001Good evening, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to tonight's school committee meeting uh for our superintendent search. At this time, I'll call to order and ask everyone to rise for the Pledge of Allegiance. I pledge allegiance >> to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> [snorts] >> I welcome everyone. I I put on the agenda a um a public forum segment uh for community feedback. Um speaking with our consultant, that's typically not done um on these types of meetings. So, I did poll the audience uh this evening, and there was three individuals that wish to address the school committee. So, I'd ask you to um keep those uh well, I'll allow you to address us
002this evening. Uh just kind of keep your statement brief and about the district um and not directly comment commenting to any of the candidates that we're considering this evening. Uh anyone wish to address this committee at this time? And I'll just ask you your name and address. >> Ed Casting, 842 Carter Ave, Blackstone, Board of Selectmen. Um first off, I just want to thank you all for the time you spent uh during this search. Um as an analyst for a living, um I can only assume that each one of you has done your due diligence, not only just to look at these interviews, but also research information based off all these districts. And in doing so, I could I could, being allowed, I did find that in looking at these districts that these individuals are
003coming from, Blackstone outshines, which is great to know. It's great to know that the current system we have in place is thought highly of. >> [snorts] >> And I think that, excuse my words wisely, I think that this committee should think about that. Think about those very specific things that this district alone outshines the others that were presented. So, we are doing it right already. And I thank you for your time. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. >> Thank you. Anyone else wishing to address the committee this evening? >> Can you find my time? My clock stopped working on us. >> Okay, thank you. >> Good evening, Chairman and to the school committee. I'll echo thank you for the time. I was here for a couple of the nights and I know a lot of effort goes
004into this, long hours. >> Just introduce yourself. >> Gino Layous, 170 Menden Street. >> Thank you. >> [cough] >> Father of two boys in this district. So, I want to >> [sighs] >> share some thoughts with you. First being you know, I I was here for two of the three candidates. And I reviewed the third one via a link. And personally I find it's just me. I'm not making the decision. That's for all of you to decide. But I I don't find there to be a candidate that stuck out to me. That being said, I want to be fair to the two candidates that were here when I was here. Uh I asked them some tough questions. Uh and they answered them. Uh I wasn't here for the first one, but I think in fairness
005to those candidates, I think in fairness to this committee, cuz you get to hear my questions of that I asked. If I was here for the the first one, I'll share a couple of the questions that I would have asked. One would be uh and that's regarding Dr. Paul Haughey. Uh The retention surrounding staff and administrative staff within the Spencer-East Brookfield district, why is that not stronger? Two, one of the biggest platforms >> [snorts] >> when getting people to join on to the building renovations and capital investments projects on the platform that it would in- induce and attract more kids to the district is a flat, and we see 140 kids leaving the district at a cost of a million dollars to that district through the choice program. And most importantly, I would have asked
006them, why, if you're going through this process, on June 1st, would you submit your letter of resignation to the school committee chairman of Spencer-East Brookfield a week before >> I just if we can just focus on the dis- like concerns of this current district. >> Again, Mr. Chair, I I asked tough questions >> Right. I understand >> candidates. I think it's only fair that you would you would understand what I'm asking. >> He's not here. You weren't here to ask those questions, and he's not here to defend himself. >> Which is great cuz that brings me to my next point. My next point would be that's now for all of you I hope to ask. Right? To fact-find. To verify. To question. And not to just rush to a decision. Base the decision off of
007how well somebody spoke and they all spoke well. They all were had polished the answers. Long answers. Should not alone drive a decision. Rather their actions through their work in other districts compared to the words that came out of their mouths is what should drive that decision-making. I will close with this. Uh rus- rushing to a decision may sometimes overlook sometimes what's right in front of us. And I say that because each one of the candidates talked about in their district how they empower people within their administration and within their educators to reach higher and promoting from within is so very important. So when we look at the totality of all candidates and we look at leadership institutional knowledge, relationships, and commitment we need to at least ask does that already exist? And if it
008doesn't, that's fine. But if it does, what message, what ripple effect does that have throughout the entire district when they look to achieve higher limits within their career right here in this town. >> I'm going to I'm just going to ask you to wrap it up. We're in >> Sure, I'll be quick then. Our students, educators, and families, taxpayers, they deserve the right leader. And not just the available candidate that you guys had to choose from. >> Thank you. >> And I respectfully ask that this committee make a decision simp- simply not make a decision simply for the sake of making one. Thank you. >> Thank you. Anyone else wishing to address the committee? >> Good evening. My name's Kristen Foody, 83 Central Street, Millville. I'm one of the members of the Board of Selectmen
009in Millville. You know, it's always been told to me that excellence is top-down. And when I think of excellence, I think about performance. So, being the superintendent of this school system, that's what we expect. That's what we desperately need. Excellence from the top-down. If the other school systems, if we're looking at data from them, from these other candidates, and we're not seeing results that are meeting the same excellence that we have here or greater, we should take consideration, and we should think about what we really want from this. And of course, I'm sure every single one of you all can resonate with this saying, "We want excellence for our entire district." You know, that's what Millville wants. That was what Blackstone wants. So, it's going to be top-down. That's what leadership is. And we should
010be asking for excellence. I hope the candidates you find are showing that in the current districts in which they serve. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you, everyone. Anyone else after this speaker wishing to address >> 30 seconds. >> Okay, well that's you'll okay, you're going to be the last one. >> Thank you. >> Jenny Chen-Ramka, I'm a principal here at the middle school. I consider myself a decent principal. Um, I think my parents can attest to it. I love where I live and I consider myself a Quinsigamond stonian, but I love Blackstone. And I just want to tell you what we need in Blackstone and what I need somebody who can support me and being selfish. Our district need a superintendent who will be visible, student-centered, and committed to accountability. We need someone
011who will take the time to understand the work already underway, build upon our successes, continue practices such as learning walks, and work in collaboratively with staff, families, and move the district forward. Most importantly, every decision should be grounded in what is best for the students. Thank you. >> Thank you. All right, that concludes our public forum segment of the meeting. >> [snorts] >> Uh, next in this process, we are essentially uh, I'm going to actually next I'm going to welcome >> a resource if you need me. >> Um, uh, Tracy Novick from the MASC who has assisted this committee in this process and I thank you very much >> Thank you. >> for your uh, work on this. Mhm, so [clears throat] um So next in this process is essentially an informal round-robin straw poll
012um, we'll take from the uh, school committee. Um And and before I do that, just to the to the people that did um, present, thank you at public forum and I'm I'm confident that the school committee members uh, individually did their own research and deliberation to get to this point as well. I just wanted to make that clear. For this end of it. But with that, we'll do a round-robin style like straw poll on thoughts of the committee members on who their thoughts are on their best choice for candidates. And I can start at either end. I can start here or >> You're on. You're late. You're on. >> [laughter] >> We [clears throat] may have taken we may have drawn straws >> [laughter] >> before you got here for the straw poll. >> I
013apologize for being late. >> No straw. >> And I'm uh hired by the school committee. I'll be directed by the school committee. Um I In doing my research, I um I found a lot of the similar things that we heard from the um public forum tonight. Um I don't know that what we were presented with as far as candidates in this shortened time. We we didn't have you know, it wasn't a normal search. It wasn't a uh as much of a widespread net that we could have have sent out. So, I worry that, you know, we don't have the best of the best coming to us. Now, that being said, the candidates that we had did present themselves all well in their in their own way, I feel. Uh they all had their each individual
014strengths and, you know, uh played upon those. So, um I don't know if I'm supposed to be stack ranking anybody or how I'm supposed to be doing this. Uh it's my first time going through this, so um I will say that, you know, if I had the choice, um I would want a different choice. Or more choices, I should say. Chuck. >> Uh All the candidates were vetted by the MS MASC. So, I I my opinion was would be that I I felt we had a couple of good candidates. Uh both of them coming uh from regional school districts. I hear people talking uh about someone not telling the truth or you know, I I'm going to take >> [snorts] >> take that with a grain of salt, you know, just he said, she said.
015Uh The Spencer School District you know, we've heard about it over the years. It's really tough school. I used to go there on sporting events >> [snorts] >> and uh you know, I've just familiar with that school system and uh so, I'm I personally with Paul Houli I He's got the experience working with the MSBA. He's got the regional experience. The state was in uh that school district was in state receivership. He saw them through that. They had a growth in their testing accountability. Um I feel like he checks off all the uh the list that we have we can check off the experience. We don't need someone to come in here and change things. Our ship is running smooth. Which is tells you, you know, that our administrative staff has been doing a good
016job, the teachers are doing a good job. Oh, we we need [clears throat] someone here just to uh we can't expect someone to come in here and spend the rest of their career here. So, whether they they spend 5 or 6 7 years here and they move on to another school district or they finish out the end of their career. All we need is someone steady and strong to guide the ship over you know, continue on, get us past this school uh building project. So, uh that's my thoughts. >> Thank you, Chuck. Tara. >> Um so, I did do some research. I did go on the DESE website. >> [snorts] >> I did compare the two Massachusetts superintendent candidates and their districts. I did look at staff retention. Um and I did also look at
017accountability. And I looked at accountability through the years that both had served. I did see strong growth in David Prouty from their state retention. I think one was 57% in a year. Um I did feel like I I hear [snorts] the concerns of some and I hear the positive of the of others. With that being said, I do feel like he has got the financial experience, the MSBA experience, and for me he mentioned the student and the whole student numerous times and the importance of the whole student. So, I would say in my personal opinion, Paul is the one with the most experience. >> Okay. I'm going to kick it over there and say what I say. Go ahead. >> Um so, um again, as has been said, um, each candidate does have their strengths
018and they also have their weaknesses. Um, judging by the path that our district is on, I actually don't have a choice out of the three. Uh, there's not one that I would, um, suggest. >> Okay. Jane. >> Okay. Okay. So, I have 11 pages >> Oh, you you we we expect you to talk. >> I have 11 pages of notes. I will not read them. Um, but I I have I will enter into, um, whoever is going to do the minutes for this, we did ask for feedback from the community, from administrators, and, um, community members. You it has been shared with all of you, but we will enter it into our minutes and make it available if people, um, I will say that I did, um, make one change. There was an individual who
019identified themselves personally, um, by their title, and I just changed that to reflect what group they would fall into so that nobody was identified with a particular comment. Um, so, we will add those to the minutes. Um, I have been in this since the the beginning and, um, was part of the initial screening committee. I believe we brought candidates who are all qualified, all met the criteria that we had, and I think it's kind of us to have a tough discussion on what we're really looking for. If we're looking for finance, regional schools, MSBA, facilities, budget stability, Paul Haughey presented the strongest evidence. He did. Um, if we're looking for balanced leadership with strong community engagement and operational management, Matt Aaronworth's pretty competitive. But, if we're looking for collaborative team leadership, operations, relationship building, um,
020Amy Anzaldi, again, was probably the most um competitive. They all align to our BMR blueprint. I actually put it into G chat GPT what our blueprint says and what their actual transcripts of their um interviews, what they said, and they all actually align and come out very strongly. Having said all that, I do not support any of them to move forward in this process. >> Carrie. >> Like we all did, I have spent hours and hours and hours on debating between all of these candidates. Um they each bring their own strengths, but they each bring their own weaknesses as well. If if thinking about what the climate around our district has been like recently budget-wise, I weighed a lot on fiscal responsibility in my decisions because I don't want to see us ever being in
021trouble. Um I put a lot of thought into our MSBA project that we have ongoing and the push we're going to need within the towns for them to know about our MSBA project and where we are in that. Um Yeah, I I think we've all done our due diligence on this. Um Out of the three, if I was to choose one of the three um as our strongest, it would be Paul Haughey out of the three. >> Thank you, Erin. >> I was delighted to see the finalists that were brought to us because they all had experience and we were we knew searching at this time of year. >> [snorts] >> It could have been nothing and it could have been this. I we we couldn't even ask for more to be honest at this
022time of year. The the typical time to search is late December posting, interviews going into January. That is typically when experience is moving around and you're going to get that bigger pool. So to see original [cough] three [clears throat] experience superintendents with many years of tenure that had all worked here before want to come back. I was I was honestly complimented by that. That says a lot for our district. They've been here. They left to better themselves and they wanted to come back. That's a compliment. It's a compliment to BMR. It's a compliment to our towns. It's a compliment to our work. Um The the two additional candidates um Amy had amazing experience as well. Um I thoroughly enjoyed meeting Amy. And if we were looking for a different position, I think she would be
023an asset to our schools, our community. Um >> [clears throat] >> She has a lot of education experience behind her. And I'm kind of sad that it's just I don't think it would be the right fit for where we are right now. That building project is it's necessary and we're not hoping to get into the pipeline. We're in the pipeline. And it is in my opinion the top priority of our needs right now. We are we are okay everywhere else. Um, our teaching and learning is never going to stop. That is why we are all here. Um, but we're trying to better the district in other ways and it has to be at the forefront of of the work at this time. Um After Paul's interview the other night, I felt like we did not
024need to even continue with other interviews and to see his sincerity with our community which I feel he had he had a better presentation of himself at during the community event than our interview. I think he got very nervous. Which I think is humbling as a tenured educator and doctor and professional in our community, he was still nervous at our table. And I for me, what I've reflected on over the past week is how bad he wants to be here. And then I think about other people have dream jobs and I think we're his. I do. I I did a little bit of research. Though maybe he turned in his letter of resignation on June 1st, he also had never searched for another position in the eight years he spent in Spencer-East Brookfield. He had
025never applied to leave there. He was dedicated to them until now. BMR opened back up and I think he's lived here. He's worked here. And it's his community and this would be home for him. And I think he would treat the kids like home. I think he would treat our facilities like home. I think he would treat the work like home. And I don't think we would have gotten that in any other candidate, even if it was January. Um I think he would have applied in January. Personally, I wish we had been able to ask questions. We ran out of time and we never had you know, follow-ups because I would have asked Matt if he if this job had opened last year when we had to have would you have applied? I don't I
026wonder what that his answer would have been. I feel like I wouldn't I wouldn't have to ask Dr. Hawley that question. He was so sincere to our community. >> [clears throat] >> I also think it would be a positive that he's in our community when we have to go to those town meetings in >> [clears throat] >> in the fall for our school building. And it won't be his first rodeo. He's done this before. He's gotten it passed. That building is completed and partially opened. So, maybe there's some school choice kids leaving right now, but they're not that's their grand opening is this fall if I'm correct. So, has it been tenacious working with port portable portable buildings and school choice? Um I would say yes. I I can't I've never actually seen the building.
027I know some of us did get to tour um and see that work going out there, but it's not going to be easy to the to live through a building project. Um but he's already done it and they're about to open their building. He got it passed from the communities who are in a different place financially um than we are. And we are not, I'm not saying we're anything, but comparatively being in receivership and then getting a building project approved and then fixing your receivership is huge. You know, the finances would be trusted, in my opinion. He was, I believe, also on our town's finance committee. And and he was a selectman in town. So, you know what? I believe that shows dedication to our towns. It shows dedication to his community. I hope it's
028never negatively looked at that I was on the school committee for almost 14 years when I'm looking for my dream job because I did it for the betterment of the kids at that time and the school district through these years. I haven't done this for fun. Um would I be called a politician? Maybe. I've never put myself in that category. I I I think um my choice is Paul Haughey. It was from the day of his interview and forward. Thank you. >> [snorts] >> Okay. >> [clears throat] >> My turn. Not liking the numbers here. It's Um well, I did um dig into all three candidates and any resource at my disposal to reach out to people to have conversations and understandings and I I did get a wide uh range of responses. Um but
029I think I've been very pretty consistent in my position um on this. I've had the fort you know, the fortune of being elected the chairman of this committee. This is my would be the beginning of my third year. This would be a third superintendent um in that those three years. Uh, Someone of us had mentioned the ship is running smooth. Uh, and and we can't expect someone to be here for the rest of their career, but we could and the ship is running smooth for that reason. Um, and the ship was running smooth because of the work that this committee has done and the administration has done. And I look at the work that this committee's done, this administration has done, and I compare it to what we have in front of us. And we're
030already ahead of the curve. I I I have no stake in this in in in in in the district outside of my willingness to serve the communities and the most importantly the the children of this district. And I can't [clears throat] in good faith choose any one of the candidates that we have in front of us this evening. So, that's my stance. So, with that, it is four to four. >> It is. >> But, we have a candidate. >> Mhm. >> So, we can continue to deliberate or even take a a motion on that candidate. >> Yep. >> So, what would be the plan? >> So, I would like to make a motion >> Okay. >> Thank you. That we enter into negotiations with Dr. Haughey to become our the next superintendent of Blackstone Millville
031Regional School District. >> Okay. Uh, motion made by Aaron. >> Second. >> Uh, seconded by um, Chuck. Any dis- any further discussion? >> Yeah, I have a lot. >> Okay. Closure. >> So, I'm more than mine. Okay. >> Um so, I'm going to read some of my thoughts. Um I think um a recurring theme in Dr. Haughey's interview was finance facilities MSBA projects um agreements. He talked about overrides, municipal relationships, and those are important skills. But, BMR is not in the position that Spencer-East Brookfield was in when he arrived there. Our challenges are not a failing building project, financial receivership, academic issues, broken town relationships, deteriorating facilities. That's not where we are. We're in the middle of curriculum alignment, instructional coaching, writing initiatives, assessment systems, MTSS development, improving student achievement. Dr. Haughey didn't speak to
032any of those. He didn't speak to a leadership drive. He did not speak to an academic curriculum. I he he did not speak to driving the you know, leading a staff in those directions or how he would work with the central office staff. Um he spoke about what he built, what he changed, what he implemented, what he fixed. Um and I learned a lot about Spencer-East Brookfield during his interview, but I didn't learn a lot about what he knew about BMR now. I heard about what it was like when he was the principal, when he was the director of special ed, but not where we are now. I'm not sure he did the homework of moving this district from the point of where we are um to where we need to go with the current
033administration, with our current staffing structure, with our current climate. I'm not sure that he has the effective leadership abilities to be a boots-on-the-ground in the school, communicating with people. Um I think he he is a very good communicator in the process, but in the day-to-day operations of walking around and being There's a difference between presence and being present. Um and I'm I'm not sure that I saw that. Um I Uh well, I have other comments, but I'm not going to um I think he understands the history of the district. I'm not sure he understands where the district is now. Um I I left the interview understanding Dr. Hahi's accomplishments. I was less certain that he had spent sufficient time understanding what is already working in BMR and how he would preserve it and grow it.
034Um that was also true for some of the other ones, too. He Dr. Hahi is clearly an experienced superintendent with strengths in finance, advocacy, and community relations. However, BMR is not a district in need of rescue. It is a district experiencing positive academic momentum through years of intentional work. The last time we did a search, we intentionally looked for curriculum development, academic instruction. We looked because we were losing that. Our students were failing. They no longer are, and we need to keep that going. The assessment and coaching [clears throat] we have we have coaches and leaders and and team leaders and district leaders and we need to continue to build that and grow that. I'm not convinced that Dr. Hahi demonstrated the level of instructional leadership, organizational listening, and commitment to continuity that our district
035needs at this particular moment. So I will I do not support him as our next superintendent. >> Thank you. Any further discussion? >> So can I ask a question? >> Yes, sure. >> And maybe we can have a little discussion about this. What is the need of our district right now? What is the need for like let's take it one year at a time. I'm I will start it and say MSBA [clears throat] project is a is a high need. We're doing great. We're moving forward with learning and curriculum and continuity. So, I don't Does anyone else agree with that part with the MSBA as a huge Or is there some another need that anyone thinks is higher than >> need anyone to come in and rescue us and I don't think Paul Houli was
036trying to to do that. I think he has the experience to lead us through this building project. >> I've said numerous times like the building project is a massive undertaking for our district and extremely important, but it's not the only piece of our district. >> No. >> Um but I do feel that we have been in error then if we're going to have this conversation now after having candidates in here. And we're going to discuss what our priorities are now when we couldn't have questioned any of them to those points. >> Well, we listed our priorities on our job application. >> I got that. >> I'm Do you have a Does anyone have the job application? >> I have a copy of the um >> announcement? >> Yeah. >> What were they? >> Um I
037passed it down there. >> Yeah. >> I already read it. I just wanted to say it publicly. >> Oh. >> I I Can we read it out loud? >> Yeah, go ahead. >> Okay. >> Sorry, I just threw my pen at you. >> [clears throat] >> The School Committee of Blackstone-Millville Regional School District in Massachusetts invites qualified candidates to apply for the position of Superintendent of Schools. We give a little history about our district and then it says leadership profile. The staff and community believe all students can learn and meet high standards and expect students to be engaged in a supportive learning focused community. School Committee seeks an innovative leader with experience in long-range and strategic planning, developing data-driven goals, implementing curriculum focuses focused initiatives to increase student achievement, and demonstrating strong fiscal management. The
038successful candidate must lead technology integration to support instruction and oversee several infrastructure projects including an MSBA high school project currently in the feasibility feasibility schematic design phase. The successful candidate will work closely with the dedicated staff and an in- involved community to maintain and foster a safe, healthy, and intellectually stimulating learning environment. Developing positive relationships and maintaining >> [cough and clears throat] >> open communication with community members and town boards is imperative. I can keep going. Minimum [snorts] qualifications: licensed as superintendent, assistant superintendent in Massachusetts, or eligible for licensure. Master degree required. Minimum 5 years of administrative experience. Experience teaching K-12. Deep understanding of Massachusetts Regional School District finance and business operations. Understanding of the MSBA project building project process and desire to lead the district to successful completion of the current project. Ability to
039successfully oversee continued implementation of the Massachusetts Curriculum Frameworks, educator evaluation, technology integration, successful special education program, standards, aligned formative assessments, and data-driven decision-making. Understanding of the proven success with interest-based bargaining, and developing partnerships to provide a 21st century education for students. Citizenship, residency, working visa, United States. Preferred qualifications, doctor doctorate degree, central office experience, and 3 to 5 years of teaching experience in K to 12 systems. >> Which he doesn't have. >> I I believe he checks all of those boxes, but I >> I don't >> But we did have heavy in here and that's >> teacher, but I don't We didn't disqualify him as a result of that, but he did the special ed track. >> Any further discussion? Mr. Chair, I'll say all of those qualifications, everything that we've spoken about, staying on
040the you know you know, moving the ship forward. Uh MSBA We're on the right track with curriculum. I'll maintain what I've been saying all along and say that we had the right candidate. I think this board was unable to come to an agreement, unfortunately. Um but I still think we have the right candidate in this district. And I'll leave it there. Any further discussion? >> I believe the only people we're deliberating right now are the people that applied for the job. >> That's what we're doing. >> But that Right. So if someone else wanted to be a candidate, they could have applied. >> Right. They needed to follow the MASC. >> Right. And And Mr. Catalano's entitled to his opinion on that, but we're we're we got a motion and a second on a candidate
041that we're discussing. >> I I do want to follow up on something James said. I did hear Mr. Hawley speak to curriculum, and I actually heard him speak to adding more opportunities in CTE for students. Um he did commend our administration and our curriculum leads for the work they've been doing, and he did mention wanting to build off of it. [snorts] >> Okay, any further discussion? Okay, hearing none, I will It's just for the transparency purposes, I'll take a roll call vote. The uh the motion was to enter into negotiations with uh Dr. Paul Hawley, uh made by Aaron, seconded by Chuck, and I'll do a roll call vote. Um Jane? >> No. >> Aaron? >> I second. >> Sorry. I don't know why I did that. So, Carrie? >> Yes. >> Aaron? >> Yes.
042>> Matt? >> No. >> Chuck? >> Yes. >> Carrie S? Yes. Carrie L? >> No. >> And I'm a no. So, vote is four to four, the motion fails. Are there any other um uh motions uh for um candidates? Okay, hearing none. I'll probably ask you for your guidance at this point. >> Um I mean, my first thought is to look at the calendar, um which is that you you are legally required in Massachusetts to have a superintendent. Um and I believe that you stop having a superintendent July 7th. Is that right? Something like that? >> I think the first week of July. >> Actually >> June 30th? Okay. Um so, we're looking at something in 2 weeks. Um, the the difficulty becomes um, that is sort of you you've the path you had perceived
043prior to going to the search is, you know, the one that usually becomes the one that um, is the the the quick turnaround. And obviously in your case it wasn't, right? Because you couldn't come to an agreement. Um, >> [clears throat] >> if internal if there is not an internal candidate, you've done a search and you scuttled the search. Um, and though the search that you were doing was for a permanent position. Um, you can look for an interim superintendent again. Um, the one difficulty with that is that um, interim superintendencies can either be um, someone who is qualified to serve permanently or it can be a retiree who comes back and does the position for a year. Some of this may be things you already know. I apologize if I'm repeating information you have.
044>> Okay. >> Um, the one difficulty is that if you have a retiree, um, often they will need a waiver in order to serve because they're receiving their pension. In which case this the um, department would require you to post the position for 2 weeks. Um, and then take applications, go through an interview process and so forth. So the the the barrier here in terms of that sort of thing is time. Um, I will say that um, that that is a more recent phenomenon in my my experience. That's something that the department previously wasn't requiring, but now they're being very difficult around waivers. Um, if you weren't looking for a retired superintendent, you would have more or less the prospects that you do um, though lesser, so. Um, because of because of the decisions you
045you've sort of have already made. >> Can I Can I just ask them now that you're saying that? >> If we did choose a candidate tonight, they would have had to start essentially July 1st. >> Yes. >> So, and >> So, you were on a You were You were already >> are currently employed. >> They are. So, >> So, they would have had to >> They would have had to go back >> Right. And I will say that in my 11 years of experience, I've never had a school committee say no to someone who cuz most of them of course have a part of their contract that says they have to give at least 60 or 90 days. I've never had a candidate a school committee say no to that. They certainly can. Um but
046yes, and you would also need to be in some form of agreement with a candidate in order for them to start. Yes. >> Right. >> So, what So, what if it's a requirement to have a superintendent, what happens if there is not a superintendent on July 1st? >> We can call the department and ask. >> Yeah, I don't know. I mean, the the problem becomes you have There are a whole kind of I mean, some of you may have actually even seen a list of things that superintendents are required to do in Massachusetts and that one kicks into effect for next year starting on July 1st. Um I will say I've never asked the hypothetical question, Jane. That's a That's a good one. Um yes, but there's there does need to be somebody who's filling
047the position. >> Okay, so we the executive session does not fit that criteria. >> It does not. You actually I do not know of anything that you could discuss in executive session regarding this. In fact, >> Um okay, so we got to pick another meeting date quickly to determine Yeah, we'd have to pick a date to determine the direction um of the committee. >> Yes. >> Yeah. We don't want to discuss that. >> And you are correct that you can't really discuss that this evening. I I feel badly about that to you because you are the clock is ticking, but you're not posted for that. >> And then you cannot post a meeting for another 48 hours. Although this could potentially fill in the emergency. >> You could try that one with the AG. I
048I don't I never count on that one. >> other things that the chair >> Uh that's a >> business unanticipated by the chair. >> may may let me check the balance of that agenda. So we do have Well, actually Thank you. Um items listed on this agenda are those reasonably anticipated by the chair to be discussed in the meeting. Not all items in fact may be discussed. Other items not listed may also be brought into discussion to the extent permitted by law. >> I was going to say so you you would be if you were to proceed with a discussion, you would be proceeding under the AGIS that this was not something that was anticipated by the chair and thus could not have been posted. >> Well, that's fair. It's fair to say. >> fair
049to say. Yeah. I would be cautious about doing too much business under that, but >> I >> We also are looking at the time frame we are. >> Yeah, I would So at least we have the discussion on the direction we want to go in. >> Yes. >> For the purpose of a posting maybe another meeting too. >> So that you actually have a reason for Yes, so that you have a context. >> Yeah, I think that's the fair safest way to proceed. Okay. Thank you, Tara. I'll give you Um I have everything else in this folder but the agenda. >> That's okay. >> Um Okay. Direction. So the direction would either be essentially what you said. We post for another search, repost for a post for an interim, or or or >> you try
050again with an internal, but you had gone to a significant extent with that one already as well. But the the three ways are you can do a permanent, you can do an interim, or you can do an internal. That would be my That would be my list regardless. >> Okay. What's the pleasure? >> If I had a magic hat rabbit, I certainly would. Um the only two comments that I will make is that I um I was frankly surprised and pleased at the quality of candidates you had. >> Yeah. >> Even setting aside the the sort of local tie. Um uh this is um I I would not have anticipated you getting both as many candidates as you did, and also the level of experience that you did. Um so just lest you wonder too
051much as to whether or not that was entirely what happened here. Um I had multiple searches this year. You actually had more candidates and had more candidates with more experience than many of those searches. So just to put that on the table. >> Very good. What direction? Do we have any? >> I don't think we have time to do a a search. I mean we tried to do it expedited and couldn't reach consensus here. Um so I think we have to look to name an interim, which impacts a lot of the work that we said we were trying not to impact the work. Um and yeah. >> And Yeah. Yeah. Um but we could do something similar to what Marlborough did and say interim with the opportunity to, you know, become permanent. Like I I
052don't know, but I just don't think we We don't have the time to do >> does open up our calendar to to search at the preferred time of year. Correct. >> So with that being said is we have qualified candidates in front of us that have superintendency, they have the license and um do we entertain offering an uh one-year contract interim with the option to extend if proven themselves or I I don't know. >> That interim if they wanted the permanent position would be willing to go through the interview process with everyone. Correct? >> Or we have the option of offering the job which is exactly what we did last [cough] year. >> [clears throat] >> It's exactly how we ended up here. Just we we entered into an interim option with our current our
053assistant superintendent and then they offer you know the the offer was entertained to enter into contract negotiation to extend that contract. So no maybe no Chuck my I I'm saying like if that interim is working out we can just negotiate with them just like we did for 5 months this year. >> But if we're saying name an interim to then be able to do a full search at the same time we kind of don't >> saying it does give us the opportunity to do that. If we offer it to an interim we can either extend that person this like Jane just mentioned Marlborough. When our last superintendent left here, he left for one year with the option to extend. >> Which they did 3 months on the job. >> And then they did that pretty
054quickly. So is there a candidate we would want to offer that to with the option to extend because then it gives us time to I don't see the work. I guess. >> So, if if a interim search is posted and done is is it it it's not this kind of detail of search processes that like is it can you just appoint an interim? >> Um it depends. If you um >> If it's a retiree? >> Right. It depends on whether or not you need a waiver from the department. If you need a waiver from the department, no, you cannot just appoint. Um if you were appointing someone who was working full-time now and continued [clears throat] to do so, then yes, you could. >> That's what we did last summer. >> Yeah, so it's only
055if you need a waiver from the department that you get into the question around um having it posted for 2 weeks and being able to demonstrate that you had considered other options, but that all of the other options had failed. And they do go into what I would consider excruciating detail on that. >> Well, we don't have any we we we We will not have somebody on July 1st. We don't have the time to have somebody on. We couldn't come up with >> We offered it to one of our the candidates here that we were considering tonight. >> An interim? Mhm. >> I'll just say this is not going to change my vote. I'll just cut that conversation, so that's where I would stand on that. That wouldn't change my vote. >> But it does
056fix our July 1 problem. >> Well, we we also can consider extending for the period of time the current interim. But I don't want to get too deep into that because that would be contract negotiation. >> I'm also not willing to entertain that. So. >> That's fine. And by the way, the negotiations with that person was not 5 months. It was like maybe two and a half tops. So. It was maybe about 6 hours actually. [snorts] >> So I I'll move that we post for an interim superintendent position. >> Okay. Motion made by Jane. >> Seconded by Tara Lockington. Any further discussion on that? >> Can we just clarify what the time is on that so we make the motion on what is today? 17th? When does that get posted? Like where where are we?
057Because we are >> But >> Yeah. >> Do we have to have another meeting to actually officially do that since it wasn't on our agenda? >> Um I think that if you're a you're voting to scuttle the search and to move forward with an interim, I think that that would probably still be in order. >> Okay. I'm not a lawyer, but that would be >> This would be in order. >> That would Yeah, that would be my best >> I think it's a response to the unanticipated result. >> Unanticipated decision of the district. >> Yeah. >> So I guess my official motion is to scuttle this permanent search and uh post for an interim superintendent for a 1-year position. >> Okay. >> So second. >> And that was a motion by Jane and seconded and
058Carrie, was your question answered? >> It was, yeah. >> Okay. Any further discussion? All those in favor signify by saying I. >> I. >> Any opposed? >> I'm opposed. >> Okay. Okay. So it's what [snorts] 5 3? Did I get that right? Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> So we can post that tomorrow. My question is then what kind of process are you anticipating and are you still trying to get someone in the door for July 1st, which is more or less in 2 weeks, 2 and 1/2 weeks? Or do you want to see if you can extend any current things for even a number of couple of other weeks to see if you can give yourself breathing time and maybe you don't, but >> No, we need July 1st, so can we post for
0595 days? What's the minimum posting time to >> So the I mean the the only ex- the only exterior requirement for length of posting um is if you end up potentially needing to go get a waiver from someone who has been a retiree who has been working. If you were not going to consider any of those, then there isn't any requirement. Um you will cut off there will be people that you won't get because of that who are retirees, but if you are more interested in people who might sort of do a tryout run, you would be largely thinking about that anyway. >> What is 2 weeks from now? >> Oh, I just had a little >> Sorry, what is what? >> It's 2 weeks from now. >> 2 weeks from now is July 1st.
060>> Like literally. >> It is exactly July 1st. >> Yes, July 1st is on a Wednesday. >> So we need a 5-day search and 5 days to make our decision, I guess. >> Once the posting closes, then then what is the process? >> So that >> It's obviously not what we just did. >> No, you did it you so you did a um We were doing Doing permanent search. So you were still doing confidential applications. Part of what you can specify in the circumstances is that you are not doing a pre-screening that everything is going straight to the school committee. And I have done that before within term searches. We just make sure it's everyone is very clear that this is entirely a public process. So you would get all of the applications when the
061applications close. You would make a decision then about how you want to proceed. Presumably you would do interviews with people that you wanted to to actually see based on the applications had gotten. >> We can do a half an hour each person in one night. >> You can. >> Or we could just make a job offer. >> Uh >> Based on >> Arguably you could do that as well, yes. >> So just to put a little kink into the calendar, I am scheduled to fly out on the 25th. >> to have to do virtual because I'm >> I was going to say I I actually leave town on the 24th until the 1st. Um although I will be reachable the 24th through the 27th. Our national conference is next week. I'll be in Idaho. >>
062You'll be where? >> Idaho is this year. Different state conferences different state associations host. So Boise. >> [clears throat] >> Okay. >> But I'm reachable. >> state. >> I've heard that. I'm looking forward to it. I've never been there. Um but I I won't be I won't be reachable those beginning of the last week of June. But then I'm back on the 1st. >> What's five days? >> For what it's >> So you're we legally have to have a superintendent. The licenser? >> Yep. >> So our our active assistant superintendent as of July 1st holds the license >> of a superintendent. >> Yes, they do. >> So where does that leave us? >> So I think you probably probably part of your posting because again, you're just simply not going to have time. I mean,
063even for you could try it. Um if you held, for example, the licensure I hold of a school business administrator, you can pretty quickly step into having um the the preliminary licensure of a superintendent. Um you may want to to make that part of your consideration though that they essentially already hold the licensure that they need to have. >> No, I'm asking like legality where that leaves us. If we don't have the person on the title of superintendent, but we have someone in the building that has the license because we did have a uh >> That makes sense. >> Um when our last assistant superintendent left, we didn't they held the business. >> Yeah. >> So, um there was a time frame where our superintendent had to >> We would >> um apply for and
064get that license legally. >> So, >> I think you would I So, I again, I wouldn't I I wouldn't dare speak for the department. I think that they would say that they would want someone to be acting superintendent. For whatever time you don't have someone who's beneficially appointed. >> Okay. >> I do believe we have more than one in the district though. >> We do. >> Yeah, we do. >> So, we should probably send out a uh survey tomorrow to find out who holds the >> Who holds this license? >> You can actually look it up on the the that's public information. It's the licensure look up allows you to do that. >> Okay. >> So, if you want, that's not hard to get. >> We have We have several. >> I mean, I just
065need to get this out there cuz it's to make it make sense. We have a current um interim superintendent that holds the license. >> Mhm. >> Why wouldn't we just extend that? We'd do a full search. >> She told us she was returning back to her position on July 1st. That was her choice. >> based on the offer that we presented to her. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Like why wouldn't we just consider having a conversation with her and then going out to a full superintendent >> Because we're here. We're here a month into this search because that didn't work out. I I honestly, I would rather put a Is there going to be an internal search? If there's other people in the building that can hold it? >> So it makes no sense to me.
066>> have to apply. >> So you're saying do two searches when we already have one in the position. >> No, we're saying that we need to do a full search. >> Regardless, there's two searches. Or two appointments. However you want to put it. Someone for the time being and then someone moving >> Okay. >> moving forward. Yeah. If somebody has interest somebody can apply. >> Fine. I I just wanted to I just will be searching for the next several months. >> Yes, because that was the plan for tonight anyway. So. >> What was the plan was what? >> That we're not we're never going to find anybody. That we've had we have very qualified people in front of us, but nobody's ever going to be good enough. So we'll just keep searching. >> Yeah, you
067were you were right. >> kids will be the ones that suffer in the end, unfortunately. But we all want what's best for the kids. So we're posting tomorrow for how many days? >> Five days. Is that what someone said? Five days? >> I said five. >> Okay. >> Is it five business days? So is that next Wednesday? [clears throat] Does it have to be five business days? They could be five. >> So you given what you are doing, you already are going to be short for what the department wants, which means you need to make sure that you're not picking someone who needs a waiver. Um you could I mean if you were to make it neat, you could simply say that you're closing on the 24th, which is I don't know if that it
068matters in terms of business days versus weekends. We just take them the way that we got them. And then my question would be what then you would want to do. I mean the applications are Well, I guess I let me back up. What do you want for the applications because I mean, we have an application that gives all of their information. Um you're because of the shortness of time, the one thing I would say people might have difficulty with is getting letters of recommendation if they're trying to generate something new. Um so you might consider instead planning to follow up with the references that they list on the application and have that be something that maybe you do amongst yourselves that you make phone calls. >> What about a statement of interest? >> Statement of
069So you So what you could do is you could do an application um a statement of interest and their CV which may have a different additional information on it. Is there anything else you would want? >> No. >> So do we have statement of interest, regular application, their qualifications, references, >> certification, Well, that would I To me that goes on the application. >> Something like licensure and all whatnot. [snorts] >> Licensure? Okay. >> Experience with MSBA projects? >> Well, that that will be the presumably they'll list that in there. >> Okay. >> I mean, what I guess then that is maybe the other half of the question which is that I mean, we can certainly post, you know, Black somebody who seeks an interim superintendent. Is there anything else that you want us to say?
070Do you want us to take any of the language that you've actually said that you posted previously? Um or do you want it to simply sort of be pretty cut and dry? >> Cut and dry with the basics. >> Yep. Okay. >> So minimum qualifications are the same. >> Yep. >> But I also don't want us to get another week into this and then have an applicant pool in front of us and start saying, "Well, they didn't talk about this and they didn't talk about that." So maybe we did need to list more things. >> I get where you I I get where you're getting at, but we like I suppose we could have questioned the candidates for 4 hours in a public session. So, I like So, I I I I for the interim,
071I [cough] I suppose we're just going to get we're going to see that experience through different school districts. >> We're forgoing what we were trying to hold an uh one of the applicants to >> Yep. >> tonight. >> We are. >> Mhm. >> By By posting for an interim, we're going to get what we get. >> Yeah. >> And we're And >> Yeah. How's that children's book? >> [clears throat] [snorts] >> And then what will you imagine your process to be after that? The applications close on the 24th. Um if we communicate them to you electronically, um having stated to the the applicants that all of them are public, you then will Anything after that that you do, you'll need to be doing as a body. So, would you post to actually screen? Would you
072post to make a decision? Would you >> 24th. >> I will not have access to this at all times. >> Would you limit it to the three candidates again? It's typically four or five candidates, so >> We can limit it to one. >> Okay. >> Right? Um >> It's an interim. You want to probably have a >> You could You could pick from a paper screen. Yes. If you did it in a public meeting and posted that that was what you were doing. Yes. >> Do we have time for a paper screen is my question, or do we look at all of them in front of us and move on? >> Sorry, that's what I meant. I mean, you can >> We would be the >> select simply from the applications is probably a better
073way of putting >> I'm putting it in a question to them. >> Like for me, >> Yep. >> I want to I want to see them all, though. >> Yep. >> I don't think we have time for a paper screening. >> That would be It would be as a as a as a group. >> So we are talking across purposes. >> I think we all need to lay them out and see what we got. You know when we had discussions previously, you know, we we said you know, we said here's a list of people who are potential interims and we can >> That was sent from Glenn. >> Right and that's our that's our retirees list. Um right. So the now some of them haven't had positions this year and they thus wouldn't need a
074waiver. Um I've never sort of gone into it by sort of weeding through that way before. Um that is the only problem in this case is that and it has been taking up a bit of time as well. So you're not posting in a way that really allows us to do it such that you could take someone who who needs a waiver just because you don't have enough time to post the meeting. And I say that only because I've had to do it twice this year, so. >> [snorts] >> So theoretically we could set a meeting for July 1st. >> Theoretically you could set a meeting for July 1st, yes. >> That's 2 weeks from >> So you thus would have the applications from me on the 24th or barring depending on how late things
075work cuz I'll be at frankly at >> Isn't July 1st too late? We have to appoint >> And they have to accept the contract >> becomes the So why would we wait till the last >> I was just looking at 2 weeks, that's all. Cuz I think Carrie as you guys were going, right? Till >> Well, Tracy comes back July 1st. I don't come back until July 4th. >> Oh, 4th. I'm sorry. Okay. >> I think that's 23rd. >> Oh, that's a Saturday. But you Carrie you said you left >> the 25th. >> 25th. >> Yeah, it's uh it can be posted July 6th or 7th. >> But why are you trying to push it out beyond our >> I'm trying to I'm not I'm trying to make sure that people >> So what are
076we doing from July 1st to July 6th then? >> Well, no one took that in consideration before the night started. We may not have a superintendent here either way on on July 1st. >> If we're posting it tonight or tomorrow >> had no guarantee from any of the candidates that they would start in July 1st. >> to do it tomorrow. So realistically speaking as to who has access to our website. >> Right. So tomorrow's day one. >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> So Monday the 22nd would No. Five business >> Five days is >> Why does it have to be five days? >> I threw that out there. >> It doesn't have to be five days. >> Okay. Cuz I'm just saying if we push it to the 24th >> You could scoot back. >> We
077could yeah. >> Yep. >> I I I don't care what day you guys want. I was just trying to I was just trying to >> To get everyone here. >> If we can do it, we carry on um Not that you'd want to be doing that on vacation from a >> I I just don't know if I will actually have >> service [snorts] >> service at all times to I'll do my best. On your boat it's utmost important. >> When are you back? >> what's what's what's what's what's the penalty if we don't have a superintendent from >> We can't answer that. >> I I >> from one school >> call the commissioner's office and ask. I don't have any idea. >> I think they would >> I I would say that I think that
078probably the difference between what you're doing now versus if you had decided to appoint someone tonight and hadn't actually made a decision is that you might be able to say to your current acting we're still in negotiations. We're probably three days away. Can you give us another week? Maybe. I don't know the circumstances. I know that has happened before. Um which isn't quite what we're asking here. Um I I think that I can certainly see if I can find out for you. Um, what but I think that they would probably tell you to look at the people who have licensure and make some on the acting. >> Yeah. >> That is my guess, but I think that is what they would say. >> Very good. So, what day do we want to put this meeting
079on now? >> So, if we post, they have till Monday the 22nd, can we meet on the 23rd? You're still here? >> Sure. >> Oh, wait. I cannot. 8:00 in the morning. >> I will say that I I can't meet with you. I have time in the afternoon on the 23rd. I'm actually ironically meeting with Oxford um for their intern um that evening. >> [laughter] >> And that morning is the Board of Ed, so I'll be in effort. But I do have time in the afternoon if that would work. Or you can certainly do without me. I mean, don't don't make that hang up. >> I definitely need like evenings like after work. >> I'm good with any Zoom time. >> So, 23rd Jan, you said you can't make >> 24th? This is when you're
080traveling, isn't it? can do the 24th. I leave on the 25th in the morning. >> Oh, 25th. Okay. >> Is it Zoom? >> We will. We we can make we'll make it a we can make it a hybrid. If some people want to be here and you Zoom in. >> we're saying? >> It was really nice to have the camera and the screen. >> Yeah, and we'll we'll make sure that everybody has the information to them by by email from the from the search. So, we'll do 24th 24th, 6:00. >> And what are we doing on the 24th? Reviewing applications? >> Reviewing and deliberating. >> And you want to close the applications on what day? The 22nd? >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Is 3:00 p.m. a usual time? >> Um it is, but it there's
081no magic to that. That's just us. >> No, that's fine. >> [snorts] >> And I'm sorry, you said you'd meet at 6:00 on the 20 4th? >> Everybody good with 6:00? >> We're deciding. I >> Um the later the better for me. >> 6:30? >> On Zoom? We can do that, right? >> 6:30? No, good. 7:00? >> I prefer 7:00. >> Everybody good with 7:00? 7:00 it is. >> [snorts] >> Now, this one final thing, well, cuz you and Jane are working so well together, >> Mhm. >> we're going to keep that communication. >> [laughter] >> Jane? >> Uh Sure. >> I It is fine with me, Mr. Chair. [clears throat] It is fine with you. Certainly. >> Okay. Thank you. >> if any of you have any other kinds of questions or any other
082what ifs as this goes along, by all means give me a call. >> Okay. Next meeting is um 6:00 7:00 on the 24th. Um any further discussion? Uh I'll take a motion to adjourn. >> So moved. >> Make sure my voice had a lock in. Is there a second? >> Second by Jane. Uh all those in favor signify by saying I. >> I. >> Any opposed? The eyes have it.