School Board Work Session: 10-1-25

001[Music] Call the meeting to order. Miss Tanner, will you please call the role? >> Bassine >> here. >> Buffalo >> here. >> Inge >> present. >> Martin >> present. >> Thomas >> here. >> Kaliro >> here. >> Uh move on to item 2.01, a discipline update. Um >> uh and I'd like to welcome uh Miss Hamlin and Miss Plute up to uh present the latest discipline update for the board. >> Good afternoon, Madame Chair, Miss Caligiro, Madame Vice Chair, Miss Thomas, members of the school board, Dr. poll. Members of the public and colleagues, today, Miss Plute and I will provide an update of student conduct and discipline across the district. Our focus is on equity, consistency, and restorative practices while ensuring compliance with state guidelines. >> Okay. Discipline across the district. Our district-wide approach to

002discipline is aligned with the Virginia Board of Education's model guidance for positive and proactive code of conduct policies. We emphasize fairness, consistency while prioritizing restorative practices over exclusionary measures. So our goal is not to suspend students. Our interventions are matched carefully with the student infractions, ensuring responses are proportional. Importantly, all decisions are data driven and reported in compliance with the state the disciplinary process pathway. So we've established a clear disciplinary process pathway that schools follow. So let's just walk through that together. So we have an infraction that takes place. It has to be determined whether or not it's a teacher response or an office response. So what is the teacher response? That's the classroom management. That's looking at maybe the setup of the classroom. We have um the teacher might have one-on-one conferences. conferences with

003parents, proximity, making sure that um you know they are doing everything redirection in the classroom. So the teachers are taking care of that. But if it's a serious infraction, if it's um repeated violations or of safety concerns, then that becomes one that has to go to the office. Due process must be given so the student has to know the allegation against them but also allow students to share their side of the story, their perspective. We perform thorough investigations, which means that we're going to collect statements from everyone that has knowledge of the incident. If it happened in the classroom, then the students in the classroom would be asked if they know anything about what took place. If it happened in the hallway, we're going to ask anyone that was in the hallway, students, teachers, security

004officers, anyone that has knowledge of that incident to write statements. We gather the video evidence as well. And sometimes students will share even more information with us um so that if when they have trusted adults in the building, they will give us even additional information about a particular investigation. Then we decide on the infraction code. We match it with the code of student conduct to ensure that we have consistency across schools. We decide on the intervention or s our sanctions. So we have the north of public schools level system. So for example, level one to two could be detention, restorative practices, loss of privileges. While levels three to four may lead to an inschool suspension, out of school suspension for 1 to 10 days, and that's done at the school level. It might be referred

005to tribunal. If it's referred to tribunal, then that could possibly lead to a long-term suspension or an expulsion. If a student has an IEP or 504 that will exceed the 10 days of cumulative suspensions, are there being referred to tribunal? A manifestation determination review must be held that's conducted at the school level. But I just want to mention I've I've said this to board members previously that we also go an extra while their MDR is held there. If it comes to tribunal we also have our compliance team to kind of look at things to make sure that we are doing things in order. We contact the parents and we provide written notice. The narrative must tell exactly what took place, what the student um you know is being charged with the decision. And we also

006put that there's a right for an appeal. All of our incidents are entered into synergy. So we have documents of the in incident, the findings and the disciplinary action. If a tribunal is required, we give the schools a list of things that need to come to tribunal. It's not just for that particular incident. We ask teachers to give us feedback about the student because we want to deal with the whole child. We have the um school counselors to provide information. We ask the schools to bring the cumulative folder because we want to make sure we know everything about that child. And sometimes we find things that are maybe a little surprise once we look at that cumulative folder. So the evidence that comes to tribunal has all the statements, videos, that kind of thing. that

007when the panel and the hearing officer have to make a decision, it's an informed decision based on everything about that particular child. If a long-term suspension or expulsion is determined, the hearing officer then refers the students to Madison, TRA, or ACEs. And I don't know if I've ever told you, but the ACES are elementary program. So, we have supports at all levels. And so these are the students that are reflected on our monthly schoolboard reports that we discuss in close session. Individual school reports. Each school is unique. They have strengths and challenges. By reviewing individual school reports, we can highlight areas of success and identify where additional supports may be needed. This school level analysis allows us to tailor interventions more effectively. Each school report is provided to the principal, the executive director outlining discipline

008incidents, strengths, areas for improvement. This process allows us to identify PL uh patterns, respond early, and ensure accountability at both the school and the district level. Reports are provided throughout the year but also in our trainings that we provide in the summer. Principles can also run reports in power school and in synergy. So they can run their own reports but we do send them from from our office as well. We're also able to meet with the executive directors to look at numbers percentages and dig deeper when needed. Please note you had um some data that was uploaded for you. That information reflects the students um the percent of students that have no incidents. So I thought that that was very positive. There are no incidents. So then the other percentage reflects those that might have

009one or more incidents. Student Handbook Transparency. Our handbook plays a critical role in transparency and we're one of the few districts that put it all out there. We've even had our colleagues like U. Miss Plutude and I both served on the state committee and we had people that said, "Why would you put that information there?" Because parents do read our our handbook, okay? And they know a lot of things and so they they want to make sure that they understand what to expect. So, by having our policies clearly outlined and the level responses, staff, students, and parents know what to expect because it's all there. Um, it's also updated annually. Now, we can tell you that that's a choice chore. Um, it used to be mine, now it's Miss Plus. It doesn't always make you

010the happiest camper during the summer when you're trying to update it according to state and federal guidelines. It's easily accessible. So, we ensure that it's communicated. It's inclusive communication. We have it in English and in Spanish. It's online and it's in print. And we've provided copies of the imprint um standards of student conduct trends across the district. So, MTSS and PBIS serve as the backbone of our approach. MTSS is the multi multi-tered systems of supports. That framework includes academic behavior and social emotional supports. While PBIS is our positive behavior intervention supports and its datainformed approach which is in the MTSS system specifically focuses on organizing and implementing a continuum of evidence base behavior supports and practices across the three tiers of intervention and um school wellness with Dr. Moore and Dr. uh Williams spearhead that

011for us and we have a big committee that meets to make sure that we're moving in the right direction and I have to tell you today I was on the phone with this high school and in the background the principal was making the announcements for the e uh for the afternoon and I heard him say and remember we're going to be responsible respectful and safe that made me excited because a lot of times you know you know that the elementary principles they do it a lot But to hear the high school principal, that just kind of made my day, especially when we're having this conversation today, um, with universal supports for all students, targeted behavior, targeted interventions for those at risk, and individualized strategies for those who need intensive support is also a part of

012this because we want to emphasize prevention, equity, and positive student outcome. Our discipline data allows us to identify strengths and areas of concerns across the district. We analyze increases and decreases in infractions. We have a lot of conversations about that as we break it down by grade level and subgroups and we also it also highlights emerging um patterns across the district. It helps us to adjust supports, target interventions and remain proactive as opposed to being reactive. It also helps us to address systematic issues and measure the effectiveness of the interventions. Um I heard to one comment earlier about our administrator's guide. Well, this is a tool that is um to ensure consistency and practices across the district. It's a tool that's unique to Northfor public schools. Our administrative guy went from this to this now,

013but we put a lot of time and information so that we can make sure that our um school level administrators have what they need to um you know deal with things across their in their buildings. But it we also shared it with the people in region two. So, we were recently talking to someone in another district and the one thing that they asked was, "Have you published your administrator's guide yet?" because they wanted a copy. Um, this resources compiles best practices, current policies, and key information in one place. It equips the stu school leaders to create a disciplined safe environment while stand align with the district goals of equity and student success. You might ask, well, how does the department of student support services support schools? We do it in a multiple in multiple ways.

014We provide large group, small group, individualized training. We also make school visits. Um, we have ongoing coaching that goes on all day every day where we are talking to schools. We give consultation by phone, email, and zoom. We also share resources like Pludes News and it has everything that you need to know in one place. When the newsletter goes out, it has links to all kinds of things. is very informative and I tell people all the time if you keep Plut's news on your um desktop most of the things that you want to ask a question about is is right there. She's done an excellent job with that. We also provide referrals when needed and legal guidance as needed. Um this ensures that again that they have the supports and tools they need to manage

015discipline effectively. We have suggestions for principles um when we meet with them in the summer. We have an annual meeting every year where we talk about discipline um and make suggestions like having conducted you know the walk-ins uh check-ins walkthroughs sharing best practices across the district. So we might have one school present something because of the way they did it was really positive. We had that this summer. you know, one school did a really good job of handling in a situation. So, and it was very effective because people had an opportunity to say, "Wow, that was really good." And, you know, think about how that they can do sort of the same things. We offer professional development on trends. So, when we look at trends, we try to bring things to our summit trainings and

016other um other trainings throughout the year that deal with the trends. Um also I mentioned that we you know implement an MTSS PBIS framework so that we have consistent systems. You have to look at all systems. It's not just it's from the time the children pull up on the bus, get off, what happens in the parking lot, what happens in the hallway, what happens in the cafeteria. You need to analyze all of your systems so that you can make sure that the processes that you have in place are working for your kids. And so what might work over here may not necessarily work over there. So if you look at your individual systems and it it can give you a better idea of okay I need to change that move that that doesn't work we

017get rid of it. So I just feel that that's very important to focus on and this action helps to create a positive climate and it reduces our exclusionary discipline. Again, our goal is not to put the students out of school. So, we want to have things in place. In closing, our goal is to ensure discipline practices are equitable, consistent, and supportive of students. We remain committed to using data, restorative approaches, strong leadership, collaboration to make this happen. And at this time, Miss Palut and I welcome your questions. Buffalo. >> Yes. Thank you for this presentation. I have a question. Um the the pro the discipline process pathway. Um I know putting incidents in synergy for incidents to kind of go through the queue or the steps, but what if there is um our teachers able

018to put in synergy? Not necessarily um a referral, but just kind of document. hasn't got to that point yet. But it's important to kind of um record, you know, things that um the teachers are able to put like the contact information in. They're able to, you know, not necessarily the discipline things, but the kinds of things that they're doing there. There's room for um the comments and and notes. >> Okay. So that's what so if you have to go back if something occurs and you have to go back and say see some kind of history of an incident or something building up there's a place in synergy where they could put notes >> there things for teachers and then there also >> for the office and so there there may be times that it may

019not lead to a disciplinary sanction right >> but it's noted in synergy and and it's for the same reason that you expressed that you're saying, "Oh, this is the first time." When it's actually the third. Yeah. So, sometimes teachers put things in and that they can use it as their supporting information, but then at the same time, we can put things in synergy that didn't have any discipline, but it does document the behavior. That's That's um I'm glad to hear that we're collaborating with uh other school divisions in our region because our kids, we do know that we're so close together. Our kids, you know, transfer in and out to our neighboring cities. So, it's good that we're collaborating with other school divisions to see what they're doing and their processes and how we can

020implement them or they can implement ours too for um around student discipline. So, I think we're lucky to be in region two because we are very close region and we do share a lot. It's not like you're trying to say no, we're going to keep this so we can be the best. And so we're we're very happy about that and we were happy when um we served for years with the region two people uh we still meet but our state we also served on the state committee as well and it was nice to hear what other people were doing across the state. >> All I have >> Thank you. Um thank you so much for the presentation. I have a few questions. Um if we could go to slide three on the uh about the

021pathways in particular. So you talk a lot about restorative practices and um you know other interventions. Can you in this pathway process can you explain exactly at what point those practices are employed? Uh the whole thing about you know restorative practices or anything along the pathway is not so I always say that our goal is not to suspend. So you want to do everything and if you look in the administrator's guide as well as in our uh student handbook there are a lot of things that can take place prior to um a referral being written. So those are the things that we would expect even at the teachers level. gives quite a few things that you can do. So before we even get to the referral and one thing that we we we say all

022the time is that we need to tell parents right away and you know sometimes that's not done until it's you know more serious and so then you know everybody's kind of caught by surprise. that if we're working with kids along the way and we're making sure that we have those um conflict mediations, we're we're trying to, you know, get children to see your behavior had an impacted me. When I was an administrator, I would always talk about, you know, wow, what just happened out there, you know, it wasn't just you, it was the other people around, it was me. I don't like sitting here having this conversation. You know, what can we do better? So I think that there are opportunities throughout for us to um you know have those teachable moments and intervene as

023early as possible. So if we start seeing patterns with a particular student that needs to be done right away. Okay. So with um with the restorative practices with PBIS and any other tier one supports, it's like how are you tracking um or at the school level? I mean not you personally, but how are you how is it being tracked? What's working? What's not working when it comes to those interventions before the referral is? So, you know, again, that's why it's so important to have the collaboration in the schools so that everybody's talking to each other. You're having, you know, you're pulling your um discipline data or looking at the discipline data and seeing what the trends are, seeing what people are doing. Um looking at our hotspots, you know, are we getting referrals from a

024particular place in the building? Is that somewhere we need to pay more attention? Um, I mean it even breaks down to referrals from a certain class. I mean you might have um a student I mean a teacher who writes referrals constantly. So that might need to be you know another thing that we look at the observations the walkthroughs just to get a clear understanding of all the dynamics of that's going on with students and also um when all of us know the same child then we probably need to have some things put in place to really help that child before they get to a point where they're getting referrals are getting suspended constantly. So when we send the data um you know we we I always encourage the principles administrators to sort it and look

025for specific things and they do an excellent job. I specifically make sure it has location. Let's sort it by location because we need to see where our hotspots are where we don't have cameras. We need to be watching that and coming up with a plan. We can sort it by um you know location teacher like you said. um we're just looking for you we're hoping that the administrators look for the trends that are like a problem in their building and they're coming up with a plan. So in synergy when we log an incident in there is a place it's our ESBAR interventions that's how we're reporting things to the state. There are several um you know interventions and behavior interventions that we check that they're supposed to check that they do. All of that is

026reported to the state. So that that is a way we can track it too. Um with every incident that we put into synergy, you know, we kind of require that parent contact needs to be checked. If anything was serious enough to put in synergy, which means it's going to stay in a student's permanent discipline history forever, then a parent needs to have been contacted. So, number one, always in every incident, parent contact should be checked. So, um if a student if the IEP has to be revisited, um like I said, there's several that are listed, you know, in your handbook or in the advent guide, they're supposed to check that, too. That's a way to track it. Now, the data that we send, we want them to sort it and look for everything. you know,

027anything in the building. If the dismissal is not right, if your if your referrals go high up at from 2 to 2:30 and that's your dismissal time, please, what are we doing now to curtail that? >> So, we just provide it so that they can sort it and every single building is different because it depends on where they're situated. Neighborhood schools have different problems than Lake Taylor High, for example. They're out there by themselves. So um we basically ask them to check and monitor and we just provide the data, provide the data, provide the data. >> Great to know. Um I have a couple couple more questions on that. Um so I appreciate that. So also you talked about at the end um you know uh working with principles and the information that so that

028data is going back to principles to then develop um what their response plan is going to be and can you talk a little bit about or Dr. I don't know um about how you know our principles are also being held accountable for ensuring that you know MTSS and other measures are being implemented as they're supposed to be. >> Is there is there a mechanism? We are student support >> and so we're going to >> that's why I was saying I started Dr. Paul but you know >> yeah so so that you know that comes into the evaluation process as well for principles and and assistant principles and then it's also a discussion point with the data meetings that they have um to talk about how are they using this data to find the hot spots

029especially if discipline is a concern in the building u but those those data points are looked at by the executive directors when they do the evaluations for principles. All right. Thank you. And I do appreciate the school by school um information data that you provided. And the the last question I have is you know clearly there are um you know schools where we see higher levels of incidents and those are tend to be you know sitting having sat here for quite some time see the same schools with the same level of incidents. How are we I guess you know what are what are we going to do differently in terms of resource allocation um to enhance our ability to provide you know the appropriate interventions for students particularly at those schools where we see um

030you know greater level of out of school suspensions or things like that. So budgetarily, you know, we're we're pretty maxed out right now, but as we go through the consolidation process, that's part of the discussion is, you know, where where are the academic needs and where the this like the SCES needs or the the the student intervention needs um for discipline and other other SEAL reasons um to make sure that we're putting the right supports there. if it's an extra school counselor, um you know, extra security to be in places where we notice there are hot spots that you can't really monitor with cameras. Um that those are things that we'll be able to do in the future once once we have some some more free staff >> questions, Mr. >> Yes. Um I think

031it's maybe a question for you or maybe a question for Dr. Paul, but we'll figure out who needs to answer it. So the question I had um I looked over the um spreadsheet with the data for the high schools. So um my question is I saw that y'all track a lot of data but you don't track any race ell and oh you do put it. >> So yes we have that information and if it's requested we can provide it but we do have it. >> Let me let me clarify that a little bit. So we we knew that it was a desire of the board, but when when we reviewed this before the upload and we looked at it, it was spread out by every single incident as well. So I asked them to narrow

032that down some more. So we will have that to be able to email out to the board because we do track that by by demographic as well. >> Okay, cool. >> So because I didn't figure we needed the one day OSS by demographic, two-day oss by demographic and it was it was so massive, right? And I appreciate you doing it that way. Yeah. So, we do have it. >> Just so you know, the schools when we send out that data, that's exactly what we ask for. You know, we send everything from ethnicity to grade level to 504 to special ed. We want them to sort it. I mean, even the date of birth, let's sort it by date of birth and see who are are overaged. Um, especially in high school, there's the first ones

033we need to hit in terms of providing resources or, you know, supports if they're older. But all of that is also in what we send to the schools. So, we do expect them to, you know, look at their disproportionate amounts of suspensions they're doing based on race, special ed, 504. So, it's not just location, it's everything. >> Yeah. With that, because that's the I'm so glad that you brought that up. You led me to the um what I was going with. Studies show that um African-American students are actually getting a higher disciplinary rate than their counterparts. And so, that's data I would like to see um at the school level. And then also if there is showing a disparity in that, what are some of the things that the school system are doing to ensure

034that discipline is fair and equitable across the board regardless of who that person is, where they live, or the race or color they're skiing? >> Yeah. So, a big part of that are the three main areas that you heard Miss Hamlet talk about. One, um, our MTSS planning. So we get down to the indiv individual student level on that and then the PBIS program trying to to to to catch it before it even gets to be a disciplinary incident and then the other is the restorative practices and you know the restorative practices uh Miss Passin to your question earlier you know it does come early but it also comes very late in this you know when students come back if they've done something it's about how do we reintroduce them back you know even from

035a day or two OSS or even from ISS and they're going back to that teacher's classroom where the teacher you know and them had the conflict. How are we making sure that we're we're restoring it back to what it needs to be? So, it's throughout here that practice and and and looking at that type of data student by student is the best way to to get to that any any discrepancies that we find in that data. >> Excellent. Thank you. >> Um second question, what um mental health and behavior supports are available for students before they actually reach the disciplinary stage? So school wellness takes care of a lot of that, but I can tell you that one of the things that we worked to get in place was care solus where you can refer

036the student, their families, anyone that needs that extra support. Um, our school >> Carus Solas is a company. It's like a soft handoff and they contact to make sure that they're providing whatever needs that family or student might have. >> Yeah. And then also, I mean, I think our our I think our school counselors and our school social workers do an excellent job as well in getting and I I I can't tell you that we did have a big meeting this morning and we're looking at, you know, other ways that we can support children as they move in and out of our schools, going to Madison, coming back, going to, you know, other um places and coming back that we have a clean way of making that transition so that we'll for welcoming those students

037back into the zone school or the regular environment. >> I have a litany of questions but not all of them. >> For right now, Madam Chair, >> ACES I got the ES part. Okay. >> I was going to ask that question. >> Alternative classroom for elementary students. >> Oh, who is alternative class? alternative class >> classes for elementary students. >> For elementary students, >> okay, we we're good in education with acronyms. And I know somebody out out watching, what does that mean? Okay, >> maybe that's what we need another book just for education acronyms. >> Exactly. Thank you. >> Sure. >> So, ASUS is held at Crossroads. Okay. >> Dr. Nichols has been fabulous and has welcomed um the alternative program to be in her building and the teacher who is in charge of that

038class is phenomenal. So, um, you know, the kids generally, if we have any elementary school kids that unfortunately have to be long-term suspended and have to go there, I mean, typically they do not. I mean, they just say, "Can I stay? Can I stay? Can I stay?" >> Well, so she's got a class, the teacher has a classroom with all K5 students, >> but I mean, we're talking it's >> I mean, less than five typically a year. >> Oh, okay. Very few. >> Very few. We just we did need something because every now and then we have one. So never have more than five I don't think. >> I'm sorry miss clarification >> even for those students to get there because you know basically our law says that you know students K to three you

039know can get up to three days. They have to have aggravating circumstances for it to be big enough for them to receive a long-term suspension. So our numbers in that classroom are very low every year. >> At one point did this program come back >> years ago? It was I think it was at Graanby Elementary School. >> So that was that was your cryalis program. Yes. Okay. And so that went away but we realized that we still had to have something for our children. So at one point we had the um city divided up in four quads and so there were certain schools that housed the children that might need to move from a particular elementary school to another but ASUS has been in place for quite a few years now and as Miss Plute

040said Dr. Nichols has been phenomenal and she welcomes the kids in and makes sure that they get all the things that they need when they come, you know, if they need extra help in reading or math, all those things are mapped out. So, it it has been very successful and um as she said, most of the time they're like, >> "Can I stay?" You know, >> it's good to hear that we have some kind of um program like that for our small kids cuz Yeah. and we're one of the few districts that does. >> Um I don't know if you could speak to what our inschool suspension program looks like. Um and also and do we have inschool suspension? Well, I want to call it something different because it's um I know it's think of

041something more um inspir aspirational than in school suspension. So, so excuse me for I mean I know that's the official terminology for it, but um do we have ISS monitors in in or teachers? I don't want to say monitors, but teachers in every elementary, middle, every school building, >> not elementary, >> it varies from school to school. Um again, our staffing has been cut a lot of times. So, some schools have figured out how to have in school suspensions and they do it different ways. there, you know, there are certain um staff members that may float between two elementary schools that are supposed to hold it. But um if that was something that's something that we can really like improve on is to try to find a way to have it so it's consistent across

042the district. >> So you so you would see that as a need, something for us to like programmatically figure out how to >> Absolutely. >> Okay. and and maybe making the inschool suspension classrooms one of and we got this from someone else but we really liked it is that that's a restorative classroom. >> Yes, I want to call it Yeah. a restorative classroom. Yeah. >> But we are struggling with keeping staffing. the pay is low to see those positions >> and and I recall I do recall hearing that and that was one of the things last year that I was trying to advocate for is as we're looking at you know we were looking at pair of you know uh teacher assistant pay looking at and that was one area that I feel like we

043need to >> and I and and Dr. Walter um has has said that several times too about our you know our pairs in special education >> special education >> and and not only during the year but but also summer school >> you know the rate is you know we that's something we're looking at this budget season >> but we we of course we always welcome any inschool you know intervention I mean like you saw on your data like the list I mean like just our loss of privileges I would like to see that used more our community service. We have some options here. Classroom removal. We have options that I feel aren't used enough that we need to keep them in school. So, you know, some principles embrace it. Some principles get them cleaning and

044get them I mean, you know, we're going to try anything we can do. You know, I always say when we train, we want to we want to issue out the amount of discipline that's going to change the behavior. We really don't need any more than that. So, you know, if if that is loss of um computer time for an elementary school student, if it's, you know, whatever we can do to keep them in school, absolutely. But the inschool suspension is something I know desperately the high schools probably need help with. >> You know, cuz the the kids are older and you know, it's it's high school and so keeping them engaged in a room, you know, all day, it takes a special person. And when we have one, it's fabulous and it works. So if

045we could copy that and reproduce it on every high school, then we could see hopefully the number of suspensions go down because anything that inschool bus suspension, loss of privilege, community service, class removal, detention, ISS, those are all things we would love to see go up and then our suspensions go down. agree that having a strong school culture will help with with that with the high expectations. This is >> absolutely. >> Yes. >> Which kind of goes back to my comment earlier that when you look at every aspect of your day from the time they come on campus until the time they leave and look at those systems, it helps to create that positive school culture and makes children feel belong. And you know, if you have people that are greeting them by name and

046you know, it it's >> teachers at the door and all those things, it leads to a very strong school culture where everybody feels that they're important. >> We want our children to be missed. Like when they're not there, we want someone to miss them and we want someone to say, "I missed you yesterday." You know, because >> we all know the teacher of the room that they never cut. you know, they never and so if we could just clone that teacher, you know, they just would, you know, maybe others but not that class. It's something different, something special in the room and they would be noticed if they didn't go. >> Let's work on the teachers of the class that they want to miss. >> Uh-huh. Mhm. >> It trickles down, you know. So, that's

047very important. Um so um for um training what um trainings are we providing to teachers to mitigate implicit bi um classroom biases. >> So I mean >> relates to discipline. So you know defiance and disruption are two different things and that can be interpreted differently by a different teacher. As far as we're concerned, most of our time is spent with working with the administrators and then they're to go back and, you know, put those things in place. There are wonderful trainings that go on in Northfor public schools all the time to address just that. And um it's just, you know, making sure that it gets to teachers as well. And um I think that we do a good job with that. >> Do you offer any specific professional development in that area for our teachers?

048>> So we do. So, Miss Smith um offers that diversity training um with with teachers and that's a part of that um talking about implicit next biases and and and other points of that. So, we do offer that. >> Excellent. Thank you. of the training that particular is is done by the principal but I have gone to an elementary school when they invite me and they want to come you know want me to come and I've done training with teachers on referrals and what's the difference between an office referral and a teacher managed office managed and they've asked me to go and we'll definitely any anything we're asked to do we're gonna we're going to do it >> Dr. Do you do you as a superintendent if there's a school that has a high disciplinary

049um rate just looking at numbers here like we can look at um Graanby and Southside STEM do do you put action plans in place for the administrators to bring those numbers down? >> So the executive directors work with >> Yes sir. Um yeah. So are we and if are we going to talk about alternative education? So what's next? Okay. All right. So um >> just wanted to be sure we're Yeah. Okay. All right. Well, then the the last piece is so I know in our strategic plan and also with our non-negotiables, but we we the safety and climate um there are measures in there that are obviously, you know, tied to discipline. How do you use the data from that that you're monitoring through that to I guess guide the practices? So the you know

050the data we look on that is the amount of students who don't have discipline as well as the amount of students with short or long-term suspensions. So th those data pieces are monitored throughout the year. Um those are the pieces that are monthly sent out of um our DSS office. The you know principles have access to that through power school as well. Um and those are expectations of growth as well as academics is that there >> Thank you ladies. >> Thank you. >> Now we have we'll move on to agenda item 2.02 alternative education update with Dr. Valerie Griffin. Good afternoon. Um, good afternoon, school board chair Decalerro, Vice Chair Thomas, Dr. Pole, board members, and members of the public. Thank you for the opportunity to present an update on North Public Schools alternative programs,

051Open Campus, Madison Alternative, and our need for an overage program for middle school students, specifically those in middle school who will turn 16 before the end of their eighth grade year. These programs are designed to provide critical pathways so that every student has the opportunity to succeed and graduate. This aligns with Northfor public schools board policy that emphasizes ensuring equity and providing pathways for all students to graduate college, career or military ready. >> Dr. Griffin, you'll have to use the mouse and scroll because you uploaded as a PDF. >> This is a PDF. >> Is the mouse >> got the mouse up? She's He's bringing it else tonight. >> I don't get that song. I know y'all get that. >> Oh, y'all don't know that song. >> I do. >> Okay. Okay. Why Open Campus?

052Open Campus was established to support students who may not thrive in a traditional setting, but still want to want and deserve the chance to graduate. It provides a unified approach that is flexible, supportive, inclusive, and empowering all at once. The program offers afternoon attendance four days a week with an option for one virtual learning day, giving students the flexibility to balance school with family, work, or other responsibilities. It is supportive through teachers who provide remediation, small groupoup instruction, and one-on-one help while wraparound while wraparound staff ensure social emotional needs are met. It is inclusive because students from all five high schools participate with a focus on serving historically underserved groups. And it is empowering because it restores hope, helps students regain confidence, and allows them to accelerate or self-pace their learning while taking ownership of

053their academic journey. Together, these elements show how Open Campus is a comprehensive pathway designed to meet the students whole need and keep them on track to graduate. For a period of time, due to unforeseen circumstances, the roles of site coordinator at Madison and open campus were combined with one person overseeing both programs. While this arrangement ensured continuity and support, it also temporarily limited the ability to expand. Currently, open campus serves about 75 students at a time with each high school able to place about 15 students. We are looking we are looking to expand opportunities by reopening a morning session in addition to the afternoon session. This would allow us to double the capacity and serve significantly more students. We already have a site coordinator dedicated to open h with excuse me, we already have a

054site coordinator dedicated to open campus with Madison now having its own site coordinator as we have interviewed and we are in the process of identifying that person. This structure will allow us to restore the morning session at open campus and more effectively meet the needs of students. Enrollment across the last four cohorts show Open Campus serves a diverse student body with the majority identifying as African-American with representation from Hispanic, white, and multi-racial groups. This reflects the city's demographics and reinforces the need for equitable culturally responsive programming. Additionally, attendance techs at each of our high schools and staff from the Department of Student Services are actively monitoring and following up with students when they are not attending school at either Madison or Open Campus. This system of follow-up ensures students remain connected and supported even when

055attendance becomes a challenge. Over the last three years, Madison has served approximately 750 students, averaging 200 to 275 students a year. These numbers show both the scale of need and the importance of sustaining strong program structures. Um, at Madison and Open Campus, the focus is on the whole child by surrounding students with academic, social, and emotional supports. Counselors, behavioral specialists, and social workers play an active role in helping students manage challenges while staying on track academically. Teachers receiving ongoing professional development so that they can consistently use effective practices, approaches, and targeted interventions that are effective for our student populations. In addition, strong partnerships with curriculum and instruction ensure lesson planning and instructional quality are aligned while student wellness and support student support services address the social and emotional well-being of our students. We also recognize

056that family and community is a critical part of this support network. Looking ahead, we are exploring enhanced mental health services, deeper family involvement, and more community mentoring opportunities. Together, these efforts will remove barriers, build resilience, and help students believe in their ability to succeed. >> Can I ask can I ask a quick question that I'm I'm slightly confused by? >> Um, when you're talking about the cohort year, if you went back up to enrollment trends, >> is when you talk about Madison Well, enrolling by ethnicity across cohorts is that the Madison group and the open campus group together. >> Um, so the cohort, let me go back and make sure that I tell you correctly. This is Madison. Over the last three years, Madison has served approximately 750 students averaging the 200 to 275. Um,

057I want to say one of the slides here also has the attendance for each of them separately, but the co is this the one here? So like the enrollment by ethnicity across cohorts. Is that talking about the two groups together? >> This is talking about the two. This is talking about the two. This is called Madison. I'm sorry. This is Madison and this is enrollment over time. Madison versus open campus. >> Okay. >> Right here. Yes. I'm sorry I misunderstood what you were saying. >> Yeah. >> Any Was there another question? Puff. I just had a question about um >> what um um so what is the um ask um how are um enrolled students performing in comparison with their um their cohorts their counterparts that are in the traditional recommend we finish because there

058are some there's some information on graduation rates to come still. So, if we can just hold until the end, that >> I just I just didn't understand that previous slide. That's all. I'm sorry to interrupt. >> Um, okay. >> We're on slide five. >> Thank you. Um, to give a clear picture of impact, we look at Madison and open campus separately since each serves a different purpose, but both contribute to keeping students on track. At Madison, outcomes from the last four four cohorts show that 65 students earned diplomas. 300 of those students are still enrolled in Northfor public schools. 77 of those students are no longer in school and 28 have earned a GED. Madison is a placement-driven program and students often assigned here as a consequence of disciplinary actions. Yet with the structure, expectations,

059and support provided at Madison, students are able to make progress and re-engage with their education. These outcomes underscore the importance of Madison as a program that gives students the second chance, structure, and encouragement they need to stay connected to school. At Open Campus, the program's citywide reach is evident in diplomas earned across our high schools. Graanby 18, Mory 13, Norview 10, Lake Taylor 4, and Booker T. Washington 18. Each diploma recommend, I'm sorry, each diploma represents a student who persisted, a teacher who guided or encouraged, and a family that partnered to keep that student engaged. These numbers demonstrate that open campus is more than an alternative. It is a true graduation pathway for students across the city. Looking ahead, our focus for both Madison and Open Campus is to deepen instructional practices and strengthen family

060school partnerships. By doing so, we aim to increase the number of students who finish with a diploma and a clear path to their future. Students who turn 16 while in middle school face a high risk of disconnecting from education. Research shows that retained mil middle middle schoolers are far more likely to drop out and national studies confirm that overage underredited students rarely graduate without targeted supports. This year we are researching ways to support these students by developing a comprehensive program. A committee of stakeholders including administrators, student wellness staff, student support services, counselors, and site coordinators have been formed to identify what supports are needed. The goal is to establish a central location where students can receive instruction and resources in a structured setting. Our vision is to house these students on the open campus side

061for access to online coursework while also providing in-person instruction and supports on the Madison side. This combined approach will allow Madison and Open Campus to work together to meet academic, social, and emotional needs. Ultimately, the goal is to help these overage middle school students transition back to their home schools and successfully complete their diplomas. Long-term, this initiative will allow us to better prepare students for graduation and post-secary opportunities, ensuring they remain engaged in their education and see a clear path to success. By gaining early high school credits, consistent counseling, and wraparound support, these students will enter high school with a greater confidence, a stronger sense of belonging, and a momentum needed to stay on track toward graduation. In closing, Norfol Public Schools is committed to expanding opportunities for students across students through Madison Open Campus

062and our efforts to support overage middle school students. These initiatives are critical to advancing our district theme, vision to victory. Together, we will continue to keep equity, engagement, and graduation at the center of our work, ensuring that every student has a pathway to success. Thank you for your support. I will now take any questions. >> I missed I'm sorry. Can >> Oh, go ahead. >> So, with um overaged middle school students, >> yes. Are you suggesting that they attend open campus with >> Well, they won't necessarily be with the older students. They'll be housed in the same building to receive some of that individualized support that we offer on the open campus side, but they will not be with them. >> My concern is >> but they're already high school aged at this point, >>

063right? But they could be 16, but their maturity level might not be >> Yes. because they have been in middle school or surrounded by other middle school students. >> Well, in some cases what we found is we have some students that have not been in school for several years. And so when they come back to us, they are 16. And so at that point, we are faced with a dilemma. Do we put a 16-year-old that's in the sixth grade back in sixth grade or do we put them in high school as a ninth grader with no foundational skills? >> And for some reason, I thought this was a discussion years ago that we had. >> We did. >> Okay. Yeah. So what have we didn't resolve it then? >> I I'm not aware. >> No,

064that's why I mean as Dr. P knows I've asked for what was the discussion >> the overage for grade. >> Oh okay. >> Yes. So we it is it is something that we've talked and asked about having a review over and and specifically open campus and how that open campus might address some of the things. And Dr. Griffin, you know, I think for the benefit I was going to ask or Dr. Paul, um, you know, for the benefit of new board members, you talked about the different purposes of open campus in Madison and I don't it might be a good idea to elaborate on that because I'm not sure that we've had an open campus update or overview for new board members. So, it might be good to >> So, Madison, um, as you heard

065from Miss Plud and Miss Hamlin, those students are there, um, based on disciplinary infractions and they're placed there by these ladies. Um, so it it's it's not voluntary at this point. Um, the open campus is voluntary. Um, what happens is when we see students that are not being successful or students that um, have to work and they cannot be in school from 7 until 2, then they will apply for those students to go to open campus. um the site coordinator as well as the principal, graduation coach, parent and student all come together to talk about the program and to see if it would be an option for them. Um most of the time it is a go. Those students are enrolled into the program and they are supported until they graduate. When they complete the

066credits, they then are able to graduate back with their base school. Um and that is a success for them. At this point, we only um have the capability to have about 15 students per school. Um and those um principles use those spaces up very quickly um because it's only about 75 um and we only have one session at this point. If we were to open up the morning session again, which we're working toward, that will double the number of students that we have. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Not only for behavior in school, some kids that attend Madison, is that correct? >> Yes. And they are placed by the Jay-Z well by these ladies over here >> for Madison. Correct. >> Yes ma'am. That is correct. >> Can I ask a clarifying question? Um so but

067they if they are they are not physically present at Madison. So that's the part that I think we need to make clear is that they are participating electronically um virtually at Is that >> with Are there students with um Hey, Carol, you got to go to the >> There students with ankle bracelets. I mean, that's I think the assertion. >> Okay. It depends on the um [Music] so there's a law that says that if a student has the crime in the community, the superintendent has to be notified. When we get those letters for community charges, we do place students at Madison under JCAZ. That's our policy. And they are there virtually. Okay. Not all students that are on ankle bracelets would necessarily have a letter. It might be because of probation violation or whatever. So

068they may be physically in the building. We only remove the students that have the letters with the community charges. Many times they may go to NET Academy and come back. And so they might have that, but it's because of other reasons. And it's probably not a felony. >> I just Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for clarifying that. >> I don't Does Miss Thomas have other question? >> I did have another question. >> Oh, no, no, no. >> Oh, okay. >> So, for our students at Madison, we know they're referred there for disciplinary reasons. Um, if they get a criminal charge, they um come to you. Um, it's you're notified and then everything goes there. Some may have ankle brain cuts. How do you refer to those those students? It's just students. >> Okay. All right.

069Is that is that how they're referred to? Okay. I just wanted to make sure that's how they were referred to. I just recall on a um on a recorded facilities call um a member um had actually mentioned them and called them paroleles, >> which I thought was very um racially undertoning. So, >> sorry I I just want to respond to you. Sorry, I didn't mean to. >> Yeah, we'll get to that later. Well, um it's not that is terrible and so I appreciate you sharing that because a lot of these children haven't even been con they've been accused of something and not convicted of it yet. >> Right. >> So they're still not proven guilty of anything. >> Right. >> So I just want to make that clear. >> Yeah. No. And I >> call

070our students that. Not at all. >> Yeah. Those are our students. And I think that's why you're bringing that up is because that that we're we're setting the tone that that is not how we refer to our students. Um so yeah, go ahead. >> And I just had one more thing even though that was just on that. Um what that that we don't address our students that we as they are students they are they are our treasure. So, let's make that abundantly clear so that everyone can hear that from the mountain tops and and any anything else is inexcusable, unacceptable, and we will take care of that um as a board and handle that person >> absolutely >> with them. But I want to commend you and your staff um because y'all got perfect attendance.

071So, that's a good thing. I saw it on the Northwood Public website. Congratulations and celebrate that. I mean, that's worthy of making sure we getting them there. Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> We're getting our students there on school and on time and they're staying. So, that's >> and the teachers work very hard um at Madison and open campus and um all of the staff. Um student wellness is is working with us this year to increase um the number of supports that we have there to assist these students as well. So, I'm really excited about the possibilities that this year may bring. >> So, I I'm sorry. No, go ahead. >> I have a question. Cool. >> Back to the overage middle schoolers. Do we have capacity for them at open campus right now? >> We do.

072>> Um, we absolutely do. I actually spoke with Mr. Freillley to ensure that. And we do have enough class space to have those students to be there. And >> what do you think is the number of students? >> Right now, we have 13 students that will turn 16 before the end of this school year that are in our middle schools. >> Absolutely. because I know you said if you had were able to reopen the morning session, you'd be able to double the number of students that you were serving, but you've already taken into account. >> Yes, ma'am. >> For these middle schools. Okay. Thank you. >> And that's same space because you'd have a morning session, afternoon session. So, yeah. So, it would work out well. >> Miss Moore, you had a had something several,

073but >> Okay. So, so can we say that Madison the supports are we fully staffed at Madison? Can we say that >> we are fully staffed at Madison? Yes. Okay. >> Okay. And I guess I say administratively >> we have made a do we have admin? >> Well, they don't have administrative assistance. >> We No, they don't have administrative assistance, but our um our coordinator has has been on leave. >> Okay. >> So, we're in the process of hiring someone else currently. >> Okay. So, we have we do have a um we we did convince uh former principal Sharon Phillips is back and working in that role right now at Madison to help us out. >> She's whipping us into shape right now. I'll just say that publicly. Yeah, >> I'm sure she is. >>

074Um so, h how does the district I can't read my own handwriting. How do the uh district address students that come to open campus with um learning deficits? cuz >> they receive the same >> they are on a program, right? >> Yes. But they receive the same if they have an IEP, they receive the same supports as they receive receive in the base school. They do have someone on site that supports them directly um from learning support and um I know that um that the um site coordinators or the senior coordinators do go out to the school to support them. >> Okay. Uh, come back to me. Some of mines were answered already. >> Yeah. You sure? >> Okay. >> Come back to me. >> Um, so I'm really So I got excited to hear

075about the expansion of open campus and doing more innovative programming for our students that just need a different pathway. uh for for learning and I wanted to hear more about it. But going back to at the middle school level, so you know what your early warning systems look like. And I know we are there's two groups. I think they're the overage for grade and then there are still those that are in the middle school level that are still much very much at risk for dropping out that may not be overage for grade but may still be at risk. Um, how how are we I guess addressing I mean I know they're two two very different groups, you know, you have the overage, but how are we addressing that other group that is at risk of

076dropping out and like trying to capture them in this perhaps alternative um setting so that they can be successful and um you know that we can meet their needs in a in a smaller environment, >> right? So for our middle school students, um again the number of students that we have that um again will turn 16 before the end of the school year um it seems to be rising. Um we do have some students that will turn 16 in the summer. Um and as those students come back to us, we welcome them. We want them to come in our schools and those middle school principles work to support those students in various ways, whatever that may need. For example, acceleration could be an option. So, if you have a student that say the student is

077going to turn 16 in August before they go to high school, then you may find a way to give them help them get a high school credit so that when they go into high school, they already have a credit. So, in middle school, they're working with those students individually based on the needs that they may have. um as we go into high school, those students that are in ninth grade that are not showing promise or are struggling for whatever reason, then those are the students that the graduation coaches and the and the principles are having the conversations with and they're recommending the open campus program. Um and just because open campus is recommended, you know, it doesn't fit every student's need. Um but it does open up the conversation about what is it that we

078can do to support these students. Um, graduation coaches work very hard um to figure out ways to address the needs of every student and they work until the very last day before graduation to help get many students across the board. So, they're looking at them individually um to see how they can support because what looks good for one or works for one of course may not work for another. >> Okay. And that I mean just hearing about the expansion is also you know you have a I think if I heard you correctly a task force or a committee that you've put together that has had they met yet or are they >> October the 8th >> octo okay so that's a group of um can you talk a little bit about what that group looks

079like and >> so we have um of course the site coordinator um at the alternative school we have administrators counselors we have someone from student support services. That's also on that. I'm trying to think. It's escaping my mind right now, of course. Um, but we're going to all come together and have a conversation about the needs and how we can best serve student needs and what does that look like. Um, and then together we'll work through this year because, you know, we're going to tweak it as we go along, but the desired outcome is to find something that is meaningful for students and will support them as they continue on their educational journey. So, I'm really excited about that opportunity. >> Yeah, that's great. I was I've I know that we have several students that

080have gone through open campus that would rave about the opportunity that it provided because you know over the years because I've been on the since it began um and sitting as a observer in the boardroom when you know it was a Magic Johnson Bridgecape and you know we were doing a lot of work around over we I the the district was doing a lot of work around overage for grade. And there were students that had been identified gifted that were had traumatic experiences in their high school that they just could not that was no longer um a safe place for them to learn. So, so I mean like you said earlier, diverse backgrounds, diverse re reasons for why they need an alternative setting. And um so I'm glad to to hear like focus and attention

081being placed on it, but I was just thinking like having former students that were an open campus perhaps, you know, I mean, you know, just as a thought, but u to kind of help him build that. But >> um as we're talking about school closure consolidation, another reason looking ahead for what this program might look like, I think that would inform if we even what kind of building space we need, what kind of capacity do we need. Um so that's something that I hope we'll have an open mind about too. So, >> what is the is there a time limit like a duration on um how semesters a student could go through this before they complete? >> Well, for um open campus, so it depends. Um we have I know last year we even had

082a ninth grade for um almost seniors. Um so it just varies but however long um the site coordinator and the transitional specialist a plan of action for that student and they work very closely with the student and the parent to ensure that we're very transparent about what is needed and that they're able to accomplish that in the time frame that is set >> and they eventually would age out of the program. Correct. That's a good question. I mean, um, I I I think they would. Yes. But the desired outcome in looking at them from the beginning, >> but that's why you do the planning process with the parents to tell them what they have to accomplish in what period of time. >> That is correct. That is correct. >> Question. Um so um those students

083that are referred to open campus is there like a um they have to meet a certain criteria or just I need this student to go I mean do they have to meet some >> so um I think there's not necessarily a criteria I think that is what's in the best interest of the student again um and again for what works for one may not work for another and that's why it was important to me last year that we involve all parties at the table including the parent and the student as well as the homeschool and Madison to talk about what that looks like. Um a lot of times the student will tell you no this is this is not for me. Um and then sometimes you have students saying yes um this is for me

084and they come in and they complete their their requirements in no time and they're done. Um other students we support and we have to work with but as long as they show up we're going to work with them to to help them be successful. That's That's where I was going. That's good to hear because I just didn't want this to be you're going over here, but it's a team effort. Okay. >> Just wanted to piggyback on um Mrs. more Buffalo's question because looking at slide I don't know what slide this is but the outcome and impact slide um you know it looks like you know some schools have higher enrollment than others which may be because you know perhaps you know the principal is more aware of the program and the opportunities that it provides.

085Can you um talk a little bit about like the differences that are observed here? So all of this all of the schools again each of them have 15 slots at this point. Um and so I know as of last year those slots were completely filled but again you may have 9th graders, 10th graders, you know 11 or 12th graders. The first slide actually shows um the diplomas that were received um by cohort. Now as you look you have a disparity from 18 to four but again that could be various reasons. It could be a student decided to go back to their base school or it could be that we didn't have um you know as many seniors during this time. So that's going to vary and on the other side the outcomes um of students

086or the number of students that are enrolled at Madison. I'm sorry. Bring it up a little bit. So that's not so graph one time. >> Some of the open campus students opt to get GEDs or is that mainly the Madison students? I think sometimes they do have the option to get that, but the desired outcome at open campus is for them to complete their diploma requirements. Um, but if a student gets in and decides that, you know, hey, I think I just want to go the GED route, we will support them. >> Yeah. Okay. So, that makes sense because I was looking at this looking at diplomas. So, it's not necessarily that they entered and completed in open campus. It was these are just that they receive. >> Okay, >> that is correct. >> Okay.

087So, I just interpreted it. And again, every year there is conversations with the families and the students to see, you know, some students want to go back to their base school and and we encourage that whatever works for them. >> If I can add too, so we we actually had an ISA specialist at the the the building for a while and the numbers were so low that we moved that staff member to NTC, but the students there at Open Campus might still have the option to go to NTC to to have it completed. But I I mean I think maybe one a year might have been in the classroom here and there. It just wasn't a good use of resources, but they still have that option if they want. But our our ultimate goal is

088for our students to get the the diploma in hand. >> That's that's me with that graduation rate. We you know tested um agenda items as graduation coaches to see what the process is. Just need to hold your horses a little bit and we will get there. >> I know we're all very anxious over here. >> but absolutely >> other questions. >> Thank you. >> Your great work. >> Thank you guys. >> All right, we'll move on to agenda item 3.01 policy. The second reading of the policy discussion. >> Yes. Uh madam madam chair and vice chair, members of the board. really nothing nothing to report. We've already reviewed these policies. It's just an announcement. They're the second reading and they'll be on the consent agenda for the business meeting this month. >> Quickest item on

089the agenda. >> All right. Now, Miss Moore, we're going to move on to future agenda items. Um would you like to to start with >> Yes, please. What would what what what would exactly do you want our processes? Um or how do we capture, you know, students who have are off the roll? How do we help them if there's no possibility that they're going to graduate from high school? How do we um navigate that and um yeah, get them on the path to to graduation? So what does that look like? The life of a graduation coach so to speak. Didn't have that. >> Clarify just real quick. Sure. So I don't think we've had the opportunity to present really much on what our graduation coaches are doing since we implemented them. So I mean when

090when we can fit that on the agenda, I think a full like an overview and maybe have a coach come out and talk about day in the life of a coach and how are they capturing the kids back. I I got you then. Okay. >> Is there a general agreement? >> Yes. And per I was just going to say perhaps connecting that when we do get graduation rate and dropout rate um information. I think that's a perfect just finished writing this down. Okay. M >> um I would like and it was kind of sparked by um the conversation we had the other night, but um I think we're due for that, but having a specialty program, specialty choice program review or overview uh for the board to kind of talk about what the um goals

091of each of the programs are, you know, how we just all the details about the programs and I think that would also will help inform as we're about to make decisions about, you know, perhaps uh potentially moving programs and and just kind of so you could hear about why it's important to to really understand what what they're actually offering. >> Aren't they about to have a magnet or something night? >> Yeah, they're having an open house >> October 9th, I think, is the u >> the specialty night. special team >> at Norview High School. >> It's on the events at a glance. >> Yeah. But I >> think we'll be work here. >> Yeah, we we can attend. We'll be here. >> But yeah, but one of one of the things I think we what

092I would like to see us dive into is look at it from an equity lens in terms of admission selection. Um how they're perform like and tying it to our student outcomes. um you know how they're performing and then with the goal of the school consolidation closure you know it presents an opportunity programmatically so what can we do to enhance these uh programs as well so this could perhaps kick off what I see is what we had started several years ago with it having a task force that never you know got to completion I think they had recommendations but we just um didn't have the chance to really review those recommendations. So um that could possibly that process >> board in general agree that we should have that information. >> Parents all the time asking

093>> we want to come to board consensus on things we're going to add to future agenda items. What else? U we were going to address a few things at VSBA but we didn't finish the agenda and one of them was u a request for censoring board members and we didn't address that and I think we should address it. I think we probably my opinion is that we probably should be reviewing our norms and protocols and perhaps we need to spend a work session give a work give that time at a work session because once we've hammered out our norms and protocols then it would make sense to talk about censuring board members because it would be a violation of our norms and protocols that would call for a censure. But if we don't know what

094all our norms and protocols are >> exactly >> sort of putting the cart before the horse. >> Yeah. >> Call for the um we are we appoint to >> I'm referring back to with the um statement from the committee member. >> Oh. I don't know what can be done, but that's just inexcusable. >> Politely correct them. >> Our volunteers, they're not elected. >> Yeah, I think >> they see us sitting on our committee, >> right? But I mean, I think they're taking the space of someone else >> thing to do would be to have that conversation. Yeah, we can have it offline in um the board um office >> dealing with children at the end of the day. They still >> that remotable. >> It's not acceptable. That's what I'm saying. But I'd say the

095first step would be >> the first step would be would be count to counsel the person. >> Don't forget about it. Like take note of it. >> Okay. >> Yes, sir. >> Okay. Uh today there was or yesterday an email about um apparently a decision was made to change the uh legal representation representation for the um superintendent search to VSBA. I don't >> from yesterday. >> Yesterday or today. >> It was wasn't >> I don't I don't know the email that you >> It was what we talked about. >> It was >> Yeah, it wasn't a change. It was what we talked about with the BSBA for the superintendent search process. When we initially talked, they they provide all of that service as part of the service that we've agreed to. So, it wasn't a

096change in No, it's >> no additional was indicating that we needed to make sure that the lawyers from the city knew that they weren't going to be in that process. >> In that meeting, it was for our closed meeting. That was that was >> I that email must have come after >> I'm not aware of that email. I was asked to do a motion to enter the closed meeting which I did and I included advice of council in it. If we are not and I said this in my email today if we are not going to be a part of that and that is fine but you cannot cite that as an exemption for the closed meeting. So we'll have to delete that before the motion is made that paragraph. >> Right. And that's that's

097what it was in response to. Yeah, >> I it must have come in at like 2 o'clock. I I checked emails all day up to 2 o'clock and then between two and four >> before two was >> Yeah, >> must have just missed it. >> Well, the the the email was from earlier. I'm not sure exactly right now because I'm just getting here. I don't have >> I'm trying to get access to stuff. The the point of it is is we were changing our legal representation during that process >> um to uh to the VSBA. What's the cost? >> That's already included in the included. It's included in the services that they provide. Yeah. >> It just seemed >> different to me. Uh and about we didn't discuss the cost. I I didn't know that.

098I don't think it's been >> Is an attorney Is an attorney from the VSBA going to appear at that meeting to advise you? >> Because if so, we can include that. >> This is just a meeting with VSBA and the school board. >> No, I think we're making it. >> But I don't think we I know we're making more out of that. >> It's just like our initial meeting with VSBA that happened in July, >> right? It's it's a review. It's a closed meeting to review applicants. Yeah. >> Yeah. There's nothing legal. There's >> Well, we're just we don't need >> No, we don't need the attorneys in this meeting. This is not a meeting where we need legal counsel. >> So, it's more privacy somewhat. >> Correct. maintaining confidentiality. Right. I just need you

099to say that's all I think Colonel Paula may I'm not putting words in your mouth, but maybe he wanted you to state that. >> Right. Right. It's it's really no different than our initial meeting with BSBA where we did not require um legal counsel. >> Um okay. I was the way that I read it. It was like we were going to change all of our legal representation to VSB. >> Okay. >> I don't know. >> It's and it's just for the superintendent search and it's included. So, okay. Thank you. >> And um I think we need to look at the issue of citizen input at all of our meetings. we now have where they we only allow I won't say allow is not the right word they're not on the agenda for the like today

100we don't get input of citizen input it's not on the agenda today so uh >> well it's a work session typically that's at a business meeting >> why is they why are they excluded >> because it's a work session >> go ahead I was going to say right now is a time where we need to digest the information and ask our questions so that we can be prepared to vote at the business meeting. So that is why you know right now we could hear them but like we really haven't um the the it a lot can change between now and and the next in the business meeting and so it's just traditionally been and I think I feel it's appropriate that it is at the business meeting just But we do vote in the in

101the uh work session. >> Vote in work sessions. >> We are not supposed to that's not >> unless it's a personnel matter that Dr. Pole or the superintendent. >> We do vote. We do >> but we should allow it. So maybe they can't make the the second meeting they could make the first. Well, I it's traditional. If it's traditional that then we can train change our traditions just as we can change our normal uh norms and protocols and our policies need a meeting to digest. >> Yeah. And we that's questions of each other and and of the presenters >> discussion. >> We have discussion. We do not have discussions at >> business meeting is a business meeting to conduct business of we need to work to not Yeah. Now we can always have a special

102public hearing if there is a topic that we feel like the public needs to give input on. That's that's >> additional input. Yeah. >> Additional input. But >> you know our business meeting is when we >> end up business school and >> and our work session is also where we're conducting business and being focused on what we need to be focused on. >> And this Yeah, this came up at our VSBA retreat. >> Yeah. that we should not be voting during work sessions. >> Yes. Right. >> It's not practice. >> Not right. >> Well, then should we make it a policy we don't vote in this this work is strictly work? So because >> certain things like hiring like hiring when we're in a position where we need to >> you know expedite the hiring

103process I think it's important to give the superintendent some leeway to to bring individuals forward so that positions can be filled. Um, I don't know. >> I I I think especially in, you know, when we have vacancies, this to be able to have twice a month opportunity to do hiring instead of once a month does help speed up the process. So, the only thing I ever ask is if it's an ahr docket for any kind of a vote. That's the only thing administratively. >> Don, um, this exception usually runs like this time. We're just trying to get >> This should be the last one where we have it. >> Yeah. thing that it we we should consider it. If we don't want to do it, then that's fine. But I think the public needs to

104know that why we don't have this. I don't think it's >> well explained or well or they don't the individuals don't know and that's why I'm bringing it up. The citizens don't understand some of the processes what we do. >> Okay. Well, I I'll say this. A work session is just what it is. It's a working session for schoolboard members to come around the table, discuss certain topics or issues and have an opportunity for dialogue. >> A a school board business meeting is where the school board conducts his business. We we we take votes on financial uh matters, personnel matters, um any other issues um that we need to address at the business meeting. There are times that the superintendent will request that a personnel docket be reviewed and voted on by by the school

105board because we're trying to get people in position. But, uh, typically a work session is just for that for the board to come around the table and work some things out and have discussion. Um, and so that's typically what a work session is. So, typically >> I'm familiar. >> Yeah. But I'm just saying that Um the board has has the option of ha um having a special meeting was just public comment seven days posted you know for that for the public but typically a work session is just what it is. It's an opportunity for us to come around the table and and discussion and working. Yeah. >> And if we have a special call why can't we have a a public input then? We just had a a meeting. no public input, the special call

106meeting. It's still I don't know if we vote or not, but we're doing a select item and if they they have in input, we should we should allow it. It's again, it's up for discussion and that's what I'm trying to do now is just interject these into what we're going to talk about. And the last is the question is when when we get input from the citizens at the mic or written who tracks the answers and I know you can't answer every one of them >> and that and that that's a reality when you get 600 for Mory's uh project which I I have them in a folder 620 20 48 scans 48. Uh I have them, but I didn't read all of them because they were mostly repetitive. They were the same thing over

107and over. But if you choose to answer one um or somebody sends you one directly to to us from an individual, not part of a group, about a situation, how do we know that it it gets answered? I mean, and we we have to rely on on the uh administration to do that because we we forwarded, but something that says we close the loop. You know, we got 48. >> The chair is supposed to answer those. >> I'm sorry. >> The chair is supposed to answer emails. She's >> and I and I do to the best of my board. >> Okay. >> Send back an email that says, "Thank you for contacting the school board. Your concerns and thoughts will be taken under consideration." >> But I'll I'll be honest. I'll be honest, when we

108get overwhelmed with emails, I I just I I I simply can't do it. But I but I I'm telling you that I do do my very best. >> Well, you're one person, you're human. >> Like a thousand emails within the last week. >> Thousand. >> And and and that's the reality. But the the the ones that we I'm just trying to if it's sent to everybody and and and and some of you have been very good about when you send a response you you send it to everybody and I think that works and and that's good so that way you know but there's so many that they just disappear and we don't hear from them again what what happened and I I I don't want to make work but I are we comfortable with the

109system is what I'm saying what the way we that is part of of our normal protocols we need to hammer out >> conversation. >> I mean if somebody used emails me directly and uses my name I absolutely will respond back to them >> but when they send things to the whole board I will say that when I do respond I'm trying to do it so quickly that I forget to see everybody on the email. So you can put some of that ownership on me. But again, when we get, you know, this is a job that pays $3,000 a year and all of us, pretty much all of us have have a hustle that pays the bills. And so we we cannot work full-time at this job because that is really what it would take to

110answer. >> I'm glad you said that, Sarah, because a lot of people don't understand. I got messages um out of the thousand before taxes are taken out. She said before tax you have lives, jobs, family, you know, just trying to take care of, you know, your personal things. So when we can get to it from me, I will get to it. And I'm sure everybody, you know, around the state will say it. >> My daughter decided to order homecoming dresses at 3:15 today. And I my answer was I have to get ready for this meeting. And I said just order all four of them and then we'll return the ones that don't work. I mean >> try trying to trying to juggle a full-time job, full-time parenting, full-time school board member is tough and we

111have to give ourselves some grace in this process as well. >> Yeah, I was Oh. Oh, I was just going to uh suggest the the one thing that boards have raised is that closing the loop. um you know when we forward you know citizen concerns or whether it's from a student teacher um parent to um you know the superintendent it's like just has this situation been resolved you know and typically I think you've said you said the administration is taking care of it you know >> that may be something >> I I can start to do some kind of a log or a return just so you guys have it >> something that you may want to look at >> all right that because anytime time. No. Anytime an email comes to me where there's

112a especially a student concern or you know something at a school that that is that is forwarded that is taken care of. We are working through that. Um and and generally if uh if a if it if they email me directly the the the concerned citizen or parent or whoever it may be, I I will reply and include the person who's going to work with them on it. So if it's like a specific issue in elementary school, it might want to be one of the elementary school eds who's going to be there. And that way I'm doing the digital introduction at the same time and I'll work on a way to do a better followup of that internally because I don't know if we have a good practice of that in place >> to you

113know that when when it's been completed. So I think it's a good concern. >> Um and administratively when those come up we can do we can improve on that process. And if anything you want to share that please send it my way. Well, and also our clerk, Miss Tanner, when she gets these, she will copy Dr. P so that it could be directed and worked on. >> She does and she does excellent job of that. >> But my my intent was not to increase work, but to understand the process is increased. >> And we we had a a good example was uh somebody complaining they hadn't gotten responses over like four or five months. Uh but what they didn't say was what was acceptable to them has not been they haven't been told what's acceptable

114to them and and they you would step put out everything that had ever been done but the person wouldn't accept the decision. >> Well yeah >> and and there we will get those and I say and those are usually the ones that say well I've been doing this for four months and I'm not getting any answer. I'm not getting the answer I want is do you kind of have to read in in that into it. >> But if we have a followup then we would know because you know we do get emails say I've been reaching out no one has responded but in the meantime you may have responded but we don't know. So we're like okay okay we'll get to the superintendent send him a message. You know again if you say you haven't

115respond most of the time you have responded but we don't know. So we just on that one side from the parent or whoever teacher whoever it is. >> So until we hear you say, "Oh no, I did respond to him." Okay. He responded to you. >> And anytime you follow up, I of course keep my my documents in order. So >> Oh, I I know. I know. >> So I will I will definitely let you know that this is the date and the time we working on it. >> I gotcha. Um, so we do need to talk about a potential rescheduling with city council on a meeting. Unfortunately, the city council is meeting October 28th and November 18th. They're only meeting once in the month of November. October 28th, Dr. Paul is not available. So,

116that is not a date that I think we should consider going forward because we want our entire team there. >> Go ahead. I I would like to suggest that we invite them to our work session to meet with us during our work session on uh Wednesday, November 5th at a at a probably at a school location. So, we have the space. We have the capacity for that. Now, we can we can we can put that out there and we can see how they respond, but I don't think we want to wait to the 18th. And um and I'm s and they're not meeting on the 4th because it's election day. So, I can understand that. But, you know, we can we can we can what >> November 5th. >> I was saying >> Well, November

1175th. Yes. cuz that's a that's a schedule meeting for >> schedule a meeting for us and we could offer to host them and do it at a school location and I think >> yeah are we firm at setting that we will have a commitment to everyone on the 15th of this month October. >> Well I think that we are voting on the 15th. Well, okay. So, we we'll we'll have that done. Why not have a special call the next week? Do a special call and see if they will reciprocate on on a special call, a meeting just for us, not part of another thing. And do it sooner is my point. Not not in >> the problem is with the next week. Some of us are attending the council city schools conference from Wednesday through

118the weekend. Uh, >> but that's on that's on what day? Wednesday. >> 22nd. >> Okay. Well, there's the 21st. I mean, you know, there's other days, you know. Well, >> third Tuesday of each month, I have a school I'm working. I have a school board meeting. >> We can do it on a Monday. >> I can I cannot do that Monday. >> Yeah. I'm not available on that Monday. >> Well, I'm not saying that Monday. A Monday. >> A change. change the way we're thinking. We only do it on Wednesday. Let's do it Monday. U Tuesdays don't work for most everybody or Thursdays. Wednesday is a conf see the that Monday is the 27th, but we do have a meeting scheduled for the 5th. So >> So we already be together is is what she

119said. >> And um Madame Chair, were those the dates that they suggested to you or or were we just assuming that? I I was just because they had they had said during their meetings. I >> Oh, okay. So, they didn't necessarily say during our meeting. >> Well, that's the dates that I was given was during their meetings. >> Oh, okay. So, you Okay, that's what I'm asking. Okay. >> So, we don't even know if they'll be available on the >> We don't know if they would be available, but I wouldn't want it. I would I mean, I'm comfortable putting the offer out there. Um, we can just see what they said >> November the 5th. >> Yeah, >> cuz we are not available on the 18th. >> I'm available. >> But, uh, >> I will

120be here on the 5th for sure. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah, we're all Yeah. >> Oh, all right. Right. And if needed, you know, I don't know, are you also suggesting coming in earlier for that portion or just doing at our regular uh you know what, that's a good question. I don't know what we have on the agenda for that day if we would have or if we would have to meet earlier for our work session. >> Yeah, that's that's why I was like it'll be >> we don't want to push that off. >> All right. So then perhaps we need to do a special call >> or or do if it's possible for the team to get together earlier. Um that's an option too. Just putting that out there. >> Well, we have a >>

121agenda back and forth over here. So unfortunately we are not available on the two meeting dates the two most two closest meeting dates for city council. We we cannot pres we not cannot bring our full team. Um now we could propose a special meeting date. I mean, I could try to work back and forth with them to do just a special state of the like a school city council meeting or we could invite them on the 5th. But it sounds like we have a lot of work to do on the 5th that we'd have to meet earlier to complete. Uh, which would also make it hard for our if we met earlier, it might might make it far hard for our two student representatives to be able to meet. >> I'm still a little confused

122about um why we wouldn't meet before we vote. They have they have because you would after we're done with the vote, we're done. Like I don't I don't understand what's to come of that meeting. um you know this is an opportunity where they could give some input >> and to the narrative that's out there is very negative toward us >> and we have been making progress and we've been very um deliberate about >> yes we've this come together and and we've taken great strides I'm really proud of us >> um so this ne negative narrative has to go away and then when we show up and want their input. You're like, "No, no, no." But there's push back. I mean, I'm just really It's >> I I did ask those questions. I said, "Wouldn't it

123make sense for us to continue our meeting next week so that we can present our current plan and get, you know, their input as stakeholders and partners um but they are not interested in meeting with us until we have voted. So perhaps we vote and then we set up a meeting. that we get our house in order and then set up a meeting. >> We are working and we are committed to doing this work in the best interest of students if it happens on the 15th or if it happens. But we are going to be committed to doing this the right way in the best interest of students. be great to have that partnership and collaborate collaborative um uh effort, but >> it' be nice to be collaborative, >> but you know, it ultimately is

124our job to do this. So, um I I support that we could we could wait to connect with them till after we take the vote so that we're not in this constant >> state of flux >> data flux and everybody changing schedules to kind of meet you know we all changed our schedule to be available next Tuesday and um it's unfortunate that that meeting is not happening now um uh I'm very disappointed in it as well um so I would just wait till we take a vote and then um >> schedule a meeting. >> I think I think that's probably our best course >> because our work continues and we're going to continue the work and that's that's where I I I don't see the um urgency uh if around it. So >> Madam Chair,

125um I just want to echo the same sentiments um of Dr. Martin. Um this board has been working um digitally and collaboratively to um come up with a plan. We've have one. We're now um having for public input. Um I would have really I I was very sidebarred and a little disappointed that our city council counterparts um have not come to the table. Um education is a part of the quality of life here in Norolk and is the economic generator for this city. um no one will come to our city if our education system is not robust and um we have a educated um labor force. So, I would have loved to had our city counterparts here together working with us so that the community, our citizens, those who have put everyone here will see,

126well, with the exception of me since I'm appointed, that's a big thing with everybody. Um, that we'll have it so that they see we are all working together. We have to show a united front. This is not school board versus city council. city. >> There's one city as the city of Norol and we have to make sure that works for all of our citizens and that includes our children, our families. So, I'm just a little little disappointed that the city council did not want to meet with us um to provide input knowing that this does also affect their their city as well. >> All right. So now I need to know if we get a motion to enter into closed executive session. >> I move that we I move that we go into executive close

127session. >> Second. >> Miss Buffalo has put forward the motion and both Mr. and Missine have seconded it almost simultaneous. >> It was Martin Dr. Martin. I am sorry. >> I just heard the sound coming right there and right there at the same time. Um, you ready for me to read? >> Okay. >> Dr. Move that the members of the school board of the city of Norfolk going into a closed meeting for the purposes which are sat under subsection A or section 2.2-3711 2-3711 of the Virginia Freedom of Information Act as amended for discussion, consideration or interviews of prospective candidates for employment, assignment, appointment, promotion, performance, demotion, salaries, disciplining or resignation of specific public officers, appointees or employees of the school board pursuant to subsection 2.2-3711A1 of the act. The subject covered by this exemption

128is the discussion of specific persons and personnel actions included for vote on today's personnel report. Consultation with legal counsel regarding specific legal matters requiring the provision of legal advice by council pursuant to subsection 2.2-371181188 of the act. The subject covered by this exemption is consultation with legal counsel connection with the specific set out above in subsection A of this motion. Bassine. >> Hi >> Buffalo. >> Inch. >> Hi >> Martin. >> Hi >> Coulson. >> Hi >> Thomas. >> Hi >> Dalero. >> Hi [Music]