001good afternoon board members just as a preface to this jic Code of Student Conduct initially this was also slated for board approval on May 8th 2018 however due to a sensitive change which we'll discuss today in today's were real development workshop this policy needs to be riad vert eyes and so we will be re advertising it will come to the board on June 12th 2018 so that way we're following all the rules as far as a rule making process in chapter 120 of the Florida Statutes so this essentially serves as almost another workshop to sort of look through some issues and talk through those those code changes and we of course take notes as I'm at the will of the board so I'll turn over to Sarah pesky to get started with the actual code
002jic so I'm going to start with the policy itself the purpose asses procedures for disciplinary action and the rights of students this policy revises existing language to include content formatting and terminology edits consistent with statutory language in jic the policy itself under student detention searches and seizures the current policy reads that the provisions herein shall apply to official school trips we're recommending changing that language to all OCPs school sponsored events under zero-tolerance for school related violent crime currently there is no language but pursuant to Senate bill seventy twenty six amending section 1603 assessment team who shall consult with law enforcement when a student exhibits a pattern of behavior based upon previous acts or the severity of an act that would pose a threat to school safety again under zero-tolerance for school related violent crime currently
003there is no language but again under the Senate bill seventy twenty-six we had to amend it to add students may be referred to mental health services identified by the school district pursuant to section 1012 0.58 for florida statutes the mandatory reporting to law enforcement agency does not include petty acts in misconduct as defined by the board however if the student commits more than one misdemeanor the threat assessment team shall consult with law enforcement to determine if the Act should be officially reported to law enforcement again that Senate bill seventy twenty-six amending one thousand six point one three of the Florida Statutes that's language taken directly from the bill the unsafe school choice transfer options we're recommending a title change to the Disciplinary school transfers and then adding in that section as it relates to the
004Code of Student Conduct matters students may be transferred to a different school as determined by the superintendent or designee and then on to the code itself were there any questions from the policy wait would you like to wait till yes okay the cover page we're recommending changing the initial page on the Code of Student Conduct the current language speaks to extracurricular activities organizations athletic clubs which are no longer included in the Code of Student Conduct we're proposing to update the language to include OCPs jurisdiction as well as review of the code and then we're also adding a bulleted list bulleted list of pertinent information that will be included within the code the next recommendation would be to add a summary of changes page which would show all the changes that we implemented this year and
005then the notice of limited responsibility for supervising students we're recommending adding the statement nothing in this section for cludes oats EPS from administering discipline for acts or behavior that occurred on OCPs property the public notice of parental rights student records FERPA amendment procedure under FERPA were required to have an amendment procedure in place should parents contest the accuracy of their student record they can contest if a record is inaccurate misleading or a violation of privacy rights so under this is actually language taken directly from the US Department of Education guidelines on FERPA basically saying that you can use it to challenge fair record-keeping however you cannot use the Fourth Amendment process to challenge disciplinary rulings placement determinations or academics assessments okay so this is this section pertains to the participation in extracurricular co-curricular activities the
006current language in the code really does not include anything that addresses students who have a court order that prohibits them from enrolling I guess in a traditional school school and participating in extracurricular activities and so we're recommending that we add language that says a student is ineligible to participate in extracurricular co-curricular activities if a court order prohibits the students enrollment in a traditional school setting and so in this of course is also the section where we had quite a bit of discussion proposed some language and then have gone back to the original language formed for now we looked at changing the language from last year where it says code of conduct rocoto students transported by school bus to using transportation provided by OCPs this just encompasses all athletic or co-curricular travel that may be -
007field trips or out-of-state or in state also we're incorporating student technology is acceptable and responsibility use agreement language basically we've updated the new language to show the new proposed information that we received from IP as far as school searches we've added the language to include as it relates to student discipline investigation school personnel are authorized to search a student and their property of reasonable suspicion of a violation of the law or code of conduct exist we felt like we needed to give more information on our rights to do the search last year we had language in that says er CPS is responsible for investigating all allegations of student misconduct within its jurisdiction we're adding to that language where we're utilizing the preponderance of evidence standard this is basically letting them know that we are tipping
008the scale to show that we have enough evidence to proceed with discipline we as the new Senate bill we do not have language in the code for mental health services so we're adding referral to mental health services to available disciplinary responses in Level three offenses we are kind of getting that language consistent across the board with intimidation threats we've created a news new section with intimidation threats to a person this is any direct or indirect threat to do violence or harm to no CPS employee contractor personnel volunteer authorized the daughter student this included this includes but is not limited to threats made verbally or non-verbally by ACT through social media or by text so what we've been getting is confusion because the direct threat was located under threats or intimidation the indirect threats was under
00940 which is other serious misconduct and so we've decided to pull the indirect threats into the language with the threats to make it more more concise level for offenses we've added language to state the student who commits level 4 offenses may be referred to local authorities for further investigation this notifies the parents and the students that law enforcement may be involved in some of our disciplinary actions we've taken out mandatory referral to an appropriate agency because we've we felt like that was in some of the other codes and it's just consistent with what we're proposing okay 4c intimidation threats the language lines up with 3t intimidation threats and includes but not limited to making threats verbally or non-verbally by act through social media or text so we've kind of just cleaned up that language and
010we've taken out which creates fear that the threat could be carried out so we've changed for a bomb threats explosions - 4e threats to a school and we've added language to say any direct or indirect threat that may harm or disrupt the school or school function campus or school sponsored activity including but not limited to threats made verbally or non-verbally by actors social media or by text this is a better way that we can track with the actual threats to a school property continuing on with level 4 offenses and 4 F drugs again there are some confusion with drug paraphernalia it was located under 40 other so we've pulled that up into 4 F drug possession use and we've added language to say the possession solicitation or use of illegal or illicit drugs being under
011the influence of illegal or illicit drugs or any other substance capable of modifying mood or behavior the possession or use of any substance represented to b7h nature or the possession of drug paraphernalia possession of over-the-counter medication is in excess of the manufacturers prescribed limits may be treated as mood altering substances again we've for the elementary we've also added or possession of drug paraphernalia in 4f so we've added language to 4h firearms we've included destructive devices and the language reads the possession use or control of any destructive device or firearm operable inoperable loaded or unloaded as defined in Chapter seven ninety Florida Statutes and there's a list of criteria under that under that for iron seeding and seeding and sighting sorry inciting leading or participating in a major act which subsequently or substantially disrupts the orderly
012conduct we've taken out of school or school function and added of a school campus or school-sponsored activity we also felt that we've taken out language that said this may also include social media threats because we've moved threats all under either the for either or the foresee and incidents with multiple or any false accusation made by a student that jeopardizes the professional reputation employment or professional certification of any OCPs employee we've actually taken that out of 4i because feedback that we received led us to think that it would better fit under forty other so we've taken explosives out of for K other weapons because it's under destructive devices for H so in forty we've just added the language that we took from for I we've strike the this may include hate crimes or a possession of
013drug paraphernalia because we move that to four F or any false at and we've added or any false accusation made by a student that jeopardizes the professional reputation employment or professional certification of any OCPs employee we've added language into for you drug distribution selling and buying to include transmission we were getting challenged by some attorneys about transmission so we've decided to add that language in for procedures for level four offenses there was a timeline that is in the current code that all discipline team meetings have to be done within the ten days of suspension that's not in statute so we've taken that language out to give us a little more flexibility we've also added language to include but not limited to personnel that is needed for those meetings and it basically says include but not
014limited to a counselor school psychologists admin Dean or positive pathways transition Center staff under the procedures for students who commit serious acts of misconduct eligible for services under IDE a suspension removal the language has been added that states the discipline team meeting should occur in conjunction with a manifestation meeting if the behavior may be a level-4 offense also under the procedures for a level 4 offense step 3 we've taken out level 3 and then we've added in in some cases it is appropriate for a discipline IEP team meeting to convene for a level 3 offense to conduct a manifestation determination step 5 the language was removed that says if OCPs the parent and relevant members of the IEP team - just if the IEP team and then under step 8 this student will was changed
015to the student may remain in the current placement during the pendency of the proceedings unless another agreement is reached between the parties and then the language under stay put was implemented saying stay put during the proceedings will be in accordance with the discipline IEP team decision under points of clarification currently reads had knowledge and it's being changed to knew or should have known and that's in and that's in federal law thank you and then under procedures for students who commit serious acts of misconduct eligible under section 504 and the American was Americans with Disability Act or removing an offense of possession and adding and changing other students to non-disabled students the next steps we are actually at the rule development workshops but revisions to the revisions to the internal procedures provide training to internal and
016external customers provide clear delineation of duties and responsibilities training for internal OCPs employees regarding revisions to policies and new procedures and again and because of the just as a reminder the Averett the riad vert Iseman of the of the new language I believe the rule development workshop will come back to will be on May 31st if I'm not mistaken further clarification as well a chairman and members of the board for your understanding you gave a significant feedback around adjusting some of the length of suspension or referral to positive pathways and we actually have those as administrative issues however we will be bringing you an update on that as well we'll be briefing board members and getting you an update still in process but we've taken into account all of your concerns where 180 days may
017have seemed excessive and cutting those back to 90 days will bring those to you separately they're not actually a part of the policy chairman we're happy to entertain any questions and hear your discussion discovered thank you really good job cleaning up some of these gray areas so you have some current events where where these new policies will really come in handy so thank you just a couple of questions we have page numbers on jic Code of Student Conduct under the zero-tolerance for school related violent crime because mental health services identified by the school district so does that mean we are referring to specific mental health services to specific persons can we clarify that a little bit yes so this the statute it's funny because its actually very broad in the Senate bill that authorized many
018of these changes is very broad and didn't quite offer much clarification so we had a conversation with dr. Vasquez and we know that she also is indicated we need to meet to figure out what exactly that means how that works and so she's been in the process of meeting with you know different mental health professionals and I guess there's a team for that force yeah task force of getting that information together and so that's one that's gonna have to roll out once we obtain some additional information but that's the legislative language and so we're trying to make sure we're in compliance gotcha well that's that's where sometimes their language causes us more work so that is something that needs to be clarified so notice of limited responsibility for supervising students says nothing in this section
019precludes OCPs from administering discipline for acts or behavior that occur on OCPs property what about acts or behavior they occur off OCPs property but at a school sponsored event yes so we currently take jurisdiction for those matters essentially wherever we go whether it's a prom homecoming extracurricular event or activity whether we've had field trips out of out of state out of town those actually become OCPs property for the sake of our Code of Student Conduct so the student commits those offenses we will discipline them as well okay so just a little worried about that being a gray area or something that someone might challenge sure dr. Jenkins so I want to make sure everyone's clear on that it's an excellent point so in this particular section we are trying to deal with supervision of students
020so a parent drops a kid off or a kid hangs around campus and school has been over for an hour that we are not responsible for the supervision and so in this particular instance we're saying that doesn't mean there won't be discipline administered if you check a brick through a window while you're hanging around can so not responsible for your supervision because you're way beyond student hours but if something happened while you're hanging around just because we're not responsible for supervising you doesn't mean you can't get into trouble if you do something on our property weekends after hours etc thank you under level four offenses when it talks about drug possession and adding drug paraphernalia what about alcohol or is that included in mood altering substances it's included it's actually a separate category on its
021own okay and the last question on also under level for offenses on drugs transmission distribution selling or buying what is transmission interesting we've had quite a few cases as I'm sure the board is aware of drug related incidents and so in the past couple of years we've had quite a few criminal defense attorneys who represent students in saying that when a student is almost serving as what would be deemed the middle person in a drug transaction apparently that's viewed as transmission and so we've had some lawyers try to find to circumvent our policy by saying well no my client wasn't buying distributing or selling they were transmitting the drugs to the next point and so that's why we've just said you know we'll go ahead and close that loophole yeah anything that's included as part
022of a drug transaction okay thank you good job you guys thank you Miss Gould I know when that when we were doing the briefing we talked about communication could you tell me how these policies are communicated to the public for these changes what's the process just to review that sure so are you talking outside of just for the community meaning how our parents notified of these policy changes so we have two community meetings in beware the month of February prior as we're collecting you know input from the community and from from schools and parents and so every school has invited the schools push out information to their parents so we advertise that there's two meetings and then the price we send it to the principals the parentals principals can disseminate it amongst their staff and
023do a connect to Orange if they choose to do so to their parents and community to get the word out that there there are these meetings I was asking them how many people had showed up at the community meeting with a district of almost two hundred and ten thousand people and this is always a hot topic throughout the year I don't think we're doing enough to communicate these community meetings for community input and there's times where the policies were reviewing are probably not as interesting but I have to believe this year with the changes that were made that we should have had some people showing up and so I would like us to look at being a little bit more thorough and taking advantage of all of our communication options when the code of conduct
024policy on all policies but especially this one maybe just go in the extra mile and making it more so I'd like to have somebody consider consider that with the communication you know with all the activities especially on the front of the mental health and the in school safety it's it's incongruent I also wanted I know we're bringing this back and I don't want to be lenient on kids that are doing the wrong thing but another question that I had for them when when we were in the briefing is about pulling the fire alarm pulling a fire alarm and threatening to shoot up a school or bomb a school to me does not have the same wait it's bad both things are bad but you know the punishment of of it always being a level four
025in 180 days is that equivalent when you look at the threat of threatening true life or being very mischievous and I know that we need to keep it strong especially when we have law enforcement and fire trucks and such showing up and we're disrupting an entire school and there could be some accidents as kids are exiting the school and those kinds of things but is that equitable and I'm not sure it is in the in the punishment rolls so what I'd like to request is to see if there is any language maybe that we can benchmark against to see if there's language in other districts that treat those two threats a little differently but still when it when necessary it can be a level 4 but a level 4 with 180 days of expulsion for
026that and 11 for 180 days expulsion when you threaten you know to come in and it just doesn't seem that cold a bit to me I'd like to hear what my other board members thoughts on that - well you know all the way and I would agree that someone should be looked at oh yeah yeah I think you all know that I'm always in support of discretion you know we've had numerous debates up here about what discretion and what should be just spelled out in black and white and but you know that's just my philosophical bent if it gives it superintendent and are just plenty more discretion something I support I just do I trust our discipline team I trust a superintendent I'm not sure that example I necessarily agree with but there are other
027examples I can think of over the years where you know I thought our punishments were unduly harsh and me be a ninety-day would have been more appropriate or I can't remember why it's not legally permitted there's a reason why it's nagging at me in the back of my head but I've always said you know why can't we suspend for 30 days and said it's just ten or full expulsion you know why is there no in-between yeah this is Robinson I'm not for discretion as long as it's handed out equally and equitably that's the problem when you don't spell it out specifically then you run the risk of discretion being one thing over here and discretion being something different over here so it hat I think it has to be spelled out we just have to
028just decide what we think the spelling out should be because it you have to have something you follow and you these the folks that are dealing with it now might have discretion and then it turns over it and five years different people have different discussions so I think there has it has to be spelled out so I hope Jenkins Thank You chairman I appreciate both ends of the argument here's the thing on fire alarms in particular I believe those are actually considered pretty significant crimes when law enforcement is actually engaged if you recall part of the issue with the school shooting included the use of an alarm to create havoc and so I'm probably I think we have other examples when we tell you how we're trying to adjust on those 90 day versus 180
029days we're trying to stick with semester for grades and for credits for our high school students I think you'll be pleased to see some of those adjustments we've made based on your feedback I'm a little hesitant on the pulling of that fire alarm because it was used specifically to put children in danger and could certainly be used that way in the future we don't take that lightly in law enforcement in fact won't take it lightly but but the adjustments that we're making around the 90 day versus the 180 days I think you'll be pleased with and it still helps our students be able to achieve their credits this is Robinson well in and in that line of thinking of the law enforcement the cost associated with a law enforcement coming out to the scene you
030know I've heard in some cases that they want to charge the people because it took their resources and their time and then if there was a real crisis down the road there at this crisis that isn't really a crisis but that's where they have to be so that's to me that's the danger or not danger but the problem with with the pulling of the fire alarm when there's really not a fire it's cool and I and I understand that too it's just when you look at those in those may be the extreme examples and there's other things that we were talking about with that with that discretionary but one is if it's not an association or in cooperation with with another of them like a shooting which I don't want to go on a witch
031hunt for kids either and in a lump all kids together because one has a excuse the expression but a brain part you know that day versus the mischievous intent it's still an intent to cause mischief I know and I know there's an expense too it's just those those two things are so dramatically different but it sounds like we're addressing some of those concerns and giving a little bit more I don't even want to call it discretion but really taking into account the testimony the the background are the children they're their record etc etc etc so that satisfies me dr. Jenkins I don't want to mislead the board and the provisions we have are adjusting the days of expulsion or turning to placement based on certain offenses I do not want to convey that we are
032talking about adjusting those times of expulsion or alternative placement based on referrals or references or other issues that might sway us but I think the adjustments that you see in our matrix you will be pleased that we've heard you talking about bringing them down to 90 days but it's not because of reference letters or what's the character references and such or great it's really because we believe it's it would be appropriate based on your feedback in our review of the information to narrow down how long a child is out of school for certain offenses and I think you'll see that when we bring it to you which I look forward to seeing I'm glad you're looking at it dr. Jane can say I really am you know I you know if in my perfect world
033there would be language in our Code of Student Conduct that a mitigating factor could be a student's prior record some have said that for a year such as my philosophical bent again you know a kid who takes hurdles and puts them out on a busy road in his junior year who has a stellar record and not a single disciplinary offense in this entire 11 years of school before that merits different treatment to me then a kid who stills an iphone who has five prior disciplinary offences for stealing five prior iPhones and engaging and fighting and has a rap sheet as long as his arm I just I just you know that's the way I believe in I guess maybe it's my background as an attorney when you go to sentencing as an attorney your prior
034record matters you know you're gonna get a longer sentence if you have five prior felonies then you are if you have a spotless record and it's your first offense that's just sort of an inherent assumption in the criminal justice system and I've always said and that's why you know sometimes I've advocated against the administration's right me the prior record of a child does matter in certain offenses you pull a gun on a teacher you bring a gun to school I don't care if you're a Phi Beta Kappa National Honor Society 4.7 valedictorian your class I want you thrown out of school for full expulsion or if you hit a teacher I want you thrown out of school for a full expulsion or you know beat the living Dickens out of another student in a in
035a locker room at a high school and it's on video using another real-world example I've got no sympathy for you but you know and you all know what I'm talking about you've been on the board a while you take hurdles and put them in the road and it's just a dumb thing to do it and you know and so and so chairman yeah sorry so I absolutely agree with you I just want to make sure I'm clear and your example we would want a student who put hurdles in the road at a different school to have the same discipline as the one that did it at a particular school okay okay yeah yes so but if they did this if they both put hurdles in the road ones had a couple of other discipline events
036and the other has not they still put hurdles in the middle of a busy road and so in that instance we just want to be consistent and you know and that's we're know you know what you know you know reasonable Minds just your again it's just your approach to justice that's where I differ you know if you put hurdles in the road and you have a stellar record then I want you to treat it better than if you put hurdles in the road and you have a rap sheet as long as my arm I just I think prior behavior should be taken into account as a mitigating factor mrs. Gordon Thank You mr. chairman III guess I'm the oldest up here and so I'm just gonna take press I'm just going to take some privilege
037here hurdles in the road I was on the board when the hurdles in the road came before the board this hurts my heart when I hear lawyers speak about the first second and third offenses this is just a horrible everybody has a burst of dents and then it turns into a second offense and it turns into a third bit my heart just pained a minute ago when I heard that because because that's why you have more minorities in jail you just said it all just a minute ago we cannot go with this kind of thinking when are we going to change an offense is an offense state what you want but I'd be dull but we gonna sit up here and give favors because it was their first offense let me point this out the
038hurdle and the road could have killed somebody in one second what we don't thought of it I don't want to know I don't want to know I'm trying to get us to think deeper than a lawyer think like a mother think like a an experienced teacher that works in a discipline school where I have right now 400 great kids but somebody killed somebody but that child is getting ready to graduate right now and somebody brought up the devil you know he's my son is here but but he has an offense he broke into that lady house he has three three times against him oh my god yes but in offense is an offense and we as a board must treat the offenses and not the stuff piled up on our children we can't even get
039the balance to boat after you put them in jail and and now their rights can't even be restored after they have served their time one day you may be in jail for nothing you're running to the wrong policeman and before you know it you in jail and you didn't do a thing please stop looking at incident like that's the best kid in the world every kid that comes before us every child that comes before us is the best child in the world we have got to look at children as children offenses defenses I don't care they're rich or poor I don't care what nationality they are I ain't no writing up and down on me I'm gonna do you like you do me please don't write anything down and you thought I wasn't gonna say
040anything tonight but I cannot let you sit up here this board and think and say what you are saying say what you want the offense to be but don't give leniency how are you going to get leniency to one child and not the other I'll fight you until I leave this board you cannot give me nnessee to one family and not to another because it was the first offense every offense is a first offense that goes before a judge I'm sorry I was gonna keep my mouth shut but y'all kept talking and I counted the number of times you talk back and forth back and forth I've waited my turn it is now 528 you made a little comment when you came in or will leave early now no you're not not until I have
041my safe and you say something else I'm gonna say something else because it's no way in the world you could fix it you've got to look at every child that comes before us you can't even hold what a child did in the past yes you can count that but you gotta look at right at the child why is this child continuing to get into trouble what are you gonna do as a judge what are you gonna do as a lawyer to try to stir these kids in the right direction how did that child get there you went to my counselor mode now how did that child get before that judge that many times and why was that child before that judge now I'm serious about this doggone corner student kinda just spend my baby since
042I've been on this board and before I came on this board and was Katie Adams that brought the code here a black woman brought the code here because she's showing justice that's how we got this call and I've been following it since 1968 and I hadn't let up yet and I've spoken before you sports before coming on this board about the injustice of this cold and now we are finally getting the code to not show favoritism and to not show because the child first offense I understand first offense in a courtroom and that's why so many wrong people are in jail because you I did something wrong and you blame me well you've done it before so let me put your behind back in jail I have no leniency on you oh but somebody else
043will come before the board come before a lawyer and you show leniency it's not about the leniency it's about and posting your code just say it I argument Ric Rhodes that entire time he was on this board with me say what you want to say do what you want to do but make sure it's equal distribution please I don't want us to talk that way because people will use it they will do like they've been doing in the past come with their lawyers come with their suits these children I killed somebody they not shot somebody I don't even want to bring up the winner part stuff you don't even hear it in the news but let somebody get killed near Jones Oh Bridget Evans all over the radio when they killed somebody near Jones and
044Oklahoma the boy came from boy graduated from Jo and fifty years ago oh never hear that baboon oh but some crap goes on at Boone and how well do we know how it goes on because we see the Code of Student Conduct on our desk you can get angry it would not matter I will fight you to a tee on the Code of Student Conduct we have got to be fair we are not fair I've seen this board vote down recommendations and brag about it we're the board yours crazy because when you bought something down you just vote down what you passed on this is the purpose the session change it now mr. chair change it now if you want something changed now is the work session to do it in because once we change
045it we're suppose enforce it but we get up then you want to go along with mr. Blanco just bragging that the didn't you have your a good good family we're gonna we can overturn the soup it's not the superintendent's recommendation it's the board stop that we're going to enforce so we can have a safe and pleasant school but these children who make mistake to grow up in so please it just hurts my heart and I'm sorry you brought up the hurdle ahead you're not brought the hurdle out the hurdle was wrong I could have been on that dawn road and got killed with that stupid game he played anybody it could have been a pile up like on 520 this morning all of people got killed don't just let's be fair equity must be in
046this code of conduct and as dr. Jenkins say it don't forget if you do it the one first offense for black Haitian Hispanic any kind of Latino any part we've had good kids to come other nationalities it's not who could afford a lawyer and that's what the school board has been about before any of you said in the seats that you are sitting in it was all about who could get the lawyer let's not make it that let's try to get to the public like my school mentioned get the public involved the public supposed to be here and give their input parents supposed to say it you might need you might need to do a parent committee you may need to pull parents together from each district every school it's not that many you might
047want to pull a high school group together we pull up a rivalry team together why not why don't we pull high-school team together to come and we did it before when we didn't have a great Code of Student Conduct I remember my kids from the elementary school they told what kind of a penalty they were gonna get maybe we need to go back to that and let the children decide on the penalty then it wasn't no black/white situation it was everybody that put the hurdle in the road everybody got the same thing it wasn't that it was that first offense it was that they put the hurdle in the road that's all mr. chairman you can get mad doesn't mouth it matter I'd know how to handle it been married over 30 something years got
048three children I think I've raised so it's nothing you can say that I will not count Iraq because we as a board got to stop thinking like we're in a court of law we're not in a court of law we're in a school that's trying to be fair and if we're not gonna be there and we're gonna begin to look at first offense yes we can but put it in the code then you're gonna be in a hell of a lot of things mrs. Robinson to follow up on my comments from earlier about discretion it goes along with this concept of first offense second offense third offense it has to be in the code what the first offense is if you if if we want to as a board establish that's why we're here if
049we want to establish the amount of time that a student gets off campus or in an alternative setting for a specific item now's when we say it we just can't leave it to discretion we can't leave it to others it has to be in codified in this policy if we want to go to the trouble to say everyone's first offense 4x will be this and then we want to say second offense but you can't you can't take away a punishment from someone who's done an offense they've made they've done the offense regardless of what it is who they are they've done it they get the Code of Student Conduct discipline we want to then add on okay second offense same thing then we add on more third offense if we want to do that if
050you can't you can't remove we can't expect to remove an offense for someone who's just done something wrong there has to be a discipline that's why we have the code but if we really if you on your line of thinking if you want to to make the punishment harsher for a second or a third offense then now is the time we can have that conversation and decide that but a child stealing regardless of what they stole is stealing and in two year and and actually from that threat that situation that we were referencing we actually changed the situation in our code that if a child brings it back there's less of a discipline so we did actually there that some positive did come out of that so now now is the time to have the
051conversation let's have the conversation if we want to have a harsher sentence for a second and a third offense of the same nature let's talk about that thank you mrs. Robinson so you know one of the one of the hallmarks of any representative democracy whether it's a legislature of school board of county commission or Congress's hearing things that you may not agree with without getting emotionally exercised about the disagreement and just realizing you're just going to agree to disagree and if you can't do that it's very hard to serve in elected office not everything has to be World War three and you know the viewpoint of its spouse is the same viewpoint of its spouse for eight years and I'll tell you what it's going to be the same viewpoint all spouse for another eight
052years and every time we have this disagreement in this dispute always remarked to mr. Rodriguez and it's and I think it's you know I don't think you have to be a lawyer to understand its concept it's just a fundamental debate and in in in systems of legal justice what discretion to give a judge what mitigating factors do you take into account do you have a system of law where it's the whole Sentencing Guidelines debate for lawyers do you have a system of law where every sentence is uniform for various offenses or do you give judicial discretion and there's no right answer it's just a matter of opinion where you fall on that debate I fall on the side of giving discretion to judges and giving discretion into boards I will say this has nothing to
053do with race or socioeconomic status just as she's supposed to be blind and when I sit up here the justice that I seek to administer is blind and when I can think of the six to ten times and I'm sort of thinking through examples of my mind up here on the board when sometimes I've left the chart sometimes I've joined the charge to go against the superintendent's recommendation and it's not disagreeing with the super-dense just I think that a lesser punishment was warranted or I've advocated successfully the six to ten times and there have been at least six to ten times the my ears on the board where we have lessened a disciplinary measure recommended by staff and they're doing their job and when I think of those six to ten times if my memory
054as often as not it was an african-american who is subject to that discipline or somebody from a poor family or someone from a school that is a poor socio-economic population and by the way I feel the same thing about employee discipline matters there have been a number of times when I've gone to bat for employees I can think of a certain bus driver who had a 25 year employment history and a stellar driving record and never committed offense before and I went too bad for that employee to keep their job because I think somebody's job is very serious I will proudly I don't think it's bragging I will proudly continue to advocate no matter how much heartburn it may cause other members of the board for either ameliorating sentences or arguing for discretion or arguing
055and using every power of persuasion I have and more often than not I've been successful my ears on the board to lesson a discipline handed out to a student or to an employee I will continue to believe proudly and will continue to proudly stated to audiences that we have a system of governance we're coming before this board is nothing but a kangaroo court where there's no chance of ever overturning the decision or the recommendation of the superintendent whether it's an employee or a student that I think we lose credibility and I'm proud of this board every time we advocate for a student based upon whatever factors and I will proudly continue to advocate for students who have stellar records before and it's a first offense and if that concept of looking at a person's record
056bothers any individuals I respect that I truly do I do though however ruin regret the fact that those individuals who don't like that concept must have tremendous heartburn over the entire juvenile justice and criminal justice system of our country every system of justice in our country juvenile justice or criminal justice looks at prior records you go in on a juvenile offense to juvenile courts and I know what I speak of I've been a juvenile advocate for years they will look at the prior offenses you have the prior arrests you have and what a level of facility you get sent to or what program you get sent to you go to sentencing in Criminal Court they will look at your prior record so for me no matter how much heartburn or emotional consternation and angst and
057hand-wringing and hair-pulling and every whatever else it may cost somebody yes I will continue to look at that student's record whether they come from abject poverty whether they're African American Asian Hispanic or white regardless of race color creed or socioeconomic status because I think that students records should matter in the discipline that we hand out in certain situations other situations not necessarily other situations I think are immutable it doesn't matter what your record is I'm going to support throwing the book at you but there are many many other situations beyond the hurdle one I don't want to further flame things but I could come up with a half-dozen other situations where we have gone to bat for students and ironically sometimes some of the folks to get stuff said about it or leading the charge
058to go to bat for that person because it's a good kid and seems unduly harsh and I know it's nothing I'm ashamed I'm not proud of that's why I'm up here why I ran for this office it's cool and the work members just so nobody's offended I truly have to be somewhere at six o'clock so it's 543 so at 5:00 till 6:00 no matter who's speaking or what thought they're in I have to get up and walk out of this room so it's no offense to any of you all if you're in mid-sentence and 15 minutes I have to leave in this cold I think I started this conversation so my intent is at the basis of what you've all spoken about I also want to make sure that we're fair and that we give
059every every single student and child the opportunity to be successful and there are times I have walked out with the feeling that we may not have done what was in the best interest of that child so I do want to find the right words in our code of conduct and policy to make sure that there is that consistency I do think that we have to look at the whole child each and every single time I may not use the right words when I'm describing that but that's my core belief is that we have to look at the whole child and their circumstance every single time and even going back to the hurdle one because that was my very first one so I was traumatized by it my very first one on the board of course
060yeah and you know that one was that group mentality and our and our policy was not as clear as it is today that so that was the reason you know for that one but neither here nor there on that is last five years ago now wow that's amazing but I do think that we just have to find ways and that's why I was asking if there might be some other bench mark policies out there where they have looked at the nuances of these situations but they can be outlined in the code of conduct and give the proper guidelines so there's not wiggle room for what's that called unbiased or biased unconscious bias I'm conscious thank you mrs. Corney unconscious bias but you know I think we have to be aware of that in both in
061every direction possible whether you're talking about a wealthy white kid or a poor black kid or a wealthy black kid or a Hispanic kid or a girl or a boy or transgender or any of those things you know it has to be clear but at the end of the day we have to making sure we're doing what's in the best interest of that student as well as the safety and security of our schools that's that's my only point Thank You mr. chair I'll go quickly cuz I don't want you to miss not one morsel of what I'm going to be tasting on here basically Thank You mrs. gool for bringing it all up thank you very much I do want this board to understand that we are not a judicial system we're not the knight
062traditional court nor the 11th or any other we're not the Supreme Court we our school board members trying to enforce a simple code of conduct we are not in a courtroom with balance we do not handle felons at the school board there is a court system that would handle it and I pray the day that we do not put the school system in the hands of a federal court I mean I've got all my heart and soul because we do have a heart and love for children we do not sentence children that are balanced when you get to court you have doing something way past the court of school Code of Student Conduct so I do want us to keep in mind let me share something with you my colleague mentioned is eight years on
063the board let me just mention my 18 years on the board in my 50 years of teaching and Orange and Osceola County 51 now 51 years let me say this everybody knows how emotional I am and I don't want anybody on this board to take my loudness which I consider a gift to try to tear me down because we'd never tear me down the more I hear people talk about my loudness because they are solved however I've seen them get blown up I've seen the President of the United States blow up I've seen Congress blow up I've seen senators blow up I've seen judges get kicked off the bench I will never change my style don't hate me or dislike me or trying to put me down because I disagree in a way you did
064not like we can be disagreeable but we can all come together because we all gonna cast one and only one person up here gets a chance to cast to which I consider is still unfair I want to say this there's no world walk up here because I'm loud there's a world war because I'm making thunder to make sure it doesn't get to a wall because if I'm not vocal and what I need to stand of who I represent and it appeared that I have been elected over and over again because I must be doing something right and I don't even want to count the number of children I've taught in my 51 years and I really don't want to count how many times I've been reelected and when I get ready to go I'm going
065and I'm gonna dance on a pole behind this chair that's how I plan to go out I will leave when I want to leave but I will fight the bite to the end with a loud voice because they always say black people like to be heard and they think we allow what I happen to not be a quiet Negro I will be loud I will voice my opinion whether you like it or not I am NOT a quiet Negro and because I disagree with what you say I respect you mr. chairman that you have the right to say it and I feel bad that you feel it is a defense you said it I contracted you've kind of wrapped it again it's okay and when I walked out here tonight I still love you because
066I'm through with it that's the way I do with my kids at home that's what I do at school and I pretty much have been very successful I haven't been fired but one time and that was because I was pregnant and it helped every teacher in the state of Florida to have a baby whatever they want in the school on the steps because Kat Gordon went to a principal at dream lake and not dream like Englewood and told her that I was expecting a baby and she said you will not last what she didn't Lance and all of us go back to Englewood and we celebrate so everybody has a fight in the union thank me because you can't tell I got a lawyer and a doctor and anybody can have a baby how they
067want and it because of me and a lot of people don't know that so you may not like my demeanor which is fine cuz I'm not gonna be the little black girl I am very vocal I told you I went to jail for marching for freedom so I am tough I know I'm tough and I will fight the fight until the end so we our children are not felons they're not in a court system and I think what we need to decide is how we're gonna do it not the only way we normally change our policy and both superintendents have been excellent about this board members if they bring new information it's not cutting goal it's not a kangaroo court I will not sit on a kangaroo court it is what we are trying to
068do you couldn't have lived under zero tolerance you wouldn't made it under zero tolerance the majority of my time on this board with zero tolerance that's why I went to the national school board and looked into restorative justice and as this board to considerate so I'm just as much a fighter everybody on this board is a fighter but I want everybody on this board to know we are not we are not fighting felons we're fighting children mrs. Robinson we're fighting for children I like that miss Gordon thank you and I want to make a point that the reason in my mind that the Code of Student Conduct is so important and it has to be something that isn't there isn't crazy discrepancy here and there is because we're fighting for the children that don't come
069before us the ones that get the discipline handed to them and they just accept it and go they aren't the ones that came before us so it has to be equitable across the whole every single discipline that the people that follow this policy has to be equitable because there's a lot of them that don't even come before us so I'm actually I see the importance of it more for the children that don't come before us that get the discipline so thank you and let me ask who's dr. Jenkins how long you been with the Lawrence County School Board or district I know you left for Charlotte let me see I was in Charlotte for a tu something I started I was in Florida for eight and I was in Charlotte for eight years I've been
070back now for 11 when did you start I guess that's a better way of asking it 84 okay do we have a Code of Student Conduct in 1984 no I don't believe so okay it's been under miss Adams yeah oh students disciplined when he started so that was back when the earth was cooling I don't want to answer so here's my here's my only point I'm not an educational historian we can get mrs. Robinson your point all government systems have to have codes of conduct and this school board I'll buy a steak dinner if I'm wrong this school board had a discipline code back in 1965 it had one in 1950 it probably had one in 1980 I'm certain I had I buy you a steak dinner from wrong that they had won back in
0711930 you can't operate without some kind of discipline code so there's no disputing that you have to have a discipline code but the question before us is when you exercise discretion and how much Harper and it will cause you know some to exercise discretion we will continue to exercise discretion I mean it is what it is I guarantee you after I'm gone in the fall if I follow it you all will sometimes deviate from the superintendent's recommendation again next year the year after that and I think you did it before I got on this board so it's not a radical thought and it just is what standard y'all bring to it and I think that's the point this bullet started this would that she was trying to make in one that I was trying to
072buttress and your points well-taken we have offered discretion at this board table that's why I'm saying though the students that don't come before us they need that's why we have to have we have to have I had code okay yes am i'm up Thank You mr. chair and if you're going out to do I'm loud enough for you to hear me let's not worry about where it started I said Katie Adams helped to formulate this Code of Student Conduct don't tell me about the history dr. Gingka ain't even born when I was here okay I came here in in 65 and scouted the system came back to teach in 68 I think I had the senior already up in I'm just gonna say it but for the chair to ask that is it's insulting because
073I knew when they started formulating I was in the Union still in it and was one of the top officers there when Ulysses worth fighting for all of the things we were trying to get for bargaining so I know when the cold really evolved and farm go in search of dr. Jenkins you go in and search it for him you do that for your chairman because if we're gonna argue about little stuff like that to try to put somebody now you can't put me down because we have the one who put Katie Adams in the chair and Katie stayed and just as long as I'm in okay so looking up dr. Jenkins and give it to me quickly I've met fact I'd like to get it tomorrow so your department needs to get on the
074ball okay we had a cold and indecent code when I came in 68 I was under the cold hot Duncan yes that I was a teacher at Orange Center in 1968 how dumb and he's gonna turn in ask dr. Jenkins let's not argue about who was who nobody was up here longer than me at any school okay so you give let's stop it why we want to discredit each other when people have when you have the authority and you know that was always some kind of governance in the school but it did not begin to formulate until Katie Adams got on the board they were messing her with it that's why eating veal and never got together Nancy that's why you don't have nothing going that's why hundreds and hundreds of acres have taken away
075out of Eatonville because of the previous board when they got that land back in the 50s people we all travel back and forth the little old Florida which was hardly nothing but you know what I'm just saying that the chairman you know would bring up he sounds like President Trump and I'm just saying it be everybody get angry but you got to stop this hatred everybody up here is trying to speak camaraderie ship and trying to speak love and try to look out for the children they're not jailbirds they're just committing things stupid things I've got a school full of kids that have done some stupid things these are honor student they were gifted they just did certain things but you gotta have some kind of code to punish and that's what this school board
076has done and this is one of the best codes of Student Conduct in the nation I know with the other districts ass I know what they have and this is one of the best and you have worked extremely hard as a team you know how hard you work and you sit with each of us and get input then there's another team that sits with each of us and give input okay so he said he was gonna leave at 6:00 it is 559 madam chair I thank you for listening board members thank you I'm in agreement with everything you said school board member goal thank you for your tenacity I thank you I thank Miss Robinson for her speaking up and you too Miss COBIT for your speaking up because if we don't do it imagine
077and if we don't set the peas imagine what's gonna happen so thank you so very much thank you miss Gordon the only comment I'm gonna make is that I agree with mrs. Gordon as far as her point of consistency its consistency we do have discretion when our students or employees come before us and I think that the superintendent is going to resolve some of our questions through her administrative packets that we'll see soon and that's all I have to say is there any more comment or discussion madam chair we had one correction that staff needs to make on one of those slides just so we're clear it's really not critical as we'll be bringing back the code again with it being riad ver ties with that correction that we'd spoken to you about one additional
078correction if you would share with us thank you under the procedures for students who commit serious acts of misconduct for 504 students in a DA we crossed out use or and that's an error it should say the possession piece should be crossed out so it should read the student may be disciplined in the same manner as non-disabled students for use of illegal drugs or alcohol so instead of say possession I should say use Thank You superintendent is that all for the Ute thank you then we're adjourned thank you