001recognize and explain our procedures that we need to follow when addressing the board and ask that you please silence your cell phones. As required by Montana law, members of the community are given an opportunity to make brief comments to the board on any matters not included in the agenda. Individuals wishing to be heard shall first be recognized by the chairperson. Individuals, after identifying themselves, will proceed to make brief comments. The board would like to remind everyone that to avoid violations of individual rights of privacy, a member of the public wishing to address the board will not be allowed to make comments about any student, staff member, or member of the general public. No action may be taken on any matter discussed during the public comment portion of the meeting until such time as the matter
002is specifically not uh noticed on the agenda and the public has been allowed the opportunity to comment. Is there any public comment at this time? If there is no public comment, we will move into our new business. >> Do we have a motion? >> Um, do we have a motion for the first new business item, canvas results for November 4th, 2025 bond election? Motion to approve the results from the November 4th, 2025 bond election as follows. 2356 votes for and 3933 votes against question one. Whereas there were 2,81 votes for and 4,214 votes against question two. Therefore, not receiving voter approval for either question. >> I second. >> We have a a motion and a second. Um, >> public any public comment comes back to the board. Are you sure you don't have public comment?
003[laughter] >> She's got comment. We don't want it. >> Okay. >> We agree though. [laughter] >> Do we have any? I think we all know. [laughter] Frank's leg. Oh boy. >> Okay. I said we can uh vote. All in favor say I. >> I. All opposed. >> Twice. Uh rebel. >> So >> Motion carries. I don't know the number. One, two, three, five. >> Five to one. All right. Item number two, uh, discussion the of the future of the fourth elementary school. >> All right. Um, so we can, uh, organize this or not organize it in any way you want. Um, if there are specific, if we want to kind of talk about, I sent out some questions to think about. um if we want to talk through those or if we just want to
004start by having people say I think that you know the big idea here is to have a chance to talk and not make any decisions about where do we go next? what is our next step um related to uh what we put out there for the the bonds and the fourth elementary school in connection to the you know the bigger goals of the district and the voice of the people and and what you're hearing in the community and things like that. So um does anyone have a preference on >> I think we just go with like some open discussions. >> Okay, >> start from there. Maybe maybe let's talk about what we heard in the community. Um I there was a lot of confusion. >> People really did not know what they were voting on
005and I that's not for a lack of getting information out. Um people also did not understand what the cost would be. Again, that's not for a lack of getting information out. Uh Walt and I kind of had a brief conversation about this. M >> um we don't know how to I mean you you can you know I mean we had canvasing there was uh 66 different outreach moments not including the individual uh canvasing that was done by the various members of this board and um I am honestly not sure how we move forward you know knowing that information. Um, I think both Walt and I spent some time reading feedback on uh various news articles. >> I I I think that we were >> I want to slap the media cuz what they were saying
006and what we were what what was the truth were two separate things. Um, you know, first thing I want to do is I want to thank Dee for, you know, her countless hours and all the board members, Scott especially. I've seen Scott out there for I that guy's probably got as many hours the rest of us combined tied into this and I just want to thank everybody for their hard work and, you know, sucks, but you know, we tried. Um but uh no I there was like like you said there's a lot of confusion. A lot of people are sitting here. I mean they think that every bond we p put out there passes. So now they're just seeing oh well they just got 63 million or whatever that number was. And I'm going no
007that didn't pass. We came back you know whittleled it down to what we absolutely need and then we're back to where we were. uh you know this is what bare minimum but it just yeah people had preconceived notions. They thought everything else had passed. Um a lot of the media especially if you don't read the body of the story and just read the headlines some of those headlines were atrociously misleading. Um I don't think we're in a budget shortfall and you know I'm pretty sure that uh I can't even remember the other ones. It's like >> well people [clears throat] don't understand the difference between levies and bonds and they don't understand why we haven't been given uh significant raises to our teachers but don't understand that when we don't pass levies we can't do
008that >> you know that this bond is a completely different >> you know animal yeah it's a completely different animal. Um I thought our messaging was really clear. Uh I think the problem is kind of that you know you can lead a horse to water type scenario. I don't know how to, you know, that in the age of social media, I think unfortunately people want tins. I don't like part of me is like, do we need to start like making realels and Tik Toks? Like seriously, I No, I'm serious because people won't read the information and if we can feed them to it them like in some sort of video where we're all talking about it. Um I think some I mean tr I really I truly and honestly I mean this because people watch
009videos and they watch um you know you can put reals on Facebook. I don't I think that may be a way to approach this type of thing so that we can have like 30 second snippets of you know what's a bond what's a levy you know why can we not you know why if if how can we be pursuing building another school if we didn't give teachers raises you know like and I have I created a spreadsheet of all of those questions because I saw the same ones over again and it was clear that and then people did not understand the two things they were voting on the difference between like the school and the gym and why we would did it that way. They sort of thought we were building some massive I think
010like the Max Center and but if those of you who know what the Max Center and but is right it's it's a very large standalone gym I think they thought we were building that um and I don't know how we >> approach this I I really >> you know because it drew a lot of uh issues with number of people for the exact reason you mentioned and just the fact that >> they didn't understand it. >> They didn't see the value. >> Yeah. They didn't understand that it's that we that that we're building a school with a multi-use and not a gym. But the people who have their kids in sports understand that we are gym short. You know, the fight for gym time is real. So the question is is is and you know
011obviously on the the ballot ballots we cannot put you know a bunch of extra language. So the question for these types of things in the future is again I I think we've done the things we normally do but I think in today's day and age we might have to approach it different. I think people's um their attention spans just not wanting to read and ask those questions. I think it needs to be like fed very easily. I I also mentioned to Dee that maybe we should try to do something in the Belgrade news every week, >> have a little BGA schools corner, >> something >> and something to the fact that you know whether it's >> again we can even do the definition of oh this and this and I think I think another thing
012that people don't understand and we ran into this when we were campaigning is they do not understand school funding at all that the state gives us so much money and that our community is responsible for so much money. I when I was canvasing my neighborhood, I visited with a number of people and the other complaint that I felt like I heard or read and I don't know where it comes from, but that we are wasting money. >> Yeah. Um and to that I said multiple times, you know, our budget, we have our budget meetings, our budget is online. you know, you can look for every single pin we purchase, >> you know, I mean, it's all there. >> Well, I asked one lady to please come and speak at a board meeting and tell us
013the areas where we were failing because we would certainly do our best to address those. >> And the the other thing is PE the big one too, like you said, I saw a lot is that since people's taxes went so high, they said, well, they they're sort of under the idea that all um property taxes go to the schools. They don't understand that it doesn't matter if a hundred million was collected our budget if it's if it's a h 100,000 we get we get 80,000 you know >> they they do not understand Montana school funding especially people who come from other states >> I think some of that has to do with how our tax bills are written out >> um some of it yeah >> a lot of it you'll go and look at
014it and it you know I mean it says Belgrade Elementary Bgrade high school you know and >> posted >> it's got all the levies the last what years >> levies, bonds, it's got all that. It's got and then it's got, you know, transportation and and it's got multiple things, but they're all listed as Belgrade. And I'm not convinced all that money for the way it's been explained to me is coming here. It's just that that's the way it's written on our tax bill. >> And so therefore, it's misleading because, you know, that money's going up to the state pot, not staying close. But yet people, you know, think that it it's coming, you know, to our coffers and wondering why it is that, you know, they're paying whatever it is. But yeah, if you look
015at it, I mean, depending on where you live, if you don't live in the city of Bgrade, um Joanne, yours is probably the same, it might be better than half's uh tax bill as actually I tagged to the school if you live in the city. I think you know the city you the port the proportion of it because there's other city taxes you know makes it look smaller but I think yeah if you live outside of the city of Belgrade it might be over 50% keep schools >> whether or not it comes to Belgrade schools is a different animal. Yeah, I was looking right now like it's got um you know countywide elementary school retirement, countywide high school transportation, and then Belgrade general, Belgrade Elementary building reserve, elementary bus. Yeah. I mean, you can see
016it and people just don't understand what it means. >> Well, and I also think people were surprised when they got their tax bill that it actually had gone down and they just didn't realize that they're >> No. Even though we had tried to tell them that, right? and and I kept telling them, you know, our other bond is expired or is paid off in June or in um >> yeah, it was June, I believe. And so you actually, you know, it's you kind of are net positive because this one was going to cost people maybe $9 to$10 a month and that other one was larger, but people were I mean, we just were kind of in a bad time. People were angry about taxes last year. Yeah. >> Wow. >> Yeah. >> Stop. >> Yep.
017I mean, even with the property taxes going down, I think people are still angry, you know, and >> people that I talked >> and and I've tried so hard to tell them this is not the school we're not we don't get that money. >> Yeah. I don't think they trust what we're saying. >> Yeah. No, >> I don't think they trust >> I think that's >> and you know, we can't do anything about that. All we can do is tell the story about where the money comes from and how much of that money we end up getting >> and how we spend it and how I mean I think it's the one thing that is positive for us is that we're one of the only double A schools in the black. >> Yes. >> That
018runs their business in black. a good indication that we're approval >> that we're trying to do what we can. The other part of that though quite frankly is um you know our deferred maintenance number >> the deferred maintenance number is a big number >> and you know we're going to be unable to do much of anything about it that's only going to get >> worse >> more difficult over time I mean I don't know what the number is l I think it's 10 or 12 million isn't it or maybe it's a little less than that now but >> somewhere in that range >> yeah it's more than what we have currently building >> significantly yeah >> so you know there's a lot of things people don't understand about the finances of schools >> and I
019mean I I in I said you know come to the budget meetings there's you know they're all open um the other thing was is people talked a lot about um the uh the building that we just what we did in the the exchange and didn't understand that cost and why, you know, that decision was made. You know, they said, "Well, there's a perfectly good school." They don't realize, you know, it's not it's not, you know, disability compliant. It's got a lot of issue, right? And they don't understand. Again, >> order to bring that building up to snuff would have been more than to >> build a new >> tear it down and build a new >> Yeah. And that's I try to tell people that again people just don't and what's frustrating is nobody asks
020these questions in advance, right? And then they're like, "Oh, I didn't know that." and like they don't realize, you know, it's like because for me as a parent you, you know, like one of the biggest feedback that I get from parents is is how how devastated they are because they they're their third grader is now guaranteed to be in the junior high and how, you know, or the parents who've had that fifth grader in the junior high and how much they struggled by not having free time in a recess, how much they struggled with, you know, just such a big change at such a very young age. So it seems to me that parents were who are who voted for it. So when we're targeting I think we have to target non-parents a lot heavier
021because all of the parents in of the grade schools were so disappointed because they said we need a new gym. We really didn't want our fifth graders to be in a junior. I mean, even for me as a parent, um, knowing the feedback and knowing my children, it's a big like question mark for me if my kids would go to junior high and fifth grade. >> Well, the thing is, we sit here and I don't think we're wrong when we, you know, when we ask these questions, we ask parents. >> But then when we put it out, we put it out to voters. And there's a lot of voters that don't have kids in school. There's a lot of voters that will, you know, their kids are out that won't have kids, single, whatever, however
022you want to slice it, but those got those people, you know, they all get ballots, but they don't have any investment. And you know, I think you're right that we focus, you know, and I'm not saying it's wrong that we focus a lot of our effort into parents and students because students are who we're here for, but yet, you know, it's the the community as a whole that we're, you know, somehow they're not, you know, they're not as uh they're not sold on their schools. And like you say, they think we're, you know, screwing this money away and doing something with it. And you know, maybe Dei's got some home in Tahiti she hasn't told us about, but I don't think so. um you know but we're you know like you say they don't trust
023us with handling the money and it's you know so I guess the question is is how do we and yeah I think messaging might be helped but how do we show the people you know that we are trying to be as fiscally responsible with their taxpayers as or with their tax dollars as we can the best stewards we can of their tax dollars while yet you providing the schools that a the community wants and b the law requires. >> I was struck by >> um having spent a number of hours wandering our community, I was struck by how little the school board got credit for having cut the size of their request. and you dropped what 50 some odd million dollars and it was like you didn't do anything. Actually, I had a couple of
024conversations where people said, "Well, why did they ask for all of that money last time if they only needed 6 million?" And it was like you did something wrong rather than you tried to pair it down. Um, the other thing I was struck by in the whole effort to engage the community, um, I think that often school boards make a mistake by sharing too much information because most of the community doesn't want all of that information and so they don't end up prioritizing the most important stuff. Um, >> so I was struck by how often um, we talked to people coming out of mostly Albertsons about moving fifth graders out of the middle school and that that was really important in their development and their education. Um, and they seemed surprised by that. this it
025was like well nobody's ever mentioned that before. >> Mhm. >> Um and I'm not if we think about how to build a campaign, you did I in my opinion a great job of managing the finance and the redesign of the project. I I was amazed by how much you were able to strip out of the and the idea of building half an elementary school. I've never heard of anything like that as a selling point. Um but I'm not sure that we and one of the principles in selling bond issues is sell one thing at a time. figure out what's the most important thing, which is easy to do to because you just figure out why did I vote for it and then that's what you sell. I'm not sure that the community heard that the
026most important thing is saving fifth graders from middle school. Well, I think one of the other aspects of this that we all I don't know how many were have been around, but our little building over there that needs all the repairs was called intermediate and we had fourth, fifth and sixth grade that met in that and then those buildings were separate and seventh and eighth grade met in the seventh and eighth grade. So you have a community out there also and I saw these comments why we had the fifth grade in the intermediate. Why do they need to be now in grade school? Because it was the intermediate. So for some reason there is a concept that the intermediate school is like junior high. I don't know. But I think that's also something because you've
027got some of your parents now that are in their 40s that are looking at it. they were part of that intermediate schooling and they're looking at it and they're going, "Well, this is ridiculous that we would move fifth graders because fourth, fifth, and sixth was altogether." So, you also have a mindset among, you know, some of the 40 and 50 year old uh adults out there that that we did not reach. They I saw that question mentioned several times. I don't know if any of you had kids that you're probably not old enough either. >> I don't know if people have kids that went here and actually like the experience like the other% my kids enjoy the extra classes >> in junior high. >> Yeah. I >> so I guess the real question is where
028do we go from here? I mean we sit as is. I mean it's broken but you know meets minimum requirements. Don't don't think the minimum requirements are where I want to be. Um, you know, I mean, just because we have fifth grade in the middle school, you know, that's that that ain't the ideal. I got a fifth grader. I can tell you right now, my son Jet should not be in middle school. That kid, he he is a captain ADHD and he's, you know, he struggles in being in middle. I mean, middle school is not where, you know, he's 10 years old. he shouldn't. And they're just his mother and I, my ex-wife, have both had a handful of conversations about this and how he Yeah. He's not even close to ready for it. Um
029I don't know, Dee, you probably know Jeff, don't you? Yeah. And I mean, he's fairly high energy, but uh um so I guess what I'm, you know, trying to figure out is is how do we in what way, shape, or form strip fifth grade out? You know, I mean, we can stand here and blame game, but let's look at moving forward a little bit. What what what do we do with fifth grade? How do we get it out of the middle school? That was the aim of this whole thing. And you know, we've got $20 million we can build some sort of a school with still. Um or do we just say, you know what, we're going to turn this back. That is plausible. You know, not the ideal necessarily unless you're a taxpayer, but
030um it, you know, I don't think it's best for the community. It's definitely not best for the schools. But what is the next step? And I'm when I ask for ideas, the crazier the better. If I think you need a drug test, it's probably the one we're going to go with, right? [laughter] Um but seriously, what what is our next step? What is our next, you know, how do we do this? Um do we, you know, overload? Do we strip it out and overfill our our current elementary schools? stick some modular schools on the out there and you know >> do do exactly what Frank's sitting here and you know I mean or do we build like a you know concrete ugly $20 million Well it's a building for 20 million and you know I
031mean about as ugly as gray and functional as you can get out on our property and then build, you know, start the fourth elementary that way or do we, you know, I mean, I've had thoughts about taking the old intermediate wing and making it back into an elementary school. I don't know if we can do that finan with our with the 20 million on the bond. elementary. >> Yep. >> That's That's Yeah. >> And and basically, we're asking for another $20 million bond, which Yeah. I don't I'm not convinced we'd be able to get that through either. >> Um so, what is plausible or doable? I mean I think the you know there's a couple of pieces to this one is the 20 million right that's that's sitting there and our need to do something
032with the property it can be something little so that is achievable but that 20 million sits heavy right what what do we do with that I think the realization that at some point we will be building schools on that property and being able to pull pull utilities out there now when that's cheaper than it will be later would be great. >> Yeah. >> Um but we can't build a big enough school to achieve that goal of moving fifth grade back with the money that we have. >> Um so I think the 20 million is a question and separate or together the what do we do instructionally for fifth graders is a question. Yeah. Right. And those can be two separate questions. I think that, you know, they we combined them by proposing, you know, the
033the the proposal that we had. So, we could continue with that proposal if we still believe that's the best one. But I'm sure there are other ideas out there, too. I'm just saying that the 20 million and the fifth grade conundrum can be two separate >> and I think we should look at them as such so we don't bind ourselves to a specific like approach. I think we do need to look at building because things have are going to just continue to get more expensive. >> I don't know what that looks like at this point, but >> and remember, we're just brainstorming. There are no decisions that are made tonight. We just talk. So, we can talk about anything and then we'll revisit it in a meeting where we would actually make some decisions. My
034issue by whatever the cost of construction in the valley since we had it last time because it cost more people see two years to do this if the increase every time the ask is we're asking for the same this is how it's going to happen. So, when would you ask for that again? In the fall or right away? Right here? >> Right away in May. >> It's important. If it's important. >> Yeah. >> And we have to build something on that land. >> We're close to our grace period. I believe if we do not build the school, if we do not successfully pass >> up a chicken coop or something >> and that probably would have come out of building reserve. >> Could you explain that Frank to me? Turn your mic. Um >> so
035when we purchase the land, >> yeah, >> when we purchase, but >> um we have a perpetual right to use it forever and eventually it'll probably get turned over. It's the same way we'll have the opportunity to buy it like people canyon fairy cabins, that kind of thing. But we were under an obligation to build something for the school on that land within five five years or else it was returned to the DNRC without us getting any money back. >> Oh. >> so we didn't actually acquire it till 23. So, we still have a we're we still have a couple years before we need to do something. But they were very clear also the guy that with the DNRC that throw a metal shed under and park a car under it and call it a
036shop, you know, whatever. But they just need to to meet the letter of the law. We need to put something with it. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. >> And some point we need a well over there. So at least it wouldn't be a waste of money to drill a well and do something. >> Are we in municipal water out there or wouldn't we be? >> We not be part of the utilities. >> We retain irrigation rights for a well. Oh, okay. >> Which we want to do because it's a lot cheaper way to water. >> Yeah, you can get a get a permit >> irrigation. My question my question is is do we have to bring power in there and the city water in there? >> So, would that all come out of that too? And
037would that be considered >> was in the infrastructure costs of the bond that we just had? >> And so, would that be um considered part of the doing something with the land if we brought the power out there? if we brought the city water in out there. That's a good thought. >> Drilled the well and then and I don't I like your idea. Let's plant some grass out here. Let's use it make a practice field or let's make a >> We have to put so much as a doghouse on it. Don't we just have a structure of some sort? >> I was going to say, do you know the details on this at all? >> Let's put in a >> I'd have to >> I think we'd want to We >> have to It's something.
038We can't just let it sit with >> Yeah, I think we would run it by DNR. Like, is this >> what you're asking for, right? Substantial enough to >> Yeah, DNRC just has to They want us to have the ground. That's not the thing. It's just that we can't just let it sit as a wheat field for the next 30 years. Vegas is their thing. If we can demonstrate that we as a school district are doing something with it. So that when somebody says, "Hey, well, what about that property out there in Belgrade?" They can say, "The school's doing something with it." And it's long-term plan is, but you know, >> it's checking a box. >> Yeah. >> I think you need to run it again. I really do. I Or else kind of discredits
039us. I don't know how to the thing that I don't know how to overcome is the negativity in this community towards our school district and to fight that I don't I like when I on social media when I was reading comments I was just like how you you do not understand you're what people are saying isn't true but it's like it's perpetuated You can >> like >> the board's too empathetic. That's This is people don't want to know. There was no lack of information this time. It was as digestible as it could be. Everybody did a really great job of being educated and out there >> that wanted to. >> People here don't want to pay any more property taxes. And >> you know, >> we're not Boseman. >> We have frequently asked questions. We've
040covered every single piece of information. >> That's right. >> You would need >> to to understand what was going on. But you have to read this stuff. >> Yes. People didn't take the time. >> No, they didn't take the time because they already made up their mind. >> Mhm. >> Yeah. >> Got better. >> That's actually what we had was pretty good for an offear. that it was okay >> when when when it's literally two school questions, you know, theor it really wasn't that bad of a voter. >> Well, I think in you know, in a lot of ways, it's too bad we doing mail-in ballots because people that really cared could come and vote and then you'd have it would make it a lot easier to pass things like that. But everybody gets a
041ballot and you know they feel that their constitutional right to way and they do they have a right to do it. I know why we do it but >> it definitely puts us on a at a disadvantage >> if if Yeah. If you have a if you if you have to take time out of your day and inconven yourself to go down to the polling place and vote and you're just kind of an ambiguous no. you're not going to if you, you know, have an investment in it. It's a different thing. But when it shows up at your mailbox and just >> that's the way it is. >> But yeah, that is what that's what it is. I was struck by how how often people coming out of Albertson's simply said, "I don't want more
042taxes." That was the defining answer. And often what they said is, "Oh, my kids aren't in school anymore." Yeah, >> not my job. Um, when I looked at the data, the 2,000 or so people who voted in favor of that on what percentage of our school parents does that represent? Did we were we successful in capturing our customers? >> I don't think we captured our own employees. >> No. >> I agree. >> That's sad. >> Well, we've had such a big change in text. >> Well, I think it comes down Yeah. Again, >> the last two or three years and it's had a substantial impact on >> almost everybody. Some people that are, you know, on fixed incomes, this is really a big issue. Other people that have, you know, they just have never seen
043these kind of increases before and it just got them uh up in arms and it was the same way on the last pass. Um, I think your point about doing it again is a good point. I think we just have to keep pushing that forward and seeing uh you know we can't really do you know you couldn't really take the 20 million and do something with it because the >> the public has said no. So we'd be really at odds with the people that voted us in if we wouldn't do something like that. On the other side of that, you know, I think you can make a case for doing something so you don't lose the land. >> Yeah, I think so, Jim. I I thought I read something in the paper that the fire
044district is going to ask for more money as well that they are living that they are >> using five years ago budget or something and that they are going to also ask for more money in the upcoming election. I feel like I just read that. >> Yeah, they have to because they've grown so much. >> No, they're No, no, no, no. They're different. They're not funded like we are. >> We get a we're we're voted a levy of a fixed dollar amount and it's spread. >> They are not. You're tax when a new house is built that tax also they also pay a dollar if I'm currently paying a dollar. It doesn't mine goes down to 99 cents, >> right? No. >> So they're different. >> Yeah. No, I know that. I'm just saying I
045know that from the what the the fire >> just is both of us though. >> Oh yes. is that they they're they have so many more calls that they need they're running off of old budgets. So, and they've they've grown so much. That's why they're asking. >> The theory though is >> they're running into more places and but those more places are all paying the equal amount of tax that everybody else was paying before. That's the difference. Yeah. >> I like to separate myself from them when people are asking questions because they actually do get more money when people move here. >> Yeah. >> We do not. >> Yeah. We do not. No. Yeah, that's true. >> Could you Could you reend that one more time, Frank? We didn't quite hear all of that. >>
046Okay. So, if we as a whole, there's a hundred houses in our community >> for each pay, you know, 100 bucks a year. When that 101st house comes in, your school taxes, each house pays goes down to 99 bucks a year. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> But the new house pays the same amount that you pay for >> Okay. >> the fire police. >> Yeah. Yeah. So if each each house pays a hundred bucks a year to the fire station. >> Yeah. You're not offset. >> They gain 100. Makes >> sense. I mean that's the way ours should be too honestly. >> Right. >> I thought that's I thought that's what I g the logical way it should be done. >> Well the other thing with them is when a house is built they get
047money. We don't get money till a kid shows up at the front door. >> Right. Right. >> And not all the houses that are being built >> have kids have kids or the kids not all the kids that are there come to our school. >> Right. No. >> Um, >> I've asked a a friend of mine that's on Central Valley Fire Board and quite possibly he'll get back to me if he sees the message and I'll I'll have an answer for you if they're going to run a bond this uh bond or a levy this spring as well if there's a ballot question for them. >> Always kind of been opposite us. I think I don't think they do. We do it one. >> Yeah, they do it. But >> I think >> I don't
048know if you stack both of them on there if it does either of us any favors or if it just makes everybody twice as cranky. >> We're not going to get less votes. [laughter] >> No. But if if we're going to rerun this, do we try to do more outreach again with more focus? Do we try to do like Joanne says a few things on social media or a little thing in the paper each week? just have a corner in the paper that says, you know, for your information. And I think one of the things that should be told is what Rocky just said. We are a fiscally conservative school district. We run in the black in this district. We do our best to protect taxpayer monies. We we manage your money responsibly. And if
049you have a complaint, call whatever or email or you know. >> Yeah, we're all here. I mean, that's what we're here for. >> Yeah. >> We're the the board's here to >> Yeah. >> public's concern. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> I mean, >> call us. Let us know where they are. Tell us where you feel like we are doing something wrong. I and I I feel like when I tried to find out where we're wasting money, I never could get an answer. No. I feel like it's a flat statement that's just made. >> There's a loud loud small group that screams very loudly the gray and the small. >> Yep. >> When you're fortunate enough to find one on social media and can call them out, that helps. But just some there's just a group that
050will do that no matter what the election is. One one guy the last time we passed one that was the loudest chirper on Facebook was from Washington State. I wonder on having been so active in the campaign as you look back on it. Are there things on a wish list? I wish we had done this. I wish we had done that. Um because lot of his points I think are really good strategic points about things we could do that might make a difference. Um my inclination, my view of of how the board came to the decision, I think you made the right decision and fifth graders in middle school, nobody in the country is arguing that's a great idea. Um, fifth graders stay in middle school when communities decide they they want to cheap out
051on education. Um, and we have many in the community who struggle financially legitimately. Um, so as I looked at it, I couldn't figure out whether we had been successful moving our staff and our parents to vote for us. Um, for me that ended up being a question mark. Um, and if we didn't do that, then all of those people who came out of Albertsons and said, "No new taxes or my kids are already in 8th grade, so I don't care." And you're not going to transition those people into supporters, >> right? >> If we can't hold the people who are closest to us and get them to support, do you have a sense of Were we successful or not? >> Well, I think um we weren't because they didn't pass, right? Were we successful in
052creating the base of a uh the ability to connect with people in our community in a better way? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, that was part of the work regardless of the outcome of the election. The goal was to make those connections. I already I was at the Belgrade economic um forum and one of our um community partners came up to me and gave me his business card and said, "Give me a call. Let's have you come in and just talk to all the staff just about school funding." So, they're reaching out to me saying, "Let's make opportunities for you to come." Because we talked about I talked about that with people as I was going through like this is we're going to keep coming back and talking about this because school funding is so complicated.
053You need to hear it a couple times before it starts to resonate, right? So, did we build a foundation? Absolutely. Was it are we at the top of the mountain? Absolutely not. So, there are a lot of things that we can add to what we've been doing to increase our communication with our community and to try to address some of the concerns that are out there or the catchphrases that we're hearing or things like that. Um, so yeah, I mean I I'm working with our team. We have a whole list of different kinds of communications that we can start using or avenues that we can use to try to tackle some of those questions that people have. >> And that work should never stop. >> Bonds and levies saying that again and again and again
054and again. that should never stop because it's so confusing to people and why we have to keep coming back and keep coming back and keep coming back. So, >> so I guess my feeling about where what direction do we go is I think there is real risk in um doing all of a sudden changing over and now we can build something for the 20 million that's already been approved because it suggests that that when you made the decision to ask for six million, you really didn't need it. And when I looked at where we were, it seemed to me that you'd made a good decision about the finance of that and about the outcomes educationally for children. Um, so my inclination would be to go back and say, look, we were really serious. We need
055this. This wasn't on our wish list. This is this is on our need list. Um, and >> when is >> then it's can we do a better job of um helping people to understand Montana's broken finance system for education and um the ways in which we are dependent on the community to continue to fund even after you've paid your taxes. Dy, when when is the when does the election have to be called by if we wanted to get it in the spring election? I know that date backed way up and I just can't remember what >> Yeah, it's in December. So, we will call for a a bond and levy election just to have it be called for decide later what whether you want to run them or not. >> I just wanted to ask
056that question because >> we have to language. >> Yeah. Uhhuh. you have time, but we'll have to call for it. >> So, we have to do a levy. Well, we the last levy didn't pass. We're going to do another levy. >> So, um yeah, we have um Carrie and I just last week ran some preliminary numbers to take a look at what lev a levy would look like, right? To get us up to that 100%. and it would be probably a similar number to what we ran last year, somewhere between a hundred and $200,000. Um, unless we want to take a look at we have an opportunity that the legislature gave us because we live in a high-cost area that we could levy an additional 6% um that would go to employee housing stipens. Right?
057every employee gets the same thing. Um, that would bring our total levy amount up to like 1.3 million if we did that. >> But that's a non voted levy. >> No, it's a voted. >> Okay. But we have what? Okay. I missed. So, we would definitely need to have support from our staff who would be the recipients of that of that. >> You know, I I got a lot of feedback on that that people did say they would vote to raise teacher pay, but they said they wouldn't vote for a new building. I did get a lot of that which >> they didn't vote for >> but I did get that feedback now whether or not you know >> I know of >> course the question wasn't being asked okay hey this is for teacher
058pay now that it's for teacher pay all said oh no well you're taxing me too much I'm sure but >> you also have 450 more people out campaigning for it when you have that >> touche Well, >> and that matters. >> It'd be nice if those same people campaigned for the school. >> Yeah, that would be nice. >> Well, not seem to have it. I don't know. Did we ask all the question? >> We did spend time in the schools and you know we tried to communicate to everybody and we didn't get at least I don't remember any real serious push back from the people that were in those meetings. Uh maybe they weren't all there or maybe they just kept their mouth shut and didn't really want to say negative things. Not sure. probably
059guessing that must be the case. >> Having done this in many places, when the superintendent shows up, if you have a concern about something, you don't share that in the meeting. >> So, would our conversation be different if we didn't have the 20 million? I think it's might be framed a little different next time as in we only need six million more. We have 20 rather than we need authority to spend 26. I think I'd tell the true story. Um I think I would ask the gym off it. I'm the one that probably wants the gym more than anyone any coached for a long time and you need it. But >> I think >> just make it a singular issue and it's about it's about eighth grade getting or fifth grade getting out of middle
060school, >> right? >> And that's your that's your pitch and then you have a couple other noise points on funding or whatever else that hopefully somebody like the 30 second TikTok, but man, I don't know how you distill it down. That was the problem last time. Thank you. >> I think if I think, you know, maybe if we could get in front of social media now, do I think that it would, you know, there's people that are going to look at that and go, "Oh, yeah, bold." But, you know, do I I I don't know how to get in front of that. I don't know. >> I mean, billboards, you know, signs out, you know, if we put signs out, hey, vote yes for Belgrade kids. I don't know. And there are things that we
061as a district can't do that you know may and and we have a what's that not a foundation what is it de >> yeah so we have some interest in the community in in developing a 501c3 that is a group that would support public education >> like Lincoln for levies >> yes um so they're able ble to, you know, >> be nice >> talk about school funding in Montana, not from, you know, the superintendent who look, you know, people >> wonder, right, like why I'm saying things because I'm paid to say things or, you know, versus a group of parents who get together and say, "We support public education. This is how public fun this is how funding works in Montana." coming from a different perspective >> if it come if it comes from outside
062the school. I think there's a lot you know you know as a you're you know you you don't have anything to gain from not that you know any of us in here other than you know the handful of school employees would have gained a blasted thing other than a name on a bronze plaque you know but you know they look at it as oh well the school board's going to you know like somehow we get something no we don't I don't know how to explain that yeah if you got somebody that's not associated, affiliated, tied into the school that's out there going, "Come on, guys. This is what this is about." I think it would have a lot more at least maybe they would look at it a little more >> and they can do
063things like yard signs and, you know, they they're able to do different things and the school district is pretty limiting. >> Yeah. >> Not care how the perception is. >> We can put up a sign that says vote yes. >> We can't we can say vote, but we can't say vote yes. >> Hell you can't. You can say vote yes. She c she can actually but she's not sure she can legally. But we can say whatever we aren't employed by the school district. >> There is no bounds on >> liel or slander of what you can do to help with that. >> Okay. >> It's the teachers can't. It's kind of a weird mix. >> Oh, the teachers can't. >> No, any employee. We can't. >> So they couldn't put a sign up in their
064yards to >> They support Belgrade schools. >> Yeah. They put up. >> They can't say vote yes on whatever. >> They can put up a yard sign in their personal yard. Yeah. We just can't put them on school property. >> Vote. Yes. >> Million. >> Yeah. Yep. >> Hi. Um, so yeah, so there's, you know, potentially some additional support and communication. >> Yeah. >> Um, >> I mean, the need hasn't gone away. So, how do we meet it? I guess >> I think you got to go right at again or else you discredit what we did last time. I think so, too. >> I like the idea though of how you described that. say we have this 20 million in order to build this building we need this additional six >> instead of I think
065that's a better idea >> also this comes fresh off the tax bill going down a little bit that might help >> yeah unfortunately the tax bills came out at the wrong you know if the tax bills would have come out a month earlier it would have done it >> I don't think it would have swung it enough to man made us feel a little less bad. >> Problem is is I'm sitting here looking at my tax bill and you know in 2019 30027 and everybody else is seeing that too. you know, of course now, you know, 2025 2362. So, I'm back in 2022 range, but >> how's that going to react with, you know, although I think property values are slightly ticking down. So, >> yeah, >> but actually mine went up, but I think
066in general they go down. >> I think they're you think they're kind of at that plateau. And >> we held par. Yeah, we were not our tax. >> But how do we I don't know. I guess I'm sitting here trying to figure out what's the >> Has anybody heard what the legislature This is another top topic with this, but has anybody heard what the legislation's talking about doing? Any changes update? Anything come out of that work? And I tried to get a Uh, so my origin of water there, but never got any response back from anybody there. >> Garden taxes. >> Yeah. >> Uh, you should talk to my husband. He's he's basically spent the last like several months reviewing all the tax bills and legislation. >> He can explain it all to you. um
067tax just on the side >> how the you know they're talking about alternative ways to approach this from a tax from a tax taxation where they're >> they stay with property taxes or whether they supplement that with something else sales tax or >> there's all sorts of proposals out there but >> whatever and I haven't I just haven't heard where they where they live, >> kind of where they got to. >> I think I think we, you know, unfortunately it'll take another, you know, ne a year from now. >> We'll have a lot better clue on that, but we don't know what legislature is going to look like, you know, through another >> I mean, it's going to get a little bit >> I'm just wondering what they're thinking. I get I get what you're
068saying, but I >> I just >> what they've haven't really worked on that. Maybe they've worked on it in the past, but they haven't worked on it recently. >> Have we heard anything Dee from committees? Nothing. >> No, no, not about that or the dennial study. There's, you know, they're doing their work and there isn't a lot of communication about that right now because I think they're in the middle of it. >> Yeah. >> All right. Are there any other thoughts or ideas that anyone wants to share? Again, this is just a a time to time to talk and there's no decisions that are made tonight and and so um >> yeah, >> I have some thoughts. >> I'm listening, Leroy. >> All right. Some of these might be crazy. Welcome. >> Um, I think
069Dee's question of what do we what would we do if we didn't have the 20 million is is a a good question and also how she framed of moving fifth graders out of the middle school and the 20 million that we have maybe not necessarily the same question or the same thing. If if we go back out for a bond to build this school, we accomplish the goal of getting fifth graders out of the middle school. No doubt about it. We wouldn't build that school and not put fifth graders or keep fifth graders in the middle school. And we've tried this a few times. Um, and certainly we could go back out again in the spring for the same thing. And I totally see your point, Frank, of if we don't do it, then then
070there's the they're going to ask the question of was it was it absolutely necessary? [sighs] >> The thing that really gets me about this is in 2019, we went out for the bond and it passed for all this. And you look at our enrollment numbers and the trends that we had at that time and it was skyrocketing. If that trend continued, we would be in portables right now. >> But that trend hasn't continued. It's actually done the opposite. Co threw a wrench into everything. And if you look at the enrollment numbers over the past five years versus that trend, it's a completely different trend. And I don't think enough time has passed that that trend has actually established itself. But we this year we were down I think it was close to 10% over previous
071year. I >> is that >> Not that much. Okay. >> Um we had a meeting last week. >> Lying Leroy. >> I said that's why I said I think not definitively. >> Uh we had a meeting last week and we talked about a lot of different scenarios. um we are this close to being able to put fifth grade in our current elementarymentaries that we have without having to build another school. Problem is is then we'd be bursting the seams and if that trend comes back then we're out. We're out of space. So I think that's something to consider as well. Um now we we do have this $20 million that's unprecedented. It was set to build a school based on a trend that doesn't exist anymore. So, we have some other options as well. We
072could just go back to the voters and tell them we don't need it. If if we didn't spend that $20 million right now, we're not bursting our seams. Our schools are fine. Thing that sucks about it though is fifth grade is still in the middle school. We also have the ability to go to the voters and say, "Can we use this money for something else? You guys voted to approve it. Times have changed. Things have changed. What if we do something in the middle school? We turn fifth grade into we keep fifth graders in the middle school but we section it in such a manner that they don't have to have the same daily routine as the sixth, seventh and eighth graders or there's some sort of a hybrid approach. um if they're quarantined, if
073you will, essentially that's and it's it's taught in the same way that a uh an elementary school is structured the same their day is. There's a possibility as well if we went back to the voters and said, "All right, things have changed, not because we've changed our mind, but because things have the the factors are different." We take the $20 million and and remodel the middle school, which out of all our schools is in the worst shape of them all. I mean, I just threw a couple million into it and it it wasn't I mean, 20 million could turn that place into an amazing school that people this community would probably be proud to send their middle schoolers to. Um, and it it's possible. It's not necessarily the easiest thing, but of course from my
074perspective, I've been looking at that school for the last 4 and 1/2 years and metaphorically crying every time I walk through it, feeling sorry for these kids for having to deal with the worst deferred maintenance in this district. Even if we went back to the voters and said, "All right, we don't need 20 million. Let's maybe you guys would approve us taking 10 million off and letting us use another the other 10 for the middle school. Um obviously there would have to be some staffing changes. We have the ability to create an office if we had an administrative person down on the fifth grade wing. Um then then we'd have that. Fifth graders are still right where they are. But a lot of the reasons that people want to pull fifth graders out of the
075middle school could be accomplished and still keep the fifth graders in the middle school. The tough part about all of this idea is how do we get the voters to approve that and not have this uh this idea of would you guys make up your mind? Come on, school district. I >> think that was what you just did. Well, >> that's what you would label. You you sure need that to pass the first time or else >> Come on, guys. >> Yeah, certainly. >> What are you gonna do next week? >> You're gonna send everybody to Boseman that's in the fifth grade? >> Blessings, chief. Let's do that. I mean, you know, I've had similar thoughts and, you know, to take the 20 million if we could without going to the voters, you know, and
076then I was looking at the language of it, which sucks because we put, you know, we didn't think to write it. We could have wrote it and got it passed with like three words different completely. Um, and been a been a lot more flexible with it now to do that very thing. I thought about I've had thoughts about taking that same intermediate school, fifth grade wing, the old section that you you and I both know needs truly in not not a, you know, level and rebuild, but a you know, windows and, you know, big, you know, a good good overhaul and uh then you'd have, you know, all your schools very modern and, you know, that would take care of a lot of the deferred maintenance as as well as you know getting us a
077nice facility you but I was thoughts of actually making that fifth grade doing into a elementary and then instead of you're thinking just a satellite fifth grade dedicated fifth grade and I guess my thought was just a ded uh you know make it a K5 and that'd be your fourth elementary. I don't know if I don't know if I'm wrong. That was my initial thought, but like I said, I'm sitting here listening to what everybody else has got. And >> I don't think that wing has the full capacity to be I mean, it it could be a a K5. I feel like that would be even be tougher cuz while we have the ability to section off and keep fifth graders in that one section, um it it wouldn't be I don't think that it
078we could maybe I'm wrong about this fully guarantee that there would be zero interaction between fifth graders and and other grade levels as well. >> Graders in that same room fifth graders. No, it's all fifth. That the yellow and the orange hall is all fifth grade all the way down. The toughest part about that is the library is smack dab in the center of it. >> Now, $20 million. We could >> you could build a new library somewhere. >> Put a library elsewhere. >> Well, where the music room is in the junior high, that was the library, correct? In the junior high. >> Yeah. Back in the day. I would be very cautious about that kind of shift in plans. It makes us look as if we have no clue what's important >> and that
079we're not behaving in an honest way with our neighbors. Um I frankly I wasn't here for the vote, but I would have voted what what you folks said. I think you got it right. And if you got it right last time, the voters said, "We don't think you got it right." All right, that's nice. But if it was right last time, it probably hasn't shifted. And your hypothesis was everything is different. And I'm not sure that that's true. I couldn't make that argument to the community. I think there are trend lines. We don't know. one year is not generally accepted as a violation of the previous trend. >> This isn't a one year >> and what they look at is three years of data um as a standard for looking at what the impact of
080enrollment is going to be. our our trends of the everything and and not just one year it's you know I'm see and it's not just the schools Belgrade's growth BG grades demographics co blew everything up >> I mean >> and I'm willing to accept that and then you made a decision that fifth graders should not be where they are >> that was a good decision we just have not been successful in communicating that to our neighbors. But the truth is, if you step away from that, I think you undermine our credibility. >> That's >> you suggest that voters who voted against the bond issue were on the right side of that issue, that we didn't know what was important, and that we are willing to agree with them. It isn't important that fifth graders are
081in elementary. They can be any place. >> And I I think it's dangerous when school boards step away from wellthoughtout decisions. All it does is it makes us look like we really are not very thoughtful about what direction to go. And if we aren't, we are not supervising the superintendent and the assistant superintendent because they are going along with this as well. Their credibility is hooked to us. Well, the other thing is if you took the 20 mil and you attach it to a new plan and the new plan fails, >> then you lose it. >> Zero money. Yeah, that's the >> approved money. >> That's the >> I'm thinking today if I was to do this, there's a I'd be bet I'd be betting on the uh the other side if I was. I
082I I'm yeah I'm not optimistic that we get >> the the thing is is in Bgrade and I know I probably have beat this drum before having been in this school district for 30 some years um our trends fluctuate and sometimes you know for years I was told every year we're going double A next year you're going double A you next next year next year your speech team's going to be double A. You better be prepped for it. You do this. You're going to go go double A. And guess what? I didn't go double A. Double A came on after I left. And so maybe we have a trend right now that goes, oh, you know, our school numbers don't look so good. But I look at the building going out on Jack Rabbit. I
083look at some of the building going on in my neighborhood and there's nothing that says to me that we're suddenly gonna just go stagnant in Bgrade and this is going to level off. >> There are I think that we will I think we will continue to grow. Maybe it won't be in the next two years, but I think we have to look a little more futuristic. And I agree. Um I really agree with what Frank said in that let's take this back. Let's say here we h you have approved us 20 million but due to costs we cannot build this for this 20 million you approved. Please help us help our babies and give us please support us and give us 6 million to move forward because I don't think in the long run we
084will regret that choice. I think that we will see ours I think we will see that number come. I don't know that we're going to go double A in two years, but maybe. >> Well, keep in mind, guys, >> I your thoughts. >> I'm 100% on board. Obviously, we're going to grow. Um, that's just an out of the box thought because >> it's your thoughts. I I think it's something for good. It was good thoughts. There's nothing wrong with your thoughts anyway. They were good. >> Oh, thanks. Normally, I have to pay a counselor to tell me that. >> [laughter] >> All right, that was a great discussion. Does anybody have any final thoughts? >> I'm actually glad Leroy came. Thank you for that cuz you know your your two cents and you know these
085buildings and you know everything, you know, better than we do. Um, >> not me. I get to see enough of you. >> What >> I said, not me. I get to see enough of you. Dropping kids off. Spent years working with you at Oracle. [laughter] Plenty of Leroy. I'm >> Whatever. It's fine. You'll talk to your counselor about it later. [laughter] >> All right. You can go ahead and >> Are there words I'm supposed to use? >> No. >> I guess that's everything. Meeting adjourned.