the other piece you really want to be careful >> and and a prime example, >> you know that >> and another prime example is understanding how ter but not only that when they were selected as the semar it was on the board assembly agenda. the process was on the assembly agenda, evaluations, all of the pieces that

153we then reiterated again. It was the exact same conversation that was on the original agenda, but it wasn't the the board did not get into the specifics around parish that is it was above the threshold. Therefore, it was on assembly agenda. Mhm. >> I just want to say kind of in support of this that the this norm accomplishes two other things. I think one, it keeps superintendent from feeling like they have to say yes because they ultimately all do work for us and the contract and that sort of stuff. So, it's a check. Two, I learned more about being a board member calling my chairs, Jana, Tasha, Lewis, and saying, "Hey, I have this question about this thing that I want." And then, you know, Jana calling me. Similarly when I was chair we had

154some very long conversations where she wanted to talk about an HR issue and I remember being like we can't have that and just like learned and and the norms develop relationship. So that's a I love this norm of like I I may not know what I need to be focused on by as a board member I may learn from a phone call. So that's that's a really important part of it. >> See where I'm I'm still struggling. I like the human part of the phone call. Um, I I like the quick access to an explanation, but then it's still public. And I I think that's where at times I know it's going to happen. Hans, you mentioned earlier the train being built, but it's that one little like adjustment that I want to see. And

155I I I when we get to the board self assessment I may well because I'm hearing you say James that you learned a lot from talking to Jana or talking to Carmen and that's good that and I've learned so much from all of you and even you Lorine um in these last you know six weeks I think but at the same time ultimately we are performing a public duty right and so therefore at times I wonder when we're having a conversation about something that might be better served having a public discussion. And yet I understand you've got an agenda and you've got the things you're trying to do. But I I just I get a little uncomfortable sometimes with the phone call element. >> The part that you're missing is >> it's not a conversation

156about the thing. It's a conversation about whether the thing is relevant. >> Right. >> So Hans is throwing himself out there. First month, Hans is annoying as a board chair. He's asking lots of questions, lots of financial questions. He's wanting to get into it. And he calls me and says and he says, "I demand these codes from I'm like Hans, one of two things are correct. One, you're over asking or two, you got to educate me so that I know." >> And if we come to the conclusion where I think he's right and we ask, then it does become public. Then it is like we have this and we're adding it to the agenda and Hans is a pain and he won't quit calling me. But we but good job Hans is accomplished. Or number

157two, I say not yet. We'll get to that in May. Let the finance office do their job. That's a little too in the weeds. Maybe you set up a onetoone and then that part is good. So what you what you're asking gets accomplished because if it's something that needs to be a subject of the board, then it is a subject of the board. Okay? And if it's not in place, then all of a sudden the city schools of Decay are at the whim of Hans's questions. And that's a scary world. >> It's not already that way. >> Not we're close. We teeter there, but you know, >> but just like I said before, if something if you think that there's some direction that we need to go in and you really feel strongly about it,

158you've got to to call me and let me know. Otherwise, I legitimately have no idea what you're thinking. I can do a lot of things. I can't read minds. I don't know what you're thinking. Um, I don't know what's troubling you. Um, unless you call me and let me know. And like James said, you can educate me or I may tell you, look at the BOP. It's actually in two months and that might be the end of that conversation. Um, but I don't know if I don't know what I don't know. >> And AP is a AP and IB was is a prime example. You started when I started in July. You started in January. You wanted to know when we were going to talk about AP scores and IB scores. But when you receive

159it back as a teacher, I can't necessarily give it as a full fully analyzed and synthesized version of what the district performances until two different organizations, college board and IBO give me. But ultimately that first year we didn't have a BOP. We moved to BOP after me being here a year and learning the cadence of how much information really is digestible, student specific information. Literally BOP is based upon when data releases are of student release data. So when milestones, you know, I know typically most subjects by June, but I can't have a public release on that information until it's no longer embargoed. But it, you know, that's where you may want to know, but that might not be the time when it can be provided. >> Just in the interest of time, because I know

160we're short on time, I it sounds to me like there's at least a majority of the board interested in maintaining this language as it is, right? So we should kind of >> all right just one point phone calls are not bad between the board chief not not being transparent right that is not that is anformational conversation where there's understanding that part of the chair as to what it is that you'd like to see on the information that you need to have those happen all the time all over the state that there are phone calls that does not mean the phone call has to be recorded for minutes for somebody to have and and now this is this is what I talked about with the chair that no >> all right so you've read E already

161right that one relates to student board of ed representative we're good >> all right so now the next one that we have highlighted was board communications with constituents and you have four items there. So, take a look at those. >> These look like these are new. >> New. Yes, this is a new >> talked about these and >> this was a discussion at pre-work in February earlier this month. And so this is what was drafted. Um I believe uh board member Iier pulled from a couple places and kind Yeah, because I was just acknowledging I think in reading this the first time that of course if a constituent contacts us, you know, I've shared someone contacted me one to one and wanted to talk to me or whatever, we're going to respond to them and

162maybe meet with them or talk to them. Um, and so when I I just felt like that that was needed because without that this section it seems to just jump into constituents who contact board members with a concern will be referred to the superintendent and not really acknowledging that of course board members are going to be also talking to constituents and you know having communications otherwise. But if it's an operations you know question or something that concerns the whole you know board then we share that too. have seen that. >> So, everybody is on board with the this ordinance. >> I don't see in here anything that speaks to the relaying of relevant information to the for your conversations with your constituents. >> There's nothing in here that that speaks to that. And while it

163might not be operational, it might be something that the superintendent needs to be aware of. So, and I don't see anything in here. And I'm just saying that for you all to at least think about. There's no bullet that speaks to I was talking to uh constituents at a community meeting. This issue came up. I could see where this is going to be an issue and I how do you communicate that there's nothing in here that speaks to that? John had his hands up first. >> I I also would add the second point that if we are meeting with constituents one on- one, we are not in any way representing the board. We are individual community members in that conversation as well. And I >> So I think your question reminded me of something. So

164right now I think our norms say that you know if one of us asks the question then we get else has asked it but along those lines I don't feel like there is a process for me to know the concerns that Hans shared or James shared >> with you. >> Well yeah so you know you might have insight into constituent concerns you share that with Dr. Whitaker. Am I just to infer that then somehow that's addressed? Like it seems like it might be useful because you might any of us are going to hear things that others might not. >> But that's where I think your relationship with your fellow board members really come. I I'm not the the telephone game of I like >> I typically meet with the way the day goes, you know,

165I'm I have you guys one oneonone for by the time >> I get to tell you what my conversation was for because >> of course >> when I started with this person which typically it is here or it's there >> I'm not telling them what I had convers I do think Tracy, it's a good idea for us to figure out how to share that information. I think we should not do it through the superintendent, which I think you're you're agreeing to. >> But I I do have to ask though because if our POI is specifically giving us access to the question that another board member asked of the superintendent, why wouldn't the POI also allow for >> indicate that like what's the difference? >> Oh, no, no, no. I'm saying when I if I were

166to share something with Dr. Whitaker, it's not a question. Right now, our POI exists as any board member who asks for something or asks a question and I've seen it work really well. I'm saying the reverse though. So now one of the board members shares with Dr. Whitaker a concern. Why wouldn't that just be included in the POI as FYI? Well, the when someone shares a concern, >> it's just like when everyone asks me when you have the advisory council, what did you do with that information? Sometimes I just listen to them and say, "Okay." When you share concerns with me, sometimes I just shake my head and say, "Okay." Sometimes I have to follow up with a staff member. Sometimes I have to, you know, do due diligence. But my communication with you is

167not simply a point of interest on what questions we're asking. Communication is so that you are fully informed and prepared to do what we do in public. >> Which is around the work of the school system, not >> telephone game of us. visibility that constituents are raising with either or any of us. I'm super loathed to put more work on the superintendent to manage that. And so I think it's on us to figure out a way to manage it. And I don't know that I'm prepared to write a norm right now because I think we need to think about this. Like to to Valerie's point, I don't I don't want to overprescribe in the norms a way like like maybe we should have some conversation around how to facilitate a that and and maybe it

168arrives at a norm or or maybe it just becomes a operating thing that we do like >> I think it would be a good idea to come back and address that. >> Yeah, like I said, if if somebody comes to you and says some if you get some feedback from a constituent and it's something you feel like we as a board need to address, I would hope that you would let me know. Otherwise, like I don't how how am I going to figure out the best way to because if you say something and then Han says something identical, well then I know this is something you know I need to take back. But the the one piece in here um wait the piece uh on letter C around keeping sensitive matters confidential and then a

169piece with transparency. Kind of talk about because I've heard you say even today there are times and things that are shared in the board that aren't that are sensitive in nature. So how might we reconcile I would say B with C. So the first sentence of B with the piece of C >> but I mean isn't C limited like I thought it's executive session so that >> including the discuss is not >> there are top I would say it this way there are topics that would be subject to exec session if we're having a conversation as a group but even if we don't have a conversation as a group about those topics we still need to keep them confidential. Anything related to land, personnel, etc. is confidential whether or not we've talked about it in

170>> exact. But the but the topic and the subject would fall under executive session if you were having it. Correct. Correct. >> Yeah. So it seems to be exclusively stuff that would be an executive session or topics that would be an executive session that would be limited that need >> would be >> yeah I mean I that one overlap >> I hate to say this because I know like why we have teacher code of ethics but I mean it seems almost common sense after executive session but I know we shouldn't realize it like an HR matter matter is something that even if we haven't gotten to executive session yet, I'm just not going to talk about that with someone. >> But as a board member, let me just ask a question. If you all are

171talking about something that has the potential of blowing up or you know it's already a hot item in the district, in the community um and you know it's sensitive and you know you all have not fleshed it out enough a sensitive topic. Would you put it out there for conversation in the community and you all haven't even fleshed it out yet and you know that it could blow up and get out of hand if you haven't even as a board fleshed it out. You've had some conversations about it and it doesn't fall under the executive and because this says including executive session matters, right? Including those discussed. It says board members will keep sensitive matters confidential. It doesn't say confidential forever. It just says confidential until you have the opportunity to really flesh it out.

172And then it may never be an executive session matter. It might be something, but you've got to you got to flesh it out before you if if if I'm having a conversation that says, you know, Tracy or the whole board, uh, we've got this matter happening. I'm not getting into what y'all have just gone through, but something around that, right? And I don't have a recommendation for you all just yet. But these are things that's happening. And this is this is something that may I may have to come back to you with this, but I don't know that I'm going to have to do that, right? Because you'll you'll get the the community going down a road and getting all of >> me like figure out what the I haven't done. No, no. I'm answering

173what you were asking. Right. So, you're going down this road >> with with an issue, right? Place on it. Yet, I just I just think sometimes we we as as governing authorities, sometimes we bring issues on ourselves when we ought to be the calming kind of >> kind of aspect of the community. And why would I create a firestorm if there doesn't have to be a firestorm? Because there's no decision that's made on something. We're just talking about it, right? And if you're talking about it in a public in the board meeting, it's public anyway, so everybody's gonna hear it anyway. But that you're having a phone call with with Carmen or Hans and they're talking you're talking about something, right? I said Carmen and Hans. I didn't say you. Right. comment or Hans and

174they're talking about something, right? Hans can't walk away from that going, "Well, I gotta go. I got to make sure that the whole community knows this now." >> Because it's it's it's just a conversation between the two of them or with the superintendent. It's nothing that should be made privy to the whole community yet because no, y'all haven't taken any actions. >> It's premature. So, and then also as you the language say including but not limited to those discussed in exact session. Has there been I mean I guess I just want to know like has there been an issue with this that we just need to kind of address head on because >> this was what was provided by what board member I thought >> I'm just speaking to this okay and then the conversation

175got going okay commenting on the conversation >> I realized that I just tried to word smith it so I'm back off that time but in general All I think all of these are necessary and sufficient. So I'd like each of you. Does anyone feel different? >> I think this is I think um I think sensitive matters I I agree with this point. Sensitive matters don't always exist in the setting of objective. I also think community that is small but well intertwined. It's also a community that uses social media a lot. So you may say something to somebody about something and then some version of it could end up in social media post unbeknownst to you and you're like oh I know I talked to that person that's not exactly what I said but >> that

176post says here it comes the next post says something else that adds to it and then the next say something else that adds to it. >> Right. And I think that's the I think that was her point about being careful about not just talking about exempt session matters but sensitive matters that maybe are not well organized um because even some of the most well-intentioned people um and where we have the cake baked maybe to stay in the kitchen. I think I think it's written well. Board members will keep sensitive matters confidential. And that's not saying we're not being transparent. >> That's just saying they're going to be confidential until they are ready to be made public. >> How did he have based on the conversation? We have consensus there too. >> Yep. Yep. >> Okay.

177>> Right. So that takes us to constituent. >> You go ahead. All right, constituent requests and issues. You have reviewed this one already, right? The one comment I have here is that A3.3 looks like it captures what Tracy was asking for in terms of communications to the whole group, but it is buried under the purview of when constituents have requests and issues. And I think the way that we've been talking about it is that it's for any mass communication, not just a constituent request. >> So it becomes the new number four, not a sub. >> No, it becomes a seat. It becomes move it >> not constituent request initiatives, but just a communication. >> Communications. >> I a section for communications with constituents. with the community. >> Yeah, >> that's what I meant in the

178take that and put it up in make it >> I do I think a couple of thoughts things like the uh board bulletin comes out on behalf of the board but it does not come from me. Um so are you guys wanting to this is where this starts to get a little dicey or tricky. Are those things that you want to look through or look at? Things like my chair's comments that are read um during the board meeting. Those um those are not those are not something that those are communications, but they're not by email that go out. Um, so it also I think I'm I'm happy to I'm happy to have you review and circulate things, but to Val's point, it has to be that depending on the urgency of the matter that you

179respond within a specific time frame. >> Um, because some things, like with a lot of these mass communication emails, if I send them out a day or two later, not a big deal. Send them out three days later. Let's talk about what we mean by review because I think that's the word that is tripping us up because to to Valerie's point earlier, this is not what I certainly don't intend here is that Carmen has to send stuff to us and then deal with 40 iterations to get all of our input and everything incorporated and changed so that it can then go out. I think I think it means review in the light touch review. you are aware that it is going out and you are aware of what it says. You can of course write

180back and say, "Hey, I don't like this word." But it is up to Carmen whether that gets incorporated into the communication before it actually goes out. >> You know, that makes sense. I mean, I think, you know, just seeing what I've seen in the short time, it's just having an opportunity to see what's going out. not words smmith it too much but just to have an awareness of what's going on. I don't I mean the board letter I think that you said that comes out from McCall, right? She publishes >> newsletter. Yeah, but it says board now. It's >> like board chair letters or board, you know, important responses and things like that. Making sure that we all are on the same page >> because I mean if I'm reading this correctly, number two is

181really the thing that explains the stuff we already know, right? So to me mass communications or am I looking at the wrong I'm in constituent request >> request and issues a >> yes so number two under letter A Roman numeral three number two yeah for high volume inquiries or matters so that already is addressed that kind of there's more um possibly community >> sensitivity yeah >> but I don't want to add extra work to people but the way I read number three if we wanted to do it was what we've done already, which is effectively if anyone has anything to say. No one responds either. They didn't have anything to say and I I doubt we're talking about things like word choice. So, I feel like number two answers to my concern. I have some

182suggestions for the board newsletter, but I don't think we have time for that right now. >> Oh, yeah. That's fine. So as long as as long as we all as long as our common understanding we don't need to word smith it but our common understanding on this that review does not mean roundroin editing. It literally is FYI. >> Yeah. >> Okay. I I >> realize what you're looking at on paper as the number three has just moved up to >> James. Do you have a concern? >> Oh, I just I I we don't often know what will generate significant community attention. Throwing that in there. It's almost like hindsight looking at the numbering that I'll check. I'll be like, "Nope, I was definitely consulted on that. I just had no idea everyone was going to

183be angry." >> Yeah. >> High burden on that as a norm. >> I just think for high volume inquiries. So scratch or matters that generate significant media attention. >> Yeah. Just any high volume inquiry. >> Yeah. I agree with him. >> Draft response should be shared with a full board. I think I think just the norm of like, hey, I'm thinking of sending that out. You've got a day to respond to let me know if you have a problem with it and then I'll send it. Whether it's about something like school closure, which we know will rile people up, or >> gym equipment that that Jarvis put in. You know, it's like I don't think anyone's going to be mad about it, but they might. >> Right. >> And I I need a little bit

184of clarification on what you're considering mass communications because that I don't that like I said, some things are written on behalf of the board, but don't come directly from me. It may say board and maybe I just greenlight it, but it's not coming from my email inbox. >> Could be the other >> come the other way around. Some could I could have nothing to do with it. Just like James said, could be a letter that has our names on the bottom of it. >> I think letter with our names on the bottom that that it's just the norm of working on a board that's fine. But if it's addressed as from the board of education >> or if it's like a board chair letter >> beyond those that are part of like regular like the

185regularity, you know what I'm saying? outside of the regular >> Yeah, that's what I think because like for me the board newsletter maybe not, but we can talk about maybe how to >> in general >> ad hoc communicate. I mean, that's what you're describing. You're describing things that are not routine. >> Yes. >> Ad hoc mass communications from the board will be circulated to the full board for review prior to release. >> That sounds good. >> Yeah. Does the board chair >> and that the board that the system is that hasn't been already taken by >> Okay. All right. I'm I just get confused because it sounds like you're reviewing the actions that you've already taken. >> The board newsletter. The board newsletter is literally the agenda, >> a transcript. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >>

186That's not We don't need >> I don't need to look at that. What is on board chair letter or a board chair comment are those are actions >> sometimes some I don't know sometimes we are making statements there that it's the first time those statements are being and I think that is what board members are saying I would like to just know that that's being said in advance >> okay I I just didn't understand All right. Uh, >> the last new one in >> that was the last one. Now, I highlighted the uh superintendent evaluation, chief executive office, the superintendent evaluation because you all have been talking about things that that really if you're going to hold should be hold should be taken care of in the evaluation, which should always be aligned to your

187strategic plan aligning that to that. But I wanted you guys to take a look at this again and to see where there is because I think you address it all in here. But I want you all to take a look at this. It talks about setting clear goals, objectives each year for the superintendent alignment with the strategic plan. I don't have edits here. >> I think where I'm getting confused and I'm sorry. We have our norms here and then we did the self assessment and this is also a standard in the self assessment. So is this then where I would talk about comments I put in the self assessment because these are norms. >> This is talking about your process and how you what you do how you implement the Tennessee. So the only thing

188I put I think it was a followup to what um I can't remember who mentioned at the last meeting and the way I framed it was because I think Dr. Whitaker, you and I both kind of paused at the same time. You know, when you're talking about evaluations and you understand that it's executive session, but I did like the suggestion of some um public input perhaps in building the process um the tool, right? And you know what I put in my comments is so we'd have to be careful about how we did that, right? That's just not something you could do willy-nilly. Um I was reading about Virginia DOE and they do a stakeholder input but again I wondered if even for us that's not really though at that point if >> I don't know

189who evaluates us but um >> well the the voters >> yeah I got well I was going to say that >> will be evaluated by an external partner >> uh so so that you can qualify for exemplary board status. And one of the things we keep saying, the reason why we have to talk about the vision project is not only because the vision project is something that's important, but we have to do it because that's a qualification of it. The external evaluation of the board is a part of that process. >> Yeah. So we and you're speaking of the external stakeholder committee >> and different language is used in different places for that but that's a piece where cross-section of stakeholders however you all develop that >> and is given the opportunity to give you

190input on how the governance team functioning based on certain indicators. I do I do want to address kind of board member Anderson's question though because I think you're talking about Superintendent Whitaker's evaluation itself >> or the tool that we're using. >> The tool that we're using. >> I'm going to push back on that just because I think one I'm elected to this chair. I'm loathed to relinquish that. I don't know that the community has the expertise, has the knowledge, has all of the information necessary. And then on top of that, this is fundamentally what the representative body is meant to do. Like that that is 100% one of the core three things that we do. I'm I'm pretty loathed to to relinquishing that up to other folks. >> Well, I don't think I mean, yeah,

191I get that. I didn't want to relinquish it in any capacity. I just was looking more at the building of it. Um, not the actual evaluation. Obviously, that's us. >> I'm I'm willing to have a conversation about empty and we had talked a little bit about this as a body whether we want to publish not the evaluation but just the tool like here are the 10 things that we're looking at >> empty. Um, that is a conversation we can have. Obviously, the superintendent has to be comfortable with that as well. But in terms of what goes into that document, I I'm going to be hardressed to let somebody else tell me what >> at the end of the day, you were elected to that's your job. Your job is is to hire um to evaluate

192to like that's your job. That's what you were elected to. Um I think that the the the instrument that you use to evaluate the superintendent and even the areas that you're evaluating the superintendent in. Again, you see it said in state board in the it should be aligned to your strategic plan. There's no problem with showing that to your community. It's aligned to your strategic plan. They can see what you're evaluating the super. They don't need to see the the final evaluation, but just as you wouldn't show a final evaluation of the teacher or anybody else, right? But you would show you can show what the instrument is, right? But that's your job. That's not the community's job. That's why they elected you. >> The governor's team has joint discussion on building that instrument as

193you all know. Y >> and I will say that this is the document or process that further explains my contract, the items that are specified in my contract as your superintendent. Not necessarily the contract of previous superintendent indicator but my contract. All right. So I don't necessarily hear any changes to this. I was I just wanted to pull it because you all had talked about building her evaluation instrument, but that doesn't necessarily I think it's all covered. I personally think it's covered in this. I just didn't know if you all felt that way because of some of the questions that were being comments that were being made. >> I don't have any movement. >> All right. >> Three minutes early. >> Well done. Well done. >> All right. Well, thank you all for allowing us

194to kind of walk you through this process. I do think that it is a good process to walk through with an with an independent someone kind of helping to guide the conversation. I do think that that is important. It's hard to do that when it's just you all talking among even though y'all do a lot of talking among yourselves. So, but it is good. It's good to have kind of that facilitating voice. >> Thank you very much. help you do this. So >> you all mean power to you. >> Thank you Miss Wilson and Dr. King for joining us today. Your guidance and support are greatly appreciated. Thank you Mrs. Lynch for capturing the revisions and we look forward to seeing the final product at the March 10th pre-work session. Oh, the final agenda item

195is the GSBA governance team self assessment which I will facilitate. >> So, a little bit of a logistics infrastructure issue. We've got a solution to you. Go into your BOE email. There's an email from me sitting there with a Zoom link. It's not the regular broadcast one. You'll share the self evaluation that Zoom that >> you just sent me. >> I just sent it to you. It might be clearing the filters and whatnot. Okay. See what this was. >> Click that link. Don't worry. It's safe. Good to me. >> I need to see it in contrast. >> Yeah. >> Melting. >> I need some more sugar. >> No, you don't. Yes, I do. All right. >> All right. >> Where you going? >> Are you? >> I think so. >> Where all the student board

196reps go. >> I mean, 100% rate, >> right? person. But yeah, um all my decisions are coming out like March 26ish. >> Yeah, I will keep y'all updated. >> I'm sorry. I'm sorry. >> Given your age, it's the only question you get, so I like to ask it in a >> joial way. >> Congratulations on that star. Okay. >> Like this. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Open this. Crack it open. >> I can't remember anymore. Do you? >> Y >> and I want you to >> because I get confused what VS get and I know what star student >> get anything other than like >> they can recognize $100. Okay. That's what I call a lot of Chick-fil-A. Don't go to work. >> Oh yeah. No share. Who was the starter? >> Um, Miss Lee. You

197know what? Does IB English year one? >> So, you had Miss Beach junior year. >> Yeah. It's not even an asterisk star student anymore. Everyone's taking it, right? I know for years it was like only a few were taking it, but >> I think near 100%. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Did you try the like I've heard different regions of the country favor like Midwest ACT. And now students tell me they take both >> I definitely hear but then it seems like over the years students have told me they'll take both and then see which one >> better I never really heard of like >> from your it's definitely better your not just your has an optional science section. It's way more like less reading, but it's like faster pace. >> So now as you like

198if you're bad at reading long passages, >> is act also more like >> feel safe for lack of a better word. >> I mean I would say there's like I like better from what I >> No, I've never taken a practice. >> What's it on a score of now? The 1600 still or the check. >> Well, I thought they didn't do their own 2400. >> Isn't that the GRE? >> I don't know. >> Nope. The graduate readiness exam. >> Wait until you take that. >> I crushed the GRE. I don't remember what I did on it. >> You had the craziest like verbal and then that just >> a friend and I had together and I was just like killing me. No. GR >> and if other folks want to log in to like read

199the descriptors or anything. >> I got I got like a 2320 or something. >> I didn't. >> No. >> Did you do it? Cool. >> No, I was not joking. I did not do it. >> How do you have six satisfactory if not everybody did it? >> Well, I learning to >> five of us. >> Ah. Oh, >> so James, you're the odd man out >> again. >> All right, let's pound through it. >> We need Yeah, probably >> started. I mean, >> at least where it's all unanimous. Okay. >> All right. Okay. Standard A. Governance leadership team is compromised of local board of education superintendent appropriate roles and responsibilities as defined by state constitution state law. Everybody says satisfactory >> consensus rating. >> All right. Standard B selector of consensus rating all the ratings

200which you don't. Yeah. There you go. >> Okay. Standard B. The governance team leadership team executes its duties as defined in the state constitution, state laws, state board constituent or local board policies, accreditation standards, procedures, ethical standards, which govern its conduct by satisfactory one needs improvement. So the board communication norms address code of ethics and conflict of interest standards. However, they could be clear. The board is currently revising these particularly that appear access to information. Absent majority support equitable access information is essential to fulfilling fiduciary oversight responsibilities. I've requested records for several weeks related to a PR consultant engagement and receipt and complete responses. >> We discussed it. >> Okay. So that's consent. Well, the consensus is five. >> Yeah. >> I mean it's satisfactory. >> Um board acts policy meetings body separate from the

201rules and responsibilities authorizes superintendent. So this is split through satisfactory three needs improvement. Okay. I can summarize. Are you is it are you supposed to read it for? Um, you can probably read. >> I think I really said this during our discussion earlier, but I saw a need for attention given possibly to policy versus regulation. Um, and then, you know, as I said earlier, I was thinking specifically at that constituent question. And then I think I cited the executive function. Um, and I quoted from the standard in acquiring or disposing of real estate and other property construction of facilities in particular. And so I thought specifically of K through2 and ECLC in that and I looked at Fulton Ford policy education specifications um for design and then Marietta has one for building project records but

202that's for ESPL. So I don't know if our audit does that for the bond or anything else but >> so I can speak specifically to Fulton's policy on >> so Fton has over 110 >> buildings and so when they build a building there are specific educational specific specifications that are aligned to what the DOE's eds are um and that policy is because you have very large maps that you have to ensure the same build in every location because your south and your north can look different. I would also want you to understand prior to four years ago the average tenure of a board member was 20 plus years. Holton's policy manual as you heard Miss Wilson say, >> huh? >> It's old. >> It It's not only old, but it's a lot because it's people

203that have been creating and maintaining and realize your policy manual is is very very new. >> I think this one they either updated or it's new that like it's >> they have a revision. Yeah, >> they have a revision cycle just like us. But edex is just that's what they do to build buildings because that you can't have one side of the district have a building that looks a different way than another side. Any other feedback? Iput needs improvement for this for namely because of number operations versus what's actually board governance. Um I think sometimes we we struggle with that although it sometimes sometimes it does get fuzzy. Um I think sometimes we struggle with what's actually operation. >> I agree with that. not a consensus but it's certainly not satisfactory. So I think needs

204improvement. All right. Comment. >> I think staying in our governance lane is a is a significant. >> Okay. >> I think also just clarifying roles, responsibilities part of that too, >> right? understanding the your role as governance and versus operations help us stay in our lane >> because I think I mean >> when they get intertwined that it gets confusing >> we're on standard C right >> okay >> yes >> all Right. Standard D. The governance leadership team demonstrates a unified approach to governing a school system in order to assure effective fulfillment of roles and responsibilities. FC um professional development um governance leadership team differentiates professional development curriculum and delivery for whole board and individual members. members are provided with an introduction orientation and mentoring based in order to support their effectiveness. We have um

205two sorry two needs improvements for satisfactory. Um I wrote satisfactory for this but from like a pseudo member perspective um you know I've appreciated all the training I've got but a lot of it has been um just like by being in the leads and you know I think we can continue to refine how we're um on boarding members. Like even this year um we struggled to schedule it so that um my like internship block was aligned was like on that last at the end of the day on Tuesday and so I've missed a lot of class. So that has limited like my efficacy. Um, so just like as a general note, not a specific ask, but like continuing to like be thoughtful about um how we're equipping our So are we okay with satisfactory? >>

206I would I would include the comment that that Nia just made though. >> Can you summarize it for me? um continue to be thoughtful and like a word that means like >> cognizant >> constantly. Am I am I writing in the right? >> Yeah. Um with our masses. >> Yeah, that I that's news to me, right? And so that's something that I think would be helpful for us to know and to take into account with with other student boards. >> Just continually improving the process of onboarding, training, and scheduling >> is really >> for student board reps. her your schedule because she's a student like we got >> first and foremost you are >> I was told has the most complicated student schedules ever in the district of Dec. >> I'm sure that's definitely the

207nature of the role of >> but it is something we work with the school but we've already reached out this year in master schedule. >> Wait, so are we saying it's Nia's fault? Yeah, >> well, >> what I will let you know that we had C as the need improvement standard last year >> self assessment the uh just so you know what was designed in the action plan was for today which was to have the changing role of today's governance team as the school board you course but you had the live course >> by now but so yeah so I would want to say that that's two years in a row that we've had that standard so we definitely want to address it >> all right um okay two >> okay uh leave your leadership

208team provides input and adopt the system strategic split three and three. Okay. Comment about the newer strategic. Well, I can I don't mind owning my comment which was you know again I used the language of the self assessment and collaboration 2328 strategic plan has been updated and then we review it. I believe also it says we adopt it each year and so I'm just not clear. I think we do a very good job of like, hey, these are the strategic accelerators and we have this BOP, but I couldn't tell you how we're using community input. >> Well, that so the strategic plan as written was built with community input. I don't know that >> then it was updated and when it was up and then the standards because there's a later standard that also talks

209about it. >> When did we adopt an updated plan? I and I'm not saying you're wrong. I just don't remember. I asked that email because the 23 28 um was adopted I believe in March 23. The one that's posted as a summary is dated July 23. The only public facing document I could find was the board retreat from May 2024 that like on the bottom very bottom because I think one of the updates was the ECLC. >> Okay. And that would have been the last time. So my my comment was that the the last one that I I don't recall ever actually re-dopting like reaffirming on an annual basis and we can have a decision as to whether we want to but we did say we would and I don't recall us ever actually reviewing

210and readopting. >> I think one of the standards specifically says we're supposed to. >> Yeah. And that that's why I made that comment, right? Maybe we need to do that to you know look at it annually and considering the feedback that we're getting from the community. I want to emphasize though the strategic plan is not built solely on the community's feedback. You know it's not a community facing is something that the community participates in but the board has a big say in it. So does this >> right? It's a threepart. So what what I do want to say is that if you might remember that what was that our charter approved document with the DOE >> was approved in May of 23. >> Had to resubmit it. >> Yeah, there was a resubmission process. >>

211So that because what was listed there was not in alignment. It was the old information, >> right? They the in the rush submission during a time of transition, they did not update the document as was submitted. So, we had to resubmit the correct one. >> Yes. Which means everything's date got changed. But the original pillars of the strategic plan were agreed upon by the community were the same. Those are the big picture items like where we should focus our attention. But it doesn't that sounds right. >> It doesn't or shouldn't ever include an action items on particular things. >> I think that it was it was bringing coherence to all of the foundational documents. So the foundational documents of the 90-day plan I was given which is basically my first semester of being here. the

212strategic plan and the charter all kind of needed to be in alignment because they were different. They were diverging into different places because some of the whatever. So we finally by May and the reason why you say by May 24 for member Anderson because by that point in May of 24 we finally got the revised approved version from the state which then is now everything is alive in alignment >> right but I mean we did have a training here where I think it started with the fact that this is not something we created right that this tool in >> oh this assessment. >> Yeah. Like so this we didn't make this up and GSBA didn't make this up, right? And so again, when I'm reading what do we mean >> particular tool that measures or

213identifies these standards, these policy procedures fact still remains that it identifies community input in two different standards here specific to a STRA plan. If you look at our May 2024 board retreat, it specifically talks about the Strat plan being effectively a living document. And so I think to the same conclusion you drew, Hans, if I understood you correctly, is when are we reviewing this? And given the fact that the ECLC is probably one of the most important features of that STRA plan, and the fact that we talk about community input is where I see a real need for improvement. I don't I I don't disagree with that. I think reviewing it like say every January, you pull it up, you look at it, make see if you want to change it, you know, if you

214want to adjust it, make sure you still agree is is reasonable. Um, but, you know, realize it has a fiveyear life, so you don't go through and like tear the car apart and rebuild it. But I don't know if I I don't know if I completely agree that the ECLC is the most important part of it. There's a ton of parts of it, >> I think, to the community part and community input. sitting on this board besides K through 12 and then one other I guess HR matter for lack of a better word because I wasn't on the board during COVID. it could be the single most thing for which people have emailed and we have various >> but teacher salaries and teacher retention is on there and that's all >> okay but again I'm

215just saying community input because it appears that when the ECLC was added to the updated STRA plan there wasn't an adoption and we didn't have any community input with it was simply shared during the board retreat >> I also don't know if the right direction to go is to start adjusting the strat plan based on whatever is >> but then we would change it like every year and we might be painfully off track now. Should we review it every year? I I I think that's totally should we change it based on whatever is >> Yeah. >> you know kind of the flavor of the minute. I don't I don't know if that would be the right I don't think I'm looking at changing it. I'm thinking again of our the ways in which we can

216be the most effective. And so perhaps because we hadn't reviewed it in a way or readopted it in a way where it would have been as public facing then there was a lot more energy and many more resources used. So I'm not suggesting it should have been suggesting but it doesn't appear to have had the community input or we don't appear to have used it whatever process was or wasn't there. So that maybe resources are being sent in a direction that didn't have to be if in fact we were reviewing it. >> Am I correct? The strategic plan is just those the five pillars we agreed on as a community and we voted on >> that's a aspect of implementing the strategic plan. >> Go to and then open up the assembly again. I really

217do assembly. >> How do you I have >> right here. That'll get you. Yeah. and then click on send >> or the blue link >> here >> right down in the middle >> link that blue link. So, one of the things that we do at the November and the May board for retreats. Yeah. Get her to it to planning. We have a summary twice a year on where what we're meeting the goals and objectives. >> Sure. like like do you remember when we were over at the cater center uh and we said these are this is the strategic plan and then >> scrolling down though >> you'll see keep going >> the bottom like that you guys give feedback >> do you remember doing that. >> Mhm. >> Oh, I remember this. >> Now, push

218back a tab or go back to where you just were a second ago. Now, scroll up a little more. >> Yeah. And now, so then you can go to the KPIs. We talk about the KPIs and when we update them when it's appropriate, meaning twice a year because you're not going to get CCPI data >> every quarter. >> Sure. >> But in November or November board retreat is when we are doing that part of what's in that standard. We will do it again in May for what we've received over the next six months. So now go back to your original tab with the policy or the yeah the what what we were updating our self assessment. >> Yep. Okay. So at least annually and as needed the governance leadership team reviews assesses the system strategic

219plan and the board readapt we don't read i.e. have those each one of in May is when you go through all the objectives and look at all of the There's a difference there's a difference between looking at the KPIs that are under the current plan and saying are we hitting what we said we're going to hit under the current plan >> you kind of dig into it >> versus saying is this still the right plan and I think that's what it when I read assesses the system strategic plan and the board reads there is a conversation it doesn't have to be a giant one but there is a conversation that says are these still the pillars that we like is this still the direction that we want to be going. >> The answer might be

220no, but we still vote and say we adopt this plan. >> So that's done once a year. >> It's not done. >> We can you can you can add that in May when you talk about your BOA which is what do you want to because that's the same meeting that we say. >> Yep. >> What do you want to talk about when for the next year which is aligned to the >> plan? I think this is a needs improvement and the comment is in the May meeting we add a review and re >> that may retreat. >> But do we vote at retreats? I don't recall voting at a retreat. >> Well, why would you read it up? >> Yeah. >> Uh we can vote, right? There's no reason. Yeah. This is this is a

221a call an announced official meeting. So, so yeah, I I think in the May retreat, we'll just add an item to the agenda to review the strategic pillars to have the conversation about the plan and to vote to read, >> but I sorry and we'll pick up with the community standard after. So, are we saying because I wrote I think here and then later the Strap plan comes up again the community input part. I want to be very clear. I am not suggesting that every single person in the community sits at the table and helps but at the same time community input is here. Well, I hear what you're saying James that the community help >> no earlier you said the community helps inform or input the original strap plan that then we have identified

222as a living document and can be revised and readopted. So where does that community input? >> You asked about community and you said it appears twice but I don't see it anywhere. Am I missing it? >> The governance leaders team in collaboration with the community provides input to >> and adopts a strategic plan. >> Okay, >> we did that. That was in 23. >> Plan is updated. >> Doesn't say it. >> But we readopt it. >> So we just keep reading the same governance leadership team. >> We review and adopt it. We heard strongly from the community and I'm sorry that you didn't serve but it's the one time where the community means the community. GSBA does a that did a mailing campaign. They walked through they it wasn't the 13 people who were angry.

223It was the community. >> Yes. >> And I do mean that intentionally coming up and showing and speaking. It's not it's it's not taking the worst of us. It's taking the most of us. >> And I appreciate that. But I really do take issue with any identifications of angry community members. Maybe it's because I'm a teacher and I'm used to a parent who might not be satisfied with something. I can appreciate we might have angry community members, but I just don't think we need to keep refraraming anyone who's asking questions as angry community members even though some may be angry. >> So let let's just be wait a minute. >> There was a grammatical shift there where I said we are responding to angry people and then you said that I've characterized anyone who speaks

224>> as an angry person. So let let's just let's just talk about the specifics of the words. Point one is every five years with the collaboration of the community we build a strategic plan and adopt it. Point two which is the one we're talking about now annually and as needed it's us that reviews assesses the strategic plan. Obviously in that assessment we're going to bring our perspective to the table around what we think the views of the community are but we are not under point 2 annually to to seek input on the plan and so I think in May we review have our perspective and yeah >> that's compromise what about they have leaders their community they are elected I put that in That's not but it is if if we're trying to figure out

225a way to bridge community input with this particular matter which to James's point it does not say broad you know input into a readoption but as a a bridge point maybe there's there's the SLTs there's the advisory councils we could see how to use them >> I think it's just what we hear too maybe from our one-on- ones or from the emails or from the you know public feedback fact just being cognizant of that when we maybe >> yeah what you bring as a board member should be informed by all of those things but it is a far cry to say the board should be informed by those things those are two different they're each elected to represent choose to do that >> right standard B utilizing the adopted strategic planning process the leadership team

226monitors and reports progress ress on performance measures, right? Five satisfactory, one needs improvement. I put the Georgia DOE student growth percentiles because um Georgia DOE considering student growth in addition to student achievement provides a more complete picture of academic performance. >> More closely, we look good. Um, but I would like us to look more closely at the college readiness numbers on the back page where you get to see and again comparatively I've, you know, looked at Alpharetta, that's an IB school district. I've looked at Walton's um the number of our Decatur students that are entering technical colleges or the Georgia system and not needing needing remedial classes, what the Lexile or the reading score is for our students with SAT and AP. So the difference in what Cater does versus some other schools is the

227number of students that actually metriculate in out of Decater in Georgia versus anywhere else in the nation. So that is only able to pull Georgia students and the majority of our students graduate and go out They can't pull they're not pulling national clearing house data to inform our Georgia technical USU. It's only Georgia. So our students who are staying with us in Georgia, it's a very it's a small number in proportion, but I can give you a full deep dive on CCPI. >> I think just because >> we can go there. We do really well as a lot of schools do. We get 100% in advanced academic performance. Kudos. But you I want to understand more of those students who are graduating and who took these academic classes. How capable are they to perform in

228those college or >> and I can we can go to the CCPI. Okay. >> Okay. Community relations standard A. The leadership team develops a process for creating a culture where input is thought and valued are a two satisfactory for needs and >> I mean if no one wants to hear me I can't just what I really latched on to here was that um there's input and there's review and there's feedback and I just don't see a process in which we categorize um and use I see a lot of opportunities for people to share things. They can email us. They can come to a board meeting. They can put some information in a survey. They can go to a listening session. They can go to the community meeting. But I don't see the system we have

229in place to use that. I see we have a lot of good systems for people to speak and share. I I struggle with this one because I think some of the voices that we hear are not representative of the entire community and I think sometimes voices also coming. So I I struggle with wanting to hear people and make decisions but then realizing that it's a small percentage of the community at large. Like even when I go back home and I talk to my neighbors or you know friends that know I've known for years and they're like I totally don't feel that way. I heard public comment. I don't feel that way at all and then I get conflicted. Um but I also know that you know for years before I became very active in the

230community I didn't go to board meeting meetings public when I was a fellow when I was you know had two really young kids I didn't public comment. Um, so I think that's something that I I struggle with. I think, you know, my thought is that I think we need to be very we need to be a little bit more clear with the community about our role. They elected us to make decisions and sometimes we are going to make decisions that are unpopular but may not require community input. Sometimes like Val said, we're private to information and use that information to make decisions as a governance team. And if we ask for community input all the time, it gives the illusion that the whole community is in the room with us and sometimes they're not. So,

231I think we need to be clear when we're asking for input because your input is going to guide us or we're asking for your input um or we're sending something out there just to FYI you. I think we can be a little bit >> I feel like we're kind of talking about again like two different arenas here. So, I hear you right. There are just things that unfortunately you know someone may not be satisfied but hypothetically right you know we got to do X and X program just isn't getting the return on the investment and my heart goes out to you because you love the sewing class right I hope we don't have a sewing class but here you know it specifically talks about a culture in which ideas are sought valued again I feel

232like we have created a process for people to share. So maybe that's the thought part but I don't know how >> we're taking it in like in yeah I mean when we have those surveys and feedback does it do we get all of that information as board members because I think the question becomes then why are we doing it so if the starting point is sorry you know we're doing this anyway then because as someone who has attended many board meetings and I think James you were on the board when I emailed the board during co There's nothing more defeating than I took the time. I took the time to read this stuff. I took the time out of my day to come and a thank you. And then the other part is if we're

233not synthesizing it, how do we know that we're not overlooking something good? Like we had a lot of good people in the community that helped us or at least in me think about questions and things regarding the K through2 process, learning a lot more about the school. So, I understand the people that might be complaining or unhappy. And >> I think it depends on what it is. I think there, like I said, there's some decisions we're going to make and they're not going to be popular, but the decision is going to be what it's going to be. And then if we're then maybe we put out FAQs or FYI, like here's, you know, I know we've gotten a lot of emails, but this is the way that it's going to be. And then maybe sometimes

234we're putting out surveys because really, like I think changing public comment, that was a good example. We put out some we truly were like we could go either way about this. We put out some surveys. We got some feedback and then ultimately we made a decision. But I think we need to be a little bit more clear about where I truly struggle is that there are a lot of people in this community and we hear from a fraction a fraction of the time. >> I I think it's extraordinarily important to not be misled by the phrase sought, valued or heard. That does not ever mean followed. Like I can value someone's input. I can hear their input and decide to not follow that input and I have still valued it. I have still heard it.

235I am making a decision that I am imbued with to to do the thing that I think is correct that might be different from what that individual thinks. So that sought value to heard does not mean followed. And that that's a really kind of critical component that I think you're starting to get to when you say we hear from a relatively active but small group of people. Our job is to make the decisions that are best for the children in this community. Synthesizing everything we're hearing. You can value someone's input and you can hear it and still make a different decision and that does not mean that it's not valued or heard even if the person might be mad at us about it. Our job is to make the decision that's right for the kids

236anyway. >> But I think like when I read this, it talks about advocating for effective collaboration and engagement of internal and external stakeholders. If we feel like we're not getting representative input, then what are we doing about it? because I feel like we spent a lot of time talking about how well whoever's, you know, communicating with us. That's not the majority and we're going to make a decision. Well, then let's move this into an arena where we actually do describe what collaboration we're looking for because I'm hearing from decision making. I'm doing it. So then >> yeah, I am not outsourcing my decision- making to the community. Not at all. >> I know that I am more informed when I learn from people. And right now I just don't know what that process is. >>

237What do you What do you mean? No, no, no. But you're more informed. >> Yeah. When I learn >> as am I. >> That that is a tautology. >> We are more informed when we hear from people. >> Okay. So then why are we doing when we have a community meeting? >> Yeah. We five sit there >> and then it ends and then I guess each of us kind of qualitatively or subjectively synthesizes whatever we heard and then we follow the process of either calling Carmen to let her know we want to do this putting this can't be that difficult. the city does such a good job of community engagement and so I just I'm not comfortable with the idea that well the people that are coming are complaining and that's a small group >>

238and so if we're rec well I hear that I >> I mean what I I'm hearing too and this you know because I haven't been here a long time and I just have observed the K to2 process and you know get going to effective collaboration we heard a lot of really cool ideas actually from the community right about uh maybe adding prek or doing >> tuition programs. >> Yes, exactly. A lot of great ideas. So that >> all of those kind I'm speaking effective collaboration. So I mean I think it kind of goes into the committee work that we are still fleshing out right how do we maybe form a committee or have a standing committee advisory committee on these really important enrollment or utilization you know studies or issues that we're going to have

239and because we have a lot of really educated smart people with great ideas so if they you know can help us guide us right through these processes because I think you're right like when you look at the city of Decar the commission they have a lot of standing committees and ways to engage with the care 101 or all these things and I think we can do that too, you know, to help maybe positive because I hear what you're saying in terms of like you don't want to give source, but I think there are a lot of really good voices too and ideas that we have in the community that we can harness, right? >> Yeah. And I and I think to say that you're more likely to hear from someone when they're angry is >>

240no. And I think to say that hearing from someone is valueless unless there's like a meeting the next day to address it is also, you know, like you hear like you collect ideas, we communicate with people, you know, like I hear from public comment and then I talk to some friends and I I walk to school. I mean, we all do this and you but you're also looking at data and all of that comes together to create an informed board member, decision maker that's doing their job is where man to call feedback value list is cra I loved the when we sat down with Jarvis and we're like these are the things that I want to hear that I want answers to data wise before we make a decision from a school >> just community

241imp I'm not I'm not arro I am not arrogant to say that like I'm the one who came up with those ideas but I I had a list of things that I had heard that I was written down right so it seems like it is very much happen this is an area that needs improvement I'm not hearing anyone push back on that. I mean, there were a couple of votes against it, but the majority seems to support it, I think. >> But the the reason the city does a good job is because they have these listening sessions and then you hear those listening sessions reflected in their agenda as commissioners, but that's also happening regularly for the school board and the schoolboard agenda as well. So, I I I hesitate to to say that >>

242per se, like standing >> Well, yeah, there's a there's a different I mean, cities are encouraged to create committees. school boards are not encouraged to create committees, >> but I think harnessing, right, not just, you know, I'm a mediator, too, and I deal with a lot of angry parents and so I think it's getting them to focus and harness their frustrations into something to see how it can be productive, right? And asking them, okay, what are your goals? So, you know, when we have these committees or um informational sessions, it's trying to focus the okay, what's it's easy to complain, but it's hard to solve a problem and figure out the next steps. And so, I think that, you know, we can do that better. Um, and we've been talking about it with the K2

243informing committees or standing committees or, you know, cater parents. Well, so what is it that we like again to your point James, the majority of us said this needs improvement and yet we know that we have or am I wrong multiple mechanisms right now for the community for stakeholders although I >> then what is it that we think we need >> I think we need to >> what exactly do We have got something that we're going to work on. So I can tell you here wouldn't you feel like the problem I mean I definitely think the SLT or committee model would definitely be effective because it also solves the problem of like if it's a community member who's not just like angry in one moment but is working in partnership for a long period of

244time. They're not just um you know giving they're not just venting but they're also more familiar with the processes. Like I'm sure the SLP leaders since they're consuming all these presentations and stuff are just well way more wellversed in like the process of the district. So that would definitely solve one problem. But I also think to Miss Sanders like there is a part of the the herd part that is just even if it's not acting just like repeating it back to um like to the populace. I don't know if that could look like I don't know if you're asking for maybe like a report out. I also wonder if maybe just sometimes it was like discussion of like board members um you know after um Dr. and gives her a chair comment. She always asks,

245you know, if the other members have any discussion and that at that point, any of you, which I think is the norm in some other districts, any of you could say like, "Oh, this is what I've heard. These are my feelings." Like >> um we often don't do that, but other boards definitely do. And I think that could be a great um point of that. But I definitely think looking at, you know, we don't hear a lot about what the SLTs are thinking in like um an official report out. I think just that that work is already happening but just making it more regularly a part of discussion >> I guess policy button does have a board committees policy how does that work um they have different committees and better I didn't hear the first

246part of >> Fton has a board committees policy because I was looking up different governance like policies but I feel like right Now we at least have a starting point with the SLTs in the we're charter leaders. >> So SLT have a job with the principal >> that is similar to our job where they're empowered on how the budget is spent feedback. >> Sure. >> personnel issues and hiring >> at the school level. Mhm. >> The SCT is from >> So the SC >> the existed in the charter to make sure that there was equity of information and budgeting between the schools without >> okay >> without third party feedback. So when I first sat in as the SCT chair in 2017, it was a meeting where it was like making sure that Oakhurst and

247Glenwood had similar resources and similar questions and were there any themes that they were seeing in hiring and stuff like that. It wasn't like a board policy. That doesn't mean it can't be because most people who serve on the SLT do raise questions. They're like, I want to be >> I don't I don't know that I I I I think that there is there is something to better leveraging SCT specifically, not necessarily SLT. I don't know that it relates solely to policy because I do think we've that that's pretty much within our wheelhouse. But I think that there is something to using them as a sounding board on like that's just a broader array of what the community they they have a perspective there as well that they can feed up to us. we can

248feed to them same information, right? I mean, so I think there is a value to being able to use them a little bit more broadly than just that specifics of the charter, but I don't necessarily have the answer right now, right? Like I think this is maybe something that we need to think about. I also Carmen that first sentence I think you mean to say engage community members who are not only interested in issues but problem solving. Um, but >> maybe more effectively using the SCT to get feedback and ask, you know, question. >> May maybe we take maybe we take this question of committees to the SCT like I'd be curious what purpose. >> I don't know. I feel like on the complete opposite end of the spectrum, I feel like all feedback is

249not good feedback. You know, you need feedback at points. You need it in particular doses. you don't like a barrage of feedback is like cats in a bag. Like you don't know what to do with it. You don't know how to utilize it. And I feel like that's when people feel like they're unheard, you know, because they don't know where they are in the lineup. They don't know, you know, how you cannot respond effectively. So I feel like, you know, rather than saying we need more feedback, maybe we need to narrow the scope, the timing. So I think yeah it may not necessarily get more feedback but figuring out what are we looking for and when do we and when do we want it um and then who ultimately is going to be responsible for

250synthesizing and collating that feedback because ultimately it doesn't all come to the board. Um you know we can ask to um to see it but ultimately somebody has to be responsible for the implementation. Um, but if we're just asking to hear from every single community member, I feel like that's when they end up feeling >> Yeah, that's where we end up problematic. I agree. >> So, this semester, I will meet with SCOT. I met with them January 21st. I'll meet with them March 18th. I'll meet with them April 29th. That's three times this semester. I I provide their their agenda dependent upon if they are right before a board meeting. I can preview what I can preview but I'm never going to give the community before I give it to you. >> Yeah, understood. >>

251Unless like it is the creation of the SLT policy that we they created the policy. So I say that to say it's not like I don't get feedback on things as they are timely, but know that they it's not like I'm meeting with the SD 2 days after the board meeting, but I do meet with all administrators the next day after the board meeting to ensure that policy you've passed is then trained upon. And so I just want to we can leverage it. I definitely want to, but I just want you to know that it's not like I meet with them every single month like staff. I think I also we may also have to decide as a board what feedback we need to see versus what we're okay with the cabinet and other people

252synthesizing. Um, so you know, do we need to see every single month the budget feedback? Are we okay with Lonita like high level, you know, triaging those things? Um, you know, not I don't know. I think sometimes it's my that to me feels unclear um because we're saying we want feedback, feedback, feedback, but then we're not clear about where it's going, who it's going to, and then ultimately when it has to rise to our level. But we have to be clear as a board as to what we want to see, how often and then the structure of it because then ultimately has to be in line with you know our goals as a >> the goal is to capture like the working committee spirit of the utilization study and then also like I had even

253mentioned like Mr. Adams works with the sustainability board and we don't directly hear about it but it definitely informs his work. Like I think we're looking for prescribed um working committees that like pursue topics of interest and then report back to us like on our >> and I think like the budget thing comes up in a different standard because I did comment on that. So I I think I'm back also to well one this tool identifies input sometimes and then feedback. And so I'll explain that when we get to that one because I looked it up. I'm like they're not being pological here. There's a three-step process. But this particular standard is in ensuring effective communication and engagement of all stakeholders to support the strategic plan desired culture and continuous improvement. And I think it's

254the culture component that maybe I'm responding mostly to here. Our decisionmaking authority. Yeah. Often I mean I love the policy review because I get to see before I vote on a policy what people had to say. >> Let me ask a question. Do you guys think I mean the strategic plan says what the four pillars are that are most important to us? >> Five. >> Sorry. five pills that are most important. What wouldn't I mean, wouldn't a starting point be a >> four pillars? Five. >> There's four pillars in the right. Um, >> we're having to create a pillar for you. No, no, no, no. So, sorry. All jokes aside, like like wouldn't it be interesting for there to be a community-based committee for each of the one for each of those pillars? And we

255would conver them the things that we need have questions about like here's a specific topic that we would like a little bit more perspective on or here is the specific reason we're making this decision. Even though there are people that are angry about it, it goes through this group. It like it would give the community an avenue to access us, us an avenue to access the community, but with committee that is structured to bring down the the vitriol a little bit. >> Just thinking out loud too, maybe we don't need four committees because that's a lot. >> Well, I mean the city has the city has like 12, right? >> Especially when we have important topics. >> Seems like an as needed. >> Yeah. And so that we can harness them not to just be

256venting but to help them problem solve right and come up with ideas to help us right because they're on the ground you know that's >> I the reason why I think it is for is because there are a series of topic I mean like so let's take literacy and let's take all of the things that we've done to improve student outcomes right that's one of our core pillars and we actually struggle a little bit to get that message into the community about just how successful we've been on that front. Like it's been dramatic the shift and and some of the mom I say moms but but there was a mom group that was very that was Yeah. And so they actually have some insight into some of the changes that have happened and the benefits.

257They also have perspectives on things we need to continue to improve, but because we aren't still having a dyslexia task force, there isn't a great way for that. >> And so, if there is a student outcomes committee that we can go to periodically and say, "Hey, look at all this incredible data and look at everything that we've done." Like, >> absorb this sort of like the next main thing is that you think do you see what I'm saying? I mean, I do think that there ways. >> I do think there's a two-way communication that is aligned to the strategic plan that gives the community access, not just on any topic, but specifically related to the strategic plan. I I I don't know. I this is a lot to put into the put into this document.

258>> We need to flush it out. >> I just think that there is some conversations that we can have. I do think the way the city model works works pretty well for the topics that are necessary. I I just think there's some value in in thinking through how we might do that. >> Yeah. maybe like a board advisory committee and like you said we can keep them apprised of topics and then ask them for feedback. I I think starting where Carmen mentioned, what is it that we want to know and what is it that we want to convey? And that might guide us a little bit on what a communication and engagement of all stakeholders which support strategic plan, desired culture and continuous improvement of the school system. law. >> So, I went to GSBA's

259website because I know we've talked about community engagement and I copied what they said, facilitating active participation, parents, teachers, and community members. Um, so one of the issues I saw in this one was just do we have a clear identification of who all our stakeholders are? And this kind of indirectly I think answers in terms of hey if we're just getting a small group here. Um, so the first thing I took note of is the term stakeholder and that so I asked about that and then I wondered how when possible right um these stakeholders have an opportunity to be included in an informed decision not just provide feedback and I think it's the third standard where I noticed it says input review and feedback maybe it was for the board for the budget so that's

260why I keep harping on that because input I think is more in the decision making phase doesn't mean we are going to use each person's suggestion but to me the biggest need for improvement is who exactly are our stakeholders because they're not called constituents here and it's not called communities I feel like that could be part of a conversation about I think students or >> in some cas I mean I think yeah kind of yeah >> um I I do think I can't quite remember but I do think that there that last comment if that's not my comments I just agree with it completely that there is a there's a PR element of this of of getting the message out and getting the message out in a way that the public can absorb and hear

261this isn't necessar necessarily about communicating in a way that people can hear and I don't know that we do that great and I think that is precisely what a PR team >> I absolutely agree because I don't one of the things that we talk about in organizing is like the worship of the written word um and you know not everyone's like reading their emails or reading every communication some of that is like word of mouth and face to face and again like committees like just making sure that more people are in the know and and that's not just happening. >> Gen Z doesn't actually read. >> I think the other thing too that um using the PR team and stakeholders well is to um emphasize what the school system is doing well. I think you

262can count on media to emphasize clearly and well lot of successes out there and they should get equally as much >> um air time. Um so that's also something um that you use stakeholders for. You have to give them um you have to give them some tools. You have to give them some >> if you give them something to go out there with. If they don't >> give them that, then you know that's sometimes all people know is what they >> Sorry, I'd also comment about the student board member and I know we discussed like how are we keeping in the loop? Um I I don't really believe in like a systemic way of doing that or a norm just because I think I wouldn't want to create work for staff to have to like

263read through emails and synthesize them. But um I would like to encourage like you know there's been many a meeting where I've walked in like completely having no idea what was going on or what the community had in mind. So if anyone like felt it in their personal like their personal prerogative like at their own discretion to just like be like hey board member team board member this is what's going on. Actually, this is a really let me let me raise this as a question because I've actually asked this a couple of times and I am I am very aware and sensitive to the fact that there does have to be right like we we do have to follow the processes, but I I do think our processes for how we communicate with our student

264board reps makes it actually fairly difficult for us to communicate with our student board reps. And I would like us to revisit how can we how can we put together protocols that respect the the you know whatever the associated safety and and various concerns that exist. How can we mitigate that and still make it possible for me to have a conversation with Nia about heys up this is the kind of thing that we've been hearing coming along right like I you know I don't like the the only thing that I think you've landed on because I get the ad hoc me picking up a phone and calling Nia maybe that's not going to be okay but then the only alternative is that we have to go through Amanda and have a a class session I

265just I feel like we we can figure out a way to streamline I think we need to figure out a way to streamline this not just for you but for Zoe for all the the board reps that are coming in the future. >> That question I mean and maybe this is an illogical comparison but I'm thinking like when I advised our newspaper students are contacting other faculty members and community members sometimes but I would be CC. So is it not something as simple like I know we've talked about this before but to your point Hans then if I you anyone wants to you know give Nia a heads up or you're asking as long as Amanda is CC what's the problem with that >> that's within the norms of our >> right but I think

266the norms had the whole board >> well that should probably >> yeah but that then that that starts to complicate and bog down the like like you know let me say it this way. We don't communicate to each other like that, right? And so, like, we're adding a level of we're adding several layers of bureaucratic burden to be able to communicate with NIA in a way that we don't do with each other. And I recognize that there are some >> long as Amanda is CC, then aren't we? >> But like if I pick like but you can't pick up a phone and call like I guess we can do a three-way telephone. >> I don't know if you know what I mean, but An an email with Amanda copy is fine. Okay. I do three

267ways phone calls. >> All right. >> I mean it >> I'm better on a phone than a email >> unless you want a 42. >> Anyone have an Android? >> Get one from >> Anyone on the board have an Android? >> No. >> You just call add person. >> Just add a person and have but you need to make sure that person is home. If you enjoy Crime and Punishment, have an email exchange with Lorine. >> Oh, come on. Huh? >> I mean, I would love I like those guys. >> No, no, that's >> We're leaving it up to >> You can call me text me up. Like I'm just wondering what the >> likeities that develop, communicate and maintain which result in resolution of issues and concerns supporting the strategic plan, desire cultures, and

268continuous improvement. >> I don't know how I'm always first in these comments, but >> it's just chronological. So you submitted any >> that's it. Well, so CFC resolve is great, but I wonder the analyzing part is something I'm not aware of. Right. So when I and ESD resolve seems like a good way to address issues or concerns, but I'm not sure of the analysis process. Um, I brought up SLTS again there. Um, yeah. I'm just going to keep saying the CLC because I think it would be great if we could get people in a good place. It's a I don't know how we analyze how we addressed anything. quite frankly we do a good job of like measuring student outcomes on uh so on an annual basis you do get the data for resolve CSD

269it's not something that we provide data on monthly what have But I I will be honest with all CSC is only one component. Most people if they want to they send an email >> for you. >> What? >> Very few people I'm gonna be honest. Very few people email me. >> Yeah. The board. >> They email the board. Very few people email me. do because because most times when people are emailing me, they're emailing me about a student matter and it's not governance related. It is how do you address the needs of students? They're not emailing me about that. >> So with with so I actually think there would be some benefit to having some sort of uh visibility into this is the number of emails on this topic. This is the general, you know,

270c customer sentiment analysis on that. I also know that's an enormous amount of work to put on any one person. And so this may be more for Eston, but I know there are great AI tools precisely for this thing out there now, right? That that can just sit and count how much is coming across, synthesize and no >> I I would be interested in looking into some kind of tool or something that could and maybe along with the annual resolve CSD a here's the heat map of the five topics that the community was most active about and the bulk of the comments on topic one related to this the bulk of the comments on topic two related to this blah blah blah something that something that can I am very very specifically not suggest- suggesting

271that this become a human task, right? Because that's a lot of work. But I I do think that we actually live in an environment now where there are very effective tools that could do. >> I mean, I will say our survey results around the calendar, >> we help because that is large amount of information that we get. AI does help with that analysis versus >> back in the day, you know. >> Yeah. You know, I know some some poor >> some poor schmuck. >> Yeah, that poor schmuck is over there. Raise her hands. Look at her. >> I love it. >> Remember that first Remember that first analysis we did in this room in August the 23? We had to scan every student. Um >> I just said that um I've really loved all the

272work that s technology has been doing to gather data and make that public on the website. I think we should update there anything I'm not sure if I understand exactly what I'm >> Well, so this is this is a way >> here's the actual two-way communication with stakeholders um management of communications with the governance team accountability and collaborative action in support of the strategic plan. Um working with the superintendent establishes a process for monitoring and reporting the school systems performance. That last one is what I'm really addressing, right? Because resolve CSD to Dr. Whitaker's point is is really a very small slice of the stuff that the community read. And I'm talking about trying tool resolve not use resolve trying to >> illuminate analyze and illuminate what common things that can be found other forms

273of communication. Is that the process though? Because number three, and that's why I focused on resolve CSD, not because I necessarily think it is or isn't doing anything, but I couldn't identify any other process for monitoring and reporting the school systems performance in analyzing, addressing, and resolving. >> So, we get emails and you might reply to them, but I didn't know any process that was there besides resolving. I think >> that's why we created resolve. Yeah, I think >> I think a tool is step one so that we actually can >> get a picture of what it is >> and then I think step two is what have we done to address and maybe that's what we figure out. Step one is let's get visibility on to what's happen. Are we going to be able

274to like later if we I think you said earlier Hans like hey I need to think about this one but like are we going to be able to follow up with some of this if we think of an idea or how well I do want to >> secretary secretary >> so yes two things one and we'll name all the needs improvement standards um one is from domain one governance structure two is from strategic planning um and understanding uh standard A on the uh strategic plan for domain three you have standard A, standard B and standard C. In the past, you only had standard C. So we've added additional and we haven't hit policy development. So your your action plan so just so you know from what you said are your needs improvement standards you need

275targeted interventions to address >> to use you know true education language >> uh when creating your action plan we talk through board retreats We talk through community meetings and we talk through pre-work sessions on board days. Those are all of your times when you're engaging. You will probably mod if you need improvement on almost every standard. I'm just letting you know where you where you're landing. >> Policy development uh leadership team promotes policy development aligned with the system strategic plan. Um these are the guidelines here. This looks like everybody put satisfactory. So here um oh that's I mean I do think com is probably what we have the most issues. board meetings. Board announces and holds meetings in accordance with law um by satisfactory one needs improvement. One thing I wondered was I didn't give

276it a needs improvement but unaware I don't know what the procedure is for the public to provide information ideas or input on agenda items besides email us speak at public comment and say put this on the agenda next week. >> My thought would be to contact your board member. So that's the procedure. We're telling the public like because it it felt to me like it should be written somewhere if it's written here. Typically a procedure is like an actionable thing, right? Like what are the procedures to take a pendant, you pull up infinite campus under the student's name. So in this case, do we have anything written anywhere that tells people because it's in the standard here um how the public gets to put input on an agenda item. So I I will say that

277annually the board approves board member wants to add something in addition to that there is a process in the communication norms for how you would go about adding to something on the agenda that's not already in the BMA and then I mean constituents you just we just put in there about constituents and when they have questions and concerns talking to you and then you relating it. >> I I think where I'm struggling is, you know, we talk a lot about the line between governance and operations, right? Earlier when we talked about K through2, we were very clear. There wasn't a vote. It was a discussion. And then when we move to these standards that have pretty objectively identified language, we're kind of like, well, someone could just email. >> But I don't hear where it

278says about public adjusted environment. It says procedure through which the public D can provide information, ideas or input on agenda items. So I wonder >> you have a link that says if you have information on an agenda item >> so that's our procedure. >> Yeah, we created that this year >> the public comment information. >> Okay, >> that's when the agenda is published. There's a way for them to not know that. But I think you're saying if they want to add let's talk about >> um food and we want to add that to the board agenda they need to go through their board >> go to the board me do we have that written somewhere >> in the common norms isn't it like a board member can add something with >> I'm just thinking like

279on our website we talk about public comment what can we just make it easier for people to understand how to do it that's all Don't we have a like a page long detail? I thought this board >> out within the last year about >> very very specific. We don't actually say anywhere in this that the public can request agenda items. All they can do is provide input, information or ideas on existing agenda items. >> Okay. >> Right. So, >> and that link that is the procedure is the link that is somewhere on the website >> and then and then an unwritten if you will procedure. I mean, I think that we're sort of all recognizing that if if a public if a member of the public came to one of us and said, "Hey, I

280I wish you guys would do this as an agenda item and you really think that's a good idea." Then, yeah, bring it to the bus. Okay. Does personnel board of education employ the superintendent who acts as the executive officer of the school system? >> Oh no. >> That was me. It's just because I'm not part of that. >> Okay. Everybody else said satisfactory. Can I just specify there because I'm sorry I just read it the way it's written that professional development plan is not a requirement even though it says annual right that's contingent on the evaluation which >> I'm about to send you guys something >> okay what >> well it's just weird because you when I think of a PDP right professional development plan I know what that is you know that's caused typically

281by something. But the way it was written here with evidence, it seemed to be that there should be a professional development plan and I thought there wouldn't be unless there was something in the evaluation kind of like you were citing for us board members now probably having to do additional >> I I think I read that I I hear what you're saying Tracy but or I'm sorry board understand I'm I'm reading that as in the event it's needed. >> That's what I thought. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What's the number? >> It's it's two. So, we set performative expectations adopting the plan, adopting of the job description and adoption of the professional development plan. >> Yeah. Yeah, that is implied. >> So when I go to all the when I go to

282training to find out about the laws that we're going to that are now going to be state law is so that I can do my job effectively and and that that's there because some systems would say well you know get it all on a webinar but you know that's why that's there. The only thing I didn't understand was number six. No, that was a question, not a statement of me. >> Um, it's because I would >> it's about hiring. It's the board's ethics of if I was going to hire your one of your children or your >> We have all of those. >> Yeah, we we have a policy around hiring. >> Yeah, but none of us can have spouses or family members work in CS, right? >> Oh, okay. Like and so that's why

283it ties into ethics like conflict of interest. All right. So that's satisfactory. All right. Oh, there's a B. Evaluate the professional performance of the superintendent. Three satisfactory. Two that don't know. >> We already discussed my I think we answered to my input and I didn't do a >> I'm new so I didn't know >> over there. >> Your yours was related. Okay. So to earlier. Okay. So, I think this is >> right. >> So, we haven't had another improvement. >> No. >> Wow. >> That was satisfactory. >> Make Yeah, I was just making sure because Okay, here we go. Personnel policy. Um, personnel policies that are in line with the STRA plan and organizational effectiveness. Um, okay. Board members do not engage in the implementation of personnel policy, including employment assignment or step to accept

284or reject recommendations. >> Um, >> and that's why that five once again goes to domain a ethics. >> Hold the superintendent accountable for all personnel in the system that are evaluated in accordance with um but then is five. So five isn't just about us board members. >> It is >> well we have a personnel polic ethics in general the domain >> the only other thing I put here and this is again was a question not anything that I thought we needed to change was I just needed clarification on evaluations. We assume that they're done. We don't we cannot see them but it says here that we hold you accountable for assuring that personnel are evaluated. So does that just mean that I have to tell us that they're done >> who the charter >> and

285typically to be honest >> you would know it's things >> so if evaluations aren't and this is I'm going be honest something that I walked into coming new to the district there were some period of times when evaluations weren't necessarily done with fidelity And so I can imagine what that's like, but I will say I have a current monitor because is when it then came to you on a dismissal or what have you that we weren't able to substantiate things. That's what I've had to work through. Um, but I can always just make sure you know that it it's been done by industry according to dates >> what I was putting about the charter hunt and I think I confirmed it just >> yeah go on >> just SLTs right technically get some kind of

286say in the hiring of a principal >> there is a process by which now they don't hire them but they're a part of the process. >> Yeah. But the one thing I did wonder and I I have a feeling it's operational, but I'll ask. So, I was looking back over our charter things that talked about is expanding. Anyway, I could come back to it and how that links then possibly to fine. I may have missed something. >> All right. Uh All right. to finance upon recommendation of the superintendent adopt the budget that aderes to state okay >> satisfactory one person doesn't know people need so what I said here is that we get feedback but I don't see the process for input if those are meant to be separate actions because I think it's detailed

287it's input review and feedback um and so I also wondered then if our board priorities that are decided on in November largely before lots of budget stuff is out there actually negates um any input and then I looked at our budget feedback form and it really conflates input and feedback. So I'm still going to recommend that when we are doing budget stuff, we have something that effectively says this is our strategic accelerator. This is what we're looking at doing and then we're getting input because input should be like about 30% according to one definition. Feedback just seems reactionary. So that's my my I think that budget feedback thing is all wrong. Like I I think it's a lot of I don't know if I don't know if any comment we've gotten has changed anything directly.

288Um I think we do hear a lot of thoughts and mullings about how people feel about the process. Like I said, I think you maybe we need to figure out exactly what we want feedback on and at what points in time and exactly how it would be helpful for the finance team and then exactly what we want to hear out of the process. But right now, it seems like, you know, sometimes we get nothing and then sometimes we get a hundred comments and then I I personally am sometimes confused about what we're doing with them. Um, you know, sometimes we'll get a lot of ECLC comments, sometimes get a lot of teacher salary comments. Um, and um, I think people are confused about what we're doing with them. Um, so I think it the whole

289like process needs to be revised. I think it would be helpful if we had a description of what the input is and then because I agree I think one of the reasons that it's that way is because by the time we're getting feedback the decisions have largely been made and so I still don't know how we're using input here and again I just keep deferring to the language of the document. >> What do you what do you mean you don't know how so this just says seek input right? Well, so go if you go back up to the standard. >> Yeah, the governance lead but on the screen I can't see it. >> I'm sorry. Sorry. >> So, >> number three, correct? >> Okay. Is it number three? Um, yes. Input review and feedback. Not

290input review or feedback. And again, I'm not trying to be pedantic. I'm just asking what's the input process that's different from the feedback process. And then because I was curious because I thought initially I can't describe it and that's always a problem for me if I'm you know in any capacity. And then I Googled it because I was like well how are organizations or entities discussing input different from feedback. Input is treated more in the planning phase. I think some identified it as 30%. So one of the things in the revision of the fe called the feedback been named I'm going start that always been there it was here when I started like I didn't create it but what we have said is now this is what is coming up we would like your input

291because it's beforehand. >> This has been done. So now give us your feedback. You get to select. Are you going to tell us about it on the front end which is what to me is definitely so you can't create priorities at the end. Priorities must come first and that is guidance that has to come from the board so that the administration can do the work. I think the thing that I wondered about in the priorities is that sometimes it appears to be a more kind of global description of something we're trying to achieve and then other times it's very specific to like an elimination of a position which I guess goes back to your point at this time. Sorry, this is just the way it's going to be. Um but either way I feel like

292the priorities negated in >> we did yeah we do the budget priorities in November and I think for the last two November >> when we have them listed or we're discussing preliminary but last year I think we eliminated K through2 assisted this year the school a lotment guideline that's not the priority >> okay so then the budget priorities are shared during the same meeting that The sag is >> the budget priorities are what you what we give you a initial draft of >> during the board retreat, right? >> Okay. I don't know what I'm just >> You get No, you get the stag in the board retreat. >> You have to clarify the priority first so that we know what to do. >> Do we give a I mean un I'm sorry. I know we're

293having a long meeting, but I feel like what I remember is I know sex, but then we talk and we because we had that screen this time, right? We looked at um I think maximizing QBE >> and then it was like, hey, this is the priorities I hear and then we come to the December meeting. So, but the do kind of start in a draft form during the fourth. >> No, they start in a draft form before then. Okay. you don't see the draft of the of the new stag until the retreat. >> I don't know. I think maybe with all feedback with the budget especially and I don't know I I do this when I'm solving problems at my primary job. I think the more narrow and specific you can be the better off

294you are. You know figure out what the problem is that you want to solve and then who you want to give it to and then craft your questions that way. So maybe we could think about, you know, if really some of the budget areas we want to massage are, you know, eliminating wasteful positions. So maybe we, you know, craft a quick survey and then we send it out to, you know, stakeholders, but maybe the stakeholders are them. Maybe it's them we're surveying. you know, it the stakeholders may not be the broad populace, you know, but I think we need to really figure out, you know, how we're seeking community, how we're seeking stakeholder feedback, really narrow it down, craft the question, and then figure out who's going to be responsible for the feedback that we

295get because right now, I feel like we get it and it's like all up in the air. And I think that also contributes to people feeling unheard because nobody's taking responsibility for feedback that we get. >> I got maybe 10 more minutes. Yeah, I've got a big baby. >> All right, that's satisfactory. This one is adopt policy for sound fiscal management and monitors the implementation of budget. Everybody look satisfactory for that. Right. >> What does that satisfactory All right. Adopt the policy for school safety plan. Five satisfaction. Oh, I just want to Okay, so I put in something that was more trucks, which is definely an overstep into operations. I just which I've since learned. Um I've just been worried about um you know, safety is a really big priority for me. like how are

296we thinking about it in a way that doesn't you know contribute to the school to prison pipeline and disproportionately harm students. Um and one of the things I've been concerned about is you know how are we like um education technology specifically around safety is so unregulated and a lot of the statistics are based on like prevention which of course is not really an accurate like something that you can count aside from maybe like how many how many things you've detected but like you know there's even prevention of like if you have a metal detector like how many you know what what is happening in the mind of a student you don't know so I've just been concerned about that But definitely a general point and not something the board something you want me to put

297here. >> Yeah, I I feel like please take into consideration is good, but you know, choosing um yeah, cons continuing to be careful about who we're partnering with and what we're curing. >> I'll be interested to see what happened. in the House floor today. >> Oh, but then it'll be legislated, right? We won't even get to the side and it goes all the way down. >> But they don't sell the T, do they? They just sell the >> Well, it's like Centiggics is an example. I mean, I I think we're happy with the program, but that's mandated, >> right? Superintendent accountable for school safety training satisfactory. You okay with that policy for the mental health of students and staff. >> So I I implementing assessment addresses mental health needs of staff and students through strategic

298Now, this is interesting because I gave this satisfactory, but now that I'm reading what y'all are saying, I am thinking >> I I put satisfactory. I think that those are good points. I think that those are very much principal level, school level points. I think the superintendent, we've gotten reports on on all of these policies. That second bullet point really is transitioning between schools and and the the recognition that we >> have I can't I can't speak firmly as to where things are today, but we certainly have been uh have had room to improve between what we do at an elementary versus what happens at a a at the middle school. And and there are multiple parents that have been unhappy with that particular transition and and the services they received through that transition. Not

299necessarily because they received the wrong services, but because the manner in which the changes were communicated alienated them. I think that there is uh some improvement we can do there. Um so that so that the >> remember you just approved the addition of FT. >> Yep. >> What about though the now that I'm reading it also though the mental health needs of staff. So, I'm hearing a lot about students sense um >> the the EAT information, the HR's recharge information and submit all of that we kind of talked about. >> So, are we giving this a satisfactory? >> Yeah. >> Are there any comments I should put here? >> I I think it could be improvement, but obviously I go with the board. I think the comments that we're we're concerned on the implementation of

300some of the services that happen aware of that and it's KPIs for both and superintendent moving forward >> particularly in that elementary to middle transition and I and I and I agree like that's exactly what we hired. >> Yeah. I mean that's why you the so I mean We had a conversation once about how maybe in a school you worked in or like a peer um they like went through and had a student put a sticky note on like an adult that was like the trusted adult and then the teachers in like five students that they knew were um like their trusted students and I thought that was >> and that's you know not to call out Francis but specifically reports on that twice a year to the board. Like it's it's literally Yeah. >>

301KPI. It's there. >> Okay. Adopt the budget with funding for school safety. Is that satisfactory? >> Yeah. The only thing I wondered for the effectiveness I love that kind of return on investment presentation with technology and so >> can you scroll up to I realize this is a new thing. It's a new standard. Now the state might be mandating. >> Part of it is that we're executing what the state has forced us to execute. So it's more like we're the metrics are are we doing what the state said we need to do. >> But you have to realize some of the things that we started was before the state. >> No, no, no. I get Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. It it is the risk assessment of me walking in and it without a formal document

302but walking the building of the KO there were safety alarms going off like this in my head. >> I mean and that's just because we we just lack the systems the processing and the people all three. I I think this is set that marked the end. >> The end of our day. >> I know. I know. I can't leave. All right. Thank you board for your participation. Thank you for attending the board retreat. Our next board of education meeting will take place as scheduled on March 10th, 2026 at the Wilson Center. There being no further business, this meeting is adjourned at 5:11