001It is the um 29th of January at 6 or 5:02 p.m. Did I miss anything? >> Thank you. Oh, the pledge of >> allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> You can say that those meeting. All right, Madam Chair, trustees, we'll go ahead and get started this evening with um our um special meeting presentation um around school finance recalibration process. Um before we get started um this evening, I just wanted to emphasize the purpose of tonight. Um and for anyone listening online, um obviously this meeting will be recorded. we'll be able to share this with our staff and community. But the purpose of the meeting tonight is to simply provide an overview of what has happened
002and where we are to date around the recalibration process in the state of Wyoming. Um we felt like it was important um to ensure that our staff know that we are actively advocating for TCSD, make sure they understand those processes that have been put in place. Um and also just to provide a general overview of where we are today and then what will come next um in the next uh legislative session um at the state level. Um like to first thank everyone who's been advocating for our district. Um we have a tremendous group of trustees who are advocating strongly for our students and staff um at the state level, at the local level. Um, I cannot thank our trustees enough for their work. Um, in addition to our senators and representatives that we have listed
003here. Um, there's been a lot of advocacy happening behind the scenes and directly on the recalibration committee which representative Mike Kin serves on. How we will uh communicate tonight will be very much a presentation style very one way. um tonight in terms of hearing from myself and our trustees. Um this is an opportunity to add clarifications, ask questions. Um our trustees um can ask questions and clarifications tonight as we learn more about the recalibration process and what will come out of the legislative session um that will directly impact TCSD. At that point, we would may change formats and move to a more two-way um uh meeting where we can answer direct questions on uh numbers, budgetary questions, etc. We are not there as of today. We do not know um what will come out of
004the legislative session. So, it's very difficult for us to get into the details of any budgetary conversations. Again, the meeting purpose um or presentation purpose, I should back up and say, uh tonight is to just ensure that our staff and public understand um what the the recalibration process is, where we are now, and where we're headed. Some of the learning outcomes for tonight um will be to uh be able to understand what happens during the recalibration process, what elements of school funding are being discussed again at a broad level. Um also understand what TCSD has shared with legislators and understand the next month or month and a half or so in terms of this process. I think one of the ways we'll communicate tonight as well is um I'll I'll review a slide which will
005be available for the public to to review. Um we'll pause after each slide um for a moment or two. I know we have our CFO Kristen Mayo online. she can provide additional explanations um to the board uh pending questions, but also I want to make sure we give an opportunity for our trustees to add clarification too because many of you have been involved in this process and we want to hear from you as well and give you that opportunity to communicate with our public. So some opening points to get started. Um recalibration is required by Wyoming statute every five years. We are in that fifth year process. um this year. Um the process can lead to some uncertainty. Um but it is a process intended to be healthy to evaluate the state funding model of
006education across our state. Um and that's the purpose of the five-year um recal process. The process is under a microscope by many right now and you'll see many news articles being published from different towns across Wyoming. And sometimes this can cause some anxiety given the unique nature of each town and how they're reporting about this process. Obviously, they're taking an approach from their local community much like our media does here. Um, we're also very interested in how the Campbell case, the Supreme Court case, will impact the final outcome of the bill. Um, again, the final outcome is weigh to be determined. We have not even entered the legislative session yet. Um and so again, this is a very first first step um in communicating where we are today. Our goal is tried to provide as
007as much data as we can to our staff and community. We're trying to really advocate for predictability so we can create a budget um for our for our uh school district that's uh meaningful to students and staff and supports students at the end of the day. through all the discussions we have about recalibration and all the technicalities that we talk about at the end of the day this is about our students and making sure that we have a proper education system for them. So what is recalibration in plain language? It's a review of our funding model and it also is a review of uh in my experience this year coming into this process for the first time um I would say it's a it's a process of really hearing from our districts across the state
008and all the uniquenesses that they bring to the conversation publicly during the committee meetings. Um, I will tell my trustees today, I've learned a tremendous amount from other districts and their particular values of what they think is important. And I do believe that the select committee is really taking into consideration the uniquenesses of each town in Wyoming. That's what I advocated for. That's what I testified about. And I think it's one of the reasons we all love the state so much is that the public schools are the heart of these towns. I'm going to pause just for a moment and allow for either Kristen online or any trustee to you have any comments at this point um to share based off your thoughts about this process um and where we are today. Any comments online?
009Yes. Um >> do we address the chair too? Um can I summarize what I think the evidence-based model is that each category is sort of given a price tag and then they build from there. Is that the evidence-based model? So you need so much for insurance, you need so much for teachers, you need so much for security etc. And then that's evidence-based. And it's evidence-based based on somebody's research and and you build up you don't take a sort of a an overall formula and make everything fit into it. >> Yeah. listening uh Trusty Dorn and I think listening to the consultants which we'll talk about in a minute which are hired um by the state to provide a recommended model which is the evidence-based model moving forward. It is a buildup model based off certain
010components that they study and then compare what we do compared to other districts nationally and they make a recommendation >> the comparison part I didn't know. Now, it's a it's a complex model um to say the least. There's a lot of uh agreements and strong disagreements depending on what district you reside in. For example, I'm a member of a superintendent group with all the superintendent. And it's really interesting to be in those meetings to hear the different uh reactions to this proposed bill. And it all comes down to their individual district unique circumstances. How many teachers they have? Are they really remote? They do they have a a more um small town or very isolated town? It just depends on their unique geographic area. And to be very clear too, and we know this with
011the Campbell case, very specifically called out that you cannot fund schools just simply based off a zip code. It must be an equitable education for all students and geography and zip codes aren't a variable essentially when you talk about an equity education. But then the p budget that comes out of that is sort of an average of these districts needs for each component. >> Yes. Yeah. >> Average or something else? >> I don't know. Kristen, would you like to speak to it if you're online? Just for the record, Kristen is joining us from home. So, >> um, sure. I mean, I think I think the what there's a couple of different questions floating around at the moment. The first one is evidence-based models. So the evidence-based model starts in the consultants going out and finding
012what is effective in K12 education across the US. So they say okay for to to offer an equitable education these are the components that we think we need and that establishes the basket of goods and we hear that a lot through this recalibration process. Then in order to to actually offer the basket of goods in Wyoming, they go in and they start assigning costs to that and compare it to what we're currently funding for teacher salaries, um, supplies, and then comparing that to the states around us. Um, and where do we where do we lie in those averages? And where do we how do we attract the best quality teachers to Wyoming in each of our communities when there's a lot of competition now increasing salaries in our neighboring states? And so what we're what
013we're talking about when they're when they're trying to establish the budget bill, um, I think one of the things that's really clear is they they do have a number in mind. They're trying to get to a number, but they're also still trying to meet the Wyoming Constitution requirement of offering an equitable education to all students in Wyoming. And that's difficult because we have so many rural areas, we have some larger communities, and then we have places like Teton County that have an extremely high cost of living. And so a lot of the conversation through this recalibration process has been how do we how do we handle outliers like Tuton County? How can we meet that statutory requirement of offering an equitable education to all students and still be fiscally conservative because that is what our
014legislature represents is a fiscally conservative Wyoming. Um, there was an article that came out in in one of the state newspapers a couple weeks ago where Governor Gordon has come out and said that he thinks that some of the cuts the legislator legislature has made or recommended um, cut too deep. And that's not just around education, but it's elsewhere. The bill that was eventually approved by the recalibration committee last week does add, I believe, 16 million. Don't quote me on that number, but I I I believe it adds 16 million to current funding where the evidence-based model that the consultants were recommending was going to add like 80 million. And I'm a little under the weather, so I might have those numbers not exactly right. Um, so it's it's it's a work in progress. It's
015a compromise. It's trying to hold on to the funding that we have at the same time as how do we continue to be competitive in the space that we live and work in. >> Thank you, Kristen. Trusty Gingri. >> Scott, I would just add Trusty Doran. I I think I only went through one recalibration when I was in the legislature, but I'll it's changed a lot since I was there. But I'll just tell you when I did it, what what we meant by evidence-based at the time was we sat down as a group and determine what our values were. What were we trying to attain and what evidence was out there, meaning studies to show what was best practices. So one of the top ones for us at the time was small class sizes especially
016at the elementary level. So when you say that one of your objectives or one of your values is small class size what that does it translates into money because the smaller the class size the more teachers you need. So that's that's this balance that you got to make that you only have so much money. your objective is small class size and um so you got to find the money to bring in those extra teachers to bring the class size down. At our at that time small class size was big. Um we really spent a lot of time on one-on-one tutoring. We were trying to find monies to do one-on-one tutoring like after school things like that and and and that was somewhat successful at that time and and it's it's gone up and down. Uh
017we were really pushing for what's called instructional facilitators. That was another big value of ours that you would pull the master teachers out of the classroom and have them go teach the younger teachers how to be a good teacher. So that was a value. Um another big value was that was a big issue was at the time that we didn't have to be the number one in the nation for uh salaries for teachers. We just had to be number one in the region. Then the concept was when kids are graduating from Montana State or from Colorado State or or Idaho or Utah, University of Utah, that we need to entice them to our state. And the way you do that is you pay more than all the states that surround us. So that was a
018big objective to us. We would see what were the salaries in all the surrounding states and we made sure ours was the highest. So that if if you were one of the top kids coming out of University of Utah, you would look over across the border and go, "Oh, I'm going to Wyoming. They pay better." And so then we entice in the best of the best was the concept like you're trying to get the best students coming out of all these different universities. Those were like the So that's what we first did. We would sit down and list what our values were and and what we considered evidence-based like that instructional facilitator one. there was this big study out of I think making this up now but I think it was like Sweden or somewhere
019like that that that actually had this huge correlation to scores going up that if you took a master teacher and had them instruct so anyway I didn't mean to go on too long but that when we were doing it was our evidence-based um how we uh tried to come up with the numbers and and and those are things you're striving for but then of course always the money outweighs and then you got go, well, can't quite afford all that one-on-one tutoring. And um but I have to say over the years, the real consistent one has always been small class size. And I've been surprised to hear a lot of discussion lately about increasing class size. Um >> Oh, wow. >> Because it used to be almost like a third rail. Like you didn't touch that
020one. That was one you did not um try to touch was class size. You tried to keep those class sizes smaller because the concept was of course smaller the class size more one-on-one the teacher has with the kid and your scores go up. It was at least the concept. I'm not saying that you know you know. So anyway [clears throat] that helps. >> I was just trying to contrast this model against say uh say the way we do family budget. We only have so much for food this month. Let's make our food bill fit into that sum total. It's seems to me the state is not starting with so much for teachers, so much for insurance. So, but they're building up rather than taking a pot and breaking it apart. >> I think the thing
021we all have to remember is currently we're under a block grant. And so with classroom sizes and what they're arguing now is I forget it's 20 high school class size. Oh >> 25 I think >> it's 25. Well elementary school isif uh K through three it's 15. And what they're finding is to give teachers more money. um local districts because it is a block grant are are having larger class sizes to be able to afford to pay that teacher more >> to fit into >> to to make that where one of the big things that should concern us all is this legislature wants to change that from the block grant to a categorical grant which basically strips a lot of our local authority away. They say you have $100,000 for your lunch lunch your food
022program. That's all you get. You have a bucket of $30 million for your teacher salary. >> That's all you get. >> Right. >> And your teachers those classrooms have to be this size. >> See, that goes against evidence base to me. >> Well, it really goes against local control. I mean >> I mean you're not set starting out with your values. You're starting out with your numbers. >> It's big government. >> I can remember when when we had the instructional facilitator debate and it wasn't going as well as we thought it was in one legislative session and and I think it's still true. They pulled instructional facilitators out of the block ring and made it separate because they didn't think school districts were operating it well. And I can remember the debate at the time
023was you do this, you're opening a door and you're going down a slippery slope because if you start pulling one thing out of the block grant and making it a category, >> what's to say the next thing you're going to pull out of the block grant? And so then the question starts to become and it's more philosophical what Trusty Scarlet was getting at is what's the purpose of the school board? I mean, if if you're going to dictate um how the money will all be spent, then why would we even do a budget anymore? The money would just, you know, and why would you even have a local school board? Why wouldn't you just, you know, you know, the state school board will run all the schools across the state? Um, you know, that's the
024debate, >> right? Right. >> Look at that, Scott. You made it through one. I love [laughter] it. You made it through one slide. >> That's good. We just don't want to speak through slides. I think encouraging discussion tonight and talk is the goal of tonight. So, >> we got it out of our system. You can keep going. >> Perfect. Um, couple things about for clarification for for the public and and a lot of staff questions I've had this past week, you know, so what it is and what it's not. Um and I think the last um statement is is one of the most important um for our staff to understand. Um and that is you know our board um doesn't determine the bill. Our board can advocate for certain things uh that are good for
025our district. They're good for our kids. Um at the end of the day, um the legislative session will determine the bill and it'll be up to um our board, myself to work together to figure out how to um take what is given and create the best uh system that we can. Um and we are doing everything we can to advocate for what we believe the best system should be um and should be part of the bill. But at the end of the day, this is a legislative process. Um, and so I think there's a little confusion on who determines the bill and just back to government 101. Um, the bill will be determined by uh the folks in the legislature. So we we are working on that. It is our goal to keep advocating for
026what we need in our our district especially around our regional cost adjustment. That's a big part of our our work. some components that are generally talked about um during the recalibration process. These are not new to anybody. Um but the staffing assumptions and what I mean by that is what was just discussed by our trustees around um teacher to staff ratios um class size ratios, transportation operations and then of course regional cost factors. Um I want to read a couple things to everyone. There was an excellent summary, at least I thought it was excellent, that came out of the WSVA um summary of the session and they did a really good job of just listing what people said, what some of their concerns were, what some of the testimony was. And um some of the
027things that really came to the the top of the testimony in the past reccalibration meeting were significant concerns over local control and block grant flexibility that was just discussed by our trustees. That was a dominant theme by most people that testified was the fear losing local control in a block. The other consistent uh topic was class size. Um there was at least the folks that testified on this day the 22nd and 23rd of January there was uh considerable opposition to the health uh care plan at the state level um which we haven't spent a lot of time talking about tonight but that was a topic. The other consistent theme was the RCA or the regional cost um adjustment. Um other themes that came up um and one that we haven't discussed a lot were um
028mental health and behavior health um in schools and ensuring that was funded appropriately. Um they gave a nice count and I thought I would read some of that information. Out of the people that testified the last uh session on the 22nd 23rd of January, there were 17 superintendent uh 13 business managers um who are very engaged in this process. I think they know a lot more than some other people in the room when you really talk about the nuts and bolts of what's going on in school districts. Um teachers and school staff, there were 10 people that testified. Um school trustees, five um there were some private insurance providers that testified. There were five of those. Three parents, one state or two state officials, and one um member from just the general public. It's kind
029of your breakdown. So around 60 plus uh testimonies for January 22nd 23rd. So this is a process reminder as well. I think it's a it's a question that I've received a lot um from our staff in particular on how this works. And we've we've been through this a couple times already, but just wanted to emphasize um the proposed bill which is approved by the recalibration committee. So, we have a proposed bill right now. Um, all the amendments are being adjusted based off what was amended in real time um as we speak. Um, that will go forward February 9th to the legislative process. The bill will be introduced to the House of Representatives and the Senate and debate will begin. That's the process that we'll be following very closely. >> Right there. I have a >>
030Y absolutely. This is legislative process. It's going to get there seems to be some question. Is it going to go straight to appropriations? Do you think it'll go to education first or do you have any clue >> that those committees the process is it needs to go to education first? Usually then it gets reassigned to appropriations after the main committee has made the changes. So usually appropriations is always second, but maybe they're going to reverse the order. But technically any bill that has an appropriation to it, it goes to the main committee that deals with that subject matter and then it goes to appropriations. It's normally and then I'm assuming it's going to get run through the house first and not the Senate. >> I can't remember, but there's like a rule. Oh, no. It's
031revenue. Revenue always has to start in the House and goes to the Senate. I I don't think there's a restriction on on educa on reccalibration. >> So they'll I assume the president of the senate and the speaker of the house will will work that out. Those two would make that determination as to which house they wanted to start in. >> Yeah. >> So it'll be in front of a committee very quickly. >> Oh yeah. Like I would assume >> that day or the first the next day following. And I think Trusty Scarlet, you that was made very clear in January at the last session that they want this to hit fast >> right out of the gate. Um >> but they're I don't think they're going to run like the budget bill. They run shadows.
032>> They do, but it's really difficult. They have this thing called the golden rod. The only reason it's called golden rod, it's the color of the piece of paper. um um the uh golden rod throughout the day changes as different bills have appropriations attributed to them. So it's tough to finish the budget bill until you know what the reccalibration bill is going to be. So they almost have to finish recalibration before they complete the budget. >> They got to sort of know what they're doing there, you know, so they need any extra money. They're two different funding. It's two different funding sources, but sometimes you need to know what's going on on the education. You you technically don't because they're two different funding sources, but they try to get the education the recalibration done prior
033to the full budget being done. And one of the things I believe it's it's just super important to emphasize to everyone is this is the beginning of this process and there's going to be a lot of iterations probably to this bill before it's all said and done. >> Um we hope there [laughter] iterations that support TCSD. Um, but I think that's a very um important message for our staff to understand as this evolves um through the process. So these are very similar topics as well. Um and this is also um a direct um reply to the WBA lawsuit around teacher salaries, food service, SRO's. These were all discussed in all the recalibration meetings starting in June. And I do think it's a uh a good time to remind everyone that this process, we're going into
034the seventh month of this recalibration process. The first recalibration meeting happened in June of last summer. And so all this has built up to this potential bill to be reviewed in the legislative session. One of the pieces um at the very bottom of this slide that I think is very important to highlight um that has some substance and is actually um a specific area that impacts us. Um, as we all know, um, Representative Yen, um, made a motion to and it describe a way in which we could adjust the regional cost um, adjustment for Teton County, which essentially makes up the difference of the I think it was um, five or six million dollars um, that we would have potentially lost in the hyonic model. Um the motion was made forth. It was unanimously approved
035to include language in the bill that would allow for an adjustment of the RCA to make up the difference of what we would have lost. Essentially keeping the funding the same as now. Now, I cautioned that statement for folks that are listening or were will listen because again, many things could change, but I think it's really important to be transparent with where we are now. Um, that's a good thing. That's a good thing that occurred for our district um that day. Um, but again, I would ask that we hold tight until we know the final the final approved bill. Kristen, would you like to add to that? No, I think that's that was well said. Um there's there's so many conversations happening statewide um about this process and um there's one there's one consideration that's
036happening in in terms of where the bill will go next and the processes that Trusty Gingry and Trustee Scarlet were just talking about. Um, one of the things that the committee did was encourage as much public comment as they possibly could so that when they get to that assignment stage, it's possible they're just going to jam it through as quickly as possible, saying that they've already had all of the public comment that they believe is out there. So, that's one theory that is cir circling the the rumor mill at the moment. >> Thank you. any trusty comments? Um, again, just a reemphasis of how we are engaging right now. We have been very proactive um, uh, since June of 2025 before any bill was cracked. Um, we've been very active and engaged with this entire
037process. Um we are doing our best at the district level to ensure that we're communicating at a high frequency with staff um explaining the process on a weekly basis to all of our staff um so there's not any guessing games of where we are. We will continue to do that um to ensure that not only our staff know but our general public knows. Um in addition to that for the past week I've been on three different interviews with local media. um Charlotte Reynolds and um Kristen have been involved in some of those conversations. Again, emphasizing exactly what we're emphasizing tonight, a common message around we are at the beginning stages of this and what we have done so far. I thought it was important to include a slide on what we control and what we
038don't. Um we did talk about this briefly. Um, you know, TCSD does not control the state of Wyoming legislative outcomes. At the end of the day, we can influence and do all we can to advocate for what we believe is best for students. Final funding decisions from the state are dictated by the bill and what is passed. What we do control is how we communicate with our community and let them know what's happening in a high frequency way. I think we'll be very transparent with our stakeholders once we know our bill outcomes and also how we determine our budget and move forward. But again, one thing leads to the next. And I think it's just really important to know the differences at the state level and what's happening at the local level. What does this
039mean as of today? 5:35 on January 29th. Um things evolve every day. Um, and this really is addressing some of our staff questions that we have received. There is some anxiety around staff. What could happen? As of today, we do not have immediate staffing recommendations until we know better what's going to come out of the session. Um, there's no finalized district budget or impacts until we have this information. However, it is um important for us to begin doing some scenario modeling and budgeting and thinking ahead and not being completely reactive to a bill because this could be early March before we know something in the worst case scenario. So, we need to be proactive and planning all different types of scenarios before we get to that point. Again, continuing ongoing communication with our community and
040we want to be thoughtful. We don't want to be reactive, but we want to be really clear. We'll do our best based off the decisions that are provided to us. As I said before, um we'll keep this as a standing line item, board meetings, our Friday staff updates, and our Friday community updates. We'll have additional meetings if we need to, and we'll continue to work through the media to make sure the message is consistent. on the presentation. Um I've added a link to um the main page uh for the finance recalibration committee. At that location online, you will find all the minutes. You will find the the members on the committee. Um but most importantly, you'll find the updated drafts of the bill as they come into place. You'll find all the information in one
041spot. Um, if you're interested in looking at that resource, I'd like to kind of sort of take a moment and open it up for any kind of closing comments from our trustees or Kristen if you have any closing comments for our trustees or the public. >> I have a question maybe for you or Kristen. What was the discussion on healthcare? Like where did it end? health. >> Well, it ended with um Let me pull up Trusty Ginger. Yeah. >> I mean, it ended with they didn't say we're going to go with the state. >> 26 27 that's being written into the legislation that we will. >> Yeah. Okay. >> But they're going to look at it in the future >> again, right? >> They're going to they're going to look at it. I think the
042um insurance Blue Cross Blue Shield Sigma almost came out very strong against it. >> Uh hub um school districts by by and large were against it just for eroding the local control. >> That's one of the big things school boards do nowadays. >> Um so so it's still going down the tracks to go 26 27. Representative Kelly did try to get it uh struck and his motion died for the lack of a second. >> Yeah. Many of them thought would cost them more money to lose state insurance >> there. The state's going to basically have to triple their so the ANI department. >> Yeah. I think >> Oh, really? >> to handle it. >> Oh, that's true. The impression I got was if you remove just the benefits and the health care piece, the impression
043I got was just systematically running all school districts is a monumental ask and it cannot practically happen in one year. So they they're still talking about it. I think there's a lot of iterations of it to come. >> So Scott, can I ask another question? We're [clears throat] one of few school districts in the state that has a growing school district and a lot of the other school districts, in fact, I would guess the majority, have a shrinking population. What is the adjustment to class sizes doing to everybody? It seems to me >> it's really hard on rural schools that are down to one teacher per subject in the high school say. >> Uh cuz I read a whole lot of their comments and and it looked like boy people were really upset because they
044couldn't cut any further. Since we have a growing school population, is it compressing our classes more? Obviously, it is if it raises the school. But if we have, you know, say a half a class more, what are they going to do to us? Say we have one and a half classes of physics. Especially Dora, you you asked a question that I think gets more at and correct me if I'm wrong, but gets more at the conversation about the u how they determine sort of an ADM funding. So, right now we're on >> right >> a three-year cycle. There's proposals to make it a one-year, meaning not a three-year average, >> but ADM is the whole school district as a whole, right? >> Correct. But what it does take into account, so the the reason I
045bring that up is the districts that are s all the districts seem to be concerned about that change, but the ones that are more concerned are the ones that have fluctuations in population significantly [clears throat] going up and down yeartoear. And so if you're just looking at the last year only, it dramatically impacts your ability to be predictable versus the three-year rolling average. that does get at the heart class sizes because it's very diff if you have a up and down district and I would venture to say probably most are going down. Um >> Scott, can I speak to that for a second? >> Absolutely, Kristen. Yep. I also think Trusty Dornan um the question that you're asking so many times in these conversations we we end up talking about what the changes to the
046funding model are going to do to our spending model. And there's a big difference between the two. And this is where we want to stress the importance of being on a block grant because when they start pulling out those components or having um the categorical funding that we talked about earlier, that's that's when you get stuck is you start saying, "Okay, we're only going to fund you on prior year ADM and we're going to pull out all these categorical pieces." When the district and the local schoolboard has the control with the block grant to be able to make those choices locally, it it becomes much easier to move through and organically flex class sizes or flex um teaching positions. And so that's the importance of the funding model remaining a block grant funding model instead
047of a categorical because the more they move some of those components to categorical, it becomes a spending model, not a funding model. >> And Kristen, do we still in in your budget narrative, there used to be a page that showed how far off we were from the funding model. Do we still put that page in there? >> We do. And what's interesting about um about that this year is we've always tried to stay really on model with salaries and compensation. And one of the things that is hurting us right now in this reccalibration process is because every district has has essentially managed their local salaries. They're paying 20% above model salary and we've tried to stay on model and that's the justification that the consultants are using to now not give us our full RCA.
048And so what I've really urged the recalibration committee to look at is full compensation, not just salary. So when you look at these other districts, their teacher salaries are 20% above their model salary, but their compensation, their benefits packages are 20% below their funding for health insurance. Whereas Teton County, we're on model salary, but our benefits are at 108% of our funding instead of 20% below. And it's something that I I think that we need to adapt to in creating our compensation package and our budget for next year. But also it it just creates this environment of a moving target that we're trying to do what we're supposed to be doing and because everybody else is doing something something different now we're we're somewhat getting punished and that's concerning for me. No, that's a really
049good point because I can remember when Pam Shay was superintendent. I remember asking her for the that chart and that was the first year I think we created that chart because I used to show it all the time because there used to be this argument that we weren't following the funding model and I could show that chart that Pam Shay would always get done and then Kristen continued that I I just wanted to mention I I think we're almost done here but um uh I don't know whose idea this was. It was the chairs or superintendent. Um, brilliant. Just a great idea. I I hadn't even thought of this. Um, I found this very useful. More importantly, I think um I think it's great to inform the public and and the teachers and everyone what
050we're up to. Um, and um, so that's great. Um, the only other thing I was going to add was um, when we did this five years ago and Janine was down there legislature, one of our we sort of had like, you know, statements that we told each other. um don't don't chase squirrels. Um and that just meant there is so much in the bill and that we needed to stay focused at that time. I'm not saying this year, but at that time our focus was solely on the RCA. Just stay focused on the RCA and don't chase the squirrels. Let the other school districts deal with all the other little things. We don't need to solve all the world's problems. We But for us, five years ago, that was our objective was keep our head
051down. um we didn't need to be, you know, um too out in front of everybody because sometimes we our our community is not always well loved sometimes um in Cheyenne. And so keep your head down and stay focused and don't chase squirrels and stay focused on RCA. Um and um and so that that was what we tried to do five years ago. I just throw that out there. >> So would you say RCA should be our focus again this year? >> I don't know. I was just sort of throwing that out to the trustees. I I a lot of you sat through a lot more of these meetings in the past few weeks than I have. I I would be curious as to, you know, is it class sizes, the RCA it because it doesn't
052have to just be one thing. It could be, hey, um, you know, Bill, when you're down there or trust, when you're down there in the legislature, please, you know, focus on you and Kristen and Scott, focus on on these three issues. Maybe there's three. But my point is we need to give clear direction to the folks that are down there so that we're not running up and down the hall >> cuz we heard there was some rumor about some part of the bill that maybe we're not that interested in. But when you get involved in those, you sometimes annoy someone potentially and then they get back at you with the thing that you actually they know you cared about. So they're mad that you got involved in this issue that was a smaller issue and
053they're going to get back at you because [clears throat] they know you care. >> But with the yin amendment I think RCA is taken care of, right? Or not. >> Well, that's why we haven't we haven't seen it yet. Yeah, right. >> It was all >> but it goes through >> we it gets back to overall transparency of because the hadonic wage index will be a major portion of the yin amendment where it's basically they said I'm going to screw up this number so Kristen can reach through the TV and slap me. Um, our current RCA is what 174 or >> correct >> 172? Well, we're going to just use 172. The hydonic wage index is 148. And the number that they miraculously came up with to use was the cost of living index up
054to that number that's between the two. >> That's great. Well, and I just want to say like on the RCA, the yin amendment to the bill keeps us flat where every other district is getting between a 10 and $20,000 increase to their teacher salaries. So, the the yin amendment keeps our funding flat. And I don't know that we can call that equitable. It saves us because we're not losing $6 million, but I still don't I still would not say that that's equitable. >> Should we I guess Kristen, two questions, Steve, sort of going to Trusty Doran's question. What things do you think we should be focusing on? >> You know, what are the, you know, is it one thing? Is it three things? And then yeah, >> should we be arguing >> for a different
055RCA for an increase in the RCA beyond the the flat year November? >> Yes, I believe that the WCI should be the index that is used for Teton County if not the entire state because it's transparent. We can see the data. We know how it's calculated. The Hyonic wage index has had zero transparency. the con the consultants have come back and provided their sources for the information that feeds the hydonic wage index but not how it's calculated and not the data behind it. Uh I think that is a huge problem. I don't understand how the reccalibration committee and as I've stated to them in my testimony how they can accept numbers on a piece of paper because I'd be happy to draft numbers on a piece of paper that would work better. They have a
056whole economic division in Wyoming and they're trusting data that they have zero transparency on from a professor that works at Texas A&M and the consultants keep coming back and saying she's the best in her field. Then show us show us why you're the best in your field. But they're calling it proprietary information which I do not think our committee should accept. I don't think our legislature should accept that as transparent data. Um, yes, I think the RCA is still our top priority. I think Teton County should be funded on the WCLI. Um, I think that makes for an equitable education. You know, all of the other components are are here and there and up and down. Um, and all of them are going to be changed. I actually with the health insurance, the way that
057the bill has been recommended to be written now is that everybody's going to be forced onto the state state plan, but it's going to be reimbursed monthly. So any premiums that we're paying for health insurance are going to be reimbursed. It's almost like a special ed or transportation model for the health insurance. I actually think that would be great. I mean, I'm not advocating for everybody to be forced onto the state plan, but that setup is much better than the original proposal. So, I'd say RCA should still be our same. We should be advocating for WCLI in Teton County. I don't care what they do with everyone else. [laughter] >> Trusty. >> So, what I'm trying to and um Trusty Gingry and Trusty Scarlet, maybe you can help me out here. This is I hear
058a lot of discussion about changes in the model that would address an equitable education. That's one thing. But then I heard Trusty Scarlet say changing the whole funding model from a block grant to a categorical that scares because that from a legal perspective because no offense to Dr. Chris, but there's three branches of government that we all know and the one that we haven't been talking about is what do we do if something backfires or comes back against us? are we going to do something? But trustee Scarlet, maybe you can help me understand is if they change that this idea of equitability that's not under that definition that becomes something completely different. So the funding then if we move if they move to that that kind of focus then they can say it's equitable and
059stuff it down our throats on a regular basis. is I mean where do we go with that? >> Do you have any I mean I mean any thoughts or is that why you're looking so concerned? Okay, >> you're the lawyer. >> Well, I'm just saying like that's I'm sitting here listening to all this going. We could argue about all this other stuff, but I'm I'm and I Sarah unfortunately walked out. I don't know if you have any comments, but that is the part of all this that really to pick up on Trusty Gingry saying stop chasing squirrels. I love the idea. Like to me that should be I can't imagine we're the only district because we're always on the outlier, but I can't imagine that there's other districts that aren't absolutely positively opposed to that.
060Is that >> Well, I can >> 100% of the districts that are >> I can verify you every superintendent is against category. >> I mean that that's something that I don't know whose idea this is. >> Majority say >> it's what >> I I should backtrack that. I don't want to speak for everyone, but overwhelmingly the communications are clear. >> Please do not change. >> Who is pushing this idea at the legislative level? Because I I don't know what the legal arguments are. I'm sorry, but that is a whole change to everything. So like who is pushing this? Do you know? We >> I don't know the individual or the people pushing this. I do not believe it's part of the Picas model and maybe Kristen could jump in. >> Yeah, I'm happy. >> The
061consultants have repeatedly said in their recommendation to stay with the block grant. They do not recommend um pulling pulling these out. I I believe in the in the current bill what they're doing, they're not actually pulling teacher salaries out as categorical at this moment in time, but they are pulling out summer school and instructional facilitators, but the way that they've drafted the bill and the language that they've used is really confusing right now and it has a lot of people spinning. And in in one meeting, they said they're going to pull it out and make it categorical. you can only spend it on instructional facilitators in summer school, but it adds like 14 instructional facilitators to some districts and and the school districts are responding saying we don't need 14 instructional facilitators. We need classroom
062teachers. And so they they've kind of backtracked and gone all over the place. It'll be interesting. I think we won't have an answer to this question of categorical for for those pieces. But right now, I believe those are the only pieces they're talking about categorical um until we see the final version of the draft bill that the recalibration committee approved and what that language is like in there. I I guess I would just suggest that if that language [clears throat and cough] um gains any traction at all um we need to have the I don't know how many alarm fire thrill and get going because that I mean you're talking that impacts activities that impacts every aspect of what we do. Um, so, um, I'm not trying to oversimplify this, but that just when you
063told me when you said that, I was like, my head almost spun around. So, >> we we've re as a school board, we've agreed and we've rejoined the school boards association. Kristen is incoming president of >> business, which is the school administrators and and Dr. Chris, of course, is on the state education board and on on the superintendent side. I forget what they call that organization. >> Awesome. >> And so, I mean, we >> we're we're going hard. >> We're we're covered with some really good resources. Um, and WSBA will support support their districts. Another thing that's getting pushed is they aren't going to um provide local districts monies to join associations. [clears throat] >> So that's another thing um coming up. >> So the final the final thought I mean I wasn't going to
064go there. I was going to go there. I'm going to go there. We have a legislative leadership group that is adopting the Nancy Pelosi rule. You have to pass the bill before public can see what's up. And that's what's happening. Whether it's theonic wage index or all of this stuff because we just we're trying to understand what's going on. We don't know how the h hadonic wage index works. that's been told to I was in the room with Kristen three times. First time was oh it's not done yet. Second time was you you won't understand it to Kristen. If anybody in this world can understand it's Kristen. And then this most recent time was oh all of this information is proprietary. So as far as we know we get docked for having views of the
065Tetons. >> Yeah. Well, in those I I I think that's crazy. The thing is is I see a a remedy that most people here don't like, but I love because I love being in the courtroom. But um I understand that. But what I what I'm really afraid of is the one that I don't see a path to I I I can't in my brain see a path to some sort of remedy that we might have like what you're talking about with the category block. What I don't understand is is there is no third there is no recourse for us. There is no nothing. It's just if that passes and gets through somehow, I don't think we get to the constitutional arguments that were raised in Campbell. Now, I could be wrong on that. I haven't
066done that, but that scares me. >> The only argument I can come up with is um the way the way we have to fund in Teton County using these categories isn't the same as the way you have to fund a school in um Pine Bluffs. >> Yeah. you know, and and we can't put a square peg in a round hole and vice versa. And um and you and I are on the same page. That's just limited arguments because I can see somebody saying, "This is how much you get for activities. Doesn't matter if they're in Jackson or Pine Bluffs, too bad. Your Nordic teams, your alpine downhill teams, they're they're gone because this is what we're doing." And so what I am that just I think um at some point in time I don't know
067who would weigh in on this but I would love to see if that even comes close to anything we just find a way to jump on that more than anything for me at least. Sorry. >> Um at least from all the days I listened I don't think that many people are taking that seriously. the categorical >> the categorical >> that that's what I got >> and thank you Reed for listening [laughter] but I listen >> legislators are or public comment >> I'm talking about uh the committee and the public com the public comments were against it >> the categorical so and I didn't hear the committee making noises in that direction at all but of course I didn't sit in on the same committee meetings you did with Yeah, >> that's I want to thank
068you for allowing me to at least sleep tonight whereas Bill got [laughter] >> that's in the bill. >> I think you should get a good night's sleep before you go to court. >> Yeah, man. It is in the bill. >> Kristen, one more question. Kristen, um, should we be So, the old system was old, harmless, WCLI, Adonic, and you got to pick the one you like or the one that benefited your district the most. It sounds like going to a new system. Should we be pushing, I don't know, Representative Yin or someone to put forth an amendment that you either get to pick WCLI or or Hyonic, whichever is the best for your district, or does that highlight the issue? I mean, I guess should we just sit back and go, well, we got what
069we could. Let's make sure what's there gets through so we don't lose money. or do we risk it by pointing it out and saying we like that but we want more. We want the and I I assume it'd be an amendment that says WCLI or Hyonic whichever serves your district the best. Is your thoughts on that? >> Yeah, I mean the committee has been very um they want to get to one index and so the amendment that Yen made is a blended basically a blended of the rebase sedonic wage index. that's proposed and the WCLI. Um, I think that the this first step in getting the Yin amendment passed in the bill, that's a good protective step. But if we actually want to offer equitable education to the students of Teton County, we should be
070pushing WCLI for Teton County [snorts] and any outlier that crosses a certain threshold at at any point in time. And I and I gave a proposal to um Senator Salazar and Mike Yin on how to evaluate what that threshold is. You know, you have your your median or your average, you go out a certain margin and then anything over that margin should be considered as a WCLI district if the WCLI is in excess of that. There's a lot of different ways that you could write this so that districts once their cost of living and we have a couple of districts around us that are going to hit this threshold at some point and that's their concern is when when this bill is proposed they're locking in this hydonic wage index for 5 years at minimum.
071The recommendation is for them to re-evaluate the hydonic wage index every five years, but that was their recommendation when they initiated this model in 2005 and they've never done it in 20 years. So the scary part isn't necessarily that they're coming up with something that works today. It will be outdated by next year and there is no mechanism in place to refresh the hydonic wage index and it has to be touched by Dr. Lori Taylor in order to be renewed. There's the problem with the current funding model or the current bill is that there is no plan for them to renew that. and by their own recommendation, the only person that's qualified to renew and refresh the hadonic wage index is Dr. Lori Taylor. That's a huge misstep. >> I guess madam chair, just a
072question of the rest of the board. I assume we're talking a lot about the legislature, but our objectives here, high teacher salaries, and when I say that, I clarify that for Kristen, salaries plus benefits that we keep those high, >> right? >> We're also committed to small classroom sizes, >> right? >> Is there anything else just to help those that are going down the legislature? What our core values are? Not with the legislature, with recalibrations, what are our values? Well, you know what I'm wondering about? There's that 240,000 that's running loose down there. What the heck are they doing with that money? They the governor says, "Well, let's put it in uh savings." And I mean, they've already got huge savings. And I'm just wondering >> well it was they came up with 240,000 surplus
073>> unallocated I guess I should say rather than surplus >> million >> and they have not decided what to do with it and one of my talking points might be that they shouldn't stent the schools if they have the money if they have extra money they should be spending it on schools not putting it into savings. And their argument, which we heard, is that in four years, the education funding model has a $750 million cliff. So, we need to save that money today to help offset that cliff. And that may or may not happen in four or six years. >> Did they give a cause for the 750 mph clip? >> Yeah. What? I didn't understand that. I I requested the reports that the there was two legislators that were looking at this on the
074re reccalibration committee. I'm happy to share that with Dr. Crisp and so he can share it out with the board. Um basically they're working they're looking at a worstcase scenario of revenues in the state and the worstcase scenario creates this funding cliff. um every year when they publish the Craig report and all of these other state revenue reports, there's not been one year in this district that I've worked that those projections and those values haven't come out far ahead of their worst case scenario. So, they're using a document, >> calling it worst case scenario that creates this cliff that will likely never happen, >> right? >> And so that's what they're looking at. I'm happy to to share all of that with Dr. Crisp so he can send it out. Um, but it's it it's
075just a a bargaining tool that they're using that actually they haven't shared in public. Um, and you have to request it if you want to see it. >> Goes back to the Nancy Pelosi rule. [laughter] So, you will have we'll have this on at the board meeting. We'll talk about this in two weeks at the board meeting or an update or >> Yep. >> And I I like the key suggestion, the core values. Um >> Yeah. >> You know, maybe instead of compensation package, commensurate with the cost of living. Oh, >> that's a better way of saying it. >> Yeah. um >> small class >> classroom sizes, evidence-based classroom sizes that support quality learning >> and I the the teacher education, teacher mentoring type things are big thing for me so that we proper funding
076of of ongoing education >> going to teacher education stuff like that. I mean that to me is a or for me >> I don't know if we want to >> yeah I'm not sure if we want to >> that kind of goes back into the overall quality of the education plop that into the that category of smaller classroom sizes and well trained teachers >> well trained teachers is I think finding that um as well as the sound of benefits but I I I don't know sitting here I'm a little I'm still in that downward spiral on that issue. I just hope to God that never promised it to be anything. >> So maybe what you know I think we've identified what are our priorities. um we can think about it, you know, everybody think about
077it not just, you know, at the spur of the moment and maybe we touch back on that during the board meeting just and then it it'll be in public again. Um and we can and at that point the legislative session will have just started. So then we'll maybe need an update 10 days into the legislative session to do something else like this >> or a workshop or something. >> So February 22nd, it's a Sunday that is the WSBA um uh schoolboard association day at the legislature. On Sunday they do a afternoon presentation with with the legislation and then a lobbying social function with legislators and then [clears throat] uh traditionally we've hosted our district has hosted our legislators that night for dinner and then Monday uh everyone goes up and attends the session and lobbies
078on behalf if you're in But other than the February 22nd, 23rd, what other dates are people going? >> I'm looking at going that entire week beforehand. >> The February 16th >> 16th. >> And then Dr. Chris, are you and Kristen Charlotte or amu guys going down? >> Um, Trusty Gingry, I was planning on going to the WSBA >> on the 29th 23rd. Yeah. >> Yeah. I'd like to go to And I believe Trusty me has confirmed with me too that she would like to be there for the WSBA. >> Trusty Scarlet will be there the full week before February 16th. >> More or less. Okay. >> Is that a good presence? Do we need to have a more of a presence? >> I think that's a good presence. >> Because we do belong to WSBA
079now. And so um what's the gentleman's name? >> Brian. Brian can inform us. Yep. It's the >> I think they're paying attention to us these days. >> Sometimes that's a bad thing. I'm just [laughter] saying. Sometimes I keep your head down. Madam Chair, I I would like to say the last couple days when we were in Cheyenne, uh the 22nd and 23rd of January, um Kristen and I spent a considerable amount of time working with various people on the committee and um I know some of the recommendations being brought forth are are potentially scary for Teton, but I will say it was a very collegial atmosphere. they listen to our concerns. I felt like in the session listening and being part of that that they understand our uniquenesses um even with some of the members
080who maybe traditionally haven't uh voted our way. Um now rubber's going to hit the roads and we'll know where people stand, but I do think it's important to mention that that I felt like it was a very constructive two days um in Cheyenne. I do want to clarify just before we we leave um some of the priorities that we just talked about just so I have that correctly. It sounds like um maintaining or or continuing to advocate for high salaries, compensations that align with the high cost of living, um small class sizes, and then continuing teacher education so our teachers can continue to grow and be um the awesome teachers they are. Those are the three that I heard tonight. And I know that's subject to change, but RCA is at the very top. >>
081RCA of course at the very top. [laughter] >> So this is what I would say to this is my thought on it, Dr. Chrisman. I I'd like to think about this a little. Talk about it again. I'd like to hear I mean Dr. Chris, your recommendations, what you think. Um and and maybe get some I don't know if there's a way to get public comment, but at least put it on the agenda. have it out there. But I I'd like to hear I those are just the things I'm coming off the one thing that came to the top of my head and I just I don't want to I hope everybody is not in agreement. We're not agreeing that we're going to lock us in right now. >> No, that's why I was saying that.
082Let's think about it. >> In in two weeks. >> Yeah. The important thing for all of us to remember is >> we don't get a vote on this. You got to reach out. If you got a comment, reach out to Yeah. >> Michael Y. Chris Rothos is a real advocate for education. Um, you know, the chairman Hiner uh from Afton um >> Salazar who who's a wonderful man from Riverton. Um even reach out to John Bear who seems to be controlling the purse strings with his steel fists. >> Can you give us all this? >> Yeah, I can. But see what I was talking about is >> bear and company >> want to hold the line on >> u on funding >> right >> for the sake of holding the line and I think if
083we have more money in the state budget than they count on for the worst case scenario that they should spend it that they should spend it on schools and they shouldn't and be putting it away. We've got a a huge rainy day fund >> or the university >> ginormous. >> We don't need to save money that way. We need to invest the kids. >> All right. Thank you everybody. or some second [laughter] >> I well you know I was in a Boseis five meeting last night so and there I can take the role of like okay come on second parents How many people were >> there's >> every same issues came up a different way we said the board but there was always no mess they just cared about just one of those folks Once
084you get to drive to spend nights, >> you don't get that. You got to spend night to make money. Well, Victoria wants you to come. >> See, now I'm let you guys