April, 8th 2026 Board of Education Work Session

001Good evening everybody and welcome to the January 8th, 2026 Westerville City School Board work session. Mrs. Welty, can you please take the roll? Starcher? Here. Goodright? Here. Kleinhenz? Here. Deegan? Here. Near? Here. All right. Can I please have a motion to approve to suspend Robert's Rules of Order? So moved. Second. Kleinhenz? Yes. Starcher? Yes. Deegan? Yes. >> Near? Yes. Goodright? Yes. All right. At this point we'll go into work session. Okay, thank you. And just so the people watching know, work session just takes us out of having to be as formal and can have conversation a little bit more organically than what Robert's Rules requires. So, we're going to refer to the outline that I kind of created just to kind of keep us in focus of of what we want to work through tonight

002is our whole conversation is related to our facilities and decisions that you know, we need to continue to work towards to address our needs. So, I guess the first thing I think just to kind of frame the conversation, I think it would be helpful for me to just very briefly review kind of where we're at and where we're not, right? So, we talk a lot about our facility needs. To be more specific there as we we have one building that is less than 40 years old and that's the high school that we're in right now, which is a great building that does require upkeep, but it's a great building. The rest of our buildings are between 60 and 110 years old. We have attempted a couple different times in the past 5 years to address

003some of our facility needs through tax levies that have been unsuccessful and so, you know, as I kind of one of the things you hear me say a lot is even though those have been unsuccessful, our facility needs haven't changed. If anything, they've kind of continued to become more burdensome, right? As we have facility needs that need addressed. All of our facilities need some repair renovation. That's not unusual in any school district. I would probably say though Keen, Melrose, and Parkview have some needs and we are addressing some of those. As an example, as we're putting a roof on Parkview at this time, we're doing an electrical upgrade at Melrose this summer. But have been are somewhat manageable and again, partly the size of the buildings make them manageable as well. Edgewood is not a

004perfect building. There are people here that work there that definitely could say that, but at the same time, it's better than it was. We do have full HVAC there. There have been There's new roof, there's new electric and so it's in a pretty good position that still could have some needs. Our primary focus definitely is Cornerstone Elementary. Cornerstone has been in existence for over 100 years for us. It was built in 1920s as an elementary school. When I got here in 2021, the discussion of how to address our facility needs and really master planning from that was really focused on Cornerstone well before I got here and you know, to some that know a lot more about the history of Westerville than than I even do, probably was a discussion for the last you know,

00530 some years as well, right? You know, what I have really observed and and continue to to state in the last several several months is the facility at Cornerstone is in need of significant repair and renovation if we intend to stay in it. And we really can't wait longer to make those decisions and do those things. Um you know, as we have started to have more significant costly issues just to keep the building open and those are not going to go away. They're going to get more significant. So, I don't feel we have time to really wait for you know years and years to make this decision and you know, in other words, punt this down the road. And so we would have to think about that pretty pretty strongly right now. We estimate to

006repair Cornerstone which really would mean warm, safe, and dry. It wouldn't really be improvements or change the overall structure. Would probably be about 26 to 27 million dollars. Or the quote was about 25 and a half 6 months ago and then with inflation probably a little closer there. And that's if everything goes well. As one of the things as I did talk I did talk to the OFCC as you know, we've we've been it's been brought to our attention that you know OFCC helped a renovation a small school in New Richmond in southern Ohio and I called the OFCC to ask some questions about that and that was almost 85% funded by the state which our funding is 31%, but they said they ran into a lot of un unexpected contingency cost as you as

007you would when you I mean if you have an old home, you you recognize and have that as well. So, our facility in summary, our facility needs has not changed and probably have increased in the past [clears throat] 6 months. And so, you know, that's kind of why one of the reasons obviously [snorts] we're we're here today. Probably the reason we're here today. In the fall with our previous board and then that has continued to be evaluated by this board I presented some different facility options that would address our facility pros and cons to all of those. We talked about renovating at Cornerstone. We talked about two different building options, a 345 building which was in the mid-40 million dollar range. We talked about a K5 building which is a about 80 80 well, about

00890 million of total money, but then OFCC would offset that a little bit. We also talked about modulars as as a kind of like temporary permanent solution that would be obviously a little cheaper that would you know, move us out of the building. So, those were presented. You know, the previous board I think wisely knowing how challenging that those decisions would be, did not feel it was appropriate to make a final decision at that time. And so we've kind of been evaluating it as a new board you know, I I I will say just right now that I think this this board is definitely doing a great job of thinking through this and trying to make educated decisions and it's a it's a tough start to the board term and just happen to make these

009really challenging decisions. Then we talked at all another thing that with with that is what's how would we would pay for the whatever improvement that we would consider doing. We talked about what we would call a cops loan or or cops payment which is a certificate of participation which really means that we would basically somewhat take out a loan pay it a yearly cost which you would be eat out of your operating money to do an improvement whether that was a building an improvement to a building modulars you could you could use cops for those different things. We talked about a tax levy which is you know, on the next you know, kind of agenda item you know, pursuing you know, public support for you know this project as as something that is kind of

010the I wouldn't say it's elephant in the room because we've talked about it, but it is a very bless you. Big challenge to this is you know the state the amount of money we're receiving in state is continuing to decrease. We're going to move to the guarantee which will mean that we really see no increases in state aid. The the fair funding formula was frozen at 22. What's that all mean? It's decreasing revenue, right? At the same time you know, operation costs go up because of inflation. And so you know, that that's one of the reasons why if you're willing to get into why why there levies in Ohio is because you can't bring in more money than you have in the year or than the year you pass it and inflation so over time

011that happens. We're on so we're on that back end of the levy cycle where we yes, we have some money in the bank, but we are spending at this point our revenue is less than our expenses and so we are planning for that ultimate need at some point for a operating levy, right? And just to remind you that operating cost operating levy is more to operate. It's it's you know, staffing, turn the lights on, those kind of things where you know, a bond or facility project only pays for a facility the facility itself, right? Operating you can actually use for anything, but really you target that more from a you know, programming and staffing. And honestly, when you think about kids that's really important. Right? I mean, our buildings are really important and we talk

012about that, but we but we also talk about how great our staff does and there are many here today and I really appreciate you guys coming that do great things in buildings that have challenges. Doesn't mean we don't have to address them. We do have to address them, but good things happen there. You start losing operating money that really can start to impact the programming and services that you can provide for your students, right? So, we're mindful of that. So, there's there's that extra extra factor that makes this a challenge, right? The decisions that we have to make. So, we've considered you know, a levy, we've considered cops kind of transitioning us into the second you know, outlined section here. You know, last month in March you guys approved you did not approve a bond

013resolution to go out for a levy. What you approved was really just Amy and I direct us to get more information and work through the process so that we could go out for a levy in November because that takes two official resolutions that are not something that we whip up in 5 minutes without additional support, right? And so, really that's where we kind of left off at that meeting and then we scheduled this work session to talk more about that levy and whether we will pursue it, how we would pursue it if we choose to. And what do I mean by that is there's different kinds of taxes that we could consider, you know, asking the community to support. There's income tax, there's property tax, there are earned income tax, there's combinations of those that

014we, you know, we wanted to consider. We definitely did not feel ready to have that conversation at that last meeting. So, we wanted to have that for that. Another thing we've talked a lot about which I think is going to be very important regardless of the decision that's made with the levy. Is plan B. And really what I call plan B and that's kind of the third step which we'll get there tonight. Plan B is how we address our facilities if we either didn't go for a levy or we didn't pass a levy because I think what in the past two levy failures you know, we didn't have an official plan B and so the status quo remained, right? We We didn't pass the levy and then we stayed in the buildings that we were

015in, did some repairs that we absolutely had to but we really kind of had status quo. The status quo at Cornerstone does not work anymore, right? So, if we are not going to you know, have a levy whether that's a decision that made by the board or voters there has to be a solution in my opinion that addresses Cornerstone. Either fixing it which this board has has kind of communicated that's not really of interest and I would agree I don't think that's really the best use of our dollars or we have to have a solution that does move out of that building if plan B if the levy is either not pursued or not successful. So, that's kind of where we are. Just you know, I know the board that's that's all review for the

016board as they've been thinking about this a lot probably the last few weeks but just to make sure everybody's on the same page of where we are. So, I think that moves us into number two which is consideration of the tax levy and you know, obviously board I sent you in the last week or so you've gotten a lot of information on a lot of these topics. So, just in a in in a folder so you know about different things and we can share those as well publicly as we as you have questions today. But just kind of opening it up there to talk about the K-5 levy to start. Levy, K-5 levy or just a levy period? >> I think I think right now what we have on the potential is the K-5 doesn't

017have to be, we could switch that but right now that's where we left off that it was the K-5 levy. Well I think that the community has told us twice that they have little interest in that for whatever reason. You know, we haven't been able to convince them that was high need or um they just can't afford it. So I was I'm thinking that moving forward with a levy would be a real challenge and um considering the amount that both of the last two bond efforts um went down by um I would think that um that's probably not a wise choice. That's just my opinion. Yeah. [clears throat] I I mean I guess I would say um you know, probably a month ago I was all about the levy. Um you know, I had a

018lot of optimism about the levy and you know, just as I as I've talked to more people as we think about the the potential property tax reform that could be on the ballot in November, I think about the noise that we could be fighting with a levy in November. You know, property taxes I mean I don't know that they will but there is a chance um that that will be on the ballot that they could go away like but yet we're asking for property potentially property tax dollars. Um and I also I mean you know, to Rick's point we did just have a levy last year. Um and I just I worry a little bit about us being able to be prepared fully prepared and successful by November even though I believe it's right for

019us to build. Um I just I worry about us not being successful and then again kicking the can kind of down the road um farther. And and on top of that and you mentioned this I mean we we know we're going to be asking for operating dollars in the next two to three years and if I have to think about a trade-off of you know, funds if the community would only support us once and I'm I'm not saying that they wouldn't twice but if they would only support us once I feel like the operating dollars are more critical at this point um than building dollars. So, it just it just makes me nervous that if we you know, we go do a do a but then okay, in two years we're having to ask for

020operating dollars. What is that going to look like? And so, those factors together just make it hard to think about a levy in November for me. So. Yeah, just to clarify um a couple things for for not just you five but people watching. So, um conservatively I would say we would say fall of 28 is a levy and aggressive meaning like if we're able to, you know um save some dollars here and there probably and not have a lot of spending we aren't expecting probably fall of 29. So, just so people kind of know when we're talking about that timeline of where we're at that's probably where we're at. Also, I think I would mention besides property tax reform which would be through a referendum. There is also a lot of movement in the legislature

021I think to try to address property taxes but keep them and some of those would be honestly concerning to us as well. I'll use one as an example. We have all continuing levies in Wooster um which means that once they've been voted in and it's a it's a choice. You can do renewal type levies, you can do continuous. Wooster has always done continuing levies where once they're voted in we they continue to be collected. Now, that also is why we have not seen inflationary increases in our levy collections because that used to count against the floor. So, when you hear about the 20 mil floor that was people that had renewal levies could experience that inflation. We did not. So, we were continuing levy. There is a bill out there in Columbus that some people

022feel that it would it's not appropriate to have continuous levies anymore which would mean that if that bill passed we would have to go and get our continuous levies approved every so many years. Um like a renewal and you know, just the the facts of that is is obviously you know, that could really change how you budget and plan when you don't know if that money's coming in, right? So, and there are others as well but that's one that I think for this district is one we should definitely be paying attention to. Thanks. Thank you for adding that. This other other thoughts either from Clayton? Yeah, I think go go were you saying? >> Well, I was just going to say that um you know I think the health of Cornerstone building has deteriorated to

023the point where we would be if if in fact we would have passed a the first bond attempt as a board the community would be anxiously awaiting the completion of that project to get um the people out of Cornerstone. And we've kicked the can down the road here for a number of years. Um when I worked here we we were repairing Cornerstone. There wasn't any thought at the time about replacing it. That all happened after I left but um I think that um you as a superintendent inherited a tough task and I do appreciate you really moving forward with this facility stuff. Um but I do know that um we need to get the people out of Cornerstone and um I don't think if we were to have a bond and wait till 27 to

024collect and to start building that pushes the can down into the 2030s which I don't think we have time to healthily I mean to keep people in that building. So, that's just my Kate Clayton, were you going to say something? Um not. I was going to kind of So, the continuing levies aspect since we have all continuing levies that would be why our effective tax rate is so low compared to our past rate. >> Correct. Right. We have a lot of that. We have a lot of support in the past from the community for these but over time the millage you collect goes down cuz you only get your dollars. >> think we voted 80 mills and we collect like 35. >> Right. Okay. That's understandable. And then we might be looking at since they're

025all continuing if there's potential we might have to reestablish all of that. Correct. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. I don't want to mean to go down a rabbit hole but is that is the continuing levies is that kind of common amongst districts? Do a lot of I mean so and again this is this is not is impacting beyond us. I'm just curious like I mean, so I mean obviously state's looking to change that. It's going to impact multiple districts. I I would assume. I think it's a little this little stereotypical for me to say and I'm saying this somewhat more out of experience, but in like our area a lot of rural districts have done renewals and have kept them at the floor. Like the district I worked in Wadsworth for putting most of my career before

026I came here and they're also the same all continuing levies. Right? So I think maybe your city districts or or larger have been more continuities, but I don't think that's a full across the board statement. >> Yeah. I think it's different everywhere. Where I was superintendent, we functioned on three emergency renewal levies. So we were to the ballot every two years, but the community knew that that's what happened. So they continued to pass them, but they were smaller, but that's just what that community you know was using at that time. Yeah. I guess I'm just thinking if the state's looking at that, then I mean it's obvious that multiple districts are in that scenario. Yes. Oh yeah, we would definitely not be the only one impacted for sure. Just to address address the comment about

027a levy. Um A ditto what Rick said that you Gabe have inherited this building problem. And I mean building meaning increasing over time and literally the building problem. And um shown leadership and it is appreciated very very much because you have really worked at this and appreciate that. You inherited it. Um On a personal note, I am just of course in a moral outrage over the fact that we are kind of stuck in a situation in education where I don't know what to say. We're getting information from like five or six different places and it's all very inconsistent, but it meets some short-term goals somewhere. And so I just find that saddening and worrisome because I continue to believe education is fundamental for all students and I just will not leave that position cuz it's

028so important. So I'm very sad. That being said, following the levy, I spend as much time as I can just like thinking and talking and I guess I have to say Um that passing a levy I think would be very very difficult. Um for a maybe a dozen reasons. Um And that bothers me. I guess I feel like you feel Jody because education is so primary and important that it's kind of hard for me to believe. Um but I just don't My feeling is I don't know if we can pass a levy for a whole bunch of reasons and it is a short period of time to prepare and there's a lot of complicated factors associated with trying to pass this particular levy. So that's what you're asking, but Yeah, I think I mean right

029now that's yeah. Wrongly I feel it would be difficult to do. Um It's really difficult to communicate. It's really difficult to get the specific information that all the different listening groups have. That's another thing I've kind of like There's 10 kind of different points of view and they all have a very different perspective. And that Venn diagram is not overlapping. So it's like multiple messages and how to reach all those people. That feels difficult to me. Um and then just the nature of what goes on in buildings every minute, every day, every week is vast and huge and important. And um I guess that's all I have to say. So I question a levy and I worry that it might not pass. I mean I'm in support of education totally. Um I believe teachers and

030students deserve the best environment hands down. It's not even a question for me. But I'm forced to say that I'm not sure a levy would work which makes me feel bad, but that's really what I feel. I feel sorry. No, I was just going to say it. >> sense. Yes. I mean for for me I guess I want to make sure that I'm clear that it's it's not that we're not up for the task of doing a levy or at least for me. I mean knowing that it we know it would be monumental. Um we know it would be difficult and it's not that we don't want to invest the or I should say I not we. I don't want to invest the time and energy. I think it's more about you know, if if

031we feel that strongly that it won't pass, we're losing more time. Like that is that is where I'm at. >> I would agree with that indeed. I'm [clears throat] totally willing to expend the energy. Yeah, but but it's like then then we lose eight months. Eight months more. Eight months more. Right. Right. Cuz we we just right, we started this in 2023. >> Indeed. >> Yeah. No, you didn't. I just thought it was important to clarify for >> And I want to clarify that I'm absolutely up for that task, but the biggest hurdle for me is just like the communicating the need to the various listeners. Be able to get it passed. Indeed. >> Yeah, right. And I I do think I understand that. Yeah, definitely it's not a for anybody. If we don't do

032this, it would not be an effort issue. I think time is is a factor. As actually when you were saying something Rick, I thought something that was interesting. If we would have passed the first levy, we'd be opening corners we'd be opening a new building right now in the fall. Mhm. Um At the cornerstone site. >> At the cornerstone site. Right now that's not what the community wanted and so that's not what happened, but just to let you know where you know, when you think about that timeline. Another thing I think that is if we if we do choose not to pursue a levy, I think it's going to be important to communicate the the why of that and I think one of the whys of that is going back to my first comment earlier

033of operating is like I think we need to be very transparent that operating is not something that you know, we have five years plus to wait on. Right? And and that is vital for this district to be continue to be able to provide the services and quality education that people are so used to having. Right? And because what happens, I mean it's it's just the reality. Every time you attempt a levy, that's political capital. Right? And it's and it's uh And if people are frustrated by this ask, the last thing we wanted to do would be impacting that very crucial thing that will happen within a few years. So I think it's going to be very important that that is not something we don't talk about. We talk about that need throughout the next few

034years because that should not be a surprise as you know, we're we're going to do everything we can. Yes, we have Yes, we have Yes. >> of people. Yeah, consistently. It's a fair point. Yeah, go ahead Colleen. I would I would echo that sentiment as it comes to like the timing we have facing us to get to the ballot box in November with a levy as opposed to then turn around 18 months later revisiting it. I I do think like our when it comes to focus on passing a levy, the operating levy is definitely front of mind for me. Like that's we have to we have to pass that. And I think we'll see tonight. I think there's solutions that we can come up with where maybe we don't need a bond levy, but we

035can focus on the operating levy farther in the future. I agree. I think passing a a bond levy is going to be very difficult. We've asked and we have asked and they have said no. And nothing has changed. The economy is still the same if not worse if that is the concern. People want their children to have the best here in Wooster, but I'm not seeing anyone opening their pockets to that right now. So if if If so I want to confirm. I mean in you know, like what I'm hearing is you know, we were initially thinking last month at this time that we would be bringing resolution one on April 21st. Um based on this conversation, I'm not gathering that's what we're going to do and instead we're going to talk more about plan

036B here in just a minute. Would that be Is that accurate? For me that's that is. That is accurate for me as well. I agree. I think plan B is the better plan. Come back to plan B. I mean we agreed on that. A 90 million dollar bond is not what I think we need to pursue in November. But I think I I was obviously in agreement with that, but I think by moving [clears throat] on to potential of a plan B um the board um and the district is also listening to the electorate that they said no twice. So at this point doesn't mean that we won't down the down the road, but at this point then that potentially is off the table. Okay. Well, I am prepared to talk about plan B and

037have shared some of that information because whether you would have wanted to pursue a levy this evening or not, we need to talk about plan B because we had to be prepared for that. So you know, plan B and this are going to be high-level conversations tonight. I mean obviously there would be logistics on either selection or combination that we would definitely have to work together on, work with our staff on, our parent I mean it's not you know, all vetted out, but we really came up with two general options for plan B. And again, the purpose of plan B is moving out of cornerstone as as soon as possible. As I even though I know the general renovation costs, we have not done a lot more with that based on your previous feedback that

038corners, you know, investing that in cornerstone was not really the you know, the way you wanted us to go. So we have two different considerations for you that that we can talk through. So the first is building additions. So, when I say building additions, I mean a true permanent structure that is built onto current facilities, okay? Um we really did we did two different um kind of scenarios that would kind of get gave us two different estimated costs costs. I do want to make sure we all know these are cost estimates. When you think about like it's a lot of contingencies that go into this. Our architecture firm has been very gracious to do a lot of these things, but you know, there's you know, there would be more that we would need to do

039before I could I could give us our final number. The two options we considered were a addition onto each uh of the three remaining elementary schools, uh Keen, Melrose, and Parkview in order to um basically take a portion of the Cornerstone students and continue to keep three K-4 buildings. Okay? Um the preschool is not being forgotten about. There are different options where we could put the preschool depending on the choice that selection. We could go into more detail of that, but again, I want to kind of stay high-level here uh today. We could even keep the preschool at Cornerstone for a few more years as that is a newer part, although we're having facility issues there as well as we've had some uh flooding and some other things in that area this year in that

040basement. Um the the to build onto the three elementary schools, um it would be about 30 to 31 million dollars. Um which obviously is less than the other things we've considered um and would keep all as a K-4. Um pros of that, you keep your neighborhood schools. Um uh it keeps kind of the current elementary structure that we know and that our staff is used to. Um negative, it's the most expensive of the plan B options. Um and it also I think we we do believe we can do all of the options I'm presenting to you. We believe we can do with our current programming and large spaces. When I say large spaces, like my biggest concern at some of the elementaries is like, you know, all of our elementaries are used for cafeteria and

041gym at the same time and they are not big. I mean, some of you here from Parkview, Matt's spent a lot of time at Parkview's gymnasium. That's a pretty small gymnasium, right? And it's also our cafeteria. So, we do think we could do it um but it would it would um you know, be very tight. So, that's that's one option and it would keep 5 through 12 in the same structure that it is right now, right? Um Edgewood and the high school. The other building addition option, and I want to note we don't believe um that the building addition options would get OFCC approval um because those buildings are that they would be built on are not part of the long-term master plan. When you think about OFCC thinks about things 30-plus years down the

042road, right? And so, even Edgewood, even though Edgewood is a building we can plan to use for a long period of time, it it's um it's renovation cost versus rebuild is over 2/3, which at that point OFCC recommends rebuild, right? So, even though that's not on our radar at this time, they're probably not going to give us funds for that. Um the other option we've considered uh on the building addition is to build a wing in the back here um where um we would be able to put um two grades, um sixth and seventh grade at the high school. Um I think it I would want to again, don't get too specific or visualize. It doesn't mean that that's where the sixth and seventh graders have to go. It just means you would have to

043build enough space that you could put two more grades here. That could be where your sixth and seventh grade go. That could be where your, you know, social studies and English departments go at the high school. I mean, it just means that you, you know, you build enough space for that. Um that would basically go where the greenhouse is. Uh nothing against the greenhouse. Uh we we appreciate that and we actually just got some some uh free roofing pieces from Seaman Corp, but when you look at trying to keep something close enough to the to the actual building um and to be able to build on and all those logistics, that's really the place where you would have to do that, okay? That is about 25 million dollars. All right? Um Uh and again, no

044OFCC. We would if we went out for a bond, we could go out for bond for that or if you did cops, you could do you could do a cops purchase for that. Um I guess before I move in do would it be better you want me to just talk tell the modular option as well or do you want to go through the building one first? Can we just do that? Just Well, the you want me to I mean, do you do we do it like stop for questions or do you want me to go to the modular one as well and do them both so you can >> the only question I would have. So, your building at the high school, your elementary's configurations would be what? Um your great question. You're at the

045high school, if you did that, you would move sixth and seventh grade up here. So, then you would put three, four, and five cuz remember Edgewood can do three grades uh pretty much whichever configuration you do. So, they would become a three, four, five building and then your elementaries which are would stay the exact way they look now would just house kindergarten through second grade, Right? Yeah. Yes, which um if you go back to our unsuccessful levy last year, that was technically the plan, right? The three elementaries were going to be K-2s, Edgewood was going to be a 3-5, we were building a new middle school. From reviewing, is it correct that whether it's modulars or buildings, those kind of configuration plans are similar? Yes. >> Between and I'm not trying to be two and

046three. Yes. There's one we did one third we did a third configuration with the modulars just because there's a little more flexibility to do that, but they're pretty similar. That's what I thought. So, really it's a discussion of cost and permanency. >> Yes. One thing, you know, and I get this >> separate from like educational benefit, which I consider separate, which I won't ask about now, but I want to. So, it's cost and permanency. >> Yes. So, one thing I will say about, you know, the building additions and if some people are like, "Well, hey, that's a cheaper option. Why haven't you guys considered that one before?" I think the the reason is is I I'm not saying that it's not the option we should consider today, but when you uh think about master planning

047and what you would want to do for your your district, that would not be the first thought of putting a wing onto those buildings that are in existence at the elementary or at the high school, right? We can make it work um but I think when you think about permanency, that's why it hasn't been considered in the past. Doesn't mean it shouldn't be now, especially with all the factors that we just talked about. Does the if you were to um >> [snorts] >> build [clears throat] onto the high school, would that kick the can down the road? It wouldn't. As far as getting people out of the Cornerstone building? Good question. Uh it would take about 3 years from the make time you make a decision to do that the same as if a building

048addition is is going to take about the same amount of time as a new school, right? It's [clears throat] it's uh you know, it's a it's full new construction. I'm not convinced we have that time. Yeah. All right. That's just me. Yeah. Um So, and and then once those are built, again, those are pretty permanent and if you're thinking about what's like in the long run, it might not be the right time, but someday I I do believe I my recommendation is the the plan that we considered just last month is an appropriate plan. Parkview, Keen, and Melrose are are not buildings that we will see in use in 50 years. I don't I would be very surprised at that, right? And so, when you think about true long-term master planning, at some point, it

049just may not be the right time, but at some point, that K-5 building I think does make some sense. Um I I think it is an important to note we did not put it at all in any of Amy's as Amy's been Amy's been playing with a lot of forecast on purpose just based on all these different choices you could make. You know, we didn't put in we do think any of these will create some efficiency savings because you're closing a building, right? Um but we didn't incorporate that. Uh we've cuz we the reason I mentioned that now is we've talked about that with a K-5 building, too. Obviously, there would be efficiency savings. So, transitioning to modulars and then maybe just open it up for you guys's conversation. So, two of the three modular

050options are very similar to what I just presented to you with the building options, okay? So, one modular option um is putting enough modulars at Keen, Melrose, and Parkview to make them K-4 buildings and accommodate the Cornerstone students. Um the [clears throat] uh uh you know, again, same kinds of pros and cons in terms of, you know, neighborhood, but the concerns as well as in that area. Um that's again, just like it was more expensive on the building, it's more expensive on the modulars. Uh we we do have an official quote on that. Um we've been working on that the last few weeks cuz we wanted to get that to you as well. About 7 million dollars would be the cost of that and that's what they call turnkey. So, that's that's the that's the

051sewer lines, that's, you know, water, electric, all of those things. The only and the only thing it wouldn't, which I think if you if you did anything that would be an adjacent structure like a modular, it's going to be very important that we're wise in how we do sidewalks and awnings and things like that to, you know, obviously uh for movement in and out. The other another option we considered of modulars was again, the same as the building one, put the two grades um uh where the uh um greenhouse is. Uh that is the cheapest option in the modulars. It's a little over 5 million, about 5.2 million. Um the reason that they're less is um it they take if you do new building or modulars at the K4 it takes about 36 classrooms. Um

052if you do um uh that in the back it's 28, right? And it's just so it just because as you know, programming changes as kids get older, right? Um the third option we can we have with modulars is kind of a hybrid of that uh where you would put one grade in the back and then you would put um a smaller amount of modulars at the elementary schools to make them K3 buildings. Um and if you did that you would do a 4 through 6 Edgewood um and a 7-8 kind of junior high concept and then high school. Um you know, I I think it's important to note that again there's pros and cons to all of these, but if you did choose anything with the high school, um I mean all of these could

053take a lot of educational logistics and work with our staff and all of this to think about how to do this smoothly. But you know, one of the things that we have heard in the past is eighth grade at the high school is not preferred. Now, I think we have came a long way in what eighth grade at the high school looks like. It's much more um you know, its own area than it used to be. Um but uh you know, it's still people talk about that. Well, if you add other grades, that's going to be the same as well. Now, we would work to try to keep them isolated, but you would have to use large spaces like the Golfer gym and stuff like that even with that. Okay? Um and you can pay

054for modulars outright. You can use cops. Um you know, uh their tenure it'd be a 10-year cops instead of 30 like a new building. So, anywhere payment between uh 6 and 700,000 a year uh would be for that. So, um you know, in a way I think you know, modulars is uh people think trailers and they are trailers. They would be double wides. They would have restrooms, hallways. They're connected. They're not separated, right? They're all together. Um um but um you know, they have came a long way. Um I again I don't know that I would I'm sure it's no one's permanent solution, but I think it's a uh at least a considerable temporary solution and so that's why we brought that option as well. So, all of those both building additions, modulars, or even

055a combination which I didn't, you know, pursue, um would do the one thing that I think is uh on our minds, which is Cornerstone. Uh timeline for modulars, it's really the biggest challenge with the modulars is the same as the building additions. It's it's just it's a the logistics. It's not the actual facility. Um we could probably cuz those modular companies are are built on emergency, right? I mean, hurricane comes through and you know, they get you back in school. Um we we would have no problem having modulars in place by the 27-28 school year. So, basically 1 year. Now, the reason really that 1 year would be more there's planning to do and things to do with uh trying to figure out, you know, um how we would do that. And and my my

056take today I would if you on any of these solutions if you you really want us to pursue one, um that's great, but I think that whether it's a building addition or modular unit, um there is some continued um due diligence that I would like to do before we bring you, "Hey, I think we should do this configuration." Um it's not that we didn't want to continue to do that work, but just getting to this point I felt like I'd wait for more direction before we dove into that next step. And to clarify uh could you do please please no no no no Um I think you said this, but how would we fund the building addition? Uh we could well, you could go out for a bond um or you could do cops um

057which uh would be between about 1.5 and 2.2 million a year um if we did that depending on which solution you picked. And then would that bring the operating levy forward a year? It would. So, if you chose the modular ideas if you would, um there'd be an opportunity for your staff to have input into their thoughts on that? Oh, for sure. I think we would, you know, um we would have some conversation initially on just like the first step would be figuring out which solution we want to do, right? And then once you figure out that solution, there's a ton of work Yeah. on the back end of well, how are we going to I mean, think about it, you know, I see a transportation person here. Think about how we're going to, you

058know, pick up drop off and bus. I mean, there's there is It's I'm not overwhelmed in a bad way, but it's overwhelming to think about all the things that we're going to have to think about if we go in that direction within a year, but we would have the year. As one thing we've talked about at least, you know, I've thought about before is if you try to levy and then you failed and then you did, you know, a modular for example, they might get here by that time, but I'm not sure you can put a good plan together in 6 months to do that. So, it'd be another year. >> Yeah. I've seen modulars other districts, but what I will say is um the work that Brian and you did with the modular at

059Keen, um was really good. I mean, that I mean, the appearance and the safety and the fences, I mean, I think that was a very good I never realized you could do that cuz I worked at a place where we'd had those. It wasn't anything like that. The kids are walking through gravel to get in. Sure. Yeah. We would definitely want to be a pretty thought out. And we I would I would tell you that when I say if modulars are between 5 and 7 million, um I want you to know there would be some contingency costs for those kind of things that would be really important, right? We want to make sure that, you know, we would have all that safe and dry and things like that if that was where we went. You

060said that modulars could be used by the 27-28 school year. >> On the other side, how when could an addition be used? Um probably the 29-30 school year. Um uh maybe if you did it we you possibly could do a mid-year move. Once you get design fully done, it takes 18 to 24 months. But we're not done with design, right? So, we'd have to do design plus that. So, that's where I say typically 3 years. And now, Triway did just did a mid-year move and so it's possible, but there are challenges with doing a mid-year move as well. So, probably the 29-30 school year. So, that would not to be that would be 2 more years in Cornerstone while we wait? Correct. How much money have we spent? This is one of my little things

061and I with all respect to the staff at Cornerstone and I love teachers and staff. Okay. Um how much have we spent just in the last I don't know year? Did you tell me once and I've forgotten and I apologize just repairing these emergency situations? >> Told you about the the at Cornerstone. >> Yes, the uh Ballpark. I don't mean to put you on the spot and I apologize if I am. I should know like I can get it. I've got it. Unless Mr. Madigan has it before I can get it, but >> it was it was considerable. Is that right? We've had numerous floods. We've had a bunch of things. Oh, we spent over 100,000 just on the mold testing and mitigation itself. We spent uh without we spent over 50,000 on two rooms

062last year that had I-beam repair, 107 and 109. Um we put a $120,000 roof on it last >> 400,000? >> Oh, for sure. 500,000? I mean, I'm trying to be >> 500,000, yeah. >> without being disrespectful about money or cost or anything. Okay. Yeah. So, then if we waited till 2029 to do the building project, we can anticipate 2 more years just like simple math that we might have to spend another couple 500,000s to fix the next problems over the next 2 years in addition to the cost of the building. It's a It's a good way to >> but to take it to the kindergarten level, which is my math. Yeah. Literally it for 2 more years we'd have to keep [clears throat] fixing things while we wait. >> Correct. On top of everything else.

063Yes. So, what's the um I don't want to be simple here, but what's the simple what's the quickest way to get people out of Cornerstone? Uh to decide to do modulars and give us 18 months to plan for that and open without Cornerstone as a part of the educational platform in 27. So, 1 school year. So, cuz next year's 26-27, so it'd be the next year. That's that's the quickest. Well, Can Miss Can they be sold? Did you tell us once or did Mr. Madigan tell us once that they sometimes can be sold? Yeah, so when you get modulars you either rent them or you lease them or buy them. Right. Mhm. If you buy them, there may be a market to sell them back or to sell them to somebody. They would have to

064have their approval on that. And there is cost to disconnect plumbing and electric. I was going to say next question. >> Okay. Right. It's not as easy as hitching them up and driving them away. They're they're anchored in. They're on uh at the you know, if we were to go that route, the amount of time we could use them, I mean, the building code would say they'd have to be on a concrete foundation. They have to have a concrete foundation anchored in a little bit more with the utilities and everything. And they're permanently plumbed in? Well, indirectly I'd say permanent. Indirectly. I apologize. Directly is the word. Okay. Okay. So, so yeah, I don't know what you would get for them at that point or I don't know. But not having a long-term plan, we

065would be buying them because we do not I agree with you. It's my fervent hope that there is a time when we can reconsider. Yeah, I I >> But we I when that is. So, what's the sense to lease these in any Lease does not seem to be financially incentivized from what we're seeing so far. So, I would probably say we're going to If we go this route, we'll recommend buying them. There's not a huge difference between the prices of those three options. No, there really isn't. >> Not much. Right? I mean, not really. Really, the only part The only advantage on rent on leasing to me is that typically there is a how they get rid of them cuz you have to get rid of them as well. >> Yeah. But you you would

066have to know your kids, right? Right. There's no way. Bonnie, I'm so sorry. Forgive me. Forgive me if I What what would be the grades of the children using the modulars? Um depends on the configuration we use. So, if we like So, if it's if it's at the elementaries, it's an easy answer. Um well, it'd be the K4. I would I really want to be careful not to go too far into that because I think that's all part of the educational programming, but my assumption is you're probably going to put your older kids outside. Your kindergarteners probably aren't going into your modulars, right? Um if it's at the high school, I don't want to say yet because I don't I think it would be um it would not be fair to say oh, that's just

067where the sixth and seventh grade are going to go because they're coming up here. It could be I think what we have to weigh is we'd have to weigh the programming, but also trying to keep sixth and seventh grade as isolated from high school as we could. Um and you know, so it could be sixth and seventh grade, it could be seventh and eighth, it could be a couple departments at the high school, it could be a combination of those. Um those are details that we do need to provide you and the community. I think that's just all part of that next step of planning that really we would be doing together. Yeah. I think I'm more concerned about the safety, especially of small children, and we occasionally do get tornadoes and things here. >>

068Yes. They're trailers. >> Yes. So. Yeah. I know that like when we when we added the one at Keen, we talked about like that was something we thought about when we were deciding who was going to go out there, right? Was you know, the age of the kid and then how quickly they could get inside was going to be a part of that. And then as you see at Keen, if we did this, you know, we would we would put fencing and other things up to really make it from a safety standpoint a part of the building so they can't wander off, it can't be a you know, really an open access. It's really a part of the school in itself. So. I mean, it's not it's not perfect. I mean, it's it is a

069modular, right? But it there are things you can do to try to make that, you know, uh a more enjoyable like transitional experience or you know, uh from that standpoint. Part of that 18 months though would be um staff input. Yes. Yeah, there would I mean, look, there's a there'd be a lot to do. I mean, you're closing a building, you know, I mean, some of you out here have been a part of closing buildings before, right? I mean, that's that's a um there's a lot to do with that. How do you got to place teachers through that um and and staff and and then obviously um all the logistics of, you know, what you would be doing with a building addition or modulars. You're overall still using your current footprint with additional classroom spaces.

070Mhm. So, the utilization of your current footprint is going to have to be more precisely done. Right? I mean, think about it if if right now, okay? Keen has so many PE classes and then it stops for lunch and then there's so many PE PE classes again, right? Um if you're going to add kids to an environment, you're still using your educational spaces that you have. Right? So, those decisions are going to be happening either way. Whether you If you did a building addition >> all the staff input, all the scheduling, all the bussing, no matter building or Building or modulars, those things will happen. Correct. Is tonight Are you seeking just an understanding between permanent building and modulars only or are you also seeking input on option one, two, or three from us with

071respect? Um I would say at the very least I was hoping for clarification on the levy, which I think I got that. Yes. And then I was hoping for um direction on modular versus building addition as plan B. When plan B was enacted really relates to the decision on the levy, which now we we know, right? Um I would say today I am not needing you to tell me if you like option A or B of modulars versus building addition. I am happy to have feedback cuz I think that feedback's good, but I think that's Indeed. Indeed. >> to tell you which one I think is the way to go. I I I can tell you that really when you look at if if you decide to go building addition or modular, whichever one you

072do, at that point cost you've decided the big part. It's really at that point what's the best programming option, right? At that point. So, I mean, what's the difference? I mean, it's still money, right? But like if it's a million dollars more to put modulars at this situation than that one, that's or a building addition as well, right? >> Indeed. Indeed. Well, um my final thought here would be I'm not giving up on the K5 option for the future cuz I think that's what's best for kids and what's best for W- the city of Wester, but at this point um I like your modular plan and um I the idea with building on to existing would be that as a taxpayer, old taxpayer, um if you're building on, if it's bricks and mortar, then you're

073telling me that that building now is good for another 30 years. So, don't come ask me for a pre-K option if you're putting bricks and mortar down on those three elementaries. I think that's pretty final as far as a decision for a taxpayer. So, but I don't think the modulars is final. It does give the option to do to do what's best for kids um when the community decides that, you know, they're willing to to invest in a long-term beautiful plan for our kids. Yeah, um yeah, I I would agree with Rick. Um I mean, I I have said it multiple board meetings. I am not fans a fan of modulars. I've I've said it last year. I've said it multiple times. But again, I you know, we have a lot of choices in front

074of us and we have to make the best balanced choice and I do think that it's important for us to start to move ahead. We've been talking about Cornerstone for close to 30 years. We know it's time. This gets us out of Cornerstone. It gives us more time to plan about what the right next step is. I do think that there is some I mean, there has been a lot of good work on the facility plan and like everybody else has said, you know, Gabe and his team have done an amazing job, but I also think that there is some perception that we kind of keep coming back with different ideas, right? So, we had one plan in 2023, we had another plan last year in 2025. Now, you know, we're here again. Um and

075I just think it gives us some time to back up and say what is the right long-term plan based on property tax reform, uh you know, funding of public ed. Like it just gives us a little space, but it is not permanent by doing modulars, you know, and hopefully we can in three or four years we can get out of those modulars. So, you know, we're talking five to seven million dollars. I think we believe we could save one to two million dollars a year in some efficiencies. So, we're going to pay those back pretty quickly. So, from an ROI perspective, it kind of makes sense. Um not ideal um from my perspective, but I also I I can't remember who said it, but some some people said that the modulars are almost nicer than

076the buildings that our kids are in. Um I was in a modular in Edgewood and I got a good education at Wester City Schools. Um so, it's it's not the the worst case. Um and I think it just helps us move forward. We It is time for us to move forward um with something. And so, I just feel like it at least gets us moving in that direction. So, I am supportive of of the modulars. I would I I I'm paper I'm not a fan of the modulars either. Um it If we're talking about a three or four year gap, I'd really want to examine renting them or leasing them. But if if the thought is we'll build the modulars to hold off to just to solve the Cornerstone issues we have and then we'll

077have only a few years before we're thinking about building something else. Well, we have to pass our property tax or our operating levy in two years. >> And then is there if we revisit that, I I have concerns with putting the modulars up, especially if they Are they going to look like colored like the ones on the website? Or are they going to be like It's all choice. plain. So, like those type of things like if we color them up and they look nice, too, I'm worried they're going to look and they're permanent. They call them permanent. The person selling to you would call them permanent. We're going to pour foundations. We're going to pour sidewalks. We're going to plumb. We're going to electrical. That starts to look like a permanent building. And what does

078the manufacturer tell us the expected life of this building is? Cuz you're saying they're not as disposable as as people might think, right? >> Correct. I think 10 years is pretty reasonable [clears throat] for sure that you can use them. I mean, you can use them longer. I mean, now I'm not saying it's a great example, but the Melrose library has been used a lot longer than that. >> [laughter] >> But uh um like warranty-wise, they're um five years for like HVAC and roof. Um you know, so and I guess that's a good point, Clayton and and Jody, just to kind of like I think realistically I would I would hope within three or four years we are revisiting this conversation. Right. But the reality is it's not going to be three or four years

079until you're in a new building, right? If we've got If we've got two to three years until an operating levy, you need to focus on that. Now, you could do a combo, but that's down the road a long down the road to think about. If you do them separately, you know, whenever you do pass again, think that three years from the passage date of a building in order to, you know, get in it. So, I would say conservatively, you know, even if you know, we would happen to things would I think get better in financing public education here in the state of Ohio and there would be some changes that would benefit and and and us and and other school districts, six or seven years it's is not that conservative. Yeah. And in in that

080vein, then then I start to think, okay, if we think 10 years for these and they're roughly 7 million, well, three times 10 is 30 and three times seven is 21. So, now it starts to look about the same as the 30-year solution in cost of building something, right? And like they If you I'm sure you're not going to wholesale replace them every 10 years, but depending on the repair they have or the the level of repairs they require or the level of maintenance that they require, you might it might not be that different over the lifetime of of the two builds, right? I don't I kind of like the idea of the the the building something against the high school. I think you're using your newest building, right? You're you're attaching it to your

081newest building, not the ones that are going to be 100 in 30 years. And I think that uh in that concept, do you Does that add-on include the frontage, the parking lot reconfiguration? Does it say Wooster Middle School or does it become Does everyone enter over here type concept and it's a 6 to 12 school? Cuz we see a lot of the county schools have built side-by-side schools, right? Where everyone is physically in the same building. They have may have different entrances or may not for middle high school. There's different examples around. Is it And I think that if we if we go if we go that route, we're going to we're going to have to wholesale move move the middle school, right? It's going to have to be repositioned. Is it going to re

082Is that Is that have an office back there? So, what I can tell you really the quote is pretty rudimentary and it is basically number Well, in an office, but it is but it's not it's nothing and talk talking about frontage or like how this middle It's just simply if you have this many classrooms and an office space and you build based on square footage cost today, >> [clears throat] >> that's what it would be. So, there would be some additional Again, contingencies will happen on both sides because these are pretty rudimentary. And we're going to do parking I mean, I think about like is it going to have Is it going to feel like a separate So, if we do that, does it feel like when you go around there, okay, this is the

083middle school. And now we're entering the middle school side. Otherwise, I'm kind of worried the middle school just it'll be lost for the for what it is, right? Yeah, I think one of the thing that does worry me a little bit when you think about some of these schools that have built either K-12 buildings or middle high schools is they were built with that purpose in mind. And this building was not built that way. I mean, there there, you know, there was consideration you could add on to Wooster High, I'm I'm pretty sure when they built it back in the '90s, but I don't you know, those would be a challenge They'll be a challenge whether it's modular or not. It's that you wouldn't have if you know, like when we talked about originally if

084we were going to build a K-5 and you or you were going to build a maybe a three-grade building like we talked about at one point months ago and then you added on to it. If you knew it at that time, you kind of can prepare that build that way. Yeah, and I think at the scale that that requires, I think I think more to the board's discretion for how to spend our general fund money, how to acquire cops loans. If we spend some of our money and they're looking at 20 to 30 and we're talking about a cops loan less than 20 million, that payment's not super high. It might capture for us a more permanent solution. And when we talk about the bond levies, only 20% of people vote. So, the middle 80%

085of people aren't aren't registering an opinion. I'm I'm not uncomfortable in the cheaper scenarios where we say, "We've made a decision that brings longer-term benefits. We're not going to be talking about this in five years. We're going to make a permanent solution and the cost we achieved is cheaper than the renovation of Cornerstone. Just to be fair, right? With contingency, it's 36. That doesn't address several areas of the building that we have actually spent money in. I mean, the foundation is not addressed. It has a zero next to it and we've already spent money under there. I feel more comfortable taking that that position of we've come up with a more cost-effective plan. We're say we're spending less money than the proposal to prepare the building we have and [clears throat] we know that it

086will buy us a longer time and the cost scale of the cops loan if we put some money in is I don't think unmanageable. And we can and it goes to the operating levy and then you can pay for it. It's going to be part of the operating, but it's it's a it's a part of it, right? We put some skin in the game and we're only asking for a part of that operating levy, probably under 20% of the operating levy, maybe under 10% of the operating levy that goes to that. Are you talking about now? Like if we did the building project now or >> if we said we're going to move forward with a building project, like we'll do scenario two so that we're clear on what we're talking about. We're going to

087build the smallest square footage addition by doing a two-grade, not a three-grade. And we're going to put some money in the game. We're going to invest 5 to 10 million of our dollars into it. That will set our timeline to operating levy. We only need a smaller cops loan then. It's not It's not a 90 million dollar loan. It's not a 5 million dollar year payment. It's something more on the edge of maybe less than a million a year in payments. And then that will set our operating timeline, get us started on doing the building. The building still may take more time than building a module in the next year. But some scenario between between one and two where we maybe take a strategy like that is not unpalatable to me. May I ask a

088question to make sure I understand? What I'm hearing understand what you're saying. No, no. It's It's last, right? No, I I do think so, right? It's It's not to say, "Hey, we're ignoring you and we're taking a loan for 90 million dollars that you need to pay for soon." It's, "We hear you. We're investing and the consequence of of our investment to meet the needs of the children is that our operating levy will look like this soon." when we talked about it before. Mhm. was almost higher than the levy. Because people felt completely disregarded. At least when there's a levy, some people can vote and if if it passes, even the people that voted no, at least it went levy. I I agree personally I can understand it is a smaller thing and it should

089work. And I'm not saying I'm in agreement or disagreement, but I felt like the outrage about cops was the largest outrage because the people were like, "You don't even what we're saying." And I may not think it's a lot, but some people will feel it's more than it is and it is money. So, I'm only trying to bring that to this as well. I Oh, yeah. >> I don't even completely disagree with it, to be honest, as an educator and board member. It's a fine point, like maybe there's a way, which I like to solve problems that way, too. Like maybe there's a way, right? Yeah, it's And I don't disagree with that, I'll be honest, but I have to say like it makes me a little bit anxious cuz cops really pissed people off.

090Well, and I think the concept around it cuz they felt completely minimized. And and I totally agree with that sentiment, too. When you build a ground when you go green field building in the tens of millions of dollars completely, right? Cuz we said we proposed those things and and they said no. And I think when we when we look at it from the perspective of I'm hearing a lot from the rest of the board that we need to take action sooner and we need it we need to do something now. I I think it blends a cost efficiency, right? We did we did the lowest cost thing. We built the minimum amount of square footage necessary for what the the students need. And we have to do something. Because we could do all this and

091we could do our bond levy and fail it and we'll be having this conversation in December. I agree. I think that many people were upset with the idea that we were going to build without asking them. That there was a lot of outrage about that. I agree. Yeah, right. Yeah, it's Yeah. I'm I'm kind of hearing the temporariness of the even though they're permanent modulars, I'm already hearing the temporariness of that situation as we sit here. So, then we're we're going to spend money anyway. I think that's the hope that it is temporary. And that that could go away cuz it sounds to me like within [clears throat] the next three [snorts] years, we'd like to at least put our toe back in the water of a bond for a K-5 building. So, should that

092happen, then then we're back to that if we were to build something, then we have extra space at the high school because we don't need that anymore if it's permanent. I actually I actually think the 6-7 and the middle school here opens the door to the K-5. And then it completes the whole thing. You have all new square footage, as new as the high school. We could We could do the 6-7 here with modulars, too, right? >> Correct. You could do Right, you could do that concept there, too. I Yeah, I would have a hard time with cops cuz I heard a lot of negativity about that, and um superintendent who was a part of that actually talked with me about that and said, "Be careful." So, I don't know. You know, I would say

093I'll do what the board wants to do, though. I mean, I would say I one thing I am looking for is just to I I you know, cuz the one thing we all do agree on, and these are really good points, and another good night of conversation is I would honestly encourage people to watch the past several board meetings >> [clears throat] >> and listen to how you guys have thought through these things, and and to come to what I think is a very challenging decision. You know, I I I think what we do need is we do need some clarity of how to move forward um because again, because of the conversation that started this whole thing, which is, you know, where we're at with Cornerstone. What I what I think I'm hearing is

094I understand And I mean, look, by no means is is I mean, I'm not saying that one plan is better than the other, but um you know, the you know, modulars does have a temporaryness to it. Now, technically, I think that we want that, but we want to do it well if we do it still. Um I will say that when if we if we go that route, which does sound at least like the majority, I I will think it would be valuable, and I can show you that, Clayton, and everybody, um the rent cost for versus the purchase cuz I have nothing against how you know, if I mean, because I don't think there's anybody if if we leave this tonight with the clarification that we are not going out for a levy, and

095our plan B is currently modulars, um I don't think anybody is going to you know, have a celebration of that. That's I mean, that's not what we would probably hope long term for our students in Wooster, but you have to make decisions based on what you have. Um but I think we could think about whether or not how permanent that has to be. But again, I think our primary focus has to be um whatever it is is is Cornerstone, operating levy, Mhm. and then the long-term future. And even though I I you know, I I think both plans that we presented to the public did think about that that like I'm talking like the pet didn't pass, right? Both of those addressed those things. Um it wasn't where the community was at the time for

096a variety of reasons. And so, we're we're trying to solve the problem the best we can um in the moment with the information we have while still thinking about the future. Yeah. I mean, I guess how how clear do you want to be tonight on the modulars versus I I guess I mean, some of the things that that Clayton just brought up around 6-7, you know, being back here, and if it if it was all separate, I mean, there would be certain shared spaces still. Cafeteria. >> Um I mean, I get you know, I'm I you you bring up something that's interesting cuz if 6-7 was here, then Edgewood, and then we do K-5, then You can still We have two buildings. >> Same building, yeah. Now you have greater efficiency. Yeah, right. Right. Um

097I guess I just I hadn't thought about it in in that way before. So, but I guess I'm just wondering I mean, you hoping to get a clarity on Yeah, I mean, well, in in the end, it's it's your guys's call, but I I would say, yeah, we would I think our team and and I think uh we we would we would I think we can best continue to present you the most appropriate educated um recommendations if we know which direction you you you want to go. >> We are building a building here. It's a permanent middle school building. Mhm. A fine building. So, that wouldn't I I want to make sure I'm clear for that. That would not be connected I I Yes, I was just trying to >> Or would it be a

098added because I for me, if we're building something, I plan it to be what we want. Right. And I think what what you put together wouldn't necessarily be probably what we'd want. never not be in the channel of what you know I want. Like I wanted to be a thing. And now if we're building something permanent behind the school, I I don't disagree with you conceptually, but in the end, we're building a permanent building behind another building that doesn't even have I don't know. I would say if if if we're going if we were going to go the route if we were going to go the route of building it like not connected to, Yeah. even if it was two grades versus three, I would actually probably recommend revisiting the site plan for the middle

099school, which was there. And we're starting all over, right? We're just kicking the can down the road. Right, we are kicking. Yep. Kicking the can down the road. >> Yeah, because what you had presented to us wasn't really I mean, it was more classrooms. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, now if that's connected and if we go connected But if you move the sixth and seventh graders, now you move them Now you have a middle school here, and I think we should acknowledge that it's the middle school like if we go that route, and 6-7-8 are here, I don't want to lose the middle school in the I agree completely, for sure. Right. But that takes us across the street to a building, and that's going to cost money, and we don't have money. Right, and that keeps

100our Which is why Right. Unless I'm missing something. The modulars will have costs their whole life, too. Especially if you try and maintain them. They would be have to replace them sometime, I think. >> You might have to buy one. We're going to need And I'm not saying they're costing more. Like, they probably cost less, but you get a longer timeline out of other things. They're going to you know, we'll want to keep up on the maintenance properly with coating them in the summer and winter each year. We're going to probably want to have service contracts or war not warranty, it'd be service contracts and stuff that they will need, you know, If we are building a new building, we have to do a bond issue. We cannot use cops because we have been told

101resounding no by our community is what I'm saying. I unless I've missed something. Has Did that occur? I believe people were vehemently opposed to cops. Is that correct? So, we're I'm I'm not disagreeing with your point because we've done this. And at one point, I tried very hard in some meetings to wrap my arms around I'm going to do this anyway cuz I know it's right, like I tell my kids, "I'm sorry you're sad. I'm doing it anyway cuz I'm your mom." Okay. So, like I really tried to wrap my arms around the concept of we're telling the community that we're borrowing $40 million and paying it back without asking your permission. And in essence, that is what we would be doing because if we build permanently, we don't want to hide it behind the

102high school cuz that's not what our middle schoolers should have. So, now we're across the street with Love, which is where a middle school should be if we're building a new building, and it should have a sign and a parking lot and all the things. So, now we're back to a bond issue or cops. And we might try to do it for less, but we're not going to really do it for enough less. Not really. I'm not saying that I'm saying bless your heart. I'm like I'm not happy cuz I want a K-5 building, and I want all the bells and whistles for all the kids and all the teachers. So, I'm already in the zone where I'm like struggling as an educator, but nonetheless, I'm trying to do what is prudent now, not what

103is my goal. Right? Because we have financial constraints. So, in essence, if we do a middle school, that's what we're doing. We're back to cops or a bond. You're saying, "Let's just do cops and try to not spend too much." I mean, your your contention was it's a possibility. >> Yeah, I think we should put money into it. I don't think we should finance the whole thing. I think we should spend at least $10 million. $10 million? And take the rest from the cops loan. That sets our operating timeline. And then it's 15 if you could almost start to argue that the efficiencies in the plan will cover the cost of the cops loan cuz your payments are down to 1.5. If you can take it for 20 years, you're going to be under a

104million. And I think the cops pushback was like, "You're building a whole building for $40 million or $90 million." Which I would like to build the K-5, too. I think that's that's the best thing. Like, that's the best thing. And I don't again, if if I'm a person walking down the street, I can buy into that personally, but I'm not clear as a board member that I'm doing my obligation by agreeing to that or thinking it's the best option simply because there are so many unknowns. There's so many different factors. There's so much we can't see or predict. I don't disagree that we don't know how long we will have trailers. Again, I bless bless your heart or you know, yeah, or all the memes. I'm not good at those, but whatever one we need,

105I'll use it to say how sad I am to have to be saying yes to this. But nonetheless, this is where we are, and I fear because okay. We we would like our community be unified. We would like our parents and our members of our community to believe. I would like the senior citizens who live here to know that educating kids, that's their future, Dr. Dennis Plummer, all the things. Like I like we want to come together here on this somewhat. And every And I said this a bunch of times, we all kind of have to come together. Education is an investment in everyone's future forever because your children are paying my social security and all the things. So, education is vital, but things are so kind of acute right now that we're struggling with

106money, but I would like to try to think about a plan that everybody can ultimately give a little to buy into so we are unified as a community because it does matter. It does matter to every person what every kid does because they're part of our community, and they're going to grow up and live here and work here. And I mean, like I kind of believe that a little bit because education matters again. So, I fear the cops because I fear the backlash, not because I don't want a K to 5 building because it doesn't matter what I want. Mhm. Really, at all. And I'm I'm totally comfortable with that. It matters that I'm doing the best thing for the district, the teachers, the students, the parents, and the community. That is and that has

107proved to be really difficult compared to 50 years ago when everyone kind of thought the same way. That's perfectly fine. So, how are we to build a sense of community and agreement? I I don't even know if I know, but cops makes me nervous. That's all I can think of to say. I'm sorry if that was not what you wanted, but I just and I know that the trailers are an unknown, but at least what we're trying to do is an understandable next step plan to give us time to think about what we need. And I don't disagree, a building would take us to a K to 5, but if that's the case, I want a real building. I don't want a building behind a building. Or and I'm not saying that Mhm. anything you're

108saying. I'm just like >> to be more thoughtful about it. >> I certainly, if I'm building a building, want it to let yes. And I don't know how to do that. And I don't know the answer, but that's my fear, if I can say it that If you get the space we really would want for a middle school, it's going to cost more than probably the dollars that you >> Yeah, your your low-cost plan is not going to stay low-cost. Right. Right. And Gabe was correct. Our teachers are awesome and they have done a phenomenal job in difficult circumstances. And while nobody loves modulars, if if we can rely on their excellence and their integrity, and we can buy a few more years and spend the time we need to engage the community on what

109we will need for the next 100 years. Because we all need good schools for the next 100 years because these children, in fact, are going to take care I'm like all the things that education is. We need to get back to understanding that that's I strongly how I feel. I won't say another word. Thank you. I do think that we can view if we if we go that like I think it's a balance of I would say that this is just off the cuff I would say if from a modular standpoint. I think we want people to know that they are temporary from the standpoint that's not our long-term goal for our community and that our objective while being good stewards of the money we have and that operating cost kind of elephant in the

110room. Our goal would be to get out of those modulars as soon as we could. But at the same time, even though they are temporary, we want to do them in as absolute best way that we can so that it can be the best experience. So, and if that makes people feel like that they could be permanent, no, they're not permanent, but we still want to do them well, right? It's kind of my It's kind of where I I I would I would kind of lean on that. And and I I think within the next couple years we'll get a lot more clarity on how when we can really readdress this long-term facility plan. It It might be that it could be addressed when we do operating. It might not be. I think there's a

111lot of unknowns. I mean, you know, we go back to we haven't talked about it a lot tonight, but I mean, there is potential that property tax goes away in 6 months. And if property tax goes away, I mean, people ask me all the time, well, how are you going to like what do you do then? There is no solution unless the state puts in a different type of tax. I mean, property tax is 2/3 of most school districts' budgets. There is no way to frugal down and address that, right? So, I think, you know, I I think we would I think we would want to share it I think from a standpoint it's not our long-term plan, but at the same time we're going to do it well, and it is it's you know,

112it's not a 1-year plan, right? And again, kids are still going to get a quality education, a quality experience at Westerville City Schools. So, I I appreciate I'm sorry, go ahead. Is there a way that we could move the administration into the modulars, allow the children to still stay within the building, maybe um switch some of those rooms around? Good question. I don't like I I would be happy to to do that. I don't know if our like central office I don't know if central office I think it would take a lot of additional construction in order to make it have availability for classrooms. And if if you did that, I would Are you talking about the central office? I I think you're talking about I'm talking about school administration. >> Oh, you're talking about

113like the office area and things like that. >> the administration be within the modulars as opposed to the students that way none of the folks in town are upset that their particular children have to learn in a modular. >> No, I understand now. I think you would I think we would try I think that's where again, as a group and then really with you guys as well, we would want to work through and see the best solution to not impact kids. I don't think it would be that you could put just administration out there and you wouldn't have kids, but I think we would want to we want to make it as least burdensome on everybody as it possibly can, right? And and that's where like I say, I don't know that I would say

114right now that you would want to say commit that the modulars are where the sixth and seventh graders go. It might be you know, it might be where you put junior and senior level classes, right? It might be where you there would be a lot of work that has to be done there, and that would be a consideration we would do. But that's certainly interesting, and I mean, you have a lot of like all the extra people. Mhm. So, you really could spread out some adults. Mhm. You know, like I've never had an office or anything, but I'd be glad to be in a modular. >> [laughter] >> So, what I'm saying though is it is a good idea and it is prudent to like look at the whole big picture, and there probably would

115be some people that would be happy to have a room there, and I think that's a nice thought. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I I I personally um appreciate the extra conversation on the build um cuz it it it get my wheels spinning a little bit, but I think just with some of the things you highlighted um my thought is still modulars are the right um next step. And then again, it gives us space and time to think about the right long-term build. So, that's it just for me personally, that's that's where I'm at. >> I think too. And I also think that um First of all, it's not 18 months, it's actually less than that. Um if you were to use modulars. Yeah, right. It's a next 4 months till August. So, it's August 27th.

116Yeah. 16 months. Yes. For you. And that's again, there's time as an issue here. I also think that as far as the where they're placed, um I mean, does that modular company do they have educational planners that help look at your buildings and what they would suggest the best case scenario? I mean, I know like rural in those places, the people who build, they have educational planners, but obviously there are people who could give you a good idea what they thought was best academically for your district. Yeah, I think in the building design for the construction working on the building, there's design ideas and layouts. These trailers are pretty pretty standard. Like there's not they're not adjusting walls here or there. Like it's pretty much a corridor with the rooms. Uh they do have sections

117for bulletin boards, and that's all mapped out, whiteboards for the teachers to use, and media boards that are where they put the yeah. TVs or monitors or smart boards. All that stuff's figured into that and how they're designed. But they don't they can't customize them based on the cover. I just think I think as a board we if we choose modulars, then um I think it's your responsibility to come back with a plan of how you think they should be. Whatever you you know, I mean, that's administrative work. I don't know if that's board work. And and that's and you know, we're we we know that's something we're going to have to do. We actually talked about that a little bit today with your question. You know, what we are probably assuming is we would

118still involve an architect because we would need some traffic engineering and some other logistics that when you do a building project get even though we would be doing the modulars. And that was I think one other thing in terms of the modulars, I think it's important like when people understand like it's an 850 square foot classroom, which is actually larger than some of the classrooms that we currently use. That's the standard that is built in new OFCC projects is about that space, 850 to 900. So, you know, there's a smaller version, a 700 square foot. We did not I did not send you that information. I feel like the larger one is more appropriate. Um What's what's the response been at Keen with that with that modular? It's been good. >> I've not heard anything

119negative from families. >> had we've not had any parents concerns. >> is library. There's a It's a classroom on the right, right? >> Yes. Yeah. Um library is out there. Um you know, it's been I mean, it's been a good thing. And again, I think partly it's it's kind of the same as you know, the cornerstone staff. I mean, some of the people that we were feeling so crunched at Keen that they were pretty like, okay, yeah, that was they were ready for that. Um And even that one did take some logistical discussion though. And that was one modular, right? So, it's definitely going to you know, yeah, obviously be our whole team working through that and and our staff being a part of that as well. I think the first step is just being

120able to make an informed recommendation um between the different options for you, which would you know, and then once we do that, um it will be a lot more internal conversation of how does this work with bussing? How does this work with our bell schedules? How does this work with our staff? And then >> conversation for you for your team. >> Yes. Yeah, we would Right, correct. I just, you know, we would just want to come to you with enough information to say we feel that this modular this scenario is the best of the different options that we presented. Correct. And then we would you would basically be voting on the uh the contract to purchase those modulars. And then from there we would just continue to keep you updated on you know the work

121that we were doing to to prepare for that. So there doesn't need to be an action item for this month's next board meeting or is there? No, I think the next the the action item would be as soon which it could probably won't be April, probably be May unless we felt that we had that by April, but April's I mean we have a week and a half, but there's a lot going on, but would be probably would be May. Our next action item would be basically the contract to purchase the modulars that and remember whichever modular configuration we purchase is based on which option we choose, right? >> Yeah. So I would come to you and say, hey, I after all this we feel that we're we we want to do option B and you

122know, give you some high-level reasons for that and then your your your your vote would be on you know, the modular purchase. I will say and I do appreciate that feedback. We will look into a little bit more because it doesn't change anything in terms of the work we're doing, [clears throat] but we'll make sure we have information on rent, lease and purchase as well. I think that's valuable to to have as well and they should they can get us some of those things. But yeah, there's you know, there would be a lot of work to to to be done on that, but but good work and again I go back to our staff. We have a great staff and I'm sure that they have mixed emotions with this kind of this kind of decision,

123right? I think they know where we're at with Cornerstone and things like that, but at the same time you know, this is we we are in kind of a quasi temporary solution here, but they're a great staff. They will provide great feedback and then we'll work together um you know, to figure this out and there will be a lot of things to figure out in the next 18 months while at the same time continuing to provide a great education next year. You know. Uh I want to I wrote I just wrote down here. We talked about cops with the modulars. So we're going to not do cops then at all. We're going to do we're going to do So I think that's yes, I mean we could pay cash. They're also the modular company has

124financing options. So I think that would be something as well that I would ask you to think about a little bit on how we would The nice thing is Amy has priced out a lot of the different things like if we just did a lump sum purchase versus you know, the cops. I think I think really it's you know, obviously it's the cheapest option. So it's really thinking about it from that standpoint or using you know, the finance company. There's really a variety of different ways you could go, but Right. Cuz we got a time value with the year you know, the life of I get it. And I think some of that Clayton might be on again if you choose rent versus purchase too. I mean if you rent if you rent then it's

125right then you're not obviously not doing cops if you did that. Right. Okay. I mean probably the other thing and we don't need to talk about this now, but just again what is the community communication and I know we've talked about kind of getting a timeline out in front of the community of what's coming so they understand the operating, they understand decisions we're making, timelines of decisions we're making. So Well, I just think it'll be important to Very much. keep that in front of the community very consistently. >> Yeah, I think great point Jody. So just obviously we can start Grace's back. We're thankful for that and [clears throat] she's here and I told her I feel like she needed to be here tonight for sure which of course she was wanting to be here,

126but knowing that there was going to be a lot to communicate. First step we will do is a very general we we obviously don't we didn't know what it was yet because we needed to talk to you guys first tonight, but hopefully by the end of the week we'll put out just a general like, hey, here's kind of what the conversation we had and the direction we're going. And then we'll it's it in a way I I view it you know, when I view it I even put in your guys's packet like a plan for a levy communication. It really is very similar. The difference is it's not trying to you know, help people decide whether they want to vote yes or no, but keeping them informed in what we do. You know, I think

127at some point even having some just open sessions for people to come and ask questions as we start to know more. It could be maybe something even for next fall once at that point we're maybe more clear on the grade bands and different things like that to allow people cuz there is there's going to be a lot of questions. Yes. Yeah, and then a lot of questions to answer through that. One kind of final like if we're in those scenarios like where we're moving people all around and maybe we what stops us from just putting them all on the green field at Cornerstone? Um Like like we're we're making a ton of effort to reconfigure it all, but what's that like I think they would fit like is there something stopping us from doing that?

128Um no. I would say well, possibly, but I don't want to say that the city wouldn't do this. The I think it's not really been a considered. The real reason we considered otherwise is because of the efficiencies of closing that building and then going to either going to three elementaries. It does create you wouldn't experience much of your efficiency change if you just keep the elementary at Cornerstone. So that was really the biggest reason we didn't consider it. Sure. Um but it is an an interesting thing to note. In like 1950 the northern half of the Cornerstone property was donated to the district with a deed restriction. Uh it was when they first put in the park at Christmas Run, there was a park on the north side of Cornerstone. Um Once they moved to

129Christmas Run and they didn't need that anymore, that was deeded to the city or deeded from the city to the school district. The way the deed reads is once the school district is not using Cornerstone as a building, it goes back to the city. So that doesn't mean they couldn't give us to us Just basically the the northern half. But our goal also too is if we vacate Cornerstone is to work with an entity or Wooster Growth to have interest. Yeah, that's >> We don't I mean the thing is I mean that's the elephant in the room is that then what happens there? Well, we're not in the business of holding on to old buildings. No. No, that's a good point. I we didn't talk about that, but I think that's a good question and

130you know, if we once we had clarity which sounds like we are that we're moving in this direction, you know, I intend to start conversation which in the end you will have to vote on, but I want to start conversation and you know, Bonnie is our rep on Wooster Growth so she'll be a part of that as well with Wooster Growth to you know, acquire the building so that we talked about it many times before so something good can happen either in that building, that space or a combination of, right? Um and again why Wooster Growth? Sell it to the highest bidder, we have no control over that, right? But we are able to sell it to municipalities and so we would start that process to work through the details. We've never done that because

131you can't do that when you're still using for you know, going to use the building. So that will be a that's another action step that we'll be working on in the next 6 months or so. Yes. >> [laughter] >> I do think I I It is disheartening that we know the levy most likely would not pass, but I do believe that the majority of the community believes in the education, the public education system here in Wooster and wants the best for the children. I think right now economically a lot of people are not doing well. I believe we are the only school system in our county who gives this free lunch to everyone because we have so many children who are >> [clears throat] >> under privileged. I mean this is just not the time.

132Hopefully the tide will rise for everyone and we can get through this and then move on with one of these great plans, but now is not the time. Does anybody else have any other thoughts before we adjourn? Yes, I would I would just like to say thank you to everybody. I mean first of all Gabe and his team for all of the time and effort put into the options. I mean he provided us with a lot of information ahead of time and then just for all the engagement from the board, the extra time tonight, all the thought and time and prep. So again these are hard decisions. There's not one clear path forward. Again it's it's trying to figure out the best balanced decision that puts us in the best position long-term. So any other

133thoughts? Well, I just Is this just a clarification? The sheet you sent with the uh efficiencies that's centered on the K5 plan, right? Yes. Well, I I think we sent one we sent I think there was two tabs to that, right? Um Did we only And then we think the other one was I thought we we think we we did both the 3-5. I think we thought about a million. We think about 2 million savings for the K5. I have not you know, all I know that both of those are some of those are experienced by closing a building. Yeah. Um so I would not The big plan definitely did. >> Yes. I don't think that I could say today for sure you're going to save 2 million a year by putting the modulars in.

134I think I might be able to know that more in 6 months. I do think that you could experience more than a million dollars in savings for sure. And and I think that's important to note unrelated to all this knowing we've continued to have this operating levy is is an issue. We've already started you know that process you know we've we've not we've not laid anyone off but we have done what we would call attrition where at this point you know we have several positions that due to retirement and resignation that we've evaluated and not refilled right just moved class size up just a small amount still definitely within a range that our instruction people are comfortable with but then you know we've reduced a couple of our coach instructional coaches that were not right

135directly related to kids and definitely helpful and but you know and again no layoffs. So we're already starting to do that. We're about I think $700,000 in reductions already for next year and there may be some more. So we're doing that regardless of what plan and that's really just to try to be good stewards to push out that operating in as long as we can until you know as that's really you know it's funny and I'll be I'll be done after this but you know that cash balance provision that came in that was going to come in last year was penalizing districts for having a cash balance. Well the operating cycle creates the need for a cash balance because your goal is to have one so you don't have to go ask your community for

136more money right and so that's kind of what we're trying to do there. All right well thank you all. So also as part of that that plan um I even hate to say this but are we looking at like traditional three neighborhood schools or you looking at like a pre-K K 1 2 3 4 building? I think that regardless of any of the options it's at least pre-K through two or it's it's at least K through two neighborhood. It could be K [clears throat] through three neighborhood K through four but it'll be K through two. All right just throwing that out there. >> Yep no good question. Great question. >> [laughter] >> All right if nothing else I would ask for a motion to adjourn the Board of Education meeting this evening. So moved. Second.

137Kleinhenz? >> Yes. Starcher? Yes. Nair? Yes. Deegan? Yes. Goodright? >> Yes. Thank you everybody for coming and watching. Appreciate it.