May 4, 2026, Governing Board Study Session

001Thank you so much. All right, we wenardes. Good afternoon to everybody here here tonight. It is 4:01 p.m. and we're going to go ahead and get started with our board study session. I'm going to go ahead and do a roll call. We do have Cororum, Miss Erys is present, myself, and we have Miss Gibson McClean online. Um and just to give us a little bit a background, the framework for student outcomes focused governance is built around six research informed competencies that describe schoolboard behaviors and the degree to which which they create the conditions for improvements in student outcomes, vision and goals, values and guardrails, monitoring and accountability, communication and collaboration, unity and trust, and continuous improvement. And with that, um, we're going to be going over some different things. We're going to go ahead and

002get started with our item B, which is evaluating board time. And I will hand it over to Dr. Ramos to go ahead and get us started. >> All right. Well, good afternoon everyone. It's good to be back with you again. Um, first want to start with a heck of a lot of kudos of meetings from your workshop in February. Conversations about budgets, conversations about aligning work, uh, conversations about the progress that's been made. We are towards uh what I would say is almost the end of a coaching platform or coaching journey from my end. Excited to revisit the conversation of how to codify your board meetings. um really good and really helpful for the leadership team as well to watch and learn how exactly we have been tracking minutes. Um and we're also going to

003revisit the conversation about submitting smart and strategic questions uh from the board side so that that can help and support the leadership team. I've heard it several times in this boardroom uh particularly from the leadership team from superintendent man uh to the rest of the team that when you as board members ask really good strategic questions your leadership team is going back to meet to talk about what it is that they need to go and find out in regards to inputs and outputs and they will continue to fine-tune that um because that's what we call parallel processing that as goes the we can expect the rest of the system to go with you. So really appreciate your cander as well is when you've done your self-evaluations when you say I have not uh you know

004submitted questions ahead of time like I said that I would uh it's part of the journey and my hope is that you get there sooner rather than later because it's given your leadership team a huge advantage to be able to prepare ahead of time uh especially for the smart strategic questions. And then uh the last piece uh I believe was what's that last item? >> Um today we will be doing the evaluation of bartame the smart strategic questions and the case study on governance. >> That's right. We're going to have a case study we're going to get to review. So let's jump right in unless we have any questions or thoughts before we get going. We're going to start with completing a time use evaluation. >> Okay, perfect. >> Yeah. All right. Does anyone happen

005to have a document in front of them which I know President Cario, you have been reading from it from time to time, the effective gold monitoring document. Do you have that in front of you by any chance? >> Yes. >> Yeah. Um, Miss Huades, I'm not sure if these were emailed to Miss Gibson McClean since she's not present. If if Are we able to email them to her, please? >> Yes, I already >> Okay, awesome. >> Okay, thank you. >> Good. We'll have that one handy. The main one I want you to go to is the one that should be in front of you that I did see up there. It's the completing a board time use evaluation. >> It's the purple one, right? Good deal. So section one which references why school systems and

006school boards exist should be repetition of not only what you've done in the workshops but what you continue to discuss. The second part that talks about how effective school boards govern what we say that is a continued conversation about why we have goals and why we have guardrails. The part that I want us to zero in on is the one that says the currency of life. If I may ask a board member to read that section, the currency of life, what we do, who will read that for us? >> When we see what someone spends their currency on, that provides us with insight into what they most value. Ultimately, there is really one currency, time. Money is simply store time. You exchanged some of your time and got money in its place. You bought an

007apple, but really what you were doing was trading a unit of your time stored as money for a unit of someone else's time. The time they spent picking that apple and bringing it to you. Oh, to market. So, if we want to know what people most value, one means of doing so is to track their universal currency, their use of time. This is as true of school boards as it is of people. thoughts, reflections on this section called the currency of life. What we do >> um what's coming up to me is almost like what you it's not what you say you're doing is but what you're actively doing is more your actions. So that kind of bleedins to that is um is where I'm where I'm going and thinking of this. >> Yeah. And

008with that notion, then we'll go to the second part which says alignment between saying and doing. Can I ask someone else to read that section for us? >> I'll do it. Boards that want to have the strongest impact on improving student outcomes will demonstrate a very strong alignment between the vision and values they speak and the goals and guard rails they act on. The more alignment there is between saying and doing, the more likely it is that the schoolboard's actions will create the context for improvements in student outcomes. The less alignment there is, the more likely it is that the school board's behavior is unintentionally harming the school system's chances of improving student outcomes. Alignment between saying and doing can be measured by comparing how the school board chooses to use the precious time it

009has each month, the time during public meetings of the school board with the board's written vision and values, the goals and guard rails they they've adopted. This benefit of a time use evaluation to reveal the extent to which there's an alignment between what the school board says and what the school board does as a means of helping school boards see a path toward improving student outcomes. what's coming up for you as a team as you read that section. >> So to President Cario's point, right, what we what we say is important, what's just as important is aligning what you say along with what you do. >> And for me, it's that I think historically um in in our district, I've seen that we've worked in silos. And that's not something just here in this district.

010it I think it happens everywhere but I think that stems from the governance board members different paths and them themselves not being aligned onto what truly matters. So I think it sends this whirlwind down the pipeline. So I I think for me this is so important that as the board we have to stay consistent to our commitment into student outcomes and making sure that the majority of our time is so we're not allowing those whirlwinds to consume us. They're going to happen. They're going to be there. But I don't think it's necessarily our job as a board to control those whirlwinds, right? It's really just staying focused and setting the tone of what we really want to achieve. And I believe for I'll speak for myself, it's ultimately that our students have the tools they

011need to continue um succeeding as they pass on every grade. >> Got it. >> I think that I mean you I think this is just like all about um are you like if you're walking and acting in integrity um rather than just than speaking about it. So, um, you know, it's not even cuz you could you could go to this part where it says, you know, the precious time it has each month, the time during the schoolboard meeting, but if you haven't prepared appropriately for the meeting, then you're going to be wasting time, you know, at the school board meeting. Um, so I think it just all goes to like are we all walking in integrity >> and and acting in integrity in the way that we're doing this work together? And one of the

012things, thank you for sharing that Katie and one of the things that comes to me also integrity is reminding people that integrity is the extent of what we've allowed others to expect of us. And that's all it is really. Yeah. So if I tell Miss Shapiro, hey, I'm going to give you this breakdown by 2 p.m. That's nobody else's bad but mine. And walking in integrity in my in my own integrity with honoring that word, right? So it goes back to what Katie said that integrity is very important but integrity in context of this is literally that >> Mr. Man. >> Yeah. Thank you President Curio. I I this has really gotten me thinking because I think about the work we do in the district and um the connection between the governing board, the governing

013board meetings and the you know the day-to-day work. And so, um, one of the things that this has really spurred for me is I I, you know, having been, you know, I've had Miss Miss Shapiro's chair here for almost a decade and then I've been in the superintendency now um for close to three years and working with the executive team in both of those roles. One of the things that I know that happens in an organization is in a board meeting, there's limited ability to have a conversation because you we have open meeting law. you have to be posted to have a conversation about something. And so you rarely get the full spectrum of the board's perspective or opinion on things. And while the board is five individual members, that each member technically doesn't have

014any authority. The board only has authority as a body. Um, it often still leaves the staff wondering like what's the board thinking like because obviously as staff members, as members of the team here, what our goal is is we want to make sure that not only are we creating conditions that um create improved outcomes for our students, but we also are here to serve a community and the board represents that community. So the challenge that I see happen sometimes is when there isn't when there isn't self-discipline around something that's maybe the interest of of one or two board members. Um and those things become these sort of larger conversations that overshadow the amount of time that we're spending on the student outcomes work. It puts it basically creates a dissonance for the staff and a

015lot of time gets spent not only trying to work on those things but also trying to interpret well without a vote on something that gives us clear direction. What is it that we should interpret from the board's conversations and actions that we should do? And so that actually, you know, from my perspective is something that is very detrimental to actually achieving the outcomes focused goals because all of that lost time, those to me, those are really the whirlwinds. They're the places where there's a lack of clarity um in movement and direction that really distract from the core of the work. And there's no time is a limited currency. So there's no way to restore that once it's used in that way. That time has passed and there's no getting it back. Those kids get one

016day older every day. No matter what happens in the system, they get one day older. >> So >> other thoughts, reflections? This is a pretty powerful document for you to keep nearby and I I'll I'll do my best to collect to connect back to what I've observed over the last couple of months. Anyone else? I was just going to say this is a good um tool for analysis on government accountability. Uh was just trying to think of tying it to your governance case study. Like we can say we're the representatives of the community and we, you know, are stewarding this vision that we think the community wants for our schools, but we can say, "Oh, well, we get elected every four years. That's our checks and balances. That's our Um, oh, they're saying, "Yeah, we're

017doing a good job." Or, "No, we're not." But the only other time we can check ourselves is with a tool like this, saying, you know, we're walking what we're what we're talking. So, yeah. Yeah. It's it's it's the importance of why we wanted to help you be able to codify what it is that you're actually spending your time on. Um and and I lessons learned from the national coaching team. I I'll I'll be vulnerable and honest with you that this portion you notice that we're doing it towards the back end of your work in three years. We are now doing this in the first second month with boards that were beginning to coach new boards because there was a disconnect between board members that leaned in and learned and grew and move fast and then

018those that maybe didn't chose not to have the time to, you know, family work, all those kinds of things because at the end of the day, you're volunteering for your role, right? So we saw a disconnect and so now uh we're looking to address that and not and kind of have that in the forefront that way you as a team as a collective team not only the board but also the leadership team becomes very very conscious and aware that time is the most precious valuable um thing that you have and how we spend it says a lot. So part of my observations and watching your board meetings over the years has been to going from becoming conscious and aware to now some in the board having a little bit higher understanding than others. We want

019to close that gap so that you as a collective team can be on the same page versus what's that board member talking about or what's the superintendent what's with this time thing? We're all going to be speaking the same language moving forward and the accountability piece. Any other thoughts? Anyone else? All right. You ready to roll up your sleeves and figure out how this works? >> So, I have your uh I have we're going to do your most recent one, which we're going to do your April 21st board meeting. Uh what I want to do is I'm going to write on the board here on on on the the the large um what do we call it? Post it. uh what your April 21st board meeting one let me compliment you that your agenda is

020really organized. So I'm kind of giving you the answer I was supposed to ask you which was how can you ensure that you become self-aware of how you're spending your time. The answer is you have a really good agenda that prioritizes student outcomes. And so what you have here is I'm going to finish writing them out for you. Um if anyone is if you want you can look them up on your device that way you can follow along with me. Right now so far what I've written is one when you do call to order and then call to order. Uh President Kario what do you typically do right after call to order? >> I mean in between the call and order or right after? >> Right after call to order. >> I approve the agenda.

021>> Yep. You approve the agenda. >> Roll call. >> Before you approve the agenda. >> There you go. >> Yeah. Yeah. But I I said within the call to order or the next moment and he said the next a land acknowledgement roll call and welcome statement is within call to order and he said not that. So just for clarity. >> So any idea about how long that roughly takes you from call to order, land acknowledgement, roll call and adopting the agenda >> in our welcome statement? Um I would say like >> like two minutes. >> Good guess. So for the month of for April 21st, it took you all of two minutes >> to go through that. >> And then comes the governing board reports, which I've kind of separated here, and then the superintendent

022report. Your governing board reports took you 9 minutes and the superintendent report took you six minutes. So that's 15 total. >> Different meeting, Dr. >> No, that's perfect. >> That was my longest superintendent of the year. >> Now, I don't want to assume, but I hope that you have the SOFG manual somewhere nearby. Anybody have that nearby? >> Yeah. And if not, um, the completing the self evaluation on the second page, I believe you have the template of what is in your SOG manual. So, if you would pull that one out because I'm going to I'm going to ask y'all to work through that here in a bit. So, after those reports comes y'all did progress monitoring on goal three and that took >> your progress monitoring for April 21st. You spent 36 minutes And

023then after progress monitoring was consent agenda and consent agenda to >> public comment but we didn't have any >> right you didn't have any public comment. Uh so after that was consent agenda which took you 22 minutes. >> They don't always >> I know. >> This was a different >> Wait. So you took the consent agenda took 22 minutes is what you're saying. Sorry. I was just making sure I understand. Good. >> Yeah, because we had a um consent agenda item. So, I'm assuming that's he's including that discussion in there. >> That's right. >> And your action items took you a total of 25 minutes. >> Yikes. Well, it was a >> I was thinking yikes to the 22 minutes compared to the 25 minutes. >> Oh, yes. Yes. Yes. Yikes. I would agree. >>

024And then after that, just in case. >> Thank you. After that, you did legislative updates. You asked if there were any future agenda items. Uh, and then you adjourned and that took you nine minutes. All right. So, if you're looking at the and sorry, vice president, it do you need me to turn this facing the camera or? >> Um, no. I think we're okay. >> Yeah. >> So, I'm going to switch colors on my markers here in a bit. Okay. I love color coordination. Thank you. >> First thing, first thing I want to ask the board members if there's any area here that you think there might be room for improvement on what you say and what you do in terms of the minutes. >> Is there something being projected right now? >> No, I

025wrote it on the >> No. Yeah, he wrote it. >> I was like, what is everyone looking at? >> I can FaceTime you and show you it. >> No, no, it's okay. It's okay. Russell's trying to switch our camera angle here, too. >> Oh, it's no worries. >> If I can read body language accurately from across the board, drones. >> Oh, I see you, Russell. >> Oh, there we go. Just a little to the left. Oh, thank you. Thank you so much. >> You're welcome. >> Yay. So if there's any area here that we could align what we say with what we do on what what you are prioritizing is there any room for improvement? >> I mean definitely consent agenda. I think that sometimes when we pull those like especially this time, I mean,

026I know people have a right to pull like consent agenda items, but a lot of the times I don't I guess I don't understand why there aren't questions being asked before from either Mr. Man or even going to Miss CO and asking those questions and getting information before. Yeah, I I I want to note that it was a good dialogue for me to watch and witness from you as a team and I Oh, thank you. There they are. So, yes. Um you're right, board member Ayers. uh and and notice that there's there's uh and madam vice president this is an area where I have heard you say that you know this is why we want to encourage you to visit with the superintendent you know get your questions answered sounds like maybe if there was

027a gap we can begin to close that gap with having this conversation because it's not until a board becomes aware as a team um and I think you also mentioned it like you got to go through a cohort You got to lean into this. You got to chew on it. You got to wrestle with it. And you got to learn and grow as one board member. Now we have the opportunity for you as a team to become very hyper aware of where it is that you're actually spending your time. So consent agenda typically takes historically I've tracked your meetings for three years. Average what do you think your consent have usually averaged? >> Two minutes. >> Yeah. If that >> a minute. >> Yeah. >> One to two minutes. 15 seconds. >> I only think

028of two meetings. >> Yeah, me too. >> Yep. >> Right. >> So, this is just one of those just because it was the last meeting, right? Um and then in your in your action items, I also don't want to tell you I don't want you to receive this message saying don't talk about things at action. That's that's absolutely not what we're saying. >> Well, also there's stuff by law we can't not talk about in action items. >> Yeah. And the conversation I really enjoyed the last couple of months of watching your board meetings, you're wrestling with coming to terms with what does 50% look like and how do we how do we get to that point? This this should begin to help you get over that that that hill of understanding, oh, okay, so if

029so, if each one of you takes turns coding a board meeting, each if one of I guess in other words, who's taking over next month? who who's going to code next month's or better yet who's going to code this month's board meetings right if you rotate that each of you will become aware the other thing I want to submit to you is that this is how you plan for succession of board officers >> that that a any anyone that takes a seat of a board officer would ideally you would be well aware and you would know and understand that when you set that agenda with the superintendent you stick to something like this and you're hyper sensitive about it you're going to keep running effective board meetings. Don't want to leave this to chance. Don't

030want to get in a position where somebody doesn't come back or has to step down. The entire team would speak the same language. So 50% would be ideal. That still leaves you the other 50%. To do action, to do information, to do reports, but when you're aware of this, you'll hold yourself accountable like I'm the one that distracted my team and pushed us over the edge of not getting to 50%. And then the the self-reflection which I loved in your workshop that the superintendent led was what choice or behavior have I made where I may have made it harder for the or for the system to achieve its vision. These are the technical things that you could reflect on. >> I mean if if we swap out 22 for two minutes we still only meet

03140% with our SFG from the last meeting. So there's some work there too. >> Yep. And may I say that again? I think it was it was you all as a board here who talked about getting better progress monitoring so that you can extend those minutes naturally, not because you're checking a box, >> right? >> Okay. Well, here's here's my observation and not just mine. Let me say this. There are there are a number of boards across the country who are watching your board meetings. One of the things that's a big takeaway, this board has really began to internalize what exactly those inputs and outputs are, what's working and what needs more work. You as a team demonstrate a high level of competency. Encourage you to go watch three years ago. >> Watch what three

032years ago. >> Oh god. >> And and one your agenda doesn't look like this. Two, the beginning conversations about education about about your academic reports was nowhere near where you as a team are at right now. So the the percentage in the minutes will come the more you keep diving into this and the second part of today will hopefully help you get there. The only thing that comes up for me for this, especially when it comes to the consent agenda item, and that goes back to having uh board procedures, because I think what happens too is that I would never want it to be the speculation that just because something's in consent, you can't speak about it, right? There's ways of pulling stuff out of consent ahead of time and putting it over as a

033discussion item. So, there's certain things that we can do ahead of the meeting. Um, so that that just kind of makes me wonder that we really do need that board operating procedures. That way when board members feel like, you know, this is going on. I don't feel like you're talking. There's like, okay, you know, you can actually let the president know or the superintendent, you're not going anywhere, I can work with you on pulling it and then we can have a discussion or whatever that looks like, right? So, um I think that's where I'm landing on that too that I think it's important that all board members feel supported when they have certain issues and there's different ways and mechanisms to getting to those >> without, you know, consistently having to pull and >> go

034into this um big conversation. So, that might be helpful. >> Do we know if Miss Marquez is joining us this this evening? >> Um I do not. She said she was going to try to join online, but I'm not sure. >> Oh, okay. >> To that note, well, let me pause. I I won't go there yet. Let me ask you for the next part. You have that document in front of you. You should have it which is aligned with the framework, vision and goals, values and guardrails, monitoring, accountability, communication and collaboration, continuous improvement, and other. I think it's on the is it third page? It's the graph. >> Oh, yes. >> Yep. Page three of your document. Now, not trick questions, but an opportunity to work together as a group. When we each one of

035these agenda items, which I've kind of summarized for you, those are your options. In other words, call the order and then uh President Kario asked that you not do this because you should be very familiar with it. So, I'm going to ask the rest of the room and Miss Katie, you can do the same. Where would call the order fall in in these categories? Is it a values? Is it vision and goals? And then the descriptions you see are to the right. In other words, where would call the order fall? Would it be vision and goals, values and guardrails, monitor and accountability, communication and collaboration, continuous improvement, or other? Take your time because you'll you'll have to read the descriptions. I think it goes under communication and collaboration and community engagement. >> Tell me why,

036please. because um we're communicating who like when that we're beginning the meeting, who's present at the meeting, and giving the land acknowledgement communicates values of our district to the community as well. >> Okay. >> But is it two-way communication? >> Good question. >> I mean, I think it also I mean, it would be if we included the public comment, but we've moved that out of call to order. >> That's a good point, too. That's a pretty common response. Is public comment two-way communication? >> No. >> Why not? >> Because it's not it's only you can only respond if it's in the agenda. >> That's right. It's >> not two way. You can only listen. >> Yeah. And y'all said it in one of your recent meetings. This is the reason why you're doing the community

037engagement and outreach because only in community engagement and outreach can you truly engage in two-way communication. >> So this other other >> Yeah. >> Good. It is. It's other. Yay. >> Let's go to the other next major agenda item, which board and superintendent reports. Where would that fall? >> Same. >> Why? >> Because you're doing essentially the same thing that you just did. It's just one way communication >> that's not accomplishing any of these other things. >> Right. >> No, I'd say because you're not taking a bunch of time. I'm not saying get rid of it. >> No. >> It's just, you know, y'all do a really great job of updating the community about what's happening uh superintendent to the board. So, >> please don't take any of this as removing. It's just you becoming

038aware. I'm just realizing that the meeting right before the coach comes is not the good time to have long. >> Oh my gosh. >> If you want, we can go back. We can do other meetings. I got them all coded. >> I'm just being >> I have a quick question. >> Yes. >> So, if the board superintendent report was sharing maybe a celebration from like one of the guard rails or goals, would that count? >> Excellent question. is Congress and their voice and different things like that. >> Would you happen to have the Elliot I mean the students focus governance manual nearby? >> Yes. And I I was going to kind of interject in that there should be a portion where and I've talked we've talked about this where there should be like a student

039outcome celebrations or recognitions and I think that's where it would live and I think it would count. >> not not in the minutes. It will count though if you have continuous improvement under page seven of the SOFG manual. You will see under approaching student outcomes focus the third paragraph. So the board has provided time during regularly scheduled board authorized public meetings to recognize the accomplishments of its students and staff regarding progress towards goals and interim goals. >> That's the key. So, can I get credit back for the portion of the six mess I talked about creating kids congress? I'm just taking >> for board self eval. Yes, but for timing, no. >> Right. For the board self eval, yes, for timing. And and this is where I'm so glad that uh I think it was

040board member Marquez who picked up when in the policy diet. She goes, "What's LSG?" Typo on my end. I know the attorney said, "I think that's a typo from Sinto." That's correct because I did not remove LSG and replace it with SOFG. LSG is the Texas version of SOFG. With that said though, in Texas, boards get student outcome minutes for recognizing students and staff align to the goals. The national model, you do not. What you do though is you get points here on your self-evaluation. And that's an opportunity for you. But here's here's the key. I would recommend that when you do recognitions, name it specifically >> to which goals you're recognizing students and staff. You get to send you get you know what you're doing here is you're is you're reentering the conversation and

041you keep sending out these messages goals goals goals students and you're doing that as a system. I think just the opportunity lies there with the students and the and the staff. Great questions. All right. Where would the progress monitoring, how would that one be coded? >> Think I heard it. >> Mhm. >> What was it? >> Monitoring. >> Vision and goals. Gold monitoring. Heather, would you mind reading that description for us that we move around on make sure on the same page? >> Reviewing, discussing, and or accepting, not accepting goal uh monitoring reports in accordance with the monitoring calendar. >> There you go. That section, my friends, we call the golden minutes section. So, that one is vision and goals monitoring. You spent 36 minutes on it. All right. Consent agenda. Where might that fall?

042Vision and goals, vision and guardrails, monitoring accountability, communication and collaboration, continuous improvement, or other? >> Other. Why other >> um it's not any of the activities above kind of just stuff that we have to do like as board members like me and donations and >> there is one kind of in the middle of the document that'll speak to what you just said. I'll give you a hint. It's under vision and guard rails. I mean values and guard rails. See if you can find the description. Would it be monitoring accountability under voting? >> Yep. >> Could you read that voting description for us? >> The board debating and/or voting on any item voting on goal guardrail adoption andor scheduled monitor reports and emails are counted elsewhere. Not here. All other incidents of debate voting are never

043a form of goals and guard rails monitoring. Does everyone see why it's monitoring accountability and voting? I'll give you a hint. you'll know it's monitoring accountability voting anytime it has to do with consent or action items. That's your that's your hint for that one. >> So I kind of gave you the answer. What is action items? >> Oh, I don't know. Maybe monitor and accountability. >> Yeah. So any voting items are going to fall under that's not related to goals and guardrails votes. So anything under consent or action are going to fall there. What about future legislative everything all the way to the end? >> those are all other. So for moments of like what I really hope that you can gain from today as well is that you celebrate how far you've come as

044a team. I would encourage you to look at any random board meeting around you and see what their agendas look like and try to codify their board meeting. See if it flows the way yours does. Are you seeing a no? and see if the time that's spent is more here in this range than anywhere else. >> I like zero. >> Yeah. So, what they say and what they do may not be aligning. You curious to see what your percentage is for this month of April. >> Yes, please. >> 33%. >> Got it. 33%. Most boards spend 0 to 10% if they're lucky. You have consistently been way above that range. You are on a journey to try to get to 50. You have done, I think, everything you possibly can with your agenda to have

045it be very effective and efficient. Now, you know that your consent that that's not the norm. So, that number probably would have been boosted and vice president. What did you say the percentage would have been even if we would have gotten down to two minutes? You say 44%. We got Yeah. If we got down to 2 minutes on the thing, it would have been 40%. >> She >> But then if we knocked down the superintendent report, it would be even more. >> I I see how you play. >> Weak. >> And again, I don't want you to short change yourselves because there's so many great things you want to talk about. Um, what is your pathway to get close to 50% then? Can I make a note real quick? I just want to also talk

046about the action items because we do have those legal requirements and like recently it was the the pro statements for those elections and that was important. Um but I I also want to note that I have noticed for me the 25 minutes maybe is a little higher than normal. We could have been a little more efficient but I really have seen that number come way down too in our regular meetings and I think that's because we've been trying to prep as much as possible ahead of time. give the board enough information um on those action items prior to us coming into the meeting so that you already have a lot of that information. So I just I feel like sometimes we're we're stuck when it comes to the legal ones. We'll be bringing some budgets

047here in the future. Uh but I think we've been doing a really good job there. Um so I mean maybe 25 minutes could have been a little more efficient, but I I just think that we're we really are focused on those action items. uh and getting the board educated prior to coming to the meeting on on what they are. >> Yeah, I would agree. I think for the most part, most meetings were good and sometimes we do have bigger conversations on certain topics, especially because some of them our board members were new into accepting prostatements. So, it was a little bit longer, but that's perfectly fine because it's a very important needed conversation. Board member Jones, are you curious to know what it was like back in 2023? >> Yes. >> Oh my goodness. >>

048December of 2023, out of the 210 public meeting minutes, zero were spent on student outcomes. >> What? >> Yep. And then we go >> surprised by that. >> We go to January of 2024. I'm just going to skip around. January 2024, 16 out of 203 minutes were spent on student outcomes, and that was 8%. February, 10 out of 319 public minutes were spent on student outcomes, that was 3%. Then you fast forward to what we had in 2025, >> was over 300 minutes. >> Yes, >> that was that was a short one, >> not including executive session. That's what I tell you. >> I didn't tell you, but executive session does not count in these minutes. >> Uhhuh. >> So that's without executive session. >> Yep. And in 2025, we just you've gotten the reports

049from me. You see, you like range from like 28 to like 40 50 something sometimes. Uh you have not gone back down to those three or zero or 8%. You've not looked back. You've been a disciplined team >> and we haven't been in the boardroom past 11 p.m. >> That's a big one. >> I get tired. >> Yeah, exactly. >> What questions do you have board leadership team? >> Is this helpful? If so, how so? It is, I think, super helpful because I think it it it helps become more aware. Again, I know that we know, but the more that we're aware on how much time we're spending on a certain thing, I think unconsciously it will help us not want to spend so much time. Ever since I knew that the my, you know,

050board reports were going to not be counted. I even noticed a difference in my own personal board reports. I used to tell everybody everything I did on a daily basis. basically in the schools and you know it was a self-reflection for me. It's like that for me personally all that lives out in community and they know. >> So I really try to be conscious of what I bring up to the board and what I'm going to talk about and say so it doesn't eat up that time. >> So I just think it's good. It's nice awareness. I've tried with my board report just to list three things the top three that I couldn't go without and then you know sometimes I don't it doesn't always line up but like there is a conscious effort to

051like well I know don't want to waste everybody's time. >> Yeah. Uh the other thought I had was that we could make a better effort of spending more time on our goals and uh monitoring reports. Um extending that discussion uh naturally and organically. I know it seems sometimes we just come up here and we're frozen because we're just getting, you know, death by PowerPoint, but you know, maybe there's something else we can do. >> Well, I think of course it comes down again to questions, right? Like those questions on how we can extend it because you know if we have people asking questions then of course it takes a little bit longer and um more indepth. Um, I think sometimes for me I'm still struggling in asking more complex in-depth questions than like surface level

052questions. Um, and so sometimes like I don't know how to ask like questions that I think are like valuable for everyone because I don't want to waste everyone's time or or um I want it to be something that like they look at, you know, the exec team looks at and like thinks in a different way. And sometimes it's hard for me to to think of questions that I feel like could affect them that way. So maybe it's not I don't want to ask something that's like not useful because I also don't want to waste people's time. >> And I think that's like my problem sometimes. Like I'm trying to ask questions. >> Yeah. >> Um I'm trying to review it, but I just want to I do want to ask questions that make people think.

053>> Yeah. like how can we change this or how can we do replicate this or you know something that maybe they haven't thought of which is probably hard to do because I'm sure it's you know different things. So I think that's where I get stuck with the questions and of course if we ask better questions I'm sure that that would extend that time out and be a lot more useful as well for everyone. I think for me like um especially when we have executive session or things that take a lot of my um brain power and I've just come from the whole day at work. I think for me sometimes like stamina is an issue in terms of like making sure that I'm not checking out and like staring at things. Um, and I just

054I get tired and I need to make sure I'm paying attention because sometimes I find myself with my brain drifting off while people are presenting and then I say, "Oh, you should probably be paying attention because you're not asking any questions." I definitely did that in the last meeting. >> It's hard when like sometimes the information is continuously presented in the same way. Not that I'm saying it should be different, but like I just wonder how useful some of the graphs and some of the things are. >> Um, to me, like I look at them and I'm not sure that they like affect me in any way possible. And I think that's I mean I love I I know people love making graphs and stuff but >> well to be fair to the team I

055don't think the graph the team hates making those graphs. >> They they don't make those graphs because they love making graphs. They make those graphs because part of the framework is to put things in a format that's >> um accessible to like the lay person. So that way as this is communityf facing people can observe it. I was just I was just going to add um we after going through the cohort training we follow like the um rubric for progress monitoring reports. It has gotten off a little bit of that because it's supposed to be five slides and just the data like there's certain parts of that. Um, but what I did, what we did see when we were at the other um, when we were at the SOFG cohort is that some school districts

056instead of a slideshow, they just give like a one-page report and it's like just a one pager that has everything those five parts. Um, and that was another way that they presented it. Um, and I think we just did the slideshow because it's easier to show and explain visually, but um, that's also something that we can look at. Vanessa was there too, right? It was just like a onepage report had like the five sections and then um one section was the data. So it was like a graph or a table. >> Yeah, it was more infographic and I think we've had those discussions before because we go to the cohort and we're constantly trying to pair it down. Um you know it's three to five slides if you're going to do it. And so I

057think um you know it is a constant challenge but a lot of that is perpetuated by some of the good questioning um that happens and then also just trying to um not present the same information over and over. But I I think because of timing sometimes that's just where it where it is with our inputs and the timing of when our results come back. So but I mean I I think we've seen a few examples. We can maybe grab some more just to like you said when you see the same thing or it looks like it's the same thing or in the same format maybe we do an annual refresh of just the formatting of it a bit to make it >> and and I don't want it to seem like I'm complaining because like

058I know everybody works really hard on them but then the other thing that I think about is how friendly are they to like the people watching or the people that and I I'm I don't know how many people or or whatever, but how many like people on the outside in our community can actually read them and understand what what we're actually saying and how we're showing growth because I I I get them. >> I get them. >> I understand them. I'm a teacher. I understand the lingo. I understand that. But like even after reading that article um you know I just worry that like what we're presenting isn't going to it makes might make sense to us but isn't going to make sense to our community. Is that something we could post and they would

059be able to read it and be like oh they're making growth or oh they're not making growth. Like sometimes it's really hard when we say we want to decrease this but increase this and I'm not sure that it's like even connecting with teachers per se like you know that's what I worry about. >> That's fair feedback and we we've talked a lot like obviously you can see from the team about how do we get >> how do we pair it back down to like a more streamlined more accessible model. I think part of what happened and I think this is part of our journey is we we were getting a lot of requests for like a deeper dive on components and because you know we really just best way I can describe it we want

060to take the hood off the car and let everyone see the engine right like there's there's been despite the fact that public education gets accused of no transparency all the time like the transparency particularly in this district has been like off the charts right like we're like hey check this out this one still has a carburetor in Um but but it does I think we drifted too far in that direction and now it's time to recalibrate back to a more you know baseline methodology. Doesn't mean that we don't answer questions, right? It just means that the report itself gets kind of streamlined back down. And I think sometimes because we're trying to make sure the board has all the information, we're overproviding information in those reports. And we've had those conversations an executive team like

061a number of times. >> And keep in mind that is a sliver of all the things that our teams are doing. I mean, it is the tiniest amount. Just even trying to give you that information um is is a tiny part of what everyone is doing in all of our areas and departments. It's a fraction of what we're doing. It's a sliver of what we're doing. Um there's a lot going on and I don't think that there would be um an ability for us to put it all in a PowerPoint. I just think Lorissa's team does such a great job disseminating all of that into the really relevant um portions of information. But as always, you know, we can always improve. And I think that's part of this is staying on top of it, having

062the conversations, looking at our minutes. What can we do better? And I and I hope no one is taking it that we're doing anything wrong. I don't think anyone is doing anything. Yeah. And I don't take it that way, Heather, in any way. Um, but you know, we know why that happens and we're very aware of it and always trying to work on that streamline process. >> I'm just wondering, could we put like something out for like the general public that would be like simpler for them? Uh, I just I don't know. Like I just I just think like I'm not sure that we're like conveying the right information for the community to understand what we're doing and the successes or the areas of improvement that we're having >> and maybe like a a summary

063preview. >> Yes. >> Come watch our meeting. Well, so many things are popping up in my head right now, but the first one is that I do think we do need to be better at conveying what we're doing and and translating those reports to our community, but that falls back on us in our two-way communication. And we all have lacked in that aspect. We haven't really been out in community presenting our boards, our our board reports. We haven't committed to actually going out. We were good when we started. I know that Katie and I presented at a couple um schools. Nicole did one and I I think you did one too, Tristan, right? Or not yet. Anyways, um so with that all being said, I think we need to be more intentional in our community

064outreach two-way communication because that's how we can get people to really start understanding that because at the end of the day, we are a board. We are this is our business meeting and we need to understand certain things at our level and then it is our job as the electeds of this community to go back and explain that to our community and if there's still a gap I think that falls on us. Um, so maybe we can create some creative ways on how we can be better at being community. And something that always pops for me is community council is a really good one, right? We can do like a mock board meeting at a community council and go through a pro. I don't know what that looks like, but I think there's spaces where

065we can try to work that and see what that works, but that disengagement or that misunderstand a misunderstanding I think falls on us. Um, so we can be better at that. Um but yeah, that's what's coming up for me um regarding those and which I think leads us perfectly to our next point, which is our strategic questions. Because I think the better that we get at actually asking those strategic questions, it will leave the you know the ins and outs of the meticulous stuff that we've been looking at lately and looking at a more out of a on a broader view. So, um, if we can move into our strategic questioning and hopefully that helps us to be a little bit better at asking those questions. >> What what I want to do is I

066see a clear opportunity of um, Heather, you are right on point on how is the community interpreter. Sophia, you're right on point on it's the board's responsibility to take it to them, but if you as board members aren't clear on what you're seeing, then you might struggle with relaying that information to the community. So, let me see if I can break this down as simple as possible. You've got the effective gold monitoring document in front of you. I'll ask you to look at the beginning of page two, which says effective monitoring reports. Keep that nearby as I walk you through this brief example up on this board here. So my question to you as a board uh if you you remember the analogy of the football game, you remember inputs, outputs, and outcomes. You all

067as a team use those terms regularly here. Question board members, and you don't have to answer because I don't want you feeling like I'm putting you on the spot. Although you want to get there sooner rather than later if you don't have the answers. from where you started this year to where you're probably projected even if we just say goal number three fresh on your mind from this last board meeting question that if I'm a community member and you're giving me this goal my question to you as a community member would be how are we looking are we on track to meet this year's target and the second part are we on track to meet the overall goal what would you as board members What do you think? And if you if you want to

068share, you can. If not, I just want you to think about it. You have goals. You have annual targets. We're right at the we're right at the end of the game. The reason you did the monitoring reports was so that you don't have to wait till the end of the year to figure out are we going to win the game or lose the game. So theoretically, right now, after these reports, you should have an idea. Should is a word that we may need to unpack with goal number three that you just monitored that you spent what 36 minutes on? >> Yes. >> This is what I want you to have in the back of your head when you're doing the next progress monitoring. Do you understand what's being placed in front of you? >> Do

069you understand how you got there? >> And do you understand what the strategies are moving forward? >> And if the answers are yes, >> my question still is, do you know if you're going to meet the annual target? And do you know if you're on track to meet the overall five-year goal or not? >> I don't I don't think so. >> Yeah. >> Yes, we are on target to meet the goal >> for goal three. The issue is is if we don't make considerable improvement, are we going to continue to be on target to meet the five-year goal? I'm not sure. >> Leadership team, you can help out. >> I remember if Let me >> I didn't understand the question. So the the question is from the last progress monitoring report for goal three, are

070we on target or offtarget to hit the annual target and are we on target or offt target to hit the 5-year goal? And so if I remember correctly, we had so we have three interim measures. >> If I remember correctly, one interim measure showed us as being on target and two interim measures showed us as not being on target. And so in the aggregate typically you're looking for I always my pneummonic devices two out of three ain't bad. So, um, the fact that we're that we're showing off target on two of the three would be an indicator that we are likely not on track to meet the annual target, in which case we would not >> track to meet the >> I would I would add a correction to that because if you're looking at

071the overall what's been happening each year, we haven't necessarily met the interim goals, but we and this particular goal, we have exceeded the actual annual goal each here. >> And so what that's why I said what I said, which is, >> you know, if we stay with what we're doing, it's likely we'll still meet our goal for the year, but are we going to meet the five-year goal if we don't make any considerable progress? Maybe not. >> Well, what I now I can hear your question. Um, sorry because I can't read your lips. So, thank you. Um so the one that is on basically for the goal three is a tough one to answer because we know that all three of our interim measures does not measure um language acquisition. So they're not interim measures

072that have the um correlation that we know it's going to um likelihood how we're going to do. But those are the best measures that we have um right now and we'll have the Azela mimic next year. >> Um it's hard to answer this question because I already know what the data is because I already took the Aela. >> I was pretending really well that have insight or information. >> We don't pretend. So go ahead. >> So based on I can't it's not it's preliminary data I can't share. >> Okay. Yeah. No, don't do that. But I will say that the interim measures that we have are not good predictors. But the one that we are on target with is getting better every year. So it's improving. Their reading is improving. Um but it's not measuring

073the four parts of language acquisition. >> And that's what I would say no because in order for us to say yes, we would know what those indicators are to get us to the goal. And that's why I'm going to push back on a little bit on what Katie said that I >> I'm just answering Sinto's question. which rules. Are we on target? Are we on track? That's the question, not are you meeting all the interim goals, >> right? >> I'm answering the question he asked for parts and he >> I think it proves his point is that would not be able to go back out into our community and sufficiently explain what's going on right now. >> Correct. >> That's the point >> because the progress monitoring report doesn't >> Can you repeat what did

074you say? She said that it goes back to Sinto's point where we would not be prepared to go back to our community to speak to that goal because that our inner measures are not predictors of what's going on and yes we're moving along every year but we're kind of like >> how much >> working yeah >> what's working there's something that that the team just said that jumped out at me which I've heard in your progress monitor reports she said some of the interimms are not good predictors >> those interimms are your outputs This is not a moment to say staff, you're not doing well. This is a moment to highlight that your leadership team is being honest with you that because you as a board are prioritizing this work. You're you're playing it's like

075you're backing your team up against the wall and saying, "We'll get better at it. Figure it out." You're not beating up on your leadership team. You're giving them the grace and the room to get better at it. I heard them say that one of them they're getting better at it every year. Understand that most school systems that do not have boards that do the work that you're doing, they don't have to worry about it. They just go about their dayto-day. And remember, for every benefit that I get to experience, someone has to pay a cost. Mhm. >> And in these conversations when adults benefit from not having to go dig into these conversations, children are paying the cost, community paying the cost. So let me just say that very very loudly that this cander and

076this honesty from this team group that's important. Second part, we got to keep it simple though. As you're saying, Heather, at the end of the day, my community wants to know. Are we moving or not moving? And then the next question is going to be why not or why are we? >> And why are we? We need to celebrate that. >> Why we're not, we're going to be honest with you community. We got some work to do and we're on it because we're disciplined and we're focused. We're spending more and more time asking these questions. So again, if you're leaving a progress monitoring session and you are not, let me make a recommendation that I haven't made before. If you don't have your beginning of the year progress monitoring report, you don't have your middle

077of the year progress monitoring report, and you don't have your third quarter monitor progress monitoring report, you're you don't have all the puzzle pieces in front of you. >> Your leadership team is doing everything they can to paint the picture. This is how we're starting the school year. This is we're at midway and this is how we're predicting it's going to come out. I would highly recommend you have all all two or three reports in front of you. When goal three comes back around, I would highly encourage you to have all of these in front of you and then see if they make sense. And then leadership team, that's an opportunity for you that if if you as a leadership team can't put puzzle piece one, beginning of the year puzzle, there's got to be

078at least three puzzle pieces. beginning, middle, and then right before the tests are taken. And then which one is the fourth one? >> It's the end of the year. It's the final results. That's your role as board members. That's the opportunity you have in front of you. So, I I I love that you're lifting that perspective. I love that you as a board are being honest. And I also love that you're saying, you know, I don't know that I have the the energy for it. Yeah, you're being honest. A lot of adults would rather talk about turf or or the color of the school walls or or the naming of a school. They'd much rather lean into those conversations, but to talk about student achievement that that takes a muscle to be built up. What's

079coming up for you before we jump into the questions because I want to make sure that you're not leaving your board meetings without understanding these pieces. >> And I I like that. I like that. I think that we all feel safe like with each other like >> like I feel safe saying these things and I like I don't blame like I never think about I don't think about like the blame game when we see like places where maybe we still need to work like I feel I feel like people are especially from the district like on their team are like harder on themselves than of course we are because that's that's you know as an educator like that's how I am as well like I'm harder for myself than you know my kids might be

080harder they you know or my leaders >> you know I'm going to be harder on myself than they are. >> So I like that like there is that safety and I like that we are working towards you know our common goals like we can we can see that right we can see that everybody's working really hard. I just I don't know for me there's just something more that that needs to happen I guess. Um, >> what do you what do you think that might look like? >> I think it's the community piece and it probably was just a lot of that like article like like just thinking about that community piece because yeah, like we can't just sit up here and and do this without going and explaining it to the community >> because they

081don't they probably don't understand, you know. Uh, and at first to be honest when I read that I was like kind of taking offense to like they kept saying educators on boards and I yeah well I understand stuff but then you know I you know after like finishing you know the whole thing then it kind of like hit me like yeah like we aren't going out and explaining things to to people like the way that it should. Like I do understand a lot probably a lot more than other people just because I have that lingo and >> and see that but I feel like that community piece is really lost and I know I haven't done my fair share with the community the community piece. So >> yet yet >> I'll just speak for myself.

082>> Yeah. Thank you for modeling. >> You also the more of this that you do the more you will find ways to to portray the the true picture to your community. For example, when when parents or even students say, "I don't understand why literacy is such a big deal." >> It's it's for you to be able to have the tools in your tool belt to be able to articulate that to any given person in your community. I am so glad you raised that point. Let me help you understand what that means to me. Let me help you understand when we say that we're looking at meets or exceeds why approaches isn't something that we subscribe to here. you're passing, but you're going to need a lot of help when you go to the next level

083in life, even just going to the to the high school system. We want to set you up for success. And so, if you can't read, right, what is that saying that students learn to read so they can read to learn? For them to understand and grasp at it, let me give you an example. I was at a I was at a fast food place last night with my wife and behind the counter were all these young people and the number one theme while they're making we ordered a banana split. In the meantime, while they're making our banana split and everyone else's banana splits, the common theme behind the counter was school is not fun. School is not something for me. And I'm talking about eight to nine young people behind the counter. I so wanted

084to say stop making my banana split. Let me drop some knowledge on you right quick. Because what they're not realizing is that the way the way things are progressing or regressing, young people that can't read and that can't learn and that aren't growing as human beings are going to be left behind and will be the ones like my wife said, I wanted to tell them, is that what you want to do for the rest of your life? If that's what you want to do, by all means, have at it. But that is not what you want to do for the rest of your life. by you choosing to not want to learn. Right now, the conversation is what did the adult surrounding them in that system do or not do? Got a lot of wonderings

085around that. At the end of the day, for a young person to not understand or for a parent to not understand the importance of literacy, that's a gap that you have an opportunity to close. >> And when you go equipped with data, you go equipped with history, and you go equipped with strategies, they may not grasp it. So maybe I just got to adjust the messaging in the way that they're going to receive just enough to be like this matters. >> And what's coming up for me and thank you for sharing that is that I think we also need to do a better job of giving of like where we started where what's happened and where we're at. Right. Because like you said if we can show our community that we were at 0% student

086outcomes 23 24 but now we're at 33 and we can start putting those pieces to um pieces together. I think it brings this notion of like, oh, stuff is actually happening and moving. So, maybe that's just um some of the things that come up with me that maybe we can talk at a later time on how we've reinvisioned what our two-way communication and it's a perfect time right now. May's coming to an end. It's a great time to strategize for next year and making sure that we're not leaving that component out >> at the at the risk of like I don't want this to sound um critical or rude. Um, I think it's okay to put a little bit of that in there, but a lot of the feedback we've had from community when we've

087done those types of presentations is well, I don't care what percentage the board has, like what's happening with my kids learning. I I really think we need to put it into terms of >> Yep. >> what are what are we doing? What impact does it have on your child? And what do you have to share with us that will help us do a better job of partnering with you to create success, you know, for each child's ability to to have outcomes that lead to a more choicefilled lives, right? So like honestly like in my experience the two most effective spaces I've seen um communication happen in one with the board actually both with the board ultimately um have been the conversations with the PTO groups is like those folks really engaged with that conversation and

088were and were able to kind of drill in a little bit deeper on it. Um and then the other one has been with the kids congress. When the boards come to kid cong kids congress for feedback the students are very open and honest with us and um but the difference is when we go to kids congress the board often puts it on a student level and I think to a large extent when we're dealing with parents it's beneficial to them to put it on a student because they really I mean again I don't mean this to sound terrible but they really could care less what we do in this room. Um yeah, >> they can hear about the impact on their >> I agree. But part of the education part of it is what board

089behavior adapts to how you operate a board, right? And eventually if we want good governing board members here, I think it's important to let our community know that you're going to have to have board members that are student outcomes focused in order for this to continue, right? And it's I'm not saying we spend all the time talking about that, but I think it's good for them to know because it's also part of the work how we've evolved as a board and how we've made this a priority. So if the board gets overflipped or we start getting a new superintendent or whatever and the community starts seeing not this agenda, not this prioritization on SOFG, then the community can come and say, "Hey, that's not what it's been. What's going on?" on. So, I think it

090sends this two-way um gathering of them also holding us accountable of why haven't you been talking about XYZ or how my student learning is doing? >> I don't disagree. I just thinking like I'm looking like from a Simon Simon Synynic perspective. Start with why. Why you should care is look um we're we're having more students that are testing out, you know, on their test or that are making progress on their language acquisition. How did this happen? Well, here's how it happened. It happened because this is the way the board and the leadership team have engaged. >> Yeah. And I think also when we do it at a Kraton level, district level, I think there's a disconnect too because parents want to know what's going on at their school site, right? So maybe our town halls

091need to be more school site appropriate versus districtwide because we throw them this whole district conversation. And I think that's where that whole, well, I don't care what you guys are doing districtwide. Like my kid goes to this school, what's going on here and this. So maybe we just pivot on how we're doing our two-way communication. >> That's a great answer. >> Yep. I agree. And we've got all we've got a lot more examples in the last year that we didn't have before. Um I've just spent the last three weeks going to different communities doing governance overview with students in about an hour to hour and a half. We do some really cool interactive activities. We'll put a we'll put a piece of chart paper on each corner of the room, the four corners. We'll

092have teacher, principal, superintendent, board member, and we'll read out scenarios and we'll say, "Who do you think's responsible for XYZ?" And then they'll move to that part of the room. Interesting to see how students go to different corners of the room because they don't know. For example, one of the main ones, I hope they're not watching, which I don't think they are. One of the questions is who sets the vision and and the goals for your school system. Most young people think that it's the teacher or the principal. And so when we uncover that, right, we get to have conversations because we're extracting from them how they've perceived the world and how they perceive the roles. Once we've earned the right to be heard by them and parents and guardians and community, the pathways open

093up. Otherwise, there's groups that are getting their elected officials in the area together and they're having a governance overview with them. the adults are more likely to want to engage in a conversation because they're interested to see how israton doing your business community how is this how are our future um community members looking as far as education tailoring everything towards the specific groups we can help you and we can walk you through that all right good com my friends let's transition because you've made some excellent points and brought up some so I've asked the leadership team to bring up the progress monitor report I also want you to have the >> your notepads are blocking our oh sorry our computer view. >> Yeah. So I want you to use >> I wonder why we didn't

094know >> I'd like to I'd like to ask you to look at the effective question asking document. >> Um >> not in Go ahead. >> Dr. Ramos I am so sorry. Do you mind if we take like a quick five minute recess? >> Sure. Let's do that. >> Um some of us need to go do something and then we can take that real fast. >> You got it. In the meantime just make sure you got the effective question asking document in front of you when you come back. >> Okay. 518 523. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Assuming this is other >> This is executive time. This is executive time. >> I appreciate it. >> When I'm coding, I count as executive. I'm doing all my superintendence reports in executive meeting. >> We could put

095the little timer. >> You know, that timer needs to come back. Detecting It's off now. All right, we are back. Dr. Ramos. >> Yep. So, welcome back everyone. Hopefully, you've got the effective question asking document in front of you. Uh I want to if I do my job we would have connected the dots as to why this is super important moving forward. It shouldn't be new to you. What we have though is an opportunity to practice in real time. I did ask the leadership team to put the April 21st progress monitoring report up on the screen. Um actually Hilda if you don't mind going to the overall goal first. Let's start there. I want to I want to see what your a little bit more. Go back to page three. >> Oh page three. Right

096there. >> Right there. Board, what do you see? >> Is there any way this screen can be put on my thing? >> Um, I don't know. Can it? Yeah, it should be able to >> Katie, I'm sending it to emailing it to you. >> Well, I know you guys were just looking at the progress monitoring report, right? It's just nicer if it's all on one screen so I don't have to keep going back and forth between things. >> I think >> Thank you. Got it. So the question is on page three, what are you looking at? What do you think you're looking at? >> We're looking at the overall progress of goal three from 2024 until now. And then that's the blue line. The gold are the actual goals and then the blue line is

097our actual progress. >> Are you on track? Yes. Yes. >> Above track. >> We're exceeding our >> exceeding. >> Let's go to the next one. Missilda, >> remember your interims are supposed to be predictors for your overall. What are you seeing here? Your staff has done a heck of a job of putting some things in red for you to let you know right off the bat. you and the community >> that we're really far from our goal, >> which in my head doesn't make sense because if we're exceeding every year but we're not meeting our interring the wrong thing or we have the wrong interim or because I don't know I I would assume that if we're moving up at our every year and our annual targets and our end goals Then our interims would

098be slightly moving up little by little, too. >> Interesting. >> I think this one's the most weird for me because this one's the weirdest for me because tech Oh, sorry. Am I thinking of because DNA >> I feel like DNA is supposed to be our technically maybe I'm crazy. It's supposed to be our most accurate indicator on these. And so it feels like this should be less off than any of the others, unless I'm forgetting or misremembering. >> I would agree with you, but I don't know. Um, Dr. Pomble, does that sound right? >> It's the most accurate for the standards. So for the state assessment, but for AELA, it's just it's just showing that our kids are getting better in reading. But Azela measures three things or four things, reading, writing, listening, and speaking.

099So this is just showing one part of the AELA that is getting better. >> So, and there's there's really three ways to look at this chart. The first one is because what it's intended what that measure is intended to give an indication of as Dr. Pombo said is language arts skills. You're seeing over a 2-year period consistent growth and development. And so when we talk about student outcomes focused governance, we're rocking it if we're hitting our targets, but we're only failing if we're not getting significant growth. And I would call 5 to 16 a pretty significant amount of growth in relation to the interim measure. Question becomes how does it translate to the end ofear outcome? Right? And in this case we're using a measure intended for something else because we didn't have a functionally

100aligned measure. So we stood up three interim measures that were the closest tool sets we had while we were in the process of integrating a new tool set in order to be able to have something that should be more of a onetoone alignment as a as a hate to use predictor because I've always been told we don't predict anything we have a correlated result. So, um, something that's much more highly correlated for it's an indication of whether we're on track or not. >> And I think this go this graph obviously goes back to what Heather was saying, right? Because if we're just looking at the title of the graph, it would lead you to believe proficiency is all-encompassing in my mind. And so, in my mind, I would think this has got to be the

101most on track with the overarching goal. And so I think I think the like just like if you were randomly looking at these things, you would be confused and think there's a disconnect here. >> I would agree. Yeah. >> And so just to to push the board back to it and I know that's not captured here. And so in particular for the public, this is awkward. >> But when we set these interim measures, this was probably one of the longest conversations we had was about how we needed to have three interim measures and and the team wasn't happy with anything that was available. And so then we would be standing that up. And I will also share that in a one-on-one um our board president challenged and said, "Well, I understand you need a baseline

102year for the indicator that you think is more accurate, but I kind of feel like perhaps we should have tried to find a way to stand that up." >> Now, at that point, obviously, we were I a quarter of third the way into the year. So, it was a really good insight based on what was being seen in these progress monitoring reports. um and may have an impact on, you know, as we move forward and we look at future interim measures. Um trying to have some more intentionality around like rather than preferring for three perhaps we we prefer for something that's more greatly correlated even if it isn't ready for prime time and look at different aspects of >> That's what I was about to say. I was about to say like I know we

103hate stirring the pot and we just adopted some of these tools prior to adopting student outcomes focused governance but if we just keep getting to this end of the year and saying yeah these just aren't measuring things that are going to be like accurate indicators for us then I think it's time to make a change. >> Well thank you for priming the pump for some cheese moving we may be having conversations about fairly soon. So, >> and I just want to reflect for that Miss Mark Marquez has joined us online. >> Yes. Hi. I'm I'm still in in transit, so I won't be chiming in too much, but I hope to catch as much as I can by ear and once I arrive, I'll be able to participate better. >> Thank you. I appreciate you

104um logging in and being with us. I was going to share that the Azel mimic that we've been piloting this year um the company um Renaissance or DNA had to use that data not just our district but other districts that were piloting it to be able to see if it was correlated to the Aella so we could use it for next year. So we couldn't really even know if it was correlated or not. And so they're still still doing that study. Um, but we have we're planning on putting it in our assessment schedule for next year. >> So, looking at just even at 3.1 and I know that you asked questions at the board meeting. What I want to do is I want to ask you to try to formulate one smart strategic question. Meaning

105that you're going to obviously want it to be strategic over technical tactical. You're going to want it to be measure focused, which you're going to be wanting to reference specific data points so you have data in front of you. You want it to be askoriented, which means that it's open-ended. You don't want to uh tell them or you don't want to accuse them or be confrontational, which you're not. You're amazing at that. You want it to be askoriented, a professional manner. And then you want it to be results focused, which means that you're really genuinely looking to learn, not that you think you know the answer already. And then you want it to be time bound which you want to focus is it on current performance which means past actions or is it future performance

106like what's the strategy and so you have on that document you see that there's an effective example and then there's ineffective example encourage you to look at the in the I want to encourage you to look at the effective example which reads third grade literacy growth on page four appears to be flat for group A but not group B. Which if any of our budgeted strategies most accounted for that difference? That is a smart measure focused askoriented results focused timebound smart question. And again we're looking on the first page of effective question asking and it says smart questions. Y'all have that one? >> Oh, there it is. >> Yeah. That's your criteria for making it smart. And to your point, Miss Heather, it's I I wouldn't focus on it being so so thoughtprovoking that it's

107going to like create this seismic shift in the way administration reviews. Just looking at that screen of interim 3.1, what is a smart question that follows that example that you could ask the leadership team at a board meeting? And what I want to do is I want to encourage you to to partner up. So Trist and Sophia, I'd like you to partner up. And just looking at this one, what is a smart strategic question you might ask the leadership team? Heather, you get a bonus that you get to work with Jay. >> I don't know. >> Bonus. >> Sorry. >> I don't know if that's a bonus. >> It's a bonus. >> Oh, I get the bonus. All right. >> See if you can come up with one together and then we'll I'll write them

108out up here and we'll review them together. We didn't seven points the first year. >> And I mean then just comparing the ears themselves it was 10 points. Yeah, you're right. >> Oh, no. >> 10ardless. >> But even if you did a 10, if we did a 10 job from 12, Oh, I think >> or is it >> I don't think that's would be time bound or measure focused. But like the same thing just kind of restructured might be something like given that last year's for the literacy date on page four given that last year's measurements >> of emerging studies >> did not accurately reflect our output. >> What's confusing for me is why that And this here's measurements >> of 2026. >> Just putting it out there that I put a qu my question

109in the chat just so that people know >> whereas we have short of the target. >> I mean >> is this more than double of what this year is? >> What what changed this year? I'm not sure that fixes it, but I think it fix or something to that effect. >> And you know what I was trying to say, but I I accidentally said IBM2 to >> Well, yeah, there's three different >> and then then there's two different school years. >> I I guess what what was the difference in 24 25 versus 256 >> in that two tests? What happened? >> Yeah, but there's also cheese in the mix because of that adjustment. >> I think it's also Maybe you could even assume >> we using the same strategy. Were we using a different >>

110what they >> what do you account for this >> difference in the IBM one and two tests >> school year 242 school year test. >> That's right. Is that harder than others? >> I think it's less accurately reflective, >> which in our case means it's harder. >> Yeah, of course. >> It's interesting. And they talk about them district or they're overseen here. They're overseen by biased to promote. Why is that through some >> audience? >> I don't think so. I think you kind of already sh I haven't heard that. >> It wouldn't surprise me. I feel like I'm in a performing simulator right now. >> Why? >> Because all I can hear is everybody whispering and having four or five different conversations. >> That's hilarious. >> But I can't see anybody either. So, it's just

111like me making lunches for tomorrow and we're seeing the people talking whispering in the back >> randomly just throwing your name in like quietly. >> We like she saying about me. >> Did y'all come up with a smart strategic question? >> Yes, we did. >> All right. Read me read yours out to me and I'll go. >> Mr. Jones will do that for us. >> The honorary Mr. Jones. the uh I didn't write it down but uh given the percent of emerging multilingual increasing from 5 to 9% in school year 2425 between preIBM1 and preIBM 2. >> Oh, you lost me. Oh, >> given a percent of multilingual >> uh emerging my multilingual increasing one or more proficiency levels in preIBBM1 and preIBM2 of school year 24 25 by 4% I don't know if that

112even makes sense >> by 4%. Yes. And given that >> And given that >> Mhm. Uh >> in 2526 it was only 1% increase between preIBM1 and preIBM2 were the same strategies being used in between those two tests Or did something different happen? >> Yeah. So, we we went a little bit of a different route. I think we were caught up in the prior conversation a little bit. um help help make sure I'm representing this correctly. Um so ours was given that in uh four um slide four given that the percent of emerging multilingual increasing one or more proficiency levels from preIBM in in 2425 from preIBBM1 sorry >> given that slide for >> given uh that the p the percent of emerging Multilingual increasing one or more proficiency levels from the pre-EST to the

113post test indicated that indicated that we would not reach our annual target for that year, but we did exceed the target for that year and that the data from preIBBM1 to PreIBM2 in 2526 also indicates that we are short of the May 25 interim measure target. It's very compound. >> Yes. Good stuff. >> All right. So, let's check them as a team. Have your smart document in front of you. I'm going to ask you with the first one, which was the one that Katie submitted to us via the chat. We want to make sure there's strategic that it is not technical or tactical. Do you remember what technical and tactical actually mean? It's at the bottom of that document. So, just we're all on the same page. Technical means that there are questions to understand

114how something is measured. Tactical is questions to understand how or by whom something is done. Strategic, they're questions to understand how something aligns to the goals and guard rails. So, that's the first part. Second one is going to be as a measure focus does reference specific data. Let's start with strategic with Katie's which reads given that only 16% of emerging bilingual students in grades three through eight advance one or more proficiency levels on the DNA ELA assessment at IBM2. What specific school level instructional interventions will be implemented between now and May 2026 to close that gap? And how will we measure whether those interventions are working before the final post test window closes? Is that technical? Is that tactical? Is that strategic? Is that a little tactical? It's a little tactical. >> And I was

115going to say there's a little bit technical in there, too. >> There's a little technical. >> Instructional interventionist would be technical. >> Yeah. What I'm looking for is where's it strategic? The strategic part comes in. So she's saying that the 16% of emergence multilingual students in grade three and then yeah what interventions by May 26 will be working on before the final po before the final post test window closes. >> Yep. This is this is a uh this has technical tactical and strategic completely okay. You want to work your way to making it more and more strategic as time goes on. You'll understand why as you do monitoring because this is this is a really good question. I want to look at the leadership team. How are you? >> I thought this was like uh

116my strategic part was pretty melee for this, but sorry. >> That's why we're practicing >> and it's on the spot. We didn't have time to think. So, this is great. >> Correct. >> The fact that we were able to come up with a question like this in this short of time tell us that >> our coaching and we're working. We're doing good. >> Yes. So, I'm curious to see how the leadership team responds to a question like this. What are you seeing? Um I I think I mean actually do you want to take a shot first? >> The first question to read it. >> Okay. >> Well, Dr. Pombo's reading it my opinion. >> Sure. >> You can't read my lips so it won't color her opinion. >> So she can't hear. >> I'm starting

117to know your voice. So >> wow. I don't know if that's a compliment or an insult. Um so um I mean we do particularly the strategic portion of this are the types of questions we like. We we really um looking at things like what are the interventions that are being implemented. I think one of the places that we sometimes get a little bit ahead of ourselves is if you look at the level of detail that we include when we get to next steps because there's been some push back by the board on next steps. we've gone to an extreme level of detail and I think that's one of the places where we've kind of exploded our progressive monitoring reports and they've gotten too voluminous and probably a place where as the board gets better at

118asking strategic questions we can pair down >> and then address those components in the strategic piece. So it's a very long- winded way which is why Dr. Pal was getting used to my voice because I used too many words. Um, it's a long-winded way of saying though like that strategic component of that question is really one of the things we enjoy digging in on when we get a chance to go back and take a look at um strategically what's working, what's not working, what adjustments are we making. It also gives us an opportunity to showcase where most of these progress monitoring reports are functionally postmortems. We have to have the data in order to present it to the board. It takes a certain amount of time to prepare the report. there's a certain amount of

119lead time to get it to the board, give the board time to absorb it, give the board to ask their questions. So typically in that window of time, ballpark 6 weeks passes. So by the time we don't have 6 weeks to wait for kids, right? Kids are only with us 180 days each year. So in the intervening time period, we've already done our assessment and we've already implemented changes to our inputs and our strategies to the best of our ability to adjust. And so these questions cause us to then go back and look at those things and see are they are we starting to see an impact from those. Right? And so it it really puts us in a position to reassess the work we've already done and then also showcase the work we've done

120and come back with a deeper answer related to here's what's been done and here's the impact that we're seeing at this point. Did that make any sense or >> to me it did. >> I don't know if to the board. >> Yeah. I mean, for me it does. Um, because what? Yeah, it does. And I understand why he says that interventions versus instructional or getting too much into the weeds, why that can not only cause more on them to try to figure out and add more on the on the report, but it kind of really doesn't tell us anything either, right? It's just telling us what they're doing. It's not really telling us okay out of what you did how did you notice if it's effective if it's working or not and that's where the

121strategy play comes in right cuz we can learn about technical and technical all day but it I still even when I get my technical and tactical question centers it still leaves me confused on well I'm not I don't know if we're moving the needle or not. So board members understand that you definitely especially as you're newer you want to ask technical tactical because especially if you don't know how something is being done or by whom you want to get that information as you progress and you get better as a board member and you get that that um you build that muscle in governance you can really start to lean more into the strategics because you would have understand you would have understood the technical and tactical. So, who's given the the assessment tools? Who's, you

122know, how are how are we assessing children? Are we assessing too much? Um, are they aligned to to to the goals that we want? Um, I heard something really cool in one of your recent board meetings, your leadership team referenced highquality instructional materials. Unless you're in education, you may not have a full understanding of what those look like. Again, technical and tactical time for you to maybe spend with the leadership team like, "Walk me through this. help me understand how are the high quality instructional materials aligned to the assessments and the assessments aligned to the final exam. I think the challenge of most school systems that and I've heard it in your board meeting if you if you're getting complaints that we're assessing and we're testing too much, there might be some misalignment from high

123quality instructional materials to assessing to to to giving the exam to children. What happens in a lot of school systems is that we we over test and we over assess and that might be for a lot of different reasons. What your team is doing here is you're fine-tuning that. But you lead the way by asking the questions >> strategically because getting me technically those questions isn't going to help change that. >> Only thing that it will really help is that you understand how it connects to the strategy, >> right? >> So don't hesitate asking technical and tactical. Be clear that your technical tactical have got to lead to the strategy. question. Is this a measure focus? Does this reference specific metrics and data in it? >> Yes, >> it does. So, it meets the measure

124focus. Is it askoriented? Is it open-ended? >> Yes. >> Is the tone asked in a manner that's not confrontational or accusatory? >> Yes. >> Does it seem respectful and and and in a professional approach? >> Yes. >> Okay. So, it meets the askoriented. Is it results focused? Does the question focus on understanding data rather than sharing opinions? >> Yes. >> Good. Is it time bound? Does the question focus on current performance or past actions or future performance? >> Yes, >> it does. Which one is it? Past or future or both? >> It's a little bit of both because she's referring to the past and then she wants to know what's going to happen by May. >> What do you think, Tristan? Well, I think specifically it's future from now >> to Maine. >> So, at

125least we're clear, right? And it's okay if you ask both. You just want to be how do we get here and then where are we going? She's specifically asking you for the interventions and the strategies around that. So this if if what's the only area that we could probably strengthen this question in out of the smart acronym >> just make it a little bit um more um specific I would say >> close okay measurable attainable realistic time bound strategic okay >> making it more strategic >> more strategic than that great job Katie look at that all right Second one is this strategic. Let's start there. >> We use the word strategy. >> Blade again. I'm sorry. I can't see. >> Might not be >> strategery. >> Yeah. given a percentage of emerging bilingual um or

126increasing one or more proficient level proficiency levels in preIBBM 1 and preIBM2 by 4% and given that 25 to 26 school year only 1% in preIBBM1 and two were the same strate were the same strategies used or something or did something different happen so one is it strategic Well played. >> I mean, yeah, I guess I I'm not joking. I'm being physicious since Tristan already said this, but I mean, we're talking about strategies, I guess. >> Well, he's asking were the same strategies used. >> Oh, so it's a little more basic. >> Yeah. >> Is it focused? Does it does it reference any specific data metrics? Yes. >> Yes, it does. Is it askoriented? Is it open-ended or is it a yes no multiple choice question? >> It is ask oriented. >> What can you

127say? >> It's kind of a quasi one because they could make it pretty closed ended qu like answer based on just picking from the strategies that were available or were used. >> Yeah. Because it's same or different. Yeah, >> it's an or question which is a yes no. >> Yep. >> Yeah. And so here's here's the thing board. When you ask them technical technical questions, they can probably give you a pretty quick response, but it's not going to lead into an in-depth conversation, >> right? When you ask them to tell you the strategies and you leave it open-ended, you let them tell you what's relevant and what they've been gathering over the years or months with how you process things as a board meeting, as a board member. So, I highly encourage you to ask

128them open-ended. Don't lead them down a pathway and then close it. Leave it open so that they can really highlight all the things. And if you think that it's all roses and peaches, then what? tell me some strategies that maybe aren't working as well. And that's kind of where I think you were getting at with this question. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> Yeah. And one of the things we talk about a lot, you've probably heard us talk about it in in our board meetings, is our strategic abandonment because one of you have you have two challenges in education. One is are you implementing strategies that are going to be effective? Do you have inputs that are having a positive impact? But you also can discover that you have inputs that aren't and leaving them in

129the system wastess resources. So, I think that recommendation that if you don't like if what you're looking at seems like it's on track, asking about what's not effective is also really powerful because it helps. We we've had actually a couple of those types of questions that have helped us go we really should stop doing a few of these things. >> Question is it results focused? Does it focus on understanding data rather than sharing opinions? Yes, I agree with you. >> I see no opinion detected. >> Yep. Is it time bound? Does it focus on current performance meaning past actions or future performance, future actions? >> It's comparing a past to the present. >> Very good. This is a pretty good strategic smart question as well as the first one. Just I think the only area

130to fine-tune would be the askoriented piece. And you did great considering that I just put this on you with one slide up on the screen. >> I mean, granted, we've already seen this slide and we had a whole meeting on it. So, we kind of >> we have a fair advantage >> to some degree. And like I said, imagine you got to turn around and you're going to go host a two-way communication. >> How would they interpret this? And how would you articulate what's actually happening on a slide? That's the part that I really want you to to become fully present to. Last one. Think about it. Is this a smart strategic question? So given that the slide four percentage of emerging of emerging multilingual students increasing one or more proficiency levels from pre to

131post IBM test indicated that we would not reach our annual target for that year but we did exceed and that the data from the preIBBM1 to preIBM26 school year also indicates we are short from May 2025 interim target. >> We didn't capture the end of the question. So the end of the question is um what is our confidence level that we are currently off track to achieve interim measure 3.1? And if we don't believe that we're off track, what what indicates that we may be on track? >> I'm not adding that now. We just got cut off. >> Interesting. After all the feedback, all of a sudden, we want to finish our question. >> Oh, you got cut off. >> So, overall, is it strategic? Is it technical or is it tactical? >> I think

132it's strategic. Okay. >> And then is it measure focus? Is it a reference specific data? >> Yes, it does. Is it ask oriented? Is an open-ended question or yes, no, multiple choice. >> It's open-ended. >> Open-ended. Is it results focused? Is it a question focusing on understanding the data rather than sharing opinions? Well, >> a little bit of an opinion. >> Our confidence level sounds like an opinion. >> So, the area that we have for possible improvement is results focus. Right. >> Right. >> Okay. And then is it time bound to talk about? >> Yeah. >> Past or future? >> Uhhuh. >> Good. Can you see the value of asking a strategic question? Yes or no? And then if no, how can I help you understand that this will elevate your progress monitoring sessions? Especially

133if you have in mind, if I don't understand, how am I going to explain it to community when we go do two-way? >> This makes sense to me. I think a lot of the times when we have these it clicks and it makes sense and then when we get to the point of of actually crafting the questions not in this setting I think that's where we start straying away a little bit. So I'm just trying to think on how >> I stray away a little bit. Um, so I'm just trying to figure out how this can be a consistent reggrounding of what a strategic question is moving forward versus it living here, staying here and then we just kind of don't bring it up again and we go on and start and then I start,

134you know, my questions and then they can get unstrategic really quickly if we don't if I don't stay focused, right? So, I'm just thinking on what does grounding look like for when these questions are are meant to be um submitted. >> Technical question for you as the board chair. Is a reminder going out to each board member on hey there's a there's a potential deadline for us to submit a smart strategic question. There is. >> Yes. And there's even calendar invite sent to us. >> Good deal. >> and a reminder email. I was like, I don't know that we have calendar invites, but we do have email. >> Oh, I have it. Oops. >> I don't have calendar invites. >> Okay, maybe we should do that. >> I just keep the message um unread so

135that I don't forget since I don't have a calendar. Okay. I guess Miss Huades is saying that a link was sent out and if you do not subscribe to it, then you won't it won't pop up on your calendar, but it pops up on your school district calendar and and we can figure out how to do that. >> Yeah, it's not on my school district calendar. So, that's what I'm saying. What I want to place in front of you is the I am the genesis mindset of you know I as a coach one what do I need to do to help you and support you uh let me also I haven't mentioned this and >> oh I'm sorry it is there what it is is that if I subscribe to my schoolboard calendar on any

136other calendar it doesn't then take that subscription with it so I have to be on this thing to be able to see it okay sorry I just never realized that because I'm not usually on my school calendar anywhere. I have to have everything in one place. Everything has to be melded. >> We have someone who can help you with that. >> You already say >> no nothing. I was just waiting for you. I >> remember where I was going. >> You was just going to say something that I haven't told you guys. >> I am the Genesis. >> Yes. And then >> Oh, yeah. It took it. I never mastered smart strategic questions when I was serving on my board. And I've got video. I'd be happy to share with you and show you how

137I was horrific at this part of it. It wasn't until after I I ended my service to learn and grow. And most of these documents were developed past my time. So I have also seen the value of if every board member tries to submit one smart strategic question that means you would have five. That is plenty. >> Oh wow. >> For the leadership team. So even if one or two of you don't get around to it and you end up with two or three strategic questions and then you come with technical tactical at the board meeting, you got yourself a good monitoring session. >> So let me say that again. If you all submit at least one, know that that's a heavy lift for your leadership team because they got to go dig into that

138data and the strategies and talk to campus leaders and all. >> Oh my god, I'm feeling really horrible about all the questions I've seen. Oh, >> well, feel free to to narrow that list down. >> I was gonna say, look at Dr. Pombo, >> safe, honest place, right? >> Yes. >> I know that it's recorded. Um, but yes, each strategic question takes a really long time. >> Hours and hours. >> Yes. >> I was like, look at me actually asking really a lot of questions. I was just proud of myself for getting you guys questions. I didn't mean to go crazy. Super vegan overachiever. You're an AP overachiever. Yes. Love it. And also, >> but it was the first time I actually submitted legit questions. >> No, we we very much appreciate that, but um

139>> and I was going to try to say this at some point tonight, no matter what. One high quality, well-crafted question is significantly more valuable than multiple solid questions because like like quality over volume is really kind of critical because keep in mind what you want the team doing is working on the implementation and monitoring of inputs. So while this is an important and valuable part of what we're doing to come back and review it and answer those questions and it does improve our thinking, if it starts to exceed the time assigned to it, there is no extra time anywhere. So that means it come it gets taken away from someplace else which is which is typically on the implementation end. >> And I really like what you said Dr. Ramos that strategic questions get

140submitted and then the technical and tactical followup can happen in the board meeting. Not necessarily that it has to be asked beforehand because those questions of understanding is where I think the technical and technical live and that could be done in a two-way and instead of spending all our time asking this question then having come and report and I think that also is what cuts up into our time and makes it lower because we're not having that fluidity of of conversation at the board meeting. Mhm. >> And I have a question. Like if it's not a smart question, could it just be like a simple phone call or I I don't know like sometimes I feel like maybe mine haven't been like maybe one I was thinking one this time wasn't maybe a smart smart

141goal so or a smart question. So maybe um like that could be a phone call instead of like actually like putting it on there and >> yes, >> you know, >> or or if it's technical or tactical, it could be one you bring with you to the board meeting and we and we're just not researching in advance, right? So >> yeah, let me let me add this part. There's a reason why we do the mindset of the choice bene the choice behavior benefit cost the pretending. I definitely don't want you to pretend and and I know that sometimes it can feel performative. I hope that you're you're almost beyond that phase completely. Again, if you're leaving your board meeting and you cannot connect the dots between the progress monitoring reports and you don't feel comfortable

142to go and tell the community that's what this slide means, we're missing we're missing the mark. >> And that's okay. And this is the time where we can ask for added on support. >> Correct. Correct. And that's what I mean. it at this point where you're at in your journey and the way again the way you all are internalizing the conversation around progress monitoring the way you all can follow the conversation is radically different than three years ago when we first started this journey if you weren't an educator you might have struggled with DNA or all the acronyms this team your leadership team is not pretending they're being honest they're being vulnerable you're being being honest. You're being vulnerable. It is a powerful space that you live in right now. We're just in that final

143phase. You have your you have your be ability to codify your meetings. None of that means anything if you don't understand the purpose of progress monitoring. I want you leaving here knowing how do we get here and then what's the strategy moving forward. Is there one question is there is it appropriate like you know obviously we should be reviewing our own questions in much the same way we did today right um before we submit them but is it appropriate I would say it's appropriate for me I just don't know at like a whole board level for us to like just like if the admin or the leadership team looks at my questions and are like Katie question you know four five and six are not are are technical and tactical. We're not answering those. I

144mean, like I don't care. I just I just don't want to like especially if you know I'll try my best and do better, but what I'm saying is is like I would rather you if you can identify what is a good question if there is something that then you can say, "Hey Katie, maybe you just ask these ones at the board meeting." And I'm not saying I'll just continue to submit like millions of questions, but is there some way we could we could do that? because I would hate for you to waste your time on things that don't even need to be in the presentation. >> I I it doesn't waste our time. What I would say is to create the space for us to do that. We just need to receive them earlier because

145our timeline's super tight right now. So, so the questions are due like the Friday before board prep week. Typically, the team does their first pass on them on Monday to get pull responses together. So that way when we're an executive team on Tuesday, we review those responses and sometimes Lissa or myself or Vanessa or Joel or Emily will see something in it and they'll say, "Hey, I don't know that this is a complete answer because aren't we doing this too?" Or, "I don't think you interpreted the board member's question properly. I think they're asking this, right?" And so then we will kick back that feedback to the team. So that way Wednesday they produce a final result because all of that gets attached to a presentation and sometimes a presentation with the voice over for

146the guardrails that has to be attached to the board meeting agenda by 1:00 on Thursday. So, if if prior to that Friday deadline, people had their questions and they sent them over for feedback, I think we could turn that around and get that back to people, but I think it's challenging for us to do that if we're first receiving those questions, you know, kind of right at the deadline to receive them. I'm going to defer to the team to correct me if I'm >> Okay, I hear that. have to think about like it's a one week tight turnaround for us too and I'm not trying to complain you know but >> it is I yeah >> and I and I think the other thing that I was just going to add too is that um

147I know Dr. Ramos is available to have those quick check-ins and use him as a coach too whenever because that's what I've done. I've called him and I said, "I don't know if this is strategic or am I being too rough on these questions." Like I I'll call him and ask him his personal opinion because sometimes I also don't want my questions to see um you know push off of or whatever. So we have our coach for right now and we can use him as a resource. Any questions that we have I I mean I'm not trying to speak for Dr. Ramos, but I know that he's said that in multiple meetings that if we have questions or we're thinking one way or another, we can always reach out to him and he's there to

148support us. And I can also support in whatever I can. I'm not an expert and I still have a lot of work to do, but also I've lived and breathed this for like the last four years. And I'm also in a cohort right now too to get coached. So, it's it's always on the top of my mind. And >> no, I think I just need to do a better job at like it's once a month and I'll figure it out and you know there'll be some months where that week is going to be bad for me and I'll try my best, >> right? >> Yeah, >> that seems very fair. >> Okay, >> I was just gonna I was just going to add um that Dr. Ramos, you're doing you did a really good job

149of like going over the success criteria. I'm a success criteria. I love it. So like going through each part to check and so that's what I do too like when I'm looking at the progress monitoring reports like check the success criteria to make sure or have someone else check it. Um so I think what you're saying too Sophie is a good idea to have someone check it to see but I know all that takes time. >> Yeah. So I'm I'm a resource and then also um I I think the question is spot on. I I think because you have what we've called a brave space uh superintendent man I don't want to make the assumption for you but I I hope that you're in a position where you could say board member these like 20

150questions might overwhelm us and this is what it's going to do to us and you know narrowing down to one or two like I really hope that you get there sooner rather than later if not already. >> No no I I think I think we're there. I mean, honestly, I I was I wasn't actually joking earlier when I said I was going to be reaching out to Katie because the only reason I didn't manage it today is every time I turned around something else, which I know is not me being the genesis of change, but u but it hadn't fallen off my radar either. So, if it if it didn't happen um during the day today, it was going to happen this evening u that I was going to share something out. So, I wouldn't

151have just let it sit on you, Katie. And then we you we wouldn't have sat in the background and gone, man, she can generate so many questions. >> There there are board members around the country that use this and then they overdo it and they put it in a chat GPT and then they send like 20 questions. >> Yeah. >> So I don't ever want you to get anywhere near that arena. Make them genuine, make them authentic that you want to learn because you want you want to be able to turn around explain this to community. And I am not an expert on strategic questions by any stretch of the imagination, but I'm also like if people haven't figured out that my favorite role is thought partner, like it genuinely is. So never hesitate to

152reach out to me too or or even Dr. Pombo or anyone else on the team. So >> last phase, you ready? Are we good here? And you know, you can reach out to me. Please don't hesitate. Okay, last one. and I am excited to bring you a case study. Uh you should have it printed out nearby. I want to ask you to pair up. Um Katie, sorry you can you you have if you have it, you can read through it. I think I think uh >> I got it. >> Awesome. So I just want you to read read it by yourselves and then I want you to kind of go through not kind of I do want you to go through the discussion questions. Maybe zero in on one or two. Uh but enjoy time

153reading this case study completely make believe not associated with you or anybody in the area but enjoy reading the the the case study and then we'll come back to it. We give you about 8 minutes. without. This one. Just to be clear, I'm answering these questions, but everybody else is partnering up, right? >> Correct. Yeah, just this one. Just one by yourself, Katie. >> Okay. Okay. Question. I see. strategies that they can um figure out. Yeah, the first part it's frame doesn't drive. >> Well, now you have no way to measure. >> It's more about the implementation. >> Yeah. versus the framework itself. >> Okay. >> Sorry. >> I didn't want to rush you. >> No, I interpreted. >> My eye is still >> obvious. >> No, it's fine. I just have to take it's

154showing but in reality it was not when something I'd always say that there's >> annoying >> um so commitment to governance framework should the board remain committed to governance framework why or not >> um number three managing boards >> for me I still think >> because right now it sounds like the board >> member and As a educator, >> I think everyone being like on the same goal page >> I just see it as >> I would say >> as something like I wish was happening in our district >> because I think it keeps people like really attuned to >> the needs >> and everybody on the same page, right? Everybody's not like doing their own thing. >> Yeah. So that's just how I feel about that one. >> Yeah. And I think the issue

155is probably less with the framework than with like do you have the right inputs and are they being implemented fidelity? Like I saw all over that case study that fidelity is the problem. I can tell you from our experience here in Kraton, the reason you see significant differences between sites is because >> I can tell you you don't even have to ask me where the greatest fidelity is because you'll see it reflected. >> So that was probably like one of my questions. Yeah, I think with >> with a one and I and I debated whether or not asking it. >> Maybe they need to be called out. I don't I don't really know. I think maybe next year we're in that place because I think it's been a journey for everybody. One of the things

156I was telling Sophia the other day that >> like here I don't know their story but for us we talk about being in year three. We set goals in May of year one. >> Yeah. >> We set guard rails in September of year two. We set inter measures in December of year two. Right. So I'm not making excuses. We've tried to hold ourselves accountable. I feel like this is the first year that we've really got the data. >> I totally understand. >> So, you know, it's like yes, are we a little off track in some places? Absolutely. Are we getting >> better? >> Yeah. But then that means it's okay for the other person >> like functioning under the SOFG and improving things like progress monitor >> inputs and outputs. Absolutely. So you know are

157we going to make the fiveyear goals I still think we have a fighting chance but but if we got >> if we got if we nailed two of them and got improved on the other three then I would feel like couldn't have gotten there without and we fundamentally really did it in three years, not five. You know what I mean? So, but but at the same time, I'd rather hold our feet to the fire >> and be accountable to it. So, >> there no I think it's we'll take a look at it. So >> if it's not appropriate like like I hesitated but it's really just >> no they were so much >> I mean >> their leadership >> is probably not the best question. So yeah >> feel free to take off. Well, we

158I'll I'll let them know to have that information because I don't know that this moment is the moment they're Did the mics get turned off? >> Oh, okay. Cool. >> Sounds like it did for a minute. says >> and Katie said, >> right? >> Katie Katie. >> I mean partial success. >> I mean um and we know that change takes a long time. >> Need for adjustment. I I mean >> we adjusted some with the numbers, but I'm not saying that they need like goals or anything. I just it's just going to take longer. >> Well, I think I think part of what sometimes needs to be adjusted is >> what you may shift like how you approach them or the amount of resources you put into them, the exp What additional information would help

159the board make a more informed decision? >> So there was an indicator in the thing about how even though you weren't seeing it and we we're experiencing this too. Even though you aren't seeing it reflect >> in the outputs, >> there is uh there is there are signs of growth and improvement. And so one of the problems you have a great example is if one of your measures is for proficiency. Well, if you >> have to care that >> if you have less than a year's worth of growth, then you're really off target because you're never going to get to proficiency. But if you have a year and a half's worth of growth, but the kid came to you five years behind, >> then you're moving them towards proficiency, right? So, so sometimes I think

160like for additional data it may be a deeper dive into data to see what those what what is it that the administration seeing that leads them to believe that there is movement. The movement just hasn't gotten to a point where you're seeing it reflected in the progress monitoring report. Does that make sense? >> No. As a teacher that's I mean that's how I look at my kids data. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Completely. >> Yeah. Because a kid comes to you like >> like I had I had one on third that came in at third grade level instead. >> Right. But Right. >> Right. And are you teaching sixth this year? >> No, it's fifth. >> Oh, fifth. So you got him to grade level which is amazing. >> He is proficient. But I've gotten other

161kids like being a seller, >> you know, pretty much a couple of my dreams into >> Yeah. >> That's growth, right? >> That's huge. But then they don't they're proficient, >> right? And they don't count as being proficient, but >> they move forward. Yeah. >> Yeah. It's not like they say >> so kids are still making growth. It's just not for the proficient. >> Yeah. >> And I think a lot of people don't understand that. Uh, I don't think the general public understands that. >> Well, and I think the hardest thing because this is what I struggle with a lot is I want like you always hear me say my phrase warts and all. We just want to tell you like it is just the facts, right? >> And I don't want to make excuses,

162but I also think it's important to know context and um what are we seeing, right? And so like I think one of the hardest things is to represent that information without it being an excuse. You don't want to take yourself off the hook for being the genesis of change, but at the same time, you don't want to ignore those signals that things are moving in the right direction. And we >> acceleration. >> Yeah. >> It's like um old carbureted cars. You don't really get this so much with like fuel injectors now, but like are you flooding the engine or are you just about to get that >> car to turn over and start, right? Like so if you're seeing signs that the car is going to turn over, that's good. Yes, >> if you're just

163flooding the engine, then you got a problem. We need to make some systemic change. >> Um, how should the board address growing divisions among its members? >> That's awesome. Duke it out. Um, I really think maybe like the study sessions like I feel like we have a a lot of study sessions compared to other people which isn't a problem because like it helps us like understand like deeper, right? So maybe they just >> like sometimes people just don't get it like you you know that like with certain people it's just really hard to explain certain things for them to understand it >> or sometimes they don't want >> because their the opinion they have is more important >> right and it's and that's what's stuck in their head >> um what are the risks if

164conflict continues to escalate publicly I mean I just think >> like how they talked about in there there's so much division going um people finding you know new people to run or you know getting other people outside involved and >> I think the students pay the price ultimately. >> They always do. >> It's all about behavior and adult convenience. Right. >> Exactly. >> Um rules politics and governance appropriate for me. >> You know what I mean? >> Sometimes I'm sorry but sometimes I mean >> you know what what I'm thinking like sometimes yes I'm sorry >> if people aren't on board or they are like they are on a path of destruction or off off railing people then yes >> if someone's doing harm to the district they're not good for kids >> right then

165yes like totally how might election dynamics influ government decisions well I mean I think we all the time Um, >> have political grandstanding students. >> Yeah, totally. Heather Brooks had a whole It was funny because Dana was watching something the other day for all. >> Okay, we'll look to come back in a little bit. >> I hate that she has my name. >> Um, the board ensure that student outcomes remain the central focus. I think it's constantly you open the door and there's just like one of those pictures that you can put it as a background for the kids pictures like all the trees and you're wearing a black shirt. I'm like oh picture Okay, everyone. I want to be mindful of time. >> If I could ask who will give me a little synopsis

166of what this case study described? Who who will explain that to all of us? What happened in this case study? >> Um I I think it's you know people weren't seeing there weren't results. they weren't seeing results as fast or as quickly as they perceived should be happening and then were getting angry and blaming was starting and then division um and a lot of adult behaviors were happening at the expense of children. >> Wow. Thank you. Anyone have anything to add to that? >> I would agree. It just sounds like wasting, you know, your board meeting time, >> right? Which is interesting, right? You spend most of your board meeting time arguing about the things when you could have just been asking the strategic questions to begin with and kind of gotten answers anyways. So,

167it it's just a really interesting concept. I'm trying to understand what the data is really showing because like we talked about data. Um, and I think as a teacher I understand this like your kids may not be proficient in something like you know our Zela scores just came back. Your kids might not be proficient but you might have moved them from one category to another. So there's still growth like good growth going on. they just haven't reached the proficient level where you know but as long as there's like growth going on like you're moving in a good direction. It's not all about proficiency. >> I I love that because you know I've had a transition over the years of understanding what you understand as a teacher as a classroom teacher that that that growth is

168so significant. And so the opportunity you have as a board is how you tell that story that maybe the proficiency level isn't there wi with with the conversation you have with your community. You get to try to help control that narrative. Why would that be? Why is growth important? We didn't get proficiency. So help me understand why growth is significant to you as an educator. >> It means that I did my job. >> There you go. It means >> it means we did our job. when you're moving them. If you if you move a kid from, you know, a third grade level to a fourth grade level and you're a fifth grade teacher, they're not proficient, but you moved them a whole year. That's amazing growth. >> That's right. So, where the student entered my

169classroom versus how the student leaves my classroom at the end of the year that there was growth for for whatever reasons they entered my classroom in this current state, I was a genesis and my my children and my classroom move from here to here. And if anything, I've now helped them close more of that gap. That's part of the storytelling you get to tell. >> Yeah. So, in our conversation, like in the case study, I believe the administration were seeing some promising things like they referenced it very vaguely, right? But the board obviously doesn't necessarily know that. And that's I think why the strategic questioning is so important because it's that strategic qu questioning that drills down to like what's really happening. And um and so like you know Heather framed it really well, but

170like if you're getting a year and a half's growth on kids and they're not at proficiency, you can be frustrated that your proficiency percentages aren't where you want them, but at least you know your kids are getting closer to proficient as opposed to falling farther away from it. And it's just a matter of time before you get them there. So you literally and we see this in district. We've had this conversation in in our leadership team meetings. We see a lot of places where we're just poised to make a big spurt forward, but we're not seeing it in the endofear target results yet, but we're but we're seeing the movement in kids. We're seeing the movement in the quality of instruction in the classroom. Right. But like um Lissa and I were having a conversation

171the other day and I was like well I'm a little bit frustrated because we've moved so many teachers to a three like on our when we talk about our learning walk data. It's like look how much our learning walk data has imp improved. Like we've moved two orders of magnitude in improvement. Why aren't we seeing greater gains in our results? And because she's smarter than me she said well because we're not we don't have enough fours yet. because four is where the students are the ones that are leading the learning and that's really that's the critical thing but you don't go from one to four like that there is no pathway to go directly from one to four it's not like a board game where it's like skip three spaces right so um you know

172ultimately the fact that we've moved the distance we have doesn't mean we can let up on the gas we have a lot of hard work to go but we're closer to getting there than we were we what we always call three years ago and functionally is a lot less than three years ago given our journey. So >> thank you for sharing >> and what go ahead. >> Oh all right. uh in the case study, I I think the big thing is in this situation is um they want to throw out the baby with the bathwater that they're taking the framework and you know the system of accountability and they're taking that as the results from that right or the two board members who are suddenly oh well I need to make my you know constituents

173happy So, I got to do something. Well, let's just throw everything out. At least that's what I took from it. >> Yeah. No, that's accurate. So, question, what what could be done, if anything, to begin to remedy that? What what ends up being in essence a potential split in the boardroom. >> You have to go back to the basics. >> Yeah. It's a complete misunderstanding on their part. So, I think Sophia had several solutions. To me, the most basic would be the mindset work, right? It sounds like there's a lot of adult um convenience going on even with the board and we know about vertical articulation and parallel processing. And if the board starts getting into this ego match or this I think I know better and we're not focusing and reggrounding ourselves in the

174mindset and the I am the genesis of change then this is where that Spider-Man meme comes up and everybody's pointing the finger at each other and it's just going on and on and nothing is getting done. And I I think it would be important in this situation to have like if somehow these people didn't have a coach anymore to to get an outside facilitator to do that just because they're not going to be able to do this on their own at this point. I I'm finally at a point where I can chime in. Um >> thank you Miss Marquez. >> Hello. Hello everybody. I'm so sorry I'm not their family. Family happened. Um so uh I'm looking at the superintendent perspective and it's showing that you know the superintendent maintains progress while slower than projected

175is still meaningful and then gives the bullet points and to me it makes me wonder is that those kind of small details as far as like the gains happening in student subgroups um you know the inconsistency of implementation but uneven across campuses like has that all been presented. How aware is the board of those uh differences? And perhaps it's a situation where in this situation maybe they're not, you know, not asking the right strategic questions, which then leads to like coaching, right? or perhaps you know the the superintendent or the team in this situation are not you know um disagregating the data in a certain way that you can really see the differences and and improvement. So that's that's what I was thinking. >> Thank you for sharing. >> Yeah, I think that you all

176as a team were able to see through this a lot clearer probably than in in many other circumstances. maybe in year one uh may not have been as easy to decipher through this. Um Heather, you were going to say I'm sorry you >> I was just saying that sometimes because one of the questions was talking about is it appropriate for board members to recruit or support challenges. >> I was going to ask. >> Yes. >> Yeah. I'm sorry, but like I'm not saying and I'm not saying like anybody on our board specifically. I'm just saying about this case study that if you can't be on board and you if you can't if you can't do this governance work in in an an appropriate way or a way that is working towards change and is more

177convenient for you then maybe it is time to recruit other people that can or to stop the sabotage and and there like I've felt that way before like like not with these people but other people. Yeah. Like sometimes it's time to get people off that are the saboturs. >> Okay. >> I did disagree with Sophia about that. >> I said the same thing you did >> and I and I say that because when you when you choose violence or in this case uh political opposition that gives the other person the right to do the same thing to you. So then you become an even more dysfunctional board. And if the goal is to be a functional board, then maybe you have to leave the politics out of it. And I'm not necessarily saying I agree

178with that thought that I just articulated, but >> don't follow me to it. However, >> I think that even if you are inviting other people to do that, the difference is is are you letting that then interfere the bad >> No, I think that the difference is how are you letting that interfere and show up within you at the meetings and when you're governing versus what you're doing outside the governing board meeting. And so if that other person is letting, you know, adult behaviors get in the way of things or they're being selfish or they're doing things in meetings that aren't appropriate, that's on them. If you're still, you know, doing what you're supposed to do and then still doing that on the side, I mean, it is what it is at this point. And

179sounds like if they're that way, they're probably not going to do a great job at getting whoever they're getting to run to be elected. But that's neither here nor there. >> I'm not saying that. I'm just saying that sometimes it does require change. >> You mentioned in your last couple of meetings, you mentioned what is a tool that you could use within the framework to try to remedy this conversation of recruitment of of board members, but also what role can you as a board play in preparing people for what? >> School board of school. >> There you go. And if you as a team participate in that, you get to you get to relay the message of I loved board member Marquez saying, well, when I ran and what I heard and what I thought

180and then to watch her lean in the way she has an interest and same with you, right? You didn't hear much. I don't know if you heard much of it, but the way the two of you have leaned in in this process has been pretty inspirational for a lot of folks around the country who who are like, well, what is this thing and why should I adhere to it? >> Oh, I'm gonna have a little tear. >> I mean, it's the truth. Like it >> I'm getting serious. >> Yeah. Right. You've been to conferences. You hear Tristan, I heard you reference that in in a board meeting like what you heard and that I'm lucky. You said, "I'm lucky that I don't have to to go through what some other board members are going through

181around the country." >> And I've had people ask me, well, what is it like with the two new members? And I say, I couldn't even tell you that we have two new members. >> Wow. >> Right. >> So, there are there are aspects of things and I heard you also I heard right here this side of the room. One of the things that I heard you you were talking about a board self-evaluation. In what context were you talking about that? Well, we were speaking of the board self eval and the superintendent when it came down to superintendent accountability obviously, but managing board conflict. Um, I put board guard rails and then I put board self eval mindset too because the board self eval is a really good place to check ourselves before we start pointing

182fingers at anybody else. Yeah, I think it was a number five. >> Yeah. >> Oh, yeah. Number five. And then we put coach question mark to to bring up um Miss Gibson McLean's point of if there was no coach, then maybe this is where a coach needs to intervene as well. >> Got it. >> Any other thoughts before I ask you the final question? So, how should the board hold the superintendent accountable for the results moving forward >> and what are appropriate next steps for like progress monitoring? >> I put calling in executive session if there's so much information like that going. Obviously the superintendent eval but at the point that the board and the scenario sounds it doesn't sound like they would agree or they even know what would be in the superintendent eval.

183So I suggested an executive session that way they can really lay out all the things set expectations moving forward and have a candid conversation. >> Other thoughts? Yeah, I think any action would have to be independent of what the election outcomes are because that's adult convenience. >> Wow. >> Right. >> Well, I it was kind of a trick question from my end. There is a there are two video clips specifically that if you if you email me, I'll send you two video clips. One from here locally and one from Texas over on the coastal side. >> How many live right now? It's uh there are two video clips. One that happened last June from a board nearby where the data did not come back the way it was anticipated by the board. The board after

184almost three years was pretty frustrated. What we witnessed, what I witnessed, what I what I'll share with you in the video clip, this board member did not go into common pretending and blame the superintendent. As much as they wanted to, they wanted to blame the superintendent for for little to no movement. Are you curious to know how that board member responded? The board member said, "I failed this year. I did not submit questions. I did not prepare the way I know I could have. I did not submit strategic questions. I did not ask better questions of the superintendent. Um, and I will own the data that we have in front of us today. It's pretty inspirational to watch an adult from a board seat with political pressures to respond in an I am the genesis

185mindset to say as much as I want to blame everyone else in the room at the end of the day I'm one of the team members that's responsible for the outcomes and I did not ask enough questions about inputs and outputs nor did I understand what was going on in my board meeting and then there was a shift over the summer for this person And then the other person in Texas, they leaned in extra heavy because they realized that they were just kind of checking some boxes and not really internalizing the depth of the work. This year has been radically different for the entire team. So I ask you that question really with in hopes and belief not just hopes I believe listening to you you're saying all the things that you've been learning you've

186been internalizing them you're demonstrating them in yourself evaluating when you when you're here on the dice your minutes have shifted and reflecting my hope and in my preparation for you that whatever comes in June and July that you are in the genesis and be like I am responsible for this outcome I played a significant role in either moving it up, being stagnant, or going down because at the end of the day, you are the outcome. You are the owners of the school system. >> And we vote and approve those. >> And you Oh, come on now. You vote and approve. That's the reason why you have your monitoring reports that you're approving. >> You're approving saying, and I heard Superintendent Man say this recently as well in a meeting, those serve as a micro assessment

187of his performance. Mhm. >> What's coming up for you as we put all the pieces together? Questions, thoughts, and my favorite word that I love y'all using too, any wonderers you may have of our time together today. Was that too deep? Um the main thing that's coming up for me is that sometimes when you're so laser focused and you're going into this work, you want quick expectations and quick turnaround, right? Cuz it's hard it's hard to stay patient. It's hard to stay consistent in the same things and not freaking out when one thing's not working and then switching automatically to another. Um, what this is bringing up to me is how much growth we've had as a board, how much alignment we have, and even doing this case study scenario. This is a real thing

188that happens almost at every board meeting, right? I've seen it, and we haven't had this yet on our board on our board. So, I think it's it it just attests to how committed we are, even though sometimes we feel we're not. I think we're all doing the greatest job. we're asking questions and we're not I don't believe any of us on the board are doing anything in a spiteful matter. So that that makes me feel really good on how much we we've been able to work together to make sure that our students are being prioritized and I really do feel that that's the sentiment of this district and everything that we do. You know, we're we're thinking of those babies first. So it just makes me feel really really happy and it puts a lot

189of stuff in refocus mode too if how fragile it is and if we don't continue on these strategic questions and we don't stay on course how easily it can be to get dissuaded and move away from that. >> You have examples here in the area of when a board loses focus and what it does to the system. I love that you just said the word fragile. One thing I've learned over the course of this journey, this work is extremely fragile. >> So you want to be you want to continue not be because you are you want to continue to be super intentional about your schoolboard school about how you do progress monitoring, >> two-way communication, listening sessions, training students and and educators and community on governance. You put all of those pieces together that's in

190the research, you have a higher probability of sustaining the work and it being effective. If you look at the eight effective characteristics of school boards, you'll see some boards are mentioned in there that are no longer high performance school boards. Some of those boards that are highlighted in the research, and I'll email me or call me and I'll tell you exactly which ones. I don't want to name them here. they they were highlighted in a research and they were thriving and they were doing great and then out of nowhere they ended up with DNF rating school systems and some have even been taken over by states. So it's fragile and um could not leave without letting you know and reiterating what President Kario just said. >> That all is definitely resonating with me especially as

191I see our district that we feed into start to the process of adopting this the the push back that they're starting to get um reminds me of the fra like the fragility and also reminds me not to listen to all of that noise and just continue the course with us even if they sorry my boys are coming in for me today. Um, so like just definitely staying the course and making sure that we're like not letting any of as long as we're doing the community education we need to do and we're educating our community, um, I think we can we can we keep that noise out is what I'm trying to get at. >> Yeah. And the other thing that Katie said too is that I think it's finding our partners and she nailed it

192right as our feeder schools and some of our neighboring schools are in this work. I think that's why it's important for all of us to stick together and have those joint links that we have been having because it's going to bring that added on support to them like hey you're going your your staff is going to start feeling it people will feel it but it's going to be okay and we can work together to work through that because it is a very fragile but it's also a beautiful thing there's a movement going on here in the city of Phoenix with different school districts and us all working together so it's really a beautiful I want to encourage you to keep speaking at conferences because you there are folks tuning in to watch how you're conducting

193business for children. Um that that cannot be overstated. Um and so a little bit of pressure maybe. >> Ah so we should do something at great city schools and cube >> of course >> all of them. I >> I think my final thoughts is you have modeled what parallel processing really looks like systemically. Um, I know that we're almost at time, so we have time for one word. One word to describe our time together. You know me, when we harvest, what's one word? >> We'll start with Miss Shapiro and then make our way around. >> One word, just one. >> I know. >> To describe our time together. >> It's always just the one word. reinvigorating. >> All right, Miss Hilda, you're not exact. You're part of the team. >> Inspiring. >> Constructive. >> Um,

194>> reignited, >> committed, >> aligning, focused, >> thoughtful. Mine is still feeling revolutionary with you as a team. Thank you for your time. >> Um, we have two board members online. >> Oh yes, >> Miss Gibson McClean. >> Auspicious. >> Interesting. >> Miss Marquez. >> Um, uh, I'm tired. Sorry. But I love, you know, thank you, Sinto, for kind of sharing their bits and pieces about, you know, how how you see that we're how we're doing and, you know, that we're we're moving along and doing well and being watched and that's that that is um uh what's the word? I guess kind of in inspiring or almost like, you know, encouraging. Encouraging. There you go. I'll replace tired with encouraging. >> Oh, I love it. Yeah. To the I guess to add a little just

195a little bit more to that part. Um you allow people to see what they can't begin to imagine. What what you are modeling and demonstrating to see it on video and audio, it accelerates other people's belief that this can be a real thing. So, uh, I love sharing your board meetings with administrators and board members and superintendents, but by presenting at national conferences, there's plenty of other folks that are starting to tune in. So, >> is it weird that I just find it so f it's not funny, but I'm just like, this is so interesting that people are interested in this. I don't know. Maybe I just feel like we're doing what we're supposed to be doing. So why, you know, why why do people want to pay attention to that? >> We don't have

196that sense of desperation yet to >> That's true. >> All right. Thank you so much for everybody and taking your time and being with us study session. >> With that, I'm going to go ahead and adjourn our study session. Everybody, we wen have a great night. Thank you guys for joining us online. >> Thanks y'all. Good night. >> Was no. See you next week. >> Bye. Oh, yeah. Hold on. Next week.