001This is an actual meeting, so I will call the meeting to order and we'll start with roll call. Heather Brekken Here. Didier Donlongo Here. Stephanie Edelman Randy Heitman Here. Sarah Speer Here. John Ward Here. Thanks, Kelly. Uh we'll do the Pledge of Allegiance, please. It's a new meeting. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Uh this meeting of the Brainerd School Board is being conducted in accordance with Minnesota Statute 13D.02. This meeting is being recorded. Access to the recording is available on the school district's YouTube channel. Due to this being a special school board meeting, there will be no public input allowed during the meeting. I will take a motion to
002approve the agenda. So moved. Second. We've got a motion by Director Heitman and a second by Director Brekken. Any discussion? If not, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed? >> Aye. Motion carries. We have um a couple things on the agenda for today to discuss Sorry, roll call because Oh. Everything's got to be a roll call vote. That's right cuz we've got Thank you for um reminding us of that. So, because we've got folks that are online, we'll have to do roll call votes for everything. So, we'll go back to approval of the agenda. Didier Donlongo Aye. Aye or yes. Yes. Stephanie Edelman Yes. Randy Heitman Yes. Sarah Speer. Yes. John Ward. Yes. Joe Brekken. Yes. Paul Ennenga. Thank you, Kelly. Thanks, you guys. All right. So, uh new business and
003up for action today is discussing and deciding superintendent search timeline, hiring criteria, stakeholder involvement, and procedures, and um the things necessary for the hiring process. And we've got Barb Doran from MSBA with us today. Thank you for joining us, Barb. And we'll jump right in. Sounds good. Thank you, Chair Speer. It's nice to see everybody again. Uh time goes fast. I was up here last a year ago. And um most of you will be very familiar with the search process, but we're going to go through all of it again for those who are familiar with how a superintendent search process works. Um so, I don't think we need to do a round of introductions. I met everybody at one other time, and nice to see uh Director Ward and Director Ennenga online as well. Um
004so, we're going to review the statutes first and foremost. There are two statutes in Minnesota law that will apply to your superintendent search. Uh that is the open meeting law and the government data practices act. This is a reminder, every step of this process will be done in an open meeting. You will not be closing any sessions for any part of the superintendent search process. That needs to be balanced with the government data practices act, however, because the names of every single applicant are private data. So, when you're discussing the applicants in a public meeting, it will only be candidates A, B, and C with no identifying information, so people can figure out who you're talking about because those names are private. You as the board will have access to every single application and all
005of the application materials therein. So, I just want to caution you not to look at those in a public space. Don't let anyone walk behind you when you're on your computer because they might catch a glimpse of a resume or something. Those names need to be handled very, very carefully. So, those are the two statutes that will apply to the search. And just a reminder, board ownership. This is not MSBA search, is the school board for Brainerd Public Schools superintendent search. So, you will not only make all of the decisions, but you will own those decisions. My job is to guide you, provide you with information, make recommendations as appropriate, but make sure you have the information you need to make the best decisions for the students here in Brainerd. So, as we move along,
006I'm going to give you options. You can at some point in the process go this direction or that direction. And that starts today with a lot of decisions here in the planning meeting packet. So, any question on that overview? Again, familiar ground, I think, but a refresher is always good. Okay. So, on the agenda, uh the first thing we're going to talk about is the timeline. And this is often what takes the longest in a meeting because people's schedules are very, very busy. All of these things can be adjusted. I built this timeline based upon um availability and a standard 3 and 1/2 months search on average. So, today is a special meeting to plan the search right away. Um we have the proposed public survey opening on November 10th and closing December 8th. Again,
007we can talk about that a little further down here as well. Surveys can be optional depending upon if there's survey fatigue in the district or not. So, we want to be able to talk about what that means for you also cost-wise. There is a savings if you decide not to do the public input survey. And or listening sessions or focus groups. Um those are an option that are included in the search if you feel it's uh valuable. Um you will see we're proposing posting this November 13th to January 11th. Um that'll get you out early, but you do not want to close before January 1st. You definitely want to get into the new year. And that posting can be adjusted however you'd like it to be. We just don't want it open forever. Having it
008open for 3 months is too long. You want to build on momentum. Um and search season has heated up. We are doing five searches right now. You are one of those five. So, it started earlier this year than it has maybe in some past years and there's going to be a lot of movement I think across Minnesota Um, but when we start pulling out your calendars and looking at timing, you guys can make any changes you want. I'm just going to do a quick review of the timeline so everyone knows what these uh meetings would be all about. Uh, the Q&A session we would do on November 19th. We want to wait and do that after uh the survey has been posted but before it closes. Uh, so we can share with any stakeholders what's
009happening when and why and we record that, put it on the district website. We did it for the last search as well. But what's new is search preview meetings. Um, we did not do those I believe two years ago. So, we've added search preview meetings which means early in the process we meet with your um administrators and separately we meet with the leadership of your bargaining units. And the idea with those search preview meetings are to bring people into the loop as soon as possible. Um, we share information. So, we talk about timeline, survey, brochure, et cetera. We answer their questions and it's a smaller group so they usually have a whole lot of questions and we ask for their help. We ask for their help to get people involved, to pay attention to the
010search process, to watch the board meetings. If you have a survey, they fill out the survey. So, those search previews came out of um a couple of searches we did a few years ago where people felt out of the loop until the end of the search. So, we started bringing them into the loop much earlier and I think that provides a great deal of stability to a search. It's a good foundation because the information we're sharing is accurate. I give all of those people my phone number and my email and say reach out if you have questions about the process. So, we're trying to bring people the internal district leadership in as soon as we can but it's not a focus group. It is us sharing information, making sure they understand the logistics of what's
011going to happen over the next few months. So, those are new. Um, I'm suggesting some dates for the interview training. Uh, that'll be a refresher again for most of you but we will need to still do it. Um, if you have a survey report, we'll discuss it that evening as well. Also, the interview questions and procedures. And interview questions have changed in last 2 years. We're doing them differently as well, and as always, you can submit your own questions in advance so we can talk about them at that meeting and choose which ones you really want to use, particularly round one and then round two. Uh so, that's going to be done potentially here in January or uh December. You're going to have application access, as I mentioned. If you need hard copies, let me
012know, but otherwise it'll be up in the cloud through Revelus, secure password, all those sorts of things. Uh you will name your finalists. Everything in yellow are dates that might need to be determined today. Um and finalize things like the interview questions and such. First round of interviews, you could do again, perhaps three to five, six people on two evenings back to back. You could do them all day on a Saturday. You could do interviews however you would like to do those. Mostly five or six people's the average, and then round two, it's probably two or three people. And that tends to be on the same day for round two, and that's when you might have additional stakeholder input on the finalists. There would be district tours. If you want more community interaction with folks,
013we can sure talk about that um in conjunction with round two. Uh last time, I believe, you had a board designee who was uh designated to negotiate the contract on behalf of the board, knowing that it comes back to the board for approval, and you as a board initially set the parameters about where you are comfortable with the compensation package. Traditionally, the board chair has done that, perhaps in consult with HR or legal counsel, just to make things move more quickly, but it could always be a board committee or the full board negotiating with your candidate if you'd like to do that. Um you might have this approved by February. And then the new superintendent would start July 1. We would also come up here and do a transition workshop with the new superintendent. We
014have not had the chance to do that with you yet, uh but it's once you have a superintendent who is signed to a 2-year contract, we come back up. We're doing them right now for last year's searches. Talk about expectations for their first year at the helm. What do you want them to focus on? How will you evaluate their performance? What metrics will you be using? All of that compensa- conversation is included in the transition workshop at no cost to the district. So, that's the timeline. So, now I'm going to open it up for questions and I have my uh computer along for my own calendar. If you see things you want to move around or change in any way, shape, or form. So, I'll turn it back over to you, Chair Speer. Sure. Um
015so, anything Michelle, you look like you had a question. >> No, I didn't have a question. No, mhm. Um any questions on timeline? Anything Or maybe I'm Why did you say that we don't want to do anything till after January 1? You don't want to close before January 1. You know, you wouldn't want to advertise now and close December 23rd. Okay. Yeah, people like to use People like the holiday breaks, whether it's Thanksgiving or the Christmas break, to work on all their materials and upload everything. So, I wouldn't close until middle of January at the earliest. Okay. That's the application process. Right. Right. Is there I'm I know DJ asked this question or Director Donalinger asked this question. Sorry rolling around here. Um is there a benefit to having it open longer? Should we hang
016on to it until closer to December? Yeah, you sure could. You sure could. They'll start They'll start being posted within the next couple of weeks. We'll see people posting their positions. So, um you can do whatever you want. Again, this is the board's decision. So. We're looking for your advice. I remember last time you told us that you know, we were so late. I mean, when did we even call you? Like the 20th of March? 23rd? What day it? It was late. >> late. >> Um I remember you saying that well I don't remember. 75% of our stuff comes in over Christmas break and I thought that the ideal time was like the 15th of December, but if you say it's Thanksgiving, I'm fine with that. Cuz you know what? Things stay out there, they
017kind of drift down the list. >> Yep. Yep. >> So, sometimes it's like better to Mhm. Strike while the iron's hot, you know. You can do that, too. Yeah. As far as giving advice, it's hard to say. We've opened searches. We opened searches last year in October. Mhm. Um, I think and then we also opened a search in April. So, did you feel any big Well, there's obviously a difference between October and April, but Mhm. did you have better luck I mean, if you noticed that it doesn't matter? Mhm. It doesn't >> they were they were all successful. It doesn't The timing of it is not as important other than you can be too early. Like, you can close in December, that's too early. Don't do that. Um the um biggest drivers are going to
018be location, salary, and reputation. That's what drives the size of the candidate pool, not when you announce it. If you're too late, however, there's people that are looking to make a change that have already committed to other districts. So, sometimes you miss good candidates if you're closing in March or April. But, not always, you know, we had a search in the metro last year that was very late and got rockstar applicants. So, um it really just depends. We could push this back several weeks and open early December, mid-December, push your whole timeline back and you'd be interviewing in the middle of March, probably. Um depends on your availability. If I know someone's going to be gone on vacation and can't join virtually, I I I don't want us to be interviewing in March because I
019feel like people will have made decisions by then. So, I think as soon into the new year that we can start doing that, but I just was wondering about having it open. >> Yeah. You want to push it back even by 2 weeks? Um post right before Thanksgiving and close at the end of January? I don't know if it's going to make a difference or not, honestly. Again, they're looking for location, salary, and reputation. That's how you're going to get applicants, not when you close. Exactly. Exactly. I like closing early in January, whatever that is. So, what wherever that puts us then to open. That seems relevant. Is there a benefit to open? Well, I guess we're already in November, so I was going to say October, but I'm a month late. I I just
020If you're going to be closing in January, I'd open before Thanksgiving. Okay. >> Cuz that's a that's a long break for a lot of people, and that's when they start looking ahead to the next year. Now, there are going to be people in January that are just starting to think about whether or not they want to make a move. But if they have their eye on your district, it doesn't matter when you open and close. If they have their eye on this job, they're going to apply. They'll make sure of it. Um How are they going to hear about it? Yeah. I'm good with this timeline. I may too. Yeah. That's fine. I'm good too. November 13th to January 11th? Yes. Yeah. Yeah, I don't have a problem with that. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so
021if we're going to um open on the 13th, close the 11th, that's the week of the leadership conference, and so I just selected it to be early that week so that we can start reviewing them immediately after the conference ourselves. What do you want to um do about the survey and our focus groups and such? And we do visit revisit it later in the meeting because there's some financial consequences for those things as well, or do you want to decide during the timeline discussion whether or not to do those things? Um any strong feelings on the survey? >> So, you want to know if you want to do the survey? Yep. And have you told us how much the survey is? Included in this price, but if you want to remove it, it'll save you
022$1,500. Got you. I would like to do the survey. I think we need to get public input. Where does the survey go? Where does it go? Yeah, how do you get people to fill out the survey? Uh every single communication channel the district already uses, we'd be using to get the word out through email blasts, um website, social media, newspaper perhaps if you have good relationships with the newspaper. Um we have a template that people um copy and paste into their own district communications protocols. And there's a link in there for taking the survey. Um we last time I think we talked about doing it in English and Spanish, but we can do it in Somali as well if you need that. Um we'll also have a link in there for the Q&A session and
023for people to submit questions in advance of that Q&A. Not everyone's going to be able to come to the Q&A on the 19th, but we'll answer questions that come in in advance during that live session, record it, put it on the website as well. So the communications blast we call it has a whole bunch of different things in it that the district can use and modify to really fit how they want to get the word out. You want hard copies of those surveys also in the district buildings on the front desk of, you know, reception desk for everybody that wants to take it or needs to take it in a hard copy as well. You want to do it? Do you guys want to do a survey? Yes. Okay. Well, we'll say for now we
024will and then when we get to the back, which is the proposal pages, I didn't actually write a proposal, but it's the same one that you saw last year or the year before. Um we'll talk a little bit more about what that means and then how and if to set up additional stakeholder input sessions. We can talk about that. >> Are we going to survey people out? I mean, uh we're going to do surveys with the budget, right? And we're going to be doing a survey with this. Are they going to I don't care one way or another. I'm just asking the question. Yeah. When's the survey for the budget going out? What is that survey? Is there really going to be a survey or is it just going to be a little five question
025thing, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I just feel like we need to offer the public the chance to give input. And that's >> Whether they want to or not, that's up to them, but to at least we can offer that. I feel their only defense would be is that we just did it a year and a half ago. But I'm fine with doing it. Yeah, I mean I It's just a question. >> I think things have changed and I think that more that we can update bring an update and and involve the public is the best thing to do, so I'm all for it. Okay. Okay, cool. I agree. Great. Okay. Um so just moving down the timeline then here we have the next decision to make then would be the board meets for interview
026training and to discuss questions and procedures. And we could do this it looks like in December or in January. My recommendation might be January just so because then it's closer um to when we'd actually do interviews. It's kind of top-of-mind for folks. Yeah, cuz it looks like that would be the earliest to do the finalist interview questions, etc. January 21st. So yeah, that's a good point. We have Sometime in January then? Okay. We have our regular meeting if we want to try to 12. That's going to be January 12th is there. 6, 7, or 8. If I could make a suggestion, maybe it would help to set your interview date first and then look backwards to when you want to do the interview training and final You may pick a date for interview training and
027then it turns out you're going to do your interviews further out than you thought you might because of the availability of board members. That's a good idea. So, if you look ahead down to conduct first round of interviews, we're saying the end of January all the way through the middle of February. And I'd suggest you hold spots for six. You might not need all of those, but two evenings if you want to do that again or all day on a Saturday, you can sure look at that. So, interviews, when do you want to perhaps conduct those? What does the 20th, January 27th, 28th, and 29th look like for folks? Good. For me. Good for me. What is it now? Except I'll be I'll be doing it virtually, obviously. Which day? Um January 27th, 28th, 29th.
028This is for these um having these interviews? Yeah. Or February 2nd, 3rd, and 4th. That's to determine finalists, right? Interviews. >> That is to determine interviews. Interviews. The actual interviews? We're kind of working backwards cuz the interviews tend to be the most pivotal date. And once you know when you're interviewing people, then you can Okay. back up and pick when to announce and when to train. I just wanted to make sure I was looking at the right dates here. Why does three have an asterisk? Because that is um there's some dates you cannot meet and on February 3rd, it is precinct caucus day, so you cannot have any meetings or activities after 6:00. But we could meet and be done before 6:00. Okay. Got it. I can't make the 27th, 8th, or 9th. So, we're
029I can't either, actually. Sorry. What about that? And I can't do the 21st through the 23rd? 7th, probably. yeah. Okay. So, the second February 2nd, 3rd, 4th. And February 3rd should have an asterisk on all three of them. I had it in the first one, but I didn't carry it over. So, that is precinct caucus day. Oh, got you. Okay, got it. Yep. So, again, this date is to determine the finalists. >> February 2nd. Okay. Can we do that? Brandy, can you make the second work? For what For interviews. If you do interviews, you're going to need the full day. >> round of interviews? Say that again, Barb. These are for interviews. Round one might be six people. So, if you're going to do February 2nd, you're going to have to do it that whole
030day or most of the day starting at noon perhaps until 9:00 at night to hold space for six people. Unless you want to bleed over into the 3rd. As long as we're done before 6:00 p.m. on the 3rd. Okay. Last time I think you held two evenings back-to-back. >> I think we should do I think we should do two. We could do the How about the 2nd and the 4th? 2nd and the 4th? Yeah. We could do that. Um the thing we ran into last time was not being able to do them live or put them out there so that candidates didn't see the questions. But I think we got we worked with that. I think that worked okay. >> recorded on >> We recorded it and put it up later. Okay. Yeah, should I
031mean, 2nd and 4th, how does that look for folks? Good. February 2nd and 4th? >> Unless you want to do all day Saturday the 7th. I don't. Nope. And this is to conduct first round interviews, is that >> interviews in the evenings The second and two things. Two things. Two requests. I like the second. I think we should do the second and the third, and I think we should do these in the afternoon. I mean, I know it It to take the afternoon off, but everyone's fresher. The people we're interviewing are fresher. >> Yeah, that's We're fresher. This whole interviewing somebody at 9:00 at night who drove up here from flipping Owatonna or something like that. It's like, "Holy cow." They're just, you know, it's like it's not I just It's a pretty important deal.
032Yeah. So, if we start at 9:00 >> or we just do a whole day and we just line them up and do them from morning till night. I even for ourselves, I mean, if we then we get a like an hour and a half break for lunch or something, you could kind of get your wits back. It gets long. It's a long day to do that and stuff. I do. PhD Well, you know >> Or do you do the whole day or the second and third, just do it two days back-to-back? Well, I think we can't do the third. Otherwise, >> to be done by 6:00. Oh, we have to be done by 6:00. If we did them in the afternoons, which I think it'd be nice to do them. I mentioned that the last
033time. Like noon, do one at noon, one at two, and one at four. Is that how you do it, Barb? Pretty much. The only thing about that that I worry is um access for the public if they want to be there is nice for them to be able to have in the evening when they're not at work. How is that important? Then they might have I mean Yeah. It's an important position that we're dealing with. So, I'd like to see people fresh and sharp. Um I I don't think any No one's doing their best work at night. Yeah. You know. Well, true. It depends upon what your job is. Oh, Randy. >> No, no. No, no. I'm not going anywhere. I'm just saying that, you know, I mean, I understand what you're saying. I mean,
034I wouldn't want to drive all the way up from Owatonna or wherever and then do an interview at 7:00 at night. No. I hear you. That can't be good. No, I agree. So, if you do it in the afternoons on the second and third, you can start at noon or 1:00. Now, on the third, if you have three. We're saying three and three, you might have a total of four people. So, it could be four. >> may not like them. You just don't know. Just like them. Just don't know. >> need to allow time for deliberations on the third to decide who to bring back for the second round of interviews. So, the interviews would need to be done probably by 4:00 on the third so that you give us a half hour to tabulate
035the EMD forms. You start deliberating at 4:30, quarter to 5:00. That gives you an hour, hour and a half. I don't think it'll take that long to narrow it down from let's say six to two or three. We could start at 11:00. >> What's on the third that's so important? Precinct Caucus Day. And the state law says there can be no meetings or activities after 6:00 p.m. on Precinct Caucus Day. Oh, who monitors that? I won't be here. You You can all meet. I won't be here though. That's okay. Cannot participate in the fair activities. We won't make you, Barb. >> Thank you. And that's assuming we have six candidates if we have You may not. What's wrong with doing the second and the fourth and we get a break in between there, too? All
036right. Well, I'll probably be on Zoom on one of them. All right. That's okay. Which one? I don't know. Oh, okay. >> I'll probably the fourth. Okay. So will I. One of the two. >> we should second and let's do the second and third so everybody can be there. What's you remember what you saw yesterday? If you split them They really go apart. It's like, "Well, I don't remember. Did I say >> a little tougher. >> That's true. That's true. >> Your brain is refreshed. Yeah. Okay. Let's just get it done. I just want to leave enough time on the third that we're not rushing. >> Let's just start at Let's Let's do noon on the second. And 11:00 on the >> 11:00 on the third? Yeah. You know, most of the time we never
037really We never really interviewed anybody over an hour. Last time. >> No, you didn't. No. You took a 15-minute break between. Yeah. I don't know if you need to start at 11:00. If you do have three people, you do a noon, 1:15 or 1:30, quarter to 3:00. Oh. Like quarter to 4:00, you're done if you start at noon. Okay, then. >> You could do noon noon both days. That's fine. >> Sure. February 2nd and 3rd, noon both days. Okay. Noon both days. Yeah, on the 2nd and >> So, February 2nd and 3rd for round one, then let's identify round two moving forward then. So, if you interview on Tuesday the 3rd, you could interview on that weekend, the 6th, 7th, or the next week on Monday the 9th, Tuesday the 10th of February. So, by
038the middle of February, you might have someone selected and hopefully have a contract signed by the end of February. That'd feel good. Mhm. If we stick with the same schedule, the 9th will be a board meeting. Say that again, Kelly. If we stick with what we've done in the past with the second Monday of being a school board meeting, the 9th would be that Okay. So, we could possibly do the 9th at noon? No, the 9th would just be our school regular school board >> Regular school board. >> Yeah, I know. Yeah. But, I mean, I'm talking about second round of interviews. Why couldn't we do it on the 9th before the school board meeting? Oh, can we do it that fast? If you have three people, it's going to take a while and deliberations
039to choose who to hire. It can take a while, so I I worry you wouldn't finish in time for your board meeting. Okay, no You know, block block out probably 5 hours for round two. If you have three people, you might have two or one. So, we just do it on the 10th? >> On the 10th. I guess so, then. Tuesday the 10th? Mhm. What time are we doing that? It's going to take us 5 hours. Could we start mid-afternoon, late afternoon? 2:00? I like that, Barb. I'll be here whenever you need me to be. 2:00 p.m. on the 10th? John and Stephanie, does that work for you? February 10th, 2:00 p.m.? I'd rather start earlier, but yeah, I can make it work. Okay. All right. So, now let's work backwards. So, Oh. If I
040don't know. Are we done? Okay. Okay. February 10th at 2:00 p.m. round two. Round one is February 2nd, 3rd at noon both days. So, now we're going to back up as to when you're going to name people publicly. So, if you're interviewing on February 2nd, uh you could name them the week before. The week of the 26th of January. So, >> we're all going to be gone. >> We're all gone that week. >> You're all gone 26th, 27th, 28th, 29th, and 30th. Well, at least three of us are. Yeah. Yeah, I was going to say, "What do you mean all?" Well, I could hop on a Zoom. No, I'm good. >> Well, no, I can't. Not on that deal. I'm going to be at this meeting in I'm just kidding. one of you here. I
041don't know if I can be on it. >> We need one person here. >> be in Randy. For what? I I'm I'm in Mexico. I'm not going to. I am, too. Yeah, let's let's uh How about the 21st? Any Is anybody going to be here on the 21st? Um I think that's what No, I'm not. I leave that day. Well, so we're kind of screwed up. So, we probably can't do the 2nd and 3rd on the interviews. Mhm. Cuz then cuz you guys are going to be gone the whole um other dates. Mhm. This meeting is relatively short when you select your finalists, maybe an hour. Maybe. Um 45 minutes sometimes if there's consensus real quickly about who you want to bring in to interview it can be even shorter, but um Oh. We don't
042want weeks between naming finalists and interviewing them. If you name them and you wait two or three weeks to interview them, that's too long. That allows for lots of shenanigans to occur relative to their candidacies. So we try to name them closer to their interviews so that there's not a lot of time for people to dig up all sorts of things on people that may or may not be true. Got you. Okay. >> And why can't we do this virtually? Why can't it be done virtually? We can. We just have to have one person here in the room. Randy, will you be here the week of the 27th, 28th, 29th? Um I will be back We're talking about January? >> Yeah, okay. I'll be back by January the week of 20 the 26th? Yeah. Why
043can't we do it on the 26th, that Monday? I'm gone until the 27th. Oh, okay. So I could be here the 28th or the 29th. I'm going to be there the 29th. Um So if we only need one, isn't there somebody that's going to be there on the 26th? Randy could be. And then we would And then everybody else zooms in? Yeah, I can zoom in. DJ, could that work for you or no? Yeah. Why don't we do it a little earlier in the day? If we're just going to if it's only going to be a 45-minute meeting, what difference does it make? Do it like 2:00 or 3:00 and you can go off and you're on your trip and you can go do what you want. What what what day are you guys picking?
044Um 26th. I'm not available night on the 26th, so I didn't list it as an option, but if you meet during the day virtually, I can join you as well. Okay. 26th is the first day this meeting I'm at. I'm done at 12:00 Eastern, so I'm done at 11:00 here. So 12:00, 1:00, 2:00 Probably not 2:00. >> Yeah. Still here in the afternoons. It's like where all going in these boats, you know? >> Yeah. I'd say the earlier the better, too. Noon? Noon. >> Noon, yeah. Does that work for you, Barb? On the 26th? Yeah. Yes. Okay. Kelly, does that work for you? So, this is where we where we determine we're going to we're going to interview um Hopefully they candidate 1 8 10 Yep. whatever. And then that after you've decided who to
045interview, I'll read the names out loud on that day, on the 26th. So, between January 26th, that's it's only a week. January 26th to February 2nd is a week. Which is good. That's long enough, not too long. Um then candidates will have a week to prepare. So, is their interviews on the 2nd 26th at what time? Noon. >> At noon. Is that the day that we get training on the interviewing process and Um we could, but normally that's a separate meeting. Okay. >> So, we would back up from January January 26th now. And so, this is why we kind of did this backwards because if we'd picked interview training for December 16th, for example, January 26th is a long way away from then. So, we don't want to have too much time elapse between the
046interview training and when you actually um determine finalists. So, now if you're going to name your finalists on the 26th and interview on the 2nd, uh are there folks that might want to be trained? I put January 6th, 7th, or 8th, but we can go later than that. Yeah, maybe right after the leadership conference, the week of January 19th, 20th, 21st, 22nd. Yeah, meet on the 19th, and I do have something on the 20th, but the 21st, 22nd, or 23rd of January? Or we roll it into the 26th. It'll be a longer meeting then for those of you who are out of town on the 26th. And that'll take that'll take an hour and a half, 2 hours. I like going on the 26th. Let's just do it all in one day. With the training?
047Yeah. Where's the training? It's on the 26th at noon. No, the the interviews or the pick our people are on the 26th at noon. I'm not doing it on the 26th. What? I Should we do it I'll meet for that. Yeah. Yeah. I don't even know what kind of internet kind of I'll have connect connect connectivity I'll have. So, um what if we did it at our January as part of our January meeting? Our board meeting? Mhm. Yeah, great idea. Perfect. >> When is that? 12th. Sorry, that's not on your list, Barb. Um When do you meet? We meet at 6. Could we do it before that or as part of the Can I join you virtually cuz the leadership conference starts the next day. Oh, okay. So, I have to be in downtown Minneapolis
048Monday night. Yeah. You have organizational at 5:30. At 5:30. So, um 4:00? 4:00? Is that enough time for you? Hour and a half? I mean I think so. Five of us have been through it. Yeah. Okay. This is for interview training now? Interview training and to discuss the stakeholder report that we gathered from the stakeholders. So, Interview questions and procedures, okay. Monday, January 12th at what time can we start? I'm sorry. >> 4:00. 4:00? 4:00. Okay. January 12th at 4:00. You have to get yourself like a day planner, Randy. I got a phone. And I got Okay, so I'm going to repeat the dates that I wrote down to make sure that my notes reflect what you just decided. Okay? So, um I will work uh probably with Kelly to set up search preview meetings
049the weeks of November 10 or 17. I'll send um send you an email, Kelly, and just say this is the groups I typically meet with and it's usually virtual. And then if you could help me set up a time for me to talk to those two groups um the week of November 10th or 17th. All right. So, meeting for interview training and discussing the public input report is Monday, January 12th at 4:00 p.m. I will join you virtually. Uh then we're going to go down to the next meeting would be January 26th at noon to name your finalists. And then you would interview February 2nd and 3rd if you have six people. Save hold you know, save spots for six starting at noon both days. And then round two would be February 10th beginning at
0502:00 p.m. and we'd have district tours earlier in the day as well. And that means right away in February 11th someone would begin negotiating with your selected finalists. Do you have a regular meeting in February that you could approve the approve the contract tentatively? >> Yes. February 9th. Okay, it's too late then. So, do you have any special meetings coming up in February? No, but if all we have to do is approve a contract, we can throw a meeting together in 15 minutes and vote on one thing. >> Yes, absolutely. So, should we leave it February to be determined when you're going to approve the approve that contract? Okay. So, those are the dates. Um so, let me look take a look here. If you're going to name your finalists on the 26th I'm just
051looking at the application deadline. Um mean I'm going to go back and look I'm I'm still thinking January 11th is a good day to close. But the 11th of January is two weeks two weeks and a day before you would name finalists. So, we could potentially push it back to the 18th and let people apply till the 18th and you'd have access on the 20th and you'd have 6 days. That's a good idea. Mhm. That's fine. Mhm. January 18th, we look at them on the 19th, you'd see them on the 20th, you'd have 6 days to do your research. Meanwhile, we're doing our vetting. Um we have 8 days to our vetting to recommend some folks to you. So, then I don't know if we need to open on the 13th if we're going to
052close January 18th, we could open on November 20th. Let's do that. >> maybe a week, it's a little closer to Thanksgiving. Yeah. >> Good idea. Okay. So, post November 20th, close January 18th. Why would you send us an updated >> Oh, yeah. timeline, thank you. >> Yeah. I'll I'll fix it and clean it up and I'll make sure Kelly proofreads it for me as well. So, >> Great. Uh so, then we'd still be looking at closing the survey on December 8th and we report to you with a full report on January 12th. Hm, we could leave the survey open longer as well then. I might push back the survey a little bit, also, but I'll I'll do that to be determined. I'll figure that out as to when the survey opens because then it doesn't
053need to open on the 10th. Right. Maybe people aren't quite in the mode yet for superintendent search. So, if you push that back because if we don't need to discuss a report with you till January 12th, um we can push that back. So, there'll be some different dates on here for that survey, but we'll make sure it's still open for about 3 weeks. Okay? Great. Thank you. The timeline is always the most challenging part of the meeting. So, I appreciate you pulling out your calendars and walking through that. So, now So, No, let November 10th to the 17th, that doesn't involve us at all. That's a district leadership, right? Correct. Correct. Does not involve the board at all. Okay. Thank you. All right, there is a proposed vacancy brochure in here for your review. Hopefully,
054you had a chance to take a look at it. Um all of the information was updated. I want to thank Kelly for her help her help getting all the numbers in terms of by the numbers and some of the points of pride were updated as well. I will add in the search timeline and things like that. Uh financial highlights were updated. The leadership pro- profiles on page two. And so, you can certainly take a look at that and I'll just turn it over for the board uh to the board for conversation about what you want to advertise. What we always say with the leadership profiles, you don't want to list everything because sometimes a leadership profile is a page and a half long. It's very hard for candidates to discern what's most important to you.
055So, we're starting to use the phrasing uh you have high priorities in the district, you have higher and you have highest priorities. Try to base the leadership profile around the highest priorities in the district. And I think your strategic plan would be a great place to start with that as well. Um but, we did try to model it based upon not only the strategic plan, but there's the results in here on the page that's colorful, green, and yellow. That's the hiring criteria survey that all of you took as individual board members. So, you can see on that next page past the brochure that um in green were the most responses. Five people had school finance, six people had honesty and ethic man- ethical manner. Lots of people had other ones in yellow. So, we incorporated
056all of those. You also had a 4-2 split about previous experience. Uh four people said yes, it's important they have experience. Two said it's not. So, in the brochure under the leadership profile, we put that previous superintendent experience is preferred. But, you word it however you want. This is your profile. So, if you see anything that needs changing or updating on the points of pride, about the community, or the leadership profile, now is your chance to edit this with me here. So, you Do you we have too many? I don't think so. No. This this is a pretty standard how many there are what? Eight bullet points? 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 Yeah, there's eight bullet points. So, usually it's six to eight. We've just seen some leadership profiles that are on an
0578 and 1/2 by 11 sheet typed and it's an entire page. It's like listing a job description for a superintendent, but you need to look for someone specifically for Brainerd. I think it looks good. I do, too. Yeah, I do, too. Five and five and six just seem to be I don't know. They seem They seem to be kind of the same. I don't know. I think it's better than the last time. I think the intent on the first one is more internal and the other one is more external, but they are similar. Randy, you're right. You could combine those or eliminate one or something, but one's more about inside the walls, one's more about outside the walls. Maybe just even adding collaborates effectively with community. Why not Yeah, add that to the 1 2
0583 4 Add it to the fifth where I mean, to me it it I understand now that you mentioned you know, one's inside, one's outside the walls. Can't we just add engaging with diverse stakeholder groups somehow into that discussion? Excels in team building, fostering a culture of shared responsibility, continuous improvement across the school district, and engages with diverse stakeholder groups. And then eliminate the sixth one. Is that the only one that talks about outside the building? Cuz I do think that is important. I don't want to lose that. Oh, I think it's important. I'm just saying what why can't we just add it? Excels in team >> I think you want I think you want to keep them separate talking about the school district uh environment and then the community environment. Rather than saying stakeholder
059groups, I would say diverse community groups. Does that help Randy clarify? Take out stakeholder and put community. Yeah. That's a good suggestion, I think John. Yeah, no. I mean I was just >> you could just take it out personally, but you guys do what you want. I mean Yeah, I mean I just It's it's it's like a nothingburger. Collaborates effectively earning trust and engaging with diverse stakeholder groups. What does that mean? >> See, I I guess I want my superintendent to be visible within the community and that's what that is. Isn't aren't they all? Isn't that kind of how it works? Yeah. I want that as an expectation that they they work within the the the district, but they also um have relationships and connections with community organizations. Doesn't say anything about organizations. Diverse stakeholder
060groups. Isn't that what that means? Yeah, well. And I like the edit for diverse community groups. I think that would be a good edit. So, like if you know, if they were connected to Rotary or the Lions Club or um chamber or How about we just put in gets along with everybody? Clean language. No, I like the community versus the stakeholder. That's for sure. You guys okay with that? If we Yeah. Make that change to community. Okay. I just don't like I mean I just try to get eliminate some of these. Yeah. Words that seem to permeate Yeah. the educational industry. Buzzwords, yeah. Sometimes. Buzzwords, yeah. So. Otherwise, I think this is a really good list. This is what we'll build our draft interview questions around as well as these eight bullet points, but you
061of course in advance of the meeting where we talk about questions. I'll give you deadlines to send me your questions in advance so I can include them in our list to give to you to discuss and choose what you want to ask about, but this is what we guided on. We'd also um go through your applications with an eye on these things to make sure that people match experience in these areas before we recommend them to you as finalists. What about the previous previous superintendent experience is preferred? Do you want to leave that off or do you want to put preferred but not required? Or as is. I like it as is. Any preference? I don't care if they've been a superintendent before. Somebody has to go first. You know. I think it's preferred. I
062think leaving it at preferred just It leaves the door open that it could be either way. >> have to. Yeah. But it's nice that they've got Just another one of those things that we're saying that don't mean anything. If we don't care, then we don't care. And if we care, we care. How about if we I just like to see as many people as possible. I don't like to limit. How about we satisfy both parties where we say preferred but not required? The reason it's not in here now is we ran out of white space. Is one I'd have to I could take out Brainerd Public Schools with opportunity innovation success and you'd have room to move everything down and make it a little less busy and have more white space. I could add but
063not required. I would just need to find room. It's fine the way it is. It's it's Yeah. I just I don't think it's going to >> want to limit the opportunity. >> I want to see who's out there and um so I don't see any I mean, what is it? Oh, that's one we Oh, they weren't a superintendent before. Well, if you're not interested in someone that's not a superintendent anymore, then don't but that one's out. It's no big deal they send their application in. Who cares? It doesn't cost us anything, you know. But they can stay in there, too. That's fine. We had people apply last time and we had that in there that weren't superintendents before. Mhm. And the guy from Albert Lea. Going once, going twice. It stays in as is preferred.
064Yeah. Okay. All right, so then you can go past the results of your hiring criteria survey. Uh the next page is the compensation language. So, what's different from the first search I did with you all is you now are required a salary range in your posting. So, you can use this language right here, but the next page does have some comparable districts and uh benefits. So, what I'd be looking for you to give me today is the salary range to publish in your vacancy brochure. So, can we do that when we're like not in session? I'm sorry. Are we okay doing that? We're in session. >> This is a regular board meeting. >> That's right. We did That's right. We did the budget and everything. Hello. Oh, yeah. Yeah, okay. Well, I think we need
065to bump it up on the calendar. Need to bump it up. I think we should bump it up and take some vacation away. 40 days, wow. Well, 40 days was a Peter guy, but I think It'll be negotiated. 30 is what it was plus the 11 paid holidays. So, yeah, you're you're on the money, Steph. But, it includes his sick days if you look all the way to the right as well. Yeah. >> Yeah, I added those two columns up. I added the vacation, PTO, holidays, and sick pay up. And they range from um you know, 48 to 102. If you add them all up. If you add up the days that they're entitled to have off. So, That's 102. Holy cow. Um what we're deciding on right now is a salary range. >> Range.
066Yep. So, is there a bottom and a top at which we feel comfortable? I mean, just looking at this list, maybe um our bottom is where we're at now, and our top is 220? Oof. Oh. I'm with Stephanie. I don't think that You can't do one without the other. It's a package. I mean, let's just say that we paid way less, but we had a huge donation to your uh 403b, and we gave you twice as much time off, and it's a package. So, >> Right. It has to be negotiated. So, depending on That's why you have a high and a low range because they can decide what's important to them. Maybe salary is not as important to um as days off or 403b contribution. So, I don't know. I'm just saying that Jason, you
067have any uh thoughts? HR guy? I mean, just one thing to think about is, you know, uh for what it's worth, right? Um think about CEO versus workers, and and in the private sector how that's a massive difference. Here, we're maybe two, three, four, five times, depending on where someone's at in the org chart. I don't think that's unreasonable. I think you got to get over $200,000 to have a reasonable shot at getting a good pool. But, I'd have to defer to the the expert on that. You know, and if you got a low low range of 170, I guess that starts that that works. But, um our our admin comp seems to be kind of low market when you when you kind of look at our data. I agree, Jason. Yeah. Yeah. So, I
068think we should go to 25 days off. We were at 30. Peter negotiated that cuz we're not paying him his HRA. He doesn't have any of that stuff. So, Peter's deal was a little different because we didn't have those other costs with him. So, it kind of makes sense, right? Well, see, then we'll start fresh with a contract to negotiate when they come in. All we have to give them right now is a salary range, but once we go into negotiations over the contract, then we can talk vacation. You have to put down that so this stuff doesn't go on. That was negotiated. >> right? Just a salary range, and then we do have the options in um italics. Some people like to throw in something that might be unique to their district. You know,
069benefits such as health, dental, life insurance, you know, that kind of thing. They can throw I don't know if there's something really unique in Brainerd that you offer. You know. I don't know. Do we do any of this stuff, Jason? Have you seen this? I'm just used to a verb we say and like an an excellent benefits package. Keep it short and sweet. You could do that, too. I mean, that's what I've done for a lot of my Most districts >> Yeah, that's it. People who apply know that there's a pretty decent benefits package. And uh is it getting in the weeds on all that? That's probably not why they're necessarily going to apply or not apply. Um but, again, How about benefits commensurate with experience? Well, that's not really the case. We have to
070offer benefits based on reasons that aren't based on experience. I like that idea though of just um includes an excellent benefits package. >> Yeah. I'd like that, too. Um so back to the range cuz that's the piece that we have to decide on. So we're saying 178 to 220. And I hear Jason say I'm not cool with that. I think it's 200. I think we um probably eliminate that we start at 200. I think we start at 200, too. Okay. What do you think? Well, I'm fine with that. I'm good with that. I I just heard the other number before. And it really starting at 200. I think that's fair. What is What would our range be then? What's What would be our top that we >> The only reason we're doing a range is
071because we want to attract people at a higher number. Mhm. So. I mean, what are you seeing with these deals? Is that Does it end up getting The problem with the range is I mean, I don't have a problem with a range. I guess I do it for years, you know, before we had the rule. You know, you put the big high number in there because someone will maybe think they can get there and then it's like, well, you know, that's somewhere you for your your 19, you're not going to get that now. You know, you work your way up there. My concern is that if in the end we negotiated 200, would they feel like they're getting the low end of the the offering? Depends who's doing the negotiating. >> Cuz we don't really
072want to go much above 200, do we? I mean, you look at these other districts with their Well, I was looking at St. Michael-Albertville. That's kind of commensurate with our district and they're at two to what, 220? Yeah, but they have 6,500 students. Huh? They have 6,500 students. >> Well, we're 59. And that's not that big of I mean Yeah. Morehead Morehead is 220 and they're at 7,200. >> Yeah. Yeah. And Louisville is 214 and they have 8,000. Yeah. What's the range for 190 to 210? What do you think of that part? I like >> that's 190 to 220. It's never stupid. Mhm. You do what you >> We could tell the truth on this board. Because then if they >> We could take >> 190 to 220. >> cuz then if they're getting 200,
073they don't feel like they're getting the low end of the salary range. >> Yeah. But 190 started at 200,000 now. >> No, I want to start at 190 so that we give them maybe 200 and Oh, sure. They feel good about it. And they feel good about it. Yeah. Okay. They'll either feel good about it or they won't take the job. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we'll get a sense for that, I think. It might be It might be like certain things too and they they might defer some salary to some other benefits that they might want to have too. So, but that, you know. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Okay. We comfortable with that, team? 190 to 220. Okay. Yeah. All right. Okay. 190 to 220. Got it. And then just including an excellent benefits package. Mhm. Super
074simple. >> Yeah. Okay. Okay. Thank you. So, the next piece in your packet is the um survey. And it's similar, but we've updated a few things since we did it a few years ago here. Um so, I'll insert the dates and uh as far as respondent categories, these are traditionally what we'll see. Um for sure community member, parent, guardian, staff member, and student. Um whether or not you want to have the additional one of business owner or district partner or agriculture is entirely up to you. Some districts choose one of those or two, some remove it entirely. Depends how big a contingent you might have in that category that would fill us out. What are you going to do with the information? We'll give it to you broken out quantitatively. The first two and a
075half, three pages will be broken out by respondent category. So, you'll say, "This is what the students says mattered to them as far as top six. This is what staff said. This is what parents said. This is you know, so you can see and compare and contrast the quantitative stuff. Um so, you'll you'll see the trends. But, you won't see the raw data. We have a report that we'll share with you um in that stakeholder summary report on that one meeting where we bring you the report. So, what we're doing is comparing what our six most important things were with the communities. >> Yep. Correct. >> Got it. Okay. >> Correct. See how they align. Yep. Okay. So, I guess do you have enough of a an agricultural influence in the area that you want
076specifically? Sometimes people who are in ag fill out community member or parent. Yeah. Um do you have a business community that's going to want to be specially called out as a business community? Usually the respondents in that first category are pretty low. Maybe five to 15 people choose it versus, you know, we have 500 community or 600 staff or whatever. So, it's not chosen a lot, but if you want it in there, we'll put it in there. It is nice to know what's important to that group as stakeholders, but I could go either way. Do you guys have a preference? I don't know why you wouldn't leave it on there. I don't What does it accomplish to get rid of it? Nothing. It just simplifies it to fewer choices. Cuz most people, if they're a
077business owner, are probably a community member. Probably. It's just a matter of whether you want to call out or if they didn't even choose business as their category. If they maybe they'll choose parent. There's so many cross hats that you all wear up here that it's just it's one more piece of data, but it's um I just wouldn't leave it with all three. That's a lot. Business owner, district partner, or agriculture. So, Yeah. whittle it down if you can. >> Get rid of district partner with the district partner. But agriculture, too. I'd give it to both of those. >> Yeah, I think business owner is is good. Yeah. Just business owner. Okay. We'll eliminate district partner or agriculture. Do you want this in Spanish as well? No. Just in English? Are we good with that?
078>> How many Spanish How many ESL families do we have in the district? I don't know. Are you still here, Carrie? Yeah. Oh, no, she left. I know Spanish and Vietnamese are higher. But I can I can get that information if we're interested in other languages. Okay. Can we hold on that decision until we have a better idea? >> be Now we push the survey back a little bit a little bit. You certainly can. Um We'd love to offer it in multiple languages so that people feel it's optional. However, what we find is even people whose first language is not English will fill it out in English 90% of the time. They have their kids help them fill it out or a neighbor or a cultural liaison. We're always surprised even in districts that have
079a very high, for example, Spanish-speaking population, we get very few surveys in the actual language, but offering it is an inclusive thing to do. We just get very few actual responses in languages other than English, so. But it's your call. If it goes on the parent square, depending on how Carla puts it up there, parent square will translate. Or so at least for the district piece of it. Okay. So, knowing that, are we comfortable just offering it in English? >> with that then. I just want to make sure we're inclusive to all of our English only? Just in English. Okay, so this is the survey. Uh let's see. Here we go. Uh, so then we're going to look at the Oh, I wanted to talk a little bit about um the Q&A with MSBA again.
080When I send the communications blur about, we'll have people send me questions in advance that I'll answer. I'll record it. We'll put it on the district website. I do encourage everyone on the board to watch the Q&A so you know what I told people and you'll know what questions they asked me. That way if you get stopped in the grocery store, you can tell them to go watch it themselves. Um the search preview meetings I think are going to be very helpful. Those have been a really good tool for us to get those internal leaders in the loop as soon as possible. Um staff survey, community survey, it's all the same. And then the finalists interviews you're going to wait and decide on that um if and how you might want people involved in um
081in the search in the interviews themselves. Last time you did not have anyone interview uh the candidates except the board. That's what the vast majority of boards do. However, if you wanted to have input from people on the candidates through an electronic form or through interview committees, you can do that. But we don't want you thinking about that till you've seen the the input report from the the stakeholder survey. That'll help you make the decision about what's next and do we want more community input? What does it look like? How do we put guardrails around it so that we don't end up with I mean, sometimes if you put an online form for people to fill out about your candidates, you end up with people spamming the survey um with an orchestrated campaign against someone
082or for someone else and the data is actually pretty useless. So you want to be careful how you offer opportunities for input and to whom. But we will talk about that later. Uh so then if you look at the next page, it says page three. This is from the proposal that I originally submitted to you uh for this search. Um the question I'd have in addition to the survey which you just decided we are going to do. Um we'll do the Q&A session search previews. Um do you want me to schedule any focus groups or listening sessions during the time that the survey is open? They used to be normal everyday everybody did them. I haven't done those in 5 years. I think because the survey is such um a universal tool and everyone's voice
083is heard at the same volume. Um I am doing some listening sessions in a district right now. And we have had people RSVP'ing if they're going to come and so far um I have two people signed up for listening sessions and they've been promoting it for a couple of weeks now. So attendance is typically low but that doesn't mean you shouldn't do them. If you want me to talk to people in advance in addition to the survey, I will do it. I just want to make sure that you have the opportunity to say yes or no cuz they're they're always optional in the beginning stages of a process. Um I just worry with the Q&A sessions also scheduled that that's a lot for people if they choose to be involved. I don't know. I agree.
084I don't think we need it. I agree. Strong feelings? I I mean I think the best data we're going to get is from those folks filling out the survey. >> so, too. So I Yeah. Everyone have my phone number. If someone really wants to be heard, they can call me. And I'll take notes. But I always want to make sure they also fill out the survey. Okay. Yeah. So we won't be doing listening sessions. I'm good with that. Yeah. So the surveys everybody okay with that? Okay. All right. Um The next thing on the agenda is to discuss um in district meetings but we've already talked about that because on the next page if you notice where it says page nine I normally join you virtually for those two middle meetings but because we've also
085the timing that we discussed with the timeline, I'll be joining you virtually for those two meetings anyway. If you wanted me here in person, it would be just $300 a meeting but you don't want me here in person, so we don't need to worry about that at all. I'll join you virtually for those those two meetings. So, no additional charges for in-person meetings. I will be here for all of the interviews, round one and round two. Uh but those two meetings I'll be virtual. They have the red asterisks by them on page nine. Do you want any national advertising, page 10 in red? If you want them, we are happy to provide it for you. We do not mark it up. These are the actual costs to advertise your position on any of these national
086sites. What did we do last time? Did them. We did all of them. I don't think we did all of them. I think we listened to of I don't remember. I think we did the AASA. I think it's the one we did. And then we had an applicant that I talked about last year. Mhm. Not a name, but it just a Yeah. They were from Indiana, were they, Matt? I think they were from Chicago. Mhm. Some from the West Coast. >> Might have been Gary. It was right there. What What is your experience, Barb? Do you see good results when people do this? Do you see more applications or less or the same or what do you see? Um it depends on the district. So, larger districts, metro districts, post on all of these. Um
087also communities that have a high population, for instance, if we're working with um again a community with a high Hispanic population, they might want to advertise on ALAS. Um if there's districts that have reservations included in the boundaries, they want to advertise on the National Indian Education Association. So, it's sometimes driven by the demographics of the district. I'd say if you're looking for just um exposure without specifically trying to reach diverse candidates based upon their sites, I'd say that the AASA is a good one. Um and maybe Top School Jobs Ed Week. I don't know that anyone has applied for a job because they were convinced to do so because they saw it. Most often they're thinking of already coming back to Minnesota. And so they've maybe worked here before or they have family here.
088No one tends to you know, click on a site and go, "Oh, I've always wanted to move to Minnesota." But I think it at least could pique their interest, but then they're going to do their homework. You may get one, two, three people that see it on a national site and go, "Hmm." Because by spending the money on a national site, you're also putting yourself in um sort of the destination district kind of category that we are going to spend the money to make sure that people nationally know. Now, you're already national cuz of Revelus. All of the school board associations that do searches use that. So, we have it in Revelus, so Texas, Michigan, Nebraska, Wisconsin, they if they're looking for jobs on their school board association site like ours, they'll see Minnesota's already
089at no cost. But you could choose if you wanted to do just a couple of the bigger ones. We usually don't see Minnesota districts do it though unless they're big districts or they're in the metro. Let's not do it then, yeah. Last time we're doing doing it early enough in advance. I think last time we were really wanting to get a bigger Yeah, bigger candidate pool, but Yeah. Okay. And then what do you think about background checks? You can wait and decide on that as well. This is the in-depth um national criminal background check as well as educational credential verification that if they say they have a master's, you confirm they have a master's. $395 per person. >> We don't want to be like Des Moines. That's been an interesting scenario. It has. Mhm. Yeah.
090I think last time around we only did background checks on the two finalists, I believe. >> I think so, too. Um >> Not every not not not Correct. And I think you probably paid for them because the district does your own background checks. You you have to do them for every employee. I mean, everyone fills out a background check, but it's usually Minnesota. And this is um a national, but it doesn't go back 20 years. And it also doesn't do I-9 verification. That's the thing we learned from the whole Demoine mess is the only people who can do the I-9 verification is the actual employer. So, background check company, no matter how good they are, would not be able to verify that they're eligible to work in the United States. That's on the district shoulders
091to do that. No one else has access to the I-9 form other than the employer. What is the deal with um So, they would have checked out that guy's education? Someone should have checked and confirmed the educational verification that yes, he did have the doctorate. If they'd done a background check, yes. And our our firm does that. Did he have the doctorate? I don't know. I think it's What do they call it when it's um doctorate in progress or something like that? ABD, all but dissertation. Um a doctorate, but ABD, all but dissertation. I'm not sure, but I don't know. Yeah, that that that was whole thing was unfortunate. Um but everyone learned a lot and double-checked their background check processes and we're doing everything we possibly can. If they're a known commodity in Minnesota,
092many districts say, "Well, we don't need to bother because they've been a superintendent here for 12 years." or whatever. Some districts will just say no, our our $15 background check's good enough. Can we just wait on this? >> Yeah. >> And to see who our candidate our final candidate is. >> Yeah, I would think that what we would do um I think we kind of would negotiate to get done what we did last time. I remember you didn't want to pay. Um it's all right. I'm trying to save money in places that don't affect student achievement. >> you. Um I think we should um I think we should if we get down to five candidates, four candidates, six candidates, whatever our final list of candidates is that we're going to actually interview, we should do
093all of them. Cuz we'd be pretty bummed out if we went and cut it down to two I I think that >> then had the background check done and found out one of them was a I think if they've been in a district for 20 years and in an in an administrative role, we can trust that that that's good. I'm not a very trusting person. Yeah, but I mean I think that's that's we should just that's why I'm proposing we just wait until we see Yeah, but we don't know Yeah, I think we should do that. I think we should do the ones we interview, not just the like we narrowed down it to two >> Well, because then if one of them is bad, then now we're we don't have two finalists. We We
094only have one. Yeah, I follow you. We can still wait though. I mean I just >> do we end up with? Yeah. How many did we actually interview? Let's push that decision. Maybe we should Yeah. Like Yeah. And we'll we'll know a little bit about their history. >> How much are they? 300 bucks? 400 >> 400 395 Okay. Yeah. Well, that's kind of a good deal here. 399.99 300 is the closest to that. Okay, so we're going to come back to that at one of the meetings when we meet. Maybe maybe the night you determine your finalists. Right. That's the night maybe you say or day, whatever we choose. >> sense. Okay. All right, so finishing up the agenda here, the rest is um sort of review as well, but the role of the current
095superintendent, generally speaking, they are not at the meetings, they're not a part of this other than um they're a cheerleader for the district. If someone calls and says what it's like, you know, great staff, great district. Do you have any other role envisioned for Peter during the search process? No? Okay. That is what is traditionally what it is. Um school board spokesperson, if you're contacted by the media, it is usually the board chair. Bet bet that. >> something Sarah you're comfortable with doing? Yep, spokesperson. Yep. Yep, here's her cell phone number. Give her a call. Um we have added uh we've added ground rules and do's and don'ts uh just as a review before the search gets rolling too much further. So, I share this with every single board. Couple of things, please. If you
096are asked for a letter of reference for this job, please don't write one. Okay. >> It puts you in a weird spot if someone asks you to write them a letter of recommendation and you're on the board. Now, if they're applying for like I mean, like Albertville, I'm not saying but if they're applying elsewhere, feel free to write letters of recommendation, but please don't write letters of rec for your own job. Also, please turn down the opportunity to be a reference for someone. And sometimes it happens with internal candidates. They'll say, "Hey, you're a board member, you know I'd do a great job. Would you be a reference for me?" Again, it just puts you as a hiring authority in a weird spot to be listed. So, try not to do that for your own
097search. Um if you're contacted by candidates with questions about the search, please don't handle those questions yourself. Just have them call me. My number's in the vacancy brochure and on the survey, it's everywhere. But don't handle those questions yourselves from candidates. It's a lot safer for you to just turn them over to the search firm to handle those as well. It's tempting, but don't do a deep social media dive with every single candidate that applies. Um about 75% of what you read about them on the internet will not be true. Maybe based in fact, but be very careful. We do a deep social media dive in the background check actually. We've added the social media sweep to that as well. So, you can see what their social media footprint is like. Um but just don't
098go down rabbit holes. If you do and you get concerned about something, call me. I'll pull you back up to the surface of the world and try and get you out of those dark deep holes sometimes with your candidates cuz everybody has a history. Um everybody who's a leader has people who hate them because they've made very difficult decisions and there's people that have access to grind. Uh because names go public in Minnesota when named a finalist, even if someone's coming from out of state, you might be lobbied against people from their current district cuz they have a tickler file set up that if their name ever pops up, you're going to get spammed by people trying to convince you that they're not a good leader. So, just be careful of that and um take
099it with a grain of salt. Uh you will be lobbied and I think you know that from the last time, so just listen. Thank people. Um it's a board decision ultimately. If you're related to anybody, let me know that you see in the pool. If you if you are related to the fourth degree to anyone that you're going to potentially hire, it changes how you vote. It has to be a unanimous vote of all six of you. Um, if one of you is out sick, you can't even take a vote if it's someone related to one of the board members. So, that um, in education it happens, it's a small world kind of. So, let me know if that's the case. What What has to be unanimous? The vote to hire somebody. It It cannot
100be a majority. It has to be unanimous. >> If somebody on the board is related to that person Yeah, if you're related to the fourth degree. So, there's a chart about how far down a fourth degree relation is. I usually defer to your attorney to figure out how far the fourth degree is. But, um >> What What if we've had a direct relationship with a candidate? What if we've had a direct relationship, working relationship with, um a candidate? >> Doesn't matter. >> Okay. >> Yep, doesn't matter. Education's a small world. So, very often people know people in education and are serving on a board. But, that doesn't matter. It's just the one relation as well. >> Uh, let's see. Oh, as far as candidates, the last do and don't that we're adding all the time
101is, please don't recruit yourselves. Um, we're going to get the word out. Word is already out with Peter being an interim, but the caution with recruiting people as a board member is if word gets out that you've reached out and recruited somebody, it will deter other candidates because they'll think, "Oh, I'm not going to apply cuz the board wants them." So, it'll make a much much smaller pool pool if you are trying to get people interested in the job as a board member. So, leave that to us and our service providers to spread the word as well. Plus, it puts you in a weird spot if you actually have recruited them and then you end up not hiring them. They're going to feel used because they felt like you indicated they had a really big
102leg up on this job, when in fact they may not. And the last caution is we sometimes see people put blinders on. Um, if you've recruited someone, you have your mindset that they're the best person. You end up with a pool of people you really don't take an honest look at because you're convinced that this is the person. So, your own bias comes into play sometimes if you're involved in the recruiting process yourself. So, don't do that as well. Any questions on the do's and don'ts? Okay. Uh in-district contact person, I've been working with Kelly. Is that this person I should continue to be emailing and working with? Um when I send her information, I'll always copy Sarah as board chair so she's in the loop with the requests I'm sending to the communications like
103that as well. And then who would be the confidential employee for all of the application materials when the search is done? Jason. Is that who was sitting here? Yeah. Jason. Did we have a list of the do's and don'ts in this packet? No, you did not. No. >> Okay. All right. Sorry about that. >> No, that's okay. Uh what's Jason's last name? Olson. >> Olson. Olson. Thank you. Ean or Owen? O. Owen. Okay. All right, the last thing I have on the agenda for you today is to pick two questions. It's the last page in your packet that you'd like to ask in the application itself. Um the nice thing about Revelus over Applitrack is that you can customize the questions. We always do ask based on the leadership profile, why are you a match
104for this district? That's always asked. These are 15 samples, but you can make up your own question. What would intrigue you enough to want to interview them? It's the very, very first question. So, I've got about seven of them highlighted that that are I are important to me, but there's some questions that I've got highlighted I don't like all of them worded and I'll give you and I'll give you an example. Yep. Um I like number two, but I it says, "What are some strategies or initiatives?" And then etc. etc. etc. I I would say, "What are some actions and ways that you have?" I don't like strategies and initiatives. Okay. Well, let's just scratch that question anyways cuz I don't like collaboration. Trust, respect, I mean it's all just a bunch of word salad.
105I knew you'd say word salad. I had a bet with Amy at the office. Cuz when I was up here 2 years ago, I I I said, "I bet you DJ's going to use the term word salad." >> I mean there's a lot of people that, you know, I I remember that from 2 years ago. And she said, "Okay, I'll take that bet." I win. You know what you're doing. I know, DJ. What do you get for the win? Nothing. Just the satisfaction of being right. So, what do you want us to What do we have to do? We have to figure out two of these we like? >> Two of these or make up your own. It's a question that when you're screening the applications and you're reading their answers to these questions, um
106They're going to write out a They're going to write out a They're going to write out an answer, aren't they? Yeah. Hopefully, they're going to write it out. We actually had a search last year where a couple of candidates had the exact same answer. Imagine that. Yeah. And so, when we talk to candidates, we say, "Do not use AI for your answering of these questions." Proof it. Maybe they could have started with AI, but we we immediately take folks out of the pool when they they do that. It's just And we like AI as a tool, but we have seen people, unfortunately, use it as a crutch and they don't even try to be themselves anymore. So, What do you guys think about a question? I talked to you about this, Sarah. I don't know
107who I've talked to about it, but like a Let's just say that, you know, if you could be king for a day, you know, money's no object, um what would you do to fix the What What do you think is wrong with the reading and math scores in Minnesota? What kind of changes would you make to to get kids' reading scores back up where they have traditionally been in our state? You know, I mean this is not about Brainerd. I mean this is a this is a statewide deal we have going on. Nationwide. Well, no, it's not nationwide. It's a statewide. Public schools, you believe public schools is a nationwide, but reading scores, some states are going up, some states are going down, and we happen to be in one of the ones that's going
108down. I just like to hear what they have. They said, "Well, I think we need to get you know, wouldn't it be interesting if you know, Sarah's applying and she says, 'Oh, I think we need to get these these computers out of all the little elementary schools for fourth grade and down. No computers till fifth grade.'" And then Randy's like, "Well, I think we need different software on these computers." And And Michelle's like, "Well, I think MDE is giving us some bad information and we need to quit wasting as much time on SEL and MTSS and all these other things because there's not enough time to really get the kids up to speed on things that they need for the rest of their lives. I I think it'd be a pretty open question that could
109have a whole bunch of different answers. What do you think? I think it's a really big question question for the application. I think it's a great interview question. Oh, this is for application. >> the application. So, they could use AI to answer that question without having to actually think about it, but if it's in the interview, they're going to have to really think about it. So, the questions usually start pretty broad on the application. That's why the things in yellow are kind of like buckets of things, but then first round is more specific, second round is very specific. And that's where I think last year you or 2 years ago you wanted your specific questions in round two especially. >> we had to pick out these questions and then we didn't get to weird We
110ended up having three or four I think though that night. I think John was writing some and we we we took questions from you that night, but we're going to do it in advance this time. >> Yeah, I like I think it's a great question, DJ. I just wonder if it's better for an interview with your finalists than in the application. >> what they have to say about this though cuz this is really what we really want to hear. So, the purpose of this question as a screener on the applications it's kind of to give us an idea of um how how they would what their approach would be to the position and to to the job. I remember last year we had some or the last time we did this some sort of um
111variation of question number one and I really appreciated that cuz it was so vague. You know, what's your vision for the future of education basically? Um and so it kind of let people lay out their philosophy about what they think education should be. I'm with John. Uh number one, I don't mind that question. I think it's a good question. Why don't we ask them what your vision is of public education? Yeah. You know what I mean? We write that thing just a ditch. Yeah. You think? I like that. Yeah. That's different. >> So are we only I like answering that. Are we only picking Go ahead, John. Are we only picking two questions? Yes. This is for the application. Any of these could also be interview questions. All these questions are more broad though than
112we typically see in the interviews, but you can keep this list and pick from them for interviews as well. But we're just talking the application. So if you get 20 people to apply, all 20 of them have to answer two of these questions. And so that's what we're asking you to choose today is what do you want us to advertise in the application? I like number four. I don't mind that. I don't I like number seven, too. Sometimes with question four, people remove the things in parentheses. And they just say how do you manage district resources? And they see if people mention human resources, financial resources, technology They just wait and see what they answer instead of prompting them to address all four of those. So you could remove >> I like that better. Yeah,
113cuz that that would fit number seven would fit in there then. >> So then you just go with how do you manage district resources? The rest of it's gone. You could include the second sentence or not. The second sentence, you know, expands a little bit. >> the second sentence Some of these things to me, and this is just me being my weird self, is they're givens, you know? Yeah. How are you demonstrating ethical leadership and professional conduct as a school superintendent? Well, I hang out at strip bars. And I have a small cocaine problem. you know? Other than that, I'm really kind of okay most of the time, you know. I'm pretty level-headed on most days. Every now and then, you never know, I might go a little kooky. Like, how they going to answer
114that question? To me, it's just a stupid but I'm a cynic. So, I think that's a stupid question myself. Like, I would just I would never put that on my application cuz someone like me would be like, I don't want to work for those people ask some stupid questions like that. You know what I mean? I mean, I'm just nuts. I understand. I have issues. All right, let's go back to the two around resources then. How do we cuz I hear people saying there's interest in that. How do we manage resources or experience with school finances? >> is, Sarah, is that I worry that when you go to ensure accountability, efficiency, and equity in allocation and utilization of the resources, all I'm going to do when I write my answer to that question is I'm
115going to try to make sure I make you happy about my equity and my allocation and my this and my that about the resources, which I would think that anyone that's qualified to make 200 grand to run this school district, they better know how to do that or we've made an awfully poor hire. Right? Yeah. And I just think it's There's You just want to put in there How do you manage resources? Hallelujah. I would say they come back and say I spend it like it's my own money. I think it's very important. I think, you know, da da da da da da da da. I don't know. How do you feel about number 13? >> Why is 13? I'm just kidding. I'm not. Well, if we're going to have it only be one of
116our two questions Once again, if somebody can't handle that, get rid of them. I knew that. I would like that, but I knew that was a joke. How about 14? What do you think of 14? I I was looking at that. That's interesting. It is kind of interesting. >> Mhm. We don't care how they >> You know what? DJ to DJ's point about academics, what if How about a number 12? Simply say, "How do you address the academic and emotional needs of all students?" Period. Cuz you're you're addressing academic and you and you're Well, you can include social, too. Social and emotional. I mean, that covers a lot of bases there. Academic, social, and emotional needs. I like that cuz I think >> too. I think it's broad enough. >> all students, right. Right. Right.
117>> They're part of the package. >> I'd get rid of the back end of that question. Yeah, you don't need the criteria. >> I agree. >> Cuz Ramus is giving him the answer. >> Yeah. You know, we want to know what >> We want to know what they >> Talking to these questions and it's like you were telling me how you want me to answer the question. And just stop at all students. I think so. Yeah, I do. >> Yes. Yeah, that's >> Yeah, that's great. That gives us a real good sense of who they are. Do you keep all three? Academic, social, and emotional? Or I I think we need to because I don't know that it's social. It's there. Just they're they're um Yeah. Maybe it is. I mean, I know it's a
118thing. Yeah. It's just that I don't know what they can really do. But you're >> I want to see how they address it though. I want to see what their how they react to that. What do you think, Stephanie? About these questions. I I think we should just take social out. Just academic and emotional needs. We don't Yeah. What is that? Do you like 12? Do you like one? Do you like 14? Which ones do you like? >> seven. I like seven and I like one. Can we have three? There's only room in uh you can take out the question that says based on the leadership profile, why are you a good fit? And replace it with something else, but that tends to be a direct response to who you're looking for. So, but Stephanie,
119did you see number four? Did Oh, wait wait, we wouldn't that would be a separate one. Yeah, okay. I mean, if we were going to go with resources, I would want one and four. But I do I kind of like 12 just cuz it gets us a sense of who they are as a person. So we take one and then just shorten it up just like What do you think, Sarah? You're the one that had that question. Yeah. And just go and say what is your vision for the future of public education? >> Yeah. Mhm. Yes, I like that. I like I like that. Or how do you manage district resources? Mhm. That's just like two questions that are just short, sweet. For us it's important because >> Yeah, yeah. I think our resources haven't
120been managed very well over the last few years, so it would be nice. Managed well by some. Yeah. Okay, so everybody comfortable with that if we go with a version of one and four? We shorten those up. Yep. And Okay. One and four. What is your vision for the future of public education? How do you manage district resources? Yep. Yep, and then get rid of the accountability thing. Efficiency again cuz we're kind of leaning them on. Got it. Those are the two that will be in your position when we post it on November 20th. >> Make them think. Okay. What questions might you have for me? That is all I had as far as kicking off the search with you and I still will adjust the public input survey dates and um I'll get the
121vacancy brochure updated and the timeline. I will send them to Kelly to proofread and when she says they look the same with her notes, I'll send them to everybody. And I'll give you until a certain date to let me know if you want to change anything, otherwise this is what we'll go with. Okay. >> And we're sending that application out. Applications will open on November 20th and close January 18th. >> the brochure that you're going to put that we're working on now? When is that going to is it or is that s- That's what will go live on the 20th, but I'll have it to you this week. Is today the >> The 20th of November. >> have it to you I hope by tomorrow. I hope I can get it to Kelly tonight to
122look at. Do you work tomorrow, Friday? Today. Okay. So, maybe afternoon tomorrow I will send it to the board and say this is what we're going with on the 20th as an FYI and I'll send you the timeline and the brochure. At the at the latest I'll have it to you next week. But, if we're not posting until the 20th, we have a little bit of time. So, we won't necessarily have to rush this with that extra week in there now. Okay. I'll look forward to working with you all. Thank you so much. >> This is excellent. How many candidates did you say again, Barb, are out there in Minnesota now? Stephanie. How many candidates are out there? You put your coat on, you got to stick around till we adjourn. Um we're You're doing
123five searches right now. We're doing five searches and we've interviewed in two others and have had requests for RFPs from probably another three districts. I think there'll be a lot this year. Okay. But, there are already our five. All right. You have five. >> We have five, correct. We have five. I I make a motion to adjourn. We've got a motion. >> Yep. We've got a motion by um Director Brekken, a second by Director Edman. All those in favor say I vote I. Oh, roll call. Sorry, roll call. Thank you. >> Stephanie Edman. Yep. Randy Edman. Yeah. Yes. John Ward. Yes. Joe Brekken. Yes. Peter Donahue. Yes. Shelly thinks you did well. Excellent. We are adjourned. Thank you, everyone. Thanks for the time today. Thanks for