001[Music] good evening everyone thanks for joining us if you would please stand and join me thank you so much for taking your time to join us we would like to start with item number two which are on our agenda which is a presentation on school finance which are members of the board members of public welcome we're delighted to have so many of you here this evening and as well as those that are watching us online my name is dr. Maggie Horniman I'm just super Intendant of Avon Community Schools and this is the first in a series of community engagement meetings our meeting is being live streamed and recorded for later viewing so if there's information that you want to go back and review at a later time that should be relatively easy to do our
002next meeting will be Monday November 27th at 5:30 in this room the purpose of our meeting tonight is to hear from those of you here in the audience but prior to listening to your input we will explain how school funding works and the significant funding challenges we face we'll review the ways we've become more efficient save money and generate an additional revenue for our school district in order to cope with these financial challenges and finally we will receive input from you about our priorities and our next steps in order to explain where we are it's a it's important to understand how schools are funded we have two main funding sources the first source is described on the left-hand side of the screen and this is the money that the state of Indiana provides to public
003schools on a per student basis it's called the general fund the general fund pays for salaries benefits supplies substitutes in other words the general fund from the state of Indiana a place or pays for a lot of our operational costs the second funding is described on the right-hand side of those of the screen and this is the funds that we receive from local property taxes that we all pay if we own property these funds allow us to pay our debt specifically our mortgages and we have some high mortgages because we grew very quickly as a school Corporation and built many buildings for our students to accommodate our 9,500 students this is the same fund that supports capital projects things like technology which as you know is growing and changing more quickly than we can keep
004with capital projects funds also help us maintain our 2.1 million square feet under roof and our 712 acres of land you know as homeowners that it's wiser to maintain our property rather than to allow it to fall into disrepair because it will be much more costly to correct we use our local property taxes also to pay for transportation we offer transportation to 100% of our students because it's simply not feasible for them to walk to school while the number of sidewalks in Avon has increased in recent years we are certainly not what anyone would describe as a walking School District some districts require any student who lives within a mile to provide his or her own transportation we don't do that and that's the reason we have a hundred and forty six buses 99 of
005which are on the roads every single day and we drive over 1 million miles a year you can imagine the cost of fuel and keeping our buses in good repair for the safety of our students this will sum up the challenge that Avon Community Schools is facing we are getting hit hard on both sides of this slide we are getting hit hard on both sides of the budget well the general fund and the local property taxes now this slide is an actual page from the state's budget we don't want you to read through the 300 page state budget we just want you to know where our numbers come from and I'd like to call your attention to the two numbers that are circled in red because these numbers represent the percent in crease that the
006state of Indiana is providing to our general fund that was the fund that pays for the salaries and all the operational costs these two circles represent the percent increase for 2018 and 2019 so you can see them in 2018 our school system will receive 1.3 percent more money than we did in 2017 then looking forward to 2019 you can see that will receive 1.4 percent more money so you might be thinking wow great more funds that's that's great or money than last year unfortunately no it isn't great because these funds don't begin to keep pace with inflation inflation was 2.1 percent in 2016 yet we are receiving 1.3 percent in 2018 that's the story the story is we have not been able to keep pace with inflation we call this our what-if slide this slide
007shows you that the moment the state took over funding of the general fund which happened back in 2009 this shows us in the left-hand column or the second column rather exactly how many dollars we received from every one of the students in our school system that's represented by that middle column so you might look down that middle column and you might say well okay their funding didn't decline every year for six years but at least it's going up now so that's good right it's going up now no because that funding has never kept pace with inflation so what is this what what if slide the what if slide shows you in the far right column what would the situation be for community schools that the state had kept pace with inflation well can see at
008the bottom we would be receiving five hundred fifty eight dollars more per student or 5.3 million dollars more in 2018 and we certainly would not be faced with this financial situation now we recognize the importance of all of us living within our means I'm sure your incomes didn't keep pace with inflation either during the recession and for maybe even a year before or after and that's why we know that it was important for us to take significant steps to contain our costs and to generate additional revenue for our school system but living within our means is not possible if the cost of doing business goes up every year and the revenue reasons we've received does not keep pace with those cost-of-living increases imagine in your home budgets if your income went down six years in
009a row and even when it started to go up it did not keep pace with inflation that's the situation we find ourselves in right now so when you think about well if the state isn't keeping pace with inflation what have you done how have we kept the doors open how have we succeeded so far well just like you have at home we've tightened our belts in every way possible but especially with fewer staff members on this graph you see several blue bars and you can see that on the far left in 2009 those blue bars represent the number of students and how our enrollment has increased on the far right the blue bar says for those of you that cannot see this it says that we currently have 9527 students that's how many we serve
010today compared to 81 84 back in 2009 the red line represents the number of teachers we have in our school system so you can see that compared to 2009 from 2010 we have eight and a half fewer teachers six fewer administrators twenty few 24 custodians yet 1343 more students it isn't just custodians and administrators and teachers who's been cut we also have fewer teaching fewer teaching assistants fewer clerical staff here are bus aides fewer food service workers those are just a little more difficult to quantify because they are our and the employees and so it's a little more difficult to be completely clear about the number of hours that we have less and support staff suffice it to say we are as lean as leaning to be over the last five and a half years
011that I've been superintendent I have repeatedly said if you see a place that we can be more efficient or way that we can be more lean tell me and I'm grateful that many of our staff members and many of our community members have given us some excellent ideas many of which we've implemented but I don't think we can cut anymore when it comes to personality here to discuss those all-important teachers is our associate superintendent dr. Johnny thank you doctor the next two slides contain information on your salaries from local school districts in districts we like to compare ourselves to why is this information important because in Avon schools it's a priority for us to attract and retain top tech this is not only important to us it's also important to our parents we know they
012want their children to have great teachers it's critically important to our students we know the quality of the learning in the classroom is directly related to the quality of teaching attracting and retaining top talent is a sound business principle of high quality organization so the data on this screen concerns us there's a well documented teacher shortage in our state and as you can see our beginning teachers make less than in every district about one at the start of their careers but what keeps us up at night is that the gap whities for veteran teachers these are the teachers who are committed to our mission our district our community and our students these are the teachers our parents and students love teachers we've invested in with professional development and training I would ask for you to
013pause for just a moment close your eyes think of a great teacher take a moment and picture that teacher and reflect on what that teacher has meant to you now imagine if you've never had that teacher I know for me it would be devastating now look at the screen our teachers are loyal but they're only human if they can do the same job in a similar district and make more money than you they have to consider in 10 years they can make fifty two hundred and ten percent more lifetime earnings in one of those districts and just like that great teacher you were thinking about moments ago if they choose to leave our district it will be devastating we must find a way to stay competitive with our teacher compensation now dr. Scott Windham is
014going to come up to the podium go a little deeper to school finance thank you doctor think back to one of the first slide that dr. Horniman reviewed she compared the different funding sources in Indiana for public schools one being the general fund which was state funding that's what we've spent most of our time so far in the presentation but we're going to shift down to the other side of that first slide which was property tax funding can't really talk about property tax funding in Indiana without talking about the impact of property tax caps as Hoosiers we voted for tax caps to be included in the state constitution so there's no doubt when tax caps are here to stay tax caps began in 2009 with partial implementation and in 2010 began being fully implemented what
015tax caps mean is that as homeowners we know no matter where we live in the state of Indiana we won't ever pay more than 1% of the value of our home in local property taxes same thing if you're a farmer an own farm Lee you'll never pay more than 2% of the value of your farm property in local property taxes you're a business owner and own property for your business you won't pay more than 3% so let's think about a hundred thousand dollar example just for so if I'm a homeowner and my home is valued at $100,000 I know that I won't ever pay more than $1,000 1% in my local property tax bill each year if I'm a business owner I know I'll never pay more than $3,000 in local property taxes so right
016there in that equation you can see how the makeup of your community is a significant factor in the impact of tax caps in Avon we're over 70 percent residential so the vast majority of our tax base in Avon is capped at 1% drive down the road to Plainfield and it's a completely different story Plainfield is about 30 to 40 percent residential so the vast majority of their tax base is commercial and is taxed at 3% so in Plainfield tax caps just aren't as much of an issue as they are for us your name on so let's go back to that hundred thousand dollar example it could be for the purposes of this equation let's just say that these four tax caps I was paying $1200 in my property tax bill for my hundred thousand dollar
017home tax caps come along and now I'm captured a thousand dollars so as the tax payer I just saved $200 in my tax bill and we all loved that in 2010 we love getting to to keep that additional property tax money but we didn't take into account was that that $200 then doesn't get passed along to the different taxing entities we didn't account for the level of which that would not get Haskell's so it's taxpayers we saved that funding we got to keep that funding but it impacted the fire department the police department the schools the public library so that $200 and my example is the impact the negative impact of tax caps and that's just for this one property imagine if you multiply that across the entire community and that's what this slide shows
018for 2009 the first year of partial implementation of property tax caps the impact to avan schools was 1.6 million so we did not collect 1.6 million in local property tax revenue you can see that absence flows over the course of each year to 2017 since that's the year we're currently in that's an estimate that's provided to us by the state county auditor they estimate that we will have a six point nine million dollar negative impact of property tax caps 2018 is even worse at over 10 million dollars in uncollected funds due to property tax caps the cumulative impact since 2009 is over 64 million dollars so what does that mean 64 million dollars that means we're not able to keep pace samples that dr. Horniman shared at the level that we think our students and
019our staff deserve so things like pulling into the parking lot to drop off your child of school and being frustrated with the condition of the parking lot or the driveway into the school we're simply not able to keep pace with that maintenance things such as technology that we're not able to maintain and refreshed at the level that we think our students deserve not being able to keep play keep pace with replacing buses at the level that we would like and older buses are more expensive to maintain and then finally the repairs that we just cannot keep pace with as dr. Horniman described out of our capital projects fund building repairs carpet wall coverings rug all those things that require funding to maintain and we just simply can't do it but the impact events so it's
020not enough just to talk about the hits that we have taken both on the general fund side and the property tax funding side we also wanted to highlight for you areas that we have been efficient and that we have helped ourselves by seeking additional resources for our students first example there are several examples on the next two slides and I'll just highlight a few of them the efficiency task force that in 2015 and this was a 28 member committee that came up with recommendations for the school board that was three $50,000 of savings and we continue to implement those recommendations our health insurance premiums for our staff have not increased in the last two years as a result of our effective management of our medical insurance program unfortunately this year 2018 there is a 3%
021increase but if you followed the news that's pretty low compared to industry averages so we're pleased with the level of support that we've been able to provide to our staff through effective management of our health insurance dr. Harmon mentioned our debt we recently refinanced our debt to get a better interest rate a lower interest rate without extending the life of the debt beyond that which would which what it was issued we have recently entered into partnerships with Henri's Regional Health and handy more for sponsorships to provide additional funding to support our students and on the curricular side the math science partnership grant provides $250,000 to benefit our students and our staff as we focus on those important areas in the curriculum of math and science one thing that we have done in the last two
022years and specifically more so this year is open enrollment and open enrollment is a bit counterintuitive because with open enrollment we have accepted students who apply to attend school in Avon even though they don't reside within the boundaries of Avon or Washington Township so we accepted 63 students this year as open enrollment with those students comes that state funding that dr. Horniman talked about earlier so those 63 students brought with them almost three hundred and fifty thousand dollars to support their education in the general fund we were able to strategically place those students at our smallest schools that were able to welcome them and support them with minimal impact to our staffing so actually increasing 63 open enrollment students was a key factor in allowing us to reduce our class sizes at the elementary level
023in our kindergarten through fourth grade classrooms most recently we were awarded the very competitive lilly grant almost $800,000 Matt grant will be used to add counseling staff and support additional resources to focus on the social-emotional health and mental health of our students those are the things that we would not be able to do to the level that we want to without this funding with that I'll hand it off to dr. Miriam and our assistant superintendent good evening everyone I would like to take a few moments to connect why the previous slide are relevant to our mission of providing an 21st century quality education to our students in Avon schools I believe we can all agree that the world has changed significantly in the past 15 years first and foremost technology has been and continues to
024be employing influencing about every aspect of our lives technology is now a natural part of our classrooms including how educators and students access and process information additionally economic shifts since the recession as a result our work has expanded to have both academic rigor and to increase our students ability to be innovative collaborative and strong and technical skills this first slide represents a traditional classroom in the type of educational experience most of us had growing up typically the teacher role in this setting is to impart knowledge to students the teachers considered the expert are viewed as the sage on the stage the student in a traditional classroom setting spends the majority of his or her time listening to lectures and responding to the teacher only when called upon we know that students of today the more
025that traditional style of Education our students need authentic experiences to become the collaborative and innovative problem solvers needed in today's job market they also need to be proficient and academic content as well as the technical and soft skills over the past several years we have been shifting our classrooms function to prepare students to be successful for life after high school our classrooms now look more like this these pictures represent a significant shift from the sage on the stage approach more and more in our classrooms you will see teachers working side-by-side with students and small collaborative groups these small groups allow students conversation increasing participation while building academic language and content knowledge teachers are able to ask higher-level questions in real-time while allowing the processing of information is aggrieved smaller constructions significantly increases teacher-student relationships we
026know having students listen and regurgitate information is not good enough anymore not only do we want our students to be problem solvers innovators and collaborators we also want them to have an educational experience that has rigor relevance positive relationships these are the classrooms our students and Families this is the experience we want to provide at the highest level possible and in order to do that we need to keep and retain our speaking of great teachers we have quite a few of you here tonight and I am absolutely delighted to have you with us you've heard a lot from administrators tonight and we want to make sure that at every community engagement session you get the opportunity to hear from at least one of our teachers tonight mr. Dean Westman who is the Performing Arts Department
027shared a bond high school and one of those veteran teachers we never want to lose to another district is here to share some thoughts with us at our meeting two weeks from tonight we'll be hearing from a general education elementary teacher and at future meetings from some other teachers please welcome mr. Weston so I have been geeking out lately learning about the history of our community it's something that's kind of always fascinated me looking up different articles that talk about how the settlers came here in the 1830s all the different names that the community has had write some funny ones along the way and then even some whether it's factored more I love it the lore that it was the railroaders that looked and gave it a mon and what they put is a do
028and they called it a valley of neighbors as a way to mark this community when I saw that I don't even care if it's true that is so amazing to me I also found an article in the flyer from a couple few years ago it was called the history of a bond and it was a fascinating article it's just reading this the other night I came across a paragraph that made me lol parents that's laugh out loud this is the paragraph this is in a newspaper article the Avon consolidated school was built in 1917 the first graduating class consisted of Russell Blair and Mary Davis classes averaged from 10 to 20 per graduating class from the 1920s until about 1955 sex that time the school enrolment has expanded rapidly understatement of the article I want
029to take a few moments to share my story and a unique view that I've had over the past 1012 years as a member of this community my wife and I we moved here to the valley of neighbours in 2005 we were both teachers down in Houston Texas in the suburbs of Houston Texas and I had accepted a position for an organization called music for all as their director of education and my wife Adriana so by the way left Wayne Township to come be part of this valley of neighbors because she wanted to be part of teaching the kids in the community where she lives that was more important to her than the data out there and when we moved here she was going to be working in Decatur Township and I was going to be
030working downtown had music for all but the only thing that mattered to us when we were community shopping was we wanted to be in a place where we believed in the schools our daughter was going into the first grade at the time she is now a freshman art education major at Indiana State University we looked in Carmel we lived in Greenwood we went out and Lawrence ultimately we looked here and I can't lie when you drive into the top you see a sign that says welcome to Avon home of Champions and you're a music geek like me you noticed that but there was just something about this place that's forward to the spring of 2007 I'm still working at music feralas the director of education and I have a conversation with Maddy ornament I believe
031and that time was in an assistant superintendent role and she was wondering about starting an orchestra program I'm quite sure after several years of Ric Wagner asking her why doesn't anyone have an orchestra program Ric is one of the incredible advocates for all of our students and we had that conversation and our message was actually really clear and simple if we're to be a truly comprehensive school system we should offer it all and I'm sure that's a message that you have shared many times on many fronts whether it's creating a dance program whether it's creating a robotics program I could go on and on and on but the message was if we want to be this canvas valley of neighbors this community let's have it all and offer it all for our kids so in
032the fall of 2007 I became the lucky guy that was able to found the Avon Orchestra program we started with 38 sixth grade beginners those kids are all now seniors in college I'd love to tell the story how over the past decade we grew from those 38 to a program that serves hundreds and hundreds of students grades 6 through 12 and five buildings I'd love to talk about the growth of the program the excellence of the program I love to talk about the fact that the largest arts organization in our state the Indianapolis Symphony Orchestra shows a bond as the community become partner with when they have their three-one-seven series I love talking about being named the state runner-up last year this for state fliers there's a story I don't tell enough and that's why
033I really appreciate this opportunity I don't get to tell the story of the people that I've gotten to know and work with over this 10 year plus journey there's probably not another teacher in this community that can say that they've got to be a part of the family in five different schools in Avon as we grew I was able to be part of the educational experience at intermediate East intermediate West this building what it was just a Vaughn middle school and then when we had a by middle school north and ultimately an Avon high school I've been able to work with and get to know the teachers the custodians be aides the cafeteria workers the administrators the parents so many of them who are sitting here right now out of all of these places along
034the way I got to build those relationships as mr. Chapin metallian I even coached the girls golf team for two years and a little spoon salad firsthand folks I've seen the miracles that these schools that work in the hearts and in the minds of our students I've seen it in my own kid I've seen it during good times and I've seen it during times that have become tough I've taught in two other states and in my role as educational director at music for Allen I really was able to visit with schools from all over the United States but there's something about this place this valley of neighbors in this community a custodian like Victor Mormon can make the exact same positive impact on a kid that a world-class physics teacher like mr. Hyde who makes
035I've sat with a bus driver like lars Larson who uses John not only is getting the Symphony Orchestra safely to state finals but making sure that every single Avon kid that performed an act state finals feels valued and loved I've seen teachers all over this district were used to compromise their committee - creating life-changing experiences for our kids even though the student population has grown extensively we take pride in the fact that as a community we've been able to do so well with an ever tightening belt but when you tighten the belt all the way it's no longer a belt it's a knot I've seen the physical and emotional toll that has taken on so many people that I have come to know and love on my journey here in Avon yet they still filled
036up every single day inspired to use education as a mean that changed the lives of our children our children tonight I'm here to say that I believe we can do even more for our kids I know we can but we need help I believe in this valley of neighbors the Avon schools are the epicenter of this community whether it's a football game a holiday concert you name it these schools are who we are as a community through academics athletics and the arts we teach the mind body and soul of these kids in this valley of neighbors no part of the child should ever be left behind I believe in this place called Avon and I believe we have a really bright future if we can all come together and simply do what is best for
037our kids the Orioles nobody could have said it better and you know each and every one of you stood to applaud mr. Westman and his message you were standing to applaud every teacher he represents we want to conclude by reiterating what we believe are the main concerns number one large class sizes we definitely made some progress this year with our cake for classes becoming reasonably sized but had no change at the 5th and 6th grade where all of our classes are over 30 at the middle and high school level we have some classes of 35 and even higher but please don't think I'm only talking about the class sizes into social studies and science and math and language arts we're concerned about the caseloads of our special education teachers we're concerned about the caseloads of
038our counselors at grades 5 through 12 which will not be impacted by the lily grant and we're dealing with more and more social emotional issues with students every day we're unhappy with the student-teacher ratio in the arts in general music physical education building super sciences technology education and all the other important subjects we know that our students to succeed they have to have a relationship with their teachers and it's much harder to develop relationships with students and with parents when we have teaching loads and caseloads that are incredibly high ultimately or not achievement and so the second main concern we have has to do with our academic performance as our class sizes have grown larger our performance slipped on many standardized tests finally we know that we are not right now able to offer everything
039our students deserve from a curriculum standpoint a extracurricular and athletic standpoint specifically we've heard loudly and clearly from our band choir and orchestra staff and parents that have not had any daily instruction for our beginning level students is taking its toll on their progress we offer some fabulous electives like anatomy and physiology forensics etymology studio art creative writing all of which we must maintain and I say expand schools are not solely about what we offer during the day there are also about extracurriculars and athletics from an ECA standpoint we have lots and lots of clubs but in many cases teachers are volunteering their time not getting paid to sponsor those important clubs or if they do receive a small stipend for Student Council or an academic team that stuff that hasn't changed since 2009 from
040essa from that Lubbock standpoint we lost a great deal when we moved from one large to two medium sized Middle School's we did so to expand opportunities for our students unfortunately our plan to have things like mills will baseball and no school softball they've never even got off the ground in other sports there are no B teams there are no C teams so middle school kids often get cut and don't get to make the team this is a time in their lives when they should be able to experiment and try out all sorts of different things and find out what they're good at of what they love but because lack of coaches we have to cut them we have a lot of volunteer coaches don't get me wrong we have boatloads of volunteer coaches but
041when you think about keeping kids safe 50 or 60 kids on a track team and keeping them safe you can't have everybody out there at high school we know that every single one of our coaches our sponsors our music directors are all the lowest-paid and our conference recall that keeping kids involved outside of the classroom is one of the best ways to dramatically increase the graduation rate it's time for us to not only restore what we want that but to expand it we're very proud of our newest state champions in volleyball and our marching band placing third this year this weekend in Grand Nationals the 11th time 11th consecutive year they've done that our thespians won their first regional this weekend maples Blue Ribbon School no it isn't all doom and gloom and sometimes people
042say oh thank you know there's so many great things have in there how can you say that this is a problem well our community is thrilled about these types of accomplishments but these accomplishments should not be the exception we have gaps in many many programs and we need your help to fill those gaps when people move to a new community the first thing they ask their realtor is what are the schools like they know their home's value is directly correlated to the quality of the school system in conclusion as your superintendent I promised back in 2012 when the board entrusted me with this position to do every I could to become lean and efficient to be good stewards of the money that you pay and that our community pays I remain optimistic about the school
043corporation but I also know that the erosion of quality can happen slowly and almost imperceptibly until one day we wake up and find out where average I don't think we are average I don't think this community's average and I don't think the school system should be ever thought of as average I'd like to work with you to make this the school system that our students deserved now's the time that we want to hear from you word president mrs. Woodward will provide some instructions but we're open to questions were anxious to hear your feedback and I'll remind you that this is not the one only opportunity you have to speak up for those who prefer to ask a question or make a comment privately and in writing we've set some index cards at your places and
044you can certainly feel free to put some notes on that and leave them in the basket as you leave and we'll gladly collect those and review those very carefully with that I'd like to turn the meeting over to mrs. Woodward thank you doctor dr. hunt dr. McMahon dr. wisdom and mr. Westman or setting the stage so well for us and now it's your turn what I would like to invite you to do is to give us your comments and your thoughts about what you've heard tonight as well as what your perceptions are of our Avon Community School Corporation I would ask you because there are a number of you here and that's delightful we're really pleased that we have such a great turnout tonight thank you so much for taking this Monday evening to come
045and share with us but I would like for you as you give your comments please give us your name and where your address and then limit your comments I know it will be hard but limit your comments please to about three minutes so that we can get everyone an opportunity that like said that would like to speak to speak as dr. Barnabas said this won't be your only opportunity to talk or weigh in and in fact what we hope is that as we go through the next several meetings that this will be an evolutionary process that as these your concerns are be here input that we'll be able to infuse this presentation with more information that is helpful to you and our and so with that I will open the floor for your comments yes
046sir particularly with Mitch here wish to be here what are some of those proposals the cuts and is there are there things that we can do to try to help to the offset I don't think that our board or our administration came in tonight with a set of Robster of things that we intend to because in fact what we're hoping for is that we'll be able to maintain everything that we have today I think that what you can see though is that the efficiencies with you when you add up the 65 million dollars loss of property tax caps go to the past several years that when we looked at just recently our annual budget is tipped above 100 million dollars so sixty-five million is sixty five percent of an entire year's budget that is gone
047lost to us and not recoverable what we've tried to do in the efficiency slide show that is incremental we find ways that we could not cut services to students not cut programs to students and still maintain our budget but as you can imagine there comes an end to that there's nothing more you can cut until you begin to cut bone and muscle so we did not come into this meeting at all with an agenda of things that would be cut but I think this is probably a poor analogy but this is the best one that I think describes it my mother-in-law was an educator my mother who was an educator for 40 years died in 2000 from all fibers and we did not see her deterioration as a clip what we saw is a daily
048dimming of her ability to maintain cognitive reasoning be able to function I think that's what we see in a con is that this is not a severe cliff cut this is the situation where we're abiding small incremental decline because we don't have funding to maintain or better improve or actually add programs for our students so thank you for coming thinking that there were going to be so if you wanted to speak out about cuts that would be widespread we have no such plans for that but what we're trying to do is try to encourage our community to help us to maintain and increase our programs our solutions yes that helped a lot of things have you thought of some ways that we can't help them you know I have a student here who actually has
049an idea of something that she wants to do and so that's kind of one of the things that we why we wanted to just get an idea of what's going on okay well dad in a crowd before somehow we started so we touch the fourth graders ads or animation if they wouldn't mind in your letters written out with don't need know what you don't have to start at the absolutely you start learning how to play actually the classes on further along I think that second grade is showing a lot of musical interest not let a promise yet but I think that sat is an awesome idea it takes teachers of course to commandeer and to move forward an organization like that at birth of an idea like that great idea we definitely that's why we
050are at Valley Inn neighbors we have ideas about things that we can do to improve and we should do those things I think in the end funding to encourage professional instruction which help to expedite that even further in fourth grade in fifth grade in sixth grade so that I I missed your name Tierney hands thank you thank you very much other thoughts ideas input yes I'm Sarah Weimer the 592 box for drive my husband in this building I guess I'm learning more about my friend but I think I'm also interested that information [Music] Gordan we're getting little bit on that now but very good point Sarah people's bring that information we will add that to our docket of information slides that we debrief to the next meeting I hope you all caught that too that
051next meeting will be Monday November the 27th and so people make sure [Music] learning the board are here welcome you to I instituted a run and so obviously and so Thursday is my plug for our land we're actually perfect awesome a lot of the graphics thank you so much the median sir 6:30 at Senator John crane and representing the prankster well we'll be there they've been very very involved with our school corporation and you don't have to just talk about education this is very informal you don't have to feel all uptight about talking to legislators they are very approachable it's very informal if you want to talk about education I'm talking about education if you want to talk about something else that's in the news that's happening in Indiana that our legislators are going to
052affect feel free come yes my name is grant I'm very good thank you I'm a member of the Avon require boosters from the local pastor 30 years the most important and my father the three wonderful children two of which are currently in school and one former student alcohol state here that advocate well and speaking and based on mr. Westman standing ovation I think I'm speaking to a like-minded crowd but in case there are a few of the Centers and beyond the door I'm going to advocate general for the referendum but specifically in areas of music instruction especially the intermediate school levels of a creative art occurred when a monster elaboration made their cuts everybody experiences some of those have been restored but some of the not including the instruction that teachers and funding especially as
053it relates to the sightings whereas some athletics get this energy stipends now where some this lizard used to make it mandatory for students to enroll in music class through eighth grade they no longer require that only through sixth grade they've got another drop seventh grade so even though it might be helpful to list the thousands of reasons why that is counterproductive to your children only one leads to Google why is he usable instruction beneficial and they will find it currently basically rates easier college acceptance more scholarships and higher job at positions in my life ceremony in the process I also learned that emotional energies were exhausted during the process and our game is awesome and back then it can become deeply personal to fight for Richmond and as we've learned over the past few years
054so it can be seen that more destroyed on the dress of course and nothing is more first there was there was one I know that personally because I had some of it was listening back and as we saw in the exhaustive in presentations we see how she was investing in dr. Mermin was listening and she didn't we've asked her to not all of us including the conscientious citizens of 2011 who with their constitutional right but didn't know if she in the school or didn't recommend them as a pastor I defended my integrity for job security internet business doctor corners is a woman of integrity I believe in her and I believe but more importantly I believe in my kids and I want to be with best for them and that is a top-notch institution top-notch
055education necessarily includes I'm afraid not essentially a hospital so I'm my son graduates this year so my daughter is a sophomore in college now senior and my mom is a music how many new pretty to be tired but one time she told me she was talking to some colleagues about my granddaughter so the point is that we have a reputation far and wide and everybody we're known another friend of mine they moved to American Fork Utah and they had a conversation and they and so anyway I appreciate the 11% that Plainfield Passover Avon in the 5% and those things I understand that part of that comes from all those billions of square feet of warehouse but what else is talking that difference where is it because we're trying to do everything with less and this
056stretches out the budget so far or and we're you know trying to be so awesome that poor or what my mysterious was it's making that difference I'll start and I'd love to have those other three chime in so the first thing I would say is that the property tax cap if you take 70% residential 30% industrial or agricultural and you just flip back you can understand that that substantial amount of revenue on remember not the jet not the general a sight that on the side the debt side and the bus replacement and bus operation so that is a significant factor what else may contribute to that and check me on this but when I moved to Avon in 1999 I would do the Davis high school my husband went to Carmel my school our daughter
057was getting ready to enter her freshman year in high school and we wanted to go where there was a little or high school when we moved to Avon in 1999 there were three thousand six hundred students in Avon Community Schools this year you can see that we're welcoming more than 9,500 students so that growth has been astronomical compared to either our neighbors to the south or to the north and as a result we've had to build schools just in time to accommodate all of those students so our our capital requirements to pay all of those mortgage on brand-new schools as tax that tax that property tax category significant playfield that Brownsburg both of had steady growth but those were established communities that really their growth pattern at a much slower rate than Yvonne's growth so
058I would say that those those two factors really just become the complexion of where our taxes come from and other tabs in 70% of the households their Catholic that one combined with that astronomical group over a decade causes us to be to be different than that you know sip one of our legislators actually representative care world was was talking about the dynamics that caused our community to be a little bit different and so if you think about Brownsburg i-74 is there a lot of commerce can go on that interstate i-70 is just south of Plainfield and a lot of commerce can come and off load and unload their distribution in those locations that Avon has become the place where people come to live in order to educate their children this is the place where any
059anomalous people come to educate their children for that very reason it's it's magnificent that we're viewed as the community where we do kids and we do education and you do industry and commerce but those that factor it puts us in a very unique situation when it comes to what our communities so prior to avon I spent some time on the business side of public school operations prior to tax caps and so in those days in communities like ours you did everything you could to protect the general fund because the general fund pays salaries and the daily operations and so anything you could move into the capital side the CPF that the State Board would allow you to do you pushed it into the CPF right and that was just school financing 101 okay and so
060our situation today I am glad that dr. Windham is in charge of that not me because I know the stress bills from my past experience but we can't do that and so the general fund has to cover those things that a playing field will push into their CPF or their local property taxes and so I mean there's just many things that that you can do and so our because we actually to protect MPF and our capital side push things into our general fund just to get by and so it's it's it's just crazy and so in a district like ours with the some of the challenges we face because we grew so quickly and where we are is as dr. Hartman it's a perfect storm and it is so complex that when you know the
061laws were passed in this doctor wouldn't say you couldn't imagine unless you lived it every day as the CFO what would happen you just couldn't if the idea of a tax cut was so much more you know it was just we appreciated that and we've been talking about in this state since the thirties right any containing property taxes and so we finally found a way to do that on one side but there are districts like us devastating impact we talked earlier the operation that we don't have to because that so that around our camp I think that also a part of this the funding formula for the the state of Indiana that is determined that this game we advocate to our legislator and we've made some progress in the we've get a little bit more
062per student but again it's not keeping pace we're still turning to a child we will of course continue to but how many years will it take to catch up and what will our current kids on teachers News I think the state legislators do the best they can they've got a pot of money and they're charged with dividing it up and whether we agree or disagree thousand to like it or not are we're capable internally our gel on their hands to try to figure out [Music] five hundred dollars less per student one thousand children that's nearly 5 million so how do we all of you what we I think about this they're going to do what we're supposed to just think it out but you know what I've never heard a legislator tell me live within
063your means I think they're doing the best to work with and some some children are way more needy and so they have to try to help them they actually for them they actually think that they've done by creating the referendum on what they say we're giving you local control you made you believe that here's the method by which that yeah attitude we're just supposed to accept what [Music] Oh and so you just imagine how bad best we have and they know that if they can hide because they games before that you start taking the pass through out for a month but that is what community rich you know you talk about our legislators mom go on and ask them for solutions and you're way out well that's why we wanted to right yes so that's
064never been but I'm concerned about class sizes a report later that shows in our class sites that's the two topics I want our students but honestly and that's my son I don't want any cut tell us how do we expand whatever we're just going to clarify one thing and mr. Larsen you've given us that important point that we need to cover at our next meeting which is really on a lot of people's minds why isn't it so badly grounds for new plaintiff that's really what you're saying we need to do a little more succinct and concise explanation of that and we will do that but just to clarify because we all live this we talk about this kind of stuff all the time I don't want you to think that I think bill gives Plainfield
065schools 100 million although that would be very cool this is going to explain kind of the fine points where that they pass through a AV which is a valuation right the tax generated by that so when we talked earlier about clean bill has more industrial commercial that success the value but in some cases that funding doesn't get passed to all the taxing entities by the town so what Plainfield has said was some of it doesn't get passed through but they allow a portion of it to get pestering and considered in the funding for all the taxing entities so about 100 million dollars in Englehart all the taxing entities get my question is so there's two types of referenda that communities can undertake one is called operational or general fund and I think that's what's primarily
066on our mind another type of referendum is for a property or - let's just say build another building and that costs a lot of money even if we could afford to build another building we can't afford to staff that zone so at this point mrs. Lambert I would say that what is primarily being discussed is an operational referendum that would increase funds to the general fund if still would help because on the property tax caps I remember we said we're dipping into the general fund we're taking money that should be going to teachers and salaries and benefits we're taking some money in over here to pay for a chiller and Avon middle school South that goes out from the day that school is about to start so we unfortunately are dipping into our general fund
067for some of our capital projects needs because of property taxes I think primarily we're talking more about operational the other point that I want to make about this whole notion of the property tax caps because it goes today why do we feel it so much more in a bond I think we all understand that we feel it more in Avon because we're so highly residential but there are only a third of the school districts in the state of Indiana that are even affected by property taxes property tax caps the rest of them have enough agriculture enough business it's just a non-issue so this is not an issue that very many people care about and then when you take that 90 school districts that are really negatively affected by property taxes the Airy few of them
068grew as fast as we did and built all those buildings and bought all those buses and incurred all that mortgage and very few of them have seen their dollars per child go down six years in a row that's what we mean by that perfect or maybe better described as in perfect storm of getting hit on both sides but we'll do a more thorough and I hope concise job of addressing I do want to be clear that an operational referendum is an increase to the local property taxes in the community outside of tax caps so you can increase property taxes in a community through a referendum and use those dollars on the general fund side so and that is an eighth year as an eighth year time frame or renewal so if you do an operational
069referendum it's for eight years you generate a certain amount of dollars annually for eight years in the capital referendum right would be then for a project or some sort of capital improvement so to build a building or to replace a chiller all right no biggie so and so that would be that would be a one-time now we might we generate those taxes over a certain number of years whatever we sold the bonds for to pay those bonds back method by which the legislature has right and you have to be a realist right classroom while we what so someone we were optimal so we're stupid I'm hi I'm Mary Burke aye [Music] in tax evaders here a little bit different than those people in Sweden to because obviously enough state line and also my husband and
070I our daughter graduated in 2010 and our daughter did very well because of the opportunities that should have here in the she got into a top college he's currently a second-year law student and a great law school and he goes back to the opportunities that she had here and again graduating in 2010 it was before a lot of the things that have to be cut or actually feather so just to business abuses point that if your children were in school before men perhaps their elementary students now you may not be aware of all the things then but my point for being here is as Horsham you no longer hurts children in the school corporation I feel a passion for money your kids and your grandkids to have the same opportunities that my daughter was afforded
071that is so important to me and loved mr. West who needs to talk about a valley of neighbors I had never heard that before here's the next up Steve you know articulates what I know and that is I think I want people like me even though I don't know many of you in this room that we certainly don't near the children as a member of this community I want us to be to care and to be invested in the Eternity of opportunities that are available to your kids it's seven or the I mean the way I see it some of the pillars of any community a non-included certainly include quality public schools these protections firefighters all of that is so important and we need to support these pillars of our society to have the creative
072community that we play you know what I've asked myself is what kind of community do I want to live in I want to live in a community where people like me who no longer have children we're still invested because it's community I care about my neighbors kids I care about my co-workers kids I care about your kids and if I don't know you or know that it's important that we keep the school corporation is strong and so that your kids can grow up you know when I went to school dinosaurs were roaming the earth but when I went to school I competed for college place repair jobs locally or perhaps regionally my daughter and your kids they're competing actually means one way it's important that all of these programs and these are made available to
073your kids and I want you to know that someone like me cares about that even though my kids aren't here so I just for 50 grand I am actually a student at Avon high school a junior and the largest spots at Oakland High School isn't at the Holcomb and my question to the board is actually since class times and font sizes are increasing which I've learned a lot of recruits as I said it comes through a long high school how is the board trying to diminish the amount students are in per classroom and increase amount of teaching ability per classroom to help improve these students learning experience that's a great question Ruth I mean we we recently went some additions to our staff really to focus on classroom sizes in that prime time area Katie's
074three three and four we felt those are kids who when you were in third and second third grade you were trying to learn to read and socially adapt and do math and just understand how you did school right and so what we've tried to do is really focus on those areas because we believe that those children really deserve to get that very pointed instruction that helps them we have focused less on large classroom sizes in the upper grades which is something that is not far from any of our minds ever we believe that that is an unmet need we believe that there are leads that occur at those higher grade levels where students still need that individual instruction or they mean a team of teachers to come around them and really assist them but we
075have had to make some choices with our diminished funding and we have really focused on those younger students this chalasis here tonight she was my grandson's first grade teacher and what I've noticed in him was that before we had classrooms that were really sized manageable we had to rely on some of our gifted and talented students in those classrooms to teach their peers we were asking children to educate their other children who needed that remediation and we simply could not provide that with the dholtze that were in that classroom well I think that that is a collaborative way of learning I still believe that those students who are asked to do that are that their educational ability is diminished so what we're really trying to do is focus on those grades where we feel we
076set those children up for success in later grades but it does not go unnoticed to us that classroom sizes across all of our buildings including our are very sizeable junior class that that that is exactly what needs attention I also like to mention that about a little over two and a half years ago we began to talk with the board at every single board meeting about class size and the board quickly said that they wanted to see what our class sizes were at every single board and so every time we need that is a standing item and we don't think we should all be about test scores but we are concerned about some slippage and some of our standardized test scores so the board asked us a couple of years ago to take the top
077performing districts in in the Animas a the top 15 and and research what are their class sizes and then compare those to may bonds class sizes now here I am talking only about social studies science math and language arts and only talking about the k8 level one of the reasons we don't out that research all the time is because we don't want to be all about eye step we know that the whole child is far more important than just those subjects nonetheless at every board meeting and would do it again tonight we will talk about what the class size average is an Avon K through eight in those general education subjects and how those compared to the top performing districts despite our very very significant investment and eight and a half elementary teachers so that
078our K or class size average is now for the first time since I've been superintendent 25 or less with some outliers at Sycamore in Hickory in particular but we have those class sizes a little bit more in control despite that dr. ava has been a report later and the board's regular meeting that we are still at the bottom of the perform of the class size averages compared to the top 15 districts so at least I do want you to know that this is something that our board has asked us to report on publicly for probably thirty we don't have a lot of people at our board meeting but our board still doesn't conducts their business in the public and wants everything on the record and when we meet with our Teachers Union which we meet
079with our Teachers Union quarterly that is also something that we report on each time so it doesn't feel good to just report on it and don't boy that's a drag that's the way it's felt for a couple of years but I do want you to know that it's been uppermost in our boards life you go to the high school level in terms of what have we done allemande with poverty yes I just wanted this forever 15 2017 when my son started hitting her there were 18 kids in his class at country my daughter had 21 or 22 that country we have 27 to turner's and everybody's done and if you didn't see stuttering kindergartners to Lincoln big difference I volunteer for kindergartners base it's huge and we're asking these teachers to do more and more
080rigorous these kids are being mentioned for active interest well they was not connected so they were only there two and a half hours these kids are out here all day earlier about more needs and we got the grant for relief were counselors to inform our kids coming in with higher needs and a higher science classes that we've ever had and criminals were innocent so for those of you that it's not been that long since the classifieds were that small and now we grow so much realize how much and how short a time period those classes are oh yes thank you yes I but here's what this jar for most possible in many articles Miss America school supplies and loading up their cards and so one of the things that - is to not only think
081doubt for money into our schools into our children so that every kid has the chance shut wire or be on the map we you know to travel to another I'm very important have those opportunities but also you gave our art teacher crash and so I encourage us to our futures they are so barking I feel other than money too well that's okay teachers in college so I appreciate the the first year she had we have and now I'm concerned and I know that this very class is bigger than the junior class and you just wondered how and it's taken three years to get where and I know that you know very important but I don't want her to get lost in the shuffle of this that's such a good point there's an old adage that
082says if you have to eat an elephant the best way to do it is just one bite at a time and so as we fix one problem we have to look at the next problem in the next problem and certainly I think one of the things towards mine is as you made a dent in the case report classroom size here you're right those children the to the trick you laid to upper grades and we've got to continue to try to solve that problem forward we try to think of ways that we could be even more efficient and effective we think of ways to be able to maneuver classroom sizes and cross all of the Elementary's you know as an example if you were to look at every single classroom size came through for at every
083single elementary school you would find some that are at the low end and some that are the high end and so there's a lot more ability and in a number of elementary schools to be able to through get around to take advantage of that but as you get to intermediate school and you get to middle school those those have built that ability does not carry on so it is I wish I could give you an answer for what as dr. Burton said we report every single meeting except that we have dr. Edith pull the information sometimes oh we can do a staring thing yeah well that's still bad but [Music] we don't know or are you some of those things are those things on your mind - have we done a good enough job ours
084[Music] and they know that they'd like this that have tremendous [Music] to know that some nursery and all of our teachers and so I can't do we were it's frustrating you have to there's more and we saw fewer inspired a work [Music] so I am a junior and I really see that that is my second family I but I believe that Avon is the valley of neighbors but it's hard to find a and such the so you know what we do is people who find smaller communities to really get closer to you are close to me through that Orchestra it's very and know what strings wait sir and the whole year you know I did and consonances learned as much as I could and I'd like to say like to pretend that the reason that
085I like when I signed up for Orchestra next year at the in the sixth grade going into 7th grade it was because I just loved it so much because those have won such a big time and I didn't I kind of didn't want to continue because I didn't know what I was doing I wasn't like but by the end of demonstrated I got I understood the community and I understood what's so amazing about our program like actually care about artwork character stuff I mean I would say the work she's a really big part of my life and a part going up and so I definitely think that you know making the kids to Orchestra through seventh grade through eighth grade is a policy considered saving but I think it's really wanted to find develop programs
086and policies and such that helps the students and the teachers as best as we can without having to do like Alcon moving things around because the atmosphere some sense without is I know so I think it's very important those bikini ways to help may be said about appreciating teachers just making sure that the community is alive and helping each other example as a student we are always working through things put on a colored resumes so many like community service max ourselves looking for yeah it's like the court and the whole community should always be ways to think upset lots for she's a very patient there what's the actual shortfall what's our budget what how much are we spending how much do we eat what's that trimming going forward you know what I wouldn't those charts
087look there I've got that to us and see if everything to see how this is well gab is a little offended this is what we think we need to close this gap you know some actual dollar figures that I'm assured commissioner we didn't feel ready to present that to you yet and part of it is because we need to know what you want you know there are a lot of performing arts people here a lot of music people here we're hearing some very loudly what is value in the school district I know what the principal's want we have this conversation with them they want class sizes at 25 or below at the elementary 26 27 at the inter medium school they feel that they need additional instructional coaches they feel that we need additional counselors
088at the 512 they feel that the ECAs extracurricular activities are poorly compensated and that teacher shouldn't have to volunteer their time I've got a whole litany of things but before I can put a price tag to it these kinds of conversations need to occur so that we can come back because if we do ask you and we moved here and I'm a homeowner yeren if I'm going to ever ask this community to pay more we want to do exactly what you say which is this is how much it's gonna cost and this is what you're going to get but right now I think it's a little bit premature for us to tell you how much it's going to cost until we get a better sense of what you all want and you've done a marvelous
089job tonight I've got pages and pages of notes and many ideas for the presentation two weeks from tonight we thought we practiced a lot and a lot more work to do so we will absolutely come back and refund this presentation and I promise you that we will get to that point but we want to continue to ask what's the most important thing to you is class size as extracurriculars as opportunities for our kids is it a number of instructional minutes that our youngsters have our music and physical education what is it and as you tell us that will get a sense and we'll be able to come back to you not say here's the plan but we can say here's what this would get here's what this would get here's what this weekend and again
090I know our board well enough having for five years I know our board is going to want your opinion if we're going to ask for more money from the community they're going to want to know that you think this is a good plan so I promise you that we can get to that I won't say to you that there's a shortfall right now because that would imply that we're spending more money than we're taking in we do have a balanced budget but it's been balanced on the backs of our kids and our teachers and our staff members our bus drivers and our teaching assistants etcetera etc so we balance our budget or we're holding on for dear life and my attitude upset it over and over again I want to avoid a referendum I want
091to avoid a referendum I would not want to have a referendum that's what I've said but now I'm looking around and I can't I don't have any more tricks to pull out I can't get any more sponsorship sighted I don't think I can be a whole lot more efficient so now that's what we want to get your input about are there efficiencies we haven't considered are there revenue streams that we haven't considered and what is it that we want for our schools so I really appreciate that question because I think it really will take us to the next step and both sharpen our pencils any final comments here will be dude and I just worked with dr. Bergman says which really was the purpose of tonight's meeting was to do a lot of listening and
092not a lot of talking that we heard more information it was important for us to give you some basic information in those slides but now really what we'd like to encourage you to do is to start thinking about what are some of those trade offs one of the things that are important what are the things that your neighbors and your fellow parents believe are important and to really start to focus on that as we begin this process of studying what's next great money please come to the November 27th meeting encourage others to do that because once again probably won't have those answers but we're getting you know it's like when you're focusing a camera the aperture gets very much more clear as you as you try to get this thing and so I would encourage
093you to talk to others to send us your information if you think it's something as soon as you leave the meeting please one last thing is there are the note cards that are on your chairs please take this opportunity to break down any questions or comments that either you feel strongly about move we didn't have time for this evening or that maybe you just didn't want to ask you this public forum that all of that would be consideration to do import my comments won't fit on a card and finding it on the agenda and email cardboard so how there are a couple of different things that thank you for that question this is a great way to gather information but there are a lot of people who didn't speak our course today I'm thinking and
094as this process emerges there will be opportunities for electronic and but both anonymous and from your email because we know that that's important we know as we move forward will be important to say this question was asked and this is the answer so at this moment I always invite anyone to email me you might you know address names hard to spell we use middle initials it keeps us from having too many awful technology my email addresses M as in Maggie E H o ER and as in Nancy E a and m h o ER and e ma and at a bond - fools org I know our auratus always open to receiving input and all of their email addresses are on the webpage so they're hyperlinks so they're pretty easy to to connect with because
095sometimes you don't really want to talk to the superintendent directly to the border I know that they welcome that input both formally and in for right now I think that's your best bet but I can I guarantee you that before a decision is made about what we're going to do and how we're going to do it it what it's going to be there will be a lot more opportunities fringe but thanks for asking that question last night I'm going to bed my wife so without their that this meeting is about cutting these and I was floored Cheryl pants have me heard that how many hurt that you think you're thinking that to those who spoke about teachers I'm not a parent here who's graduated a few years ago greater so we have completed in our
096house with them and even though I haven't counted and all of that else is what theory classroom I saw the numbers I knew how to what whether fabulous that's the best three years ago so we did we did add teaches the past year especially well very concerned about you know so you know Senator John sit up here or make the laws now the classes should be so he makes it a point to extend it's important because talk about but if you never and it's disappearance night it's not something I like so we're not talking about kids in the ideal world we could expand everything to have all classes down we know the state active state involved as we go through this process to decide what our options are really appreciated we are going to move
097on to the rest of our agenda which includes very encouraging now budget and we love daddy state but these understands been here I know for two hours how are you yeah