001Good evening everyone. Welcome to the zoning board for January 8th. Tonight we have two hearings. Uh before that we'll go through the general business. Um we have a uh uh I need a motion for the approval of the minutes of December 11th. >> Done. >> Motion by Mark. Is there a second? Second by John. All those in favor? Opposed? That's unanimous. You pass that down to Melissa, please. >> Melissa's too far away. >> Okay. The first hearing for 605 is on the application of Ferrer. Are the people people here for Ferrer? Well, come on up here, please. Okay. Okay, I'll read out I'll read out the notice and then um we'll uh we'll get dive right into the uh right into the hearing itself. So this is on the application of Reana Ferrer. Is that
002did I pronounce that right? >> Reanna. >> Rejana Ferrer. one Esther Drive, Milford for a special permit relief to section 2.3 of the zoning bylaw in relation to a parcel of land on the east side of Esther Drive known and numbered as one Esther Drive consisting of a 25,386 more or less square foot lot. Uh the special permit relief is is in order to permit the keeping of up to five residential an I would believe or animals within the meeting of the zoning bylaw. So with that on the application, the applicant is looking at uh the aspects of article two uh accessory use to allow the residential animals in the RC zoning district. Uh concerning the question that was explained um the reason they sought the special permit would be in harmony with the general
003purpose and intent of the bylaw. The applicant states yes because uh we came to my >> attention. >> I don't know what that word means. >> Where came to my attention >> came to my attention that state of Massachusetts if there is more than three dogs in a house. Uh it must have the residential kennel license anything beyond three dogs which is absolutely true. Concerning the proposed use of the premise will not create undue traffic congestion or impair pedestrian safety. applicant states because they're asking for the residential dog license because they have five dogs, they have a backyard that is all fenced in concerning that the premises will not cause harm to the neighborhood or create nuisance of hazards concerning the affecting the health, safety, and general welfare of the public. Uh the applicant states
004that uh the dogs have no have no bark collars on. So with that and in the application, you will find a plot plan on that. And what I'll do is make a couple of comments concerning the aspects of that. So the town of Milford has a kennel bylaw and it's been modified um from uh probably in the last couple of years. So, the law requires that if you have more than three uh dogs that you must apply for a special permit through the zoning board, including the building department and also authorized by the board of selectment, that that license um has to be issued in order to have more than three dogs. Concern concerning that there is a article uh 42 of the Milford bylaws. There are probably six or eight pages here. I'd like
005to give this to you. You may have already gotten this. Have you gotten this at all? >> Um I got some stuff in the mail. I'm not sure about all the a >> Yeah. So, so for the for the benefit of the public, um the bylaw requires that the animal control um office along with the board of health, they have to go into the property to expect to make sure that the dogs are are are actually following the guidelines of what that license is issued. concerning that these are details of what they will be looking for. So irregardless if you get something tonight um whether favorable or not favorable uh if it is favorable the uh board of health the animal control officer and the building department will actually have to have access to go
006over everything to make sure that it's also safe for the animals. I'll give you this copy so that you have it >> just for the public. It's an annual inspection. Yeah, it's annually, by the way. So, it's it's yearly. Um, and the reason for that is for the safety of not only uh residents, but also for the animals. In the f in the folder, you will see a plot plan. I did take a drive by the property as well, and I understand it is fenced in. I have been told by a couple of people that the dogs do have uh what are they called? Bark collars. >> Yeah. >> Okay. What exactly is a bark collar? It it gives them a chalk when they bark and they completely stop. >> It's like a little electric
007shock. >> Yeah, it's electrical and also makes them noise if they bark. >> Okay. >> And uh I was recommended uh through uh the I forgot his name from the animal control. He's the one who told me that I was to get those. >> Okay. So before I before I turn it over to anybody that has interest or questions on the public, uh I'll go to board members if they have any questions. So currently Okay. So what uh Dave, do you have any questions concerning this? >> No, not really. >> John, >> I don't know our bylaw. >> I just I just noticed that the planning board suggested the dogs be spayed on Newton. >> Well, let me read that so I can clarify it. Put that out there. So, this did go in front
008of the planning board at their schedule meeting on December 16th. The planning board made a favorable recommendation uh with consideration of the following. I'm sorry I don't agree with it, but that's just my personal opinion. Uh no more than five dogs. That's that's uh that's their suggestion. I would say that this board would probably do the same if that comes to that case. They're suggesting that the that the dogs on site be spayed or neuted. I'm sorry. I am not going to tell Melissa she can't get pregnant. >> So I am not going to do that to >> telling someone that they >> I can't believe you just said that. >> Well, you know what I mean. It's >> Oh my god. >> You're in >> It didn't make a lot of sense to me
009because now we're trying to dictate. >> Now we're trying to dictate that you can't you can't have a litter of puppies >> only on live TV. >> Just don't. But but it also if you do that, you can't keep the dogs there because it's in violation of of the bylaw of whatever is decided. So with that, I'll I'll ask I'll bring it back over to Mark to so I give you that clarity. >> All right. One of my questions is she got to go on maternity leave. >> Then we're all in trouble. >> Oh my. >> The license indicates that you can have up to six with a kennel license without stipulation with planning would be five. >> I'm not going all five. my fives and >> that's all I got. >> When they die,
010they die. >> Wow. Okay. >> Yeah, I love them, but it's I find out it's a lot of work with respect to the law. >> Just if you don't if you don't have them stayed and one does get pregnant with another litter cuz you adopted the litter from the ones you had. What are you going to do if more show up? >> It's not It's not happening. >> Maybe Maybe there's David. >> It's It's not happening. >> It's not happening. She's going to call for that too. >> So concerning the planning board concerning the planning board's letter, I'll bring up to the point >> downhill. >> My house is it's >> they have their own rooms. >> This first floor based on the second floor. There's enough space for them to be separated. And it
011only happened when I was traveling and I gave it to my friend to watch my >> one of the dogs got pregnant. >> Yes. But that was, you know, leave the kids home alone. >> No, it was not even in my house. I sent it to my friend to watch it for me and it's not happening. >> So, I'll just read the the letter from the the town the town planner. >> They asked a special permit for the accessory use to allow the residential animals in the RC zoning district. And the proposed use will allow five dogs. Originally, the owner had three, one of which gave birth to puppies. Most of the puppies were sold, but two stayed with the owners totaling five. The backyard is entirely fenced in. No additions are being proposed for
012the dwelling. The use meets all applicable zoning. Therefore, that's why they recommended it over to this board. With that, Bobby, you've got the floor. >> I don't have anything yet. >> Okay. >> You have nothing to add to all this? >> If anybody in the audience wants to be heard, please state your name where you know what street you're on so we can answer or address any questions you may have. Oh, okay. Please your name. >> Sure. Sue Frederick, 30 Camp Street. Stand or can I No, you can. >> Um, so I guess my my concern so we can hear their dogs in the nice weather um when our windows are open and the dogs are outside. That being said, that's not necessarily my concern because we're far enough away that that's occasional. My concern
013is if this is allowed, what is the precedence for that? Right? our neighbor next door has a dog. What is the precedence for our neighbor now to say, "Well, I want four more dogs or the people who >> same process, >> right?" So, I guess that's my concern is precedence to to do this and maybe some of the dogs are going to be fine and not bark and some of them aren't. So, I guess I have a concern about precedence and our ability to to live in our house and then sell our house. That's why we have that they have to come here for a special permit because each case could be different than the other. So that's why the bylaw was developed. >> But I guess I'd argue if I was looking if my
014next door neighbor was looking for five dogs, I guess I would cite the fact that this this owner was able to do it, so why can't I cut it? >> So after after the public speech, I'll I'll make a comment concerning that. >> Anybody else? Go ahead. >> Hi. Uh my name is Lucia Zagi Copelan and I live next door at 3 drive. Um and my experience has been very different. Um I have endured over a year of um all day off and on high-pitched loud barking that has really affected my quality of life in my home. Um I've been very unhappy. It has been really difficult for me to enjoy going outside of my home. Um, and it has been um really a very stressful situation. Um, I've been extremely unhappy. Um, the multiplied
015barking of all the dogs is um it's a lot. Um, >> so you said you live next door. >> What number are you? Number four. >> Three. >> You're number three. >> Was this before or after the bar collars? Is the bar caller something that you just did recently? >> Um the uh what happened is we move in last October and um we got the call from the animal control. They went over my house, stay out there for 30 minutes. Couldn't hurt that much barking except if you approached the property back then. and he talked to me and I stopped the application but no one knew what to do when one year went by and then on around Thanksgiving this year again he got a call again that's when he suggested to me to get
016the bark coll around Thanksgiving and that's what I did and our dog doesn't go all of them outside because we have a plan I spoke to Ken myself and he's like let two at a time Um, and he stopped by my property and he said, "I don't see that. Whatever is going on, I don't see myself." >> So, so >> is the bark collar always on? >> Always on. I agree. Always on. And you guys are more than welcome to come in my property anytime and see it. >> Okay. So, so just to give you some clarity, the bylaw requires and and calls. But in the event that the the barking is is uncontrollable, complaints can be filed and that's how the process goes with the complaints. So, saying that, I don't know. I've spoken
017to a couple of residents on Esther Drive, actually a couple of doors down, um, indicated that they haven't heard any of the barking. um over the last couple of three months. So I don't know when this call went on. >> The call went on around Thanksgiving. >> Thanksgiving. >> Yeah. Because that's when uh Kim suggested me to get them because until then I didn't know that I could put a caller and like >> Yeah. >> When you Yeah. >> Have you noticed an improvement? >> So what happened is this is not what his last name is Hayes. Hayes the dog officer. So, I'm the one who called him. I had called him originally um to say that this is going on. Can you please do something about it? So, he went there and and spoke
018to her um and um let me know that he had spoken to her. Um they were home. The dogs would be out barking. Nothing was done. They were out with the dogs. I would go down to my mailbox and the dogs would go to the windows and be barking their heads off. I couldn't walk around my yard without the dogs. >> But they were in the house. They were in the house at that point. >> They were in the house >> barking at the window at me as I was in my yard trying to enjoy my yard, walking down to my mailbox or walking in my driveway with the dogs barking their heads off. >> Was this before or after Thanksgiving? >> Before. >> Okay. How long? And when he spoke to her, he called
019me back at Thanksgiving time and said that she let him know that she wasn't aware that they were doing this. When they were home, they would take them out in the yard and be physically with the dogs while they were barking. They would take them out in the yard to exercise them. And they would be they're they're half husky, half German Shepherd. So they're big and they bark like huskys which they yelp they howl. Five of them. >> But as Mark said since Thanksgiving have >> no the last time I heard them was Christmas Eve. But now it's my responsibility to police this. I can't go on my deck without wondering are they going to be barking? And in in addition I wonder about the welfare of the dogs. five large dogs in another home.
020I mean, why does that bylaw exist? The home is supposed to be checked. Um, and and now and now it's my responsibility to wonder. >> No one says it's your responsibility. >> It's going to be because it has been so far and we don't know if bar collars are always going to stay on. What happened was he told her, "You need to put the bar collars on." So, at that point, they went on once she was told they had to go on. I I drove by there today. Are you the you the one that has the big shed >> and the boat? >> I'm right next door. >> Okay. >> Yep. And my We're this close. >> The There's cameras in my house. You guys are more than welcome to come and see the welfare
021of the yard. We are very >> well. No matter what happens, you're going to be watched more in the event you get this because there will be annual inspections for the wealth and safety of the dogs along with the noise issue. So because a neighbor clearly should not be up all day long hearing barking all day long. That's a disturbance. That's a noise disturbance. So saying that when you have five dogs that is that is the critique of this. Now in saying that I'll give you what my opinion was going to be because I've seen one complaint but I'm hearing that now the the dog collars are on the barking out the window. Maybe those windows need to be shades need to be shut on that side of the house. But no matter what, if
022we were going to go down this road to try and issue a special permit for the five dogs, my only recommendation to this board was going to be for a year. That way there it's under your control to make sure that your neighbors don't get noise complaints. So that that's something that that has to take responsibility from the owner. So that's why I'm making that comment. >> Well, you know what, David, again, if we're going to go down that road and issue this, I think a year is actually too long if the neighbors are hearing that noise now. >> I don't I don't know what >> sounds like it's kind of been resolved for the most part except for that one time during Christmas. I guess it would be one of those things that I'm
023imagining. I'm not up to speed in this. A bark collar isn't used for the rest of your life. It's to train a dog. This is a 15-year commitment, >> you know. So, eventually they get quiet, I would imagine, but who knows? Um, but >> and and I have a question. Um, we're going down that road. It's uh he said, she said, I think if we're going to go that road, we actually need to prove I'm not like there's cameras over my house. >> I have videos. >> If I want to do a complaint about my neighbor, I also have videos about my dog's neighbor. not be in the leash. And I have one from today that her dog ran up to someone that was walking on the street with their dog. I have it over
024here. Like I I didn't want to go that road. But if if people actually have time >> you do you have a dog? >> I have two dogs. >> You have two dogs. Okay. >> And they never in the leash. If I take my dog to walk in the street, they come running towards my dog to attack my dog. But I never complain because I don't know. I come from a neighborhood that you don't complain about things. Okay. >> But if we're gonna go that road, that's fine. I have plenty of videos that show your dogs barking. >> All right. Let's not delay the situation. Is there any other comments or questions? >> I have a question. >> Yeah. So, if the bylaw is three dogs, whether whether you grant it or not, like if
025the bylaw is three dogs and since these other dogs were born, the they've been in violation of this bylaw. >> She was notified that she needed a kennel license and that's why she's here. >> She didn't know. She didn't know. >> Yes, she is. That's what they're asking for. >> That's what they're asking. >> I thought she was asking for a >> domestic license. Domestic >> Oh, I'm sorry. I thought she was asking for a variance, not a >> kennel. A special permit. Anything any dogs over three requires a special permit, >> right? >> Even if it was one more, she would they would still require a special permit. >> And I guess my other question is more like process-wise. So they're also how did how do neighbors get notified that this is happening? Is
026that the neighbor's responsibility? >> Not not if you're further up on camp street, you would not get notified. The the it goes out to the director but is within 15 was 150 ft or 300? 300. >> 300 on all sides. >> That was just in process. >> Yeah, >> I might have missed it. Has the animal control officer been over to your property? >> Yeah, >> he came in my property last uh around Thanksgiving and I started the process back then, but no one know what to do back then. And there's a records that I started and then year went by and he came again around Christmas uh around Thanksgiving again and he called me and he said like >> you got a complaint >> let me fix this for you. Let's start this license.
027Let's and he was a huge help because like I didn't know where to go, where to start. >> I I can tell you that what you have in front of you and what I've given the board members and if one of the people in the public want a copy of this, they can have it. But the requirements that you're going to face are pretty substantial. Um it it goes down to the temperature control. It goes down to food, water. Um the they come in, they check it annually and they um it it goes through every single detail of what is required in including noise. So and that's what I'm saying. I mean she's got she's got two dogs. Hopefully, they're registered with the town. I'm not sure if they are or they're not, but any
028anybody that has uh dogs in this community, they need to be registered with the town's clerk's office. >> Dave, does this does the state also inspect this? >> The state actually the state this is this act, this bylaw, some of this, I believe, based on what I was told was actually incorporated from some of the state guidelines. >> So, what what happened? >> I don't think the state does any inspection if that's what you're asking. No, the this the inspections the the approval process on this is the zoning board along with the building department and the inspection process is the board of health and the animal control officer. >> Have you been >> annually? >> Have you been contacted by the animal control officer? >> No. >> Um should we not get a reading from
029him as to his concerns? And >> well, he actually guided her of the right way to go. Well, I understand, but it says that the milford under F under section two personal kennel license, which by the way, there's a little bit of a I see two different kennels here. One's a commercial or training kennel and one's a personal kennel. There's not too many restrictions on a personal kennel, David. Okay. On section two, it then jumps to section three. Although, let me back out. In section two for personal kennels, it does say that the milford animal control office shall inspect the facility before the personal license shall be issued. So I haven't heard that the property has been inspected by the animal control. >> Yeah, I have nothing here. >> Oh, we don't have anything. Okay,
030that's number one. Number two, you were saying it's pretty stringent. Yes, it is under section three on state the restrict restrictions and requirements for a commercial kennel. So once again is that commercial these commercial kennel restrictions uh uh are they applicable to a personal kennel license? >> What's what's the limit for? They all be reading >> two separate things. So she's going for a personal person. So these commercial kettle licenses do not >> is a higher is a higher inspection process. >> Commercial is like the doggy day. >> Yeah, that's much more much more restrictive. >> So it doesn't apply to you were saying earlier about is going to be restrictive. Well, >> annually he's got to go in annually. >> Well, once again, but they're not going to abide by section 21, which >>
031which is the commercial. >> Correct. >> Yeah. >> Okay. But it also as Bobby was saying on F the animal control officer shall inspect the facility before the personal kennel license shall be issued or renewed. >> Right. >> So we we are not issuing the license. >> We are giving a special permit if they want to have five dogs. That's all. We're not >> Yeah. We're not we're not >> Yeah. Just just >> so now they if this goes through >> goes to the select >> now it goes to the select >> correct and then and then the animal control officer >> has to has the full authority on it. >> So is that in perpetuity? So if they move tomorrow and somebody else buys one >> only to the applicant, right? >> Mhm. >>
032It's not doesn't go with the property. >> Doesn't go with the Anybody else having a question? >> Yes, sir. >> I got a comment or a question. >> Whatever you prefer. >> I live on Cricut Lane. I live up behind them so I look down on them. You know, my property is down on the back of the people cricket of uh Camp Street. >> What's your name, sir? >> Kevin Dorsy. >> Kevin. Okay. Thank you. >> Number six, Cricket Lane. >> Okay. >> Um I never heard about these B callers. This is all new to me tonight, but if she wasn't ordered to get them, I've listened to this all summer long. You come home in the afternoon, you sit down and relax. Somebody comes home around 3:00, they let all the dogs out. They've
033been cooped up all day. Now they're running around like crazy. They were very noisy. Very, very noisy. I'm not one to make the complaint, but they were very noisy. All right. >> I don't know how these things work, but >> Well, it's handheld. >> It's the responsibility >> supposed to stop or something or >> I I guess that's what these callers do. Well, if another point is that if she wasn't told, >> but we're talking about >> if she wasn't told to get the the calls, would she get the In other words, >> well, she didn't know, >> right? She had three dogs then. So, let me ask you a question. That was this past summer. >> Yes. >> How has it been now? >> It's cold. >> The dogs still go out. My deck's
034in the backyard >> cuz if her dogs barked, her dogs could be barking with someone walking by the house. >> No, no, it we could definitely tell. So, I'm Sue Susan Dorsey. I'm his wife. And we definitely could tell when things changed when she moved in. It's like we said, "Oh, somebody's there with a lot of dogs." Yeah. >> And it's sustained barking for and and again, I I probably wouldn't make a big deal about it if this didn't come about, but um sustained barking for a good amount of time and then maybe in the morning and then maybe in the afternoon. So there's times quiet too, but I had said I, you know, we are quite a ways from it, >> right? >> But I wouldn't want to live next door because that would
035be that. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Are they service dogs? >> They're not service dogs. Um, >> how many people in the house? >> Um, it's four. Um, >> so everybody has a dog. Is that it? >> It doesn't matter. >> I don't want to get into my private family, but I know a lot. I don't have to ask. >> Are the dogs home alone during the day? >> There was a vet there in need of the service dog as they have it. >> I work uh three days in my office and two days at home and my husband we have our own company too. Most of the time we have someone at home. >> Yeah. >> My daughter go to school and come home at 2:30. My other daughter go to her college
036and come home. It's always someone in and out. >> So you just got two puppies. You said this >> they they don't bas anymore but they they one year. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Yes sir. >> Uh Tony Sharelli I live at four cricket lane. So same thing we're above and behind. Um the the the noise I think has been established by different people at different levels. One of the things that I I know because I've had dogs and I and the bark collars are limited in their effectiveness to different kinds of breeds. So they might slow it down, but eventually the dogs sometimes dogs dogs like the privacy fences work the same way. They get a little shock to tell them don't cross that line. But if once they figure out it's only a
037little shock and they cross the line, they'll learn to endure it. So some dogs will will get past the bark collars. What I'm saying to you is it's not a failsafe solution for every dog. So to to say I've got bark collars now, I've solved the problem. It's not it's it's with all due respect, it's not in her control to solve that problem because the bar collars aren't always affected. But just want to put that perspective out there for you guys as far as if you were to go down some the a particular road because she she had a litter, she's got five dogs, there's going to be some kind of oversight. to your point, sir, I'd like it to see more frequent uh opportunities of of inspections and then something some kind of a
038recourse that if things don't get changed because of then it gets withdrawn or something along those lines. It has to be a control especially labor's next door that comes up a lot more frequency frequently rather. That that would be my uh my input on the whole >> and the other woman's point about precedent is also something to consider. >> I I have a I just have a question for for time. I'm sorry. So you lived there since October and you moved in with three dogs and then they had a then they had a litter because that the dogs are a year old. I'm just trying to >> there were five dogs at >> I'm just trying to establish like when they moved in was there three and then there was a litter >> I think
039what what she >> when we moved in was five dogs kind of >> the dog was born in um June. >> Okay. So >> when I moved in cuz I have butcherable properties in Milford when I moved from my other property I had the five dogs already >> illegally. >> Yes. And they are registered in Milford >> and they're registered. I just didn't know about the >> the kennel issue. >> Let me ask you a question. If you got five dogs licensed, all five are licensed. >> They they all right. >> Nobody picked up on the same >> They are now. They weren't back then. >> Well, she said they're licensed. >> They all licensed. >> So, why didn't somebody at the town hall pick up the same address as my >> Well, I check
040I checked at the town clerk's office and and I've been told there is four licensed Maggie, Milo, Luna, and Simba. >> Yeah. Where's >> Toby? Toby. Is Toby registered? >> All of them are registered. >> All at the same address. >> So that's when you were told that you needed to get a license because you're over the three. >> Yes. >> When you realized it was over the three? >> Yes. >> Okay. >> And I And the other ones I didn't sell them. I don't need them. I let them go because I don't sell dogs. And unfortunately this one stays and time went by and now they became part of the family. And how many family members do you have? >> Four. >> I just want to clarify. So I have we my husband Neil.
041So we and my children have spent the last year enduring this illeg illegal action because there were five dogs there. >> You have no idea how much illegal action goes on in this town. >> But this has affected us. My children's bedrooms are on her side and have been woken up. And my husband and I work in health care and we get up. I work in public schools. He works in hospitals. We both work with disabled individuals and we wake up early in the morning and our bedrooms on the far side from her house and we get woken up by the barking dogs. >> Okay. >> I mean, this has seriously affected our quality of life and and >> well, it becomes it becomes an issue. paid a pretty penny for our home and now
042we're looking at possible, you know, if we go to sell our home and someone wants to buy it and then they look over and you can see five dogs and and someone comes to look at the house or something and then >> they or they find out there's approval for five dogs next door. I mean, what? Seriously, what kind even if those five dogs are quiet on the visit? Um, I don't know. It just seems like >> Well, again, >> there's no protection. >> There's a by there's a noise bylaw and that's why you're here. You're you're basically and that's what we're trying to do is to get a handle on has anything been corrected or better since the back call has went on now. And and I and I get it. I I have
043a dog, too. and and the only time she barks is when she defends me. So, and that's a lot. >> I have a question with barking. Uh when you say bark, we're talking about couple of minutes or we talking about anything? >> Um constant >> prolonged. That's Yeah, >> prolonged. >> And if you they can hear it on the other side on Cricut Lane, that's not good. That's just not good. It's not it's not a peaceful surrounding for your neighbors. >> 30 cam street is 300 ft >> way down camp street. >> So 30 cam can hear it. Not in the winter when our our >> you know our fan is going from the wood stove and our windows are closed and stuff like that. >> But in this in the time when the windows
044are open and you're outside in the backyard 30 can't hear it. >> Yeah. Yeah. Any other comments? Anybody else want to make a comment? Board members, um, why don't we openly discuss what the thoughts are? >> My thought is personally I'm not a big fan of pot callers, but they're a necessary evil in some situations. Additionally, in close quarter neighborhoods, five dogs is a lot. Whether the law says we can allow this or not, it's still a lot. That's my personal opinion, and I'm sorry, but I love dogs, but it's a lot. That's my personality. Y >> Bob, >> no. I'm all set, >> Dave. >> Um I just I wish we were more educated on if the problem has been solved and if it will be solved. And um I think maybe is there
045a way to grant like a shorter amount of time? Well, I'm even I'm even I don't know if I should be having a conversation with the animal control officer, but but again, if if the if the thing has been basically the situation has been helpful with the bark collars and I know it's winter, the dogs don't go out. I think the the other corrective act action is that that the dogs can't be barking out a window. The shades got to be pulled. You know, that's a comment that's if and again, maybe you don't understand that constant barking is a negative to neighbors. They don't need to be living constantly with the barking all afternoon or an evening in the summer. Apparently, based on what Mr. Chelli said, it was pretty upsetting to be hearing that
046all day long. So now you're saying that the bark and collars are going on. Listen, this board tries to help and work with people in the community and I make that strong suggestion with neighbors as well. So you know when I thought about this and I went by the house and I spoke to a couple of people on Esther Drive and it was indicated that and they weren't far from you. there across the street or a couple of doors down and they didn't they said we don't hear a lot of barking. Dogs are going to bark during the day at a squirrel or a neighbor or someone going by the house that I get. for us to consider going down this road and doing any type of authorization, it would have to be on a
047short period of time to prove that you've got it under control or it will be revoked. So that's where I am because neighbors should not be sitting there next door and hearing barking all day long. I wouldn't want that. Well, how can we get the animal control officer to monitor this situation? >> Can we give them a more frequent uh right of entry? >> Well, I I can tell you right now, I am not going to grant a one-year license. I'm listening to the neighbors. I love dogs. I've had dogs all my life. Um but barking dogs is a nuisance. It is. But I don't know if us as a board can say we're going to give a threemonth temporary license because again they've had the dog for, you know, the younger ones for over
048a year now and I wouldn't want to get rid of my dogs if that was the case. you get and you got family members that get attached and I get I get that and that's why it behooves the applicant >> to work with this >> and control it and if it's not controllable >> but that's what I'm saying can we grant >> like I'm just putting it out there a threemonth temporary so they don't have to do anything with the dog but they everybody has to come back in and the dog can a good I don't I don't know. >> That's a great question for Jerry. >> Obviously, you'd want some proof, some video, >> three or six months only. I >> I don't know if we can >> and see if it if it
049proves. And if it doesn't, we can we can terminate it. >> Or can what if what if it doesn't work out in 3 months? What are you guys going to do? >> well, because it's only 3 months, then she's going to be forced to go down to three dogs. >> And also, what's going to be the proof? because she said he said I think >> probably some video or something that can capture the noise >> recording of of times and >> but also capturing the noise for how long because let's say if the dog just bark once and doesn't bark for >> it would have to be a nuisance it would have to be for a prolonged period of time where people can't >> she's going to check with town counsel we got one more
050question one more question >> I think it's a good idea that monitoring like that but a difference between January, February, and March. World of difference >> versus the summer. Yeah, I get it. Oh, I get it. >> Dogs are going to be outside twice as long. >> Yep. I get it. >> If I I didn't I complain, but if I had a complaint, they are a pain. >> Can I have the dog guy come and sit on my deck and listen? >> Yes, absolutely. >> In other words, I'll call him and say, "Look, you're you're welcome to come on my property. Come sit on my deck." >> Yep. >> And then you can sit here and you can determine you can, you know, >> we can also give it for a year. It's always rev
051you can always revoke it. Um you can you can >> have the complaint and it can be revokeable. So >> is it >> Yeah, that's why we're checking with legal now. Go ahead, >> Tony. Uh what what comes to mind and this is all good discussion is that that what ultimately is happening in in a consideration of a short-term or or overly monitored thing is you're putting the burden of proof on all the neighbors that are being potentially impacted by this to catch the dogs versus letting them just live in their houses in peace. Well, now you can said, "I'm going to get the dog officer to come sit on my deck if it's a you can have one dog and they can be barking all day long." Even that and that actually happens. >>
052That's true. >> Right. >> You can have one dog, not five. >> You can have out of these five dogs, you got two of them that don't get along, they can bark, >> right? But no one's no one's I'm not down here for >> but but again the by the bylaw the bylaw dictates that the the neighbors can call in write it down. It doesn't need to be as far as I'm concerned. You know someone can put a phone out the window to hear the barking but you know to write it down. You you get three or four or five of these. It's time. You know what I mean? >> Okay. It's not it's not 15 or 20. When when when it's consistent like that and five four or five neighbors have to call two
053or three times, it's over. It's over. >> Okay. So, that that that that works because to your point of like we got to come in here with videos or tapes and stuff and that puts a lot of burden of proof on the on the neighbors that are being impacted. Personally, I don't think that's fair. But to your point that if if the complaints are now being logged in that you've now got >> Well, that that's the important part of because otherwise it won't work. Has anybody ever called the police on the noise? >> If we're talking about >> No, they're supposed to call animal control. >> I know they are, but I'm asking >> the neighbor call and complain. And if no one comes, if the the animal control doesn't come and see it, let's
054say if you have five, six neighbor that doesn't like you, >> if we're talking about fear, >> well, that's part of the reason why it's nice if you guys if you if it's truly a nuisance, >> it would help to actually have some kind of video, some kind of proof. >> Um, other just That bolsters your your argument >> with the dogs barking off and on throughout the day. >> What what are the times that they bark usually? If you had a guess, you took the videos. >> All right. >> 6:30 a.m. all throughout more in the warmer weather, but all throughout the day. So, I don't work over the summer because I work in public schools. So, I would want to go out, enjoy my deck, >> go outside. >> Yeah. you should be
055able to have your quiet your quiet time along with every other neighbor too. So and again this is a balancing act for this board because you know we we are now hearing this but we also understand the process that of what has occurred prior to the bark collars. So again, you don't want to lose your dog if you've got family members. And I get it and I don't want her to be getting rid of dogs, but if it comes to that, you may have to. >> So yes. >> Okay. >> Three months, four months, >> three months, >> five months, whatever time. Set a date. >> Yeah. >> Already know >> and then they can we come back and we readress it. >> All right. So, so this board this board tries to do things
056fairly and taking in consideration the abuters and the neighbors and I get it. I clearly would not be wanting to be living next to something that's barking all day long or at night. It's it's it's not warranted. >> I'm going to make it easy so we don't just keep talking about it because we all understand everybody's aspect because we're all dog owners, animal owners. I I I am going to make a motion that we grant a temporary six month so we could get some summer months into this and then this has to be revisited >> at this board again. >> Well, the it'll expire. >> The license will expire in 6 months. So, let's go down that road if that if the board >> board members even want to support it. the license ends up
057lapsing or it's up to the animal control officer along with the building department and again the board of health's involved in all of this too that they they cannot they will not issue you any extension beyond 6 months. So, it gives you an opportunity to see if you can you can work this through, but it also gives the neighbors an opportunity to be able to be heard and not be able to live with barking all day long. So, we're trying with that motion is not letting you get rid of two brand new little puppies that your family probably loves, but also understanding it you need to be able to control the marketing. If you think you cannot do that, >> then you've got the six months to kind of get that under control. >> Do
058you understand what I mean? Yeah. So, that so so the motion on the table and and and there's a motion. So I I I want to be able any more discussion concerning >> this >> because the motion is now brought in for a six month temporary to see how it works. It's up to all of us to make sure that your lives are peaceful. >> So just so I understand that. I guess I'm I was a dog owner too. um giving up a dog six more months from now when I'm six more months detached is going to be even harder. But the the ask of the neighbors who we don't know these we don't we don't know the people on Cricut Lane. So this is not a a vigilante kind of thing is >> no
059clear clearly that the dogs >> if we hear barking our task is to make sure we instead of just trying to ignore it and just say well it'll stop blah blah blah our task is to >> and it wouldn't be a bad idea to to communicate with each others on both sides so that >> you you can at least talk with each other and say did you hear the dog at 2 o'clock this morning record it document it because we want to be able to if that license doesn't get renewed after 6 months, it's because of things were not corrected. >> And is there a chance for that license to be revoked before the six months? >> It's only good for 6 months. >> But what happens if the neighborhood if it's April and the
060dogs are incessantly barking? That's still within the six. >> That's within the six months, but they lapse. >> But you but you'll be calling the complaints. The animal control officer will be there. Yes, ma'am. >> But I think her question is, can it be revoked if it's like technically violating the parameters of it? >> No. So the if the dogs can bark their their silly heads off for April, May, and June. >> Well, I think that's the thing that we probably need to have the animal control officer have the right to revoke it. >> Yeah. >> Prior to 6 months in the event of constant complaints of of dog barking. >> I don't know. I don't I don't know if we can. >> I don't know if we can, but >> can I? >> No,
061>> I can't offer. Okay. You can't >> again I'm trying to my six months was listening to you guys saying you know 3 months is winter time >> and yeah I'm not going to say four months. Okay we'll give it to April and then No. So my motion on the floor is 6 months >> and it has to be revisited. >> I'm sorry but there's no more questions please. >> There there's there it won't be revisited because what's going to happen is they would have to reapply. >> Well that's what I'm saying. and that's going to be under the control of the building commissioner and the Milford animal control. So those are the two calls you make for those complaints >> that we there were. We're addressing an issue now that she wasn't aware of
062concerning the amount of dogs that you can have. If I could have six dogs, I'd probably commit suicide. But that's that's rather here or there. So, there's a motion um for the special permit for F not to exceed five dogs for six months from this date. Uh is there a second? >> I second. >> Seconded by Dave. All those in favor. Three in favor, two opposed. Didn't pass. So, you you're not you won't be getting the license. So, you're going to have to make a determination that who's where those dogs are going to go. >> I'm sorry, but five dogs in the neighborhoods and I love dogs. I'm just sorry. >> So, you need you needed four out of the five votes. >> I really am. >> You only got three. >> Four neighbors all
063at the same complaint. Too consistent. >> And I am s. Trust me from the bottom of my heart. I am so >> I think we all are. Mhm. >> Apparently, there's been stuff going on here that that we were not aware of. So, with that, um, that decision is made. It has been it has been denied. >> You're all set. I'm sorry. >> It's okay. >> Thank you. >> First, I want to cry. >> Thank you everybody. Thank you. >> I want to cry. >> Thank you. >> I feel bad, too. >> I feel terrible, but it's again, it's we >> the attachment aspect of it's awful. >> Yep. Okay. Uh, next hearing. >> Thank you. >> I'm all set. >> Let's just go home. I don't want to give you >> I don't we
064don't >> you can give it you can bring it up. >> Hang on to it. >> This is on the application of Home National Realy Corporation 8 O Expert Road Mendon for to amend a variance which was previously issued under the date of August 8, 2025 in relation to a parcel of land consisting of 93,000 square ft more or less located on norly side of Medway Road known and numbered as 100 Medway Road. The amendment is sought for reasons of an erroneous reference in the previously issued variance which transo transposed the frontage and width dimensions of the commercial lot. In that earlier decision both lot width and frontage are described an error by being 206.26 ft and the amendment to the earlier variance is sought in order to correct the erroneous reference on the record.
065With that just give you a quick overview because it did go to the uh planning board. Planning board did uh review this made a favorable recommendation. Planning board indicates that the applicant requests a modification of the variance issued on August 25 to allow for the creation of the building lot that was previously parcel configuring that the currently constitutes lot 95 C. Specifically, the proposal was to establish a separate lot to accommodate the sale of the Roman Catholic Bishop of Wores of the Bank building property which is currently situated on the land lease parcel of 100 Medway Road. The lease parcel was established uh from the larger Sacred Heart Cemetery property in 1985. To align the property boundaries and the actual physical location of developed bank building site, the IBZON district lot with and frontage variances
066will be required. Hence the former application. The proposed lot frontage is 194 and 230 is required. The proposed lot width is 20626 and 250 is required. Unfortunately, the number of the frontage was erroneously labeled the same as the width and should be labeled 194. This is a corrective application by the applicant. Therefore, they're recommended a favorable report be sent off to the zoning board. With that, attorney Peter, >> and that has been corrected. Correct. Attorney Peter. >> Well, okay. Just let's let me just revamp that. Um >> there hasn't really been any correction because what I came before you in the summer to do is the same thing I'm doing tonight. The lot line on the variance plan is in exactly the same position. The problem was that through all the eyes of all the
067geniuses that looked at this, my own included, we mistook front edex for W. And and that got written into the variance decision. And because of that, we now have a lot that does not conform to the plan that we presented to the board and which was approved >> because it got reconfigured >> because it added 12 ft. Mhm. >> And the reality is is that we toyed with a variety of ways to solve this, but because this is such a sensitive thing and because the bishop of Worcester is selling this particular parcel >> and it's it's it's a lucrative sale, they wanted to make sure that all the tees were crossed and all the dies were dotted. >> So, we're here tonight just simply to seek the correction of what was really a typographical error.
068Whether I made it, Jerry made it, we don't know who made it, but but yeah, it's a title. >> I thought that we did that last time. >> It's just just >> we we approved it. >> It was >> we approved it, but with the frontage and the width when the decision was issued, it was it was >> exactly right. Okay. >> There's nothing new in what we're doing tonight to what we did in the summertime, but we we have to get this done so that it's all >> and legally you can record it. Well, it's already been recorded, which complicates it because I recorded it. >> So, now what do you have to do? >> Unrecorded. >> We just No, we just got to do amendment. >> You just have to amend it. >>
069Correct. >> You call the bishop and the bishop pulls a string and you get a text. >> The last thing I want to make sure I say to you, and Jerry knows about this, I talked to Jerry, add in an item. Worcester council for the bishop of Worcester has prepared this document. This document is purporting to be findings of fact which the zoning board might choose to adopt. Jerry has seen that. He reviewed that today because I got it early this morning. Jerry has seen it. He's reviewed it today. His opinion on it is that there's nothing in there that is different from what I'm saying to you tonight or what his impression is. He may want to change some of the language, but he told me tonight before I came here that I could
070represent to you that he will adopt what they're doing, assuming this board votes favorably to grant the correction. I just want to say one more time for the record, we're here to fix a mistake. We're not here to change any substance at all. >> Okay, >> I'm done. >> Make proof. >> Second. >> All right. Do you All right. So, so besides the modification of the amendment um motion to approve, there is also the amendment and uh restated decision that has been handed to me which I need to have authorization from the board for me to sign in the event in the event Jerry needs to change anything. >> Okay. But I I think you need to let Jerry write the decision because based on this >> because there's things in there like he doesn't
071know who you people are. So he puts in zoning members present. So I'm going to let Jerry do that and then he'll sign his own decision. But I've just given you that because I want to make sure that I represent to you everything that I've done with everyone that I've done it with over the last six weeks. >> And the plan's correct. >> The plan is exactly correct. >> So we don't have to worry about that. >> No. >> You want me to sign this? I don't think you have to. I think the >> because I signed the other plan. >> I think the plan But you signed the right plan. It's just >> Yeah, it's just a transcribed of the frontage and width. >> You're on TV. You're on TV. Let's Let's vote. >>
072Motion. >> Well, you already have a second. All those in favor? >> We made a motion. >> Oh, motion to approve uh as amended. >> Uh John seconded. All those in favor? >> I. That's unanimous of five. With that, is there a motion to adjurnn? >> Motion to adjurnn. Seconded by Mark. All those in favor? >> I. >> Thank you. Thank you everyone for joining us. Tonight.