001e e e check yep good evening everyone and welcome to the ashin planning board meeting of Thursday February 13th I'll be calling the meeting to order at 7:16 and just a reminder to everyone that the meeting is being broadcast and recorded first on our agenda tonight is the clerk's report as as usual thank you madam chair we've received three correspondents to the planning board since the last meeting two have been responded to by the town planner and one I will owe a clerk response and it would fit with our general responses and um just a typical question that I ask you once in a while are we keeping up to date with those responses according to your spreadsheet I didn't way back check but yes for the since the end of December through now for
002sure we're okay way better great thank you always good to have a reminder when we're not okay next on our agenda is public comment we'll open up public comment uh both in the room and online and REM you that this public comment um is obviously open but if we're talking about that item on the agenda it's best to offer your comment during that um agenda item time if you can Connie Manel resident of Ashlin for 47 years Newcastle Road I've raised my family here and I live in ashin because of good schools small town atmosphere and Open Spaces there's no doubt that the Boston area needs more affordable housing at the same time I feel that my town planning board and zoning boards should be able to determine appropriate housing and its spacing for Ashland
003to meet the new Town's MBTA law and the 4 41 40b requirement I fear that Ashlin is doing too much too fast in 2020 cus built an enormous complex of 10 buildings near the train station 398 four and five story units you would think that would go way to meet the MBTA zoning law constructed this year the ashler connected to the faford complex on Chestnut Street has 174 units for story and yet this year in 2025 more units are in the pipeline these are not small complexes if all of these proposals go through we could be accepting a very large increase in population as much as 177% do we really know how much how such a large increase of housing units will affect the town the schools police fire traffic how can a small town
004balloon its population to this extent and still maintain proper Services many say that the NBTA housing law is unconstitutional they don't believe that the state can lawfully restrict local towns from creating their own zoning laws many towns are resisting such rapid and explosive development affluent towns are able to forego state grants if they don't comply with 40b but Ashlin depends on the state grants is this Equal justice ashin is not saying no to new housing however ashin does want the right to to say how new development happens Ashlin wants to determine the character of it town in my estimation the sanctuary in the middle of downtown does not Soo the character of the Town Ashlin has worked hard to beautify its small downtown new street lights New Street traffic controls renovating and preserving the town
005hall preserving the historical society's Ocean House supporting the Federated church is in historical site renovating the ashin library erecting a mon bridge over the Sudbury River with a walking trail forming The Corner Spot open space for community activities providing space for ashlin's Farmers Market John Stone's Pub Erica Clover road Brew uh Clover Road Brewing Company restaurants most of these buildings are only one or two stories high white Colonial or red clapboard or red brick architectures at the last CBA meeting the the sanctu um at the last uh Zoning Board hearing for the sanctuary an ashin historical commission representative stated that the proposed color orange and contemporary style would be inappropriate and uncharacteristic of the town I agree in addition I think that installing a 250 unit apartment complex a huge edifice compared to the rest
006of the town and is high is five stories towering over any other building would not only be intrusive it would just be plain unattractive Town needs to work with contractors to design proposed buildings that fit the character of the towns for example hopkington is working with contractors to replace the former downtown hopkington drugstore to meet the ab Butter's concerns the contractor has made adjustments to the much smaller SI 60 unit three-story complex changes were made to mitigate issues of exhaust emissions light and sound pollution parking and trash collection more brick was added to the building's facade to keep it better to help it better mirror the downtown's architecture even Juliet balconies were added to be more aesthetic in short the state the contractor and in our town are working together to answer the need for
007housing but they need to do it in a way that works for everyone please take the time to make it possible right now it feels like too much too fast and unreflective of the needs of Ashland thank you um I wonder to first of all say thank you for your comments we always obviously welcome people from the public to come in and and make statements and make um um to Give opinions about things that are going on in Ashland it's important to note that I'm sure the uh won't speak for everyone for the board but I know the board in general I I would say shares your concerns some of these projects that you talk about um were before our board and they are no longer before our board and we tried as you were
008saying to to really look at those projects very carefully other ones were in our purview some of those projects we looked at for a year in length um the process so we take those concerns very seriously I think the um there is a um the two kind of things you mentioned the 40b and the MBTA communities are are very different separate um things we have a limited control over um both of them or limited control over neither of them I guess um the 40b project is um especially is in the hands of the zoning board of appeals the MBTA legislation obviously we we worked on drafting that bylaw and that went before um town meeting and was tried to um be written in a way that would affect Ashland as little possible uh um myself
009Peter and Alvaro as well as uh Joe manani from the select board were on that working group and that was our primary goal is to have MBTA affect Ashland as little as possible um and hopefully we were successful in that as as time goes on we'll see um so um yes so we share your concerns um and um we've been just recently we sent information to the zoning Board of Appeals that uh a long actually letter document that the planning board had written I believe it's up on the website somewhere is that information that 13 page yes yeah yeah everything's on the everything's on the website that we that we then sent to the that we had sent to the state about the 10 to 60 Main Street development unfortunately um not many of our
010concerns were um maybe heard at that or they didn't CH it didn't change anything so we um sent that letter to the zoning board of appeals that they know the process we went through and our concerns with that building when it was front of in front of us it wasn't the same building in front of us but when that project was in front of us so we very much are trying to do what we can as a board doing the things that are within our power um um to to help with the situation um unfortunately there are there are limits to that that I think um are sometimes hard to understand that about the power we have and don't have um does anyone else want to add to that or correct me if I was
011mistaken in any way um I would just like to Echo thank you for the comments but what I think um this brings up and it actually is one of the reasons I wanted to be on the planning board is have more people involved right our Z in does not have to be stagnant we we are the board that does that but people can propose things and talk to the board and I think I think I think our zoning does need to be updated right and it's not that it's never been updated but I think there's a way which I can't comment about those whether it's going to change anything in those projects I me probably if they're but if you see a community active and cares and is asking for updates to zoning that does
012mean something and that is doable so I please I I appreciate it and I think that people should not here leave it to us because we're we're residents as well and we don't do this full-time um so I welcome any help on that and very active and I I'm so excited to hear that so thank you it feels like 40b takes away our ability to determine our future how what kind of town we will have in the end but beyond that if I M correct me if I'm wrong but it I think there are towns that are foro 40b because they don't feel that they need the the grants the state grants but Ashlin needs the state grants and that to me is uh unjust it's it's um what's the right word financially inequal I
013I think and please Peter correct me if I'm wrong but I think that's that's in regard to MBTA that they're forgoing those things I don't think a 40b can be I don't think that's related to any kind of funding so so 40b is a state mandate that's dates back to 1969 comes out with the fair housing market act which is a fedal law that rolls out in the late 60 right there's no way to get a around 40b it's a state mandate that all communities have 10% of their housing stock considered affordable um that's what 40b is MBTA is a zoning which came down and actually the court in the Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts just cre that's just came down with a decision and say that it is constitutional for the state of Massachusetts
014to make cities and towns Zone in a way to make housing in close proximity to train stations right uh and communities that have trans uh uh Transportation infrastructure such as the MBTA to Zone land no less than 50 acres um for housing by right um and so that is they're they're two different programs but they do so and and they you can you can get them Chris criss cross but there are two different separate matters well how much tie that back to your comment I'm Sor to tie that back to your comment the communities that are not compliant with MBTA zoning it's totally different from 40b as Peter explained those communities with certain I see so that's MBTA I was confused not correct and those communities such as Milton Milton is the the community that
015had the um that brought was brought to court you know by the Attorney General they now have until July 14th to adopt bylaws that will comply with the MBTA zoning Andor The Next Step will be taken by the state of do you have any jurisdiction about the size of the buildings that are put on the the sites so that refers back to 40b and 40b is so the the whole process of 40b uh and in short that the question the answer is no 40b goes to the zoning board of appeals for what's known as a comprehensive permit it goes through the 40b process so it disregards a community's bylaws right and then it creates a project right and it has to be a project of Eligibility then it has to be a project which receives
016a project eligibility letter from a subsidizing housing agency such as mass housing and then that gives them the ability to file the application and so this is the process we're in right now where the community works with the developer to help mold that project that's you know we're in we're on our second meeting or our second public hearing of the application of the 10 to four 10 to 60 Main Street project um last meeting we talked about traffic as as you know and I think it was a very successful meeting um and I think the next one the next meeting we're going to talk about civil design in traffic um I think each topic will be discussed in front of the zoning board of appeals and hopefully the project will can start to be molded
017in a way where it's acceptable to all the applicant and the town great thank you thank you for all that you do as well thank you thank you for your comments um carollyn Bell coner Street I just have a question so under that 40b then they could build a eight-story building or a 10-story building there I can't I'm not going to say here and say yay or nay but in theory they you know we're go that's the road that you could go down from a developer now there's a lot of twists and turns you know from a safety standpoint but yeah they could propose a building they're proposing a building that that they believe fits on to that site the reason why I asked was I I vaguely remember at a town meeting that um
018the town passed a downtown plan correct and I thought there was a three stories yeah that was in 2022 and actually we were on the board when we redeveloped when we updated that bylaw um and we did set in um a three-story maximum from the the the street now that that would be for a project using the Ashlin downtown overlay district and so however this is not using the ash downtown Town overlay District this is using state 40b regulations and so as their permanent Avenue per se and so that's why it's above the maximum and so the applicant is asking for a waiver as part of their application from multiple bylaws one of those bylaws is the height recommend in the height restriction or the height maximum per se in the ashon downtown overlay District
019so just as Hopkinton adjusted or or became the project was sensitive to the community's wishes is it possible to negotiate with the contractor and say that how many stories is this five uh yes is it possible to say to him five is really high it it's 100% possible yes okay thank you you're welcome so I have two people online with their hand up Mr uh first uh and foremost Mr Mark Don Mr Mark Don I'm going to ask you to unmute yourself okay thank you Mark Sony 1119 Main Street and I'm glad the first two got up there to speak and plan board answer back I have saying about the plan board in the zba get a Little Bit Stronger with the state about this MBTA housing but that's that's one that's one step I
020not I'm not I don't want to get into what I was saying is the um the 10 1040 Main Street that I made copies for each board four I know that Mr Mr Town plan you still got my sheet I have your sheet Mark I don't have it in front of me okay that sheet even though it's all zoning and stuff like that I would I would like to have the planning board take a look look at that see we can combine planning logic with the zoning so it can fight harder to the state and let the state know that the planning board can't be rolled over like the zpa is going to be because of the state regulations it's not it's not worth keeping if the state's G to say oh there only a
021small town Ash rural town ashon and and and Milton another one that's against us it's only going to be two and they're not going to hear not going to hear logically what's going to happen oh I'm I'm looking at a as per say get these codes stronger is z combined with the planet Co Planet board with self- regulations to make it a strong suit and then understand from there because well I I I I was at the um CBA public porn there last last night and I got tongue tired because I got because it was all traffic not everything else but the everything else that I have on the sheet that you that you have here that I want you to make if you can make C of give to the planning board is those
022ones that combine together not just for MBTA and the um 10 40 60 main but for all other projects either residential mix build and stuff like that to show that this town is looking forward growing forward with the generation coming that it can see worthy worth the time because I because this board has has really not worked down the road understanding what is for the future they just see it hear from other people and hear it from developers and from inside the town hall bill in itself which I am all for but to understand that people coming down in the future and maybe newer businesses coming around if if this federal government freeze can be can be can be uh Su Mark I'm gonna I'm gonna stop you there and I'm gonna say I'm happy
023to share that letter that you said that you wrote that you handw wrote um with the zon Bo I mean with the planning board um and then we can kind of continue our conversation okay other words if if I was at the CBA last night I would have been over three minutes right okay thank you okay I'm all right I'm gonna move on to Mrs uh M Jon on Friday uh please uh uh unmute yes jungan Friday onore Road Ashlin on the historical commission but speaking as an individual resident first I'd like to say that I wholeheartedly agree with the two ladies who spoke um I'm sure you'll be shocked but um I also just wanted to um thank the planning board I read your letter that you sent um obviously to the mass um
024housing but also um that you included in your um letter to the zba and I just thought it was it was a really really great letter and I I really appreciate the fact that you Incorporated the historical um issues in there so that's just my comment and thank you very much take care thank you Joan all right thank you um seeing no more hands we will move on to our next agenda item which is speaking of History um the Ashland historical commission that has a presentation for us about a proposed historic district so Mr neelon yeah put this down right and I would did I do yeah I'll just put it here s okay yeah so I'll just put it here okay so but then you're going to share I'm going to share this right
025up here historic district for yeah it says yeah you can just I can just go up and down y yep okay um are we ready to go good evening everyone my name is Jim neelsen I'm the uh chairman of the ashin Historical Society I know it's very funny but it's it's no it's very funny that I'm also the chairman of the local historic study committee how that happened um but I'm here tonight uh to update the planning board from the last time I was here on what we've been doing with the proposal for a local historic district in the downtown area um we've made quite a bit of progress um this is a project we've been working on for over two years and I just have a short PowerPoint presentation I don't know does everybody
026this was sent to you a while ago the the district report does anybody need a copy of it it was in an email a long time ago I'll take a hard copy if you have if you have an extra one thank you now this was prepared by an outside consultant Stacy spies who is on Zoom with us tonight if there's any questions about it the methodology or anything like that and Stacy has a lot of history um she's from Hoppington and she knows a lot about uh historical preservation and has done this in for many different towns aston's one of the few towns in the area that does not have a local historic district um I'll just back up a bit is proposed and this was all we've had numerous meetings we had our first
027the the public hearing and beginning of last month um and it's already been approved by the Massachusetts uh commission historical commission so the next step in this I'm having a couple more meetings we're talking to different groups and I'd like tonight if I could get an approval from the planning board or some kind of letter or note saying that you approve of this so that's why I'm here to answer questions and try to just tell you exactly what's going on with this um like I said ashin does not have a historic district uh in Li of what's been going on downtown with all the improvements and the whole controversy about the mill building um we decided that we would go forth and try to do something about it and why create a local historic district
028a local historic district is the only mechanism of available to preserve historic buildings um you've probably heard of the National Historic register um or the demo delays those are all fine and good but they don't prevent anything in the long term if you're on the National Historic register you can still take the building down um the only thing in this state is the local historic district and what that does we're we're quickly losing historical buildings as said by The Mills uh building and other buildings around town but reason we concentrated on the downtown area because a lot of the historic uh buildings in as are spread out an old farming community and what this has to be is contiguous and it has to be a contiguous area not everything in it is historical but everything
029in it that is historical you can't change the outer facade or alter anything uh structurally um from the character of the time period that it is and a interesting point Come came up at that public hearing they're not all the same time period these buildings but it's actually we have a little bit of everything so it's kind of like a time capsule this is from the 1830s this is from the 1850s this is from 1933 1929 um so it's kind of a unique situation um we have all kinds of different uh things in ashin let me just go down this is the map and as you can see it's strictly in the downtown area it starts up by it includes the ashin historical society's building the Ocean House goes down through the mill buildings um
030even though this is a 40b issue they not going to be probably included in it but they will be in the district for contiguity contiguous contiguity I know I know um and then it goes down Main Street with the building next to the church is a store I have all the documentation that I could send anybody on the actual history um a history has been done on each of these properties the Federated Church all the way down to the corner down to the library across the street around to the post office the block where there used to be ebbr Pharmacy which is now where the pizza place is and the old train station Town Hall uh John Stones the old ashon General store which is now luners um the old fire station some of these
031buildings are town-owned but most of them are in private hands and there's only one building that's an actual house um that's the purple house and she's been at the meetings and she's all for the the she's gung-ho about the whole idea of preserving a local historic district in the downtown area um we've had some push back but um we're going to go forward for example 58 54 4854 Front Street it's which is more commonly called the Masons block was built in 1882 the historic name is the Abner Greenwood block and the common name is the Masonic Lodge it's been used since the Masons since 1884 they've had a variety of businesses on the first floor but they they was a brief I think 1920 to 23 they weren't in there but they've been in there
032for over a hundred years um and we had somebody from the Masons here at our public hearing and he was generally supportive he's the man in charge of the buildings um going down I've just included a few I'm not everything is in here of course J Stones uh actually called called the railroad house Captain John Stone's hotel which was built in 1834 predating the town of Ashlin um he got inside information that the railroad was coming to town and built his hotel to get the railroad crowd and he built it too close to the tracks which it still is but um Stones is one of the most iconic buildings in Ash if you any ask anybody from out of town where do you live Ashlin oh I know I've been to JN stones or into
033Stones so it's very well recognized another building well the historic fire central fire station which has now been repurposed um as as a u a brew Hub I believe it hasn't quite opened yet but this is a good example of what we're talking about with the historic district we're not looking to like regulate any kind of business or what goes in it we don't care it's really only about the facade of the building and keeping the original architecture the facade what you can see from the street if they want to expand that then can go out back where you can't see it from the street no problem um like I said it's only it's from you know fences there's certain I'll get to it but there's certain things that are regulated and certain things that
034aren't and you have a copy of the bylaw at the back of this which is being proposed uh oh of course Boston and Alby railroad station which is now an accountant's office but it's also been a a vet and various different things this is one of the last uh railroad stations that they think HR Richardson the famous Boston architect had something to do with it was actually built after he died but his office was involved and it's the same style uh along this line I think the only three left are in Welsley besides Ashland Bingham and two stops in wsy I think are the are the four buildings for the for the railroad design built in 1887 it went out of commission in 1960 when they stopped doing the passenger service and then it went
035into private hands and right now it's still in private hands it's being used as an office another example the building's been repurposed uh many times we're not looking to change anything that's inside it's just the exterior vat Church of Ashlin iterated church has been around since 1835 the land that it sits on was actually bought that bought it from JN Stone himself and we've uh with one of the members is is the historian there and he's found the deed back in 1835 from Captain Stone um this is a good example it's the last Church uh Federal Federal sty Church left in the downtown there used to be a few more if you look at the histories that have burned over the years this one um if it ever does stop being a church for whatever
036reason this will preserve the facade you know it can be purpose is something else but the actual steeple and the facade what you can see from the street would be protected in other words if they were to sell it to a developer he could not or she could not tear it down just to put up more apartment blocks or something like that unless they incorporate it into the design which we don't have with the mill buildings and this one is called the the Wiggins block it doesn't look like it's very historical but it's actually from 1850 and you have the um vinyl sighting and things like that which people say well that's not historical doesn't matter it actually is an 1850 building it's the home of the original ashin Public Library back when it was
037the ashin agricultural library before we had the library which is now next to the the uh the one we use now which was of course a um Andrew Carnegie grant that was put in In 1902 when Carnegie was financing uh a slew of libraries and local towns if they came up with the money matching funds which as did In 1902 um so the Wiggins block is historical it doesn't look like much from the outside but it's it's from and oh the last one I put in here is it's eber's Pharmacy or the Ashland Pharmacy it's now Zen Dental this this building and the one next to it with the pizza places there two separate Parcels we preserving as an uh example of 1933 as you can see there's different time periods in downtown ashin this
038was a a this was the drugstore in downtown Ashland and older residents can tell you that's where they went for their medicine and next door was also a market now it's a dental office again I know since I've been here it's been NAPA Auto Parts and it's been another market and a couple different kinds of markets but again that's making it contiguous and it goes across the street from that the US post office but I didn't put a picture of in this presentation but the post office itself is an example of 1939 Art Deco which is also unique they didn't do very many of them um and so the US government and we've all seen the mural inside which is a WPA project mural um from the 30s U depicting the uh arrival of the
039train to Ashlin which I think everybody's seen I think John stones in the actual picture okay what's a local historic district like I said it's a continuous area group of historic truck structures uh what we're going to need it it required an approval by the mass historic commission which we got and we're going to need a 2third vote at town meeting we're currently working on the warrant that be on the town meeting this spring we originally tried we're thinking we could have done it in the fall but we didn't have enough time and this we we want to publicize it a little bit more and get it on in the spring so if two-thirds of the people people that go to the um town meeting vote for it it will become a law um and
040it'll be a district now the district commission which will be created if the district passes is made up of local residents and there a selection process they have to sum Architects some are real estate people there's a whole procedure you have to do um and they'll be the ones that will uh rule over uh or or be sitting on uh things that come up before the commission or if somebody wants to make a change uh located the hisor exclusiv in the downtown area like I said from the Ocean House to the post office and back um there's also something I should mention we're it's not a bylaw but there's a set of guidelines that have been prepared and it's up on the website those are informal those are to give developers an idea of what
041the commission uh if it's created would be looking for we can only do an informal one right now is it won't become part of the bylaw um and the the future commission um historic district commission will make the final say on that if and when it's formed so right now it's more of a reference point so if you want to look at I don't have a copy of it with me but it's up on the town website under the historical commission and what does a local historic district do it preserves the exterior of historically and architecturally significant buildings protects the character of the downtown increases property values Studies have been been done uh downtown re revitalization Main Street is an economic revitalization program and it's kind of fitting in well with what we've already been
042doing in ashin um with the Reconstruction of the downtown sidewalks the lamps um and the comprehensive um Planning Commission I'm forgetting the actual name of it um there's lots of components in that that're about historical preservation so I think it's kind of dovetailing nicely into the whole thing then we've Studies have said there's no more cost effective program of economic development of any kind in the US today it's cheaper and more uh efficient to reuse old buildings than it is to build from scratch and it's also a way to have more local control over that area of town not just the planning board which will still have say over what goes in down there but if one of these properties that isn't historic and the example I always give is a liquor store and let's
043say he wanted to sell it it's in the district um and somebody wanted to build a something on there it would have to go before the commission so that it's architecturally appropriate for the area it's a hard thing to Define it's kind of like a a character Vibe kind of thing but you don't want to put a like a I mean I I grew up in walpool have anybody ever been to downtown wpo lately when you go into 27 you go into the railroad bridge there's a huge like six seven story um Condo building right there it used to be the old fails Factory and it just looked wildly out of place that's what's happening to downtown ashin and this is some one way to try to prevent that uh and what does it not
044do does not control property usage of what people can do inside the buildings does not control what businesses are allowed doesn't prevent new construction they just have to get a certificate of appropriateness which is something that uh if you're doing any major constru minor minor Renovations are not a big deal if it's something major they were changing the physical character the architecture of the building then they would have to get a CER they'd have to go before the commission and get a certificate of appropriateness much like you would have to do um with many other things studies shown it does not decrease property values and it only applies to the portion of building like I said that you can see from the street uh so the ashin center historical district commission will be created uh
045when this passes uh the historic district is made up a local residence like I said and it's respons ible for overseeing the district's bylaw the bylaw is in this folder in this pamphlet commission's also responsible for establishing a non-binding set of guidelines which I already mentioned and in summary the historic district creates a thoughtful community-based review process that protects historically significant buildings from Demolition and inappropriate alterations to retain the unique character of downtown Ashlin now if somebody who's been on the historical commission since it was reconstituted in 2020 um we spend an awful lot of time with demolition delays um where people want to just tear down the house and start over again and we've updated the bylaw but a demolition delay is only good for a year and then they can do what they
046want um so we were kind of thinking how do you protect the mid building really got it started it's too late for that probably but you never know if plans fall through and all that kind of uh you know who knows what's going to happen but uh that's why the mill building is included in the in the designation of the district in case something does happen but this would give us more uh local control over what goes in downtown just another added layer it's not telling people what to do um with the what business to put in there just to keep the downtown character intact so questions oh Everybody's Fine great I had a couple just um um some of the the um buildings you showed and that were on the list just prompted some
047questions so um I know you mentioned you know it doesn't impact what goes in but you know we have seen projects before us that in order to bring the building or the space up to Cod for the use changes need to be made the fire station Street wasn't there other things that are that are excluded are are paint color roofs solar panels W energy efficient windows I mean we we say storm windows I mean nobody's really putting storm windows on anymore but they're more energy efficient Windows um screens and I apologize if it's in I'm I've been trying to read the bylaw as you were chatting but um you know in the case of the firehouse there was there's a door that was not there previously with solid wall now an 0 accessible door that
048had to in as AWB so my my reading my sort of understanding so far is that that door would run a foul of this not necessarily if they they they'd have to go in front of the commission to explain what its use was and to make it ADA Compliant for the business and the commission would have to the commission can would have to not I wouldn't say they would prove it automatically but if the case can be made um that that's what we need I think the commission would allow it I can't predict what future people are going to say so that sort of brings me to my next question so I think that would be certainly an additional hurdle I mean that would have been additional hurdle for road which is you know when
049they were before the planning board obviously we needed that door there in order for them to open um you know things like that do limit use if you can't bring the building safely up to code for the use that is proposed and so my other qu my what brings me to the next question is who is appointing the members of this commission select board okay select board is in charge of appointing them like I said there's a selection process they solicit two people from the real estate um industry two people from the there's an architectural Association of Massachusetts um that's that's who was made up of the local study committee and two people from the Historic Society and or if they can't fill that then the select board will appoint people that they do that
050I again I apologize that's fine read as we go um and then my last question is um the police station no police station is not included we've excluded the police station because it's it's getting t as far as we know it's getting torn down um if it doesn't get torn down and repurposed it's just a non-conforming building within the thing so it's it's only 1978 it doesn't count as that was my question it's only 1978 so it doesn't count as a historic significant architecturally or agewise so is the appendix is this a list of buildings that are included police station says na next to it I just saw that tonight not applicable okay so this is just a list of addresses that are within the district MH okay I just want to add to that
051comment on the Clover one the accessible door was on the side of the building so that really is not something that counts for historic preservation point of view um it is actually the street facade that really counts for his um preservation even though you can see it in the street it's soose corre it it is actually the front elevation that really counts stly facade okay so you can create accessible entrances if required for a commercial purpose close to a parking spot or easily accessible just so that you give equal weightage that's all the logic is I was worried about how close that door was to the where it's it's very sure yeah sorry deep so you were making a clarification about this that you know about the historic districts yeah well I worked in a
052couple of historic preservation projects and the importance is to the actual facade front entry and not to the sides of the building because you have to give accessibility to the building um which most of them don't have obviously make sure that it is diverse as well so from that point of view so the sides don't really count it's actual facade okay on the street side thank you Kate do you have um yeah I have a question so you talk about the front so in theory a developer can purchase one of these historic properties and cut everything away and leave it like a a la movie set right well in theory no but you also but you also have the planning board and you also have this is just strictly concerned with the historical aspect they
053they can't build like you know a 10 storying but it is literally Technic Al if someone wanted to implement they can make they can make the movie Set facade leave that and do anything that's in compliance with yep our bylaws zoning okay yep along with the bylaw the downtown building where you have the millennial Park they kept the original um I think I forget was a kind of a commercial building so they kept that floor and there's a millennial glass building behind it yeah and a good a good example too it's just so in Hoppington uh across from the town hall the building that burned down my chiropractor used to be in the back of it um he rebuilt that the owner on his own initiative rebuilt the the front but they they let him
054build a lot more in the back you know so that building if you look at it now is it's a lot larger than it used to be but the build the but the sprawl goes out in the back so the front he didn't have to do that but he did it because you know he wanted to be a good good citizen of the town so know my uh consultant Stacy has more information on that if anybody wants to hear it but um Stacy do you know if there's any um any other reasons that would be concerned with like doors on the side or anything like that is she unmuting Stacy I made you a co-host so please unmute you yourself okay there we go wasn't it was saying I wasn't allowed to be unmuted um
055hi uh Yes actually um uh I'm I'm a former chair of the historic district Commission in hopkington and that's actually a good example um when that house burned down um he took it as uh an opportunity to do some upgrades and uh what they brought to the commission um was you know the front would be it's a former house in the front uh that was a way to kind of keep the streetscape and so then um it had been a number of it had been Apartments uh in the house and then some uh offices and then they ended up turning it into condos so I think they got five or six condo units out of it and the you know it's a larger Edition in the back but it's the original volume in the front
056um uh something else uh that can be done um is uh it had some kind of Victorian detail up in the Gable Peak and since that wasn't really as visible from the eye since he had you know made the efforts to try and recreate you know what had been there um you know the commission and Hopkinson decide you know and your commission could too to say you know what it's okay if you use the TRX you know that sort of Plastic Lumber nobody can tell up there it's fine you know so it's you know it's a give and take um oh and also I did want to also say real quickly about uh you were talking about the other facades um uh the way the bylaw is written uh is that anything that's visible from
057the street is reviewable but things like ADA compliance are just you know are just common sense um and I could see maybe you know if if let's say like the firehouse has the you know the arched openings you know from the fire you know where the garage doors are maybe when they put in the you know um Ada door on the side they do like a little Arch over that door so it's all about being reasonable um that's why um when Jim was talking about guidelines um it's uh better to kind of have guidelines going into it and then you can use that but things you know that way they can keep being updated um when the laws were written in Massachusetts there weren't heat pumps there weren't electric vehicle charging stations there weren't um
058uh well they're come and gone already like the uh sat light dishes so there's all sorts of new innovations that keep coming and so the good idea about guidelines is it um kind of says uh is this is what is what you want to do reversible say um someone wanted to put in a wood accessibility ramp you can put a wood ramp in and then you pull it back out you know somewhere down the line if it isn't needed um a lot of the it's kind of common sense um uh approaches to it um so I do want to go back to that and just clarify because I am reading the B as proposed and it says anything possible to doesn't it clarifies Beyond facade so I wonder it's not just the facade y yeah
059and I think that so that's why I was saying that it's on certainly the facade is the is the primary of the concerns because usually the facade traditionally has the most um detail to it and the most effort design wise goes into the facade but yeah so it's anything that's um that's why you get things like heat pumps and you know electric vehicle Chargers and stuff um Hopkinson even uh because that involves Town Hall the um the drive up voter Booth uh U drop off got reviewed yeah the Dropbox got reviewed and it you know it it got you know was a certificate of appropr appropriateness and a quick stamp so not everything is um I think this is I think this is an important thing to know the what the regulation will actually be
060on it as written by Ashland though if if there or if hey it just goes it has to go by the state is there local control right um wait wait a minute um because I think um I think it's an important question that um you know could the commission hold up um the coming of a new business because of the Ada access which is common sense but is that written into the bylaw shall not be unreasonably withheld or is it not is it in the hands of the commission um you know and it might be it seems like common sense but it could also be unreasonably withheld I think it's important to know that in information there are there is um uh an appeal process I should say there's like a person agreed so there
061is a process in there um for that sort of um you know issue I know I know it's hard to it's hard to legislate common sense because it is so common sense I think just for purposes of clarifying our conver so I thinka you have dealt with communities where it is just the facade it looks like this bylaw is proposing more than just the facade and I'm wondering if you know there might be like some sort of a compromise like you know DEA maybe if you're familiar with communities that are only restricting to the facade maybe that's a better fit for Ashlin versus the sort of more all encompass say anything visible from the street which would be could be a significant hurdle to economic development in our downtown which we are putting so much
062effort into you I think the community is extremely excited about something over Road that's also a very small business and to have or not very it's it's a small business local business to have them have that additional hurdle just to become ada8 compliant that was also my my recollection is really the only business that was really eager to go into the fire department to the to that space um and so like deter adding additional deterrence for something like making the building accessible if that triggers to go to the commission and again it's it's a lot of wh ifs and well we wouldn't imagine that the commission would have she just said though that the ADA compliance stuff is is Exempted um so there there's a list of exemptions in there this this was all vetted
063this was all vetted by the uh the state um and it's it's been put together it's it's virtually Stacy correct me if I'm wrong it's a lot of boilerplate um yeah this I yeah this was um this is the uh bylaw that was created that the Massachusetts historical commission the state level recommends because this is the one that stood up to um legal challenges this is the one that's that's widely accepted I can pull up I'll have to pull it up for you there is um uh there is a hierarchy um I'll P I'll pull it out CIT we can check with Council there is a hierarchy of which commissions have power over the others for example historic districts uh have um if there's a building in a historic district that's also that wants a
064demo delay the district is the higher um level of requirements so they get um uh the demo delay defers to Historic District commission I'm going to double check and make sure there's um something about that for Planning Commission too because something like Ada would certainly be more more um a higher order I guess as a way of saying it a higher order requirement so um historic district would defer to that I'll pull up that citation um let me if there's any more questions you know from the board I mean I just have a comment to speak to the what's visible I think just like we're saying legislate common sense and when we're talking like heat pumps and things you like someone might not think about it well okay we have actually an example Starbucks right
065that didn't didn't come the way the planning board did about some infrastructure right and so I think it I think the visible from the facade makes sense to include to make sure that there's for simple things that really can be if they're thought out out of view and and slightly you know so I think I think I 100% agree that I the Ada is different and I assume that does take precedent I think it would um but as far as keeping it in a visible I think that absolutely should stay yeah I think um yeah I mean I think there's there's a whole lot of gray there's going to be a whole lot of gray area those are like two examples but in um you know in some areas of the downtown we know that
066um you know there isn't a lot of there isn't a lot of place to go right and so I'm I'm wondering about like you know how many single family homes or you know two family homes are are included in this district and um and then you know it say say if you they want to stay but they need more space I'm I'm an architect I have this a typical um request by the client I want to stay in my house but we need more space but right and so hold on finish my question and so it's often would be very hard again the visibility for it to be all behind the building it might be on the side it might be and I understand that then this would go through the historic commission it would
067have to kind of fit a certain style right to to fit in with the downtown it would need to go through a review in that way it would have to go through a review but there's no really one style for the downtown that's what I was trying to say before there's all kinds of different styles and as far as the residential goes there's like I said there's only one the purple house that's the only that's the only residential that's the only residential and we did that on purpose we could we could have gone up Main Street further with all the houses going up to 35 we didn't we stopped with the downtown because it's mostly commercial there's a lot of town-owned property and we weren't going to get into you know that's that's totally I
068mean that's why there's no paint color restriction because no who wants a purple house right but but that's you know it's already there so it's it's not a it's not a you know and some some of the I mean the the house on py wither did a really nice job of fixing up on the corner there of um what's the Tilson Tilton yeah on the corner there you know I'm talking about the yellow house the green and the and the that's a beautiful example of of taking having the money and and and restoring an old Victorian that that doesn't happen every day and a lot of people can't afford it and we we hear that too you know we wish we could help people and we're looking in a program for people to restore their
069historic houses um with State money or whatever um one thing I did forget to mention though too I know I don't know if you folks are aware of the cemetery project that's going on behind the uh the church uh the um the restoration of the old the old village Cemetery I know there's been work done we've been we've been redoing the whole they've been cleaning all the stones reposting them um that will that's part of the district that will qualify for Grants if this is part of a district so there'd be additional money available right now it's all kind of private um very little town the DPW helps uh every once in a while bring water over something when they're cleaning the stones but that's just a minor thing um um so another question um
070I'm looking at the building which I think the address I think it's nine Homer a it's not the one on the corner not the little brick one on the corner that you mentioned but the one around the corner which is a little strip mall no not well what's what's going in that that's where that development is yeah yeah they no it's not the Brown strip mall there the one right across my train station that's not included in this the one the one that's right there that has pizeria what is it it's in the blue line yeah it's oh that's a mistake okay that's a mistake that's a mistake it's in the blue line that was supposed to be corrected That was cuz we actually originally had ericas in there too we took that out okay
071because that could be converted back to a house at some point um what about a question like okay that um that little on story brick building that we're talking about that's on the curve I think it's the five hom RAV um what about if that uh um business uh the owner there wanted to add a second floor I mean it's low building in a downtown that's getting taller it's a little bit in my just my personal opinion a little bit too low um to hold that corner so it was is that something that would be disallowed or it would be reviewable it would be reviewable because you're but not necessarily disallowed like new construction is not disallowed reviewable okay because you're holding on to the facade of the building and yeah you know if looking
072to add to it I'll give you a good the example we didn't include I I think a good example of that is where the bagel table is kind of Blended that into like the surrounding uh neighborhood on that building it doesn't look out of place whereas the corner building with the condos are that replace the alberini property um we think that's a little bit over the top for downtown Ashen um but that's just that's just the opinion of the commission we can't do anything about that that's included too and that's that's already mil that you're talking about what's that 128 me yeah 128 I also know that the the the U it's a little this m map is a little um confusing in here because it's obviously a quite an old map that you're that's
073the assessor map oh that's the assessor map oh so so yeah um yeah so there's obviously changes in here there's no Corner Spot on here the 128 building isn't on here um yeah that's that's what they have for map right now okay yeah I mean like the banks the banks aren't are included in this but as as nonform in uh or whatever it is non-conforming um structures within the district in other words if somebody wanted to buy say Sandra goes away and you they want somebody bought it and wanted to put in something it would be reviewable by the commission but not necessarily you know we're not going to prevent construction so are the are all the buildings that are on the list represented in these images and called out as such yes there's a
074there's an inventory of all those buildings I saw the list but the list and I don't know if all of them are they're all on the mass mackus list uh with the state okay um they all had to be registered and you know signed off on so they're all registered with the state which is a list of uh historical properties or not historical properties it's like an inventory of the history of the property like when the building was built what style it is ownership that kind of thing and have you had any other responses you mentioned a few people a few um a few people just don't want change and be told what to do you know never getting my sentence in here here I'm sorry um like from the uh Federated church or um
075you or JN stones are they like all for it these I haven't I haven't heard anything okay no I haven't heard like I said The only person any of the businesses that that's come to a meeting or or or the public hearing people that came to the public hearing were against it they didn't own anything in the district they were just against it in general principle um of another government regulation um but anybody that actually letters was have been sent out couple times now there's been published notices in the paper and online and that kind of thing so no I'm I'm kind of surprised I haven't heard from more people okay I'm just curious yeah um any other question I have a question so there's the the bylaw and then you referenced guidelines which come
076later but how does that so we go to town meeting in May and we vote how did you're not voting on the bylaws and they're not they're not um the guidelines the the guidelines I mean they're not um what's the word um not binding not binding okay they're not binding they're suggestions okay that's what I was kind they're to give somebody an idea of what the committee commission is looking for yeah whether or not they actually can do it or not I mean it's it's a starting point so they just come in blind and say what do you want yeah they need that and that's helpful to to there's a there's a there's a guideline just to you know rule of thumb and that can change like I said instead of updating a bylaw which
077is harder to change you can update at the guidelines as time goes on okay I just I because like people people do want to know what they're yeah voting on clearly so that is a you know suggestions to get people started just like we have um which is why we're trying to do as many of these kind of things as we can to get the word out you know I've been here now twice I'm going to the select board again um I've been to various groups in town um we've had we've been at Ashland day we've been at the farmer Market you know generally the public in general if they hear about it are in favor of it it's a very few local um individuals who are against it but everybody generally seems to have
078a nice I don't know it's just it's just my perception of it it's totally unscientific but I mean like you know it's going to depend on two-thirds which is a a big hurdle at a town meeting I mean so yeah so I I mean as the comprehensive plan is moving along we are well past people the community that spoke which was a good decent percentage through that saying preserve historic Ashlin small toown field we had some people that came out of their house and joined us tonight that I that's what I heard them speaking so I think I think there is community support for this I hope so I've worked on a couple of historic projects and I think the folks that I worked with have so much passion for the kind of work that
079they do um but in reality I'm I'm curious random scenario if for some reason Mills building was not in the position that it is today and we had this historic district in place would this have prevented us from having a 40b in that location at all no 40b Trump's this completely so having said that uh you began the presentation saying lot of this these buildings in this map right now are town-owned building few of them but there seems to be always and way around the so-called I feel good because it's a historic district feeling um is it beating the purpose is it reaching the goal that you're trying to get to because it feels like there's always a way around this even whether it's a historic district or not so I'm not sure if we
080if you really want to preserve those those facades on that main street is there should we get a little more stringent with what you have as kind of your bylaws guidelines to make sure that your goal ultimate goal is met because right now to me after hearing all the conversations it feels like this is coming up only for Mills building as a main project because all the others are Town owned so is there something that we can make this a little more stringent so that there's no way you can bypass this to get another fivestory building in that street well that that's the whole point of the district because like I said that's the only thing in Massachusetts that you can do um Somerville for example does individual buildings but they do it through a
081process of city council which is a lot easier um to do you know that this this building will be a local historic district or that building I can't do that in ason because we don't have the people or support to to make main committees commissions for each and every building you know um Hoppington downtown district is quite small actually um it's not as big as you think it is but that is the only because I did a lot of research on this because people say oh just put it on the national register you know won't won't fly that that's the same thing and you know I have had people say well they did a good job with this building and that building um when the people restored it I said yeah that's that's true you
082know but if you really our mission is to preserve uh at the Historical mission is is to preserve the architectural and historical assets of the town of ashin and this is the only way I could see that not everything but but a good chunk of the downtown area could be preserved for future Generations nothing's perfect you know I don't have a a crystal ball to say what would happen in the future but um I don't know if they've ever been overturned Stacy have any of like these districts ever been like desertified oh decertified I don't believe so I mean there have been some challenges um uh because there's always the you know um sometimes you'll get demolition by NE neglect yeah which happens um but I don't think there have been any that have been
083decertified I could check that for you but nothing comes to mind no just just came because you don't know what's going to happen down the future but you know and I'm and we're not advocating for like strong arming people telling them what to do with their property you know and that's the that was the major complaint I get from some people that you can't tell us what to do it's my property also it's worth and just noting I know you had talked about the there's a specific uh call for an architect and a realtor there's also spaces on the commission specifically set aside for uh Property Owners property owners in the district right in the district yeah for the whoever the whatever the historic district commission is in the end there are calls for there
084are spots specifically for people who own properties in the district so they'd have some say over their own um and this is I'm sorry Trish I'm won't cut you off this time no I mean um you had started actually before but I am wanting to kind of wrap up the discussion for this evening and but do you have something you wanted to say for no I I was just going to I was just going to say that uh this this is we we've looked at many different things to try to preserve you know downtown Ashland and if that if it doesn't you know we hope it goes forward you know if not then you have to look at other Alternatives as far as the mill buildings Go I mean it it seems to us like
085that ship is sailed but even still I mean we got all kinds of promises and the original go around he was going to keep two and a half of the facades now it's down to one and a half and you know all that stuff that we've been through um so looking around you know to prevent the destruction of downtown at the hands of developers if you want to get hysterical about it you know that that's that's one of the um you know people say that all the time this is not the town I grew up in well nobody's town is the town they grew up in but you know they can preserve some of it you know and at least the F and look because people move to these New England towns for a reason
086for these little small towns and as we're growing as a bedroom community now from some being a farm uh factory town um it's it's it's I think it's worth preserving some of the character and of the town's history yeah and um you just speaking as an individual I I I think so too I think there's there's a lot here to be uh obviously we if you moved to Ash and you fell in love with it for a reason and everyone probably doesn't love the same things but there are things you would like to see preserved that said um for me I would not feel uh responsible in doing my due diligence if I didn't take the time now to look at this in more detail after our discussion I would like an updated mat map
087with yeahor it's the right thing I don't know if the is the updated map on the on the online version Stacy do we know these were printed out by the town by by yeah I'm not sure yeah I'm us I used we need to fix that it was required that I use whatever the assessors had and I think cuz we had a mistake on it and I thought we fixed it yeah that little that little bit there is train station yeah I'm wondering what the build toppers.com do they have a bit more updated than this do you know I don't know I don't know I don't know yeah but I know that little bit that's next to the strip mall it was all one lot at one point so it was I don't want to
088go long it's okay it's okay we don't I don't need to go I just want want it to be updated so we have the updated map in front of us right and I think it would also be um good to have some um that it whatever map it is like I'm marking on my map like Yep this house is gone yep there's a there's a building here yep like I'm I'm correcting the M as I know it and it would be good to have that to really to understand whether that's through US or you know you guys have some notes on that um so that we really understand what it is when we're looking at the bylaw and the reg and the proposed guidelines I should say so my proposal would be that yes you
089did come before us before but it was very late at night night and we apologize for that it was very late at night and I remember yes yeah and thus it was very short and you guys were very patient um at that time and so we wanted to give it its time tonight but I also I I think this should come back sooner rather than later after we have a chance to digest this information I know our other member Anna is also on screen I I think she's not feeling well so hasn't really had maybe an opportunity to comment um as well so um so so I want to make sure we are able to have a a fully informed research and any further questions that we have before we take that vote on it
090that you've asked for opinions from the board um my only this one is I would also want to kind of re revisit these exclusions it becomes it feels like it's too broad at this point and may not really get us to where we are um I've seen communities where they even Define the color of paint it has to be a historical paint palette cannot be any paint uh we seem to have omitted some of those in this exclusion so I would love to take a stab at it if and kind of share those um thoughts just from looking at the map that you have or the area that you're looking at and give you some suggestions yeah well we specifically excluded color from the thing um from the bylaws because we didn't you know feel
091it was appropriate so along long with Deep's point because so this has been approved by the state yes so I'm not sure if any changes we make and we have to send it back to the state and that's going to delay this and and that's what I'm saying like I I don't think so I'm an advocate of let's not say we did it once and ignore it this I assume Deepa comes up with some wonderful suggestions and other people in the community this can be presented at Spring and we say there's people working on the committee and maybe you do want them would be I'm just kind of putting that context for me personally I waiting doesn't get you preserving history in my experience particularly watching in Ashlin so absolutely it's not should not put
092wrench in your process for sure Amanda and uh Anna online if you have a comment I mean I think my comments are similar to deas where it's sort of speaking content but that delays past Springtime think perhaps that's not appropriate so I had similar thoughts Anna do you have anything you want to add I mean I certainly support the the the concept of it in premise and I think it's good to get some specifics to vote on um if the rest of the board feels like we need a little bit more detail I'm I'm certainly willing to do that yeah I think for me it's just like I I want to be able to really read through all the material in the light of of the discussion that we've had tonight and and digest it
093all before um before proposing a vote on it so I would suggest that we we don't have to officially no put but I I would suggest um I I think our next meeting is looking kind of full am I right yeah but what about the first weekend first meeting in March would that be yeah L is that is that doable give us a little time to get questions together if you have any questions please send them to me yes you know and so I'll do my best to get them addressed by hook or by crook by somewhere you know we won't leave you hanging to the last minute we wanted it to be a dialogue yeah yeah that's that's reasonable I agree thank you very much for considering it and the goal for that March
094meeting would be to kind of say y or n to the concept of historic district yeah I think if the if the board feels it's appropriate and it probably is that we um take a vote on it you know of how we feel um about the uh about the proposed bylaw yeah it's not I mean just so you know it's not mandatory that you folks vote on it for to go forward it's it's more of a courtesy in my from our perspective because we'd like to get the town behind us as much as possible so if it's yay or nay it doesn't really you know affect the proc you don't need it you're just I don't need it but I I would like seeing what the support is yeah I I like to I would
095like it you know could it very well um and I just an add though I appreciate because I if it's in front of us it's at least getting hopefully some more publicity and and that's what you want and we all want so thank you exactly great thank you thank you very much all right next on our agenda that's good we've been waiting for that one for a while we've been intending to do that next on our agenda discussion of the update to the flood plane overlay District um section 8.1 of Ashen zoning bylaws heer you can take this away sure thank you so uh first and foremost uh Alvaro is here tonight and he's helped us out a lot on this and also Becca Solomon our conservation agent is joining us online so I just
096want to uh point out and and thank Becca for jumping on this call um to update this this bylaw so um the flood um excuse me the flood overlay District uh was last updated in 2014 and that was done using FEMA Maps so from time to time which I actually have in front of us on this table so we can get up and walk around I know we've been sitting our chair for a while um so this past year um excuse me I lost my trans thought so from time to time I you know these these Maps do get updated and I put a little fact sheet together in our packets um and it just kind of talks about what the flood plane District bylaws are um and so I'm just going to kind of
097pull those up and so these have kind of been around since the late 1960s um and to do so um communities adopt the the regulations and then allows the community to take part in the uh flood insurance program um theoretically that that the government government provides um so with that said um Ashlin for numbers of years has opt obviously opt in we do adopt these maps and from time to time they are updated by FEMA Ashland is lucky enough to be in two um two watersheds um the conquered which is the asit sberry conquered uh Watershed in the Charles River Watershed with that said so with that said this past year year two um FEMA and the State Department of Conservation and Recreation um has been updating the Charles River Watershed and so we have
098uh two tiles of our Ashland's I believe 10 or 11 tiles um and I if I bring up um if we can look at the maps here if anyone wants to move around I can explain what the tiles are but two of the tiles are being updated the two of the tiles are within the Charles excuse me in the Charles River Watershed and so with that said um what we are being asked to do is to update our bylaw first and foremost and update the tiles right we only have to update two of our tiles um however uh the state has provided us with a sample bylaw um Alvaro and myself and Becca have been working um and so that is what you see in front of us here tonight so Peter try to interrupt
099but when you talk about tiles is that something we're seeing like is it these squares that we're seeing on the these sares is what you're pointing to on the desk the same the the squares that we're seeing up here so what we're looking at on the comp tile so with that said but can I can I just like is this that whole thing is whole thing is one tile okay so this is a tile okay got it so what we're asked to do and what we're asked which we' been asked to do update two tiles within the Charles River so this is what has in front of us and this is where I kind of email I sent in the email I sent out um and and Becca Solomon is here online and and Becca
100I'm gonna make you a co-host as well um so you can un mute yourself um and and and Becca and Alvaro and myself we've kind of looked at this stuff and we've analyzed it that there very minimal changes in the tiles from to 2024 so Becca please feel free to jump on and and fill in any blanks that I have have uh that I have uh I have not spoken about um about the two tiles and the updates and alvro will help point out on the screen with with the mouse uh and also we have hard copies here in front of us um and then we can go into the bylaws uh that are here in the binder so Becca do you want to jump in is talk to the Plenty board a little bit
101about the updates on on the tiles uh just to check you guys can all hear me okay yep loud and clear perfect so um I think the tiles you have up here are focused on the waren wood section you can see the Ashen Reservoir off to the left there um so the area that is shown in the red circles there that is a 500-year flood plane shown on the 2014 map in Black on the 2023 Maps they changed that to an orange area um you can see on the 2023 map they actually took out that 500-year flood plane as it goes through Warren Woods and across Prospect Street um towards Raymond way over there so that is the first change that's the more substantial change um the other Maps which I see we just switched
102to here this is in the corner over by hollison um and when you first look at this it doesn't really look like it's touching ashin um and you would be right in the 2014 map in the 2023 map it's very hard to see at the scale there's like two pixels of the blue which is the hundred-year flood plane which is now within Ashland um that's over by aeta Road over there so it's very hard to see um it's those two pixels are basically smaller than the size of a house so it's very very minimal of a change I can see someone zooming in even at that scale it's kind of hard to see but it's just basically like these tiny tiny blue over the yellow line those are the two yeah when they're like recording
103the date I guess with like a airplane I don't know maybe they're like taking the picture like the sample just looks so tiny at that scale but yeah that's what Beck is talking about right here this corner those are the only changes that I know it's very small those are the only changes that are within Ashland there's definitely much more substantial changes in Holliston and in other communities that are within the the Charles River Watershed um we don't have much of that Watershed in Ashland and as you can see now we have very little flood plane uh associated with that Watershed as well so Becca can you explain on the first tile again the one with the more substantial change what the change is from then and now is it just so sorry just the
104elimination of a flood zone is that yes so they eliminated a 500-year flood plane um so that would be with the 500-year flood um they took that out from uh the Warren Woods area so uh anyone who's a little bit more familiar with the names of the streams and everything over there that's jar Brook over there um and so the flood plane associated with with kind of the headwaters of Jar Brook in that area has been removed and the flood plane would not start until after you cross into hollist and and those are the only changes for for us those are the only changes with this update okay so it it seems I guess then what's happening to the bylaw then thew it's all yellow and green so the bylaw is the biggest change right
105and the bylaw is is the bigger update right I'm just going to take these back this the changes with the yellow and the crossing out it makes it look like everything is changing yeah okay explain this explain this to us yeah yeah so backer if you can hang with us because because you're this is you're a pro at this stuff so um so you're are correct right the biggest change is going to be in the bylaw so what the state did along as they when they rolled out these new maps for the child's River Watershed they updated the bylaws right and so our bylaws were last updated 10 years ago and there's a lot of updates that the state is asking us to put in so working with Alvaro and Becca we ended up taking
106the sample State bylaw right and our town bylaw and we updated it right and so we took a lot of um what they were what they're asking for and but there are some some situations where we have to kind of think about what we have to think about right um what you're first seeing is a list of definitions right the state is asking us within this bylaw to adopt regulate a list of definitions and that are applicable to this bylaw so similar to the MBTA bylaw we adopted the list we put it first and foremost right after the purpose and then we um kind of dive in and kind of jump into the bylaw um with this Alvaro and was so kind enough to work with me on this one today which was a real
107which was a couple you know a couple long hours um what we did right is we ended up taking the old bylaw right and them plugging in the new language and verbage from the state sample bylaw underneath it right and so everything in red is struck and that is the existing bylaw right if you can see on this sample of the district delineation a lot of the verbage is the same however it was all chunked together so what I tried to do is separate it the other thing I want to note which I did in this area is Ash's in two Weds so I tried to separate the two different watersheds to make make it more organized and more clear because back in 2014 the state updated both the conquered and the Charles at the
108same time we're on the same Maps right the maps spoke to each other at this point the maps are going to be with two different years right and so I just tried to clarify that um further down so further down just keep on going we kind of take out some stuff they update l language right they up they use updated language most of it from a ver it's a verb from a verbage standpoint it's very similar um Becca correct me if I'm wrong um but there there are a couple new things the one thing that really is up for discussion um and I think we need to think about is in the new state bylaw right as proposed there's very limited in indor no exemptions right in ashlin's current bylaw as it was in 2014
109there are exemptions right can you go back up Alvaro so just to explain this right here under the the the green right so the green is the existing bylaw right now we have seven exemptions within our flood plane overlay District bylaw right agriculture use forestry outdoor recreation Wildlife Management foot bike paths pretty I don't you know pretty I don't want to say common sense but uses one could see happening within a flood plane right then if you keep on going further down we do have a special permit application for any work within a flood plan can you keep on going down the purple right is the proposed language that the state says and what the state is saying in this instance is saying hey any work within that flood plane installation of a fence needs
110to get a special permit right and so a question that I I I want to lay it out for everybody is that do we want to use and I think it's appropriate to build in these seven exemptions that we have in our existing bylaw for installation of a fence and walking trails right or do we want to just say y you know this is what the state wants you know this is what they're recommending right um and then just to add one Nuance into this because there's always a Nuance is that it came to us right within some State trainings um that they're also going to look at the MB BTA how overlay districts and how flood plane overlay districts interact with MBTA overlay zoning districts right so going back to MBA MBTA zoning district
111one of the big elements of the MBTA zoning district is that there are those housing units are allowed by special permit right that you cannot have special permits on that property um if it's zoned MBTA so with that said alvro and I looked at where does the flood plane District interact with the MBTA District right and it was about six acres it interacted in two spots right it was a little bit on the Burnham's parcel and then it interacted with the uh 10 to 60 Main Street parcel right and so those are the two places it interacts but it's been suggested um that we build in an exemption if we do stand with if if we keep if we continue on with our s exemptions and then just continue on with our special permit as
112is today in our bylaw it was recommended that we build in exemption and we say no special permit uh shall be required within the MBTA overlay District's boundary just where that interaction takes place and so I did have to build that in the state has called it out on a couple occasions within their training sessions and I'm just looking to aide by so I think I mean isn't an obvious thing to update the M zoning to not like you so so I feel like that's there's a reason there's a flood plane overlay District this is this is serious right comes from federal government on down people study this they change it by like two pixels right it's not determined by Ashland and now we're like hey doesn't really matter because we did this law that
113you told us to and we do control where The mbta's Zing is so like I I um I think the obvious thing is not to just say hey go build there I think it has to be update of the NBTA zoning to take those out of it the six acres or whatever needs to be done easier said than done a lot easier said than done and then the two I you know we start discussing this until we're done with everything no I just wanted to point that out so as you continue down um they do everything in yellow here uh subdivisions um this 8.65 8.63 these are all accepted updates from the state uh proposed bylaw um so everything in yellow is directly from the state correct everything crossed out was our bylaw that we've
114updated that we've gotten rid of or that we're proposing to get rid of correct the ones in red that's crossed out correct the ones in red that are crossed out right the ones in green are what's what what's currently in our bylaw should keep that you're keep that proposing to keep that's what we're proposing to keep yeah uh Becker at this time do you have anything to add do you want to give your take I think it it' be great if you could give your take on the um on the update I know you've looked at it you know through and through y I just have a couple things to add um first just in regards to areas that aren't going to be um that you'd have exemptions and waivers for a lot of that
115stuff is still going to be reviewed by say the Conservation Commission because fences sheds things like that they're not exempt from the wetlands protect ction act and flood plane um in a lot of those cases so there will still be review there will still be permitting um they still have to provide compensatory flood storage for that stuff so there are still protections within the flood plane um this bylaw is more to give um you all a little bit of uh jurisdiction and input on that as well and then the other thing I wanted to add um I know there's a couple crossed out sections I see them on the screen right now some of that we crossed out because the state actually provides a revised language for it in a separate section further down so
116just if you're seeing a couple things on there and you're like why are we getting rid of that um we had looked through the state proposed language and um there's a couple things in there you can actually see cross out number five is about subdivisions and you go down a little bit in the yellow to 8.1.6 and there's an entire section on sub divisions that's been added instead um so just keeping that in mind that might answer a few questions in advance hopefully as well that's a great Point Becca and that's exactly you know taking subdivisions out we just added it in its own section and so if you do look at the state at the and and we can send out an example of how the bylaws written today how this interacts with it
117um and everyone can kind of take a look at it but we've just tried to go through it um reorganize it color code it obviously um to try to give everyone the best information possible um like I said the map Parcels excuse me the tiles um they're fairly minimal changes um when the state comes through with a update to the conquer River obviously there'll be more changes to the flood plane in Ashland just by fact that we have more tiles and more land area within that conquer River Watershed than the Charles River Watershed so it's almost like we're doing this heavy lifting with the bylaw today right um which will'll hopefully make for tomorrow with the update to the conquered a little bit easier where we would just have to accept the tiles as they
118were up but the biggest discussion points and to think about are keeping the bylaws and the exemption and the special permit as they stand or taking a look at what the state is proposing um in having that discussion I um I don't remember what the what's pink here purple there what what is that what was the code for that so that is the state's proposal yeah which is the discussion point between the existing exemption and the special permit process so it's not currently in our bylaw and it's correct part is what is there and we could keep keep or we could switch it for the thing in purple so in that case everything on green on that section will be stried out and we will insert the Lang the verbage in purple that makes more
119sense uh a little bit and then is there anything that the proposed state bylaw had that whoever you Alvaro um in Becca determined don't don't care don't want Ashlin to look at so they there were no we took no I'm just asking I no we there was some things that were not applicable to ashin that we did not you know sand dunes we have no sand dunes in Ashland we have no barrier beaches in ashon right so those were non-applicable but everything else was built in um and and we you know we we looked at it together I can you can take this bylaw here that we have and Alvaro we made notes on it and it says C State 13 right and if you in within the pack the information that we sent out
120it's the state model bylaw and it will say 13 boom so you can kind of Mi you have to mix them you have to mat you can we've matched them up we've done the hard work right we took the state bylaw we reorganized it matching it to what ashen's existing bylaw is right right however there is this topic that we have to look at um there's new items right um you know and I just just for a point of you know conversation it talks about recreational vehicles right and you'll you'll find this in you know in I think at uh 8.1.9 8.1.9 what a recreational vehicle is a recreational vehicle is a Winnebago right and so the state is saying if you're going to park a Winnebago in a flood plane right you need to
121have it anchored right so if a flood ever comes a Winnebago doesn't go down the river no pun intended right so that's a new element that the state's asking us to put in or you don't park your Wago in the flood plane um and so that doesn't mean you can't park your car or a everyday vehicle such as a truck but you know they're they're starting to look at campers um RVs I guess right um when bagos so everything was brought in Kate from the state and it was just organized in a way to meet what Ashland has in its current bylaw green is current green is current my question is you mentioned that the Concord One Is Yet To Come and that's where the larger chunk of ours kind of by doing this edits
122at this point and not knowing what's coming down the pipeline is this like safe time to update this or should we uh wait because if that's what has a massive Impact versus the child's which is literally pixel count I don't I don't know if I have a yeah where I'm saying is there a kind of a timeline necessity that this needs to get updated Now versus wait till the next map comes in I believe so because I was on the training for the with the DCR today and they said that they wanted to see a update by was it July 8th they want to see towns within the Charles River Watershed updated and and just to clarify like there were two changes to the tiles the little two pixel one and the the area that
123was eliminated but we have a lot more flood planes oh everywhere they just and that's what this that's what this is all about correct the ones all those ones that are left correct correct 100% you can't park you in a bag so this bylaw would pertain to the entire town right those two I'm going to call them Squares tiles are just updates within the Charles River Watershed Basin and what's the process between us and conservation like obviously it's a bylaw so it has to it's a zoning bylaw so it has to go through planning board but conservation is looking what were we talking about that it's kind of a team eff right Becca is our conservation agent start tree Warden um Bec is very knowledgeable on wetlands and but this doesn't go through conservation no
124no no so it still would require planning board you know if there was work to be done within the bylaw I mean within the flood plane it would still require planning board however if work is done within comc com's jurisdiction correct me if I'm wrong PKA a lot of this stuff would be triggered with conservation's approval in hand so this is one of those areas where conservation and planning are always going to have a re are going to have a review theoretically of the same of of very similar projects right um indor projects are going to go to both committees per se Becca is that a good way to explain that or yeah I think that's a a good way to explain it and just to bring it down a little bit more into comparison
125terms it would kind of be similar to how the planning board and conservation um both look at storm water right now obviously the planning board has a a certain level of jurisdiction on storm water review um as does conservation and that's shared um so this would be a similar situation where you would have a a certain amount of riew over the the flood plane and conservation has our own regulations under the wetlands protection act to deal with as well okay so this isn't this is something that goes through planning board not something that goes through conservation and that's like is this something conservation needs to take a look at orte this is just coming from the state so I think it it goes both ways right it's coming from the state right it's it's a
126federal update to the FEMA Maps right DCR is the one that is being the conduit of this information and the DCR flood plane Management Group um it does touch obviously conservation and Becca and and kind of it and it kind of blends to her expertise regarding the flood plane and wetlands however this is a local bylaw and it's a zoning bylaw so it do still kind of fall within the realm of the planning yeah I get that it's it's in our jurisdiction I'm wondering just that um in the same way the historic commission is looking for support for a bylaw you know it seems like a bylaw that would also you know that conservation might be interested in looking at and saying that it's well written and yeah no uh you know um is anyone
127else well I think that Essence that's why Becka and Al myself are all working together right we're all talking about it but you know obviously um we can I'm sure Becca can take this to the conservation a I mean the conservation it's an an appropriate process you know for to gain support make sure there's no thing left out well so along that lines in the green on like 8.1.4 if this is the current exception which potentially we that's one of the topics right but it just says um you know there they're basically saying they're going to be allowed but there's no reference to like conservation commission other rules overriding this and I feel like you know conflicts aren't good if someone wants to challenge I'm like no but you you approved a bylaw it says
128I can do this and why put the town in that position I feel like that if that stays probably needs to be at least looked at from that angle what number was this 8.1.4 uh so are you through the through the board if I can just chime in for a second please I'm not sure if it's on the version that's on the computer on the screen right now um there it is um so in 8.1.4 in that kind of introduction paragraph where it says um GL chapter 131 section 40 that is the citation for the wetlands protection act okay I think we had discussed Peter um putting it clearly in plain English wetlands protection act and then putting the general law citation um in parentheses um I'm not sure if this version had that update
129or if we decide to take that out um but that is a citation for the wetlands protection act saying that to um to to be able to get these exemptions you do have to be in compliance with both that and the building code thank you Becca um I'm curious so we said that either it's everything highlighted in green or the one that's in pink purple is that what we said or is that not that's just the base this is the starting this is the start of the conversation because lot of the information that's highlighted in green is not all covered in those four lines I'm just curious like um for example the timeline on the receipt of application and under special permit that's not all covered in this in these four sentences it's kind of
130very specific about the use um and in addition to the seven uses there's obviously some language in the special permit about where the special permit is so I don't know if it is Apples to Apples replacement it feels like it meets or am I not understanding this correctly just one note I don't it's not all the part in green is just section 8.15 or the purple one so the purple one will just replace a 1.5 not a 1.4 okay but then that does not again talk about the within 10 days of receipt for example the line item two so this is not getting covered there so I didn't change any of that that's how our bylaw reads today so what we're seeing is we are still going to keep some sections of this and we
131don't have to keep I didn't change a thing okay right so it still needs to be scrubbed right still need needs to be discussed but I didn't take what I what we tried to do is say okay this is what we got now we tried to organize it format it so it's readable so we can discuss it so sections okay exactly colors will be good so this is just we can change it we can manipulate it we can discuss it but this is just kind of the start the Baseline of the conversation what's our goal tonight Peter this is a lot to digest what do you this is it really if I think we can just take this it's we digested it took it in think about it bring it back okay and then go
132from there right that's it I think this is the state is asking to do this um if we can work through this process and get it to town meeting great if it's going to take longer you know don't put me on camera with the state but we going to fall Tomy right um I I think we should worked through it's just a lot to digest all at once it's a lot to digest at once this is it I just wanted to start the conversation okay we just kind of like wanted to make it clear with the colors and everything so now you actually can see what we're changes that we're suggesting the word c is a good one here I know I know you sent this out I I don't remember if it was a
133we haven't sent this out we're going to send this out we send you did you see such colorful prints I say can you send it out as a we're going to send that out the doc like I I I just have trouble with the no I think the printer the green dots there is little it's better to read better yeah yeah so what we sent out I sent out a little fact sheet she can be a loose warrior in this Cas right a little fact sheet came out on on the email on Friday this little fact sheet came out and it was just to provide a baseline okay what is FEMA what is the flood zone what are we talking about here talking about those Maps Okay right talking about those Maps Regal flood insurance
134big programs right we're talking about an update to two tiles out of all of Ashland right and we're talking about the state provided us a baseline right we're taking that Baseline and we've compared it to our current bylaw and that's it right we're just starting the conversation and Becca is here to kind of help us as a conservation agent kind of guide the conversation so that's all I had to think that's all we need to talk about tonight about flood plane overlay good stuff yeah yeah a lot of homework to do between historic and this yeah and I think this is one of the elements obviously we deal with a lot of applications this is an area where dealing with something that we don't deal with often and from and I do not deal with
135the flood plane often right um Becca does a little bit more obviously due to conservation in the wetlands but also the please know within this by de facto The Building Commissioner is the flood plane manager right so he kind of has some say in this too so we're all kind of we all kind of work together on it in a certain way and it's just a matter of kind of of of doing the best we can all together um so Becca do you have anything to add before we move on I think you basically covered thank you for Jo I had one quick question sorry I'm curious about this MBTA one and what Kate just said is does it make sense to kind of look at it with this package versus looking at it as
136part of MBTA guidelines and if you've kind of looked into that at all so so I we have a little bit right and I don't want to go down this huge rabbit hole with MBTA in Ashland well Ashland you need right all communi need 50 acres a minimum of 50 acres to be zoned MBTA in Ashland we have 56 acres and that was done strategically to keep low density to take advantage of what we have had permited and what has been built right the MBTA bylaw was also built around on Cirrus right Cirus is the backbone and what makes ashon comply because half of our district is has to be contiguous thank you I was looking for that word right and so that's what kind of makes us and that has kind of squeezed us
137down we did a lot of We've ran a lot of numbers to make sure cus on its own is our number one contiguous 50% area right it works right now it works how we have it if we start adding more if we say okay we're not going to put an exemption in for for for um for excuse me for for the flood plane right we have about a little over six acres of land right between 10 to 60 and a little bit maybe about a I think it's 0.3 I think it's so you lose that cushion that you've built into that NBT that's where you're getting so you lose it okay SO3 Acres of over at Burns very small numbers here right within that flood plane District right so if you say hey no exemption
138that means we're going to have to go out and find my eyes six more Acres exactly however you still have to go back and look at the principles of the NBTA bylaw right you have to have 50% your toal whole acreage has to be contiguous on one lot right and so therefore it's it's a lot like what Trisha said it's a lot it's not easy it's not easy the thing and the thing is I think the the areas where these the areas that we chose for all the MBTA and it's and particularly these two 10 to 60 no matter what this does no matter what be MBTA does there's a proposal in front of the zoning board right now or does it will it go through we don't know for sure right but is this
139the point to change our MBTA because I mean this 40b overrides this right this doesn't stop 40b correct and also I mean because that whole thing is in I don't think 40b over overrides flood plane with so that is I don't think correct so with that said 10 to 60 is also going to have to go in front of conservation right and and meet conservation requirements with this right um so it's something to think about I think it would be very hard to to to I think it' be very hard to take the principles that we built the MBTA byar on right and try to thread the needle without going back out and having to do the whole you know to really rethink everything but I think the importance is the whole reason why you
140have a flood plane right if if if MBT yes that has its own consequences but I think the whole reason why you have this on the larger part of the plan is to make sure you preserving those natural resources and if we are saying just to protect that MBTA uh plan we are ignoring and giving that room for that six acres to be just slide it in I am just curious like how does that really work right I I would just make a comment that I don't think it was like ignore because when we were looking at the MBTA there was also the sensitive layer that it was part of that process so we were looking at zoning over it it was part of the NBTA exercise to look at it and make sure that
141that was a red flag area it will still be included in the MBT like it will be still allowed to be sewn for development within the under MBTA regulations because it always will fall back to conservation to take a look at that in for like so you do have that backup yeah it was not so it's not correct to say that it was totally ignored when we did M we didn't pay attention to that we had a backup of the conservation aspect yeah cuz let's say like you take like a and I know like this is because I talked to Becca that like if you take and like you like change a cubic feet of that that will have to be recreated under like a certain area and that will be something that conservation up
142look all the time okay maybe for the next discussion we have on this can you um show us on a map those those six acres like that you know where those are so does our current put bi this is where I'm going to the green so but does it require can you say that again I don't think there's an exception for the MBTA right now it specifically say so it basically Falls within a gray area but we are adding that as one of our line items under special permit in this package like right now because you have proper in all right it's a gray area right now because you can't have permits I think that's what I'm trying to make sure that I understand that currently our by lot says that because it's not in
143and it's just because MBTA is new this is new it's just one of those things that need to be reconciled reconciled correct clarified all right so is it okay if and and an it on online jump in if if ever you have a question but otherwise are we okay um taking in all this information and finding our next appropriate open space to to go at it again my brain can handle it no I know it's getting late no it's just that it's it's just a lot of information yes it's just a lot of information um does anyone have any questions though before we do that okay if not we don't even have to officially move this week no nothing to okay so thank you so much Becca thank Becca all right so next heavy hitting
144topic on our list um accessory dwelling units why not good stuff next discussion of how to modify our bylaw for those at home had a discussion about how to modify the Ashen bylaw for accessory dwelling units to uh be in line with the new state regulations re um allowing them by right in single family home districts so that's where we're at um Peter do you want to just give us an update about the work you've been doing I think Anna has been doing some work as well sure so a couple things we talked about this at the last PL board meeting there was a couple principles that we did pull out of that conversation um number one um correct me if I if I miss this step is that we wanted to um make sure
145that we were only allowing one Adu bylaw law on a per lot to amend to the bylaw I mean to to um as discussed um you mean you mean one protected Adu per lot correct per lot yeah per lot um so that was built into this into this um we did talk about the the distance allowable um for a parking space right now the um the regulations state that if you are within or the parcel is within a half mile of train station Ando here in ashon a bus stop um you do not have to build the parking spot um we talked about Anna cor me if I'm wrong moving that to a mile yes I think we reached consensus at the last meeting okay that no parking space shall be required at the parcel
146of land is within one mile of public transportation okay did Anna get did you send out this I haven't sent out this map actually I had ask Alvaro to do this today so this is new for everybody so regarding that conversation I just kind of wanted to geographically show everybody um where the bus stops were and where the train stations are so um obviously the train station here in Ashland is on Pleasant Street um which is right here and then you also have the train St station over in Southboro um and then you have two bus stops at along 126 one at the Market Basket Plaza one at the um the Shaws Plaza there is a bus stop at cus development which is RTA and then there's two bus stops here in the downtown so
147geographically I thought it would be helpful just to be so deplick um those stops um in the train stations um just to confirm everybody uh see those from a geographical representation Anna are you able to see the screen yes I can see it okay so obviously there's the difference the inner circles the half mile the Outer Circle is the mile um like I said we just put this we were able to put this together soon so I apologize for not sending it right out um right away my only question is um are these walkable when you make that one mile radius are these walkable to those bus stops or train stations because we don't have sidewalks everywhere in Ashland and this is as the crow flies and not as a person walks it's a different
148thing talking about the number of units and why the possibly the5 mile radius was set in place to begin with because not you don't want people walking on the streets in Ashland if it's not meant to be so are we triggering other challenges with increasing this radius yeah I'm I'm not I I think that's a really good point and I think also um when I think about okay if like if you're not part of riding a parking spot yes there's definitely some people that even if they're a mile out won't want a parking space but I would say the majority will want at least one and if it's a couple living there they could have two and that's all then parking on the street you know those for those cars versus providing off street parking
149so I think that's a little concerning you know to me um so the question is though um we aren't saying they cannot provide parking we're saying the consideration is requiring right right I'm just wondering I'm just thinking a mile out and that's showing it like I said by the crowfly so likely someone's walking typically more than a mile in most cases um might I I don't know I I'm not sure I think that's a good idea and the other thing I think you were searching for Peter just to throw it out there is that we had decided no short-term rentals that's true as a part of this at this time that's true yep those are added in so what I did do I did um take a look at a couple sample bylaws I pulled
150some things out um I looked at our existing bylaw um and then I created um what's in tonight's packet which is an example by so um I was able to send this over to Anna I know Anna took her look uh put her eyes on it um obviously this is just being developed within kind of um the development stages and again I think tonight I'm just trying to get everyone's you know I think the biggest goal here is just to present some ideas some discussion points everyone can got take them back take a look at it and then kind of continue on so um drafting a bylaw that obviously fits the town of action um so my yeah and I I'll add I did review Peter's uh draft and I thought that it was good
151um obviously we need to kind of confirm our consensus I I personally am not disturbed by the one mile issue you know if there's not consensus I'm okay with the0 five it certainly this this map just shows me that we're kind of being super flexible relative to adus um we can also go three qus of a mile it doesn't need to be half a mile or a full mile it can be something in the in the middle if we wanted to find a compromised position but I'm also okay with the half mile um I think the one thing that wasn't clear for me in Peter's draft I think for setbacks we wanted adus to conform to existing setbacks and that language Peter I just want to make sure it's in your draft Yeah know I
152think I that's one thing that I know um we need to look I needed to add and the only other thing is your bylaw draft did not mention the perming authority like who would the people go to is it the Building Commissioner so it's going to be the Building Commissioner yep so we should probably add that to the bylaw those are my only two kind of changes or three I guess what's our consensus on the parking distance let's add the pering authority and let's make sure it says clearly what we agreed to on setbacks and I think with those three changes Peter's draft is in my opinion worthy of public comment at our next meeting did I lose you guys no we're all in the room we're just reviewing than you I'm just thinking about
153the parking distance um I'm thinking about like a day like today and I feel like a half mile is a whole lot more dual than a mile poten as the crowfly is potentially longer than a mile and thinking about like what would realistically happen in that situation and the increase in like overnight street parking and the string that would put on fire and plows and everyone would try of do we have a bunch of cars that are not lawfully parked in what looks like a whole lot of town with the one mile radius versus sort of a much more manageable swap of town at the half mile yeah yeah what I what I wonder is okay yes it doesn't mean they can't they can provide parking if they want to but I'm afraid it gives
154especially for people who are doing it as a rental and not not for a family that it gives kind of an out like okay I don't have to construct another parking lot parking space which is obviously it's a little bit more money to provide it I don't need to have another car park on my property I don't up one of my own right I don't give up one of my own I I don't want someone else you know the renter parking on my property so they have no choice then to find a spot on the street which then it becomes the neighborhood's problem or the neighbor problem versus the person who put in the adus problem and I'm not sure about causing that kind of yeah we're a half mile seems much more plausible that
155they're like great I don't even need a car here awesome you know so I get that agree especially looking at like the just how much of town is covered by the one mile versus yeah one thing we can do is we do have a a a sidewalk layer a g sidewalk layer so particularly we could lay that sidewalk layer you know and then um and then come in a little bit closer you know and I think what I think you know let's be realistic here uh Kate you live pretty close here right and there's this area obviously I'm just going to take this and and look you know behind the Market Basket Plaza right um I know there is a trail there it's a well-used trail okay so that's a well used trail there um
156obviously that this neighborhood obviously could get to it so you you're saying okay there could be a plausible link here but then down in this area uh at at the Shaws Plaza you know well the area up into spy glass Hill and behind spy glass Hill right there's really no direct sidewalk access that could get you down there is a sidewalk now coming down well sidewalk access is one part yeah but the other part of it is this adus is also either it's rentals for young family or older population and the fact that now you're saying then this whatever distance want the older generation to go looking for parking spot on the street which may get challenging um and I think that's the other because the adus are meant for very distinct group of folks
157right it's not folks with larger families um so I'm I mean I know we talked about it last week but it feels like once you saw that map that one mile looks like Jun Ash I'd like to see the the sidewalks who said and I but the reality is we cannot require a parking space within5 miles and there's plenty of those places that people are going to need a car anyway and and so I think I I don't want to speak for but the raising is sort of like trying to make I think the board and obviously the state agrees with trying to promote adus and and so I I think I can see both ways as well but I think we have to not just quickly give up the one mile I guess which
158I don't care the board is doing but it there there's no way some of those people aren't going to need a parking spot in the 0. five miles for your point about specifically older people and we cannot do anything about it so do we move the needle right is and and try to make the mile if that encourages one more unit is that worth it right that we we cannot solve the parking issues because that was created by that of of um not requiring it doesn't mean they won't build but we cannot require if you're within 0.5 miles you're 100% correct right right and I and I think that I think that makes sense because that's that's you know uh walkable but I I I just I don't see it in the I don't I
159don't agree with it in the mile I think it's too far I think that if you're going to build if you're going to be if you're a mile away half hour a half mile to a mile away I think you can provide a parking spot in my personal opinion just one you know and these could easily be apartments for two people are we even owed to ask for more than one anyway I think is the way the law no I and I wouldn't ask for one more than one but I think you should be able to it's just one we just a discussion point it's all all I think that's all you know in the office looking at regulations looking other bylaws I know we talked about the half mile versus the mile I just
160thought having a geographical representation would would just kind of is a different way to look at things and so that's why we kind of produced it um looking at the bylaws we're just trying to draft them up obviously there's edits to be made and we'll make those um and it just kind of it's to you know I know just to kind of get everyone's head you know wrapped around you know what what is coming um coming up for bylaw changes I mean it's super helpful are you publishing any of these because people like that is part of we're talking about it we're planning on being in Spring and that's how you bring the public along we've we looked at this stuff and we didn't come to a decision yet but like by the time it's
161presented them we will but these are super helpful so hasn't been published yet you know this is just this was in draft you know it was just kind of here as a discussion tonight this was just made this week today right and so but we can right it's a discussion Point 100% it's a tool why don't we include it the toolbox I mean if we it sounds like a helpful thing to include when we publish the draft we should include that as part of our reasoning it it seems like we're really close to to that point like like I said if we make those changes I'm okay with a0 five in light of what I'm hearing on the board the only other thing I was going to ask I guess the designers and Architects on
162our board is I think some communities have created almost like guidance of what the Adu should look like are we going to sort of leave that alone and come back to it you know once we have something in a year or two and we can see how it's going do we want to create any kind of design recommendations you know the ashin should it look a certain way downtown versus on 126 I to share my opinion on that and is that is the biggest thing that I my one of my takeaway points is that the state is saying is that if you don't do that for a single family house then you shouldn't do it for the Adu right and so we do not have designed guidelines for single family homes so I think we
163can do the best that we can to kind of say that this should you know be reflective of a housing unit and obviously should be connected to the principal structure but I don't I I just I'm hesitant of going full on design guidelines on edu when we don't have them for a single family house yeah I'm wondering about that too I'm trying to think how you would do that like you know you could say you know the ad you should match the existing house but you may not want it to in some cases I've certainly seen additions that were better than the original House you know I think the market is now getting flooded with lot of preab prefab uh modular units which are like absolutely stunning um and they absolutely fit in the square
164footage that we're looking so I think we should not narrow ourselves down and they may be cost effective options as well out there so I don't know if it's too early to even think of design components for this at this stage I'm okay with that yeah I my my designer mind says yeah there should be a way to write this but I I don't know what it is you know to get the result that I would like just a takeaway point is you know these structures if new if if detached right in or detach or within right the principal structure they still have to meet fire code right they still have to meet they still have to have a foundation they still have to be they have to meet building code energy code energy codes
165you name it um this isn't going to be you're not gonna like I joked around the other day I said you're not going to go to Rees fery right and grab a shed and say okay I'm G to turn this thing into a you know that re said does not meet building code right does not meet fire code so if you are going to build one of these or whoever's going to build one of these in their backyard it is still an expensive addition right and I tiny houses are not anymore yeah they that it's like 75,000 dollars for like 750 square feet or something like that that I literally saw so there are a lot of options out there there options and also they're going to have to meet sanitary code for of Health
166that's true what are you going to do with your septic system if you're on a septic system right and and so there's a lot of you know questions that have to be added to before you say okay I'm going to build one of these yeah um I have a question on that where the 7.64 on the sanitary sewer Adu shall have meters for um both water and sanitar who are separate from the principal dwelling but you're allowed to have an Adu in the dwelling so that seems correct not right and not in keeping with encouraging these so but with that said the DPW made the suggestion that they would like each unit to have its own separate me but when you have a like I mean I guess I've owned a two family unit and
167had one sewer pipe like I I think we're asking for so much more and I don't think that's the intent like there's no way around that because that's maybe it's just a water maybe it's just the I'll double check with I'll I'll I'll talk to DPW again um but they wanted a meter because each unit right one unit could be rented they would they wanted each each unit on a separate meter meters can probably be separate it's connecting to the same main sewer line maybe the same well the sewer doesn't no but the sewer they're saying a separate sewer connection sewer doesn't have a meter water does okay yeah what I mean is it's connected to uh the meters can still be separate yeah but it says a separate sanitary sewer and I I just
168I don't I think a lot of times the the homeowner would possibly want that but if it's you are allowed to have it in your house right it says that and now you're putting a roadblock that is not helping get an Adu okay maybe my language is wrong I'll double check with DPW and make sure I kind of I I mean why do they need two meters like I can't we encourage two meters but not require can we be like yeah that's what I'm leaning some things like that too feels a little restrictive I can uh I can ask DPW yeah yeah let's get dpw's input and and why like the why recommendation and why it was recation when we talk I talk to him about it yeah so we can understand it better yeah
169I can I can we can we can dig into that we also look into what NAIC is doing because I'm not sure that's the thing so like why are other communities not doing versus US yeah I think um I don't know Anna but that's a good point Y I mean it seems like we're really close to to kind of having this wrapped up if we wait another meeting are we going to lose the ability to present it at the spring no okay yeah we to have the two public we'll set to do public hearings and it's it's still February can you guys um make like a schedule yeah like schedule it out for for both of these bylaws kind of going simultaneously or whatever so that we can make sure we stay on track know
170the drill yeah just going back though to the water and super connection the big you know DPW does every te right every connection to the water system right is a point of weakness right it's a point of it could it's a potential point of failure right so they they don't want to expand on that you know they don't want they're not saying oh okay put a separate tap into the street to the main they just want you to continue that tap off the street but when they got to the meter if you're doing an addition right and or if you're building a detach structure right you're creating an old meter if it's a separate meter pit whatever it is and we'll dig into a little bit more but say if it's a detached it's at
171least giving you a gate valve you can shut that off at but you're so you're saying they there's already the house a structure is there that's what this is something has to be there with a with a water connection correct so they would prefer a new one or they wouldn't prefer a new one so they would prefer if if you went with the edu they would prefer a second new meter off of your main coming in not not off of the from the street what you're saying they're not saying pull a new main in right they're saying and I think in some instances because of the added load you may be having to upgrade the main coming off the street right so if you have a 1inch main and you're looking to do a detach
172structure from a pressure standpoint you may have to upgrade to a 2-inch main correct not my wheelhouse but depends on the square footage so the 900 ft compared to the main house that square footage may decide whether you need to go to larger Branch majority of the times I don't think it's yeah because I think most people have probably an inch main coming ho a thought we'll dig into it with the DPW but it's just something to think about I mean can and I think just one more thing about that like it might be if it's a separate structure we asking but if it's in if it's in an existing structure that has it I think it just makes it much more difficult and I think we've all switched to saying let's go and get
173this and make it as reasonable as we can I agree so okay there there could be an option right that might meet DPW but still help I guess too so it's a question um also to understand it if it's a separate structure or if it's an kind of an apartment within a house right two kind addition versus Adu right in that case wouldn't that become like an addition I think it's addition versus an detached yeah detached versus something enclosed or it could be I could see like a a third floor attic space being changed into an Adu it's fully encompassed into the existing house and roof and now how do you you know now what's the easier I'm not going to wear my cord hat there a lot of the additions used to be like
174how like family so in that case maybe like a extra meter didn't didn't make sense because they will share like the water bill like internally or something like that but now that you could potentially rent it or something like that maybe that's where DPW is like thinking yeah I mean it would be good just to understand um especially um safety maintenance concerns I mean obviously I think it's we up to kind of the homeowner like do I want to charge one rent and yeah then they can use as much Heating and Cooling and water and whatever that they want or hey they're just going to pay on their own if they use more than they pay for more right so there kind of pluses and minuses to both um but for the DP for the
175DTW stance that's I think what we have to pay attention to all right okay all right so next on the are we are we good with that topic yep I'll all right for now okay um and yeah that calendar would be very helpful just to keep keep us on track this spring um okay discussion of the planning board open seat um I don't think this is anything it's not really a discussion of the seat it's more just a discuss an update about what's happening so um right now we I believe we put a placeholder on select board correct at this point we have one uh we've received one Talent Bank form uh from man uh to fill the open seat uh we do have a placeholder uh on the select board um I have their
176agenda I've actually drafted up an agenda for next Wednesday night I know through conversation Amanda will be driving back um so the question is and I leave a attrition to carry the conversation um does the Plenty board want move on this and and how what's the best path forward well my uh um question was my um we have two opportunities to get this done and it has to be done our our next meeting is the last opportunity to to do it to approve a member to fit otherwise we just have to otherwise we just have to wait until the election right so um which isn't not terrible right but um so but I thought if we have enough members we have to have at least three of the four of us on the select board
177meeting at whatever time we designate um to look at um to look at the candidate if you know that I thought we would we would keep a placeholder there if it works out and it kind of be it might be a little bit ma last minute thing if it's going to work out right so I was kind of looking for people's availability you know otherwise we will definitely we will just kick it to our meeting on the 27th so so I'm asking I guess from the four of us is there if people want to look at their schedules can they and I think the select board is probably pretty flexible about the time we do it the time set on the select board agenda at this point is at 9:40 okay 9:45 so it' be
178checking in is that on the N the 19th y the 19th I have a draft I have their draft agend P up to um there were no applications with advertisements is that it's out there it's it's been but we but there is no closing date on the application so um I not that I want to necessarily stay up that late but I know I might be stuck at work so if they stick to the 945 is then well I can actually remote in anyway REM If It Moves too much earlier I'd be reluctant to 100% commit I would absolutely try but need to work um the last time I was doing a bid my boss is like why didn't you finish this and I'm like it's 9:30 at night he's on California time so okay
179yeah so uh and and if it happens that we have to just hey we can't get a quorum we can't get their select board sorry we have to kick it um then that's what we'll do but I'm just saying if if if two of you tell me tonight Trisha no way no how I can't do it then it's a done deal we can't do it because there's only four of us and three of us have to be there um 19th works for me so this would be Wednesday the 19th right before you go to bed could even be in your PJs and how does that look for you possible it's in theory possible yeah this is the 19th which is a Wednesday Wednesday the 19th probably late on the agenda 9:45 and can be virtual
180right can be virtual y virtual I shouldn't have a problem oh what did you say 74 Oh I thought you said 9:45 7:45 oh yeah I mean if it's like a virtual thing I should be able to make it yeah be it would be 7:45 on the selectboard that's what I have slated as um is 745 is that better or worse for you I mean it's worse because I'm dealing with California people for for the bid stuff so it's only five there but I will try and it's also shouldn't be long so I could maybe say sorry I have to do this so I would assume it would be short I will definitely try and it's a possibility it makes it a little harder okay 100% all right so um but it sounds like maybe
181we would have three anyway um like I said it can be remote um and that would only be the case if we only have one candidate if we have other candidates it would immediately be kicked to our second meeting because we just can't do it that way then so okay so we'll keep that on there well I'll say that would it help anybody if I reached out to the to the cboard office and tried to move things around as far as a later time no okay well I just look at you know I said 8:4 7:45 8 o'clock update with there see Jim neelon so I could try to flip things but I would just stay with 7 let's let's keep it where it is for for now it can always get pushed later if
182need be right correct so okay so we'll give it a shot otherwise it'll be on our agenda in two weeks okay next week this is next week this is next week but if get okay and that's the select board meeting but if it doesn't work at the select board meeting it'll be on our agenda in two weeks in the select board they'll have to come to us again got it so which they've been pretty generous about doing so okay that's that um and then okay so Kate these were items that you added in I think one was of more maybe more higher priority than another do you want to take over well so I I know if we weren't slammed we're trying to use time for planning and it's our meetings are long so I
183I went back to that list and I think the 8A site plan review timeline was mostly with Peter and Alvaro and I wanted to see if there's something the board could do to help and if we were going to Target the spring that is like a formality but I think it would help everyone particularly planning department right yeah um so can can you just say the bottom line of what this change would be it would be a very simple change right now our site plan bylaw calls for I think you have to open up the public he within 30 days and what we' be doing theoretically is um however if you apply Master law regarding special permits it gives you 65 days to open up that public hearing process so in theory we' be changing
184that 30 days to 65 and that's it I mean I I would recommend we do that and try to get it on the spring because it's obviously easier and sometimes there's an application that has two anyway so it's kind of a no-brainer to to move it it's I agree 100% I think we brought this up it's just syncing up the site plan and the special paramit to talk to each other I think it's a simple move I think if we do have a couple bylaws on the Springtown meeting it makes sense to plug it in and and move forward so it doesn't mean we have to wait till 65 days you know because usually we try to handle things sooner than that if it's just a site plan review it makes sense to get it
185it just makes sense in my eyes it's also just for tracking it drive you I mean to me it's a no-brainer to put it on the spring be done with it's simple and since we're kind of doing a couple it's probably a good way to add it that that's I think it's with you guys though to yeah we can take care you know that's as simple you know I think with so much going on the last couple months with MBTA and this andly uh but we can draft that did we ask for enough placeholders or do you have to ask for another placeholder I can we can take care yeah that's not a big deal okay so um so at least look at that at our next meeting we'll just we'll piggyback that discussions of
186that public hearing for that with that's a public hearing and you know if we're going to do that to tell you the truth there's a couple other items site plan approval like the language it says for a it says for a for a meeting I would call that public hearing yeah um you know just clean it up yeah clean that s plan approval bylaw from a formality standpoint could be updated which just you know public hearing a butter notification things of that map okay so we will we will get that going yeah we get I can get that we can get that moving by the by the next planning board meeting uh or soon soon after okay um and the next one so this has come up you know a couple times in front of
187us but also just members of the public like I'm not an architect but the projects never seem to look like what was approved right and and I think we have lots of examples so we owe it to our community to kind of do better I think on that in ourselves um and so things do change and I think what made it clear is a very large project really isn't designed to that level and things change so a let's communicate that to ourselves and the public and then have a process that those changes are essentially recorded right and um so I I have um I attached there's many communities there's actually more but just sort of you know how they handle it and I I the decisions um that I think are what level of Change
188by the process like we do spend a lot of time on color so maybe that is but maybe other communities don't even care about color and they would say that's a small change right so so maybe that's not a good example but um the some of the other communities have very specific spelled out I think I think that gets hard it's like you're saying how can I describe something like that um I think the second thing is do we have a form or just um how how do they modify their application right if if um they're communicating have this change and then I think there's probably some deliver I'm thinking of the um the ash like I feel like they did that came I think that's what got me think too that came late but
189the presentation when we asked for it was quite good it was like here's what changed here's my little thing so I think it's us just making a process here's what I want from you right however that is um to me it's probably a separate form so it's not confusing it's just I'm applying for a change of review whatever and then what level of change I think is probably the more um the item that probably needs a little more attention um there are lots of examples and I I I know there are more I kind of just had to call it quits to get something turned in are these are these um examples that you're providing are they a part of these towns bylaws okay um often it looks WR into an approval well that's one
190way I'm thinking we could solve this and simplify what seemed more often is their procedures but I might have just found the thing that they're referring back to but I thought there was an interesting several communities had like almost like the um the the planning Department's reviewing and they're putting in our agenda and saying we're recommending this is a small change right we they they come to us with a recommendation then maybe that is the process right we don't have to listen where the board but they're giving their professional you know recommendation which might streamline in in one way um so they almost didn't seem to have I found a lot of it said the planning board the planning department reviewed blah and recommends on many different towns but I couldn't find their policy so
191I didn't put them in there but I do know that's a seems like a slightly different way to address I wonder if this is very similar to when as a designer when we submit permit drawings and it comes back with the permit reviewer's comments um the way we resubmit the packages with the comment and what was the action that the firm took to resolve that permit comments so it's a cover letter that we prepare every time we resubmit our drawings so I wonder if that's what we looking for like when have um presentations come back with updates in addition to what we hear there we have this as part of the package where it's a cover letter that talks about what are the updates from the previous ones so we can document it instead of
192creating a form not sure that's what we're looking for some of these towns say like they want to see red line plans like they say what to so I think the thing is like some of what gets redlined or discussed back and forth is none of our business that's with the building department right and so I don't want to get involved in that but I do care that something we approv gets built or we know about it ahead of time and talk about it so we can have a record of doing our job right it I I can point to many things around that isn't that and and that's not Co our meeting minutes uh no it wasn't at Asher it came they built something different and Peter and Trish kind of thought it was
193a little bigger something that should be brought to the board that's why they came back but that was that was already built not two PL and I I don't think that's great I don't think that's a good yeah I mean in that case I would say that you know and this is where trying to read through sometimes the list of everything that's considered a minor change is is almost everything about the building that sometimes I it feels like so I'm not sure like those changes were they were changes but they were changes that probably no one would spot except in a way except me because I was always looking at those elevations and studying the elevations and you know whatever and so that's why I noticed something didn't quite look the way I remembered it
194so um but they were still in keeping with the spirit of the building like like you know what I'm not saying that that's okay then I'm I'm but it's not the reason I it's not the reason I brought it to the board I brought it to the board because I think it should have been not because I thought it was a big change but because I thought it should be we should you know how do we deal with these type of things that's exactly why I want to keep going on this and I don't think it's super hard to solve but I think it it is it is for me it's to fairly represent to the public it's fairly represent to ourselves and if someone didn't think it mattered um as a developer we make
195the position that yes it does right kind of yeah so I think it's it's so it's about finding those and I don't know if it's a bylaw or in the in the approval you know I'm not sure where it goes or the inspection process right it's or the inspection process yeah that if you see a change like this if then that needs to come back to us um or you know to both um because the inspection should be part with reference to the drawings that's been approved that's how the inspection should be you as a design ER as an architect you were able to spot but if I was not having that design background and I went and spotted I probably would not even know that so until it's built into the actual process um
196and we are not involved in that right when the construction happens don't really go around I mean I it's not you must have we were only there for a certain a certain really it was like an invitation I'm like yeah I'd like to see the site you know well but they also they indicated that there was a point that I I got this approved by the planning board and now further designed that it was different submitted but we didn't see it right so there was there's several points to catch those things it's true it and it's a point of um then trying to figure out and this is where the whole question comes in that if when we approve these projects at 20% if that of course there's going to be changes of course every
197project I do is different from 20% versus 100% And of course we don't want every little thing coming back to the planning board that's all we'd ever do right so how do we find that line how do we Define it and how do we yeah keep kind of that we're a breast of of these changes you know type of thing so it's probably a longer discussion than we want to go to it 10:05 but you know I mean I I think that the towns that have process I like shrews berries because it it sort of says what like some examples of what dimen changes would be but it also says listen if you're going to make a change even if it's dimen you need to tell the planning board about it right but it doesn't
198require a planning board approval if the chair and the um planer decid it is dimin and that I think is like it takes the burden away from like the board at the meeting like if so for instance if you know the Asher had come to um you and Peter and said here is the deal you guys could have said this is di Minimus and it was all by the book and they had done you know gone through it the way that we lay out the process but it didn't sort of reopen because that was the other concern with that project like are we like re don't want the public thinking we're like reopening that project and sort of concerns around those things I mean I think that there's a way to do it and I
199like the way shb did it where they said these are some examples of dominous changes if we I we always feel strongly about things like material materiality like colors you know what are you using on the building that could be provided the process document very clear these are examples of not dominous changes when you were changing materials or colors or like that yeah and I think it could be I mean it I don't think it always just has to be it could be the chair and one other person from the board right well I was going to say I I sort of like that too but I do not like putting the burden on the chair who's you know and I don't um I think that it does need to have board I would not
200want to sub that to the Building Commissioner or the planning department not saying they wouldn't be involved but I do not want to sub that decision well and also I think sometimes like I said it could be just better with two sets of eyes it could be the chair and it could be a different person every time like when if it happens you know more than once you know the that just so there's a second pair of eyes and yet yep we agreed with this or we didn't agree so it had to come before the board or you know whatever but um so I guess what we're saying is we need to define a scale to these changes in some shape or form right like example in the Shrewsberry is very specific about U kind
201of um changes in hydrant locations parking space sizes so we it has to be quantitative versus kind of it's very loose on this though I mean if you look at number eight changes in sight or building elevations like well I I changed this doorbell that's yeah I I wasn't proposing like the um the language but I love your idea of saying it's also doesn't include because that's you you need guidance and I I would think it would be get down to kind of minimal that doesn't need more but I I don't think that means reopening either right and that um The Challenge would be to identify those elements right um for a developer to know that hey this Falls in this category so I have to go back check it out well I think what
202I like about the shuberry one is that it says we are going to decide whether it's dominous or not you don't get to De you have basically you should be defaulting to bringing anything to us if we say it's the Minimus then we don't you don't need full board approval well true but in this case like she said she walked into that space and noticed something different and then that's how it was brought up they would have had to say we changing this and it would be so for the Shrewsbury process like right in that instance they would have needed to do a form for I think in sh they do a modification say plan form and that goes to the chair of the planning board and that this to planner and they decide is
203this dominous not if it's not dominous then it goes to the and would actually be interesting to know if there's another part of this process because again what we saw at 20% isn't quite what looks like the the 100% CDs they're at 20% of design versus 100% of CDs that is night construction Administration that is night and day yeah that is night and day and then there are changes that can happen in the construction process right hey they got a new tenants now they have to switch the door you know whatever so there's actually two kind of levels here one when the final drawings are submitted to the Building Commissioner and then changes that happen during construction so the the one design we I almost think that should be a condition to submit them back
204to the board and we can decide what to do about it but why wouldn't we submit back to the board with a cover of changes let them put big and small let them decide simple they're going to do that anyway right that should be part of the process now the construction needs a little more work and that's where we're not going to be out there right but maybe maybe we should be starting to get more independent inspectors um but I I I mean just like you said that is part of their process anyway that happens nobody just makes changes on drawings without some record of them yeah so they already do that we're not asking them to do more work we are to submit it to us but we're not asking for more work per
205se so I feel like that can be an easy condition handled done we don't to talk about it more we're going to draft a condition for that and then the follow on is more like instruction yeah I think it's going to be trickier the one where you're reviewing construction drawings is going to be tricky because that's that's unless um unless we have something in there that approval will not will not be um you know whatever the the phrase is um with you know unreasonably withheld because because there will be you know can you imagine going through another series of meetings like you know like we really have to you know we have to be clear too about yeah but again nothing inside is under our purview so you really it already minimizes what we're actually
206talking about so you don't you don't need to make this onerous I mean they go through that process right and yeah that's true I I think that if I don't think we need to out guess and like what we're asking I think it's a very reasonable ask we need to be responsible on our end but I I think this would make it just much more professional and I hope never to hear from a resident why do these buildings not look like what you approve because we will be able to show why if it doesn't right now we cannot right and and again that is our job representing the public in Ash to get what we ask for Okay so I guess the next question and again I don't think we need to go any further
207with this tonight but we'll be like where is this is this in a is this in the information given to the contractor up front hey I want to do a project in Ashland and then it's put into the approvals is it in the bylaws like where is it documented and known um but again I don't really it's it's 1010 and we need to still do just at least through the meeting minutes so if we can hold on that thought Anna any thoughts from you are you good on that conversation okay sorry I forget I forget you there floating around in C cyberspace okay so um all right so we're discussing that any minimal reports on the any important reports on any of these topics since we're already at 1010 anything Peter or anyone else no
208I have nothing I um for Tower update yeah build a soccer field a parking lot the first meeting in March yeah that okay sounds like something different fun project yeah yeah it's a good it's a good project to feel a good project I think it it be good for okay great so um any other thanks you think are necessary to all right um then we can go to meeting minutes get those taken care of just one set from the 23rd this was uh was this the YMCA this was the YMCA meeting um I only had one sentence line 3031 um the dream of a regional YMC in this area has been dream for the entire 12 years he has been in this role do we really need that or if you want to document that
209maybe then we should take off the two dreams that is there in that sentence so just if you knock off the dream of in the beginning a regional YMCA in this area has been a dream for the entire 12 years he yeah yeah just simplify it a little bit didn't have anything El just clean it up um and just since we're talking about YMCA I've been forwarding a few emails um from really like I guess it's an individual but um related to CPC so he's been asking me questions and I've been sing there which I I think are good questions but we're also going to be sending those to the YMCA and we can discuss it obviously when the public hearing comes up those are those questions don't think I have anything else no other
210changes okay okay then um is there a motion from the board our first motion of the evening I make a motion to approve the minutes of January thir uh 23rd planning board meeting as amended second and a roll call vote Anna tminit I cathine Jersy I and Trisha Kendall I so those those are approved I think then we are at the end of our agenda woohoo anything else anyone has all right is there a motion to adjourn I will make a motion to adjourn at 1015 second roll call vote Katherine Janda and Trisha Kendall I so thank you everybody good good topics e e e