Board Work Session | October 16, 2025

001Good evening and welcome. Today is Thursday, October 16th, and this evening the Rochester Board of Education will be meeting for our Tuesday work session. Excuse me. Today, Tuesday? It's not. It's Thursday. We had a uh a day off. It's Thursday. our October third, excuse me, 16th work session we'll be having. Um, and at this time I'd like to call the meeting to order. And uh before we move forward, I'm going to ask uh for us to uh entertain a motion for executive session. >> Motion >> to discuss or do we have to >> um I'm looking for the language. Uh this meeting may recess an executive session to discuss matters leading to the appointment, promotion, discipline, suspension, dismissal, or removal of a particular person and to receive the advice of the general counsel as permitted

002by section 105 of the open meetings law. I have a motion on the table by Commissioner Patterson. May I have a second by Vice President Malloy? All in favor? I. Any opposed? >> Okay, we will dismiss into executive session at this time. Thank you for your patience. We are returning from executive session to our board work session for the Rochester City School District this evening. At this time, I'd like to bring forward um our partners who are the Council for Great City Schools, uh Miss Dr. Ray Hart and uh Cindy Cindy, give me your last name again. >> Ellburn, I was going to add some syllables there. Ellurn, thank you uh for joining us this evening. U we've been working with the Council for Great City Schools on student outcomes focused governance. uh this work

003continues and I'm going to turn the mic over this evening for your facilitation. Thank you. >> Uh thank you, President Simmons, uh commissioners, Superintendent Roser, thank you all for having us again. Um and we look forward to having a conversation tonight. We're going to do two things tonight. The first of which is at our last session with the board, we had the board draft uh guard rails to round out the goals that the board has already set. In the interim, between our last session and this session, we've been working with the administration to think through what might be possible measures, which we call uh interim uh guard rails for the goals and the guardrails that you've set. We'll also work with the administration on setting up um interim goals as we move forward. Uh but

004we'll have a conversation about that later. Before we get to that conversation, uh you all requested from us the opportunity to hear from board members around the country who have been through this process before to get a perspective of what it's like, where you're going, uh what it has looked like for them. Um and so we are going to share uh we've asked two board members uh to join us via Zoom to share with you their perspective of what the process has looked like, what it's meant for their school district uh and then answer any questions that you might have about uh where you're going uh what what the process looks like etc. Uh before they join, I'd like to share a presentation that was just presented. One of the board members is from Charlotte

005Meckllinburgg Public Schools. Uh and this was this presentation was shared uh just a few days ago actually about Charlotte Meckllinburgg's results from um this year's state assessment results. Uh and it'll you'll also see some other things in there about their goals, what their processes are. So I wanted to share that with you as a bit of background before you actually hear from the commissioners. I'll also share some information. that hasn't been publicly shared yet about Philadelphia, but I'll share some information about Philadelphia and then we'll introduce those to to board members to you. Uh so, beginning as I shared earlier, this uh is a presentation that was most recently done um in Charlotte Meckllinburgg public schools. Uh you'll be hearing from uh D Rankin uh who is uh the school board member on your uh

006to your right in the picture with the gray beard that you can't miss. Um and so he'll be joining us shortly. Uh the first thing I'd like to note is and I'm going to skip this slide which talks about their enrollment, their background. Uh but I'm going to go straight to this slide which actually uh so you'll notice the third slide in the board's presentation is actually the board's monitoring report and moni what we call monitoring calendar for the year. You remember we mentioned to you that one of the things that you'll want to focus on at each meeting is how are students actually doing? What are student outcomes and what's the district doing from a strategy perspective to improve student outcomes and student achievement in the district? What you see in this monitoring calendar

007are their their four goals. One is K12 literacy, one is 3 through eight literacy. Uh they have a math one goal. Uh then they have a post-second rating secondary readiness goal. Um and I'm pulling this directly from them. So I know you can't see the monitoring calendar. Uh but what you'll note from this particular monitoring calendar is that throughout the course of the year on your left you have August 2025, September 2025 is the next column over October 2025 is the third, November, December, January. Uh so for the rem for now through January what they've laid out is here are our four goals that the board has established and here's when those goals will be monitored either the goal itself or um an interim goal. uh and as well as uh their guard rails. And

008here are some of the initial results. Um what they've noted uh as a part of the process that they've gone through in setting uh those student outcome goals for kids uh this year. Um the Charlotte Beckinberg schools outperformed the state of North Carolina in overall grade level proficiency and they grew in reading grades 3 through eight 5.2 percentage points. I'll put that in context in a moment. They grew in math 3 through8 4.6 percentage points and they grew uh in math three 8.2 percentage points. In addition to that um 156 of their schools met or exceeded growth. Uh and that was a total of 89% of their schools uh the first time uh in their history that they've had that number of schools meet or exceed growth. So it's the first time it's ever happened

009in Charlotte Meckllinburgg. In addition to that um 115 of those schools uh exceeded growth um and this is exceeded growth and uh it was these two percentages. So the first one was met or exceeded this one is exceeded growth. So 115 of their schools 65% exceeded growth expectations for the year again uh first time in in the history of the district. uh 10 um is the ranking of the district out of uh schools. Again, that is the highest ranking for the school district in its in its history uh relative to other school districts in the state. Um 123 of the schools uh increased uh from increased to uh A, B or C. Again, the largest single year increase in the history of the schools. Sound uh or 123 schools or about 70% of their schools

010earned an A, B or C. And then 55% of their schools uh improved um again by letter grade largest single increase in the in the history of the district. I'll skip through most of these just in the interest of of time. Um but I'll share just a couple of others. Mentioned uh earlier that they were up 5.2%. again that's their reading goal. Uh the other thing that you can see here is by each grade level how reading has improved. So it's not just and this is one of the important things about um setting goals even though they set um kind of broad goals those broad goals have resulted in improvements at multiple grade levels. Uh so 79.3% of students demonstrated proficiency through uh a state's read to achieve program. Uh in addition to that in

011mathematics you'll also see similarly across grade levels even though they set math goals at specific places what the the district and what we wanted to share here is that what the district recognized is that in order to hit those goals if I set an eighth grade goal or what have you what I recognize is I've got to improve um at each grade level to accomplish that. And so that's one of the things you see reflected here. um 66.6% is uh the grade level proficiency rate for those students who are level three, four or five on high school math three, which was one of their goals. So, just a broad overview of where the district has gone, uh how the district has improved. Uh there's one other slide that I'll show you. That's a a picture

012of all of their schools. Um but there's one other slide I think that's important to note. This is about the number of schools that uh were ABC or D. But I'll share this in a little different way uh relative to uh the DNF schools and the AB and C schools. Uh and that is on uh this particular slide. I know you can't see it well, but going back to on the left hand side, what you have is the 2122 school year. Um and what you have going across is the number of A schools in the district is that first column. Uh and then the percentage of A schools in the district is the second column. The number of B schools in the district is the third column. Uh the number of C schools outlined in

013purple is the one two three four fifth column over. Uh and then you've got the number of D and F schools in the last two purple highlighted columns. of note since the 21-22 school year um they have had an additional nine schools reach the um A uh level. They've had an additional four schools reach B. They've had additional eight schools reach C status. They've dropped the number of D schools by 11. And they've dropped the number of F schools by nine. Uh so it gives you a picture of you know what happens when you as a board set goals when you begin to then monitor those goals and then move the administration in a direction of actually improving. The last thing is the number of F schools that they have in the district has gone

014from 27 F schools to six um in this school year. So, one of the things that we'll continue to focus on um as we work with you, as we work with, um the the the setting of not only goals, but interim goals, interim guard rails, putting the guardrails in place, uh is really moving the needle on student achievement. That will always be our focus. Uh the other thing that I'll share with you uh and I won't take the time out to do it in a PowerPoint slide, but I just want to share with you some context uh for Philadelphia public schools who will join us uh as well. And the Philadelphia public schools this year um has set a number of goals around literacy and mathematics as was shared earlier. Uh but in Philadelphia this

015year relative to 20 the 2122 school year uh they are up in mathematics 8.6 6 percentage points. Um, and Philadelphia is a school district that has struggled um, historically academically, but uh, these are the percentage of kids who are proficient or advanced is up uh, for third grade students in particular who are proficient or advanced on the state test. They increased 12.9 percentage points uh, in that category over their 21-22 school year. Um in addition to that uh in terms of percentage of students with regular attendance their attendance is up 4.1 percentage points. Um they have some other key areas critical areas uh relative to teacher attendance in particular. Uh teacher attendance uh 90 and they measure that by 90% or more of days attended. Uh that has increased 8.2 percentage points. Uh and then

016the number of student dropouts uh which is important and they measure this in grades 7 through 12 but the number of student dropouts in grades 7 through 12 has decreased by 2,237 students. So they have 2,237 fewer dropouts now than they did uh in the 21-22 school year. Uh it was 3,917 that year. It has dropped to 1,680. Uh and then the percentage of students as I mentioned earlier who score proficient or advanced uh on algebra 1 um and biology uh and some of their high school measures up 1.4 percentage points up 2.2 percentage points uh and then their uh competent or advanced uh on another state test that looks at kind of how students are doing relative to um uh a a college and career measure is up 15.7 percentage points. So, didn't want

017to introduce the individuals uh who are going to join us um without giving you some background about uh the actual performance of those school districts, what it's looked like, how it's changed uh and what the parameters of setting these these uh types of goals and guardrails means for uh improvement in student outcomes uh in your districts. Um and so, Cindy, uh do you have anything you want to add to that? joined yet? >> I don't think he has. Um yeah, so uh the only other thing that I'd add the um I don't think it was mentioned that the other uh board member that we have that will be joining us um is from Dallas and that is Ben Mackey and um Dallas is has been um doing this work for quite a number of years

018since 2015. Um they actually in Texas um student outcomes focused governance is known as lonear governance. Um and it it a lot of the same tenants uh and they too have seen numerous gains in um in their student data as well. Um, and this this is just uh and what you'll hear and you'll you'll have an opportunity likely to um ask these folks questions as well um once they've uh talked a little bit about their governance journeys. Um but a lot of that a lot of uh what it's about is having those priorities um and then aligning resources. So when we talk about aligning resources, it is time, talent and treasure. So when we um and that's both time, talent and treasure of the district and time, talent and treasure as a as time currency

019of the board. Um so uh and and how the board spends its time um really really matters and that's why we focus toward that 50%. How the board allows the district to spend its time also matters. So, anything that the board or board members um do to take the eye off of that ball um off of that student outcomes ball uh is is not going to is going to take away there's always a trade-off um take away from the the chances of your students getting getting to have the benefit of such results as well. So, um just a little context there. Do we have is D back with us? >> Oh, Ben's here. Okay. Hi, Ben. >> Hello, y'all. Great to be here. >> Uh, we'll go ahead and introduce we'll we'll start with Ben,

020but we have three others. We asked them to join at 6:30, so they should be joining in about two minutes. Um, so D and D Brown was D was with D. Rankin, excuse me, was D. Brown was a basketball player. Now I'm dating myself. Um D. Rankin um was with us just a few minutes ago, so he'll join. I'll allow Ben to introduce himself, but I didn't share any data uh from Dallas ISD. Uh but I'll share with you that um a couple of things that were really and Ben can share some more details about their their student achievement outcomes as relative to uh setting their goals and guard rails process. But uh one of the first things about Dallas that was notable is their goals really focus on again improving student outcomes coming out

021of the pandemic. Um their African-American students in Dallas were the first and it was well before the state and well before other student groups uh to exceed their performance coming out of the pandemic relative to where they were pre- pandemic and it was almost immediate. Um, and so when you look at kind of student achievement, setting goals, things like that, uh, Ben will give you more details on what they what they've done and how they focused, but just understanding that that makes a difference for your kids. So, Ben, do you want to introduce yourself? >> Dr. Hart, if I can interrupt, I apologize for interrupting. Is there a way we can cast so we can see Ben and everyone on the bigger screen? And, um, >> once he starts talking, he'll show on the other

022screens. Okay. Thank you. Pardon my interruption. >> So, Ben, I will let you introduce yourself. Um, and thank you for joining us and thank you for uh sharing with the board here in Rochester about uh your experience with setting. We know that uh you have Lonear Governance in Texas, but it mirrors student outcomes focused governance and what it's meant for your district. >> Absolutely. It's an honor to be with you all here tonight. Uh my name is Ben Mackey. I am a schoolboard member in Dallas ISD. Uh I've been on the board for the last six years. though the work that Dallas ISD started along the student outcomes focused governance direction actually pre preceded my time on the board they actually started about 2015 2016 um and we've been doing the work for the better

023part of the last decade uh so I'll talk a little bit about that but separately in my um professional life I also am an educator I have actually been an assistant superintendent in a district that went from not really having a governance framework to adopting essentially again sof um although we in Texas call it lonear governance but it is essentially and functionally the same thing. Um and I got to see the difference from the administrative perspective as well. So I'll talk briefly about that but at the highest level um and when I came to Dallas I was actually a principal in the district. So, I watched a lot of schoolboard meetings and I watched them go until 2 a.m. in the morning talking about all kinds of number of things, usually procurement, contracts, technology, uh,

024policies, uh, any other number of things that might be the topic of the day. And again, the board and all the board members really wanted the best and they were engaging on these topics that some of which had real concerns to them or ways to do it. But what was lost in that was what is the most important thing and then how do we make sure our actions speak louder than our words. We can say what we say is important. We can say that we want to improve student outcomes or make sure every student can read on level. Um but in 2015 the board actually sat down spent I think the better part of R you might have been there for part of it. Um spent the better part of three weekends really crafting out

025what the goals were going to be for that first one. We are now in the third iteration of student outcome goals that square solely on student outcomes. In Dallas, we've chosen to essentially have a benchmark achievement level on um third grade reading, third grade math, eighth grade reading, eighth grade math, and college and career readiness by a particular set of metrics that we have used. And it's been more or less while it has changed over time, um they have been relatively consistent in that. What I will say is it's one thing to set the goals and set the priorities. It is a wholly different thing to spend substantial time focusing on them. Uh in about 2020, we actually implemented where we do monthly monitoring and I truly believe that that has fundamentally changed our trajectory

026in the school system and the data bears it out. So as of this past year, we actually um Ry alluded to this. I don't have the data in front of me, but I will make sure you all have the data from this. Um but essentially we went from a place where about you know we had a lot of schools that were DRF schools. We have an A throughF system in Texas. Um to this year we only have 14 out of well over 200 campuses that are DRF. We are the highest achieving um or at least one of the very highest achieving large urban districts in the state of Texas and nationally when you look at some of the other metrics that translate across state lines. um we outperform our state in absolute achievement um for

027all of the so for our Hispanic students, our African-American students, economically disadvantaged students, and emergent bilingual students, we are outperforming at every single performance level. And I attribute that squarely to the fact that the board spends every time every month focusing on that. Where that fades in is there's a whole lot of other systems that come from it. It's not just about setting the goals and just spending time to spend time on it. It is actually though where a board focuses their time, administration then has permission to spend their time there as well. And if they know the board is going to ask questions about things, is going to really dig in deep on third grade reading, you better believe that administration is going to spend time in the preceding weeks and months making sure

028they are ready to talk about all of the ins and outs of third grade reading. And there's a safety and a trust there because administration also commits with this then doesn't get blindsided by whatever else is there. There's other procedures to talk about and get questions answered around procurement or uh different construction elements which board members still need to know about and there still needs to be a conversation but the board doesn't dedicate nearly as much time to that at the board meeting that gets handled outside of it. So fundamentally, and I can tell you this is my last anecdote and then I will stop and I'm happy to answer any questions or be a resource however I can. I was the assistant superintendent overseeing a lot of the data elements and a large streams

029of our student support services work in a district that I worked in that adopted this model. And I will never forget there was after the midterm assessments, I was in charge of actually putting together and the data packets that would help guide our reading and our math strategies for principles across the district. Our board at the time had a major concern about something procurement related as it related to special education from a few years ago and that was the question that came up and we knew that that was going to be the topic at the board meeting. And so you better believe that I ended up spending my time trying to figure out everything I could know about that procurement system that happened a few years ago. Again, not because the board members are trying

030to distract us, but that was just the topic at the moment. There wasn't a structure to keep the focus on third grade reading on third grade reading. And I often reflect on my own actions that time and and the damage that I caused by not being able to put those reports together and not putting those reports together for the district because I was too busy spending my time choosing to figure out about this procurement issue. In the intervening year, the district adopted goals and they chose one priority goal, third grade reading, that we focused on. And so you better believe that next year round there was nothing that would distract us from getting those third grade reading reports out to principles. And I am proud that when by the time I left even with the

031pandemic, our district emerged actually reading at every grade level higher than prepandemic levels u by 2023. So a huge um turnaround there especially in the face of a pandemic. But I would attribute that almost squarely to the focus the board put on the system and saying our students are going to read and we are going to be ruthless about asking questions about that and we're going to align this so the superintendent feels uh supported in focusing their time and staff attention on these priorities that we have set. So again, thank you for the opportunity. Just thankful to be here. Thank you for choosing to serve and do the work that you do. Um, I know that it is a lot of time for very little, often no pay whatsoever. And so, thank you for um

032serving your community, your students the way you do. >> Uh, thank you, Ben. Before we open the floor to questions for you, uh, we'll go ahead and introduce uh, D. Uh, and D Rankin is a board member from Charlotte Meckllinmberg Public Schools. And D, you missed the presentation that I just shared. Um, but I just shared your 2425 endofear student achievement results presentation that was just shared with the board. Uh, so I just shared that with the board here. Uh, but feel free to take a moment um if you will to just share a little bit about your perspective um to the Charlotte to Charlotte uh to the Rochester uh city school district board um of commissioners on what this process has meant for you, your district uh and your board overall. and feel free

033to introduce yourself as well. >> Sure. Thanks, Ray. I appreciate it. Um, my name is D. Rankin. I'm currently serving uh on the Charlotte Mechanburg schools board of education. Uh, I am also serve as vice chair of the board. I've been on the board. This is my first term. I'm up for re-election for this for this term. Um, unopposed. Um, so I'll be on the board another four years. My second term. I'm also serving as the policy chair. uh been through uh the coaching cohort um for the through the C council of great city schools. Um and when it comes to the SFG um framework uh before I joined the board um I our our board um started this process created goals and guard rails. They started this process I think maybe two years or

034three years before I I joined. Um and then when we joined we set a new set of goals which we are currently in now. Uh a new set of goals focused around early early literacy um K2 literacy uh 38 literacy uh math one and then a college and career um goal as well. We did that through a process of one receiving um feedback from our community finding out what their vision and values were when their values were and then from there we um uh created our goals. Uh so the our this is our first year and I don't know if you I'm sure you saw the data but we had really historic gains uh through this process. Um in the meantime also we also between the two uh creating new goals we also hired a

035new superintendent and with that new superintendent um we we had these goals and we it's really as a board has kept us focused um on really making sure our meetings are uh I would say more intentional each meeting we have a progress monitoring session each meeting um and we are really focused on making sure that we not focus on more operational um conversations, but really focused around strategies and learning from the superintendent when she g after she gives her presentation on how we can continue to move forward um to achieve our goals. Um and I think we're we're super proud of what we we've accomplished this first year and hopefully we'll continue to move forward um and hopefully by 2029 we'll we'll accomplish our goal. Uh, and Joyce um, who is from Philadelphia will join

036us in a moment. So, we'll introduce her when she joins. In the meantime, I don't know if we can get Ben, Andy on the screen together, but want to open up the floor to uh, commissioners here in the room to ask any questions that you might have about uh, your colleagues from Charlotte and Dallas. >> Um, thank you, Dr. Hart. I think I'll start if if that's okay. Hi, my name is Camille Simmons. I serve as the president for the school board here. I've been on the board for um I'm completing my first term and then I'll be going on to my second term soon. Um you all mentioned um what I think a lot of boards deal with, which is um wanting to focus on the work, but not necessarily focusing on the work.

037uh like you said, there's a lot of different pieces that drive a school system, but they don't necessarily drive governance. So, the behaviors that you begin to recognize that needed to change to will you back in to focus on this student outcomes, um can you share a little bit around how you all held each other accountable or supported each other in kind of refocusing toward um the recognition that we've got to focus on student outcomes. Yeah, I'll be happy to go first. Um, and I think it you you hit the nail on the head. Board member, every board member that I've ever met met really wants to do right by the students and the families of their school systems. And it's not about board members necessarily so much as it's about board systems. And so

038putting in place and really having these conversations about how do we put the systems in place to keep our board as a collective focused on this. Um and so what that looked like in Dallas, we actually set board operating procedures around what types of reports come to the board members at board meetings. We tried to center that around the student outcomes themselves and put a calendar for it. And then where do the other reports go? Um it doesn't mean board members never get updated on these things. That's not the point. there's just other modes of information to be able to get that. So, it really is around thinking about your procedures, really interrogating why do we do things the way we do things and is there a better way to do them? Uh, is there

039a better way? And I, you know, often times this gets lost is I what I hear is the first response around SOFG sometimes is like, well, this is where we talk about things and our public sees what's happening and so we need to continue to spend a lot of time at our meetings talking about them. And my point is there are some people that watch your meetings, but your wider public does not. And there are often way better ways to communicate what you want to communicate about items to your wider community than simply talking about it at a board meeting. What a board meeting does is center your priorities. And so it's really about building the systems that align for that. How do we consider policies? How do things get put on the agenda? what

040does our calendar look like that help us center around those priorities and help us achieve what we want as opposed to answering whatever is the topic of the moment. >> Thank you. And um just following behind Ben, I would just say that we too um have a a board operate operating procedures manual that we follow um that give that of course talks about how many days ahead of time that we have our agenda set and the items that go on our agenda. But our our our board chair also takes the time to do a timed agenda to make sure that what we're doing, what we're focused on is um the work or the the actual student outcomes focused work um and not more so the operational pieces. There are some reports that we have to

041or things on the agenda that we have to do just because legally we have to do certain things. But for the most part, I we do I feel we do a good job of u making sure the items that are on our agenda are necessary and the reports that come before our before us are necessary. Um some reports um can be in and our in our we call them as presented reports and the board members get the reports before the board meeting. I mean 11 days before then then we have we have the opportunity to provide questions on those reports that won't be presented the board to the superintendent by within seven days and they get they receive that give us the answers within five and we follow that procedure um to when those and

042you have ask as many questions as you want how many and that's fine but then of course you can have your one-on-one time with the superintendent or her cabinet but that's how we kind of keep our agenda tight and make sure we're focusing on our progress monitoring. >> Thank you. >> You want me to facilitate this part? I can. Um, okay. Yes. So, we'll open it here on the deis. Then, uh, Vice President Malloy, I believe you had a question, pending. >> Yeah. Thank you. So, thank you both for being here and for your insight. I know I've done um two years of the Council of Great City Schools just as part of a cohort. I've learned a lot, but implementing things, it's a lot different than just being part of a cohort. Um and

043so I'm really excited to see us adopt this here in Rochester. Um I know oper it's really easy to get involved in the operational parts of our district um and get bogged down in that, but is there anything I don't know if you've ever had truly like emergencies in your districts that you've had to deal with as a board. Um, and how do you balance those district-wide operational emergencies that might occur? How has the board been able to stay or your boards been able to stay student outcomes focused during those times? Because these are often very pressing issues that have real impacts on employees and children. Um, have you had to deal with those types of crises? when when you say emergencies, um I'm just curious what any particular examples because most of the time

044if there's emergencies, unless there's something that we have to vote on or requires us to do a vote, I don't not I'm not sure that we were it would require us to address anything during a board meeting unless it's something um pressing to where that the superintendent can't handle. But for the most part, if it's something that we we don't have to require us to vote on, I'm not sure if there's any type of type of emergency that we would have to handle during a board meeting. Um, and I will say this too, I meant to mention this earlier, we it is great to have the majority of our our board, um, I would say almost 100% but but nothing's always perfect, but it's bought into the into this framework. Like we've we have several

045that's gone through the cohort. Of course, we've done we of course we have a coach and we've had several different workshops and um focusing on our different mindset practices, those different things. And I think that's the key to make sure we have a board that's really bought in and focused on the framework. And that was that that's key um to to to staying focused and being intentional how we have our meetings and what we're doing. >> Thank you. I would add that there's not a, you know, I think this is a common misperception about SOFG is like don't focus on any operations. Inevitably, you're going to have to that's part of your job. There's those things that come up. I think what the heart of SOFG is is that you if you say something's your

046priority. You prioritize it with your time. Uh that doesn't mean you spend 100% of your time on that. In fact, the SOFG framework really only talks about that the highest level being half of your time, which leaves another half of your time to deal with all the operational priorities. The heart of it is just that you are being really intentional about not spending all of your time on those operational priorities. And then to add on to DE's comment, I think it has given us a framework in how we talk about these things. So, it's not just trying to make a decision about in a vacuum about this operational decision. It has given us a new language to say, okay, we need to make this operational decision. There's a couple options on the table. Superintendent, which

047of these is going to help get us closer to achieving our goals and living out our values? Uh, and which ones wouldn't and why? It gives us a framework to talk about those, but it's definitely not the case that it you never talk about those things because that's part of your role, too. >> Thank you. I appreciate that. >> I do have another question, but I won't. >> Okay. Any other questions? Um, Commissioner Santiago, >> I do not have a question, but I just wanted to thank you guys uh for taking time out of your uh busy schedules to be here and give this presentation. I think everything that you guys have shared has been uh pretty clear so far. So, no questions, but just want to say thank you guys uh for coming here.

048>> Commissioner Patterson, >> thank you. Thank you. Um, I don't know if this is a question for you or CGCS, um, but I'd like you to talk about, um, you know, publicly televised meetings. Um, we have a number, numerous publicly televised meetings. Um, and I'd like you to speak relative to the percentage, you know, that you have, like how many a week, how many a month? What's your thoughts on that? um you know does it detract from um progress uh or do you think every meeting should be televised to the public? >> I can go for it. So we have seen a drastic decrease in the number of meetings that we have. We used to be having weekly meetings about any number of topics that come up and it was hard to follow. Um, actually

049putting a cadence together about when we meet and why we meet and what we accomplish during that, even though there might be still some other things that come up out of nowhere, but it kind of gives a framework has allowed us to focus and understand that everything that's urgent is not important, but we it allows us to prioritize the urgent things. As far as the televised meetings, I think this is a um, you know, oftentimes this is governed by state law. So in Texas, we definitely have to record and share our meetings and that's got to be available publicly, which we do. We don't publicly televise them, though they are live streamed. You can watch them on YouTube or wherever else. The I would just say is I would just ask like I think part

050of the SOFG process is to ask a board about why we do things the way we do them and really understand how it helps us get closer to achieving our goals or not and then making a decision in that consideration. So in this instance like I would inquire about you know why first of all do we have to is it legally required why would we do that what was the purpose that it was started for sometimes it is we want to communicate to the community that's probably a good thing but I would just encourage a board in that instance is how wide of a reach is it how many people watch it and is there a better way to communicate the message to your wider constituency but I think those are questions that only you

051can answer I don't think there's one right answer but I think some of the work of SOFG is to really interrogate these practices that have always been in in um in practice just because they've been there and really think about how this is helping get us closer or further from our priorities. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. And I would say that here in North Carolina also we're the same where all of our meetings are televised. um whether it they're live streamed, but we also our meetings um that that's anything that's any of our public meetings, whether it's a committee meeting, whether it's a a board working meeting, there are tele um they're all live streamed um or they are on um our local cable station here also also shows our meetings. So, we have to

052have that option. And I would also say something that's been beneficial to us as well. When I first got on the board, we had maybe I would say six to eight comm six to eight committees which was working against our time our board time on SOFG time. And at our last retreat over the years, we've taken the time to do committee diets because what we were finding out was a lot of the the committee meetings that we we were having was really more so just the sta our staff reporting out to us the work that they've been doing. It's not really the work that the board had been doing. Um, so we've had we we've t been intentional with a committee diet and we also taken the time to uh like I said cut committees

053but also we in our we've also created policy around them the the amount of meetings certain committees can have throughout the year. So certain committees can only meet can only meet say four times a year which would give them once a quarter but that's and that's it. Um and some can meet up to six times. I think we we only have I think right now we up to three we're down to three committees if I'm not mistaken. Um and that's it. Um and then we have our regular board meeting. So we meet twice a month and then there may be a committee meeting in between some of those um depending on if they meet or not. >> And last uh the timed agenda you mentioned which I agree with and I think is very important.

054Could you uh explain that to the listening public? Um I have an idea what you're talking about, but if you could explain that a little bit more in depth. >> Sure. So once the agenda once our our our chair and our superintendent um come up with the agenda items, uh that then the chair allocates a certain amount of time for each item. So we'll so we'll have an idea of how much time we'll spend on each particular section. And so we'll know, you know, if it's a report out on, you know, any particular item, we'll it'll say 10 minutes here. And then for pro for our progress monitoring session, we know those are a little longer. So we may go say 45 minutes or so to an hour depending on on the on the topic.

055And so each item is given a time. So we'll have a guesstimate on um how long the meeting will be, number one, and how long how much time we'll spend on that particular agenda item. And the only thing that we don't really we can somewhat gauge is we here we are we're required by law to provide public comment and that's that's not um something that we limit to where each each speaker gets two minutes and we don't know until 12 p.m. the day of the meeting how many people um the that's when the cut off is to sign up to speak. Um, so then we'll have a we'll by the by the meeting time we'll have an idea of how long public comments will be and we only have public comments once a month at

056the beginning of the month. >> Thank you. Okay. Um, >> thank you. >> Hold on one second. Commissioner, >> I just want to thank him. >> Did you have I'm sorry. Did you have one more? >> I just wanted to thank them. >> Okay, go ahead and thank >> All right. Thank you very much for your comments. >> Thank you. Um I have one more um question to my left and then Commissioner Elliot I do see your hand. >> Okay, Commissioner Elliott. >> So the drawback for me is is that uh without having the meetings that we used to have as a board while they were um long at times and um pretty frequent uh it did provide me with information that I can articulate in the community. uh I don't feel that I had

057that kind of intimate information at this point and so for me it feels as if I cannot communicate um to the community um you know around a lot of different issues because we had the subject matter experts that would come in uh to be able we can you know ask questions and they can respond. Um so I I missed that piece. I I understand why we may want to um reduce the meetings that we made that decision to do that, but I'm feeling lost. I'll just say that. Um and so, how did you all handle moving from your uh original um schedule of meetings to still feeling that you know what's going on in your school district? >> I can take that first. Um, so and I believe in Dallas, how we do this is

058board members need access to all the information that they need to be able to make effective decisions and share with their community. Um, so that can't go away if you're going to have board members who can actually advocate for things and share this. So I empathize with your feeling the need for that. What we did is found better venues for that. Um, so a setup where we can ask questions well in advance because what fundamentally was happening is that we weren't getting comprehensive answers at the meetings because it's the first time that the staff is hearing those questions. They're saying we might have to get back to you on that. Uh, they're trying to grapple with this. So when we found when we actually went to how do I ask questions or set up these

059individual meetings where I can get the answers I need based on this. There's other ways to do this that have gotten me a lot of information. It's still incumbent on me to ask the questions. Just now there are more venues and more effective venues where I can get those answers that aren't at a public meeting when we've got a bunch of other agenda items on the agenda to get through. And so that has saved the staff a ton of time. That has saved me a ton of time. And it has allowed me to get better and more responsive information uh in a more timely fashion than in a slew of other agenda items. But I empathize with the need. you definitely need information. Um, and I think that's part of the SOFG framework is not

060to say board members shouldn't have that information. It is how do we find the most effective ways to get board members the information and then also how do we support the board as a collective and actually communicating that more effectively with the community. >> For for me, it had a lot to do with being able to ask the questions in public for the people that put us in office. um so to put that in the public um space to be able to ask those questions. Uh we do have uh ways in which that we can get that information. But for at least yeah, at least for me having those conversations public like that um and for the people that viewed this and who was going to share this information throughout uh the community. Uh I

061just found it to be far more >> I got you. I thought you were talking about you you found value asking the questions at the meeting, but really what I heard you hear you say now is actually the community who watches us is able to hear that conversation, which is so amend >> slightly on that, which is I've seen boards find a lot more um far-reaching ways to get this. I've seen boards actually they ask those questions in advance, administration can put together a really meaningful one. and they put together a YouTube video that then gets sent out and is available on all the feeds that people can watch and actually learn about that and see the discussion if they're interested in that particular item and can send it rather than have to go through

062a meeting. I've seen it communicated in newsletters. I have seen a lot of different ways to get that information out to the community. Uh and when we looked at our who watched our meetings in both of the systems that I have worked in, yes, there are a few community members, but for the size of Dallas, it is mostly a number of staff and the same three to four people that are deeply interested. And so we found we can actually get a lot wider um information out to parts of our community that don't typically tune in to the board meeting and actually get that meaningful information in their hand by using other means. >> Thank you. Thank you. And I would like also like to add also um we have we have a we've created like

063I said 11 days before we're able to ask the questions. We received all the agenda items and all the reports. Everything that will be on the meeting will be was is sent to us. We have the opportunity to ask multip any question that we want about the reports or about the the items that will be that will be on the agenda whether they their actual reports or whether they'll be as presented. They don't mean they don't mean they'll be presented to us, but they'll be a agenda item as presented. Any questions that the board members ask, they are also posted on the agenda the day of. So, community members can also see the the the questions that board members ask and also the responses that the district um staff has given us. So that's also

064posted on our public site along with any presentations, any reports and information. So we that's how we get anyone that's watching our meeting will have those responses that happen prior to um if there's not official report or dialogue between staff, but they will also see the questions that we've asked but prior to the meeting before since it won't be presented actually at the meeting and we present those on our site. >> Thank you so much. >> Thank you. Um and so and this is reassuring to hear because we see that there's a lot of things that we are moving in the right direction. It's reinforcing some of those pieces and then we're also hearing some tidbits that we can potentially adopt or consider for even our own board. Um I want to be cognizant of

065the time. I think I see two more hands and then we'll try to close it and send it back to CGCS if that's okay. Um Dr. Hart, um I'm going to start with uh Vice President Malloy and then Commissioner Griffin, I saw your hand. Uh, and just so you know, I think Ben Mackey has to jump. So, so D, you might be on your own for just a second. Go ahead. >> But you're in good hands with D. I got to jump to my own board meeting. We have ours starting right now. >> Thank you for joining us. Thank you. >> Um, Cindy and Ray both have my contact information. They can share it directly with all of you. If you want to talk more offline, I'd be happy to, but you're in great hands

066with D. Also, >> thank you. You >> did you want me to go ahead? Go ahead. >> Okay. All right. So I the question I have is just about the board's self-evaluation process. Um what impact or changes have you observed in that process in your time on the board? >> Um with the board self-evaluation I think we've been very it's made us really re-evaluate um one our time. Um and if you are if you don't if you're familiar with the board evaluation really the the first three um the vision and the values and um those two the first two we really have um been intentional um with making sure we are progressing and have continuous improvement. So it's really made us excuse me take a look at um how we operate as a board and

067we hold each other accountable um to uh those measures in the self-evaluation >> and do you have full participation in that self-evaluation process? >> Uh for the most part I would say for the majority of time we do have everyone um I'm trying to think of the last two or three that we've done. Yes. And of course the board we also have we actually do the actual self-evaluation in one of our board meetings. So we review it together. So so everyone can um discuss that at a in a public meeting. So that's it's the the responses and what everyone scores individually and we kind of talk through and work through that. But we also have our coach there as well kind of talking us through the process to get us to where we need to

068be. >> Thank you so much. All right. I'm going to call on um Commissioner Griffin. Thank you, Vice President Mallaloy. Um, I know I missed a lot of the conversation, but I kind of um um going to come in to where I feel is most feasible at this time and say that um I have to agree one with uh Commissioner um Elliott and in being kind of um not having the insight that we did prior to all these changes and the lack thereof of communication um with as a commissioner from um administration in dealing with areas of concern. Uh also would say that with the with the removal of the committees, um I find that there's a lot of information that we not we now do not have oversight on and it's causing a problem.

069Um I feel because it's not being communicated in the way that it should should be. um with the changes that you have made in your district. Um how did you overcome those things? And like I said, you may have answered this question, but I I feel kind of like less thereof uh having the autonomy to address the issues and concerns that are in this district because I don't know what's going on. It's like we don't know what's going on. is it's like people are talking in speaking in silos and I don't I don't have the information I need to address certain things or to have insight to make a sound decision. So if you specifically talking about committees um I can give you an example um like some of the some of the committees how

070we did our diet at one point we had an audit committee and the audit committee would meet and talk about the partic the the staff would come and tell us results of the audit and we decided that it was really more taking more of staff's time because there was no board work. there was nothing the the board needed to do when it came to having an actual official committee meeting about the audit. So, that's one of the that was one that we took away, but that the audit still occurs. We receive the information um but it's just not as a committee. We receive the audit information. We have the opportunity to ask questions to staff. We receive those questions. Um if there and then like I said if the information is is is as presented

071it's it's posted on our website on our agenda the responses to the questions. Um so we still able to receive the information that as needed when it comes to um say a capital bond a bond um we had a community capital bond committee which once again was the staff coming and presenting to us where we are with our bond taking up more staff time versus prov staff would provide us with a report would have an opportunity to to ask questions about that report and receive responses back from as much as we needed to from staff. have and um so that that's been very beneficial to us. Like so the the main committees that we have right now are we have um our policy committee of course we need policy because that's one of the main

072things that we create. We have our um our finance and operational committee and then we have one more if we we have one more um but we we'll still have the opportunity to receive the information ask questions. It took an adjustment for some board members, but I think a after after you get used to the cadence of being able to ask questions because we always have access to district to at any time we could ask questions about what what's necessary um so that we can be um informed to our to present to our community. Um and we we have a fair fairly large district. So, and it's been working pretty well. Um I I just have to say I that you say policy policy committee is a very big concern as is ESA um and

073in New York State audit the audit committee is like kind of mandatory. So those are the three areas I think primarily is a big concern. But I have to say that across the board when I look at other branches and in in our um in our city they all have an oversight a member of the of the board has an oversight over something so they know that everything is going correctly or they can they can relate and say hey this is what's going on and relate back to the board. So I feel that in some ways and I'm not taking anything away from the council great city schools but some things I feel because of the dynamics of of of the board and how the history has has played out that things are still it

074it takes time to to for things to get better but I still feel that is some things we need to have to ensure that this district is going to be run smoothly and some of these committees that were taken away should not have been taken away so abruptly and and and without having something in place to build upon so that we can have a clear understanding of what's going on. So I think that that's where the you we lose a lot because we don't have that oversight as we did before. Other committees I understand but certain committees I felt feel should still should be in play at this time. >> Thank you though. I appreciate your response. >> Thank you. Yeah. >> Okay. I'm going to end the questions. We're at 709 mark. Um but

075I want to definitely thank our guests for joining us this evening. Um and answering so many questions as we continue this journey with CGCS. And I'm going to turn the mic back over to you, Dr. Hart. >> I just want to take a moment to say thank you to D. Um thank you for joining us. Uh D Rankin and as well as Ben Mackey. And just let you know, let you all know that uh Joyce was not able to uh join us this evening because she's also in a board meeting. So uh they all have joined us around their own board meetings as they were able to. So D, thank you very much for your time this evening. >> Thank you. Thank you guys. >> I turn it over to you. >> Okay. It's very

076interesting. Thank you again um for for presenting us with some testimonials and seeing how the work can actually um manifest as we continue this journey. It looks like the next item on the agenda is going into the guard rail conversation. >> Yes. Um so I believe um what you have attached to the agenda are some uh are the guard rails and then um some of the draft interim guard rails that Dr. Roser and staff have been working working on. So I believe right now it's an opportunity um for if you're prepared Dr. Russer and staff to talk a little bit about some of the thinking um that you're putting in uh that you've put into these um concepts into these interim guard rails so that the board can understand um how you're essentially interpreting uh

077what they've um how they've expressed the values of the community. And just a reminder to the board, um the su if if it's such that the superintendent's interim guard rails aren't necessarily the direction that you were thinking with your guardrail, it's not about their needing to go back and come up with ones that you like. It's more how do we rewrite this to express it in a way that our intent is more understood. Before we do so, can we can you spend a little time with sharing with the board the process by which >> we ended our last session with draft guard rails and then of course there was some work that was done by the council to um worksmith. >> Yeah. >> So can you talk a little bit about that before we get

078into >> Sure. Um so if you recall the last time we were here we went through that process of of you know first you worked individually then in pairs and then in um in groups and we had the the chart paper and you voted and what rose to the top and there was a a little bit of combining of some of the guard rails um that occurred. And as we left that evening, um we talked about that there would that we would perhaps help with some of the word smithing um to get some especially some of those combined uh concepts uh into a guardrail format. So uh with that it was handed over to Dr. roster and team and then Ry and I spent some time with them um talking about what effective guardrail interim

079guardrail metrics are uh and and what the qualities are that they need to have like you need to be able to measure it multiple times through uh the the cycle. Um they need to be influencable by the superintendent. they you can have one to three per guard rail and they last one to three years and they're for the board to progress monitor to ensure that that that that um guard rail and the values that it is protecting are being honored. Um so we spent some time uh and started um we were witness to the team having some really really great discussion and since then um they have continued to work on that and have um been putting together some of those interim guard rails and um we were able to review some of those and

080give them a little feedback as well. Um so it's definitely an iterative iterative process both by way of um between the board and and the superintendent um as well as you know so we're we're coaching you all but we're also coaching um here as well. Yeah. >> Uh if I >> I think there's a question from the deis before we continue. Um, >> thank you so much for summarizing the work that we engaged in as a full board. Um, we were able to create guard rails together, which we'll hopefully be finalizing tonight. Um, can either of you just speak to so that the community hears, this is a new process for our entire community. We're using a lot of terminology that is brand new for our community. Um, can you just explain why we created

081guardrails, what they are for the community? >> Sure. So um the two things that the board has been working on are goals um which are about the vision of the community and those pertain to what students know and are able to do which the board um there already was a set of goals and those in that same session um we went through those with the community feedback and the board determined at that point that they were pretty set on on those um the guard rails then are that opportunity um to speak to the values those non-neg non-negotiable operational items. Um it can speak to other other things in the system that aren't student outcomes. So operational actions or classes of actions essentially um and they are written in a thou shalt not type format. So

082it actually puts a boundary around um it it says what the superintendent and district cannot do uh as they work to achieve the goals. Um and it leaves options for the superintendent um but also definitely protects what what is valued as uh the board has described through the guardrails. >> Thank you so much. >> Sure. And then those interim metrics um that we talked about those interim guardrails then actually are written in a smart for format and those are the things um that are used for the board to the board will get reports with that data to see how how those values have been honored. >> You're welcome. >> Thank you, Vice President Oy. Um Superintendent Roser. >> We have another hand. I'm sorry. about right now or is he >> I think he's going

083to um superintendent Roser is going to present I believe um the the cabinet level guard rails and then we'll continue from there. >> Okay. So, I first want to thank the council for their coaching support and assisting myself and the team with um developing what we consider to be um a good first draft of of responding to the draft guard rails that the boards created um during our last session. So, I want to read guardrail one so our community can most certainly hear and then we can refamiliarize ourselves with um what the board governance team elevated as a um as a guardrail. Guardrail number one reads, "The superintendent will not allow the selection or implementation of curriculum programs or practices that are not evidence-based or that result in inequitable opportunities for students. So when the

084team was working with the council, we identified three major areas that will most certainly serve well as interim guard rails to this guardrail. The first area being curriculum selection, the second area being curriculum implementation, and the third area being student placement practices. And let me the first two are are very self-explanatory, but let me speak a little bit about the third one, student placement practices. The last section of the guardrail speaks to inequitable opportunities for students. And we all know that depending upon what school zone you may reside in may then depend on what type of quality of educational experience our students may have. So we saw looking at student placement practices as a way to better guarantee that the equity and opportunity for all students to receive a high quality educational experience would be

085in play. So with the first one, curriculum selection, and keep in mind that these are drafts, you know, we do need to words smmith some of these. Um, we came up with 100% of core, which is literacy, math, science, and social studies. Curricular resources selected for district-wide adoption from December 2025 to December of 2028 will demonstrate evidence-based and equitable practices. So with this language that we came up with, it's clear how it associates with what the guard rail number one speaks to. Are there any questions? And I probably want to structure this where we can go through each of our things and then ask questions of the board to see whether or not there's questions for the purposes of clarity. Um if there's questions for the purpose of modification or if there's per questions um

086related to this is not a good interimm guard rail to measure the board's guardrail. >> I don't have I don't have any questions. I I love that it's evidence-based because I know that was one thing I learned is trying to understand curriculum and I have lots to learn about understanding curriculum. But um I'm going to open the floor for actual questions. Um I'm going to start at the far end. Commissioner LeBron, Commissioner Santiago. >> Yeah, I just want to say um that I actually I really do agree with the interim guard rails that's been put in place definitely for uh guard rail number two. Um, I think that they're all good measurements uh to put in place for the specific >> guard. Commissioner Santiago, we're just on number one. >> Well, even for one, I

087I just think that um I've read all the way through, but I believe that the ways that you've uh put the interim guard rails in there. I think they're good ways to measure um the goalguard rail and it'll be good ways uh for us to track the changes throughout um the time. So, >> any questions regarding clarity on the statement as he's presenting this so that we can determine if this is, you know, if we're on the same page, if we understand it or as um Miss Ellensburg and um Ellurn, excuse me, see, I like to add syllables. um stated um if if we don't feel that the guardrails presented are aligning with um the goals or or what we've presented then we may have to go back and reestablish our language. So are there

088any questions of clarity um as we continue miss uh vice president Malloy? Yeah, I actually really like this uh first interim guardrail um as presented um just regarding the curricular resources and I guess my only concern would be I know that I like the smart format from December it's very specific from December 2025 to December of 2028. Does that potentially mean that we could be looking at new curricular adoption or curriculum adoption during that time? And I know that um obviously that might be necessary, but I think a common refrain that we've heard um at least as long as I've been on the board for the last five years is a concern that we're constantly changing curriculum and that it's overwhelming for staff to have to go through those constant changes like every couple years.

089Um can you speak to that at all? Yeah. So we would not necessarily be looking to take existing curriculum and to engage in the process of curricular adoption for the core areas. Um that may be a little bit too much. As a part of my work um coming into the district and the team's work, we are evaluating our curricular resources to make sure that our curricular resources are are standards align number one and that they're evidence-based. And where we find that there is great deficiencies in either of those areas, we will be exploring looking at adopting curriculum that is most certainly standards aligned as well as evidence-based. >> Thank you so much. But it doesn't mean that we're going to wipe everything clear. But as we go through the process of looking at our and

090evaluating our curricular resources, if we find that there is something that uh does not meet those standards or is not evidence-based, then we will most certainly um be looking to utilize the Council Great City Schools curriculum quality rubric um to determine whether or not the curricular resource that we're looking at is suitable to the Rochester City School District. >> I didn't even know that CO or Council of Great City Schools had a curriculum um rubric. So, thank you so much for that response. >> Thank you. Before I go back to I see another hand before I go back, I just want to make sure I'm getting any fresh hands. Um any questions? And I don't see any. Commissioner Santiago, >> just very quickly, what what is usually the not the expected amount, but usually um

091the the most used amount as far as uh these interim goals. So I know that so on on this one you have one for each one. Um but at the bottom it says and or so are is are we usually projecting to get about one in goal or two to three in go goals between every guard row? one, >> you should have um one to three. So, I would um my coaching would be that the it would be an or um and not an and uh because that would make for four interim guard rails. Um and then uh and then also to think about um I can't I don't have can't read that far away. Um what uh some of those Thank you. um jump in here. >> I just want to make one comment.

092One of the things we wanted the the district to do tonight was give you an idea of the direction so that you all understand the direction that the district is going in. Uh but just note that these won't this won't be the final language because what we're going to do is create smart goals. So the same way you have goals that say from X to Y u we're going to do the same thing with these. So we'll we'll play with the language so that you'll know that it one it can be monitored and two you'll know where the baseline is and then where the district is going to pro progress to >> I have a question >> commissioner Elliot. >> Yeah. Yeah. So my concern would be that we when we do this that we

093look in the line we look from a perspective of who we are educating and I'm talking about black and brown children that the curriculum matches our students so that our students could see people in the curriculum that look like them and that have been accomplishing things within um uh who that have accomplished things in the past. We have not done a very good job of that. Um, I saw a video the other day where uh a young kid thought that all the black inventors were dead >> and not knowing that there are current black inventors. And so I'm interested in making sure that if we're selecting curriculum that is not a white curriculum, but it is a curriculum that is going to meet the needs of black and brown students. >> Uh, so to to

094address that, um, I think two things. The first of which is um I didn't we didn't know because the district didn't discuss this when we were in the meeting with them but didn't know they were going to include the council's rubric uh for uh scoring the curriculum actually in the guardrail. So that was a surprise to me uh when I saw it. But we do have in that rubric um and we actually have an updated version of it as well that we'll share. U but in there we actually do have specific language around uh curriculum uh that is uh culturally responsive etc. So you'll see that in there. >> Thank you, >> Dr. Hart. May I ask the question, would it behoove the board or the governance team to make modifications to guard rail number

095one to include language that is very explicit um that in includes cultural responsiveness? >> Yes. I I don't um if the board So I think that is a discussion that the the board needs to have if the board is satisfied with the idea that the that um that the rubric already speaks to that that that uh um curriculum quality rubric uh speaks to that then um no. But if the board does want to be more explicit than it would be then then having more explicit language uh is fine. But I think that that's something that the board it it's not required. But if the board would like to they are definitely um welcome to have that conversation and and add that in in some way. If I could just one other question. I'm also concerned

096about students um our special education students and so I don't know how we uh align that or or articulate that. Um but when you know we're talking about inequitable opportunities and certainly um we don't do as good of a job as we should do with our special education students as we see in our graduation rates. So it's gra you know when we look at the graduation rates for students with special needs and there was another ohll um then we have to look at you know what's equitable um as for those particular populations I don't know how you word that but I wanted to um share that because those two those two areas are the areas that has that we graduate the least elells and special education students. Commissioner, I mean, President Simmons, >> just getting

097back on my screen. Um, did anyone did you want to respond to that or is this just for us to consider as we move forward for additional conversation at another point in time? So, I think that um I think that's something that if the board is wanting that to be addressed or um then the conversation uh could happen now um so that so that the staff is absolutely clear on what they need to um write because the thing is or if there is so another option is is it a matter of changing this guard rail or is it a matter of adding adding another guardrail? I you know again less focus um when you have more guardrails just there's always tradeoffs and that >> you know that's that's the board's decision right >> um and

098up to the board um but uh the other the other piece of that is um there are only three interim guard rails per guardrail. So, a guardrail can't be everything. One guardrail cannot be everything. So, the board needs to decide how they want to how they want to do that. Um, or if another guardrail needs to be added. I just I wanted to just simply get a little clarity like you mentioned the uh the the cabinet or the administration pointed to having the the council for great city schools linked in and um for example the culturally relevant curriculum is part of the rubric that's that's there. So again, like you said, is it a matter of us explicitly putting it there or do we just honor that, hey, it's embedded and understood that that's part

099of the package? It's and it's um it's pointed to there. Um to the other point, is that language also in there around special education or um ELLL students? Is that also in the rubric? I I do see that there's an attachment there, but I just scrolled through it really quickly. Um >> uh yeah, the and like I said, there's an updated version of that. the updated version of has it. Uh we do address in that um ELLL students, special education students, we don't call them out separately. Um but I think one of the things um that you could do um just to to help is uh you you already have the language of inequitable opportunities for students. Um you could add just inequitable opportunities for student groups. Um, and it would cover, you know, obviously

100all students, but then students by student group as well. And then we can adjust the language. It wouldn't necessarily change the interim guard rails per se, uh, but there are some things that you can put into the interim guard rails that would then show that you're addressing the needs of student groups. So, just a thought. >> Um, Commissioner Griffin. >> Yes. Um I I just I just want to go back to um what Commissioner Elliot was saying. Um, I don't think we need to have add another guard rail, but I do believe that one part of what she was saying as far as the reduction of or the lower um level of graduation rates with our special needs um children, I think is is privy to the movement that they have ensued over the last

101couple of years. They they they need consistency. So, I think that when you have consistency with children that have special needs that we we um find that they do well, they don't adapt to change a lot. And I and I think that is a major concern. So, I think that to her to her point, um I don't think it needs to be an actual guide rail at it. I think that that's something at the administrative level that we need to look at to make sure that these kids if they stay at the schools consistently and have the same teachers and with that I think that we will see a higher level of graduation rates. That is just my opinion. >> Commissioner Patterson, did you have a statement or question? My thought is that um the

102verbiage that you have here the suggested edit for board consideration in the verbiage uh results in inequitable opportunities for student and encapsulates encapsulates if I'm pronouncing that properly all these groups already. So the language is there for me. I don't have to have a discussion or enter into a discussion relative to adding other things when that verbiage right there clearly outlines that it includes and inclusive of all these groups we just named. So I just wanted to add that point. >> Thank you Commissioner Patterson and respectfully all um as I mentioned before I unfortunately I know I've been here for 10 months and have been at every meeting and I hate that I'm leaving because this is such a critical meeting. Um, but I am looking forward to catching up on the information. I do

103have to depart and at this time I'm going to turn um the the facilitation over to Vice President Malloy who will work in tandem with CGCS for the remainder of the evening. Thank you. >> Thank you, President Simmons. Um, were there any other questions at this time for our coaches? I think uh I think one of the things we can do I I think for now since we've got your the feedback um that you just shared um we've mentioned that this language isn't final language um so for now I would offer uh let us think let us keep the language the way it is and when we fine-tune the language creating as we share those smart goals we'll see if we can create something that that addresses what you need with as you shared Commissioner

104Patterson the language that you current that currently exists would addresses the concern. Does that make sense? >> Yes. >> Okay, Commissioner Elliot. Does that make sense? >> Yes, it does. >> So, I guess at this time we'll allow Dr. Rosser to continue on with the the next guardrails. >> So, thank you very much. So, the next interim guard row um curriculum implementation from December 2025 to December 2028, the percentage of classroom walkthroughs showing evidence of standardsbased instruction using district approved curriculum will increase from a certain percentage to another percentage across all schools and classrooms. And we would measure that using a district-wide walkthrough tool. questions. >> Oops. So, I'm unable to open that tool at this time, unfortunately. Is there any way that that can be put up on the screen? >> Okay, thank you.

105And as mentioned, this is a draft. This is not has not been finalized. >> That might that walkthrough form might be still in process and something that a metric that they're still working on. Um so it might not be ready for prime time yet. >> Fantastic. We don't need >> maybe maybe a little bit of explanation of the types of things that would be on that. >> Dr. Correct. >> Good evening commissioners. So what we have been finding is that there is a need to level set what's the expectations are in the classrooms across the district. And one of the best and easiest ways to do that is by having an agreed upon tool that everyone whether they're building administrators, central office administrators will be able to interpret as they are evaluating what's happening in

106the classroom. So we started with Vicky Ramos, Dr. Ramos last year started with uncovering the curriculum that we are using and she found that we were using a lot of stuff and in some areas especially with in our bilingual classrooms they weren't appropriate. So right now we are establishing what our scientifically based curriculara will be and then we're going to match that with instructional methodologies via a walkthrough tool. And we are currently designing this walkthrough tools. We're not ready to publish it yet because we want to engage teachers and administrators because buy in in what we deem as being the best practices for Rochester is absolutely critical. So some of the things that are on the tool would be ensuring that the lessons meet grade level standards. Uh, one of the commissioners mentioned our special

107education population, our ENL population, our bilingual population and unfortunately what we have seen has been the watering down of curriculum for those subgroups. That's not what we want. We want to make sure that we are teaching at grade level and providing scaffolds to help students rise to meet those expectations. Additionally, we want to make sure that all of the materials that teachers are using are district approved materials because of the constant shifting in leadership. There have been many different messages and now we want to make sure that everyone is using the same types of products in different ways because you have to differentiate so that centrally we can ensure that professional development is given to teachers so that they can feel successful in delivering instruction for their students. >> Thank you so much for that

108explanation. And if I can just add real quick, you know, as I mentioned during my 100 day report out that currently we have um a system of schools where depending upon what school you go to, you will see something different at let's say the third grade than if you go to another school. What we're attempting to do particularly um through using this student centered methodology um is to make sure that we're aligning what one can expect in one school to what one can expect in school B through Z. >> Thank you so much. Um I've seen some hands. I guess I'll start at this end of the deis. Um Commissioner Griffin, go ahead. >> Thank you. U Vice President Malloy. Um this is to Dr. Wright. Um I I didn't hear that in your in

109your explanation um for the changes which I think are very good that you would be meeting the children where they are where they're at. I know that some kids are not at the right at the same level as others but they may be in the same grade. So what are we using how does that to how is that tool going to be effective in that manner reaching the kids where they're at? So, just real quick here, um, and I'm I didn't set these expectations ahead of time, okay? But typically, this is a conversation between the board and the superintendent. The superintendent is welcome to call on his staff if he needs assistance with explaining something. So, all questions go through the superintendent and if if he cannot answer them, then then he can throw it

110to his staff. I didn't set those parameters. I apologize. But this is a this is a board a board superintendent conversation unless otherwise. >> I'm saying I >> I just need to understand the process because you're saying what she's asking should go to the superintendent. But I just want to how how are we supposed to be engaging here? That's what I want to understand so that the questions that I'm asking are not, you know, just in vain questions. So what is it that we're supposed to be asking? what are we supposed to be talking with the >> with our colleagues about versus >> get clar so if if you need clarity around what the measurement is what it's going to do how it speaks to that guard rail um then then definitely ask those questions

111and then have that conversation accordingly but it's a conversation between the board and the superintendent as the superintendent is the board >> to you all >> not and you can ask us questions too but um as the coaches but to the to the administrative staff. If if the superintendent needs them, he can call on them. But if he can answer it, >> we'll keep it there. Is that helpful? >> Thank you. >> Yeah. Sorry, I didn't explain all that before. >> It's a two-part question, but you want to direct I That's a question I have. So, you who you want you want to answer? >> Yeah, I can I can I can most certainly address the question. So, when we talk about educating our children and making sure that all of our children have a

112high educational um experience here in the Rochester City School District, there are multiple things that we need to guarantee are in place. So, when we talk about the varying levels that our students find themselves at right now, >> we need to also keep in mind that we do have an MTSS, which is a multi-tiered support system, right? so that those students who might need greater supports that they're receiving greater supports. This is not necessarily these guard rails don't necessarily speak to that but that's embedded in the work that we will be doing and continuing to do here in the district. >> Okay. I and those are the things we don't see. You know what I'm asking is something that you know is not written but is is um you're actually going to be addressing those

113needs. Is that what you're saying? It's okay. Um and and then the other question would be um we are 2027, you know, regent is going to go away first per you know we're trying to um get rid of that which I think is a really good thing. Um I guess my question would be would that tool that is being put in place would that also play a part? Would that also be set up so that that that type of you know the regent part of it is not is not applied or then would that system have to be changed again because the regions would be would be part of that too. >> There's no correlation. There's no correlation between the walkthrough tool and whether or not you know the Rochester City School District or any

114school district in the state of New York implements the regents um testing. There's no correlation between them. >> Okay. walkthrough tool is really looking at as Deputy Wright spoke to making sure that standardsbased curriculum is being um implemented in each and every one of our classroom making sure that the resources that our teachers are using are standardsbased but standardsbased standards don't have well they do standards the end testing particularly at the high school level >> will not have an impact on our walkthrough tool. >> Okay. And and and I just want to just end it with this with the with the curriculums that we we currently have with, you know, the in the math and science. Um will we still be having our children um putting them through the AP or the calculus or will

115we try to because to be honest with you, I don't think it's necessary, but I'm just I'm just going to say that. But I think that, you know, um unless they're going to uh into a certain field, I don't think that children if they want to go to that that certain level of math skill set, algebra, I think that they can fall off and go into another, you know, um like a some type of apprenticeship. It doesn't always have to go to the calculus or AP level. I know, and I'm just going to always refer back to when I was in school, we didn't have to go take calculus. we could take two we had two years of science and three years of math back when I was in school and and and and we

116and a lot of people in my era are very successful. So I say that to say why do we have to take the kids all the way up to the AP or the calculus when it's not even really necessary if they're not going into the field of of of um of um engineering or being a doctor or something like that. So, this is just something I'm just putting out there because I see across the board and in some states they're not actually having the children go to that higher level. Um, and we're we're pushing them to do that. That's maybe something down the road that we may need to look at to to reduce to that and not and not force our kids to go into those higher level math not necessary. So, I just

117I just want wanted to put that out there. >> Yeah. Thank you so much for sharing that. I want to make sure that's getting pretty curricular. just those types of questions doesn't mean that they're not important. But um we want to focus more on >> it's if I can just respond real quick. So right now in any school district across America AP calculus classes are not mandatory for every student. They are an option for students. So, as you spoke, when we look at the commissioner's regulation on what students need in order to graduate, it doesn't state that students need to have AP, advanced placement. That is an option that is most certainly and I'm glad that the Rochester City School District makes that option available to those students who are seeking to receive AP credit

118for the purposes of either college admissions or college credit attainment through their successful testing taking of the test. But it's not something that is mandatory and it's not a part of the walkthrough tool. >> Okay. Thank you so much, Dr. Rosser. Are there any other comments about curriculum implementation? Uh, go ahead, Commissioner. >> So, blank here, um, under curriculum implementation, um, is this something that you and your staff, uh, Dr. Roser will come up with or is this something that this board discusses with you in terms of the percentages? Because I'm thinking that by 2028, this would be a higher percentage. I don't know where we are now in terms of >> district approved curriculum as it stands now but and I don't know you all have to tell me if by December 2028 we

119shouldn't have 100% or 90% or something very very high um if we're talking about just the um the um the implementation of it the part of your walkthrough is that we should be seeing u a high percentage uh by 2028 I could be wrong on that, but um are you asking us to are you your staff is going to >> Yeah, we're going to most certainly develop, you know, what these percentages are. Right now, they're they're blank if you want. >> And Commissioner Elliot, just I'll respond as a as a coach if that's okay to that one. But, um the for both the interim goals, which the district will will set, and the interim guard rails, all of those are are the superintendent and superintendent's team. So the board won't um provide any your job

120is to focus on are we setting the right guard rails and then they'll focus on here's where we want to move from um and you can you can assess that as you go but that team will do those both for the interim goals and the interim guardrails. >> Thank you so much. Um any other comments or questions about curriculum implementation interim guardrail? >> Okay. So at this time we'll move on to the third. So this the third one we see that there are two that are there and this is because we're still having some internal conversations about what might we we set as that goal for student placement. What we came up with um and as I mentioned we have not yet landed on either or of these um but we did want to list

121them because we're still um in the process of having conversations internally about them. But the first one reads, "By June 2026, the district will audit, standardize, and centralize student placement criteria and processes to ensure 100% of schools have clear, documented, equity vetted criteria aligned to district standards and which do not include exclusionary practices that are not evidence-based. So that's the first one that we're we're sort of playing around with. One of the things that we have to consider um when it comes to developing the interim guard rails is looking at beyond just one year because these interim guard rails can exist if I'm not mistaken up to three years. So we we most certainly will need to play around with this so that it reflects an interim guard rail that can be measured over three

122years. Any questions related to this first one that we're we're sort of toying around with? >> Just ahead, >> an example of um this I was at this has been years ago now, but I happened to be getting my car fixed and there was a gentleman in there who wanted his child to be placed at school 25. person in placement said, "No, you don't want to put your child in. Put them in 46." >> Now, that was race-based, right? Clearly race-based. And so, you know, that I just shared that because that's the kind of stuff that was going on down in placement that they would put the white kids in some of the areas where they thought that they were doing good. But there was a particular program at 25 school that this family wanted

123their children to be a part of. So, um, I would just throw that out there as an example of what I've experienced. >> Yeah. If I can just speak to that real quick. What's going to be critically important with our work that we we engage in as we transform the Rochester School District is to make sure that every one of our buildings is a building that is offering highquality educational opportunities to all children. So, while that may have been a part of the conversation, we are working to make sure that all of our schools are attractive to all populations of students. >> Thank you. Uh, Commissioner Griffin, >> I appreciate that comment because I think that the school should all be leveled on the same level and every every school should have the opportunities that

124one school has should be at all schools. So, I appreciate that comment. >> I think that kind of Are there any other comments? First of all, um, that lends itself well to, I guess, the next bullet for student placement practices. So by December 2028, representation of historically underserved student groups will be proportional to overall enrollment in the district with no school or program deviating more than five percentage points from district demographic averages. And I'll say real quick that that po that that five percentage points is just an arbitrary number that we just stuck in there. But we still need to do our research to get a better understanding as to how the proportions exist right now. >> Thank you. Um, Commissioner Santiago. >> Yeah, I just want to say that the second one that you

125just uh presented uh connects exactly to what we were speaking about earlier as far as ELLL learners and uh special education students. And so um just want to say I support that one a lot definitely to the conversation that was just had. >> Thank you. Explain this to me in layman's terms. >> So right now >> try to read it. It's not happening. >> So right now there are a number of our schools where we have a disproportionate number of students with exceptionalities. So when we look at certain buildings, certain buildings have a greater number of students with exceptionality classes than other buildings. We want to make sure that when it comes to all of our student populations that there's a fair equitable representation of our student demographics across all of our buildings. So this

126is what that particular guardrail speaks >> specifically to the students not necessarily programs per se because there are differences in programs throughout our schools. So if you look like a Edison program for example or school of the arts for example they have different kind of offerings but this is in regards to the >> student population. So when we talk about our L students, when we talk about our students of color, when we talk about our our students with exceptionalities, when we talk about our multilingual learners, you know, we want to make sure that as and I hate this term that the state uses, that our subgroups, I hate using the word sub because nobody's a sub. >> Our our our groups of students are fairly represented throughout all of our buildings in an equitable manner.

127>> Okay. And and I do think that um part of that may also be considering um that you have to take into consideration where our parents want to have our students. So and that also may need to be taken into consideration. Well, not necessarily because if we're working to make sure that every building has a high quality educational opportunity for all all of our children, then it's not necessarily where parents may want the children. Because right now, parents, from my understanding, are requesting schools in which they feel that their children have a better opportunity with receiving a high quality education. >> Right. But once we equalize all of our schools, then my belief and what I've seen um particularly in Buffalo, New York, is that there then is a high premium on each of our

128schools where our parents are seeking to get their children in. And it may be based upon the programming >> and it may be based upon how we have made sure that that school is a school of choice. >> Thank you so much, Dr. balance that and I'm looking at the term, you know, uh, equity is what I'm >> excuse me, Commissioner Elliot. Uh, I would just ask if you could speak more into the mic. It's a little challenging to hear you on a recording. Thank you. >> Yeah, I just that trying to balance that term equity with what um um this particular bullet point is representing. So, I may be a little slow on it, but I'll study it more. >> Thank you so much. I have a quick question just for our um coaches.

129As I look at what we've reviewed so far, um you know, we have interim guard rails. Well, we we're still on guardrail number one. Right. And I see one, two, three. So, we have four interim guard rails that have been produced before, >> right? >> It will ultimately be three. And I think >> Okay. Part of the part of the conversation here I think which is important is to kind of hear u one hear the board's feedback but also have board members really reflect on does is are we going down the path and remember we said this is we're going to word smith it and do other things and make them smart goals but are we going down the path of what we might envision for each of the guardrails fully expect that I think

130some of the some of the language will be be tweaked and and clarified. Okay, thank you so much. Um, any other questions regarding the student placement practices at this time? All right. Um, I guess we can move on to our board guardrail number two. >> Okay. So, I'm going to read the guardrail first and then I'll speak to the two um interim guard rails. Um, the guardrail reads, "The superintendent will not allow conditions that compromise the psychological or physical safety of students or staff." So, our first guard rail centers around proactive safety system compliance and it reads the percentage of school facilities completing all required safety protocols such as fire drills, lockdown drills, safety audits, mental health screenings, threat assessments should be on schedule and will remain at 100% from December 2025 to December 2028.

131And >> before we ask questions, can you go to maybe the staff and student safety perception as well? And then we'll just save our questions for um after we've made it. >> Most certainly. Yeah. >> So staff and student safety perception of course you know you have your quantitative data and then you also have your anidotal or your qualitative data. And the staff and safety student safety perception speaks more so to the qualitative. Um the percentage of elementary students who report worrying about safety always or usually at schools will decrease from 40% in January 2025 to a particular percent um by January 2029. We do currently offer a um school climate survey in the district that is administered um every January and we're looking to use that as um our our survey to be able

132to measure staff and student safety perception. >> And it looks like it says many climate surveys administered quarterly as well. Um, and if we were to click on that baseline data, is there data there for the public yet or >> I believe this is data from the last survey? >> Okay, >> that was administered this past January. >> Okay, >> and just to clarify, we took a we took a look at the data. Um, I just want to mention that um it is quantifiable. So, um, mentioned qualitative data is qualitative questions, but it's quantifiable data on how students will perform. So you as a board will be able to see whether there's progress on that quantifiable data. >> Thank you for that clarity, Dr. Hart. >> Thank you so much. This is just a you

133know I teach sociology as one of my courses and I'm just teaching qualitative versus quantitative to all of my students and I'm actually using it now for the f really the first time um in this sense. All right, some questions. Um Commissioner Santiago, go ahead. Yeah, I'm just wondering uh within the two ins that you have provided and specifically for the second one um the the guardrail is uh students and staff. Um and so I'm just wondering how does any of the the two guard rail connect back to staff specifically? I do see student, you know, students inside of the wording, but specifically for staff also. Dr. Wright, can you help me with this? And I think it may just be the Are you asking about the percentage of elementary students who report? >> And

134it speaks to staff and student perception. Is that what you're asking? >> Either of the two, but ju just to make it clear. So for for board guardrail 2, the guardrail is the superintendent will not allow conditions that compromise the psychological or physical safety of staff or students. and students. And so my my question is um how does any of the two interim guard rails that you've given connect specifically to staff? I see in here where it says students, you know, how this can connect back to students, but how does it connect back to staff as far as that garden? >> Yeah, on the second one, I can speak more specifically. The annual survey, the school climate survey, actually seeks to get that information from student, staff, and parents. So, the perception data that we

135would be seeking for the second bullet, and I'm looking to see that we might need to um update the language because the language says the percentage of elementary school students, but we probably need to update that to read the percentage of elementary students and staff who report worrying about safety um so that there's clarity there. But the the >> school climate survey currently captures information from students, staff, and parents at the elementary level. >> Last question. Do we have anything specifically for measuring secondary level also because elementary is important, but how do we um ensure that we're looking at all of our students inside the district besides just elementary? >> It's the same. Yeah, same the same survey has elementary, I think, middle and high. >> Okay. Um, >> so maybe just switching the wording

136in there just to say all students because in here it just seems like specifically elementary. >> Yeah. >> Why we chose elementary? Was that just an oversight? >> Okay. >> Um, and the other thing that I would add for the board, if it's okay if we make just make this switch for you, uh, rather than students or staff, uh, just make it students and staff. We can word smith that for you if you all agree. uh we don't have to have a formal anything but that way it would cover for you that that guardrail has to cover students and staff not or staff. >> Thank you Dr. Hart. Um other commissioners um would you like to comment? Uh Commissioner Elliot >> the the other piece that we've seen around safety is we've seen parents come

137in uh with altercations either with students or other parents. And so um I'll just point that out. There's got to be a way in which that we can protect our students from other parents that come in. Um parents who may be um having altercations with with each other from you know the community. So I don't know. I I'm just throwing that out there because um there has to be those kinds of of safety measures um as well. you know, we've seen, for example, some altercations at graduations um between parents and others. And so, I just wanted to lift that up that in some ways we've got to, you know, protect in some certain instances the community from our students and um we've got to include that in there somewhere. So that would be part of

138our tactical um strategy on making sure that we are working to meet this goal is to make sure that those actions, those preventative things that we're putting into place will most certainly guarantee that we meet these goals. Thank you, >> Commissioner Elliott. Um, just Commissioner Elliott as well, just one of the things if you go back to um, all of this, by the way, just so you'll know, is grounded in the document that we share with you where we kind of laid out the color-coded kind of sets of things. Um, and there's a guardrails page. One of the things on that guard rail guardrails page talks about does the superintendent and his staff have the ability to control at least 80% of whatever guard rail you set as a board. Meaning that the bulk of

139whatever that thing is the superintendent has and their staff can control that that issue. Um I think as the superintendent shared it's an important issue. Um, but it's one of those things that we would ask the board to go back and revisit. Does the superintendent really have control over 80% of what of how parents interact uh with each other? There might be things that you can do on the back end, but in terms of preventative uh that might be a challenge. So, those are that's just something to think about as well. >> Yeah, I mean I I agree with that that there'll be a challenge. It'll be a challenge, but in some ways, I think we've got just for the safety of people. You know, we've got to make sure that we respond to that

140in some way. I'm not exactly sure how that is, but there's got to be some way that we respond to it. I remember years ago um when we had um uh Van White was uh on this board for a long time, but he also defended um a student that was killed on campus. I think it was at Jefferson if I'm not mistaken. So >> that comes up a lot for me that um you know that can happen again if we don't in some way put something in place. I don't I don't and I'm not sure what that is. I do know one of the things that I would do when I would go to graduations I've said to the parents we're not taking this foolishness or we can stop the graduation. You've got to make

141sure when you come in here that you respond right. This is for our students, you know. So, you can't be just being foolish and and and having these kinds of altercations. I would say that from the from the um podium. So, that's what I would do. Um but some kind of way we've got to help to protect our families and uh students um from that. And that's just one example of um safety issues. Commissioner Elliot, thank you so much for that insight. Um, are there other commissioners who'd like to comment at this time? >> We good. >> All right. I think that we can go on to board uh guardrail number three. >> Okay. So, board guardrail number three says, "The superintendent will not exclude the voices of stakeholders impacted by major district decisions." So

142the two interim guard rails that the team and I have drafted um are as follows and they'll need to be word smith of course 100% of district recognized parent groups report being informed about and having opportunities to provide input on major decision district decisions between December 2025th and December 2028. So, one of the things that we played off of that's currently in place um is the fact that when it comes to our policies, our policies are surfaced through our parent groups. And we were planning to do the same sort of opportunities particularly around budgeting, particularly around other major um district decisions to make sure that the groups that we currently have access to um are are a major part of parent engagement and major decision-making. The second one, stakeholder input integration. the percentage of all

143major district decisions where documented stakeholder input was collected, analyzed, and explicitly addressed and the final decision rationale will increase from a certain percentage from December 2025 to December 2028. And this we found that it is important that as we are engaging our stakeholders that we also engage in the process of documenting their engagement or their input so that there's evidence that speaks to our stakeholder input. >> Thank you. And I'll just start with one quick question. Um just for the stakeholder input integration really it applies for the parent engagement one. Can you talk about what that means overall structure for data? Can you talk about what that means overall structure for data? >> So what we are still we're still having conversations around that. >> So you we just developed these was it earlier this

144week? Yeah it was earlier this week and you know so some of this is still as I mentioned earlier um a working document. So, we haven't necessarily talked explicitly about how some of these things, what tools will we use in order to be able to capture this data. >> Okay. Thank you very much. Um, looks like I see some hands. Commissioner Griffin, go ahead. >> When collecting the data, um, this is just a a suggestion. Um, because sometimes you don't get the the numbers you're looking for when you're collecting the data. At this time, we have a lot of sporting events that are going on. I it would probably behoove some members of the district to be there to engage with the parents that are at this at these games and probably get some surveys

145from the people that you actually are not may not see or may not, you know, that is just one of one of the big ways to to get get the surveys or get the um the data that you need. Um, that's just that's just a suggestion, but it's a very good one because you get a lot of them out at like the cheerleading events or the the sporting events. So, those are the things you might want to tap into um in the city to see if you can get some of that that data that you're looking for. That's just a suggestion. >> Sorry about that. Um, thank you, Commissioner Griffin. Um, are there any other comments or questions at this time? >> Yes, I have one and and this is to um our um colleagues

146from Council of Great City Schools. What comes to mind um to me is uh and I don't know if this fits in there is uh measuring confidence confidence um because I think that that's going to drive um um increased enrollment um how do we and it's just sort of something that u came to mind as we're as particularly with this particular um guard rail Uh is that is that measurable and should we be looking at something like confidence um in the sense of how that can in in my mind increase um enrollment increase people's um uh positive um experience and positive view of our district. Um, and I know a lot of that is going to depend on how we and it I I believe it's going to take a long time for us to

147gain the kind of confidence that I would envision us having in in this district. But is there a way um in which um we can and maybe it has to do with ensuring that we put these particular programs in place and people begin to talk about how well those those um um programs are. Now, on the flip side of that, I think the lack of confidence comes in when they see a board that's not working together well, when they see low academic achievement, when parents are not welcomed into our district and that kind of thing. So, I don't know if I'm off or not, but um if if if that could be spoken to in a way, and I don't know if that could be a part of a guard rail or where that would

148go. I'm not exactly sure, but um uh I it we've got to stop him hemorrhaging u students who are going to charter schools um and keeping our more than hund00 million within this district. So that's I I sort of bring that up. I don't know where I'm going to go where that can go. Uh but I think that um that's something that has to be looked at uh in terms of um you know goals and guard rails and and the like. >> So I think um and thank you for sharing that. I think it's a it's a board's prerogative. But again going back to the guardrail itself um if you feel like and if the board collectively feels like that guardrail is not capturing um what you intended when you created created this language uh

149then as a board you want to um tweak the language to make sure that the the district is interpreting the lang the guardrail in a way that you would see fit as you see the measures that they put forth. >> Yeah, I think the level of confidence is an can be an asset, >> right? But that would be something that you would have to as a board you have to change the guard rail uh to reflect what it is you're specifically looking for. >> Thank you. Uh Commissioner Griffin. >> Um I just want to say this um and as a whole with a confidence. I think you build on a ch child's confidence. Um one is literacy. Literacy is a big thing that that that brings down one's confidence. I know if I was wasn't

150able to read, I don't know what I would do. So that's one aspect that I think that we are building on that we're that's our number one goal to achieve which will help in confidence. Um but we when we're talking about the kids in the charter school I also want to reflect on the urban suburban as well. I think that once we build our schools up one of the areas of concern is our kids going to the urban suburban and that's a cost effect too and it also affects the transportation. So for me and when we talk about the kids being divided out and money being spent, we also need to look at the urban suburban how they taking our best children and moving them out to and taking them from our district and and

151they're strategically doing that as well. So, um I think as a whole once we get our district on a level ground and a level playing field with everything that we need and that's everything athletics and academics that we will see an influx and we can we can stop we can stop have a moratorum on the urban suburban and stop that and keep our kids in our district and some of our best kids. So, I think that's that's something that we need to address as well. Thank you. >> Thank you, Commissioner Griffin for expressing uh those thoughts. Uh, Commissioner Santiago. >> Yeah, I just I want to also propose, you know, the the conversation of of our enrollment. Um, whether that is through a guard me, a guard rail or another goal possibly. Um, and if

152it's a guard rail, possibly saying that the superintendent shall not uh do actions that reduces the confidential not confidentiality, the confidence of our parents and students slash community. Um, that's an idea for guard rails or possibly for goals to have to set out goals for uh our enrollment. Um, and I think that that will that that will be one of our priorities and that will set the administration to focus on how do we improve these certain areas to either not lose uh more students enrollment and gain students back or for this guard rail, how do we put things in place to ensure that our our parents and our students aren't losing confidence in our district and we're losing more students. And so I think for the board that might be something to consider, either adding

153a another guard rail or uh adding a goal to our our goals. >> And Dr. Hart, can you just speak perhaps to the Thank you so much by the way, Commissioner Santiago. Dr. Hart, can you speak possibly to just um like we came up with three board guard rails and now we have interim guardrails that are being set by the superintendent. Um the normal number of guardrails is re recommended between one and five was it or >> between one and five. >> Okay. >> Um and so we came up with the three guard rails. I guess what I'm trying to get a sense of is if the board is satisfied with having these three board guard rails or is there a need to add more? At this point, >> I'm okay with it. I'm sorry.

154You got to call on somebody else. Go ahead. >> Commissioner Patterson, >> I'm okay with any recommendation made by the Council of Great City Schools are trying to help us to be a more functional board and I'm just going to stay positive. I think that the guy uh the guard rails that we have so far are um specific and uh I think they're well written. We agreed on these and I don't see any reason that we should be adding or deleting from what we have. Maybe manipulating a little bit as far as word verbiage. Yes, I'm okay with that. But I think we've done a good job. I think they've got a done a good job and helping us to getting to the point to where we are today. Uh so I'm just going to

155stop there. >> Thank you, Commissioner Patterson. And just to that point, if I can ask our coaches too, um, guard rails are ever evolving, correct? Like that we have the opportunity to set new guard rails at some point or are these typically going to last us five years or >> do you see other boards changing guard rails, you know, you know, a year or two in? Are these something that can change over time? >> You want to take it or you want me to take it? Um no guardrails similar to your goals. What we say about guardrails is anywhere from one to three years. You want to keep them consistent. So keep them consistent for the next three years unless um unless you feel like uh I'll take uh one for example the uh maybe

156the parent one. If you feel like okay we're consistently doing that well u we're consistently seeing engagement from our community, our parents, our stakeholders. uh we don't need to continue to monitor that guardrail because we see that it's consistently happening. So uh there are things that you can sunset um you can and add another guardrail at that point. Uh but typically you want to stick to it for the same reason you want to stick to the goals. What you want to do is help the district focus on the critical issues that you think are important for the for the district so that you're not as a board consistently changing. Same for your goals. You don't want to consistently change goals every year because what you're going to do is have the district going in different

157directions every year. So, uh once you set them, you want to stick stick to them. >> Was more like interesting followup to what Commissioner um Santiago had mentioned. And so, I'm going to just um he had a followup, I believe, or do you down there first? Okay. I just wanted to say to um Commissioner Santi, I understand your point, but I think as we work through these go is work through the um guard rails, I believe that that will all come to fruition. I I is reference to, you know, the the um in reference to what you're stating, I think that we don't need to add to it, but we will see a difference once we accomplish the goals in in the in how the respect level is with the children, the parents, what have

158you. So, I think that that that was that would um that's going to that's going to work out itself in my opinion, but I do understand what you're saying. >> Thank you, Commissioner Griffin. Um Commissioner Santiago. >> Yeah, I just think that it's an important thing to the to the board in the district right now. And I don't know if that's um adding a guardrail, adding a goal, or you know, possibly even editing this final guard rail to possibly add that in. Um but I do think that it's an important thing that we talk about, you know, on a daily on a month, not monthly, meeting basis, you know, it's often spoken about and so I think that is something that is a priority. Um, and of course, I know that our superintendent and their

159team is is they also take this as a priority, but like the the school board members said earlier, what the board focuses on gives, you know, our our administration more fuel to also focus on. And so that's why I made that proposal. I do think it'll be important, but um yeah, that's just my my ideas and my thoughts at the moment. Thank you. >> Thank you so much. And Cindy, I know you had something to share. >> No, I I the only thing I was going to say is that and it would need to be um there would need to be a majority of the board deciding that. But um we could attempt to uh add something into this third guard rail that could address that. Um it might take some word smithing. Right now

160there's two interim goals for that. So perhaps a third interim goal something in a way that a third interim goal could somehow I don't have I have no idea what that would be or what that would look like. Um, but we could if the board wanted to entertain that, we would we could try it. >> That's what I mean. The the board would Well, so the language in the guard rail would change to address um to have an addition of something about public confidence or something like that. That's is that what I heard? >> Yep. >> Can you just rephrase um what you had asked for? >> Yeah. I for guardrail specifically, the reason why I said public confidence is because it it makes the most sense for guardrail. If it was a goal, it

161will be, you know, to to lose less students to, you know, charter schools, urban, suburban, etc. Um but confidence as far as public confidence trust um is really meaning that a lot of times the reason why you know parents and students are leaving is because of their confidence and their trust >> in the district and lack of it. And so, um, that's the reason why I use that word is to, you know, that's the intention behind it. That's what we're talking about here about the intentions. >> And, and I think too that, um, go ahead >> that, um, because I throw it out there, but I'm I'm respectful of what has been done already. Uh, but that that has come to mind. And so, what I'm thinking is that if we are meeting our goals

162and implementing uh, these guard rails, that confidence may come. But I want us to keep that in the forefront of our mind because that really is what we need to be looking at because that's going to determine a whole lot of things. Increased enrollment, um um graduation rates, academic achievement, that's going to and you know some some person I think we years ago had a high of 37,000 students at one point >> and then they began to uh to leave. And here here's the other thing. Our parents didn't care where they sent their kids. They didn't care. I mean, it it some of the charter schools don't perform as well as we we uh our district performs higher, but they did not want the name of the Rochester City School District because of its reputation.

163So that's what I want us to help to change that um that that perception and so that it increases you know um enrollment and and uh we could decrease the charter schools. >> Thank you so much for those comments. >> So one thing um as well so a next step of the process and this might be another way to to handle that suggestion as well. Another set of the the next step in the process will be our working with you all to set board guard rails. Um and so you'll set guard rails for the for the board, meaning here are the things that we are going here's the values that we're going to have. Here's the things that we're going to live by. One of the things that you could do um in the go

164in the board setting um about guardrails process is establish a similar guard rail around confidence that now becomes a governance guard rail that would not only be the superintendent and their team but the superintendent and the board collectively. Um and that guardrail might empower all of you to say it's all of our responsibility to address u the confidence uh within the district and then we'll measure ourselves collectively around what that looks like. Does that make sense? >> It does. >> Thank you. Um okay. >> So at this time I think she uh clerk do we need to advance this particular document? We don't advance the interim guard uh guardrails. We're advancing the other document. >> Correct. So, um there were two documents attached to board document that you all received. The first one um is

165title RCSD guard rails where the first half reviews the three guard rails that you discussed tonight. The second half you did not talk about yet, but they were the board guard rails that you developed in a retreat a couple months ago. Um that is what the board would um have to vote on. You do not vote on the interims. Um, that was just more for discussion. So, I don't know if you all are ready to move this to the business meeting for a vote or maybe perhaps move it to the business meeting for further discussion. Um, either would be an option. Your business meeting is on October 30th. >> Okay. U Commissioner Santiago, >> I think it might be good to add it for discussion because it sounds like we've made some agreements that some

166things have to be changed like specifically where it says uh students or you know uh staff. So I think move it to another discussion where we can see the final and how it will look. >> How are other commissioners feeling about that? >> And this is for you're talking about the guard the the three guard rails that you we just talked about right now, >> right? Because there's still some things that we have to edit from the discussion today. And then even for the board guard rails, if that is a discussion about adding something, I think that it would be good to bring it uh to then. And I think we also can have more representation at the same time in that discussion instead of voting for it tonight. >> Yeah, >> they've already recommended

167some changes. I'm okay with those changes. I'm ready to vote on the section we just talked about tonight. >> Well, we wouldn't be voting on it tonight. It would be just moved to the board meeting to we'd motion it the board business meeting where we would vote on it. >> Um, anyone else? Commissioner Griff to motion it to the next meeting. You said you want to just motion. That's all you we're doing today. We're not voting. Correct. >> Do we need to motion it? Even if >> Okay. Yes, I'm fine with that. >> Yep. >> Sorry. >> Um that would just be for further discussion. Clerkwote. >> If you want to vote on it, you would motion it to the business meeting for the vote. >> If you just want to discuss it, we can

168place it on your business meeting agenda for further conversation. In the meantime, I can work with the CGCS coaches to get a most updated version um prior to the meeting so that everyone can have that language and be prepared for the discussion. >> And just to ensure that we have like full board participation, we do have two members that are not here currently. Um and so I respect that some of us might want to go ahead and vote on it this evening. um it might behoove us to put that on the board business meeting agenda so that we can have any further discussion or changes discussed then. >> Okay. So what so this would be around the guard rails the three guard rails. Make sure that they are worded as you will as you would

169adopt them. Um just reminder again that you don't vote for the um interim guard rails and those will um they're still working through those things. Um and then are we talking yet about the board's guardrails for the board? >> We haven't yet had that discussion. >> Okay. >> So I guess do we need to move the discussion then to the board guard rails? >> Yes. You can talk about the remainder the updates to the superintendent guardrails as well as the board guardrails at your business meeting if that's your >> the business meeting. Okay. Although we haven't had that discussion about the guardrails for the board this evening yet, >> right? You can well well it's 8:30 so it would be totally up to you all if you want to stay and continue that conversation. Um

170but if you do not both of those things can be picked up in your business meeting. >> Okay. Is that amendable to um other members for this evening? because it is already um 8:30 and we have not yet discussed on that other document the RCSD guardrails for the board. Would you like to put that on the agenda for the business meeting so that we can have a a more thorough discussion then? >> I support that. >> I support that as well. Sorry. >> Is everyone else okay with with that? >> Okay. Without further discussion, it looks like >> All right. Is there anything else that we need to discuss this evening? Any other comments? >> I just want to clarify one thing as we move forward. So, first of all, thank you all again for

171a wonderful evening of discussion um questions and suggestions. The one of the things I want to reiterate as we go through this process is what the board is doing now is the board is saying here are our expectations for the superintendent and the team but primarily for the superintendent which is your employee um around goals for what students should know and be able to do and guard rails that honor the values of the district. How the superintendent accomplishes those is up to the superintendent and his team. So, I want to make sure that that's that's clear that once these are established, the board will say, "We're going to hold you accountable for accomplishing these, but how they go about doing it, how they go about measuring it, how they go about making sure that it

172occurs is up to the superintendent, their team." So, I just want to make sure just kind of reiterate that in your minds as we go through the process. So, thank you all for having us. >> Thank you. And thank you so much for your time this evening. Thank you for having our invited guests earlier. I know that was really valuable to hear from other districts and larger districts than our own where this model is certainly um coming to fruition and gives us something to look forward to. Um so I want to thank my peers for the robust conversation this evening. Can I get a motion uh to adjurnn? >> Motion. >> So it looks like it was motioned by Commissioner Santiago, seconded by Commissioner Griffin. All in favor? I I have a great night everyone.

173Thank you.