001Finance meeting of February 7 2024 have a motion to enter into session second motion made by Charlie [Music] second all in favor I thank you um in the interest of time uh surprisingly have nothing to say so I'm going to turn it over to to to John to begin with and then I'm sure I'll have something to say uh after okay thank you John thank you Rich you hear me okay U so talking with Rich before the meeting U we thought we might do the capital budget first there some things we like to talk to you about and then uh we have some things on the operating budget after that sounds okay um I have a handout excuse me because um it's not all stapled but I'm going to walk you through I think I
002have 14 you'll see here some help put them um so so let me just point out the capital budgeting process I think it's important to know businesses um our city uh does its capital budgeting separately from uh its operating a lot of businesses do that most other cities and towns it travels on a very different path uh here uh it does not even go through the finance uh Department it is um collected managed uh and so forth by the planning board and planning director Sharon kedro um organizes it should send out instructions um in the fall uh forms to use uh things of that nature and uh in the city Charter uh you've heard me mention that the um our operating budget is due to the mayor on February 15th also in the charter is
003the capital budget is to the mayor on the same day February 15th and it comes out of the Planning Commission get to him uh everything that goes to him ends up in you I've shown this before the the mayor's Citywide budget includes mostly operating expenses but there's a separate tab in there for the capital budget and you'll see the different projects there and um you'll also see in the capital budget is a multi-year capital budget which is typical some projects uh will be funded in the first year others maybe over a couple years um maybe some are scheduled for the third year and so forth but it's all laid out there those are the decisions that come out of the Planning Commission and what uh what happens is uh once the projects are approved they're
004financed one of two ways uh they may take some and issue bonds to pay for them to try and match the life of the bond with the life of the asset and um if they decide to issue bonds which our city does once a year then the principle and interest that's due to the first year that goes in the operating budget and each year uh there's principle and interest that's part of the the operating budget um and what uh our city does and a lot of others do is uh as previous bonds are uh coming to turn where as that debt is coming off the balance sheet they'll put new debt on to replace it so that the amount of debt usually Remains the Same and you see some of that with what they're doing
005but what they also do is they don't bond everything uh many years they'll take some projects out and they'll just pay for them in the first year with with budget money so um those are the decisions that get made after the projects come out as the city's trying to put their um capital budget and the whole budget together including their milary and uh so what I've what I've hand and by the way the Planning Commission meets tonight uh at 7:30 you'll see their agenda in the second but what I've U put in front of it you'll recognize the first page that's the U that's the capital budget that you uh as a board approv different projects there's some bricks and morar I'm not going to go through all these your me these came up through
006the sites committee uh to the full board where they were adopted um we've highlighted um some of the security items that we had put put in there and uh on the second page some of the technology items that had gone there we talked about the Chromebooks a number of times but here they were uh what's going over there there were some copers in there um I won't go through each one the um capital budget this year just to give you an idea from the mayor's budget is the requests were four were $3.2 million of requests uh the very I think it was for us in here this year but we we've changed that by adopting a capital budget and submitting it so here it is and you can see uh we spread it out over
007a couple years that's that's the way they like to see it uh there's some things that we didn't think needed to be done the first year but and it it's really also up to them and through the city engineer um what do they think they need to do something right away or or can it wait or is there another way to do things so um our recommendations for what year things are done in um may change a little bit based on what they have going on um what I included U next uh you'll see an email exchange uh between myself and Sharon kro um I reminded her I wanted to be part of the uh kickoff meeting uh get the instructions um we had done that a year ago and you can see her uh
008response back to me um she's referring uh me to Antonio and Sean Hanley um to uh develop the list uh and work with them but you can see there in her words um the projects uh would then be subject to their review and approval in other words Antonio and Shan would um see if they agreed and then they would along with other projects and see I then U referred it over to Mike cuz it was uh coming to you folks uh for approval um and then the next thing you do here's your agenda uh for tonight I'd might rather to see that because if you uh were to click on any of the links you can see the projects that are coming out of um the the commission uh the one year the projects for
009next year a six-year plan these are all u in the format that appear in the mayor's budget book and then they list of unfunded projects as you can imagine it's it's quite lengthy um and then this as I said goes to the mayor he can accept it as is rejected change ad and so forth that's going on tonight uh but what they have uh and it's the last page is conning because um you can see there are six items for us they're not the items uh we asked for not quite sure where these came from um but I think it's U something we should talk about now we're I think we're trying to understand why our projects weren't considered why they weren't even considered in rejected they were not trying to find out the reasons
010for that um but I think the next steps and we'll talk about we get to the operating budget whether we want to include some of these items in the operating budget or not um but what I think we ought to consider is whether we want to uh bring our capital budget to the attention of the mayor himself uh the fact that they didn't come to him from uh commission I don't think um means he cannot take a look at them uh he has according to the Charter until April 7th to present this book so he's he can add or subtract anything that comes from the commission from other departments certainly from us in our operating budget um so that's the that's one suggestion I'd like to make uh that we consider uh bringing it to
011his attention and perhaps there are some items we want to put in our operating budget as well so I don't Mike anything I you like to add John what is this Bud go ahead when was the budget adopted uh the capital budget from the board uh I think our board did it at their October meeting it was due uh early November in the planning was du nov 30th I'm not sure we we did it U my recollection is about a week before it was remember yeah and there's been no contact with the administration relative to accepting denying And discussing what was proposed or given to them I we've asked just some questions to say hey how's it looking this sort of thing but no no official confirmation or rection so I of at least of
012the opinion that somebody at the level superintendent or Finance director Mike's position should get a hold of someone in City Hall I don't know who maybe start with Dan G I'm not sure but or maybe even start with Antonio if that's who you furnished it to and ask what happened to to this I mean we're not in the habit of wasting our time and coming up with you know figures and and and things like that to to to be ignored so I think this is a terrible insult um as far as I'm concerned to us and truthfully I don't know Michelle was talking about this the other day about the million dollars the well it's a total of what $4 million but for the Chromebooks well that we're moving now to the capital budget it's
013not in our operator right right right so yeah so I mean this you know we're looking for Nichol and dimes and were looking to to be prudent on a budget uh now we have to go through and evaluate the need for these Chromebooks how it affects education and then bump up $178 million figure to to to to something else so I I definitely think this is my own personal opinion that we need an answer to this uh as to why they ignored it maybe they have a different uh budget process or a different place to review it but we need some information as to why we were not informed uh of this to me it just seems like he sent it somewhere and wound up in a trash and I find that very insulting Rich
014has a question yeah um following up to what Mr janelli was just saying I mean there are a few items that are on here that sort of correspond but the numbers don't match at all so when we worked up estimates on our end for these items on the budget um the capital budget how did you guys go through that process to work up those numbers to provide to the planning department so with with the buildings there buildings the security and the technology um so the security and Technology are are based on just you know estimates or quot that we've got in for specific things that we know we needed um you know Chromebooks that's just you know math you know um cop printers the same um buildings uh some of these are based on existing
015estimates that we've had sort of laying around for a couple years and you know say be nice to finally get to that um other of these are you know conversations we've had for ex you know example the stadium lighting um you know we've been doing you know kind of Kick the Can repairs on that for the longest time so we just know from discussions with you know the electric company which what the company that does the just roughly that cost so some of these have actual you know estimates that have been provided some of these are you know quotes that were in a file you know sitting there waiting for the right time um in other of these we just achieve mathematically because we know cost and we knew we needed number um I'm looking
016at like the elworth Avenue School the roof section replacement we've got an estimate here for 200,000 they've got it down for 850,000 so I'm just I'm trying to reconcile I'm sure you guys are doing the same trying to reconcile like how did you come up with such a large number way do yeah I think it's impossible crazy we have repaired they have replaced right they have repl yeah we have repair can I the U car or my how do we address the the issue with the Chromebooks as I recall during Co we used some of those funds right when we close schools we purchase Chromebooks it the the computers those computers they have like a short life four years 5 years but where do we stand at this point is is this a replacement generally
017for all of the students are the Chromebooks at this point Obsolete and how does this how does this not having this interfere with the educational process so I can respond to the piece if you want thank you um I mean I am very concerned about the problem component as well Mak somewh um you know right now you there's a there's a breakage rate you know the kids are tough on war up so so we do go through some at certain grade levels more so than others but um you know the 4,000 is really just to you know I think we do fifth grade um again get to nth grade and they had that last that lasto carries it through the high school um we we've C back um a little bit on sort of the
018one to laptops going home in the younger grades wasn't really necessary so we we have more stationary CS in some of the younger grades but um you know very quickly you know particularly around testing time testing situations we need to have guaranteed um up toate ready to go non damaged laptops for testing almost all of our testing now is is digital even sat is moved to a digital assessment so making sure that we have enough laptops PR I should say is extremely um you know we have found Pockets here and there we able to P away um Tu money and Technology we have a little bit of an alliance over time um we a little bit of title one so we we can find some pockets in GRS but going into next year all those
019pockets are drying up as as predictably with the budget situation that we're going to be so um you know it it will it will impact the way you know our expectations of students to work independently outside of school um there is an equity issue for students who don't would necessarily have access to their own laptop otherwise so our district in particular with our population having access to to those is how much would you if we had let's say it comes back the city said but we're just not going to give you any of this whatever the reason is and then it falls on us to have the burden to to to come up and provide these these ch folks in your best guess what would you estimate that we would need in terms of the
020the numbers or or the dollar figure that we would have to add to our our existing budget would it be the total that we have here projected out or just a a specific year and then we try to work this in every year going forward give to Mike he's more closely with G on this I I have the number in my head but yeah there's number different scenarios um there's certain things we can do like um in the younger grades just not allow take home devices which reduce breakage which reduce the spills and allow the damage so as as Dr Caso said we refresh they'll get a Chromebook in first grade they get a refresh in fifth grade and then a refresh in ninth grade then that carries up through high school with the breakage
021we we've so that is essentially uh 3,000 uh books a year right one each of those refresh grade levels we've put in 4,000 here because that gives us the cushion that we need for breakage you know new students that arrive all students that that depart maybe don't give the device back or just you know General wear and tear so by not having a take-home device that would improve the the breakage situation it would also uh just you know have a Chromebook cart you could even have some classes sharing so there's a number of different scenarios we could we could work through to bring this number down um the other thing too is it's not like after four years these devices just stop turning on they do work there's just progressively fewer features that will work
022um specifically with the data breach there's certain security systems and uh uh software that need to run on these devices that just won't work on an older machine so a lot of this is is really just keeping up yes they be able to turn it on and do some you know math activities or reading activities yeah for the most part um but to really keep the system strong and robust would require this number so it would just start to ship away that so here it is February 7th we have an obligation on the 15th you have the document in I think we have a meeting if I'm not mistaken Miss Cooper on the 14th who budget so we pretty much have to put this to B very quickly I guess what I'm asking is to
023instruct John as to whatever answer we get in the city how much money would we have to increase the budget by would you be able to assess that between now and tomorrow and let us know or already have a number now that you could tell I can okay I mean this is you know just like the 11th hour it's kind of criminal we're looking for you know I I was going through this budget and trying to see you know where it's overstated and stuff like that and now I got a couple of million dollar hold where we have to go from 178 to 80 Millions um I find crazy but I tend to think first thing in the morning we need some answers is to where this is you know maybe there's a gift somewhere
024and they say they have another budget you're going to get it wishful thinking I think I'm going to be 6'2 tomorrow but that's not going to happen don't think this is going to happen either my Al I got to say I agree with the uh we and tear I have juniors in my class they've had their laptop for four and a half years well they since Co and they're having problems logging on and getting information because of the wear and teer of the of the Chromebooks um and they a lot of them have been replaced because Stanford believes on one in one um throughout the the school system but yes we I think the 4,000 is an is a a good safe number and I I would be in favor adding into the operating budget
025instead of the capital budget any other I Know Rich John if you be kind enough how does this how does this single sheet from the capital budget 2425 translate to your proposed budgets I mean within this page six of n shows shows a total cost of 29.8 million yet Capital fund cap general fund capital expensed I don't know if it's expensed or approved is only 1.5 yeah it's a couple million doll difference no that's that's that's $28 million difference where are you looking on the SEC on the separate page just this sheet right here seed to recommend then perhaps I'm misreading this but I'm reading it under the school budget we made a proposal or there there's a total cost estimate to replace exterior windows at various schools of $17 million and the general fund
026Capital number underneath that Cal is $100,000 what does that mean okay so uh we did not request 17 million that has come up uh apparently through the engineering department okay what we requested is the first sheet um and we asked for we'll just talk about equip uh Capital over the next three years we asked for $5.6 million uh of that we wanted 4.9 almost 5 million next year and what they funded is a million something of different projects the second column is what is going forward again maybe maybe it's my total confusion I'm looking at even the second line HVAC programs totaling $8 million whereas on the capital expenditure budget proposal which I I consider what what we're looking at only totals 1 1.05 million that's a significant difference so can I try to sure
027this is this is what we wanted and this is what the city decided we should have the Planning Commission the second column the second column is what the city decided but but but where but where is the larger numbing coming from from our engineering department as far as what they actually truly needs where where where is that where's that 8 million doll estimate for for school AGB programs coming from okay City Engine uh yeah it's it's the city engineer uh and the and the Planning Commission that came up with this proposal right and I don't know what they took from our budget because if you look at our Bud our proposed list we have window and blind replacement down for a million dollars next year right and that's it so they've they've made this decision
028and that's where we started in the in the conversation they've made a decision to fund projects that we not asking them to fund I don't think they gave any consideration to this I think that comes from the I tend to think that came from the engineering department regardless of what we gave them yeah here we [Music] go actually have a sixe capital Improvement program posted in that second link there and some of these items they've got funding numbers in 25 26 26 27 and 27 28 so they took the totals that were in your budget spread them out over time I but you you only this one's only 2425 it's linked it's linked in the agenda so it looks like some of these items are actually funded but spread over later years this is just
029one year we're looking at years in this agenda I just I just link press the link on my laptop and you can see a link to multiple years and they they' posted it and it's a like a six year some of these things are spread out over six years noology but no technology K so can I can I just ask then are there what other projects that are on our capital budget request do you feel are urgent that are not reflected in what the capital budget is from the city for next year next year so we did an exercise of just trying to identify we felt was the most critical needs um the top ones and and for those of you who are on sites um in the fall you probably heard us talking a
030lot about the H rant we have an opportunity to get a h rant but in order to qualify for it we have to demonstrate that we have our share of that shared Grant so we have to be able to up you know on a million dollar project we have to be able to put up about $350,000 to get the balance of that 650 back so we we prioritize HVAC projects to make sure we don't miss out on the opportunity to collect that money back from the state this is work that we need to have done anyway we might as well get a reimbursement on it the other ones we had here as high priority were walls of KSP um we feel that that's a learning issue but also a Safety and Security issue um um
031there was a uh sopit on the entrance way at MRP which actually I think made the list here yes yes it is and uh we had a number of vestes I think we had uh we had one vestule per year yeah uh security best of FS 50,000 depending on the school and the way it's designed could be got one or two depending on how complicated it was to install so we thought those were the the highest priority items in addition to the uh to the uh chomebook Mr har do you have a question yes it's the chair well the chair is asking a question and we you know everybody else is talking so you know do you want me to run the meeting Mr Dell or you no let me I asked the question in
032addition to the the items Mike that you pointed out are we also looking to have the Chromebooks addage yeah I did want to point this out is um so we're looking at here the schools don't have their own line item really this this little schools thing uh section here is a subsection of public buildings so when it comes to things like technology um there is another page here where it shows um City it department and there's some numbers in there that if if I'm optimistic I could crosswalk to some of their question here but they're sort of tucked into larger it things it's it's not clear to me if maybe that is part of a Chromebook refresh we haven't received that Clarity yet so maybe I'm being a little optimistic but you know that's one
033of the first questions I would ask when we we reach out to the the mayor's office tomorrow for Clarity on this ahead great I'd like to make a motion on part of the finance committee to approve John's request for $7.9 million and to move it forward to next item for next week's general meeting for 7.9 yeah say it again how do you want so I'd like to make a motion that the finance finance committee approve John's proposal for Capital expenditures of $7.9 million and to move that to an action item for review with the entire Council next Wednesday for approval prior to the 15th when it's due again if the council doesn't have a capital budget and they're not going to give it to us we still our face with the the issue of incorporating
034some of this or all of this into our operating budget and we don't have again times against us so Point order there's a motion on the floor and no one second the motion if I'm not if I'm not mistaken Kim the motion is say are you having you're having discussion no one second the motion all right so somebody second so we can have to come from theion somebody want to Second this motion I'll second the motion okay is there a discussion on this so yes how do you propose that in the time frame that we have to put this budget to bed we get the these questions answered and figure out how much more we have to incorporate into the operating budget from this capital budget once we understand what's happening I unfortunately I feel
035that the time is of is of the essence that we need to honestly move on to an operating budget which is much more severe critical at this St at this Venture we're talking about whether or not to pull the .2 million out so if if if you'd like me to amend the motion to say okay our capital budget is now 6.7 million and we slide that 1.2 into the operating budget I'll be more than happy to but we honestly need to move on to the operating budget which as I said is much more in my opinion much more critical and Cru I agree and I was getting here do you mind if I jump in for just a second here I just want to clarify uh uh Mr hly when you made that motion you're
036talking about putting this delivering this to council is that is that correct no I would imagine it's got to go to the entire board for a vote to go for approval but I'm what I'm meent what I'm stating is as a member of the finance committee I feel the finance committee should approve it as issue 7.9 million and then bring it to the entire board next Wednesday as an action item for approval so that John can then presented to The Count Council as well as the as well as the mayor on the 15th as to when it's due as a separate separate and distinctive from the operational budget because as he mentioned there's two separate issues we're speaking about tonight so what he opened the meeting talking about though was the process for getting this
037information to go through Council and that this had to be submitted prior to the Planning Commission and now the Planning Commission has taken a look at this information that we sent over to them and dumped out their version of what they think our plan should look like so I don't like are you suggesting that we submit a separate Capital request to the council I like I don't know if we can do that and if if John can clarify as I was to understand it from him he needs to put together two budgets to the to the mayor and common Council on 215 the capital the capital budget as well as the operational budget is that correct um for both bugs are due on February 15 the operating budget comes from us Board of Education uh
038the capital budget comes from the Planning Commission I think um this board did approve the 7.9 million at its October meeting as its capital budget so I think am I hearing you say there should be another action of SP then then if that then if that was approved discussing it now of course we have an item on there of the Chromebooks that we're not sure whether we're going to be funded for them and it appears that we need these Chromebooks in order to to operate for testing and and and for other reasons and then it becomes an issue for us whether we take this Chromebook figure whatever it is and add it to our operating budget I think that's one of the that's the issue I'm trying to get out capital budget I think is
039already done and finished it's just I and thinking that we're not going to be given the the monies for the Chromebook and it appears that we need it so we're going to have to fund it out of our operational budget is that so let's discuss the operational yeah well well it would have to be to to in discussion of the operational budget what items from here are going to increase the operational budget by that we feel is important that's what I was trying to get at and understand Mr canelli I think Cara has number here the things that we can't do there's a couple things on this list um that we can't do without that are that to are sa I'll come back to security a second might speak to that um but I have
040texting back and forth with Gina a very minimum threshold you can get away with and it's not ideal it would mean for the most part a lot of our kids who K having kids on a par um we keep most of the books in school with those nth graders need to be refreshed um and then there's breakage and they have to ens sure they enough for testing so we can get away with 2,000 um for that that cost will come down to 750,000 at 375 a piece the teacher laptops are critical our teacher laptops are form apart those are that would St the cop years could come down to 500,000 um per genina you think that's a safe estimate and like I would ask you to confirm John um book transition should get should get
041delayed but cyber security should not website reild gets delayed so that number there is 1, 525,000 I you on the front page um we have a terrible issue with our cell phones uh reaching certain schools um that's a safety issue so sometimes dead zones our school so we wanted to have some boosters um those those are important um so I think everything that's um the boosters the the cell phone boosters the radio boosters and the Raptor emergency would go that total number would be 860,000 that would be the number I would put forward in probably the the elevator wers Park it's already on that the list the 1,800 is that a total for 1, 860,000 so that would include the cell phone boosters the radio boosters the Raptor emergency student formbook refresh but at 2,000
042instead of 4,000 the middle school teacher device refresh a reduced copier printer so you know less we refresh less copers but have some at least one building um pause the void transition maintain sens of sign1 security and the DHS that suggest forward so then can I make a suggestion and correct your motion Richard that this board make a motion to recommend that we increase the operating budget to the total of $1.8 million as detail to be provided with what you just listed off will that be correct second and then car you'll give John the details and that will supplement the the motion and the details so we can incorporate that into the budget yes Kate second the motion I I I made the motion Richard H second second second okay so all in favor okay
043stand any discussions or no can I ask one question is not a Committee Member um the items that the city thought we should do how do we find out where these came from what the thought process like how do we find out what their thought process is and why when as the Board of Ed you guys know what we need and we've already discussed it so how do we make these line up and now we need more money in our budget that we're coming at them with like how do how does this make sense to anybody I think one of the first calls would be to the Planning Commission this is their document the director's office and they can leet us the right place I'm sure okay and then you can get that information back
044to us yes because that's this is just insane nice isn't Sharon kicho leaving soon she's retiring I think in a week or two yeah I mean did they have a a person on board yet I'm not 100% sure all right John one more information like to walk through the um couple of things uh incidentally inside the the jacket there you'll see a um I call it a scorecard and what we could probably do is right it it's designed uh to help us uh add subtract uh keep the superintendent budget the same whatever we'd like to do taken some Liberties to put some things in here but I think we just took care of the last item on the list the capital equipment so we could add could write in on there 1,860 see see where
045it leads us to inside the yellow yeah that one all right um so in talking with Mr janelli um before the meeting uh just a couple things we'd like to make sure to cover one is uh we ran out of time in our last meeting um to go over the questions and answers from the previous meetings I'd like to walk through those fairly briefly U we've gotten a uh re recent report from our Healthcare Consultants Gallagher uh I've done some work with that I'd like to talk about that uh you also see their reporting here uh there's an analysis page uh as well I'd like to talk about and some information about S 3 it's expiring that we have so um just get started um you should recognize these questions um I think the first
046one had come from Michelle we had a couple different numbers in our presentation our slide presentation when we made it um one number was the uh was the January enrollment the other number was the October 1st enr very different so um I just pointed out that one of the things I've heard is that January number can come down gradually in the next couple months it's in our historical experience um we also uh and I I've used the same either I've tried to answer the question with a in a paragraph or so or I attach exhibit so I came back with it I'm using the same method we've used a couple times so far exhibit one which actually is two pages one of the suggestion was to add the total to that U exhibit those are
047the drivers we talk about enough times milon you see the total right there on the end of exhibit one and then on exhibit two uh we were asked to put a subtotal of the new positions that are in the drivers so you can see the 104 right there broken it down well you've seen the sheet before by location uh but it has uh some what's new on this one is the projected cost each school so for example at the high school you see the million 881 I call the sub total that sub was not on the sheet when you got it the first time that's a that's a change the uh you asked about the magnet school uh enrollment uh this exhibit 3 was put together before we were finished with the application process so
048if you recall at the last meeting we had a handout that uh recommended a change in the subsidies so this information on exhibit 3 is already outdated but at the time we were answering the question it was based on what we had it was based on a lottery that wasn't finished so we'll skip over that uh I was asked about uh the other positions in the May budget book I forget who asked about that uh you can see a description of those on exhibit 4 just listed the titles question um okay ex uh question five that was probably one of the more interesting ones U that's one I I couldn't answer I didn't have an idea when it came up uh you were looking at a slide about the grants and in that slide we
049have 40 or $50 million grants we had shown the major objects remember salaries benefits and so on so forth there's a big number there for dues and fees uh $3 million and what it actually is it's not dues or fees but it's it's what we put there and if you look at exhibit five do some fees is really the wrong label that's it really should the description is things that don't belong in one of the other categor the way our software works it just collects it up and calls it to and fees but what you see there on exhibit five uh those are payments that we uh we make to promly uh preschools and and other um programs you many times when you accept a state Grant title one is a good example uh as
050a condition for accepting that gr because you're the public school there's other parts of that there might be a parts for nonpublic schools or something else you have to be the fiduciary for those funds as well and that's what these things are these are really just pass through payments that are um we can see who they are YMCA Head Start little people and so on and it it balances to that 3,106 we on the slide the budget presentation a number of good suggestions made about our slides uh We've made all those suggestions next time uh we present it to you we'll show you one of which was uh there were a couple cases where a narrative would have helped a reader to look at it so we put some of those in uh some of
051the other small changes that we made they've all been into the book I just mentioned in here really is a way you know we heard each one of them and did something about it um The Cliff page came up I explained that um that was our projection a year ago what we call in a CLI page that colorful page and uh the reason it's different uh now is a year has passed we have more actual data known we have better estimates we're closer to the Finish Line we know a lot more now what it's going to look like on June 30th than we did in Europe go they really are separate separate estimates excuse me what exhibit is that um I didn't I answered that in a narrative you remember the page in our book
052last year had the two or three columns it said the cliff right at the top with was different colors and uh what we were estimating for next year is different than what we're estimating now and when we went back to look that's really the reason they were done at different times a year apart um okay the technology Improvement that's a u important one um exhibit in your package um breaks out exactly what that 785 is for you can see some of the things it's u a lot of it is infrastructure uh some training Wi-Fi improvements I I won't go through each in one of those if if you'd like to um I'm sure Dr cely could help us with that that's how that's accumulated the there was also a question was not an exhibit about
053the cupal spending amounts that we have we had a couple discussions on what they were what they've been uh conduced to and we were asked if we could uh take another look at that the amounts that we we thought would would get us through and I I put a couple uh thoughts there one it wasn't I think real obvious that many of the school supplies that um go into our classrooms come come from the curriculum Resource Center um they they have their budgets as well we've done that uh for many years these uhal allocations are in addition to those and they're really I I gave some examples um for things that are unanticipated or discretionary um they go along with the day-to-day running of a a building at the high school based for graduation we
054have a base allocation for inner Scholastic sports that wouldn't come from the the CRC um maybe if uh we have to replace some desks and chairs in the classrooms we come out of that maybe things at the end of the year there's a school assembly or field day uh building staff development uh there could be some expenses there so it's those kind of things uh go into that and I I point out that they are the peral amounts are the Same by level all the elementary schools get the same amount of people they different enrollments so that drives the amount up and down Finance the middle schools U at equal for pupal amounts in the elementary amounts CU it's a little more expensive to run a middle school than Elementary School some of the things
055they have to buy uh and same with the high school that's it's a little higher than the middle schools that amount is also uh what we find what we give to a same as we give to the the high school and then the the final question had to do with the uh state federal grants and so what you'll see beginning on uh exhibit 8 exhibit 8 at the top says Grant other breakout and there you see all of our grants all 46 of them remember in some of the slides we were we were showing you the major ones but then we were showing everything else I think we called all other brants and group them all together so here's everything one through 46 and then what we also try to do on exhibit 8A is
056tell you a little bit about what each one is for it's just a thumbnail it's not a lot but you see an idea I think the point one of the points we're trying to make is they really are uh for special purposes depending what they are they can be as you'll see as you go down through the list so those were the questions we picked up from the meeting anything further to this or moving along no anybody have any questions um looking at exhibit seven and um I believe it's seven and S eight okay um and so these uh these amounts are for next school year 24 25 they are they're the decisions that the principles made as the how they would spread out there people correct and based on expected numbers right so we
057looked at our demographers report and um that and so on uh exhibit 7 the third page where we have reach yeah and you have a total of 12 correct it's is that because that's the number so far for this year no uh that's what we thought a year ago at this time would be the enrollment is that reach and Endeavor it is 1,000 I think the projection 1,530 that that's how we put it together right I think in hindsight it was a low estimate should higher from what I know um and CH can I just make a comment okay and so um and I'm coming on but from what I'm hearing um just last year alone and I'm not sure if every everybody went to Endeavor or reach that people sat in close to 30
058something expulsions did I get that number right9 30 something expulsions 39 30 and so again I don't know if they all went to reach or Endeavor but to put down the number 12 for our total population for our middle schools and high school I think is a low figure much and would like toose that going up do I need to make a proposal to say I'd like to look at one budget item and cut that I'm just asking for protocol um one budget item I'd like to reduce that and add it I think I might look to Mr janelli to answer that one you looking to adjust this um I'm on exhibit seven the third page basically interested what a net change is this point that's where my mind is going so whatever you're recommending
059to to John he feels that the numbers are can be adjusted uh then if there's a net change then you can calculate what that net change is we can figure that into the overall total right now I'm looking for Concepts and seeing what the net changes to this budget is because I'd like to again sort of wrap this up and get a handle as to where we're going with these numbers does anybody see that as reasonable maybe that that I I don't know I I really don't have an opinion on that that Happ refer to John on that I just I just want to say that 39 figure wasis for last year uh so far this year doesn't seem to be on that same trajectory just my thoughts on that it could change but last
060year seemed to be the exception not the not the normal car I'm sorry I'm having a hard time seeing so I apologize have a little bit of a solution for that without taking away from another school and their allocation and having to Rue everything through our CRC budget because we do have a lot of we do provide a lot of supplies we can Rectify that number to adjust that so might not be listen here we can certainly make that Arrangement um with the administrative staff there to take care of the numbers of students who actually attend there to the CRC budget for next year you can make you can make that that's not a large number um but it would be equivalent to the number number without having to make a lot of changes to
061the other thanks um for the purposes of tonight though I think you know you're going to get a a lump sum appropriation for intensive purposes and how you choose to move it around in your budget is up to you you're not hitting things that are bricks and Border or something like that so so when need to your point that if you want to find an equivalent amount to take away from somewhere else to add to reach Endeavor I think that for the purposes of tonight you can have a lum sum budget number and make those adjustments kind of as we go through the process because you're going to bump up against some time constraint here is all right SE and then can I not member but to Kim's point that we're going to get that
062lump sum and we're probably not going to be fully funded and this is a conversation that I'm sure we've all been thinking about so we're going to need to have those conversations going forward thank you Kim um because we've had this little chat but of where we're going to make those cuts and what is not going to get so that's also something like after we submit this to the city we're not we're not done like the tough conversations happen after that butex thing positive all right so I'm keep moving through our behind questions you have a something from Gallagher that's our consultant this was U was their monthly overview we U we've heard us tell you we get reports from them each month and uh coincidentally Monday night uh the report for the month ending
063December came and and that's what I've copyed for you here I'm not going to read through it all uh but U we met with them today um got their view of things as we do each month and they were uh they were optimistic uh in one way that they thought we would end up below the projection uh that they had given us a year ago uh one thing I was encouraged to hear today was they felt that the experience we had last year particularly last spring was abnormal uh we had a number of we had many number more people in the high cost area that were driving things up and uh today the consultant even attributed that uh to at the same time there was a a lack of care uh when people in weren
064going to the hospital they finally did start going back they were further along but you did not see that happening now and you know it's it's February so that that was encouraging um and you can see by some of the uh comments here um that he he tells different ways that he he sees us being under uh his early his projection a year ago including Dental which is on the second page and that was a line item we U we needed you pointed helpfully pointed out we needed to take another look at it was budgeted too low uh so what I did uh they also do a 12 month U average of What the claims have been actually a 13mon look that they update each month uh was we pushed them a little bit today
065they still they did not move off of the 5 to 6% estimate they had given us earlier they said they didn't want to look at things uh later down the road but they didn't come back with a higher number they didn't come back with a lower number so I think what we've had so far uh makes sense the so what I did was I went back and looked at the calculation again and uh with with better information and took their 12mth uh accumulation added the increase that their recommending to the claims then began to add in the other things that go into our estimate uh for example Signa custodians are Teamsters their health insurance is through the teamsters that's not part of the Signa analysis that you're seeing here we had a a good upto-date
066uh look at what the teamster payments were costing us put that in we also have um H HRA and HSA contributions that are made uh as part of our self insurance program at that number again what I did also was I looked at the drivers I think of that drivers and that sheet that I showed you all of the new positions that were coming in I took a fresh look at that we did the earlier estimate we didn't have some of these um drivers uh refreshed uh the employee contributions uh that employees make which is which is significant it's it's over $3 million that come in some other things um I think well the other part of this you know we're we're looking at the general fund and what what gets paid with tax dos
067and we have as you just saw we have 46 grants well over 100 people that are in Grants so part of the health insurance uh experience is picked up by the grants it's not all for the general fund so that the numbers you see from Signa are not what we need in the general fun went back and look you remember the green sheet that I used um the other night and we had the 12 page summary including the health insurance line what you we didn't talk about it but there was a line item for health insurance there that you would have uh it was I think I mentioned to this is our first real look at last year the health claims uh were under 24 million last year in the general fund all things uh
068considered 23 milon $688,000 whenever all the dust settled uh that amount is is increase 6.4% for this year this year's budget what we're hearing is the the projection that Gallagher makes they're they're comfortable with that and then that 6.4% increase this year is raised up 55% for next year and that's what you see but when we put all these changes in that I just talked about the number actually came out a little lower now I didn't cut it too close one of the things that last month we talked about with Galler was they were asked well if you're saying our claims are going to go up 5 12% what about the unfilled positions that we have um if those people come on they'll have expenses too and what we then was that a better number
069would be 6% if you wanted to consider the unfilled position so in the estimate that I've done today I use 6% not the 5.5 to allow for the vacant positions when you put it all together uh you'll see some differences I put it on the scorecard here where I think the uh and yes the dental was too low I'm suggesting that we raise that by $300,000 but I'm also suggesting that we can lower the health insurance amount by about the same amount you see the numbers here now if um you think it it sounds like too much risk uh we don't have to make the drive Nets out $32,000 change I don't but um the big uh the known really is all of the new positions and what's going to happen what are their selections
070going to be it's kind of hard tode that's that's the health insurance so Teresa last year this time didn't we have a $12 million surplus and then by the next month it was gone the financial report this commit each month uh did not have everything encumbered uh last year there was a good 12 million that was unencumbered uh much of that was our health insurance uh some was Transportation uh this year as you look at it we this Summer that what we knew we put into purchase orders and say aside I like to think we we've done a better job setting aside the things we know were going to happen we were behind last year anybody have any questions uh uh John and I'm not sure if this question should go to you or to
071Kim can you guys just remind us how many unfilled positions we have please so we have probably a handful left at this point of certified staff remember we're right now filling those with overloads a lot of them but really the tricky number I think is the paror number and that we've got as many as 50 um and so and those remember are generally the people who take the insurance because those are folks that are low Jers but take the insurance so that's really the the mystery number so if we were to fill those you're going to drive up your number back to of of insurers or what they call like belly buttons in the plan and that number is going to look a lot like it looked about a year ago honestly um we've had
072a dip since then so that's the concern thank you John and that's the thing I'm having trouble trying to quantify is the bump from the 5 fo what 5.6% 5.5 five to to the other half per going up to six and to Kim's point which is really a guess because of a total population you don't know how many are going to take the the the insurance but or what they're going to take family right yeah exactly and so that's the risky part and I think that's a reasonable question that somebody would ask us in preparing the budget is to how did we account you know for something like uh like that and that's why I have a reservation about reducing it to the 300,000 because I'd rather be more conservative and you know at least
073if you put the 300,000 back you know at least we can say we've covered that particular concept I I don't know how to yes I can figure out maybe how to calculate a percentage of a new population taking an average cost that's coming in and go through that that that uh that calculation but these and to my friend here's comments are big needle movers uh and we mentioned last year or it was mentioned last year that one of the issues we had was health insurance that created the problem that you stated just now the fact that that was an anomaly and you know hopefully that was an anomaly but you never know in health insurance and I think with the amount of new positions we hopefully looking to fill we have to take that into
074account in the health insurance Richard So within your budget scorecard do do we have an estimate on on the kindergarten age change as far as that expense is concerned please oh we just on health insurance still no he Insurance we're going to put it back but yeah but I just want to make sure that it doesn't go over that too is there's nothing more that has to be added to it that that's what I'm saying are you comfortable putting back is the feeling are we comfortable putting back the 300,000 that he wants to take out or do we want to look to to put it up do we think that's enough of a cushion to take take into account what we're talking about on these unfilled positions I don't think it's I I you know
075which I could add this when uh a month ago you know I was basing my um this it's such a hard that did simply on the comment that the consultant made but I I can tell you all the years I've done this um I thought my first reaction was it was a little low he said we're you're at 5.5 but if you feel the positions it's six it felt low to me but I'm relying on his comment that confuses things I so are we comfortable then with taking out out the 331 let me put it that way as as as a question to the to the committee members or do you want to leave in the 331 or how do you want to to to to deal with this particular issue I would prefer to
076leave it in leave in leave in leave in the 331 rather than take it as showing it as a deduction on the budget score card okay I'm I I agree with that it's I have a better Comfort feeling with at least that how about the other members Melle I'm not a city member of the committee sorry I just you hear and and as long as you here I give you respect your comments okay so let's do that okay okay Mr Chell could either the uh kindergarten AG come up that's something I put on the scorecard today could do that next I had two other things in the yeah let's finish your list and then we'll go to to Richards but that's okay all right right so you have uh you have um giving you the
077details you have a a page in your packet called S three um those are the positions uh to make up the 6.7 million that You' seen on that thought was important for you to see uh what was in there and remember we're um we're we're extending our messaging um I think I made the point the last time we want to let people know that um the lights on budget U should include these people because they're here they've been here for two or three years and but I wanted we hadn't shown you this and then um so John so is that is that number that you that you show is that all it is that inclusive of salaries and health benefits it is okay and then uh the last thing in your packet you have a
078sheet called the proposed budget comparison hold on par me on your scorecard let's complete that okay so I plus down to health insurance right you've added in uh some technology those are the only changes I've written and the the new item here you brought the detention where I questioned was the the attrition oh I'm sorry yes and that would be $10,000 savings for 10 positions okay and if if I may ask if somebody recalls maybe Kim can address this is to Prior years as I'm going back U the numbers were greater now times have changed and so we have 10 position person since what we had before and we used to have a spread of 20 30,000 what's changed y so a couple of things have changed um first um what's changed is during and
079immediately coming out of Co we saw a lot of retirements so a lot of people that when we went all remote um Folks at that point who we might have seen retiring a year or two later than they did had retired so we've lost a lot of people during that time so that's the first problem the second problem is that what we're seeing particularly in the shortage areas like in special education for example is that we are retiring very very senior teachers but we can't find their Replacements at the bottom of the scale like we could in some other areas so it would be for example a teacher would retire at $100,000 and we would bring in their replacement at $50,000 for a $50,000 savings now it's entirely more likely that a teacher will retire
080at 100 and we're going to spend 80 to 90 to get a new in so the Delta has really shrunk so those two things together um um led me to think that it was most conservative to take what normally we would budget at 15 to 16 retirements drop it down to 10 and then reduce the Delta down to 10 $100,000 I I think you'll I think you'll do better than that but it's really ex so G to the days where we have $800,000 I'm not sure we ever had that yes yes Wishful thank you all right thank you yeah I just wanted to bring up the question so that at least uh we had the narrative and it's something somebody may ask all right John thank you the last sheet I had is called a
081proposed budget comparison it's um it was designed uh really to demonstrate that our operating budget without theer moving in the increas is is not high item to item year to year so um we're going to at the next finance committee meeting we're putting together a comparison of uh next year's budget which we have in front of you with what I'll call the expected this year with the cuts we made some of the reallocations uh we Tred to have it for this afternoon that there there were so many different things going on we didn't come up with a real clear way to that was simple to uh show you that I think we can uh but we need a little more time this was put together just as a comparison budget to budget that's all it
082a general fund budget to fund budget so in the First Column you'll recognize that that's the uh the ask that's what the city council adopted $150 million and then what you've seen uh a couple times from us uh you know this this spreadsheet where we had showed the different drivers going across the second column was if we took just those line items just those major objects and with the different things we've done different ways to project what it would come out you saw the transportation calculation of last time specially you saw some of those different things going on depending what it was and that when you do that that just next year this year the difference was 6.99% but when you start to look at just the spending lines and that's what I've put the
083box in the fourth column the differences add to 5.7 million now one of the things in there if you look at the chart you can see the enrollment impact going down 4.2 million remember that was what we're doing this year last year the sr2 was expiring we isolated it we put it on that line and then uh next year though it's up in the salar on because primarily those were high school teachers but the group is is the same whether it was in that line or the other and that whole group is going up 5.8% uh 5.8 million almost and that's an increase of 3.84% you can see now why are we saying 6.99 we don't have that savings built in again so of the points we tried to make early on was that our
084operating our general fund budget is is not going up a lot uh the the main reason I I find is that the teacher contract is not going up a lot you can generally what your teacher contract is going up that's what your school budgets going up and we have a think a gwi of 1.75% yes there steps on that but that's very very low and that's that's the major thing going on in the budget the other labor contracts are low too and you saw the discussion we just had with health insurance five or six that's not eight or nine and so that's all in there too so I thought it was important to to show that it's it's um the things that are causing us to look for more money are uh the in the
085general fund are the sr3 expiring and those other initiatives which youly at the high school we talked about that's all this was for this is said I'm confused on something a few days ago I had asked you and you gave me the information on the $4.7 billion as to how You' accounted for that from the the budget of the 154 to the 150 and if I recall just rough numbers initially the administration came away with $1.8 million of adjustments of which there is 900,000 or a million dollar of that 1.8 that was uh transferred to the alliance money uh Alliance grant money and and the rest were I think unfilled positions that that you you took out to the station that you anticipated you weren't going to have any expenses for that well uh the
086the difference was $3 million well we're getting down yeah getting down ask that's the request in front of the city still to be decided let me finish and so was my understanding that the $3 million you gave us a breakdown saying of the three 2.5 you had moved to other grants some of which if i i m serves me right was it use the Expression or the example of Title One money where you might have had carryover funds that that you for excess you had to use and and so of the 3 million you park 2.5 million in in in some grant money or maybe the full 3 million I'm not 100% sure now I had asked question at that time I think it was last week um was that 3 million coming back in
087the operating budget or was it sustainable in those grants that you park those expenses in for for the coming year and I thought you said no they were self- sustaining in those in those grants leaving me to believe and understand that the the the grants next year would be large enough to absorb what you put in there from the uh the current year but now based on here it seems like you're putting back into the operational budget the $4.7 million am I reading this correctly I may not have been clear when I was asked the question before um I I recall being um was it sustainable I think was the word I was asked the decisions were made and when I answered in the affirmative the the positions that we move to the alliance Grant
088are indeed sustainable 900,000 some of the alliance Grant uh will continue for the foreseeable future it's it will increase uh we use the increase that we got this year for those positions and those we expect to sustain uh what we moved into uh to to balance the budget this year and to use a couple grants to do that one of the two grants was the sr3 grant that's expiring the sheet that you saw earlier you'll notice that there are eight taken positions in there now if we didn't do anything we would that money would get returned to Hartford uh in June so by taking some of our salaries out of the budget put them in the grant hardford pays uh that takes care of this year but those positions are in next year's budget and
089they're one of the drivers that Esser driver we should probably stop calling it that but that's that's where we're going to pay for all the all the people um that we have today and some of the vacants are budgeted next year in different places now the other Grant we looked to was uh the title one carry over so what that means is um if you have a title one grand it's for 12 months but if you don't spend it all in 12 months you can get permission to carry over the the unspent amount for another 12 months there was a few hundred th000 in there that if we didn't do anything we go back to Harford so that's the other place we look to balance the budget so those two are really not sustainable but
090we don't everybody is in a place for next year in 178 so what I understand that in the operating budget of that $4.7 million all but 900,000 right which says where it is in Alliance is that correct or did did you take it out of Alliance and the whole 4.7 is somehow reallocated back to the Esser as well as the current operating with one exception answer is yes with one exception part of the cuts were reductions in the per pupil spending and we've kept those lower amounts for another year so essentially all of the magic that you did last year you're restoring back into the current Year's operating budget through Esser for increasing the so-called rights on budget correct is that correct correct yes okay thank you I know it's confusing very confusing Teresa um
091is it possible to give a number of salaried employees full-time part the total number for that million and then the 92 I mean is it the same number going forward you know what is it like 900 employees full-time part-time well um one of the pages you saw earlier was the um replicate a replica of the page that goes into the the mayor's budget remember it added up to it and what was not uh what we also added to it for next year were 104 positions which you see here those are all the general fund positions those are all going to be in the mayor's budget that's what the property tax pay for well I'm just talking you no right so I just want to know what is the total number of employed people representing that
09283 million and then Carri forward to the 92 what are those figures what is that figure I want to know we got 1,354 people in the system you know that and then carry forward it's going to be 1,450 people you know I just kind of want to I want a number that because that salary number seems to float all every year and and it's hard to justify without thinking the number of who's employed and I don't care full or part-time everything on the green page from last week uh the column in the middle FTE full-time equivalent you'll see 1,365 N3 that's the number but that includes five special ed positions that are in the driver so as you look down the page there's another 99 that are in that enrollment impact with the five special
093ed there's your 104 that's in that page well and so the carry forward lights on is that same number from year to year I'm just looking forward and this is general fund grants right from the 1365 if you subtracted five that would be your number general f thank you John excuse I forgot your name John that information is around here on our Green Sheet you gave us last I didn't point it out I probably did you have a question Talking Money inad of position number basic to the chair to the chairperson of the committee finance committee is uh running we're running about 8:30 yeah I just want to take care of Richard he had a question okay that I defer and I think it should be acknowledging push on the 3K or the kindergarten retre
094correct if I could estimated cost in terms of the uh the kindergarten age change sure um so I spoke to and the Staffing is already in the current budget um as proposed the Staffing is there um the there was one question though about uh the busing specialized busing U and whether or not you had already included that in this in this current ask um that would been 150,000 and then potential lease so um Staffing is in okay Staffing is in so KY didn't want to clarify just about the busing busing uh raning four home to school buses High School U students they certainly could do prek runs after that I think these are specialized for the first they're not then I would add 15,000 to that line buses for buses and the lease is an
095unknown that's that hasn't occurred yet that a potential so if I could re go ahead no I'm ready to make a proposal you go just to read recap the budget scorecard that John presented the adjustments that I've noted that we're looking to do and I just want to confirm it is on the health insurance line we're going to ignore the $331,000 we are going to add 1.8 1, 860,000 to this budget for the Chromebooks and other Capital items technology technology with a list to be provided that backs this up in addition we're going to add $150,000 for transportation for additional buses for the the the uh special ed uh situation is that correct is everybody prek prek prek special yeah ask CH sure are we also adding in the dental or we leaving the dental
096no no everything everything it will stay the same except the the D we're going to add in 299,000 so the only thing that's coming off the list would be the health insurance basically and that's a negative number and we're going to add 1,860 and we going to add 1 milon 50 we're subtracting the health insurance no I thought we were leav the health insurance I thought we were in the health insurance we decided he it was 331,000 right we're going to leave it in is that correct it was it was originally John had subtracted it based on scard okay and we're leaving it in correct okay yeah just we're saying the same thing thank you yeah I'd like to make a motion to the board to the to the to the finance Comm committee that
097we approve a budget to send to the entire Board of m674 isre and allow me to explain so if we look at the budget scorecard take the top item 1789 we add in a 21 M we leave the instructional Improvement alone so that that can that that stays within the budget as far as the operat we keep the salary savings at 100,000 as far as Retirement goes we put back the 330 Health we put in the 300 Dental we put in 150 for for kindergarten and we put in 1.86 million for capital expenditure bottom line 181 674 579 do I have a second yes I did but may I ask a question I'm not on the committee so may I ask a question um he's he's making a motion sure do we have to second
098motion you made the motion I second yeah oh you did second discussion so discussion okay ahead okay I just wanted to confirm that that number includes the 200,000 that 58% reduction in the magnet school that we were looking to add last week is that in here yeah just want to make sure I heard Mr say we're not going to offset that impr okay Mr H could you just read your number again your final number so if you start within the budget scorecard we start at the 1789 M we leave the but Magnet School in to 11 we do not make any adjustments in the industrial and uh in instructional Improvement so we don't take away 211 we do take away 100K for retirement we leave the health insurance as is conservative so we put that
099331 back in we put the 299 Dental in we put $150,000 as far as the uh the kindergarten or special ed transportation and we put in an additional 1.86 million under capital capital equipment so new proposed budget would be 181 674 579 that's my calculator want to ask you a question sure um you said we put the health insurance back in um it it hadn't come out I'm only using the far right column that was a proposal um but we decided not to do that right so I think what we're doing are we not adding in the dental amount yeah he said yeah I am adding that actually doesn't me to 32 it actually NS to an increase of no I think [Music] think 2993 yeah so all right yeah let's let's do this be
100close are we adding the 32546 from the dental back in because that's on the right hand column as well let's just read down the number so it adds up we don't have so 178 CH I have we start with 17893 145 M we add 2,434 okay we we take away $100,000 add 299 416 for dental we add 150,000 for 3K buses and we add 1,860 for technology equip so that was the confusing part was the health insurance and that if you add that up I didn't add it that comes to Richard's number of [Music] 181 add 14 actually with a little less I have 18143 so it's that it's that 331 it's that 331 which is tied into the top number of 178 so did you take $100,000 yeah he did okay so what's number
101181 443 [Music] 995 I think we should do it again okay let's go guys M 're they're double checking yeah [Music] yeah3 again 181 343 9 okay so let's do the motion go ahead so I'd like to make a motion to the finance committee that we bring forth the entire uh Board of Education uh members a proposed budget of 181 m3434 anybody want to second that second second by Kate um all there any objections or any discussions all in favor I I okay that does it so I make a motion to ad second Richard one need second I thank you very much thank you for your patience you