001[laughter] I was like >> So, are these already on? Um, that one is Joe's. I don't know anything about it. This one is ours and I'm turning it on now. >> I was trying to save batteries, but >> I knew this three was picking up some audio. So, >> okay, we're good. You had goes along with your age and we all want different Everybody, >> spend about two or three hours. John always I don't know anybody. Let me call Randy. [laughter] Yep. >> Which one to call? >> Okay, Randy, I've got you on speaker phone, so we're getting ready to open the meeting. >> Okay. [laughter] >> Yes. Are you on? >> I will be. >> Are you on? Mark, >> I'm on. Mark, >> you're on for me. Thank you. >> We all get
002>> Okay, we're going to go ahead and open our special meeting of the Wayne County Board of Education. It is uh 503. And if you'll stand, we'll say the pledge. >> Flag's in the back. >> I'll lead us this evening. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. [clears throat] >> Let the record show that all board members are present in person except uh Mr. Troutwine who's joining us by phone this evening. And we will um start our meeting out with our CRM preK8 hearing and we want to thank you all for coming this evening. Uh tonight's hearing is being held in accordance with West Virginia West Virginia code 185 uh-13A
003which sets the process that the board must follow uh when a school closure or consolidation is being considered. And this um purpose of this hearing is for public input. Uh your board members will not be responding to any individual comments this evening. We just ask that you uh follow a few simple guidelines. If you're speaking, just state your name and your connection to the school. Uh direct your comments to the board and each speaker will have up to five minutes uh to speak. So if we have any questions, we'll direct those to our superintendent or to our directors that are here and try to clear those up for you. [snorts] So we'll turn it over to Mr. Alexander to open the hearing. >> Yes. Um so we had a public hearing yesterday evening um at
004Dunlow and um the the purpose of these hearings is to consider the closure um or consolidation of Dunlow Elementary and Genanoa Elementary. And the reason that uh we're considering this is because enrollment in the district in the last decade has dropped 1,600 students, which is the population of nine of our current buildings. And financially, it's necessary to reduce the footprint, reduce the number of buildings that we're operating uh to make sure that our finances stay in order. Our unrestricted fund balance at at the end of the last fiscal year was at 1.8 8 million and that is below the recommended percentage that the uh that the state um wants the county to have in cases of emergency. It is also necessary to free up money uh for uh future projects uh replacement of bleachers um
005construction projects that are scheduled to begin. uh we have to free up additional dollars to be able to uh afford our cost matching for those projects. [snorts] When you look at how much we are spending per school, the per pupil cost by school, Genanoa Elementary and Dunlow Elementary have the highest uh have the highest per pupil spends in the district. The district averages spending around $15,000 per student. At Genanoa Elementary, we're spending over 20 uh I'm sorry, over 2,000 per student. And at um or I'm sorry, over 20,000 per student. And at Dunlow Elementary, we are averaging spending about 1 eight,000 per student above that $15,000 mark. Um the uh reason is and it's through nobody's fault but there's just with less students that that is u with less students that drives up the cost
006for every person that works at that facility for utilities etc. And so the state those are state numbers and again the district is around 15,000 with Genanoa being over 20,000 and Dunlow Elementary being at 18,000. Our largest schools are which are the most costefficient. Cerita Canova Elementary is below the county average of 15,000. Spring Valley High School is below that average of 15,000. So all that is weighed into the consideration of which schools to recommend for closure. Um the as the and the problem isn't just the enrollment at Janoa and Dunlow. The problem is the enrollment of the district overall. Because enrollment is dropping at almost every single one of our locations, we have seen the cost of personnel that is charged to the local budget continue to increase. So the way the school funding
007formula works is the state pays for positions based upon the number of students that you have. The less students you have, the less positions they pay for. any positions that are above and beyond what they pay for um have to be paid for by the district. So in 2021, the district was paying approximately $5 million out of local funds for pos uh for those positions that were out of formula. We had less positions in 2024. We had less people employed in the district, but the costs out of local funds to the district had risen to 9 million just because we were receiving less funds from the state and had to take that burden on to local funds. In 2025, we reduced uh positions in the uh in the district and the cost lowered to 8.5
008million. But with a loss of 220 students in this year's October enrollment figure, that number is projected again to be above 9 million unless there are cuts made during this personnel season. Again, we've talked about the uh enrollment drop. The enrollment drop has been projected and it the decline has been steeper than what what was originally projected, but we are projected to lose enrollment for the next decade. uh based upon birth rates and death rates. So the death rates are exceeding the birth rates and so the population isn't as big as the county which impacts the schools populations. So what that has resulted in is the state recommends that that buildings be utilized at an 80 to 85% number. Now the way they calculate that they take the number of classrooms they calculate a certain
009number of students per classroom and then they multiply that out and the number of students they count per classroom depends upon uh the uh grade level. So in kindergarten it's 20 students per classroom. First and second grade it's 23 students per classroom and then the number goes up as you get into the higher grades. So based upon those utilization calculations, the schools that we are having hearings uh this week are at the following utilization levels. And again, I want you to keep in mind that the state recommends an 80 to 85% utilization level. Dunlow Elementary is at 23%. Genanoa Elementary is at 38%. Wayne Elementary, closest to the uh actual recommendations, is at 76%. Crumb PreK through 8 currently sets at 28%. Fort Gay PreK through 8 was included in the numbers because it's a
010newerbuilt school. We're sitting there at 40%. East Lynn Elementary is sitting at 36%. Now, if you look at the numbers around the district and if we looked at the rest of the district schools, the average for the entire district uh was reported in the media last week to be 44% building utilization. The enrollment um has fallen at almost almost all of the 18 schools. And again, um we spoke about Dunlow and Genanoa's um enrollment last night at Dunlow's hearing. Uh we'll speak about Genanoa's again uh tomorrow night at Genanoa's hearing. Uh but the enrollment trend here at Crumb PreK through 8 when the school first opened uh the enrollment was above 300 and we're currently sitting around 194 students here at this building. The uh the proposed action would raise the enrollment here from 191
011students to a projected 233 students. It would raise the utilization rate from 28% to 34%. Now that is uh still well below the recommendation uh but it would raise the utilization rate with those students moving to this building. The uh personnel projections indicate by the uh movement of the students to this building there would be two teachers that would be added to this facility. So, we talked about um through our budget talks, we've talked about the cost to operate Dunlow and Genanoa is about $2.1 million per year. Our savings with the schools closed would actually be 1.6 million per year. And the difference in those two numbers is that there would be additional staffing that would be required at the buildings that the students are being moved to. >> Two of those positions would be
012here. uh the rest of the students that are projected to move here would fit within existing staffing. And so we are here to uh receive comment about Crumb PreK through 8 possibly receiving receiving students if there is a closure or consolidation of Dunlow and Genanoa. So I'll turn it back to you. >> All right. Our uh we have uh Mr. Johnny Packed to speak this evening. First off, I'd like to thank the principal and her staff. They do a fine job here. Look at the school. Look at the bathrooms. They do a first class job. You can't ask for no better. And moving kids here, I think, would be a plus except for how far they have to be transported. But in my opinion, if y'all want to do some good, you need to cut
013your cost at the board. You got way too much staff members. I know for a fact you got 10 people. The board makes well over a million dollars salary for 10 people. That needs to be cut. If you want to do the county right, cut the cost that you board. cut all the wastefulness out and then the people probably will accept what you want to do a whole lot easier than just [clears throat] tell them we're going to do this. You know, show them that y'all cutting costs where you all at first, then do it instead of just saying, "Well, we're going to shut the two schools down." But if you have to shut them down, then say, "Well, we got to shut them down, but we made this much cuts here, and we made
014this much cuts here, and this is what we've done at the board and stuff to make it look a whole lot better to the community. And I don't know about the other kids, where you going to send them to, but I do know this is a good school, and they run a top-notch school here. Only time I can say that the school's been any better was when I was in high school here. And there was some top-notch teachers there, too. And they're gone now. But they do a fine job. And I think you need to [gasps and snorts] cut your cost down first before you make any kind of decision to shutting them two schools down because the understanding I got was you're supposed to have three top paying jobs in the board of education.
015I know there's over 30 at Wayne County Board of Education. You need to cut costs down first before you shut the schools down. And I I agree with Senator Maynard. That needs to be done first before you all start shutting the schools down. And if you have to, then you have to. There's no other choice. But cut your costs first. [clears throat] Um, some people I know was getting paid way more than what they're worth. I don't mention names, but everybody in this area knows who they are. And to me, that would be the right thing to do if I was running an operation. and the [clears throat] company said, "John, you need to cut your cost down." First thing I'd do was I'd cut down how much I'm spending on parts or whatever. And
016if that don't work, then I'll cut some the some of the men off. It's only way or cut the cut them down to four days instead of five days. And I think the board needs to do that first before you start shutting them two schools down. Do that first and let the community know, well, we've cut this person's salary down. we've cut this person's salaries down, blah blah blah, right on down the line and let the community see what you've done. And then if you have to shut the schools down, it has to be done. There's nothing you can do about it. But I think that'd be the best way to go first. At least it looks good on the county and everything. And that's all I have to say. >> Thank you, >> Mr.
017Pac. If I can if I can respond. I just wanted to share some numbers with you. So in the past 10 years um there's been significant cuts and some years more significant than other others trying to keep up with this number over formula that Mr. Maynard uh Senator Maynard mentioned last night the 140 positions over formula. So last year I think we cut around um 30 positions out of the district. um that included in each year almost every single one of those years that has included central office positions. So I had shared with the board a number of meetings ago um through some state reports the salaries of our central office rank 47th in the state um out of the 55 districts for cost per pupil. So we are 47th and the lower the better
018on that number. Uh the cost per pupil is is that low and so I think anytime I've been involved in school closure talks or anything like that, there's always talk about central office cost and the board does intend to cut central office positions this year and reduce that cost. But I I just want to make it clear to everybody that it has been occurring over the years and that per pupil cost for Wayne County is significantly low. There are there are districts half our size that that have assistant superintendent. There's not an assistant superintendent in this district. So the board has done work along those lines. The 140 positions over formula, 75 of those positions are service positions. It's custodians, cooks, bus drivers. And what happens is the way the reason that the positions get
019over formula is because the schools become so small. So for example, if we're talking about Genanoa and Dunlow, um the state formula for a cook is that a cook will serve approximately for every 140 meals that you're serving, you hire a cook. um at Dunlow currently the enrollment's under 50. So we have a cook that is employed there to take care of those kids, but the funding that we receive for that position isn't there because there's not 140 meals being served. So we have a cook at Dunlow, we have a cook at Genanoa, and you can't do it by yourself. So we have a halftime cook that splits between the two schools. So the state is funding a cook for every 140 meals. We have three cooks hired uh that are serving approximately 100 meals
020and that's how the positions get over formula. So um about 75 of those are are service positions and then you have the remaining that are on the professional side. Uh, so I think the board will take what you've said to heart and I think you'll see when the uh, personnel season hits a little bit later on that it's going to affect the entire county and uh, not just Genanoa and Dunla. >> Let me ask you something. What are you paying them cooks per hour? >> Uh, per hour I I don't know. Um, the I think the average uh, the average service cost is around $50,000 per year. Now, that's not all salary. That's benefits included. I know some of you people that work for you is hitting 95 and 100 grand. >> Some of them
021a little bit over. One of you that you all put as a football coach is over 100,000 now >> that we tried to talk you out of but you went against us. Well, those and those are folks that have uh not only college degrees but have master's degrees and and it you know, if you look at salaries across the state and what those positions are paid, they're in line with what those positions are paid for other counties. But I understand what you're saying and I understand exactly what you expect. >> Yeah. But the key is, you know, I know personally some of them people work for you. Uh, I wouldn't pay them $50,000 a year for the same job that they're doing because they're not capable of doing it. And most of the people in
022this county know who works down there. And we I mean ones that's from this area. We know them. I don't know them from Wayne or nothing because I don't live down Wayne, >> right? >> But I know you can cut costs there. >> Okay. Thank you for your comments. That's the only speaker that we have this evening. Anyone else um have any questions that we can answer? >> So, the remaining schedule and I mentioned the schedule last night, but we're scheduled to be at Genanoa tomorrow evening uh for a public hearing there and then we will be at East East East Land on Friday at 5. And then the plan is to be back at Wayne Elementary at at seven uh to wrap up the public hearings before the board meets hopefully next Tuesday with
023the weather coming in, but hopefully next Tuesday to make a final decision. >> All right, motion. >> Motion to adjourn. >> Motion by Janita. Second, >> Randy. All in favor? >> I. >> Any opposed? Motion carries. 5 to Z. It is 5:22. >> Okay. And we are adjourned. >> Thanks, Randy. Bye. >> Okay.