001[snorts] Good evening. This facilities committee at the Manhattan Township School Board meeting is now called to order. Welcome everyone here in person and those joining us online. In addition to the live stream, both audio and video are being recorded. Their true challenge for success is our district's mission. It serves as a reminder of our intent to enable every Manhattan Township student to learn, grow, and thrive. Please join me in the pledge of allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, liberty and justice for all. I have no announcements this evening except that members of our community are encouraged to participate in board meetings in person or view them online. And in support of both transparency and community engagement, recordings of our
002meetings can now be watched afterwards on the district's YouTube channel. So now we're already at number two on our agenda, which is our facilities updates from Mr. Cotch and Mr. Welcome. >> Well, good evening everyone and uh thank you for our first attending our first facilities of the whole. So, it's a new new day in Manhattan Township. But so, tonight we're uh [clears throat] you're here for two reasons. And one is our request that the board of school directors approve contracting with RLPS architects to develop design and draft bid documents for the various projects listed in phase three of the campus master plan. And we'll also be providing everyone with an update of where we are with the excuse me our elementary school project, what we've done and what will be uh will be upcoming
003in the next few weeks and months. With that being said, uh Zach Charles is going to provide an update of the phases because today we're looking for approval of phase three. in phase one and is almost complete and phase two is underway. >> Good evening everyone. Um yeah, just to refresh everyone's memory, um I'm going to go over phase one which is complete. Uh we completed uh varsity and JV softball and varsity baseball irrigation. Uh we added a new uh stadium track replacement. uh the removal of the fuel pumps that was next to the maintenance building and we've added uh field lighting at Journey Field. Uh moving on to phase two. Phase two is the construction of the uh food service and maintenance building and the expansion of the Landis Run access drive and parking
004improvements in that area. Moving on to phase three, which Tom uh mentioned is going to be presented this evening. Uh phase three would consist of bleacher upgrades on both the home and awayside bleachers. Uh stadium team rooms for visiting teams, uh journey field seating and a pavilion. a new parking lot for the stadium and new concession stands or I'm sorry, new concessions, ticket booths and scoreboards and softball and baseball improvements. Um, and stage four, which would obviously is to be determined, uh, would be the, uh, indoor practice facility on campus. Pass this back over to Tom. So, tonight we're asking board to award the contract for phase three of the campus master plan RPS as was reviewed at the 827 20 uh 25 special board meeting. Uh the work would be done on a time
005and materials basis and I think that's very important because uh they'll be building us only for the time they spend. So if the scope of work should change of course the their uh billable hours would change as well but has a maximum not to exceed of1,332,400 and that would be for the items that Zach mentioned in uh base three. So if the board was to approve uh Reese Lower this evening, the conceptual plans of phase three will be presented at the school board meetings and upon approval of the conceptual plans, submissions will be made to the zoning and land development for the design and the approval with Man Township. Now, we're very fortunate that we have uh one of the partners with Reese Lower Patrick and Scott here this evening and he's going to give
006you an update of what we've been doing with Nich hour which I know is very exciting to everyone. Thank you, Chris. Uh hello everybody and good evening. I'm excited to be here. Tom said I am a partner with RLPS and um overseeing your feasibility study for Nau Elementary School. So um just big picture first um our schedule for the study for elementary we got started in September and we're looking to complete that study in February. Um when we talk about feasibility study we divide it into three parts of the feasibility study. the discovery, the analysis and the options development spread throughout that is our engagement with the community, with the school districts and the families. So what we talked about up here, I can talk about in those categories. Um, so we got started in
007September and we're really still in the discovery phase. That's going to last that that's going to extend into November a little bit. So our steering committees and our review meeting at Natur part of the discovery phase what's ongoing now is starting to transition into our now phase but part of the engagement is have focus groups and surveys with those groups that we just talked about. Uh a large number of those focus groups are going to occur in early November um and then some towards the end of November into December. the facility facility assessment. The one part of the facility assessment um is a point system we use to evaluate your building. So we will complete that early in November. So that's coming to an end. Um but something that we do a little bit differently
008is an educational design brief. We walk through how you want to educate for the next 5 10 years in your building. So we have the educational design brief that will influence the program of the spaces that go into the options. So this is to say we do a lot of homework before we just start spitting options. We're trying to build a base of knowledge and understanding of where we're going together. One of the other things that we do is building tours. We're going to go tour um a recently completed addition and renovation elementary school and a recently completed new elementary school. It gives everybody a basis to talk about spaces, relationships, and education when we're reviewing the options. The whole way through this we are developing a priority list um that will give us direction
009or um to develop the options but it will also give you an evaluation matrix and when we get to the end and we have three or more options to evaluate. So upcoming um when we get into November that's when we'll start developing uh those options and that's going to go from November till the end of the project. There's going to be constant refinement, discussion, and refinements. We will be coming back to the committee to hold for monthly updates from November through February. Uh, another unique thing is going to be a town hall meeting where we will invite the community out to Midor Elementary to let them walk the building and then we will give a presentation on the options that we are developing. um and then let them have Q&A with us so they can
010comment on that before we get to the final report and then we'll finalize that in February. And just as a reminder minimally there going to be three options that we're going to look at the renovation of the existing building and we typically call that the status quo or the baseline option. We'll also look at a large addition and a renovation to that existing building or a brand new building as a third option. We will probably develop a fourth and fifth option as we get into it because at the feasibility study, we want to make sure you're looking holistically at all options. It's just a paper exercise at that time. So, you may not even like all those options, but we want to investigate it just to make sure we're leaving no stone on ter. Any
011questions? I think we have a question for Mr. Greer first and then we'll go around and see where we might have questions and any board discussion. >> Uh, thank you. I should I my my question is kind of it's not exactly for you. Um, but it was it was a little bit um before we got into all of the substance of this and the options that are being presented before us, I thought it might be worth us as [clears throat] a committee having some sort of process discussion about what we want these committee meetings to look like moving forward. So, forgive me. I'm not trying to to >> So, if we want to put a pin in that until later, we can. I think we have one more facilities of the whole or facilities committee
012meeting um in December after the reorg meeting. But just in terms of making sure that you know this is our first one of these making sure that we're all on the same page in terms of what information is going to be presented to this board and then the sequence on when we want to act upon it. I don't know that we totally have that squared away across everyone. And so um I'll defer to you Miss Woodbury if we if there's space for us to have that before get into the substance of the conversation, but I also don't want to interrupt the flow of us being able to ask those substantive uh questions before we get into a process one. >> Thank you for the question. I'm going to make a recommendation and see what you
013all think and I'm going to look up to you all. Um since we've just heard two chunks of information and a third kind of point of process question which is valid and I'd like to have that conversation before we get too far down the line in our agenda. And this agenda item is about these presentations and discussion. What I'd like to do is first while we have our architect partner here talking about narrower which is first and foremost and rolling I'd like to talk about narrower first and ask about those questions ask about anything the board needs and wants to know first then I'd like to go back to Mr. and talk a little bit more, have board members ask questions and have any board discussion that we need to have about what is what
014does that mean and um anything about that item. And then thirdly, I I'd like to talk about our points of process here. We've we've had we've touched on them a little bit in past board meetings talking about we typically don't vote on a thing the same NDC presentations. Do we vote in committee meetings? This is our first one. So there's a lot of there's a lot of questions on people's mind about what is this committee of the whole related to facilities anyway. So I think your question is well timed Mr. Grer. But if we can go in that order I think that might be helpful to us all. Is there anyone who's feeling pressed or doesn't like that idea? Okay. And we'll we'll do that all here on item two unless unless the parliamentarian calls
015me out. We'll keep going. All right. So, let's first open up the floor for questions about NAR and anything we've heard or want to know about NAR in the process. This is Romano. [clears throat] So, I wonder given our um growing needs from the student population and most recently a few weeks ago um the township approved a development that was not in our last study of 100 with a new 100 homes by a runab. I wonder if option one here is kind of like a waste of time because I think we are going to need more space and while doing the renovation at Mitcher it seems like the most obvious time and place to make those additions for more students. So to me one I don't know how much time it takes to put them
016together. It seems almost like a waste of time. >> I think I understand that comment. Again, all the options we're looking at, um, you're not going to like all the options, but you should cover your bases and look at. So, it's a status quo. It's a baseline option. Um, it may not be where you end up, but it's a basis of information to judge the other options. >> It's not status quo. It's not like we're leaving the building completely on its own. But what I'm saying is it's it takes time at the architect's great expense hourly rate to put that option together. And I just wonder if it's more prudent to to say that that's not really I don't think it's really an option for us to not have a bigger building there. >> Kevin,
017let your question in the air for a moment while I call Mr. Bazar on the sense. Just one thing that um might put that question in a bit more context. I think one of the things I really like that you mentioned there as part of your process is you go through and use some kind of more structured system to kind of look at the building and do some rankings. Um and the way I interpret that and you can correct me if I'm wrong is that that would go into your thought process on these things. So you may right away in your in that structured process which I think is really the best way to go because it it would say and I'm sure part of that will be what's growing population all these things may
018immediately point out to what Mrs. said that that might not be the option and you're then I would assume not going to go well let me go flesh out all this option so I could show you something we're not going to do because the data doesn't support is that a fair way of looking at it >> fair way of looking at it >> and I said I'd call in Mrs. Hens next >> I I was only going to point out that all of that has to be done in number two it's exactly the same with with what it would take to put on an addition. So, they're going to be evaluating what's there one way or another, unless we want to jump completely to no, we just want you to bring us a new building.
019So, I mean, it's just in there. I I agree with what you're saying, but it's it's in there. >> And just point of clarification, I think asked asked a different way, does it actually cost more time and money to include number one? >> We have a fixed fee for feasibility study. So if it's on us to develop it under the fee that we already >> so it doesn't cost more time. >> Okay. Well, that's important. Thank you. Thanks for the question. Thanks for the answer. Thank you. And I've got some other board members, Mr. Andis. >> Just you might not know this off the top of your head, but what is the current square footage in the >> 88,000 88,000? Thanks. We'll look over here, Miss Lamb or Dr. Henderson. I don't know which is
020first. >> Okay. So, I'm going to number three. And I guess the question isn't specifically you, but maybe for the district if we are going to tear this building down. We have a plan to for what to do with those students and enough capacity to uh follow through without interrupting our education. We do Are you talking about in number three? >> Yes. >> Ideally, if you would go with number three, you're going to build a new building somewhere else on the site, >> move the kids into it, and then tear down the existing building. That would be the ideal way. >> Have you been down that access road to the trer? >> Just checking. >> All part of the plan, but really a good question. Thank you for understanding and making sure we all understand
021the importance of the continuity here as well as >> um so regarding one and two I think part of the issues right now is more than just the systems and the code deficiency there is a lack of accessibility to outdoor spaces it's been three years and I still kind of get lost and I just learned it's in the shape of a E. So, it's like, you know, would that would something like that be addressed in one and two? I'm sure it'll be addressed in two with the 40,000 addition, but I just wanted to bring that >> address number one because that's just >> you're trying to take the existing building and make the systems like new now, but it's the existing chassis that you have. You start addressing that in option two. be completely redefined
022in option three. >> Mrs. Hoffman, just to go back to um Mrs. Romano's point, I think one of the things that the school board should take a look at um is setting up guidelines, not necessarily a fixed parameter, but uh knowing that we have capacity or enrollment um implications on these buildings, looking at guidelines to drive the opportunities for number two and three specifically with square footages because that 40,000 square foot needs to be vetted out. What What is in that? what how many students is that? And so a lot of school districts start to look at like kindergarten and first grade. We like our class size to be between 20 and 22 students. That's a board guideline given to the administration to be able to rightsize the building. Uh looking at third and fourth
023grade, is it 22 to 25 students? I think that's a decision that the board should really vet out in these meetings to understand so that um our LPS can make the decision on is 40,000 square foot the right way and to uh Chris's point like there may be other options that maybe go to 50,000 square feet because you realized you have a new neighborhood coming or it may be we only need 30,000 because we reorganized the building. But setting those class- size guidelines is a key component to make sure that the building is right size for our needs. >> Dr. Go ahead. >> I just this I believe was part of I know it was part of the previous administration but there was a demographic study and and I don't remember at which meeting where
024the um student enrollment was projected to plateau and then taper off a bit even with the new community coming u online. How is that going to affect the building? what our needs >> I'll defer to Dr. K there. So you had a demographic study study done in 2023 and we've referred to that quite a bit. Um none of that includes the new construction that has been approved. Um that largely hits the Ryenba zone. Um, and so I do think that considering that as a part of this process, when we met with RPS, we talked about that change since the demog demographic study and um put some what our teachers have recommended for class size and that has been negotiated kind of we discussed that at our prep meeting and so we'll continue to keep that
025in our thoughts. We're open to a new study but um those communities are now happening. we know the estimates coming out of those um and so I think we can do um an estimate from here. >> Thank you Dr. Anderson. >> Uh thank you Dr. and thank you Dr. Anderson for that question. I want to make sure I understand that answer. Um so in your prep meetings the staff the administration internal to staff prep meetings for meeting with RLPS teachers put forth recommendations on class sizes. Is there any I guess has it has so those are recommendations that were given to your team but um I'm I'm trying to think about how that's that seems there's a gap between that and what I heard Mrs. Hoffman describe. So I'm trying to think about what that
026looks like operationally right now where we stand today. >> What I'm actually referring to as a class size plan and I'll kick that to Dr. Redmond. He that's something they worked on prior to my time here. So in terms of class size right now at the K to4 level and I have to check but we've spoken to the board before what we're living with today and what Mrs. Hopman is referring to is a 25 maximum in kindergarten and a 26 maximum grades one through four but as Mr. H said if the board wanted to consider or look at something different we could certainly do that and I think where you were headed Mr. Grer was that was that kind of stirred into the stew with what we shared with our LPS to get them off
027the ground with our guidance that answer is yes. >> Yeah. No, thank you Dr. that's super helpful. I guess as a point of process then is that I mean I'd be interested in community input too. I wonder if that's something that we can measure through the open house or our survey or the other option that you presented and then I guess is there or is that too late in the process for us to then incorporate that data and then you know issue guidelines? >> No. So we have focus groups and surveys going out that mostly deal with administration teachers staff and we want to get those responses before we get the community survey out but we want to still get the community survey out by the end of November. So we can build upon that
028information for that survey and so that can be asked. >> Mrs. Sorry, Mr. and then Mrs. >> I think I saw that. >> I think it's important to point out if you look at Ryball and you look at a class size, you got to look at all the schools. So if you you put in some perspective that you're going to make that class size smaller, you should really understand what the implications are on every building because I imagine that could be a problem in certain other buildings. So, it's not as simple as just a ride question. >> Mrs. Roman, I was just going to say even if in our ideal world if we really want our classes to be 21 22 and that's something um you know we can do but I think for building
029purposes we probably want to go with our max to give us that flexibility. So if it's 25 or 26 for building purposes, I would think we would want to take advantage of that and not kind of pigeon hole ourselves into the ideal 21 student classroom. >> Thank you, Mrs. Romano. >> Dr. Just a quick >> Okay. Um, you make a good point, Mrs. Romano and just for the board's consideration with the 25 and 26 that we're living with right now, our average class size is somewhere in the 21 22 range. So if we set a limit, let's just say 21, we're going to be hiring teachers to be able to manage. And now a new class average size is going to dip two or three numbers below that. >> And I can I ask Dr.
030Ryan a point of clarification there, which is um you said there was a max that's communicated to RP. Is that max an administrative uh guideline or is it district policy? >> That is a that's a guideline. It's not in policy. >> Got it. >> It's a guideline >> because some districts do we don't at this moment. Thank you very much. >> Mr. Mr. Baldar quickly. Um that average class size is that just regular ed classrooms >> that uh yeah it's home rooms can't afford. >> Thank you, Mr. Baldesar. >> Yeah, if you were ever going to think about having a class size be lower, you'd have to actually plan the building for lower class sizes, not larger because you want to be in the position of having maximum space. So, if you only plan that
031to be at 25, then you're never going to be able to go you you never be able to go down. So, I just wanted to make point of clarification on that. So, I'm glad to hear that we've got a lot of robust discussion and a lot of care and concern among all board members about class size, which we know is a really important um element here um in future planning for all kinds of things, facilities and others. Are there any other questions about this repeat? >> I'd like hearing the monthly updates and that the community presentation would be at mid. Thank you. Yes. Thank you very much. Appreciate that. All right. [clears throat] Is there are there any other questions for our architect partners? If not, we'll move back to Mr. Cotch who came to
032came up and gave us a presentation talking about the item that's on our lower on our agenda and kind of the next steps in our facilities planning. So, Mr. Mr. C, you were talking about the awarding the contract for phase three of the district campus master plan to RLPS at a time in materials basis coming to you on one point. I'm going to save $1.3 million right now so I don't have to say the whole thing until later on. Um, and so I'd like to open up discussion and questions for Mr. Cotch about that, what it means and those and those things. Miss Woodbury, we're blessed that we have our head football coach and our ad here. So, if I can't answer the question, I'm sure they can. >> Wonderful. >> More discussion and questions
033about I'm going to start with Mrs. Hoffman. >> Thank you. So, I know there's been a lot of concern and um information or lack thereof, which is why we switched to committee of the whole facilities. Uh and with this phase three, I think the prudent thing for us as a board would be not to necessarily itemize the list, but ask to go back to the beginning kind of what we're doing for an intra hour and really look at what are the data to Mr. Baldesar's points, what are the metrics, what are the decision points to make sure that all of the components in phase three are correct size, right numbers, right quantities, uh what is included. safety is a major concern. I know that has come up from a lot of board members. Um so
034it may not hit all of those items, but I I feel strongly that phase three should really be looked at holistically with the data to back up as Mr. Baldwar said. So it's almost going back to as in the architect world we call schematic design where or the conceptual design [clears throat] where are all the ideas what are all the components coming together and with the facility committee as a whole everyone can understand that d that's supporting the actual project moving forward. So I think at this point my recommendation would be to not necessarily have a specific list of items but that it is the phase three campus athletics area. That makes sense to everybody. And you know to Erin's point that's the great thing about having it as a time of materials because we
035might find out that you know we want to do something different than what was in the initial five points of uh additions and renovations to the stadium and baseball fields and softball fields. So I think we we need to start at that beginning point and I think that's where uh Reese Flower needs to start as well. Thank you, Mr. Couch. Mr. Bolazar. >> Yeah, I 100% agree with Mrs. Hoffman. So, if I look at this if if there, you know, and this for me will tie a little bit to the point of process for these meetings that Mr. brought up, you know, my um as we talked about this and talked about going to committee on a whole. One of the things uh that and I mentioned I think last week at the meeting that
036I think is great idea about that is there can then be a robust discussion amongst this whole group about actually what is there and the the items that are on the list phase three and I'm glad to see that there's a phase four and that's not also phase three really were things that just came at us very much like the phase one item of the back just okay. Well, here it is. No, by the way, it's going to be blue. Being able to step back to the beginning and say, you know, if we were to approve what is being asked of us, just blanking out everything that's on that phase three and starting it as a blank slate. So, there'd be the same kind of discussion on what what are the needs like and then
037rank them down from okay, there's a hierarchy, there's safety, right? because we cannot look at this next phase or any of these phases without putting it in the context of a whole. And I'm sitting here looking where I look I added up all the things that are in the master plan on all the other buildings not just in 20 26 27 but 27 28 there's a heck of a lot of money coming up. And if I'm, you know, if you think about it from a business or a house, you know, if your um your windows are broken out, you're probably not going to invest money in a hot tub in the backyard. You're probably going to in fact, you know, put the windows in first. And I think one of the things that we really
038have to keep in mind is first and foremost, the school district exists to educate students and the extracurricular activities are highly valuable, right? they they they provide um a supplement to that education and teach things that um you know that don't necessarily get taught in the classroom but we don't but to accomplish that and I grew up in the middle of nowhere and the football field was like a rock dump right but all those athletes learned those same lessons and I'm not saying that we shouldn't invest here but let's put into perspective where our money's going not only do we have nitrower but then following going after that there's things that need to happen in the high school and so there's just a lot here and I think stepping back to put that into perspective
039in some ranking of needs and wants and you know would really help make a decision the best decision that balances the needs of everyone including those in the district who don't have kids and they're paying taxes. We have to balance all those needs. >> Thank you, Mr. Buldesar. Mr. Landis, I'll go on. >> Yeah, thank you. Thanks. Thanks for this information. Thanks for um the the hard work that the district's been doing, a lot of people diligent, a lot of um board members from the past. We've worked through a lot of these things. So, I'm a little bit conflicted because there's things that the former committee or whatever it was called um worked through. We certainly didn't um to your point go to that level. Um and I think that is that is a good
040prudent way to do it especially now that we're really looking seriously at nature hour and significant being spent there. So, um I hate to regress and miss an opportunity to keep moving forward, but at the same time given the fact that there's a lot of money on the line with nature and that's educational. Um, I think that we probably need to take a step back with this athletics thing. Like I said, I'm conflicted on that because I I know athletics is very valuable and there are things that need done there. Um the other the other component or thing that I want to comment on is um I don't think it's appropriate for this committee to be voting in these meetings on items. Um I understand why we want to keep moving things forward, but this
041is sort of a significant decision and I think this for for the public um it's fair to have these types of votes at our regular board meetings. So those are my thoughts. >> Thank you. And Lamb, >> um, thank you. Thank you so much. Um, so when we got the opportunity to form this committee, I saw it as like an opportunity for a restart button. So I would love to see RLPS come in and do the research and development and tell us, you know, what makes sense, what the needs are, what the options could be. Um, I've always spoken up for needs pertaining to safety. That's why I had heavily advocated for nature and I do recognize there are needs in phase three of this campus master plan. I remember those photos that we saw,
042the deteriorating bleachers, the restroom with no doors, um their safety concerns with parking lot, there's a lack of ADA compliance across different areas of campus. So, these issues do affect the safety of our students, staff, and community. Um but I think that the problem that we might have right now is how it's written out in agenda. everything is listed out. Um like we don't know what is in the softball field improvements, the concessions. So we need information prior to voting on something. Um so I think that's that's probably like that that transition that we're kind of missing a little bit. Um but of course there are needs in this phase three. >> Thank you, Miss Lamb. Mr. then Mrs. Romano. >> Thank you, Miss Woodbury. I I agree with with Miss Lamb um and appreciate
043her leadership and advocacy on the trial. I don't think we'd be here without it. Um you know, I I I remember walking up those bleachers and wondering if my foot was going to go through um some of the the rusted out um stairwell. Now, I know we were assured that we did a full inspection and it's safe and it was structurally sound still, but I I remain very concerned about the state of our athletic facilities. I don't think that they are um commiserate with a school district of this size or or quite frankly um deserving of the fact you know thousands of people visit that site every Friday night um at the very least. and then also throughout the week and on the weekends for for the variet variety of other sports teams. For example,
044I mean I went to the girls soccer district game earlier this week and you know was sitting on a hillside and I'm thinking about taking my my my Asian mother and my aunt who's visiting in town to their game on Saturday and I'm wondering how I'm going to be how I'm going to get them there, right? Quite frankly, to be able to watch. Um and so I I that's all to say that um I I agree. I think that I'm just kind of repeating in small part what Miss Lamb said of that um I still feel urgency around it, but I don't think we're in a position to make uh the decision in a way that this this board was intended or this committee was intended or or or what we're hearing. So, but I
045still think I'm in support of because I don't think any we're not going to be able to get any of this information until we retain our LPS. That that's correct, right? So, um, in order for us to to be able to have that sort of information, um, you know, I think we're going to have to do that. Now, uh, I also don't want to do so in a way that loses sight of all the other priorities and needs. So, I I I'm not trying to take issue with what Mr. Bulldozar said at all. So, um, trying to think about how we operationalize that, uh, you know, we're going to have to move forward in a sequence that I think we all, uh, or at least a majority of us agree upon. Uh, and so I
046think that's part of what we're have to hammer out here tonight. >> Thank you, Mr. Mrs. Hermano. >> Um, so I know that this this um committee of the whole is new, but I I don't think we can lose sight in the amount of time and energy that has already been put into um the beginning stages of this project. I mean there was much discussion not just of the subcommittee facility subcommittee but from the administration perspective as well. Um and I don't know why we're getting hung up on this this little bulleted list because it's it's it's really just I think a guideline right for all of Yes. Um and and the bulleted points are the are the items that we identified as being issues during that year's worth of meetings on a facilities committee.
047So it's not like ROS or or Mr. Cotch just threw these out into the presentation today. You know, these came from um lots of discussion and I mean we saw mockups and went through mockup and after mockup after mockup and took away and in this and not to say that we're going to, you know, just copycat that whatever that mockup was, but I think that's how we got to these bullet points starting point and we don't need team rooms, which isn't the case. Coach Evans. Um, but that just because it's here on the bullet list doesn't mean it's etched in stone. So, I'm not sure why we're hung up on the list. I think it's a good place to give direction to the architecture firm. Um, and to your point, we do need to give
048them the work in order to get the more information out of out of it. Um, but again, we we did do a lot of back work on this. Um, and so I still want that to be overlooked and I I don't want to kind of stall here because we're going to redo a lot of the stuff that we already did. So based on Mrs. Romano's question, I have a question. I just want to be really clear about what is the item on the agenda and what does it mean and what does it not mean because I think that's really really important. This award the contract to RLPS for $1.3 some million dollars uh to the not to exceed amount is to help us take the next steps forward. but not to vote on the bulleted
049items. We're not saying yes or no to any of these things or how big or small they are or what they're made of or any of those things. What we're saying is we'd like RLPS, our partner in Nich hour, to be our partner in this next phase of facilities improvements that people tell, call me if I'm wrong, but that we all agree are important improvements to make. Um, we've just talked about what the next steps will be is there's a lot of um partnership work behind the scenes with our administration and RLPS about how they go about guiding us in those decisions. I think what we've heard tonight from our LPS about how they guide their clients and decisions with public input with on-site tours with all those goc's and with all of those things
050that make sense to me that and um just a point of I want to address just kind of a point of process here which we're I think we'll morph into here. Uh, one of the reasons that we don't um, vote on things that are sort of not at our voting meeting is because this board has a tradition of saying really the first time we hear about something is not the time we should take a vote. But, um, I want to go back to Mrs. Romano's point and and the slide here that says, you know, two months ago, you know, we have had a conversation. It has been woven throughout. This committee is um a move for the board to be intentional about all the board and the public, our community being involved in the dialogue
051upstream and from the get-go. So when we um hire an architecture firm to say yes, we'd like to proceed along this route. Now we're doing it with the most upstream transparency that we can get and the most dialogue and the most context I think we can get. I think that's so I want to just be clear the item on the agenda which is scheduled for a vote and now we'll probably talk about process a after this prior to moving on is to award this contract to RLPS to say yes we'd like you to be our partner in the this phase three work but not the specifics about exactly how we should go about doing the phase three work particularly is that right >> Barry you couldn't have said I couldn't have said it better you
052did a really good job summarizing this and you know I heard the word holistic and that's the approach that RLPS is going to take. The other thing that RLPS does very well I've worked with them in another life before uh them rejoining forces with Manheim Township they will challenge you and they have great questions. So if you say I want that they're going to challenge you and make that us prove that we need that. So it's just not an item on a list. It's they use the Moscow method. Would you share Eric? Would you just share the Moscow method what that is if people aren't familiar with it? >> Sure. You can make Chris do it too. Um it is the name doesn't mean much but it's called mustave, should have, could have, won't have.
053So it's the MSCW out of that and it actually will help this board to make decisions because things that are put in and you'll see it in the options as well. is everything there's a priorities list created and does it belong in the mustave because it's got to be in that option and if that option doesn't have it it doesn't become viable so you apply that not only to the midshaw decisions but it can be also the campus work so it's must have should have could have won't have thank you Mr. Bulazar. >> I like that um approach, but I still think um there should be a step back to say before we go and say, "Hey, we're going to award you the ideas. Do what?" Right? Because there's already preconceptions of what the list
054should be. And I know I've heard about them and many of them I haven't been in favor of for various reasons. So if that approach that Mrs. Hoffman just laid out is saying we're starting from scratch and saying you know what I agree I don't think my foot should go through the bleachers when I'm walking up that needs to get done we we've lived with the the facilities in in the way they are so you could create accessibility and seating in a way of journey field that doesn't require this huge building that we've seen and some of these other things that are in the context of I'm going to have to put tens and tens and tens of millions of dollars and nitro and all these other things, right? So for me the step back
055would be I want to understand what that process is going to look like because I'm still concerned that we're yeah I hear that but and we want to start at the beginning but I feel like we're coming in somewhere downstream and I wanted to be clear like if we're doing that you're starting completely from nothing versus what had been asked for from a group outside of the board. I'd like to see what that process is going to look like of how or who or what is going to define the musthaves, could haves, right? Because I think that for this type of project is going to be [clears throat] much could potentially be much different than it is for the educational building like well through with the middle school and that was difficult enough and I'm
056sure nitro even going to be difficult. finding this one same way could even be a more debate because you might debate that there's very little that's a must have other than things that are going to stop people from getting hurt at the facility or it needs to be some ADA compliance. >> So that's where um you're bringing us into sort of our third chunk of the discussion very nicely Mr. Bazar. So um I just um I'll call in right next Mrs. but to say that your question about what does the process look like for RLPS and what does the process look like for making all those decisions? I'm gonna ask a question about that question, which is, is this the time that we can take advantage of our partner here at RLPS to describe it?
057And is that what the board would like to hear more about tonight? And will that satisfy or do you mean because I want to get I want to get to our point of process meeting or do you mean that that we might want to consider that um that tonight's not the night to um vote on awarding this contract or not? Because because we need some time to think about it and time to ask different questions. >> Yeah. For me, it's not about like like I think if RLPS does something similar in nitro that that's good. I I'm not sure where's that alignment between RLPS and parts of the administration have already went things and they have things in their head that they wanted to do. That's the part I don't know that can get answered
058for me tonight. Maybe it can. I doubt it. And that's where I think there would need to be some more time to really understand how will those things mesh together. Can we really reset? Like I'm concerned. Will we really reset back to ground zero and allow the process to develop what's going to come out? So I don't think for me it would get answered tonight. But >> okay, >> that's just me. >> So I have now I've now I've teed up about four people to talk and that's not a good way to facilitate. So I apologize. But I have said to Mrs. Hence I will call on her and I've I've indicated to Mr. Gunter I would call on him as well. And then Maybe I'll I'll ask you some more questions. M >> I
059I have some different kinds of questions. Um I'm familiar over the years Oh, I'm familiar over the years with your long range fans. Um my question is, is there anything that we've discussed in phase three that would be covered by general fund is all of this borrowed money? Uh [clears throat] this has been in our uh multi-year plan for many years. Uh Mr. Robinson isn't here today, but I can assure you that uh all of the work that we're looking at in phase three, as well as the NRA elementary school project, the funding and the financing is in place. She'll be bringing in November an update. We'll also be doing the multi-year can in November. So the financing is in place. >> Dr. Excuse me. Uh can you uh speak more to that with Donna
060D? >> Sure. And it might be helpful. Cindy, I think you had a conversation this afternoon. Miss Lamb, I'm sorry. >> Yeah, I connected with Mrs. Robbins earlier today. I like to do a lot of research before a decision comes to the table. So, I connected with her and I she did give a presentation about this before, but just a reminder that the district has been approved for 100 million. $45 million of that will have no tax implications. It it would be without any impact on our current tax rate. Um, so that's what I remember her repeating. Um, that the district can borrow up to 45 million without any impact on our current tax rate. And then back in 2021, the school district is did refinance. And she had a great example. It's like when
061you refinance your home, but you still make the same debt payments. And then the savings, the school district has been putting away these savings for projects like this. um because of course I want to advocate for nichrow hour but that doesn't mean I want to take a backseat on these other very much needed um improvements. So that was something that I really had to talk to her about. Thank you. >> And my question was what part of our savings would be in this project or would you say that really the whole thing will be financed? No, we have we have $16 million in reserves. >> 16. Okay. >> So, some of that >> correct. >> Um time impact. If anybody can say to me if we go back to reset, if we don't act on
062this, I know that in major projects you run into calendar obstacles. What would you see as the overall impact of us waiting on this project? >> Well, we're at a point where we want to look at this holistically. And I think I'm going to defer to Chris to maybe speak to this point of saying, okay, coming into the project, kind of knowing where the deficiencies are. We did some due diligence. Chris, can you speak to that of what we would look like for a schedule going out to bid the whole process? And I think this is your question is if we defer to vote on this till our regular voting meeting on November 20th, >> what would be the impact? Or if we say that we want a broader perspective and not not handing them
063phase three but asking them phase three. Does that impact time and how things I was more thinking um athletically. Uh I know that sometimes if you postpone something that can't be done in a calendar year it makes a whole calendar. For instance, the track had to be done on a timely basis. When we decided that um what happens to the project, we start stretching out the time. >> And because this might be relevant to your answer, Dr. Henderson, did you have something you wanted to ask about that before or after is fine with me? >> I'll ask after. >> Okay. So, trying to cover a couple different things here. >> Thank you. We're not making it easy. Thank you. So I I think our first process there have been a list program spaces out there.
064Our first step would really go back to programming and conceptual and we're going to ask why a lot. So of the spaces that you have why like why you have so many seats in your matrix why you have so many team rooms and build that as we're getting out there and also getting into the business facilities. So there's probably a couple month reset on that part and then you get in to the project process. Um I think getting back to Mr. Kaj's comment about how long will this take land development usually develop is the determination of how long it will take to get approvals to get into the project and then how that hits season and how we're going to phase through the project. Um I'm going to ask you the cost estimate that you
065had before for this work. It's about 20 25 million. >> It was 20 about 25 minutes. >> All right. So 25 million um every year we delay that probably going to be a 5% increase to the cost that be considered as well. And my last question was if we say to you not can you do this but will you give us the broader perspective does that still come in under your quoted um one2 >> I think what we would do is go back to that programming conceptual phase and then if the scope is much bigger or smaller we could adjust that number accordingly that that number is based on that list of program spaces that's already been provided So if you do less then remember to come down or if you want to do more
066then we can adjust that number. >> Thank you Dr. Henderson. So piggybacking on what Miss Hint said, I did have questions about the timetable as well and I think you answered some of those. Uh because my um my question is or my thought is fixing the trial should take precedence over the sports um issues and but I also understand that this is not immediately fixing those issues. If we like Mr. faults are intimate, it can go back to ground zero and really address the safety issues and like um Miss Lamb said the ADA issues. Can we then build up from there what we want using tonight? >> Yeah. >> So I think you want a holistic plan of what you want to do on the campus no matter what. >> And you're saying do you
067go back and do peacemail? you the bleachers or some ADA ahead of time, that's okay as long as you know you're not going to get rid of that later. You don't want to spend good money after bad money. So, it's a possibility, but you have to have a holistic plan of what you're going to facing to make all of that work. >> I agree. I think I still will go back to saying nour educating the students is the number one issue. So natur project at all >> except for finance. We don't have a we don't have an endless world of money. We should not look at our taxpayers such we would have to float debt in order to pay for large scale um projects because we don't have that cash flow immediately. So I'm just
068looking in the grand scheme of things for our constituents. Thank you, Dr. Henderson. I'm going to go to Mr. Granter and then Mr. Bulgazar. >> Thank you, Mr. I I also don't want to have Mr. there too long at around not trying to uh belabor this, but I guess I'm trying to understand the the gap between what I'm hearing in your process and what I'm hearing from Mr. Bazar. I want to get specific so I can understand. Uh, and that's what I was trying to that's that's what I'm trying to unpack here is because what I'm hearing I guess the so the question is so the the administration gave uh your firm a list of what we're generally interested in terms of our athletics which is largely consistent with the work that the facilities team
069and we've had we've discussed for more than a year at this board in terms of a prioritization of our athletic facilities but you, I understand, would not take that as gospel, but you would take that as a starting point to then evaluate the the campus and the uh uh including the athletic facilities and then come to us with recommendations that we would have to approve. And that doesn't start until we retain your firm uh in order to do so. And so I guess I'm asking you're you're hearing Mr. Bulazar's concerns. I I don't think they're unreasonable at all. And so I guess I'm trying to hear from you like your affirmation that you know you will take fresh eyes at some of this and and and you know not you know take I I I
070don't want to disregard the professionalis professionalism and the advice and the work that's been done you know and and and I certainly trust Mr. Kosh and his team and I certainly trust the the work that's been done from the facilities team before this committee existed. Um I guess how would you control for the concerns >> obviously we would love to be involved in the beginning develop the program and build the project for coming in midstream but we come back to challenge you ask the question why to make sure we have a solid foundation that we're going from and going back and asking those questions we may have some variation that came off of that list but we're not going to go forward until we are comfortable that we understand the why of the project before
071we get into the project and then we have to explain it back to all of you at the same time. So I do think there is a startup process whether it's two months two and a half months whatever you need for information for us to go back and ask the why make sure we have everything that we need anything forgotten is there too much and then bring it back to you and then we own it at that point. Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. Bulazar. >> Yeah, I think this uh most recent part of this discussion has brought up some of my concerns that I've had for quite a while and you know, one of those Mr. Cotch brought up the multi-year plan. So we were a share of multi-year plan earlier in the year
072and every one of the items on this list was for the expected cost was TBD. So if I'm looking at running business and I'm looking at a plan, right? And same way for niche power. There are no numbers in there. So it's it's a list of projects with no numbers. So there's no context to like the question of well we have to finance this. what would we do? How could one answer that without there there being numbers? So that prompted me to have to create my own spreadsheet with budgetary numbers. So I mean I deal with the managing the facility and where I am which includes fixing the building, adding equipment and anytime there's something that comes up you can get a budgetary number. Somebody could put a number together of what they think and
073if I were doing it, I would look at a worst case. What do we think the number would be in niche? I don't know what the number is, but on my spreadsheet, I put what if it's $65 million? What if it's $40 million? To put some kind of parameters on this. So, if you saw and you looked ahead and we talked here about, well, there's $100 million out here that we're approved for. Because we're approved for something doesn't mean we should spend it. I'm sure I'm approved for a lot of credit out in the world that I don't actually plan to go out and spend. So without for for me stepping back, it's not a question of whether RLBS will trust their process or whatever. It's more about let's look at this number. There's not
074one place we've all looked at what the investment for all the things that need to happen within a district next year nour and all these things. Okay, I put a number. It might be who knows if we put all these things together. And this was back when um the indoor facility was was in phase three as well. Is it 120 million? It's 140 160. So when you look at the context of the hall, you can make a better decision. We're still in my opinion looking at this as if it has to happen on its own and there's money. Oh yeah, we could spend that. And it I just can't. it is just financially not um prudent to try to make decisions in this way. So when I say I want to step back even before
075we award, let's step back and say what is it that we're even asking them to do? What is the budget? Right? Because in this exchange here I heard well what was the number last show 25 million. So we're already going back to something that's there versus saying what should our budget for that be? What do we have to spend? Right? And then that will drive us to the first the safety things. So what I thought and I mentioned this I think um last week when we talked about the committee as a whole that that part about actually getting advice from Mrs. province around the finances about not oh well you could like yeah we have all this money but as from a chief financial perspective I want to hear what's the prudent thing the way
076they look at these investments right because that we're representing everyone in in this district and I'm I am sure that everybody in my world wants to know how much money are we spending on it like in total right and I just don't feel like we ever bring all that together and that's what I was hopeful that would happen in the committee of the whole and you know maybe we'll get >> this is our first one >> I know I'm not saying I'm not I'm not implying that we won't that we won't get there but what I'm saying is that to me is why I feel like there should be a step back >> thank you very much Mr. Bazar I'm going to go to Mrs. Hoffman >> so what I hear and tell me if
077I'm not interpreting you correctly Mr. Bazar is you want a district-wide feasibility study. Chris, I'm going to put you on the spot. Can you describe a district-wide feasibility study, please, so that it tells you a long-term plan? >> So, districtwide feasibility study, we're getting into all your buildings and all your facilities to address all your needs that are both maintenance versus what you might have for capital projects coming. So, that's a six to eight month process to get into and evaluate all and give you um options, plans, cost estimates to address your needs. >> And and that gets into like a 10 to 15 year plan. So it it looks at your whole district holistically, looks at every building, what are your systems that are coming up in Ryen? What are your systems that are
078coming up in the high school? It also looks at it from an educational standpoint. So like, are we meeting the needs of the students today? Um, but it looks at it district-wide and it it defines is it preventative maintenance, is it non-prevent, is it nonrepetitive? Speak tonight. I'm so sorry. Um, and where does it go? What bucket does it fall in? Which is basically what you're looking for. And it puts numbers and dollars through all those items. Um, so that you have like a 10-year plan. >> But we just did that. >> Yeah, the multi we do have some it may not be comprehensive enough, but that's that's the multi-year plan that Mr. Cut was talking about the and and there are many numbers in here. So, but there are many places where there were
079not numbers. So, what I'm saying is that really is the context. So, whether what we have right now is comprehensive enough, but even with what we have and what is lined out on this plan and it really only goes probably like three years where it's where it's clear it gets murky. There's 10 years on that plan, but it's murky out. But yeah, I actually think that's the prudent thing for us to do because I would suspect there's more things underneath the surface that we have not identified that are in other buildings, which then puts the the more athletic type things, which when you put them against education, as as Dr. Henderson said, there, you know, I would weigh the education over that. That's the context I'm looking for. Maybe we'll never get it and I'll
080continue to be frustrated in that way, but that's what I'm looking for. >> So, let So, just a point of clarification, the feasibility study describes I don't know how often those are done. I don't know if this district has done one. >> We just completed one. >> So, I will because operational definition is why I'm asking. So, we just completed a specific feasibility study. It did not look at every district, every district building. It looked at no >> engineering all that. >> They didn't look at here. It wasn't that long ago. >> And we, >> but they did not look at capacity at every elementary school. They looked at all of the the mechanical and the electrical and all of that. And that's where that comes from, that long-term plan. And the to be decided
081are too far out to know what those are until we get there. So, it's not like we haven't done all that. I don't want it to sound like we've been neglectful. We have done all that. I I think there's a both hand here. I think we're talking about very very specific and very precise technical definitions, right? So, two things can be true. We can be a very planful district and have not done the specific and precise thing Mrs. Hoffman just me mentioned. And I would like to go to Dr. Now >> just very quickly the multi-year plan will be presented to the board next month and so that's kind of what you're talking about Mr. Bazar. You're right that the closer the year the more specificity we can provide with those numbers but as you
082move to the right it's more like a monitor but things that are closer to us we will have figures for the board to to be able to see and look at and reflect on. So you compare that to what an inhour cost would be and and what a campus master plan would be and be able to will evaluate all that fairly. >> So, I'm glad to hear these questions. The goal of the facilities committee meeting being a facility of the whole uh a facilities committee committee of the whole is so that all board members have enough information all the time to do what they need to do. Our administration is committed to getting us whatever we need to be informed to make good decisions each time we vote. That's what we're I'm committed to making
083sure if it's not clear if it that we make sure that each and every board member gets their information needs met because um there shouldn't be um we shouldn't be voting on things that we think we need we need to understand better. What is this voting item? What does it do? Um what what are the other implications of it? So that's the commitment we're making. you're seeing the first instance of the committee of the whole um and the information needs that board members have. We should continue to surface those and continue to continuously improve which we will. We're committed to that. Dr. Pet is committed to that. Dr. Ryman, me, Mr. Grer, all of us together are. Um so that's really important. I'm glad to hear that we're going to get um ch we love
084to hear chalk full of Mrs. Robinson's chalk full of good information. Uh so that's That's a good thing that's on our agenda next for next month. [clears throat] Point of process about our meeting here today. I think we've all understood that the item on the agenda for voting is not new and it's been in process. It's been in process for quite some time. It has been discussed at previous board meetings uh that we've had. We had a special meeting. Um, but in our in our agenda here tonight, I'll talk about the roll call vote. There'll be an opportunity for for public comment. And then the fifth agenda item, if you'll notice, says approval of agenda or agenda modification. So, to my point about board members having enough information at the time, uh, I don't want
085you to think that if we take a vote tonight, well, that's it. We're always voting in committee meetings. um or that if we don't, well, we're never voting in committee meetings. This is step one. Um so I don't want um board members to think that whatever we do tonight carries on forever. That's not the case. But um when I call for approval of the agenda or agenda modification, as we always do, I'll ask for that and board members can say they they would like to move to approve the agenda as is. And there's only one item uh which is to hold the to vote to award the contract to RLPS or uh and vote to pass that or not. Um and so if the if the board feels comfortable, someone will make a motion, someone
086will someone will second it. Um we'll I can have discussion and then there'll be a vote on whether we if someone votes to approve the agenda, we'll vote yes or no to approve the agenda as it is. the parliamentarian will tell us what to do if someone votes to the agenda as approved and we vote that down. Then I'm going have to call on our parliamentarian or someone will make a motion to amend the agenda um [clears throat] about that next item which which could be any number of things including moving to our voting meeting. Okay. I want you to make sure you all understand what's coming down the road. And are there any questions remaining for item two on our agenda? >> Not a question, but I'd like to make >> sure >> that's
087the old person on the board. Um >> seasoned season was just said about you know being first and we've said that a couple of times. I've said that I want to see the dollars remar before I vote on dollars for the stadium. But over the years, that's what happened to the high school. That's what happened to the middle school. That's what happened to, you know, Landis Run came in and somebody didn't do the middle school. And each time we put band-aids on the stadium because I remember them all. So, we don't want to drag our feet on the stadium project. It has to keep moving. Um, we delayed enough times, but I do agree that the focus needs to be on how much is it going to cost at Metro so we know what we
088want to be comfortable spending on the stadium. So I just I want you to remember to say let's not do what we've done before. That's why the stadium is in the condition. >> Thank you, Miss Sense. So what you're what you're talking about is that you want that's what you want to hear from architect partners is and what does that mean in terms of dollars going forward. Okay. Thank you very much. All right. So I'm going to ask um one last time. Are there any other questions, comments before we move off of agenda item number two? Because I don't want to cut anything short. I hope this can be considered short at this one. All right, I'm going to move on to agenda item number three, which is roll call vote. Unless otherwise stated, each
089vote taken at this meeting will be considered a roll call vote and the board secretary will record any negative votes or abensions. Now we're up to number four, Manheim Township of community comments on consent agenda. There's no consent agenda. Manheim Township of Community Comments. So I'm going to read a statement about that. So we're all briefed. Residents, taxpayers, district employees, and students are all welcome and encouraged to participate. The board will engage in discussion, but will provide followup if needed. So, if you'd like to speak tonight, please fill out the commenters card for the board secretary to collect. Limit your remarks to five minutes related only to item seven. Um, and then share your full name before you begin, please. Coach Evans. I'll let him introduce himself. >> Sorry, I didn't hear what you said.
090>> It's welcome, Coach Evans, is what I said. >> Welcome to be here. Uh my name is Mark Evans. I'm a resident uh representing tonight as a coach and a school counselor. Uh, and I want to say just listening to you talk and the meticulous attention to detail that you all uh put into this, uh, it's very impressive. Um, just like getting ready to play a football game, we're putting our meticulous attention to detail and the X's and O's and and hearing all the work you do behind this. Uh we have an incredibly awesome campus uh districtwide and I think we have an incredibly robust educational system and I certainly understand the needs for Mitch hour and and totally support that as a resident taxpayer with no children in the district. I believe in paying
091for education. I think it's important. Uh and what I'm here tonight first of all say thank you for an amazing looking track. It is very impressively looking track and it it is certainly an awesome upgrade and it certainly has added some pop to the stadium. Um, but I would really like to express my strong support for improving our other athletic facilities, hence the stadium. We drive onto that campus and Manhattan Township and we have these beautiful buildings. We have a beautiful middle school. We have a beautiful high school and then we have that the stadium. And to me, I've gone to a lot of schools over the last 28 plus years as a head football coach and I just like I want so much more for us and that's what I'm here to talk about.
092Um, I'd just like to again to express my strong support for improving our athletic facilities for the betterment of our student athletes and our community. Our teams continue to find success despite working with below average facilities, but they deserve better. Providing locker rooms and adequate storage space on or near the field would greatly enhance efficiency, allowing our athletes to transition on and off the field more quickly and maximize valuable practice, game time, and opportunities to get home earlier to work on their academics. When compared to neighbor neighboring school districts, our facilities fall short of the standard our student athletes have earned through their hard work. Our kids work hard and they really are passionate about another part of their educational process and that's extracurricular. And through their hard work, dedication, and success, investing in improved
093athletic facilities would not only meet practical needs, but also would reflect the pride we have in our school and community. An updated facility would serve as a source of pride for everyone who supports and represents our district. Thank you for your time. Go streaks. Beat the dogs. I'll just say go streets. Thank you, Coach Evans. Welcome. >> Hello. Great. The six foot five guy. Uh, good evening. My name is Todd Beckman. I'm the current president of the Mannheim Township Dugout Club. And I came here tonight just that's a high school booster club for baseball. And I came here tonight mostly just to listen. But if there was any questions or any thoughts on the baseball, I thought I could uh maybe add into that. As I've listened to the uh the conversation and everything here
094tonight, just kind of a different chord struck me because I've been around and looking and dealing with the athletic facilities for probably like 20 years and Mrs. Hence just nailed when nailed it when she said um took kind of my light out of that. you've been around this as well quite a while and I'm like every time we get close um we start to talk about another facility that needs upgraded and those facilities do need upgraded and it happens we went from you know from high school to boot to the intermediate school and then of course the middle school and now of course nitral and there's always going to be something there's always going to be something else because that's the nature of the beast but what happens and these arguments that folks are making
095I sat in your seat so I know those arguments And when we had them come when I was sitting there, I don't think we ever got past midfield. Coach Evans is here, so I'm going to use football analogies. You guys have got it inside the 10 yard line, even closer. And a lot of people are really excited about the the potential for these facility upgrades. I mean, Mr. just mentioned soccer game the other night. I was there as well. Lights are great. That's the first night game they played that I've been to. We used to play. I treed that field for four years when my daughter played soccer here and which is about seven eight years ago and it's still as I was sitting on the hill somewhat uncomfortably the vibe was great but it
096was still uncomfortable to sit on that hill and I'm sitting there thinking how are they still not fix this where people come to these games and it just goes on and on. So I guess my summary point is um you know I really appreciate that we've got to this point. You put in a lot of great work. there's always going to be something and that's not to discount those other needs because obviously we need those as well. But if we push this back, you know, it's just going to constantly be pushed back. And the thing that really strikes me, it's always easy for folks to say, "All right, well, those are the sports things. We can push that off." And, you know, I get it. But sports is part of education here at Manhattan Township.
097Marching band is part of education at Manhattan Township. theater. All those things are important and they're a very important part of the education process. So, if we're going to just keep pushing those back, they're never going to get done. And I feel like we're so close. Again, I know you're going to have to make tough decisions and it's going to be difficult and there's a lot of information you need. So, I get all that, but really at this point, I feel like we're we're really close. And keep that in mind that there's reasons why we're in this situation and we can't just keep pushing it back. Somebody's going to be hurt. there's going to be title N issues. I mean, you know, all the issues. So, it's a matter of uh they've got to be
098prioritized as well. So, I hope you'll consider that when you're starting to make these these decisions. And that's really intimidating. [laughter] >> We just mean it to be informational. >> No, it's good. I've never seen that. >> Thank you very much. It's a new improvement, but maybe you don't think it's one. >> No, it's great. >> All right. Good. Thank you. Um, so are there others and thank you for your comments, both of you. Are there others who would like to make comments this evening? Would any who have spoken like to make additional remarks? >> I said anyone who spoken can speak a second time if they'd like. >> All right. Thanks to all. Now we're on to item uh number five on our agenda, which is for approval of agenda or agenda modification. Uh
099so um I'll ask is there a motion to either approve or modify the agenda? >> Motion to approve. Mrs. Romano. Is there a second for the purpose of conversation? >> All right. There is a second with Mrs. Hent. Now there will now there is discussion prior to any vote. And I want to call on our parliamentarian as we're having discussion as this discussion opens to say that the that the motion on the table is to approve the agenda as it is. The board can vote to yes to to um have the agenda as it is or the board could vote no on having the agenda as it is. Do I understand that correctly? >> You do. >> Okay. So the board can say vote yes or no after we have our discussion and I will
100not cut the discussion short. I'd like to open it up for discussion now. >> Mr. Buldesar, >> I'm one in favor of keeping the agenda as it is. I think um there's it would be prudent to have more time to put it in the context of what um I've mentioned here in the past many times. What does the budget look like? What where is the money going to get paid? And none of that means that, you know, I think we there's a bit of the discussion here. It's like it's kind of an either or. We're either going to do everything for the athletic facilities are here or we're going to do nothing. And I don't think that's what we're saying. I think but to know what the budget is would guide where the money spent.
101Clearly the the safety item and you know upgrading those type things are are important but I don't think it's prudent to go forward to approve to go to that next step until we know what it what is the directive we are giving our LPS. So I'm I'm not in favor of the agenda as it stands. >> Thank you Mr. Bulazar. Mr. Mr. Mano, I believe putting a budget together is part of of that first phase for LPS, correct? Like we're giving them directives. I I don't think it it's in our best interest to say, "Hey, LPS, here's our uh stadium facility area. Um, recommend changes." I mean, I did that once putting a a deck on the back of my house and the quote that came back was insane because they just went crazy, right?
102So, I think it's prudent for us to give us like these are things that we think, right, or or big bullet points for us for you to focus on. And then obviously there'll be degrees, right? I mean, I think initially we had an alumni room and this, you know, and and so things can be toned down, but I think the budgeting process is is part of that first phase. So, I don't know if it's as simple as, "All right, we have $10,000. Tell us what we can do with it." I I think it's a a little bit more of a a process there of a give and take for them to help us with the budget number and us to say, "Okay, that's feasible for us or you're not even, you know, we're not in
103the ballpark or whatnot." >> Thank you, Mr. I see Mr. Grener with his microphone. I I want I want this side of the table to know the podium's over here. You might need to blame it out sometimes. So, I'm going to go Mr. venture first, but then all the other people on this side have the table next. >> Okay. Thank you. Uh yeah, I I think I uh I understand concerns about process, right? I I try to think of myself often as someone who values process over results. And and I think um I haven't heard any of the concerns about process tonight that are raised that I think are unreasonable. Uh, I will say having heard I I agree with Mr. Bolazar as well that I don't think this I'm not thinking of this as
104a binary an either or. Um and and what and as a further point of of explanation, I I I'm confident that we have the budget in place now to instruct our LPS to move forward and evaluating uh the athletic complex in a way that does not compel us to green light something that our budget won't support. Uh I I I don't think this is our only bite of the apple. In fact, I you know, I'm very uh I will say I'm not intrigued. I I'm I'm booed by the the process that we've seen at Nich hour and I think the process that we would see on the athletic complex that makes me uh confident that RLPS isn't going to present us Mrs. Romano's deck. They're going to present us something that's achievable. consistent with the
105goals that we have and if they're not then we can provide that feedback. That is what this committee allows for uh and allows for us to move forward without having to be really concerned about what's around that corner or about decisions that will be made subsequent to that that we don't agree with. this committee is in place to allow this board to have oversight, transparency, and a voice in navigating helping the district navigate these decisions that are in front of us. And so that's why I'm comfortable uh supporting RLPS uh tonight uh because, you know, this is a this isn't a one-time thing. This is going to be a process and this is an important first step of the process. is the way I see it to allow us to continue to have momentum forward
106to address the concerns that we have about the athletic complex. I agree with everything Coach Evans said. Um, and I've spoken about that publicly and like so I won't do so now. But I I uh, you know, feel fully comfortable having heard the the the the concerns and issues that were raised that my vote, yes, doesn't foreclose us uh, addressing those concerns uh, in the future. >> Thank you, Mr. Brener. I'm looking across now. Miss Lamb, Dr. Miss Lamb, >> question time is over, right? Questioning I >> we're it's for discussion now about whether to have the agenda that's um before us. >> So I think when we talked about budget, I saw Mrs. Hoffman nod that that is part of the next step. So I do appreciate the nod even though the question time
107is over. Um but I want to go back to the safety concerns again. I really spoke up about that. So given the safety concerns, I also too feel confident in my decision to support awarding this to RLPS um because I know that that is now that we have understanding of what we are approving for and that's the next step and then I trust in RLPS that they will look at the needs and um versus the wants. So just wanted to make that clear. >> Thank you Miss Lamb, Dr. Henderson. Do you have anything to add, Mrs. Hoffman? >> I'm just recusing myself from all of the above. >> Thank you, Mrs. Hoffman. Mr. Landis, do you have anything to add for us for the discussion part? >> I already said my thoughts and I won't
108rehash them. Um, I think there's it's unfortunate that sometimes on this board when it comes to decisions like this, it seems to get framed by uh certain people that it's an eitheror and it's happened it happened with the track as well. Um so I I I think it's missing the broader point but I'm going to vote what I'm going to vote. Everyone knows where I'm at. I support facilities. I know we need some new athletics. I don't like the process with where we're voting on this tonight. >> Thank you. Mr. Landis. So, unless we have other discussion. >> Oh, I'm so sorry, Mrs. H. >> This is longer than they usually take these days. >> I was going to say that I also would prefer to see um votes of this type at regular board
109meeting. And I know that we can vote at this meeting because it is we have a majority of board members and it is a public meeting. Um, but I just think as president I would like to see this taken at board meeting and that would in my opinion give us opportunity to word the action to represent what we thank you Mrs. H. Now, if there's no more discussion, there has been a motion to approve the agenda and there has been a second. There has been discussion. I'll call for the vote and all in favor of approving the agenda as written, please say I. >> I. >> Do you want all oppose? Nay. >> Nay. >> Do you M. >> Madam Secretary, would you like to do a roll call? >> Yeah, I think we >>
110I would like you to as well. Yeah, I was going to actually suggest that, but um Dr. Henderson, >> Miss Lamb, >> I >> Mrs. Hoffman, you're recused. Correct. >> Mrs. Romano, >> I Mr. Bazar. >> Nay, >> Mr. Landis. >> Name. >> Mrs. H. >> Nay, >> Mr. Greer. >> Hi, M. >> Woodberry. Hi. [laughter] >> Okay. I just consulted with Jen because I've never had this experience before. >> We haven't either. >> Um, so what? Go ahead. I've never had this. Oh, it's okay. In the case of a tie, it needs to go back around the table in reverse order. If it's a tie again, then you need to have discussion again and it will go to a vote again until a decision has been made. >> No, my rule is Roberts. So,
111we'll go around in the opposite order and then we'll have discussion if the vote is the same. >> Is that what I heard? >> That's correct. >> Okay. So, you start backwards. I'm starting with you, Mr. Speaker. >> I'd like to vote Ir >> I'm going to change my vote. >> Okay. >> I [laughter] >> I'm sorry, Miss Lamb. You said I Madam Secretary, >> we have a five >> to three. I'm sorry. Five to three. >> All right. So, that means that the motion carries to have the agenda as written. The agenda has been approved as it is. Um, item six on our agenda is for things that have been pulled for consideration. We've been considering this item the whole night, so we don't need to. Item number six is moved. [clears throat] So
112now we're going to go on to other recommended actions, which is number seven to award the contract for phase three of the district I'm sorry. Yes. Award the contract for phase three of the district campus master plan to RLPS architects on a time and materials basis not to exceed amount of 1 million332,400. It says Mr. Cotch, plant manager and Mr. Charles, assistant plant manager. I think you've talked to us a lot tonight. Is there anything else you'd like to uh tell us about? >> I appreciate everyone's time this evening. I know uh this is our first meeting for facilities as a whole. I think it was a learning curve for all of us, but I applaud you guys. You did a great job tonight. Thank you. >> Thank you very much. So now I think
113I'll ask for a motion and a second. We'll have discussion and then we'll have a vote. Is there a motion to approve? >> Is there a second? >> Mr. Ger and Mrs. Romano. Thank you. Any discussion? I'm going to start over here if there's discussion. Mrs. Hoffman, recusing myself from this vote. >> Thank you, Mrs. Formano. Um, just to reiterate that we've been talking about this for a while and I really appreciate Mrs. Miss Lamb reaching out to Mrs. Robins because she had questions to be able to come tonight prepared in order to vote on something that we were aware we were going to be voting on. And so I think we've had opportunity. We all know that we have specific questions. We can reach out to superintendent, assistant superintendent, other people on the board.
114If we have questions um um Miss Hoffman, if if something that she can provide can give us more information. So I feel like we've been thinking an opportunity. Um, and I just really don't want to see us kind of set ourselves back as far as waiting until November 20th for a vote to kind of move the wheels forward and we're not committing to um specific facilities or whatnot. Um, and I made a list of deficiencies and I will save you all from them, but there's many. Um, and and things that are like bothersome to to watch as I'm at a football game or at a lacrosse game. Um, and I will say the one and it is a football player that um, two things that my son's been playing with. Um, they have two disabled
115boys in wheelchairs and I have watched them since youth drive up. Mom gets out, takes both boys out of the car, sits their wheelchairs there. She goes, drives, parks, walks back, and then one boy can push his own wheelchair, but the other boy cannot, and she pushes him up the ramp to watch the football game. And she does that every single week. Um it's upsetting that she has to go through that and that's just one small thing that that is the reason why we need to keep pushing it forward. The other is my dad sitting in the car watching lacrosse games because he can't navigate lacrosse field. Luckily that parking lot is there. I watch it but it's not ideal. >> Any other discussion from this side of the table? Okay, Mr. Bulasar, >> I'm
116torn on this. Um, I will likely vote no. Not because I don't think we should have ordered the RLPS because I know that no tonight doesn't actually stop that from happening. It could come back in the way that I think it should. And I'm I'm highly confident it's going to pass anyway. So, I'm going to vote no, but I want it to be publicly known. It's not that I don't think that anything should happen. It's not that I don't think we should take care of certainly the agree just things that Mrs. Romano brought up. I think in a in a process way I tried to articulate my points about budget. Clearly, it's not getting through. It's not just the budget of this project. It's the whole. We never look at the whole. Um and I
117think there needs to be time to do that. And so, because of that, I'm going to vote now. >> Thank you, Mr. Bulasar. Any other discussion? I'm going to go to Mrs. Hen and Mr. Ger. My comment is also in process. Um, looking at this, it really is only about these the architects we want working with us forward and I think that that is a yes and that would be how I would. >> Thank you, Mrs. H, Mr. >> and I I similarly don't uh I I will be voting yes. Um, and I uh I hope this doesn't fall on deaf ears, but I I don't view my vote yes as being a rejection of the concerns that have been raised. Um, I don't think those are invalid. I don't think they're unreasonable. I don't
118think they're out of left field. Um, I just uh and I don't think that I haven't excuse me, I don't think I haven't heard them. Uh I just uh still feel like securing the uh architecture for MRPS to to start this process allows us to uh continue to move forward while we uh improve as a collective team. >> Thank you, Mr. Grether. Before I call for the vote, I'll just add my comment that I respect and the and honor the opinions of all um and all of the points and counterpoints that have been made by each and every board member. I think one of the best things about this board is how seriously each and every member takes it and uh and how much we honor and respect each other. Uh and that is a
119tradition that I'm proud that we have here in Manhattan Township. So, I um appreciate Mr. Grener and all of the work that I want to just recognize the people who are on this board who have been serving behind the scenes to advise our administration have been doing work for quite some time that have been it's a lot of hours that no one has seen. Um and I want to acknowledge that um and knowing that we've it's been a long arc to get here I want to acknowledge the points of process and how we are committed to continuously improving our process as well. So my vote yes to um to award this contract does not negate all those process points and all the information needs of the board members. I want that to be known before
120I call for the vote. And now I will call for the vote and say would you like to do a voice? Yes, please. I will ask our board secretary to ask us for a roll call vote. >> Mrs. Romano. >> Miss Lamb. >> Yes. I >> Dr. Henderson. >> Hi. Mr. Bazar. >> Nay. >> Mr. Landis. >> Hi, >> Mrs. H. >> I Mr. Grer. >> Hi, >> M. >> I passes. >> The motion carries. Thank you very much. We are on to item number eight. And our and by the way, thanks for all the hard work. I just want to acknowledge you all. Um, now we're on to new business. Um, Any items brought forward for new business will not be acted upon until the next school board meeting to allow school board members
121to have sufficient information to allow opportunities for public comment. Does any board member have new business to bring forward? >> At the risk of having something thrown at me as we're here at the end of the meeting, um I uh think we can probably wait. I my envision would be we would cover this at the next facilities committee meeting, but I would like a status update and a project update on two matters. One of which is the installation of solar panels on the top of the middle school which I have not heard any update on in some time. And number two would be a status update or operational update on the health clinic. Uh specifically how its unveiling is continued to evolve, how our staff are utilizing it. Do we have procedures in place to
122allow our staff to utilize it as the way it was intended? uh and uh just basically any other um uh evaluation measures or tools that we've used thus far to uh ascertain this impact. Thank you. >> Stop just one taking water. Mr. Granter, thank you for those two items. Update on solar in the middle school and operational update on the health clinic. Does any other board member have any business? I see Mrs. Romano's finger in the air. Sorry, Mrs. Hoffman. It's getting late. you're both right there. Thank you. >> Yes. Um just for the facilities committee as well. Um I recommend that there's and it it's probably more of a discussion, not necessarily a vote or anything, but um this is what Barry and Dr. may have been to work with RLPS to potentially have
123some tours of athletic facilities um to set up with RLPS just to uh give some board members some opportunities to tour some local athletic facilities to compare uh contrast and and look at the why as u Mr. Lincoln had mentioned um and compare it to what we're looking at doing. >> Thank you Mrs. Hoffman who is not Mrs. Toronto for that position. Dr. Henderson, do you have some business? >> I do. Um the I guess it's a poorly kept secret among board members, but um I will be stepping down in November and it has been a pleasure to serve Manhattan Township. I appreciate the opportunity. I appreciate the evolution of the community. Uh going from someone standing on other side of mic very nervously criticizing the administration and school districts for not having enough representation
124among students and staff to being essentially drafted to run. They didn't have to do much proddding to get me to run. But um I appreciate my colleagues and um the open-mindedness with which you and the diligence with which you approach all of the topics brought before you um putting politics aside and making about the students and the growth of the community and again it's been my pleasure to be a part of it. >> Thank you so much Dr. Henderson. We appreciate your board service and your commitment to this community. I mean, we couldn't cut for Dr. Anderson. [applause] >> Thank you. Heartfelt acknowledgement there. Is there any other new business? Oh, >> Mr. Landis, >> point of clarification. Is this your last meeting or next two meetings? Okay. >> Okay. So you'll still be with
125us November 13th and 20th >> for sure the 13th. >> Okay. >> Thank you very much. >> So just as a procedural thing, can you write >> Absolutely. >> letter of resation direct it to me because then we'll have to get the board to vote on that at the um November 20th meeting. >> Thank you very much. Uh, thank you to our board secretary who keeps us crossing all the tees and dotting all the eyes. That is very much appreciated. So now, is there any other new business? All right. For our agenda, I've copied the agenda. Do we have a second public um comment period? Is that nice agenda? >> All right. I just want to make sure mine matches yours. >> Yes. >> All right. Wonderful. Community Nanheim Township community comments. Residents, taxpayers, district
126employees, and students are still welcome and encouraged to participate. We won't engage in discussion at this at this time, but we'll provide you followup if needed. If you'd like to speak, please fill out a commenters card and hand it to our board secretary. Um, and please limit your remarks to five minutes. [clears throat] Are there folks who would like to make comment at this time? All right, I waited for a really long pause. I'm not hearing or seeing any votes. That brings us to adjournment. Is there a motion to adjurnn? >> Is there a second? >> Thank you. I have uh one announcement which was that after last board meeting um the worst um which was a week ago on the 16th the board did meet in executive session to discuss agency business which if
127conducted in public would violate lawful privilege or lead to the disclosure of confidential information. So we did meet in executive session right at the close of last week's board meeting. Our next scheduled board meeting is Thursday, November 13th at 6 p.m. here in the district office. Meetings will be livereamed and recorded for viewing purposes. Thank you all to to all of Manheim Township staff, administrators, and volunteers for your dedication to our students and community. All in favor adjournment, please say I. I. All oppose, nay. That motion carries. We are journed.