001Uh, I call the governing board special meeting tonight to order on February 25th at 6:00 p.m. Would you please stand for the pledge of allegiance? >> Ready to begin? I aliance to the of the United States of America and to the republic for it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all. >> Uh let's go with roll call >> Matthew Patinsky >> Amy Carney >> Mike Shy >> and Donna Lewis and we are expecting Karen Warner so we'll let you know when she arrives for the record. All right. and make a motion to approve the agenda as presented. >> Second. >> All right. All those in favor? >> I I approves 4 Z or four zero. Yeah. All right. It's time for superintendent's comments. Dr. Mel. >> Well, good evening, President
002Lewis, Vice President Sharky, members of the governing board. Three quick announcements this evening. First, a reminder that the I think it's the fourth annual family arts fest will be taking place on March 6th and 7th at the Scottsdale Performing Arts Center. So, in the first three years, it was at Sky Song and it's moving this year to Scottsdale Performing Arts. On Friday night, it's from 5 to 900 p.m. And then Saturday is 9 to 2. We'll have display of student artwork along with vocal and instrumental music presentations throughout both Friday evening and Saturday. Uh families are encouraged to come. We hope to also attract individuals who might not be enrolled in Scottsdale Unifi but could see the amazing opportunities at our different schools as we showcase our student talent. Uh secondly, also on March 6th,
003uh the Desert Canyon Elementary School, Desert Canyon Middle School student showcase for the Chinese Lunar New Year will be taking place at 6 PM at Desert Mountain High School. And then finally, pursuant to governing board uh discussion at the last meeting around the Phase one options for Echo Canyon. We will be holding a community forum at Echo Canyon on March 3rd beginning at 5:30 where there'll be brief presentations by each of the three organizations that made those proposals. That meeting is envisioned to go from 5:30 to 7. Notice will be going out to our parents in the Arcadia Learning Community using uh Parent Square and then we'll do social media post and and whatever we can to get word out. homeowners associations and others who live within that attendance area. So those are the three
004announcements and that I'll turn it back to you. >> Thank you. Uh we're here for a particular purpose because we had table the topic of one of our last meetings that needs time and attention at this juncture. Dr. Menzel, will you frame the meeting for us relative to the Puma attendance boundary? >> So thank you Dr. Lewis. Uh at the last meeting we discussed the recommendation of the committee and there were questions about options outside of what was recommended. Uh the board has been given information with respect to that and I'm going to invite Dr. Bono to come to the podium. Uh the reason why we scheduled a special meeting instead of waiting until March 10th is twofold. One, we have families who are waiting for this decision to be made in order to finalize
005their enrollment, particularly families that live within the Puma boundary. And we also have staffing decisions that we're trying to make as expeditiously as possible and knowing this decision will help us do that with a greater level of confidence and in a timely manner in terms of the staff that are impacted. So with that, I would like to ask Dr. Mono to quickly review the options and the information that's been shared with the governing board and then we'll open it up for any questions that the board has. >> Thank you, Dr. Mensel. Good evening, governing board president Dr. Lewis, Vice President, Mr. Shy, and our governing board, Dr. Menel, Mrs. and our visitors and guests wanted to come back again to uh review our options, review how we got here, and then spend the bulk of
006our time answering your questions. I want to thank you. I know I've been bombarding you with u many emails. Um thank you uh governing board member Mrs. Carney for the request of the let's talks regarding the puma. We got those to you. Uh and then Dr. Patinsky, your emails and thank you to everybody else. I know it was a lot of information, but hoping that helped provide some additional So you they say when you know better you do better. So instead of having all those maps again going back and forth I did put them um and you have this presentation as well but I did put links especially for our community members who might be looking at this presentation for all those options so that they're here um and we can go back to them
007as you have questions. So just to review the reboundering committee their recommendation was option 3A which ma maintains the entirety of the puma boundary in the coronado learning community. It supports that continued growth at hookam yabapai tanalia and coronado preserves the transportation but still allows families who choose an open enrollment option that that choice. We also uh wanted to review those two other options that we had robust conversations about. especially as it relates to realigning that current boundary to keep some in the cornal complex but move some into the sarro complex. So just a reminder if you remember and I can pull up this map. So this is the current puma boundary. This is this shows all the schools here. And when we talk about The recommended option was 3A. When we talk about 2B
008and 2 C, right now I'm talking about 2B. At main question are these right here, the the cells 12 A and 12B. >> I want to let the record show that >> and cells 12 C and 12 D. So we had talked about at the last meeting that dividing line of those that what we'll call zone 12 north of Osborne south of Osborne. So option 2B moves uh there's one cell that is currently allocated to Puma kind of northwest. Uh we only have one or two students who currently attend school in the cornal complex from that uh area. But at main question is that 12A and 12B those are the two cells just north of Osborne in this option. Those two cells would now be allocated to Navajo within the learning community. Uh also on
009the slide here I've outlined a couple of the unintended consequences. So currently there are 17 students who live in 12A and 12B. Remember that's the current Puma boundary within the Coronado complex that attend Tonalia Middle School and Coronado High School in the Coronado complex. If those two areas were moved into Sorro, potentially they would need to arrange transportation or change schools if they needed uh our transportation. And then option 2 C which came out directly as a result of our work as a committee. This option did not exist prior to the committee convening and this was the suggested option which takes all four TWW of zone 12 A and B which is north of Osborne and C and D which is south of Osborne and [snorts] allocates all of them to Navajo and then subsequently
010Mojave and Saworro when you look at the entirety so that previous slide was focusing just on A and B when you take all four the two north and the two south there's 35 five current middle and high school students who live within that zone and currently attend school in transport in Coronado and enjoy the transportation that's provided to them. So uh they may again face the transportation uh hardships if those four zones were moved out of the Coronado complex. And then this last slide just summarizes the unintended consequences if we move part of the Puma boundary into the Sarro learning community. We As I indicated in the board memo that I sent you the other evening, the transportation costs if we move if we have to add additional routes uh north of Indian School to
011go into the Soral complex that could be potentially $90,000 uh and it's broken down here about $45,000 per bus, the salary and the benefits. Uh and uh Director Jacobson is here uh and uh Mrs. Croser can also speak to this is could potentially also limit our ability to save about $270,000 uh that we've saved by reducing our reliance on contracted services for special education. And then it also indicates altering the landscape of the Coronado learning community and again reiterating the impact on those current Coronado learning community students who do go to school uh in the Coronado complex and live within that zone 12. And then again keeping in mind that potential precedent as we're talking about phase two after this phase uh any conversations regarding boundaries may shape expectations for future conversations around boundary boundary
012changes. And with that love to uh answer any questions you have thank you. I just wanted to say thank you for all this uh extra information. I wish we would have had this prior to the last meeting um because this has been easier for us to understand I think. >> Thank you. >> And I think that will also help inform the phase two that now that we know exactly what's at stake to or not at stake rather but the other information that would make it more uh meaningful to provide that to you. So thank you for that. Thank you >> Dr. In 2C, you mentioned the consequence of 34 middle and high school students who would be affected um if we don't grandfather their transportation by losing transportation. How many families, just to put that
013in context, would benefit from transportation who are currently attending an SLC school? >> So, how many students are currently in Sarro who live in those zones >> in zone 12 that we would unlocking transportation for >> I'm looking at Dr. Bachna. I know I have those numbers and she's going to pull that up for us. >> And while she does that, can you talk a little bit about um the uh potential of grandfathering transportation so that >> we're able to both set our boundaries the way we want them for the long term and also follow through in our commitments with families that already in CLC? >> Absolutely. talking to director Jacobson who like I said is here there would be no additional on the onset we would not need to um add more routes we
014could keep the routes we have uh so there would be no additional cost on the offset Dr. Do you want to? >> So, so the because we would maintain the routes that we currently have that are servicing the students that are in those zones that go to Tonalia and Coronado. So, it's an extended period of time that we providing that transportation. There would be an opportunity cost issue with respect to efficiency of transportation because you're going to be adding to transportation routes to get our students um from that zone to Mojave and Sarro. So, you have that cost and you're going to be inefficient because operating another bus that you would not normally have to run for that period of time, but there's no because we already have the run there, it's not shown as
015an additional cost, but it it does represent um a lost opportunity to be more efficient. >> Yeah, I appreciate that, but it's not necessarily a consequence of doing these families. That's a choice that we would be making if we did. >> Still getting those exact numbers for you. So your question was all of the students in all of zone 12, all four of those cells who are currently zoned for Coronado, how many are attending school in the Sarro complex? >> Yeah, it just helps us understand 34. If it's 34 relative to 100, that's different than 34 relative to 35. we think about. >> Well, and I think while she's looking at that, maybe this is a good opportunity, Miss Mclennon, to talk about what we discussed at the beginning. >> Sure. So if the board
016[snorts] grandfathers in, so if you were to choose option 2B or 2C and you grandfather in for transportation, you would also be grandfathering those students attendance in the Coronado community that are already there. But for a new student who was say metriculating into um high school um from that community, let's say they move in, they're not already attending, uh the boundary The boundary for Sorro would have to be redrawn to encompass those grids. And currently we would probably need to have um additional an additional hearing and additional process to redefine the Sorro boundary. >> Does that make sense? >> Yeah. We're not grand my my meaning in grandfathering isn't that anyone in those in zone 12 get both options. It's you're grandfathering very specific families based on the date and time stamp of them being
017enrolled, you know, in CLC, you know, as of this decision. That makes sense. >> It does make sense. And so what what I'm for for decisions for future if we're redefining those zones to now be in the Sora learning committee we would likely need to have some additional conforming hearings and a conforming process to redraw the Saboro boundary >> and that's because this was primarily related to Puma Elementary and we we didn't have a specific around Mojave Middle School and Saro High School. >> Correct. So the Mojave Middle School and Sorro High School communities were notified of the because they were receiving schools for potentially receiving schools for Puma, but the reverse isn't true. They weren't notified that um that if you lived in those zones, you could no longer go to Coronatada. You would
018be zoned as an without open enrolling that you would be zoned to attend in Sora. So it's doable, but I just want the board to be aware that those um that that would be uh consequential that we would need to have a conforming hearing to redraw the Soro and Coronado boundaries as well as the middle schools. >> There are approximately 126 students attending Navajo, Mojave, Sawarro. Um I didn't pick up I did I left out PBLO because it doesn't have So, a little bit more than 126. Yes. From 12 A through 12B. >> So, 126 families would benefit and 34 families could lose transportation, but that's a choice. We could also choose to grandfather them with with inefficiencies. I understand. >> Just to be clear, if we're talking middle high only, it's 34 to 103.
019I left the Navajo out just so it's middle high to middle high kind of apples to apples. So in that zone 12. >> So it's 34 to 103. >> Yes. >> Thank you. Thank you for that clarification. >> Other comments or questions from the board? >> Dr. Penski. Um, I guess want to kind of summarize my thinking a little bit in case it's helpful. Um, at first I want to thank the district and the cabinet for being very responsive. So, everything I asked for, you provided. I very much appreciate that. And I also want to thank the families that I've had a chance to email with. And part of summarizing this is for their benefit as well because I think all the we get everyone gets but you don't entirely know and so I just
020want to make sure it's all kind of laid out. Um there's sort of four I don't know where to look so I'll look at your documents. I'm not >> disrespecting you. >> No disrespect. >> Um if I was sitting there >> uh I think there are four kind of considerations in my head and three lean in the direction of approving the recommendation and and one is the one that's giving me a pause. So the first is just deference to the district's expertise in the committee. So, uh, you know, so many of these dynamics better than I do, and I think board members should have humility. You know, whether it's kind of the feeder patterns, the transportation issues, the capacity that different schools have, the knock-on effects potentially, if there are more students, then classrooms get
021repurposed, which then affects certain special programs. Um, you know, and there was an inclusive committee that also looked at this. And so, I kind of start similar with like curricul kind of start with an assumption of of I wouldn't say difference because it's not rubber stamping but just humility that there's a lot of factors that I may not you know fully appreciate. Um the two is also just the respect for precedence that Puma is in the CLC. Families bought their houses believing that they're in the CLC and the CLC with open enrollment but it's a much bigger change for a family living in the CLC including amilies who have not yet started their educational journey with us to have that change than it is for families living you know in that area to all of
022a sudden you know have it have it change and wanting that change. So I think there's also I don't know I think there's like a respect for precedent and stability and not changing as much. Um, and I don't find the disruption of those 34 families particularly compelling because again I think we could just decide to to grandfather them. But um, the third is kind of then the counterweight to that which is this is a unique opportunity to redraw boundaries to align with where families are actually choosing to enroll their kids. And whether it is I mean, I think it's like something like 71. The trending towards family in zone 12 heading to this SLC is just very compelling. You're talking almost three quarters of the families and it's only been moving in that direction. And
023it could be because it's physically a little bit closer. It could be because they just have a different judgment of the quality of education, you know, in one set of schools versus the other set of schools. It could just the peer influence of the school that they're in, which is a point that you made if I'm understanding the school culture kind of argument. Um, but to have that strip, that zone 12 so disproportionately demonstrating their preference to be in the SLC and having disrupted things through the closing of of Puma or the repurposing of Puma, it just, you know, it's really causes me pause of why we wouldn't create lemonade out of lemons for, you know, for those families. Um, and then the final consideration, which I think is kind of a tossup, is we
024shouldn't be making the decisions based on today's enrollment patterns. We should be making the decisions based on what we think is right for some longer term period because we don't want to be doing this very often. I don't know the last time we've redrawn district boundaries. Do you have a sense of that? >> So, so we haven't done a district wide. We did it in 2022 when we made Tonalia K8 a standalone middle school and then a portion the K5s between Yavapai Hokum and Puma. So that's the last time we did boundary work and the only time since I've been here until this one. >> Yeah. >> Before that I don't remember the last time we did as a district looking to Dr. Sackos who's the longest >> suffice it to say it's something we
025want to do rarely. >> Right. So, and that cuts in a bunch of directions. Again, if the families in zone 12 are generally choosing SLC for geography, then all we're doing is putting a transportation burden on them when we had an opportunity to reszone to fit a little bit more of a geography alignment. If they're doing it based on their perception of the quality of the two learning communities, then we might be overindexing on that reputation in the moment. And you know, to Mr. Sh's point at the last meeting, let's strengthen those schools, get the message out. There's been leadership changes. These things have a lag to them and we don't want to over adjust, you know, when there's an opportunity. And then the culture point is once these families are in other elementary schools,
026their kids form friendships, you know, it's quite likely that more zone it's possible that more zone 12 families will choose CLC based on having in elementary school, you know, where that's a stronger pattern than, you know, existed in Puma previously. I think I'm understanding >> Yes. >> the culture argument that you're making. I don't know if you want to articulate it better than me. >> Well, I I think that that's exactly what you see. You see the feeder pattern between Hokum and Yavapai. The vast majority do feed into Toni and then into Cornado. So you see that kind of culture of staying within the learning community and it's it's just been variable and to your point for those 12 zone the 12 ABC and D increasing into Mojave and Sarro. I think the other thing
027that I would um put on the table in response is we're closing one school in the Coronado learning community without having uh provided then time to see how that shifts in terms of where students enroll and giving the Coronado learning community the opportunity to as we think about programming and and increasing enrollment giving them some time. One of the criticisms we've heard, you didn't tell us that you were going to be closing and we should have had more time. On the flip side, for the phase two schools, they've said, you know, now that you've put us on the list, >> move quickly. >> So, so we we understand those dynamics. My uh my my recommendation would be if we give some time for the Coronado learning community with the 3A option to show growth trajectory
028um you would have another opportunity to to revisit this boundary conversation if we need to reduce the footprint in the Coronado learning community by one more. My fear is that if we make the decision now to redraw those, we might be already predetermining that we need to close one more school in the Coronado learning community. And I would prefer to see the the entire community have the opportunity to have two K5 elementaryaries, a middle school, and a high school and do the work to have the compelling argument for why students should be in that complex and actually do work to draw more into Coronado. I think that would be the preference. um if we do the other um you know we it doesn't mean that we we don't have an opportunity to grow but it
029may um foreshadow what would be on the horizon >> and that's true with just the population of zone 12 that's a big enough set of families and zones to cause the sort of snowball effect >> I think it's probably more optics and perception that you're you're shrinking the the footprint of one of our learning communities and it's already the smallest learning So, I don't know that the raw numbers themselves. I'd have to go back and look at the demographic study to see where there's projected school age students and I don't have that off the top of my head. >> Other comments, questions from our board, Mr. Shy. >> Um, thank you. Thanks Dr. Pinsky for the lead in. Um, reiterating the comments I said before. I look at this as a a good natural experiment.
030We have families that have made a choice, right? We're a state of school choice. We're open enrollment. Uh and we see the choice they're making. Um as I said before, you know, I want to strengthen our community. I want to make sure that if we look at why those families are choosing, right? Is it the math and science academy is a draw to them? Uh is it the gifted program in the Coronado community isn't as strong as it can be? Right? Those are things we can invest in. We talked about um reducing our footprint, investing in our district to grow and this to me is a great opportunity. We have the the principles of most of the schools here and I've interacted with most of them and I know they will do what they need
031to do. They will advocate. they will fight if it's you know if if the the trigger is you know the math and science academy is such a draw at at cigar learning community we should do that in Coronado as an example that's something I know they'll fight for and they'll bring up and that you know we should support um as a board and so um understanding that relationship understanding the nature of the footprint um I have tremendous empathy for what we've done to families in the Puma community. Um, I've talked with them. I understand. Uh, and um, when I look at this, I look at their choice as something that we could benefit from. Um, and you know, I I follow that comment that if we do change that boundary, we're essentially hamstringing the Coronado
032learning community. and then you know whether it's the 34 students now or the potential for more students you know those blocks are gone and then we've already sort of predetermined that decision I don't think that's the right move so from my standpoint looking at we can satisfy our families whether it's in Saro community whether it's in the coronado community um I look the look at it is keeping the boundaries where they are and doing what we can to support and strengthen the coronado Miss Card, >> um I'd like to know Dr. Menzel, when you're talking about Okay, so let's try this, right? What are we talking about for a growth plan? Two years. >> So I Yeah, two years is what I would anticipate we should be able to see the the change. So you
033have this coming year and one more. And then if you did not see the the kind of growth that would and ultimately and they know this when I met with the Tonalia staff this week um what we'd like to see is Tonalia having 200 students per grade level because if you have a feeder pattern into Coronado that could give you 800 from within the community and then you work to attract from surrounding communities you have a potential to get Coronado closer to a thousand students and we are seeing some positive signs already at Tonalia but I think you're going to need a couple of years to be able to build on the positive momentum. I think after a couple years, you'll have a pretty good sense. >> Okay. So, we um go with the district's
034recommendation of 3A. Correct. Um we also need to invest in that and going to five APS is not investing in those communities. Um and you know them not having the marketing money that some of the other schools do. Like we really need to take that serious if [music] we go with this. Um time in for investing in the community. We need to invest not just with the the boundaries. Um but we we really need to give them the opportunity to grow if we're and not just give lip lip service to it. Hearing no other comments and uh much appreciation for the depth and the unpacking of the various um components of this complex consideration. Uh, I'm going to make a motion to approve the committee's recommendation of option 3A to establish new boundaries for the
035Puma Elementary School based on the depth of various components just shared by each and every board member. They were aligned very much with the comments I had intended or hoped to make, but as I listened, they were echoing and ricocheting right here at the table. So, thanks to the board for its thoughtfulness, and I'm looking for a second to the motion. >> I'll second the motion. >> It's been moved and seconded. All those in favor say I. >> I. It passes five to zero. >> Uh at this juncture I'll make a motion to uh adjourn our special meeting. >> Second. All those in favor? >> I I passes five to zero. We are adjourning at 6:30. >> Thank you all for your time this evening.