001You ready to start? Okay. Uh, I'll call this work session to order. Let's see. I need to We all need to stand for the pledge of allegiance, please. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Thank you. >> Okay. And we'll do roll call. Student Representative Howard >> here. >> Director Russell is absent. She's sick. Director Kellins >> here. >> Vice Chair Smith Reed >> present. >> Chair York is here also. >> On to the meat of the meeting. Item number three, OSBA superintendent/board development and sub uh bullet points. Superintendent evaluation and communication expectations. >> All right. I think I think it's up to you. >> Okay. Carry on. Hi everybody.
002Good to see you. Um, thanks for having me back. Uh, tonight we are going to do um, a little bit of training in doing the superintendent evaluation. Obviously, we're not doing that tonight, but I appreciate the fact that you all want to um, learn about the process. Um, I'm going to go through the process as we recommend doing it. Obviously, we'll answer any questions. This is not a super lengthy training in that process. Um it's pretty straightforward and then we'll move on to um what we recommend for communication protocols. You've got the template and some questions to consider on that. What um what Michelle has also provided you is just a copy of your board operating agreement to consider as we go through those communication protocols. So um we'll get to that second. Um I'm
003going to go ahead and share my screen. get this order. So, it'll take me just a second to actually get the thing share this and then I'm going to put it in a for Okay, um okay. So the first thing um that I want to go through is our recommended process. So we've got um our booklet um that we go through it is available online but what um it's a it's a very big multi-page booklet but what I want to go through you don't even have to have it you can have it in front of you there's a link to it but I'll walk you through what the standards are and what the process is because some of it would be specific to you. um the things that are standard in it are the are
004the standards. So um the first piece of this is to go through the standards. So we um we actually created this booklet with KOSA uh um the coalition of um school administrators which is our sister organization that um is a membership um group of administrators and we work closely with them and we wanted to develop the system with them so that um there was a superintendent voice in this and board voice um and because it's really meant to be um a system of accountability and support. We really believe that the evaluation process is is to hold both of those things. And so we went through standards, we put together standards that are drawn from national standards as well. Um and so I'll go through what those are. The second part of the evaluation process should
005be goals. We don't set those. So that is something that you would fill in and um we've got some recommendations for what those might look like. Um the evidence of performance piece is then um multifaceted. So there are the quarterly check-ins which I'll go through the self-evaluation piece and then the evidence piece um which is kind of a new newer piece when we developed this in 2020. Um because really we had this we had boards saying hey look OSBA you tell us not to be involved in the daily business of superintendent but you know how do we evaluate these things when you when we're not involved in the daily business. So we developed the portfolio the artifacts section um because that was a really good point. So um so we developed the artifact section that
006said here are some things when evaluating these standards that are a list of things. It's not meant to say, "Hey, your superintendent has to provide all of these things to you, but some things that you and the superintendent might consider saying here are things that you um might look for when evaluating these standards." Um the targeted feedback survey, which I will actually not recommend for you in this year. Um I can go into why. And then of course the formal evaluation would be the the big last part of that. So that's the process which I will go through in depth but just that's the outline of the whole process. The first piece of this then is the standards and I'll go through what these look like. There are eight standards um that you would evaluate
007on and and this as you go through this process would be each of you um going through these um ranking them by number and then making comments. Um this would be where like a conversation would happen between all of you. Um so the first standard is visionary leadership where um there there's more description of this in the book but I'm trying to distill this for the purpose of of this training. Um where the superintendent is collaborative with the board inclusive of the community implementing the strategic priorities. Right? So this is I mean this is the big one, right? Like how how does a superintendent lead the district, ethics and professional norms. That one is pretty straightforward. Um do they model the behavior of being just, fair, ethical um in their daily operations, having an inclusive
008district culture, having that supportive culture. And um and if you'll notice, you know, when we did our training, we went through those board um standards as well. And um a lot of these weave into our board standards that that we went through, but like having an inclusive culture, evaluating for that kind of thing and supporting the rest of staff in underscoring what that inclusive and welcoming culture is supposed to look like in the district. leading a system of culturally responsive instructional leadership and improvement. Um the superintendent may not necessarily be part of designing that system depending on the size of the district but like modifying that thought um to but supporting that system ensuring that the system is culturally responsive and that staff are trained. That's the first four. Then communications and community relations. So
009how does a superintendent communicate with um with you know with families with a broader community however that community is defined in in your district multiple constituencies and partners managing the district the organizational management hiring and retention systems thinking relationship um with your unions um all of that goes into the management financial management um budget um aligning with strategic priorities well managed. Now you do some of that aligning the budget with strategic priorities but you know how does the superintendent work with you in then translating that to their job um in managing that and then policy governance and advocacy. um advocating for the needs of the district beyond the district office, having a good relationship with you all, being knowledgeable of whatever is applied to the district, laws, regulations, policy, um things that are impacting the
010district and its students. So those are are the standards. This is where that evidence piece comes in. This is where, you know, when, you know, when we developed this in 2020, we were getting feedback that, you know, some of these are more intricate and, you know, we were getting the like, but we don't hang over the superintendent's shoulder all day. And so, we've got that list of evidence for each of these that there are some ideas and that is not meant to be in any of those cases a comprehensive list. It gives some ideas of things that you could. Um so before I get into these more deeply um I want to go through the timeline. Um the timeline is meant to be a yearong timeline because you know if we're going to look at
011a process that is both for accountability and support. You don't want to start evaluation at the end of the evaluation process. This is a very important process and it's meant to be a feedback loop all year long. Um so as soon as the last now for a new superintendent you don't have a last evaluation. So you want to as soon as possible adopt the evaluation process, tool and timeline. All of this, by the way, the adoption of the process, tool, timeline, standards, all of that, all of that has to be done in public. And so we'll talk about like what can be done in executive session and what has to be done in public. But any discussion, I mean like tonight, but any discussion of tool, timeline, and process, all of that is public meeting
012stuff. So you adopt the evaluation tool, process, timeline, anything you're going to include in the evaluation should be done as soon as possible. Then because you're going to evaluate on goals, the goals need to be adopted in public as well. So, um, when your superintendent goes to set goals, our recommendation is give her a first pass at setting her own goals and then where to go. I don't know, Karen, have you set goals for yourself for this year or do you have goals to be evaluated on? >> Not yet, but I have ideas of what goals are even. Yeah. >> So, my recommendation would be um to let your superintendent bring her goals to you first, right? to not so the so I do not recommend that the board set goals and impose them on
013the superintendent unless you've got you know like performance goals like from a previous evaluation that you want your superintendent to work on but it's always nice for your superintendent to say here's what I want to work on and it can be a combination of those things but if Dr. Brown wants to say, "Here are some things that I want to work on," right? Like the board should incorporate those things. Um, I will also say, um, protect her time and, um, she is going to do a million things this year. Not all of those should be evaluated, right? We we want to protect her time and pick like I would say no more than three to evaluate as far as goals. Um, and also that protects your time as well, right? That protects her time and
014focus. So, highly prioritized goals. It's not like she's going to do any less work, but highly prioritized evaluative um or evaluated goals. Then the quarterly evaluative check-ins. So, a lot of folks think of, okay, evaluation happen happens once a year. we do it in March or we do it whenever um the contract says that we do it. But we really recommend having evaluative check-ins. And when I say evaluative check-ins, I mean something different than a superintendent's report at a board meeting. If you are, this is my disclaimer. I'm sure I said this a lot to you last time, not an attorney. No legal advice for Michelle knew what I was about to say. Um, so I can't tell you when something qualifies and when it doesn't, but just like you can have the evaluation in
015executive session. If you follow that same process and have an evaluative conversation, you can have an evaluative conversation in executive session along the way, right? You don't have to produce a big document at the end of it, but you can have an evaluative conversation about standards about, you know, and give evaluative feedback um along the way before the big summitive evaluation as long as you're meeting the provisions of the law. Um and so you would, you know, decide that and ensure that you are. But from what we hear from boards and superintendents, that's really really helpful because no one wants to hear at the very end of the year how they have been doing, right? >> Whether that's positive or or less than positive, right? Like you want feedback along the way. You want you
016want really honest, constructive feedback along the way. And so um we recommend it be quarterly. Um, some superintendents and boards feel like that's pretty often. Um, so at least once per year, you decide that that timeline together with your superintendent. I would say if your superintendent asks for quarterly, you make the time to do it quarterly, right? Um, some superintendents that I work with, they're like, "Hey, I'm going to start bringing the evidence like along the way so that I don't have as much to bring at the end of the year." and some just really want that talk check-in. I I have facilitated those quarterly evaluative check-ins that do both. That is really all up to you and what system works best for you. I don't have a best practice there, but I would say
017that like those check-ins are really the targeted feedback survey. I'll tell you what it is and then I'll tell you not to do it. So, um and I will so I will all and that's for this year. So, um I would not in general recommend any sort of feedback survey for this year and I recommend that always for a firstear superintendent. Um for a first year superintendent, they are they are, you know, getting their arms wrapped around the the district. They've got a million things to do, right? It is time to do level setting, getting to know you, getting to know the district. um you you know doing all of those first year things it is hard to capture really good data in a survey in the first year um it is much better data
018to capture after the community and staff have a year to get to know the work of your superintendent. So in our feedback survey um we do targeted response by um our survey is aligned to the standards in the workbook. So we ask questions that are aligned to those eight standards. Um and we uh we have questions for staff and we have questions for community because those two groups of folks have different experiences with the superintendent. um but they are meant to go out to folks that know the work of the superintendent which you just don't have a lot of in the first year right and so um so I would not recommend that for the first year we do not do 360 surveys anymore like we used to sit around the board table with boards
019and sort of develop um surveys what we found over the course of many years is that doing it that way kind of unintentionally solicited complaints And so what we did was just really align our surveys with the standards and we got like much more accurate better feedback from you know that board said hey this is better data superintendent saying hey this is better data and now we just do this but anyway that's my recommendation for a survey in the first year and then you get the um summit of evaluation at the end of the year that is that document um that comes for you know the and figure what you think about as an evaluation. Some considerations um that I would um give you and I just said this and evaluation is an all year
020process. So you've got those check-ins. You really want to um set those timelines really as early as possible. Um, also I don't know what the dates are and I think I've got a slide for this at the end if you're ready to talk about dates, but if you don't have a date um in um Dr. Barry Brown's contract. Um, we generally recommend going with the March 15th date if there's not a date because that's the administrator and licensed folks um deadline to renew contracts and it's sort of, you know, like iffy whether or not that applies to superintendent. So, we generally recommend having it done before then. Do you have an evaluation date in your contract? >> No, I have a three-year contract. >> Right. >> Yeah. But there's no I don't think I don't
021think there's an evaluation date, but I'll look. I don't think so. Okay, you all can decide how that works best for you. >> Um, >> and I'm not saying that we have to do it this way, but I know one of the things that we kind of done over for quite a few years now is try to do one after Christmas break going just starting the other half of the year and how's it going and what can we do to make the other half be better than the first half. So, it's not really an evaluation, but it's more of a let's get together and figure out, you know, where are we right now? Where do we want to go? So >> um one of the most important things to remember is that evaluation is a
022one voice document, right? Um it's not the you know many many individual voices. This is this is the hard part, right? It's like everybody comes, they each fill out their own um evaluation form and then like you know I facilitate a lot of these. I'm not saying I have to do it, but like the the job then is to get everybody's perspective into a one voice document. That's like, you know, one rating per standard and one set of comments for everybody. It does not mean that like you know everybody like individuals get massaged out of it, but it does have to be the voice of the board, right? And it means that like not everybody's individual comments generally, you know, make it necessarily into the document. It means that the voice of the board comes
023out. And so what does the board want to say? Um there are a number of ways to do that. And so you know how that works best for this board is how you would do that. Um there are ways that I do it. There are ways that you know other boards do it. Um, but it's important that your superintendent walks away with good direction because that's the most important thing that it's not confusing for your superintendent that your superintendent has good direction from the board as to what the board is saying on all of these things. Um, I already said this, it's a tool for accountability and so forth. >> Can we back up for a second? So >> would you use like a one through four, one being poor, four being excellent or whatever,
024and then just do an average of everybody's scores added up for each or how does that >> Yeah. So in our tool it is a one through four, but like when I facilitate um I don't I don't let boards average because like let's say you've got three folks on a one and two folks on a four, the average does not represent anybody. >> Right. Okay. >> And so like we really try and come to consensus um I have not had a situation where we haven't come to consensus but if there were a time where like the board couldn't come to consensus we would have a little like minority report thing you know where we would say like the vast the majority in the board gave this rating there was you know there there was like
025a minority in the board wanted to reflect this. There can also be you know I always say to the board there can be comments where like the majority of the board said this there you know there also is um like a suggestion that the superintendent also set a goal in this area on this standard right so I mean we like don't want to send mixed messages but it doesn't mean that there has to be like um not a nuanced you know evaluation I mean like the evaluation can be nuanced it just like it can't be confusing Okay. >> Um and then of course a good evaluation system avoids surprises and that is why we really recommend that um that quarterly piece. We never want surprises. Um any questions, thoughts? because I think my next um
026yeah well questions questions about the system questions about evaluation in general thoughts I told you this isn't the hugest part the training on this is not giant or super complex >> well pending of course what Corine wants would you recommend for this particular year doing just check-ins and then one evaluation That that is what it is, right? Like there's the evaluation at the end of the year and then you would have the checkins. >> Oh, okay. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> And sometimes for a first year superintendent um sometimes, and I don't know that I would recommend this, I'll just tell you what I've seen some boards do. Sometimes, you know, boards will say, "Hey, we just want to really focus on a few of these standards." Um, I don't know that I would necessarily
027recommend that because the standards are about performance. They're not about goals, right? They're not about things to go do. They're about ways of being and operating. Um, so I don't know if that will come up in any of your conversations. I mean because like you wouldn't necessarily want to say we're not going to look at you know ethics professional or something because they're ways of being. They're not things that you know going to do. But you but you certainly can always take into context like this is our superintendent's first year here. You know when you are looking at the evaluating right the context is like this is our superintendent's first year in this district. Um, when you're looking at evaluation, >> any thoughts? >> I was just going to say we can ask for your
028assistance in evaluation process. >> I looked up the evaluation section of the um contract and it does say and evaluate and assess and writing the performance of the superintendent by March. >> March. Okay. >> Following the same guidelines. Yeah. >> Okay. So then I would say really really soon >> you are going to want to adopt a tool process timeline um if you are going to be done by March one you'll want to be do it in February right and you'll want let's see it's October >> so you'll probably want to have you probably have time for one checkin >> before March And I think that's probably why we did start in January is so that we could be able to have it ready for the by March 1st for superintendent. But I also another
029reason why we didn't can't tell you how many times that meetings got delayed because of snow. I mean it never failed. Okay. So anyway, so you just have to think about that that could happen right too. So our best of intentions >> because the evaluation needs to happen at a work session so we can be an executive session, right? I mean regular meeting. So we can be in a executive session and discuss. >> Yeah. Evaluation conversations can happen in executive session. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> But those are regular meetings. >> No, they can be at either. >> Yeah, you can do them at either. Um >> but when you do a report out of a summary of an evaluation, that would be at a >> you need to adopt like you need to come
030out of executive session and say something like, you know, we did the evaluation, we adopt it. Like you know there's there's there's part of it like most boards will come out and adopt a summary that says like you know we did the evaluation we found the superintendent like you know meeting standards or above standard you know or excellent in these on these standards and give some sort of summary to the public. Um and that can be brief. It doesn't have all of the like you know what you would put in a personnel file. That would be >> but you like you were saying you could we could have um like the check-in at the work session and an exe not a work session but a yeah work session executive session because you're not really reporting
031out the check-in you're reporting out the actual evaluation. So that would be at the >> meeting at a later date. Okay. >> Yeah. >> So yeah. So I would recommend putting your date setting and adopting your tool process timeline on maybe your next four things. I would agree. >> I would agree with that. And to your question, Reed, yes, I do. You can ask. >> Okay. >> And I will say yes. >> I think some of us are very new. Somebody's experienced, but I think we could use the help. >> You know, with that process, >> I think have her included. >> I think it'd be great. Yeah. >> Any other questions, comments, thoughts on evaluation? >> And the the tool book, the tool box or whatever the evaluation PDF that you guys had on
032your website you shared with us. It's really great. It's a great document to read and it's, you know, clearly articulates every step of the way. So, >> yeah, >> it's long. There's a lot of narrative in it that you can probably skip through. >> It's good narrative, >> huh? >> It's good narrative. >> It's It's good. I mean, reading >> some stuff we don't need to know like if the superintendent is also the principal and there's somebody like that our small districts were incorporated and included. There's a whole section on the tour feedback survey this year. >> Not this time. >> Um but yeah. Okay, good. And then there's a whole thing you fill out um in the end. So, okay. >> Thank you. >> Great. >> Um, okay. With that, if there are no
033questions there, um, I'm gonna stop sharing because the rest of this is not on a PowerPoint. Um, the rest of this will be our work on communication protocols. So, I'm glad that in front of you. So, we talked about this last time I was here, the importance of and we and we will always talk about the importance of just having common expectations. The more common expectations you can have, the more transparent you will be, the better because um you know, the the more your superintendent and you all have common understandings, the better that relationship is. You know, that's not just in this room. best life. Um, so I sent this to you and you've got your agreement in front of you because we always want to be consistent across agreements. And so I sent you
034this um list of questions kind of as a starter. Um, a lot of these questions show up in um in a lot of communication protocols that I end up working with with boards. So, I put them in the form of questions, but like if I was going to write this for you, which I will do. I will edit whatever you come up with and send it out to you like I did this. Um, you know, I would write it as like, okay, you know, handle a crisis. You know, what the superintendent does in a crisis. I'm not thinking really clear. I mean, I'm thinking clearly, but I'm not speaking very eloquently right now, but like what happens in a crisis and then what the superintendent will do. So, what I would love for us to
035do is go through this list of questions and come up with a common expectation because like if something does happen, like you know, if there is a crisis that the superintendent is expected to be on the ground floor dealing with right away, she can't like call one person, send a text to one person, send an email to somebody else. That's just not possible. Like, so this is the easy one. Not easy, but easy to describe. you know what is the com what can she do to get a hold of you all really quickly send a one-way message to all of you and you will trust that she will get back to you with the rest of the information that she can so then like she's got one pump expectation so when we answer these questions
036all the way through I will take notes and then feed back to you what the protocol is and then if you think of other things that we can put on here we can but I wanted to start you out with not a blank slate and if there's there's something on here that you don't want, we don't have to answer those questions. So, first of all, let's go through and look at the questions for a moment. Is everything on here something that you would want on here? Because we can strike anything that you don't feel is appropriate. I think it's all appropriate. >> I agree. >> All appropriate. Great. >> And things that we've already been dealing with. So, it'd be helpful to have clear, concise processes and procedures for how to handle this. >> Is
037there anything, and if you can't think of anything right now, that's fine. We can start working through. Is there anything that strikes you just immediately that you would like to see added? >> The only thing I think of, but I don't know that it I don't know that it falls under the communication, but it sort of does, is um and and we've worked on it every year that I can never remember, too. Okay. So it's not like this I can come up with an answer but when it comes to the word crisis as we all know over the years those have even changed as to what they could be or you know even from a her you know hurricanes that never would have happened to a rioting to a tsunami. Okay. I mean no matter
038what. But um I know that even just the other day we were having practices with our buses as far as an emergency and the kids all coming out knowing what to do to get on buses quickly. But I was just wondering if we couldn't put together somehow a list at least of the main crisis that you can come up with and what is your answers you know together because sometimes I know that we've had superintendents before they come in and what they would have done might not work here just even for the lay of the land or how a bus is bus drivers couldn't even get here in time to do what you might think was the perfect answer or Portland's or you know Newberg's whatever. So I would just love to have something that
039even talks about each of those categories and what we would do for them. I mean, you don't have to go all the way down to how you'd handle a kid if a kid did this, you know, but a lot of our major crisises at least having an answer and then the community to know what to do too because like when we had a fire at McBride, the original McBride, people came from everywhere and they stopped in the middle of the highway and got out of the cars and ran because they were sure the kid was still inside, blocked fire trucks. I mean, you name it. So I just, you know, like I think that it's important for the community to even know what we would do and where they should head instead of trying to
040block, you know, traffic, for example. So anyway, that's just something I wanted to talk about, too. It's not just word me in crisis, but actual things in the district or whatever. >> Well, and that's what this is meant to address, right? like and I think maybe that um is more of a like safety protocols that are probably like there's probably some sort of district document or something somewhere that deals with safety protocols. But this would be like if there are safety protocols that are being implemented that rise to the level that the district need or that the board needs to know about, how is she going to get a hold of you to tell you that, right? like if there is a fire, you know, district's going to be dealing with that over here, but
041like what is the mechanism by which you're going to be informed immediately >> specifically us, not the community, because >> Stacy can handle community relation stuff. Yeah. Okay. >> Oh, I know. But I was just saying it's an addition to being in here, not just I didn't put it in that category talking about, but we were talking about should anything else >> be added to it. I just >> Right. I my suggestion on that would be that that is operational. The >> that's what I was how would we get the superintendent's opinion on how what works good for them >> to get the information like to be left sometimes >> how they like to communicate it to us by either phone email or whatever whatever works for you guys. >> It's hard to put a
042definition on a crisis too because I mean it is relative. if it's a crisis to whom, right? And and also there's so many that you couldn't even imagine. >> I know that's why I said they keep changing. So there's it's hard to keep up with, but Right. >> So if if something happens and since we can't we won't be able to list everything in this document, right? like that that would probably satisfy I think what what you're talking about Melody like in in sort of a safety like what would all of those things be but let's say that's over here in more of a when does you know when does safety and operational things kick in to deal with that? Let's say like something happens that that does kick in you know a safety protocol
043situation. So then at the board level, how does your superintendent notify you? Like that's what that's what we'll put in here. Um so then let's let's talk about like what are your preferences and what are your like what is what is easiest and what are what are preferences. >> I think I think for me just an email just >> I think an email is good. >> A flash email go out and just say hey we're dealing with this and more to come. Yeah. And I sometimes like I have a really great um communications director that I've said I need you to like email the board this or I need you to do and that that's part of the response mechanism. So it might not be directly from me but it would be this is what's
044going on blah blah blah because I might be in the middle of it, right? >> And so I and she's great at or even Hall could I would delegate if I couldn't but that's fine. and an email works great for >> I think that's the quickest and easiest way so you're not trying to call text or >> I would agree. I also like that when you do message you specifically say do not respond to this. >> Yeah. >> You know and that's for the serious crisis stuff like fire flood kind of >> lockdown kind of thing. >> Okay. Okay. So, a quick email and then I think the important thing about this one too is that um there won't be like in this first one there won't be many details, right? And it's like this
045this first one is the board trusts that the superintendent will get back to you all when there are more details available. And often you may hear things before the superintendent is able to get back to you just because like if she's required on the ground to do things like you may hear other stuff, >> but there has to be that trust that like just because you haven't heard from her means that she's actively working over here, right? And so >> yeah, she didn't go home and forget about us, >> right? Or she's not KEEPING SHE'S NOT KEEPING anything from you. It's because she's dealing with a crisis man in the middle of it. >> Yeah. >> Can I ask one quick question? Do you guys get um like when I get stuff I don't always
046get I'm not saying you don't get a ping when you get an email. Okay. But texting is a thing that comes whenever we've had emergencies before. Actually got text and that I don't know why. It could be it's just my house. Okay. But everybody got them immediately when it was an emergency. faster than hey you know it's an email from the school district not realizing that it's that important. So I don't know I'm just >> I did hear you say at one of the last meetings that you hadn't received an email or something about something >> quite frequently. I don't at my house so I understand that one but I know that when we have had emergencies before we got a text so that it came and it comes faster and and you realize it's
047important. >> You could link your email to your phone. >> Oh I have my it's just you have to know my house to know that. Yeah. >> Anyways, but it isn't even just that. I just realized that, you know, when a text comes across and it's coming from you, I'm going to realize that is way more important than just an email that from Michelle or from Stacy or whatever. >> Absolutely. >> We have like the Google, what is it called? Message >> Google chat that's hooked on to the that's part of the email. My advice is that we keep things that are easily public record like so yes texts are fantastic to get quick hey this is happening but I prefer like if we're going to do an emergency response that it goes through and
048that'll ping on your phone just like a a text would it just it's through the school district you have it in your your account and um Ed can help us set it up for you guys on your phones because I just pulled the on my phone the other day and it's fantastic. That's how I got the when there's a 911 call I get notified immediately. Um it's just a really nice mechanism to have, you know. So that that's what I would recommend if the tech if the if texting is texting is a is works better for you and we could do a test run when you're at your house. I could text you >> from that and see if it works out there >> before we agree to it. I mean, we could do a
049test run. Yeah, >> that's it's just like a text, but it's through the school district communication. >> Yeah, which I have on here, too. It's not that, but >> Yeah. >> It just I just want the texting like I said when we had one before it was emergency at the high school. I mean, that was all it was, but it was then you knew this was important. You was going down and I wouldn't have expected any more from you till you had time to get to it either. It's just then I realized there is something really going on, you know. And maybe if it's on your phone, like the subject line will give a clue as well, right? Like I mean subject line will be pretty nice. >> That's what I said. Either way, that's
050all. >> Yeah. >> Um Okay. If that works, um then the next one. So how does the superintendent communicate to everyone if something is important but not a crisis? Right. So, something's important and she wants you all to know um but it's not a crisis but it's not you know it's it's something that um you know maybe coming now obviously you know not something that everybody has to >> could be Monday like you need it for Wednesday but like >> Exactly. >> the building's on fire. >> Exact Exactly. Right. Like um I sometimes say like you know in a small school I said this the other day to a charter school like hey a teacher gave us one week's notice you know like that like not and is leaving and of course in a charter
051school that's a very big deal you know something like that that's not a crisis but it's very important to know something like that um uh like how would how would that be communicated something that's important but not a crisis. You may not get all of the information right now, but it's also something that you might hear about. And how would you expect to hear about that? >> Well, I hate to sound redundant, but an email sounds great. >> I mean, it can be the same thing. We don't think it's super creative. >> And then we also u we do parent square for the board now too. Like we found out that some folks >> if you don't have children in the district, you don't get a parent square. And so it was it's nice if
052>> there's information out there that's like hey there's an open house or whatever you know those things are also going now to the board >> um through that parents square because we've got access to it. Um and then even that, you know, if there's an urgent matter happening at um the middle school, there is a way that we can connect where we're they're getting the same information that all middle school parents are getting at the same time through that parent square, right? >> And so those things are really cool because then there's not this oneoff having to have Yeah. So, >> but can you send a message then just to board members through parent score? >> Yeah, you can. I prefer I prefer I prefer email when it's me. We're just going to you me
053to you where I'm having Paul email you. But I'm just saying that there's other ways we can keep you informed on multiple things that are happening in the school district. >> Square. Yeah. >> Right. >> Yeah. But I agree. I think just if it's me emailing Yes. >> So email for this one as well. >> Okay. >> All right. Who handles media requests? >> Okay. All right. Okay. So Stacy, but always >> Yes. >> Okay, great. >> Unless I mean, and Stacy is our is our um communications director. So it's it's me or Stacy or the Del Mendoza. >> Yeah, we have me because we are the we're the spokes folks for the spokespeople for the district, spokesp. Um and um however um there have been times and you might smack me on the hand
054for saying this, but there have been times where we've um in other spaces where the board has um selected like the board chair to collaborate with the superintendent or Mendoza to give the board perspective on things if they're being asked questions. Like I had a for example I met with um a reporter that wanted to know about the opening of schools and me and read sat in because I want to share a collaborative approach to when we are talking about the school district we're all on the same page on things and so I mean the board can >> that is likely a policy but that is the officer role like there's a yeah there's a board policy on board officers and it's likely a policy but that's part of the chair. Yeah, >> good. I
055don't know how specifically, but I'll look. But yes, >> it often says that the board chair >> represents the voice of the >> Okay, then that works. >> I think I read it in there already. >> Yeah, great. Y >> but that's in collaboration because we wouldn't want >> we don't want mixed messaging >> going out because even like if Stacy's reporting on something I'm always right there want to know what how to or we check in to make sure that we're giving >> shared messaging around certain things because it just gets confusing if multiple people are >> and what is Stacy's title because I don't want to put names. >> Director of communication. >> That's correct. Right. >> Okay. We'll keep it general. >> Okay, great. Okay. How are school visits handled? So, um
056you have policy BBA. >> Um which gives some information, right? It's policy BBA says that that board members can visit schools to gain information. where that stops and where I usually, you know, recommend that communication protocols go a little further is um it stops at like okay, do you get, you know, do you notify the superintendent? Do you notify the principal? Do you have somebody walk around with you? Like there the policy BBA kind of stops there at just >> and just you can go if there's not sort of a common expectation about like you know how you how you go. Notification is usually good. maybe having somebody go with you, you know, something like that. But there should be sort of an expectation or a common understanding between all board members and superintendent about
057how that goes. So, what is what is your preference? How would you like to handle that? >> I think that we should be escorted >> Yes. >> by administrators. I also think it's really important we understand we're not there to be evaluative in any way because that's not our job. I think that that's important for everyone who sits on this board to understand. >> And if we go if we're sending somebody there, it has to be the approval of the board set up ahead of time to go into class and look at something. >> It's confusing for me because are there exceptions? Like my husband is a teacher. Can I go to have lunch with him? >> That is completely >> But I don't know because I'm not there as a board member. I'm there
058as a So I I was I've been avoiding it because >> Well, don't do that. >> Well, I see him all the time. remembers that so many of us do have something in the building was our own kid or at different events. But one of the things I felt like too that we really hadn't had the talk talk about is that there's that difference between school visits. So you're just walking in to go walk the halls and go check out things and then there's the volunteering side of school visits and that is two total different things, >> right? Yeah. And and so many of us are there for different reasons or if somebody just says, "Hey, I I need help. You know, somebody down here helped me load up this or unload this truck or
059whatever." So many times the board members are the first ones that would be that volunteer just like we're volunteering to be here, you know? So, >> so I think that's that that would be worth some clarification actually in this section, right? That like volunteering is distinct from visiting a school to gain information, right? So um >> and Reed and I had a conversation about this um you don't mind me sharing about like because he wants to volunteer because one of his students um goes to a specific school. So he said, "Do I just go through the volunteer process and if I have a scheduled time that I'm attending, do I have to give notice every time?" Well, please don't. I don't need notice every time you're volunteering at a school that's different. But if something
060changes within that volunteer, like you're adding something or doing something different, just make sure that we've communicated that with me and with the um >> u the administrator, right? >> But yeah, absolutely. We want board members volunteering in schools and supporting just as anybody else would like schedule the workout an hour I'm going to an hour training on Sunday >> right right >> with that >> so your thoughts about so outside of volunteering which you could do just like anybody else would do and and I think that it would be good to call that out in here which I will do um if you wanted to go tour the school as a board member to get familiar with something certain do you think then would you like me to put in here that I mean
061so first of all who gets notified of that >> we first have to ask the superintendent yes >> and ask her to coordinate it >> okay >> because even even a board member come we still disrupt >> created a standard operating procedure um more than happy to share that with you how to implement some of the policies that kind of left the blank >> um because they this school district had already had a standard operating procedure but they didn't have it written down Okay. >> And so we just wrote down and you had shared the standard operating procedure that the superintendent or an administrator did escort on visits and you know you had been escorted on a visit when you wanted to go tour the >> high school um with and Stacy brought you through.
062>> Yeah. >> So those so we just put it to writing. We we created it and it would follow you know the communication process that they would notify and we would arrange someone to support. >> Okay. So then the procedure would be then you're notified and then you arrange for somebody to >> I would notify the principal. Yeah. >> Okay. Then you notify principal >> and then >> to see if that works. Like I mean we also don't want to tell principles >> this is when this is happening. We want to engage conversation and be flexible and schedule but we also know that everybody's working people here. So maybe certain times would work better for folks. Um, and that yeah, I think that would be fabulous. >> And then arrange for somebody to go, >>
063right? >> Not always me, >> right? >> And and I think for me is that I just was always always been around so much because I always had kids in practically every building for so many years that if I needed to ask something, I was already there, I asked it while I was there. So I never went out of my way to just come and stop in to tour the building or whatever except for when we built new ones and began to check. >> But it's pretty easy here though for us now because like I'm in schools I work from schools two days a week and Jeff works from schools one days one day a week. So all there's three days a week there is an you know assistant soup or a superintendent at the
064school. If you choose to go on one of those days one we know we'd be more than happy to um you know show you around. Um, but the administrators themselves, they're busy people and they but they still want the opportunity, they get excited to the first time I've spent at a building, it was fun because every time I go now that I've been there now. It's like tomorrow will be my first time at um Columbia City and I'm certain that the administer want to show me around and take me through spaces. I mean, I bet was there before there were any students there this summer, but this will be nice to be there and working from the building. Um, and that's they they love to walk people around and show off the wonderful things that
065are happening in schools. >> Um, what about for like assemblies and stuff? Like do we need to check with you if we can attend assemblies like if the high school's having a homecoming assembly? Um, >> parents are >> you're still busy to the school. It just would be nice to let us know so that we can let the um principal know because when it's open to families that the students that go there, yes, if your student goes there, then yes, but it's not open to the entire community for people that students don't go there. Okay? >> So, if your students are there, yeah, you wouldn't have to let me know cuz you're acting as a parent. But if you're going as >> a board member because your child doesn't go there or visitor, then just
066let us know so that they know that you're going to be there. Okay. >> Um that's what what I would recommend. >> Okay. Yeah. Yeah. >> And the hardest part is that there's we do have different administrators. We haven't had the same events for different reasons from COVID to you name it. So, in a little bit there hasn't been a lot of regularity as far as it used to be where there was everything for everybody knew exactly when homecoming was and exactly when the Christmas programs were to you name it. And well, I guarantee you if you would like to volunteer as a chaperone at one of the dances or prom, they would love to have chaperone. So, >> I would say get on those volunteer for prom cuz I got a new dress. >>
067Oh, I love it. >> I love it. But seriously, I mean, we were always we're always looking and scrambling for volunteers all over the place for those events and the more the better, >> right? I'm looking at our student right now. Okay. All right. So, next. What if there are and and these are the things that policy doesn't cover very well. So, these these get more specific. What if there are issues between a board member and the superintendent? How are those addressed if one-on-one conversations are not providing resolution? Right? So these are more relational questions and these are the things that are really good to have in a protocol temp in a protocol. Um so obviously you know we are all going to you know make an attempt to resolve communication. I think is this
068in your thing? This is probably here. This is why we brought this out. Um >> hang on. Yes. So in communication agreement number three, board members and the superintendent shall communicate one-on-one when an individual concern arises with any member of the board superintendent team as appropriate. So we have that, right? That's foundational. We understand that. But what if there there are there's board member superintendent tension and and what happens if um the one-on-one conversation is not providing resolution? I think board leadership >> I mean personally that's what I think right step in board leadership sits in on the conversation with one-on-one right >> that's what you mean by that though exactly >> chair vice say you and Karine are you know not communicating well then Reed would sit in on a conversation with you two
069and try and help resolve it more as like a mediator And if you don't >> then make an ask >> then I'll get >> I'm just I'm guessing I literally have no idea what I'm doing on any of this stuff but that seems to me like a logical thing. >> It does >> but I don't have a clue. So, >> well, and I was thinking one of the things on on this issue itself, I mean, I'd love to break down so that everybody knows where we're going from here, but I was saying we've just had over the last couple months so many brand new people and and not enough time, no matter what, to have even gotten to even understand all these parts, let alone for everybody. But to have three brand new board members
070all at the same time, you're just lucky cuz you had a couple months before that we made you work, you know, on the budget. But other than that, I know that that's part it. And you had to go right into a brand new school, right into a crazy month of September for no matter who it is for all we can all been here for 20 years. September is still crazy. Doesn't matter. So, I feel like we're now into October. Start having more time together and getting to know things and understanding these rules and how you would like to, you know, be able to do stuff. But for me, if there's a one-on-one with it, if it doesn't work with him, then another one-on-one with somebody else until we can all try to, you know, be
071on the same page. So, if it takes more than one, we have to figure it out. >> I'm pretty confident one board member talking with the superintendent should be able to hash it out and figure out what the problem is and come up with a solution without having to involve anybody else. But if it does, then, >> you know, come to the board chair, the board vice chair, and ask them to sit in. >> Yeah. I think sometimes emotions are high and it's sometimes when emotions are elevated, >> it's tough to even be able to have a mediator. >> Yeah. >> sometimes you hear what you want to hear the other part, >> right? And I think just me personally, if I have an issue and Reed comes in and says, "You're wrong." I'm like,
072>> next tell him where to go, right? >> Next person. I want to hear from the next person because Reed Reed is wrong. I know. I'm just saying that like, you know, when >> when we are emotionally involved or invested in our opinions and somebody tells us we're wrong, we don't want to hear that. And I don't know how we resolve that. No matter who it is, no matter when it is. And maybe that's just it. You just keep rotating out people until because we're adults. We had >> your calendar. >> You're not an adult, but the rest of us are adults and we can have adult conversations and also be wrong >> and also be outnumbered. And those things are just part of being on a board. But I think sometimes when emotions are
073elevated, it can be a difficult place to when you're the person who is emotionally elevated, it's hard to hear other people disagree with you, >> right? And and and so how do we then move forward while making that person understand that uh we hear you, you're being heard, we just don't agree. I don't know how to move forward that way and I that I mean it kind of pertains to this so that's why I'm asking >> so um what's your >> well so >> put you on the odds >> well it's this is my job so first of all I will back up and say I agree there is a role for board leadership here and this is part of the tough job of board leaders partership, right? Like they they get to sometimes if
074the situation calls for it, play mediator and um and that is part of the part of the role. Obviously, we want to work out issues at the at the lowest level possible. You know, there's always the um you know, when I do conflict management, um there's always the like what do I want for myself? What do I want for the other person? And what do I want for the relationship? And ultimately there's that there's that question on the full board. What do we want for the relationship and what do we want for our students? Right? We modeled the way for our students. Um and and then I like the idea of if it's not working with the board chair, bring somebody else in. And um uh I totally agree um Christine that like we nobody
075wants to hear that they're wrong, right? Like of course nobody wants to hear that they're wrong. I think that, you know, we can obviously start with and then of course there's a question of like what's what's wrong, right? But like we can always start with empathy and validating like, you know, I I hear your frustration. I hear where you're coming from. I I understand where where I I understand where you got there, how you got there, right? >> And even if I don't agree, I can see how you got there. And um and I don't know like you know I mean there's maybe that goal of being the third person in the room like I hear how you got there like I don't agree and I hear how you got there and what what is
076the what is it a matter of after that? Is it a matter of what what is it that we don't agree on? Do we not agree on policy? Are we not agreeing on practice? Like and how like what is the adjudicator in the end? Right? and how do we agree on what is moving forward? So, one of the things that I have learned like in some of my training is like it is eventually pointless to argue the facts because like we are emotionally charged beings, right? And so, like when you end up arguing the facts like it doesn't even matter at at some point >> you lost, >> right? And so like and so then I don't know you know so then it it becomes about you know the relationship and validating like so so
077I do think when when we have somebody else who's there to maybe help folks get grounded then it is about like you know I don't have to win this argument to to save the relationship but it is about you know like being heard and um and valuing the relationship enough to move through the conflict. lict in order to get to, you know, what is it that I want for myself? What is it that I want for the other person? What is it that I want for the relationship? And what is it that we both want at the end of this conversation? Like what do we want to walk out of the room with? Um, and what is the common solution at the end of this? Um and sometimes at the end of all of that
078because like so stepping back from just like human dynamics ultimately you all sit on the decision-making board. So if there is I if the um if the argument is technical in nature right if the argument is like and I'm making something up now but if the argument is like what is it that a board can do or a board member can do or or whatever because often what causes conflict are like this is information that I want this is what I think that I can do this is what I think that a board can do or this is what I'm going to go do the board ultimately gets to decide that. >> Yeah. >> And so sometimes that conversation has to be had in public, right? If the private conversations aren't working, >> then this
079then this gets talked about in public. Okay. >> I'm curious, Reed, what happens if you have a problem? Is she the only one who can sit in or can another board member? I wouldn't have any problem if she could sit in and I don't think it'd be a problem if another board member sat in. >> That's what I was curious about. You said like board leadership can't really be >> vice chair. So >> I just think kind of as a general rule it probably should be but >> it usually starts with the chair. Yeah. I I mean it usually starts with the chair but um just because the chair has that leadership role but yeah I mean certainly if the conflict involves the chair you know it's going to start but I think also if
080there's just some level of comfort that folks have with somebody else there's nothing wrong with being >> somebody else I don't see an issue where I'm going to have with the superintendent that we we can't solve. >> Yeah. >> It's early. >> I'm just kidding. Just kidding. I'm just joking. and I will be the value. >> Um but I think that from my experience um in education >> quite some time now I'm not going to say the date because ages me um that it's whether it be board superintendent relationship or um teacher administrator or um >> you know we could be anyone in the organization. >> It's all human. It's all but it really is around roles and responsibilities and having a clear understanding of what those things are and there's research around organizational conflict
081>> and it has to do with the ambiguity if there's too much if you are not we have to set the guidelines like what is our role what is the understanding of board work superintendent work or principal work and teacher work superintendent administrator work having clear understandings of those things and identifying that out loud and having it in writing um because then you can refer back to it. So that that's where I and then of course the personality differences of course those come into some of the conflict but the majority of the time it's because um we don't fully understand our role and our responsibilities >> and so me sitting down and clearly like just give an example with a brand new you know administrator sitting down and being able to say you know hey
082this is your role this is your responsibility or this is the shared messaging around this like oftent times when I sit down and do a coaching or mentorship with someone, they say, "Well, should I when I go back and have this conversation with this direct report, should I say, well, the superintendent says that like no, I'm helping you with what you like I'm you're roleplaying what you should be doing." And as an administrator or a director, you would be saying, "This is coming from me. These are my expectations, right?" And so I think that just being really clear with one another our roles, our responsibilities and our expectations of each other through these things >> um create that that great working relationship, right? That professionalism um and then when we do have a disagreement, we
083fall to these things to have those disagreements. And we don't have to always agree on things, but we should always treat each other with dignity and respect. Um and there shouldn't be any ambiguity around superintendent role and um board role or superintendent role and principal role, right? Or principal role and teacher role. There really should be clear understanding of what those things are. >> Should be. >> Yeah. And so I don't I I feel like that's part of I mean just I'm speaking from experience and when those things when the conflicts are there it's because we don't have clear understanding >> and the things that are supposed to address potential ambiguity are policy >> which is most policy when printed out are those things right and then >> and that's right and and then where
084where policy where there are gaps that's why we have these that's why we're creating communication protocols and ARS >> and ARs. Yeah. How to implement like that is that's the purpose for all of those things and then why we keep going to you know I mean this is why I started with this why we keep going back to like any time we can have tools that set up common and mutual expectations. that's just going to end the tour of that relationship. >> And then we have to own that there was some there was huge amounts of, you know, trauma and things that happened last year in November that caused a distrust of certain people and experiences and I'm coming in like having this new energy and and hope and it's like I don't have like
085you're saying emotional connection. I don't have that yet because I wasn't here through that experience. So I'm when I speak I'm speaking directly. I'm like, "Okay, well, let me go see what the policy says." I'm going to the policy because I don't know all of the policies, although I've most policies in Oregon are similar because we all work with Oregon School Board Association, but sometimes they differ slightly. So, I always go to policy or standard operating procedure or guidelines and it might be where it sounds like I'm really being like this is the way it's supposed to be or oh, hey, we're not following policy. This is the role of the superintendent. This is the role of the school board. And it's not me judging or trying to step on anyone's toes. It's me because
086I'm brand new. I don't hold that distrust. I trust all of you until trust is broken, right? And so those are the things that um I think also play into this. Um, >> I think it's really easy to say that all three of the new board members watched a disaster unfolding and the only reason we ran is because we wanted to make a difference. And whatever that difference is, it looks different in each of our eyes. And we did all have a lot of distrust in the former leadership. And it's really easy for that to carry over because no one wants to be blindsided again because there was so much trust put into the former leader that people were like disasters were happening. >> Um and you are not the former leadership. So it it
087is a mind switch. you have to stop being angry at the former leadership and see that there's new leadership and we have to give it a try. But I think that I think and I I feel like there's some concern in like what if cuz you're just so sweet and cute and nice. What if what if we're too we're too trusting, right? I don't feel that. I feel like you're proving yourself every single day. Um even though you don't have to, you are. So, for me, it's easy enough for me to see you're doing the work. Um, but I I just want to say that I know that there's >> there's >> Yeah. And it's it feels personal, I'm sure, because it's you are a person. Yes. >> And the only leader right right now.
088>> And so >> I just I just wanted to say that because I think that that's >> Yeah. >> It's it's important to understand that you are not the past, you are the future. >> Yeah. And then practicing the balanced governance. Like I love the fact that we all went to the conferences because we don't want it to be a rubber stamp, right? I don't want to ever >> like you guys just go, "Oh, pass pass." Right. What else you need there? That's why we have discussions that why there's motions and then there's discussion before the vote. Like >> it is okay to disagree with each other and with you know or ask questions, >> right? >> And then but I like that when we say no surprises like those things can happen in our
089board 2 by twos. They can happen if even if it's there's not a board 2 by two schedule to say hey I really want to stop in um this week because I have some questions that I want to ask before the board meeting. and we set up a time for you to do that so that we >> there isn't surprises, right? So that we can work through it and talk about it and then it doesn't mean that I want to change your opinion or your perspective. I might have I might be holding information that you don't know, >> right? And maybe that information should not be shared at an entire board meeting for the discussion. But the operationally things that you might ask about a certain program or or have the conversation about the assembly
090or something that's happening in the school. But those things can be asked during that time, right? And I think that that's critical for that communication, those communication agreements. Yeah. >> Um but nobody wants anyone to be a rubber stamp, right? We want us to have conversations. We want us to >> all be voting whether we're voting, you know, you know, we're not all voting the same direction, right? But we are all making we're having our influence and our perspective shared. >> I think the problems that I'm seeing, I'm just going to be completely blatantly honest as well, is that >> I we're not all we're new, right? We're all new. Um I'm not new to superintendent work or leadership work. I've been doing this quite some time, but I'm new to St. Helen and learning
091the systems and the you know personalities and the um feelings lots of feelings attached to what's happened and that's not me judging that I'm having to learn that because I wasn't here right >> um but the not understanding that board governance is here and I'm lucky and you're lucky we get to play in the garden every day. You guys don't get to be in the garden. You're up here at the board governance, right? >> I don't hate to say the trenches. We're in the garden every day. I don't say the trenches. And we're doing that work. And it's sometimes, you know, you're not in the light until you're in the light, right, of what's really happening. And so I think that just asking those questions and um trusting and then making informed decisions at the
092board meetings, not un in because if you're not making informed decisions, you're rubber stamped. >> Right. or you're stamp you're hearing the rumors that are out here and not you're not in the garden and understanding what's really going on. >> Right. So, >> I know Reed and I have I mean Melody doesn't really need to, but uh well, just because you've been around a long time, Reed and I have leaned on you quite a lot for direction and you'll say, "Well, it's on this policy." So, okay, then we'll go and we'll read the policy ourselves and then, you know, make our but you have guided us a lot. So, I think that's really helpful. And I was thinking that same in the same line is that I still feel like even in past or even
093now is a lot of times it's >> um some one person's understanding of something is completely different than someone else's or their expectations. And I mean, we all know that we all think that the president should solve all the world's problems and our town thinks that the school board should have taken care of everything and the school board thinks that the superintendent should have done it and she thinks the principal should have and so everybody does understand. They can't just walk in and expect that we should have solved every single thing that was wrong or you should have or or even you walking. So, >> we're in it is hard. We have to remember we are in the second month of school. Like I was just talking to the superintendent advisory council next door and
094we are just entering the second month of school and so I feel like you know there's growth, there's growing. I mean I feel I've seen a lot of wonderful things that are happening in our schools and then I see things that I need to address. I'm there all the time, right? And so I can make those decisions and we can talk about those things at those board 2 by twos because I want you I want you to be informed, right? Um, but I I do think it's going to take a lot of all of us. It's shared responsibility, shared messaging, and that we're following policy and our roles, right? Um because if we're not, that's when all that because if we're not functioning at the level we should be functioning at the board level, then
095we can't expect the garden the garden to be without, you know, weeds and blossoming and blooming. And right that strong vegetable. I love I love the garden >> cuz it also gets to use the in the weeds. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Okay. I'm going to use it and steal it. >> The weeds. >> So, for this one then we've got um so what I've what I've written down is the board leadership would sit in on the conversation. Um if that you know someone else if that's not working um from there um if a you know if an individual conversation is not working that comes to the board to discuss operating agreements >> it needs to >> but you give an example of what it looks like to discuss operating agreements in the boardroom because I
096think that's important that cuz we did have it on the last agenda, but I don't think we actually went over it. >> So, I was just could you like role play for us what that looks like? >> Sure. So, and I and I've seen this happen and this this can happen in um in a really calm, you know, like um I mean that should right in a really calm civil, respectful way. Um so when you put it on the agenda um it can just be like you know discussion of board operating agreement and um so the the conversation is usually how are we adhering to our operating agreements and it is generally you know led by the board chair that um it is you know we should check in every once in a while on
097our operating agreements. We should look through these. We should talk about particularly um and invite our superintendent into this as well because superintendent has expectations of the board too. Um you know we have collaborative governance agreements, we have communications agreements and then um you know we have expectations of superintendent, she has expectations of us. We should really read through this and discuss amongst ourselves whether we feel like we are living up to our agreements, whether we feel like we have these in in are holding these in fidelity and um and have an honest conversation that is transparent to us and to our community. Um and if we are that's good and if we're not this is a document to hold ourselves accountable and that is why we adopted it, right? >> Do we feel like
098that then becomes evaluative? If if a board member doesn't particularly think that she or he is being heard >> and we start going over this is that opening up some evaluation. >> So can I turn Okay. So do you mean of the superintendent? >> Correct. >> Okay. So if that feels like that's a risk >> um it can be framed as um you can certainly put guard rails around a conversation because you can't have you you have in order to have an evaluation of the superintendent there has to be notice given right and so when the conversation is opened up it can certainly be like you know we either um we're either just talking about our part tonight And any evaluative conversation of the superintendent would need to happen in a quarterly check-in >> an
099executive session that it's an open session whether or not it's session or not >> one day like that's my goal to get St to get us to a place in St. Helen's where we can model really healthy conversation around performance evaluation for our staff and what that looks like and growth mindset like areas that I want to grow and be able to have those conversations areas of you know strengths and really because performance evaluation is for like you said support and you know it's it's not and I think that we need to do that for showing our principles and our educators like what what it really truly means to have those healthy conversations. And I'm not ready to go into that conversation in public because I do feel like there needs to be >> we
100need to be >> healthy in these things and in the communication and healthy in our roles and responsibilities >> before we can articulate that >> in public right because I think just doing it in public is going to cause more harm to everyone because we're not modeling >> right >> yeah absolutely and so I think the way then to open up the conversation is that This is, you know, that it it can't be an evaluation of superintendent because proper notice hasn't been given. That kind that conversation would be, you know, had in um in an evaluative conversation that would be set up for that purpose. That what we want to address tonight is the section of the board operating agreement that has to do with our agreements with each other. >> And then the and
101then the board chair is responsible for ensuring that that conversation happens. I feel like I don't I don't feel like that is if a member of the board is having a disagreement or something with the superintendent and it's not being resolved in a one-on-one setting or with board leadership involved. Then bringing it to a public board meeting where we discuss this feels like all it's going to do is become evaluative. The disagreement itself doesn't get brought to the table. >> Okay. >> Right. >> Okay. >> The adherence to your agreements. >> Okay. >> Gets brought example. So let's like I said role play like an example. So like um What about >> so my like I can that's I was say we were thinking like I was saying like okay so the um superintendent's expectation
102it like number three is um willingness to acknowledge and follow the chain of command of the school district >> and that's also in communication agreements communication >> agreements so that's a really important one it's also in policy BDA right so as you're looking over this and you are all sitting at the board table. You're looking over collaborative governance and you and and one of you says, you know, I think that maybe we are struggling with communication agreement number one. >> Okay, >> I think that we're struggling with chain of command and um how can we improve this? What is our system for following chain of command >> and communicating you know when a question arises or a concern you know like when when what are we all doing when we are hearing a concern you
103know what is our what is our practice for that what is supposed to be our practice for that how are we doing that you know can we give some generic examples like we again we're not calling out staff members we're not identifying anybody we can't do that at a at a board meeting But you know, if we're not adhering to this, how do we get ourselves back on track? >> Okay. >> So, so the the conversation is focused on the agreements themselves >> and you can even pull policy to say staff >> communication policy around the board and superintendent. I can't even say that. Which one is that? It's the >> pull it up. You pull up the policy and you can even read over it at that time, right? >> It's like BG. >>
104Yeah, >> I think it is too. >> Look at you. I was going to say, wow, isn't that nice? >> We could play a game of what is it that we played with the OSBA round that Jeopardy. Jeopardy. >> Jeopardy. >> We were going to be we're going to have a team next year. >> We're going to win. We're going to win. >> All right. I'm going to look it up real quick. But yes, that's what And then you can refer back to policy and we can look at it. That's what I do is like when we're doing something and we're trying to create a standard operating procedure. I'm like, well, that's not aligned with policy. So, we have to go and we look it up. We just did it today in cabinet, didn't we?
105Ed pull up a certain policy and review it to make sure that we're following it. All right. So, let's see. Staff that be in boards board of governance, right? >> I think it's BG. >> You're right. Sometimes though I noticed um through all the years of policies is that no matter how hard you try, a lot of them sometimes have what I call big words in them does not always mean that you are reading it the same way that she's reading it the same way I'm reading it. >> Well, policy is all about interpretation. It doesn't matter what kind of policy it is, it's about interpretation. >> Yeah. which is a good conversation for the board table, right? Because like if you end up having a calibration conversation with the board table, which you know
106ends up being like, hey, wait, we're all reading this differently, >> right? >> And that has been the problem. >> So like this. So it says staff communication to the board. All formal communication or reports to the board or any board um committee staff members will s be submitted through the it will be submitted through the superintendent and then said board communication to staff. All official board communication policies and directives of staff interests and concerns will be communicated to staff members through the superintendent. The superintendent will provide appropriate communication to keep staff informed of the board's policies, priorities, and actions. >> Yep. that cannot be misinterpreted. >> I'm just being honest. >> It should be, but don't think they're strong. I think that also at the end of the day, you know, like if you've
107got if you have a calibration conversation because everybody's reading it differently, if there's still questions at the end of it, like >> edit it, >> hey, can we modify it or call us because our policy director will tell you what it means, >> right? I mean we wrote it and likely I mean depending on what it is there could be some um legal reference in it >> that can be interpreted. Now B section quality policies have fewer legal references in them, right? But um >> this one has OS 32 332.17, >> right? So but you know we wrote them. >> Yeah, >> we can tell you what they mean. So and you know if you if there's room for you to change them, then you can change them in a way that makes sense to
108you all, right? But like, you know, if there's no agreement on what it means, you can call the author. >> I mean, at least as an extent. >> Well, and if the majority of the board agrees and is interpreting it the same as the superintendent, then you you just you guys get to make the decision. >> And in the end, >> this is how we're going to interpret it. And in the end and I and I know that this you know comes down to bureaucracy but this is what >> the majority of the board >> decides the direction right of the board right >> which is why there is a board >> that's right that's why there's an odd number of board members >> typically typ not right now >> soon. soon. >> Uhhuh. Did
109you already appoint next board meeting? >> Next board meeting everybody. >> Next board. Oh, that's right. You gave me the whole >> Right. the whole thing. >> Next board meeting. Okay. So, do we have that like you ultimately talk about something about your board operating agreement >> in public? Like if if the private conversations aren't working, we talk about that. And we can put you know like operating agreement with a specific >> section that we want to talk about >> and policies should have done. I know that you already adopted this. You know what I should have done for you though? I shouldn't have like aligned it with the policies that go along with this. >> You could Yeah. Amen. We can amend it. I think that would be >> you know what I could
110do for you is just like put you know in parentheses next to it like you know BG B A >> that would be fantastic you would already have references exactly references next to all of these >> and do that for you. >> Thank you. I appreciate it. >> Um okay and maybe this next one is going to be very close to this. So, what if there are issues between board members and one-on-one conversations are not providing resolution? Then you can't pull another board member in >> become a board. >> Yeah, that's true. >> My breast. >> It's not you. >> NO, I WAS POINTING AT YOU. >> I thought you were like, >> "No, no, I was like I said no. >> I think we'd have to reach out to us if you want some
111help." >> So, we don't provide mediation. We don't do one-on-one mediation. Um, we do come and do like whole board conflict stuff, but we don't uh we don't provide the one-on-one. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> So, we'd have to part that out. >> Somebody. >> Okay. >> I nominate Ed, >> right? >> We uh, you know, we have Northwest Regional ESD. >> Yeah. Go. We we've called on ESDs before in circumstances and usually they have really, you know, either they come out for free or they help support very very fair wage. So yeah, >> one of the things is not really going to be able to be something that in all honesty could be written down and we all have to follow this rule. But one of the things that I've noticed it in our
112own community on other boards is that they've had that issue with a board member having an issue with the rest of them. um to the point that either that person quit or they were asked to resign or whatever it was. Um and I remember thinking though at at each of the situations in the last five, six years that that's happened is at the same time what a shame that we lost that person whether they were a city council member, they were a schoolboard member, they were whatever is because they had great things to contribute. And so it still comes down to me a little bit is that the rest of us got to figure out then what can we do then also for that person to feel like that I am listening to you and
113I am learning from you and you've got great things but we can't do what you're asking or wanting to do because of this whether it's a policy or a law or it falls under legal or whatever it may be but I you know I don't ever want to lose anybody because I think everybody's got something that they're bringing right to the table. >> Yeah. And definitely Melody, that's a great point. Like we don't want anybody to feel so isolated that they leave, right? I mean, like the goal is to like keep relationships whole and you know, and um >> and I I love the idea of reaching out to Northwest Regional. >> Um and or like like Mediation Northwest. I think there's a you know, >> they do a good job, too. Um there's just
114in the state the state has some folks too that that will step out and sometimes other superintendent. There's some colleagues of ours that are consultants that do >> work outside of their role that are really good at that that have really great um board and superintendent working relationships. But when you say, you know, the thing about um we have to remember that yes, it we don't want to lose board members and we also we have to consider the working relationship between the board and superintendent because it reflects all of the work that our staff are doing and we can lose staff around those things including the superintendent, right? Um because this is a highly turned over seat, right? because you know this I'm the third one and I'm not saying I'm leaving but I'm like
115the third one in what a year. Um so and there was they were interim. Yes. But the stand what is the what is it? It's gone up a little bit I think three years. >> Oh the yeah it's about three years. >> Three years. It used to be two. So it's gone up one right. But for here specifically, >> no for this for across the nation, it's not just the states. Like the turnover is three years and co didn't do any help with that. >> But we have to figure out how to um collaborate and work together effectively because it impacts everyone and that's our students because our students can't just keep having a people and so it's really critical. So thank you for bringing that up. It is really critical that we all know
116our roles and can collaborate and do the board work. >> I think know knowing the roles is the number one most important part of this new board coming in is is >> that we don't all fully know our roles. Not any one of us fully knows our role. >> And it's hard for me because like you said like you know that's not your role. That's his role. It's because I know the rules. This isn't new to me. you know, you know, being five years as a superintendent and then >> a couple years, three years as an executive chief, academic officer. It's like I know the roles, >> right? And so it's not >> and and so when I try to help, it's not that I'm trying to like >> I'm just trying to help support
117and give direction in any way that I can because I don't want to sit there and watch people, >> right? Because that's not doesn't feel good to me. But then it can create a tax on our relationship. That isn't my role. >> That makes any >> Yeah. Well, and as I think we discussed when I was here last, like it's also, you know, it and and this is borne out by research, it's also not good for the relationship between the superintendent and the board for the superintendent to train the board and to provide professional development to the board. Right? So if you've got like a superintendent who's been a superintendent before and has more experience with roles and responsibilities of the board and then feels responsibility for training the board in roles and responsibilities like
118that that disintegrates that relationship too because like imagine training your boss, right? Like >> right that's hard. Orienting is one thing, training is another, right? That's >> um okay. Okay. So, if we had, you know, one-on- ones, called in some sort of, you know, looked at some sort of other sort of mediation and then talked about the operating agreement, right? Had a public conversation, did that take the same path? >> Mhm. >> You know, be just a a number there on our agreement that we bring and discuss. >> Yep. >> Be very open and honest about it. >> Oh, sorry. I was just say what I mean I think the biggest thing that I I've especially watched happen in the last year but it's not like it hasn't happened maybe here and there throughout all
119the years of maybe around the school district but is that there were at the same time and and we're all seeing it even every day in our own normal lives now is that there was things that just would come out of the blue that no one knew how to react to and never seen before never had happened before I mean simply as even as somebody that instead of talking with swearing instead. You know, those kind of things was was very difficult because everybody was just as hung. How do you handle this one? You know, so you can have all these great rules and we can all think we're on the same page and then all it takes is one person to throw that a curve or one person that's a guest that's upset or whatever.
120you know that it is it does make it so sometimes that operating agreements or anything else get broken no matter what everybody's best intentions to do it the right way what I've learned is practice practice practice and role playing like some of even the work session having time to be able to like what if there is a a person that's doing public comment that may that goes outside of what public comment expectations are or policy what do we do in that circumstance right and then practicing that like when we go to the conference we're bringing back that information. It's hard. It's hard. It's hard. It's hard when you're in it. Um and I I love that like I love it I was the president of the thespians club. So I'm a really good actress. So
121we I love role playing don't I add I love to role play. So where you know we're actually talking about the things and working it out and practicing those conversations because it's hard. It's hard work. At least we're preparing for it before before it happens and we kind of know what >> what happens when you have to call point of order. What does that look like and all of those things that's part of what I think some of the communication you know agreement sometimes I think even amongst the board I think sometimes when that conflict arises within board is that people feel like they're being shut down when that's not what's happening. there's a public meeting there's public meeting laws >> that we have to follow and it's not because we want to shut down
122someone's >> experience and that's I think that's where things get taken very personally >> and so yeah >> well just as much as you had three four different or we did I should say superintendent we also had that many chairman and they were just getting good at what they were doing when for different circumstances they were gone and now another one came And so um it made it really difficult was everybody was just trying to keep up with what were they supposed to be doing. So the the rules again and learning how it should be how to keep up media under control which poor having to do a lot. >> That's my new book. >> The attorney general rules. >> Oh yeah. I love that. Is that >> No, it's actually the latest one. 2021.
123>> I don't mean to say oh my gosh you guys are nerds. >> Total nerds. I was thinking the same thing like, oh no, not 2019's edition. >> I want a copy of that. I want to read that tonight. >> Everybody, nobody had time to do anything between co. >> I just fell asleep even thinking about 2019, but 2019 is yellow, so I knew that was a >> Yeah. No, this 2024, >> right? And I went memorized into, >> you know, they reference the OSR and you go right to that and look at it. >> Yeah, I'll have the for you. It's a good It's a It's a good >> Just be fair when you're interviewing the applicants. Don't ask them questions from that green book. >> Oh, no. >> Page 56 right now. >>
124No, I'm just trying to learn the rules around. >> Thank you. >> I like that. >> All right, last one. >> What happens if the operating if an operating agreement is violated? >> Fired. Yes, >> I I think we need to bring it back in front of the full board and open meeting and discuss it. >> And >> however, if the agreement is both us and her, that's not something can be necessarily, you know, >> I mean, this is kind of like I don't know. I'm I'm going to suggest I don't know if we necessarily need this one now because we've kind of addressed these in the last two. >> Yeah, let's hope we don't get there. >> Unless it's not about individual conflict. Yeah. >> Right. I mean, like, we're talking about something that's
125not about interpersonal conflict, then I mean, I guess I could just put except for interpersonal conflict, then you're talking about things that maybe do need to be brought >> because the last two are about interpersonal conflict. Mhm. >> And this I mean that one doesn't have hardly ever really I want to see happen but at the same time is if there's been enough prior conversations whether it's one way or the other leading up before you ever get to that one. Then at that point, you'd have to be right up front with the person that you've been explained. You know why you can't do that and >> and you ask >> and you're still doing it. >> Do okay at that point, do you like silence someone? Can you do that even? Can you >> I
126don't know. That seems like a weird >> That's really hard. >> It can. >> So if something is bad enough, right? Like I mean so if we go through all of these things right and you talked about the operating agreement and you've done all this in public and you know whatever whatever I mean censure is is the outline thing right that's the that's the furthest thing you can get now we always say like if you're going to go that far maybe get something before you do that right I mean that is a formal declaration of separation between the board and the actions of an individual board member there are definite permanent ramifications on the relationship between the board and that >> yeah so it you know when that happens it's usually a fairly extreme thing
127but um so careful consideration >> okay >> and I say in in this in our town and in local ones that are next to us probably on both sides we'll just say is that it's never ever happened to get a recall to go through and the second thing is is that to me it's still that the person needs to be again talked to maybe individually but as to why we can't keep doing it this way and they have a choice to either start doing the stuff right or we're going to be asking them to step down. That's all you can do. I mean and and that happened recently in one of our commandees but it did take community members to actually get it to that point for the person to agree to step down. It
128doesn't always happen but it's happened here at our city council. what's happened in the towns too. But it is a tough one if it gets all the way to that point. I hope we can maybe prevent from ever getting there. >> Yeah. Prevention. >> I think um you know, one of the things that keeps boards, you know, knowledgeable about their roles is just continued however you do it is just continued professional development, right? Blake and continued um team building and working together and taking time in work sessions and taking time, you know, to build your knowledge, build foundational skills, build your team, like you know, like we all do, you know, our business meetings, we get our work done and all of that, but like continuing to build your skills, foundational knowledge and all of
129that like keeps you in your roles and keeps you talking about these things like and And Christine, you just mentioned prevention like and you know talking about these things before they come up and and developing these tools like this is the kind of thing that you know gets you ahead of those things. >> And I was going to say one thing and I think that you guys saw how we all did it too but um >> even though you've got this great policy book and you might have this great green book and but you still can't remember it all no matter what, right? But I feel like when you get to sit down and do the policies, you learn more about them and the understanding of why they are in place and what they apply
130to, then you just have this magic book sitting over there and you're supposed to kind of keep that always in your mind. So by working on them and if that means we got to start at the beginning of that policy book and start working our way through it or you picking certain ones that are um applying right now to what we're dealing with and we're having discussions about them. Sometimes it's only changing the word 'the' for somebody to get the whole point behind policy. I watched that happen multiple times that it didn't interpret that way or the and or the or, you know, but and you all voted to have a policy review committee and Michelle and I have been working on inviting folks to that and scheduling it and then I love that that
131you all have >> agreed to rotate through it. Like it's not just two board members doing the whole thing. It's like we start out with a couple like a section and then we switch out so that everybody has that opportunity to experience it. Um but then we're also getting feedback from educators and community members, people that are in the garden um on the policies themselves um before we bring them to the board. Yeah, >> it's still it's just great to at the same time everything that you get to even from that team is that it comes still back here >> so that everybody understands why it got written up that way. >> I mean I've printed and read every single policy. Couldn't tell you a single one. It's like reading the phone book honestly. They're
132so boring. Um but they're necessary. So like when you need one and it applies, I can go read it and be like, "Oh, yeah, that's right." You know, >> now you get it right. >> Right. >> Yeah. >> It is. It is hard. >> And we all I mean I mean I'm just I was referring it today in cabinet. Right. It's a our tool that we go to if we're um we're questioning something or if somebody asks a question about what policy do we have in place or what you know is our standard operating procedure align with the policy because if you're writing a standard operating procedure or administrative rule it's because we're trying to implement taking the policy into action and so making sure that it aligns with that is really important right because
133you're not taking it into action like we just created a standard operating procedure for mandatory reporting because um folks were concerned about that because they wanted to make sure that they were doing it right. Well, here's the thing. They are doing it right. But when people get nervous or fearful of not doing it correctly, it's nice to have the this is the checklist on how we do things, right? And this this is aligned with board policy and why you would do why would you do this first and then this and then this, right? And so it's really helpful, but we as educators still have to look back at policy to make sure all the time because we're not going to memorize it. But that's why it's there and it's so easily accessible through OSBA. Is
134this a commercial for OSBA? You get up there in the search button. You can search any word and it's going to pull up every single policy that has that word in it and you find them really easily. >> That's what I do. >> I think I have what I need on this. I'm gonna go back. Um, and >> I want it, >> right? >> You type it out right now. Like you did last time. >> Um, I'm going to go back. I'm going to write this up for you. I'm going to send it to you in a form that I hope you um find acceptable. You can always tweak it. Um and then you should adopt it formally so that it is so that you voted on it because once you vote on it, right,
135it's a thing that you will do, right? It has the force of policy and um and then it's the same as this, right? You hold yourselves to it and you can check on it and you can bring it out of board meetings and you can talk about it whether or not you're following it. And um and then all of these things are really good onboarding tools for your new board member when you appoint a new board member as well. >> Um and maybe I think in next couple of our work sessions we can go over a couple progress rules of order and what they mean and how we we >> did you laminate. Of course I did. >> How proud. >> Oh my gosh. You're just asked me if I wanted a copy. >> I
136got four. I love it. That's fantastic, too. >> No. >> You have a lamination machine or is that like Oh my goodness. >> I even bought the super thick laminator paper. >> He was so kind. >> Those are like >> I don't like it. >> Oh my gosh. Don't let our elementary school teachers know that you have a laminator at your house. They might show up for some lam you laminate some things. >> Yeah. >> That's a popular thing. >> Can I make a suggestion so you can take all the time you want this way? um is because we're going to be appointing a new person >> and they're going to have to have some catching up to do too is that we don't extremely go too much more without that person being here >>
137because otherwise they're going to get left lost. Then we won't understand why they aren't getting what the other four of us >> have, you know. So, not to say that I want to slow us down, but we're going to do this soon. So, you know, it's that um getting that but then maybe not working on this totally till >> that person's here too. >> And also about professional learning, right? like we talked about like continuing to grow um and it's we have like dates on our um the agenda that's certain events but we have a November conference that's coming up and so I do think that um it would be extremely important for the new board member to be able to attend that conference as well because it's an amazing way to understand roles and
138responsibilities of superintendent and board um and also why these things are so important. Um, and when you have really good forward superintendent operating agreements and communication agreements, they should never change just because a new person comes aboard. You stay with them and you train people alongside and you say, "These are our these have been working for us, but if you have feedback and you'd like to change something, we're more than willing to listen to that." Right? But these are the agreements that we follow. It's kind of like the legacy thing. It doesn't matter who sits in these seats that we are really working towards a high functioning board and superintendent. >> Yeah. Which I understand. I just know too though that most time it usually is July one when a new board member comes in.
139So they get to go to that first conference. It's in the summer that teaches them a lot of this. This person could actually almost practically walk in even after the second conference if we don't get them in place or they're not able to even attend that. So that's all I was thinking is that let's at least start out with this part being that everybody's on the same page and then go from there. So absolutely >> that's all I have for you. You all did really good work. >> Thank you for being here. Yeah. >> Yeah. Of course. Anytime. >> Okay. Couple more things we got on our agenda. Um number four. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Anything else for me? >> No. Thank you for coming out and helping us again. Upcoming meetings and
140board meeting agenda input. October 22nd is our regular session and board interviews. If you note down before below dates of interest, we will be appointing a new board member at that time also. So just be prepared. Um November 6th through the 8th is the OSBA conference and I believe that's in downtown Portland. Um, November 12th, uh, 2025, regular session. December 10th, 2025, a regular session. And then some, uh, points of interest dates. The 10th, October 10th, there is no school in service date. October 13th, 2025, the application window closes at noon for open board position. October 15th through the 21st, the board will review and screen applicants. October 22nd, board interviews and appointment, new board member in open session. Then October 22nd, we're back for another It'll be a regular board meeting also. >> The
14115th through the 21st. Are we having meetings that day? So that >> No, you get the packet. >> Send you >> Oh, yeah. >> I'll send you a hold. >> Okay. And then what I heard um Kristen say was that we should be adding to the next um board meeting the timeline for our evaluation and adopting this this evaluation as our evaluation. Yeah. Okay. >> And we'll make sure that we follow up on that. >> Okay. And then one other kind of side note, um, our board has been challenged by Scampoo's board to compete at the civil seven mile civil war at halftime and >> board to board something. >> Yeah, >> I work with both of you. I don't know. >> And uh, >> don't worry, we win all the time. >> I don't
142know about this year though. >> Oh, no. >> We're going to set a tee up on the 10 yard line and each board member gets two tries to kick a field goal. normal. >> I'm not sure my foot can be >> I don't know if I can kick >> that is a bar kick, >> but I have also um gotten permission for superintendent >> or principles or whomever to help fill out the team. >> So, we need a couple more members because we are going to be down a few people due to personal reasons. >> Yes. >> So, I don't know. >> So, >> all right. Is there anything else we want to add talk about? >> Nothing for me. >> Okay. Well, then I make a motion that we adjourn. Is there a second,
143please? >> I second. >> I'm just going to say it. >> Oh, she was wooing. >> Cuz we're going home before bedtime. >> All in favor on this one. I'll just go all in favor say I. >> I. >> Okay. Meetings adjourned. >> Thank you. Yay.