1.29.26 Board Work Session

001Way too many wrestlers. Okay. Um good evening all. Um it is 6:30. So we will call to order um the this uh work session, this joint work session with the SILA school district uh board of directors as well as the um Scula Valley Valley Charter School Board of Directors. Um, uh, welcome to the public and, um, everybody that is that is joining us. Our mission statement, motivating and preparing all students to reach their greatest potential. And for anybody that re-watches this on YouTube later, it is January 29th, 2026, uh, 6:30 p.m. Uh, we will begin with attendance. Um, attendance of of the SU Law Board. Uh, Debbie, please. >> Chair Lacatur, >> present. >> Vice Chair Milenberger, >> present. Director Plet >> present. >> Director Cole >> present. >> Director Habberly >> present. >> Director

002Posegate >> present. >> Director Pimlock >> present. >> Excellent. Thank you. Um and uh uh just for anybody looking on YouTube, uh Director Plet is joining us via Zoom. Um uh also I'm not sick currently, y'all. I was and then I was hollering at wrestling tournaments. So that's why I sound the way I sound. So once it gets a little drier and I have to really project, I'm not yelling, I'm just projecting. So there's there's my disclosure. Um uh we'll we'll move on to the pledge of allegiance. And Chuck, would you join uh lead lead us in that please? Thank you. Um, also, uh, just, uh, real quick note, um, around the table we have CC and Lisa and Chuck and Jennifer and Kay and Lindsay and Heather. Uh and then joining us via Zoom,

003uh we have Michael Wilfong from OD, uh Matthew Lowe, uh which is uh legal counsel for for SVCS, John Bullock, who is a uh a consultant with SVCS, and Richard Con Lee, who is uh legal for uh 97J. So, uh going to 1.5, the approval of our agenda. Superintendent, please. >> Okay. Um item uh 0229261.5 approval agenda. Uh superintendent recommends approval of the agenda as presented. >> Excellent. Directors, any questions on on the agenda? Nope. Then a motion to approve it would be accepted. Well, I guess I can't accept it. Hopefully somebody would second it. Tom, >> be it resolved that the Sla School Board District Board of Directors approve the agenda for this work session as presented. Resolution number 012926-1.5 approve agenda. >> Second >> resolution 012926-1.5 approve agenda. Motion made by Director Posegate,

004seconded by Director Cole. Uh any any discussion on the motion? Those in favor? All right. Okay. So, um and we look at that agenda item and well, couple couple of quick housekeepings. Uh we have uh microphones around and so so so that it's recorded properly for YouTube and those watching on YouTube can hear. Uh if your green lights on that means your your your mic is live. Uh and then also try to keep only two or max three of them on at a time otherwise we get feedback. Is that right? Okay. Um, so mind the microphone and then, you know, just to uh broaden here. I'm grateful for the opportunity to sit down together and and just get our our clarifications regarding sped. Um, so that I think we're all much more on the same

005page than than I think is recognized or maybe not recognized. That's not the way to say that. Um but the opportunity to sit down and and define it all and and look each other eye to eye and be get on the same page I think is great. So then uh uh motion not motion but movement can be can be made forward and and uh where the district can assist with that will that's that's where we'll rock and roll. So, the charter school discussion contract clarifications and special educating special education. Um, there's a comma there, but I'll throw in regarding. So, um, now seeing as I sound the way I sound, I'll I'll stop talking to some degree. Um, I know one thing we Well, also just as a clarification, one thing we are not doing,

006um, you know, if I I did hear I had a I had somebody ask me when I was walking through Fred Meyer if we are renegotiating the charter school contract. That is not why we're here. Um, so YouTube land that is not why we're here. Uh, we >> have director Lacitar. I was also stopped by someone at Fred Meyer today. Really? >> So, >> what were they wearing? >> I I don't remember. >> Okay. is a hot spot today. >> Yeah, there you go. There you go. Which is why I normally just drop my head and walk fast. Um so, uh so as far as this, this is not a contract renegotiated at all. Um you know, we we we have discussed a bit of an addendum to better clarify what sped looks like, but

007other than that, the contract is the contract. So So to Fano, that means what's what's their name? I did not catch their name, but to Fano who who was asking me at Fred Meyer contract is not being renegotiated. It is simply being discussed. Okay. So, I don't know where to go from here. >> He's going to hand his mic. >> Oh, you you got your >> I again I again I I think we've got a pretty good clarification on what responsibilities are. Again, is that we're looking at really bumping the ADMW to 90%. Um and then uh again it's I think there's some again again a sped person of uh at least 0.5 FTE and then some aid level support undetermined. Again that would be at the discretion of the charter school that what are

008we doing? What do you got happening there? Oh, okay. >> Dude, dude, it's it's it would have been way cooler to go over the table Dukes of Hazard style, man. >> I didn't mean to interrupt. >> No, no, it's it's okay. Again, I'm I'm I'm used to curveballs, but that's the first time somebody's gone under the table on me. Um, >> we build a lot of forts at my house. >> Yeah. >> Andy feels like he's back in the classroom. Yeah. >> Young man, sit down. >> Yeah. you're seeing. >> Yeah. >> So again, I think again I think that's really we got need to get down and determine to because that's kind of the heart of who's covering responsibilities and this allows the charter school to hire somebody within their own ranks that's on

009their building on their campus that knows the rhythm of their schools and their building. Um again all the primary oversight comes from Mrs. Uts and the district psychologist. Um >> and and so with that primary oversight that is that's IEP meetings that's child fine child is what it's called >> fine testing re-evaluation case review Lisa you want to go ahead >> I think I got it >> yes >> um so my job as a supervisor for compliance when OD comes knocking and asks me to pull files and verify that our IEP case managers are running IEPs and are writing IEPs compliantly with the law. There's an annual monitoring process um for the actual facilitation of IEP meetings. I don't know that I would be the one to sit in on an IEP meeting necessarily as

010the director of special programs. It would be the spedc case manager teacher. That's that's kind of how it runs in all the buildings, right? So my envisionment here is that this is much like any of our sped teachers in any one of our buildings. I don't go in and micromanage, you know, their daily rounds, nor would I do the same with the charter school. So the compliance part of it isn't like an ongoing I'm in charge of everybody's IEP. 200 IEPs would be way too many for me to handle. >> Sure. Um, say that title again of of the who who it is at at the building >> special education teacher or case manager. They're the certified sped teachers. The teachers that we hire, >> they are essentially a teacher in our district. They have

011a special endorsement for special education and their duties are to provide instruction and also to case manage the IEPs to write the paperwork to prepare the data collection and the assessments around what drives an IEP because an IEP is driven by the data collected on student progress. Right. So, does that clarify a little bit more about the compliance? >> A sped teacher can be a case manager, but a case manager is a case manager only. No, >> they're they're both >> we use the term sped teacher and case manager interchangeably. >> Oh, that makes it super clear. >> Well, yeah. Again, it's the it's the same job, two names. >> Yeah. Just because of it's one person. >> It's one person. And again, >> if anybody's looking for a contractor/carpenter, >> there you go. >>

012Yeah. Yeah. >> Duties as assigned. Right. >> Right. >> Okay. >> Yes. Yeah. >> Um, as far as what the school psychologist does, the child find portion where if there is a referral for evaluation, she and I talk about the the response um because not every referral for evaluation goes through a full evaluation. There is time for a review of the file and the data um and to look at, you know, whether this would ultimately qualify. And if there are questions, then yes, we move forward with an evaluation. If it looks like a kid is pretty much a grade level and the questions are are fairly minimal and that maybe just some add additional accommodations or something like that might be what the kid needs, then we might recommend looking at other um plans like

013a 504 plan or just some some universal accommodations in the classroom. So the school psych and I do combine efforts on the referral and evaluation piece. So find it's child find is what the legal name is, but it's essentially any student who resides in our district. We as a district are responsible for answering the call when a referral is made for special education. >> Sure. And then that comes down to a case by case. >> Yep. >> Because not every >> once the evaluations are identified because so sorry to go into details. There are multiple different categories of eligibility for special education and each one has a different lay uh uh requirement for what you evaluate. So the state has different sets of testing requirements for each one. So for example, if you're uh suspected

014as having a specific learning disability, you might be tested in one way. If it's for autism spectrum disorder, you might have a different set of evaluations. So that also goes into the the pre-planning and the the looking at everything. Um and then once once the evaluations are decided upon for that specific kid, the evaluations take place. Then a meeting is held with a team to determine whether or not that team feels that that student is eligible. If eligibility is decided, then an IEP is written, then it's in the paint, and you move forward on an annual or whenever needed meeting basis. >> Okay. And I think the the other part again that kind of gets confused in the discussion is that again IEP services are a continuum and the vast majority of special ed students

015spend their entire day in the regular classroom with minor accommodations and what's done there um again in terms of again exercises and small groupoup instruction is done with all students all the time anyways. And so when you go into a regular classroom, you do not see a distinction between who has an IEP and who doesn't. And that's really what this is kind of focused on is making that transition as seamless as possible to integrate within the flow of the general workday. And so again, the like running spec numbers on like between 50 and 55 potential charter school students at 90% this provides an extra $102,000 of revenue. Right? So that that >> at the ADM of 90% over 80% which is the current contracted rate. And so yeah, this I think it also provides an

016opportunity because looking at how long students go in the system of needing again regular instruction to show that instruction, you know, lack of instruction is not the deficiency that caused them to be behind that they truly have a learning disability. Is that as this as this growth builds again, it you have the special ed teacher who again may only have, you know, a 50% case load or 50% workload. This is again this can become the person that you fill out the rest of their work assignment again with general education duties and they become your reading interventionists and they become your math interventionist and so um again this there's dual duty there's dual purpose here um that creates a more seamless integration in the day for special ed students. So, if I'm understanding, you're saying that

017um scaling it down to the charter size that just making sure somebody on staff has the special ed certification and is going to be doing this work, it doesn't have to be that doesn't have to be >> all the all they do. They can also >> be the recess helper. What? Yeah, like you you said better things to me, but okay, that makes a lot of sense to me. >> But again, that again our again our special ed teachers do a lot of other duties in the regular classroom as well. And so they're working with the gened teachers so that they can implement the plans of the IEP and then show them how that is applied to all students in every setting >> and just like looking out for those kids and making sure that

018they're they're getting what they need. Right. >> Yeah. And again, but so much of what is good for a kid on an IEP is good for every kid. And so that's again that's kind of how again we negotiated the the the concept again it's kind of a hybridized model of responsibility. Um again, and so again, like having having a a sped person on campus that is an employee of the charter school again helps with again integration and services instead of having somebody come out that is always an outside visitor to the classroom, outside visitor to administration, outside visitor to the students. >> Um again is what really kind of helps kids get along. >> Excellent. Jennifer, please. What? Yeah. Yeah. go with what you have there or just kind of do a hybrid. >> Uh

019a hybrid. We were just talking now. Um I think what we're talking about generally sounds good. I do want to go back and visit just one piece of the funding, but we can talk some more about the special ed teacher and special ed services first and we can do it in reverse order and go back. >> As long as when we're talking about the funding, we have three pages of charts that >> that we have to jump from page one to page 3.5 to follow. As long as that's how we discuss funding, I'm good to go. >> Okay. Well, first of all, I'll go back. We'll start with this and then I'll go backwards to funding. But I do think what you're talking about makes a lot of sense and we've talked about how it's

020just again doing things like you're doing in all the other schools. I think where it becomes just where we want to make sure we have clarification on when it goes beyond those general classroom accommodations. And so in coming forward with our original addendum, we included some specificity as far as responsibility and who's paying for certain things in a spreadsheet. And I did that kind of based on Andy's and my emails back and forth where we went back and forth to delineate some of those things. And uh there were a couple other clarifying points in our original addendum that we wanted to make we sure we include also. So what I would love to propose is for sure the addendum piece could be the funding element that we've talked about here and then perhaps a memorandum

021of understanding where we could fully lay out more specifically what some of the responsibilities would be just so there's not any um miscommunication or things that aren't clear. And we did line out those things. I've got it in a spreadsheet here. I could pass that out as an example. Um, the other parts that we thought were pretty important were, let me find my notes here. There were three sections in our original um, we've had Andy's original addendum, then we commented on it and made some additional red lines and additions, and then it came back to us kind of trimmed down this afternoon at 3:30. So, we haven't actually gotten to work all the way through all those negotiations over those things, but we're we're very close. It's not that we're not. I just want to

022clarify a few things. There were um three elements that we definitely wanted to include in some sort of a memorandum of understanding. So one was the district and WCA acknowledge and understand that delivery of special education and related services to eligible students enrolled at WCA is being done through a hybrid model whereby WCA has agreed to employ a special education teacher with additional district funding to perform special education services in a manner consistent with the delivery of such services by district employed special education teachers at district schools. So that was one that we thought was important to put in a memorandum. Uh, number two was the um exhibit which we talked about and I can hand that out that gives Okay, sorry. The exhibit that I uh have that I can hand out that shows

023the different services and what Andy and I talked about for who provides them and who funds them. And then the third piece was this number four on our red line addendum. Pursuant to state and federal law, the district is the local education agency, the LEA, under the individuals with disabilities in education act, idea, and is responsible uh for providing a free appropriate public education for purposes of delivery of special education and related services pursuant to the IDEIDA. WCA will support the district as the LEA and otherwise deliver those special education and related services to eligible students enrolled in WCA as described in this addendum. So we thought those three elements that had been removed from the version we got this afternoon were important to include and it wouldn't have to be in the addendum itself

024and perhaps that piece of it could be a memorandum of understanding or something just so it's in writing. I think our goal is to make sure nothing's missed and nothing's misunderstood and that the special ed students and their families are served the best we can by being very very thorough. Um because it's so easy. You know, you've never worked with the charter school before. We've never worked with the school district before. And so there's just a lot of things that we need to make sure are very very clear. >> So again, part of the reason I again I redlined some of those out was that those pieces are already covered in the current contract. Again, we talk about um item 13 within article 8. Um again, we talk about Whitmore Classical Academy will cooperate with

025district procedures regarding IDEIDA and 504 compliance. Procedural compliance reviews uh practices will occur quarterly. We have this will include IEP 504 participation in district special education improvement plans adherence to all documentation requirements under Oregon legal statutes under federal uh and Oregon special education. each district has a legal duty for the guidelines for IEP and 504 procedures and documentation for all resident children who have disability and need sources. >> So, sorry to interrupt there, Andy. So then so if if that is clarified in another point of the contract, would it would it make sense then in this addendum to buy I think you said something 13 >> like reference like in in this addendum that we're we're for lack of a better term here in this addendum that we're word smithing >> does it make sense

026to reference that specific part of of the contract? Yeah, we can't because we have again we have child find in item 12. We have uh compliance in article 13. We have district psych who again does eval in 17. Um we have again well academy will comply with all district polic regarding special education procedures discipline for students in one. We've got IEP compliance in two. Uh we've got appropriate placement um for least restrictive environment in three. Um so again, we can just again we're in essence restating in the MOU where the reference points are. Um >> yeah, I think the the parts that were significant to us as we've really delved into this over the last several weeks is the the really clear understanding that um services are expect this is a mutual understanding services are

027expected to be performed um at our school as they're performed in other district schools. I just think we don't really state that outright anywhere. I think that would be helpful just to have that outright stated for clear understanding. I do think the specified index of services and who's responsible for them would be helpful. And the other piece that I think would be really important to spell out is that the district is the LEA, the local education agency, because there have been over the last several weeks some misunderstanding about that. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Well, I think again if we get bullet point six, that would cover most of the what's in the addendum. The district has the discretion to determine which specialized programs that are not duplication of services with the possible expression of seat

028service will be offered on site at at what class college site. WCA is responsible for implementing the directives outlined in students IEP or 504 that constitutes accommodations, modifications, specially d instruction made within the general education curriculum and classroom district is responsible for ensuring compliance with provision of special education and related service to any WCA student uh pursuant to an IEP or 504 WCA. I mean, that loops back into everything we just talked about. Tom, >> um, one of the things you said was, um, services will provided I'm sorry, I don't have the document. Um, >> we could hand that out. >> services the same as the other schools. That would be great, actually. >> Yeah. >> Yep. >> So, the first docu, >> thank you, Lindsay. is so we had Andy's original addendum and then

029this is his original addendum with our additions and some red line suggestions but you can see where those changes are and then I also have a copy of the addendum we received this afternoon you all have that you didn't get it from the superintendent >> yeah that one that one I will say I haven't checked email >> okay this came from your uh legal counsel and it's a change it's a whole it's a very modified addendum >> okay two pages. >> Yes. >> Um, okay. So, this one that uh Jennifer, this one is Can you tell me what that is? I'm just going to write it on the top so I can >> I've had to do that, too. Uh, it is actually what Andy originally sent to us, but then we took it and

030where you see the lines drawn through and >> those changes are our changes. >> Okay. So, you this you last touched this document. >> We last touched that document originally came from Andy and then this item that re we re received at 2:30 today um is the updated addendum that's coming from you from your district to us. >> Okay. And and this one with the red is newer is newer than the one with the blue. >> Correct. It came at 2:30 this afternoon. So I've had spent a whole lot of time on it either. >> I've been cleaning up vomit since 2:30 this afternoon. So I'm with you. >> Yeah. I can give you more details if you want. >> We're good. >> Okay. So, this is not since this is not a radio broadcast,

031we're all fine with a little bit of dead air as I uh as as we read through some of these addendums that just landed in front of us. Um, >> so enjoy the dead air. >> If it helps on the second page of the one that was from us, the one that's kind of looks small. >> I couldn't get it to have the tracking and fill the page. So, I apologize. So the parts that we we would love to put into into some sort of a memorandum of understanding would be number one, number four, number one and number four. But part of number one is the um detailed appendix that you'll see attached at the end which I have here. And that came directly from Andy and I going back and forth clarifying in emails.

032I do. Maybe not >> this one. >> Yes. Okay. So, you can see the major change that happened between our last version and what we received at 2:30 today is the new version received at 2:30 today is just the funding. It doesn't talk about any of the other pieces, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. It's just I'm clarifying for you at this moment what the distin distinctions are. >> Again, if we take the table and merge that with the funding piece, I think that that clarifies and lines up. And then if people want to go back through and put the point specific pieces from the contract language that already exists, that would cover it. Um, the yellow item says preparation of IEP documents, IDA explosures, documentation. That would be the labor of the on-site case

033manager. >> Okay, that was a question. >> That's where again that additional 10% that's the labor of that cost. >> Wait, time out. >> Yeah. >> Did y'all notice what just happened? There was a question that had got a definitive answer. >> Yes. >> Progress. >> This one. >> So, yeah. So again, labor labor of the on-site teacher, right? That's what's being that's really what's being funded by this additional 10%. >> But there's three question marks and they are now checked off. >> And the other two highlighted at the top of the list, I put highlighted because I modified them from what Andy and I had said in our email, so I didn't want to modify it without addressing it. Um, we did not talk about life skills placement and services although it's been understood

034that that would occur at the district level but I again you don't want to assume anything >> are they >> they would be served at the district level. Yes. But I just >> so so those two categories those line up. Yeah, they do because again that is one of those pieces that really again avoiding a duplication of services. If there were to be a life skills or a high-cost disability placement at WCA, it might be for like one student. Again, we're recreating an entire program when we have that facility here. And if that student is from outside of the bounds of the district, the responsibility for that cost is the resident district that they came from. >> Right. >> I'm not sure that part's accurate, though. I've heard I've had people tell me that's not

035accurate. That we accept the students regardless of their disability. >> We accept them regardless of their disability, but the cost for the services is born upon the resident district >> because CC is going to send them an invoice. >> Lisa, please. finer point of special education law that I just want to clarify. A placement is not made by a team of people sitting around in a schoolboard room. A placement is made by an IEP team. >> Correct. >> So the reality is the services required for a student in a life skills placement are fairly intense usually typically but not always. So yes, for the most part, I just want to be really clear, for the most part, I would agree that this kind of thing would be borne by our our programs and that the

036IEP team will probably sit around the table and say, "Wow, um the sensory needs, the the um amount of specialized equipment or what have you, the inclusionary practices of being able to go out into classes with the support of another person, that really would be better met in the programs in the district buildings. I could see an IEP team making that decision. But on the off chance that you do have a student who might quote unquote qualify under many circumstances or different people's, you know, eye test on where they should be placed, they may do just fine in a regular ed classroom or in a regular classroom at the charter school as well. So, I don't want to I don't want to dismiss the ability for a student who has life skills needs, quote unquote.

037I mean, you you can't ever put a a complete um period on it. It's the IEP team that makes that decision. >> And and this may be the simplest distillation of how the IEP comes to that decision is that is there a resident program that could meet these needs. If the resident diff doesn't have that needs, do they have a relationship with their ESD for their program? Now, if those two if one of those two contessions is met, the follow-up question, again, having been in these meetings before, is why are we going to put a kid on a bus for an hour and a half round trip every day to get the same services here that they would get in their resident district? And the answer is putting a kid on a bus for an

038hour and a half every day is not to their benefit. They should stay in their resident district. That's where the IP team makes the placement. That's again in simplest term that's what it boils down to is that we're looking to do what's best for the kid. And so having having a duplicate service that is 45 minutes or an hour away is not to the benefit of the child. >> Um can I ask a question? Um >> sure. If I remember correctly, um, kids from the same family, um, is it right that they can bypass the light the lottery? Like if if an oldest child gets into the charter school, then their youngest sibling will have more preferential placement. >> Not necessarily a bypass, but if you pick the first kid, the other two come along,

039right? We do, again, we do the exact same thing with interd district transfers, both in and out. >> Okay? Again, we don't we don't go, "Hey, your third grader can come, but your ninth grader can't." Right? >> Once we take the third grader, we take the ninth grader, right? So, we take everybody and we we accept and re release in family blocks and we count that as a one transfer. >> Their their lottery process is the same. >> The first time that they pull a student from a family and they go, "Oh, this kid has a sibling that comes through and fills in essence two spots." >> Right. Right. In in this context, if we came across a family where one of the students was struggling um or what so we're talking about if there's

040a student that comes along that has high disability >> high cost disability and um is it do we do we need to decide now or can we take it by case by case? We they apply for our lottery without any special needs identified. They are accepted into our school without any needs identified. If there's enough Yeah. Other And if there's seats for them, they're in our school. If we have too many seats, we do the lottery. But everyone's treated equally in our lottery process. Then when they're students of Wentworth Classical Academy, if they're special education students, they're special education students of Susawa School District. >> Okay. So, >> and what would then happen if that kid goes through the IEP team placement >> to see what >> to see where they best fit. And again,

041if it's a kid that is going to be put on a bus for an hour and a half, two hours every day, this may not be the best place for them to be simply because it's a duplication of services. They have two other options in their resident district. Why are we then again putting this kid on the bus that may cause >> This is Rich Conley, a district council. I just want to insert just another nuance here and I know this is frankly um something that can get a little confusing. So typically with charter schools and charters that have a lottery, you do have families that would apply to a lottery. Uh including a scenario where you have a student with a sibling already uh admitted and attending the charter. However, as multiple people have

042already spoken up, there's that initial layer. So, someone's uh initially accepted, I'll I'll use that term, they're accepted to the charter school, but whether or not they're actually enrolled and will be attending the charter school, that is up to the IEP team. So, typically you would have a family um get on the lottery. Let's say they get accepted on the lottery. And typically within a reasonable period of time, I mean, I'd say 10 school days, a couple of weeks, you would want to have that initial IEP meeting where the IEP team, including members of um WCA and the district, would convene and look at that student's IEP to determine whether or not that IEP can be implemented at the charter school. If in a scenario where the team determined it could not be implemented, then

043essentially federal law would trump kind of charter choice and then the team would have to decide what level of placement supports does the student need and does that drive a decision to have the student attend elsewhere. So, I just wanted to make sure that nuance was on everybody's radar. >> No, thank you, Rich. >> Thanks, Rich. So, if I if I could finish what I what I'm sorry I'm I'm meandering a bit, but what I was asking about if say say a family had a a their oldest kid was at your school and then a younger kid came up and then it was determined that they would not be a good placement. Um, and maybe this doesn't have to be policy, but like do do the parents get to then just force it through or

044>> No, it's it's a team of the it's the IP team decision. >> Okay, great. I just want to make sure I fully understand. Okay. >> And and really, I mean, this this addendum, >> there's no way that we can we can't take those those rarities and those exceptions to form the rule. It's the general that forms the rule >> and then >> it's the IEP teams that that >> well you have the nuance >> that yes that yes as Rich was just explaining and I think I think we're all understanding the same thing right like >> okay I'll take head nods as as correct you got another one that's kept off that's two steps forward >> hey how's the song go >> about to take one step back >> okay >> same verse same

045as the first Oh, >> so I guess just coming back around, I still I think we are on the same page. I just like to have things in writing and I think a memorandum of understanding identifying those things clearly doesn't hurt because also the face of our board will change, the face of your board will change and the more that we have in writing and clear, it's just a good thing. It's not meant to be um prohibitive or anything like that. the >> we have a process that will be consistent >> no matter if the sorry >> thanks Tom. >> Yeah. >> So the idea is so that we have a process that's consistent as people change as Jennifer was saying whether it's either board or IEP team or whatever the case might be. We

046just want to see that that process is identified so that we all know what's expected and we deliver to the benefit of the child. >> Yeah. >> And again, I think again like statistically we're talking about 2.5% of the overall population. So again, this is going to be potentially one kid where a decision is made by an IEP team that may not land them in the formal enrollment. They may have been accepted. I team makes a placement decision and that may that may lead them to not being enrolled there because their best placement is in their home district. >> if that's in their best interest, right? And that's again but again avoiding duplication of services then they might wind up being placed in cycas or middle because that's where again the best service is right.

047So that's yeah I mean I again I think we take this table and merge it with the funding piece and we eliminate the need for anou because this is again kind of the linear function of task bytask delineation >> and I think miss Wagner said that I don't want to speak for >> Wagner. Wow. >> I I I think you indicated that would be agreeable right the chart was was good. >> Yeah. >> Oh my gosh. Just keep checking off this stuff. It was great. Boom. Love getting things done. Okay. Um, yeah. So, so Andy, as you as you looked more through this, you know, not just contra concentrating on those on those yellows and and uh um to CeCe and to Lisa also and the rest of our board here. Um, as as we

048see, here's the sped service, here's the responsibility, >> right? >> I I'm seeing that all of these balance out the way that they're supposed to be. Um, I don't see anything that's really jumping out at me as >> well. And again, I think they mirror the primary they mirror the primary languages in the contract. >> Yeah. >> And the and the addendum covers the funding piece. And and again, in simplifying it, I again took off a lot of again the initial restrictions or conditions about, you know, full-time equivalent for positions. Um again, so again like but again looking at what would be what would probably be required by the case load based upon general enrollment size. Um it's probably going to take at least a half-time person. Hiring somebody less than halfime is going to

049be extremely difficult for any entity. But again, if the charter school can take that halftime sped person and then use the rest of that position to fill out and use that person for reading intervention, math intervention, that student can that person can be used in general ed and special ed. We do that all the time with our >> Can I can I just clarify? Do we have an understanding that the additional language that is recommended as a memorandum of understanding will be included? Is that what we reached? >> Well, the I again I think no the language is to include this table because that's what delineates >> asking for the table for sure. I I just like those two other parts in there about the LEA. I can let it I could let that go.

050Um but I like the the clear explanation that the Let me find it. Sorry. I have too many papers. >> Well, well, let's let's let's discuss those other two briefly. Okay. >> Um, so, so, so Diana, I think let's let's verify what you what you were just bringing up. So, >> we're talking about, >> well, let's let's let's put a punctuation mark on on this table. Are is we're all good with with including this table that is the service and the responsible party. Yeah. >> I'm a page and a half and that would be attached to you said the funding page. >> Yes. We just make that a continuation of exhibit D. >> Okay. So, so >> Mhm. >> We're all copathetic with that. >> That's good. The two the two Okay. The two other

051items that were important to the board really as we >> feeling my punctuation. >> I thought we' moved on that. We're all good >> with that. Sorry. >> We like this chart as as a continuation of exhibit D. Right. >> No punctuation. >> I think he's just asking if everybody agrees to include it. Okay. Okay. Okay. >> You don't need to pretend. >> Jennifer, now now go back to uh one choose one of your other two your other two points there so that we can get that all at >> Yes. Um, number one on this page, the blue page. Yes, I would like to include that. >> Just I'll read this. >> Oh, >> all the without my microphone and nobody hollered at me. Um so so real quick uh point number one um uh

052on the original proposed addendum. No, this this was the this was the addendum version two says the district and WCA acknowledge and understand that delivery of special education and related services to eligible students enrolled at WCA is being done through a hybrid model whereby WCA has agreed to employ a special education teacher with additional district funding to perform special education services in a manner consistent with the delivery of such services by district employed special education teachers at district schools uh for for purposes of clarification. Exhibit one to this addendum sets forth the specific responsibility for services and which party is responsible. That's the chart we just discussed. Uh WCA and the district acknowledge that the items listed in exhibit one may not be an exhaustive list. Okay. Yeah, that's that's defining that. Well, I'll finish

053it. WCA and the district agree to collaborate in good faith to allocate responsibility for delivery of special education and related services and payment therefore to ensure that the party responsible for delivery of such services is compensated from the state school fund for those services it is required to deliver. So that's what we're discussing. Um that so those second those the second and third paragraph I think we've we've answered that by including that chart as as a continuation of exhibit D in this addendum. We agree with that that two and three are are are satisfied these the second and third paragraph of item one. >> Yes. And then I would like number four. >> Okay. I just wasn't sure. I didn't know if you were like ending the discussion. I >> No, no, no. That's that's

054when I smacked this thing that part. >> Yeah. >> Yes. >> Um Okay. So to that to that first paragraph um to me as I as I read through it, it just brought to um that to me and I'm I I want everybody else's opinions, but to me that kind of sounds like a duplication of of what the addendum states and and what other parts of the contract state. But I I feel free to, you know, feel free to correct me here. >> I to me it looks like we're just putting Well, that first section just looks like we're just putting in writing that what we're talking about right now. >> Yeah. >> Um >> but do you think it's in writing other places already? Meaning in the contract? >> It it is, but I

055think maybe because there's a lot coupled with the other language. This just makes it clear and in one place. I think that's what >> direct to the point. >> That's what we're >> moving on. Okay. Uh Lisa, >> uh turn your mic on. Thank you. >> I just want to clarify what you were just talking about. Moving on from his number four, the LEA conversation. >> Yeah, we're not we're not there yet. >> Still on number Yes. Yes. Still on number one. We'll we'll move to number four. >> Both. I was moving on. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Um, yell just moving too fast for my brain. >> So, so, um, well, Andy, let me, let me ask your thoughts. Is that that little what three sentence paragraph is that is that >> as long as

056we as long as we punctuate it with the points in the contract that already exist? Because again, on its own, it makes it seem like that that's not in the contract now. And I want to make sure that it is. So by punctuate with points in the contract just right down here paragraphically >> we're gonna say section 8 um section 8 G admission three again or a and those points that speak to again the responsibility and acknowledgement of whose responsibilities are because they're already stated in the main body of the contract >> and and that and that's good to it will clarify the contract and direct you to the contract. So it's appropriate to put those in. So, so we have a little bullet point, a little parenthetical footnote of >> the parts of the

057contract that this spec that that you can get into the nitty-gritty about this statement. >> Correct. Yeah. Again, it just provides a reference back to the main body. >> Mor, what do you think? >> Thumbs up for M. That's another step forward. >> Um, the last the just the last paragraph. Um, wait, are you jumping to number >> of number one? The last It's the three. There's three characters through already covered. It's just this one that we're >> Yeah. Oh, but he read all three of these, >> right? But we just we So, we're only talking about one. The first paragraph are already clarified with the chart. >> Okay. >> No, I thought you talking about the three paragraphs and number one. Yes, but the second and third paragraph are already satisfied by including that

058chart in exhibit D, >> the one that we were talking about. >> Okay. So, we're crossing off. >> That's fine. >> Cross off paragraph two and three. We're going to bullet point paragraph one >> item number one. >> And then we're skipping two and number two and number three and going for >> not yet. Well, >> it's just this one that we're talking about. Okay, great. >> Okay, >> paragraph two and three of number one. >> Paragraph one of number one to me reads like we are putting in writing the conversation that we've had so far tonight. So that seems agreeable also great shirt >> and then referenced >> at the end of that >> is already in the contract. >> Yes, >> but we're referencing. Yes. At the end of that, we will refer

059to the parts of the contract for the nitty-gritty details of that statement. >> Yes, the legal ease part. That's a great way to say that, Josh. Okay, number four. >> Lisa, you had some on four. So, so four is one of those I hope I don't muddy the waters, but it's one of those special education types of things that the LEA, the local education agency is the district as compared to the SEA, the state education agency, which is the state OD, right? There are there's the regional inclusive services. There is the ALSD, the LANSD. Where you will see this is on the IEP services summary page. So I want to clarify that just because the LEA is noted on the service summary page as being the the agency in charge of the services. You also

060on that page outline who will deliver those services. So even in the nitty-gritty of an IEP, you go a step further from LEA and you define it's the special education teacher, it's the SLP, it's, you know, whoever it is that's delivering those services. So it's still under the umbrella of the LEA, but I just wanted to clarify that. So when you look at an IEP, we know that based on this outline of services, when it defines that it's the special education teacher, that's the teacher in your building, right? when it's the speech language pathologist that's the district one that comes out and does the services redundant because we're including the table that has already delineated those items. >> Okay. I just wanted to clarify because I didn't want you to feel like you were all

061of a sudden looking at an IEP and going, "Well, wait a minute. The LEA is supposed to be responsible for that." But then you say that it's the sped teacher, so that's a So because the charter school will be part of the LEA, right? So we're all delivering the services together. >> And again, I think the point where I made a confused thing is again before is again >> for the function of the day-to-day piece with a sped teacher in the charter school, you function like an LEA. you're the direct delivery model for that kid every single day. And the legal responsibility and oversight is still with the district. >> And so again, you're not an LEA. We're not. We are the LEA. But again, >> you're a functional LEA for what happens in the

062building just like the elementary school is a fun. Yes. For that specific kid that day. So >> yeah, none of that changes our legal responsibility for child fine, compliance, oversight, monitoring, and again, making sure that those all those detail things are buttoned up on both sides of the equation. >> I didn't know if LEA clarified the costs, like if for example, if you had services through Laney SD as an example that were contracted services, that that made it clear that the district paid for those things. Right. But I guess we do that in the table here. >> Okay. >> And that and I think that that covers it >> because again out again we have regional inclusive services and a few other pieces that we have that again would come that again it's part of

063our service order. >> Right. >> Um and so again if we again if there's a here's where this would come into play. You have a child that is enrolled that becomes enrolled. It's a good placement and they need augmented communication. They need uh again they they they need a hearing aid set and the teacher needs to wear a microphone. That cost comes from us through the through lane. It's delivered on site there. That's the type of service we're talking about. >> That's what we want to clarify and say, right? >> And again, but that but again when we talk about again regional inclusive services district through lane >> that it's it's right there. >> Don't forget some of us haven't been working in education for 20 years. So I I always appreciate when you explain

064it further. >> Been 20 years. I'm on 32. >> Yeah. Okay. So, so what it sounds like is is that chart coupled with a couple of points in the in the contract that number four as far as defining who the LEA is is this this one would be Diana >> I I'm not sure that it's redundant. I think maintaining the language and directing it to the chart is more appropriate, especially for someone who doesn't understand all of that other stuff. >> We can put we can put the chart under under number four with some of the same bullet points because again, >> uh it's it's we're looping back to the main body of the contract. And that again, that's funny because there's not >> not even put the chart there. Just just make reference to

065the chart exhibit. We need the chart >> in exhibit D. >> Yes, we do. We need the chart. >> We wouldn't print it a second time. No, we would just say see exhibit D chart. >> So, so >> maintain it and just reference the chart. >> Okay, >> I think it would be helpful. >> Um, >> yeah, I'm fine with that. >> M maintain maintain and reference reference the chart and any potential um point of the contract just like we did with number one. Because I think again the one thing that we all need to be cautious of and concerned about is that whatever language changes we're making now wind up being the language in the contract for for 2030 for renewal. And if there is impass at renewal, whatever is negotiated today will roll

066forward from 2030 to 2035. >> Right. >> But but are we are we negotiating anything here? because it seems this is just structural. >> But again, I just want to make sure that we're not taking anything foundational. >> Yeah. >> Because again, this leaves us the opportunity for again when the charter school opens and is operational and has shown that there is some undue burden by the by by these terms that then we can come back to the table. If we're making preemptive changes about hypotheticals, we are going to make mistakes. But we do have experts >> uh microphone please. Thank you. >> Still didn't turn. >> We do have experts here to help guide us. >> Should we should we ask our experts? >> Experts. Anybody want to chime in? >> And when we're

067saying experts, so I can speak. So just for awareness, Mike Wilfong uh administrator of school finance, school facilities with department of education. I've worked with the state school fund for a number of years and have been asked from time to time to participate in board meetings and and discussions of charter schools and uh school districts when there's sometimes differences of opinion on uh interpretation of what the law says and and in actual practice. I think that um you know with I think what's what's going what's happening right here is I think that the the recognization of all the nuance uh that's that's you know the potential here. I think the superintendent identifying that you know that this is going to be a perfect document right off the the bat is correct in the sense that

068there will likely need to be discussions as far as what that looks like. I also think it's smart of the of the charter school to uh also have that in writing as I've seen this a lot in my time uh you know roughly 20 years working on this where school districts and the change of boards and change of superintendent and change of staff what have you that having that in writing is really going to be a key piece. So as far as where you're at right now what you're accepting and and and putting this in the addendum and what have you um I think it's really smart to have that well thought out. there's, you know, potentially some other things that I want to comment a little bit later. So, I'm going to pause here

069to make sure that there's not any other experts that I want to weigh in with their opinion. >> Anybody else? >> Hi. Um, this is Matt Low. I I'm I'm council for the charter school and I I don't want to take up a lot of time. Um, but when you're asking about this clarification, I think the reason it's necessary in this case is because you're doing this, you're employing a teacher through the charter school, that's typically not done throughout the state unless you're having a virtual school that takes over the entirety of of operating the sped program. So, that's why I do agree and echo what everybody's saying that by laying this out, it won't be a perfect document, but it'll go a long way for people to look at to say who's doing what,

070you know, and and clarifying that. So, I think you're going to be well served by that. So, I appreciate it. And I won't say much, >> Matt. Matt, I think uh I think Tom has a question for you. Director Posgate has a question for you. >> Well, but is that is that correct? Because he said we're we are employing a teacher through the charter school. Is that accurate or I was kind of understanding you guys would be hiring a teacher. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The the charter sorry the charter school Yeah. Yeah. Go ahead, Matt. >> No, I was just going to say the charter school will employ at least a.5 FTE special education teacher. Typically, and my with my other clients, I've been working with charter schools for 25 years around the state. It's

071a large part of my practice. Um, typically the district is employing them. Um, and then those those teachers come to the charter school or they make arrangements for how they deliver those services. U in some respects what you're doing I think could be very good like for what uh superintendent was saying about having that person on site I think there's a very there's a good value in that. I think it's it it really seems clever to me. Um that gives you guys the option to either like hire a retired person part-time or to have a teacher has multi-purposes which is a great way to use >> you got to think of this additional 10% of ADM is in essence it's pass through dollars. It's dollars that we would be spending otherwise, but we're giving the

072charter school the discretion to spend and hire and put this person in their specific environment on a daily basis, >> right? And I mean, specifically that the thing with charter schools that to my understanding is is, you know, some type of specialization. And so this way you you can get somebody who is >> loves classical education, you know, I think it's great. >> Okay. >> Hi everyone, this is this is Rich. I just kind of wanted to tie up things a little bit and just give a quick snapshot of kind of how we came to this. um you know over the last couple of weeks I've been in conversation with Matt as well as the district um in terms of uh where the folks were concerned and where we're heading here uh bringing things to

073a point in the last day or two you know uh we had received some uh more specific documents and proposals from the charter for some uh contract language or a uh modification to a contract addendum. Uh the district had initially expressed a willingness to bump up the pass through dollars from 80 to 90%. I think I'm reading the room. There's not a lot of controversy about that except as we'll probably get to. Um I think there is u some addendum language that the district uh would insist on having in there to clarify some ambi ambiguity that the 90% bump would be contingent on what we're talking about just now, which is the um charter actually uh employing the special education teacher and doing some of the other things that were outlined in the contract. Um,

074and with all due respect to everyone in the room, there are charters that do uh hire um special education staff. And just by way of background, all three of my kids have gone through charter schools. And uh u my partner, my law partner and my partner partner uh created a charter school in our resident district and there they did follow that model where um the charter school did actually employ special education teachers. Long story short, um we got these uh uh we reviewed these additional addendum requests from the charter. I did not believe as district council that they were necessary as I think um Andy has touched on. I believe the existing actual charter agreement has provisions that address this. I think the addition of that chart is fine. And I think also where I

075think we're heading is um having that chart plus some specific contract provision references in the addendum is acceptable. But I just would caution the district board that um you know when we are looking at a change in board when we are looking at kind of an institutional history of the negotiations it can actually be kind of confusing to have two separate documents. One is one a charter and then another either an addendum or um a memorandum of understanding. The problem is then the implication is that because you've added new language that somehow that supersedes or was necessary to augment the original intent of the contract. So I would just caution and I think you're all you're all huing that line masterfully here. But that's the potential for confusion is by having this external document and

076then you have parties, you know, down the road looking at both of those thinking, you know, what what what are these what are these folks intending at the time? So I I think we're heading in the right direction. And I think that um like I said um the district has some language in there in the addendum that it would want to clarify that the bump in the 90% was in fact contingent on the provision of services by the charter and we as opposed to just saying it's always going to be 90% even if somehow the charter decided well we don't want to hire people. So I think I just wanted to give you that quick historical snapshot of of how we got there today and and the conversations that have been happening even earlier today.

077And Jennifer, that's that's been your understanding toque, right? >> Correct. >> Yeah. And again, what that's become simplified down to is what's on um let's call it page three and it would be the of again what kind of the simplified draft and I guess it' be the one two be the first paragraph that came today >> that came today. Yeah. again because I again I've been gone conference last two days so I've been modifying things and trying to do things on the road and on the fly. >> Thank you. >> Um so again the conditional language is again when the conditions are met where a special education teacher and case manager of at least 0.5 FTE and an education aid are hired and employed is maintained to meet the accommodations that are legally required in

078an individual IEP or section 504 plan. the additional distribution of 10% in ADMW to reach a total of 80 90% will be dispersed across the year as defined in paragraph uh 8C2 again and I just put in the distribution table so it's not continued upon it following the year but again as soon as it's hired we engage at 90% the distribution across the year the July 15 payment is 16.7% then it's 8.3 till till exhaust in Yeah. >> Did we just skip over figuring out the number four? >> No. No. Again, really what again if you look at if you look at this piece, what will follow under this is number one, paragraph one with the bullet points. Then we will put number four with the bullet points. And then we will putart the table

079that chart underneath it. It's going to be one comprehensive document. We're not going to have two or three bits and pieces. We're just going to >> make one piece. Simple, clean. >> Yes. >> Right down the line. >> Does that sound right? >> So, I didn't Is there a decision on four or not? >> Uh, yes. do include it with a couple of bullet points afterwards referencing the the legal ease in the contract >> and and then after so 0.1 4 and then uh this chart >> will be will be added to what came in today. >> Yep. >> Um above above the signature boxes they are >> okay. So we so the the clarification that uh Richard was saying was that the the 90% >> ADMW is contingent on a special ed teacher or

080case manager being employed up to half time >> minimal minimum. And so if theoretically I'm not trying to like come up with every but like I'm just I'm trying to understand. So like theoretically if um and again we're trying to future proof this um if there was a year where there were just no special ed students um at Whitmore then um it would just be the regular rate that's in the >> No, we would keep it at 90%. Because the reality is there is going to be a special ed placement every single year. >> Okay. >> Right. Again, statistically we know our population is about 17% of special ed students. Charter schools some some run a little lower and some run a little higher. Again, there is going to be a kid that needs speech

081management. There is going to be a kid that needs differential placement. there's going to be a kid with again visual or heart appearing issues. Again, the saying that in a year that there are magically zero IEP students that we reduce it to to 80% is a huge step backwards. >> I mean, come on, Tom. Well, hey, >> I don't want to I don't want to dip in. >> Sure. >> Um I mean, the the kids the kids going into kindergarten this year were born during COVID lockdown, so >> it's a little bit spicy. C can I um on that same sentence paragraph, sorry, that we were just talking about, it says um when the conditions are met where a special education teacher and case manager and an education aid. >> Yes. >> Is that correct?

082So, >> and the and the level of FTE for the education aid is unspecified. >> Okay. >> That's at the discretion of the charter school. >> Okay. Perhaps for clarification, instead of an and amperand and just a slash. >> That's fine because again, we use the same language. >> Yeah. >> What what we're running into is the problem with having the same words defining the same or different words defining the same thing. >> You want me just part of the special educator is job case manager, right? Is that fine, Lisa, to just have it be? >> It's fine with me as long as the job description of the spe special education teacher includes the >> which is which we have. >> Exactly. >> I would say take it out. >> It's already in the job

083description that we sent as a sample. Yes. Again, >> scratch it. >> Case management doing IEP paper is >> the is the job description. It is a primary component. >> Nothing but progress. Nothing but progress. >> Yeah. >> Okay. I have one question. I'm out. We're We made so much progress. I'm about to just get done. >> This is This is the part I'm hoping maybe Michael can help us with. So, in or RS338.115, it says it talks about the funding and it says a school district shall contractually establish with any public charter school that is sponsored by the board and the school district payment or for provision of educational services to the public charter school students. The payment shall equal an amount per weighted average daily membership of the public charter school that is

084at least equal to then it's the 80% of the amount of the school district's general purpose grant. But in our contract and in the language of the addendum it talks about extended ADMW. So I think we have maybe something a miss. Michael, >> thanks Jennifer. Um so complete transparency. Jennifer uh pointed this out to me a little bit earlier today and I responded back and I said, "Well, here's the statute that reference references what the charter rate is." And the charter rate is the general purpose grant per ADMW. And again, as Jennifer identified, that's identified in OS 33815 sub 2. You'll see that there's two sections for both state sponsored and non-state sponsored schools and the rates, but it reference what it says is general purpose grant per ADMW. It does not say extended ADMW.

085The reason that we have the two different rates in the state school fund as well as in statute, we have what's called the general purpose grant per extended ADMW. And for those of you not familiar with the state school fund policies, extended ADMW represents where we take a look at either the current year or the prior year's ADMW and we take the larger of the two. So there's a two-year consideration in that process. And so the point being is if you're a district that has declining enrollment, you receive the benefit of the larger ADMW from prior year is what we pay pay on that. The reason we do that is it helps with smoothing for districts that are losing students and sometimes there's just eb and flow that happens. It also helps with smoothing year-to-year

086with funding. The chart the reason that we that we uh speak to the ADMW only and not extended ADMW in the in the charter school rate is because charter schools tend to be paid on the current year's ADMW. is typically not taken into consideration the two years the current and the prior year. So if you're saying general purpose grant per extended ADMW is the charter rate then the question would be is the charter school receiving the benefit of in the consideration of of of both ADMW current or prior when you're doing the reconciliation of your payments. And I know it's getting a little little technical. I can appreciate that. But I think that's a very it's a very important point in which I think that's most often times overlooked because school districts often times will

087tell me that we're not receiving the charter rate funding. We're receiving the general purpose grant per extended ADMW. The reason that the a the charter rate sometimes is larger is because that is a declining enrollment district where they're taking the prior year. In essence, and here's just simple math, you're taking the general purpose grant and dividing it by fewer shares. Okay, the current years and which is again it's less. So by dividing it by fewer shares, the amount per share will be larger. Whereas in the general purpose grant per extended A&W, you're dividing that same general purpose grant the denominator by more the the denominator. And so the amount per share will be less. In some instances, that can be upwards of 500 and sometimes over $1,000 the difference. And so it does matter. That

088charter rate really does matter in how you're how you're going about as far as what rate you're using. The other piece that really becomes critical is how we manage the state school fund where in some instances the charter school is paid for it. They at the first May they're done. They there isn't any reconciliation. in some districts, uh, they they take consideration and they do a reconciliation using the second May May reconciliation. So again, I don't know that I've seen that practice, how that's going to shake out. I can certainly help advise as to what most school districts do with charter schools. The the reason that this is important is because in how we manage the state school fund, we tend to have positive cash flow in that second reconciliation. And we do that for

089a variety of reasons, but typically that those rates are larger than where we left it in the first May. And that's by design. So I just want to say that for the record, for everybody's consideration that how you go about that reconciliation, the consideration of of the charter and the ADMW, the rates that you're using, I think that's all very important to understand because it really does uh amount to a fair amount of money uh in the end. If you're, you know, again, I've I've I can't tell you how many school districts I've talked to that said we're using the charter rate. It says right here and then we reviewed their charter agreement and it what they're doing in practice and what their agreement says are not the same. And so there's this reconciliation and

090of course there's discussions between the charter school and the dis district. So, I think it's a really important piece that everyone understands and that there's consistent understanding what what it is that you're saying in your charter agreement, what it says in the statute and what that means and the differences in those rates in the state school fund. Hopefully, that was helpful. >> That was a lot of words. >> What Michael, what it sounds like to me is the state school fund needs to fix their system. >> Okay. I'm glad I'm glad I can see you on Zoom chuckling. >> Yeah. >> So, >> um that Tom Well Tam um >> I just want to >> Hold up. Okay. Okay. So, um Tamara's question, what did it say in the contract? Are we are are we

091per that extended or are we going per that statute that Jennifer just read? Doesn't your addendum say the general purpose grant for ADMW? >> Uh point point to me where you're seeing that. Um >> isn't it at the top? >> So again, looking at our state assessment again, the general purpose grant per extended ADMW for this year is $11,126. The charter school rate as defined in OS 338 is $11,126. They're the same value for us. >> Can I can I I just want to make sure I understand cuz >> whoever said that was a lot of words. I agree. Um so what you're what Mike is saying Michael was saying sorry let me let me see if I got you before we call on you. They're saying that there's the rate and then there's the

092extended rate. The extended rate takes a two-year snapshot to give you more consistent numbers rather than something that's going to change quickly. And then you're saying that charter schools because they're on a smaller scale, it's more consistent to use the extended rate, which is a larger picture and less volatile because and I I certainly understand that coming from a small district where these changes to the state school fund have had massive impacts on us. >> And again, so we've written this again because the general purpose grant per extended ADMW is the stable number. And right now those two numbers are the same. They were the same last year and they were the same the year before. >> Michael. >> Yeah. >> So I just want to make sure everybody understands this to what to the

093what the superintendent is saying is that yes there is the possibility that there is the you know the likelihood in a district that has growing enrollment especially if you're adding a charter school uh that has growing enrollment that the uh the extended ADMW the the general purpose grant per extended ADMW and the charter rate will be the same. And that is the case where because you're growing, you're not you're using the current year's ADMW because it's large. It's the largest of the two. Whereas if you have declining enrollment and you're using the prior year's ADMW, that charter rate will be more than the general purpose grant per extended ADMW. That is >> that is that is the reality. I just want to make sure that everybody understands that. But to your >> And that's by

094statute. >> That is by statute. >> That balances out by statute. >> Yes. both the charter rate are defined in statute as well as the how we how we've uh the state school fund formula uses the extended ADMW in our formula where we take the two-year consideration >> and that's why we have two two rates and again because typically school districts or excuse me charter schools are paid on the current year's ADMW not the extended ADMW typically but that's why I want to make sure is are you going to if you're using the general purpose grant per extended ADMW are you also going to extend in the two-year consideration for the charter school would be the question that I would pose to the group just to make sure that you're all in understanding of what

095that represents. >> And and that was kind of my question. Um but I guess what I want to know is >> do we is it necessary to change the contract at this point to line with um >> statute concern? >> Yeah. And basically the concerns of fluctuating enrollment, >> I don't I don't believe we do because again, we're setting them at the value that would be of the benefit over the two years. Again, if they want to gamble on the charter school rate being higher because of declining enrollment, we can change that. Uh but again there's no we have no historical data that shows that the charter school rate has been greater for us in this district 97 >> in 97. >> Yeah. Because I'm I'm looking at um Krook County for example in 2025

0962026 and their general purpose grant for extended ADMW was 11,69 and the charter school rate was 11,292. So I mean there are there are differences. Uh, this is a really good example. I'll pass this pass this out. I know you'd love more charts. Brian's dying to get his hands on it. >> Um, >> it gives good examples of a district with a charter school in it. So, you can really see how the districts flow to the district and then flow or don't flow to the charter school. It's just a helpful tool to see to see. We have this for sus law, but we don't have it for sus law with the charter school in it. So, it's kind of an interesting thing to look at. Um, but I think the maybe what one of the

097questions problems is is it talks about extended weight to daily average membership, but that's not the charter school rate. So, we've used them interchangeably in this language in this addendum and they're not the same thing. Is that correct, Michael? >> That's correct. They are not the same thing. And then I just also want to reference back to the superintendent regarding a gamble. The charter school taking taking a gamble by choosing the charter rate. There's no gamble for both either the school district or the charter rate. It's just a function of how we define the charter rate and how we define the form the funding formula for the state school fund where the general purpose grant per extended ADMW is what we use to distribute resources to school districts. And so that's the reason that we

098have those rates is to show as Jennifer identified as to where there's a statewide rate, there's a school district rate, and those change depending on the scenarios, the the hydraulics within that school district, teacher experience, what have you, that all plays a role in those the uh those rates. And so again to follow the law uh you know where we tend to reference 338 or 338155 as that's the minimum funding if you're using the extended ADMW rate you're technically uh not following the law that's actually that has the potential to be less than what the school district would be due with the charter rate. And I just want to make sure everybody understands that. >> So Tom hang on one second. So, Jennifer, when you when you notice this, what what I want to clarify

099what we're what we're even discussing here that in the addendum, we've used the extended ADMW and the the the the charter rate, we've used them interchangeably >> and in our contract, >> but we need to say which one that that we are going by OS one which whichever that OS is the charter rate is that's that's what we're saying. >> Well, we need to be clear one way or the other. I mean, yes, I think we want >> because they're both not the same. >> Correct. Okay. I mean, they potentially could not be the same, right? Yeah. >> Yes. Tom, uh, are we talking about the number that we're talking about? Is this the amount of money going from the state school fund to the charter school or the way that the money that's going

100from the state school fund to the district is being distributed between the charter school and the rest of the district? >> Matt, >> it's the per student rate is what what they're talking about. So the ADM >> the ADM weighted is basically what they're saying. There is a section under there that um is ADMW which is the charter rate. Then they're off to the side and she you might not have an example here but that has the extended I'm gonna hand this out from the >> and if if I might I think the statute that we're referring to O RS 338.155 that's what establishes what the the minimum funding is supposed to be and it talks about um you the public charter school must be paid a number that is at least equal to 80%

101of the amount of the school district's general purpose grant per ADMW as calculated per 327.013 etc. And what the addendum says and I guess we realize that the charter also says this is it refers to in an amount per extended weighted average daily membership the charter school rate of WA students WCA students that is equal to 90%. I think and I would love Michael Wiltfong to weigh in on this and Rich too of course. Um I think we just need to delete the reference to the word extended. Um and because I just don't think that's an accurate reference >> because it's said two different times. So one says extended and then one is correct at the ADMW of 90%. So if the extended is an issue just take out the extended. Just reference the one

102that we are using >> because the one I'm going to use is the one that says charter. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> So that's easy. >> Check it off the list. Brian, >> right? >> Yeah. You use use the microphone because he can't hear you through that screen. >> Michael, just I wanted you to just clarify, please. So you're just saying if we remove the word extended. Yes, that would solve that. You would Yes, that would be one would be consistent as well as it would be following the state statute. >> See, that was one sentence. >> Yes. >> Why didn't you speak up earlier? K. >> She's sitting over there chuckling, looking at Brian's wheels spinning. Wheels spinning. Hamster's dead. Okay. Used >> to be a >> I guess. Um Okay. So, all right. I

103I'm not seeing anything else. Lisa, was that a hand up? No, she's just stretching her hand. I like it. >> Okay. >> Yeah, there are those again because they've had changes in enrollment. Yeah. >> Cameron, >> um I was just going to ask Matthew. He said, Matt, you said you had some other um things you were going to bring up, but you're pausing. >> Michael was m Oh, >> what? This one? I thought it was Matt earlier. You said you were gonna pause. >> Was it Mike? Oh, sorry. >> That's all right. >> So, Michael, >> Michael, was there anything else? You were pausing and gonna come back. We want to make sure we're covering. We're doing covering all of it. Yeah, I ear I think what's being referenced is earlier I I said that

104I think that there's another issue that I'll be able to help on a little bit later and I was anticipating that we'd be talking about the charter rate piece and I just want to make sure that everyone's aware of you know the the ramifications of that as well as the the reconciliation and how the state school fund and and the practice of how the charter and the school district go about that work. I have some models, you know, again, I' I've been involved in a number of these conversations through the years. I'm certainly happy to help or I'm understanding this is a relatively new relationship for the school district in that process to understand the state school fund and and and h and and possibly how that could work to make it a little bit

105a little bit easier in that uh in that work. So again, I know that also uh anyway, I'll pause there, but yes, the charter rate was the primary piece that I I thought I would be able to help for tonight. Well, again, if we eliminate extended that again, if there's a change, the charter school rate prevails. So, that's fine. Problem solved. >> Yeah, the problem solved. >> Yeah. >> Sweet. Okay. What else do we have? Did I hear that's it? >> Don Bulock, anything to weigh in on it while you're there? >> Uh, thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it. I think the the comment that I would make is that uh this is the kind of work that it takes for a community to successfully manage a charter school. I I've

106said for uh almost two decades that the the relationship that a charter school board has with the school district board is the most essential part of this. And that comes with the recognition that every single one of these students that's going to attend WCA is a student of the school district. And when when both boards uh understand that and agree to that, then we typically see uh great service to the students. And so I applaud you all for this effort tonight to have some uh you know technical and sometimes difficult conversations. So thank you very much for letting me listen in. >> Thank you. Um Adrian, um I haven't uh I haven't referred to you or or or seen if you've been raising your hand. Adrien, do you have anything for us? >> Uh no,

107I don't. I've just been listening. Uh, thank you. It's been uh it's it's been great to hear. I would love to get my hands on the printouts that we've seen. Um, but besides that, no, I don't have anything to add. >> Okay, great. Well, well, and thank you for joining us, even though you're I I hear you were under the weather, so thank you. Um, okay, CeCe, anything? >> No, I don't have anything additional that we've already discussed. >> Chuck Jennifer K. I liked it. >> I liked it very much that we could all come together and have a discussion and come to some agreements so we can move forward. And um I I do think that we're going to need another session fairly soon though on another of some other subjects, right, to finish

108up what you sent out whenever that was. >> Yeah. Again, we limited tonight to special education, but again, there's discussions about curriculum, transportation, that and school day, that kind of stuff that need to get clarified. >> So, should we set another meeting so we can all look at our calendars right now? >> That's what I was going to say. >> Okay. And that's that's to discuss the curriculum that's currently out for review. We have some on the table here and I'm I'd imagine you have some at your office as well. Um, there was a Andy sent out a email at 9:15 last night that had a whole list of things. So, okay, we're happy to answer all of them and we just need a date to do so. >> All right, let's uh let's let's

109discuss that date now. >> Thank you, K, for bringing that up. >> What do we got? Who's got a date? Somebody throw a date out there. >> February the 18th. >> February 18th. Who said that? Adrian. Adrian had a boy. Um, February 18th. >> Let me check wrestling schedule. >> Any chance we could do the 17th? >> Let's uh >> supposed to be in Eugene. >> 17th is a yes for me. >> Is it? >> I'm a yes on that one. >> 17th. >> No. No. No. You're in the wrong month. >> He's been housebound. We got to give him a break. Yeah. 17th works for me. >> Yeah. >> 17th. >> I'll be on Zoom if that's okay. >> Okay. >> Diana, name the time. >> 5:30 or 6. >> Chuck, 5:30 or 6?

110Cuz she looked at you. 5:30. >> 5:30 on the 17th. Andy, does that work for you? >> I'll make it back from Eugene by 5:30. >> Okay. >> Debbie, Chris, does that work for the both of you? >> Uh, February 17th at 5:30. Tuesday >> a works >> February 17. >> Correct. >> At 5:30. >> Okay. >> Another step forward. >> What? >> Somebody's getting in a traffic accident on the way home. >> There we go. >> Well, that's because Adri Adrian Yeah, Adrian jumped. Yeah, he was one that composer. Yeah, Adrian jumped on throwing out that date right away and things happened. Okay, so that was Kay who cost us extra time. Lindsay. >> Okay, Heather, Diana, Josh, Tom's surely got something. >> Always always um I just I just want to say how

111proud I am of this town. that in a year when we're seeing less money going to schools, I'm so impressed with how much money you guys have raised um and how much you've been able to accomplish. I'm so excited about the future for this district and I just think there's a world where in a year from now we are celebrating some amazing things happening at Susla and I think that would be really awesome. >> Sweet. Thank you, Andy. Anything? >> I'll turn out the changes tomorrow and get it out to everybody. Okay. >> Thank you. Thanks for >> joining us. >> They can't hear you through the screen without the mic. >> Adrian, I'm going to send you the stuff that we handed out. I'll email it to you tonight. >> Thank you, >> Rich

112and Debbie. >> Uh Rich and John and Mike and Matthew, thank you for joining us. Um and I didn't I already hit you. Moren, do you have anything? >> No. >> Moren didn't Moren's not the one that's horse. Yeah, Moren's not the one that's horse and she hasn't spoken at all. Um, okay. Well, if that's the case, meeting adjourned. Thank you all. >> Thanks everyone.