001SBSD Owl Camera: Like, the call to order? SBSD Owl Camera: The special meeting and community forum. SBSD Owl Camera: of the South Burlington School District School Board. SBSD Owl Camera: on December 15th, 2025, The first item on our agenda is the Pledge of Allegiance. SBSD Owl Camera: So, if we could do that now? SBSD Owl Camera: I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, liberty and justice for all. SBSD Owl Camera: The next item on our agenda is announcements. SBSD Owl Camera: Does anybody have any anonymous? SBSD Owl Camera: I have a couple quick announcements. SBSD Owl Camera: the… enrollment projections. SBSD Owl Camera: Came out, so we should be publishing those shortly. SBSD Owl Camera: And also,
002we have a request from our superintendent to change the… SBSD Owl Camera: video rules, like the way that, schools and principals and administrators can use, video. And so, we're gonna be, SBSD Owl Camera: Talking about that in upcoming meetings, so if you have interest in the community around SBSD Owl Camera: how video policy works, and how video surveillance works in schools, watch our agendas. It may be coming up soon. SBSD Owl Camera: Any other announcements? SBSD Owl Camera: The next item on our agenda is to review the agenda. So, after this, we have comments from the public, which is a short period where public can comment on any topic, even if it's not on the agenda. SBSD Owl Camera: After that, we will have a community forum, where we will meet the SBSD Owl Camera:
003permanent superintendent candidates, and it'll be, I believe, half one candidate, half the other candidate. And during a community forum, the public and the board are allowed to talk to each other back and forth, as long as it's about the superintendent search. SBSD Owl Camera: After that, there will be a executive session, where the school board will talk about, superintendent candidates and potentially make a decision about SBSD Owl Camera: Who to choose, and then, at… after the executive session, there's likely to be, SBSD Owl Camera: An action item to authorize the chair to negotiate with the chosen candidate. SBSD Owl Camera: Any amendments or comments about the agenda? SBSD Owl Camera: Great. SBSD Owl Camera: So our next section is comments from the public. SBSD Owl Camera: There are 3 opportunities for the public to comment.
004SBSD Owl Camera: The first, during this section, about any topic, even if it is not warned on the agenda. SBSD Owl Camera: The second is before the board takes action on an action item, but only on the topic being action. And the third is during a community forum, but only on board topics. And today is a community forum. SBSD Owl Camera: The board will not respond to public comments unless this is a specially designated community forum and the comment is on a topic warrant on the agenda. You'll be given approximately 3 minutes to comment. Please do not violate anyone's privacy, and official complaints or grievances cannot be filed during public comment. So, do we have any comments from the public? SBSD Owl Camera: Aye. SBSD Owl Camera: Bridget Burkhart, I think all of you already
005know me, but just for the record. I just want to request that maybe you share the full budget with the community at the January 7th meeting, if that wasn't already planned. I don't think it's really, SBSD Owl Camera: A great way to build trust and transparency with the community, if you wait to share it until the night that you're actually going to vote it and warn it, it would be good if folks had a chance to look at it. It just didn't seem, and maybe I'm misinterpreting, it just seems like from the list of things on the website, and in talking to, Principal Grundling today, because I went to the budget meeting this morning at the middle school, wasn't clear if that's the plan, so I would just like to report SBSD Owl Camera: What's
006that? That's all. SBSD Owl Camera: Spicy soup. SBSD Owl Camera: Any other comments from the public? SBSD Owl Camera: Alright. SBSD Owl Camera: well then… SBSD Owl Camera: Alright, then we'll move on to the community forum. SBSD Owl Camera: And our first candidate… is, Dr. Joe Blark. SBSD Owl Camera: And so… SBSD Owl Camera: Welcome, Joe. Thank you. Good to be here. And so, I've got a couple, questions, and then at any point, if community members have comments or questions, or if the board does, go ahead and raise your hand or make yourself aware, make me aware that, you have a question. SBSD Owl Camera: So, first of all. SBSD Owl Camera: Dr. Clark, would you tell us a bit about yourself and why you're excited about this position? SBSD Owl Camera: Yeah, so, SBSD
007Owl Camera: Joe Clark, I've been… this is my 34th year in public education. I retired in the state of Ohio after 33 years of service. SBSD Owl Camera: I started as a high school English teacher, and then moved into administration as a high school assistant principal, a middle school principal, a HR director, superintendent. SBSD Owl Camera: And then a superintendent. I spent 14 years as a superintendent in Ohio before I retired, and then I applied for this job as the interim superintendent. SBSD Owl Camera: Here in, South Burlington. And what I've come to find, I, I… SBSD Owl Camera: I kind of knew it going into my interim, SBSD Owl Camera: when I applied to be the interim superintendent, just by doing my research, but having lived in this position for the last 3 months
008and 3 days, I really find that my skill sets align really closely with what the needs of this district are. I am, SBSD Owl Camera: I am somebody that is really good at building order out of chaos. Not chaos might be a strong word, but what I found in my time here is that this district, frankly, is lacking in a lot of policies, procedures. SBSD Owl Camera: formats for how things are supposed, to be done. And working with my, my team, I have every, belief that we have the ability to get those things organized. What I found is we have great people here, great people working here, and they are, they are, SBSD Owl Camera: thirsting for leadership. They are looking for somebody to help guide them and to make things orderly, and I think
009we have the ability to do that. So that's one thing. I think the other thing that I… that is a strength of mine that I think this community needs is, SBSD Owl Camera: communication and trust building and relationship building. I think, over the, the past SBSD Owl Camera: year or so, that there… some of that has eroded, and I think that my approach to how I interact with people, how I communicate. SBSD Owl Camera: how I listen, I think, is… has been, at this point, well received, and I think it will continue to grow as people get to know me more, and as I'm more visible around the community. SBSD Owl Camera: Thank you. SBSD Owl Camera: what were your takeaways from today's site visits? And maybe I should rewind for a minute and say
010that the candidates for the permanent superintendent SBSD Owl Camera: They did site visits today, and SBSD Owl Camera: And so, Joe, I'm… I would like to ask you to reflect on that as what you saw at the schools, and SBSD Owl Camera: And you know, both, what did you see that was positive, and what did you see that was, that you were worried about? SBSD Owl Camera: I would say that… SBSD Owl Camera: what was really positive is we have… the people here are just fantastic. What I've found is we have really smart, hardworking, compassionate, empathetic employees who are working with their kids. I've found that we have students who are very engaged and who want to do well, who are very, very… I've never seen a student body in my career that is so…
011SBSD Owl Camera: empathetic towards others, especially those who might have more significant needs. That is really refreshing to me. SBSD Owl Camera: The other thing I found through my visits around today is that people are, really grateful of the change that they've seen over the last 3 months. I heard many, many people show gratitude for the open communication, for the Wednesday videos, for the newsletter, for… SBSD Owl Camera: letters that I sent them in the mail, all those sorts of things. SBSD Owl Camera: my concerns… I wouldn't say I'm, SBSD Owl Camera: I wouldn't say that I have… I can't remember the word to use, James. Yeah, I wouldn't say worried. I would say just another reiteration that I have… I did hear from people that they are hoping to get a little more structure,
012a little more order, that they are thirsting to get some sort of SBSD Owl Camera: policies and procedures from the administrative team together to help them with special education, with curricula. For example, I came to find today that our elementary schools are not using the same math program, and that, to me, is a worry. That's a worry. We should… our kids at each building should have the same curriculum, so if I move from Chamberlain to Orchard, for example, I know that I have SBSD Owl Camera: the same background. So that's a concern to me. SBSD Owl Camera: facilities are also worried, quite frankly. I think that, they are not… our buildings are not dangerous. They are warm, they are safe, they are dry, but they're not conducive to 21st century education. I think that that
013is, SBSD Owl Camera: something that this community will need to address, in the short… not the short, the mid-range, right? I don't… I don't think we need to be looking to build buildings next year, but I think it needs to be starting to be a discussion over the next couple of years about how might we be able to provide better facilities for our kids? SBSD Owl Camera: And staff, and also do it at a reasonable rate, and, SBSD Owl Camera: And get the efficiencies of new buildings, right? If you have new buildings, you can save a lot of operating money. Instead of putting good money into old buildings, you can put good money into programs for kids instead of new boilers and new roofs, those kinds of things. SBSD Owl Camera: Oh, gosh. SBSD Owl
014Camera: Another question for you. SBSD Owl Camera: What role do parents play in the… education system. SBSD Owl Camera: parents are vital to the education system, right? Parents are the first teachers of their kids, and we want to have great relationships with our parents. I think that SBSD Owl Camera: I think that sometimes you will hear, educators say things like, well, I wish we had more parent, parent engagement. SBSD Owl Camera: They will say that, but their behaviors don't always SBSD Owl Camera: show that they mean that. I think often when we say the one-parent engagement, what we mean is we want parents to… SBSD Owl Camera: Not question our decisions, we want them to, you know, provide us with whatever resources we need. I believe true parent engagement is asking questions of parents and
015listening to the feedback that they give. SBSD Owl Camera: As you know, over the last few months, I've gone and had 30 different meetings where I've asked parents and staff members and students about what can we do better here in the schools, and I think, SBSD Owl Camera: If we gather all that information and take no steps to, act on that, it was… first of all, it erodes trust, and also it's a waste of everybody's time. SBSD Owl Camera: So I think parents need to be active participants in the schools. I think that we need to, give them feedback. They are the… they are the… not just parents, whole community are owners of the schools, and we're responsible, to them to provide them with a great experience for the… for the kids here. SBSD Owl
016Camera: So I want parents to be involved. We've started committees that involve parents. I've had lots of my 3Q meetings, my three questions, what do you like? What can we do better with parents? SBSD Owl Camera: And I've heard the gratitude there, right? I had a meeting with all parents of students who have IEPs, and I've heard them say to me, nobody has ever asked for our opinion before. I had a meeting with the parents who form our multiple multi-language SBSD Owl Camera: committee, and I heard them say, nobody has ever asked us before what we… what our experience is like, so I think it's vital that we continue to do that. SBSD Owl Camera: Another question for you is if you could describe what's going on in Vermont around redistricting, and what attitude you
017think would be good for the district to have towards redistricting. SBSD Owl Camera: Ask the first part of that again. Could you describe just what's going on? Yeah, so, right, so Act 73, proposes to limit, the number of school districts in the state. I think they want them to be between 4,000 and 6,000, students. SBSD Owl Camera: To consolidate wherever possible. I think the general, attitude among a lot of people that I've spoken with is just, is, SBSD Owl Camera: either fear or, tentativeness about that. I think in, in, SBSD Owl Camera: In theory, people like the idea of being able to save money. In practice, I think a lot of people don't know if doing that will actually save money, and it also scares them a little bit. SBSD Owl Camera: Hi, Bill. SBSD
018Owl Camera: Period. SBSD Owl Camera: That's you. SBSD Owl Camera: Must have said something that sounded scary. Anyway… She did. That's great. So I, I think that, SBSD Owl Camera: People are very romantic about their school districts, so when you talk about doing consolidation, there may be people that think, well, I wish I had more resources for my… for my students. However, I also like that our town's logo is on the football helmet, you know what I mean? SBSD Owl Camera: Having been a superintendent in a really small district, I have seen firsthand some of the challenges of providing equal resources to kids in small districts. SBSD Owl Camera: Things like AP classes, and STEM classes, and expanded arts, and music, and all of those things are really hard to do in small districts. Therefore,
019I mean, I think our attitude should be that consolidation is good for that reason. SBSD Owl Camera: Now, we happen to be a district with about 2,400 kids, but we have a lot of offerings for our students, so I would not say that our students are necessarily SBSD Owl Camera: not benefiting from programs, but there are things that we… that they are lacking in. We don't have enough, opportunities for our kids with career and technical education. SBSD Owl Camera: We might be able to save money if we were to collaborate with other districts on some of the higher cost, lesser needs kind of things. Think about, like, alternative education for some of our most needy, needy kids. So, I think that, SBSD Owl Camera: our attitude should be one of looking to collaborate and cooperate.
020Whether it makes sense for our district to actually consolidate with another district, I don't know, but I do know that we should look for ways to share resources. That might be some sort of regional, SBSD Owl Camera: Development where we can be served by the same, you know, regional service center to help with those kinds of needs. SBSD Owl Camera: I have another question for you, SBSD Owl Camera: There is a lot of concern in the community around academic performance, and in particular, around SBSD Owl Camera: If we compare ourselves to Massachusetts, you are to Mississippi. SBSD Owl Camera: It seems like our schools are getting worse, even though property taxes are up 41%, in the last few years. SBSD Owl Camera: So, what do you think is the… SBSD Owl Camera: Most important thing
021that we should look at in the next year to make academic performance SBSD Owl Camera: If we're talking about the most important thing in the next year, I think we need to do a curriculum audit and an instructional audit, where we look to see exactly what is it that we are teaching to our kids. Is it, something that is, SBSD Owl Camera: Tied to the assessments, and are we instructing it with fidelity? And with, with, with, proper, instructional skills. SBSD Owl Camera: I think having that baseline of knowledge allows us to take the next step, which is to create that order I was talking about, about these… this is where we're lacking, therefore we are going to place resources in SBSD Owl Camera: in, aligning our curriculum, both horizontally and vertically. We are going to,
022we're going to invest in making sure we give professional development to our instructors to make sure that they have, the necessary skills to meet, SBSD Owl Camera: to meet those ends. SBSD Owl Camera: I don't doubt at all the skills that our teachers have. I think we have really, really great teaching staff. Like, I think I keep repeating myself. I just think they need leadership. They need structure, they need order, they need direction. And if we can, SBSD Owl Camera: eventually, I mean, sooner rather than later, have a strategic plan that outlines, well, these are what our goals are. And then we align our curriculum, make sure our instruction is supported through professional development, and we can get to that, to that end. SBSD Owl Camera: Great. SBSD Owl Camera: And then, last question from
023the… from the chair here. SBSD Owl Camera: How do you deal with differences of opinion? SBSD Owl Camera: Well, tactfully, right? I think, I think the very first thing to do is make sure you approach every interaction with humility. I think anybody, SBSD Owl Camera: I think if you go into any interaction thinking that your answer is the right answer, I think that sets you up for, for failure. I think that we have to, seek first to understand rather than being understood. We need to ask questions, we need to get feedback, and just because SBSD Owl Camera: Intelligent people can disagree. So just because somebody disagrees with us shouldn't mean that we toss them aside, or toss their opinion aside, or don't listen to them. SBSD Owl Camera: Instead, we need to be curious, right?
024Instead of judgmental, we need to be curious about why are people thinking the way they're thinking, and what can we do, to respect their opinions. SBSD Owl Camera: ultimately, you know, decisions we make need to be based on research, right? We're a learning institution. We need to have database and research-based decisions, but I think we have to be open to people, and not just play lip service, right? I'm a big… SBSD Owl Camera: proponent of, using surveys, but if you give a survey and aren't willing to listen to the feedback that's given in the survey, again, you lose trust, and you've wasted time. SBSD Owl Camera: Great. SBSD Owl Camera: So, do we have any questions from board members? SBSD Owl Camera: Or from community members, maybe online. SBSD Owl Camera: Anything that we've talked
025about so far that… SBSD Owl Camera: Could we start with them? Yes, let's start with the community. SBSD Owl Camera: And, Tim, could you wait for somebody online? She'll go first. SBSD Owl Camera: Perfect. SBSD Owl Camera: Go ahead. SBSD Owl Camera: online. SBSD Owl Camera: when Freestein… WenFree Stein: Hi, this is… this is, Freeman Stein. I'm, a resident. I moved to, WenFree Stein: South Burlington, last year, and I've been following the conversation. I'm a retired educator, and, superintendent WenFree Stein: Clark, I'm wondering if you'd get a little more specific about when you talk about providing professional development for teachers, what that would look like, and WenFree Stein: And if in part of that is, some substantial commitment to… to actually coaching teachers, to, in terms of, using best instructional practice. SBSD Owl Camera: So,
026I can't get more specific without knowing exactly what the area is, but my philosophy about professional development is it's best when it's job embedded, when it's ongoing, and ideally when it's presented by your own colleagues. So, we have people who have a whole lot of education, they took in a whole lot of classes, and they have a whole lot of skills. SBSD Owl Camera: So, to me, it doesn't make sense to pay somebody to come in from the outside who's going to be here for one day, and give a long speech, and then leave. It's much better if we have, SBSD Owl Camera: Professional development that, whenever possible, is done by people who are actually already working here in the district, who have the skills. SBSD Owl Camera: who follow up time after time to
027make sure that we're getting where we need to be, that we use data to review whether we're being successful, and then we make adjustments as necessary. I mean, the single most important question we should ask every day is, what do we do if students aren't learning? And we should react to that. We should find out what it is that we're not doing. SBSD Owl Camera: You also asked about coaching. I am a… I am a fan of the coaching model. I think when possible, to have teachers have the ability to go into other classrooms to see things that are going on, that just to… to use our… SBSD Owl Camera: professional educators as professionals, you know, to have them… they are the experts, we should take advantage of them being experts. SBSD Owl Camera: Thank
028you very much for your question. SBSD Owl Camera: Bills, we are. SBSD Owl Camera: Good evening, I'm Tim Jarvis, resident. I don't have a question for Dr. Clark, but… SBSD Owl Camera: I just want to provide a very strong endorsement for his candidacy. SBSD Owl Camera: I've had the pleasure of meeting with Joe one-on-one on a few occasions, and I see him everywhere. I see him at my daughter's concert, I see him at the play, I see him at sporting events. SBSD Owl Camera: I was on the, SBSD Owl Camera: the call that he referenced with parents with IEPs, and it was one of the most powerful community meetings I've ever attended. It was just remarkable that SBSD Owl Camera: Knowing, how busy And demanding the superintendent's job is, through personal experience. SBSD Owl Camera:
029that Joe is finding the energy and the commitment and the motivation to engage so effectively with the community. SBSD Owl Camera: I love the Wednesday videos and the accompanying newsletter. My daughter was in the play at the high school, and one day. SBSD Owl Camera: when collecting the mail, we had a letter from Joe, from the superintendent thanking her for her participation in the play. This is remarkably SBSD Owl Camera: effective in terms of generating positive sentiment about the school district and the central office, which has been very solely lacking, as we know. SBSD Owl Camera: And I can't believe he's only been here for 3 months, right? So, it seems like you've been here for a much longer period of time, and although I know nothing about the other shortlisted candidate for superintendent, I
030have no doubt that he is a very strong candidate as well. SBSD Owl Camera: I would like to see, Joe be strongly considered for the permanent position, to build upon the momentum that he's already put into motion, and to promote a sense of continuity and SBSD Owl Camera: solid professionalism that I think we're experiencing right now, as a result of his hard work and dedication and commitment over the last 3 months. SBSD Owl Camera: So I just want to put in a plug. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. Can we go to a moment, and then two? And I just want, we'll do another 8 minutes, so moment… SBSD Owl Camera: Okay, so a lot of students in the school, they feel frustrated because they've SBSD Owl Camera: are involved, and they feel like their voices
031are being heard in decisions that affect them, so I was wondering if you have any plans on how you can include students on school-wide districts. That's funny you should ask that moment, because you know that Saturday afternoon, while we were sitting here in the, SBSD Owl Camera: in the retreat, I shot you and Ollie an email saying, listen, everywhere that I've been a superintendent, I've had something called the Superintendent Advisory Council, which is made up of middle school and high school students, and I have not started that yet, because my job is temporary. SBSD Owl Camera: But my intention is, if I were to get this permanent job, I've asked you guys to start considering who would be some students that would be good advocates on that group. And what we do is, SBSD Owl
032Camera: really the students run it, but the model that I've seen has been that we meet maybe four times a year for a couple hours over lunch, and students come in and we talk about, SBSD Owl Camera: these same three things. What… what do we… what do you like? What can we do better, and what do you expect out of me? And we get good discussion, and students drive the agenda, and then when we get those ideas, then we try to implement those ideas. So I would love to get that, get that going, SBSD Owl Camera: probably as soon as January, one more detective. Sure, because you mentioned some concerns about the facilities and the curriculum. I was wondering if you had any ideas on how to… how we could start to fix some of
033these. SBSD Owl Camera: Well, with curriculum, I think, like I said, I think we need to do some sort of audit. I think that, SBSD Owl Camera: I think we need to step back and see what we have before we try to fix things, otherwise you end up, you know, fixing things maybe that don't need fixed, or maybe not prioritizing properly. As far as the facilities go, I do know that there was an issue to have new facilities built some time ago, and I… SBSD Owl Camera: I have not been here long enough to see what the communities, SBSD Owl Camera: appetite is for creating new facilities. Again, I'm not worried that anybody is in danger of being in our facilities. I just know that they're set up not to be how, really, current schools
034are to be set up. So I think that, SBSD Owl Camera: Within the nexus. SBSD Owl Camera: couple of years, we need to have a committee together of community members, of board members who investigate, you know, what is the best plan for us to address our facility needs. And hopefully, Vermont will come up with a facility funding system that might be able to help us out with that. SBSD Owl Camera: Great. Cheers. SBSD Owl Camera: Sure, no rush, no rush. SBSD Owl Camera: My name is Barry Young. I'm, I live in South Royalton, and I'm a bus driver. SBSD Owl Camera: And, Dr. Joe came down, or superintendent we had that… came down to the bus center, introduce himself. SBSD Owl Camera: Same thing where you just said, what do you need? How can I
035help? SBSD Owl Camera: Pretty outgoing, we had an issue with something that came up within 3 hours that she was taken care of. SBSD Owl Camera: So I went around the bus depot, asked different drivers if they would SBSD Owl Camera: agree to support, and Busting probe all their favor of 4HO. SBSD Owl Camera: And, we just appreciate you coming down and introducing yourself and reaching out to us as bus drivers and… SBSD Owl Camera: I endorse. We endorse character. SBSD Owl Camera: Thank you. Thank you. Good donut. SBSD Owl Camera: Is there anybody else online, or in person? SBSD Owl Camera: How would I? SBSD Owl Camera: Any parting thoughts, Joe? We got about 3 more minutes. I mean, I said it in the retreat, I have been so impressed with this board and
036your thoughtfulness. I know that 6 of you have not been on for more than a year at this point, but I've been so impressed. SBSD Owl Camera: And so grateful, first of all, that you took the chance, or the opportunity, the risk of bringing me in 3 months ago. SBSD Owl Camera: And I… I think we've made really good headway. I think we have good relationships, I think we're doing good work, and I would love to continue, getting… getting this, SBSD Owl Camera: getting this place turned around, quite frankly. I think that… talk about, we can be the beacon, we should be the beacon in the state of Vermont, and we're not, but we can be, and I think that can happen SBSD Owl Camera: Sooner rather than later. Took me 8 years to do
037it in my little district in Ohio. I see 3 here. I see a lot of potential. We have great people. We just are part of… SBSD Owl Camera: thirsting for leadership. I think I can provide that. SBSD Owl Camera: Great. SBSD Owl Camera: Dr. Clark, thank you very much. SBSD Owl Camera: Thanks, everybody, for coming, and we're gonna have our next candidate come in, in a few minutes. Thank you, thank you for having me. SBSD Owl Camera: Oh, one that you're on. SBSD Owl Camera: Oh, oh, thank you. SBSD Owl Camera: So you need a different link for his view, again, for those? SBSD Owl Camera: Is that okay? SBSD Owl Camera: Marissa, you're… Thank you, Laura. SBSD Owl Camera: We're gonna place it over here. Thank you. SBSD Owl Camera: Thank you. Thank you
038for coming. SBSD Owl Camera: Welcome, this is… SBSD Owl Camera: Timothy, would you pronounce your last name? Matheny. Matheny. Tim Matheny. Welcome, thank you for being here. Yes, absolutely. So, at our community forums, we allow, back and forth between the board and the community, and our topic tonight is the permanent superintendent search. SBSD Owl Camera: Thank you for being candidates. SBSD Owl Camera: I have a few questions to start. SBSD Owl Camera: And, if community members want to interrupt and add their own questions, they are welcome to do so. So, to begin with, would you tell us a bit about yourself, and why you're excited for this position? Should I speak into a microphone? That thing is pretty good at picking us up. Okay. SBSD Owl Camera: And repeat the question again? Just tell us
039a little bit about yourself and why you're excited about this position. So, I am a 35-year educator. I started teaching, just a couple of months after leaving college. SBSD Owl Camera: With the intent to perhaps eventually go to law school, and SBSD Owl Camera: The education world, really, captured my, my spirit. SBSD Owl Camera: And I have been a part of being a teacher, principal, New Jersey Department of Education official, superintendent. I've done a lot of really interesting work in education. SBSD Owl Camera: And all of that, I think, has contributed to, my ability to, lead a school district. SBSD Owl Camera: Why I'm here in South Burlington is, I'm doing a national search now for my next professional role. SBSD Owl Camera: And looking at a lot of different opportunities, whether it's a school
040district or leading a nonprofit organization, all related to education. But what intrigued me about South Burlington, I think, is alignment between the value placed on education in this community. SBSD Owl Camera: the hopes that you have for your students, like Allie and Woman, and all of the students here, but also, SBSD Owl Camera: The desire for continuous improvement, or for being focused on continuing to be ambitious for even better student outcomes. SBSD Owl Camera: So I think there's that alignment between your hopes and dreams as a school district, and what I think are my greatest attributes as an educational leader, I think there's a pretty good match there. SBSD Owl Camera: Thank you. SBSD Owl Camera: Oh. SBSD Owl Camera: Today, the candidates did some site visits, and so I would just, what were your
041takeaways from today's site visits? What, what did you see that was positive, and what worried you? SBSD Owl Camera: Nothing worried me, other than my ability to walk on slightly slippery sidewalks, at times. But I think I'm okay there. I think what I saw, SBSD Owl Camera: That made me really pleased is, one term, from the world of, organizational wellness is psychological safety. SBSD Owl Camera: And it can apply to, the adults who work in an organization, like a school district, and it can apply to students. SBSD Owl Camera: What I saw was a great deal of psychological safety in the schools here in South Burlington. I think I have a sixth sense when I… because I've been around kids for my entire career, when they feel, SBSD Owl Camera: unsafe, whether it's physically, emotionally,
042intellectually. I didn't sense any of that. I felt kids SBSD Owl Camera: Feeling like they were well cared for, that their emotional needs were well met by the educators in the district. SBSD Owl Camera: So I was really pleased to see, and honestly, that's something I was looking for, because that is a, a necessary condition in order for students to achieve at high levels. It's not… SBSD Owl Camera: Everything you need to do, but it's an essential, necessary condition for, for students to do great things, academically and in other ways that we would hope for them in our schools. SBSD Owl Camera: That's true. SBSD Owl Camera: What role do parents play? SBSD Owl Camera: in the education system. As I wrote, maybe a few months ago, parents are the number one partner, and I
043would say caregivers in general, because we know that some of our kids are raised by different people in their family. SBSD Owl Camera: they are our essential partners, and one thing that I was insistent on as a superintendent is ensuring, that we are gesturing SBSD Owl Camera: Parents into the schools and into partnership with the school district in terms of the lives of kids, and they never get the stop sign. SBSD Owl Camera: There may be times when we have disagreements with parents, but that always takes… SBSD Owl Camera: Place in the context of knowing what the shared mutual interest of the relationship is, and that is extraordinary learning outcomes for kids. SBSD Owl Camera: when we have common values around that, we can navigate differences that we might have from time to time. But
044at the end of the day, nearly universally. SBSD Owl Camera: We can come and come to agreement around shared values about what's right in our case. SBSD Owl Camera: Thank you. SBSD Owl Camera: Another question, can you describe what's going on with redistricting in Vermont, and what do you think our attitude about it should be? SBSD Owl Camera: So, even though I wasn't in Maine at the time, I know the history of the regionalization of school districts in Maine. SBSD Owl Camera: And that has created, and it… SBSD Owl Camera: alphabet maze of school districts, in the RSUs and AOSs and so forth. SBSD Owl Camera: And I appreciate, whether it's Maine or it's Vermont's SBSD Owl Camera: Interest in trying to use, SBSD Owl Camera: the dollars of taxpayers in Vermont most efficiently when
045providing for high-quality education for students. I get that. SBSD Owl Camera: And I think, there is a great challenge when we have small school districts SBSD Owl Camera: That require a considerable amount of resources in order to provide adequate educational opportunities. SBSD Owl Camera: I think the, the regionalization urge. SBSD Owl Camera: Should have a different impact when you're talking about school districts located in a metropolitan area. SBSD Owl Camera: It's really a different issue. Are there opportunities for shared services, for example, between school districts and municipalities and other school districts in order to decrease costs? You know, one thing that we did in South Portland is that we were part of a purchasing collaborative SBSD Owl Camera: Where we made joint purchases of things like technology and supplies, multiple school districts, it's called the
046Sebago Alliance, which increased our purchasing power and decreased the costs to all the districts who were a part of that. SBSD Owl Camera: That's, I think, an important… I would guess something to that effect goes on here, but that can help mitigate some of the… SBSD Owl Camera: impacts of costs on smaller districts. Now, in Maine, this district isn't a smaller district, so conversations around regionalization and redistricting should look really different here. SBSD Owl Camera: Another question. There's a lot of concern in the community here in South Burlington around academic performance. SBSD Owl Camera: For example, if we compare ourselves to Massachusetts or Mississippi, it seems that our schools are getting worse. SBSD Owl Camera: Even though property taxes are up. SBSD Owl Camera: And so, what is something that we can focus on in
047the next year to make academics improve? SBSD Owl Camera: So… SBSD Owl Camera: The number one in-school factor contributing to, student learning outcomes is the effectiveness of the classroom teacher. SBSD Owl Camera: Number one, year in, year out, research study after research study, the effect size of teacher effectiveness is far beyond any other in-school factors that shape student achievement. So, ensuring that, SBSD Owl Camera: professional learning. SBSD Owl Camera: for teachers is focused on research-based approaches to instruction, is the very first lever that any school district should look at. SBSD Owl Camera: And I've had great conversations with many teachers today, and I think they would be really receptive to ensuring that their professional learning is absolutely top-notch as a lever for increasing those SBSD Owl Camera: Student outcome measures that we all hope for
048them. SBSD Owl Camera: I would also note, I had a really interesting conversation with a group of high school students. I requested this meeting with high school students today. SBSD Owl Camera: Even though it was a part… original part of my calendar. And I think even high school students are saying, you know, more could be asked of us academically. SBSD Owl Camera: And an initial step to that, I think, is a, looking at SBSD Owl Camera: The panorama survey results from the high school about how high school students are feeling about the rigor of their education, and talking to recent graduates of the school system to determine how well prepared that they think they are for career careers. SBSD Owl Camera: And having that data and knowing how the educational approach in South… South Burling…
049South Burlington could be better aligned to those really positive learning outcomes, meaning SBSD Owl Camera: where we want students to be is, I can hit the ground running when I go to college, or I can hit the ground running when I enter into SBSD Owl Camera: a skilled trade. I am well prepared for those outcomes. Listening to them, and at the same time, continuing to build the capacity of teachers to do great work are two strategies. SBSD Owl Camera: Thank you very much. SBSD Owl Camera: Right. SBSD Owl Camera: Do I see correctly that your budget in South Portland schools is roughly $70 million? Yes, that's the last budget I oversaw there. So, similar size to our budget here in South Bronxland, which is great. I'm curious, can you talk to me about your budget
050process in South Portland, and how you… SBSD Owl Camera: How you conducted the budget process to achieve, you know, the goals and the ambitions of the district at a reasonable cost. SBSD Owl Camera: to taxpayers. How did you generate the budget every year? What was your process? SBSD Owl Camera: Or the cost control mechanisms. Sure. SBSD Owl Camera: So, one important point I would start with is the reality that the cost drivers in school districts are often fixed costs. SBSD Owl Camera: And your ability to manage cost drivers that are not fixed costs is really… it's a small part of the budget, comparatively speaking. So, 80% of most school district budgets are the people who work for us. SBSD Owl Camera: And many of those wages and salaries are driven by collective bargaining agreements, so
051we can forecast 2 or 3 years down the road what our costs are going to be. And then, of course, the other big question mark are healthcare costs, which are out of the… SBSD Owl Camera: You can reduce coverage for employees and save costs that way, but that's often a cost that's out of your control, because again. SBSD Owl Camera: the plans are fixed in collective bargaining. So that being said, knowing that you're… you start the budget season having a pretty good idea of what your cost drivers are, and what's outside of your control. SBSD Owl Camera: So, then you turn to… you do projections based on that, and then you turn to what you do have control over, which is the number of staff members, your discretionary spending. SBSD Owl Camera: You know, which
052is… might give out 20% of your budget. SBSD Owl Camera: What I like to do, and what I saw the board do, is, in your November meeting, where you said a 3.4% increases the ceiling. SBSD Owl Camera: Is to backtrack from an expectation of the board, to manage costs under that ceiling. SBSD Owl Camera: us. So, in… South Portland last year, we were looking at, SBSD Owl Camera: I sensed the board wanted to stay within a 5% or 5.5% increase. SBSD Owl Camera: And that's what I guided our leadership team in looking to as the ceiling. SBSD Owl Camera: And then we began meetings internally with principals, directors, other key staff members around their individual portions of the budget. SBSD Owl Camera: we set some general guidelines, you know, what they could expect, underneath what
053I set as what I thought was a scenario. Our board was not as clear as you were when you said that 3.4% increase, but I had a pretty good idea. SBSD Owl Camera: And then, you know, you're… you're managing costs SBSD Owl Camera: under that ceiling that, whether it's the board or I, the superintendent, was setting for them. SBSD Owl Camera: And of course, you know, our natural inclination as humans is we want to do new things, we want to start new initiatives, we don't want to buy new equipment, but setting limitations individually with each SBSD Owl Camera: Key, department lead. And eventually. SBSD Owl Camera: through that collaboration with principals and department leads, is arriving at a tentative budget, and then we began to vet that budget with, individual board members. We didn't… we
054didn't meet, SBSD Owl Camera: in the initial phases, around that kind of draft budget, we met individually to get board members' opinions on some of the things we were thinking about. SBSD Owl Camera: Ultimately, then, after vetting the proposed budget with both the administrative team and some individual conversations with the board, then we were ready to move forward with the public budget. SBSD Owl Camera: So… SBSD Owl Camera: Our timeline is different in Maine. Our timeline really, right now, is when Maine school districts are doing kind of preliminary work, because the voters don't get it in their hands until June. SBSD Owl Camera: Thank you. Yep. SBSD Owl Camera: Do we have any questions, from the community online? Did you want to ask this also? SBSD Owl Camera: Sure, here's another one from the chair,
055SBSD Owl Camera: How do you deal with differences of opinion? SBSD Owl Camera: Well, I do not claim to have all the knowledge and all the truth in the world, so when there are differences of opinion, the place to start is to listen. SBSD Owl Camera: And I would hope that, in my work with the board, and work with, the leadership team in the district. SBSD Owl Camera: There is honesty, there's directness, and there's kindness in those interactions. You know, presuming that people have positive intentions with their opinion, and setting the tone for positive intentions, but listening first. SBSD Owl Camera: Asking for evidence, if, you know, opinions still differ. SBSD Owl Camera: And at times, saying, yes, you're right. I hadn't thought about that. And my opinion has changed. SBSD Owl Camera: There are
056other times when SBSD Owl Camera: You listen, you review the evidence, and say. SBSD Owl Camera: No, I have looked into that issue, and this is clearly the direction that we need to go as a school district. SBSD Owl Camera: There aren't many times, if a superintendent is doing his or her job correctly. SBSD Owl Camera: You shouldn't need to say, At this point in time, I'm the superintendent, this is my decision. SBSD Owl Camera: You shouldn't need to do that, because you have used SBSD Owl Camera: Evidence. You've used, civil discussion to lead people to, a similar conclusion. SBSD Owl Camera: Yeah. A lot of students feel, frustrated that SBSD Owl Camera: A lot of the decisions made aren't… that their voice isn't heard, and they feel… SBSD Owl Camera: like, that they… their
057voice should be included in decisions made that impact them, so I was wondering what you plan… if you get the job, what you would plan to do to include student voice in… in their opinions and the decision to make. SBSD Owl Camera: So we had two student reps on the board in South Portland, and, you know. SBSD Owl Camera: I relied on their connection, to students' opinions, and, I would want SBSD Owl Camera: you and your role as student reps. But… Additional. SBSD Owl Camera: Student leaders from the high school and even the middle school to feel like they could reach out to me and say, hey, we'd love for you to come over and meet with a group of students who have some concerns right now. SBSD Owl Camera: And I would walk across
058the street and have that meeting. That, that is not… that is not a burden, burdensome request. SBSD Owl Camera: I would also be proactive. I would love to see something like, and I don't know what the composition would be at this point, a superintendent's advisory group of students. I'm a former high school principal. I loved being a high school principal. SBSD Owl Camera: I'm not… I'm not looking to be a high school principal again. I love the work of a superintendent, but, SBSD Owl Camera: That's just… SBSD Owl Camera: one of the best parts of my job is having conversations with students about their futures and what they think should be the future of their school. So, you would not get stiff-armed by me if you say, hey, Mr. Mathie, we want to have a
059conversation about this topic. SBSD Owl Camera: I also think it would be incumbent on me to be proactive and say, Allie and Moment, you know, this is something I'm thinking about, there are implications for students about this, how do you think this would play out? SBSD Owl Camera: And I, I did that. SBSD Owl Camera: With the two student reps in South Portland. SBSD Owl Camera: Prior to the budget becoming public, the budget proposal, and I told them the rationale. SBSD Owl Camera: As it turned out, they had pretty different opinions about the budget than I did. SBSD Owl Camera: That… SBSD Owl Camera: One thing I'm proud of is the fact that that didn't hurt our personal relationship. In fact, one of them graduated and I had coffee with him before he handed out
060to Tufts, and that's a relationship I really value. So we can have disagreements, but we have to have to spend time face-to-face to work them out. SBSD Owl Camera: Any other… comments, or… oh, please, go ahead. SBSD Owl Camera: Oh, Rob, yeah, it's Karen. SBSD Owl Camera: Hi, I'm Mark Gable. Nice to meet you. Thanks for coming. Of course. It's very impressive. It sounds to me like SBSD Owl Camera: Going from South Portland to South Burlington is… SBSD Owl Camera: Somewhat of a lateral move for you? SBSD Owl Camera: Would you mind sharing with us SBSD Owl Camera: what has brought you to the point that you decided it's time to leave Southport? Sure, and I would take you back to, and some of you have heard this already, February of 2024. SBSD Owl Camera:
061A 2023 graduate. SBSD Owl Camera: of South Portland High School died by suicide. SBSD Owl Camera: That spring break. SBSD Owl Camera: A 9th grader in South Portland took his life. SBSD Owl Camera: in… on July 4th. SBSD Owl Camera: The, son of a staff member in our district office. SBSD Owl Camera: Took his life. SBSD Owl Camera: And on, in August, Another young man who was a rising 9th grader took his life. SBSD Owl Camera: I… I knew… I know, two of the mothers of those young men personally. SBSD Owl Camera: In the midst of those tragedies, we decided as a school district to create a Director of Mental and Behavioral Health position. SBSD Owl Camera: We know every district in the country has been affected by the lingering mental health impacts of the
062pandemic. SBSD Owl Camera: I also think, social media use is harming our young people in terms of their mental health. SBSD Owl Camera: So we created this position, she started in September, when we started a difficult budget process. SBSD Owl Camera: I presented a budget that maintained that position. She'd only been in the job for about 8 months, 7 months, and we were beginning to make strides. For example, universal screening around mental health is something that I would look to wherever I work next. SBSD Owl Camera: And we were beginning to pilot that, beginning to implement it. The board, against my judgment, decided to eliminate that position, despite the fact that we were a suicide cluster. SBSD Owl Camera: That… Deeply conflicted with my personal values. As a human being. SBSD Owl Camera: and as…
063an educational leader. SBSD Owl Camera: And at that point, I had hoped to spend many years in South Florida, but when you realize that you differ from the board in such a profound way. SBSD Owl Camera: That affected the mental health SBSD Owl Camera: I think, of the young people in the community, it was time for me to leave. SBSD Owl Camera: And I resigned. SBSD Owl Camera: And I… I wish that district the best, and I have so many wonderful friends in that community, but it wasn't a fit for me any longer. So I began to look at other communities that were going to be a better fit for me, and I hope that South Burlington is that community. SBSD Owl Camera: I believe I've learned a lot in 4 years as a superintendent,
064and I can bring it to bear here. SBSD Owl Camera: First of all, thank you so much for sharing that story with us. Secondly, I'm so sorry you went through that. SBSD Owl Camera: Four times. And thirdly, you gotta love a guy who stands up for his values and walks away. I did, and I don't regret that decision. I never have. SBSD Owl Camera: You shouldn't. SBSD Owl Camera: Thank you. SBSD Owl Camera: Any other questions for the board or from the community? SBSD Owl Camera: Well, great, we got… we got started a little bit early, this evening, so I think that we will, wrap it up there, and thank you very much… Yes, of course. …for coming out and answering our questions. SBSD Owl Camera: Very good, thank you very much. SBSD Owl Camera:
065And we will, SBSD Owl Camera: We'll take a quick break, and then we'll be right back, to kick off an executive session. SBSD Owl Camera: Let me take care of a couple of words. SBSD Owl Camera: We've done anything at this point, and I haven't met. Is there a shame as we do? SBSD Owl Camera: All right, the next item on our agenda is a projected executive session. The topics for this executive session are employment of a public officer, employee, superintendent. SBSD Owl Camera: And we actually do not have our attorney here today, so we won't be receiving confidential attorney-client communication. So we will… in this executive session, we will only be talking about, employment of the superintendent, and we are likely to be joined by, both superintendent candidates and, potentially our HR director if,
066we ask her SBSD Owl Camera: To come in. SBSD Owl Camera: So, at this time, I don't think this is one of the kinds of, we don't need to… SBSD Owl Camera: say that this would pre-mature knowledge would harm the district. I don't think we need to say that for this kind of executive session. So, I would… It is a personal… But it is a person. SBSD Owl Camera: Which is why we're doing it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, it's definitely still covered. I'm just saying we don't have to do the two-step, we only do the one-step. So, I would entertain a motion to enter into executive session. Sorry, I'll second. Okay, so Laura moves, Jen seconds, any discussion? SBSD Owl Camera: All those in favor? Aye. Alright, we're in executive session. SBSD Owl Camera: Okay,
067you are back on. All right. I'll call back to order the December 15th special meeting of the South Burlington School Board. SBSD Owl Camera: We just got out of executive session discussing employment of a public officer. SBSD Owl Camera: And we were joined by the two candidates. SBSD Owl Camera: The next item on the agenda is an action item. SBSD Owl Camera: And, the action item is designed to allow the district to now negotiate With the candidate or candidates? SBSD Owl Camera: So I would entertain a motion to authorize the school board chair to negotiate with the chosen candidate. SBSD Owl Camera: Awesome. SBSD Owl Camera: Oh, sorry, commotion. SBSD Owl Camera: Jen moves. Second. SBSD Owl Camera: Austin seconds. Any discussion? And this is where we will take public comment, if there's any public
068comment in the room. SBSD Owl Camera: Or online. Or online. SBSD Owl Camera: No one online. No one online. Okay. SBSD Owl Camera: Any discussion? SBSD Owl Camera: All those in favor? Aye. SBSD Owl Camera: Did you go home? Yeah. All right, the motion passes. SBSD Owl Camera: And the next item on our agenda is adjournment. I would entertain a motion to adjourn the meeting. SBSD Owl Camera: So moved. SBSD Owl Camera: Michelle moves. I'll second. Jen seconds. Any discussion? SBSD Owl Camera: All those in favor? Aye. All right, we're adjourned.