Cromwell Board of Education Special Meeting, February 24, 2026 6:45pm

001Hi, Jessica. >> How are you? >> Good. Just to let you know, we are live streamed right now. I I we ran into difficulties on the facilities and technology committee meeting that's going on right now. And well, it's not going on. It's It's um >> Okay, >> good. Just let you know. >> Hold on. >> But we're still on Zoom tonight though, right? >> Yeah. I had to I got off that meeting. Well, that that meeting isn't even going to happen because I it has to be public. It has to be live streamed and I couldn't get it done in the time that we had before this one, you know. So, as I said, drop off, get everything ready for this meeting, >> clearing out the issues, which I had no issue getting it live,

002but just to let you know, it is live right now. I'll edit this out later, but I'm just letting you know it's that's what's going on. >> No problem. >> Thanks for letting me know. >> Yeah, you can you can mute yourself or whatever. It's um I Okay, >> I feel terrible. That was a really important facilities >> and technology meeting, but uh it it just when I went to go live, it said I couldn't. I'm like, I don't know why >> some sometimes it just doesn't want to cooperate, I think. >> Right. Right. >> So, >> I have a feeling it's because I might have um >> because I might have started meeting like like way early. I think I started it like at 5 like when I was just, you know, eating dinner

003and just getting everything ready. And then >> it probably waited too long. And there's probably like a timeout period of something, but it doesn't tell you that. And so, you know, I don't know. It's just one of those things that's frustrating because I I try to I try to be like have all my ducks in a row like I had the open and I go, "Okay, all I got to do is click here to go live and I had it already and I click to go live." It goes, "Sorry, this account isn't I'm" I'm like, "What?" >> So, my my apologies, you know, to I I I feel terrible, but All right, >> we'll get it figured out. Hi everyone. >> Hello. Just let you know you're >> we're already we're already live on YouTube.

004Um >> so don't say anything else >> ready because we had technical issues on the facilities and technology meetings. So, I'm I'm I'm trying to get ahead of it and it seems like it's working now. So, >> Michelle, I have you on here twice. >> Oh, knock me out one. >> You want me to remove the one that's muted? All right, Steve. >> All right, hold on. Can Let me see if you can hear me. I can hear Can you hear me? >> All right, let I can't hear you guys. So, unmute yourself so I can hear you. Steve, >> can you hear us? >> I'm I'm unmuted. I'm unmuted right now. >> Okay. Yeah, I hear you guys. Something was weird with the other one. I don't know. Okay, we'll figure it out. Oh

005well, technology gotta love it. >> I'm sorry. I I had everything ready to go and I think it was because I had it set so early that something must have timed out and that's why there was a problem. I That's the only thing I can think of because I had everything like laid out and it just didn't go according to plan. Like but it's working now as you can see. >> I know. >> Link is a lie. We probably should have all just gotten off and got back on, but that's okay. What are you gonna do? >> Yeah, I I like Yeah. >> It is what it is. Can't make technology work. >> We could try after this meeting. >> I don't know if other I know. I I don't care. I'll do anything. So,

006Steve, we just >> That's what I'm saying. I'm willing to do whatever it takes, but you know, >> Steve, we just decided Monday at 6 o'clock. >> All right. I got >> a new meeting. So, I'll have Lisa send out the Zoom invite, but maybe >> I'm doing live. >> Oh, it's live. It's live. Sorry. Six o'clock at the high school. >> Oh, okay. Okay. >> Live. Yeah. Oh my god. Okay. I forgot already. Alan from two seconds ago. >> It's all right. >> Honestly, I just want the snow to stop so I could sleep. >> What's tomorrow looking like there, Chief? So, we're back to 1.5 in to 3 in. And it's from 5:00 a.m. to like noon. But it doesn't look like any sleet or freezing rain. It just looks like snow. It's

007like I have two >> from New Hampshire. >> Six inches or better. Yeah. >> Six. That's how I feel. I have two different groups of superintendent. one who are very um cautious and the other one other group that's like we're going to school unless it's six feet of snow and I'm in the middle right so I'm constantly in the middle and I'm like okay guys let's try to be rational here but I think we should be fine I don't know all I know is I have a conference call at 4:30 so 4:30 has been the magic time lately and then we have another big storm coming in again next week now they're saying Monday into Tuesday, I think. I don't know. This is terrible. Tuesday had >> Maybe we shouldn't schedule a last minute meeting

008on Monday night if it's supposed to snow on Monday night. >> No, it says now it's saying I'm looking at John's thing. He's saying Tuesday. So, Monday we should be good. Tuesday, my birthday. It's going to snow on my birthday. Isn't that sad? I can't. But then it looks like it could possibly turn to rain. Who knows? Who knows? It's crazy this weather. All right, let me see if um yeah, 5 to 6:30 a.m. in the morning amounts are still likely to be in the 1.5 to 3.5 amounts. Three uh Lichfields County 3 plus inch amounts. Still ending between 12 noon and 1. Perfect. Can't have a delay. Can't release early. I swear. Oh, >> can't have a delay. Yeah. >> Have one person join name iPad. >> Yeah, that's me, Steve. That's me, Donna.

009>> Okay, thank you. war might be necessary. As is tradition, the president inviting some highprofile guest Erica Kirk, widow of slain conservative activist Charlie Per will be sitting with the first lady and the American men's hockey team flying in fresh off their Olympic win. >> Someone's got their TV on in the background. >> He'll be impeached. double live stream the state of the union too. >> That's right. >> The heckade and professional commitments >> um I was going to say that might might have been Lisa. Okay. I'm just gonna ask everybody to mute. >> Mute, >> please. >> Okay. Mute Deisman, I got you showing twice in here. I don't know which one is. I think you might have double joined maybe possibly. Oh, there we go. Now it's down to one. Okay. I I

010am just looking. Is Katherine here? >> I just admitted her she's joining. >> Okay. Excellent. Okay, Steve, is there anyone else in the waiting room or am I good to start? >> Uh, I just admitted Matt Zrowski and we have 31 32 in here now. >> You can start when you're ready. >> Okay. Excellent. All right. Good evening, everybody. Thank you. This is bringing me back a little bit of PTSD from when we used to have to be on Hollywood Squares, but welcome to our special board of education meeting for February 24th. Um, we going to try to do this back to our our Zoom rules. So if you want to make a comment or have a question, please use your hand raised tool at the bottom and I will call on you in the

011order for which you raised your hand. Just to remind everybody and think we are good to start. Lisa, I'm sorry I'm scanning this these squares because I don't see Lisa, but I know you're there. Um Oh, there you are. Lisa, do do you mind doing roll call? And I'll just ask everybody if you're not speaking to make sure that you're um muted so we don't pick up any background. >> Yeah, I've got everybody if you want to just wait um to see. I just wrote everybody's name down. Can you hear me? >> Is that Lisa talking? Yep. You're frozen, but we hear you talking. Nope. She's muted now. Try again, Lee. >> Okay. Can you hear me now? >> We can. >> Okay. Uh, I just wrote everyone's name down. Um, >> all the all

012the participants. I've got 33. >> Okay. And we have a quorum of voting board members. >> That was a question, Lee. Do we have a quorum for voting of voting board members? >> Yes. I apologize. Yes. >> Okay. Excellent. Okay. Uh Dr. Murray, do we have Oh, I'm sorry. Approval of the agenda. So, it's a special meeting. We cannot change the agenda, but I need a motion to approve the agenda. Please >> make a motion. >> Thank you, Mr. Schuman. >> Thank you, Mrs. Lamb. For the second, all in favor, just raise your hand, please. >> Okay. Excellent. Anybody opposed? >> Abstaining. Okay. Thank you. Agenda passes. >> Dr. Mary, any correspondence? >> No, not at this time. >> Excellent. Um, Lisa, did we have anybody that asked to provide a public comment? >> I

013don't have anything at this time. >> Okay. Excellent. Um the report of student representatives is in your packet. It's the CHS is reference A, CMS is reference B. Um so those are just in available in writing. You know, I hate it when we can't hear from our students directly. But in the interest of time in this um meeting that we have to have today to trudge through the uh budget, we wanted to make sure we gave that enough time um and its due diligence. So, I am going to jump then to new business and welcome our insurance brokers to share with us. We're only going to unmute you if you have good news to share with us. So, you'll have to let me know. So, Greg and Dave. >> Yep. >> And Carolyn, I think,

014right? >> Yeah. So, >> do I want you to talk, Dave, or do I do I need to mute you now? >> I don't know. You'll have to if if I suddenly go silent, then I'll I'll know why. So, I'm going to recap kind of where we left off >> and then I'm going to hand it over to Greg. >> Do you hear the echo that I'm hearing or? >> Yep. So, the echo is usually if somebody else is unmuted. So, we'll just let you talk it um and everybody else can mute. >> Okay. All right. So when we last got together, we dropped the bomb about the 52.4% Sigma renewal increase. When we parted, we had shared that we were going to do a few things. One was obviously negotiate with Sigma. We also

015said we were going to go to the marketplace to the available carriers and seek alternatives. And we were doing that in two ways. one was town and the board combined and then another route was going to be board of ed only. The reasoning behind that board of ed only was twofold. One is that we anticipated that the uh cost for the town to go to the partnership was going to be substantially lower or more attractive I guess I would say and that certainly has turned out to be the case. That's only result of the fact that they have a higher cost structure now on a per head basis because they have a lower deductible in their high deductible health plan. So some of what we're going to talk about is assuming that it is board

016of ed only. uh with some of these options. No decision has been made by the town obviously, but when we presented the alternatives to them, it seems very unlikely that they will do anything other than move to the partnership once those rates are official because it's so much more attractive than the alternatives. So, we went to the marketplace. I'll just provide a little bit of uh information about that before I hand it over to Greg. Uh we received a no quote from Etna, one of the handful of carriers that are left. That means that they couldn't come up with anything more competitive than the 52.4%. We did get an alternative from Anthem which we're going to share and United Healthcare came in higher than the Sigma renewal. So the only other option in the marketplace

017uh besides partnership is Anthem other than Sigma. We were able to work on the Sigma increase and we're going to share that with you. Now, we also told you that we were going to give you kind of a gross cost as a percentage increase and a net cost for the board of ed for each option. We're also going to give you a percentage increase for employee contributions, which are always going to be higher than the net cost to the board, uh, which Greg can explain if we don't remember why. So, I'm going to hand this over to Greg and then if you have any questions, just let us know. And thank you. Thank you, Dave. Good evening, everyone. Um, I just want to start off and I'll kind of throw some numbers into what Dave

018just summarized. Uh, but just for context, and I shared this last time, um, the increase that we're dealing with this year is primarily driven by, um, a tough claims. I'd say the last 18 months of claims. Um if we look back to the five previous years, um the average increase was 4.3%. And the primary reason for that was we had a bunch of years of positive claims experience when comparing it to premium. Um, so just from a board of ed standpoint, if we look at the prior contract year, July 24th through June of 25th, and this is just board of ed, not the town, uh, premium paid into Sigma was about $4.9 million. Claims paid out were a little north of $5.8 million. If we look at the most recent 6 months, which would have

019been July of 25 through the end of December, just looking at the board of ed, uh, premium paid in a little over $2.7 million, claims paid out a little north of $3 million. So, I just say that because obviously we're dealing with a large increase to Dave's point. Um, we have made some progress in that number. Um, but ultimately it's still a large number. And the reasoning behind it is simply claims to premium from a carrier standpoint. So as Dave alluded to, we have a couple scenarios and we had met with Enza and her team last week and we had given some kind of subsequent emails. So there's a lot of analysis behind this, but I want to kind of walk through some options with this group and allow you to ask questions um and

020we can kind of go from there. So the first scenario if we renew and these are best and final numbers from Sigma. Um so if we renew with Sigma combine town and board and to Dave's point we don't think the town will based on partnership but I want to just give the numbers because they're a little higher. So the net increase to the board of ed is about a little over 35% 35.79%. the net increase, that dollar amount represents 1,776,745 of a net increase to the board of ed. In that scenario, employee contributions, which is what comes out of their paycheck, that represents a 40% increase for employee contributions. The next scenario is if we also renew with Sigma, but we are just renewing with board of ed. the town is not renewing. The numbers

021are slightly better. So the effective net increase to the board of ed is 33.47% which represents dollar amount 1,661,953 and then employee contributions in that scenario are increased 37.41%. So, those are the two scenarios, best and final numbers from Sigma with and without the town. To Dave's uh point, we did go to the market. Anthem was the only relevant carrier. This scenario where they're matching the current uh plans that you currently have today through Sigma. The effective net increase if we move to Anthem for the board of ed would be 35.79% which represents a dollar increase of a,776,745 and then in that scenario employee contributions uh would increase actually I'm sorry I'm looking at the the wrong slide sorry uh Anthem >> wrong numbers >> yeah wrong numbers wrong slide I forgot to move it

022so Anthem the net increase to the board of Ed is 31.89% which represents a dollar amount increase to the board of ed of 1,583,287 and in that scenario the employee contributions are increased by 36%. The partnerships so just a quick update on partnerships. So, in the last couple of days, they were out to bid, which we shared with this group with regards to um the medical network. They're currently currently with Blue Cross. They went out to RFP. Um they just came out that they're staying with Blue Cross and Blue Shield um effective on July 1st. Um they still have not released rates. They are anticipating that they're going to release those rates in March. Everything that we're hearing is going to be around a 15% range um 14 to 15%. So our numbers that we

023shared with Enza and team and that we're going to share with you now are assuming the 15%. We have no control on partnership rates. So just know that as we walk through this. So if we were to move to partnership, the effective net increase to the board of ed would be 28.3%. Which represents an annual increase to the board of ed of 1,45,93 and in that scenario the employee contributions are actually increased the highest at 38.22%. So once again those are the high-level summaries. Um we gave a lot of analysis to the team last week when we met with them that kind of gave all the the meat and bones of this. Uh but that's kind of the highle summary. These are best and final from Sigma who your current who was your current vendor

024um as well as Anthem um who is the proposed vendor that was the only one that was competitive. Dave or Carolyn did I miss anything? I don't think so. >> No. >> The only um Would it be better Greg if you muted while I spoke for a second? I don't know if it I still have the echo. Also, Dave, if you could talk about um or I should maybe just say if we obviously moved from Sigma to Anthem or state, whatever, then we would not have to go back and negotiate with our um unions. If we did go to the partnership plan, then we would have to go back and negotiate. I just want to let you know know that. I've um asked Chester R today. Yeah, there there's a couple uh things to consider

025obviously. One is that the partnership plan is not an applesto apples comparison with benefits. Um so you'd be unraveling 15 years worth of collective bargaining moving people to high deductible health plans. People can debate whether uh they like it or they don't like it, but it is something that exists. The one Uh couple little caveats besides that. Most significant one being is what Greg mentioned before. So over the last five years, the average increase has been less than 5%. You may recall if you go to the partnership, it's it's pretty much a three-year commitment. There are ways to get out. They have penalties. Um, but you would expect it probably be 3 years. Whether or not you could successfully get out of it, if your claims experience improved enough that you could find something better

026in the marketplace afterwards is is anybody's guess. So there is one possibility which I shared with Enza and the team the other day is if for example you stayed with Sigma or move to Anthem for a little bit less than Sigma and you kick the can down the road for a year. It is very possible or maybe I'm just hopeful claims improve and for what am I know it's a lot of money no matter how you slice it but if you you could buy yourself a year and see what happens you can always go to the partnership the following year or a year after because once you go to the partnership you're you're not going to probably anymore have years of 0% increase or 5% increase or 3% increase which really isn't an indictment of

027the partnership plan. It's just reality. The partnership plan consists of an adverse risk selection by nature because the only entities that have joined this over the years, which is why it's a consideration here, is because of terrible claims experience. The last update we had, the partnership plan was running at an 18 to 28 million deficit and the proposed increase of 15% is something they've never even sniffed before. It's gone up gradually. The renewals are history is available on their website. Uh but it is more likely that it's going to get worse, not better. So the likelihood of enjoying a year in the future of little or no increase is is probably gone. So, one could make a case whether it's because of the collective bargaining agreements, because of the trying to retain the high deductible

028health plan type structure or giving yourself an opportunity to see if the claims improve and spending more for a year is something that you all will have to unravel and consider. It's really uh as simple as that. The only other nugget that I'll throw out there, which we have no inside information on whatsoever, but if if there was some consensus around uh staying with an Anthem or a Sigma, and I'll I'll think of Anthem right now just as an example. Everyone's given us their best and final, but after 35 years of being in this business, it's always uh never surprising to find out that it isn't best and final. If we went back to Anthem and said, "Hey, you're this close, or if you do this, we'll do this." There's always the possibility that they

029could come down a point or two. I have no um inside information about that, nor does Greg or Carolyn. We don't know that that will happen, but we do know that carriers don't like to compete against themselves. And after all of our collective years of experience, sometimes a carrier will look at it and say, "Well, Bramwell's not going to leave Sigma for what this tiny little differential is." But if we uh go back to them, the possibility always exists. They've told us it's the best and final, though. So, I'm just being hopeful. Does everyone understand why the increase is higher for employees than it would be for the the board on a net basis under any of these scenarios or is there any clarification we could add around that? >> It might be helpful. Dave,

030we have some new board members. So, why don't you explain that and then um I'll open up to questions after that. >> Okay. So the the main difference is is because right now the board's cost includes whatever the contractual obligation is by bargaining agreement. Let's just call it 80%. You know that ranges between 77 a half to 81 a half or something like that where the board contributes based on the individual contracts. So that's easy. That's just the straight premium. But the other expense to the board is considerable. It's almost a half million dollars that's being funded into HSA accounts also by agreement. So when we look at the numbers year-over-year, only the premium would be going up by whatever the percentage is, but the contribution of a half a million dollars or so of

031HSA is not an increasing expense. So when we add together the board's cost which is the increase of the premium at whatever the number is 30% 33%. But the HSA part is not going up by 33%. So the overall increase is going to be lower for the board because the employee is just seeing a straight increase in their premium. They do have the expense of funding the other part of their deductible, but that's voluntary. The board doesn't have a choice. The board is contractually obligated to fund 50% of the deductible. The employee can pick or choose whether or not he or she uh funds it. So, that's really the reason why there is a differential in each of these scenarios. >> Thank you, Dave. Thank you, Craig and Carolyn. Um, I'll open it up to

032any board members that have particular questions for our guests. >> Matt, >> so thank you for the information, Dave. I guess um my my question really is um you know this potential wiggle room that we're talking about between Anthem and Sigma, right? where there's the possibility that their best and final isn't their best and final. How would that work? Would we throw out a number that we think would be a little bit more reasonable or a little bit more appetizing or you know, however you want to describe it and then what you guys would go back to them and say, "Hey, the board said if you could come closer to this mark, then they would consider, you know, your services." It's a good question and I I almost wish I hadn't mentioned it but I

033feel like I have to because um they've both communicated to us that this is best and final. We have talked internally just because you know we we do this all the time and we've been doing this for years. So if you try to put yourself in the shoes of say Anthem, you know, Anthem is like normally you would never see any kind of an employer group change carriers from Sigma say to Anthem for a point and a half difference in premium or something like that unless there were other ma major issues with the network or claims processing or administration or things like that and we can argue you know whether or not those exist or don't exist. So, normally that wouldn't occur. So, if you're Anthem, you're there's probably some somebody there who's looking at

034this and thinking, well, you know, we're not really going to get this. We have very little chance of getting this business anyway. The only thing that is agreed upon by all parties is that the claims experience is horrific, which is why initially we thought they were going to come down even more. But looking at recent claims has has turned them off from doing that. So what I've thrown out there is simply well to to answer your question directly if the board got together and said and it was an official decision that hey if we go back to Anthem and say if you get to this point we'll move we'll sign on the dotted line and that'll be that then we could present that and at least they know that if they go to their higher

035ups or if we go to their higher ups they know that do we really wanna lose the opportunity to have this over another point or two points or something like that. I have no idea, nor does Greg, nor does Carolyn, whether or not they will accept that, but it's something that we would we would want to explore if there was interest in doing that. But that would really require, you know, a letter of intent, a commitment to do that. I guess the follow-up question is would they be more likely either company to to come down a little bit more, you know, let's say even if we were shooting closer to 25% if it were a longer term uh commitment, like can we even do that? Like could we say, "Oh, we'll we'll stay with you

036for three years. We can't like can we sign a contract for that length of time or no?" >> No. I think that would actually hurt the cause. >> Okay. Um you well it would hurt the cause if if you're asking them to lock into an increase for a longer period of time because any any if the claims experience continues next year as it is this year they will have lost money. >> Yeah. >> Even with the the increase that they're proposing. >> So even as things stand they're taking a little gamble in in uh moving that. Now, I I I mentioned in an email to Enz and her team today that um you know, you really need to evaluate as a board or however you go through your process about whether or not you just

037want to go into the partnership or not. It sounds like I know don't really necessarily want to do that and if you feel backed into a corner to do that because of the the cost, that's totally understandable. The other thing with with Anthem is is that you you move over to Anthem, they don't have I'll say the last 18 months of getting killed in claims. So I don't want to say you get to wipe the slate clean, but as far as their claims experience is concerned, they will not have endured what Sigma has endured for the last 18 months. So, if you're going to stay on a uh outside of the partnership, there's probably some some merit in strongly considering Anthem, which is why I I don't want to seem like I'm pushing that because

038I'm not, but that's where there is some merit perhaps, not just in a slightly lower cost. >> Okay, I'm gonna try >> Oh, I'm sorry, Dave. I just want to be conscious of time. So, we promised we'd be done with this conversation by about 7:30. And I've got three more folks with questions. So, I'm going to jump to Mrs. Russ and then Mr. Schuman and then Mrs. Lamb. Thank you. Um, so my I have a couple of questions. The first is um the partnership is definitely the root of the town, correct? >> It's it's not definite. Nothing's official. >> Okay. >> When we presented this information to them, their net cost is closer to 20%. >> Okay. >> So, comparing that with Sigma, which is around 40 and uh Anthem, you know, similarly because remember

039the Anthem option that we've shown you and one of the Sigma options was a board of ed only, >> right? >> Their experience is actually a little worse. The Anthem option is the lowest um percentage in dollar increase for the board of ed, but it has the higher percentage of uh employee contribution. Is that correct? >> No. The the lowest >> I wrote the wrong number down >> net cost to the board would be the part partnership. >> Yeah. So >> excluding the partnership from that excluding the partnership if we're just looking at Anthem and Sigma. >> So Sigma from a contra employee contribution standpoint is 37.41% increase. >> Okay. >> And the Anthem increase for contributions for employees would be 36%. >> Okay. All right. And then I just have one last question for

040Enza. Traditionally, the board hasn't said which direction we go with insurance. Is this only happening because of where we are with the cost of everything and the fact that we have to switch? >> Yes, we usually um we've never with Signets, we've always been in single digits for increases. >> We've started out high, but then we've come down to I think the highest we ever had was a 7% which was last year. So coming back to you guys to negotiate over a plan that we knew would be more expensive like the partnership plan without much interest. I wouldn't say any but without much interest from our unions was not good and it wasn't worth doing all this work because we had a good number. Um, so I think it's important for all of us to

041know because it's it's so expensive and I want you to know. I mean, if I I think if if you're asking me what I would do, I I would um I would like to hear from our unions and see what they think about the partnership plan um and their feeling about the HSA. I also have a question about um you know what is so once if a lot of people do use out of network providers um what would that look like? What's what is the split between um the employee and the and the board? I think that would be a question that we would get from our employees. I think our employees will be nervous because they're used to having that HSA um in their accounts and it's tax-free and it's there when they need

042it, but I do believe that the partnership plan is richer and I know that because I was part of it for a very long time. Um, however, I would say no to Sigma unless they got us to a 25% because I've been through hell with Sigma this year and I've never experienced this. That's my personal experience. I believe others have as well. So, I would say let's give Anthem a try. It's $78,000. It's nothing to like block about. >> Um, and what do we have kind of to lose? And if Sigma, if we go to Sigma and say, listen, 25%, that's it. And they give it to us, that's great. Um, but I am just looking at the whole big picture that you guys really don't have, you know, and I'm sharing it with you.

043Do I think there's a perfect science? I don't I don't really necessarily do think there's a perfect science. Um, I think the conversation with our unions and I've asked them to please watch Michelle sent them an email asking the union heads to to watch this meeting tonight so they know what's up in the air. Um and then we should most likely have a conversation because we may have people that say absolutely um not we don't want to open up the plans and we don't want to negotiate um a partnership plan um and both parties would have to agree because it is not really comparable in that sense. Want to jump to Mr. Schuman and Mrs. plan. But I also want to ask that we try to be as brief as we can so we can

044um conclude this part of our meeting and get to our budget conversation. Thanks for your patience and Jessica. >> Gregor Dan, is there such thing as a rebate if claims are lower? Any of these companies ever give something back at the end of the year if the claims experience turns around and gets a lot better than it has in the previous year? >> Go ahead, Greg. >> Yeah. So Allan, there are um contracts um that do allow uh some sort of a surplus um if if claims are better. It's technically a self-insured medical contract in a lot of scenarios. U but there are scenarios that do exist like that. You guys are currently in a fully insured contract. Um there is no surplus in the current contract that you have today. So, if claims do

045turn around um in the current contract, there would be no dollars returned from a surplus standpoint. >> Thank you. >> Sorry, Mrs. Lamb. >> Just a couple questions. Um is it is it possible that we would be able to truly separate from the town in this respect or is that something a decision that the town makes? was my first question. >> No, I >> can we say that we're going to be separate >> at this point? Yes. >> Okay. All right. And then my other question is how difficult is it to switch carriers or providers? Is there an additional cost to transition? Like is there are there onboarding fees or anything like that if we do switch to to Anthem? >> Carolyn, do you want to address that? >> Sure. Um in terms of the

046transition, there's no additional onboarding fees. Um but there would be administrative work that goes into the transition. So essentially preparing uh the materials and the systems with the new information, making sure that there's a plan in place for the enrollments to transition over um working with the carriers. Typically implementation will start in advance. We'll you know be touching base regularly to build out the structure, build out the plans, be prepared for the enrollment. the enrollment will transition over ensure ID cards are available and there's a timeline associated with that. So I would say in terms of cost there's nothing that I you know wouldn't I wouldn't anticipate it was just more of the work that needs to be done and of course we're here to support that piece of it. Um but it's not as

047easy as just renewing with the carrier as is and having everything just be the same >> and the carrier provides that service to help us transition. Yeah, they'll assign an implementation team. So, we'll partner with the implementation team. Team members um will partner with the implementation team. So, we'll all be working together on that. >> All right. Thank you. >> I would only add that moving to Anthem is not a question of re-educating people about plan designs or things like that. It's really more looking uh make looking to see doctor matches. Anthem has, you know, a great network. Obviously, partnership uses Anthem as well. It would be partnership that would be probably a lot of more heavy lifting in terms of holding meetings, educating employees, making sure they understand how they work. There's a whole

048another component called the HEP program, which Ana could could speak about or Greg could. Uh there are requirements for employees to abide by uh wellness schedules or else there's penalties. So that would be a a very different undertaking >> prevent of health. So you're required to go to doctor's offices on a preventive schedule if under the partnership plan which um I think some would say that improves health outcomes for the system. So that's their argument. Um go ahead. >> Sorry. I just want to double check as we're asking this piece. Um I do remember when we were part of that plan and Michelle may remember and Dave you may know um are we responsible to collect how does it work as far as so you get you don't get your physical you get dinged $100

049per person so then are we the ones that are responsible meaning the board of ed to try to I just remember like >> watching Michelle nod her head >> yeah I remember something Michelle what is it I forgot >> yes we get a list from the state department um Connecticut state and they let us know how you know who has penalties and then we have to pull that from their paycheck and we submit that back to the state. So there is >> work there on our end that we would have to do and I remember it being a pain in the neck. Um and that was a department that had four or five people in it and we only have two. >> Right. So the savings may be eaten up by us having to hire

050additional HR staff or or paying. >> So also something has to be negotiated with your union they good point and we already did the teacher negotiations and our bargaining unit negotiations. >> Yeah. And the only thing I'll add to what Alyssa said so there is the preventative everybody based on ages you have to get things uh taken care of. There's also a chronic component. So any members that are enrolled, if it's asthma or whatever it is, there's a whole separate piece to that where folks that have a chronic condition, they need to basically abide by all the things. And once again, the penalty comes in if they don't do that. >> Thank you for that reminder, Greg. I have a couple quick questions if I don't see any other hands from board members. Um, one,

051have you all done any comparisons of networks to to just I know how disruptive it would be for our employees if they were no longer able to access their providers and so just looking at both networks between current Sigma and Anthem. I know Anthem's got a robust network. Do you anticipate any issues if we made that switch? >> So, great question. Uh we're in the process of doing a provider disruption report which basically takes all of your members where are they going today and then running that through Anthem. When we do this Alyssa typically it's like high 90%. So to your point Anthem very strong network I would anticipate 97 99% match. There's always the chance when you move from one carrier to the next one doctor may not be in and vice versa. Um

052but it will be a very high match and we are doing that data right now. >> Okay. Thank you. Next question. Um I know you guys are the experts in negotiation and that's why we have you. So you're going to help us get to that 25. I'm hoping. Um but my question is have you tried the strategy of looking at a cap for the second year. So if we decide to make the shift to Anthem, I know one of the strategies we've used in the past is to say, okay, we'll we'll make this this switch, but the following year the increase can be no greater than 15%. Based on our utilization, it could be lower, but it'll it won't exceed 15%. Have you all opened up any of those conversations to start thinking about some

053of our long-term planning? >> Yes, so another great question. uh we have gone down that path. Um Anthem is not in a position to give a secondyear rate cap based on the claims and the volatility. Um they feel and Sigma is the same way with their best and final the numbers that they have. They need to put numbers out there that supports claims. Obviously, if claims turn, which we hope they do, that's going to help with favorable increases years two and three. uh but ultimately they're not in a position um to give a rate cap for the second year. That being said, to Dave's point earlier, we can go back to them and say, "Hey, listen. They're seriously considering it. We need X and they'll do it with a secondyear rate cap. They've initially said

054no, but once again, we can certainly ask." >> I think it's great to have that tool in your toolbox and as you're negotiating. That's what scares me about the partnership is um lack of uncertainty and the outy years and the required commitments. Okay. Um any other questions? Matt, you have your hand up. >> Sorry, this isn't I'm just I'm throwing this around in my head and it's really more of a question for Michelle. Sorry, Michelle. I I'm I'm sure you don't have these numbers available. I'm just trying to kind of get an an idea of with Anthem. You're talking about an average increase to our employees of 36%. Uh someone correct me if I'm wrong. And Sigma was >> 37.41. >> Um what what does that look like in money, Michelle? Like is there can

055can we get an idea of the average cost to each employee based on that? I I know it's a it's a a big ask even if we can't get it now. just trying to figure out like if we took the total amount that our employees are paying in on their current, you know, percentage and then we see this increase, what's it going to cost the average employee? >> So, >> I know I know it'll vary based upon what step they're on and so forth. Just a rough idea. >> So, if I just gave us an estimate right now, just let's just say on average for individual around $114 for individual insurance, right? >> Yep. And so if we took the 114 and we times that by um and that comes out every two weeks, it's

056bi-weekly. So 114, it's every two weeks. So that comes out of 22 cycles. So I have a quick calculator in front of me. So if I do 114* 22, that's 25508, right? That's for individual insurance. And this is just health and vision through Sigma that we currently have. Um, am I wrong on this, Dave? Just times it by like the 35% increase or um again um just >> if you have any premium cont if you have any premium contributions in front of you, whatever the basis is, whether it's 20 pay periods or 22 pay periods, if if you multiply it by 1.36 or it's going to be significant no matter >> where you go to the employee. I mean, >> yeah. >> So, Michelle, multiply that by 13. Michelle, multiply that number by 135. I

057did. I got 3,38580. And if I minus that by the what? The 25508, it's an increase of $877.80 for the year and you divide that by 22. So, you're talking about $40 more per pay period. So for an individual person that's single, that's $40 more dollars coming out of their paycheck. >> I'm just trying to get a rough idea. I mean, it's there's no way around this. That amount's going to go up no matter what we do. Um I just really want to make sure that we're we're kind of minimizing the pain of our employees in this process as well >> because for some people that's their actual raise, >> right? I'm aware. >> That was my next question. That was what I was going to ask you is does that does that completely negate

058the increases that we were so happy to be able to provide for our staff. >> Right. >> It's close. >> The other the the other thing I was thinking about is just if we can if we can somehow make it a little bit more palatable by saying next year it's not going to be as bad and we already know that that might be something that we could use to be able to at least give some peace of mind to our to our staff. So, I don't think we're going to solve this today. I I do think we should ask Dave, Greg, and Carolyn to go back to um Sigma and Anthem and see if they can do better for us because they're so close and try to negotiate the two off of each other and

059say, "Look, you guys are right next to each other and um you're competing against each other, but I don't know if this is >> close to 25." >> We that's our goal, 25, right? That's what's in the budget right now. >> Well, I mean, I know Anthem, you know, with with the district that I teach for, Anthem worked with them to do a 24% and I know it's not apples to apples, but Anthem, you know, hit hit the town where I work with a 24% increase. So, you know, I'm sure that there's some differences there. It's a it's a larger district, but um I don't know if they're doing that for others, maybe they can come a little bit closer to that for us. >> Yes. >> Yeah. Unless Greg or Carolyn disagrees with with

060me at at this point, um, we'll go back and do anything. I think if there's any chance of any success, it it has to be with some kind of a commitment, uh, that if if they get to this point, I mean, even we went to Sigma and said if you get to 25%, then they get the business. If Anthem you get here, um, it's not going to be that big of a move. I can tell you that right now. Now, I mean, we're probably best case scenario, even if if if there's any movement at all, it's going to be very small. >> So, Dave, if we said today with the agreement of the board, because I don't want to do this. If we said, "Get us to 25 and we will commit. I I don't

061think we're getting any better than that, especially in listening to my colleagues. Get us to 25 and and it's a done deal." Is that what they want to hear out of us? It's it's not going to happen. >> Okay. >> I mean, >> yeah. Enza just so the Sigma renewal started formula was 64%. They released 52%. And then so we've done the negotiation with them for the last 6 weeks, playing them off each other. We'll go back to them and ask them for anything. I just want to be realistic with this group to Dave's point. Um, if we can get a point, potentially two points, which I don't think we'll get two points. I think that's kind of where we're at. Once again, we'll go back, we'll ask for secondyear rate caps, we can throw

06225%. I just want to be realistic with this group given our conversations. It's not happening. >> You want to ask for some ask for something that is, you know, something that we really want and if we end up with something that's a little higher, we can then weigh it out. But I think we have to ask for what what we think we can afford. I'm sorry, Steve, I missed your hand. >> I I know the uh the 28% is kind of an estimate, but can we use that to our advantage of having that projection of 28% for the partnership program? I know we don't have an interest in going that route, but or we're not leaning that way anyway. Does that give us any value? Can that help us you guys? >> Yeah. So, Steve,

063the they're aware si um Anthem Sigma, they're aware of partnership. They know where those rates are. Those rates are all publicized. So, although we don't have the July 1st rates, they know that they're competing with partnership. Um it doesn't give us a lot of leverage outside of the fact that they might lose the business, um which they realize. So, we're kind of using that in our negotiations with them. Um, so depending on where those numbers come out, which we think it's going to be about a 15% increase versus July 1st, 2025, I don't think it's going to help us any more than it already has cuz they we we've already kind of breached it. They know they could potentially lose uh both the board and the town to the partnership. Uh, but that's been part

064of the negotiations and they know what those numbers are because they're all publicized. also realizing we probably shouldn't be talking strategy in a public meeting. Um, and and really empower that's that's why we have you guys. So, I want to empower >> your team to be able to do the negotiation to in the best interest of our our staff and our community. >> So, should we say let's let them go back and come back on March 10th and make a decision then? Because I feel like we have to >> we have to. >> Yeah. I feel like we because because at the end of the day, we're either going to make a decision by the 10th or if we have more information by the end of March, but we go in front of the board

065of finance the beginning of April, we may be going in front of them without a without a number. Are you guys okay with that? Do you want to have a number by then? It's it's >> I think I think we're closer. So, I think we should say go back to them and then see what you all can do with any of the strategies we talked about today and then give us some feedback so that when is our I'm sorry, Anza, our next meeting is March 10th after this one. >> Yes, March 10th. And should we be having I'd like to have a a conversation just so we know um with our union heads that we are considering this is a you know because it will be it will be an expense to them and we

066will have to um open up negotiations and they may have no interest in opening up negotiations whatsoever and that I can't force them to do that. So I think we also need to have that conversation as well you know as well. Well, and if we did open up those negotiations, and we limit it to just uh discussion of healthcare, >> right? That's what we'd have to do. Like an MOA of just healthcare and and would that happen? You know what I mean? would we'd have to really have an understanding in writing that we were just going to open it up and it was only going to pertain to health care and we would consider and the reason why we're doing this is because of the partnership versus this HSA which so many people are married

067to because they've never had the partnership plan a PO. So we would have is that I I think it's I think it's worth Michelle and you know myself having that discussion sooner rather than later. Yes, I think it was I just want to say go ahead. >> You'll go back and do anything that you want and some of the things you've talked about obviously we've already um had conversations about. Our advice would probably be go to your unions and at least find out because if if if there is a consensus from you all and the unions that they'd like to find a way to not go to the partnership for example because they might say yeah let's go let's do it we're going to pay more no matter what let's go to the partnership sounds

068great you know start the party if if there is consensus though of of not of of keeping the high deductible health plans and then we could you could come back because we're only going to get one more shot with the sign or with an anthem. So I would suggest we do that on the basis of knowledge of knowing that there is a agreement on all sides and if if we could accomplish this which is not going to be a big move as Greg said um >> that's my suggestion >> because otherwise we're just going back getting information and your unions might Not even >> something different. >> So I don't think this requires any vote from us at this time. But just in terms of supporting that strategy, can I just see by nods of

069heads from our members, does that make sense for strategy? have the communication with the union leadership, which I appreciate that you already gave them a heads up that this meeting was happening tonight so they could listen um get a sense of what their desires and willingness would be and then that feeds some conversation that Dr. Mach will have with um with Dave and team about next steps in negotiation with a goal of coming back on the 10th and hoping to have some numbers that we can that are maybe a little bit more palatable but that we can start using to make some decisions. >> I that sound good everyone. >> Okay. All right. Well, thank you Dave, Greg, and Carolyn. We appreciate all of your efforts on our behalf. >> Have a good night. Take

070care. you guys. >> Thank you guys. >> Bye. >> Um, and just to let you all know too, Chris, I did have Chris work the these numbers for us so that you would know in the budget how much more of an increase that would be. >> Great. >> Will he have those to share with us tonight? >> He does. >> Okay. Excellent. Perfect timing then. >> Okay. Um, I'm going to move us on to proposed education budget presentation and does does Chris want to share updated information with us before we jump into discussion on that? >> Sure. Um, I can just say um I just I ran the numbers that uh the consultants gave us for insurance and changing nothing else. Uh if we went with the uh Sigma uh numbers um our budget would

071increase to an 8.0 04%. And that number would be 43,863587. And if we went with the Anthem um option, it would increase our uh budget by 7.84%. And that number would be 43,784 921. And the difference between those two numbers is just the difference between the options that the the folks just laid out for us. It's a difference of $78,666. Thanks for doing that. Okay. And did you also send Just remind me because I don't have the documents in front of me. Did you also send some additional budget information via email or am I just imagining wrong? I believe um Lisa Hicks sent the um the monthly projection. Um it wasn't actually on the agenda. >> Okay. >> I just had um we included it just because we were supposed to uh once a month

072and I didn't want to miss the month. So just so you have it. >> Okay. >> Those numbers are scary, Mr. Botwell. All right. So, at this point, we've all gotten our questions, at least the questions we put out answered, and I think we should probably have some conversation about what people are thinking where we're This is so much easier to do in person. I'm sorry, this is difficult. Um, but I think I'll open it up to general feedback on direction, thoughts. We've got a proposed budget. That's the superintendent's proposed budget, which we need to take some action on, make some amendments to so that it becomes the board of ed proposed budget. We've asked a lot of questions. We have a ton of information in front of us and I think we I just

073want to give folks opportunity to to share their thoughts on where we should be for direction. Oh, thank you, Katherine. You're going to kick us off. >> Yes. So, I I still feel that it's hard to make a decision about what we want to do with the budget until we have better numbers about um insurance and I'm wondering what is our last date that we can make this decision and vote. I know they're coming back in March at our next meeting. Can we make it then? Have we discussed with Do we have the dates yet from the board of finance? I don't believe we do um on when they're going to have all their presentations and everything because I know we usually work from that and go backwards. It's usually the fir so I have

074it on my calendar. It's usually that first week. So April 1st is a Wednesday. So it's either going to be Wednesday the 1st, Thursday the 2nd or the following week. um which is they usually don't do Mondays but the 6th through the 9th because um then we go on vacation. So that that those are the two weeks those are the dates that we have anywhere between the 1st and the 9th I would think with a couple weekends thrown in there. So we could always have a special meeting if you guys don't like what you hear on March 10th. I don't know how much closer we're going to get, but that's always a possibility, you know. >> Yeah. Okay. I just find it hard to make concrete decisions about the overall budget when we don't know

075where the insurance stands. So that's my my opinion on this. And the only thing I think without it won't it won't be that crazy, but Chris, correct me if I'm wrong and Lisa will be they like the budget binders about two weeks ahead, which leaves us with getting the binders to them 19th around March 19th through the 24th. I don't know when their meeting is in March. It's usually that meeting that we usually get the binders to them and then just to do the work and put it all together. Um, yeah, we need about a few, you know, a few days. I'm not worried about us. I'm worried about getting it to them. So, if we don't vote on the 10th, we probably only have we probably only have one more week, like the following

076week. I'm looking, you know, I'm doing what you're saying, Catherine. >> Yeah. Um, I can tell you that the board of finance meeting in March uh is on the 26th. >> Okay. So, that'll be great. We should have the um they'll probably want the binders before then just because it's so late, but they be may be okay based on the situation that we're in. And especially if they have their April meetings, not the if they have their April meeting the week of April 6th, I think they'll be okay with getting it then. >> So that leave us that would leave us probably the 17th, March 17th, the latest because then we have to print everything and we do every all that by, you know, by hand. >> St. Patrick's Day. >> I know. And we

077only have March 10th as our meeting. We only have one meeting in March unless we need to have a special meeting for it. >> Right. >> Okay. >> And if we Yeah. If you want >> I have the same dates. Uh Dr. Murray from John Ireland those same two weeks. So that I don't think they've landed on which particular date they're going to do that their presentations and we need to be ready for ours. I mean, the town might be in the same position that we're in in trying to figure out what their insurance. >> I don't think we're going to end up with a significantly lower number than where we are. So, I think we can probably assume we're going to be upper 20s at best. And so I I still think we could

078start we should think through what our um perspectives are on other proposals in the budget now. So not just to wait until March 10th because we we can assume it's going to be slightly higher than what we put in the budget at 25%. Hopefully not as high as what they just projected today. But you know are we comfortable going to board of finance with an 8.04% increase in our budget or even a 7.84. I think that would be a hard sell. >> So regardless, then we need to look at the proposals in the superintendent's budget and prioritize what we think should move forward and what we think we could live without given this unprecedented expense we're being hit with. So that I I think we should have that conversation tonight. I know it's not an

079easy conversation to have, but I still think we should have it tonight and assume or at least we're in a closer ballpark. We're not at 52% which would have been a whole different conversation. Um >> I agree. I think at this point if you can give me some direction of what you're thinking um you know we can come up with a few different scenarios but I I think it's prudent for for you guys to start this difficult conversation and and it's okay. It's a difficult conversation. It always is. Okay, >> Mr. I'm I'm just going to throw this out there and I'm not I'm not happy that I'm throwing this out there. So, let's be clear about that and I don't know really what everyone else is thinking about this, but um there's a request

080to add five staff positions this year and those are permanent positions. And at the same time, we've got these enormous increases coming with insurance. I'm not going to argue the value of the proposed positions. I think they're all valuable. I think they will they are all a benefit to the district. I'm not sure that this is the year to do it with with what we're seeing um as far as these health care costs. And I I'm not happy that I'm saying that. I actually honestly like all the positions, but I think five, I'm not sure we can do five this year. I I think maybe prioritize the top two and and and see what that does to the numbers. Um that's just my thought. That's just where I'm at and I'll kind of throw it

081out to the group to have that discussion. >> Appreciate that. Matt, does anybody >> can you guys I'm sorry. I'm I feel bad. Tell me to be quiet if you need me to be. I just want to make sure you have the best information. So, we are having a discussion. So, that one FTE custodial and grounds, we are having a discussion regarding um moving possibly moving um our grounds person, which is a full FTE um to the town. However, we we haven't even sat and had a discussion. So, for example, will we still be paying for that? Will that person now just work for the town and the money's coming out of the board? What exactly is that job going to uh you know do? Um we have to sit and have that conversation which

082we are doing next week. Um which would then if let's say everything goes perfectly and that grounds position is shifted to the town and we don't have to pay for it. Um then I would only be asking for a.5 custodial inside. So, no grounds to help with I don't think I need to tell you guys the new, you know, the new middle school predominantly and then that person would be a halftime person, but there's a lot of butts there, right? I don't I don't know because we haven't had that meeting. So, I just wanted to let you know that that conversation is uh going to be had next week with uh the unions and the town. Dr. Mer, it's my understanding regardless of whether it's our employee or the town employee, we're going to pay

083for them through anou anyway. Some somehow we're going to still pay for it. The town won't absorb I don't think the town will absorb the full expense. >> Okay. So, you're thinking the entire FTE position, the grounds, we're going to absor absorb it no matter what. Okay, got it. >> Probably. >> Okay. >> I didn't think they would be that. Yeah, I think so. So, Matt, what are you you're holding your hand? We're we're we already employ that person though, right? >> We do. So that person it wouldn't matter. It would just be a matter of >> the F adding in five of an FTE and keeping that other one positions um financial aspect >> because even if they shift to to you know supervision of the town, if we're still paying salary and benefits,

084that doesn't really change anything for us. >> No, it's in there as that as as of now. Right. >> Thank you, Mrs. Canwell. >> Yeah. Hi. >> Oh my god. >> Try again, Lori. What? >> You just checked. Is everybody else muted? >> Looks like it. Usually that happens if someone else isn't muted. I'm going to unmute Lori and then try one more time. >> Or if you have two speakers on in the same room. So if you have headphones on that are connected and you're using your computer speaker, that could do it. >> Okay, let me try it again. Lori, Lori, I think you have two screens on. That's probably why. Um, >> you have one screen. Can Can I make a section? Maybe she can chat her her questions. It >> It looks

085like she's logged on, Steve. It looks like she's logged on in two places. So, she's got her camera here and so and it's also There's another Lori. Can we close out that other Lori? >> Sure. >> Uh without her picture in it. >> Go to the one without her picture, Steve. And >> if we close out that one, then she should be able to talk. See if I can do it. >> All right. There's only one. Lori, >> you kicked your You kicked your picture out. >> It's all right. Lori, can can you unmute yourself? >> You can. >> I removed them both. she can join both back and I'll I'll >> you have someone else's question while we're waiting for her to come. >> Yeah. Is there another qu I'll text Lori and I'll

086ask her to join back in and tell her that SA let her in. She was on twice. Um in the meantime, any other board members want to share their thoughts on next steps? I'm I'm going to ask everybody to say something. So, >> Mrs. Lamb, >> yeah, I can just go real quick. Um, I'm with Matt. Um, I don't like the idea of having to cut the positions that were proposed because I do think they all added value and are going to help our students. Um, if I play devil's advocate though, you know, what if it is a 7% increase? What if it is a 7 12% increase? Uh what's the process with the town? We're going to go and they're going to say, "No, that's no good. Go back and sharpen your pencils." Is

087that the process? So, what if we do go forward with a slightly larger I'm not saying necessarily the 8% increase in our budget year-over-year, but it's going to be bigger no matter what because of this insurance difference. There may be, you know, when the town comes in with their budget, yes, they have insurance um issues as well, but maybe there's other changes that are going to offset our increases. We don't know that yet. So, just a thought, >> Jessica, I just see that Alicia's on the phone. Um, but generally the town says, "No, we don't agree to that. Here's the number we're going to give you instead." They don't say, "Go back and sharpen your pencils." They say, "Here's your number." And you figure it out. So, usually when we make a good faith effort

088to try and present a reasonable number, >> what they deem to be reasonable, >> and we show them what we went back and forth, what we started with, and where we ended, they usually come back and say, "Okay, we see what you did." And they might work with us a little bit better. >> But no, it's not a go back and come back with a better number. say, "Here's the number we're going to give you." >> Here's you get here's what you get. Okay. >> Yep. >> Okay. Sorry, Steve. I just sent you a message in the chat that you can hopefully help Lori get back in. Okay. Any other um comments from board members? I have a comment, but >> I know you do, but I don't know how to get you. You guys

089can't hear Lori through my phone, can you? You can. Okay, Lori, go for it. >> All right, I got kicked out. Thanks a lot. So, um, my question is about the RBT positions. Can you guys hear me? >> We They can. They're nodding. >> Okay, so the and I had asked about this in the original questions. Um, I just can't remember. I don't know if we got a specific answer. the two RBT positions which I am sure we absolutely need. I'm just wondering what is the salary on them and what if we consider just doing one right now and what would how would that impact our students? Um I just wanted to get more information on that. >> Thank you Lori. And I think they were different RBTs at different schools. So that might be

090helpful. So Siri, are you able to answer that for Lori? >> I don't have the exact salary. Michelle might Michelle might have that, but it was one at ECS and when it was >> um >> approximately 27. It's approximately $27, right Michelle? An hour 2701 if I'm right. We uh listed the annual salaries for those positions at um 36,115 per salary per position. >> So, but then the we also have to remember there's benefit cost on top of that. So, the total cost in the budget would be Can you do some quick math so we can just answer Lor's question of what we think the total cost per position would be? To >> total cost with no benefits is $38,878. per position. Total cost with family benefits is $75,81. >> Okay. And you did f

091and I remember Mr. Butwell did family because we have to assume that they could include an entire family plan. So Lori, did you hear that? $75,81 potentially with benefits if it's a family plan that the employee selects. And Steve Van Bakovven, I'm hoping you can help Lori get back in. So she's So I'm not holding up my phone. >> So I I sent I resent the invite to her board of ed email. I'm hoping >> I'm trying to get in right now. So >> Okay. >> I'm trying to get >> through. Did you get the board of ed email I sent? >> Yeah, I did. It's Hold on. I'm trying to get in. It's just not letting me. It's now it's connecting. Let me see if it lets me in. Yeah, I don't want to

092hold up the meeting. So, you guys keep talking and I'll just >> my phone in front of the screen. So, >> I know. I'm sorry. I don't know. This is weird. >> Mrs. Russ has a question. So, while you're working on the technical, I will let Mrs. Russ jump in. >> Thank you. Um, I I also strongly agree with Matt. Those positions look fantastic and I'm I know they would be hugely beneficial to our budget, but we the or to our town and our students, but I I do feel that the budget this year is just so challenging with this significant increase and what it's going to do overall to taxpayers. We also have to consider even if the board of finance lets it go through, what's it going to do to all our taxpayers?

093How's it going to get past um the first week of May? It may not. So these are all things that we have to keep in mind. Um the healthc care the the insurance is is absolutely crippling us this year and some years we have horrible things like this happening. But I was also wondering I know we still have the we haven't even started to talk about the overage from last year and how we can potentially use some of that. So, I know it's only a one-time amount, but if there are one-time items, line items in our budget that we could potentially use that towards to help lighten the load a little bit, that would be helpful. I know there was discussion about keeping it for um padding as a a reserve. Um but it's it

094seems like a pretty rainy day right now on our budget. So, I'm more inclined to say we're going to have to look to see if we can spend it on some of those one-time items coming through in our budget, maybe through some of the um things that hit athletics or or something along those lines because this is really really a tough time for us and these are very difficult things to look at and cut. It's hard to put it towards those positions because they're recurring and this is just a one-time one-time amount that we have. So, those are some of my thoughts. I'm not sure if anybody else is in agreement, but um I'd love to hear from other board members. >> Okay, I'm going to move to Alan because I think Alan wants to

095comment on what Mrs. Rush just said. >> No, I think I I agree with Katherine that I think we have to look at that surplus from last year. I know you don't think we don't want to do but you know I think it's raining and it I think yeah I think we have to have to strongly consider that using that and not trying to hold on to it. Okay I'll just share with you um oh and Donna I see your hand so I'll let me just respond to Alan's comment. There's been interesting chat in the CABE uh board chair conversations about use of any kind of reserve and how quickly those reserves go when you have one additional or two additional students with significant special needs or some kind of very serious issue in your

096district and how grateful people are to have that. If we don't have it, then we have to go make a request to the town and it's a more complicated process. So, I'm glad that we have it. I don't really want to see us use all of it, but it's it's there for us and we should certainly have it be part of the conversation. Um, Don, I think Alan, do you have another comment because your hand is still up, but I don't know if Okay, you're dead. Um, Donna, I think I saw your hand raised, so I'm going to pass to you. >> Okay. Um, well, I'm looking at the increases. 6.61 I thought when we were talking about that as part of the uh superintendent's budget was reasonable considering what it was last year. Now,

097we've gone into this no man's land of 8.04 and 7.84. So, my question is this. In terms of actual money, I guess it'd be easier for me to understand. In terms of actual money, what are we talking about if we if we were looking at taking 7.84, which is the Anthem increase to the budget, how that would make the budget look. And we wanted to bring that down to, let's say, even 7%. I mean, what are we talking about every time this budget goes up a point? Are we talking hundreds of thousands, $500,000? Are we talking Does >> Mr. Butwell's got his hand up. He's going to answer you right now. >> He's the magic man. Would he know what that >> He does know. He's raising his hand, so he'll answer that question. >>

098I do know. Thank you. Um our our budget this year um currently is a beautiful round number. it's 40,600,000. So, um when you're calculating the changes for next year, um you can estimate that about every $400,000 will be 1% increase or decrease. >> Okay. And the total budget right now you said was 40 million >> 40,600,000. >> Okay. So that onepoint increase would be about $400,000. >> Yes, that's correct. >> Does anyone see $400,000 just lying around anywhere? Um clearly there is as I recall more than that in the um the the budget that is not quite an overage but um I guess this leads me to what was the document that was sent early on not not too early on about um our being audited and what the auditors wanted us to do. Is

099there something that had gone arry there or is this not the time to discuss that? >> I can answer that question if you want me to Alicia through the chair. >> Okay. Um Steve, just to let you know, I can't make you the host. I don't know why there's something really messed up with this whole platform right now, but I just want to tell you that I can't turn it back to you. Um >> No, I took I took the hosting. >> Took it back. Okay. Good. All right. So, basically, um, we have been audited by the same auditors for the last since I've been here, and my understanding is for years and years before. >> Mhm. >> Um, as Sharon Dvau, if you saw her little uh message, this is the first time we've

100ever received any feedback from any of them about anything that we may be doing um, wrong. the and I'll let Chris speak too. A lot of the recommendations that they made to us, we had been working on with them over the last year to fix. So, the fact that they put them in as a recommendation, it should have said continue to do this because you're already doing it right now. Um, they didn't do that. They just gave it as a recommendation as if we didn't even know and we weren't doing it. Um, which we which we are. Um, we sat and talked about every single one of them. um with my team and the money is all there. It's just they don't like necessarily that we're not using a specific ledger that we're using our

101spreadsheets instead of the ledger. But we've been working on using the ledger. Um Stace, if you all remember Stacy, the entire team was new. Chris was new. The entire um financial team was new. So we just continued what we have always been doing. Um, so that is we'll start using the ledger. It's not a big deal. We will move to it. Um, there's a couple things that we we disagree with and we wrote to the auditor. I don't believe we got a response back yet. Um, and some things we really don't even know what she means. So, we are waiting for responses on all of that. So, it doesn't it doesn't mean we're not taking it seriously because we are taking it very seriously. There's one thing that we noticed that we did that we

102definitely um need to address. Um but some of the other stuff we we have no idea what she's talking about. Um and we've asked for for more specific um things. And then a lot of things we've reconciled while we were going through the audit before we put it through um the report that we have to submit to the board. So I don't know Chris if you want to chime in. Um a lot of the stuff too was like something insure invoices match excess cost. So there was an assumption that Siri does it, her department does it and then you know make sure Chris looks at them and does a match which Chris has done but he was never asked if he did or he didn't do it. So there's some of that going on and

103we understand that they all have they have to come back and give us recommendations. The frustrating part is this is the first time I've seen any in seven years and it's been the same auditor for seven years since I've been here and even before me and I don't know if Chris you want to add anything. >> Can I just ask is Sharon Dvau the auditor? >> No, Sharon Dvau is from the town. They got recommendations as well. They it just weren't wasn't shared with all of us nor you know should it be. Um if you notice the recommendations start with number six because numbers 1 through five were for the town and 6 through um 12 were for the board and then there was one for the town and us to both follow based on

104fraud policy um that we're going to ask and Goodwin if they have but it should match the towns. >> So Sharon Dvau is an official of the town. Yes, the Yes, she's the financial um director of finance in for the town. >> Okay. >> And I I don't know if you guys have any other questions about that. Chris, if you want to chime in. Did I miss anything? >> Um no, I think you covered it, but I would just say um you know, I mean, auditors are doing what they do. They audit and they gave us some great constructive feedback in terms of um some different topics. So, um you know, we're taking each of those seriously as Dr. MRI said. Um we're looking into, you know, what the concern was, how can it be

105remedied. Um but in general, they're mostly procedural type things and um things that will help make next year's audit go more smoothly. So, you know, we're looking at we're looking at each of those and as Dr. Mackey said, uh getting giving feedback to the auditor and asking additional follow-up questions so we can make sure we understand what their concerns were. Well, and I understood I understood everything that you've just said that Enza has said um was clear in the prefaratory information I think that she presented with that. Um there was one part and I'm not sure I'm going to be able to remember it now. Uh I had everything typed out and written out and now I can't find it. Um, but there was one part. Is it about something that they didn't see about

106uh money that was money that they couldn't find or money that they they thought hadn't been written down? I realize it had to do mostly with procedurals and with ledgers and how it was that you were providing this information, but was there something else that had to do with >> was the was it the one, Donna, that said um that our what we have in our records and the town's general fund did not match. >> Yes, I think that may have >> That's a very that's a very easy one for us to explain, which is why we were annoyed that it was there. It never matches until we have a chance to go through it. Um, and Chris, if you want to answer that one because it I was frustrated by that one as well.

107Chris, if you can explain it. >> Sure. And and I want to add none of the money was missing. >> I No, I knew there was nothing fraudulent going on, but go ahead. Um so one of the final uh processes uh well let me back up and say throughout the course of the year the town the board of ed and the town are constantly checking in with each other regarding amounts because lots of money is transferred between the board of ed and the town. So, of course, everything has to balance and by the time you get to the end of the fiscal year, you have to agree on what is the bottom line number. What's the final number? And uh I can speak to last year was really my first year closing that out. Um

108it's a challenge because you have to make sure that everything is accounted for, all the transfers went smoothly and are correctly. Um, and so it took a few tries going back and forth, but um, if you know Sharon Dvau, you know that, um, she, you know, she worked with our team to help us make sure that we were all, uh, on the same page and we got down, we got down to the final number that everybody was able to agree on. Um, so I'm not sure what the issue was with the auditor. Um, but we did, you know, everything did turn out the way that it should have. I >> appreciate that, Chris. And I'm going to just pull us back to our budget conversation because I don't want to take a turn sideways. Not

109that I don't think it's important for us to understand what was in the auditor's report. Of course, that's our responsibility, but maybe we can if there's further questions add it to future agenda. I just we were we were on a path and I want to make sure we stay on that path. So, just in the um in the thinking about what we want to do with our with the proposed budget, I want to make sure everybody weighed in. I Steve, did you I knew you put something in the chat, but did you give us your thoughts? >> No, I I tend to agree right now with, you know, a few comments that have been made. Um, I think right now just with the way the insurance premiums are coming in, we're looking at an increase

110between 304,000 to 488,000 just for new positions. as well. You all know I agree with some of these positions if not the majority of them. Um I think just timing wise with the insurance increases, it's not really the right time um financially. So I think my suggestion would be not to add any new positions this year. And then um as far as the surplus is concerned, uh I think that's something that needs to be looked at as well. Uh last year we covered about 1.4 million in unexpected or unbudgeted expenses um in the 2425 budget. So I still think there's potentially a little room in our budget as is um to cover some of those unexpected costs that might come up that you brought up before, Alicia. So um I think the the balance of

111the surplus should also go back in and try to get us closer to a a six. Even the 6.6 six. I was a little hesitant on myself. So that's my thoughts. >> Okay. So I think I'm hearing a lot of feelings about this. So, I'm going to summarize what I'm hearing, and you all can tell me if I'm off, but I think what I'm hearing is a lot of concerns that although there's great value in the proposed additional positions, that given the uncertainty and the unexpected expenses of the insurance increases that we would like to to move forward with some budget projections that remove those positions so that we can see what that then would look like. And I know Mr. about well you won't be able to do that now but perhaps for for

112us you could do that either interim between the next board meetings or for the next meeting provide us with if we ran a scenario with a 28% insurance increase or a 30% insurance increase without the additional positions what does that get us to do you guys want just so I cl I want clarification definitely understand the cost and and agree with all the new positions costs and And do you want me to take um part of the surplus to get us back to a 6.61 or do you want me to take the entire surplus, which it might be the entire surplus? You know what I mean? Do you want me to get back to that 6.61 with a 30% interest uh increase in insurance? Is that what you're asking? >> I think I think we

113have to I think first step is let's pull out the new positions. Put the insurance up to I think we should run two. One at 28 and one at 30%. See what that looks like. Okay. >> I don't know if that gets us around seven. I have no idea where that where we land there. Maybe, Mr. Butwell, I don't know. I see you working some magic over there. Maybe you have a sense of where that gets us. Um, and then we can look at what we need to do with the surplus, if anything, to try to get us to a more palatable number. I don't think any of us cringed at the original, you know, in the six range. Everybody seemed to be able to breathe with that, but it was when it started to

114creep over seven that we all kind of got scared. I'm just I'm taking a a temperature of the room, but that's sort of what I felt last time. I don't know if Jessica Allen was first, Jessica. Okay. >> Okay. >> All right. Um, if it's not uh too much trouble in the scenarios that you're looking at, I'm curious if we kept in I think it was the two RBT positions. So if those are kept in, does that help us provide services for students and help them stay in district? And if that's the case, I understand that also um you know help us helps us on a longer term basis with transportation and additional services. So is that something we might want to consider at least as a scenario? Um, and if so, so along that

115line of thinking, were there any assumptions built into this year's budget in terms of reduction in student services, transportation, assuming we had those positions? >> Good question. I will let Mrs. Olyri answer that one. That one. >> Okay. Um yeah, I I do think if we keep those two positions or at least one, um it would always the potential is, you know, to hopefully reduce student services costs because we have since we've been building those two programs at ECS and WHIS, we have definitely kept students in those programs >> um rather than placing them out. So, I think there's a benefit to obviously keeping both in if we can't. You know, the hope would be that we could definitely um at least keep one, but >> was the current budget built based on an assumption

116though that those positions would reduce outplacements or is the current current budget is there already an assumed reduction in outplacement because of those positions that we would have to then >> how many did you assume would no longer need to be outplaced? >> I don't think I have an applesto apples comparison unfortunately. Um, but I definitely think that while we built the budget, there is definitely there's the hope that that would help us continue to reduce the cost of outplacement if that makes sense. >> But can I make can I make a recommendation? Um, in the past what we've done and it's worked pretty well. So you guys can see it doesn't mean you have to pick it and you could pick and choose from it, right? So what I can go back and do

117with my team is remember that chart that says okay here's the blue this is everywhere we cut. Now this is the pink and in the pink is the five positions with the cost of their service of their this is the cost of their salaries. This is the cost of their benefits. This would get us to a 6.89 whatever it is. Then I'll go back and I'll say if we were to cut um keep the RBTs like I'll start with cutting three positions, right? Leave the RBTs in, then cut five positions. Then you'll see what it looks like if I cut the RBTs. Then I could say um I don't know, use $100,000 of the surplus and then you'll see what that looks like. Um I'll just give you options that you can then pick and

118choose from. So this way you'll be very helpful. Dr. Murray. >> Okay. We've done that in the past. I think that's the best way to go and then you guys can choose on March 10th what you want to do. >> Okay. Thank you, Mr. Schuman, Mrs. Campwell, then Mrs. Russ. >> I just just a comment that you talking about I'm not as optimistic on the insurance. You you're throwing down numbers at 28 and 30 and stuff like that. I mean, they were coming in the mid30s and maybe squeezing out another percent or two. So, yeah. I I when you're talking about proposals, you might want to run one at the full estimated cost. >> Anthem's Anthem's at 31.89. >> So, I'll run a 318.9. Do you want me to run a >> No, an Anthem's

119currently they're they just shared with this Anthem was at 31.89%. >> 31.89. So, I I just took 2% off of that or less than 2% off of that thinking that might be something we could get close to. >> I'm not I'm not that optimistic. I hope you're right, but I'm not that optimistic. I'd go full boat on those. >> I could show it to >> You need to do that too. Do you I I would do that one too at 32%. >> I'll show it to you at 32% and you we make a decision. Am I then? Well, no, >> we that's fine. Yeah, we could do that. >> That's very helpful. If we could have multiple scenarios that you just described, Dr. Macker, I think that would be really helpful for all of us.

120Okay, Mrs. Canwell then Mrs. Russ. Go ahead, Lori. Okay, I think we're having more technical difficulties. Poor Mrs. Canwell. Um, Mrs. Russ, why don't you go and then we'll see if we can get Lor's to Lor's um sound to work. Otherwise, Lori, you want to post it in the um chat, we can see that your question or comment from there. >> Okay. Um sir, um I'm I'm confused on what Siri had said regarding your question, Alicia. you had asked if um the RBT positions that were in the budget included um took into account the fact that they might be saving some students from being outplace if that cost was also taken in into consideration in the budget and she said yes but then she said she couldn't provide an actual number. So can you expand

121on that Siri? Yeah, I can because if we have students right now, let's say that are struggling in those programs, we wouldn't have included them and I don't want to be identifiable, so I'm not I'm going to be a little broad. Um, we wouldn't have included them in an in the tuition budget, right? Because we're keeping them inhouse because we're hope hopefully going to still build upon those programs. So, that did cut down on tuition costs because we're working on these students to stay in these programs with the help of BCBA and RBT support. So, if we didn't have these programs that we're building upon, our tuition costs could potentially be higher, but I I was accurate in saying I don't know the exact number because >> it's not an apples to apples comparison, right?

122>> That's not so You're not changing the tuition numbers in the budget for the RBT number for the RBT. And if we took out the RBT position, would you change the tuition numbers? possibly depending on I guess what would be recommended at PBTs. So that's why it's so hard. Tuition numbers are much higher. Sorry, Enza. Are much higher than the RBC. >> I would wait. At this point, we're in February. I think we would leave it as is because >> yeah, >> the fluctuations the fluctuations can go in the opposite direction too. Like remember special ed, you can go in in both directions. And we saw this past year, last year that we were in the positive, which is how we ended up with we've never seen that happen before. So whether or not we're

123talking about keeping one RBT and maybe changing um whether or not we would change our tuition is it doesn't matter because it's only about 45 $50,000 and one student can cost us between $50,000 and $300,000. So I think we just we take a risk, right? We leave it the way it is and we take a risk and we do that every year anyway. And in fact, we're closer. We're we we are taking less risks the this year than we have in the past because we look back through January, February. So I I don't think it would matter because it's it's such a small number compared to what you would be paying if we were out placing a kid with a lot of services needs, transportation, this and that. We're talking. >> It's definitely Yeah. way

124cheaper to put RBTs in than to pay tuition. So >> my question was just if we with those two positions in the budget did we say we're going to reduce our outplacement rate by 10%. I don't think we did. So that's all I was looking for. We didn't make any assumptions. >> No no because no and we don't we build our outplacement rate based on students number of students. So yeah. Okay. Okay. >> That that's where that's what was confusing is >> I apologize if I confuse you. >> Yes. And then the the further explanation was no I can't >> if you have if you have two if you have two RBTs in the ABA program let's say and and I don't think those where both would go but let's say one went to the

125ABA program and we had a really strong RBT. We could perhaps keep one student. Yeah. Right. Or >> Yeah. I understand all that but the consideration wasn't taken into in changing numbers in the budget. That's that was the question and the answer was >> not clear. So just want to make sure we understand >> and and it is unclear. I think we would we don't really know until >> it's no you answered it already. The answer is we didn't make any budget ch assumptions based on that's all I want to know. Did we change the budget based on an anticipated reduction in outplacement and we didn't do that. >> You mean that's all I asked? >> Yeah. No. >> Okay. So, now I understand. Okay. Um, so I think where we are landing is because

126I'm realizing it's getting late and we still have more of our meeting to go that we are going to ask Dr. Merary and her team to come back to us with some additional scenarios um with a range of so 32% insurance increase 30% insurance increase 28% insurance increase and then a variation of positions potentially no new positions all the way up to um all the positions as proposed and that will give us a whole lot of options to look at and hopefully it won't drive Mr. Butwell crazy and pulling this together. We appreciate you Mr. But well, thank you. Um, does that make sense for next steps? I think that will really help us to be able to make some decisions and also then we all probably need to do some reflection on what total

127increase are we thinking would be palatable for us to propose to board of finance and and to the community because it goes to referendum. Does that make sense? Okay. So, if there aren't any other burning budget questions, I'm going to move us to Yes. Oh, Steve does. Okay, before I move us, go ahead, Steve. >> I guess the only other thing I would ask, you know, maybe if we're not looking to burn as much surplus is to look at some of these other expenses that may more of a want than a need, right? Like, uh, do we need 10,000 for career center furniture? Are the windcreens the right time to buy those? Maybe those can go out and shift some things around as an option. Um, that's just my two cents. Yep, we'll look at

128all that stuff, Steve. We We definitely will. >> Thank you. I know this is a very difficult conversation. I appreciate everybody's thoughtfulness. Okay. Um, next in our agenda under new business is approval of minutes and motions for our February 3rd meeting. It's reference C. Can I please get a motion to approve? Thank you, Donna. Can I please have a Thank you, Mrs. Russ second Mr. Russ all in favor just raise your hand anybody opposed abstaining I'm looking for Lori hopefully Lori can give me a thumbs up we're going to have to check with Mrs. can't well after the meeting and make sure because I can't tell what her um status is there. >> Okay. So, approved uh board and committee reports. The policy committee has not met. Um I I'm going to look to Dr.

129Mlan. I cannot remember what we said for our next meeting. Actually, I think it's in our minutes from the last meeting is when we meet next, but I can't remember when. >> March 10. >> Thank you. Thank you. um and facilities and technology tried to meet tonight. We had some technical difficulties. We are rescheduling that meeting to this coming Monday, March 3rd at 6 o'clock. >> March 2nd. Thank you. At 6. >> At 6 o'clock in the library of the high school. So, Lisa Hicks, we're going to have to work on sending that out um in notice so we can have that meeting. And the agenda will stay the same because we did not tackle the agenda tonight. Um, in your folders, in your packets as well, we've got topics for future agendas and possible

130action to add topics. We have a pretty robust list of topics for now. Uh, anybody have any burning topics we want added for future agendas? Okay. I'm going to do comments, updates, and announcements from board members. I will do a round robin to see if anybody has anything. Mr. Heisman, >> uh, the only thing I would I would say is I think it's important. I know there were some members of the facility, the town facilities committee that were looking for additional information on the CNR side for submission. My suggestion would be that we reach out to the mayor and um maybe chair Ireland to see if there's any feedback they could provide and exactly what they're looking for for that CRR information rather than waiting till Monday. >> I just got some information from Mayor

131Demetriotis which um I will share with Dr. Mery so that we can try to be prepared for that meeting. >> Yeah, I just want to give Claudio as much time as he can. >> Absolutely. >> That's all I have. Thank you, Mrs. Russ. Nothing. Mr. Shiman, >> nothing. >> Thank you, Mrs. Lamb. >> Nothing tonight. >> Thank you. We're still not done. We have an executive session, so we'll still have time. Uh, Mrs. Ruski, >> I'm good. >> Thank you. Um, Mrs. Maddie. Okay. Thank you. Mrs. Canwell, I cannot see you. Okay, Lori said it was a great meeting. I'll comment for Lori. Maybe that's what she's saying. Um except we've got to figure out the technology for her. Uh and not kick her out. I know she would say that too, but we that

132was an accident. Okay. Um, I will ask for a motion then for us to move into executive session with the invitation of Dr. Mackery and uh, Mr. De Mrs. Demorro, please. >> Motion. >> Thank you, Mrs. Ross. Thank you, Mr. Schuman. All in favor? >> I. >> Okay. So, we will excuse everybody else. And I need to ask Steve before you get