001e e e good evening everyone and welcome to the Ashlin planning board meeting of Thursday July 25th um we have one public hearing on the agenda tonight and that is for a cell phone tower modification but before we get to that I will call the meeting to order officially at 7:22 p.m. and first on our agenda after that is the clerk's report Kate thank you madam chair we have received one correspondant from the public since the last planning board meeting which was responded to by the clerk on behalf of the board great thank you next on our agenda moving right along is public comment so uh Peter I will let you manage all public comment if you don't mind sure so um prior to um moving forward to the one gentleman in the room that
002had public comment I just want to let everyone know that uh Mr Mark donon um who is at the microphone at the podium currently um he did submit a handwritten letter which is in everyone's binder tonight so uh with that said I will open public comment up uh in the room first to Mr Mark donon Mark I'm just going to turn the video on hold on a second has to unmute all right thank you okay thank you good evening mark he can stay M because his volume is going through the microphone so I'll just mute you real quick but you're good all right out in the cave back into the land good evening Mark Sony for9 haon roadms and thank you Peter for setting me up I did send in a piece piece of paper
003about zoning bylaws and I'd like to ask go go through the board that they uh what the youve been talking about you want to have Mee and everything and this is my way of saying that I want to be uh part of it so I sent in this to the planner Mr Peter there I'm the other day and this is what you got so if you can look it over I I will ask any I'd like I'd like to make a comment okay so I think this is um sort of good time in the second part of our meeting is like um a retreat about our work plan and the board has been thinking about I don't think we're quite ready to talk about any like attacking specific bylaws because I don't know if you
004saw the agenda it has many many things that Retreat and we'll probably have to prioritize but I assume some of them should be attacking bylaws right so I think when we get there they they absolutely we would want a public part of that process right and I think there's probably a way to integrate Mark with that yeah I think with with any obviously bylaws that we tackle the it it's required that the public be part of the process so yeah 100% And that's that's was one one of is is I wanted to hear and a little PS is to thank you Miss Kathy JK for your email back to me and my reply back to you it did help and this was the content that I sent up here to the U to the rest
005of the board here to continue on it's not just with the comprehensive plan it's going to be with the planning board because the planning board is part Zone and bylaws in their CH so I want us to come in and be involved in this together all every member either through EMA email Zoom meeting I I come up to my house and residence and do it inside there and and to work it through before you get to September 4th if possible September 4th is a big compreh hasive plan with the select board and I figure got to understand the regulations and everything to have a smooth talk over both with both uh boards that's why I want to get involved in with the boards themselves to to see CU I when I last time I did
006this was around 2016 2017 with the um pH base code got that pass in this town that's why I have some of the experience doing this and I wanted to show and give back to everything does that sound good to you Mr chairman well certainly we're going to be looking at zoning Mark but I don't think anything's going to be happening that quickly to September 4th we only have two me meetings in there um and one of them I know several of our members won't be at I I don't think we're going to get there that quickly to suggest zoning before comprehensive plan I think we're really looking for a little bit more the opposite process that comprehensive plan will help guide us on zoning so um it may not happen that that quickly but
007we are as as Kate said we are looking in our agenda for later in this meeting to to talk talk more more specifically you know starting to look at what are our goals with with zoning so that's all I can it's General but that's all I have right now so so when the planning board itself starts separate for what comprehensive plan is figure I can work with the plan board themselves and go with what you have with what I gave Trisha could I make a comment that I think will help Mark I I read your comment and there's there's some themes you seem to care deeply about commercial Ventures entrepreneurial businesses you have interest in that and as you can see part of our agenda for our Retreat later tonight includes things that relate to
008business whether it's zoning downtown for hotels or discussing bylaws for short-term rentals talking to um the ashin cultural Council about using art with private spaces there's things on our Retreat list that relate to business so my thought would be because you come to almost every one of our meetings you seem to have a lot of interest in planning is maybe see if you can help us find more information about some of the things that we keep talking about in our retreats in our meetings so if you're interested in accessory dwelling units which seems to constantly come up for us maybe help us find other community drafts of zoning so I feel like you come to every meeting you're very engaged you want to help us out if you pick one of these things that we
009keep talking about and give us memos on those things that would be a productive way to help us that that sounds agreeable and what I did write down on the pieces on the piece of paper that you all have K right straight from the from the town website is zoning regulations i c copied them so figure if you look into them that I I brought up there it might give you ideas where I am and how you said that Annie that and that's that is is my thicken but I figured if I try to upgrade so everything could be going forward together I would like to be in that group in that upgrade system yeah we don't uh we don't have a specific plan about how we're going forward uh yet but um but we
010have your document and so uh obviously we'll be here discussing it at other times too so you'll be able to follow the progress on where we're going with this so and I my last comment after after Peter go ahead no please mark oh I would like to have an answer either through email which you do have somebody on the board has and and um either that or um let's see through zoom and that is this 101 whoever wants to keep up with this with me and I'll be I'll be caual and social and applying my ideas with the board so we be on the same track well Mark you know I'm always happy to meet with you so you know we can schedule a meeting and sit down and go from there but and then
011I can kind of translate back to the planning board um but obviously I think you know we're still working on the comp plan together and we do have a list of agenda item you know on the items that we want to talk about later tonight so I think we can keep our minds open and and hopefully move things forward progressively and I will keep my mind open for compromise and we all can be together on it all right thank you Mark thank you [Music] uh at this current time I see nobody with their hands raised for public comment you have a public comment conc a specific topic or any um so with that said I see no more public comment I think we can move forward to our first public hearing thanks Peter do you
012want to give us um an introduction on that uh yes so first I'm going to read the uh public hearing excuse me the Public Public hearing notes into the record so please bear with me the Ashen planning board will hear a public hearing on Thursday July 25th 2024 at 7:15 in the Ashen select board meeting room second floor Ashen Town Hall 101 Main Street Ashen Mass to the hear the ition of T-Mobile Northeast LLC 10 Commerce Way sweet B Norton Mass 0277 6 requesting a special permit modification per chapter 282 section 6.4 wireless communication facilities in 9.3 of the ashon zoning bylaws the applicant seeks to modify the existing special permit for the placement of antennas and update auxiliary equipment on the existing Tower structure in in in on the water tank uh just for
013everyone's clarification this is a water tank owned by the town at 24 Tower Road the equipment will be aesthetically consistent with the existing structure in nintend Array the proposed The Proposal includes the installation of 5G capable equipment the property in question is located at 24 Tower Road assessor map 20 lot 80 in residential a zoning District the public area will be held via zoom in video conference the zoom Zoom is up here um in it the confer the link was provided parties wishing to be heard on this matter should submit comments to the AC planning board ahead of time and or appear at the time place indicated above materials will be viewed at ashon toown website uh under the current cases or the uh Town Hall by appointment during no business hours for more information
014or do subit comments please contact myself Peter mat at 85327 n27 and provided my email address Trisha kendle chair as PL board with that said I would like to take a moment and introduce the applicant so uh this application came um and was submitted by T-Mobile Northeast LLC and tonight we have attorney Adam F brilley of Prince LEL and Tha LP representing the application um just for a kind of a round description of the project so this is a 24 Tower Road it is an abandoned t water tank and um having a cell facility goes back and or the sighting of a cell facility um goes back to 1998 I believe so in 1998 the town uh in the zoning board of appeals permitted um this location as a um a sell facility I believe
015at this current time there are two um carriers um that are collocated on a monopole that is um that goes up through the actual site um indoor water tank and then it has guide wires anchored to the side of the tank uh with that said I believe in 2008 within this within the application package Um T-Mobile did come in um Andor the um company at that time I know there's been a lot of mergers in the Telecommunications um world uh came in and updated this equipment so here tonight we are talking about updating the equipment on the existing uh infrastructure indor monop pole that currently kind of comes up through the abandoned water tank um at this time if appropriate I would like to hand it over to Adam brayy attorney Adam brayy and uh
016please take it away great thank you you got it um members of the board and thank you Peter just for the record Adam brard at Prince Lael Tai um we're in Boston Massachusetts on behalf of the applicant T-Mobile Northeast LLC um like Peter said we're here to modify or request special fir uh special per modification um to modify the existing Wireless Communications facility that's located on the um Tower structure that's on top of the tank located at 25 Tower Road here in town the applicant to Peters Point there's been telecommunications equipment on that site since 1998 I think it was either Nexel or uh AT&T that went on um at that time and then I shortly after that I think it was AT&T so it was Nexel in 98 AT&T shortly after that and then
017T-Mobile under the name of omnipoint communications which is now uh T-mobile went on in um 2008 so in 2008 T-Mobile executed a lease agreement with the um with the city uh with the town and then installed its equipment um and now uh T-mobile is looking to modify that equipment the modifications proposed are easiest way to do that is tell you what's existing and what we're proposing to do so what is existing is six panel antennas that are on that um Tower structure that's on the on the tank and the um we have a set of plans that are on have three uh of the of the plans on on the package um so T-Mobile has three panel uh six panel antennas two per sector that are currently on the on that Tower structure Um T-Mobile
018proposes to to replace those with six new uh panel antennas it T-Mobile also has three remote radio units which are small 1 by one foot um units that that um that amplify the signal in the coax down to the computers um and those are also on the tower there's three currently there two mob looking to replace those with uh six new remote radio units so um aesthetically it's going to look pretty much the same uh six panel antennas um for six panel antennas and three remote radio units for six remote radio units um T-Mobile is going to replace any um worn or abandoned which I don't think there is any abandoned uh coax cabling that is um that runs from the antennas down to the ground equipment um in on the or within the T-Mobile's
019least area in Fen compound area there is two currently two um cabinets for the radio equipment and T-Mobile proposes to re uh replace those with two actually smaller uh cabinets so those cabinets won't be as big as the ones that are currently there as far as there are the plans yeah as far as the the changes that's that's really the the gist of the proposed changes so you can see there if we go yep there you go that so those are existing um t-mob at the top &ts in the middle and then there's there uh nexile but it's no longer there so those are there's no there's no um carrier that's at that lowest level at this at this time so we've worked with the planning department we've worked with uh Haley Ward um we've
020been working with them since early 2023 in connection with the modifications here um we did get a a letter from the the Department um in I think it was January 2024 that um in our application that that basically stated that we're good to go provided we conform to the uh Haley Ward conditions which we which we are yep so just to clarify so um the applicant uh with AT&T preemptively sent this to halan Ward and did a pre uh uh a excuse me a engineering um peer review and so there is a letter behind the um letter here and the public hearing notice and it's dated May 23rd 2024 and this is from Greg Aldridge working for the town reviewing uh Helen I mean as working for for the town's peer as a town peer
021review Helen Ward uh they do all of our uh water department tank uh telecommunications tank review um um and I have spoken with him on the phone and the appro the approv the proposed plan satisfies his review and from a structural standpoint I I had a question and looking over your application materials tab five there's a letter from January of 2024 I believe from um Doug Small and Doug talks about this one very important item yes that's how he starts it yep uh to mention is the strength and condition of the concrete domed roof he's indicating a man lift should be used for all Communications equipment removal and installation to avoid Point loading I'm assuming all of that you're agreeing to yes okay so this is um an abandoned water structure for the town but
022we're like obviously structurally it's not great they're saying don't like so what what is um is there any maintenance the town will need to do and how does that affect with like the equipment because I'm presuming like we're not going to just let this crash the Tower or that kind of thing I think from that standpoint I lean on Greg ALDS I'm not a inst structional engineer you know I think they've checked it out the water department has checked it out and they feel confident that the way it as it stand and it can take this no I meant so like but if there's future maintenance how does that impact with with this and then is it temporarily baned or it's never to be used again or do we know that and how is did
023anyone ask those questions along the way in my eyes this is abandoned um because there's a monopole through this oh okay through the through the roof that I don't think we're it's literally through there that actual pole that pole goes from the center of the through the roof so I do not think we the town will be using this again however I'm happy to ask those questions and try to get those answers it's it's a little bit of a strange site I went up there with pet yeah it's a yeah you don't really feel like you're in Ashland kind of when you're there where where this you come of come come across this water tower which was really um I don't know I was kind of surprised I obviously I'd never been up there for
024any other reason so um it doesn't seem like again I'm not an engineer either but it seems like something that would be if a water tower been need probably be replaced that then reused given this condition but I'm not obviously I'm not sure right is there any other questions for the applicant right um I'll open it up for public comment good evening uh my name is Eric Jensen I live at 23 Tower Road uh right next to the proposed project um a lot of our questions have been answered uh not just tonight but uh reading through other projects or other information concerning this project uh but our main concern basically uh with me and the other neighbors there are um the impact it has of timeline how long the project will take constructionwise how much
025heavy equipment will be coming in where they plan on uh stationing and uh just uh keeping all this heavy equipment when it's not maybe not in use in this area um so that's basically our main concern right right now is just the overall scope of the project timeline and uh throughout not just length time but during the daytime as well what time it will take place because it is a pretty quiet End of the Street up there correct yeah are those questions that you're prepared to talk about thank you okay I can first state is that any work that would have to be done would have to be during the during the day you know we have bylaws regarding construction hours obviously and so obv they would have to amend to that regarding time and
026the timeline equipment how long it would take I'll obviously let yeah so oh I'm sorry no no please um through through the chair um just just to try to answer the question yes I'd appreciate that so this is a a replacement of existing equipment generally what what we would do I think in this case because because of where it's located we would use a man lift anyway we're required to in this case because of the the findings from Haley ward in the town um so we would have a a man lift that would be that would you know drive up there or come off a trailer and then drive up and do the work most of the work can be done within a couple of days um because it's just replacing the antennas with the
027new antennas but I would say that you know we would we would need a couple of weeks for a prep um install and then take away um so when you talk about a couple weeks do you mean um like people trucks on site say 10 for 10 days I I would think yes yeah okay um to be safe I think it can be it it could be quicker than that but um generally the modification structural uh the modification um construction installations are relatively quick I mean they don't want to be down the reason is that you don't want this the the the facility to be down for a lengthy period of time you really want to switch out the antenna so that there's really no downtime and that and that length obviously given the nature
028of the work that would be doing would also depend on weather and things like that that's correct right thank you yes and other than the M left is there any other equipment that would be on site yeah I don't think so I mean obviously we're going to have uh there'll be ladders um there'll be some Vans probably um that would come with the equipment um smaller Vans like the Sprinter vans um and then attractive trailer with the with the man lift I think our concern yes yes and we can I mean that's that's completely reasonable and if if you want to if we need if we need to include that as a condition I I believe that that's that's reable I think that's suitable obviously we would not during any construction project we wouldn't have
029them parking in the public way Andor obviously leaving or blocking anyone's driveway so I think that would be I think that's common courtesy tell you the truth absolutely so okay uh so with public comment uh there's one person with their um their hand up um so online I going to ask uh hello can you hear me guys yes and I apologize I I I I don't I cannot pronoun I'm not going to attempt to pronounce your name but please introduce yourself with your name and address yes sure thank you for letting me speak my name is Mukesh chuk and I live on uh five royal colony Circle that's uh directly opposite to like the my backyard faces the the tower um so uh I think a lot of questions have been answered so thank you
030for those and we do have a concern about the relative increase in the power emission from these uh Towers uh presumably 5G uh Tower replacement that suggested is uh you know results in higher uh emission of power and since we have uh we are next to it we are a little bit concerned about that uh so I would appreciate any commentary from the applicant on this and also if there's any data or any any um studies that they can provide us um to uh reduce the concerns I am representing some other folks around uh on the street as well who have raised this concern to me okay thank you um I'm going to ask the applicant to see if he wants to address that uh question yes to the chair um thank you yes please
031uh so in every instance when uh T-mobile and most of the carriers either install a new facility or modify an existing facility like in this case radio frequency emissions studies are performed to conform to the requirements set by the FCC um that's been done here and the um radio frequency emissions are comply and conform with those those uh safety levels so that study has been completed and um and the uh like I said the uh any radio frequency emissions do conform to the um safety levels that are U that are that are that have been mandated by the uh by the FCC I will say that uh this is a is a 5G style installation however it is somewhat constrained typical 5G installation for T-Mobile is nine panel antennas and this is only six so
032for example in the Cedar Street um water tank that that has nine panel antennas this would only have six so the there would be a difference in in radio frequency there and FC and just just for the the notes FCC that you mentioned stands for oh I'm thank you uh Federal Communications Commission Federal Communications Commission yeah thank you I I just have a a couple of followup uh so um is that study that you mention that you mentioned is that done specifically for this Tower or is it more generic U that's done somewhere else the study is specific to to T-Mobile's installation at this at this location great thank you and is that uh is that a part of the packet that that you have submitted I think it was required as part of the
033package but we could include it as part of the building permit application it it what the applicant stated is that it's uh he it it hasn't been submitted but I think if you could submit that I'm happy to post that online and and get that out to the applicant as soon as possible is that agreeable uh yeah sure certainly we can install that uh include submit okay thank you yeah so the applicant stated in the meeting uh that he will submit that report and uh I can have that posted on the website as soon as tomorrow great thank you appreciate that and if you have any issues find I I had just a last question but that's not very important if you have press on time I I can rest no please feel free uh
034okay just quickly how um long is this contract for so is this like a forever lease or is there is there a time period for this just I can answer that if you please the least the current lease agreement with the uh with the town of Ashlin uh expires in 20 2028 so about another four more years so this isn't look yes this isn't looking to ex it's not about the lease agreement it's about doing something while you have the lease agreement active right and in order to uh extend that lease or renew that lease the the the town would need to uh and any of the carriers that are on the tank need to go through a procurement process which is a public process at this time there's no other questions all right are
035there any other questions or comments from the board okay so our typical process um to do this would be if the board is in general agreement will help have like guess is there any discussion this is a pretty typical we've seen a number of these in the past obviously and just for my only thought to show is just for the folks in the room um and on Zoom who might not have been part of the prior projects where this has come up um this is falling under the I'm going to the tri act um but this is one of those ones where we don't our hands are pretty tied in terms from the federal government in terms of what we can do that's true Peter can you give us just a the just just so
036it's a part of this meeting process a brief synopsis about that regulation so back in back in 2012 as part of the federal middle class tax relief and job creation act um they state that that application in that law um kind of took it the power away from Municipal governments right and regarding the updating of these facilities per se right and so really the town of Ashland and all towns not just town of Ashland has limited Authority and jurisdiction when when a telecommunications company comes in and wants to update their equipment on a already permitted site and So within this process right under the 2012 um Federal middle- class tax relief there are six points right of eligible facility and um and so with that said it says number one the modification does not increase
037the height of the base station by more than 10% in this case where at the same height the mo modification of the transmission equipment on the um pole or or you know does not uh produce uh from the edge of support structure no more than 6 feet so therefore we're not widening the support structure we're not making this anything different right um and that kind of goes further on um but the main takeaway is is that the FCC kind of is control here and the town is kind of in the back seat what we and and I'm going to speak for the planning board on this is that I think the planning board over the last few years we find it very important to have public hearings when telecommunications companies come into the town and
038we want to make sure that everybody within a certain dis you know within proximity knows what's going on right because it is in your backyard and so some communities um would have the Telecommunications Company file for for a building permit and kind of not go through this process so we as a planning board and as a town uh obviously have this process we go through it we are limited to a 60-day process right now we're on day 35 after receiving this application uh we as a town only have about 60 days to issue a final decision but our hands are tied a little bit but this is public information that's happening um and work going on within the community and so I think holding the public hearing what we are doing tonight in making sure
039it's a public process um that is the goal here um and to make it transparent and so um I can go further through the six points if you would like but no I think what um I just wanted to make sure since we had folks from the public here asking questions and to your point Peter I think um the reason why we handle it differently than some other municipalities is because there are a lot of questions that can be answered really easily in this open Forum by the applicant and and have everyone sort of on the same page but to your point if unless something is um Falls outside of those six points we really can't do anything other than than approve it correct so because everything sort of within that it is a little
040bit of a proforma exercise true I I will add that for me it's been although the board is limited in whether we can deny it or not there's certain limitations I think these types of hearings for me have been very insightful because I listen to the public comment and I myself become more educated as to what the public is concerned about um and although by federal law we have some limitations and certainly there's not a lot we can do as a board I do believe that there are certain points that the public needs to understand and one of those is that and Peter you can correct me if I'm wrong that this is technically public property that's being leased am I corre am I right oh 100% y this public property in theory the public
041has full access to that site I can go there right now and take measurements for radioactive or excuse me for radio frequencies and I on my own could as a public citizen do my own research as a resident as to whether I believe those are dangerous levels for me so those are some of the things I sometimes wonder about we as a board have no jurisdiction here to order anybody to do do that kind of testing but when the public comes to us and expresses those types of concerns we have a lot of very educated scientific people in this community and I think that it's important to remember this is a public site that any member of the public is welcome to do testing at and because it's a tower the way this works my
042understanding is that safety is also dependent upon where your private property is located relative to this public space so if people are concerned they have every right as public citizens to go and pesti site I hope that's helpful relative to the comment online about safety are there any other comments from the board okay um I think then and uh our typical process um would be to um have Peter start with um to put together the um the approval document for this and obviously there are a few conditions that will come in come into that and then we will look at that next time um we need to be a little careful of that window because at our next meeting I'm not going to be present and that only leaves two people of a quorum for
043this particular public hearing so either people right will need to review the tape well it's a special per so Amanda could sit oh Amanda could sit on the special oh okay she's not hear so we're a little bit in this so doing the doing the math right um the next meeting August 8th would be 48 days um and so we' be we would still be in the time frame of of acceptability I would say um I did not look to the I think the next meeting would be 14 days after so I think we would cross over that 60-day time period but um if acceptable to the applicant and we can put this in writing uh we can move this to August 22nd and 2th isn't it 25th 25th 25th isn't it the 25th or
044August no 22nd sorry oh okay it's I don't know why I had the 25th in my head okay maybe that's why um and at that point we could have a full we would not have to M we would have to go through the M off of Davids or anything like that yeah um I think that's just remind me of the process the hearing doesn't the hearing closed close the public hearing process we tend to leave the we tend to leave the um the public hearing open until until we can look at the um until we can look at the the doc approval document in case there's other information that comes into it in case we have more questions to ask um because otherwise we're we're very limited in what who we can ask question questions
045of until that time yeah at this point we usually will we will close it and then vote on it with an approval document and if and if we have to continue it out to the 22nd of August I can assure that we can have a draft decision you know complete um at a very least by August 8th for everyone to start reviewing and obviously I would share a copy with you um in the meantime yes so we can include I mean the four of us can be on the special permit process but two of us four will not be here on the 8th so I think it'd be best if we can continue it out to the end of August to the 22nd so that we can make sure and usually we go at least
046a day after that because we need to collect signatures and stuff like that yeah so we'll we'll I'll follow up in the email so we'll just continue out till August 23rd which is a Friday and uh as long as we there's no kind of hiccups or and we'll kind of go from there I could zoom in on the just for this it helped but yeah I can't even zoom in that day so um yeah so I think summer schedules were a part of your uh your earlier scheduling as well okay if you can take care of that yeah we'll follow with with emails but I think tonight we just need a motion continue it to the 22nd and um and we'll follow up verbal we know I think we got the okay verbally but we'll
047follow up and I'll file that with the town clerk tomorrow right is there such a motion I'll make a motion to continue the public hearing for 24 Tower Road with T-Mobile pending approval of extension of the deadline I'll second up and a roll call vote Anna teski I cath Jers I Amanda I and Trisha Kendall I so we will see you on the 22nd when it'll be very close to back to school SE thank you all right so um next on our agenda we knew our public hearing agenda was going to be quite light light tonight so um the planning board uh put together a list of topics that were just generally compiled um of um I I compiled a memorandum I should say um regarding different suggestions people made about um possible topics for
048the planning board it's quite a a long list but it shows the diversity of things that we that we um work on and um I'm sure Amanda will be back in a sec but um Anna you had had an idea about how we I mean we have time in this meeting but we don't have all I'm sure we don't want to stay here all night so how do we you had some ideas about how we can approach kind of a long complex list and and get something out of our evening yeah I mean I I guess what I'm seeing here is three different categories of things um I think it seems like the the guest speaker piece and the processes piece is a little bit more simple than the stuff on top the bylaw work
049I think is what is challenging to us because of the amount of work that's involved how to go about it Etc so I guess my suggestion for Trish to Trisha was do we want to talk about the bylaw stuff and sort of figure out from each one of us what two or three things really stand out as a priority priority for us and come up with some sort of plan obviously we're not going to solve these problems in one retreat but I had suggested a prioritization for each person and sort of some consensus as to what do we as a board want to f focus our attention at and come up with a timeline of some kind as to how we go about that that was essentially the suggestion and then in theory you could
050have a go-to person who sort of becomes responsible for owning that priority for a period of time and that person can sort of in theory lead the work gather certain basic information maybe even work with Mark to do some research present it back to the board for further Retreat further discussions um that was generally my suggestion Yeah so basically the the middle topic like like you said joint meetings guest speakers were not usually ones to say no we don't want to talk to you or we don't want a joint meeting usually those are always informative for our board and these are just things that have come up um not even just with this call for requests but things that we've talked about before that haven't quite made it on our agenda so and there might
051be more as that that we might add to this list that we want to bring in throughout the year but it's not something that necessarily needs to discussed right I mean we could certainly discuss it but I'm thinking like if we have an hour to do this retreat part of our agenda maybe we agree that you know 40 minutes goes to bylaw conversation and prioritization and a plan and 20 minutes can go to discussing the other two topics that seem a lot less controversial and more sort of hey what are we thinking um so I don't know how you want to go about it but I feel like we should pick a time frame stick to it try to get through the agenda and figure out plan of attack for the bylaw work I I
052think if any unless anyone has a different opinion I think that that guest speaker joint meeting thing can really be like it's just for us to keep track of feel free to add to it you know we'll keep an ongoing list of those things but there's probably not a big discussion to have there b you know about discussion would be who to invite first but I'm not sure that's a critical discussion at this stage so but between um the bylaw work and um Kate I think a lot of I think you had a lot of comments about processes and procedures so how does that how does Anna's suggestion fit with maybe your concerns about that category I I mean I agree I think they're kind of simple I think they should be talked about to
053see how much agreement and and a path forward but they're kind of simple ultimately okay so Amanda any no I think that makes sense to start with by law work um maybe give ourselves like we want to be wrapping that by 845 so that we can move on to the other things I feel like that makes so I justes have to be 45 second yeah no Mak sense you mean moving on to the Joint to the guest speaking and the other stuff exactly yeah okay mosy through those yeah as faster things at the end yeah all right so sounds good so why don't we um I don't think things don't need to be necessarily taken in any particular order they weren't put in any particular order by me so um feel free to take them
054out of order wherever you want to start um I'd just like to comment on the the tree um preservation bylaw because I said I would contact the sustainability committee and kind of their thoughts so the best I could get was that they've sort of they haven't really met and it's been um you know travel and then summer plans so I I would assume it's not off their plate but I could not get any confirmation on that at this time are we thinking that we just want to sort of talk through our priorities and what we each think makes most sense among yeah I think so I think it's just anything we want to have out there like where do we start with this thing how strongly do we feel about it um who's really interested
055in it um for me I feel pretty strongly about the ones that we already have pretty substantial progress towards like we've invested a lot of time in the tree bylaw and tree preservation between standing you know you know they sitting meeting where it's just that or having sustainability here on multiple occasions um I feel like it makes sense to sort of try to wrap up the ones that we've made that we've already invested a lot of time in and for me that would be the tree bylaw and um MBTA communities to just like focus on those two yeah the the MBTA communities just so you know that there are some other um information that was given it was really just more about the the updates it wasn't to be necessarily to be discussing MBTA but
056um there's a calendar there and there's some um um there's a map here which it it's actually a a slightly earlier draft than um there's a few Corrections that need to be made on it so I'll say that ahead of time but um I was intending to talk about that during the updates versus yeah that makes sense and and it's more something that it's kind of like that one's going to happen it's an official thing yeah it's already official thing and it's already yeah it's already going to happen um the the tree B if obviously we need sustainability um on that I just wonder if we sort of pencil it in for an early September meeting with them I sort of it would like knock out one of our joint meeting they Al I don't
057know that they're on here but um I know that they didn't want to go for it in the spring but like sort of if they end up wanting to go for it in the fall to be able to have it on there in September to have a conversation and try and tie up L ens from the last where we left everything the spring did did you did Kate did you say you actually talked to someone about this or there um there's um no I we're kind of where we were before um I sent an email I didn't hear and then I did make a phone call to say what what's up and they really haven't actually met um I think more schedules so no body can really comment right as a board I'm not surprised
058because I think a lot of boards like us have quieter Summers and people are a vacation so maybe Kate if you're comfortable following up with them and I feel like that might be helpful to figure out what their interest is before we go on with it that's true yeah because I think it was because the notes the minutes are even in here right of the and it was actually a pretty complex discussion they were taking things back for sure yeah and so so um like the at least the first W meeting in September is right after summer I I just wonder if they'll be on top of things and it seems yeah it'll seem to be we'll relying on them to say is this do you want to talk about this again is it ready
059to talk about even do you want to with the sustainability committee even do you want to have another working rehash meeting something like that you know to doesn't have to have all the answers meeting um but maybe it's reaching out to the sustainability committee and see say it has it's not off our radar we'd be happy to do something in the fall if you guys are making progress haven't met yet but who knows August FRS or September right right to to meet and and see where it is okay I guess I'll I'll jump in to kind of my reaction to the bolaw list um in my in my brain because I'm very linear I sort of separated it from things we're required to do versus optional things so the MBTA zoning thing it's not even
060a question we have to do it by State law so to me that's not even like anything we should be discussing it is a priority because we're required to make it such period um the other things you know one thing I'll say is so far on the comprehensive plan work and K you can correct me if you disagree um a lot of the discussions whether it's the public or the the committee has been consistent with some of these things whether it's tree preservation or accessory dwelling units there's definitely prioritization in the community on ashin being very green very tree likee and focus on alternative affordable housing and adus are a very acceptable form of such in the state of Massachusetts so obviously we have a bylaw already in idus but it's got some limitations and
061we don't have really a dedic ated resource mechanism to make that a successful thing in Ashland but it's very clear to me based on how the comprehensive plan work is going so far that the things we have listed here are not contrary to what I'm hearing the public is interested in so my kind of General opinion is that we as a planning board because zoning is within our purview have a responsibility to congruent to the comprehensive plan process to take those public comments and priorities and start to actually do the work so that by the time um we are prepared and engage with the public we as a board are more prepared so I don't really look at the comprehensive plan process as required step prior to us doing our work I look at it
062as a congruent step that if I as a planning board member am hearing those are priorities for our community I believe I can bring that back to this board and say hey we should do something about this um so that's kind of a a general comment and then as far as sort of where I'm willing to put my head to um obviously the tree preservation common I agree with with Amanda I think that we should engage with them um the accessory dwelling unit thing really interests me I know that Trisha I believe had prior work on that topic I don't know where that is I guess the the two topics that are most of interest to me are the Airbnb short-term rental and the uh rezoning downtown to allow some limited smaller hotels um those
063are things that I'm especially interested in because I believe that 10 years from now ashin is going to be um more competitive um Statewide and the hospitality industry and the economy seems to be shifting towards those types of uh downtown revitalization type of ideas so that we should start thinking that way not because we're going to you know become the next hot ticket item to travel to we're not the cap but you'd be surprised how many communities are not prepared for the Airbnb short-term rental issue um Kate and I went to the planning um event that happens in Worcester every year and this is being discussed as something that many communities are not prepared for and when it happens they don't have zoning ready um in those communities that are thinking ahead tend to um
064do better and there is revenue to be captured in that there are communities that are lawfully taxing these types of properties and so we should be exploring that and thinking about it before we miss that opportunity um and it tends to get hotter the hotter the real estate market is and so these things are interrelated and we should be ahead of it so that we don't get the public is not frustrated that we didn't think of it um so I guess for me those two things are I have a special interest in the Airbnb short-term rental thing and the downtown hotel zoning um and I'm willing to do some you know preliminary research on those and bring it back to the board for further conversation but I'm also happy to help with the Adu and
065tree preservation thing if that has Focus for others on this board um just a just a clarification that on the accessory dwelling units I haven't actually done any preliminary research on that I'm just kind of familiar with it because I have done an Adu in Ashland and so I know that process as well as looking at them in other communities as well so as a part of my job uh part of my day job um so um but I I agree that both um the Airbnb and the accessory dwelling units um you know they also have a lot to do with housing and our housing production plan and and things like that you know because airbnbs aren't housing right they're not they're not permanent housing for people so it's it's important to take that in
066to look at it closely like you said and have regulations about it so um and we do have um accessory dwelling units as part of the housing production plan obviously which was approved as well so and and Kate had brought it up a while back about looking at that more closely and I think I I think it's a good idea I think a lot of communities are looking at it closely because of the shortage of housing because of the good thing it can Pro good things it can provide and how do we do it if we're going to make modifications and what we have now how do we do it right how do we learn from other communities and and do it as well as we can um the other thing I I think I
067mentioned before is um that I'm kind of particularly interested in and it's it's actually maybe more of a drab subject is the general review of the bylaws that's one of the things that in signing up for a second term um on the planning board is something I just thought I've gotten so deep into the planning board bylaws in the past few years that it's something I feel like I can use that experience for to maybe straighten some of this stuff out um while I'm on the board um so um it's it's a little dry because I don't think it's about big overwhelming changes but about little things but it is something that has been on my kind of personal to-do list I think when I when I start to look at the bylaws and see
068those kind of kind of frustrations in there um so um I would I guess be leaning toward that one for myself is um but also be willing to contribute to the adus because I do have professional experience and in working with those I think that's the general review is I feel like it would be such a such a missed opportunity if you've already sort of identified those things and feel like you've gotten like so experienced in them in the past it's almost like the other areas where we've done leg work it would be a waste to not yeah and I'm not saying I'm not saying I have a memorize but I'm I'm saying that there's I just keep coming across the same things and I'm like I'm frustrated that it's not clearer or it seems
069in just like it says here something's in Conflict something repeat Heats and we it just needs a and like why lose that institutional knowledge when we have it teed up like that's that feels like an no-brainer so Anna has kind of called out things that she's interested in I know everyone is schedule is tight but is and I don't think and I don't think necessarily there has to be things that hey I feel passionate about this so I will tackle it but is there any and and we have two of our members who aren't even here but um do you guys lean a certain way like if you were going to pick something from the list um I'll just give my kind of two cents rundown as well that um so I a little bit
070disagree with Anna about the MBTA communities act obviously we do have to do it but this is really critical to be in the public so I think when we oh absolutely no no no it's number one because it has to be done we have no choice is what I mean yeah but it making sure that it gets the proper attention right um so I think the um accessory dwelling units I mean me personally I I wouldn't want to put I would support the board but put effort unless it would be flipping to a buy right which we all probably know is how the state's considering anyway they might get to it before us but I I think that shows good willll that we're hearing about housing and it's it's actually I consider it low hanging
071fruit I know it's work to get it right but that that would show you're saying it's a no-brainer a win a progress we're paying attention we right that um I think that the Airbnb short-term rentals there again there's communities that we learned like they way ahead of this and it would be very smart of Ashlin to be ahead of this before it's a problem so I think it's in keeping with that um the downtown hotels I think is going to take some convincing of the public of why that's coming up maybe not a lot but um and the general review for it this could be ongoing but I feel like that's literally one of the reasons I was on the board to set the Precedence of having people like Mark and more people pay attention
072right in and said this is a conflict and helping um even I think more than Trish like one that I think really should be looked at is we learned um over the discussion can we asked for more than 10% affordable so we're out of the pit that if it's five stories we can't and that seems silly to not lower it since we we haven't heard the public clamoring for five or more story buildings in Ashland residential so that seems in that cleanup if you're lowering at four stories at least we by that research which again economics changes all the time but the last report was 12 a half which is still better than 10 it makes again a statement the board is paying attention the community is paying attention so I think the the cleanup
073should probably be ongoing through all our terms forever but like that's not exactly a cleanup in the same way you were thinking but no so I think that and I think that's but it's interesting that there's there's different there's different ways of focus on that cleanup yes right and and and that's okay because there's plenty of work to do to spread out right so it's okay if someone's focusing on one thing and someone's focusing on another thing based on you know interests or you know passion about something so well so I think I think it is sort of the whole board but these what I'd want to do if I'm like just because doing on comprehensive plan two which also takes a lot of time is some reasonable schedule we think these could be looked
074at I don't think I'm not saying it's instantaneous but I think that's helpful to the public like here's our actual work plan published on the website what and our potential timeline of bringing these to people draas things so I guess I'm struggling with two things one is there's like for me something like uh like what you mentioned hey there's a zoning bylaw where one little sentence just makes zero sense and we could literally just like do that in 10 minutes and make it make more sense that to me is so easy I don't know if we need a work plan it's almost like if we can agree as a board that there's room for that type of thing and we can make it a regular agenda item for us and actually use it where if
075we see something I'm sorry I'm just going to say it something stupid in the zoning bylaw that just can be change quickly let's start drafting those as we go in a regular way I don't think we need a work plan we just need to agree that that's what we want to do as a board and put it on our agenda in a regular way the more complicated stuff like hey rezoning downtown for hotels guess what I will I will have to do some research bring to you as the board the things I already read about the hospitality industry growing in Massachusetts it's one of the fastest growth industries what that might look like for for for us maybe I'll reach out to Framingham State and try to kind of gather up some basic economic research
076on it present it to you do some research that's far more complex it's not like something we can just like throw together that might require a work plan and I guess if there's someone who's passionate about it I can propose something to trishia hey I'll give you research by such and such date I'll give you a memo by such and such date maybe she'll we'll put it on the agenda by such and such date for another conversation and then if there's consensus on the board I could sort of Go off into work mode you know and reach out to I don't know other committees that might be interested start looking at a potential draft bring it back Etc so that's where I'm struggling like figuring out you know work plan for what right like what
077does that so I I can just say I think we our board does not always get um the public or the public understanding like for instance I'm just going to say people have told us a case was in front of us for three years which isn't true and so I feel like it's just goes with that public like we are going to start working on these and so that if you don't come to town me you're like what where did this come from like I want to avoid right so I guess that's what I'm talking about a published work that people could I don't know how many people click on the website but at least it's there and so we're we're looking at these are the five things we're looking at and the general cleanup
078could be that I guess that's sort of where that's coming from from from me that's helpful yeah I think it's for me it's about like list listing um you know goals for this this year which isn't a calendar year but like September to September you know let's say um and not necessarily about we're going to do this first and then that second and this because I just can't guarantee that with my schedule and I from it seems what most people of our schedules probably know one can can pinpoint their schedule that way so to me it's about bigger goals and things we hope to achieve and you know like I said what are we focusing on um so so it sounds like so far based on our conversations we're all in agreement that MBTA communities
079Act is a priority for this calendar year September to September year there's no choice right because we have no choice I'm also hearing the tree preservation um and the general conflicts inside the zoning like the obvious stuff the low hanging fruit as you put it um seems like we could put them on the top of our priority Focus like we want the tree preservation stuff not to fall off effort and it's sounds like we are interested in like if we see something silly in the zoning by law we want it we want to give it a shot to kind of work together and then everything else I think is really up to whether we have time and passion so to speak to do it and if we kind of throw it on the list as
080these are our interests we're going to see how we do as a board as long as we agree that we're willing to be open-minded and hear from whomever is passionate about it like it would be waste of my effort to go and do the research and not have the opportunity to present it to the board so if we all agree we're interested I I'm more than happy to do some leg work and present memos to the board but I think we need some consensus that yes these are the things that we want to look at well and I think that's kind of my point why I'm calling it a work plan because I don't want to I've already done a fair bit on Adu and I've contacted other like state agencies and got references but
081like if it's not going to go anywhere I I I do not want to do any more work I don't agree because we have a lot to do already on the comprehensive plan so for me it's like you're looking for that formality I guess that's what I'm I'm looking for a consensus that this is really something we as a board want to explore it doesn't mean we're going to do it right like we're not actually going to finish it maybe maybe Anna does a bunch of research gives it to the board and the board is like oh this is not really our thing but there has to be some agreement that we're going to we care enough to allow us as a board to explore these things yeah I mean I think with the hotels
082and the Airbnb it's definitely not something that I would have thought of just like yeah Ashlin it's not it's not Cape Cod you know so is this really a thing for us yeah but you're saying no I think it might be I think it might be coming you know and so I think that's valid and I'd be very interested in what you what you find about it just because I it didn't float to the top of what I was thinking I'd be very interested to hear about it because it's it's kind of forward thinking it's curious something like the Adu I think is it is right now it's happening and so it should be like it should be it should be low hanging fruit it's already in our housing production plan I think to have
083it by right it's already there as a goal it's not like it's new so let's just pursue it in the right way and and see if we can come up with the thing that works for ashin to me it's a no-brainer as well right it just takes putting the pieces together and uh maybe maybe this fall we'll have time to do that so I I agree with that and I think for me a little bit of my um I had a little bit a different take of the role of the comprehensive plan with things like the Airbnb and the Zoning for downtown hotels where like I I I sort of air on like a little bit more of the side of the approach we've taken with MBTA communities of like wanting to see the results
084of the comp plan so that we're not sort of trip you tripping over each other sounds negative but like duplicating work or sort of like getting putting a cart before a horse with with that part so for me some of like the bigger theoretical things feel to your point in about like not wanting to go off and do a bunch of work on it and then like have it stall out I think that's a completely Fair concern I'm also interested to learn more about them I think I'm in York Camp Trisha I think I wouldn't want to push something like super fast through to conclusion or through to a bylaw on either of those topics until the comp plan was coming together a little bit better and we could see how they interact personally um
085but I do but I am like intrigued to learn more about them so that's sort of where I am on on those two and everything else feels like something that's like right now teed up already sort of either in existence and We Know It needs help like adus or tree preservation which is you know we we thought it was going to go to Springtown meeting so like sort of very um formulated in a way I mean it's not but it is if that makes sense as a priority formulated I guess so just to for clarification like the comprehensive plan process is setting priorities for the community and recommendations for the kind of zoning that might be addressed the problem with something like airb BS is it's not like the community can say that's a priority
086like it's just happening it has nothing to do with a priority of the community so it's a little bit different from comprehensive planning because it's just there like if you go to Airbnb I did just now out of curiosity and you put an Ashlin in random dates you will see all the airbnbs in the region many of them are Apartments we're building more Apartments it's not like something we can prioritize in a comprehensive plan it's like if the comprehensive plan allows for apartments and growth then this keeps happening it's not like we have a way to it's not like we have to wait for the comprehensive plan to be done to know it's already happening is what I'm trying to say that different in that sense it's kind of yeah I guess they're the two
087like um least developed of the ID just because dealt I them for that reason but I think you're right that airbnbs is like a problem that exists and to your point like communities get stuck um when it becomes a problem and that's sort of a more a proactive thing and not as much of a planning thing I think the hotel thing is a little bit more of a plan thing absolutely so I I should have separated them in that sense but um I I was kind of lumping them again because they were sort of the the ones that we've made the least that we've delved into the lease so far as a board and the hotel thing is coming up in the comprehensive PR process um and I think we're going to hear more about
088it from the experts the consultant team Etc I think one of the questions I had asked the Consulting team in the last meeting we had with the select board was that issue and they the person who spoke said he would do more research on it so like again it's a congruent issue where as the comprehensive plan process explores downtown and potential resoning I would love to help the board get more educated on it so that we have have an actual educated voice we may say as a community no we don't want hotels downtown right but we as a board need to kind of understand what's happening it Statewide um sometimes I look if it's okay I'll just share this sometimes I Look to what other communities are doing and interesting things right and um whether
089it's planning or zoning or whatever and these are some of the things they're thinking about so it's kind of trying to get get us to catch up if you will to other vibrant communities that are similarly situated I you know I would think that and just to kind of think about what a result of this is tonight is that the the first four things on there the tree preservation adus airbnbs and the and the hotels to me those are the four that get um like maybe on our web page or you know that that we write a few sentences about each one of those um you know if we have if we have planning board goals you know the board would like to work on pursuing a tree preservation bylaw working with the sustainability committee
090this bylaw is intended to help preserve trees in our community you know just a few things like what is it about right um just a few sentences so for something that so the community the public can actually understand what we're doing MBTA I think it it has its own page already right and uh it's just not it's not a year-long goal for the planning board it's it's happening um and and and the general review is also just like there's not much to say there like yeah we should clean up our bylaws a bit right it's not really a not that that exercise isn't meant to change the bylaws it that's that's some they do have to go through town meeting I'm not saying that but it's meant just to clean just to clean it up
091not to change the intent and that to me is different than the first four which is really about a planning issue versus a cleanup issue right um so at least in in now some of the things Kate suggested maybe are different and those aren't the things I'm talking about I'm talking about the basic cleanup so that might separate into a separate category that would make it into a a fifth goal so just to be clear about that I wasn't meaning to undermine what you had said um so does that make does that make sense yeah I think that is logical to kind of announce to the public these are the things we're thinking about this is how we're separating these items and contemplating them I guess my only other thought is like when we do
092meetings when we get busy again you know sometimes I feel like we bring the bylaws with us at least we've seen us do that we but we're like so in the mode of the project we're just like applicant speaks yeah public comment we are speaking we don't really take a breath to be like what is the zone zoning part that applies is it clean does it make sense to us and I wonder if we should make an effort to do that more and maybe start taking notes of okay this is the zoning that applies here's some sections in here that we find could use some cleaning and we put them aside and we become more active in that kind of awareness as we go been doing that yeah I mean that's exactly what I'm talking
093about because when we get a project in I am reading through the the all the Wildwood bylaw right and I'm like oh boy you know this is this is a little convoluted here you know and no wonder we get to and then right I guess what I'm suggesting is a formal almost like micro Retreat every time we have a project that focuses us on the bylaw like even 20 minutes of what is the bylaw that applies to these projects and what's dirty in them that we want to clean up and then we move on to the project like ground ourselves in this work if we say it's a priority for us to clean up the zoning the only way it's ever going to work is if we actually have it on the agenda item as
094a grounding exercise and and it's public and it's there and it's happening in a regular way and we're tracking it and we're making notes and then in some ways that benefits the projects that are right after yes so it can be done in a in an organized way ongoing I would say like two things one is that when this year we have new projects come in I would say the meeting before if possible we have that if we get something in the wild District the meeting before the the public hearing is introduced we have that little mini session yeah but in the meantime I'm going to be looking I don't know I don't know what order but I'm going to be looking at them anyway like I'm not waiting all do our job yeah we
095should all do our job which is like we should know what zoning piece applies and we should be reviewing it we should become prepared for sure I'm not saying like that stops no no I'm saying that before we get a project in another project in I might be looking at it anyway for those kind of inist for this kind at the same time you're looking at hotels and air them in your mind they're driving me they're driving me a little crazy already no reason Trish has an OCD project yeah do keep that list I see that's very important let's get that done so it is a little yeah that's way too stressful to [Laughter] have um no no in all seriousness I get it like I I do think that there's been consistent things that
096you Trisha and you um have said both of you Kate and Trisha so I feel like you guys are really well equipped to try to clean it up for some reason because I think you're very detail oriented that way um I'm just trying to suggest a way to do it as a board that benefits the actual projects as well because like sometimes I feel like I guess I'm kind of going off into the best practices piece of our agenda where I feel like we struggle sometimes as a board when we get busy we're like in this sort of energetic mode of hearing the project without the context of the bylaw and I think that's that's a missed opportunity there yeah no I agree I think that's um yeah because we've been trying to be more
097consistent about saying okay this is a special permit this is a site plan review they're different and to pay more attention to that but it would also be um and I and I think we've definitely looked at these things earlier here are the criteria for Wildwood this is what we have to pay attention to that's different than downtown yeah we have to pay attention to what's in the bylaw for Wildwood right kind of thing so um I think we've been getting better at it but as new projects come in we should have a discussion when when Peter alerts us that something's on the horizon we should start looking at that particular by set of bylaws yeah um exactly you know and maybe some of them have will have been changed along the way you know
098and and probably not because it's going to take a while to to get through that but to give ourselves a to know where all those little inconsistencies are or you know things are unclear things to pay attention to and sometimes in the context of a project because you're using it as an example to apply the B law the inconsistencies are more obvious like if I just read a bylaw right now with zero project in front of me I'll find something wrong with it but a live project is what makes it alive like oh wait how does this apply to an actual real thing um well this is why we've had Pawn Street projects we've had Wildwood we've had downtown and so when we look at these now we're like oh yeah I remember we had
099a little issue with that particular point and why why why did we have an issue what what's not clear about it so all right sounds like we have a plan to at least draft up a little summary of the bylaws and publish it as some kind of loose concept for the public ke are there things that you can pull out of my take on the general bylaws which I don't which is different than what you're saying is there something you can pull out to be with the other four instead of mine which I think is about housekeeping think housing well I think that five story thing when I heard and asked like that seemed like a no-brainer to lower that um it's also all over the comprehensive plan like we're getting pretty far we it's
100a draft vision and they said it can change but like housing affordability housing for all types is there and there's definitely um like the pre-existing non-conforming the way our bylaw is now basically can obliterate those houses potentially so if that that's a change though that is that is not a cleanup that is a change to the bylaw but it is under the guise of preserving housing yeah and those are the things we don't see a lot because they go to zba instead of planning board maybe that might be true yeah no pre-exist Section 3 is preexist all pre-existing nonconformities regarding special permits and vares go through the zoning board of appeals so but I guess I mean I know that our housing stock will be in danger if that's not yeah definitely not definitely not
101to say I I'm not used to looking at those in Ashland but I am used to looking at those in other communities so I mean those are the two off the top of my head and related to that would probably be I think the definitions I would put them under the cleanup but but to your point they are not simple cleanup they are somewhat changing potentially there's a little of both in them definitions I would definitely put in that category yeah but some of them need clean up to like make it clear but it would alter so yes you have to be care it overlaps both yes that's true but those would be my top three is the definitions the five storage pre-existing non-conforming I I do want to add one thing from I from
102what I remember for the comprehensive plan our agreement with the consultant does not include actual drafting of bylaws is that right Peter no they will yeah they're not going to be drafting anything for us recommendation right he Dred a comprehensive plan yeah no no no no no I mean I mean for zoning no obviously they're going to draft the comprehensive plan but they're not drafting the zoning B no they're not going to be drafting that's really important for us to understand it's going to be that's not on them that's on us we're the ones next St it's it's that technically then you do an implementation committee some communities that tends to fall apart historically many communities but the whole point is like we are the zoning jurisdictional entity we're the ones who are supposed to
103do this work so it's just something to remember because I feel like sometimes we forget that the comprehensive plan is not going to be ooh here's the plan and a package of bylaws choose one it's on us to clean it up yeah it's kind of like the housing production plan except the you know it made suggestions about adus it made suggestions about yeah inclusionary zoning but they didn't they're not going to write those bylaws for us and I think it's like that except the comprehensive plan is obviously comprehensive it's not just about housing so we hit the 845 Mar we did yeah I think we hit it yeah pretty well actually okay do you want to move on to the guest speakers piece again I'm not sure I mean I'll take anybody's comments but I'm
104not sure what's in there besides saying Yep this is a good list and probably be adding to it yeah the only thing I'll add to it I think we do want to maybe chat with the zba at some point oh uh we may or may not not obviously the relative to the 40 BS they're going to hear that's up to them if they want to talk to us about the 40b projects but in general I think having a chat with the zba about our role versus their role the intersections of our roles and frankly our interests in these topics of bylaws while it's kind of our thing to plan and reone this way they're really helpful in my opinion to hearing their thoughts on adus and airbnbs and all this stuff even if they're not
105going to have jurisdiction power there it may touch upon their jurisdiction so I feel like we should get together remind ourselves what do they do what do we do what are their interests what are ours and how could those things intersect like I would love to hear their thoughts on this list well it's actually it's interesting point because in the same way that we wouldn't go doing a tree bylaw without talking to the sustainability committee existing non-conforming we we have to talk to the zba because they're the ones who are in the conflict about okay this is this is us trying to follow the bylaw this is why we have a hard time y this is what's tricky for us you know yep you know they're going to have that Insider knowledge because that's what
106they do all the time so so that would be just kind of like my addition to that list um the other addition I would have and this is I don't know what you guys think about it but I do feel like a lot of what we do touches upon issues of economic policy and we're not economists and there are State economists there are the state has resources like that there are academics in this area who are economists I for one would love the opportunity to bring an economist to our board to talk about the region to talk about Ashland to gain some perspective on how our work works because we're oftentimes confronted by the public of you're the way you're doing business is going to destroy my business or the literally the way you're making
107decisions is going to be bad for my company or you know Property Owners feeling concerned about impact on property values because of certain projects and I feel like we pretend to be economists and we're not but we're being asked to make decisions in a way that touches upon policy and economics so I for one would like to build a relationship with someone regionally who can come to us with some expertise from time to time and educate us about the region and actual Economic Policy so that we're educated when the public says whatever the public says and we're not just kind of pulling things out of thin air um Beth Reynolds might have a name for us sort a couple names that we could look into I mean she has her really her finger on that
108kind of yeah just a fall um last week we had I had a meeting with Merc the Metro West um research C economic research center uh just wanted to state that you know since deep wasn't here and she asked me last time uh but uh we're we had a followup meeting on a on a um on economic tool right that we were looking at but obviously they have a very dense knowledge of research in the area and I'm starting to build a relationship with them so I think I could reach out to them you know and and maybe it's not on policy per se right or how does this decision uh impact um a business owner but at least I think they have the very they'd be very capable of painting a portrait of um
109Metro West yeah in the region of Metro right yeah and you know I know they they put out and I I I think I have a copy and I'm happy to send it to everybody but they're 2024 uh annual report of the Metro West uh economic data right and I can definitely send that out to you yeah I think that and if that's what you're looking for I think I think that's a great start I think had a GU yeah if we had a guest who could basically give us the annual report on the economics of the region how that impacts Ashlin what we as a planning board should be aware of maybe comment on some of the work that we do and how that impacts those trends that would be a great start for
110sure yeah I I think we can invite them in and see if they can kind of assuming it's free obviously well there's not too much in life that's free Anna uh but like the point is let's explore that yeah I think they say no at the very least I can I can obviously send out the report obviously the Merc report we can all go home and read it and kind of take a take a look at it you know I think that's definitely be in the capacity um and and try to have that relationship as we continue to build right and I I talked to him last week like I said about the economic uh Impact Tool and the development of that tool U and not just for as I I kind of you know
111kind of said that not not all towns have an economic impact tool right and so you know if mer had the ability to develop a tool that could be updated annually and and and granted in or sent out to you know communities or subscribing communities within the region that'd be something obviously of of Interest right and I think they' be interest of this board but for the town and also bunny towns but I think we can start there on that kind of bullet point yeah we have the resource we might as well yeah use it and they're local they have the Rams right Mark that's right that's right State when I look at this list I kind of have the same thought as I had about the bylaw work which is to take some of
112the things that have been like top of mind and see if we can get close them close them or have folks in you know when things get when everyone's sort of back in the groove in the fall but for me that would be the Ashton cultural Council because I just I don't want to lose I know there was a lot of behind the scenes sort of commentary on Starbucks I it's I feel like the recency of it people seem to love the idea of it right which is great and if we can keep including it but I think we hit these points in the projects Where It's Tricky and I don't know that we want to lose the um the like immediacy around what the issues were as we implemented the first one I think
113it would be useful to sort of tie up any Loose Ends around that or get any feedback on that when we're so close to it yeah it would be really good to maybe talk to the cultural Council like okay we put this thing in in our approval tell us how it went from your end how was your life what did you do where were the problems where can we help it be better or maybe it's out of our hands I don't know but to have the conversation not just to say oh well that worked good let's do it again yeah right board we're inclined to want to do those if they're in a way that's feasible right I think we've hit questions in sub projects as sort of concerns with the Starbucks miror were bubbling
114up that you know should we just like can we put it in should we put it in at all should we say anything about it how do we say it um so I would just love to get like out in the air like pros cons what went well what worked what didn't like it's so we can sort of know going forward and I feel like the closer we are to that the better and that so that would be a priority for me for the fall and the other one would be the historical commission um I think the forming of the historic district like in light of what we encounter with like the downtown 40b um even with like the the Clover Road Project where we wanted that signage like stuff that keeps bubbling up like
115this the idea of the district the idea of consistent sort of signs or markings like things that we that we value or that we want to bring to projects I feel like would be great to touch B with them on and get yeah it would be that hey we have these ideas are are you working on any kind of signage like this because we would love to be able to have that yeah to be able to say hey the historic commission wants to do this it's required for the project you know versus us saying right we order the historic commission to do this which we can't do right to have it already in process I wanted to make one comment about the um the cultural counsel because I mentioned a letter at a previous meeting
116that I received from the cultural Council and I realized it didn't I found the letter it didn't go to me as the pl at the planning board it went to me as the CPC so it was a letter from cultural Council to the CPC and that's why I got this letter when it was really about um um you know funding these are type of projects we do this is type of funding sometimes we're looking for you know type of thing so I wanted to I I didn't remember the time where I got the letter but but that's why the I received and the board did not so and then I would obviously I would personally be prioritizing the select board but that's in process so for it's going on the calendar yes and I I
117think that is people should put their I think they're saving their rooms for September 23rd it's a Monday it seemed to be a day I'm sure it'll in the end someone won't make it because that's just how things go but it seemed like that would be the day and it took that long to it took two months to find a day where hopefully all of us could be there so um they are looking I should also mention they are also looking at that day and it kind of comes back to the MB this this timeline for MBA communities that maybe that meeting would be twofold half of it would be about get to know you and half of it would be about the joint meeting for the MBTA communities given how hard it is to
118get us both in one room because it's around the same time frame so that's a tough one yeah it's not really what I was a tough combination of things I was hoping it'd be just a hey how are you yeah that's not for the record that's not going to go well I know but um yeah but I think realistically like try and trying to get the work of the boards Done Right which one gets priority the so it's not it's not set in stone yet but just to give people a heads up that it might be half a working meeting out of necessity so if we're just slipping on that this if this is like a public discussion in August like we have to to be publicizing that now summer vacations we already experienced at
119our own boards that if we ever want people to attend on August 27th it has to be wide we can start having that we can start putting that out there I think in the town newsletter like I think there really needs to be a strong publicity to well what strong publicity to you what does that include like specifically and well I don't on the newsletter yeah I that helps I mean the website we can put it on the board agenda mention it yeah we can get that in newsletter yeah because I mean I you know I generally get my news from the newsletter you know um so I'm like if people aren't getting their news from the newsletter but where are they getting it I don't know someone needs to tell us right so I
120think people get it from some of the Facebook groups but I also prioritized the newsletter yeah so I think we can put it on the Ashlin Facebook yeah page um you know and hopefully people have that clicked and so it goes into their Facebook y so so but yeah we can start um putting that out there um we think that's a pretty solid date but we can just also put a heads up please be watching for these public forums um so okay so what about um anything else on joint meetings guest speakers okay um and obviously I think other things will come in as we as as we interact with them sometimes we think of new things process and procedures um can we start with Comprehensive plan there we have been talking about comprehensive plan
121I got the impression that this was about where does the planning board and the comprehensive PL during committee intersect is that is that um not I know I put this on Anna might have as well but it's the conversation that Anna had earlier that there will be no zoning changes coming out of the plan but there will be recommendations but the things that are very obvious now like in the vision and the themes we do not have to wait another year we would be remiss as a community to just pretend that nothing needs to be looked at now and could be and the planning board having zoning jurisdiction needs to be part of it and start kind of pushing that along I think being a part of what zoning changes and and like the zoning
122changes we like such as the ones we've disced of at the beginning of in the first part is that what you mean I'm just trying to get specifics about what you're saying it it's I would say the simplest thing is what Anna reminded that they can go parallel they do not have to wait to end yeah and I don't think I her certainly hope it was maybe it was me that implied that we should wait for comprehensive plan but never have I thought that we have to sit on our hands until that thing is done it's more about those big decisions about rezoning things you know makes me a little hesitant until we to see what's coming out of that like to some some of the bigger moves the little moves no I'm not that's
123not what I'm concerned about I'm wor worried about the bigger moves that I think the comprehensive plan I assumed was kind of all about what what's our big directions right and those are the ones I was hesitant to I agree that's the same page that I was on and I and I'm not saying like I know we're still a year out from like everything written and formalized and all those things and we might have a vision and things like that which I think we're going to get updates on jointly with the select board at some point soon I think for some of us who aren't as intimately like aware of what those themes are that are coming out like it would be helpful to once we have something pretty Concrete where they say this isn't
124probably this isn't really going to change much like this is this is the input this is the feedback like these are the these are the themes we can take some direction from that and I don't I personally don't feel strongly it has to be like complet completely done and dusted as a comp like voted on and approved in order for us to start putting things into the works because of how long things take I do think that like I would love to see those things and like right now I think for some of us who aren't you know at every steering committee meeting the way that you guys are it's probably less clear to us what those things are and so once they come to us and that we do have that joint update I
125feel like it would it will feel easier and better to sort of start taking some of those themes forward I I look at it as more I I agree with what you're saying I also think there's a piece of it that is slightly different in my view which is that the planning board plans and has zoning responsibility and is the one that has a vital role in the comprehensive plan and so technically it's a back and forth relationship in my mind so I look at it when I say it's congruent what I'm saying is we as a planning board have a responsibility to be the the organization the board in the town that should know what zoning changes should be happening and we should be delivering that information and expertise to the comprehensive plan committee
126to help the process work more efficiently it should be a back and forth and at the same time the public feedback that they're Gathering through the really important public engagement comes back to us I look at it as a conversation that's happening congruently I don't look at it as they decide which zoning to do and that's what we do I look at it as a a back and forth a communication which is why you have two planning board members on the committee so that that conversation can be ongoing so to me it's much more of a partnership not necessarily a US telling them what to do or them telling us what to do I I think for I think for me though it's like um you know there are things that like like you said
127that we have these okay um adus and um um airbnbs these are kind of hot topics we need to kind of hey comprehensive plan these are kind of hot topics we need to we need as the planning board need to deal with because it's in our purview and they're very of today right on the other hand when we talk about the the two boards I see like the the steering committee is Ashland with this huge body carefully chosen for different districts different committees and we're five people and so I'm very I'm for one very conscious of that difference of five six with Amanda sorry six people on a board and the town of Ashlin making a decision about its comprehensive plan coming from the people coming from the residents so I'm a little H I'm
128I'm not quite as uh I'm not quite thinking this is a kind of an equal partnership I'm like we're the we're the boy that has to get it done yeah right but you're you're Ashland which is also us we are ash right like there's people on the compreh hensive plan that have expertise in like Elder Affairs and their job is to bring that perspective so we as the planning board members have a responsibility to bring the planning perspective to the comprehensive plan committee it's true it's just that we just have to remember that the the zoning bylaws are passed by the residents not by the planning board absolutely but it's the planning board that drafted zoning changes it's the only board in town that has that jurisdiction and so it's a it's a back and
129forth and I guess what I'm I'm reiterating is we have to remember our responsibility is zoning and therefore that is what we need to deliver to the comprehensive plan committee we have to be able to communicate very clearly we're not the sustainability committee we're not the Elder Care folks we are the planning board and so therefore when the comprehensive plan committee talks about zoning it's Kate and I that have to be able to communicate we the planning board have looked into this and this is what we've learned yeah not we voted for a zoning change but we as the com as the planning board have knowledge base on adus and here's what we can deliver to you because that's our thing that we can deliver to you as the comprehensive plan committee so that you
130you have our research you have our information to make the decisions to create priorities right but we as a planning board are the ones that are supposed to have that knowledge base that's why Kate and I are in the room to do that so I I think I complet completely agree with that I think what um and I don't want to speak here Tisha I think I think we might be aligned like on just the order of operations where like for me on some of the bigger picture things that we haven't really delved into much yet I would like to like or bigger picture conceptual things I would I personally feel like we would be remiss to not take the opportunity to hear from this very large community board when we're like within months of
131like having a pretty final vision to say hey planning board these are the things that our community cares about they're zoning is things please go look at them come back with your expertise and start to have that conversation I don't want to be making a list for the town before I hear like I I don't want to go the wrong direction on that part of the conversation so I'd rather for like adus for airbnbs for the tree pres some of the stuff that like is in the works is existing and we know as a community we're going to get caught out like if if we're not ready for it that feels very different to me than some of the bigger pictural conceptual things like hotels downtown which like that's a a community conversation that I
132feel like we want to hear from the community Through via the comp plan which is if it if we were 15 years away from our next comp plan that would feel very different but we are like in the thick of it right now where we are going to get some clear Direction pretty soon and I feel like taking some of the cues as to what the community wants to prioritize that might be within our realm and then we take our notes from that develop of our expertise around it and go back to the comp plan with it makes perfect sense but for me I I think I want to leverage that Community body to be able to be telling us a little bit about what's important because it seems like when we always talked about
133the comprate that we didn't have a up-to-date comprehensive plan so the planning board didn't have this thing to refer to in making our decisions which is the agreement of the town about what the town wants and so that's where I'm like well where's where's the thing I can refer to like oh this is what the town voted for versus oh I put in there what I wanted to you know it seems backwards right we build the comp plan as like this is the vision for ashin for the next 20 30 years right I don't want to I don't want to take the legs out from under that and do something really big picture that from a zoning change perspective and when we've said we want the vehicle for the vision for Ashlin for the next
13420 to 30 years to be the comp plan like I want those big I would personally like to see those sort of big Vision items that then will fall under zoning because we I think we all understand no one's going to tee up a bylaw for us but the conceptual stuff for to basically tell us this is what the town wants this is what the community wants planing board go do your job and figure out how to do it I want to be clear that uh like you I thought of it as a 20 to 30 year thing yeah but in fact it's been referred by by folks as 10 to 15 so um right now I think it's fairly confusing to the community what the number is and I would have to go back
135to the original work plan that was given to the consultant to give you the right answer but I I just wanted to clarify that if you're thinking of it as 20 to 30 years that's not long term yeah that's not necessarily how it was presented to the community 10 203 I'll feel quite somehow that got a little cut down but I I guess I guess to your point if we were planning for 30 years I might have very different feelings about this list than if we were planning for 10 to 15 so I just want to be very clear I guess so I can amend my comment and take the number of years away but say that it has been buil to the town as like the vision for the town of ashin like what
136you want to see the town of ashin become so for me that still means that the some of the big picture conceptual items like I don't want to take them to the comp plan before the comp plan tells us it's something that the community wants to prioritize and I think that that's different from and then I think we do have to go do that work when the community the when we're told by the community this is what they want to prioritize need I guess for me I've already heard the public through the comprehensive plan process focus on downtown revitalization so much but I'm already thinking about what that means and to me the downtown thing is worth exploring the down hotels because that is already being discussed not as a the hotels thing is a
137solution to the priority but the priority of revitalization and Business and Entrepreneurship and creating downtown businesses and all of that kind of for me is like oh obviously we should think about hotels because we should think about what could be the potential so yeah the comprehensive plan is not yet at a phase of what are the 20 possible solutions that could solve Reit alization to it just I'm starting to think that way because the public is already saying revitalization downtown jobs growth Etc so and history and trees right so to me it's all interrelated already to what I believe we're hearing at the comprehensive plan it's just like thinking ahead to what is our job not the consultant which is drafting um but to your point like nobody's going to be voting for any of
138this stuff until there's a thorough public process thorough feedback from the public and a vote that has zero to do with us and more to do with town so you know it has to be past the town meeting it's not our decision um we just have to reflect the values of what we're hearing and I don't look at this as a definitive list of what we're going to prove I look at this as like worth exploring for a continued conversation between ourselves with the comprehensive plan committee with the public exploration of those values um and maybe rezoning eventually um the little bit I've seen from us it takes us forever to reone so realistically none of these things will happen until years after the comprehensive plan process and I think that's exactly where where my
139thought process is it's like this list could get five or 10 things longer based on impa based on feedback from the comp plan right and so and it will and it should and so we're so close to having that that I feel like and how long things take I feel like let's tackle like the ones that don't I think it's just we're exploring some some smaller issues and some bigger issues and we're exploring them and um we realize that some are low hanging fruit probably and some aren't and that and that's okay to have things on different scales you know um is there anything else on that top half I mean I don't think um this is the proc so the the implementation I I think it it may not solely rest with us but
140I think I mean not to go backwards but the last time there was comprehensive plan process it was stopped by the planning board um people talk about it's sitting on the shelf we I've worked given way too much time to see that happen I think the other 28 people part of it have given too much time to that happen but if we're not proactive about that that that could kind of sort of happen because we weren't ahead enough of that and I I feel like the planning board can offer not not again to say we're doing it this way because it's bigger than us but I think yeah well if there's a conversation that the planning board has with the steering committee process about when we get to that point about okay well how do
141these things happen like let's talk to the planning board because they're the ones that make zoning changes great yeah let's do it you know about how how does how do this board whoever's sitting in these seats you know how do we make that process where we we make these things happen based on the book that's in front of us that's not on the Shelf that's on our table right I I think that's ideal you know that's that's the but the reality is if to really do this like it will be bigger than the six of us in my opinion oh yeah I'm not saying you just talked about the involvement to the planning board so that's why I'm talking about the involvement to the planning board think implementation best practices have us starting to brainstorm
142recommendations of that back to the committee in the way and I was talking about that conversation like we've done some thinking about it and research we think this is some things to consider I guess I would need um um maybe to see some things from other committees I don't even know what that list looks like I don't know I don't know that's what I think I'm saying as that's last I would like to see where the where they are because I think we're so much more disconnected well I mean like best practice like I don't know what like if if if there's examples from other comprehensive plans about best practic because I don't even know what you're question you're asking me and so if I had a list of oh well we have we have
143tea parties and and we have U meetings and we have like like I don't know what that means so if I saw a list of what breast practices are I'm like oh I have some other ideas in that category but I can't even tell you what that means so so I mean I guess that that's the conversation do we think that's worthwhile of the planning board putting effort to start looking at implementation to produce something to give to the steering commit sure I think I would like to see it if that's something that how other communities have done it yeah if if we're obviously the board that that um implement or you know that has the process to make zoning changes and that will be something we are looking we want to be looking at
144this book as a guide for our work um I would both take information about what best practices planning board should have because I don't know and I would be willing to add to that list if I have other ideas that aren't already on the list so I think that would be a good thing to start educating the planning board about about that about what happens after this book is complete and on the table you know I think it's a great idea so fiscal Impact Tool I I think we have uh not to cut off the comprehensive plan but watching our time um I think Peter's kind of on that yeah I just gave an update obviously had a meeting with Mark last week and actually IA email te up and I'll send it out so
145and we'll continue to work toward I think what you're talking about Kate is to have something that's consistently used that's as accurate as such a tool can be so that we have a means to compare things and I think that's part of kind of your ongoing education of to like how do we how can we get to this point how do you get to this point you know I think when other communities seem to be perhaps behind us rather than ahead of us yeah I think we had a good tool that was developed by Economist by Eon by Economist when we did there is um there's so many nuances in that tool how does it apply to all projects I don't think it could be in or can be so I think that's kind of
146a goal of a fiscal impact tool is to take it and say okay how does this apply across the board right and and that's what I'm talking to America about and so couple their Prof two of their professors that's who I was talking to last week and so they're still in that process to kind of and they're in interested in they're engaged because part of their purpose right is to help serve the region right as a economic you know economic Hub of information at Framingham State so that's ongoing and obviously it's it's it's it's moving forward I know it's slow but I think it's a very it's a tough nut to crack at the end of the day so yeah so the last category I think the planning board processes are are definitely um things
147that have it's kind of like a checklist of things that we have talked about you know over the past year or so um so good for you Kate for actually keeping maybe track of them um or kind of brainstorming as to what all these things were that we that we talked about um so I I actually printed I think I forgot to bring other stuff it it was simply um it was from like a regional planning best practices right one piece of paper it I I'm actually probably glad I didn't bring as well because people get distracted this isn't appropriate but it literally had like the application came in here's when the 90 days comes up when I asked for continuances and we would make our own I just but I like the idea because
148I feel like that could also be public to say the the long breaks are bothersome for everyone in my opinion and certainly public trying to pay pay attention so trying to be the most transparent and communicative about them like did the applicant ask for one did we ask for one right so there's like a a a a document or a list online or a page for each project yeah that kind of just it kind of just spells it out it's like right project it's got a review with our third party I I personally I like checklists and I would make it complete right and some things are na because it's never going to go to the Conservation Commission right but um and it's never going to go to the traffic and we say no but
149like it's as you know somewhat easy to lose track of like we we've been at the pinch point of projects realizing we didn't get that last letter back right and we have to be scrambling that's happened so I feel like that would help with that yes so do you you you kind of suggest that maybe there was a sample letter you found that might be a useful starting point not finish you guys would be saying this is too much I so I'm glad I didn't bring it away I I will I can email it I can I think have a starting point even if you say well this is five you see what I'm thinking about but you could also get distracted and say because it's not really I'm think it's a it's both I
150think ours should be just very I don't know like the example has like when did I get the application when was the thing published and I don't know if we need to collect all those right um but maybe this might be a terrible analogy but it's almost like the Domino's Pizza Tracker but for a project before us because i' I've recently seen a ton of community questions Bubble Up about like sorry I love that thing I kind of want to know what the Domino's Beach attractor not going to lie no please enlight me I'm Le what Fe your order is in and it's amazing I know how to clean a rug and I know how to order I know how to follow a pizza kind of hungry right now 20 minutes you know yeah we
151and there's a new one in h i just I haven't ordered yeah um I haven't used the Domino's piz tracker in a long time because there's not a Domino's that delivers to my address in ashy but it's Wonder anyway having sort of a very clear like visual of like where is a project in its life cycle because I have seen a lot of community questions Bubble Up recently about like hey whatever happened to the fire project or what's going on with the why and like to be able to see on our web page like okay this was this is approved this is now like in the applicant's corner to build it or like to get get building inform six Chestnut St it came up recently where's there a question around the firehouse there was a
152question around like you know all these things where it can be like you know this is not the pl board approve this on this date or it's it's paused because the applicant requested a continuance on this date you know what I hasn't come back before the board um I feel like that's a would be incredibly useful I it's a great idea and part of that is I didn't really bring it up but it's I think it is related like how can we do a better job of publicity we don't have a ton of time to spend doing it right and it it takes time because I've been working hard for it in the comprehensive plan and it's a lot of time right to try to just do my part for publicity but I feel like
153at least having it and then educating people it's there might might be something I think to me that's it like it's there um it's there for us it's there for the community um we might have to remind people that it's there but if they go looking it is there for them read it's easy to read it's easy to comprehend because even if you go to our website and it's it's it's organized but there's a lot there it's super overwhelming you have to know what you're looking for you have to understand the documents that are there and I think there are members of the community who put that work in and understand it but I think great idea I it would be a useful tool both for us and for the community so are we looking
154we're not looking for a document list we're looking for actual step in the kind of it's sort of like a combo yeah I sent a couple to Kate just now that I found I mean in other Massachusetts towns so it's not going to be impossible to start somewhere like that that stuff exists we just need to create it for Ashland because our bylaws are different in our process I think I I can help put that together easier so I guess one question is do we need it and want it as detailed as they applied on it got published on that the one I have has that and I torn on that but I think some of that stuff which is in the realm of like way I put it is is not what we or
155the public needs like that to me would be distracting from the real things that I think they you guys want you want to update on the website you know um like a public hearing was on like for 24 Tower Road you could say public you know July 25th you know public hearing opened uh you know information taken in planning board continued to yeah August 22nd as a bullet point under the case on our case website to say like where it is or like it could also be a document that's in our binders if that's what you're looking for then you're like then that's a different story you know it could be a combination I me I think that to Kate's point like you want the public to be aware of where the project is to
156my point I want us to know what's well that's fine I think it's in your bind is not a problem I think that can lie on me and I can I can help work that process through you know I think if it's on the website it's just that you know we're doing a lot and the day-to-day bases and stuff it's like what what do we need what we want what we could do on the website is just put up scan that document when we update if we have a document can that be scanned to add I don't know I guess I was IM imagining I there we have site plan and we have special permits each one is going to have a checklist that checklist is a general checklist for any project that should be
157publicized at a minimum so the public knows the planning board and the applicants know these are the checklist steps we expect then when a project starts that's the first date on any any checklist right I don't know if we need to constantly at every meeing scan it for the public as long as we're tracking it ourselves and we have that as part of the record in some way um yeah I think it's a lot of work to have to scan it at every meeting you're upda you're up on the website it's a it turns into almost two different things that we're talking about I think there's something would be in our binders it's a little bit more detailed and then something that's like super distilled as like a project status tracker on our website which
158is like like show basically like phases of of a Project Life Cycle that public hearing open public hearing close decision render because more like a timeline yeah yeah okay so there's two ways um is that everybody sort of bring examples or send them to me and I'll try to call because I like there's a lot of ideas and that's why I didn't try to actually create something because it's simple and complicated so um I mean it sounds like there's a pattern that Peter knows as to which groups you know need to clear every project so if Peter can give you that list that seems like an important list the list of like I think it makes sense for for k shment whatever you know share what's going on you know what she's looking for you
159know and then I can manipulate it and say okay nope this is the this is the process this the procedures we kind of have in Ashland you know how it comes in when it gets stamped in but also when's the prec you know when's the is there departmental review meeting you could say check those obviously memo issued did we get the memo from the tech review like I just I guess like we're just I just want to be able to say we got it or not so maybe the thing is too that really first of all we formulate one list and that's the list for us what we want to keep track of then it's like okay how do we we can simplify this for the public right like what do they want to know
160when they that's cool they probably don't you know like okay not this yes these three things you know when we got a project like you when we open the public hearing you know this is out this is a continuous at the applicants request it's a it's you think of some projects where we've said you know we need drawings and we don't get drawings for three months or whatever it is people can see that that's a applicant needed continuance and the project is stopped for that right now stop before the board at the moment or I think that's really important yeah and then or you know all the way through completion where it's like this is approved by the planning board it is now off in its life as a project that come to fruition yeah
161so let's focus on the document for us so and then can people I guess that have to send suggestions to Peter for list back to me is that I'll send what I can to both of you yeah see I think you can both be emailed ideas for the memor andon things went to me and or just computer so we don't have a viol I'm saying of open Mina law so you could send it just to me like just going in One Direction yeah this isn't we're not talking about here we're not talking about talked talk it's a procedural P true it's procedural Soom you com yeah comments of things you think we need to keep track of and I will try to make it in some sort of sure preliminary list to look at to
162clean up but I'm excited about that you all agree I like it for this we've got OCD all of us we're all into it personalities I'm it's not even OCD is just making it easier I think it's like I don't know if I have OCD he does not he does the rest of us I'm talking about the board I like to keep my car clean but like kind of like Peter literally looks concerned I don't have it Peter's chill how dare you imply you notice he's not protesting he didn't protest us he's like I'm fine I put their white flag all of us should be a little more like Peter is what I'm saying would probably be much happier and have a much better actually to make get easier so you don't have like you
163don't have to remember you don't have to like just in my job we're in the middle of an internal company implementation and we have things like matrixes and you know um things like that so at least we're not doing that Peter we don't have any project Matrix God Bless you that's Google Google shared unless unless anyone is really if there's really something that needs to be discussed that people are like man I really wanted to talk about outdoor dining you know or something I I think given that it's 9:30 we can we go on to the I think this to the wrap up okay is there anything that needs to be like I feel like the concept we all agree with these things and that's why we put it at the end and I feel
164like the way to do this is to start seeing them on the agenda and even if it's small right like like the review of the decision document template I know you more or less have that handled Trish I'm not super worried but I guess I put it because I don't want to put that all on you as the chair I feel like we have Collective responsibility um I I guess I I mean are you looking for an agenda topic that says how to make meetings more efficient and that's our agenda topic no uh no but I feel like that should be another retreat but um no I said the review of the decision document template so that could be an agenda item and we could spend we said we're going to spend 15 or 20
165minutes and look through that do we want any more changes for example yeah we we could I mean it if if we have some of these slow you know some of these empty meetings we could do that it would require people to really take a close look at those things in advance yeah um so that's fine if people want to do it yeah I mean the tighter they are and you spend some time in advance the easier they are when we get to a decision true that's true there's definitely some things I've been we all have the thing that we go back to every time yeah with our powers combined yeah yeah so okay so we'll start looking to yeah I mean some of these things are like application status that seems like that's already
166covered in the what we just talked about kind of long best practices for yeah so it's like some of these are maybe tied into that document um but other things um yeah I think a lot of them are tied into the document but but others aren't like the like the template so I do think it would be helpful to talk about how to make our meetings more efficient yeah um as far as timing and I feel like sometimes we're inconsistent we give certain like typically we want to hear from the applicant we want to hear from the public sometimes we we take questions sometimes we don't sometimes we have a back and forth with the applicant sometimes we don't I do Wonder at some point if we want to come up with again I don't
167want to use the word best practices and overuse it but like in the ideal world if we have three projects on an agenda how much time do we give a project how do how do we decide how much time to give it project and how do we maintain that level of continuation so that our meetings don't go off until 10:00 at night not that I'm against that sometimes it's necessary and I don't wanted to like say o we can't do that when it's necessary because we got to meet a deadline so obviously projects sometimes have to happen within a certain amount of time and and we need to do what we need to do but I do feel like it's worthwhile at some point to like brainstorm the timing of our work and how we
168want to contain it sometimes no offense to certain applicants I'm just like why do I need to hear this I can read it like or um sometimes there's more of a benefit to like an open conversation with the applicant from the GetGo and less of an introduction um sometimes I feel like some of the applicants it's almost like a marketing thing like wait I'm not I'm not going to be the one living in this apartment like I don't need to know about the amenities for the public like that's going to live there I need to hear about the design and the zoning like sometimes I feel like we we are almost not aware of time and then it's like 10 10 o'clock I I think it's I mean coming from my perspective about having to
169schedule these things over the past three years that um it's just not I think things are getting better right in how we're organizing things absolutely and they can't always get better yet but to try to set up some kind of template that's going to work like every week and for every project to me it's like I I don't see how that's happening to me it's more about um where I think that Clarity is is about again it puts on more on the chair and potentially the vice chair to look at the project before it comes to the planning board to see if we w't even put it on our agenda or if it's ready like that's kind of was under my thing like a process because I feel like that's dogged us a lot right
170yeah well sometimes it's hard because it's like Peter's looking at the stuff but he's not an architect right I I can look at the stuff and say well what's that what's this what's that right and so is that does that become my job right that and what if there's a chair that's not an architect who isn't going to pick up on the things that I'm going to pick up on right whether something is ready is really perception too yeah so um so It's tricky in that way and that's what makes every project a little bit different right um and hard to and it is different how you're going to schedule when you have to have three public hearings in a meeting because of circumstances and when you only have one those are two very different
171meetings having a checklist that Kate is talking about will will help us I agree because if we have a checklist and it's transparent to the applicant then that will guide us and the meetings can become much more efficient like where are you in the checklist what are we focused on today I guess for me what I'm suggesting is I'm not criticizing the way we've been doing it I think we've done everything to become more efficient and we've made massive improvements in our process I think what I'm saying is what else can we squeeze out I'm thinking about the presentations themselves from the applicants I find can be way shorter and way to the point of what we need and the stuff there's a lot of extra stuff that they throw in because they're trying to
172sell the project to us rather than go for what we actually need how could we make that better maybe maybe there needs to be a conversation with the applicant ahead of time as to our expectation when you present is that you focus us on the zoning here's the zoning pieces that apply we don't need to hear about the beauty of this project and the marketing for the community you're not trying to sell this to us we need to hear the bylaw applicability give us that then if you want to fluff it up with some extras have fun but at a minimum they should start their presentations with this is zoning that applies this is how we fit the project like give me what I actually need for my decision rather than frankly it takes them
173like multiple presentations sometimes to get to what actually matters um yeah I think we need to be care I mean I I agree partly because I think you know for different projects but I also think um there is a lot in a big project there is a lot of information that I want on day one and I don't want it in three sentences I wanted to hear it in detail right and I think it's important for the public to understand some of the conceptuals stuff versus I don't want to comment on it before I hear all about it right and other times I think because we have questions we Veer off on a tangent and we have a big discussion about something else versus saying nope we're not going to discuss um affordable affordability right
174now because that's not that's not the presentation we're going to discuss that in two of two more meetings when we get there but that's not maybe not what people are going to think different things in the board affordability is really important to me I want to disc it today no I want to discuss sustainability so it's going to be really hard to can we to keep that on track but I agree with the zoning how does your project deal with zoning in my opinion the sooner we get to that the better because it grounds us and it organizes where we believe as a board we we have weaknesses in the project very very quickly is there a way to almost give like an outline with suggested time that we want to see from an applicant
175like I don't know whether we do that but we have given them like like okay you have 20 minutes for your presentation or whatever it was over and for a big project like for a big project for someone who you know like that is not a lot of time on a project this size and but I'm wondering if within that just to sort of address I think some of the big picture stuff is helpful and useful to say like okay what is this like you know what are we talking about what are we doing what does it look like because I think we actually do get into the nitty-gritty of like where's the tree going to go and is there a bench and like that so like if we completely have them like not give
176us an overview at all at the beginning I think we'll end up having more convoluted conversations later but I do wonder if we can say at the opening of a project here is you know we are affording you 20 minutes and we would really like you know three minutes of like a fly over of the project of like a really good look at the exterior we would like you to jump to the zoning quickly and and focus for 10 minutes on that and then we would like you know you to move on and sort of wrap up with your conclusion and any concluding remarks for and sort of give like in parentheses like how much time we expect them to spend on each thing to be able to say like this is what we value
177we don't want you to just completely gloss over this we and and and we will spend time we are a thorough board but like this is in the interest of time this is the starting place and then we're going to take it to questions I think I think I think there could be some general guidelines you know like that knowing that that presentation isn't going to cover all the information we're going to want and we're all going to have to be patient saying okay yeah I'd like to talk about sustainability but they're not going to be able to get to it today because we've asked them to do these other things right and to able to say like this is do you have those conversations with the applicant because you seem to know because that's
178the first time I've heard of it that there's this plan and that would be helpful to know well no I mean but it's not it's not that specific Peter and I when we've had three public hearings we've said and you know I have said tell them that they can have no more than 20 minutes to present this is like maybe when we have an hour for that project they can no more than 20 minutes you know so but I haven't given thing like oh focus on the bylaws or spend three minutes on this hasn't been anything more than that like you get this amount of time and then we're going to questions from the board on us not to say what's important at least try yeah but I think we also like when we did
179when we're doing the 10 to 16 million project you know which at this point was all virtual there were some nights where it's was like Hey we're going to focus on environmental okay the Environmental Engineers coming on and we're going to focus on that part like you know I mean that totally makes sense to me so we were doing that we were doing that and I think on a big project and we did that for tenness I mean for chestn street we said okay from you know what's the legality what I'm talking more about like the everyday project you're talking about the everyday project stuff the big projects obviously are going to get broken down into sub parts and that's corre we need to focus on but the but even on the sub parts there's
180generally a bylaw or something applicable I guess what I'm suggesting is let's ground Us in the ultimate thing we got to do the ultimate thing we got to do is draft a decision that's consistent with the bylaws there's elements to every single meeting we have big project or little I'm just suggesting I've noticed I'm being honest well I'll be in I will listen to an applicant and there's a lot of fluff and there's not a lot of substance to what actually matters to what a decision is and we we tend to repeat things because that's what happens because people want to come in and sell they're not necessarily focused on what we do which is we got to draft a decision and mark up certain points the most useful meetings we've had in my opinion
181are those where we as a board are looking at those elements and we're thinking about do we have enough on this element do we have that that's what we should be doing with the applicant the applicant Behavior thing too if we tell them that's what we expect like I wonder if things will come to us cleaner like and require less discussion down the line I don't think it needs to be super super like directed and obviously we're not going to say like the buzzer dings like your three minutes on the intro to the project are over but I wonder if just some saying what we think is important and what we like to see and some allocation like I mean we do that in presentations like when we get let's say when we get a
182um when we're going to go to we're going to present like an RFP they tell us like what they want to see and and how much time time they want to spend on each thing and what's important to them and I wonder if some direction will help I almost like an opening statement from US that says we welcome the applicant we're excited to hear about the project we have some general guidelines of what we seek in each project we're ultimately you know grounded in the bylaws this is the bylaw that applies we're hoping your presentation will bring us there as quickly as possible like I I also think and this is a it's probably somewhat biased but I also think it's true I think there's difference in the presentations and the fluff Factor depending on
183when the presentation is given by the attorney no offense to those at the table and when it's given by the architect you know or the engineer because they don't deal a lot in fluff right they're explaining the project they're explaining the why they made the moves that they did why it sits on the site the way it does and I think the sales sometimes is coming from the people that don't it's very evident to me they don't really understand the project they're they're regurgitating kind of what they've been yeah what what they've what they've heard or whatever versus the architect being able to explain the project so it might be sometimes that we want the pro we want the project to be explained by the architect right not by a representative not by you know
184and that would get through some of the I mean they can explain the some of it right some of it I me I don't know that we can demand that I don't know if that's I'm not sure we can too but I think that's a careful thing about like the about the fluff in the presentation cuz I don't always experience that listen there's benefits to both like a lot of what we do is we have to focus on the placement of a tree or a bench or look at details on the building I'm all for it I actually am trying to say the exact opposite of that which is like in addition to those details I wasn't thinking about criticizing the details all of it is important we want the basis of the project we
185want all the chitectural and design details we also want the bylaw to me it doesn't really matter who's doing it lawyer or non-lawyer the bylaws to me tend to be missing the most and then by the time we get to our decision I feel like we're the ones doing the heavy lifting and we're trying to remember what do we have on this project from that point and it doesn't really matter to me if it's an architect or an attorney who does it someone needs to bring us back yeah but what I'm saying is that on some of these bylaws is um how I don't know the exact afterward but how is this fitting into the community yes right exactly so in explaining that they need to explain not because this tree I'm not talking about
186that level of detail I'm talking about the big moves on the site Y and how those things were placed and that comes better from the person that did it than the person who's trying to sell it right so um usually the people that are trying to sell it are the developers not the attorneys um lawyers are super annoying I'm not going to disagree with that but uh I I can't think of a lot of projectss where we've had lawyer presentations the ones I'm criticizing in my mind the ones I remember standing out tends to be the developer not the architect who is kind of spending quite a bit of time on things where I'm just like okay we're going to pass this thing stop trying to convince me get to the you know we need
187to talk about conditions we need to talk about the requirements of the bylaw um that's what I was referencing well why don't we again now it's it's getting quarter to 10 and we still have other things to do on our agenda so why don't we there's obviously a discussion here about especially when these big projects come on and how we can get them through a little bit quicker so I will have it noted that um that we need to talk about that um more and um and I'm very open to that because I don't like to be here all night either and it really was no offense about attorneys in general just attorneys I don't practice anymore the record I I've been in compliance in a finance company in an operational role for almost 10
188years so we can insult lawyers all you want um I happen to have a law degree and I'm active but I don't actually practice law so I'm a practicing attorney but I do find out practicing attorneys and myself often quite annoying exactly I'll and I'll I'll second that I'll make a motion to second that yeah I'm with you on that one so no offense taken well I'm I'm happy to have you both on the board because you have strengths that I do not I think that's what makes this a strong board so um okay so uh agenda um planning board retreat check okay so going through the things that we have to go through I assume you're good on comprehensive plan or is there more that I don't have anything else to say that you
189want to announce um just we should make sure the the joint meeting with the select board September September 4th yep that's on the agenda I believe on their upcoming meetings on our agenda y as a remind on the second page and just to note Kate and Anna um well to everybody the next meeting is August 15th and that's going to be at back at the library okay for the com for the you mean for the comprehensive for the comprehensive plan yep August 15th August 15th so unless there's other things is there anything for Metro West Regional they haven't done anything they take the summer off so this is obviously just an update item a report and not a full discussion nor do we have time but um the First on MBTA obviously there's a a
190calendar here um that is being filled out about MB the MBTA regulations and we will as Kate suggested start advertising for the the two public discussions which are not public hearings those come later um but the general public discussions which which we also had last time which is a which was a really great and valuable way to get um just some really open feedback about what people thought should be included and not included we got some great questions you know on there so what we were planning to do is to as you see um in the first box there SEL board and planning board update because as you know it's very hard to get the two boards together um Peter and alv were going to give a presentation a more formal update um uh for
191the planning board on the 25th for us um it's not something that necessarily needs to be ours it's just uh to to um make sure we're up to date on that we wanted to do it before we have these public discussions so you kind of see where we're are all everything that we're are is actually reflected on these sheets so which I'll talk about in a minute um and then the select board on that so Joe minani on um 8:14 um oh yeah okay sorry sorry um so we're giving like a little update now and we're going to have a more of an update on um um when we have our joint meeting will be kind of the big thing wait a minute Peter what is update boards about so we update Boards of the
192kind of process so yeah no see this should be this should be in August um sorry so that's 7:25 should be 8 25 so our so there's going to be 8:22 sorry um so on that date we're going to have a more a a bigger discussion just on the planning board we can invite the select board if they want to come we can also go to theirs if people want to participate but we just didn't think we'd be able to get everyone together again right so we said hey we'll do these updates separately in the boards um and um and then proceed with the public discussions then come back with a formal meeting with the select board and the planning board in the same room to to talk about all the results from that with
193updates in between of course in between the public discussions so what the what these things are obviously one is the calendar this one which is um the M yeah and uh I apologize that ELO didn't didn't catch all of my tweaks on this so and I think some of them are really important so um the um the thing in red below actually as on the map should have been marked in Orange so that it's not supposed to be highlighted in red it should be orange because as you can see from the key they're projects that are approved but not built and ucg is in that category it's not supposed to be I'm going to have him update this and send it to the board so it's correct and also that line about not considering Ed
194in fall fall MBTA proposal that shouldn't be there um it's meant just to understand what this is and the kind of the you know what that project is um we are look we are looking for um how can we not include that project if we don't want to include it because that's the one one of the ones we Mark as high risk Kate asked the question before like well why not and so we tried in this chart to out line hey what's it permit what's the benefits of it now right so that benefit is it's it's a low unit count um it's 25% affordable and it's age restricted all of which go away if it's in just MBTA zoning right so um so that's why we tried that's why we were like trying to take
195that out but we have not made a decision that it's absolutely coming out and I think that's so what's before and you guys were going to do is like what is the zoning now it could be there the only way to yeah so that's what's under the F right so the second to last comment is pro proposed permitted built units per acre um and that shouldn't be units per acre that should be density um so again I I'm going to have a fresh copy sent because this isn't quite right the density is showing what it's um you know what's it what it's proposed as permitted as right um and then the next one is units per acre that's a result of of that permitting so um so I don't know if that I don't know
196if that answers your question I mean I think it's just the titles to make sense of them like you want the titles to make sense what is what is currently proposed built proposed or allowed because like 1060 Main Street doesn't have any housing but you're saying so I it's confusing yeah so proposed meant um with the current um with the current numbers coming in as 4 The 40b Proposal yep so should we label those as 40b proposal thought we were going to say without like the base I thought we were going to the base zoning right now if nothing changed okay I thought we agreed to that because that's the way to make sense of it so um we we can add another column in there we think we were going to look at current
197zoning yes what does the current zoning allow for density from a density standpoint yes yeah well just a note there's a couple different things right there's F which is FL a ratio right which is a different which is a different mathematical calculation of how many units you can get on an A on a on a lot then you have then you have you know and then the MBTA is units per acre right so you're you're trying to mesh two different calculations into one which is very difficult to do especially when you're talking about F because it's more of a lot calculation and then you got to get into unit size X Y and Z yeah the same building with the exact with a two F can have one unit on it or it can have
198100 units on it same F right and that's what's in the Zoning for some of these districts is f not units per acre so you can't there is no number to give right you have to say well on you're taking the average so the AL just to me is what is the way I think about it because I'm thinking to Prior discussions we had with the select board what matters to me I think is what is the current zoning it's not about density necessarily as much as like what does the current zoning allow period because does it allow five stories or four stories does it allow 16 stories because once you have a 40b you can pretty much do whatever stories you want yeah so so it's not just about density to to your point
199Peter yeah it's a different definition of density but we do need to understand what's what is currently allowed in these areas we're proposing right we need to know where it doesn't need to be the same lingo right well um just so um 10 to 60 Main Street right that is under Zoning for that's in um add right it's add corre so that is uh I believe is it 2 minutes breaker or 1.5 F sorry not use units breaker F it's an F of two yeah that tells you nothing about the units per acre nor can I provide that because it doesn't f doesn't talk about units per acre but what does it allow what is it what's the so where did this number come from on the chart that's why I'm just that came from
200the 32 under no under 10 to 16 the 36 that came from what is being proposed by the 40b it's SL perent so we need to be more clear about what that number is about both what is what is allowed which is a two a 1.5 or two of f which is not attached to units per acre or the 36 units per acre which is being proposed by the 40b I know it's hard to the f is a really hard thing to get a hold of because it doesn't have to do with units per acre they can be three bedroom units or they can be studio apartments and you're going to get totally different units per acre so so I'm I don't want you guys to have to do work that's not necessary what I'm
201I'm trying to take myself back to the conversation we have with the select board where there was a res residents who were discussing um building or allowing their property into the 40b excuse me into the MBTA discussion the MBTA discussion next to the transation thank you next to the transation and the whole burnhams thank you so much and the whole discussion circled around this idea one of the ideas that we kept discussing was what could they do right now by right what could they do the when we look relative to MBTA and so to me what matters is an understanding of the these these areas right now what can you do there by right what can you do there by special permit and what would you be able to do there per MBTA that's what
202I'm visualizing right so what's so but what's important to understand just like as it was yeah it just that it was hard for those owners to understand is that property is determined by F and it is by right they can do housing by right they can they can do multi they can do they can do it by right not special permit that's what I mean that was not that was missing from Clarity and so for me but you still can't understand signed up by units per acre I get that and I get that too and I guess I'm okay with the imper to your point it's apples and oranges relative to density yes but it's still an instructive we need to be able to understand what is the current zoning and what is the MBTA
203zoning and yes they're different they're apples and oranges but it's a visual for the public and for us as to what we're changing we're moving from this kind of thing to this kind of thing we're moving from apples over here to oranges over here by right or do you know totally different I do it doesn't need to be the same apples apples but because it's apples to oranges we need to be able to convey that and we need to be able to communicate it because what I heard in our prior discussion with the select board is a lack of clarity that's what I heard I don't think it's clear even to the select board what is allowed there by right now or not I can tell you right now mixed use is allowed by right
204on that property under add right there's no but there's been no projects in Ash that have taken place under add I believe everything has been done under addc right uh add is the highest floor area ratio at 2 point at 2.0 right how many stories can they do by right three okay so they will probably never and no project right will ever hit 2.0 F on any project in Ashen because you have parking requirements and you have height limitations right so if you back up a little bit and you say okay well let's look at 10 to 16 let's look at looks like a 128 Main Street right that has a f of 1.5 I can tell you right now that I think that's at 1.8 no 1.08 right that is because it can't go
205that high as a 1.5 is because of all the other limitations that you have right sounds like another clean up like have something it might be it I mean f is a very common way to do things because it controls the mass of what you're putting there the shape how big is the box but it doesn't control what goes in the Box units per acre controls what goes in the box so there were I'm sure when this was created there was a and there there are very valid reasons for doing F it's hard to comp it doesn't match up to NBTA zoning which is units forer but what I'm hearing yes but so what I'm hearing is that and I like I I'm a little frustrated because some of these things aren't the corrections aren't
206made so what I'm what I'm going to do is to try to provide more information on a separate page like a one 8 and half by 11 table with more information it'll get more complicated but it's just more complicated um but it ultim makes it simpler if we can't explain this to people we're asking people to consider a change and we can't tell them what it is now I would I would say you're not going to get this passed we don't we don't know what weing if we cannot explain this to people they're not going to want to vote for it yeah I mean those questions it's a change it's not it's not yeah so that's what we'll we'll put to like I said I'm this I think it's not quite right I think our
207goal like one of our goals was to be able to convey to the public that the certain areas there's not even going to be change relative to what's already there so it would be good to be able to demonstrate that I guess but I also feel like we're creating extra work for you so I want to make it's all extra work at the end of the day but I'll tell you this right now under add you have two different things right and you're trying to and a the MBTA zoning right is trying to is is on the units per acre add is on F are yeah and so to to mesh those two things is difficult right and so I think what we're trying to show in this this this chart right which is which
208Alo put together nicely is that okay let's look at okay what was proposed what's the MBTA stuff going to be and what's the difference right and I think we can clean it up and we can get back and we can kind of send it out but this is difficult stuff right 100% and not everyone's going to be able to a will follow it and B knows the ins and the outs right but have to make this followable to the public I mean ultimately those are it will be and it and it is to tell you you know and it is um I I think it's going to be a mix some people will be able to follow it and some people are going to have a hard time following it because it's hard to follow
209and I'm not going to say that F can be made understandable to every single person but we'll do our best and maybe have to understand it in words not just on a piece of paper because it's it's just not it's very hard to make a visual representation of a complex zoning bylaw that speaks a different language from the MBTA I get that I really do can we I I don't know about you guys my brain is starting to slightly I think this is a very difficult thing to fix late at night that's why I didn't I wasn't intending to go into this it was supposed to be just an update so I'm very hesitant to even to even stand by my suggestions because I think it's so late at night that I don't want to
210like I'm going to take what I suggested back because because I feel like it's too late at night to even properly discuss this topic to the point where I can actually say change it I don't think it's a fair time no I'm going to work with Peter and Alo based on what we said today to to provide more information that hopefully makes it's simpler to to understand yeah and I I did not intend to create extra work at this hour I don't think that's fair no no like I said it's a it's a little yeah so um and El is on the same page he said I need people to look at it so I understand what they don't understand so I can help them understand maybe we should give this one more shot yeah
211I'm earlier in our meetings yeah yeah so anyway we'll be talking about it you guys can definitely you know maybe we have it on the agenda for the 8th yeah so that Peter and ELO like I don't need them to go through it with me again right they can go through it with you guys that's fine you know so um and that might be helpful okay sorry about that all right um don't need to do anything on number seven on number eight um there's nothing with Whitmore is there legally no we're just working with the attorneys continuously our conservations office is working with them legally um I'm having continued conversations with the um with the with the with the developers with the contractors we hope work to get done out there but we're we're following
212all avenues that we need to do and we're trying to be proactive to to make work to to get work going back out there to get it done okay the biggest thing I can talk to is number four and that's the Starbucks tomorrow is the ribbon cutting 4:00 if anybody's interested in being down there um the occupany print was granted today Saturday is the first day it'll be open um the police know Saturday this Saturday they're this Saturday they're open uh inside looks awesome it's been great um there are some outstanding landscape issues um that I've talked about with the owners with the developers with the um site workers um those are all elements um regarding the bushes in the front at the Apex um they're T they're taking taking those out um they were
213in the process of taking those out on yesterday um until we realized that they did not have a uh Dig Safe And there's some underground electrical wires that pertain to the overhead lights um and so therefore they stopped they halted a little bit so all the Landscaping is going to get done um obviously it's the best time to plant grass in September to get this grass growing um and so those all those issues are are conditioned on the occupancy permit um just as a note however the big story is Saturday coffee will be poured at Starbucks tomorrow is the ribbon cutting please feel free and enjoy yourself the ribbon cutting is at 4 I think everyone got an invite right yeah I thought I I might be able to go I'm trying to trying to
214see if I can make it work but I may not be able to we'll see I think everyone's excited I've been down there every day this week and I can't tell you how many people went through tried to go through the drivethru line I saw coming because I yesterday I was like I could see people thinking about pulling in there like as I was driving down and then today I saw the coming soon I was like that was probably bu yeah yeah so you know the building's going to open Starbucks is excited I think everyone's excited um there's a couple site issues that have to be worked out and they are going to be worked out um but uh just want to give everyone the heads up on that okay so update on 100 Chestnut
215Street I don't know when it was it was hot all I remember is that y but uh Peter and I met with the architect and the developer there's a few people from the development team there out at the site um because Peter and I were there earlier and I noticed um things that were different on the approved drawings and on the building right none of it was that big but I was just I had questions right and it it's important to remember that when projects go through they're not even 50% done like they're a fraction of the design done you know at that point so this is a you know pretty normal thing like I said I don't think most people would even notice them but I have the drawings in front of me and
216I did so I asked questions so we had a meeting out there and we went through some of the things um that had changed and for what reasons sometimes it was in the interior layout of Apartments had to change because of whatever um sometimes it was um a certain business that was asking for a front entry door versus a entry on the side you know things like that so to get um to fill the business slots and so um I asked them U none of it seemed egregious to me none of it seemed out of character with what we had approved but I asked them to take the original drawings put the as it was being built um drawings in the same configuration and call out the things that have changed right call them out
217so it's very obvious for everybody to see and so they're doing that they're in the process that doing that they called they sent a draft I think there's still some more things I want them to call out on there um I mean a lot of things are just different like you don't have the exact window size when you're because you didn't do your window order yet like when you're putting in the windows right so there's lots of St stuff like that in process um so they will be providing those drawings I think the architect actually said he or someone from his office happy to come could come and explain those changes and what for why the why the changes were done um so I just wanted to give an update on that it's nothing I'm
218seems to me at as part for the course especially not only in a building that size but in the little buildings I work on this uh 100 chest Street under construction so um uh and full disclosure I realized at that meeting I would not have realized if they had not said it but the architect Matt ver marada and also uh Eric senson from the development team are my former students like I had them apparently about 20 years ago in studio I guess the I guess Matt was trying to figure out during these um presentations if I recognized him I had no idea until this meeting on site was quite embarrassing actually but I had no idea who who they were I mean I've had hundreds if not thousands of students I didn't no way yeah
219so um anyway but full disclosure for student so it's all your fault anything they M up what's that you're the teacher it's all your fault it could be yeah so these changes that you happen to on like is there again with process a threshold that we should say you shall and like discuss I think we should consider some conditions in our decision that makes it clear that what we consider to be worthy of notification exactly we should think about it I don't know what the answer is like you're like oh it's part of the course because like I would imagine when you make a plan and then you go out and you order the windows they're out of stock what do you do well my expectation is if we actually cared enough to approve a
220design of a window there are buildings like I'm thinking about the old design that's now gone pre 40b up Main Street there was a lot of interesting detail in that whatever rendering of the break and the in the design of the windows if suddenly those windows were not purchasable and it changes in the size or shape I would consider that to be a big deal me personally I don't I want you to get the one that you presented not the cheaper version that you can now find so I think we as a board need to come to some consensus about what is normal for changes and what's not like yeah maybe the quality on some sort of micro level I don't really care about or a little tree moving you know a few feet maybe
221I don't care that much but like Shapes of Things locations of things on the building like the Starbucks issue that came up where they put it on the wrong you know they put the little electrical thing in a random location stuff like that to me is a big deal yeah I mean I think that discussion does have to happen because like the electrical panel wasn't a r random location it was like the probably the appropriate location for the project but at 60 at 60% or whatever percentage that the drawing is presented to us as because you can't bring it into full tuition and you know fruition we didn't even know that until somebody walked by noticed no it was me but I mean the Starbucks thing was you too yes great so so maybe we
222have the Clause called if Trisha walks by the building and notices you you have to come back I don't know what we call this Clause whatever it is we need to think about it I I do and and that's why and that's why I didn't say onsite yeah it's good you know whatever I said no this needs to come before the board like the Board needs to understand these changes I said my personal opinion is that these are these are these are in this this what's been going that probably no one would know them here's the thing what you do is a lot and I appreciate it very much but it's like that's not a fair way for you to function as a chair to have to go check projects out nor is it necessarily
223okay in my mind that one person is deciding is this good or is this not good is this consistent or not consistent I think we as a board need to figure out the expectation of what that is rather than like oh our chair is going to go check it out what if you can't check out no I I I that's why I'm totally agreeing with that like I'm totally agreeing with that but it's like we'll have to I I will have to figure out what is the um with the understanding that these projects are submitted rightly and correctly not at 100% right like it just can't they can't have to come back for every little it they can't we would be dealing with with one of these buildings every a little thing that's right that's
224right so how we get to that and how we put it in our conditions and how we it's going to be uh interesting discussion because I don't know what the answer is so just a note I think the developer was forthcoming right and he asked and theoretically it all came out when when we went up I they asked that they and they invite they I've been going up there they said let's come come up and look at the siding colors siding colors are very important to everybody right so obviously I you know having Trish in town I said hey Trish I'm going to the site look at siding colors and then when we were up there looking at the siding colors which were spoton we start to notice a couple tweaks and it wasn't a
225couple large tweaks it was just you know they go through that design change and so that's where this conversation Sparks from I just want to be clear about that and so going in that reques no I don't think it was I don't think it was I don't think I think someone asked even and they're like we don't splitting so there was a there was a Oh that was there's a commercial space right and so the commercial space um had one door coming through it right and so now um they have two proposed tenants in that one space and so they each tenant wanted their own door their own they both want a front door like no one wants a side door right and so they had a side door proposed which kind of went in
226under a residential um they're not balcony they did no I think they they didn't want to be uh you know then have to it's false through right like yeah they said there was nothing signed kind of Starbuck is open tomorrow man yeah I mean Saturday sat Amanda's like what else is opening come on come on what am I going to do after I get my coffee so I I think I think it's a it's definitely a valid question about how we how we go forward with this I don't think it's going to be an easy one are very long my children don't sleep can is this under I think it's under administrative matters I mean it's not listed but of the the um 10 to 60 Main Street 40b application have we heard anything I
227have no no update no that's up at Mass Housing and both both of them yep both of them at Mass housing they have their time they're working within their time frames um and so I have had no communication with Mass housing at this point all right so no upate upate anything else that needs to be discussed besides uh what any update on the mural for the Starbucks not that I know not that I know I know the last artist um that we that they were talking to um um pulled out of the pull pull out of running and decided not to take the job on due to that I didn't know due to I think the whole complexity of uh the tri party contracts and payments and and funding funding too but I think it
228was more of um everything right this is a project procurement um uh you know I will say this right the idea of putting a mural on a building as a town project on private property it's a lot easier said than done and that's pretty much my takeaway from this entire process um in that now we're back to let's find a muralist that's interested in working with us um to do this project it's too bad I didn't know that all right anything else you ready to clear up some meeting minutes we have first August uh February 1st Mee yeah the February 1 one's an old meeting um obviously it was a long time ago kind of slipped through the Wicket so I would say um this is a zoom meeting that the planning board had with
229the sustainability committee to discuss the tree bylaws these minutes were kind of borrowed from the sustainability committee as the meetings were already written for that uh the minutes were already written for that meeting obviously and so we were just um we put it on uh put it on on plany board letterhead and kind of put everything together so I think there's a there's a couple things that I don't really understand what comment I was actually making um I had the same reaction to mine because I was like what the hell do they think I said yeah I don't I don't understand I don't know how to make it better yeah well the only one that I the only exactly the one that matters to me it um is um on line 73 because that's the
230one I do remember it says Miss Kendall says she does not believe that anyone town is against trees true but when confronted with trees or an expanding town and I think I specifically said when I said when confronted with trees or a new town you know I I think it said the YMCA frankly um but it could be like a a new a new town amenity you know we could say something like that but I think I was comparing the trees to the YMCA you know then you might make a different choice I think that's what I was I would say a new town amenity okay and that's the same thing later in this this residents might favor the new amenity over the trees or something like that um because I don't think the students
231or that I don't think residents would just vote for an expanding town instead of trees that seems uh not true okay that was my only one what's that proposal to anex part of hopon to expand the town oh right we need more space I'll mention that to the comprehensive plan committee the planning board suggested we are so smart annexation are we good should I make a motion was again I'm good if um I make a motion to accept the February 1st 2024 minutes as amended at the meeting I'll second it R vot an tman cther Jersey guy oh um yeah Amanda ha ey and Trisha Kendall ey so then now we're at the June 18th meetings these were about this is the zoom meeting the online Zoom meeting when we came up with a letter
232when we finalized the letter for the 61 Waverly Street 40b okay right um just a I think this is correct but Wildwood Zone D multif family there's a height limit of five stories for residential commercial together is that right okay it's under my comment but I don't remember that I made that comment so it was probably just uh I'm not sure maybe I did because I was looking at the zoning at that time but I can't remember yep are these still generated by a person or or by AI a person great I've never been quoted so much before [Laughter] I'm I'm good with these so am I I'll make a motion to approve the June 18th meetings as is if if you guys are good with them I just made that conclusion based on their
233based on the silence second second okay roll call vote an testes I Katherine Jersey guy Amanda ha I and Trish Kendall I and now we're on to June 20 I was noted the June 20th can someone remind me do I vote for these I don't think you can I don't think I can I so I'm at this one I was not that's fine but I was not at the June 20th so oh it's fine so June 20th okay yeah so that's when we where the hell we do we approve approved six Chestnut and uh 151 correct the five station oh yes and we finished the letter for 61 I mean and we six we finished a 40b letter holy cow that was a that was a big meeting all it's painful just to look at
234it oh and a lot release that's right okay I think I'm good as as is I make a motion that we accept the June 2024 minutes as presented is there a second I guess I guess I can second right I will second and I guess Amanda could too because you were there but a roll second Catherine Jers gu Amanda ey and ey so those are oh sorry I completely space that you could not yeah you're good that's right five is five I mean three covers Us okay M um I'll make a motion to adjourn unless we have something else uh just one thing um August 8th planning board meeting I said I am not here I am traveling Amanda say she might be able to come on she's also traveling so um to I was
235going to come on if they needed it for that for that decision yeah I don't think I can get on at all um so Anna that means you're on unless uh as chair unless sure someone else wants to I'm just going to check on Marcelo Marcelo I'm going to check with Marcelo with his attendance because I know he's traveling uh he said so if if Trisha and Marcel are out we can't hold a meeting right no you still have AUM oh we have de can be there right you checked with her I can check with her I thought there was a meeting in August she couldn't make my imagin I'm it's on my calendar in my office but um I'll send out an email just to double check with everybody yeah but let me know
236if you need me to chair it I'll chair it okay and I will be getting this MBTA stuff to everybody because I want it I want you to be able to study it and you know with plenty of time so my only thing is the very last week of August the week of the 26th or whatever is the week I'm taking my daughter to college so I'm useless that week so if you guys have if if we're doing something MBTA related or whatever or planning board related that's the week that I'm useless so you'll be at the meeting oh 22nd I can do the week after I cannot okay there's okay so there's there's there's five Thursdays in August there's the so we're going to meet on the 8th and the 22nd perfect that I
237can do and so you're out the week of the 26th which is the 26 to the 31st and so I I assume Labor day is going to be on the 2 the second yes okay gotcha and then we're going to come back after Labor Day that Wednesday is going to be that meeting with the okay so that's fine okay I feel like didn't know something new was going to come up if something new is is this point I think right now not so much okay I think that's going to be a week that's going to be that's going to be a week Labor Day week where everyone's going to enjoy the last stuff week of Summer and okay I'm assuming we're going to stay [Music] room so sorry to hear that I'm assuming we're going
238to continue hybrid in the fall the state still allows us to do that and all that I assume since we are the only board besides the school committee and likey board that are meeting in person everyone else is still hybrid which is allowed till 20 through 26 I believe that we will just keep things going the way they are all right so we had we we adjourned toj I'll make a motion to adjourn the meeting at 10:31 p.m. second roll call vote and I Katherine Jersey guy Amanda ha I and TR k i thanks everybody e e for