001[Music] I call the meeting of the Cleveland Heights University Heights City Schools to order. Mr. Gainer, would you call the role? Mr. Cobalt, here. Miss Pepper here. Mr. Register here. Mr. Silverman. Oh, yeah. Mr. Zooker here. [Music] Okay, then uh this is a work session, but we have a couple of business items that we need to take care of. So, all of those who are raring to get into the work session, hold your horses. Uh the first thing that we want to do is we have a resolution authorizing the purchase and sale of the Milicanin property. And so, we want to deal with that. First thing on the list, the board members have a copy of the resolution in their possession. And I would uh ask for a motion to approve the resolution. So moved.
002Second. Okay. Any discussion? Questions? Mr. Gayner? No, no, no. I was raising my hand. I I think Mr. Gainner has Oh, he's I'd be prepared to say something. Sure. No, I I'll just give you a a very high level um overview of what the terms are. here. Um, this was this was uh an email that was sent by your legal counsel and um which is Kathy Petri, but also we have Dana Weiss with us tonight um from Square Pats in case you have any further questions that we need uh we need to ask. But, uh, as Kathy mentions here, um, to review, the purchase agreement provides for a cash sale of the property site for the Milicanin building at a price of $650,000. The stables property is not included in the sale. Just so that's
003made very clear, the purchaser will be responsible, the purchaser being Moss, for any closing costs, including any title work and escro fees. The agreement is subject to several contingencies for the board. The agreement is subject to its obtaining an easement from the stables property to severance circle. It is also subject to the district obtaining appropriate al alternative space for its workers and trades people. For Moss, the agreement is subject to its obtaining a conditional use permit uh from the city for the use of the property as a nonpublic school and also it is conditional uh in terms of them obtaining financing on satisfactory terms from the city. So that's the uh in a nutshell the the basis for the proposal and the the uh resolution that you have before you tonight along with a whole
004lot of legal ease on top of that. I don't have a question somebody has questions first. Well, as I have a question, and my question is maybe not completely wellformed, but would we be looking at uh another resolution to actually approve the sale document at some point? I'll defer to Mr. Shagalas on that point once the conditions are met. Is that your Yeah, there will be a second resolution. So, I'm getting the nod from our legal counsel in the audience. So, yes. Well, she can speak here. So, this so this is this is is allowing us to um effectuate the terms and then there will be uh another resolution that will come before you too. Yeah, that's absolutely correct. There are some conditions that need to be satisfied and assuming those are satisfied once they're
005satisfied the sale agreement will be consummated. Thank you. Thanks D. Do we have any sense of how long it would take us to negotiate all these ter all these conditions? the Yeah, the agreement I believe this agreement that you're authorizing tonight has 120 days 120 days to complete all the necessary transactions. Okay. Was going to say you call my place. Where you going? All right. Um at the assuming the resolution goes forward, I have some ideas for the disposition of the proceeds that we can introduce at the next meeting. Yes, that's good. Okay. Assuming it passes. Yeah, I'm looking forward to that. I think that's going to be a lively discussion for us. Uh Mr. Yeah, I I I thought this through a lot because um as I was reflecting on this, this everyone who
006who's followed this at all knows it's been a very longunning issue. It actually began before I got on the school board 9 years ago. So that's how long it has been going. And it's and throughout that time period, it's been polarizing. Um I think we've all heard people say that we should have sold it long ago. We've heard people say we should never sell it and some say that we're doing just the right thing. So I mean we've heard it all. Um but there have been many good reasons for giving this issue such careful consideration over the years. Um first of all the stables of land were actually deed to the school district by the severance Milican family. I have that right now. Uh which is in my mind is a clear magnanimous and unambiguous
007statement of the important city leaders of the time period felt about the role of public education in the master planning and future of the city. Uh they and I just talk about supporting your schools. I think that was a great way to show it. Um, shrinking the number two, shrinking the physical footprint of the district should never be decided upon capriciously. And number three, the privatization of public land is a decision that should always be given careful thought. In this regard, I'm proud of my colleagues, both the ones who are sitting here tonight and and and the ones I've served with in the past, for the depth of thought and gravity they've shown this issue throughout these years. this this school board those school boards have always in every single instance acted in good faith.
008They over the years we've offered creative solutions. One of the more recent ideas was we offered a what amounted to a 50-year lease at a dollar per year with the only salient stipulation being that the lei would invest in improvements to the building that they would need anyway in order to bring the building to their usable level. So, what's different now from my perspective is that the city of Cleveland Heights, despite the difficult economic times, has offered to provide financing for this private entity. From this action, I can only conclude that a city officials feel that the completion of this deal is a critical component to achieving some master plan they have for the city. That Milickin is a key piece in their master plan puzzle. So, my feeling is that if the board does
009decide to approve this deal, it will be in part in a show of goodwill to the city of Cleveland Heights. And so, I hope that they and all of you will remember this spirit and this gesture as we all work together in the future. Thank you. Anybody else want to make a comment or question? Okay. You want to say something? I hadn't really prepared anything, but I guess what I would say is that what you'll all hear in a moment that I will be voting to support this. Um, but my reason being that I think that for the community um and for the district, it's the right decision. And I believe that having having that building be used for um education um and not be vacant or partially vacant any longer is a is a
010is an excellent thing. So I um I will be supporting the sale of the property and I agree Cal this has been something that we've worked on a lot. We've spent a lot of hours on. we've spent a lot of um energy on and um I hope that this goes forward. I honestly don't know um because we don't know how everyone's going to come um out with the vote tonight, but I hope that it does. I would also uh echo in terms of just the the gratitude to everyone on the staff who has worked long and hard over as you say not just my tenure on this board but over the years well before that and everybody who has been involved uh in keep coming back to the table, keep coming back to the table,
011keep coming back to the table to see if we can find some way forward and uh that took uh some courage and perseverance and patience and I'm grateful for everybody who took part in that. Okay, great. Well, I've been with this from the beginning and I think it's I think it's great that uh we're at a point now that we are wrapping up our the sale and I think to me us holding on to those stables was really a key thing that we wanted to get done from the standpoint of the usability involved in those uh stables. So, I think it is a win-win, and I think uh we all should be uh very happy. I think it's a uh uh it's important to the community. I think N's idea that we're keeping it as
012a school is really important. And the idea that we have some land there, that's key for us in terms of us having some flexibility in terms of the choices that we make as we undergo this uh big u uh facilities project. So, I think it's a just a a really good day and a really good um deal for us. So, I'm real happy about it. And I think Dana might have a thing or two that she'd like to say. Yeah. I just want to clarify what I said earlier because while everyone was talking, I thought I'd go back to the agreement and double check because it can happen either way. And I thought it was set up one way. There will not be another resolution for the sale. The way the agreement works is that
013the sale will be complete as long as all of the conditions are met within the 120 days the sale proceeds. I just wanted it would just be administrative detail. Administrative detail, but I thought you should know that before the vote. Okay, that's fine. Thanks. Good to know. Anything else? Okay, Mr. Gainer. Mr. Cobalt, yes. Miss Pepper, yes. Mr. Register, yes. Mr. Silverman, abstain. Mr. Zooker, yes. Okay, the resolution passes. And I I think um I must say that we are are not prepared to have a further conversation on how to best use the proceeds. We all know that we will be using it to uh participate in some capital project related that's of significance for us and hopefully it can be leveraged to uh make some things happen that are really um necessary as far
014as the facilities uh project is concerned. So let's move on. Um we have item C 1 through five. I believe we can take those together. I'll accept a motion. These are all personnel items. I'll accept a motion to approve those items. So move. Second. Any uh discussion? Dr. Mr. Dixon, is there anything here that we need to you need to address? No. And we have Mr. Lombardo. If we have any questions, he's here to address them if we have. Does anybody have any questions? Okay. Mr. Gainer, would you call the role? Miss Pepper? Yes. Mr. Register? Yes. Mr. Silverman? Yes. Mr. Zucker? Yes. Mr. Kovville? Yes. Okay. The purpose of this meeting tonight is um our normal monthly meeting to discuss facilities and tonight we're actually um moving along and we actually look at some
015uh schematic design um ideas and I think we're continuing in the phase. But anyway, there's a lot of progress has has been made since our last meeting and uh I think Mr. Mr. Shaggalas is prepared to have our team come forward and and and and share with us the progress that has been made. And I just want to note that we agreed that we would have an opportunity at the end of this presentation for members of the audience to um to speak up and given five minutes per person. Uh we might be here for a little while. I think we've got uh somewhere in the teens already signed up. And um so we we're going to uh encourage people to stay to their time, be succinct, you know, and we do it u Mr. Gain
016will keep time and he will he you can he will give you a signal when it's time cuz I can't actually see him. Um and so what's happening is that the people who did sign up, uh Mr. Shaggalis has that list and he's going to call the names. When you your name is called, your clock starts. So be ready. And and just to be clear, Ron, unless unless anyone wants to disagree with me, the the I'm assuming that everybody who signed up to speak is here to speak about the facilities and schematic design. This is not a regular schoolboard meeting. the just the cover. So the at the regular meeting um you can if if you've signed up for something other than that, please wait till the regular meeting because this is a little bit
017of a different thing that we've done allowing this public comment as part of the facilities process. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Register. So very quickly uh just a couple of quick introductions. On the end is um uh John Orsini from BSHM Architects and he's going to be leading the primary uh presentation tonight. Next to him is Amy Euro is back with us this evening and Amy is from Brain Spaces and she helped us throughout the uh developing the pro uh program of requirements phase of the work and many of you in this room I'm sure are familiar with with Amy and have worked with her. Um, we also have uh Fred Rogers from the Ozanne Gilbane team is here and um sitting in and pinch hitting for Steve Zenon who is vacationing this evening is Pat
018O'Brien from PMC uh as representing the owners rep team. So um so that's who's here. I I would say very quickly that this is a work in progress and um so these are not uh finished plans in any way, shape or form. Um we will be coming back again for another meeting in September which we'll take another look where we've done further development had further input further discussions. So uh it's wonderful that we have such a large audience tonight and so many individuals who want to speak on this. This kind of feedback is exactly what this meeting is designed for and what and uh and is important for us to hear. So with that I will turn it over to John and let him take us through the presentation. and then we'll have some discussion
019with board members then we'll turn to the uh to the audience. Thank you. Uh just so everybody is uh familiar with the process uh we met about uh a month ago here and uh since that time we met with the cabinet, the board as well as all the user groups to discuss the plans as they currently stand. Um plans uh develop after each meeting. So there's modifications based on comments from all users and all groups. Um in regards to sort of the direction of the project, there were some key things that you know that we just want to reiterate. One is to uh renovate and repurpose the 1926 wings and to maintain as much of the integrity of that part of the building as possible as well as other areas like the auditorium. Uh so
020with with that being said, um there were some modifications made to the plans after our discussions. most occurred on the second and third floor. Uh they were a result of uh sort of comments from from board from cabinet and from uh from the user groups. So So we'll we'll start by uh looking at what we're calling the Washington level. And and John, before you go through, I I just want to acknowledge one thing for the sake of the audience. I recognize that and I apologize for the fact that it is very difficult to see these plans from that screen and I've already noted that with our IT department and for the September meeting we will have a larger screen that make will make it much easier for viewers to see even if you don't have
021a copy of this. So um I apologize for that. But they have the handout they there are a bunch of handouts out there. So um I did not anticipate as many. So I'm sure that we're short a few but okay. Um okay so the the the uh the Washington level is is is uh it's developed over the discussions with all the user groups like we had said for the most part it's very similar in plan to what we saw last month when we were here. uh you know it still contains all of the um major PE spaces as well as uh the CTE uh auto and high bay spaces. There are a couple uh cosmetology as well as um some of the uh sound and performing arts are also located on this level. When we
022uh go up to the wash the cedar level which is the first floor. This is pretty much um as we had discussed last time. Cedar uh as we could see the the color sort of represent um you know sort of program areas. We still maintained the idea of conferencing center near the east entrance as well as administration. As you go along the street that runs horizontal on the page, you have all major spaces off of that media as well as student commons. Uh in the center is the existing auditorium. And then as you go to the west towards the stadium is where we have the overlooks into the main competition gym. Uh also in this part of the building in 1926 is where we have the uh special education u because of needs for access
023to that building. Uh when we when we go north onto the north in the building, we have really a a wing of um music and vocal arts that includes um to the far uh to the far left is our band room, you know, a jazz room and an orchestra room as well as associated spaces across the hall from that. This also allows access into the uh seating area for the natiatorum. To the right of the north corridor is uh some of the CTE the the culinary as well as a classroom. And something that we've been uh discussing within uh the board and the cabinet was uh sort of a mini auditorium. So what happens on this floor is there's a lot of assembly, there's community use as well as use of students. So this is
024a floor that uh everybody everybody could use and gather in. The other the other advantage to this floor is that all major spaces are located off of sort of a central corridor. So when things are happening within the building, it allows the school or the any user groups to to utilize rooms like student commons for gatherings after activities. As we uh proceed up to the second floor, this is where some modifications have been made. uh we had discussions with uh the the the user groups and this is really academic core space that we're talking about on these floors as well as CTE. What ended up happening was we talked about clusters of classrooms. We also talked about the idea of potentially science being uh located together. So we'll talk a little bit about that. Um
025we have uh in the in the south part of the building in the 1926 wing we really have a lot of academic space as well as science. Each each wing has the ability to have interdisciplinary uh activities going on with the use of project labs as well as um relationships between classroom spaces. Uh and that's sort of the idea behind behind the cluster. Um when we get to the center of the building, as we had said in the last meeting, you know, a lot of this focuses on the tower as being central central to the plan. Yes, sir. Can I ask a favor? Yeah. Um we don't have a pointer, so they may not Well, or or you can point out those colors or Okay. Some I don't know if people really know where we
026are. Hang on. We may have a pointer here. Oh, good. Amy always has a pointer. There is no doubt in my mind. Thank you. Oh, he was faster. Okay, so here, so we're talking about cluster, right? This is the cluster. And what we have is we have the potential use of academic core spaces as well as science. So each cluster can have that sort of interdisciplinary uh you know activity going on with these rooms down down here being project labs. By project labs um what we're talking about is the ability for either a class to have a special project or potentially two two classes to collaborate on on an idea so they can go to those classrooms. When you come to the center of each floor, the tower below the tower becomes locations for lockers
027as well as for um students to potentially gather. Adjacent to each of those spaces would be um administration. Each floor has areas for for um administration. And just so everybody knows that plan is mirrored on both sides as well as on the third floor. As we proceed to the north part of the building is where we located uh CTE. Now back there there's also stairs that can uh connect you to the other floors which would bring you down to music and which would bring you up to the third floor for um some additional um academic core. These spaces are pharmacy um exercise science and health and human services as well as uh the CT administration. So that's that's that's the concept for for that second floor. When we go to the third floor, this is
028where you'll start to see the change. As we discussed, you know, this this idea of a cluster is repeated on this floor. The other thing that happens is we were able to locate science along a corridor that runs north and south and it's also adjacent to other science wings because I know that the the science department wanted that relationship. So we were we were able to accommodate the idea of being close to each other as well as being part of of a larger group of of teachers that teach other subjects. What happens in the north part of this floor plan is we were able to develop another cluster. Uh so it it really gives the the district the ability to um have areas of inter interdisciplinary teaching as well as uh activities you know between
029departments to to visually connect this floor and CTE on this floor. where we were able to open up a floor space that allows a visual connection. Also on this floor is where we located art, which is currently located um I believe that's the freshman experience space that's that's happening right now. So that's where we have art, which um for those of you that haven't been up there, the the space has a series of vaults. It was originally, I believe, the cafeteria for the 1926 building. So it's really a uh it's it's really a special space. So um the idea of that being sort of a studio was um advantageous to the program that we developed for the arts. It also allows um light to be brought in from above. you know, lighting um in in
030spaces like this, you know, you talk about northlight. Um because of the existing condition, we were able to introduce light that's coming in from um shared spaces potentially through the use of skylights or light tubes from above. So, that's that's some of the the the thoughts on lighting there. On the fourth floor, I'm sure that uh I would I would think that most people have been to the fourth floor. It's sort of small, but there's some really special spaces up there. And we're maintaining um the original uh idea of what that floor should be, which was uh vocal music. We were able to introduce um some ensemble rooms as well as a small library and then um support spaces for that for that offices um individual practice rooms and and stuff like that. So that's
031that's sort of the development of the plan that's happened the last month. As you can see um from the last month you start to see the development of the further development of spaces in regards to the program that was developed in the uh winter and the spring. So, you notice that here. You'll you really start to notice it uh when we go to the first floor in regards to administration as well as some of the music spaces because those spaces are are um important in regards to their relationships. You know, our our our next step in regards to plan and these spaces are, you know, we talked with the users. Now we sit down and really sort of get into the the idea of of what what the you know in in regards to this
032space what the administration wants in regards to relationship between offices and and relationship between other program spaces. So that's sort of the the next step and that'll happen in the fall. So the the last thing that we started to do was look at this in regards to its presence on on cedar. So it it was uh you know we spent a lot of time discussing it with um both the cabinet and with the board about how we approach uh you know opening up the courtyard and introducing additions to the 1926 wing. And what we ended up doing was we tried to maintain the integrity of 1926 by uh you know sort replicating the ideas that was in uh you know this portion of the building. So you can see that this element to the to
033the right is the addition and that's that's a uh project lab. Uh the other thing that happens on these floors is that we have elements of circulation at each end of the corridors that that um that we developed. So we tried to figure out a way to introduce those in regards to you know the existing architecture. And what we what we ended up coming back to each time was the element of of entry at the tower and that has a sort of a limestone uh col colonade and um arch and that's where the development of this space uh started. The other thing that we appreciated about this piece was the openness in the amount of glass that was in there. So, with that being said, we were able to still maintain an open stairway so
034that when you're driving down Cedar and when students are running up and down these steps, you can you can see them because that's an idea here that we've always had was that this school is now visible from the inside out and from the outside in. So there's that element of of openness in regards to seeing students walking up and down the steps. And as we know, this this this this facade is is mirrored based on the center of the tower. So each side is is identical in its architecture. You know, we start to get a little bit of change down here, but we're working through that. And that that's because of grade. So these are this is sort of looking straight on. you now see, you know, you now see something that hasn't been seen
035probably since 1958, which is that that element, which we all appreciate. This is looking um and this is the area that I'm talking about that grade sort of wraps around here. But you can see how scale played a lot of role in regards to the development of this space. So this this form right here is almost the same size as the original wing. So you have that idea of that sort of scale and that was really important because we did look at you know what happens if you bring brick all the way across if you got to be squatty. So and we were concerned about that. And then finally this is looking at the other um east academic wing. So down here is where you have your conferencing center. This is nursing or the the
036uh health office which allows for easy access. And then you can see the relationship of this to the central tower to the other element over there. So there's sort of a balance thing going on here. And that's uh that's where we are right now. And that you can see is how we started to look at the um ends of circulation. And if if anybody I know nobody here remembers what happened prior to 1959, but in plan there was always an element at the ends of the wing that was of circulation. So there was stairs there and there was um there was windows looking to the outside. So I think I think that completes our presentation. Yes. Happy to take questions. Well, I get I I assume that you're here to answer questions. Just answer questions.
037You don't have a formal presentation. I always like to hear more detail behind how you got from the last step to this step working with all of the different groups. I mean, you gave a little brief um review of that, but I'd like to hear somebody and I don't know if that's you Amy or you, John, um talk a little bit more about that. Well, when you know, one of the key things was the development of the second and third floors and the idea of relationships. A lot of it had to do with departmental relationships and the idea of both and I think I I I briefly touched on this the idea of both the ability for um one department to be together as well as to be part of other departments and that's how
038this idea started. So there was there was a desire for science to be together yet there was also a desire for science to be included in this idea of a cluster of classrooms. So that's how that started to develop. The other thing that we started to do was we started to look hard at at what can fit in the 1926 wing. And what we ended up having here was uh the the teachers area with its associated program as well as two additional classrooms. So the thought was to add additional classrooms to this space. Now that started to talk about the relationship between classrooms and resource rooms. Um and we were able to include resource rooms right along um with other classroom spaces. Now some of the resource rooms have uh I think two of them
039have a function associated with science. So that's how that started to to progress and that's how this this plan started to to to sort of develop. The other areas were were um when we go to when we go to music um you know music is um there's a lot of of sound issues associated with music and there's relationships associated with with um larger spaces to assembly rooms as well as you know sort of um offices to the overall um focus of this this area of the building. The other thing that happened here was, you know, the desire for for music to have its uh, you know, because of um because of what they do and because of how they utilize instruments and storage room, they really needed to be in close proximity to each other.
040So that started to develop this as a uh circulation space as well as a sort of a cluster for music. Um the other uh the other opportunity that we had here was the behind the stage presence and we're still talking about this and we're still talking about how we access stage in regards to finished floor because as we all know you know the auditorium slopes down and it's it's 6'6 below floor here and then the stage is up 3 ft. So there's some there's some opportunity there that that we're trying to work through. But what we do have is we have the back of house open part of it as a scene shop which um you know I'm sure that everybody's been over here into that little scene shop that's like 6 ft in the
041ground. Um, right now it's really a goal to have Scene Shop adjacent to the stage as well as Blackbox, which Blackbox could be utilized as a blackbox, which is a um, and Amy would probably be better describing what a blackbox is, but it's a performance space that really is open. It's open in regards to seating. It's open in regards to lighting, and it's open in regards to how you want to utilize the space. So, it's it's about not necessarily the space, but it's about the users. Um, but what can happen if there's a large performance going on here, this can become backup house. This can become something that's utilized during this performance as, you know, if they put curtains up, it could be changing rooms, it could be, you know, where where scene is set
042up. So, those are the kinds of things that we talked about in the last month. Um the other thing is is sort of this area here and we didn't talk as much with administration. Um but the idea of administration and conferencing being close to each other and being adjacent to some sort of entry you know library or I think it's called media center you know media center has direct relationships between its circulation desk and views into the space views into who comes in and views into at least one of the computer labs. So those are how those are how this space is starting to develop. I hope that helped you out, Nancy. Yeah. Well, I guess we'll get into it a little bit as we have conversation about I think I think this is also
043the place where the rubber starts to meet the road in terms of all of the the back and forth and when people start seeing actual ideas. It's rarely yay. It's usually ooh. And so I you know that I I guess I'd like to hear and how you've worked through that process with the different um working groups too and the staff um a little say a little bit more about that too. Okay. Excuse me. That um you know it's all a process. Yeah. and and so every iteration of the plan is a result of comments and criticisms and ideas from the various groups and of course their ideas get need to get balanced with the other working group ideas. So, you know, there's a domino effect every time you want to make something and the budget
044and the square footage. And so part of it is to um to to listen and hear all of the um the reasons why behind the criticism so that as we go back to the drawing board, we can renit the thing back together in a way that solves that why. Not necessarily that we can take the actual suggestions and incorporate them verbatim because that's um it needs to incorporate you know all of them al together. And so, you know, we take the comments from the user groups very seriously. Um, and have through the whole process. Um, uh, again, you might not see the comments exactly as they were, um, made, but again, juggling everything. And as you guys know, all the way from the very beginning and the Lego exercise, how difficult of a puzzle this
045is. And um and so uh we're find trying to find ways to achieve all of the goals that people are talking about the working groups are talking about and that might mean some joint use spaces some uh you know this kind of space may transform to that in the evening you know as John just mentioned and um but to to be able to look at all that uh the functions that were requested and say yes we can do that yes we can do that yes we can do that we think that we're getting closer and closer and need the continuing ing input of the working groups to help us, you know, even get that much closer. Still, it's a normal part of the process. You know, we we try ideas and we we get some
046right, we get some wrong, and we keep honing in until until uh the alignment is um is achieved. Thank you. One of the um yeah, as I if I'm remembering correctly from last time, one of the big changes being I believe on the second certainly on the third floor would be the um from the last plan up on the north end of the building there were also horizontal hallways, right? There was more space. So obviously you have I mean that seems to me like the biggest change is just moving all those classrooms down most many of those classrooms. That is the biggest change. And and they the classrooms that that were in this area here. Mhm. Um just so you know, some of this space is utilized for high bay space for orchestra, jazz, and
047band. Um, but the spaces that were here and here were moved into these spaces because 1926 is a big building still and there was a lot of square footage in there that we had to maintain and utilize in regards to academic core which is important because academic core is why this building was built. Um, the other space that it went to was on the third floor. uh when you start to introduce um the idea of both a connection between one one discipline of teaching as well as um being part of sort of a larger hole like Amy was saying. So that's why that wing sort of went away so it was more efficient. Yeah. And this is this is a more efficient plan. That's what I was going to say. Yeah. I mean it decreases
048the amount of hallways which we were talking about. I mean hallways are necessary but drive costs up and And also, if you go from this space to this space, it's a lot closer than if you go from here over to here, right? Which, you know, I know Eric, you went to this school and you know how it is to to sort of meand your way around there. So, if we can tighten the plan up, that helps everybody. And I think I mean, and obviously that's going to save us some money as well. I mean, every square footage decrease obviously helps us out that way. do. And I I also know that we're getting into as the plans get more and more detailed, it's easier and easier to come up with actual projections of how much
049everything's going to cost. And so, as we start to run into what our outer limits are, uh, which I assume is now, I mean, we're starting to find those things out. Um, do you have any rough sense of how how much more this is going to need to change based on just practical things of cost and square footage and things like that? How how I know we're going to continue to see changes. That's been very clear that this is this is still in flux. But do you have a sense of how is this like 80% of what's going to be there? 90% 40%. What we know there are some things that that we know we're going to maintain. And one is the idea that we have going on here. All right. We're going to, you
050know, we know that this works really well in regards to everybody that's sitting here, in regards to to the people that worked on the program, to the architects, to the board, to the administration, and to the students. We think that this is really strong this idea. Now, whether this is, you know, this is a science room and this is a classroom, you know, those are further discussions that we'll get into. Right. The other thing that we know is that you know because of because of site we know that this is going to be sort of an assembly area this whole zone here right we know that student commons and and media center going to sit there and competition gym's going to be there and and really because of site you know a lot of this
051layout in regards to some of these high base spaces are result of site. We know that we like um sort of the CTE high bay space in this area because of its ability to be accessed because that's important for that function. You know, we have to be able to get cars in and out of there. It's as simple as that. We also know that because of because of pool and because uh just so everybody knows, when you build a pool inside a building, it's almost like there's a separate building here. So, there'll be a little one-in space between this this building and this one. So because of that, it's nice that this sits over there. So things like that aren't going to, you know, we don't think that things like that are going to change
052too much. The other thing is access access from the south of the the building to the north of the building because we have this we have our beautiful auditorium that we're fortunate to have. We need circulation on both sides of it. And that's why the plan started to sort of develop into this. We have circulation there. why are we not using it? And that's where you start to get into further development. You know, we take big ideas and we work from architects. We we start out with the big picture and then we work down to minutia and that's sort of how we go. And we're sort of still in the beginning phases, but um that's sort of how it is. So, every time we come back, there's going to be changes and and there's going
053to be modifications and it's going to be further developed. Yeah. I want to um if Eric doesn't mind, I want to tack on to that question just a little bit. And the question that I I'll have others, but the question that I would raise at this point is if we think about what we're looking at now, how does this relate to the P in terms of square footage? Where are we in terms of this versus the square footage? The P the program requirements. Do we know? Yeah, we know where we are. Tell us. Remember, remember that when we did the P PR, we're looking at net area. And so when you're looking at net area, you see the spaces that are colored, not the gray spaces, right? So when we we planned the building, we
054said, what spaces are needed for education? And then as the architects continue to work on the plan, you you you determine the gross areas or the spaces for hallways and stairways and things like that. So So we need to be sure that we're comparing those, you know, sort of apples to apples. If we were go to go through the the list of um program spaces in the program of requirements, I think we're pretty close. Yeah, we're we're pretty close. And I'll tell you, there are two areas that were not. And one is the auditorium. The auditorium was programmed to be um I believe it was programmed as a new space when we maintained the existing auditorium that added square footage and the same thing. Well, you no and keep in mind there too that we
055were programming the building as as what are the needs for each space and once we have the the needs pretty much without regard for the existing building. This is what we need if we were to build new. This is what we need. This is our this is what we're aiming for. and all the functionality that was requested in say the auditorium um resulted in a space that's actually smaller than the auditorium you currently have. Once we then take the program of requirements and apply it into the real building, we we some spaces will need to get bigger because they're existing. It doesn't make sense to chop, you know, a couple thousand off of, you know, off of u uh off of the auditorium. Uh and and some places might need to get a little smaller
056because they just don't fit in the building. So we started from what are we aiming for and then we know that in any existing building we have parameters that we need to satisfy. Some of them will get bigger, some of them will get smaller. Um and so there very very few of them that are largely different but the ones that are are quite largely different. auditorium and art is another one that that's larger than than the P says and the reason for that is because the space was sort of perfect for the function. Um now there's other you know we're we're we're as you can tell we we're further investigating areas of this plan and this is one of them. Um and the reason art is in the whole space is because this floor, the
057third floor as we see here has two levels. You know, the art level is about I think 3 and 1/2 ft above the rest of the floor. So to not not use that as one program or one discipline starts to sort of muddy things up. So that's just an example as to why art is bigger. Yeah. And I I guess you know on this particular point I would probably push a little bit because the as far as I'm concerned the question is fairly straightforward and I think Eric was asking where are what can we expect in terms of change. Now if we are not on target as far as a P is concerned then that would represent potentially some change right is that I mean is that the way to think about this? I think
058the answer is unequivocally yes. Right. We and the the the straightforward answer to your question is that that the current plan that you are looking at the current iteration of the schematic plan is has too much square footage in it to support to be supported by the budget that we have. So that's really I mean so what what we can expect that what we as we move forward and just going back to Eric's uh question we can expect some modifications. to reconcile. We have to reconcile that there's too much square footage. You know, they're giving you good reasons why. You know, it's it's based on on, you know, trying to work within the framework of the existing building. We anticipated that that was going to happen. It's not anything that we didn't know was going
059to happen. Now, we've got to reconcile that and that's the next phase of work that we've got to go through. Yeah. Um Yeah. And that may mean, you know, tightening up some of this space in regards to circulation because you know like Amy said you know we're pretty much on target except for those few spaces that we mentioned in regards to square footage and you know we can't you know the classroom spaces are classroom size and those are based on state and we're we're at a very comfortable size you can't get much smaller than that um it's a great size you know we're at about 850 square feet which is about average in the state so you know things like that are are something that um that we're looking at. So, and and just so
060everybody knows, this happens on almost every project we go through this. How do we tighten the plan? How do we still make it functional in regards to the users? And we've done that all along the way because even at the programming phase, we were looking for ways to double up on spaces. We were we were talking about for example the whole conference center came about because of all the various conference activities that are needed in the school. So we look at looked at sharing that and probably you know saved a couple thousand square feet by doing that. So it's um it we have an eye to towards that budget all the way through. Um, and so every step of the of the way that gets revisited over and over and over again until we get
061to the to the real um final plan that again uh hits everything that everyone's aiming for hopefully. Sorry, Eric. I'm good. Wanted to push that just a little bit. Yep. But I'll tell you that would be something that as we move forward I'll probably bring up every single time and at some point you know like I guess you're saying that we're about 80% or whatever the number is. I I don't know exactly what it is but at some point we'll push a little bit more and say okay what where are we in relationship to what we have approved in the P. So anyway, sure. And keep in mind, I I don't mean to keep going back and forth, but keep in mind too that the idea of keeping the theater, and that's just using it
062as an example, is um goes beyond the square footage into historic significance and the emotional connection and all those things. So sometimes you can you things need to be measured in in um assets that go beyond. Yeah, we're prepared for that. But but you know we want to start I hear you you know and I would just also as a building on that just one tiny more second you know we will bring Gil Bane building company is contractually obligated to bring back to the board a budget for your consideration that or a a cost estimate that falls within our budget. So, so they have their work cut out for them and and they've been sitting at the table with the architect and with everyone all along and and so um we've got to get there.
063Um Fred's going to speak up. You're a quiet man, Fred. We want to hear from you. So, I know my time is coming. That's right. Your time is coming. Uh just so you know uh on the in the SD uh uh venue, we look at uh square footage and lineal footage uh analysis of the building because everything's not really developed on the inside. So, we've been looking at gross square footages with the designers and also the exterior skin uh footage because uh we're putting historical data to that and that's um feeding information to them and let them know that uh you you may need to reduce the uh lineal footage or amount of of uh exterior skin and also interior square footage based on our historical data of of square foot cost. So, we're feeding
064in we're we're like the buy guys. So we're telling them by humbug can't can't do it. So sorry quite a bit of perimeter was um was reduced from last time to this time. Yeah. When we went to when we went to this schematic we did reduce a lot of skin. Makes sense. Erica, are you Yeah, I'm good. Thank you. Okay. I I got a couple of things. You know, I raised the issue of toilets last time. I I'm not sure that we've solved that yet, but I I like to hear you talk about that a little bit. And I think about it in terms of the crowds that we might have at a concert or something like that. It still looks like we are fairly limited or or well, that's the question. Well, that's okay
065because we'll talk about that a little bit. Um, if we're talking about a concert, let's say that we're on this level, right? Okay. On this level, we maintained um one of the existing uh toilet rooms that are located um in the corner of the 1926 building. We went back and added probably about the same amount of fixtures um near the entrance and near the main circulation path to the north part of the building. The other thing is since the last one. Yeah. Yeah. since the last one. The other thing is that we we maintained in fact we made these even larger in regards to the toilet rooms located back here. So there's probably um I can't quite remember the count in these toilet rooms, but there's there's proximity to toilet rooms in in sort of
066all parts of this area because if you're if you have something going on in here, um grant, you know, we're talking about egress from this, but there's also um if you go here and you go down to the to the Washington level, there's toilet rooms down there also. Um, and if you're in these spaces, you have access to that toilet room and to that toilet room because if um, if we talk about um, public spaces on this floor or large assembly spaces, you have the auditorium, you have um, the student commons, you have a mini auditorium, and you have potentially a black box. So, you have those spaces that all right around here, and you have access to three different locations for toilets. And so you're happy that we've Yeah, I think I think that
067we I think that we meet the the requirements and we we give opportunities in um in close proximity to where to where the the performances or where the assemblies are happening. And the same thing if you go to the floor below, you know, the floor below um as well as all the locker rooms that you have going on, but there's toilet rooms down there also. And there's a group over in here. So, and and if we if we remember our discussion with the main uh competition gym, there is the ability to have a relationship from this floor to this floor right here. So, people that are sitting in these bleachers are able to come up and utilize these toilet rooms. Okay. So, um that's a valid concern. Yeah. Um yeah, if you think about the
068competition gym, does that mean that we would have um I guess we would have toilet spaces down there as well? Yeah, you have two toilet spaces on that floor and then you have, you know, depending on how the school wants to operate, if they want to maintain this street as being open during those those um games. Mhm. Um, if not, you know, you at least have this toilet room there in the upper part. Okay? Because I don't, you know, people would use this one. They may come down here and use this one. I doubt if they're in this competition, gym, that they would come up here, right? Um, okay. Just a question about security. uh you're actually moving security I guess and it's I can I guess we can see it on the yeah security
069the cedar level which means that in terms of the entrance to the building we're thinking about forcing a different entrance right yes we're and okay can you speak to that a little bit yeah what we you know what the conceptually we talked about the idea of this street right or this avenue and the idea that that we're bringing the tower entrance back right Um, but we also have, you know, we have 1,600 students coming to this building every single day. And right now, they all enter the building, I think, right about where I have the red dot, and they come up the steps and they go through this little door. So, what we were trying to do was introduce a main student entrance, which occurs on the east side of the building, which has a
070little more sight access than the west side. So, that's why we located it over there. The other thing is is that it's it's centrally located. I mean, it's closer to to Cedar, but everybody knows what what we're talking about between Washington and and Cedar. So that students if they for some reason get dropped off on this street, they can just walk down here and go midpoint. And if they get dropped off on Cedar, there's also close. The other thing that we were starting to talk about, and this is with how the buildings operated, is sort of a secondary security location so that kids could enter through the tower and through the entrance as it was supposed to be. So once again, it reinforces the importance of not only the tower, but this whole space that
071um is hidden right now. Yeah. Now we look at that space as it is right now. This space. Yeah. Where the you see where the security is right here or this? Well, you you only have one security, right? Yeah. We have security located here and then we have a secondary station. I think I think Ron what you're looking at is possibly a temp like a portable or small area where someone could be housed security right there. Right there. It doesn't necessarily mean a space. It doesn't mean a space. That's not like an office. It's a desk checkpoint. Yeah. But the idea is that that the school can start to utilize this as student entry because that's that's a key almost a fulcrum. So from that if you're standing at that point theoretically you can look
072into the cafeteria into the commons you can see the main you can see the primary entrance you can see the leader sea road at cedar entrance and you can also see down the hallway if there was a for after school events if there's a basketball game or something like that. Yeah, right there. You're you're absolutely right, Eric, because you have views to all of these entries because during a basketball game, you know, this is probably going to be used, especially since people are are, you know, some people are parking over here in the parking garage. So, this becomes um also a relevant entrance in regards to um not only everyday use, but uses for basketball, uses for um you know, plays and and musicals and and anything else that happens in the auditorium space. Eric,
073you Yeah. Um, last time I said I was disappointed. This time I'm very happy. Uh, good. So, yeah, I they uh much much better. Uh, on the I got a whole bunch of small little questions. Okay. First of all, thanks for your help. Oh, yeah. It's why I'm It's why we get paid the big money. Um on the basement level uh I would a recommendation I would change the phraseology of football locker room to seasonal locker room because I think that's really more uh and that's the idea behind that anyways. So that way it's not specific to one program. It's really whoever's whoever's using the the track and field complex. Um the elevator that's in the corner of the weight room is that go to all four floors. Yes. So that's like a heavy duty
074freight elevator. Uh well, we have a freight elevator on the east side, but this is a freight. It's like it's an elevator go to all four floors. It goes to all four floors and and and it can be you it can be enlarged to be a freight. Okay. I was and I I think that that would depend on on two things. One would be um art and the other would be seen chunk. Okay. So it it's it's more it's a much bigger elevator than the one you currently have uh by the stairwell. Yeah. The one that's over here. Uh other stairwell. Oh yeah. Yeah. That's just a a It's a passenger elevator. Okay. That's more of It's big enough for a gurnie to get in. It's an ADA elevator versus Okay. Um on also on
075the basement, have you had resolution if you're going to need to have those stairwells that go from the basement level up to the courtyard? Is that a co has that code issue been resolved or No, that has not. Okay. And we um we we did a thorough walk through through the building. So, I'm uncomfortable right now saying that they will be gone. Okay. And it's only because of the existing space that's down. Can you show the audience what Eric's talking about? Um when when you go into the I'm going to go to the the floor above. Um when you know when you're inside the courtyard, you see stairwells that come out through here and through here. And it looks like they were added in the 1959 edition. And that's what Eric's talking about trying to
076get rid of those because of what it did to the original building. Yeah. So, we're still waiting to see if we can Yeah, we're still waiting to see on that. I I I I don't want to say yes. When it's You have a yellow on the only thing that's yellow on the basement floor is called a learning center. What is that? Well, the learning center and that's a result of where it's located within the program. The learning center is for use um if students are and just so everybody knows what we're talking about. We're talking about this space right here. So, like athletic study tables. It's a study table, not necessarily dedicated to athletics, but for Okay. after school use um if if somebody's, you know, waiting on a sporting event or a sibling. Gotcha.
077You know, they could be in the learning center. You could even call it, you know, homework center. Okay. Uh I mean, you know, if you it wouldn't be called that, but um so it could be used during the day or whatever, but you know, where do you just park when you just I've got to wait for my um I've got to wait for my practice. I might as well get my homework done while I'm doing it. And part of that includes logging in to a computer. And so, let me do it right here. And that's why we really located it on this level adjacent to these spaces because these are the spaces that kids usually use after school. This and and probably music. Um music has the advantage of being on another floor where there's
078potentially adjacent spaces and assembly rooms. Um but that's why we located it there. Can I actually before you move up before I had one quick um just the uh uh and just to be clear for folks um as we refer to this as the basement level I mean you refer to it as the Washington level basement level but just for people at home to understand or people in the audience that the difference between this basement level and what we currently have basement level is that all of these areas will have windows. You never feel like you're in a basement. I mean, it's not like you're under the ground and too bad that's where your office is. All those places down in the bottom lefthand corner will have access to sunlight. Yeah. Especially when you start
079to talk about these spaces here, right? Well, the ones in the left current the ones on the left of the photo currently have that's where the AD comparable to where the AD is. I would the in the illustrations you have in the perspective from the front. I would highly I hope we're going to go with light wells as opposed to a wall. Yeah. No, we're not uh Yeah, we'll we'll see problems. Don't worry about that. Okay. Yeah. and just you know it's a process. I I know. I just want to make sure that we're not going to because I could see people, you know, yeah, that becomes um Yeah. problematic. Ju just to add to that point, if you look at that corner, that elevation from the outside that you had, do you you see
080those windows there? Is that at that level? Yes. Those are at that level, right? Yeah. That's at the the Washington level. Yeah. And and this line right here that you see on the building is the Cedar level. Okay. And so if we if we think about four floors, we if we go to the center of the building, I guess the fourth floor is in the tower itself, right? It doesn't go anywhere else, right? That's correct. Okay. So we sort of got four, but the way we got we have five, right? There's five. Okay, that's that's really have five. We have Washington, Cedar, second, third, and then fourth sits in here. You have four floors and five levels. Four floors and five levels, but less ramps and stairs. We're trying to get rid of ramps ramps.
081They're awesome. Um, how many What's our classroom count comp? What What is a Do you have a We have uh 44 classroom academic classrooms. Academic classrooms compared. And how many do we currently have? I don't know. I think there moving forward if you could get back to us, I I think there'd be value in comparison again to sort of the the P. What do we currently have in regards to classrooms? It's a specialized spaces and then these sort of we have that started. Um we're starting to do that right now. We had that when we did the play of the PR. I look up some of that because we because that was asked a lot as we were going through because I think again when we get when we're when we're specifically committing to something,
082we need to be able to support that support explain why if we're going from 65 classrooms down to 40 or something like that, we need to be able to explain why the building's bigger and we have fewer quote classrooms. So that that I think that would be valuable. Okay. Um, are you going to be able to is is there the possibility to almost run a a simulation of our current schedule in the the building if you understand? A simulation is that schedule of the day of classes flow. Yeah. I mean that I'm going to have to ask somebody at the district. I'm just I'm just wondering because it would like a almost like a traffic simulation but with Right. And often we are asked to to do a schedule sort of a a test run
083see how see how it would go. Um there are certain certainly um the the rules of thumb that we used when we're programming take into account the typical American high school utilization rate. And you know we we got into that sort of detail during programming just so we make sure that what we do will work for the student population. And um we're quite confident that it will um just based on the numbers that we were using. We're a little lower than the national average uh in terms of utilization. So that opens up the schedule a little bit. Um but it never hurts to get your scheduler scheduling team to come and just do a you know do a do a test run just to see how it would would go. my um uh I'm 99.9%
084sure they'll find that there's going to be extra a little bit of extra and that's to allow for uh future ability to run different programs that we haven't defined yet. You know, we talked a lot about how how this building could be able to um be uh viable and valid through into the future. Well, again, I mean, one, we did something similar for that for the middle school. It's adjustable when we went from three to two. I just want to make sure before we start putting up concrete and throwing up steel steel that we're not building over capacity in particular if we got to cut a little bit on the budget. I'm even looking just right here. We've got these academic there's a three there's uh on the side of the building by your uh
085at the end of your east west corridor there's four floors of classrooms right and I'm thinking well if you're extra over capacity you could always just bump the wall back a little bit theoretically but again I I think it's I'm looking before we commit that we know that it's going to work that we don't have we're getting that high we're going to have that higher build building utilization but we still want that that that room for growth but that we're not doing all this and then we still have the classroom utilization because that's the whole idea for the think tanks, right? So, um, good question. The We don't have this evening. We don't you don't have a massing model for the rear of the structure, correct? Correct. Okay. We will have for the the next
086one. Yeah, we're working on that right now on the first floor. Um, I would just I I would highly encourage and I know you're thinking about it, but the main entrance is going to be on the east side of the building. I think that needs not just the what it looks like on the exterior. I think that the floor the floor plan right there I think it needs a little bit more I don't want to say grandeur but it needs to be a little bit more dramatic because I think that will be a the primary entrance for most visitor well for students for visitors um our ADA that's going to be our primary ADA accessibility points. I think that needs to be a little bit uh a little bit more gr little bit grand I
087guess. Um the I know you're saying you're not you don't like ramps, but I know we need ramps parallel to the auditorium for the for fire exits. Um are these ramps going to go all the way to the basement or are they just going to go to the Well, and that's the discussion that we had last week um in regards to the theater and how the theater the auditorium performs. So right now they're going down to the stage level, but you they're but and stop. They're not going to go all They're not They're not going to go right now. They're not going all the way down. That because I was that was always unclear because it was sort of like it was we were hearing, oh, they're going to go down to the floor. Then
088I'm looking at the basement. I'm like, but they don't have Well, at one time they did go all the way down. Okay. We modified that because of function, right? That's I totally um the stairwells that are 1926, are those staying or we Those are staying. Good. Okay. That's just so everybody knows that's that's this one which I believe there's an elevator couple and then and then that's this one. Okay. Because when we did a tour the other day of the building that was one of the things the amenities even the consultant was like this is a really nice feature. It would be beautiful. Um now I guess the question I'll throw out we have four at least four 1926 stairwells that will be going away. That sits right here, right? So you get two in
089the 26, you got at least one in 30. You got a couple back by the gyms as well. The the ballasters and the banisters and that kind of stuff. Is there any value is it is there any value and possibility like code of pulling those from the demolition in the only thing that that would be um problematic with that is that uh the height of guard rail versus handrail. That's where I could potentially see that as being an issue. Okay. Um, and what happens is, um, typically if you do something like that, usually it would be within the stairwell in its current location. But let's say there's a stair that sits over in here someplace. Am I right in my location? Yeah, there's that stair. If you were to take that and and relocate it
090someplace, um, sometimes you have to retrofit the ballister and that becomes potentially um, difficult, okay, costly. But I understand it's the desire cuz from the tour the structure we had what I think was very useful and valuable for us as we went through is that to a high degree whatever was whatever they didn't whatever they didn't trash in ' 62 they did in 72. So when you're walking down the hallway pretty much all that is left is is you got the the tile floors some of the baseboards and then you go in the classroom. Yeah. Some of the baseboards some of the baseboards and that's about it. There's very very little. And then and even the doorways none of this and even the doorways you've got the doors on. There's the fluorescent paint. Then there's
091the black paint. Uh the transoms are all filled over. So there's very very little that remains unfortunately except for the floors and the baseboards. Um and again in the the stairwells was again one of the few areas that had had retained. So that was these stairwells and these are there you know these the stairwells I was talking about earlier are located right here. Right. Which was removed in 58 or 59. Yeah. Those those were gone when they built the science wings. So that was that was sort of the question was what components would if it that was what you know we we went in and did our you know we walked around the building for about four hours last Thursday and you know we were trying to see about utilizing the existing colonade that's there
092and because of the way that the original building was built with a with a ramp that goes from here down 6 feet very steep over back up and down and over those just don't work because of where they are right so but we are looking at stuff like that well I know when we did what was interesting when when we toured we were in the auditorium you the um I think the current thought in regards to the auditorium was a uh when I guess when the phrase because it's right say orchestra pit and I think the the thought was it was going to be a very hard surface sort of like w it's dug in it has a very finite amount of purposes I think the current thought was uh more let's say I guess
093a it's a it's a spiral it would it would sing it would sink for a pit raised at floor level for current use and then you could push it up for like a thrust stage for the auditori for performance. So, right now we're sort of looking at a multi-purpose orchestra pit. We really shouldn't I guess we couldn't even call this a pit. It's really more of a multiunction. Yeah. You know, the the idea that we have with the pit right now is that it's it's um it's not hydraulic. Okay. All right. Which means that it's not as invasive in regards to construction. Okay. Um, the only problem is that when you start to look at the the just so everybody knows when when auditoriums were built at this time and even today, a lot of
094the what we called conditioned air is brought from underneath the floor. So, when you're in in and I'm going to call it a basement, when you're in the basement of this this building sitting right here, you're looking at what are called plenum spaces for um bringing air into into this this large space. And what happens is that orchestra pit sits within all of those spaces. Now, you know, our our our mechanical engineers aren't thinking about using those for conditioning the space, but they're there. Um, but what happens with this lift is you don't have to dig beyond the the floor that's there. But that's the advantage. Well, I guess what what I'm what I'm saying is the the consultant was saying sort of that you'd have would almost have three levels. Yeah, you have three
095levels. You have a traditional orchestra pit, right? Um then you have the the regular floor level that that would be there, you know, during the day, right? Um you know, it would be it would be the the finish would be the same finish as the rest of the floor in that room and then you have the potential to bring it up to the level of stage. So in reality, it goes from a single purpose thing that would be a handful of times of the year to you have multiple uses. So how does that how do you accomplish that? You say you're not doing any hydraulics. No, you're not you got portable stuff that you No, no, no. It's a spiral lift. it just sort of ah okay and um I've I haven't been able to
096use one before but I had specified it in another project so it's it's very interesting they have one um uh I know that that if we do go that route that that it'll be something that um we'll get information on locations I do believe that there's one in uh Packard Musical in Warren Ohio if anybody's been to Packard um Packard put one in about um I'm going say five years ago. So but but something like this would allow us to address uh you address a lot of different needs. It well it also addresses multiple conflict. It it addresses the concern of okay it's something you use only a handful of time a year. Conversely it's something that you can use it maintains some of the integrity of the original design while at the same time
097adding functionality. That's correct. Now, one of the things I I found from the tour, I guess it's more sharing with my colleagues when the consultant was saying, I mean, when we were in the auditorium, that a lot a significant number of the problems the space has from an audio component, what have you, are really the result of alterations and changes over time. So, it's almost if you strip out the gunk that's been added over time, right? There's that bulkhead. The bulkhead, the the way the balcony has been altered, the acoustical tile at the back of the space, the uh the paneling on the side where there used to be windows, all those factors. If we sort of strip all that out and then start thinking about, okay, we take that out, what do we want
098to put back in that just stripping out the junk seems to address a number of the you know, hopefully hopefully, you know, you mentioned the balcony. Hopefully the the the balcony is still there. You know, that's that's the the sort of I don't want to call it dilemma, but that's when you start to strip away those things. Hopefully, they maintain the balcony. And when I was there, you mean architecturally? Architecturally, but architecturally is also functionally because right now there's I think it's a gypsson board product on it. And the original had plasters with coffers or or some sort of ways coat and the plaster reflected sound more than the JIF board because of the JIF board's a little softer. But what but what I think was very interesting for the folks I was with was
099that the the ability by by stripping off the junk that we've added over time actually when going towards restoring some of the architectural detail actually gets us a better space than we had we've had for the last 40 50 60 years. So I think that was it was very comforting to hear that okay if we take off this the stuff that we that's mucked it up this actually gets us a long way towards the things that we want to add. That's the same thing with the fly space. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. because the fly is is really sort of um awkward. It was it's basically what were you thinking and why did you do it, right? So um okay, second the only real question I have on the second floor is going to be I know
100Nancy and I had spoken with you the idea of the locker commons in the sec the center space. Um, I guess when I was running the numbers, I figured if a locker was one foot and you had four four feet between and you have I think linear feetwise you could squeeze them in. Yeah. But I guess I'm just a little hesitant and concerned about having 800 to a,000 kids two three four times a day all congregating on that one juncture. And you know, you said that and what we did, I went back and talked in my office and what we thought of was, you know, we have cluster lockers. Cluster lockers, maybe we introduce back here lockers. All right. So, you have potentially five lockers. And then we also have areas like this that we
101can look at putting lockers in. Yeah. Cuz I So, that's a that's a development. But the idea is that maybe there's lockers in this area as well because we know we don't want lockers the way they are now where they're just sort of all over the place. Well, that was the thing is I I did like the off administrative offices right next to where you have a large concentration of students. So, it's a more sets of eyes, but my concern was what when I did the math, I'm like, okay, I theoretically I can see you can do it, but this isn't the gym locker room. It's you want a little more breathing room. And there, you know, there's clearances that that required and that kind of stuff. But this was this would be the area
102that we would look at another sort of locker bank so that so that you have and and the only disadvantage to this area over over this is that you know you don't have this programmed element which is administration adjacent to it which to a degree I which is really nice. Right. Well well the flip side is that's great because it's getting you something we don't have. Conversely, if you put them where you don't have an office right next door, that's Yeah, that's status quo. But what you do have back here is is you have um you know, you have a sort of teachers area, right? Well, could I theoretically I mean I looking at on the what floor am I on? The second floor. On the second floor, we've got the a whole series of
103CTE locker on the CTE classroom. So, I wouldn't you could theoretically that that's a that's a cluster to a degree, right? Oh, right. Yeah, you do have that. and and and back, you know, in this part of the building, you also have a relationship to the floors above the stairwells and the openings. So, we wanted to make sure because the idea with CTE is that it's not, you know, back in the corner all on its own, but that it's integrated throughout the building. But my thought is if you've got office wherever there's offices, I think that's Oh, and here's CTE offices. So, exactly. Then my on the third Let's slow down on the locker question. Um, so right now we're talking about the lockers being pretty much confined to those areas on each floor. Yes.
104Okay. Do we do we actually physically count though? I mean, in terms of how many lockers we we have or we have we'll have a certain amount of lockers that we'll provide in the building. I don't know what I don't know how many we're providing. There's there's about 1,700 kids in the building. I think we we we programmed 1,800 just for Okay. And that's included already. The space of the locker takes up space. So, we include that locker space um in the net area. Yes. Time. You know, so it's about eight foot. Okay, that's fine. I just And please tell me it's metal and not particle board laminate because I'm looking for something that's going to have a little more durability. You're talking about recycling. Well, no. No, no, we're not talking recite. No, no,
105no. I'm just saying the metal lockers they make loose so you can see through them. Yeah, they in a lot of blue sight 1926. Um on the third floor um the art the only thing with the art space um I like the idea of the art classrooms there cuz that was one of the things I was saying you should put the art classrooms there. Um the only thing two components when I'm looking at this the walls front the walls that frame it on the east and west facade those are the current exterior walls. Correct. That's correct. Okay. Then I guess the one thought or possibility is if the hallways above the the hallways that flank that space if we could have a skylight I think would be great because that actually allows Yeah. You borrow
106light. Okay. And then the other concern I'm not a big fan of the stairway thing in the front like that. Um if we could go with more of a loft kind of a concept more even if the walls between some of the art classrooms. Oh I see. Yeah. If not the whole thing glass and that may be way prohibitive but large expanses that would be great. Yeah. What just so everybody knows what we were talking about within our office when we start to develop this space was the idea that these walls have a direct relationship to columns in those in those rooms because you know the the um the one area that wasn't stripped was this and the columns are there. The column capitals are still there. So you still have that. So the idea
107is is that the walls go up to a certain point and then maybe there's because you may need a separation, maybe there's glass above, but the idea that this is the more open space, right? I think the more because studios, you know, I don't know how many people in here actually worked in studios. Um I know I know three of us in here um had educations where we sat in studio spaces. Um but they're usually open. They're loud. They're a little louder. Um, but the idea is nice that you're able to see what 3D arts and what jewelry are doing because there is a relationship there in regards to um not only teaching but in regards to just art in general and understanding of of um you know once again you know we talk about
108relationships of space but relationship of of materials and and that kind of stuff. Well, and that I get Yeah. for the when I I like the idea just and I understand obviously we do need some walls for some of these programs, but I think the more we can make this area as uh light filled as possible, it's going to benefit from Exactly. I think that'd be great. And then the only the the last item would be just from the the I mentioned the tour of the folks we went. Um the and the consultant was sort of it was nice to hear her saying it. the the main east west hallways because that's pretty much going to be one of the few remaining the basically the floor service. I'm going to pitch it again. Um it's
109a great feature. It's pretty much the only feature left in the building aside from the auditorium. Um, so I think whatever efforts we can make to on the main east west hallway on the three floors, uh, retain that uh, that I think would be because pretty much everything else is either already gone or is not likely to be uh, salvaged. So I think if we can do that, that was uh, that'd be great because it it really is the only remaining detail in the in 26. So those are those are all my questions. Again, I much I'm much much happier than at the last meeting, last when I was uh not as happy. I was happy. I was I was uh dis I gone from disappointed to now I'm very happy. So, that's great. You
110know, we made progress. Exactly. Those are all my questions. Um just a quick question on on the floors. Um, you know, when we think about that space that ultimately becomes a display space for art and what have you, we would be bringing that throughout and at that level, right? You know, that the the the tile. Are you talking the tile? Yes. Uh, you know, Eric, what what basic? Well, I mean, basically the east west hallway, it's a it's like a 4x8 uh clay with with a a dark gray grout. I mean, basically, the idea would be I guess it's dark gray. I was wondering if it it was if it's dark gray or or dirty, but you know, I was just in there. Those floors are pretty cleaned up right now. Yeah, they are. Okay.
111Well, and well, the at least for myself and I think for the for as far as trying to maintain the patina, you know, again, there there's there's there's the renovated 26 or adjacencies and then there's let's say everything north of that. I at the very least in in 26 portion, right? You know, obviously we can't dig out the current tiles and reuse them. But I can't imagine it's hard to find a new clay tile that would match the old ones. It won't match exact, but as long as it has I think that there's there's there's similar product out there in regards to what we have now. Exactly. And what I found interesting because I was paying close attention was where they um stairwells used to be in 26 that they ripped out in in 58.
112You really can't even see where they put the new tile in back. Now it's 50 years ago. So it wasn't new. It's not new anymore. But I my feeling is that so long as we reflect it, I think people will be happy. That's what we said we were going to do. Yeah. Right. And some of those treads are um I don't know what they did to the what that thing is on the end of the stair. But you know what I'm talking about. I think so. Yeah. Yeah. You know, we're not even showing doors yet. So, we'll get to the tile in another Well, that is a you had mentioned previously that because I know the doors before the stairwells in all of our buildings were added in 72 because of fire codes, right? Is
113are we going to have to if we sprinkler the buildings, will we still have to have those stairwell doors or no? Um it depends on the heights of the shaft. So okay, if if you know the idea of a shaft is it's open from you know certain floors to certain floors and I think if it's I know if it's you know connecting just two floors we're okay. It's when we get to the four floor one that I'm not sure about. So be theoretically so we have to you know there's a code thing associated with it. So theoretically some of those we may not have to have so many cutting space but for the most part the big staircases we will have to keep them. Yeah. But what we would try to do is is you
114know when we go to when we go to this floor we would try to maintain them as being open. Okay. All right. And I don't know what that does in regards to code um because you may go up here and have to put a set of doors on this floor. I mean they've been there for 40 years. I was I was even thinking you had mentioned I was like, "Oh, that'd be great if we don't have to do them." But if we have to do them just as long as they're The other thing is, you know, we we're able to and some of the windows are open here and some aren't on the floors because of adjacencies. Exactly. And many many many additions, right? Um no, I do think the the change for going from
115the giant east west two long parallel corridors, I think this is a much better. It's much more compact. Um it gets you those adjacencies you're looking for. Um, so I think this is I think the the key challenge is going to be how uh the rear of the building's always been utilitarian, but I think because we're closer to Washington now, it's really going to be how the massing appears from Washington, which then goes to I think I I articulated previously uh how you going to I don't think we expect the level of ornamentation there that we have in the front, right? But I think that how we use the brick work like they did it before, uh, a little bit of a just different colorations, what have you to take advantage of to break up
116the massing, I think that's going to go a long way cuz the best brick work we have in the building, ironically, is above where the dumpster is. Yeah, exactly. That's true. So, uh, we're going to be the same. And that was chopped. Yeah, exactly. That was chopped. And I don't know what I can't remember what addition they put that little that little roof and that glass below. I don't know when they did that, but they chopped those beautiful arches off. Right. No. 772. Is that 72? Yeah, 72. So, yeah, I think that would and that would be something that we're we've got the brick work to to do something nice with it. So, and I would just second Eric's uh feeling that the more the the least amount of doors to the stairways we can
117have and still meet code. I would be very in favor of So, this might have been one of those times where I should have gone before you, but no, you really comprehensive. It was a really nice that was a good job there. Um um so so I'm just going to ask a really brief number of things uh in terms of some of the things Eric brought up. First I guess um Nancy mentioned and I know it's true that people seem to always grumble first because once bases show I would actually go the opposite direction. I think you guys have done a tremendous job of working with a very difficult project and trying to uh um um and Nancy you weren't say I know you weren't saying that they hadn't. I just I I know you're
118right that the human nature is to to see things and say, "Oh, but I want this to and I get right." When you don't get exactly agreed and I'm But nonetheless, I think you've done a really nice job. Um the question when when we were talking about the auditorium um just one thing in terms of acoustics and all acoustic engineers are working this or just I mean is this just a No, we have we have actually somebody as part of our project team and somebody that we've used before in regards to acoustics and yeah it's a consultant and theatrical spaces and just so everybody knows a part of our portfolio it involves um renovations of theaters um throughout um a lot of it's throughout the Youngstown area, but um you know, we we've done a
119lot of work at the um what what we in Youngstown called Powers Auditorium, which was basically an old theater. It was the Warner Theater um and it was retrofitted um into the Youngstown uh Symphony's home. And so we worked with that. We work with um we recently did the band shell and and um looked at acoustics within those spaces as well as um an addition to that which was Ford recital hall. So we have you know we have that experience on top of um experience in regards to K12 as well as um university work. So that's sort of the that's sort of our portfolio of work that we do. So, so it just it's it's not just restoring the historical grandeur and the architectural beauty, but also maintaining the the functional purpose of the room.
120And more than maintaining, enhancing it. Enhancing it. Yeah. Because right now, like, you know, Eric was right on target when he talked about the additions that happened, right, to that space, right? You know, they they put those little wings on the thing, right? And just to be Go ahead. Oh, no. I say the consultants who they they've used and she's done stuff with Severance Hall and Playhouse Square. So, I mean, it's not like somebody, hey, you walk it down the street, it's somebody's got a Yeah, she's very Yeah, we were able to sit down with her. Yeah. Right before I think right before I met with with um maybe uh with us. Was it before you? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We heard screaming stuff. You heard screaming? Not really. I could get loud. That's right. That's
121right. It was you. Um, also the when you're talking about the orchestra pit and the adjustable that that's known technology that has been used for a long time. I just it's worth people understanding that that's used in many many that particular product is used in a number of locations and and there's no it's not a weight there's not a weight restriction issue versus a hydraulic and and so it's a really nice product. It works very well actually and we'll get you know like uh the company's out of Canada so we'll get all that information prior to even going to the next step right all right because it becomes it it doesn't only involved you know the the music department and the theater department but it also involves you know these people that work in the
122orange area which is building services right because all of this stuff you know they're the one people that are in this building in every single room so we have to think about how it functions in regards to maintenance. Also, how you going to change the light bulbs and the chandeliers? So, right. Um and then, um I would I would echo uh Eric's statement about I think doing a schedule, a mock schedule to see what does it mean to get so if you move those lockers, what's it going to take for them in four minutes to get to the locker, get to wherever they're going? And it you usually it seems like it's the specialists that that cause the problems, right? You know, if you're going out to music and you have to get back up
123to the, you know, the other part of the building. So I think I think it's worth so so which sort of brings us to something that uh someone had brought up at uh one of the uh people who spoke at the podium. Do you feel that the the architecture is driving the archite the the educational program the educational programs driving the architecture and what's happening? Wow. Well it's sort of a combination of both. You know when you when you start to look you know you mentioned music right? when you start to look at music, you know, why did we locate music where we located it, right? Why is why is music here? Um, it's because of relationship to the existing auditorium as well as relationship to the ball field over here because we know that,
124you know, we know that the band is, you know, the band practices here yet they also go out here. And it's the same thing when, you know, let's just use music as an example. when we go to the fourth floor, you know, why why are we putting Vocal up here? Vocal's up there. I mean, it was originally planned for that. So, it's really part of the integrity of 1926 to maintain that, right? You know, we know that, you know, we know that there's a there's a there's a separation there, but the spaces are are so well suited for what and how it's being taught that sort of, you know, it's a it's a sort of two-way street. And then the um um the other thing when we talked about budgetary compromises, would it be fair
125to say and anyone can throw this out um is I think it's true that that when you first open up everybody's going to say, you know, I want it all. I I'm going to just go and that's appropriate. I'm going to go gung-ho. But as we are pairing down, it would be fair that compromise will be spread out throughout. This is not a I mean I think there's a there's a a tendency for people to think oh my gosh I have to do all the compromising but in reality what we're trying to do is maintain an integrity of program a maint and and actually enhanced programming to what we have now in in every which way I was thinking when Eric was talking about doing a an apples to apples po how many classrooms and
126you even start to bring it up it is an apples to apples because now we're going to have common spaces that you know the think tanks or whatever else so you can say Yes, we have fewer classrooms, but it's not fewer educational spaces. So, I mean, so I just I just I think I just want to make sure that everyone understands that I think everyone walking in says, "I want everything." And then when you get everything, you're over budget. So, there's going to be a point where everyone needs to look at what what are where you going to draw your lines in the sand. Where where is what's the most important things they have to make the these programs really what we want them to be? You know, Cal, I think that's the that's a
127perfect point. That's the sort of a conundrum of programming. It's, you know, and um uh there's a point and and we're nearly there at at a point where we need to um you know, we we started the programming not thinking about compromises, thinking about instead right sizing, right? And so, um let's truly look at what we need. Let's truly look at how we're going to use it. Let's truly look at what we're going to need. uh to support what we're trying to do. Nothing more, nothing less. Um and and so we've with all the working groups have gone through that justification exercise to say, you know, this is really what what we need. Um and so I I I don't see that there's a lot of fluff in the building because of go going that
128direction from the from the very start. Um, but there's a point after which and I think we're almost there where we stop talking about square footage and how, you know, how much space we need and start talking about here's what spaces we have. How do we really make them the same? How do we make them exactly what we need them to be? Because certainly some function is based on size, but other function is based on quality, scope, you know, other things, other attributes of the space. Um, so we're we're just about there now. And um and you know the first juggle is how much space it's lay and grab, right? Uh but then after that it's it's about the quality of the space. And then finally, how well are you going to insulate the ceiling
129so we can hear? I couldn't hear you. I just curious. Thank you. [Applause] Anything else? Thank you. Keep up the good work. Nice job. Thank you. Um, what I want to do is I want to take a five minute break and then we'll get the public comment and Okay, we're going to we're going to get going again. But what I want to do is I want to encourage people I I don't know what the feedback would be, but um we do we we agreed to allow 5 minutes per person and we would encourage individual persons to try to say what you have to say quicker than 5 minutes. So we would appreciate that and I think uh as we stand now the hour is going to get late on us. So, if you can say
130what you got to say in 2 minutes, you're you're my kind of person. So, we'll turn it over. Go ahead. And in fact, if somebody else has said it before, because we're taking it all into consideration and answering questions after the fact and all that, that we would appreciate that for everybody to not say the exact same thing, right? And what we ask is that um if it's a yes no, we'll probably answer it. If it's not a yes, no, what we're going to do is take that and then we'll post the responses on the website. So, we'll turn it over to our team, Steve and owners rep Jim, I mean Pat, I'm sorry, Pat. All right. U Thank you. Uh, Mr. Bo President Ron, uh, we'd like to first recognize the chairman of the
131facilities accountability committee, uh, Seikku. Would you like to say a few words? Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Okay. Okay. So, um, hey, by the way, I didn't see a Mickey Mouse on the clock tower there. You guys missed that one. Yeah, we missed that one. Um, I our job at the facilities accountability committee is to make sure that there's nine core competencies that are um, essentially being followed that were set forth by the board of education some number of years ago. And um our job of course is to uh go behind the decisions and make sure that they still follow those nine guidelines. So just so um everybody knows, anybody can contact me. Um obviously Angie Shaker and anybody else has my contact information, but we have nothing to do with like picking paint colors
132and any of that kind of stuff. We're a little bit uh broader than that. So I just wanted to um give our first report to the board of education. Real quick, I just wanted to say that um Steve Sharalis and Steve Zenoni um have been absolutely excellent. Um anytime that we've I've sent out an email or some of the other members have sent out an email, he's gotten back to us right away. The information has been broad and informative. Very little followup is necessary. They've been doing an excellent job. Um Angie Shaker also has been doing an excellent job as far as the communication. I think the um representatives you have from the administration are doing very good. Um the subcommittee reports, I'll try to go as quickly as I can. Um and uh just
133through the highlights from the um high school schedule and budget. Um at this time, we think that is everything is on time and on budget. It's progressing just fine. From a historic preservation standpoint, uh we just wanted to uh bring just a couple of items. Um there are some citizens that are willing to help remove some of the artifacts, murals, and other items of artistic and historic significance. Um just perhaps maybe having an opportunity for them to come in and give a hand. Of course, um you have to think about from an insurance standpoint how to manage that. We have no suggestions on that one. Um we also think that there um needs to be a little bit of time uh for the handover the high school um to make sure that we have an
134opportunity to go in because I'm sure once these gentlemen take over, fences will go up and people are definitely want to get out. From a fundraising standpoint, there is some need um for fundraising beyond athletics. um historic preservation um definitely is one of those perhaps to take a look at but right now we feel we are on track to successfully raise the 2.6 6 million, perhaps a little bit more. Um, from an MBA edge minority inclusion standpoint, we are perfectly on track for the 20% target. Um, but we of course feel that we'll easily go over that. Um, there are some, uh, requests from Ozanne directly, but, um, I'm not going to bring those up right now. Uh, for the community pool access, uh, we feel that we're on target, um, as promised from the
135board of education for the citizens to have access to the community pool. And um I do need to mention that the uh representative from the University Heights City Council uh felt that the decision to not use Pervis Park was um and I'm quoting her a little shortsighted. Move on from that one. Uh Silverle certification. We feel that we're very on track to have Silverle certification or better. Uh community engagement. Um there are a few comments associated with that one. uh we think that the website um is needs a little bit of a review and but we understand that that's underway. So obviously we'll go ahead and comment further on that once we've seen the new one. Um but uh from an overall uh standpoint uh we would like to see a bit uh better way
136for people to be guided to the website um as far as a communication that this is here particularly where to find it. The website's a little cumbersome, a little hard to organize. Most of the comments we've gotten from the community really surround that. Also, um a place for community engagement on the website would be for uh donations, fundraising, and volunteering activities and career tech. Um let's see. Uh some of this was already handled, but um one of the things I wanted to make sure was looked at was uh delaying equipping the new spaces um until phase one is near completion to determine if there are any excess funds available for things like that. Um as Eric's pointed out, there's a brand new fresh $650,000 coming in. Sure, people are going to want to do that
137one. and uh wanted to see if there was um any reach out available to Shaker or Warnesville school systems to fund a portion of the new spaces and have some joint use opportunities. Um and then uh last but not least um we did um review the complete program of requirements document and uh we did vote um 80 in favor without comment. Uh we felt from accountability standpoint the Perfectly represented everything that we're trying to accomplish. Any particular questions? Thank you for remind us of the meeting th Thursday if people want to attend. Oh yes. Um there I wanted to make sure um the meetings are this Thursday is our our next one. Uh the public is welcome to come and there is a question and answer section section excuse me at the end of the
138meeting for anybody to ask any questions they have and you can contact me uh personally through email if you have any questions and things like that. I've signed up and no problem. It's 7 o'clock at the board building. Thanks. Thank you. All right. Our first person is Joan Dusel. Hello. I think most people here know who I am. My name is Joan Drewell. Um I've had children in the school district for 22 years. 13 years at the high school. My youngest just graduated. Um, and one of the I know that there are many concerns with the program and especially with costs and one thing I definitely want to address is the the importance of the program with the arts. I know I have three daughters in um instrumental music, one in vocal music and also
139they all have been involved with the fine arts. So, is this a personal thing? Yes and no. because as much as those programs have benefited my children, I also know how much those programs have benefit the district in general and just the general reputation of the arts for the school and this community. So, I liked what I saw with the um with the plans with the instrumental music and with the fine arts. I can't address the vocal department as much um because I had less contact um with that. Um and the other thing to consider is the fact that you know with I like the the idea with with the pit with um the renovations. We have a beautiful facility but also the fact that there are other schools I know in Lakewood they use
140their auditorium for public events just like we can use the football field the auditorium um Lakewood Lakewood uses their auditorium for concerts regular concert rock concerts. Um, a couple years ago I saw a little group you might have heard of called the Monkeys who performed in the Lakewood Auditorium and it was a very nice um, concert that was there. So this isn't just benefiting our students, which it certainly will and it doesn't just benefit music students because we everybody uses the auditorium for something or the other, but it can have a p public use and then that can also bring in eventually more revenue to the district if we can use that space for community events. I know that more people will are here to address specific issues. Um, but I feel that that is
141an important thing for us to keep in consideration. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, June. Uh, Craig McGee. Most of you know me, Craig McGee, vocal music teacher and musical theater director here at Heights High. Brought a few of my friends because one of our board members and Steve Sharala said that the arts people have been quiet. So, we're here just to say we want to support and have you please support our kids. I cannot tell you the kids at risk that have been saved due to the theater and the music programs here. You'll be seeing one again a national star very shortly. We barely got him through high school. He then went to try C, kicked his way through there and then I wrote a letter of recommendation to very fine performing arts school.
142We'll hear from him one day. This year we have three students. three students that without your funding that you had given us would never have had equal access to the arts. One has a full scholarship and the other kids are both in school with hefty scholarships. We have to give these kids the access. I grew up where my parents sent me to Overland Conservatory for lessons. Lessons were important. Instruments were important. So, we've got to these kids are talented. But I would just want to address a few quick issues. We have really Mr. him and I, Danheim and Nancy Eisenberg, we've loved working with Amy and this process that we're going through. Sometimes though, she's not there cuz she's been in Chicago and then we show up and things have changed. So, we really miss
143Amy when you're not there with us. Um, but a few things. We're really glad to hear about a pit because in July we were told no pit, you've got to fight for a pit now, Craig. Give us ammunition. So, I'm really glad that you've acquiesed for a pit. It's just not used for a musical. I mean, if if you think that's what it is, it's not. We'll use it almost every choir concert. Um the band concerts, they want to use that pit. It's again what Joan says is we want the community space. And another reason that we're here tonight is because I've been told by Amy and Steve that there's constant um disengagement between the users, the teachers, and some of the community groups. And we want to can we please bring us together for
144this auditorium space as Joan said? And I have uh Pam F. She's still here. It's been a late night for everybody. I've been working with Heights Youth Theater. I'm going to bring her into the school on Friday to talk to the children in the middle school to the teachers to get the youth theater. We're about ready to lose Heights youth theater from here. Do their schedules and ours kind of butt up yet, but they're doing great things for kids. So, we're trying to work this out. We want a community space. I'll tell you, the art teachers out salivating on that third floor because of all that natural light. I mean, they have really hit a home run. Thank you for that. That is so important to them. I hear you guys are still like, "Well,
145maybe it might be going." Please don't. They're very happy. But what we wanted, Nancy Eisenberg, Danheim, and myself as representation of our school staff was a place where we could all be together and collaborate together, where the artwork, because if you look at the four musicals, the four uh instrumental concerts, the four vocal concerts, the gospel choir concerts, there's 11 major events in this school that these kids could be showing their artwork. It has to be a safe space. So Amy had left us with a nice little drawing that had us all together in a brand new building. Then we came back and it was changed. That was a goal document. Well, we were we were feeling really good when we saw that. Okay. We're not architects. We're not the the people writing the check.
146Sorry, Scott. But we're like, "Wow, we're together. We can collaborate." But we want to collaborate just like um Joan said with the whole community. I mean, at Lakeside, they had the spinners in. Earth, Wind, and Fire came here and they sold out. If we have a proper space with a pit, I don't care if it's old or new, as long as it's acoustically great. And what they didn't tell you, maybe they're trying to hide, but it's Sonia Winter who they brought in. She helped on the Seance Hall project. My friends and colleagues know of Sonia, and it was her, one of her ex-husbands, who brought back the theaters. So we are really happy that Sonia is involved here because she understands and this is what she told me. She said acoustics are a bunch of
147measurement evaluation and then a bunch of voodoo and she had me right there because it is you can do all the measurement evaluation you want with spaces, sound waves, rectangles and everything else. But what she is here we're happy and to hear about a pit. Thank you if we could work on wing space. But we we would like that we could all use 24/7 365 days height youth theater could use it. Um so please we're just here to say we love the arts and hopefully we we can keep again massaging this little plan a little bit. Thank you very much. [Applause] Jonesboro. Hello. Yes. Um my uh question actually I have two questions. Um and they relate to some things happening currently because I know that with the high school with the lead certification I've
148been been reassured that the materials used will be create a healthy environment physical environment um for our students that the materials won't be toxic. But in the meantime, my question was, as you do renovations to WY and then um any of the other elementary or middle school buildings, um I'm wondering if there's someone looking out um for what materials we're using that they not be toxic, that they not exacerbate um students current problems who have asthma, other autoimmune diseases, um other such illnesses. And I just have a quote here uh about environmental illness. This is from the plane dealer a few years ago and it's tips from Dr. Michael Royen at the Cleveland Clinic. One of the keys especially oh no sorry avoid materials household cleaners, rugs, air fresheners, even some furniture that emit lots
149of volatile or um hydrocarbons and volatile organic um compounds. As Rozen put it, you want to use cleaning fluids um to that are in fact safe enough to drink. So, in the meantime, um I'm hoping that we have someone who's being attentive to to these issues and whatever carpets being laid down and adhesives used in the other buildings that we are we can be sure that they are um safe. So, that's a kind of a question and a comment because I know there's been carpeting being put down in other buildings. Um my other um question and comment are with the new $3 million stadium. I hope Kristen Hughes had expressed an interest in this when um recognizing that having a large plastic field um has its benefits, but it also has its drawbacks as we
150know that Lake Erie advocates are concerned about plastic pollution and microlastics in the in the watershed and there's no way to keep the breakdown breaking the plastics that are breaking down from the field from going into the wershed. We were hoping to offset by a tiny bit some of that damage from that field with um a renewed uh Kristen said she wanted to see great recycling at the new um stadium and with within the athletic department. So, I'm hoping that um as part of those $3 million that you have a state-of-the-art recycling and trash um plan um and facility set up for September 13th and um would love to see us have an anti-litter campaign and educate all the athletes as well as our students about um why we can all that we can all
151play a a role and do our part to um reduce the amount of plastic pollution by making sure we're not littering and that we are recycling. Thank you, Joe. And I hope I don't get this name wrong, but I think it's uh Joey Nicolleti. Hey, how you doing? Joey Nicoleti. I recently graduated from Heights High back in June. And for those of you who don't know me, I basically lived on the fourth floor my four years at Heights. So um my main focus is going to be on the cedar level with the auditorium and dressing rooms and stuff like that. Um regarding to the music department, um my first question for the architects is looking at the stage. Does the shape of it change at all? Like does the size reduce? Does the uh little
152extra space in front of the main stage curtain reduce at all? Um because looking at the picture here, it looks like it's square as opposed to juts out like it usually does. Sure. Yeah, it's pretty quick. Right now, we're looking at maintaining the profile of the stage as currently stand. Okay, cool. Yeah, there were some other studies that we were doing, but it seems in the best interest for the overall project that it should maintain its original um shape. Cool. And then um also I'm looking here and it says dressing rooms and restrooms behind the black box in the scene shop. Um, they are tiny. Um, and I don't know if you guys have ever watched 32 girls in the same room at the same time trying to put on a costume and makeup and
153hair and all that stuff. It it it's quite a sight to see, let me tell you. Um, what were you doing? Because I mean actually if you wanna if you want to have with the limited space we have Yes, I have actually. Um because we are when we do the musicals stuff, we're stuck to the social room, the cafeteria. I've changed in a boiler room. Um and like a closet. So I'm, you know, kind of worried about that because as of what we have now, this space that we have and the access the public has to it um is kind of uncomfortable for us. You know, I don't want to see I don't want to have people looking at me butt naked when I'm backstage changing for a show. Um so there's that. Well, I
154I I'll just real quickly answer that. We're concerned about the same thing and we are looking at that right now. Absolutely. And then I heard you guys say that during a musical or a production the use of the blackbox and scene shop could be um available. Um how I'm a little curious as to that. Just wondering. Maybe not the scene shop because it's usually filled. Well, right. Yeah. But the black box uh you know sometimes a black box is an empty room. So it could be used for back of the house scene. Okay. And that kind of stuff. Um I took theater this year at Heights last year rather. And I know what the teacher wants for the space. And you know in that class we actually perform scenes. We make scenes. We do shows
155like little tiny productions. And I know he wanted that to be a very um usable space throughout the year, which would include during the musical. So, I'm not entirely sure if that would be a hindrance during that time, you know, because classes, not for me because I'm always a lead, but classes do go on during the musical. Um, so you know during that time we have sorry we have you know scenes going on and I know he wanted to use the blackbox basically five days out of the school week for you know scenes and shows and lessons even to do. Um so that's basically where I'm at. So uh thank you guys. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks, Jo. Evan Aden. Hi, I'm Evan Aden and I'm a current student at Cleveland Heights High School. Right
156now, I'm going to be a senior this year and I'm more concerned with the VMD as well, mostly the fourth floor. As I look at the floor plan, it looks like it hasn't really changed at all, which concerns me because we need a lot more storage space. Over the years, we've accumulated a lot of set pieces, props, um, costumes, and a lot of sheet music, which is stacked up in the hallways, um, on the fourth floor. And so, we don't really have anywhere to put that. So, it gets very cluttered. Um, as well, I think we need a little bit more dancing space for the singers because we have one room for the singers and one room for a choir, and dancing gets very congested and everyone's bumping into each other and it's kind of
157hard to figure out choreography and everything in that small space that we have. Um, that's about it. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks, Evan. Tim Conklin, please. Kim. Oh, sorry. Kim, apologize. Kim Conklin. Um, yeah, I have kind of one opinion and then a couple of process comments. Um, I saw one iteration of this plan that had the VMD actually on the first floor um with the IMD. I would like to see that again because I think it speaks to um the relationship issues that you brought up as uh kind of guiding principles in the design and um I think it would encourage a kind of a collaboration between the instrumental and the vocal departments and students in those departments that I think I just kind of imagine from a community point of view somebody who's
158not involved in the schools that it would seem odd to build a brand new building, virtually brand new, and have these departments split. It seems illogical to me. Okay, that's my opinion. the process comments are I'm I'm feeling like there is not a way for us as parents and community members to know how these results reflect the desires of the teachers and um in the teachers really and it kind of puts parents and teachers I think in an awkward relationship because of it's non-transparent. I mean, I don't this looks good to me, but I don't know whether or not that necessarily looks good to the teachers who gave you the input. I'm seeing some nods. I don't know if that's making sense or not, but that seems like a big gap to me, and I'm
159wishing that I had that information. Um and that I don't need to put a teacher or a department head in an awkward position of asking, hey, do you like it? Right. We we yeah we invited the teaching staff to you know they had formed workg groups, right? And and so um we invited them to uh meet with the architects on a regular basis throughout the summer and they've done that. they've been they've been coming in and and meeting with them and giving their feedback and giving their input into the design process. Um, so you know, no, I know that and I trust that and I think you did a fabulous job at getting the community input as well in the springtime. But what I now don't know is when I look at these pictures today,
160these drawings, how closely do those reflect what those teachers said they wanted? because I trust the teachers. Well, not 100%, but we're getting there, right? We're still working it and and um you know, we've got more to go. You I mean, I think it's along the lines of the kinds of questions that I would suggest that this we might want to answer this question online. I think we can spend some time thinking back and forth. Well, if if I could say, Ron, just one thing, Kim, obviously you were here all evening. That was sort of a lot of my push in the earlier um proddding for the the process conversation because that's very important to me um and to all of us but I think um maybe going forward when we have these presentations what
161we can say is and I know when when I've sat down with John to look at these things early my qu my questions are almost always are are the educators happy with this? Who am I going to hear from who's not un who's not happy with this? Um who are we, you know, and those are the types of questions that that I know we all we all ask. Um but I can guarantee you that um I'm comfortable that for the most part those compromises are being made. I know that that's that's not going to make you happy here, but I think going forward we need to be be more explicit about the compromises that have been made and then the people who have had to compromise need to um accept that at the phase that
162we are or not and continue to advocate. But we we're you know I think maybe if we can be more explicit in these presentations it might be helpful. Is do you agree? and and I think the the a statement on the process to address that particular issue might be important too. So we can work on that. Um and it at least would be out there so that when we come back next time um either that question like Nancy would say either that question has been sufficiently answered or we still need to do more with it. uh and I think what we feel certainly as a board and I think our consultants as well um is that there there there's still this interaction going on and you know one of the issues that does come up
163is who has to who has to give up what and when and how does that happen who makes that decision so I think we can spend a little bit of time just kind of going back and just saying this is how we this is how we got here so to Right. And then my my second process comment actually was um to that point which is to say I've I think um that it would be beneficial to more often um what I've observed is that all the special interests kind of like go through this central point like meet with the architects, right? And I think often if those special interests were placed together to speak to each other that this would be um be there would be quicker um compromise actually because people have multiple interests.
164They're in these groups to speak for a particular interest but in fact they're mostly parents and citizens of the community who have multiple interests and will be reasonable. you know, you're almost like putting people in a position to be, you know, solidly representing their special interests, you know, like a lobby. Yeah. No, that's an excellent point. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Kim. Sam Bell. I'll Sam Bell. I'll start off by very briefly echoing some of Joan's comments, Joan Smurl's comments about uh the carpeting in particular at Monaceel that's going in right now. Uh among other things are other areas that are being carpeted, the music room with the trombone players with the spit valves. Um not really a great idea. Now, I know we don't have a sustainability administrator in place yet, but could we
165maybe think about maybe getting somebody like a don't do boneheaded stupid things administrator in place? That would be really helpful. Thanks much. Bye. All right. Thank you, Sam. Uh I this name is lined out, but I'm going to call them anyway. Uh Liche Tenegro. Yeah. Oh, she's okay. and Sarah Linds. Okay. Uh, Greg Guli. Hi, I'm Greg Guly. Um, class of 1980 Heights High. My wife is class of 83 Heights High. We have two kids in the in the high school now. One's a senior and one's a freshman. I wanted to tell a little story. Uh, Joan was talking about public use. I remember when I was little, my dad took me to the Monteello Auditorium, which was big then cuz I was little. Um to see Stan Kenton and his big band. That was
166a little while ago. Um I did want to say um about the arts programs and uh particularly the various music programs that uh there's obviously people know this now as a very strong correlation between kids performance in music and kids performance in mathematics and I think that those two can strengthen each other. I've seen it actually in my own kids and um I know there's plenty of studies that support that and I think by giving sufficient emphasis to the arts we really do enhance not only our kids enjoyment of their high school experience but also their performance in their academics as well. Um, I wanted to emphasize that an auditorium, a stage, a se scene shop, a rehearsal space, those are learning spaces every bit as much as a classroom is or a ball field
167is. And please, when it comes to uh budget time, give that due consideration. And uh I also the last thing I want to say is that uh making sure that our our uh arts programs have um modern facilities and modern equipment really enhances the relevance of the education the kids get there. You want to make sure that the things that you teach your kids, the equipment that they're using is something they're going to see when after they graduate. Um, I've done a lot of of really minor theater stuff with improvised equipment, and I wouldn't even start to claim that that equipment is a good thing to provide to a kid who's really trying to learn uh things in the arts. Thank you very much. [Applause] Thank you, Greg. Ann Payne, she had to go. Oh,
168all right. Uh, Linda King, she had to go. All right. Uh Marcy Denton, right? I have two points I I would like to make. Um the first since we are getting into this kind of minutia. Um many of us women have been to public events where there performance events where there are intermissions and the line to the women's room is always longer. Thank you. And it seems like a silly issue, but it really does get to be an equity issue where the bathrooms are designed as such that there are some women who cannot use the bathroom before intermission is over and the men are in and out like that. And I can't help but wonder if it's not the same for our students with their bathrooms when they've only got four minutes between classes. So
169I'm asking that um perhaps this firm could be even cutting edge and trend setting in its design of the bathrooms to make them equitable for the women and the men. Main point for me being here though is again to um reiterate how important it is to do whatever we can to sustain ma maintain and even improve the quality performing arts program we have here. Many years ago, when my three children were just entering high schools, I wasn't sure if this community was if this if the school district was really for us or not. Wasn't sure how long we were going to stay until Mr. McGahi had kids from the elementary school in the chorus for the musical, the high school musical. And my son, I think, was maybe in fourth grade at the time, and
170I walked in and said, "Oh, yeah, we are staying." And then later it was when um my son was in middle school at Monaceel and Monaceel at the time did not have a PTA seeing all the kids up there on that stage and it really inspired me and I thought okay we're starting a PTA and I'm about to have my second year as PTA president at Monaceel. I brought my son Garrett to freshman orientation at Heights today and I remember that first time we walked in. It was a comfortable, wonderful place. And I really don't think we would be here if it weren't for a fabulous arts program welcoming us back when he was in elementary school. So, as we're keeping things in mind, please really remember to keep those arts a priority. Thank you.
171Thanks, Marson. Alan Wilkinson. Again, Alan Wilkinson, several things. Two areas in the PR you mentioned you were over. That was the art room and the auditorium. Is the cost per square foot of adapting them less than the rest of the building, thus making them really not an impact to your bottom line. the fact that you're using older spaces and not I don't know the answer to that question but um it would sort of say that cost per square foot is lower having more volume there is not a big problem heating if you do the heating and ventilation system that reduces energy usage by a factor of 10 which is the target square footage is not a big driver or volume is not a big driver in terms of long-term operating costs so it's in that
172first cost thing and this may not be a first cost driver but it's a question to ask parking was a big part of the last meeting didn't come up at all this time. It has a big impact on the site. Mechanicals wasn't discussed. It's space, as I understand it, it's underneath the cafeteria, maybe partially under the library. It's on the Washington Street level, but it it's it's space that I think and it's big enough space that you ought to sort of see where it fits in there. Roof line and its uses, the use of the roof. Um, important discussion that hasn't happened yet, at least publicly. And daylighting is a consequence of that. Um I go back to the two points I made last meeting. Uh cost impact drivers in a design process that didn't
173really come up in any kind of conscious dominant way in terms of your decision-m. You know what what are the the architectural things that are driving implementations that have special costs? You know, it seems like cost has got to be a part of this discussion every one of these meetings and it's not happening particularly education function collaboration came up tonight but education function is still not being addressed in a meaningful way to sort of see these spaces mean what educationally and then I can go on and make my extra pitch about building as a teaching tool not a part of the discussion because educational program is not a part of the discussion. um CTE and science you know they've moved that there was a layout earlier which put those in in spatial location that location
174has gone away understand the reasons for the changes but if there's an educational collaboration that is so well tested over at least a century that's the connection of technical education to science education I mean some of the other administrative drives to do new mixing of of science with other things. We have a lot of new fads that go through. We want to be sure that the traditional successes are not compromised by new fangled imaginations. Um so that's that. Another piece um another piece is really career technical education. Some of us had discussion about that. And just as the arts folks have their discussions, our dominant constituency in our school system, I believe, would be most served by more technical education and gives them a chance for a living wage in the future. There's an equity
175issue at this. This is a this would be a transformation in consciousness for our district to see CTE on par with every other academic uh um endeavor that's in the district and I think it serves more kids. So I don't know why we wouldn't embrace that and go forward with it. So, back. Thank you, Alan. Uh, Jody, I can't really read the last name. Is somebody named Jod here? Yeah, you must. And then it would Next would be Mario. Uh, Mr. M. I'm going to mess your name up. Mario. Is Mario still here? Is Mario here? He was here. He was here. He was here. All right. And we have Anita Pontra Moly Terry. I'm sorry. So, my name is Terry Premoly and I first want to really uh acknowledge this room full of smart
176people. There's not much that I can say that hasn't already been said, but I would like to say I have spent a lot of time in orchestra pits all my life. Um, and I do know that orchestra pits are important, restrooms are important, practice rooms are important. Um, the blackbox, I can tell you, uh, I work closely, um, with people running a blackbox at TRIC. It's a very limited thing. I would, um, not, it's a buzzword these days. Everybody seems to think they need a blackbox, but frankly, I think we would all be better served if we would use that space for our more theater oriented things the tie in the program. Um, I also just kind of think that the the core of this emotion here is over the arts. Cleveland Heights has continuously
177produced wonderful people in the in the arts. The community feels it. The school is about it. Um, so I think to really make sure that this is done right because this is going to be done for the next 40, 50 years, um, I just hope we all come to a good understanding. Thanks. [Applause] Would Terry also like to make any comments? I was saying she did it for Yeah. Got you. Got you. Okay, that's that's all we had. Uh, Mr. register. Okay, great. Thank you everyone. I I see a hand out there. Um you you've already spoken. Are you okay? Well, that's good. Asking you can I have that one more point? One minute. Less than a minute. One other piece. I talked to Amy about it already. A process piece. Have the working groups
178do written evaluations of the design. possibly two iterations of that or or an iteration at the right we might be at the right maturity for that but we don't we aren't getting the closed loop understanding of are the users really satisfied with the outcome okay we got it I think anything else anybody else okay that's fine anybody else everybody's good thank you okay then uh I will Entertain a motion to adjurnn. So move. Second. Okay. Mr. Gay. Mr. Cobalt. Yes. Mr. Pepler. Yes. Mr. Register. Yes. Mr. Silverman. Certainly. Mr. Zooker. Yes. [Music]