001Wallace School District Board of Directors at 12:32 p.m. Thank you everybody for coming. Um, I wanted to uh the purpose of our of our retreat this year is to um first of all, we're going to do our little book study. Everybody got a copy of this. Hopefully everybody everybody was able to read the chapters that were assigned to them. And then I know in board meetings we've had a chance to do a little bit of the nuts and bolts, but I want to just make sure we do it all official. So hopefully the nuts and bolts um section of this meeting will will go pretty quickly. Um but I want to have a good amount of time to talk about our um board uh professional development, our board agreements and our board goals and self
002assessment. Okay. So let's start with >> Can I jump in just a little bit? >> Fire away. >> Yeah. So, thank you so much and thank you for making the time to be here on Friday. I know your schedules are always super busy, but on Fridays especially, but our retreat time always falls on these days. Um, in the past, we've kind of evolved since I've been here, we've evolved in the way that we do our four retreats. Um, initially we had facilitation from an outside facilitator and then we kind of transitioned into me kind of like us co-f facilitating and um, and we would normally take on a lot. We normally have about six hours of material that we try to shoehorn into three hours and 45 minutes on a Friday, which was always a
003challenge. Hey, do you want to trade? Do you want to trade, Debbie? I'm just joking. I'm just joking. >> So, I digress. As we talk about the importance of board governance and decorum, >> um, >> it's a more like formal meeting. So, um, like to that end, um, it I think there was actually a benefit in having to, uh, postpone this meeting, which was originally scheduled in February. Um, it allowed us to, uh, kind of take down the number of agenda items that we had and do those in in like a greater public space in our standard general board work sessions or not work sessions, but business sessions, which I think is important for the the general public to see. But what it also does is it makes this day a little bit more manageable
004and there's consistency for what you're approaching, how you work together as a board um throughout the year, which I think is really important um for uh the function of this board and how um we all work together, but also for um for also the board to see that as a high functioning board, it's something you have to work at routinely and not something that you just do once a year or twice a year. So, I just want to say that and then um also just say that this day what I'm really seeing is uh it's a really good opportunity for you to focus on a couple of a few important agenda items related to board governance um that will catapult us into our summer retreat which is actually really going to feel like it's just
005around the corner because it's only about three and a half months away. So my role today and the way that I'm seeing my role is to really let the board conduct board business and me kind of being along for the ride and chiming in as a superintendent more than being a a verbose facilitator. So like to that end um uh we have a few a few agenda items that I'm really hopeful that we'll uh be able to get through by our in the aotted time which is 12:30 to 4:30. And um I'm not going to put any expectations in the board chair, but there's a possibility that we could even conclude sooner. And that's it for my my remarks. >> Well done. >> Brief and to the point. Um great. So I I wanted to
006do it says it's a a a book study. Um but I don't want it to be that formal. Um but what I would like is we all were assigned chapters in this book. book just like if you could talk about your chapter that that was assigned specifically to you, just the one or two high points you got out of it. Um, rather than a summary of the entire chapter. Uh, one of the things about this book that I really liked was that he does repeat his themes a lot. He spirals. Um, and so it's it's easy in one chapter to pick up on some of the themes from all of the chapters. Um, but with that, um, did everybody have a chance to read, uh, the first chapter and the eighth chapter, even though that
007came in late? I apologize if that that assignment came in. Awesome. That eighth chapter is really some little interesting tools of how we could shift how we do business as a board that I do want to talk about a little bit more later, but I thought we could just start out. Tristan, if you are comfortable with giving your one or two high points from chapter 2. Yes, I'm currently synthesizing all of my points into one or two. Um, >> I'd be happy to go first if you need more time. >> No, it's okay. >> Out of order. >> Um, so mine was the governance mindset and I think, um, can I do like a quick y >> like, yeah, >> kind of a synopsis, but kind of laying the land and then some takeaways. So
008um they really actually say in here um that they consider development of a governance mindset to be the most important characteristic of effective board members or trustees. Um, and one of the things that they talk about at one point that kind of set the tone for me is they really talked about how when this interesting shift, which I hadn't thought about in this way before, but when you campaign, you do so as an individual. The things that I want to do, the things that are important to me, my mission, my values, my hopes, whatever. Um, and so, and that is sort of what you are elected in some cases upon. And then there is a once you're elected it's a total switch to that's all fine but now you're part of this group part of
009this board. And so now you have this much more sort of unified sense of thinking around um yes we have that individual piece but we have to work together as a governance team rather than a group of individuals that all wanted these certain things when we came into the position. And I think just that sort of acknowledgment of that shift in mindset between we all did we all have things that we really campaign strongly about that don't mean they're not important but also that doesn't jigsaw perfectly in when we come together as a group. Um and so they sort of name and I'll just end with this I suppose um there are three actually four kind of areas that they talk about that are really important um kind of systems thinking. So really that idea
010of I think they mentioned it in its chapter one um the steering versus the rowing and so we are really steering that ship and then your job the district all that is is doing the rowing um and so that's sort of that systems thinking that you need to stay high level um the next piece is strategic thinking which I think that is something that we do really really well um and then the other two are deep learning and the managing manner um and the managing manner is really around um sort of how how we are either builds or erodess trust um and so making sure that we are working towards common ground um and those strategic goals even though we are individually elected. That's a really short synopsis. >> Yeah. So chapter three was about
011the governance mindset in action and um I want to focus on the thing that that impressed me the most about it was the absolute importance of trust um to in getting that in action. So trust is between the superintendent and the board, but also between the board and the staff. And that's one that I hadn't considered as much, but does the staff trust us or do we do things that undermine them? Um, and even though they're not our employees and we're not supposed to be directing them and all that stuff, I think we know our lanes there. Um it's really important that we are the models of behavior for the staff, for the students, for the community. Um and then how do we keep that trust with each other and with the superintendent? And it
012comes down to for trust with the superintendent, it's really a matter of us staying in our lanes, him staying in his lane. There's some places where it bleeds over and I think we know where those are. And when you get into those gray areas, we need to be really, really careful about how we're operating and say out loud, this might not be all the way in my lane, but um and I think part of the the trust piece uh that he describes that he described in chapter 3 is about having private conversations with the superintendent when it's in regard to um matters that are not appropriate for the boardroom. So during our one-on- ones with the superintendent is where we bring up our I'm seeing some things I'm worried about and uh and an opportunity
013for the superintendent to talk to us about things that he's seeing that he doesn't want to bring up in the boardroom either, right? And so we really need to rely on those one-on-one meetings heavily to have that level of communication because we can't as a board obviously have that communication together without breaking public meeting law. Um, a second point that I thought it's more of a tool to achieve the end of building trust um goes to the piece of superintendent evaluation. And one of the things that I'd like to talk more about later when we're done with the book review um is the idea of having more like quarterly um executive sessions with a superintendent to check in on his evaluation progress. It gives us um more time in little chunks to have those conversations
014about here's things that are going well. Here's things that we weren't anticipating when we gave you the big goal back in July that are going in a direction we didn't expect. Circumstances have changed, whatever. And it's a way to sort of have those cleanup conversations in a much less threatening way. And again, it goes back to that building trust so that we can have those those conversations more protected than executive session. It does have to do with the superintendent's evaluation, but it's along the way and it's less threatening. So, those are the the major points from my chapter that I wanted to bring up. >> Crystal, um, great. Um, thank you for that. Uh chapter five was about teamwork essentially >> makes the dream work. >> That's right. Um and there was a lot of
015kind of um emphasis on defining that in different ways. Um coherence, collaboration, synergy. Um so a few takeaways um to just kind of give the highlights. Um there was some discussion about how everyone has core values. um kind of like uh what um director Irving uh mentioned core values about um that we run on and then um but then people coalesce around a shared vision and I think for this board um although we might emphasize different you know everyone agrees with maybe a list of things but then when it comes time to govern it's like, oh, it turns out I really care about this and maybe that's not a priority for other people, but like we all care about them um in general. So, I think um it's talking about kind of that shared vision
016and balancing um those individual priorities with the larger um working together in the system. Um and um there was also a part I liked about um having a dialogue and um building trust and finding common ground because sometimes um although there might I think this board has a lot of shared priorities um sometimes there um is some variation and then the importance of having that dialogue and finding common ground. Um so that's my summary of chapter that was chapter five. So, thank you. Thank you, >> Debbie. Hi. >> Yes, thank you. Um, I don't have to do a good job of summarizing it because the uh author did it for me. This chapter was about governance responsibilities for the board. And I think we all have a pretty good understanding of what that is. What
017he outlined was uh strategic direction, policy uh direction and approval, stewardship and support, oversight and accountability, community leadership and engagement. And I think we all are very familiar with with how the board should be operating in those um in that under those premises, right? So strategic direction, we come up with a strategic plan. We set the direction. Uh we we have a lot more um stewardship than what we think we have. It's not just about policym but rather it's about uh ensuring that strategic direction. Uh we also have the ability to make policies and and approve those policies, stewardship and support. We really have to be supportive of the uh superintendent as well as his staff and ensuring that we're not at like you said, we're not at odds with the uh with the staff,
018right? We we bring them alongside so that they can help us lead. and then um oversight and accountability, the the superintendent's uh evaluation and then community leadership and engagement. Uh it you know we just had a a budget meeting the other day and um you know it was about about the staff being there and uh and engaging the community, right? But it what the author uh you know says is really it's up to the board to engage the community. It shouldn't be up to the staff, right? So how else can we take a a look at what our role is in that meeting and ensure that we're the ones kind of engaging the community rather than the staff engaging them. I mean it it's good that the staff is engaging them, but it's like where
019where does our role come into play in like that meeting for example? That's a really good point. >> Um I had chapter seven which is the beginning of the governance infrastructure piece which is really about then what are the tools that align with all of the um the beliefs and and mindset piece. Um I have read the book before the earlier version and what um what's interesting about this author's approach is that it's predicated on a moral imperative. I mean he talks about that a lot versus empirical evidence. So I don't know. I mean like that's fine. And um and for me I mean that's great. All of this stuff is good and I understand the moral imperative piece, but I, you know, just in general wish that there was more research behind this book.
020>> Um, uh, >> peer reviewed. >> Yeah, exactly. My dissertation matter. >> You look at our references back here and they're pretty short and a lot of them have to do with Websters. Um, but you know, but I don't disagree with anything in here. the the main pieces, the main structure pieces that are covered in this section are govern governance principles, norms, and protocols. And I think all of those things are good. Okay, here I I'm going to be just slightly critical, but because I think about like how can a board, how can we use these tools? The um all of those things are good and I think the way they're presented in here are they kind of all look the same. So, you know, the the principles are like, you know, be this, be
021that, be that. So, there's things that, you know, we're going to be. Then the norms are just kind of a definition of the principles. And then the protocols are we do this, we do that, we do that. And so, you know, I leave like unsure of what the difference is. Why can you not combine these all into one thing so you're not having three documents? So, I mean, I think the idea is good and I think that it maybe like complicates the whole process a little bit. Um, the thing that I really appreciate in here is that they point out, you know, and I like this phrase, um, that so often these things are approve, file, and forget, right? Like these are meant to be working documents. there are boards that like keep their agreements
022on their at the dis with them, you know, and um and so that we can hold each other accountable in real time that it's not something we just come back to um annually and say, "Hey, are we good with these? We're good with these. We'll do it again at the next retreat." And um and so I wonder if that's something that we might look at. And you know, just like Jill was saying about, you know, quarterly check-in, quarterly evaluative check-ins that make the end of the process much less high stakes or certainly no surprises by then. If we did that, if we did something like that by holding each other accountable in real time, then we would not risk the um situation where like something has bubbled up to a certain point and then it
023needs to be addressed that you know maybe we could have talked about in real time. So I I appreciate that piece. This um chapter also talked about resolving problems before they occur, orientation, which is just a brief section, and then uh self-evaluation, and then gave some steps for um for writing protocols. So, it's funny you mentioned the the uh board operating agreements being at the table because this was a conversation I had during my last one-on-one was maybe we should today look at when we get to our our board operating agreements. Do we want to make it so that it's a one pager short and sweet so that we can have it >> in a plastic file folder at our desk so that we can check each other as we're going through the board meeting.
024Hang on. are we really doing this or have we gotten distracted? Um and that might help us as a board >> moving forward. So if we get to that action item on our agenda >> chair, >> is there opportunities for So now that we've kind of we haven't gone over chapter 8, is there opportunities for like first thought, second thought, or like just to discuss? I have so many things that popped up that I'm just curious to hear the board's opinion. >> Sorry, I did that before I suggested that it was I'm bad that way. Yes. So, having heard all of the the high points of chapters, does anybody have anything they want to add on to, disagree with, affirm? What is it? What's the ABCs? Affirm >> or the three C's >> three C's.
025Yeah. Anyways, does anybody have any any ideas they want to throw out? >> I'll say with regard to community engagement, and I, you know, appreciate leaning into what is the board's role in community engagement. Um, I think that that is it is sort of the squishiest piece of the board's role and can be the most the most extreme slippery slope, right? I mean, I see board members that are like, "Hey, community engagement means me holding a coffee chat once a month and everybody can come and talk to me as an individual about something and then that just solicits complaints, right?" So, I think that continuing to talk explicitly about what the community engagement side looks like for the board is important so that we're not going off in different directions with different thoughts representing the
026board in different ways, you know, because there are the right I mean there are good positive ways to do it and then there are really detrimental ways to do community engagement. So, and I and I like the idea of you know doing these things in public too. I mean, we are in public, but doing these things where probably more people are watching so that the community can see us working through these um issues >> because I think it gives us credibility. If we're in public >> disagreeing about important stuff, it means we're not rubber stamping, right? We really are doing the hard work. We really are doing it in public. >> It comes in, so it's dovetailing this idea, but I think it comes up in chapter eight, which is the discussion conversation meetings. And
027I think that that very much um resonated with me whether that's another you know version of a work session kind of what I was like trying to think about but really to reflect on and strengthen governance um be collaborative develop criteria for problem solving provide opportunities for us and the superintendent to discuss like you said whether it's the progress on goals um programs issues kind of like things that aren't really in we can't shoehorn into the agenda um necessarily but we just want to talk things through a little bit. But again, it kind of hits that community engagement piece. It hits the sort of being transparent and like but also gives us that opportunity which I think in different ways we've all sort of said we wish we had a way to just talk about
028stuff sometimes >> and it gives us that idea of the shared purpose, right? We as a board have a shared purpose and that's what we should all be driving for and not our individual perspectives. Our individual perspectives um feed our own belief systems but within the shared perspective of a board. We have to take what the board has given our blessing to as a whole, right? And then we move forward with that shared purpose. Um, and I think that having some sort of Yeah. work session slash conversation session, >> yeah, >> could also be combined with a public listening session if we find ourselves starting to get into a hot topic. Um so that we can have that more rich conversation with a shared purpose in mind and and making that shared purpose refined with
029every single conversation or refined conversation I should say. Crystal have anything to add? Um >> no other than I can't wait to uh read Miles's book. >> I can send you my dissertation. yawn. >> Have we moved on to one and eight? Are we doing that? Are we >> We We absolutely can. >> Okay. I mean, I'm not trying to push us. >> You want to take it on? >> Well, I No, but um I was just going to say one of the things that popped out for me in aid that I really like is on page 160 at the bottom of that onboarding of new governance team members begins right after election or appointment and continues for months. So it's super important and a super good idea to like you know May election is
030over you know connection with those folks and being like here are our governance documents here is of course they can come to meetings but like what are the internal the infrastructure pieces that have been created that they can start to absorb or like hey if you're going to read policy start with the B section you know or something like that. I mean I will say um when I first got on the board I had no onboarding at all. It was like, "Welcome to your first meeting. There you go." And I I I was like, "Okay, I mean like there's a bunch of stuff I come with, but like but in this context, I didn't have that, you know, and so um I think it would be great for us to think about and and involve,
031you know, not to put work on staff, but involve our staff members in the here's what I do, you know, like here's where you're going to see me and also sort of um guard rails around this is how we connect with staff, right? Because like new board members are like, I'm going to tell you what to do and you what to and all of that. And so I think that that onboarding right after election is a really good system. >> I think you you got a a raw deal because we all just assumed you know everything on boarding >> that you know >> I don't think Devie and I had any on boarding. >> Crystal, >> did you have any on boarding? I know a lot of people in local government so I had people
032I could ask a lot of questions. >> But I mean from here >> from the board >> I think I also did I feel like our board talks a lot about these processes. Um and actually kind of labor some of these points. Um and so I think that's still a challenge sometimes where you're like oh I have which hat do I have on right now? So I always think that way like which hat do I have right now? Which email account am I using? like oh well let's consider that from more than one perspective. So I think um I think some of these things are so easy and basic um but then in an individual situation um you might find yourself uh thinking about oh I wish I would have done that a little bit
033better or like I was thinking about it from this perspective but someone else might have been thinking about it from this other perspective. So, I always think that it's important to try and keep these things in mind, but I also think that our board talks about it a lot. Um, and so, um, for me, even though I think I've asked things before that have come across, it's like, don't you know that? But for me, sometimes I'll I'll ask what might feel like a dumb question because I'm just working through it again. Um, it's like when I convert time zones, I know New York's three hours ahead, but sometimes I do it backwards. Um, and so like even though I know how to do it, I'll just double check it anyway. Um, I'm kind of a
034show your work person. So, I think um sometimes you kind of know the rule, but then when you're um or how you're supposed to do it, but then when you're thinking through an individual situation, um sometimes it's good to um kind of like compare notes or like is is that you know, am I going to this event as a is this a is this a campaign event or is this a individual board member event or is this a let's double check that first and I'll kind of just work through it each time. So I think it's just kind of that like >> I have a lot to say about time zones, but >> No, go ahead. You have >> No, I was just gonna say um thank you for bringing that point up. Uh I
035want to say whose responsibility is it to onboard new board members, right? It should be the >> Oh, >> I learned that at OSA. So that's I I had no idea. something. >> But you haven't been here since I'm saying I was like it was really cool. >> Yeah. >> It was really cool to know that that was your job >> in the last century when I was on boarded. I was onboarded by the current chair. >> Yeah. So that's what I'm saying. So like it should be up to us to on board new board members, right? I don't know why. I mean, yeah, the the board secretary should have some u like policies. Here's what we do. Here's when do you show up, right? But it should be that we're all talking about what
036our governance roles are and responsibilities. And I think we while we didn't have that at the first meeting, we did have that at like a retreat or whatever it is that when we set up our goals. So um I I just appreciate and I appreciate yeah we do maybe um talk about the same things over and over but yet some of us still don't follow them. So I figured if we don't then we start following them, director. >> I know. That's what I was saying. Like, we should start. >> I'm just kidding. >> No, we should start uh following and like, you know, >> I think having the pieces of paper in front of us at meetings could be really useful cuz I know I've slipped on that a couple of times. I brought one
037back, but the thing that OSVA has and I have like an example is it's like a laminated but it's like 11 by 18 >> or 11 by whatever the legal size piece of paper and I brought one to see if they could recreate it at one point. Um, and it really has like the basics of Robert's rules like how to do the motions and then on the one of the sides it has the norms, the equity lens, the whatever. And so I mean we could certainly do like I highlighted the thing in here about having the the governance handbook >> but also I'm not we're not trying to like flip through a whole handbook during a meeting to be like but I think that simple >> like one pager and it has like all the
038little sections and it's kind of right there. It's like a placemat. Um might be >> and they're laminated so you just kind of reuse every time would be a cool I could bring one of those. >> Yeah. Then we used to have like the art of community everywhere and all the >> on the back of our cards. We used to have them back when we had paper. >> But I'll bring the example in and have someone here take a look at it. >> And um Dr. Miles, is that something OSB does trainings on like just read like refreshers on Robert's rules or anything like that or so? I wonder if there's this we build in a work session for for those types of protocols in whether it's um something that's generated from the district which
039is like art community versus like Robert's rules and and how to use that for decorum. >> Yeah, I don't support a work session on Robert's rules. I would really rather not. Um, I actually had that printed out at one point when I was new and I was like, "Oh, poems of order and whatnot." But um I mean if others really find it useful, but I think there there are some things that are appropriate or that that we could just review as needed or um I mean if there's something in particular that could be communicated if there's something folks are not doing um or if there's if we all need to read it. But I don't I don't think we need to talk together about Robert's rules. >> We got hung up on like agenda modification
040a couple of board meetings ago and like that's like an I mean that's an example of like just and of Robert's rules that I think that it seemed like we were disconnected on. And so like things like that are things that I was thinking about but it's again it's a board decision. There's been one meeting where a motion was made and I didn't call for a second and >> but you know that >> I do but I made that mistake and really hand let me finish for just a second. It would have been really helpful if we had Robert's rules in front of us for somebody to say Joe Zers missed the second. >> Yeah. and kept us back on track because the whole idea of rules of Robert's rules is to kind of keep
041the board meeting >> within its boundaries and yeah so I mean that's just the you know you were going to say something else. >> I was going to say that sometimes when I'm serving ice cream I spill but I know how to do it. So, like I think that every now and then you might have a verbal fumble, but you know there's a second. If you don't know by now, I don't think an additional training is going to help, right? I mean, but like you I know that you know, like I'm not trying to question if you obviously know the rules. So, I just think that like there might be an occasional um like verbal snafu, but I think um I don't know. I think it is. I did have them printed out at one
042point because sometimes it's helpful to look or refer to, but I I think that is an that would be an unfortunate work session from my perspective. >> I'm going to rely on the sports knowledge of the superintendent. But as to put my final point on this, uh, basketball players know how to tie their shoes. Yet there was a basketball coach that had them practice tying their shoes as the fundamentals because we all need to relearn our fundamentals. >> John John Wooden uh made every single player uh actually put their socks on in front of them and Tyler shoes a certain way. And the reason he said that is because in he want he wanted to be about efficiency and he didn't want he didn't want players to get blisters and he didn't want players to
043have their shoes coming untied so he just made them do it but it was also just like creating systems and systems for success as part of a book that he had called the parabid of success. >> My dad went to a basketball camp with John Wooden and he they walked you through the whole thing >> and UCLA team championship. If we can take it back to the topic at hand, not this sports analogy is not a good >> I work at the leisure of the board. The director asked me about this and I was just following up. >> One of the things that I found really interesting in this book was getting back to something that that Crystal said a minute or two ago is you don't know which hat you're wearing and it gets
044really confusing and he says you're always wearing the board hat. No matter what you think, you are wearing the board. And I had never thought about it that way because I thought, yeah, I need my board hat. I need my parent hat. I need my No, it's you're a board member. Everybody in the community sees you as a board member. And I think that's a really useful >> way to think of it like I'm here for my kids conference, but I'm also a board member and that's going to have an impact on the teacher I'm meeting with. just something that you were going to say something that I had about >> um before we get >> I think that you know yes uh Robert's rules is dry and there are also times where it can
045be weaponized right like it can be weaponized in terms of if a board is not communicating efficiently or well then Robert's rules gets weaponized right I think it's important for us all to to know that so that we don't sit and go like wait we have to but that is something we can go over in the context of maybe a work session about effective meetings, right? That is a that is a bigger context in which our parliamentary procedure is embedded. But when we talk about the the greater scope of what is an effective meeting look like that covers a lot more than just Robert's rules. So it's not like a one-hour dry oh my gosh I could have learned this from you know whatever from a handout and I think that is beneficial for because
046what does an effective meeting look like? And there's a lot of things underneath that. So that's almost exactly what I was going to say is it can be part of another bigger conversation. Um, and then the other thing that and then we can move on if you want to move on, but the other thing that really stood out to me in the way that they wrote it was like the fork in the road thing in chapter one and how it's a choice. Like we can all again it's sort of like I I campaigned individually now I'm part of this group. I have a choice to be part of a a collaborative collection of individuals or be myself with my own agenda whether or not I keep that hat on all the time or not. And
047I think I think the assumption and a good one is like we are all here to be part of sort of like we are not necessarily like united but unified or not un whatever the two >> not uniform not uniform. Um, and so I think but it didn't but there's also yeah no somebody really could feel like much more here as an individual. And so I think the idea that there's that fundamental choice um of whether or not they work solely as individuals or strive to what they say strive to form a cohesive force and the choice is entirely theirs. And so I think this book kind of ties in how do we hope that we're all making that choice? But I think that's just an interesting kind of mindset to have is that it's
048not necessarily I mean it might be assumed but it's not necessarily where everybody is at all of the time and just to kind of keep that in mind and really do that own our own self assessment work around sort of where what fork am I choosing to take. >> You sound like you were about to say something. >> Well, I think those are all good points. Um but I think the book um also I mean I think this board is generally pretty cohesive on especially the big issues. I think that's um it's it's making a good point there. Um, but it's also I mean you can't form the I mean I think it just for me comes back to dialogue and finding common ground. Um because it could also be interpreted to be um asking
049for less diversity in the board. So I think it's just kind of that balance and I think the book does a good job of talking about the balance. So um but the also the um I agree um board members are always on have that hat on but I was more getting at like um you know as came up earlier just on the campaign trail versus in the boardroom. Um and um there are different rules in different situations. So >> just more speaking to that >> push back a little bit on your idea. You've mentioned it a couple of times of finding common ground as a board >> that was in chapter five. >> Yes. And I'm just saying I want to push back on it in the book and what rather than it being we
050find common ground between the five of us, we find a a a common um what was the he uses a different term for it and now forget it of course. Um ah come on it was the main theme in in the beginning chapter. Um what is it called? >> Coherence collaboration >> the the unity unity of purpose. And so it's not that we all share these things in common. It's that we have the same goal, the same purpose. And it's a purpose we share with the superintendent. And and that's I think the difference between we find common ground as a board and what do we do with our shared belief system? We find a purpose for it. And the purpose is for the kids in the district in conjunction with the superintendent's purpose. So, I
051would just like to throw that out there as sort of a slightly different way of thinking about that cohesion that you're talking about is that it's directed in a specific way. Just a thought. >> Well, it's like what Janet talks when she did our training, you know, with like everybody has to agree on this one >> like irrefutable truth which is like all students can learn or that piece. So like I think that's the kind of like big in and probably in this case like the moral imperative for our board is all students can learn and then that's kind of where we build the commonalities build the cohesion build the collaboration is around we all have our different perspectives and lived experiences and roles in that but that's where we are all continuing to center.
052Does everybody feel like that that that is our our moral imperative as a board? what Tristan just said that >> which is not mine. That was >> it's >> that's research. >> It's the every child every day every child can learn. >> Um >> I don't think anyone disagrees with that. >> Okay. I don't know about the terminology of moral imperative. You know, did lack a lot of >> it peer-reviewed journal article elements, but I mean there's nothing wrong with that. But I just want to make sure that we all as a board agree that that is essentially what our shared goal, shared purpose is. And just we've both got that in the backyard because that's the end of our time on the book. So it makes for a nice tie it all together and
053move on to the next thing. Boom. Um >> just to put like the >> the closure there. I think to have the last one. >> Yeah. I I just think people Well, you asked a question and and there wasn't a a consensus response, >> but I think >> based on the conversations that I've had with the board, >> I think we do very much have a common purpose with which is to give kids a great educational experience and advance educational experience and outcomes for kids. >> Yeah. Well said. >> And do that inclusively. Y >> I agree. And do it inclusively. Yeah. >> Okay. Uh we'll now move on to our self assessment time. We have just 15 minutes for this. So I don't want to go into most of us had a chance to
054present. I know director Hemus did not at the board meeting. I don't know if you want to do it now. I don't mean to put you on the spot, but um how do we as a board feel about our self assessment? Uh that's the multi-page document you've got in front of you. It looks like it's this guy. Um, we don't have a ton of time, but I I just want to get a discussion going about where do you if we look at our um >> so as as an informal timekeeper, we have about 15 >> minutes dedicated to this. >> Yeah. I'm trying to get to the >> What was the open-ended? Here we go. The part three generals I think where I would propose we spend some time which is what are our strengths
055and what are our areas of improvement >> and this is something that we already talked about in the boardroom. So this is a re a revisiting of >> right >> just self assessment of how we're performing in the the the global we we're performing as individuals and as a board. Correct. >> Right. >> Yep. >> And we want to start with part three. >> And so I'm thinking yeah sure >> so we only have 15 minutes. >> Yep. When did when did we present about this psychology? >> We presented board goals. >> Yeah, we presented board goals. We didn't really went so much. We kind of judged around it. >> Everybody everyone kind of jigsawed and and kind of popcorned out how they felt like they were they reflected in in boardroom. I think it
056was probably two months ago. >> Was director or sorry maybe you weren't there that day. That's >> I just remember we didn't get your >> Anyway, >> it's good. No, it's good. Um I think that we have a lot of strengths. We are um I think all aware of what our role is on on the school board. We go out into the community and um look at, you know, listen from constituents uh whoever those are that uh come up to you either at Fred Meyer or through more um more um like a concerted better effort um than that. I think that um we do a good job of uh communicating during the during the board meeting. Um I think areas of improvement if I was to u rate us that's where I rate it as
057pro like based on what the book is saying and um where we need to have more um I think community uh building amongst you know ourselves but also amongst uh the the staff and the community uh I I don't know that um that we're doing a great job with that in terms of um well at least I know that I'm not like going out to schools and talking to uh to staff at at schools and uh things like that and mostly it's because you know I I have time to pop in but being intentional about like why is this board member just popping into a school right like I would have to make an employer and and do all of that and uh not not having done that, >> you know, I can't just pop
058in. Like the other day I you I'm picking up my kid, right? I'm like, "Oh, I should pop in." But then I'm like, "Uh, >> probably probably not a not the best idea, you know?" >> And we have the board agreements that say we don't pop into schools, but >> Right. Exactly. So, it's like, >> which he was thinking of because he has a laminated copy in his car on the window >> while he's driving. But I should actually I should have because if I had that I would remember that that's one of our wor crash more but you would remember. >> So so that I think that that's where I would uh I would rate us that we're we're doing good. So if we if I wanted to give it a quantitative uh tally
059I would do a two. Uh we're we're meats we're meeting but we could still do more. Especially for me I think I'm at a two. I can say something. Um, so when I was looking at the self- assessment, I was just comparing it to our working agreements and, you know, answering questions accordingly. >> And I I brought this up in a meeting. I found it hard to rate myself on a number of these that are whole board work. So, you know, for instance, like number 16, ensure that all TTSD board policies are accurate and up to date. That's the board's responsibility, not any individual. Although, if you know, if somebody notices, oh, we haven't done this since 2008, you know, I mean, >> but um >> there were a number of these that um I
060think really are for the the board. So, I mean, in general, I I think that the biggest strengths of the board are that, you know, we all have commitment. Everybody comes with some level of expertise and I mean in different areas and everybody's involved. I do believe there is that shared belief that all students can and will learn. there's research behind that. And um you know I I think overall like we are a really we're a really good board and um I think that one of the areas that I I wonder about and is are the way that we sometimes handle disagreements or or conflicts in the boardroom. We don't have a lot of conflicts. I've seen so much worse. But um you know I I think that in general that opposing views everybody gets
061heard and I think that that a lot of times those are you know obviously respectful and and we're all open to hearing each other and there are times just honestly that I have heard comments between folks that are kind of snipy and um and I think that you know if we are all assuming best intent and if there are interpersonal issues that we work them out not in the or that it doesn't get to the boardroom. Um I think that is something that you know that should be paid attention to so it doesn't balloon um I think that's my biggest comment on on that but you know we are a highly functional board. So what number would you give us based on I'm really curious because you see more boards than the rest of us.
062So you have a better >> I mean I think in a lot of these I gave us threes, right? Like in a lot of these I said that we consistently meet expectations in a lot of these. Um and then some are are too I don't necessarily I think it would be interesting I'm not suggesting this but like the calibration between how we all feel about meets and consistently meets right. I mean that's probably a different calibration for each of us. Um, so I think overall like for me like we have a three and then I think there are just some little areas that could use some focus. >> Cool. Thank you. >> Um, I can go. You want me to go? >> Sure. >> Um, and I kind of looking over the actual numbers. I
063have almost all threes and then some like peppered twos. Um I wrote I think that overall we are strong and highly functioning our high functioning board. We have a clear vision for what we want for the students in our district and we are intentional about aligning our decisions to that vision. Um our conversations consistently come back to student outcomes, equity, and long-term impact. Um which keeps us focused on what matters most. Uh we work hard to be transparent, to communicate openly, and to invite feedback even when conversations may be challenging. That willingness to listen and stay visible builds trust and strengthens our connections to the families and students we serve. Um and I think areas of improvement for me center around kind of a shared and practical understanding of just sort of like the board
064governance and especially the distinction between our role and the district's role. Um and um and when those are clear and sort of everyone's sort of following that work in terms of who does what, it allows the district to lead effectively and keeps us focused on the work that we were elected to do. >> Chris, what do you think? >> I don't think I have anything to add. >> What was your general evaluation? approved the evaluation for the board >> For part three. Um >> this like general >> thought we generally met expectations. >> What generally do you think are the strengths of the board? What do you think are the areas of improvement? Um do we get mostly threes, mostly twos, mostly ones? I thought we generally matter or exceeded expectations. You don't want to
065talk about weaknesses, areas of importance. We don't have any. >> I just want to make sure I don't have anything to add. >> Okay. Um, we have like three minutes left, so I'll just do this really quick. >> We have six minutes. >> Oh, six minutes. >> Um, >> and we don't have to use all the time. So, >> we don't I agree with what most has been said, mostly threes, a few twos. For me, I think the ones where we need to work is I'm a little concerned about maintaining a positive relationship with the community and district staff. um both the community piece as as Devid has pointed out, but also the district staff. Um there have been a couple of times quite frankly when district staff has gotten beaten up in the boardroom
066and it's not it's not cool. Um and so that's a conversation I'd like to have a little bit more about later as we get into the board protocols because that's in there as well. Um, and then the other part is I think the board does okay with our working agreements, but I don't think we do as well as we could. And that's one reason why I'm suggesting we have it available at the board meeting so that we can make it better. Um, and as we get deeper into working on our um our board operating agreements for the next year, I'll do that in more detail. Um, but I think in terms of all the stuff where we are supporting our superintendent, I think we're doing a pretty good job of that. He doesn't seem too
067miserably unhappy. Um, I think we're doing a pretty good job on the budget. Um, and that funding process that we have ahead. Um, it's been we've had some decent conversations at our budget meeting, our our community work group meetings. Um, pretty good turnout, not as much as I wish we'd had. And now I think it's back to our community outreach piece. We're not we're not getting into the community as much as as I would like. They're having a lot of new faces at the meetings which has been cool. >> That has been cool. >> Yeah. Not as maybe many bodies um a couple that I've been to, but um a lot of new faces. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Anything else for the good of the order on the topic of self assessment? Hearing none, we'll
068go four minutes early. Does anybody need a quick break? >> No. Okay. Um >> there is food over there. Just so people skip lunch or whatever, just feel free to grab grab a bite. >> So, uh the nuts and bolts of how we meet as a board, our start and end times. We had talked about about this. Um, we talked uh very graciously about changing days. Do we want to try to meet earlier rather than six start? Do a six o'clock start? I can't remember where we left it. >> I believe that might have depended on the day selected. >> I didn't write. >> Would we be changing our day next year, not this year? >> It wouldn't be this. Yeah, that was we decided I do remember that from our previous conversation as we
069started to have sort of little chunks of this that that's going to be something we will really um have starting in July. >> Yeah. Okay. >> Yeah. Remember the six o'clock start time. >> I I remember that discussion >> but I don't remember. >> So is >> I'm good with >> a six o'clock start time. If we are doing a six o'clock start time then and we have a um work session, it would go from 5 to 6 and then from 6 to whenever. So we wouldn't have that half an hour break in between. >> That would certainly be one way of doing it. >> No, that's what I'm saying that we wouldn't have that. So I would not >> really like that. >> Okay. So you you want to have that half hour break.
070I think the half hour break is good in that scenario. >> But if there's no work session, I'm okay with just moving the meeting up or the work session because we don't always have it could move second because then we could have the consistent time say at 5. Then if we have a work session, it's after if it exists >> except for the ones where we report >> and then we from what we did at the work session. Otherwise, that would be >> I think it might be hard to have a work session at like nine o'clock, especially if we're asking prior to that staff to be there. Um, and we don't always know when our meetings end either, but and and if we ended way early, which we often do, then we would have
071to wait, >> right? What about stacking? What about putting the work sessions because we usually have two board meetings per month. Mhm. >> So what if one board meeting like say the first one is the board meeting and the second one is any work sessions and we could even have more than one work session and then they all start at the same time. So you're suggesting that in we have we would still have our two business meetings a month and then we would have one or two work sessions on the alternate Monday. just have a longer business meeting like regular board meeting say one board meeting a month and then one work session. >> Yeah. And if there's more than one work session then because I think a lot of boards just have one board
072meeting and then if we like there's no reason to pepper each date with a board meeting and a work session. Just have all the board meeting stuff and all the work session stuff and >> except we don't vote at a work session. And so when there's stuff that needs to get voted on, we have to have what we could do is we could say if we have a work session, it is not a separate meeting from the board meeting. It is the first item of business at the meeting >> At 6 and then we have the work session for however long we need. And then we can have a recess for however long we need. and then continue the meeting. We could have a really late meeting. >> I'm not in favor of the really
073late meeting. Nobody does their best. >> I know. >> I think generally starting closer to 5 is good. And having a predictable break if it's going to be a really long meeting is good. Logistics are also I mean we don't want to say we don't know when we want dinner to come. Good luck, Jade. >> That's not nice. Um, >> what's the earliest you can meet? Maybe realistically, those of you who have day jobs, five >> for a regular meeting >> or anything. >> Anything. Okay. >> Yeah. How about you, Christian? >> I didn't hear that last part. I >> What's the earliest you could meet for either a workshop? If I know well in advance what I'm doing, probably like 4 or 4:30 like But I would have to know well in advance. >>
074Well, in advance being two months, 3 months. >> Oh, I mean months. >> No, I mean like Yeah, generally 6 weeks, something like that. >> What about generally five? I mean, >> I'd rather have actually like 5:15. >> Okay. Um just because the assumption that we start immediately after um like regular working hours for some of us feels a little bit like improper. kind of to your idea, if we did like a 5:30 or 5:15, we really then could in theory start. If we didn't have a work session, >> like either way, our meetings start at 5:30. I'm just using that time or 5:15 for our regular meetings. If we have a work session, to your point, they could be then we're not we're not going till 9:00. >> Mhm. >> We just are rolling
075back the start time as early as we could all feasibly. >> Yeah. I guess my question is what problem are we trying to solve? >> That is the best question. >> That's a good question and that's what I want to ask this group or or something context for that. >> Yeah. >> And I want to almost come back to the question around um once a month versus twice a month. But I think um before I get there, I think the the initial reason this is on the agenda is because we typically have a gap between when we have a work session scheduled and when we um actually start our business schedule >> and what that does is it makes for a longer night for for most of us. Probably longer than I think we'd like
076it to be if we can make it a little bit like if we can adjourn a little earlier. So, initially the conversation was around should we start our general session at 6 pm, which would likely mean we would convene or we would adjourn a half hour earlier. Our board meetings are about an hour and 45 minutes to 2 hours and 15 minutes. So, that means you normally would get out around 8:00 p.m.ish uh rather than what looks like about 8:30 8:40 right now. So, that was that was the initial primary reason. >> Mhm. Another one that had come up was dates. Um, if and I think we kind of settled this in the boardroom a little bit if I reme recall correctly, but you know, does Monday still work versus an alternate date based on
077like our schedules and and just the overall routine. So, I think those are the two things. And then one thing around the once a month versus the twice a month that I wanted to get at is um it'd be great to get feedback from you all, but it feels like most of the time we're able to uh through through technology give you more information as a board. And so, you know, I do my weekly updates and I try to be really thoughtful about um incorporating things that I feel like you should know that might be shared in a more long- winded superintendent update. I keep my updates for to about 5 to 12 minutes. Um, so you have those, you know, I want to kind of like hearken back to like parent teacher conferences. It
078used to seem like those are really meaningful and they are, right? But they were really meaningful when we didn't have email, >> parent square, canvas, etc. And that was our really only our link to how our students were performing and our teachers and that triangulation we need. And now with all those other things, you just get less attendance at those parent teacher conferences because there's so many other ways to to to communicate. So it's kind of similar in that there's a lot of methods for us to deliver critical and timely board information. And so the question is, do we need to meet every month versus every twice a month? My two cents is it's also helpful for um community engagement and board and board transparency to meet twice a month. So I'm not trying to
079sway one way or another. I'm just going to putting this stuff in the room for you all to consider. I also think the I think the communication piece is spot on like we do have all these other ways of >> knowing what's happening and there's always a number of action items and I wonder particularly I'm thinking of like now there's all this bond work >> and so could we are we >> I think it would be really difficult to be waiting a month for contracts to be approved for true >> like those types of things. So certainly we could have I I mean I I would be curious to know how if there are boards that sort of stack like this is our sort of our first of the month meeting is really like we're
080having a lot of those reports and discussion items and some things that we vote on. The second one is very light and maybe that's where we put in like Crystal's like almost two work sessions or or something like we we fill it with other we don't make it longer but we fill it because it's really just the not rubber stamping but the quick action item things um and we have our reports and discussion more like the once a month or or you know something like that but I do think a month in between being able to vote on stuff would be tough or policy changes or things like that >> especially with bond I think you're Good point. >> Yeah. I wonder if we would, this might be a little bit what we were saying.
081We stack most of the um action items on one, but then if the second one is like as needed any action items would it be is that >> we can do that as long as it's not in violation of policy, right? There are some policies that say like we will not vote at work sessions and if we don't have that nothing prevents us from voting at work sessions if needed. >> Right. But then like that's short or something and then you know we really do the work session piece. >> Yeah. I mean the other thing we can do is we kind of we used to have longer reports and discussion where it was more discussion and not just a report and some of those got really long and excuse me we started to pull those
082into work sessions so that we could have more time to we could just push those back into the board meeting proper and just give a lot of time for here's a report and discussion items >> and it's going to be 45 minutes and we could do that way if we So, the consensus I'm hearing based on the numbers that everybody was throwing out is it sounds like 6:00 would be pretty easy. 5:30 probably works for everybody and has the benefit of getting us out the out of the building earlier in the evening, which I think is good for all of us. I'm not seeing anybody shaking their head and cursing at me yet. Yes. Um, going back to what we just read with the community aspect, did we think in the past because I don't
083know who set this time up. Was it because more people might be able to attend from the community at this 6:30 time frame or tune in at this 6:30 time frame? Then if we started live streaming back, >> right? >> So now you can, >> right? different people, >> both of those >> or or rewatch, I suppose. >> Mhm. >> Would that be an ease or a burden on staff? I feel like it'd be like they would do this starting early because it wouldn't have this weird in between time. They can't really go home, but they're kind of >> like would they have a feeling either way? >> I think most staff, >> unless you live within driving like a 10-minute commute, most staff don't go home. And so I think the staff would prefer
084to start earlier and >> that was my >> especially in the winter when the weather gets bad and of course it doesn't really matter because after 4:30 it's going to be dark anyways but just the driving conditions and being tired when the weather's really really um the intimate weather starts kicking in. >> I think just feels better for our staff in general. Um, the only thing that makes it challenging is like meals, right? Like some people finish their workday at 5:00 and so it's a quick turnaround, but we're we can manage that. We're high functioning adults, so we can manage that. Is the proposal though to I just want to make sure I understand this to embed work sessions in one meeting a month so that we are having like 45 minute conversations on something
085because the last thing I would want to do is be like now we're going to have 10 10 p.m. stops but one meeting a month >> right if we have well I think there's emerging consensus around whatever day doing it at 5:15 or 5:30 and then whether that is if we have two of something per month that start at an earlier time um then we could have I guess because we're starting later because the work session is like an empty space that's only there sometimes or like sometimes it's full, sometimes it's not. And so we're having the board meeting at at 6. So to resolve that theoretically we put the work session on the second meeting um or otherwise m I think we're trying to start earlier. So, one way to potentially resolve that is
086to have the work session and maybe a light agenda. Maybe we have a really short board meeting and then we have any work sessions, but theoretically it's not any later because a lot of times we do have a work session. Well, I Yeah. So, I think my which can be moved around my thought was first Monday of the whatever the the first meeting of the month is like a like how we have them now. reports in discussion, like all the things. And then the second one is simply any action items that have come up >> in theory like in the next two in the like that last two weeks that can't wait till the next meeting and then then we can stack maybe two work sessions like or we do a whole bunch of SIPs
087so we can get a whole bunch done instead of like spreading them out throughout the whole year or something like that. So, it's we're still doing the the action item piece of the agenda, maybe an consent agenda for second reads, like that quick stuff, >> and then we're filling it with >> I think that's >> and whether that looks like quote a work session or >> report and discussion >> that just goes on >> for 40 like time 45 minutes. >> I really like that idea. >> Yeah, I think that's good. >> Am I seeing all the work? Okay, Jade, >> is there any like um there might be some logistical or things to work through with the >> like do we call it a board meeting or a work session? >> It'll be they'll
088all be board meetings. >> We'll have a separate um board meeting to actually do our our agenda planning, our calendaring. And so during that time, we could hammer that stuff out, but we'll codify the um summary of what you will all discuss in the notes. Only point of clarification I have, I heard two different start times. Yeah, >> I heard a 5:15 start time is consensus and I heard a 6 p.m. start time. And I just want to give you an opportunity to clarify so that we can make sure that we're >> 5:30. >> I'm 5:30 called 5:30. That gives people who do want to come to the board meeting time to get off work and get to the board meeting. >> If it's feeling a little rushed for whatever reason, we can always some
089point in year change the calendar to be six or five or whichever. But I think >> And are we keeping the date? Monday. >> I would prefer to keep Mondays, but >> I >> whatever. I just need to know six months in advance. >> I would prefer not to keep Monday. Is there another day that wouldn't be too bad? >> Monday is the only day that works for me. >> What? >> Monday. I like Monday. It's the only day that works for me. I got Tuesdays is the board meeting for Sale Kiser. that usually Wednesdays don't we have something maybe for the community stuff here. I don't know. >> It's usually on Wednesdays, right? >> Lots of events for me on Thursdays and Wednesdays. >> I don't think any of us want to go Friday,
090do we? >> No. Bad enough when we had to do balance. >> Dude, if you' be rough. So, yeah. I'm hearing four pretty strong Mondays. I'm sorry. What did you say? Did you say Monday? >> I said I don't care as long as I know six months in advance. >> Okay. >> Three Mondays. >> Then I block off my voting. >> I block off my calendar. What? >> We still be voting the same way like uh in July for all the dates, right? >> Yeah. Don't we establish a calendar earlier than July? >> Yeah, but for from July one on. Yeah. >> We're not going to be changing anything. >> Okay. I don't think we can find one night that's going to make everybody happy. So, we're just going to have to unfortunately pick one
091and somebody's going to have to suck it up somehow. Well, I will continue to join remotely sometimes, which is a good option. So, >> all right. Um, our community calendar, did you want to um >> since this is a staff one, do you want to talk about >> Yeah, I want to be mindful of time. Jay, do we >> I sent it. Everybody should have gotten. >> Yeah. And Jay, we can co um co- facilitate here. There's just should be um events in your email on the community calendar. This is just an opportunity that we're trying to be intentional about to provide um intentional updates on community events. Some that kind of require board attendance, some where it would be nice to have board attendance and who's going to attend, right? And um this also
092can be um a tool that you all would use to um kind of decide what you want to report out on sometimes in terms of board activity. For instance, last week um or yesterday um we had Representative Walters attend um just the visit and tour of Bridgeport. And if that's something that we knew was happening, we put it on the the community calendar and more than one board member could be present for that. And then this might be something that you would consider sharing out with everybody. >> Do you have your computer so you can look at it? >> Should I pull it up? I can pull it up. We can share. >> I can share with you. >> Why? Why are you >> We're talking about the community events calendar. I have to look
093at it to tell. >> Well, no. Just >> It has events on it. >> It's got the events on it so you can understand what we're talking about. >> I'm just We just didn't know if you >> trying to be helpful. >> Yes. Look at it. I really like this. >> I do. >> This is great. >> This might have be something that I borrowed from Chaka Community College. I think this >> one of the things that I would really like to have on this is there if there was a way to like indicate which board members have indicated that they can go. >> Yeah, there'll be an already >> there's already two board members going. I don't want to go because that would make it a quorum issue. So, um, you see where it
094says foundation bingo? >> And how it's blank? Uh, what we'll do is put your name down if you like if you were to go around right now and say, I want to go to that on Wednesday the 18th, then we would put your name on it and >> then we we would give it we could um link it in a board update um >> for or in a work session for you all to review whatever feels like it's like best best for your routine. That's why I saw all five of our names in every box and I'm like, >> "Yeah, that's for the actual board." >> Yeah. And like, >> "Duh, got it now." >> Yeah. And there's just some things that are just FYIs as well. So, I I believe deeply in layering communication
095and so I know that during my weekly updates at the very end, you'll see calendar business there and those are like kind of cherrypicked and um this is just an opport but we don't say who's going to go to the play, right? or who is going to go to uh Lutaria. So this is just anam another opportunity to systematize it. Gotcha. >> So this is a shared document that ideally all of us would have >> start on our computers so that we can go through these at the end >> and more ideally as chair um the chair would say hey we're going to choose um we're going to schedule some time to review it together maybe quarterly. Okay >> so you can see who's going to go to what and say I'll go to that
096I love that event or I can't make it. >> Perfect. That sounds like something we could do what during board communication sounds like a natural. >> Yeah. Yeah definitely. Okay. >> Um, so the only thing is, um, why not share this on the regular calendar? I mean, because we could send out invites and then we could just hit accept or not. Um, and then folks could see who all is accepted. >> Yeah. However you all want to do it. >> That would be more streamlined into our existing systems. Except I like the idea of if we talk about it at a board meeting during our board communication time, it gets more airplay in the community as well. So, >> and also like if it's on here already, like it's upon us to go and add
097it to our calendar if we wanted to rather than have it in another email and like >> make just put it up in the email and then we decline or >> it's like a person who gets too many emails. I think I think what this could also do is um >> when you it's an opport it's a calibrating tool in public and so >> um if you say you're going to attend something then um >> Jade will be able to monitor >> and then if needs to send out a reminder for instance like let's say we have uh >> uh a goal say again >> shining stars so shining stars hey just a reminder uh to let's say that um you chair and vice chair decide want to go. Jay can send out a reminder.
098Hey, reminder you're going to Shining Stars. There's a reserved parking spot for you and you'll be seated at seat 15. Something like that. It just makes it um >> Yeah. >> Yep. >> Cool. >> All right. I like it. Um next up on our nuts and bolts is SIPS. And I feel like we've figured that one out. Um, if we're going to do SIPs as a like double length work session in a board meeting, we just need to schedule it as such. And that's how we do our sips. >> We could still do two and two like not all of them. >> Not all of >> Yeah. But I think we did two >> 17 of them at once. >> Two roundts worth one meeting. Two round tables another meeting. Yeah. >> Yep. And and
099the the staff had and I'm speaking on behalf of the staff. Uh because the attendance from board was spotty. What often happened is we would have a handful of schools there and they were just like presenting to me >> right or or other in other staff and so I guess the ask for them was is this you know it's a fair question is this important to the board because it feels like >> there's there's not consistent attendance at these and so we're just >> the principles are putting a bunch of work in to present to their peers and to me and I already know what's going on. So I think the question is or the my response back to them will be this is important to the board. We're modifying it by changing our start
100time to basically embed it into what would be general session time which should u help improve the attendance at those times. >> Yeah. >> Please don't raise your hands. We're sorry you guys. >> I don't mind. >> Part of it's like I have to remember that I have a thought. Um >> yeah. So then for the sharing out piece, would that happen at the next >> Oh, next board meeting. >> board meeting. >> Mhm. >> And as long as that was okay with So we would just take those really good notes and they would be okay knowing that that kind of immediate cool feedback and highlights that we were hearing wouldn't happen until two weeks later. Or we could structure it so that we do have that during the meeting. we can we have the
101freedom to do either way. >> The delaying the feedback to the next board meeting actually gives you all an opportunity to ask me really direct questions that maybe you didn't want to put in that space and follow up and then and then you can say hey last week we or last session we did a SIP I um heard from Byum >> check check and here's some followup that I learned because I had some existing questions and that might be an opportunity for that as well. >> I love that idea. Yeah. >> Is everybody good with that? >> Be able to like have more time with their materials if they send us the presentations. >> Yeah. We just build it into our agenda planning >> for the next You okay with that, Christopher? You're the only
102one I'm not seeing that. >> It seems seems fine. >> Okay. All right. Um board PD. Um, so we we did some book reading and um we could do more PD like that. We could do as superintendent suggested bringing people in for or you suggested bringing people to to do more directed >> um board stuff. What's the what's y'all's thinking on >> whatever we do? I really >> don't want it to be Robert's rules. >> Yeah, that too. But um I think that um there is so much educational um qualitative materials and um thoughts and approaches. And I think there is less, but there's still some that is um like more peer-reviewed. And so I think to the extent that we focus on those materials rather than just kind of like um things that are
103more qualitative is my preference. >> Okay. >> Question that I have for the board. Thank you. Um the question I have for the board is um what mode in in spaces do you prefer to receive PD? So for instance we have um a very popular PD tool that's generated from RSBA once a year um that's a two-day summit or conference and that's one method for receiving professional development. Another is through um using this retreat space to have like more long form dialogue about everything from board governance to trends in and in and education and and um so I get and then um there's a variet and then there's work sessions where we can build in professional development as well. Uh and really I I say PD but it's more development. So um the question is
104for you all like what methods do all of them work? Do you prefer one versus the other? And then that will help me uh collaborate with board leadership on how to um build capacity and platforms for you all to engage in that education. I guess one question that brings up for me is um and maybe there's a couple different elements, but are we talking more about um like the nuts and bolts of board governance or are we talking about um like trends in because I think trends in education for example is just like oh here's a new study that came out that might be good to think about >> versus like um like everyone's messing up seconding the motion consistently. different. >> I think it's broad. I think it's there's uh a lot of factors
105that goes into board function and board development and like a good example is one is for a new person who doesn't under like you all are seasoned but at some point I imagine that you all will move on right and so for that person who doesn't get Robert's rules like there's a time and place for them to meet them where they are or the collective them where they are. Um, and then there's also Can I see this book real quick, >> Tisha? On the bottom. >> Thank you. So, >> great book. >> Yeah. So, this is when we um for uh our um what was it? The summit for a not a but was it called? Um >> DM group. This was a lot of board members and district leaders coming together for a 3-day
106summit and one was dedicated to board and superintendent development. And this is a book that they did research on. It talked about public discourse and it's around acknowledging there's going to be conflict within school boards and within communities where school boards are at the center. And this is research based on like how to disagree better from Harvard, right? And so there's that's one form of PD that I think that I don't want to speak for you, but like we had conversations and felt it was really beneficial. And then there's other forms of PD where some people might want to know more about policy and maybe they go to an OSBA training on it. And then there's like internal stuff where we talk about board governance and decor, right? So it's just around what you all
107think you need in this time as a board. There you go. Thank you for letting me use that prop. I love all sorts of professional development and I think that going to a conference not only helps us build uh agency amongst all but we all get to know each other too like that >> that uh cohesion that happens during a conference if we have the time to go obviously but um if we don't 6 months in advance then >> we might be able to go >> and it won't be running it that's one of the problems with the OSBA conference is that I know Kristine's got to work it >> and >> it costs a chunk of money and so you sign up for it and then something happens and you can't go. It's >>
108it's a problem, >> right? >> And that's not to put too fat a point out, we've had a pretty >> uh high rate of signing up and not going to conventions and that bothers me because it's wasting >> taxpayer dollars. Yeah. But like uh you know when we went to DC I mean that was an amazing way to not only learn how to professionally advocate for our students here but you know we learned at the national level how to advocate with >> national and my first we went to the NSBA conference was in San Diego and so everybody did that together. So I think there is this really great balance of like what are collectively the things we can do as a group because it is weird going to conferences and everybody has this isn't
109it is what it is and being like I'm oh I'm the only one here from >> ttsd like right down the road >> there's like local conferences >> yeah like it's when everybody has their whole board together with them and they're like doing all this work together and like >> creating kind of that community. So I think and that doesn't mean and it wouldn't work anyway with OSBA because I want you to have the experience of the team piece, not the like you're leading the charge of the whole entire thing piece. >> But I do think finding something and then those offshoots of like this is what I'm really passionate about or this is what I want to get better at and I can do that individually with >> a training or a book or
110whatever. But I think a little bit of both could be >> valuable. Yeah, a menu of options might I mean I think there's general consensus like conferences are are a good um thing to have available. Um and then it and then um I like the peer-reviewed articles in their um natural habitat without too much filtering. um >> audio books varies a little bit like depending on the issue or what we're trying to get at. >> What's our budget for Peters? >> That's part of why I'm asking this is cuz we're trying to build our budget and >> let's just make some cuts. And um so but what I'm I'm kind of hearing from this group and I can't remember the exact dollar amount it might and don't quote me but Jade maybe $18,000 does it
111sound like >> total or per >> I think total is what >> hopefully it's not per I know right >> that'd be help pay a lot um so to that end what I what my um I want to put out to the board and you can give me some feedback on it is to keep our model for PD consistent right which is um a variety of um inputs and options, but I do want to make sure that um in building the budget, what we can do is uh say, "Hey, we're going to continue to have these three or four um kind of conferences that cost money that will um continue to budget for and um just try to make sure that pe everybody has an opportunity to participate in those. Those are the most um
112most expensive options and then like these are like $20, right? So like that's that's not going to make or break the bank for how much resource we get from it. So um we'll just So what do you all think? Keep things >> consistent. The library >> I I I think that that balance is a really good idea because it gives us >> um the opportunity to have a couple of people go to certain conferences. Um, and I I think sending all of us to a conference with the budget we have right now is really not going to happen. >> Sure. >> It's just too expensive for us to go to NSBA alto together. >> But a local conference probably that doesn't have a huge buy in and then the book I agree. I think I
113mean even though I was highly skeptical of this book in a lot of ways, there was some really good stuff in it nonetheless and it got me thinking about how I am as a board member and how we are as a board and I think there's value in that and we can talk about it together. It guarantees we have something we do all five together. >> I have a policy and I know we need to move on but I have a policy thing to put into the boardroom right now. Um so as far I want to pick on the the Portland conference uh the OSPA conference is typically takes place in Portland. I know a lot of us live local um but we know that traffic is really bad and that driving in the dark
114is really bad and I'm not sure I I wonder if the board would like to reconsider their policy around staying the night. >> So for after >> Yeah. So between day one and day two what happens is normally there's an 8 there's an 8 a.m. start >> and it's it's dark out. I just want to throw that into this group. So, it might be easier for for people to stay later at the night events, stay in in Portland that night, and then be able to be up and ready. Um, I'm not putting any pressure on. I just I I remember that was an issue around um folks that were local that were potentially wanting to stay the night at the the Sheridan or the Marriott or whatever it was. >> Are we talking about just
115the board now? >> The board and staff. >> Okay. >> Yeah, be board and staff. So when >> really I'm the only staff that goes there. >> So for the OSBA conference in November the convention. >> The convention >> when we couldn't stay. >> Yeah. >> And >> it's because Portland I guess is too close in mileage >> but from our district. >> We're asking if we want to stay >> just change policy so that that would be an option. I think >> we'd love that. Make an exception. >> Yeah. I think I mean I think we all need to be mindful of the expense and what's the actual value and making sure again it's making sure we get value for that that money spent. So we're going to have to really commit to yes
116we're really going to be there for the entire conference. We're going to >> I wonder if that might improve our attendance as well. Um and like so people coming from Pendleton >> right >> they're going to stay and they're going to be completely engaged because they're driving 100 200 miles. Same with even someone traveling as far as Corvalis or Eugene. >> But I feel like locally it kind of feels like a popin option more than it is like we're committed. We're going to be >> like oh look >> even like Eugene conferences are easy like you're right there. It's like yes I could or Salem ones like we could drive home or not but it's nice to be >> and there's been to have dinner to the other. >> Yeah. and four of you have
117family commitments that sometimes you're like, "Well, I got to get out by 4 because I got to go attend to this family commitment." So, I just want to put that out there as an option. >> Go ahead. Sorry. Oh, you're >> I think um maybe there could be a little bit of nuance in it because if somebody goes to like you know a DC conference and a Miami conference and then spends the night in Portland like maybe there could be um >> not that anyone's doing that in this budget budgetary situation but maybe we >> is there is there a way to build in a little bit of um >> like a not to exceed per person? >> Yeah, I think but I do think that's very reasonable. I can make an ex. So, what
118I can actually do per policy and I have to double check it. Um, I'm looking at you because you were on the policy committee last year, right? Um, but what I can double double check is I think I could actually make the exception and ask the um >> and ask the uh CFO to make the exception. I just want to make sure that that's the will of the board as well otherwise because I want to be systemic and systematic in you know um when we make that exception because there's a lot of conferences in Portland and I don't want to always be saying hey look >> you can stay at the Marriott every time there's a Portland conference because that's it doesn't seem like it's it's sufficient but this one is it's identified it as
119a problem >> I think I think it can be written in a way that meets that. >> Okay. >> And >> hopefully >> I think that's it's it's reasonable because it is a a late night. I know a lot of the events for that go late and then that just unpredictable traffic and parking and finding your car in the dark. I've done that. >> Yeah. And then getting turned around and all that. So, >> it's getting more. >> Well, let me let me take this on that I get I'm getting like yes, move forward informally. We're not taking a vote, but I'm getting an informal. Yes, move forward. So, >> bring something forward or however that needs to go. >> And if it's not a policy, then I'll just exercise my authority as superintendent to
120make it happen. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> I don't see that in the policy. >> It's not for board members. I think it's for staff only. >> It's for staff. Good. >> Yeah. >> Good. Got you. >> Yeah, it's definitely something we can address. >> Okay. I want to We've got 25 minutes left in this Yep. section and I want to make sure we've got a good chunk of time for the board working agreement because I think it's going to be the meat of our conversation today. >> Does anybody need a quick break before we keep going? We've got a break scheduled in half an hour. So, you can keep going. It would be great. >> And did we already tackle board goals? Sorry. >> Board goals coming later. >> Okay, got you. Um, so
121our working agreements, as I said, I'd like to try to tighten this up and make it a one pager that we have at in front of us. Um, it's really >> not in our car, >> but not on your not. But, you know, we were suggesting maybe could have a tattoo, right? >> Let's do it. Let's do it. >> And then you've always got these little things for like softball and baseball players. I guess like look at that. >> That's what it was. So, um, >> do you have any items you would suggest omitting to get it down to a page? Because I don't know that having it laminated in front of us is the reason I would add or subtract things. But if you have anything that you feel we we could easily delete,
122that's what we're >> So, that's what we're talking about here. I'm not going to I'm not gonna I don't want to be the one to say I think this and I think this. I'd like to have us have this conversation. Um, and some of them could, you know, some like the the how we operate and make decisions piece is a real nuts and bolts thing. We've had some of those on there for a very very long time. I don't know if we still need them. Um, we make decisions as a whole board only at properly called meetings. Do we still need that one or do we kind of know that one? Is it good to have that as a reminder? I think, you know, I mean, given that this kind of thing is meant to
123be revised or at least reviewed annually, it what matters right now is what's important to this board because when the board changes over, they should do better, >> right? So, do we need to tell ourselves we start and end meetings on time? >> I just underlined that. >> Totally. >> Just underlined that. >> Okay. Well, that's that's very much a hold over from a time when we didn't >> when it didn't, right? And if that's not applicable to this board, I think we could cut it down. The other thing I think that we could do and maybe should look at is what's captured in the preamble. >> Yeah, >> that is duplicative of what's here, if any, and what could we put into the preamble that you know in a short form. I don't know.
124I would pop this all into be like shorten this. >> Um, but I think there's probably some things that maybe aren't applicable to this board. And Jill, you would have the history of like why some things are in here probably. >> I like our beginning part, the introduction. >> Well, and maybe two, we can have >> like >> we have two documents. We have the one with the preamble and then the one in front of us. That's kind of what I'm >> so like the the kind of bullet points of like what we really will be like focusing on during meetings like some of those things is we won't need to come like be thinking about like we act as ambassadors or >> right or we hold legal compliance and confidential >> right like we're
125not >> I think that is one that >> we're not tackling that during a meeting. >> Okay. So let me try rephrasing the question. These are the ones we've been working under. we could keep this document intact and then we could make a short form for board meetings. How does that sound? And then we don't necessarily have the policy um references. I love the policy references actually though I think they're they're good for the long form but for the short form maybe not. >> Um I am curious about the purpose of having something to refer to during board meetings. Are you feeling like we are regularly violating board agreements? Is there disagreement about an interpretation of something >> or or do you think people are I'm I'm unsure. I feel um it seems odd that
126we would need something to refer to in the board meeting. And this is only one page. So it's like this could still be already >> I mean being on several boards and like OSBA stuff, you know, like we have that to refer to it no matter whether we're seasoned, nonseason, or whatever. Like it's just good practice to have. It is. Does it need to be shorter or like >> Well, I think if we were talking about having like >> that sort of cliff notes thing with the different like what's the community agreements or the art of community the Robert's rules like basic things the I'll bring it in on Monday cuz I asked Lenel if I could steal one um just to kind of see like the visual of what I'm but it's it's very
127helpful and the board >> at OSBA the president use like we all kind of refer to this thing. It's It's really nice to have. >> So nice of you. You asked to steal it. I just >> Yeah. Just steal it. >> Um Okay. >> And I think if we don't use it, then why do we have it, right? I mean, like, if we're just looking at this every six months, I mean, if I hear something like weird in a board meeting and I'm like, does this violate an agreement or not? But like if we're sitting in a board meeting and Kristen is just like springs a huge surprise question on our superintendent, like I think any of us then could feel empowered to say, >> could we stop and talk? Yeah. Gav, just grab the
128G. Um, you know, can we talk about the agreement that we have of no surprises because I think that we may be edging toward or whatever. And it's a it's a selfacountability piece >> that I think is also good for our community to see as youths as well. >> And I don't think it should be a gotcha like oh look at this like you're violating this agreement right but but I think it does serve as a reminder for all of us. I mean, every time we had those um the art of community in front of us at every meeting, people would refer to it, right? They would be like, "Oh, this is I like it when it gets messy or whatever, right?" Um it it's just a good reference point and good practice to >>
129your point like why do we have them if we're not we don't even know what they are like, "Oh, we don't I didn't know that was in there." >> Well, and we can remind ourselves too, right? I mean like if I'm looking at this and I'm like oh I'm you know I'm about to say something you know or what or what is a surprise thing you know I'm looking at that for myself as well. >> Well I mean obviously it's a good reference but I mean maybe we can just review it and decide if we need to change anything. And as far as if folks want to keep it in front of them or not I mean it it can be good but I think we talk about it often enough. >> I don't think
130we talk about these almost ever. I think that's kind of why this is. >> Yeah. So, I think the idea is >> I definitely feel like it comes up, but I guess maybe we don't talk about the whole thing. >> So, there's some things that I see I hear coming up. And one is um number seven says we make decisions as a whole board only at properly called meetings. And um eight uh once a decision is made, we support the decision of the majority. We acknowledge that we are united but not uniform. And I think the united but not uniform is something that sometimes comes up often and I don't know if that line needs restructuring and I think that making decisions as a whole board sometimes comes up in the boardroom as well and
131I'm not sure I'm just putting that in the room if that if you all feel like though that language is consistent like do you want to restructure that or does that should that stand as is? And there are probably several of these that could be squished together, right? >> Yeah, that's what I mean. >> But they're saying we worked >> Yeah. that there's enough thematic similarity that we could combine. >> Um All right. I feel like maybe I'm missing something here. >> Sure. >> Um so we make decisions as a whole board only at properly called meetings. I don't think that anyone should be making decisions not in the boardroom. >> No. And I believe people are holding votes obviously and our superintendent is aware of the votes and they're going in the minutes and
132that's the policy and I don't think anyone uh is not doing that. So I feel like this is being maybe that was just an example or is this being underscored? >> I'm just looking at so I have a handful of things. Am I missing something? Okay. >> Yeah. So I have a handful of things that I'm like this has come up. You said has any of these have any of these things come up? And that's one thing that's come up since I've started like the not the location like the first part but like the second part like making decisions is a whole board and united but not uniform. So there's redundancy there. >> So six and seven has redundancy and there things that have come up. So I don't have a judgment. I just know
133that the conversation seemed a little light and so was elevating some things into the room. And and I'm probably guilty of this as well, but I have seen in the boardroom recently a board member insinuating heavily that we had made a decision outside of the boardroom. Um, and it really didn't feel good. If I had this in front of me, I would have felt a little more comfortable with saying, "Hey, wait a second. We agreed we're not doing this and we haven't done this." Um, so, >> okay. Thank you. Um, I think I was confused because something had come up and the way it was worded was, um, sounding like it had already been discussed, which it hadn't been. And so, um, and it was one of those Mondays where I couldn't be there in
134person. Um, and it did make it hard to have that discussion. So, I think you're talking about something I said and I apologize if it came across as an insinuation. Um, I was driving a kid somewhere in the rain in pitch black in a windy road. So, I apologize for that. U Mondays isn't really good for me, but I'll do my best. And I apologize if it came across that way. Um, >> and I appreciate your Exactly the sort of thing I'm talking about where I know it wasn't intended in that way and if we'd had the thing in front of us I could have said hey wait a second that's this and you would have said no I didn't mean it that way and that's the kind of clarifying that reason why I think
135having this in front of us could be useful >> I guess someone else had said something that had had that had implied it to me which is why I was like I'm unsure why it's being worded this way since um since that's not how we would do it. Um and and I don't think anyone would would have done that, but I was like, did I miss a meeting or what are we talking about? So, um so it had been worded in a way that was confusing and I was trying to uh figure out what was meant. Um but I apologize for accidentally insinuating that. Um and um if folks want to have this and point it out. Um but it does feel kind of like a gotcha and I I would hope we could assume
136positive intent and like make sure people aren't um >> aren't just trying to figure out what's going on. >> I think that's exactly it. It's the assume good intent, but also it's much easier to do it when it's small things rather than wait for it to bubble up into something big. And I appreciate what the superintendent is trying to do in terms of like calling out specific instances of of when this would come in in handy because if not, we're just arguing. Do we want a piece of paper in front of us? Yes or no, >> right? Like >> who cares? Either have it or not have it. like we spent 30 minutes talking about this. I think it's important to have because we can refer back to it not as a gotcha, right? But
137as a this is where we should be, this is what our focus should be on and and that's great. It's not about like let's just have a piece of paper or not. This is also um when it's made public and when we talk about it in public, it is communication to the community as well that we are holding ourselves >> accountable to this. >> I I have two more things to bring up on here and I know this isn't my meeting but I'm here. Um so one is number 19 >> and it's um and this is the for in the spirit of like kind of truncating this and and kind of shortening this but we all come with specific skill sets and we read to honor each other's expertise >> while also acknowledging that we're
138not experts and everything while also build trust so we can count on the expertise of others. >> Does that feel like it's important to still have in here in this time and space? Okay. Yep. I think especially when we're talking about >> how the staff trusts us >> is I am not I have my wheelhouse and I know what that is and I also have lots of houses that I don't >> sure >> have wheels in um and so I need to and again until there was something egregious happening like trust the experts and I'm not going to be the expert in everything so I'm going to trust our HR folks. to trust our CFO and their team and and that I think that's what we need to show them that we trust and we
139can still ask questions and still have clarifying conversations with you kind of so there's no the no surprises piece but I do think um yeah learn like seeking to clarify and learn and understand is really important >> that brings me to my next one which is number which is thank you it's a nice alley you um which is number one So it says we focus on governance uh policym strategic planning and evaluation curriculum district performance and superintendent. Um we acknowledge the board's role is not management. Um me and board chair had a great conversation about this the other day that in times when there's um change management or just difficult decisions being made um I think that and I know this is public. I think that some of the um of staff or concerned um
140constituents may start lobbying you as an extended form of district management >> and you all have a really critical decision to make in those moments. um in terms of one saying let me do something about that and once you say let me do something about that it almost like you default to a different form of management versus I can listen to you and understand your concerns versus here is what my role is and um and I know it's a slippery slope because there's going to be times where if I was in my capacity as superintendent mismanaging the district you have a responsibility to do something as board members but I Just want to put that in the room that there's going to be times, especially as we're going through this change management where people might
141start lobbying you and just a reminder that like number one, the first stance and that's really important and for you to come to me if you hear anything else. >> And that's also why it's good to have really solid and known systems and processes because then when someone comes, it's like, >> yeah, >> I hear that. Thank you. Here's here's what I would recommend >> you do cuz that's not my jam. Here's KL. Yeah, >> it's always chaos. >> Well, and and people don't know. The community doesn't know what our job is, right? And so this is what I say like every night is nobody knows what a board member does and neither did you before you got on the board, right? >> People don't know. I mean, they they see us like they see
142individual legislators. And I think you said something about that earlier is that we run on a platform and then you get on the board and it's like, nope, you don't do that anymore, right? I mean, you work as a team and and folks don't know that. So I think we have a responsibility also to do community education when we are approached individually. They don't have mal intent right they just and and even saying like we focus on governance policym strategic planning and evaluation explaining what we do like I think even if we don't have current issues with this we can and will and and like every like this should always be a key part of a working agreement. Thank you. And I would say number two for this board should be what is currently number
14318, which is no surprises because this is another one where I think we've all in one form or another, some of us more than others um have have fallen into this trap of because you're sitting in the boardroom and suddenly an idea pops into your head and you're going to ask a question but nobody you you haven't vetted it with soup. you have embedded it with the person behind the desk and it's a doozy of a question and it's not fair for it to pop out of your mouth at that point because it is a surprise and it leaves the staff member staring like a deer in the headlight. It feels like a gut feel even if that wasn't the answer. So I think we need to keep first and foremost well second most in
144our heads as we're in the boardroom that we have we have prepped ahead of time and we have our big questions and we have asked we have contacted the person who's the appropriate contact for that whether it's the soup or the the uh staff member who's listed in the board packet about those big questions but then if another big question pops up into your head in the meeting you don't necessarily blurt it out um and you you you hold it until you have an opportunity to have that conversation in private >> email. >> Do you feel like that's come up recently? >> Yes. >> Do you feel like I've done it? >> Yes. >> Which one? >> Um there was uh the conversation recently about uh the turf. >> I thought that might be what
145you meant. >> Did you know that I brought that up previously? I didn't. But I also know that no that I hadn't heard anything about it. I don't know if the super had anything about it. >> I had brought it up previously um the first time it had come up and made my position clear. So that was definitely not a surprise. >> Okay. >> And I also made clear to our cabinet member that um that I respected their position and expertise. um and they were already aware of the issue and it had already been discussed in committee and had been controversial in committee. Um I am an expert in that area and I stand by my statement. >> Okay, >> then that's that's partially my misunderstanding, but it was it was an awkward moment for
146me. Okay? Because I'm suddenly being confronted with new information and I'm going to be expected to take a vote here in the next 5, 10, 15 minutes. And now there's a big piece of information that I had no idea about and I have only those 10 minutes to to find out if it's valid or not, if it's been vetted or not. Um, and so it's really hard for me then as a board member to know how to vote because I don't feel like I have all the information. >> Okay. Well, I mean, I brought it up before, so at that point, my thought is that it's not a surprise. It's >> um if if someone brings something up and says, "I have concern about this." >> Um then I probably have the same concern when
147it comes up the next time. >> Okay. >> So, that's your indicator. >> Yeah. So, that's >> I don't know. Yeah. Like, I don't know what else to do there. Like, it's >> okay. >> That's pretty clear. >> Okay. That's fair. Um Yeah. I mean, I know I've done it when I didn't think to ask the question ahead of time and I then have asked the question and I can just see it on staff members face. I >> Yeah, they were aware of the issue and versed in the issue because I >> No, I'm on to a different example. And I think um we have some really um intelligent staff and I think um it shouldn't be a gotcha, but I think um I think people are really good at their jobs and are pretty
148versed in this stuff. >> Well, and I I don't think the no surprises piece is about kind of them not knowing and and then like having to like find out information or learn the thing. I think it's just that that respect of hey I have these concerns or questions kind of like the head start of just like so that they have all the the things ready to answer in that public space. So I don't think it's about like of course they're in they are the experts, right? So I so I think it's not I don't think by saying whether it's a gotcha or not a gotcha it's it's anything having to do with their intelligence. I think it's just ensuring that they feel like they have all the information. They've gathered the data or the
149whatever it is to be able to answer that question fully for the rest of the board to hear. I think that's all that is. I I have one just to throw out there and um and this is just a this was surprising to me. So like last year during the um uh budget meeting um there was a no vote and it's everyone's prerogative to vote independently, right? But um I was a little surprised that there was a no vote vote just because I don't think we really got to process the concerns that I think that that um the voting board member had on that no vote. And I would have liked to just been able to say, "Okay, at least I understand that. Let me let me try to like answer those questions or attend
150to those questions that you might have or at least I know where you're where you're where you're where you stand." And that just makes it a little bit easier for for me to do my job as a superintendent. >> All right. So, it sounds like there's a number of concerns about me as a board member in particular not following these agreements and um it's an unfortunate way to run a retreat. Um if if that's >> No, that's that's not what's happening. I'm just talking about the surprise. So, we're talking about one >> I do want specifics because I think it's important to figure out. Um, and I am the only person that ever votes no and I know that causes some discomfort and I don't like to not vote yes on we've all voted no
151>> and I know that I'm not trying to discount how you feel um uh during this time which has been almost a half hour. I've addressed um uh number one which is the board's role and that was not about your actions at all. And then we reviewed where things need to be um adjusted and kind of squished together and then also what need to be struck out. So this was not um for lack of a better word like some sort of inter intervention on >> Okay, that's on your behavior, but like these thing came up and you were involved. So I use it as an example for context. >> That makes sense. I just think um if there's a concern that someone's not following it, it would be probably better uh to to discuss that
152uh not in the board retreat. I mean, if the intent is is that someone thinks I didn't follow number 18 um and that's like the only reason we're talking about it, it would probably make sense to just uh talk about that. Sometimes there has been attempts when there there has been some challenges and um it's been a challenge to get us all together to address those in the moment. >> That's fine, too. Um and I think >> I mean it's good to have these discussions and sometimes we're not all going to agree or we think it was one way and someone else thinks it was another way. So we're all individuals and that's >> fine. >> Thank you. Uh yes. Uh I don't know what just happened, but I was going to say so the
153no surprise part um when when we're asking questions that might require more data or might require extra exploration, you know, a more concise answer. I don't know that they would require them to go back and say I need more data or I'll come back with that information. I think that that's something that we should ask um you know at in advance so that they can come prepared. >> But if we're asking a question or a follow-up question to something that they're presenting that we know they should be knowledgeable in >> I think that that's something that can be asked. >> Yes. you know, like >> and it may also be like, let me get back to you on some of those. That's got to be a response we've got to be comfortable with. Yeah. >>
154Yeah. >> Cuz if we're, you know, if we're not coming out of left field and asking like >> some random question, but if it's about their presentation, I think they should have an answer. >> And I don't want to discourage anyone from asking hard questions in the boardroom. Um, director Himemes asked a question about very explicit question about MLAs and what we're doing to support them and we have not always been able to deliver what I consider a satisfactory response. I encourage any board member to continue to ask us difficult u questions to ensure that we're being accountable and the worst that can happen is I can say we're not in a place where we can answer that right now. Let us get back to you. And so, um, you know, it's up to your
155discretion to figure out if you're trying to drill down to a gotcha versus a accountability question. Either either way, I don't want to discourage people from asking hard questions, whether that's about turf and surfaces or what we're doing to support MLES. I just want to make sure that's in the space. And and to go back to that point, to drive that point home, it's like, yeah, if if we don't feel like we have enough information to make that vote, then we could also ask to postpone the vote. Right. >> Right. As long as it's not time. >> Yeah. I just I want to give as an example. I think no votes absolutely are fine. They have their place. Everybody should feel free to vote no. Um there was an instance many many years ago from
156nobody else who's on the board right now um where one board member could not support the curriculum adoption that was being presented. That was a fairly big deal that the curriculum adoption was going to go through without it being unanimous from the board. the board member who voted no made a point of meeting with the superintendent prior to that meeting um to say just so you know I'm not going to be able to support this curriculum do not do for these reasons and I think that was a respectful way to do a no vote so the superintendent wasn't blinded it wasn't a surprise obviously you can't tell your fellow board members because we're not gonna have those conversations >> it's it's important for the superintendent because if he's getting that same message from three board
157members. He knows he has a problem when it comes to the vote. Right? So, um there have been instances where that has happened in this district where three board members individually went to superintendent said, "I can't support this." And the superintendent then knew that they had to do something to change the proposal to what board the board could support. And so I think the the no vote is fine, but it doesn't it shouldn't be a surprise to the superintendent. And I also want to say I've been on again completely different board um in a situation where particularly with the budget, the budget comes through and it's a crappy budget. We're cutting stuff and nobody wants to do it and one or two board members decide that they're going to do a protest no vote because
158they don't like it. And that's fine. It's your prerogative. I totally accept that and understand that. But what it means is the other three or four board members have to play the bad guy. And that sucks to put your fellow board member in that position. You have to carry the water because I don't feel like it. Cuz I want to make a stand. Yeah. But now I feel or Tristan feels or whatever you feel like the bad guy, right? All the community is looking like, "Well, how come you voted to cut my favorite teacher when when she didn't? So, I just want to say that I just want to say that one out of it. >> It's a tricky situation. >> Sometimes we have to vote yes on things we really don't like. And we
159can say I'm voting yes because it's my job as a board member to pass a budget, but I really hate this budget. I mean, I've said that more times than I can many times, but ultimately the district needs a budget. >> And and I'm not saying this about any of us here. I just want to put this out there because it's good practice. >> We vote yes or no. We don't abstain. >> Yeah. >> Unless it's a conflict of interest. True, right? Like it's our job to vote yes or no. Like abstensions are about conflicts of interest. >> You can abstain I believe as well, but correct me if I'm wrong, if you don't have enough information. >> So I mean you can do whatever you want, right? I think that is >> the reason
160that's that's not a like in law or anything. I mean like you you abstain when there is a conflict of interest and then you have to right like that is part of law. You have to abstain when you have an actual conflict of interest. The rest of the time we are meant to vote up or down. >> And I think part of that too comes back to um whatever like like being prepared. So, if you feel like I know there's a vote, not you, editorial, you, if I feel like there's going to be a vote on this thing and I don't know if I know enough, I'm looking at the presentation, then I need to make sure that I do whatever I can, I think, to to be prepared or to get the information that
161I don't have. And then I suppose at at the end of the day, if I don't get those answers, then that's kind of another a bridge to cross. But I think part of like that's part of our self accountability is ensuring that we're informed so that we can fully participate and be knowledgeable and seek information if we don't have it. >> And I as a caution and not gotten the information then I think your responsibility is to vote no. >> Yeah. Then no. I had one come up where I was comfortable with it and I was going to vote yes and then during the presentation the way something was worded um made me have a sudden uncertainty and concern so I just abstained because it wasn't like a no but I wasn't ready to vote
162like it was just like I couldn't have I didn't know that that question would come up and it wasn't reasonable to delay the whole thing. Uh >> I think this has been no votes then. >> Yeah. >> Well, I didn't want to vote no, but I'm saying >> it has the same practical effect. But >> it's Yeah, >> I I think >> but it become I think >> I'm allowed to abstain and so I did, but I I I would I don't think it would be a common thing. >> We do a time check. It's 2:30. It's 239. And here's what we've accomplished, I think, in this space. Um, one, there's some modifiers that I can um, collaborate with board leadership on to update this draft. >> Okay. >> And then um, two, I think
163we had a pretty rich conversation around um, areas that people felt like they wanted to be addressed. I know I brought one up. I know board chair brought one up. And then I think we have an ongoing conversation to continue at some point around um voting yes, no, and abstension. So that's kind of where that's what we've accomplished, I think, so far. Is there anything that I've missed in this conversation? >> I will just ask if we're if we're combining things and you all are doing that, can we keep number 11? >> Yes. >> Yeah. Yeah. I knew I thought you might bring that up actually, >> Miles. That was very nice of you. sample equals 6 weeks or more. >> You got it. 6 months. Yeah, we'll keep it >> just for regular. >>
164Chair, I'll kick it back to you. >> Yeah, I was going to say um we're a little over time for the board of viewers, but I feel like we've got a pretty good um set of of ideas for going forward. Um so what we can do is leadership and superintendent will work on a new draft and we'll bring that um forward for a first read. >> Yes. >> July or before then. >> Um it's it's up to board leadership's agenda setting. Um but we can be prepared. This should take us >> not that much time and so we can bring it as soon as you're ready. >> Okay. And then we'll come for second read at our first July meeting. >> Yeah. That's when we know we do more agreements. Yep. Got it. >> So
165Okay. That sounds really good. All right. So, we have on the original agenda, we have a break until 2:45. That gives us five whole minutes before we dive into board goals. People feel like they want a 5minut. >> Stand up and stretch. >> Stand and stretch. Talk to the bathroom and then we'll come back to board goals. >> Awesome. 250 or whatever people are ready. >> You look like five. >> I am pants. Yeah, thank you. had something to add. >> Yeah, I did. Yeah, I did have something to add just um in terms of the last agenda item which is on goals. This is an open-ended opportunity for you to kind of follow up on agenda item two which is self assessment. So self assessment reflects your kind of um personal function as a
166board, right? But then our board goals are around the alliance the aligned with the superintendent goals. So it's related to um supporting our MLAs and financial stability and then board board development. Those were the three big goals. And so it's an open-ended opportunity for you all to have a dialogue on um one uh if these are these goals seem like what they're right if we're going in the right direction what what the board's role is with regards to this these goals etc. So this that's the opportunity. >> Thank you. Yep. >> Shall we go through the goals one by one? or how do you how I do a chair? >> I'm open to suggestions. I was just going to go through in numerical order, but if there's one that's like everybody is there some other
167way somebody wants to go, I'm certainly open to it. >> So, um I really like the idea of tying our goals to the superintendent's goals. I think that that's >> it helps us with our >> uh combined purpose. um that we talked about from the governance core. Um so it seems like the MLES, the financial stability, the relationships, engagement are are key pieces. And if we look at our what do we have for ourselves? Five, six goals. I can't we have >> seven. Um, I guess the starting question is do we want to keep additional ones for ourselves like that or do we want to just have the ones that we have same ones we have for the soup? I sort of feel like Well, I'll just ask the question. >> Are you meaning do
168we want to keep the ones in the table with the different colors and these or what are you >> saying? So, here we have seven. >> Yeah. >> And here we have three. Do we want to have just the same three as the suit or do we want to keep our seven or some combination of the two? I'm going to advocate straight up but we keep it as few as possible. >> Yeah, >> cuz you do things with a little bit more intention, a little more focus. You do better. >> I think that um goals aligned with the superintendent's goals tend to be more transformational and substantive, right? That these are sometimes check boxes, right? I mean, like review behavior data. I mean, that's ongoing, but it's once we've done it, we've done it. That's
169not an ongoing transformational substantive, you know. Um, I think it is tough slash confusing to have different sets of goals in different sets of places because then we've got that other big sheet. Also, we have three sets of goals, right? >> I feel like we might have more. Those were the goals from last year that we then >> oh then we okay but it is like >> you know you can spread yourself way too thin you know we need to protect our superintendent's time we need to protect our time and prioritize focus I think as well and so I think that some of these are are really good I mean number 12 is a checkbox right >> um >> but number 13 might make sense because if if it's helping create kind of the resources
170for our other goals. Sorry to jump in. That was rude. >> Well, and and maybe if we're looking at like right now we have seven which and yes, one of these is a checkbox, but maybe if we're looking at the the Emily's students financial responsibility and the relationships, we pick one or two maybe ones that we already have that kind of fit in those buckets. So they are >> right. So they are like and I I for my own brain space and for the you know I think the board's work how are we >> like his goals are the rowing what are our goals that are steering those goals for our MLE students for you know the bond worker financial responsibility. So maybe we pick one or two um that maybe already existing like number
17113 >> that that fit in. And then I think and I know we talked about this last time the rub is like what does it look like >> like what does it look like >> to support strategies? What I mean, yes, a beha reviewing behavior data, sure, but in but I think the advocate the support um I think we just need to name it a little bit in terms of for our work as a board what that looks like. >> Yes. Does it just mean at board meetings going great job, we support this? No. Right. But like with our realm being policy, you know, budget, program approval, that kind of thing, how do you define support within that role? And also 16 is a check box. >> Yeah, 16 is also a check box. In
172fact, I would say there are three that are checkboxes. It's 12, 15, and 16 are all checkboxes. >> Um, and then I think number 14 goes straight to number one of superintendent goals. >> Number 17 goes straight to number three. >> Mhm. And number 18 goes straight to number two. >> And I would argue number 13 >> kind of bridges both 12. Both two and three and three. >> Yeah. >> Um >> or one and >> almost all three. >> Almost all of them. Yeah, you're right. It actually does hit number one more, doesn't it? >> Um >> I I don't I mean they're pretty aligned, so that's good. Um, and the ones that are a little different aren't contradictory. They're more like either checkbox or kind of setting the stage. So, I mean, I
173feel like there was maybe a desire to list things out in even though they're just checking the box previously and now maybe we don't want to do that. I don't think it matters to me either way. we have to do these things and we have a lot of policies and procedures we're responsible for whether we want to call it out or whether we assume we all know >> we have to do it either way so um it just kind of depends on what everyone wants to underscore I guess >> I think a lot of times checkboxes can just be worked into the board calendar >> right >> a goal my goal isn't to like we have to ensure policies >> exactly right that's a job and and it's honestly it's the staff's like they get
174the policies first they bring um to the policy committee, but like board self-evaluation that can be put on the calendar, right? I mean, like we know we're going to address it in whatever month, you know, and >> but every has some history behind it. There were years where we didn't do a board self evaluation. So that's when rose to the level of like we really have to do this guys. >> Do we have that in the agreements that we're going to evaluate? >> Yes, we do. >> We fall behind and then we put it on there to make sure or something like that. But I think looking at this, we can't do number 14 if we haven't done number 15. >> So maybe we don't need to call 15 out explicitly. >> Well, and that's
175where like can we look at what times of the year that we would put that on the board calendar. >> Yeah. Right. >> I think we had number 15 because we'd had the more recent policy update and we were just trying to keep track of it like more deliberately. >> Well, because part of policy says that we'll do it. >> Yeah. and just to see if there were disparities or unintended >> Yeah. >> So, I could totally see taking 15 off the books. Um, we could even take 12 off the books. >> I don't think 12 has to be a bill. >> It just needs to be on the calendar. >> Should we just delete But does everyone agree on that >> or should we go in order so we don't bounce around? >> No.
176I I I is everybody com comfortable with the idea of getting number 12? >> Um is everybody okay with the idea of getting rid of number 15? >> Yes. >> As a goal, I should say. Um is everybody okay with the idea of getting rid of 16 as a goal? And then what this this will could ultimately do is that when you do when you um launch into your goal setting for um next year that these won't be a distraction. >> Yes. >> And then we So that leaves us then with four goals. Three of which are very clearly aligned with superintendent goals. One of which touches I would say all three of superintendent goals. And then we can as a board build our individual goals. No, >> we can't individually build our individual goals
177towards those four goals. Does that sound like a reasonable plan of action? >> I hear a couple of over two. Well, is the suggestion to to have individual goals that fully reflect the board goals because at that point wish >> not not fully reflect your it's and potentially reflect >> as you wish. >> Okay. The goals that you are going to set for yourself as a board member areas where you feel that you need to work on your self as a board member. >> So I think the intention was >> we're working on ourselves. we're not accomplishing or we could try and do something or or >> so we've got two sets of goals. We've got board goals. What are we as a board committing to doing? And we've got four goals that we're going
178to as a board commit to doing and then we have our individual board goals >> and those could be like learning something or doing something. Yeah, these are the onesing in a particular way. We talked about it before a couple of >> kind of or scaffolding tool for you to say, well, you know, when I did my own self-rating, I saw here were some areas where I felt like the board was doing good, but maybe I wanted to really focus on because I didn't give myself as high of a rating. And that could also guide your decision- making on your own board goal, which is autonomous and different from the collective board goals. >> Yeah. I definitely want to keep it in mind to >> Yeah. tie it together. I really like the way we
179did it last year with our individual goals where we each came up with three to five individual goals and shared them and then I got to steal one from Tristan because I thought her goal was way better than mine. Um, and I'd like to do again that way this year >> if that works for people. >> That way we can learn from each other but also >> know how to focus on that the parts of it that we are both interested in and able to do and I want to be very mindful of the fact that you four all have full-time jobs and I don't and so your ability to get into schools is not nearly as good as my ability is. And so I know that one of my jobs then as a board
180member really should be I need to be the one who's getting out in the schools so that there is a board presence, right? Um because I can't expect you all to drop your jobs like I'm taking the day off so I can go see. That's just not life doesn't work that way, right? So yeah. Okay. I think anything more >> was an efficient meeting. >> Yeah. Well done. I think we're done. What is the for the good of the order? Is there anything else for the good of the order? Going once. Nobody's going to talk about bun cakes. I am so surprised. I nearly brought bun cakes today. >> All right. >> No, you didn't. >> Yeah, I did. And I was like, you did. I did. >> No. And here's one of the thought
181process I went to around bun cakes was I could bring bun cakes to the retreat and then there would be only the seven of us >> enjoying bun cakes. Eight, sorry, third um well no seven cuz I'm not going to eat a bun cake. Seven people enjoying the bun cake or I could bring it to the next board meeting and more people could enjoy and that was actually what I thought. So, >> so on Monday, so on Monday, >> you don't look like you feel. >> So on Monday, I think you can expect a bun cake or at least cookies >> For the good of the order, I think we are adjourned at 3 >> 3:03 >> 03 p.m. Thank you everybody. This was really super. >> Thank you everybody.