Planning Board 9/28/2023

001good evening everyone and welcome to Ashland planning board meeting of Thursday September 28 2023. um just a note to everyone that the meeting is being broadcast and recorded so first on our agendas tonight is as always is the clerk's report Kate report for tonight yes Madam chair we have received three public correspondents since the last planning board meeting two of those were responded to by the town planner as specifics and one of them was responded to by the clerk on behalf of the board thank you all right next on the agenda is public comment um we will open it up for public comment and Peter can you manage the process sure thank you so much uh currently we have no hands raised here in the audience uh however we have two virtual hands raised first

002being Mr Mark desoni Mr Mark desoni completely can you please unmute yourself and state your name and address okay thank you Mark sorry foreign [Music] to say to the representative of the comprehensive plan that I wasn't I enjoyed it thoroughly I was at the meeting the uh meet the consultant meeting and got involved and that it helped me formally what my thinking is of the of that of the board itself or the the comprehensive plan members themselves and I know that made a good choice would get those Consultants but to the planning board it still haven't come up with the answers yet uh what you what is the goal for the town have you had time to think about that or you're not willing to answer that's it thank you Mr desoni the second person

003with the hand raised is Amanda Amanda can you please step forward and state your name and address is 107 Pine Hill Road um so I just wanted to make a quick suggestion um regarding the MBTA housing project um I didn't know if you guys were considering um putting together maybe a survey um you know and distributing that to the community via like social media or the Weekly Newsletter um I just made the observation like I've seen a couple of open houses and there are so many people looking for starter homes um and I just feel like you know this MBTA Community um you know action would be a great opportunity to you know maybe look into townhouses or you know these Millennials that you know don't want to live in apartments and they want to

004you know have a different housing situation have maybe like a little yard I just think it's a really great Community too a really great initiative to explore that and I think a survey would be great to hear from the community and see if you know that's what they're looking for and you know what type of housing options they would like so just want to make that quick comment thanks guys and I'm just gonna make a quick response to that um just in regard to housing because in in two ways one I think housing is going to be looked at through the comprehensive plan process which is one of the things from the beginning that was going to be looked at so um so know that we know that it's being looked at through that process

005and the MBTA um zoning districts um also will be having once we kind of really get into all the requirements that are put To Us by the state we'll both be discussing it with joint meetings between the planning board and select board and then it'll be there will be forums and things like that to um to kind of explain it on a more a more General basis right so um we're kind of just at the beginning part of exploring possibilities for Ashland to meet those state requirements great um any more hands raise no okay um and also before we get started I just wanted to let everyone know that our fourth or sorry our fifth member um Anna testmaninski will be joining us later in the meeting she is traveling and our associate member our

006new associate member Amanda Hayes also had a previous travel commitment so she is actually in Flight right now and couldn't make this initial meeting but she should be with us next time so on that note we can start our first major agenda item of the night with it is a continuing discussion with the sustainability committee regarding the development of a new tree bylaw um Margie obviously you are here do you have others that are coming in online or that we should make sure we note okay and you have a you have a presentation is that okay great can I see um okay but this is yeah if you're a person or do you have it well it's right there do I need to State my name and address okay margica cell ate Adams Road okay

007so you already you can hear me fine right okay so um what I'd like to talk with you about tonight is the situations that would trigger the tree by law next slide can I do that can you who's gonna do that okay too many things so the sustainability committee's goal is to preserve as many trees especially wooded areas and town as feasible and um as I said we would like to consider the different situations that would call for a review under the tree bylaw and I want to point out that we very much recognize the complex complexity of the regulatory issues and we're super appreciative of your advice and counsel and ultimately your approval next so in the draft document that I believe you all have seen these were the triggers for the bylaw the

008first one being site plan review the second is site alteration special permit then 40b and last subdivision so next slide so I made some notes on this slide about the content of site plan review in the bylaw kind of for myself and what I want to run by you is if I understand it correctly that it has mostly to do with commercial and Industrial construction um also parking sorry also an expansion of parking and then the last one building permits including six or more parking spaces so my question is does that refer to multi-family dwellings yeah I mean I think it can really um it just it looks to um note like a project that probably has a certain scale to it like a certain size okay yeah so it could be commercial it's multi-family

009considered commercial yes it is per the code yeah okay all right next slide and then site alterations special permit applies to clearing of over 5000 square feet or grading over a hundred cubic yards and there is a list of exemptions and I've just sort of summarized for example removal of hazardous trees and routine maintenance are within the exemptions but the one I'm a little confused about is clearing of land zoned residential when such parcel is included in a submission for development to the planning board and what I don't understand is if you look down below under intent and purpose it one one of those is to limit land clearing and alteration of natural topography and then it says prior to site plan preliminary plan and or definitive plan approval so I'm a little confused about

010the timing and the exemption I don't understand what the exemption means I'm not sure given that none of us were around when this was written I'm not sure we do either what Peter What What In Your I mean what is that what does that line mean I think it's a very good point to ask does that mean that the land can be cleared yeah I mean I'm not sure it's this point um site alteration special for me exempts your exempt clearing of land zoned residential but such a parcel is included in a submission for development board so in my eyes I would say that if you are already in front of the planning board for such a res for a site for in that instance I would say a subdivision that subdivision is going to

011include a lot of earth work right a roadway roadway development drainage basin development and so if you are filing for that such a such a type of application within the planning board then therefore you are not filing for a site plan alteration because that permit is so big and intense right for that roadway development um that you are you're not putting a special permit on top of that application okay that I think that makes sense because I actually looked up I was trying to get a sense for myself about how big is 5 000 square feet and actually this building footprint the footprint is about 5 000 square feet it's 52 by like 104 which puts it just so just to get an idea of what 5 000 square feet is so obviously a subdivision

012would be much much larger and so this site alterations special permit would be beside all the really special primaries for for applies to really land clearing indoor grading right on a on a much condensed scale right um and the major thing is to make sure that you're not pushing more water onto your name or right from a storm water standpoint you're not causing a hazard to anybody in properties however when you do a subdivision development a roadway permitting you could be clearing and or manipulating rating you know hundred thousand you know 100 you know hundred thousand square feet of material into our land area and so therefore if you're going to do this huge exorbitant project that may include 10 20 50 40. subdivision Lots then you're exempt from that site alteration special permit because

013you're doing such a such a greater development and because those issues are going to be looked at in in terms of the subdivision permit they're being looked at already was what Peter is saying correct not that they're being ignored you can cut down whatever you want but they're being looked at already Under the Umbrella of another permit yeah so so it seems like though that to be very clear needs to say our subdivision by la blah blah and that would clear it up because it's kind of what Peter's saying when you re-read it makes sense but it does not say that and that would be a potentially some misunderstanding with a developer or not as we got in front of us there can't be a misunderstanding if we refer to the subdivision agreed so that

014seems like a definite clean up easy I 100 agree with you but I think I agree with you the interpretation of the planning board or whoever when this bylaw went into effect or the last time it was manipulated it could have been clear to them but today yeah it could be ironed out a little bit better but that's the way I would Implement and or understand that that development and just to just to add a little bit more to that because of things we've discussed before in a subdivision there are very few things that the planning board can do as long as the subdivision is following all the rules to not approve a subdivision that's correct but that's just the subdivision that's not the the work on each property that's correct so the subdivision is

015the one thing on paper it's not the lot releases or anything like that no so the two things so so a subdivision development the definitive subdivision development is the is really for the permitting of the development of the roadway right the roadway in particular when you when you start looking at the subdivision regulations right which are which is another document excluded from the zoning bylaws the subdivision regulations are the regulations that the town adopts very similar to zonium actually the planning board adopts the subdivision regulations any changes to the subdivision regulations can go through the planning board they don't have to go through town meeting find just a note on that point but the subdivision relation of regulations spell out how the town wants that road to be built that roadway has to be 22

016feet across that roadway needs to have vertical Granite curbing that roadway has to have Cape Cod burn that kid that roadway has to have great uncle you know a vertical Granite curbing at the drainage at the street drains um you know radiuses grades all those elements in that layout are safe and I would say harmonious Street including storm water to Street trees right and all those elements are within the subdivision regulations now if a developer comes in and says I'm going to meet I'm going to develop this I would like to develop this piece of property and I'm going to meet every subdivision regulation that the town of Ashland has and is asking for no waivers yes it is very difficult and the town does not have any I would say therefore right to deny

017that subdivision because it is the right of that property owner to develop his property now he is developing a roadway to do really one thing in particular is to create buildable lots a buildable lot needs square footage and Frontage right the roadway creates Frontage for the developer to create buildable lots and so that's the way it all kind of is is in a nutshell woven together so but is it unknown that after that process so a person gets the subdivision approval they still have to have building permits correct and for each of those buildings in which and this is the question at which time the planning board can look at how what is intended as far as how the lots are going to be cleared is there you know what I looking at the interpretation

018I would I would try I would I would look to Town Council and talk that through before I give you a full answer okay on on film yeah so I think another Point related to that though so let's just say you know Mr so and so made the subdivision and then miss Jersey buys a lot we've already tentatively again we nothing's 100 Inked and so on but said for now for this round private property so now whatever we make Kate Jersey plot I can clear cut it so that's a automatic loophole in our in our thinking right usually they don't go that way though I didn't don't they don't necessarily just divide out and sell it to you and you and you but yes maybe right so if if the intent is to not have

019clear cutting in subdivisions we have a lot of thinking to do starting with Town Council but yeah I I understand your I understand the interpretation it's a very clear it's a very good way to look at it right you know the the subdivision creates the roadway does this interpretation of the bylaw does that include the the entire perimeter of land that the subdivision is creating and I think that's where we're going or is this interpreting that the roadway itself now very you know from from a practical standpoint if you for the Conservation Commission for example the Conservation Commission for any subdivision the Conservation Commission they're going to permit the entire project under one project right and then say they say the subdivision is 10 20 Lots right and 10 out of those 20 Lots fall

020within 100 feet of the of a wetland right then the developer is going to have to come back in for each house right and for each lot then they have to refile with the sub with the Conservation Commission for for the development of each house within 100 feet of that Wetland now I think that's what that this is that this is where we're going is to say okay if that's the case then then with and you're looking to grade over greater than 50 50 000 I mean excuse me five thousand square feet what's the interpretation when you're coming in from a lot by law basis and what would be that what would be the mechanism because I think we're strongly considering to not allow that so two it's like kind of two parts to that

021yeah but I I think that was part of the discussion in the previous time and I think we were trying to make a distinction between a large development of commercial development and private property and that was a point of discussion that needed to be clarified because that's something that everybody is concerned about in Kate's example um once you buy the lot first of all um it would be unlikely I mean if you're going to move that kind of land would be probably for the construction of your house and then if it's more than x I guess would would have to go through this but but once the lot is there um unless unless the new by law limits what you can do in your own private lot you at this point in time you you

022can do whatever you want yeah so it's it's sort of a loophole if we stick to that and there may be I mean that's through Town Council if it's a new development right that may be the way to tie it by the time the development is developed I mean the lots are buildable and they are on the the wetlands will be flagged and approved by of course Conservation Commission so really all that's left is building houses in that subdivision correct right but but at the point when you're making the subdivision here the way it reads you're going to have to go through all these review yeah so it will be redundant to also apply for these special permit this is as more localized either if you have say a property with two houses you're trying

023to change it or whatever too lot and and then you start you need to move this amount of square feet a lot then would would that be the point where where you have to go through these side alterations because it's it's just a smaller scope yeah and I think the number one thing here is and I think it's a very important point is that the planning board in the town have to look at how this has been interpreted in the past from a historical standpoint right because there was a lot of there's been a lot of subdivisions a lot of developments that are Done Right previously and how is this bylaw interpreted in the past and and that has to be taken into account um before before the before the board would you consider a

024new interpretation um and going into a different direction so so I would say I 100 agree with that and it sounds like we actually need a fair bit of Town Council input but changing if we propose to change that that we're not specifically like we're entitled to change our bylaws or proposed changes to our bylaws I guess yeah that so I think there's a distinction I I don't want to get caught up because if something was the past and we're trying to I mean I'm just going to be clear I see this as an improvement I'm supporting um I mean trying to get a bylaw to bring to town to town meeting so I assume it will be changes right and that's I don't want to lose the sight of that I guess yeah but

025I want to ask Margie I mean what we're talking about a change that by loss by default right the investigation is the tree by long what what what's going to entail so how does the sustainability committee see these different differentiation between private and Commercial yeah so you've gotten ahead of me I'm thinking that perhaps we should move forward in the presentation to the subdivision side okay continue yeah so these this is the question we were bringing to you as um there's a portion that has to do with road construction and that's not so complicated but the second part of the development of the Lots that's where it gets a little hairy so it sounds like we need to gather more information and in terms of where we are on that I think we're kind of

026divided um some members right I think it's important because we're trying to preserve trees that those lots cannot be clear-cut and others are concerned about the impact it might have on the success of passing the bylaw because it starts to to move over into the residential Realm so yeah we have to work this out somehow yeah and just to note if I can add to you in looking at the slide there's a couple things number one the subdivision um is for the roadway right and it creates the buildable Lots and working with Margie and Samantha are from our sustainability coordinator you know we've also kind of found out and I just kind of want to make note of it what other towns are doing right and in the other packet I'm not going to bring

027it up on the screen but there's this this sample tree plant right and I kind of want to make note of it and I'm happy to actually bring it I'm happy to bring up on screen I just have to jump to a different PowerPoint but to my research to our research it seems that most towns are are moving in the direction of requesting a tree plan right and so if for this instance when you create a buildable lot you also have what's known as a buildable envelope envelope okay and your buildable envelope is going to allow you to place your house right you're building envelope respects the dimensional regulations within your Zone within your zoning setbacks right and so as you develop your lot and or any new law or any if you manipulate anything

028in that lot you have the right to plant the tree in that yard you have also the right to take a tree down in your quote-unquote building envelope but it's outside the building envelope they're calling the tree area the tree the tree protection Zone which is going to be the area which is protected by your dimensional setbacks that's the area where the tree where a lot of communities are are looking to and have already done look to protect trees so that's in your rear yard setback your front yard set back but also in your side yard setbacks and so any manipulation of the trees within those setbacks are now under the jurisdiction of community bylaws but most of the I guess going down the road a little further but like most of the setbacks are

029that they're a they're the house setback they're not the accessory dwelling setback or the pool setback or the patio setback none of that counts right and so yeah so it gets complicated our setbacks are not significant I'm not saying it's not going to protect any trees but it's I don't think it's protecting a lot of trees if that's the direction we go yeah I'm just like I don't I don't know the answer I'm just trying to get to the question still I guess yeah it you know the setbacks the setbacks for a structure a pool is considered a structure a patio is not a structure a house is right a driveway is not right and so you have to kind of go down this line to say okay um where where does where do you

030draw the line right it's a very it's it's a it's a you're you're adding another restriction onto a private product you're adding a restriction to private property um and so that's just something to note but so you know communities similar to Ashland and you can look through this comparison um this is the direction that they have been going and that's kind of wanted to make note of that just for food for thought and that would make sense that that will kind of start touching on what Margie was saying that that is um uh something that could be viewed in in a number of ways uh positively by some and negatively by others because what what what is to say that if you have a property and say that that there's some trees in that zone

031that you simply don't like or would like to to to modify there's one Avenue which is this one right to say no you can yeah there's another Avenue that that gives incentives to okay you can but you have to replace it in kind somewhere so to give choice and freedom than than uh are supposed to say no you can't and if you touch that um we're gonna send an inspector that is when it becomes a lot more of a difficult conversation I think yeah if you really look at these comparisons that's how the Future these have been they are very generic it talks about the diameter of the trees and kind of the penalty if you will depending on the size but other than that it seems like there seems to be a very similar

032pattern when all these examples that have been shared it's very generic it doesn't go into that depth of what we are proposing here about that 5000 square feet because there's probably a lot of things that will fight with that logic so I think that the the 5 000 square feet to site alteration right and I think what Marge is proposing is if you trigger you're looking at the triggers right so you're saying okay what would trigger the town of Ashland to look and or do it you know look you look into this tree bylaw right and so they're saying okay if if the site alteration permit is applied for well are you taking down any trees and what trees are you going to take down because you're doing significant grading on your site you know

033so it's that that one permit would lead to the next question when I did when I look at this when I'm doing when I did my research on it a lot of these communities historically and I would say in the past couple years face teardowns you know and so there's been a lot of tear Downs of you know you know post-war housing um and so they're in the urban environment they're on the 128 belt and so they're they're tear Downs of your your your your your post-war camp and Alley split levels right that were built in the 1950s and property values have risen and the house has has fallen into a disrepair say and so a developer is coming in and taking the house down and replacing it with four thousand square foot house and

034in doing so and doing kind they're taking down some whole you know some 50 year old trees that have been on that property and so um that's where I've kind of come to find in this research you know some of the other triggers that that are mentioned in the comparison are um any anytime someone is applying for a building permit that's going to increase your gross for your gross floor area by 50 or more that's going to trigger the adoption and or um submittal of a of a tree plan right and so they're saying if you're going to get your lot surveyed with a plot plan and created to implement an addition of just for the mere facts if you have a 2 000 square foot house and you're going to put a thousand square

035foot Edition on you're gonna have to get a site plan and do all that work as well well now you're going to also go and measure all the trees on your property we want to know which trees are you taking down with your thousand square foot Edition um and are you are they within the building envelope are they outside the building envelope and so it it's kind of so that you would have to it's not that you're going to measure it you're going to have to engage a licensed professional to do it for you and pay for that the applicant yeah the homeowner would have to do that and then they would be submitting that material to the town of Ashland and so there's a couple one a couple that those are the two real

036common threads I've picked up on what this is and and what other what communities are adopting um and everyone can take a look from themselves to the comparison stuff but you know that's where my mind is going when these communities have adopted Tree by laws you know I didn't have this this particular discussion on the agenda for tonight and it seems important and I'm wondering if I need to add it to a future agenda so that we can determine what we're gonna if we're gonna deal with that situation or not in the tree by law does it sound reasonable yeah I think I think absolutely um because they're kind of on you know questions that we have um so um got me all out of order but I'm sorry okay I was just going to

037ask what did you want to talk about tonight we were just kind of coming up with questions as we yeah I was trying to keep it limited so that you know we wouldn't take too much time so um can we go backwards and come back to this sure later I'm sorry go back so um just to summarize in terms of subdivisions we do want to address the problem with you about development of the Lots how we're going to approach that hmm yeah I just don't have any we don't have to do it now don't have any answers until we understand what we're allowed to do and not allowed right right okay and then go back one more before we move to the end we skip this one so 40b yeah that one so Samantha talked

038with Lisa made to help us understand and um now I fully understand that if you filed for 40b you can disregard all local situations um and she said that we could make an exemption for them but we don't have to because they can exempt themselves but what I'm wondering is the um the the tree Violet cannot apply unless we have 10 affordable housing so let's suppose we get there does that mean that we we should include this in the tree bylaw in the event that we get to that place I mean I would just say yes because we don't need to like our it's our goal to meet 10 or more right as a community we kind of keep stumbling but I haven't heard pushback that we don't want to do that right so someday

039hopefully sooner we'll get there so the bylaw can say upon okay right all right um for sure and then I mean I I'm not a lawyer so if Lisa Mead says yes but that's not my read that that 40b completely gets to override all your zoning I know that's commonly how we say it because that's that is aversion but I read some stuff today from the state that that actually didn't say that and I didn't get to find the tree bylaws specifically but it I don't think it's as blatant as none of your rules apply so we should probably dig into that a little bit okay but I would say absolutely write it so that it's when we're at 10 it applies okay okay well that was easy okay and then we can go to

040the last slide so I made sort of a work plan for moving forward and I listed um the the topics that we want to discuss with you and I left some blank spaces because I probably forgot similar some others might come up um but this is what I have so far and I sort of estimated well I didn't estimate I just picked the dates that I think you're meeting although I might have scheduled this on um Thanksgiving I'm not sure I might have skipped it looks like I skipped it yeah you skipped it Thanksgiving oh yeah it's good I can see there's only one date in November and then I don't know what happens at the end of the year on December 28th but so I I appreciate getting like specifics I would say right

041now we need to put the subdivision back on we know we're not yes I agree so in in the work plan like that and then even though I if I'm remembering correctly the board was not opposed to private residential but we thought for town meeting but the conversation tonight kind of opened that back up a little bit right I don't think that ball was in favor either it was just a discussion no I yeah I'm not trying to I I I think I agree it was reasonably settled we weren't going to probably pursue that now but I thought the conversations tonight sort of opened that up again as a way because of these private lots that a developer sold those kind of things and then Peter said that communities that are going toward that are

042about private Lots so well yeah but but Margie said it as well on once you start going that road you better involve the entire Community you can really otherwise you're going to do a lot of work to fail right and what's the point on that yeah I think it's like it's a matter of scale right it's not intended to be hey there's a tree in the middle of my yard that keeps dropping it's healthy but it keeps dropping branches and I have young kids right it's not about one tree it's about I'm taking down this house and I'm building them you know I'm I'm really making a much bigger change we're not trying to understand that Clarity is critical yeah and it's and it's a fine line to try to describe right to you know

043adequately and I also I mean I I guess I I took all of these as almost like these are times when discussing these issues because I I don't not sure they'll just be resolved when we move on because you tend to loop back right and I wasn't here for the last discussion though I did watch a good part of the tape and I really had a question and we don't have to go back on this today I just wanted to make a point about town property and first of all you know I agree that that the conversation was about the town setting a good example and I think that's should be obvious that we're sending a good example that said it gets again kind of tricky because if you look at the recent Town Projects

044the public safety building and the school you know those sites which both cut down a good deal of trees I don't know how many um but had other important reasons for being cited where they were right now if trees was the only consideration yeah maybe they would have been cited differently but it was only one of many important considerations right so so how does that weigh in and then because it's not a matter of just choosing a different home or whatever and then how does it weigh in if you're taking down trees and say you have to and we haven't gotten to the point about talking about payment in lieu of cutting down trees or whatever does that work when really we are both exactly it's like okay I'll take my money from this jar

045and I'll just put it in this jar but I own both jars right and so how does how do we think about how do we think about that you know well I will use your the way I I'm trying to process the example the and I think the direction that the last conversation was kind of intended is at the at the essential fairness of when you apply a regulation or you and put a new regulation on on the community and and uh yeah the town May own property and build a school and they would have to do that uh and the considerations of yeah we're doing something important will also apply to a private person a private person would say yeah but this is important to me so why is that different uh so if

046the town is going to apply that to the community I personally am really in favor of the Town should be at least the same if not more honors requirements to set the example and say okay then when the town decides to do a project then uh maybe it's not there but they will have to plant trees in some other place just like a person would have to also replace in kind yeah and I get that you know I think less so in terms of the I think the site kind of depends right but um again in terms of the trees we just have to understand that you know we like when it goes to town meeting and we ask the we we are the residents that we're asking them for more money because we're taking

047down trees to plant the trees in somewhere it's just about being honest and transparent and clear that we all the townspeople and all the residents are paying that bill that's you know yeah absolutely and and but the other part of that conversation is is really how are we going to help the town or whoever is the entity in the town to have a real budget for this for tree replacement we talked with DPW once they don't have a budget to take on a tree and replace it or take out this thumb well that has to be resolved and these maybe these change is a way to to resolve it so some of the budget and talent is going to have to account for that right that's why I'm going to know I think um I

048remember uh Anna has a point uh not a point but she wanted to add a comment so Anna can you please unmute yourself and uh introduce yourself uh can you speak up a little bit sure is this better can you hear me now loud and clear okay all right you guys I I apologize for not being there in person and I had some technical issues but I did hear I would say almost everything um in the entire discussion and I just wanted to add three points um to the discussion one is I keep thinking you know what is our goal like what are we actually trying to achieve because in all honesty we the planning board together with the sustainability folks we are not going to be able to figure out what will the majority

049of the town of Ashland vote for a town meeting and so I don't think it's our job to come up with that perfect bylaw I think it's our job to come up with a few options and present them a tell meeting and be able to explain the pros and cons of them so that the community can make a good decision right and so I think if we sort of figure out what our actual goal is it's going to make our jobs a lot easier because where it seems like we're like aiming for that perfect answer and I just don't think that's our job we're not town meeting we're not the whole Community but we can be really really good at coming up with options helpful to folks just just to just to be clear like

050I think we can do that in terms of offering forums uh before there's a warrant but once a warrant is in front of town meeting it can't be changed like that on the or voted this one or that one the the warrant has to express what is being voted for so but but that discussion can happen in forums way in advance so we know which way so we have a warrant that will hopefully reflect what the people want I think that's that's accurate you could however have amendments prepared in theory as well so there are ways to creatively achieve the same results but you're right Trisha the smoother better way is to air out some of these possibilities in advance but I think if we kind of agree that that's our job it's going to

051make this process a little easier versus oh we have to figure out what that perfect solution is my second point is you know this interesting idea of like how do we look at how other communities are doing this and I keep thinking okay what about our own reality like right now in Ashland today we know hopefully what are our vulnerable areas that could confront tree removal right and so in theory we should assess it fairly quickly so that we understand in this effort what are we actually talking about meaning what is less right and then once we know what's left then we can be better informed as to how to focus this that's one way to do it so it's not that I don't care what other communities are doing but at this point we

052have clear-cut some good chunks of our properties um for multi-family housing and I think we need to kind of start there what's left a clear-cut in the same fashion and maybe begin there that's like a simple start and then we can have a more complicated conversation of private property but my recommendation would be let's start with the easy stuff what is actually less to clear-cut big chunks um I don't think there's that much left from from my personal view of Ashland um and then lastly the point of incentives for private landowners I'm sure many of you have heard about the beautiful tree in front of the funeral home at the corner of what is it 135 in Maine um and some of the Facebook traffic and attention that has drawn and that got me thinking

053about how do we create positive relationship with more private landowners who maybe have that one historic tree so even if we don't regulate that one tree we could use clear-cutting commercial type of development as a way to create a fund like a tree fund that can then offer protection and incentive to some of those very very beautiful and special trees that we ID recognize that we know are in private property so it's not that we're going to require private landowners to protect that special tree right next to the funeral home as an example but we might have a fund ready that provide some support if that tree is damaged or needs to come down and can actually be replanted so those are the three points I wanted to make thank you well we're um paying

054attention to people who are not here in person maybe I see some hands raised maybe we should open it up to public comment sure thank you I see two public comments uh number first it would be Mr Joel our biteman Mr Joel Bartman can you please um meet yourself and state your name and address hi just turning on the patio and video here uh Joel R beitman Woodbridge Lane uh I have a number of comments but first I haven't had a chance to read The Proposal at all and I I would like to do that so I I don't know exactly how this is framed or structured what I would very much like to emphasize that what's sitting behind this isn't just that we appreciate the foliage or it makes our town prettier which is

055which are both important but that we have a catastrophic I mean I can't find any hyperbole that would would go too far when we talk about the risk that we all I believe are seeing very clearly with the threat of climate change six of the nine tipping points that the U.N has identified have now been passed and the others are soon to topple I mean they they're not talking about there could be some droughts or it might be kind of warm in Ashland they're talking about the ex you know the the end of life on the planet I mean I I can't think of anything greater so my first uh my starting point for talking about this is you know does the mission here make it just painfully clear how critical this is and that

056we need to bend over backwards and do all we possibly can within reason uh you know to to be as effective with this uh effort as we possibly can having said that I have a few uh questions and comments uh first I just want to really thank Margie and the sustainability committee and the planning board for uh taking this seriously it's such an unbelievably important topic a number of points I want to make very quickly and I'm sure there's plenty of plenty of more discussion to come on all of these and that you know there's a lot of nuance to all of it that needs to be ironed out uh one um I was a little bit concerned maybe not clear about the discussion about subdivisions I thought I heard perhaps Peter was made the

057statement something to the effect of once an applicant uh you know complies with the subdivision regulations there's really not too much leverage for the town uh so and there was some Focus if I wasn't fully understanding but about putting in a road well my understanding is that when uh somebody wants to put in a new road whether it's a subdivision or any other Road uh that that's a public road that the town has certain standards that have to be met you know there's a certain thickness of asphalt or the grading or there's got to be the proper drainage or maybe curbing or striping or whatever it is there are all kinds of regulations and I'm not really clear why this couldn't be an additional regulation talking about uh you know the subdivision and clearing it

058and the impact on the trees one question I had with regard to this whole process that the sub the sustainability committee has identified I'm a little bit concerned that all of the talk here seems to revolve around what planning board actions would or would not trigger some type of tree bylaw review the concern I have is and maybe I'm not fully understanding again that it seems to me that if I owned let's say I own a two or three hundred acre lots in Ashland and I have not yet applied to the planning board for anything it's just my lot do I have a right to go and clear-cut it and sell off the wood so I'm not there there is you know all of the triggers here seem to be based on a subdivision application

059or a permitting type application of some kind what if I'm not doing any of that I in in knowing that I'm going to be submitting a development plan let's say I just want to clear the lot and sell the wood and then I put the subdivision plan in what what jurisdiction does the planning board have at that point it's a concern with regard to 40D I guess I have a question and I didn't see what the proposal was from the sustainability committee uh it it certainly would seem like if we tried to put restrictions on a developer who was who was going to come in under a 40b that they might be able to override them uh and not and and we maybe couldn't force them to comply I'm not as clear as to whether

060that would also apply to fees and compensation in other words if we said every tree you cut down you have to pay this much we're not stopping them from cutting we're making them uh either uh have mitigation or plant other trees and a really good example and the question is is this a valid example is uh Wetland mitigation so if uh if a 40D wants to come in but they're uh you know doing damage to the environment due to Wetland issues in the community they can uh as I understand it they can be permitted to develop other Wetlands elsewhere in town so that they're not they don't have a totally free hand to just damage the local environment they even 40b has to comply with the Wetland regulations uh could we find a way to

061structure the tree bylaw so that similar uh you know similar impact could be held and the town would have some jurisdiction uh one more quick one um there was some discussion and I want to second kind of what both what both Anna and um you know who else I'm not sure who else said it um uh terrific I think uh this business about we can't broke you know we can't come up with the perfect bylaw we should provide options I don't think that we necessarily have to have an amendment process I don't see why we couldn't uh uh give the residents the the greatest uh uh Voice by having a tree by law proposing it let's say without the private property option and then have a second bylaw that uh adds uh that that also

062extends the tree bylaw to private property I I I'm not clear that there would be any restriction town meeting from from providing multiple options of of something like that and the last comment I have is that and somebody was sort of talking about this I I'm trying to make it more explicit uh I think that it would be very helpful to do a study of uh undeveloped land in the town both large parcels and small residential parcels and try to identify what percentage of the towns trees or what percentage of the town's acre Ridge would be covered by the tree bylaw like it would be nice to kind of quantify that between uh you know commercial and residential and large Parcels versus small parcels and so on so that as we're setting or trying to

063define a bylaw that we would have a little bit more data to back us up and understand uh what the impact on the on the uh you know the loss of trees in town would be that's it thank you very much I greatly appreciate the time thank you so much well we have one more person with their hand up uh Ash uh can you please name uh state your name and address yeah thanks I also chair the sustainability committee I actually put my hand up more to answer the question of you know what should our intent be I think from a sustainability committee perspective I think Joel put it quite well um you know it is it is about one achieving The Net Zero goal that the town set for itself and and to to

064fight climate change um Trish to your point I think I I love the idea of doing a survey I think the goal is to try and protect tracks of land that are larger rather than uh individual tree certainly there's a place where sorry trees and beautiful trees and I think that's a very valid point we should take a look at but I think from our perspective at least the under underlying goal is uh to ensure that we don't see a loss of free coverage you know uh that that's already been happening at an extremely fast pace a lot of my other points have already been made far more succinctly between Joe and Joel and Anna so I'm just going to give give the time back and not waste you know additional time thank you Mr

065desoni I see your hand raised can you please add a short comment there are comments don't know if I can be sure I can be medium I'm thinking that this bylaw is a needed idea that the show worth it that town committees and Developers realize that nobody took uh Fair shots how to handle tree situations before they actually buy the sites and I'm understanding that the um Who the Planet will wins in sight Insight review committee that's the first step to get those questions out there to make sure and I'm saying that for three for three by law that tree bylaw should be involved in site Review Committee so that the developer of where it's going to work on those on the property has an idea of what the um it's very coverage and tree

066tickets is going to be a if is there any sort of options that you plan aboard and the developer and the right and the social and the dialogue can coincide and be working together on but other than just bringing this as a as a bylaw up here up to date and stuff like that it should understand that um the trees don't have a say it's the people who are trying to save thus wants to have a say to bring our forth to save the trees but it through sight through site um site amendments everything through the plan Awards rules and regulations that by law has got to be involved in the property standards are what there is left before the trees do come down and where the buyers will be updated this guy it's got

067to be um well what the future is well the next time that can happen and if it doesn't go through time reading that the public forums would be the best and I think part of the forums should be part of the decision making sure where the public needs to know about trees themselves thank you all right thank you um so what so what's our next step in this I mean I think um I mean I think it looking I think the research about what other communities are doing in no way obviously obligates us to do another Community is doing but it gives us some place to start from like you know um that kind of research that ground knowledge you know of what might happen and I don't know whether other examples and and I

068didn't make it all the way through that other examples of bylaws for for the not for the clear for the subdivisions for municipal properties for things that aren't so just to speak to that we really haven't come I I really haven't come across it yet you know I think the more the biggest things that I see are um really uh I would say it's a reaction to the to the to the the tear down replacement houses in in the Metro on in the Metro West 128 belt communities I do know that um I believe it's it's Sherborne uh Dover uh Halston are all interested you know locally regionally uh all other other communities are interested in developing a tree bylaw I just think we're a little our conversations are happening at the same time so

069to look for somebody an extra neighbor per se we don't really have that I think we're still looking East to the communities I've already have already done it most of the communities have done it are the Somerville Arlington I learned tonight that linfield's another Community up on you know on the north side of uh of you know of 93 and then you have your Wellesley your Lexington I believe Concord has a tree bylaw so um I I still would have to look into to the other you know surrounding communities um and then the other community is Northampton in the west and part of the state they do have a tree by law um but their tree by law protects 24 inch trees at diameter 20. excuse me 20. 20 I'm sorry uh 28th streets and

070so I think um size different different is a real difference in uh is a real different Factor uh on what Deborah communities one is and so I think that's something that's why the other day I brought those little diameters to kind of measure okay what's a what's a major tree what's a minor tree what would be affected um and so I think the number one thing to take away is you know I think there's a lot of research that has to be done on it um and there's other communities that have done tree plans you know tree inventories and tree preservation plans um and that's an option that obviously the Town Road to town could go down but yeah I think we're at the beginning and we're definitely not uh nothing's in stone I would

071say so so next yeah I guess a suggestion for our consideration which is this could be quite complex I I believe data is very very important um but I also feel like starting out with something that we like a starting step is is also something we can do in other words if we believe in our community that the primary focus should be on large commercial style development multi-family housing for commercial builds it's clearing clear-cutting land like the one that's right in front of my house um where a big chunk is just cleared up right ready to be developed if that's our Focus that's a very narrow doable thing that we probably do not need a ton of research on as far as what other communities have done because it's a very simple concise task and

072then we could just like Joel is suggesting we could have bylaw One deals with those large chunks bylaw 2 maybe deals with a municipal chunk of that size it's how meeting folks have the opportunity to just discuss that issue alone kind of large development and Municipal we save Private or later we see how found meeting reacts to these two topics and based on that we can we can come back for a third bylaw in the future once we've learned from The public's reaction to these two very concise my mind very doable yeah I I think that might be a good idea to to not do everything at one time but I don't think we have a conclusion about yet about what's the most important thing or the second most important thing at least that didn't

073come across to me that that that that was determined and I think it also in that whole process there's certain part of the data is Gathering whether towns have done so I don't think we need to not spend time doing that so like I said I would ask Margie like and the rest of the boy like what's the what's the next step here what it seems to me my a small next step is that we've asked a lot of some important questions that or you ask some important questions in your presentation some of which we don't have answers for and some of that involves Lisa Mead some of it just involves taking a closer look to try to get those answers whether they're low-hanging fruit or whether it's a more complex legal issue I'm not

074sure so that seems one obvious step answer the questions we have but Margie what you know what do you see as the next step where the board who was part of the discussion the last time when I wasn't so yeah I I need to process everything that happened tonight so it's hard for me to answer but I do want to comment that I don't think we need to do a lot of research because I actually put together a table that of every bylaw in the state or ordinance um and and what they target but I didn't bring it with me because the committee thought it was overwhelming Massachusetts hold on hold on let the Margie finish your thoughts essential elements that that might be useful to us and and I think we have the information

075handy ready to do something like that great great I didn't know yeah I was just going to support Marge there I think that a lot of the research actually has been done because we've taken a couple of stabs at this right so Trish maybe one approach we can take is for Margie to offline share that research we can certainly publish it you know either on the sustainability side through Sam or so that everybody in town can see it um or you know um on your site um uh that that way at least we can get past the hey we don't know what other people are doing um what I will say is that what Margie is suggesting usually is is based on on that research would you suggest I mean would you suggest that as

076since you have all this research that that the sustainability committee may be working with Peter because I know you've been working on this before synthesize and synthesize that's maybe not the right word some of this information so that it gets into okay based on all the research we've done and the information that we have this is what we think is most important a priority for Ashland in terms of commercial properties and this is what we think would work for Ashland in terms of Residential Properties so that we the planning board just don't have a pile of data in front of us and start from scratch you'll never get through it in a meeting right so it's a candidly part of our reticence in doing that was we actually wanted to hear from the planning board

077what they felt was most important as well because at the end of the day this is a combined activity right so from our perspective we have an extreme interest in fighting climate change and an extreme interest in achieving that zero and the only way we know how is to protect trees because that's about the only carbon sick we have so those are our guiding objectives we can certainly try and synthesize further the the research margins than like she said she already has a table and we can share that so that's what I was offering to share up is let's start there she's already synthesized it if that's not meeting your need then we can go further but let's take what we have already and maybe share that with you we can certainly make stronger statements

078from the sustainability committee but I'd also want to make sure and I heard a few voices on on the planning board as well right I'd love for you guys to also maybe put out there what you believe are the guiding things that that you want to focus on and then then maybe we can just marry that together right because otherwise we can continue to have a slightly circular conversation can I make two comments okay I think that Peter has extracted some things from various bylaws that can be useful in terms of methodology I think overall what we've discovered is that there isn't one that works for our needs and we need to we need to figure out what we want to do and it strikes me that based on somebody's comment that we have to

079decide are are these four things that were listed is that is that our basis or you know that that's a decision that we have to make for Ashan Marcelo were you going to comment uh yeah I I think I think the discussion on next steps is good uh so the thing uh that I summarized what I what I heard last time and tonight the the first thing is um I do think and I agree with Joel that uh having a Point of Departure survey would be good I don't know if that's part of of the analysis that the committee has done but understanding and kind of what Anna was referring to if we understand what what the goal the gold needs to be a little more concrete in in my view and and so we're

080coming to a point where through the discussions I believe the planning board and the sustainability committee are pretty much in full agreement with the overarching goal now the the implementation uh should go through uh through uh clearing all the questions I think would be better the next time we meet not not to come to try to answer questions during the meeting because I don't think we're going to be successful doing that but clearing the questions beforehand and then come to the meeting with a concrete either um I like the list that Margie put the a concrete set of of of you can call it proposals we say Okay based on the research on the data that we collected based on what we see the town reality is we think we want to address a b

081and c and the way to address it has been clear with Lisa and with Peter and and we could go in this way and that way or that way and then the discussion is really okay which way do we really want to go I think that would be a lot more successful because I think we've cleared a lot of the other kind of General points yeah I I agree I mean I think I mean and just just to clarify there is already you already did a tree survey right I think I read the I mean it's been a few years there's different kinds of surveys we did a survey of community views Community views that's what I meant yeah not not counting trees from the very beginning we wanted to do a survey of our

082our trees in town and it costs money however I just made myself a note because I trade it's um they can do some of that for you so I'm going to look into that okay um yeah so I guess in incredible wait hold on correct me if I'm wrong Marcel about summarizing what you had said because I think we're saying the same thing about there's all this data but I don't think it can be synthesized here it has to be synthesized out there and brought to us in a more just a suggested form we we think we should do this and here are some points where there could be changes or compromises is that yeah that that's what I meant and the the reason for that is that once we clear the hurdle of what

083do what do we recommend or propose doing these options the next step after that is okay now we Engage The the entire community and we tell them there are these three options we recommend this one or that one um and if possible that one and then you start getting feedback on that to to give reality to all these thoughts because we can keep dreaming of of all what we're doing but sometimes achieving something more concrete is better than achieving nothing right so I I think that's kind of the the right kind of uh process Kate or deeper do you have anything to I mean I agree with that methodology I will be cheerleader and put on the gas for the Springtown meeting knowing that this has been work done and kicked around for a long

084time and again I'm never a person to say everyone worked hard let's do this it's it's the opposite let's do this we can we can be smart enough to get past those hurdles and um I think personally maybe just the way things have worked at tell me but also a community like getting real with some options now I know that gets Devil's in the details on bylaws so I think it at the first pass might be high level does this affect and then I think those issues Margie brought to us flushed out I just didn't get to read like kind of go through that ahead of time so working to flesh out the issues that maybe have to go back to Lisa before we can even consider and then I think the also the priority

085of the large lands if we think it's gonna two options that I we have had bylaws that here's one and here's another right that could be Progressive but to focus on the one the larger things is kind of the right thing to do and Anna did you have a comment out there yeah I mean my my concern is I know the sustainability folks have been looking at data for many years and so I absolutely think there has to be a public process but I also feel like they are coming to us prepared with data and they're asking us the planning board offer input to a direction and so I I'm not really sure what we're sending them back out to do they've already done years of work okay for one I'm very comfortable saying I

086believe the priority for us in this bylaw should be large chunks of land where a developer can come in to build something big in the time of looking at properties that are the size of 501 Pond and Avenue of the Americas and some of these larger projects that the planning board has been dealing with that to me is is the priority I I think that could because yeah I mean I think it could be great I just think that if if we I don't I just don't know if if they need to go back out again do that I think we as the planning boards have enough knowledge and expertise based on our experience and projects to know that that is the primary target of clearing in our community like I don't think it's unknown

087to us like we do it all the time we're technically the ones clearing this land so we should take responsibility we should know by now that this is where we're at risk and we should just do this I don't know what else we're waiting for I I think I'm just waiting to see a text of a bylaw like or not doesn't even have to be in bylaw type form but this is our first prayer one this is our first priority two one large commercial properties two subdivisions three single-family home properties like those are the list of our priorities and here's how we want to address commercial properties here is how we went to address subdivisions here's how we went to address Residential Properties and so we're actually talking about something that's been collated that's concrete

088yeah that's concrete and that to me to me that needs to come from the people that have been working for it all these years right and have it in that form that now we can say Okay sustainability committee we get your priorities we agree with them or we agree except on these points and now we're making kind of progress and I mean I think I think Peter and you're working you're working in the background with this with the sustainability committee yes I am yeah I've met with Margie a couple times and I'm happy to meet with Margie and kind of continue on and and take it to the next step yeah so so am I missing something here doesn't that I mean okay I I just say it a different way I I very much

089appreciate all the effort and the sustainability folks and and I'm I'm saying that at the planning board we're the ones who have jurisdictions to draft bylaw and boning changes and and I think assuming there's capacity with our staff and our support whether it's the assistant planner who's new to the town or our planner I think it's time for for us for the planning board to perhaps with Town Council prepare that that draft for our review I feel like we're kind of repeating the same discussions in a few meetings now where we keep coming back to oh what are all these other communities doing and I'm no longer interested because I want to talk about our community we are clearing land with every project and we know exactly what we're doing and it's time to draft

090it for that size that's why that's why that's why I think Peter is already working to help maybe to help that happen I'm not sure unless there's volunteers of the five of us to draft a bylaw about something I don't feel like I'm the expert on then then I'm not sure how that happens I mean right I mean so we have we've had a draft for several years right so we should have a copy of it right so we should be maybe at the next meeting whatever the priority is of that draft bylaw we have that up there and we're talking about the draft by law I can do that so I mean once the questions have been answered and you know so let's look at this if there's already a draft by law let's

091let's have it up on screen and let's look at it yeah I was picking out things that are points that I thought we needed to delve more into all right so then we're we're going along a path that you wanna you've been wanting to go on is that right Margie I feel like we're trying to answer any answers tonight but as I said I have to digest all of those okay yeah I I I'll just make one point okay last last comment and then we're gonna yeah yeah so so I think our understanding was when we met the very first time that that the entirety of the bylaw as it was written was a little complex so I think we had we I thought we had agreed that we'd pull out the pieces where we

092had the biggest questions one of which was for example the subdivision thing and and present those in smaller bite-sized chunks to you guys um but but to the points that have been made today I think we we certainly can um try and incorporate to our best ability right uh the the the feedback that we've heard today and then then share with you what we think uh a proper version of the bylaw is and and then then I'd really like the planning board to really take that thing apart and you know reassemble it in in the manner that Anna suggested so I think we can probably work there yeah I think it's just taking can I add no please just one thought because I I think that's the next step to get clarity kind of more

093concise uh the objective clarified and looking at the buy low as as the committee the the sustainability committee reviews it it's great but it would be great to still start the next discussion with a brief outline of the recommendation of the intent and then we'll see if there by law is meeting that intent but let's make sure that we all have the intent big picture we are going to attack this and this by law does it and then then we all can have our thing up much actually faster discussion to get yeah to where we want to go I agree so and we look forward to the next step thank you okay thank you okay so next on our agenda next our agenda is the continuing continuation of the public hearing for 9 to 49

094Homer Avenue site plan and special permit application um continued all the way back in from all the way back in spring on May 11th so Peter can you give us an update about what has happened since May 11th and where are we now with this project so A lot's been going on um and that's going to kind of overview is that number first I want to introduce um the application team here on screen first Terry Morris attorney Terry Morris um Ron bork and then also Rick Salvo who just popped up on screen so a couple notes um and and just to give to your package um there was a memorandum regarding tech review meeting so because we haven't you know kind of gone through this process in a while um myself and Attorney Morris decided

095that would be best for the for the project in the town to have a new to have an additional tech review meeting one of the items that were really kind of outstanding was accessed by the fire department in safety and uh and that really got to a point and and I'm gonna let the applicant kind of speak to this is kind of gets to the point of why we have a revised site plan which proposes the access around the entire building um and that was really due to the fire department um secondly I want to make a note that the town and all planning board members and the applicant was shared all comments and emails that came back and number this includes comments from the police department regarding the access the fire department regarding the

096access conservation regarding the tree plantings DPW regarding the Civil some civil matters and then I believe we got a um well I'm sorry that was DPW and then second I want to make note that gcg did provide a response it was dated September 11th uh today I did receive a response from gcg's comments from Mr Rick Salvo I did Point those out and put them in your pocket and that included a site plan which I believe is printed out and put in your packet but these all kind of actually the one that was printed out and put in your packet was the 20th and I believe Rick may have updated so he's been working really hard the application team has been working hard to take into account Mike Carter from gcg's comments to change the

097site plan to make sure it's safe from access standpoint and then also working with the town committees not committees excuse me town departments to review this project so um without further Ado I just want to hand it over to the applicant and they can kind of run through all the changes that were made and tell us where we are at this point the microphone is yours Mr Attorney Morris uh gosh thank you Mr Magic are you uh you uh took a great deal of my uh my opening with your summary of what's happened since uh since the last meeting uh quite accurately so um I would uh point out one thing and there was uh one of the questions that was posed at the last meeting was the question about whether there was some need

098for it was actually first identified in the gcg report and that was the existing building at with a street address of 9 to 15 Homer uh being situated on the same site and being a non-conforming status as to uh parking and setbacks and other things I think uh it's my understanding that Mr Magic had a discussion with Town Council and it was determined that we would need to provide parking for for those uses and so I set about uh surveying our team and and the owner as well uh about what the requirements might be for that block if in fact it were built today um there are actually three existing businesses active at that site the first is the pizza mine in New York Deli where the street address of of nine Homer uh the

099second is Chris's Barber Shop which has the street address of 11 Homer and lastly the sheer perfection hair salon the street address of 15 Homer those three businesses actually are subject to placing requirements based on different standards the pizza shop is requires one space for every four seats in checking with the uh with the town it's been determined that the town granted the pizza shop a license for 36 seats which based on that ratio of one to four would require nine parking spaces the two properties adjacent at the hair salon and the barbershop based on square footage each of those units has 300 square feet of leasable space which is the measure set forth in the tone zoning bylaw for parking and based on those calculations two spaces would be required for each of those

100those units for a total of 13 spaces being required but because the um that block is located within the Ashland downtown district it is subject to that provision in the ordinance which provides for a reduction in parking based upon a formula of 75 percent of 75 percent and um taking it multiplying the 13 spaces would reduce the parking requirement to eight spaces for those three storefronts uh today we propose to provide that parking uh fortunately the uh the petition in this matter also owns the property at 20 Homer the former train station across the street which is conveniently located within 300 feet of the site and therefore qualifies for provision uh in section five of the ordinance that allows for parking to be located off-site um from the site it serves so then we set

101about determining what the parking requirements would be for the businesses located within that building there is one tenant and that is an accountant's office who occupies the whole the entire building which comprises 1920 square feet again based on the formula required of 180 requiring one space for every 180 square feet of leasable space that would translate into requirement of 11 spaces for that use um the total parking are located on the train site as one might accept when it was used at an active station and would require parking for patrons taking the train there are 24 spaces located on that site since the current business only requires 11 of those spaces that leaves 13 spaces available for other use we propose to satisfy and meet the requirement for the 9 to 15 block by providing

102parking uh on that location directly across the street and as fate would have it it in fact two of the businesses already rent spaces at that location so I just wanted to clarify that was the one point that was also dealt with in the intervening time from my last meeting with that I would like to uh your with your permission Madam chair uh be able to share the screen with uh with uh Rick Salvo our engineer so he might explain how we have addressed the other significant problem or challenge I would say for the site and that was access to an egress from the site given that the sight line there was a sight line distance problem that was brought up again in the gcg report about having vehicles enter exit the site excuse me

103um from onto Homer Ave from the proposed location that we had so we dealt with that as well I think to set the stage for uh for that describing that situation I would remind the members that there currently is a strip uh commercial Mall a strip commercial Mall located at that site which when uh when we get to that presentation about the I'll show you a photograph of that that has largely unrestricted parking of cars and the exiting of cars onto Homer Avenue at that that site so we proposed the situation that we proposed to deal with our expect anticipated reuse of the site is also basically going to eliminate a a a current situation that has existed there for some time so without further Ado I will turn the microphone and Screen over to

104uh Rick Salvo thank you very much thank you Terry and good evening Madam chairman members of the board for the record Rick Salvo with engineering Alliance um you might recall the the prior site plan had a full access um driveway in this location which is very similar location um as one of the existing curb cuts for the strip mall this was all 90 degree parking everything came in here parked in this field went down the ramp into the lower level garage and we had a combination of a walkway and a reinforced lawn to provide emergency vehicle access since there were really was no emergency vehicle turnaround there so emergency vehicles could Traverse through the site and be able to get out onto Alden Street and that you know posed a lot of questions from the

105fire department you know what happens during the winter months to that particular area if it's not a roadway will it be plowed regularly will it be made clear will it will it keep the same width all the time and then on top of that is the existing site distance issue this is the approximate existing driveway location and this curve right here creates a sight distance issue for folks exiting and people coming around the corner from Main Street this probably shows a little bit better this is the 9 to 11 um Homer Ave building this is the existing curb cut that Services the strip mall as you can see today there's very limited sight distance coming around that corner which which you know was concerning to um folks in the on the staff level relative to

106um Public Safety so it became evidence that the right solution was to change the circulation so it would be one way in angle the park into allow for one-way circulation which allows us to narrow up this this um driveway with a little bit create a little bit more green space along the edges and create an actual road that will exist throughout the year be cleared throughout the year and provide an Avenue that if a fire engine or an ambulance ever need to pull in here they could pull in and drive straight through the site and back out onto Alden Street um that is the configuration that you see before you we've striped we kept this the same width is two-way um so we could have a little uh area here where the Amazon truck ride

107shares can pick up um drop off without impeding anybody's ability to be able to pull in drive through the site so the access now comes in off of Homer accesses the the surface parking lot in this area goes down this way into the ramp into the low level garage and folks coming out would come out through this uh exit roadway in back onto Alden Street so that kind of solved two problems like I said it gave the emergency vehicle access throughout the year unimpeded by weather and eliminated the exit lack of sight distance coming around Homer Avenue beyond that um storm water is treated in very similar fashion as it was before almost identical it would be would be infiltrating the roof the entire roof of the building taking all that out of the equation

108and capturing the parking lot flow as well and the Deep sump What A Catch Basin that goes into a water quality Inlet and then would connect to this subsurface Drainage Field we're also proposing there's a there's an issue right here on the roadway where the water now currently comes down into into the site as there's a high point in this gutter line so we'll be adjusting the catch Basin over here repaving this section of road so we can correct that that problem that exists on Homer Avenue all the utility connections will be made on Homer Avenue and the drainage was completely recalculated to match on this current condition that was reviewed by gcg they did make some comments we addressed their comments and and we're awaiting their their review of our revised submittal at this

109point um I think now I'll probably turn it over to Terry and have him just run through the architectural side and then obviously I'm sorry not around Terry Ron and then we'll be available for questions afterwards sorry Ron and I think you muted to run uh good evening everyone uh can you see uh my screen okay it'll be an image yes it looks it's uh on screen and we can see it okay great um so this is uh an updated plan and updated site plan based on on Rick's uh Rick's work um we had some early discussions about the different types of finishes on the building and um you know how we could now sort of like use those to identify some of the massing and establish a vocabulary uh so this represents um the

110the what I what I chose is the as the final rendition for the finishes and I'll explain them in in later slides and and how they all tie together but as you can see we're looking at a variety of materials um the upper levels would have a shingle style everything would be composite of a shingle style look to it um very New England and the second floors would have a four inch clever and the lower levels uh the retail levels would be identified by the uh by the storefronts and the dental moldings and the trims uh so this these are older slides so I'll just pass by them but it does show the the site uh composite with what's existing the shadow studies we've looked at before and the context drawing for neighborhood context I've

111updated to show this uh latest rendition of the building and how it applies another view of the corner um this building data sheet we've seen the one change that has been made is that we have several one bedroom units so I just identified those and um updated the the count we still have the 25 residential units uh in the basement one of the comments from from the uh peer reviewer was to indicate qualm locations which I've done here the engineering will follow um I'm confident in doing some preliminary engineering here that we can make these column locations work uh they're outside of the drive areas and they're there are several which are located in as you see in many parking garages between the spaces so this has been indicated as they requested also they requested

112a section through the ramp this section is blowing up to twice the scale of the plans just so you can see the dimensions so essentially it's a very common speed ramp they call it where you have really three different slopes so you don't bottom out the vehicle when you exit or enter and these Dimensions work with the standard ramp dimensions on the first level the first floor plan some of the issues that we had discussed earlier was um the treatment of the um the entries along Homer Ave and I do have an enlarged plan that will show that a little more clearly I did keep the pocket product I wasn't clear it wasn't clear to me in the comments whether the pocket park was necessary or not I know that in our in our group

113we had a an early discussion about trying to just sort of speak to the train station and I went in that direction and I think successfully um to try to tie the two together but respect the train station and then in a subsequent conversation with the designer view committee they were saying we really don't need the pocket part so I've kept it in place it's it's totally one way or the other I just didn't want to remove it if it was something that we we had discussed really keeping um layout of the second floor again we have the green roof on the on the second level which serves as a community Gathering spaces for the residents this access from inside the building as well as a Stairway uh leading down to grade third level uh

114roof level one of the the issue we discussed with solar and as you can see I've indicated here by dotted lines potential locations on the south facing um roof lines for solar this is this is my initial guess we have a an engineer who helps us with solar I'm sure he will come up with a plan that will have many more panels particularly along this area here but what I've shown here is I think a pretty good um representation of where most of that solar would be I think it came out to about 40 45 panels so we should be able to provide a good amount of electricity with that the elevations I've chose to go to the rendered elevations to give a little more context This Is A View From the corner of Walden

115Street and Homer Ave and as you can see we we kind of established um zones and various datum lines the most significant one being the Cornish line from between the first and the second floor and then we get into a change of materials on the second level and a change of materials on the third level while we maintain the balance in the elevations themselves we do have some brick inset panels that we'll be able to see along here the lighter panels so we do have a you know blending of materials um in a very organized fashion and they do create interest along these elevations we've also lightened the material so on the on the bay on the uh The Gables themselves there'll be a four inch uh collaborate pattern on the insets back there'll be

116a six inch collaborate pattern of a slightly different tone so it does create a little bit of depth in it this is the view along the back side the access road which will now become a basically the second means of egress off the site uh this would be a view that you really wouldn't see because of the uh the the adjacent building that brick building the pizza and and uh and hair salons but it does give you an indication how the building bends back and changes the material so this um this gets in a little more descriptive so you know we'll have the asphalt shingle roofing the six inch Composites will be on the second levels of the insets back the four inch composite collaborate style will be on the cable pens themselves or the

117you know the Gable protrusions uh we'll have a shingle style siding again composite on the upper levels uh blowy glazing energy efficient instruction and impediments with the dentals and recesses and in the insets we'll have a brick pattern so we've essentially established the major and the minor but we've we've maintained a horizontal to help as an organizing element Ryan I think it's important to point out that um although your elevations show a uniform color pattern of gray and light gray that the uh that we're still looking to establish a color scheme that would differentiate certain sections of the building right um I'll turn over the Landscaping to Julian and he can describe some of the uh some of the moves he's made based on on the previous discussions so Julian if you could pick it

118up I'll take care of the screen yep thank you Ron good evening everybody my name is Julian salvucci I'm the designer for this project the landscape designer for this project um and I'm going to give you a quick overview of this planting plant um so just to preface this um When selecting plants for this plan native plant species were kept in mind and plants trees shrubs perennials that tolerate drought once established or also kept in mind as well so we're going to start up top by Homer Avenue and the planting plan that abuts the sidewalk and the front facade of this development from large to small we have dwarf River birches but two lenagra little Kings we have hydrangea corsifolia ruby slippers and we have Alex kranatus Sky pencils then for perennials from Back to

119Front we have chasmathium latifolium geranium maculatum carrots abicons and then a nepita little tree um so basically we have our trees up front the batula nigras they get to be about 12 feet tall and maturity by 12 feet wide they're going to be modestly sized they're going to be they're definitely suited for the space the ilex kernel the sky pencils are just dappled along the front facade of this building and it kind of just accentuates the architecture of the building and separates certain areas and then for seasonal interest we have our perennials the northern Sea Oats the geraniums the The carrick's Advocates as well um what's it called most of the plants selected are native up front with the exceptions of the ilex Granada Sky pencils we have a couple of natovars which are just

120cultivars of native species an example of that would be the hydrangea or Folia Ruby Slipper this is just a dwarf Oak Leaf hydrangea uh just because these straight species hydrangeas get to be about eight to ten feet taller maturity we don't want that up front um moving around the left hand side and into the entrance of the parking area um by the I believe pizza restaurants over on the left hand side we have a mixture of panica Virginia Adams shenandoahs which is a native switchgrass and then a non-native taxis media hm Eddie hedge and I selected these just to have a seamless green wall and have a year-round separation between the seating area and the entrance the parking area just because that's going to be heavily used heavily trafficked there's a lot of cars entering

121from that area I'm continuing around to the back of the parking area we have a couple of pinus strobus vestigatas they are just a upright White Pine and then we also have a mass plantings of I believe these are a kind of yes collateralmophobia it would be spices the idea with these is they're just going to separate the parking area from the white fence and the idea is that you know they're going to be no larger than six feet in diameter at maturity and if they're let to naturalize this area it's going to turn into a nice fragrant fragrant Thicket they're going to be blooming in the summer it's going to smell fabulous back there um wrapping around further we have another upright White Pine the highness Service as well as a couple of grow

122low sumacs um continuing around the back you have a set of one two three four five upright Acer saturum sugar Maples um as well as for a ground cover in this area we have a low growing Clover grass and Wildflower seed mix um towards the end of the driveway of the street by uh where it connects to all this street we have one cersus canadensis um I have a small planting schedule on the bottom left everything is color quote coded so it's easy to see and I believe there is another page separate to this that shows photographs of the plants that I mentioned here we go thank you Ron um that is it for the ground floor planting plan um Ron could you move it to the green roof I can elaborate on that or

123talk more about okay yep like I said with the pocket park um just a bunch of panic in Virginia a m shenandoah's hm Eddies um and other plants two that mirror the planting plant that's along the front of this development by Homer Ave um moving over moving over to the green roof so what you're seeing right now you're seeing cortense steel Planters they're 18 inches tall and they're going to have a herb seed and an herb Sedum and green roof seed blend in them um these 18 inch tall Core 10 steel Planters kind of give the framework for some pretty cool little pockets of space where people residents can't set out some outdoor furniture sit relax enjoy the open air of this green roof so we have one two and three areas for residents to

124sit and enjoy themselves outside um one change from the last iteration of this plan was a switch from artificial turf to natural grass um and there is also in-ground LED strip lighting along the perimeters of the seating areas that will illuminate um the quartet and steel Planters and just light the area up at nights um we've decided to go with a TECO block Borealis patio slabs um they have sort of a wood texture to them if they look nice up there and yeah that's it for the green roof um thank you Ron thank you so this is just a rendered version of the uh of the Shadow study which we presented earlier some details of the green roof and and how we could deal with the um the areas adjacent to the uh what is

125now the the roadway these are several images of the um of the second floor Terrace give you a sense of the space and then we start to look at some some aerial views of the overall development and you can see you can see the indication here for the solar panels uh one of my goals was to show them on locations where they would not be evident um to the you know to the main streets of Alvin and Homer Ave so you can see on the lower left hand image that um were really tucked back um will be very you know non-obtrusive and I suspect that we'll actually be able to add a few more along here and potentially here once they do their calculations this is a large plan of the entries along Homer Ave

126and some of the paving patterns and essentially I would be looking at several different types of Paving one to help transition from the sidewalk into the space along this curved Edge just uh and then just I'm sorry Ron just in the interest of time I want to make sure that you understand that most of a lot of these choices will be going through the design review committee so I want to make sure we have time to talk about the bigger question so if you guys kind of keep it and keep it to like the bigger the bigger issues and we can kind of see what you're doing but we don't need to go through everything on the slides all right very good all right so then start the service just to uh put you in

127in the space itself and that's the end of my presentation thank you so the big issue is I think we have to do obviously the big discussion point is the change in the circulation right that's um obviously it's gone through the tech review and I think that's the first thing that we should that's the big change here and that's the first thing I think we should address as a board is is that is that change and how we feel about that change I think Anna's still with us online right okay yeah I'm still here okay just so we know that you're still there yeah yeah I'm so I'm still here participating I guess I'll uh that obviously there's a lot of new materials of which um would just came in today so you know there's

128a lot of new information it's hard to kind of react to it on the spot like that and we're gonna need you know as a board to understand what what are the unknowns now that we have all this new material yeah I mean I think um I think this is the direction and I I it really sounds like it really came out of the fire to the the needs of the fire department and I think this has been kind of almost coming the entire time that this site just did not work going in it could work I said it could work but there are some downsides to going in going out in the same position so I feel like this is like yep okay we got here we tried everything else and it didn't it

129didn't really pan out or the the fire department the police department you know we're not comfortable with it which obviously we take very seriously so um so I'm I'm not really surprised to see it worked out in this way um uh just a general this is still an all-electric building right a question to the applicant it's all in an all-electric building yes and is it doing ground Source heat pumps are you looking at air source heat pumps what are you looking at for the I'm just I'm just wondering if it's ground Source heat pumps are they like going in the same locations as the the groundwater infiltrations I show them on the road yeah show them on the roof holy air source they're all air source yes okay yes any questions I do have a

130few but okay of course um so I feel like there's a lot of changes and I agree with Trish you probably like that's not a surprise on that one where we stand is like a lot lot like I brought from the last time we saw them that um you and Trish had marked up like sending it back to design review I actually thought it was back to design I didn't realize it still had to go so that's a little I felt the same disappointing but it's it is what it is but there's so the yellow is design review the red square or something open with planning board that's before all of this we got something dated the 27th there's a lot lot to do here I I yeah I mean Peter do you want to

131talk about this yeah I can talk about that so just to make it clarification point I think there was a edit that needed to be made on the bylaw the last time we heard this was actually August 10th and Tricia and Marcella did go over and create a design review that did go to the applicant the applicant received all the information the applicant after that meeting with scheduled good design review and design review and it actually and I think I believe there's a continuance and then design room to get all the ducks in a row to go back to design review design review was scheduled to meet last week last Thursday it's the same Thursday as a comp plan however um just out of uh uh the scheduling the design Review Committee did not have

132a quorum so did they did not meet and so they could not hear this application and to still discuss the memo that came out of that August 10th meeting so therefore with all the changes after the tech review meeting I thought it was appropriate to bring it back to the planning board to make sure this still moved along at a at a at a steady Pace rather than waiting to go to the design review committee so this application team is scheduled to meet with the design Review Committee next Thursday night at their annual meeting and design Review Committee is going to receive the same information that you see obviously today and so therefore it is going to go back to design review it just hasn't yet first summertime there's some things going on I believe

133everyone was you know finishing up their summer vacations last that week obviously there wasn't a quorum on the design review committee so I I know there could have been a little bit of confusion with that and and I could have spelled it a little bit better but that's the story behind why we are seeing this again without design review having their input so I think that I mean that's good news we said we're back they presumably maybe we have to remind because that was a while that the status of the the memo the nutrition I put together was yes after that no this is that this is that marked it says you put in green yes yes so that's still the memo in front of the place this is where it stands and we would

134be expecting from them correct their resolves closed just like you get that's I think we agreed but I just maybe we remind them because there's a lot there's also quite a few things open with planning board though actually there's not that I think we we were able to um to filter quite a few uh items for the center review we tried to actually do the opposite try to to clarify and make it a little more concise um so yeah so I I I I thought that that building had taken place but I guess it makes sense no there was there was a con there was a couple conflicts and then obviously that meeting did not take place last week yeah and that's fine and so with the changes most most significantly to the access um

135which was really agree you know driven by fire police um access to and around the building um with the change of the circulation post I counted 11 of my marks some of them may be small I just literally said it's an open with the planning board if we can look at these they may be closed to close this one memo right there's many memos right in in open issues so we may be able to close this or get that down to less issues or they may have to change again I get it but um otherwise we I just have so many open things right now yeah no I agree that so there's the document that Marcelo and I put together that has many of those issues that are still going to wait for the design

136Review Committee right so a lot of things that were talked about with landscape and with the colors and with the textures the pocket park you know that's all that's all back in their Court I don't have I don't have that copy in front um but I do so I I mean if we can't do it tonight it's fine I'm just trying to be helpful to try to close some issues this had issues open to be left with the planning board yeah no agreed it did and so but that that's not in our packet so the rest of us don't have it in front of it you brought it along because you were thinking ahead but the rest of us don't have it I mean okay can you can you look at well I can go

137so one of them like the setback and we should I mean we were when this was first presented it was saying it met all set box and then we found out it actually didn't and I think that's a big one well so this so that document also went to the applicant yeah and I haven't received anything back from that right so um so obviously that they were busy with this other large change but so in that document the things that are simply answerable like hey you need to check this setback those are things that should be responded to so they were they they were so but oh so this whole thing the ones that said planning board you were asking for another round from the applicant as well I didn't understand that well okay not

138necessarily I'm not saying I'm saying on that question so that question right show us that you've met the setback we're set or set it back we don't need to discuss whether it's a setback or not the setbacks given and they should accommodate it and there was a good number of those that that basically we're trying to to discern what belongs in the design Review Committee and the planning board but some of the items in the planning board were given obviously it has to comply so that's System complete you part of the plan board but we don't need to discuss it because it's by default there's a few items like that we have to go through it yeah so Peter's trying to bring that document up no I I do have some some other questions please

139do that just um and I know this is going to go to to the same review but just just been a greedy architect I just no I have I have a few of those too but I'll let you so so the first one I mean going in reverse order of what we heard in terms of the landscape um I mean I I think it seems very appropriate I actually like the idea of keeping the pocket park kind of uh concealing a little bit of that that cheek wall on on the building that's going to be left over and I'm glad that there's a little more a little extra planting by moving the parking uh in a different way um on the perimeter I think is going to be better for the neighbor as well um

140in terms of the of the architecture there's a a few things the project in general I don't have that really objections to it um there's there's only three things that I could um that I could comment um on first I mean I've never been a a great fan of the dental molding on this project and I think for for the the project seems very well developed I think as simply a little simpler um banding would be better but that's just my my opinion um in terms of the color differentiation I I would like to also we talked about this a few times ago I would like to to to just urge you to not try to to go too crazy with color differentiation this project is not a very large project I actually think what's

141being presented is it's very appropriate for downtown I kind of like it I don't think it needs a lot I mean the break is color differentiation the different siding the clapboard thickness uh differentiate so I don't think you have to go crazy in changing colors of different pieces and lastly the solar I I I'm glad he's been thought about on the on on the back the problem I have with solar in general when it's applied to roofs that are not consistently contiguous is that it can become what you see in some houses that it's it's a haphazard array of panels that look like hung on a building and not part of the building I think solo should always be a holistic part of the project if the roof doesn't really this roof is is not

142asking for it in terms of its geometry in my opinion and that can look very messy when it's done with every piece panels Go in different directions I personally am not a big fan of that but of course that you know it's you something to to to consider if the if the proponent is going to go ahead with it and lastly on the side I I wanted to ask the engineer the the one of the other things that is new in in addition to the circulation the circulation seems to make sense to me that that extra pavement on uh Homer Avenue because of the height issue that the engineer highlighted that that that is okay but it's also um some utility work in front of the of the driveway that's going to go and and

143dig the street and and install those structures and um it's not clear to me where the downtown Paving stops relative to this corner but then I'm just wondering so we're going to have a a very nice downtown and end up project at some point then a batch uh trenched repairs for for utilities and then a new Paving next it would be great if if the the the the the the aesthetic of a new downtown Road would not be disrupted and would be brought up to where now it's being proposed to save again so the entire Frontage of the site would look as part of the downtown but that's a concern so you're saying to get the whole entire Frontage of the site from from Curb to curb have a new wearing course well if if

144I could make that decision yes the answer is yes I'm just I don't know in this drawing where is the end of the the Terminus up there so it so of the problem I can tell you the end of the project is before so you are correct there will be a break of I don't know 100 yards of old asphalt so it would be the break break point I mean downtown project break point old asphalt and then it would be new asphalt down here closer to Alden Street so I'm just trying I'm just bring it to everybody's attention that that the end of the project of downtown is going to look completely chopped off right where it's very visible yeah and it's it would be very unfortunate to have to end up on that note

145I agree with you at the very minimum correct you know move the end of the downtown I mean see a new wearing course put it along the frontage of it well that can only happen after this project this infrastructure has been installed that's right that's correct maybe a manhole who knows whatever is needed yeah um I don't know what the mechanism would be but I'm just it would be painful to see that okay I would ask does the applicant have a response to that comment I don't think we're prepared to do that right now that's pretty big expense to say curb to curb for the entire Lake Frontage but we heard what you're saying we'll have to evaluate it okay Peter's got that printed and is bringing it our document Okay so um my other

146comment just says as far as like I said I want this good design Review Committee they haven't even seen it yet and these are things that are in their court but I was wondering why the the back side there's one facade of the building that has no color it's it's staying white and I'm wondering is like you know why would that be why would yeah so it seems just kind of be it's kind of that typical back side of the building that doesn't get any love so are we good it can certainly treat the the lower level in a different um yeah I think it's mostly about color I'm not sure or maybe it's just not showing up you said I think that there was another color but it maybe it's really hard to see

147on these renderings so on the front you kind of get these rich Grays and the brick and I don't think the brick needs to go all around to the back but there's I don't know somehow that that one facade seems to at least it's not showing up in the renderings whatever the intention was for that facade yep okay well you know Point Jake um staying on that facade the trees that are shown along that is that the same diameter as what's shown on the landscape plan it looked like there were larger trees along that side and I wondered if that overhang of those trees per the landscape drawings past your fire truck path yep uh Julie can you comment on that yeah the Acer saturum Reba the the narrow sugar Maples those get to be

148about 15 to 20 feet wide at maturity but they retain that upright vestigian form so does that driveway um yeah yeah where's a good photograph of that um because of their upright nature potentially in the future when these trees meet maturity they may need to be pruned by a skilled arborist and maybe limb them up slightly but I think that would be far in the future I think um I think for the most part these will not get in the way of the of the uh the need for a fire truck to get by there you're welcome all right unless I'm unless I'm mistaking the list that we have that that Marcelo and I put together the things that actually um involve planning board really are all planning board almost all things that are planning

149but are reviewing with gcg it's just as an environmental impact study you know um um traffic concern um meeting Ada bylaws all the things that are reviewed with gcg um so so we will be obviously looking looking at what they say about those issues I think the only things actually remaining um on those can I ask a question about that so has the things from here transfer that said planning board with gcg have they has has that been communicated to gcg I don't know has this has this sheet been given to gcg I'll double check it was more than a month ago but I'll make sure that it is because I haven't seen like an again we got one tonight that I'm not looking at at this meeting yeah before that I don't I think

150there was some overlap but I'm not sure these issues and I I'm just trying to get this all organized because we have like all these floating things between the the emails from departments between this between the ongoing gcg back and forth that there's a lot and we should try to put it all in one place yeah it would be good to see if gcg already covered the questions that we had like some of them they surely almost in its entirety I'm sorry for the nature of these comments I think they will be covered by the review um yeah and if there's not something specific obviously we should not confirm yeah we should note that I can I'll confirm but yes I think the things that um are not related to gcg are on page uh

151at the bottom page 17 of 19. um one of those is um that um the design Review Committee was wondering about the easternmost commercial space having an entrance door off of Homer so um it says commercial space update and stair relocated due to parking radii below I don't know if that's still the case is it is it perhaps the stairway that's right on the street edge of Homer oh sorry now the street edge of Alden Alden I believe the comment was that the way that these spaces have been identified which are totally are we don't know who's going to be the tenant and how this the uh eventually allocated was that to have a door off of all been in a door for Palmer in the same unit so for example this wall moved to

152here then this wall would have to disappear so that this space would have access I believe that's what that comment was about but as I said we have no idea who the tenant's going to be at this point right because it looks like you have a door so maybe that was already accommodated looks like there is a door to Homer unless depending on how the is that door intended to be our retail entry point or just a convenience entry to this space retail entry points Ryan so I'm sure that all the elevation oh I see so there they they were just asking on that that on that commercial space right there they have one door that's going out onto Alden instead of Homer and their question was should that commercial space have a door on

153Homer right and um I believe our discussion went as I just mentioned that I've indicated how this space could be separated but that's that's the way it's going to separate depends on who the tenants are so for example if this wall would have come over here then then this tenant would have an access from both locations that would require that this this wall would not exist and then this would be the space for this time so it's all in how the spaces are allocated depending on who the tenants are pretty penny view on that from commercial interior point of view no I think what he's getting at makes sense it depends on that division definitely because the square footage increases you may need to exit um and it feels like he's on the right track

154for now so really it's a the applicant's risk about the where they put the doors and if that'll be suitable for tenants if the tenants will like it so yeah what's that okay yes I appreciate your attention to that um okay so I think the job oh I guess Anna may be there maybe she doesn't have an opinion on that yeah no I'm yes I had a couple of questions I'll just kind of list them all so it's easier for the applicant to answer um one question was uh just to kind of get an understanding of there was a mention of the green roof for residents which have kind of a light um on the roof um you know I have friends who lives in Boston beautiful buildings that have rooftop lights and it's a

155very striking thing in a more urban setting so I just want to make sure I understand how that fit within Ashley which is a little bit quieter and at night you know you can sometimes still see stars and the light pollution I think is a concern at least for me in the National resident I think Urban neighboring communities like creating this so when you're kind of Imagining the social green Group which sounds lovely uh we'll have more in an urban setting can you just describe a little bit of what your you know what you're seeing as far as like is this an all-night access point for your for your residence is it you know very well lit so you know late at night more vibrant environment or is this still kind of a quieter what

156does this look like like I'm having trouble understanding what this building will how it will change the energy of the downtown that's question one and then question two is um a little bit more about the parking situation you know with the retail space down downstairs if you will how you did the analysis uh of parking spaces and how you're envisioning you know where where was the commercial visitors Hearth and what would that look like relative to the traffic if you will of this building um and I guess we'll just start with those two things thank you um sure so I'll start with the the first question about the green roof lighting so um Julian um if you could jump in and just explain what your concept was on this this pathway lighting it's it's a

157very subdued lighting that really accentuates the edges um rather than a restaurant yeah that's that's really all it is it's a very subtle lighting that's going to be going along the perimeter of these seating areas on this group um it's it's not going to be overbearing at all it's going to be very dull in the background sort of it's just to keep people from bumping into the core 10 steel Planters um after dark right so the majority of the lighting that will be in those areas will be generated from the units themselves I would think um and uh the second question about the commercial parking um we're looking more towards this surface parking being for the commercial units and the subsurface parking being for the residential and potentially uh you know like a a unit

158um worker or occupant uh at the park down there as well if necessary but the majority of that that parking along this perimeter would be for the commercial spaces the first point makes a lot of sense and that addresses my concerns and on the second point you know it's kind of interrelates this idea that I think a fellow brought up of you know could there be an extension if you will of the street Escape there's obviously we want you to be successful we want the buildings to do well and we want commercial and use of it and it's a win-win for everyone right that put up to be an impact to Ashland Street with parking Etc kind of like a common responsibility if you will where um there might be some maybe a win-win for

159you to really fix up that area that was my question in common thank you right so um Anna we had been talking about the um commercial space and the door on the easternmost part of that commercial space I think the four people here are have a consensus that the doors are good as they are is did you want to weigh on that or I'm I'm good with that I only think I'm I'm nervous to kind of have them put on it is quite a change in design not the doors but you know the movement all around the building and all that so as long as we're not conceding in the room that you know we're kind of done talking about that I think we can redesigned review and we do need further discussions I didn't

160can you oh yeah yeah the doors are fine yeah this is just one item that came back from from our review it came back to the planning board that we were going to make that call on the if a door was needed and it sounds like we're we're good we're good with the way it is so that that is closed as Kate would say and the other item that has planning board that does not have gcg is um is that the note that three units have access only from the green roof this is an app um and the applicant can stay if that's true or not um and they were concerned that this might be an egress issue and might need to be reviewed at The Building Commissioner which may not have been done yet

161um The Building Commissioner The Building Commissioner was present at the meeting wasn't he Peter last week he was Terry yes so and I didn't hear any comment from him on that I don't think there was there was any concern there well given that you're mostly talking about the egression for the fire department it might not have come up but so that would just be a that's a question we're going to ask them we can take this I'm asking Doug Scott if he has any any if there's any issues we need to be aware of with that obviously the building has to meet building code and that's first and foremost so if it meets building code then he's the building code commissioner so we will see what he says Clerk um Anna you have when I

162had a comment on that sorry do we do we know from that building there is it's in our notebooks I don't know if it went out to everybody I I don't I believe thank you I guess did that get published to the public part of this too can that or can it I know we've got to be put a date I'm happy to be posted on it you know we we finished it yeah and we can put that up yeah it has a September 26th date on it so it's just this week but it can be put online yep so those are the issues those are the issues that I saw that were besides the issues that had need gcg input that were directed back to the planning board all other issues were either resolved

163the setback needs to be resolved yeah that was the first one yes so um but the setback is not for us to resolve anything we're making a point that obviously has to it just has to meet the setback yeah so um well it has been resolved it was this corner right here so the building was pulled back slightly okay to uh to accommodate this it was just a little too close okay eight nine inches I think it was okay perfect so one more question yep um all right have we talked about affordability it's been a while since we last had a meeting so I just don't remember where we looked at as far as affordability counts I think affordability was offered at 10 percent and um so yeah we talked about this a little bit

164Peter and I did in terms of actually looking at um well when we give our report then the MBTA uh talking about affordability and so Peter did do a little study on that um and um yeah I know I I guess you know what's the question on it we've they're offering 10 you're asking what else can you do yeah I'm asking is the applicant willing to offer more um than obviously the 25s is ideal um is the applicator willing to to go for that 25 um if I might respond to that Madam chair please I have practiced in a number of jurisdictions um in more urban settings where um this issue is uh obviously at the Forefront of things but every one of those communities operates with an ordinance or bylaw that requires a certain

165percentage this percentages vary depending on the communities the idea but Ashland does not have such an ordinance we offered the three units even though we didn't have to do so 25 I'm sorry I had to take a deep breath when 25 was offered because in no Community do I know that has gone uh over 20 and I don't think there's anybody that's too too many to approach 20. Newton where I live has a tiered structure depending on how many units you're providing between in either 15 or 17 and a half but that's that has a level of affordability attached to it meaning you can rent you can rent or sell certain units at 110 percent of of Ami versus 65 percent of Ami depending upon how many numbers you're doing um we are the owner

166and I and um and Mr Salvador involved in a project in Framingham where Framingham has a 13 requirement um and they have in order to encourage people to give more they are exploring the idea of us taking a community preservation funds and setting up um a fund to subsidize more more affordable units within these projects so um Ashland Ashland doesn't isn't isn't set up to do that and so to ask us to go to to increase it there's a lot of things you're right that we put on the table we're now talking about perhaps repaving the whole front edge along Homer Avenue from Curb to curb um all of these things have to be evaluated I guess so I'm not going to say yeah absolutely oh no and and please don't misunderstand my question okay

167say hey we must have it I I simply asked if you were willing and and your answer is actually very educational at least for me as a planning board member affordability is something that we've been discussing here in the planning board but also with the select boards and the importance is exploring uh the possibility of this kind of affordability and so your your thoughts are actually extremely helpful for me as a planning award member because it educates me as to what to use um what you have thought about what kinds of Community standards requirements have been helpful to use as a developer and although Ashland may not be prepared for that kind of discussion today on this project you just educated me quite a bit and offered some helpful contrast if you will as to

168where we all reverse with other communities the question of how to discuss affordability something you can imagine it's coming up a lot and this specific board has started to think about using CBC funding for affordability which we could do here just like Framingham yes I don't think is is off the table and we as a planning board might want to yeah so I think I think that's we need to address that at another meeting where the planning board specifically talks about and it's not just our call right but about how use of those funds can be used or how we could work with CPC to you know to make those choices about how those funds might be used so but I do think it's a you have to throw out these kind of things about

169you know could affordability um be raised could uh could we get that sidewalk right and then now you're making choices okay you can do one or the other which one is it right and there's a fist fight amongst the planning board to decide which uh which which you get um so to throw these things into the mix um I think for now I think for now I'm looking for just a general consensus I guess that the approach that we're doing the CH the main change to this plan is the change in the roadway and yes there's lots of little things that probably had to shift a little bit to make that happen but that is the primary result coming out of the technical review to me that seems like a no-brainer for safety and traffic

170and the fact that we lose maybe a little pocket park on that side it's really fine I think I'm fine with the greenery I'm not sure what who would be sitting there anyway um in that so I'm I I think it's a good move in favor of safety and I'm wanting to know are we in general consensus with that that is good they can move on I agree completely my question is this gcg reports has a lot of comments on parking and parking spaces parking dimensions I know Ron you shared that slide but we didn't get into the details of all that you mentioned that you added columns for the gcg recommendation but did that affect parking spot sizes where the counts affected in any way it looks like with the retail space there's some

171discrepancy in the dimensions and counts is that all getting resolved is that something we should revisit to make sure yes so the gcg letter went out September 12th yeah right and the response right was something we received today correct the response was received today and just to make note gcg Mike Carter uh he was actually present at that tech review meeting and so he's been able to meet in person with the application team so I think yes there was a lot about parking and x y and z um but I go I think since then obviously this new plan has been submitted taken into account and this has been sent back to to gcg so in some instances you know yes this is appropriate to look at gcg's letter but I think in time I

172think this was done gcsg's letter was completed over on a previous plan so I think it makes sense just to hold back let gcg take a look at the new plan they were present at the meeting they were on board with the change to the circulation and um and and let wait and see the response the next response letter from gcg so there is a one more review correct there's an ongoing review going on right now uh that would pre that would make this past tense okay it also talks about missing landscape plans which talks about storage snow storage and all that fun stuff so and on the new plan everything has been updated and to number one the new plan is updated in response to this letter number two uh it's updated that the

173plans are updated with this new circulation which was you know driven by the fire department thank you so I do have a question so there were zero concerns about traffic with this new not talking on this I'm talking traffic site lines all that I I didn't get any sense of that and it's we'll wait I can wait for the report but I'm just curious like could this magically fix everything well I think number one there was two issues with the old plan I can speak to this and and the application can speak to this too number one the fire department never had an access way out right and talking to the fire department and you know Keith Roby and and deputy chief morham there was no easy way to back out onto Homer Ave right

174and so there's always going to be this this this pathway out to Alden right now the previous plan that were you going to use these honeycomb cinder blocks that were actually put into the ground and they're filled with top soil and then they're just put there's there's grass seed on top of it and so they could use that in the event however there was still this ongoing issue regarding sight lines for all vehicles exiting out onto Homer and so opening up this back for a for more permanent exit out onto Alden relieved two stresses number one it relieves the stress of the fire department and number two releases stress from a safety standpoint of vehicles coming out and taking a left and or right with very limited sight lines so the sight lines are better

175in the defense and everyone is happier correct with the sight lines exiting the site correct in an instance you can go out onto Alden Street take a left use that stop light and then take another left and go back up Homer towards the center of town and so you can use that stop light to your advantage at the gas station um you know the one item that was noted that they would like to see no parking along Homer at excuse me along Alden Street between the the you know in front of that store in front of from the curb to the entrance and that was the one that was another request you'll see you know from I believe the fire the police department but I think other than that everybody was in in strong agreement

176that this was much better plan in a much safer plan yeah so I agree with that except so I'm thinking like specifically now do we do a different traffic study it's a completely different pattern and then I do have I mean my concern is you know people complain about not enough parking now we're have to strongly consider taking away yet more parking downtown on that Homer I mean Alden so that's an issue but I but I don't know if that's really an issue okay because the the distance from the corner to to the inside you might not be able to park anyway yeah you should not park that close to the corner anyways and and the the fire apparatus needs to have Sidelines so I think that's a perfectly legitimate justification for it and I

177think there could be no I'll go walk over there I saw that yeah no I I understand I'm just saying as part of the project and our approval now we're taking away potentially taking but I agree that corner may have not really been parking but so we're introducing more traffic to a neighborhood that's a small neighborhood and I absolutely think that has to be considered and understand and and we should have a full understanding of that yeah so that's something that's not the way this was on August something when we saw this right so then so that should be something that we should note to gcg and I think we do and I think as a summary gcg reports actually says the lack of parking spaces should be further analyzed by a traffic impact study

178so that's one of the recommendations a summary for this home and this is still the 12th report but that's a summary that they have that feels like you do need a probably an updated traffic impact but this was again if they have newer plans I don't know if this will change again to the application team I did you hear the conversation here oh uh Terry you please I'd like to respond to the uh Catherine's observation about the traffic on Alden Street of course yes yes um under the previous under the current the previous plan where people were basically coming in and exiting if they were proceeding from the west and the north they would simply go out and then recruit and head and back where they came from people now will basically enter coming from

179the west and the north will come in they will go around the site and when they approach Alden Street they're not going to take a right to go down Alden Street into the neighborhood they're going to take a quick left and you can see there to short left unto Alden in return heading west on Homer Avenue from once they came so I don't think that changing the entry point of this driveway and making it one way in is going to significantly impact how much traffic is put onto Allen Street that's just an observation the other thing I would say I don't know Madam chair where we are in the process but I do I I would like some to make some summary remarks on behalf of the team if I might at some point whenever

180you're whenever you would choose to have me do so what kind of Summer remarks what oh some remarks would first of all thank the effort that you and Marcelo made to review the designing Review Committee uh two reports and try to scale them down and indicate what was resolved and what was you know still outstanding well well I appreciate that it's actually part of a process that we are internally trying to resolve on in general and your your project just was the one in front of us at the time so and that does speak to my second question really whether an observation and that is as I understand that the relationship between the design of your community the planning board is the designer group committee really functions as an advisory subcommittee to the board that's

181right it ultimate ultimately what's done is your decision that's right but the planning board does not have time to discuss the many little implications or nor do we want to that um so those things fall to the design Review Committee and we expect them to be resolved at least mostly in that context understandably the question the important word you said was resolved resolution is something that is important in the gcg report every one of those listed items says resolved resolved are still open but at the design Review Committee we may run up against uh decisions about certain elements of the project that are entirely subjective and we maybe say look we understand what you're saying but we're going this is the way we want to do it I mean there's a certain element of creative

182creative license here that's involved in each and every one of these petitions it's never expected that petitions will come and go through the process they will be certainly accommodating to to incorporate changes as we have done on the certainly the biggest one on the entry road but they may be aesthetic you know especially when you're designing a design review and it's talking about landscaping and and and forgive me my channel but dental molding on the building I would I would agree with with you about the met the potential messy look of the of the solar panels but the dental molding is entirely subjective now you know we actually I I agree with you and I I put it on that light that was just a personal opinion but not a not a demand for for

183change that so finally I would say that so we may come back to you after going design review and we may not be totally resolved as you as you have to characterize it we may have said look they they believe this we're able to accommodate that but this is what we're presented you to the board to make a decision on yes I think that I think that and the board can disagree with me I think we've discussed this before as a board that we are looking for the design Review Committee to give us their informed opinion about as professionals about about the topics that the bylaws say that they are that their committee is is supposed to be looking at but the final decision does rest with the board and so if the applicant disagrees

184with the design Review Committee the design Review Committee wants the building to be purple and you guys want it to be gray yes that decision will come before the design the planning board and we will make the final call thank you very much for that clarification appreciate it all right on that note I think we need to wrap this up for tonight we just got the gcg report that'll be going through again there's things that obviously the bringing together all of these documents as as um Kate was talking about needs to happen and now that this the tech review which I think was very important came to some resolution correct that we can hopefully go forward with those other issues the smaller issues so with the tech reviewed if I there were a lot of

185documents has a few and they are smaller but there are still some open issues and that that's what I'm trying to say can we get this yes I am I am I am not saying that anything is resolved I'm saying that the big move we agree with the tech review that this seems safer but we will let gcg and others advise us further right okay so our next meeting is on October 12th and I think it makes sense to move it to October 12th at that point hopefully the design Review Committee will have met with the application team and going back on um the DCR they've been actually sending us reports rather quickly right after the meeting so hopefully we can get something back and out to the planning board by I would say next

186Friday and or the latest next Monday which will be therefore shared with the application team and our our deadline on this project has so we have a deadline of October 15th and that was done uh that was completed through the applicant um and so obviously I think they want to get through tonight and then leading up the next meeting uh the Attorney Morris and I will work out an extension um that would suit both the applicant and the town all right so we will be hearing about that before the next meeting yes okay so that we don't go into that thinking that we have to make a correct and uh to the applicant to Mr to returning Morris do you concur that we'll we'll have an extension um leading up until the fifth to the

187to the meeting on the the 12th um from a verbal standpoint we already have I believe we our extension now goes to the 15th to the 15th exactly but you know to understanding you know that so that's for us to make a decision on the site plan and obviously there's still some outstanding issues and you're going to design review next week you know I don't know you know the planning board does like to see you know um a decision being developed and there's a couple outstanding items you know I think at the mo that the at this point we're looking to extend it you know out at a minimum to October 26th at this point you and I have always worked cooperatively to achieve the the extensions for a reasonable period I think we'll continue

188to do so that's what I was looking for Attorney Morris okay a 1949 Homer say plan special permit application until the October 12th meeting second nap and before we vote on that I just wanted to say that um I think in relation to that because I don't think the planning board would be comfortable heading into the meeting on October 12th knowing that the deadline is October 15th okay you won't have to deal with that we'll have an extension all right thank you roll call vote yeah point of order Madam chair uh yes let's finish the vote Catherine Jersey guy [Music] oh sorry Trisha Kendall I I didn't hear you Marcela so that is that is uh continued to October 12th Joel you had a point of order very quickly well very quickly uh this is

189a public hearing I had my hand raised I wasn't recognized do I have a right to be heard on this um we don't have to offer public comment at every meeting and so as we're getting close to 10 o'clock um I I opted not to take public comment but we will we'll make a note to take it on October 12th and so I ask you to return at that time and or please send an email to the planning board so on that note um it is 10 o'clock we have one more item on our agenda and I'm hoping I already did okay I texted her but maybe you can do it as well I'm hoping Yolanda will pop on briefly um to just give us a couple sentences on this um planning board representative meanwhile

190we'll go on to other things but yeah let's just wait and see if she pops on oh she's here never mind her phone number down here okay I can recognize it already up our hands raised Yolanda can you hear us yes I can hear you and now I'm unmuted sorry I'm I'm driving home from an event so thank you thank you for thank you for joining us late but at least we caught you in your car so Yolanda can you please explain what this is and what you're asking for [Applause] summative and that is one of the sub-regions of MATC or the metropolitan area planning Council and each cat each town or city that's part of the Metro West Regional collaborative is supposed to have two appointees one that represents the select board and one

191that represents the planning board since Preston Crow and it has no longer been on the planning board there's been no planning board representative and how that's an issue for the collaborative is we need a quorum of people to be able to vote on funding on our work plan and on uh bylaw changes so um I'm requesting today uh I know it's hard for some people to come to the meetings they're typically the third Thursday of the month from 8 to 9 30 a.m currently they're mostly via Zoom uh but what I'm requesting is that Alvaro your assistance planner be appointed as the planning board representative so as he's been attending the meeting since he's joined us and that way Ashton would have two people representing it and it would allow us as a collaborative to

192have discussion and to have vote uh the other plug I would give is if you as a planning board member are interested it's a great organization to be a part of I have learned so much as a select board member being part of it and it's not that big of a whip for anybody but I understand that for some people it's trying to make meetings at that time is difficult and that's my app tonight great thank you yeah and yeah and just hold hold on if you can as you drive home so the first ask would be planning board members does anyone have availability a planning board member to fill that slot it's the third Thursday of the month from 8 to 9 30 A.M um is that something a slot that any do we

193have a member of the planning board that could fill that slot um I cannot but before we like take a voter about Opera I think we should try to talk if no one else has availability I imagine most of us have interest I would love to go is um Amanda as our associate member I think we should at least check in with her unfortunately she's not at this meeting yeah I I mean here here's part of the issue I know Alvaro could go anybody can attend the meeting certainly we can make sure that people are on the distribution list and I had talked about this with Trisha the other day she's like well what if I'm interested I'm like well the idea is that you have one person who you know is your representative and

194then other people can attend we have events we have an event coming up next month that's a great Trails event so anybody can attend those events but it and we need to know sooner rather than later because as I said we've had issues trying to do some of our work because there's been no planning board representative but you will not have another meeting before October 12th is that right uh we are not having another meeting until October 26th so I mean I guess we do have some time and our next voting meeting would be November in November okay so why don't we because I think that's a fair point and Amanda couldn't be here today I don't know what her work schedule is yes so why don't we um why don't we haven't put this

195discussion earlier on our October 12th we can talk to even Amanda in advance about it um to see if someone can if that's a slot that can typically be filled by someone and if not I think Alvaro would be a great candidate to help us to help us have a voice on that committee when no one else can possibly attend is that there are many communities that it is their pla either their planner or an assistant planner or someone like that who is representing them foreign yeah I think that I think that's a fair point um so I just I think that um Kate has also made a good suggestion um so that maybe we can't quite make a decision here tonight a final decision but I think we have good options it sounds like

196Alvaro he goes to the meetings he's interested and available to fill that role if if no one else can or if no one else can commit to it that he can be that can be that regular member so so we will put that on our agenda for October 12th and and yeah and maybe and maybe at that time um we'll have you come back like I said at a at a better hour okay this worked out but okay great thanks I appreciate you being available not a problem we will get that spot officially is there other questions or can you guys hear me at all yeah we can hear you yep okay I I just had a quick question is there any chance for that meeting to not be during work hours because most I

197think all of our planning board volunteers have full-time jobs uh during business hours is there any possibility for that time to be changed that time has been set for quite some time and most of the people who attend that is the best time for them to be there of staff and volunteers Deepa did you have a question um I'll be curious to know how folks who want to listen in can be added to that meeting just so that we listen in and I would love to understand what happens in those meetings what does that hour and a half really seem like I'm happy to I'm happy to introduce you and get you on the email list yeah it'll be good to like attend yeah I'll take care of it yes Yolanda no I just said

198Thank you thank people want a little more detail of what we do at a meeting quickly today I can tell you today that we discussed change of bylaws we discussed some projects because of some extra funding we also heard from um you know legislative updates that are happening in projects and things that are you know we're looking at having a discussion about the MBTA Community act so that all the communities involved can sort of understand and see if we can support each other in different ways but if anybody has a question reach out to me and I'm willing to have a conversation with you before the before your October 12th meeting it won't be this between Saturday this coming Saturday and Sunday the 8th but I'm on vacation but you know the 9th or 10th

199or 11th I'm willing to talk to people and give them more information about what the organization does just shoot me an email all right sounds good thanks Yolanda okay you're very welcome have a good night drive safe thanks bye okay so um next on our agenda are the various reports on planning topics reports from board members in town planner et cetera et cetera we can take those in anywhere can I do comprehensive plan because I sure I do have some um so I think it's a little bit General feedback for the board and some Peter I'm hoping will take to the consultant um and one was just almost to the person of the public like I I've spoken to that were there and they were very impressed including people said I never thought I could

200say I'm impressed by a consultant so very and maybe you'll get that tour um volume was a problem both in the room and on Zoom um and then a request to have more involvement for the remote participants and I know I I think she Loosely knew that but just to see what they can do so I'd appreciate if you can get that to her um the feedback out of it for Ashland for us is the sound I have both Zoom people and the room um the PowerPoint should be distributed and posted um I don't think we've I haven't gotten it yet there's PowerPoint so to the committee but also posted I think we should and then um this is pretty frustrating because like I don't check my phone a lot but like right before the

201meeting there were two and I realized it's really three one person drove there because she couldn't get the link so we I would like to see us get a consistent spot for the link to the meeting because we were encouraging people to participate either remote or Zoom or especially zoom and um like this there's a lot of spectacular involvement like one of the people that was having trouble Zoom reasonably sophisticated found it but had to go several places and actually had a watch party with their neighborhood so pretty cool um but we those are things I think we have to do better like the actual gut feedback both in the room and the zoom the person that's having the watch party it really was a watch party so meet your neighbors bring a bottle of

202wine but get them involved so the the actual whole volume on that group but again I I received that feedback from a lot of people so and then I can just add that I I think when you hear a lot of people being very impressed I think Ashland did a great job of getting the right Consultants so the technical issues are taken care of by obviously not the planning board and obviously not the planet I wouldn't trust either no I'm just kidding you know obviously we do it is in the basement of the library right and so it's a big group of 29 people and I think it's a challenge right from a technology standpoint that we do have a owl it's linked in the middle of the room and the owl you know we

203all we view the hour on on the planning board and it's good you know um but I think yeah it is probably challenging for a group of 29 people and and I agree with you with the whole breakout rooms how does that happen you know in coordinating that kind of online um activities right and so there are challenges when you're there are challenges right and I think that's just one of those things you have to iron out you know in in I don't think it's one of those things you can't predict right and so um so do we have someone that like I think you know I think as a group and and Kate I think you can attest to this I think on the sound part of it you know I think we talked

204about trying to get a microphone in the room with a with an amp not an amplifier uh amp you know a micro you know I guess a speaker right so at least you know especially you know Jen's voice our consultant's voice is a little bit more clear over the microphone and uh and in that instance in the hope that the owl picks that up a little bit you know towards the middle of the meeting you know our we knew sound was an issue is that our consultant was moving closer and closer to the owl which is really the microphone right and so so in in in the in the Stream of the meeting that was done and obviously that was noticed but what do we start changing do we do we change rooms you know

205I don't know what that I don't have that answer you know myself yeah what I was going to say is this an issue for them I guess it's now defunct management committee I don't know or you know who I don't know whose ballpark this is to help you with the technical issues or are you just making a general comment well I mean I think I'm reporting but I think it's really important I mean if we want the public involved and we need to involve the public in a public plan we have to we have to address these things one way or another yeah I'm just not sure but some of them are is no um well it's under reports but Peter I I assume is in contact with the consultant and I think there's some

206things that she can improve and also make sure that I think we can improve I think number one the microphone all right but let's not go into the technical issues here in the planning board she's good enough that people are actually getting together yeah yes okay so who's first if I could add very quick and yeah and I mean I'm listening to you guys remotely so perhaps I misheard but I think I heard someone maybe with Trisha referring to a project management team as defunct I think oh I didn't know I didn't know if that team then got absorbed into the bigger group uh no a management team to dissolve itself nor has there been any formal vote by the steering committee to dissolve the project management group and the issue of structure of why

207does the project management team exists relative to the steering committee goes back multiple years when the select board and the planning board reviewed Michael's proposal for the creation of the steering committee and it was that document I believe in June of 2022 that created the project management team which according to Michael's document would continue yeah I wasn't I wasn't looking to I wasn't looking to go into an issue about who's who who I was just wondering I just wondering who was responsible for for solving the technical issues that's all I didn't mean any okay so no no I heard the word defunct and I wanted to clarify but because really amazing is is we have Consultants that is really impressing so many people and attracting people into the room and that's really exciting all the

208efforts of individuals like like all of us who have worked so hard to get people into the room and Trisha I know you attended which was awesome um Trish and I were in the same group uh in the breakout sessions and that was really fun for me to kind of get to know Tricia in a different way other than the meeting so I want to encourage other planning board members come to the next hearing committee meeting because anytime the public shows up there will be opportunities to participate but the other thing I'll say is like it's a mystery right now to many of us at least to me like who is going to take care of all of these sort of mysterious technical things that's why the project management team still needs to exist and

209that structural issue right now is the unknown so so I'm glad you raised it for sure by mentioning it because I did want at some point to highlight for the planning board that it's going to need to be flushed out okay what is the role of the project management team and what what does that mean great I mean I'm just yeah just curious as to who who will resolve such issues for for you knowing that it's not this body so but anyway um are there any other reports I think the only thing I would like to mention is that just today Peter and I and Joe mignani who is the select board representative and Alvaro met as the working group for the MBTA communities we had a it was supposed to be 30 minutes it

210was an hour and a half that we started to just to get into this into the details and what we needed to you know strategy so it was a good meeting and we'll be meeting again obviously multiple times before we come come back to the board there's nothing to report at this time but just letting you know that we're meeting and Peter I assumed the report on the on the lawsuit is just it is ongoing so we're gonna we're gonna schedule a meeting next Monday there's a there's a there's something going on next Monday and then I've been advised by a council that after the next defer the court date we will be setting up a uh a joint meeting with the select boy to enter into executive session to talk about it and that's

211that's what I would advise the state to you as board members um but we do have Council we have been appointed Council from our insurance company um and so both are talking to each other and working together to iron out this issue the only other can I just give a quick update um The One update I do want to make note of is that we have received a new application and it is for 400 Cedar Street and that's a water tank cell tower and that will be on our agenda next next at the next meeting the 12th 400 Cedars Cedar Street is on I would say upper Cedar Street it's on the hallston line of Butters of Holliston and Ashland or I'll be have all been notified within the 300 foot radius because it sits

212on that Town Line This is a town owned tank their equipment actually sits on top of the tank and so the town of Ashland let their lease expire because we were afraid of the structural damage of long having having equipment sit on top of the tank and so with an open spot on the side of the tank the town of Ashland was sent out RFP and so the application will be putting new equipment on the side of the tank and now it can be explained a little bit more at the next meeting but it is falls under the Spectrum act we've done a bunch of cell phones in the past so this is the same process but in this area in this instance the tower is a water tank owned by the town of Ashland

213all right so if there's no other reports the last thing on it on our agenda is the last thing on the agenda is the meeting minutes of August 10th if there are no other reports um I had gone through these previously but had no changes I make a motion that we accept the minutes as written of the August 10th 2023 meeting the second oh second and a roll call vote so those are past um any other notes before we get a motion to adjourn all right motion to adjourn at 10 20 is there a second I'll took him good day in a testimony Catherine Jersey and Trisha Kendall all right thanks everybody we'll see you on October 12th