CCSD Board of Education Meeting Monday October 20th, 2025 7 00 PM

001you can track that down, you know, each year. Um, and again, they the number one question they asked us is, "Do you think you could have a, you know, fill a full-time clinician with like need?" And we I talked to the support staff and they said, "Absolutely." So, um, we already have a listing of students. Um, so right now the groundwork is happening of speaking to parents and saying, "Hey, there is this extra option." But they give them the rundown of all the ins and outs. Um, again, I wish it was just straight up like every single person. Um, but I will say this that if there was such an acute case where somebody needed help, they would work with that family no matter what. >> And thank you. My final question, I was practicing

002listening so well that I forgot it. Um, It's okay. Thank you. >> What I can also provide to um everybody is kind of like our flowchart we use as support staff and then also just like a sample performal form um a copy machine network that I certainly have when I can send it out. >> I remember um it's safe to assume that we'll be able to get report outs in terms of usability and maybe how long someone has been in the care of this particular program etc. like throughout the year. not detailed. >> Well, back to the board to say this number of people have taken taken participated in this program. You know, some have been in a month. We've have students that are, you know, ongoing. Just to give us an idea of the

003impact and also what the need is at the schools. >> Sure. >> Thank you so much. I know this is going to make a big difference and uh we really appreciate the work that went into making this happen and getting it off the ground. >> Great. Thank you so much. Appreciate it. So, now we have uh Tetro, Tetra Tech, excuse me, who's here to present the 2025 building condition survey. Um, thank you for joining us and and being patient as we got here a little bit behind schedule. >> So, just Christine, I'm going to do a little introduction with us this evening. We have uh Jim Buffard who's uh our project manager from Tetratech uh and Chris Schmidt who is from our facilities assessment specialist from Tetrate Tech. So they are architect and engineering firm

004um assigned to the district and they're going to take you through the building conditions survey and I'm going to pass out um the PowerPoint here as we get it pulled up there. It's on the PowerPoint guys. appreciate the introduction. Thank you. Um the other person who couldn't join us this this evening but was integral to the building condition survey or BCS is what you'll hear us refer to it as. um is Ingred Martinez. Uh she had a prior commitment and unfortunately couldn't be here tonight. Um that being said, uh Chris is going to do the really the the bulk here, but I did want to just say uh you know, we've talked a little bit about the BCS in the past. Uh we've certainly met with the facilities committee as well to go over things

005in much greater detail than uh we'll necessarily present it tonight, but uh really running through each of the buildings is what Chris will do just to uh give the highle summary of of the key findings from the the BCS and then at the end kind of uh see you know where a couple of the next steps and and obviously if there are questions too. Um before I turn it over to Chris, I will just say that um there's been 19 people, myself obviously included in that uh within the the firm that has worked on the BCS. Um there's been over 750 hours in total that has been uh put towards the BCS, including uh on-site time by our team. And uh what Chris is going to show is a very concise I think I'm biased

006I guess but I think a good way of presenting um really those key findings but the entire report is over 100 pages. So with that I'll give it to you Chris. >> Thanks Jim. Well, I'm going to try to awkwardly manage a piece of a piece of paper, a mic, and a a clicker. And I may abandon one of them at some point, but so let's work through this here. Um, let's start with what's a BCS. So, building condition survey. Every school district in New York needs to do this every 5 years. It's a visual inspection by a licensed architect or engineer. And SED collects about 650 data points per building. So, um, if we answer all those 650 questions, um, we create this snapshot in time. We went in the field, we wrote down

007what we saw, and that's what SCP is after. And that gets uploaded to SD portal. And for many districts, that's perfectly fine. They just want to check the box of uh answering all those questions per for for every building. Um but other districts such as Cornwall um need a more dynamic tool that helps them with long range planning. Um, so we took all the BCX findings and put them in a big Excel workbook and that enables us to add priorities, cost escalations, contingencies, soft costs um, which provides a larger picture of the overall costs and um, the findings. Um so that tool is has been created. All of those findings have been uploaded to the SED portal. And the next step is creating an executive summary. So that is um it's also an SED form

008with lots of statutory requirements sort of built into it, but it's just a really um brief summary sheet that gets submitted with every um SED submission. Let me just say a bit about our process. Um, we got off to a great start thanks to Walter's leadership. He had our entire team down uh to to sit with him and his staff um in uh the conference room at the maintenance building. So we had um our team consists of of course architecture but landscape architecture, structural engineer, electrical, mechanical, plumbing engineers. So we sat with them. We went through every building and every system. Um they were able to share their concerns um their wish list items and our team was able to follow up and ask questions. So um we had that baseline information before we even

009went into the building. So um uh that was great. And then our team spent a few days going through all the buildings. Uh then all that information was compiled and it goes through a few um three different phases of quality assurance and then we reviewed that with John and Walter. A few weeks ago we shared that with the facility committee and here we're happy tonight to to share those findings with you. So um this is in that Excel workbook I talked about. There's lots of summary charts, but this is the highest level summary chart. Um I think this is a great chart. Um it it might look a little intimidating but it's pretty simple. So I'm just going to briefly walk you through how this works. So when you take this home and you spend

010more time with this you can know how this is working. So um we have this first column which is obviously just the buildings. Then we have uh con 202 totals per building but 2025 construction dollars. Let's use um the high school as example. So we have that 7.5 million as a construction total and each of the items that make that comprise that are assigned a priority. So what's a priority? A priority says priority one is roughly saying this could be completed in the next three years. Priority two is saying roughly the next five years. Priority three is roughly the next 10 years. And each of those has an escalation or uh just a percentage applied to it that models um inflation over time helping us think that you know we don't want to think of

011this in today's construction dollars but future dollars. So that 7.5 million is each one of those items is assigned a priority. It's spread out over time. So you can see the majority is is priority 1 7 million. The few items that are priority two make up 926,000 and then a million for priority three and 10,000 in other. Other is sort of optional. Um so you can see how the 7.5 million of today's dollars spread over time adds up to 9 million. So that's projecting and saying, "Hey, if you did all of the items that were identified at the high school over the next 10 years, you could estimate that it would cost $9 million." And that's how that's working. Um, so then going to the construction budget subtotal. So we're seeing of just construction costs

01237 let's call it 8 million which with priorities currently assigned 44.4 million of just identified projects. Now no district every district in the country has more work than they have money to pay for. So that's why the prioritization and planning process is so important. Um but then so then that's sort of the upper half. The lower half is saying okay well let's let's plan for um design and construction contingencies and that gives us a construction budget sub total and then we're going to add in incidentals. Incidentals is anything that's not construction related. So design fees, legal fees, permits, things like that. And then we're looking at sort of all in what's found in our study is uh over the next 10 years is $65.6 million worth of work. Again, no district is going to try

013to tackle that much work. A lot of that is, you know, priority threes and those end up getting getting pushed out. But that's just the highest level of of our findings at this point. Okay, let's uh as Jim said, it's over 100 page report. So, we're just going to tick through the highle findings. And as you open your report, um let's see how that is. So, if you Yeah. So, this page and that page sort of go together. I don't know if the way is stapled together. You can sort of see about right. Um, so you can I can't do that, but I'll I'll just spend a moment on this slide and then we'll we'll go through the more detail on on this slide and we'll do that for each school briefly, I promise. So,

014um, the intention of this slide is similar to the last the last slide with um, priorities and and that sort of layout, but here we're looking at building systems. And so, um, the intention here is that I should have said this on the first slide, but that the the green highlighting is a conditional formatting that just draws your eyes to, you know, rather than glazing over, you can kind of quickly move to where the high dollars are that are driving um the projects at that at that school. So, if you just just glancing at at the high school, we can see um mostly looking at priority one projects and we're looking at building interior, electrical systems, site features, and HVAC. The top four are roughly driving 80% of the work. And that's most buildings about

015the top four are about 80% of the the dollars um in findings at that building. Um, one little one little thing is that that 9 million that ties back to your each of these will tie back to that that that that the lead summary chart. So, um, you want to say what's in that 9 million, you you drill down and each of these is going to you keep drilling down. So, if we drill down, this tells you um this breaks out each of those categories. you can spend more time with this. Um I'm just going to point out the items that um uh uh Walther and John in discussions have sort of highlighted as priorities for the district. Um other prior, you know, that's that's a fluid planning process, but these are just the items

016that have been identified so far. So, I'm going to go uh clockwise and um the key items identified so far on starting with electrical systems. Oh, here we go. We have um full replacement of the PA and clock system. Continuing on under site features, the next green dot, um replacing the pavers in the courtyard amphitheater. Moving on up, building envelope that 350,000. um replacing the fiberglass sandwich panels. Those are those opaque panels you see at the high school. They're called cow wall is the industry term, but full replacement of those which are nearing the end of their life. And then um this one is uh there's some water issues and so this is addressing um expansion joints either fixing existing ones or adding expansion joints to to address water issues and then um additionally looking

017at uh some reported leakage into the walls of some showers. So, u moving on middle school. >> May I ask a question? I'm sorry. Yeah, I just missed what the green dots are relative to all items. >> That That's Yeah, that's key. So, those are items that in discussions Walter and John have identified as high priority items. >> They're high in P1. >> Like they're in the priority one group, but they're high in that group even. >> Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Glancing at this one, you can see, oh, wow. Okay. was driven by a lot of priority one work and mostly building interior envelope electrical systems and site features. Again, those top four are generally about 80% of costs. And uh as with all these, you can spend more time looking at all

018of these, but we'll just identify starting uh right here with the building envelope. Um uh replacing the roof at the D-wing site features uh sidewalk replacement in the front of the building. Um moving on up to plumbing, uh installing. So, there's some moisture issues and this is installing um drainage in the crawl spaces to sort of deal with those moisture issues. And then the 92,000 This is being sort of thick. Oh, there it is. Um we have an area in the in the uh cafeteria where there's some temporary shoring and so we want to address what's what's behind the cause of the need for that temporary shoring. Uh the total of those green dots, I should have said this in the last slide, but a million dollars. Those green dots total up to a million

019dollars. And that's again those are those um those have a priority. Those element escalation, but those numbers don't have uh the contingencies like those those lower level uh numbers. Look at Cornwall Elementary. um work is uh driven by electrical systems, building interior. This one we do have different than the other ones. We have Hback rather than just being all stacked in priority one. Um we're sort of planning ahead for systems that will need to be replaced in the future. You can see going out to priority two and priority three and some recommendations. And so far identified as key projects at Cornwall Elementary are replacing the cafeteria and stairwell doors with fire rated doors and frames and um replacing the chimney metal flu liner and that totals $360,000. Cornwall and Hudson. This this one you can

020see it's it's uh not as many priority ones. So we have uh driven by priority one electrical systems but then um mechanical is sort of spread out into priority two and other um and then looking forward to some plumbing needs. And then um here the key project identified is replacing the PA system 105,000 Willow Avenue. Again, um some priority ones stacked up and then some priority twos under mechanical and plumbing. Priorities identified at Willow are um replacing a switch gear, big huge electrical box in a in a mechanical room, electrical room, and then the feeders between the the transformer and um the switch gear. Uh again, another chimney metal flu liner. Uh there's some issues with the gym flooring and some moisture. So, we're going to look at replacing that, but also investigating what the

021root cause of that. And the total of those three projects is just around 760,000. Central admin pretty much stacked up all on priority one. And the priorities uh at this building are uh full replacement of the steam boiler and the heating system. Full replacement of the heating system. Um this is a high or conservative number. The reason being that it's a full replacement throughout the building of all the components of that heating system and we've added um we've increased it just yet working in a in a possibly historical building. Um we're looking at full window replacement. Uh replacing the front entrance door which has the uh the swing is swinging the wrong direction and it's also very old and so we want to you know replicate the look of that. So, um, higher than typical

022for just replacing two doors and then around the side of the building, um, addressing the the timber retaining wall and the masonry stairs there. And those, oh, a full window replacement. And then those items total up to $885,000. And then buildings and grounds. Um, oh, so this is this is just I would put this in other, but this is possibly I think it's a six bay. Uh, it's looking to the future, but it's was we were asked to provide a number for looking at maybe adding on to that building. And, uh, there there haven't any priorities in this building have not been identified. So, the total of all those green dots at this point is 4.6 million. And that's the very brief summary of a of a 100page report. So, um, open to questions for

023for Jim or for or me. >> I'll uh I'll jump in. Um, >> first of all, thank you for all the the work and the summary and presentation, all that. I know the um this is always an exercise in prioritization creating hierarchies as you said no no no school district says wow we have more money than we have needs um so within the green dots even you know there's more there than we could probably comfortably afford let's just say do you have a uh a sense I don't want to put you on the spot because I know a lot of this is buried in the slides um it seemed as though that there for possibly some room for tiering even within tier one green dots, you know, like there was stuff with like water damage.

024In your sense, are they pretty much all even for different, you know, they're they're just at critical failure for different reasons or do you see room to prioritize those even further? So I would say for that level of discernment for your question, I would say we so Walter knows these buildings better than anyone. And I would say as far as filtering it further than those three dots, he would be the one to make that further uh those further decisions is is with his finger on the pulse of kind of each of those items. And we've documented them, seen them, put cost estimates together. But as far as like you know very like you know prioritizing even more like you were saying I think Walter would need to really get involved. >> That's not for the

025job. Sorry >> question. >> I'll just make a comment. Um as chair of facilities committee I'll thank you gentlemen again. you you gave us this presentation a little more in depth as a committee um a few weeks ago. Um so thank you for all the work that you've put into this um and we will have a facilities meeting uh one week from tonight um where you look at this number and say wow that's a lot of projects that we need to do as a district. Uh I regret to inform you all that's not the full number because we had a list uh in the spring and summer that we generated uh preparing for um you know our upcoming capital project and there are more items on that list in addition to these. Uh so next

026Monday's meeting only for tonight is uh John has compiled or is finishing up compiling you know combining both lists into one um so we can get the full sticker shock in all of its glory. Uh why don't we from tonight's committee um and then we will ability to sit down and start to window that down. Um, I think Chris, you said it best that Walter certainly is is going to be key in telling us which items are immediate needs and which items, you know, are we going to have to wait, but we do have, you know, the capital reserve full and another capital reserve started. So, we do have a good head start and we have a lot of projects to be done and I look forward to, you know, working with the committee and

027present it to the full board to to get a list that we can present to the community in the springtime. I have a question if no one had any other questions. So really this question is for facilities and Jim I'm not putting on the spot to answer but just I'm asking maybe has it been considered. So when I look at the central admin administration office at 1.7 million in totality and buildings and grounds at 1 let's say 2 million has there been consideration ever about just building a new building for those two groups like in one place? I just I don't know cost, but that just seems like a lot of money that we could maybe build a brand new building. So, just throwing it out there. I'm not asking you to answer now, but

028um you know, if that's something that we ever consider, if I just um piggy back on your point because I think this came up, we have several very old buildings in our district and old buildings, you know, you know, they're nice to look at. their their labor of love maintained. And you know there is probably you know there probably is room for discussion probably is part of the strategic plan is that at what point does the cost of maintaining the buildings that we've had for so long you know with the cost of maintaining them and obviously we have three buildings including the advent building that um are near 100 years old. I think one is over and two are pretty close and so I think you know that is a discussion but you know I

029think we can do that within the strategic plan um so that there's more you know with the community what's with the community of mind on that trade-off >> other comments questions >> I could I could add something to that so just in K12 facility planning our facility condition index which is the cost of you know identified needs divided by the the cost to replace. Now, and this is like an industry standard that's meant to sort of within a sub within a within a system. It's not like across the board, but within the system here, you can develop the facility condition index um which uh starts to sort of just show you and you you want to look at sort of age and capacity, classroom utilization. But um uh when I say let me just say

030something about the cost to replace. It's not necessar it's just a um it's just a metric. It's not really the cost if you're going to buy land, you know, do work on the site and build it brand new. It's just like for like on that same footprint right there. And it just creates this sort of comparison tool. And um but cost to build new is is extremely high at this point. And in the Pac in the uh in the northeast, uh not a lot of new new schools are being built. Additions definitely um new is new is rare. Uh but you're right to identify that uh you know get how long does a building actually last and 100 years 150 years at some point in in in planning for new buildings. Do you start to

031sort of think of that? But that FCI index could be something that could be at least a metric to start kind of identifying. >> I just want to clarify, I wasn't suggesting the school buildings for the public's sake. I was talking about administration and buildings and grounds just so that if the public's watching, I don't want them to think I meant school buildings. So, thank you for that questions, comments. Okay. Thank you so much. And thank you so much for explaining it really clearly and thoroughly. So folks that aren't on the facilities committee thoroughly understood what all of it meant. So I really appreciate that. >> Yeah, glad to be here. Thank you. >> So going back in our agenda, we will go back to our superintendent update. Megan. >> Okay. Thank you. So I

032just wanted to take a minute to thank our community for their continued partnership with our schools. Um I feel like they are just really thriving within our schools and the opportunities that they've been giving to our kids. Um few quick examples. We had first responders day here at CES this past month and up front. I mean it was completely foot with um you know we had the sheriff's tactical team there. We had fire department there, our smokehouse, every law enforcement uh vehicle you can imagine. The kids had a blast, you know, getting in and out of the the cars and putting the alarms on, but you know, the bigger picture was just kind of showing the kids like we are partnering with our our local um first responders who we are incredibly thankful for. So,

033just wanted to thank them. Um, also the high school career day was a big success. So, big thanks to our uh guidance department for partnering with our community members. Again, it was really great to see so many um parents who work in many different fields, you know, from a PA to an opthalmologist to a forest ranger and so on. I mean, we really show up the gamut for kids of what they could do. And the bigger picture is, you know, you may have a local parent that you can make a connection with to have a further conversation with them if you're truly interested in that field. So, just again another way that our community gives back to our kids. Um, a big shout out to our PTO's, our PTO trust and SEPTA. Um, I had

034an opportunity to meet with PTO Trust last month and their calendar of events that they plan for our kids is just unbelievable. And that's not just on the elementary level. Like you often think, you know, that's a very like lower level um busy activity. It is across the board on all levels from K through 12. So, it's just so great to see that, you know, it's it's truly enriching the programs for our kids and just giving them opportunities for social connections and just um you know, anything from an author's visit to movie night to, you know, senior class, which our ladies over here will enjoy later on in the year. They're already starting to work on it. Um and then just lastly, I just wanted to share that I was really honored tonight to be

035recognized for the Divine Sea Award from our um varsity cheer team. They're right now competing for the um it's called the game day competition. So I wish them the best of luck. Um so you know it's nice to be recognized but to be recognized by our students just means so much more. So just a huge thank you to them. >> Does that mean you get to go share with them that one game or something? >> I think if they want to lose the competition. Sure. >> All righty. Thank you. Um so for the president's update um I was just going to mention um things that going on in the district that um the student reps mentioned the rock your school game on at Lee Road. I wanted to give you a little bit of background

036because I think you know our teachers go on professional development conferences and such and this is something that came back from that and that investment and it really is focusing on student engagement, academic rigor and a positive classroom environment. So I know Richard and I were available. it wasn't you didn't have a whole lot of notice which was fine but just in terms of availability um and I know I really enjoyed it and there were high school students that came in the afternoon and then we were there during the day um and it was it was just really a great joy to see their engagement and their curiosity and if you have the opportunity I encourage you to do it because their interest in the distributor you get a little ego boost so I encourage

037you to take advantage of that so it was really great to be included um I also want to mention in terms of piggybacking on professional development. Dr. Fnay has put together our superintendence um intern um wait superintendent conference day. Sorry, I'm getting tongue tied. And um I was really impressed when I saw the variety of sessions that are going to be offered for our staff, very specific for different elements of our staff in the morning. Things specifically um best practices in AI, which is, you know, coming so quickly. how to um really strategically and and um utilize our tools like parent square schoolfront both instructional with AI as it relates to um you know teaching assistance but also then in a traditional K through2 classroom what school AI and how you can use that in

038your instruction um a session on verbal deescalation for the roles in our schools that might be encountering that and then um improving peace in the classroom. So everyone having a part in you know our students academic excellence and I just it was a really nice variety of offerings that I think people will share with them each other. So thank you for that. >> I just like to say that thank you that was also input from all the staff. So it was just asking them what the needs are and this is the feedback and then just trying to you know procure those people to do the day. So I kudos to the staff because they were forthcoming with what they wanted to see. It's great topic. So, it's um it was really exciting to see that

039engagement. So, thank you for that. Um so, some of our strategic and operational things that we have going on, we are in the midst of a superintendent search. As people know, there is a link right on our main page where we have a survey. It's a probably it's a pretty robust survey. Probably would take you 10 to 15 minutes to complete it. I encourage all community members to take the time to do that. It gives the board insight into um what your wish list is, what's most important to you, not just in who is selected, but also in how that that partnership occurs once the person is selected. So, I encourage everyone to take advantage of that. There is a community forum that's open to everybody. That will be on Tuesday uh the 28th from

0407 to 8:30 here at Lelay Road. If you cannot make it in person, there is a virtual option and all that can be found on the district website. It's at the bottom of the flyer that's there. You can see that. And I want to let the board know that we are talking with uh the team about our board retreat part two. So that will be coming uh before the end of like I always think the end of the year, you know. Um so that um Richard, thank you so much for your work with the NISPA resolutions. There's a lot that goes into that tracking us down to make sure we vote and everything else. And I wanted to take a moment to highlight some key outcomes of that. And so for folks that aren't aware,

041the New York State School Board Association at their annual business meeting um they vote they have their 300 members across the state vote on resolutions and what um is a priority and then this is helps inform their advocacy work and what they will be um bringing to uh you know to legislators and and um advocating for. So uh first in the area of governance and local control, NISPA reaffirmed its call for more opportunities for school districts and municipalities to share services efficiently. So when you think about being able to um collaborate, you know, one area has a specialty and we want to take advantage of that. On funding, NISPA continues to push for more equitable state support, which includes incorporating pre-K funding into exist existing aid formulas, reforming special education reimbursement, and authorizing new health

042and insurance reserves for districts. There's also um information and aid for um I don't want to oversell it, but like air conditioning for schools with the with the thing about um heat, certain heat, we have to close the buildings, but some schools don't have AC. So, there was um a resolution to support that. Again, these aren't done deals, but this is what they're going to be advocating for. In the area of student health and safety, delegates approved resolutions promoting regular child abuse awareness training for all staff. In curriculum and instructional policy, NISA is advocating to overhaul the state testing system, which has a lot of um opinions, and they want to integrate financial literacy and AI into learning and promote daily recess as part of the instructional day. Um and finally, NISPA reaffirmed its strong

043stance in support of public education, opposing further expansion of charter schools and private school vouchers. So these elements are what set a clear direction from NISPA's advocacy throughout the year advancing fair funding, student center practices, and a modern inclusive public education system across New York State. We get um a report out, but it's a lot of data and some of the resolutions aren't necessarily as applicable to our district. So I just wanted to highlight the ones that I think um can impact us. you know, if they're used for advocacy and they're pushing elements forward. And then finally, I want to bring to everyone's attention some things that are coming up in the short term. November 7th through 9th is the drama production at the high school, the musical comedy Murders of 1940. A group of

044getting to a group getting together to workshop a new musical quickly becomes a who done it. November 13th is multicultural night. Not to be missed. Um Dr. Eigay and Rachel Das from our PTO. They've met with high school students. they gather feedback from their perspective in the years past, what's worked, what hasn't, and exploring additional ways for students to be involved beyond just setup and cleanup, which I think is really excellent. You know, it's tapping into more of their leadership, managerial, you know, critical thinking skills. So, um, but it's an event not to be missed. So, I encourage you, I would love to see you there. And that wraps up my president's report. Thank you. So, moving on to our consent agenda. Is there anyone that would like to pull an item from the consent

045agenda for discussion? >> Christian, >> I think we're both. >> Um, so for the purposes of voting separately, I'd like to pull item four and item eight. and as a group because they're related to each other. Um items 10, 11, and 13. >> Uh I guess is related to the um the internal audit. >> Okay. >> And um just the background and context that comes there really one package. >> Anyone else like to pull anything from the consent agenda? >> Okay. So I need approval for the consent agenda. May I have a motion to approve uh the consent agenda? >> So, >> we should identify the which numbers. Sorry. >> So close. Um could I please have a motion to approve items 2 3 5 6 7 9 and 12 from our consent agenda. >>

046So second >> Brendan Christian. Thank you. All in favor? >> I >> opposed. Okay, the motion passes. Thank you. So, item number four, resolution to approve employment agreement extension Harvey Scotland. Can I have a motion to um approve the resolution? >> So, >> a second. >> Second >> discussion. Christian, >> um as I said, I'm applying this to separately, >> so no discussion. >> Okay. Um, okay. All in favor of the resolution to approve an employment agreement extension for Harvey Scotland? >> I I >> I opposed abstain. Okay. Thank you. The motion passes. Okay. Item number eight. My ages to cooperate. Um, can I have a motion to approve the resolution to approve the termination of agreement with the Palumbo Group? >> Carl, thank you. A second. >> Second, >> Jim. Thank you. Discussion. Okay.

047All in favor to um sorry. All in favor to approve the termination of agreement with the Palumbo Group. I >> I >> opposed. Obstending. abstaining. I'm sorry, I can see your hand. Okay, one abstension. The motion passes. Thank you. Okay. And in the home stretch, items um 10, 11, and 13, as Christian stated, are related because they have to do with our internal audit. So, I will ask for a motion to discuss all three at once, Christian, or you just want us can we do that? I'm just say for the interest of time because I think the comments at least that I have on these are connected and I just think that important because the reason why we are putting the first reading is something that came out of as we were in the audit

048committee and I just think it would be important to provide the context uh to the rest of the board. >> So we'll do them separately just for the ease of that. So, can I please have a motion to approve item number 10, a resolution to approve the 2024 2025 internal auditors report? >> Thank you, Brendan. Second, Carl. Thank you. Discussion. >> So, we individually the one that you're talking about the first meeting is very specific. So um on the internal auditor's report so we focused on um each year in internal audit we focus on one area in particular and this year we focus on probably one of the largest areas which is purchasing practices and more items because when you handle a large area like this you're going to have more things turn up in

049terms of what the auditor will find just because purchasing is a large area uh particularly for what an auditor would review. Yes. I thought that was my recommendation. >> I I misunderstood your recommendation. Um could I >> We should probably This is been open. So I think >> we should amend it. >> We could just close that one out and then you do the next two again. >> I think I can make I think I can provide the context and then I think we can vote um as a whole or on all three whatever we prefer. So, one of the things that came up is that we were um overspending budget codes, which is not doesn't mean that we're being propagated. It just means that budget codes are created in the budget where they make

050an estimate about how much money is spent in different different buckets in different categories. And typically the procedure here is to you would transfer between budget codes because sometimes the reason why you're spending more on one is because for example uh a teaching position that might be at one school an aid goes to another school and therefore you're you're moving it from one budget code to the other code following that teacher or that student and the services that are being provided. And um so these are not large amounts but in our policy uh 6150 we basically have a cap on what transfers can be done without explicit board approval. And so what happens is we have it used to be the cap was $10,000 and this would have to go to the board a board

051meeting and that might have contributed to why we're overspending codes because we don't they can't init they can't do the transfer without our explicit approval. And what we're seeing with the same items being costing more money that what a lot of districts have done is raise that in a sense threshold. And one of the questions we asked the auditors is that what are they seeing in other districts as far as updating the same policy and you know they said that some districts have gone to 25,000 which is what is in the new language um in policy 61 uh50. In addition, at the end of the year in June, there's a lot of because we are closing down the uh fiscal year for the district, there are a lot of transfers and and to facilitate that

052process and not really part the corrective action, but to help our hardworking and dedicated and professional business staff do their job. We wanted to allow that the flexibility to do that. Transfers are still reported there. As you can see, there's a transfer report tonight as they are in every board meeting. So it's the same transparency. Nothing is done. This allows them to address these things quicker. And the second thing is that uh for the June and John correct me if I'm not relaying this correctly um is that we're allowing the superintendent and the assistant super business to approve those end of the year transfers that are involved in closing down the budget to facilitate that process. And I think this will um expedite it. So we're based the way that at least I see it

053is to make a technical change and this came out of the um the audit committee's discussion. >> Yeah, just to add to that question. So the superintendent approves every single budget transfer. So we both are on uh every every time there is a budget transfer and the June is actually all the cleanup for the end of the year gets us expedited for the audit and that's why you guys have been able to get your audit done uh first um more than any other district. So this will be an additional support for that >> point of pride. Other questions, comments? >> Okay. Uh go ahead. >> Yeah, I was going to pull out of 11. It seems that we're going to discuss all them together, which is great. It's fine. Really just a question um clarification

054for John. Um, we've got audit comment one, two, three, four. Uh, where are we here? Audit comment five. And I really just don't necessarily understand this. It says that um, review the policies and procedures in place regarding processing and approving invoices for payment. um reviewed samples of paid invoices to ensure the interest supported by accurate docu adequate documentation and it says we found that the district does not record accounts payable on a monthly basis. Accounts payable are recorded at year end. I find it hard to believe that we are not that we're recording accounts payable once a year. Certainly, we're paying we're issuing issuing purchase orders and paying invoices. So, I I'll feel that question and dig John back up. What the order said is that this is actually standard practice for school districts. Although

055it would not be standard practice for uh private business and a lot of that is because there is kind of the accounts payable doesn't close in terms of business. for not in a sense filing a financial report every month or or going to that. And so they said it's not it does get you dinged, right? You should do accounts payable every month. That is pretty standard, but it is not uncommon, they said, for the school districts that they audited for them to do this on an annual basis. And I'm not sure if that answers your question, but perhaps John can add more detail. >> That's correct. By the letter of the law, they have it as a finding. uh but to their own admission during this whole process was oh well every other district does

056the same thing pretty much except for when you get to larger school districts where they have the number of personnel to do this work. Um so just for the board's edification most of the and the new board members we have three levels of audits that take place. Uh we have an audit that takes base uh place on a weekly basis. So that's really reviewing all of our purchases and our payments. So that would actually suffice on this um audit comment number five and that's what we uh had a rebuttal to to the auditor uh which they understood and they were very um understanding and sympathetic to it but you know to the letter of the law this is the date. The second level of audit is what you're approving right now is the internal audit

057which we pick uh an area of risk within the district to uh examine further and expose any potential weaknesses or areas for improvement. And then the third level of audit is what we spoke about which is the external audit which takes place on a yearly basis and is that whole reconciliation of all of our accounts. So, um the level of scrutiny that a district takes is pretty significant and that is on the heels of some some uh nefarious work by some school districts and I'll remain nameless, you know, years back where where things were happening. So, um you know, I'm I'm very comfortable and confident with choosing this area. I'm very comfortable and confident in how our business office functions. And if anybody wants to meet Dan Martin, I'll bring him in here and he'll

058ding you for a date that was done incorrectly, a penny that was missing, and we go back and we have to avoid a check and reissue. So, we have a very um process that has high scrutiny to it at this point. >> Right. So, I guess so what what they're saying by saying it's recorded a year in saying you're not closing the book on that every month. You're not closing that section of the So, you're doing the three-part process. You're issuing a PO. You're getting a receipt. You're paying against an invoice. You're just not putting the stamp on it that says we have reconciled September's purchasing and it's closed. That's just closing it once a month. Okay, that that makes a lot more sense than saying accounts payable are only done once a year. I

059was like, pretty sure the vendors would have an issue with that. Um, >> thank you. >> We try not to allow those issues. >> Yes. Thank you. >> Other questions or comments? >> Okay. Um, resolution number 10. All in favor of uh approving the 2425 internal auditor's report. >> I >> opposed. Abstaining. I don't think there was any. So, the motion passes. Okay. Okay. Could I please have a motion to discuss items 11 and 13 together? 11 is a resolution to approve the 2425 internal audit corrective action plan and 13 is um the first reading of the board of ed policy 6150 budget transfers. May I have a motion please? >> Brendan. Thank you Carl. Second. Thank you. Discussion. Anything additional to add to what's been shared? >> Um just a a question for clarification.

060Um I So Christian you explained 6150 is really the only change being the dollar amount from 10,000 to 25,000. Is that accurate or is there are there more changes? >> So the dollar amount and then there's also an additional sentence that provides the authority for in the the June period to to handle facilities transfers. And maybe John you can address it better than I can to those only two changes. >> That's correct. Um, so when June comes around, we are trying to close out our books. We actually stop purchasing um, usually in May uh, or April in order to make sure that we are getting our invoices. We're closing out uh, we have all of our requisitioners check what are the open invoices or POS that we may need to carry into the following year,

061which is permissible. Um, but in the end, we will try and balance all of our um, budget lines because they cannot be negative before going into the audit. Um and so that is the the June language. The superintendent and the assistant superintendent, we changed that language because it used to be designate. So we just clearly define what that who that person was. Um and then uh the salary information as well. Um Christian mentioned earlier is that um we we do budget transfers for sal this will allow us to do budget transfers for salary in order to follow staff that are moving uh typically during the summer um in in early September. >> Okay. And and I'll just make a general request for um in past years um we we when doing changes to board of

062ed policies, we kind of did a right line copy which wasn't unless I missed it. This was just a a clean version. It just makes a lot easier for us to track um changes that were made. um especially for items that are coming um not from committee that you know haven't had time to be reviewed by multiple people that are just coming onto the agenda. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Okay. Um so all in favor of approving items 11 and 13, the internal audit corrective action plan and the first reading of the board of ed policy 6150. All in favor? >> I >> opposed. Obstaining. Okay, the motion passes. Thank you. Moving on to new business or old business, excuse me. Uh the first item is discussion of the strategic plan. Um last meeting we

063approved the funds to revisit this the strategic plan. We had a lot of discussion about the value of that. uh with the help of John, we found these RFPs from last year and uh I actually reached out. We had last year we had agreed upon the firm that we were going to use. Um we actually had a draft of our agreement with them, but then as the budget things happened and all, it never was executed. So I reached back out to them and uh they've changed some of their pricing structure, but in the end it's in our favor. So um it actually comes in a little bit less than what their original price was. And the greatest news from my perspective was one of the thing outputs is a strategic dashboard subscription that we would

064be able to share with the public and we'd have updates. And that was really in my opinion at least and I think for most people that was really a critical um element of um sustainability, right? It's one thing to do it but then to keep it alive. And that used to be $10,000 a year and now it's only $5,000 a year. So I was really excited when they shared that. So there were some shifts around but in the end we are within budget of what we approved at the last meeting. So um I'm prepared to you know continue the conversation with them sign that paperwork and then work with them on the timeline that you know they would recommend based on all the other things we have going on. They did say they thought this

065was a great time to do it because it it does kind of give a level set to um the start of a an official superintendent and then having this at the same time um it's really a nice way forward. So, any comments or questions? I want to give you an update of where I was at. Jim, >> uh, first off, that's great news. Second of all, I'm I'm trying to remember, and maybe you can ask them if it didn't come up. Is is is this vendor Boseis Adable? Because some of this work was Bosey's Adidable. And I remember we looked at it um in the spring last year. Some people were Boseies Aable, but their price was so high that even with the Boseies aid, they were more expensive. Um I I know that we

066took that into consideration when we made the decision last year. I can't remember the specifics. I'm just saying that's a question to ask um because it the price may we may get a rebate on the price from the most east coaster. I'll double check. >> Yeah, just verify. >> So Jim, this is my perfect memory because I was with Christine on the mayor reviewed the strategic plan RFPs is that there was one that was significantly higher like more than twice. I think it was closer to three times higher and um we did not feel that was significantly better for the price. The other two were within um I think$1 or $2,000 of each other. And so that that that was the basic structure of it. My memory was that this was aable, but maybe I'm

067correct about that. >> I'll double check if it is. It's a win, right? So I I'll confirm. And I think the other um just because you asked for the comment because some of us were here last year and some of us were on the RFP is we want to recapitulate the logic of why we we preferred one. I mean we made the recommendation last year but for for the benefit of Jamie and Loftton who were here last year why we settled on on the one that we did. I'm not sure if you want to lead on that or um or I could >> you could lead on that. I just was going to offer that um I was going to offer both of you to take a this is my only copy so I have

068to scan it and I just got it on Friday. So I'll scan it in so that you can both take a look at it and be familiar with what the process is and everything else. But Christian you can explain how we got here. >> So I think that there was um so I think there were two things. One was of course the cost and one was significantly a higher cost. And I think the other thing that went into our consideration and once again I'm repeating what I think the report was from last year was that if you look at their specialties while they were offering strategic planning these firms were doing had um different level of focus. So one was from I believe Minnesota and mostly focused on transportation planning meaning busing and things of

069that sort as well as public relations. if you look at the principles on that. Um, and most of their work was in the upper Midwest. It did not really deal with some of the issues that happened with New York State in terms of like our own concerns and the own regulations that we operate under. And the other one I think is because it's if you look at the school district they service, they were mostly um I would call small city school districts uh largely throughout New England. A lot of them were also focused on um turnaround plans which means they seem to focus their thing on you have a struggling district. what we're going to provide with you is a and I'm putting this my own words not theirs like a 10-point plan about how

070to improve performance and we didn't find that um that necessarily described what I think we were looking for here in Cornwall and the one that I think we settled on had done several um strategic plans as well as superintendent searches in this area um we reached out a former assistant superintendent here in Cornwall was one of their references and now works in a Westchester school district and uh gave us kind of um you know a personal recommendation about the quality of their work and um I think that that was kind of where there was a consensus by everyone on the R&B committee that this was uh clearly the best choice for all those considerations. I'll just stop there but I think that was the basic thrust of our thought process. >> Just to piggyback on

071that and add more color I agree with everything you said. I think some of those small city district turnaround plans are like federally mandated, aren't they? So, they there was very much like a cookie cutter template of this is what we do, which did not apply to our district. And that dashboard piece was really key because it was really important um as a review to say, hey, we're not going to take the effort and energy to build this plan and spend the money on the plan and then it sits on the shelf and gets dusty. and the the districts that have that have this tracker on, it's really a great tool to um ensure that the plan is implemented over the time frame that it's meant to be implemented. >> And Jim, is that invisible

072to the community, but I think that the other driving some of the cost is something that we were already paying for. So, um two years ago, we did the engagement survey. And so, what was driving a lot of the cost for some new strategic plans is they were offering to redo the the engagement survey, which we had kind of done. And since we had already had um we've already done that, we didn't think that that additional cost given that we've already did that lay of that strategic plan justified additional cost in terms of this particular um RFP, >> other questions, comments. Okay, I'll keep you um I'll I'll get the copy of it to both of you and um I'll keep you informed as I am in dialogue with them in terms of timing and

073and the like. Okay, our next topic is a discussion on um our board of ed opening that we have. Last meeting we discussed um Eleanor is stepping down from the board and we we have options in terms of what we do with that role and we discussed what's available to us and we asked everyone to go back and think about it uh in between the meetings and then come back to this meeting with the intention of discussing what your preference is and I think we had um essentially boiled it down to uh you know the running a new election I think everyone agreed that that was probably not financially or resource is prudent. Then um the other option is to make a call to action to the community, ask for people to submit a letter

074of interest and then the board will um deliberate and select the person to fill the seat until the end of uh until the next election, pardon me. or we can um decide to do nothing, leave the seat open and there is the potential, it's not necessarily it would happen, but there is the potential that the Bose superintendent after 90 days could decide that uh the seat needs to be filled and they could appoint somebody um without any input from the board. So, I think those are the two options are really discussing the final two in terms of get a call to action and then leave the seat open and you know see if we can get through to the election. So, if it's okay with everybody, I'd like to just go around to get everyone's

075input or what you're thinking to just to level set where we all are at and then we can jump into like a discussion discussion if necessary. So, Jim, do you mind if we start with you? >> Sure. Thank you. Um, I think you you've set it up very well. um briefly, you know, I think an important point to add is, you know, you spoke to council and they recommended um essentially that we fill it and that we solicit um applications and we have a you know a mini, you know, sort of a mini session of the candidate forum um and the interview process and then we deliberate that as a board and make a decision. Um and and I think it so I upon further reflection of our discussion last week to me that seems

076the most prudent course of action. Um if we find that for whatever reason we receive no applicants or the applicants are all um lacking in one way shape or form we are still left the option to do nothing. It doesn't so going down that path of soliciting >> applications doesn't bind us to to choosing one if it for whatever reason we don't want to go down that path. So uh so I would say that's the path we should follow. We should just try and you know the application shouldn't be super rigorous ownorous. Um the information the the interview should be you know a small handful of questions you know it doesn't need to be a super extensive detailed process but um you know just a consistent and short process to that guide our deliberations. >>

077Thank you Loftton. >> Uh I agree with Jim. Um, I think that, you know, we give other members of the community the chance to, you know, submit and we gain something by having more input from our community on the board by filling the seat with someone else and having a a ninth voice. I think that's important that we have as many voices as as we can on the board. Um, and like Jim said that we can, you know, if it doesn't work out that we find someone that we think would be a good fit, then we can just go the other route then. >> Thanks. Thank you. Christian, do you want to go or do you want to come back to being the vice president? >> Um, >> okay. Okay. Um, Brendan, >> uh, yeah,

078I agree with both Jim Hoffen. Um, I think that, uh, it's the logical first step. you know, the community has uh elected nine members. So, I think we owe it to the community to uh see if we can find them a ninth member. And uh for all the reasons stated before, if that process turns out to be fruitful, then we still have options. >> Thank you, Richard. >> Yeah, thank you. So, I was going back and forth in my head about this, you know, and after thinking about it, I do I do agree with, you know, opening it up to the community. Um, it doesn't mean we have to appoint somebody. Um, I think if we properly advertise it and, you know, give a timeline or a submission deadline, um, I think that's something we

079we could explore. And just to confirm it, this would only be until June 30th, right? this person who's appointed would only serve up until >> June 30th, the election, right? They would have to run again. Um, so I'm okay with either. If we don't find somebody, then we leave it vacant. But thank you. >> And to be clear, whoever when it's similar to, you know, the Loftton situation that that opening when elections come, that role would be for the the balance of Eleanor's original term. Just to clarify for everyone. Carl, >> I just I would like to keep it the way it is right now and not fill the position. And um you know, I think somewhere down the road we'll you know, let them have the elections like we always do. Um right now

080for us to put somebody in there, I just don't think it would be be right. >> Thank you, Jamie. >> Hi. >> I've also given this a lot of thought. >> Hello. >> Hi. Hi. um given us a lot of thought. I've been going back and forth a lot. I agree. I I agree with Carl. I don't think it's a decision to rush into you. It's arguably the most important next few months of this board's duty, right? And it it it worries me a little bit to maybe it's not a big deal. I mean, you know, I don't feel like so strongly that I'm going to, you know, fight for it that hard, but it seems like it's a lot of work, right? We have to we have to um get people to essentially, you

081know, submit and we have to interview people. And I want to put a lot of our um time behind, you know, the the superintendent interview process. And it just makes me a little bit nervous that this is going to become the core thing we're working on. and then we have this person in this position for six months to make this huge decision and then like they just might not run again or it might have just been an easy thing for someone to step in and do and I don't know it just it doesn't feel right right now and I think maybe if it was a longer term it made me push for it more but the fact that it is such a short amount of time and it is such an informed amount of time

082it's not a decision I want to make lightly and I I don't know how we can make super informed detail decision Thank you, Christian. >> So, the shortest way to say is that I I'm kind of in this camp with Carl and Jamie on this, but I think my reasons might be a little bit different. Um, you know, the first thing about it is why do we need a ninth board member? And part of the there's two arguments. One, there's a certain amount of work that needs to be done and therefore more hands make a lighter work. Um, I'm not convinced by that argument because most districts of our size have seven or five board members, not nine. Um, and I think that I could make a lot of points about like do we actually

083have that much more work and is adding an additional board member going to help any of the committee work or presence or things of that sort and it would seem that if anything uh we probably have a board that's too large, not too small. And you know obviously that's up for discussion. The bylaws are we have nine board members. Many have five. Some have as few as three. And so that's the first thing. The second thing of course is that um you have I think the decision has to be made in the context of the current board. And you can just see this by the leadership elections over the past 3 years have been 54 54 53. And that's just about where like you know the selectorate of eight people to choose would definitely in

084a sense balance or unbalance that without any legitimacy in the community and if you look at how the education law describes the board is that there is no property right in a particular position that's why we can be removed by the commissioner for New York State that's why a majority of the board can expel member because we are not repres presenting. We don't own our office. um that's why we have a corporate identity and I think for the decisions and just to be frank after last meeting you know it wasn't recorded but people were discussing about who they would want to recruit for the board and I it was putable in the hallway and you know I think that just shows that any decision we're going to make of any gravity whether it's the selection

085of our next superintendent whether it is making some very tough budget decisions which I think we will anticipate coming our way in the spring that would want would rather be something that is not a majority decision but a consensus decision they should have is basically the full support in which case an additional board member doesn't um factor in and the third thing is just the selectorate which is that I think that we can choose any process we do not have to open it up to the community I'm sure that the legal council says certainly we are capable that is an option because anything is an option. We could not even do an interview process. We could pick names out of a hat and whoever's name we pick would be the ninth board member. Um but

086you know political science would say bodies that choose their own members generally in a sense lead to insulation which then leads to poor decisions which leads to a lot of other bad consequences. Last year's Nobel Prize went to Darus and Megloo whose work was on the political economy of these decision-m and how decision makers insulate themselves from popular decisions. So I would prefer a process that was as neutral as possible and didn't give the eighth of us any in a sense say or ability to put our thumb on the on the scale. And so one way is just to say you go back to the last election and you choose the person who had the most votes who did not get in office because that person already stood for election already has justified themselves in

087the community. Um whether it's the last election or the last two elections and that in before we even ask anyone else it should be offered to that person because that is the most neutral way to do it. Um and it kind of restricts our ability to influence the process. So my if I just had to say my choice would be to leave the position vacant. Um my second choice would be to do it in a way that is as neutral as possible. Um and the third I and like not an option but one last point we don't even have a role in how the student exosio members are chosen. It's completely outside of our board for the point that we're going to get involved to have be involved in choosing the elect the the voting

088member of the board and we don't even have no say or input into that. We kind of show that maybe that's not our process in other similar situations and so for all those reasons that that would be my preference for how to go about the process. >> Thank you. Um, you know, I think the way this nets out is probably my biggest concern because my my it we could end here 44, right? And so, um, I agree with your question. It would be great to have consensus. That's always my goal, but we've been in many situations at a board where we're not necessarily getting a full consensus. And to your point, it comes down to a 545 vote. Um, so that odd number really does make an impact. Um I don't know if a 44

089vote would be uh you know how often that would happen but it certainly leaves us open to that. Um I also agree with you that you know much like you were saying about the insular thinking. Same thing happens in interview processes when people pick teams you you unintentionally or unconsciously pick people that are a lot like you or that you could see yourself socializing with. You know, in the work I do, we train people to intentionally seek out people that have different skills and different strengths so that you're balancing out your team and you are bringing to Loftton's point multiple viewpoints to the table to consider. So, um, you know, no one of us has all the answers. So, you know, I would hope that we would be looking for someone who balances the team

090and who would be um an independent thinker and um yeah, so I mean I would just I would offer that um I am on I I understand Jamie your point about um putting in the effort and that it is a heavy lift. Um but I my instinct is that it's a heavy lift at least discussing further and I think that discussion probably has to happen in executive session because if we get in to start talking about you know prior elections etc we I don't want to be talking about people in in a meeting here but my vote would be to agree on a process to get a hand raiser or somebody you know or some people from the community to um express interest and then like everyone has said we're not bound to picking any

091one of those people. If if we get a 44, we can't come to an agreement. You that's just what we have to report back on is we could not come to a consensus and we're committed to moving forward with the eight of us and we think, you know, we'll be able to um do an effective job with that. But I do think it's worth exploring, you know, what kind of um hand raisers we get or what direction we want to go and whether we, you know, take Christian's um recommendation. So um that would be my that would be the side that I'm leaning on would be to uh take the next step in determining our process for soliciting interest >> comment. So if the issue is that we need an odd number, you know, we

092could just have someone resign from the board and I will resign from the board. So you can have seven and you can have your odd number to make a decision and we could have a district that would be balanced and and frankly given how some decisions have been made where you know it really isn't about the whole board being involved or informed or consulted or things happening. This has happened many times over the years. It doesn't really make a difference whether you're making a decision with 7, 8, or nine. And I think that just, you know, I the idea that we're looking for a teammate is once again, I think that is an improper analogy. It's not a team. Um, they represent different >> I wasn't saying a teammate. >> You use the word team.

093>> I did when people are hiring a group of people. >> Okay. So the point is you know when you're putting together a team there are different roles on the team and let's say complimentary things but it's not for us to decide who the selector it is okay so the point is like I would refer to you know people who think like me not really but actually you'll differ but the point about it is that um you we are in the position of eight people who are not necessarily representative and then you're going to draw the legitimacy from that to make a decision then might be decisive going forward on the idea that on vote is a decisive between 44 and 54. I actually think 44 is an advantage because it forces people to say

094we need to go and think about this more until we get let's say a better decision. And I look I could comment on a lot of things where um the decisions have not been ideal and the process has not been ideal but I don't really think that changes with 8 9 or 7. So once again, I I don't think that really changes how we would see it. We're not in a sense as I my initial point was what is the work that needs to be done that's not getting done. And I mean I don't want to go through a list of lities of all the things that have been done and whether they would have gotten done with an additional person. And I would and that just is in a sense the argument of why

095it doesn't really matter. And I think biasing the process in the same way that Jamie was talking about given the decisions and then also in a sense committing the time resources to make that decision. Um and I'll just say this last thing. It's one thing to open it up to the community. If you want to open up the community, have a vote. Um we it's in the budget because we budgeted for two votes this year. And I'm not saying advising that, but if that's the line we're going for the argument, then that's the logical conclusion to that. And I think the point about it is is that we all know we have a very busy month with the things that are already on the plate. And I'm just repeating the point that I think that

096if we incapable of doing it with a I mean and I think if we are incapable this the district superintendent the Bose superintendent has the you could say the outside perspective objective perspective decide whether we're capable of making decisions and how that in a sense the welfare of our district. So, and I will say that the Bose superintendent does actually watch our meetings because the last August meeting she said she listened to our vote on the Bosey's budget from last year and commented on how we did they actually changed their policy by observing our meeting. So, this idea that this person is not observant or cognizant of what's going on in our district um doesn't bear what you know recent experience says. So there's a solution to that and that is why the district superintendent

097who is the agent of the com state commissioner of education should be the one making that decision for the most objective point of view rather than the internal people choosing someone to be on their team or majority of the people choosing the additional members on their team. >> You make some compelling arguments Christian. I just don't want to um misrepresent. I was not suggesting we're picking a teammate. was just giving an example about how people select other people that they're going to work with and you were talking about insert thinking. So, I just want to be clear about that. Um, but you make some compelling arguments that, you know, makes me think a little bit further. I might even consider changing my vote except um, you know, that I'm not sticking to my thing. So,

098I don't know. It's just it's it is it's a lot to consider. Anybody else have other comments or um additional thoughts? >> Something Something else I was going to say, I I didn't want to say it and then Christian brought it up, but a big point for me is and the reason I didn't want to say it is because it kind of goes against what we do as a board. But I like the idea of it being eight as well because it if you are making a big decision, like you really do have to sit back and be like, okay, like I really need to think about this instead of I think it makes it makes you more thoughtful. I mean, I can votes that we've taken recently that we were split on and it

099made everyone really like, okay, I'm going to fight for my position. Um, everyone really had to listen and I liked that, but I realized that kind of is like counterintuitive because you have an on board. So, I wasn't going to bring that up, but I that that is compelling to me when making such a big decision like the superintendent. Other comments, follow up. Can I just ask a question? Sure. Why is it the superintendent oppos? >> Because it's impartial and it's it's part of the state law or the um regulations. >> I can give a little more historical answer is that the organization of the New York State Educational System. We are not independent entities. We are part of a state system which is created just like towns and villages are created by state by

100the state um and counties as well. So the legislature has the the authority they devolve that authority onto the state education department and the commissioner as their agent. So for example and so the commissioner um can decide to change the orders of the school district unilaterally. They can remove members etc. Um the post superintendent has a genus dualace role. Half of its half of the salary is paid locally and half is paid by the state because they were the supervising authority of the district which more or less corresponds to the Boseies districts. So they are not just the administrator or the superintendent of Boseies, they're actually the superintendent of all the districts of the component districts and that is the original uh organization of the New New York State system. Um, so the point is

101that the original districts in New York State were elementary schools. So someone who would be in position of a principal would effectively be running the school district. And if you go look on old maps, you'll see district one and they correspond to the location of elementary districts. So the reason why the reserve is part of Cornwhall is because there was an elementary district on Jackson Avenue behind the Presbyterian church. It's no longer a school, but it was that catchment area. And the reason why we had Woodbury is because there was a school in Mountainville that is now a private residence and that was the component school districts then Kate created the central school district which is what we have today. And so the idea of what a superintendent is is that superant started off as

102a district clerk. They evolved into what they are over time but the superintendent referred to as person who would inspect all these elementary districts that were K through eight initially. So that's why the authority is what it is. Other comments, questions? Brendan? >> Yeah, I would just add um you know the the idea that you know if we're 44 um that we can find our way out of that I think is an optimistic view. And I think that when we have um a very big decision with a choosing a superintendent, again I just go back to this. This is not about keeping an odd number. This is not about, you know, adding someone onto our team. The community has elected nine members of this board. I think they are owed nine members and it is

103our responsibility to do to make our best effort to fill that. If we can't then we we make do with it. Um I don't I want to stress what Jim originally said and what what several people have agreed with. If we go through this process and it becomes really hard to Jaime's point and I agree like we there has to be a limit as to how much time we can put into this um then I think we just say hey we we pull the report and we say we can go with 80 um if the choice isn't clear to us I think that right away if this is not somebody who whoever you know would be the leading candidate if it's not somebody that we can easily agree on I think we can set that

104as like an internal metric, then we we don't move forward with someone. I would never want to push someone through and have them barely get on by just board vote and then be given that kind of authority. I think that's what we all want to avoid. But again, because of our responsibility to the community to provide the ninth member that they have elected, I think we owe it to them to at least make that effort. And if it I think we'll we'll know early on. A we get nobody um b we get nobody that we can agree on. I think we'll know pretty quickly and then we move on to to the next one. I just don't see why we're going to pass up what to me should clearly I mean I think the ideal

105situation is we have a qualified ninth board member. you know that I mean that on its face I I just think that that's hard to argue against it. That is the ideal solution to this. Um if we again go down the process and we cannot find a qualified number then we go to to option B. But I I'm having difficulty just squaring in my head how uh doing nothing is the the top option. Uh again, we we can put in an effort. If it turns out to be frivolous, I mean, we move on. But I mean, I think at this point, you know, we also we've made our opinions clear. We have to kind of agree on something. So, uh you know, at some point, I think tonight we should at least decide in principle.

106>> Other comments, Richard? >> Hey, sorry. Thank you. So, you know, when I started here, I'm I said I was kind of going back and forth and I didn't have like a clear uh point of view, but after hearing everybody talk, I think I already can see that I think we're going to have a tough time like if we go forward with choose trying to find somebody or choose somebody. Um, you know, I think everyone made compelling arguments for both sides. Um, but I just I'm are we gonna open this up and we already know what the results going to be. I I just don't I don't want to go and and put time into something and we're where we already know we're not going to be able to come to an agreement or have

107a unanimous um you know vote on a candidate. It just that's something that stood out to me now. So that's I'm just wondering is this something we should do if Everyone can't agree on the process. >> Well, I think uh one part that Brendan just brought up was that the people for people on on this on this committee. And so there's an election. So if we're going to do anything, then let's have the election. Let's not worry about the money of what the election's going to cost. Otherwise, I say we just sit back and work together as a team. That's what we are. There's four. There's eight of us. Okay? We have to work together. Now, that's that's what it comes down to for me. >> Um, how do we know that we won't agree

108to somebody? >> That was just my opinion. That was me just listening around the room. Not that we won't agree on somebody, but it seems like the fact that there's not there is a like a majority, but there's a some different viewpoints on whether we should fill the seat or try to fill it and leave it alone or go out to a vote. I think that alone just gives me like question like are we going to end up being able to fill a seat? That was just my like view on it. I don't know that we might be able to find somebody. I don't know. Any other thoughts? >> I think the last thought is that it's not just finding somebody who's qualified to be a board member. It's someone who replaces Eleanor's perspective because

109she was the top vote getter the year that she ran. And so the question is that is this person going to represent all those people who voted for her and the reasons why they voted for her and want her perspective on the board, not just someone who is randomly competent. Um meaning like anyone could be a board member and that's why I suggested pulling lots because that's what they did in ancient Athens. We tend to think that voting is the key to democracy. But in the original western democracy, most of the positions in Athens were drawn by law because the idea that any citizen, and I realize they had a very restrictive notion of what a citizen is, and I don't want to go there, but the idea is that randomly picking anyone from the

110community should be able to make the decisions that govern everyone in the community. Um, and that in a sense took away electioneering. It took away the bias and allowed people to then see what people who would not necessarily be disposed to run for office are sometimes the best people for office. And if you look at our best presidents, many of them are meant to best leaders, not just presidents, are accidental presidents or compromised presidents, ones that no one thought would have been president going into that process. And Abraham Lincoln is certainly one of them. Chester Arthur would probably that. Um, and of course there's quite a few bad ones as well. But the point about that is if you are we trying to replace if we're talking about our duty to the community, it's really

111a duty and I don't agree with this because there's no property right in the office and it's very clear in education law how they describe board members that we are not like office holders. We are part of a corporate body. But if we are framing this in terms of our viewed community, the question is well, are we going to find someone that in a sense represents Eleanor's in a sense point of view and views on education and views on educational matters and is that going to be our part of our criteria in choosing the person as opposed to, you know, the minimal qualifications for a board member is someone who's literate and passes certain tests. And you know, these are all laid out in state regulations and whether that gets the majority of a relatively

112minor and elite selectorate, which are the members of the board. And you keep going back to that, but like I'm not sure what gets done with more with nine as a magical number than eight or seven. >> Last call. Any comments? My my final comment is just I think that there's just a pessimism that we would be able to agree on somebody and I'm saying that we might, you know, we're just assuming like, oh, that that person doesn't exist. Um, I don't know. Maybe they don't. Um, and and to Christian's point, you know, may will we find someone who replaces Eleanor's viewpoint? Maybe we will. I don't know. Um, but I'm willing to take a flyer on that option, and if we don't, then we move on. Um, but again, I think a lot of

113this is just assuming that it's pointless to look. And to me, that just feels like giving up. And I I don't believe in that. Anyone else? I do have one question. If we take a vote and it goes if if we take a vote and the vote is that we're going to pursue getting another person and we've said clearly if we don't find someone that we all agree on we're not going to go that way. Right? If we take a vote and it goes to leaving us as is, but we find that to be um unproductive, you know, can we revisit our option of filling the seat? Does anybody know the answer to that? or is it once we decide our our path that's where we go? >> I'm sorry. >> What' you say? >>

114Um I I I don't see why we couldn't revisit that at a later date. >> I think agreeing with agreeing with Jim is that the process is our is our choice. I think there is something to be said that once we choose and announce publicly a process that we should hold to whatever we chose as a process and not just the process and not generate the outcome we wanted. So that we're going to go back and reinvent the process. Um it's like in a sense well the outcome of the election didn't go the way we wanted. So we're going to change the rules by which the election was conducted or the selection was conducted. And so I think though what Jim says is that there is nothing in education law that says we have to

115do it any particular way. And I'm not saying that we make a clown show out of it by predicting ridiculous ways to do it. Although maybe we can sell tickets and raise the money for the school district, but I think the point of that we should be at least consistent once we select a process. If we are going to select a process, >> but the option is there if we decided as a board at some point that it wasn't productive. I I just I wanted to have an idea, you know, how tied in are we one way or the other. Okay. Um, I think it's time to take a vote. So, how I'm going to phrase this is um, well, I'll take a motion to take a vote, but how I would like to phrase

116it, do I have to take a motion to take a vote? >> Yeah, go ahead. >> To your previous point about it being, you know, resendable. I think it's really just about taking a vote, like even an informal vote. um because we we can't move forward on like and if there is a majority maybe we can turn that into an actual resolution but I think first we're trying >> yeah I think this is >> thank you straw pole >> not a resolution because there's you know >> I've been studying rules but this isn't on there so um all right so we'll do a straw poll and um we will do the options are to leave the board as is um eight member board and the second option is to um pursue filling the role um

117presumably with people that express interest, but we can from that um once we have a vote one way or the other. Carl. >> Oh, okay. So, um a show of hands, how many people would like to leave the board as it is an eight member board? Can you please? One, two, three, four. Okay. And a show of hands of who would like to um pursue making this a nine person board. Okay. Um, yeah. I mean, I think that's part of the challenge. And even this, we can't if we It just concerns me going either route if we're not sort of all on the same page or a majority of us aren't on the same page. Um, that concerns me. So, um, >> this quote is like looking into a mirror that's also looking into a

118mirror. That's looking meta. Um, I don't know if this is fair. It feels like forcing us to do something feels like the wrong thing to do even though that's how I voted versus um saying okay we don't have consensus to make a move so the move is to not make a move >> as someone who voted to not do anything I disagree with you >> um because doing nothing is very definitive but doing something and seeing what happens is not so like like like I said like from the start I I believe I want to happen what I voted for however going down the path of seeing where it goes like I'm not in the against that >> I didn't it's a poor choice of words doing nothing versus keeping us like I get what

119you're saying the person on the other side so like >> you don't even four the other way >> right great >> and it also just bring some this is not a binding vote um and And she has told me and I she has told me that she has told you that the ninth member of the board would prefer that the position not be filled. She said that to me today maybe I was misinformed but that's I think that was her position and she said that she still me so with with respect she's not here. So that doesn't matter if it's not a winding bow. But the point is is that if you're looking for a tiebreaker, >> there there has been an express preference. I understand that and and I certainly respect her opinion, but

120um I asked specifically on this matter if um the person leaving would have a vote and u I was told that we don't have to like that no they wouldn't necessarily have a vote on this but I can appreciate that that's her perspective and we could consider it a nonformal vote. Um all right so we're back to Any suggestions for how we move forward? I sit in this chair, but I don't have all the answers. >> Can we also Sorry. >> No, go ahead. >> Uh, can we also have the discussion when we go back to executive session regarding people that have received votes from the public uh from the last couple elections, etc. Um, and that maybe being a path that is different from the two that we're presenting right now, that maybe makes

121both arguments a little bit happier for varying reasons. J. >> So, um I I'll say publicly and I this is um has nothing to do with the people who were there in the last election, but um I don't think it is the right avenue to pursue because uh certainly in in most recent elections we've not had um huge turnout number of candidates. Um, so you could say, well, hey, if you have an election where you have three seats open and four people go and the top three vote getters get all the votes and the fourth person gets no votes, like the community said we don't want that person and then you're going to say we're going to elect them or there could be a scenario where, you know, in the intervening period from the election

122to now, which in this case is whatever four or five months, um, that person could have, you know, committed some heinous crime or something, right? like you wouldn't want them on the there's just a lot of scenarios where I think it would be it wouldn't make sense to force that um to force that as a as a way forward. Also, we don't know you you don't know if that person has changed their mind in the time between the election. We can't certainly conscript somebody in the service that doesn't want to do it. So, um to me, I don't think that makes a lot of sense in this scenario. I certainly get your point, Christian, of hey, that's like the most democratic process, but um you know, I don't think this school board election in a

123smaller school district is an efficient market. You know, we're not uh a large election where there's tons of candidates where um you know, I just think there's a lot of oddities that are are borne out um in each individual election that it doesn't make sense to to pursue that as a matter of course in this case. So just um fast forward um this is a matter of board organization. This does not have to be a public vote. This does not happen in the public meeting. Um just like anything else like forming committees. This can be executive session or privately organized about how we want to go about it because it is not about um it's not about um we're not spending public money. So it's not covered by open meetings law. he's cho choosing a

124matter of how the board is organized and so if that would facilitate the process we might be able to discuss this um outside of this forum. Uh secondly I mean just empirically the average number of candidates in Cornwall has been um for over the last 25 years we had five candidates and six candidates in two the last three elections. So we had more candidates than the historical norm for this district. So I mean we I'm not sure what an efficient market or how we could demonstrate it's an efficient market. What I I think the point about that is being neutral and that's really the advantage of going about the way is that it's a preset process that we didn't have control over and I think that's what makes it an entire process not about necessarily

125the democratic nature of it and and obviously we can't draft someone onto the board. that you have to consent. >> So I'm I'm just hearing uh two arguments uh at the same time like we should stay with eight but maybe we should get a ninth person. I mean I think that the path forward is there was not support for finding a ninth person you know and that was my position. So uh unless somebody changes their mind I think that's where we stay. I'm sorry. Maybe >> there's been a lot said in the last few minutes. >> That's all I'm saying. >> Um yeah, I I what I want to pause I think is this sense of like well now we have to move to another way of filling it. I mean we just had the

126argument that the choice was do you want to have keep it an eight person board or a nine person board and there wasn't support for a nine person board. I'm not quite sure how we then get more support for a n then it starts to feel like putting thumb on the scale like well I'll vote for ninth person if I already know that n person >> I'm in agreement with you. I think that was what I I worded as well but it was more that if we're not all in agreement to get a ninth person. I just don't know that that's the path to go because then we're also getting somebody that um I I don't know. So I don't disagree entirely. >> Yeah. I mean I if we don't have majority support to take

127an action we shouldn't take the action. So we don't have support to take the action to go find a candidate. So we stay with eight unless some circumstance changes and somebody changes their mind and wants to make a compelling argument uh to the remainder of us on on why they did that. But absent that circumstance I don't think there's any action to be taken. >> Both of you said it better than I did. So I I agree. Um okay. So there's no vote. It was informal anyway, but we will uh for the record, we are going to take no action at this time and um we will remain an eight person board. We do have to go back into executive session. I I um know that I don't know if there's any public comments, but

128we have closing comments from the board. Um while I'm sure we'll be efficient with that, but any public any comments from the public? Okay. So, um, we will >> I mean, >> no, totally. >> No, we public comment. >> Yeah. >> Board update. >> That That's I was going to say if if people, you know, promise make sure to be efficient about it. So, >> I really just want an opportunity to to speak to Eleanor. >> That's what I mean. And but I just know if we do it in 20 minutes to half an hour. Yeah. >> How about we say everyone gets like 60 seconds? >> I'm down with that. >> Okay. like because we know we still have another discussion to have. So, um let's try to be disciplined about our closing comments.

129So, me not to put you on the spot, but I'm going to just because we're going to start over there. Do you have anything to close with? >> Um I think I think I'm all set. Yeah, >> she wins. Fastest closing comments. I just want to wish Elanora well and you know she was a I think she was a valuable asset to this board in this district. She was my elementary school teacher so I knew her for a while. Um so best wishes to her and I hope everybody has a good rest of their night. >> Yeah, just quickly uh Elanora thank you. you know, obviously her dedication to this district is beyond question. 25 years, I think, as a as a teacher, and then a year plus on the board. Um, she definitely showed

130her dedication, I think, to the students. That was very clear. Um, particularly, I thought, during our last budget season, she would she'd be she emerged as kind of one of the most vocal and and passionate supporters of of kids. And, um, which should be no surprise because that's that's just how she, you know, conducted her whole life. Um, and she was also just a very pleasant person to be around. I had the the fortune of being uh sat next to her um for for most of the year and I know we we shared a lot of laughs and I think that although we nobody at this table agrees on everything um you know I think when we look back you know years and years from now that those the details of our disagreements will uh

131fade away and we'll remember you know snide remarks and laughing at our breath of that's that's what's important in life and certainly we had a a lot of those moments. So, uh, Eleanor, we're going to miss you. Uh, and, uh, you know, 26 years in this district, obviously, your fingerprints are going to be on things for a long time. >> I think my regard um, to she knows it well because I communicate directly. Um, I will say that I claim a little bit longer association because before she worked in Cornwall, she taught at my elementary school and I think started the year that I left it and taught two of my siblings. Um, and so we reminisce very often about how this captorium looks very much like the captorium that I went to elementary school

132in in kind of like a PTSD uh kind of way. So, I'll give a shortened version of what I was going to say, but I just would like to bring to my colleagues attention an article that was just recently published in the Hill about um fan books week and it made uh two observations. The first one is that the number of challenge books has gone down uh over the last two years and that's the good news. But the bad news they pointed out is the reason for it um when the American Library Association, Paname and Penguin Random House have been involved in this issue is that the reason the number has gone down is because what they are seeing is a rise of self-center uh teachers and school districts. And so what they are seeing

133is that people are bas and they mentioned one uh story where a superintendent gave a post-it note to the school librarian about what books they wanted pulled and then requested the books and the post-it note back. And I think we should be understanding about those processes just as much as the the open one the open processes and I think it's an interesting article to read um in the light of man books week which was earlier this month. Thank you. That's an interesting perspective. Um yeah, I just really wanted to have closing comments to take a second just to thank Elanora. I think I really to to Brendan's point. I think I've met um few people who are more passionate and more of a a just full advocate for kids. I mean a lot of people

134in our district are, but I mean she would, you know, fight to the death, so to speak. Um, and however, what I will say is, you know, to Brenda's point, too, we didn't always agree, but what I really appreciate about it, Eleanor, is she was willing to compromise and meet halfway and um, you know, consider um, alternatives or consider sort of elements that could be an alternative to progress, right? So, it's not perfect, but um, and we've talked about that personally, too, that um, we really appreciated that about our relationship. So I valued that she brought a different perspective to the conversation from what I experienced and um it certainly made me think and times I I changed my opinion because of her influence. So I appreciate that and uh she will be missed and

135really wish her all the best. Um, and certainly, you know, we're here if she wants to keep us uh, you know, informed about what she thinks we need to be doing, you know. So, but genuinely, thank you for her, uh, service to the board, but also service to this district for so long. So, with that, um, may I have a motion to go into executive session? >> A second. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> Any oppos? All right. So, we are going to go into executive session. We do not have anything to discuss in the meeting afterwards. Um, so we'll just be coming back to close out the meeting essentially. Um, just so everyone knows. Thank you. All right. Thank you everyone for your time. I think we've had some really fruitful discussions throughout

136all these meetings today. But could I please have a motion to adjourn the meeting? >> Carl, can I have a second, please? >> Oh, Richard, too. All in favor? >> Any opposed? Okay. Motion passes. Thank you. Have a good night. Thank you.