Board of Education Special Meeting 6/11/25

001and welcome you. And um to the pledge of the people to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Have a motion to approve the agenda. So move second. Second. All in favor? I motion carries. Monarch United GSA are ready and an end of the year set. They're here. Oh, go for good evening, President Wong, Superintendent F, board members, and administrative staff. Um, this evening I'm going to present the end of the year monitoring report. And, um, I'm going to quickly go through the slides. We're going to kind of shift the way we're going to do this so that we have more of a discussion about the data. I know you've already seen a good bit

002of the data, so I'm going to go fairly quickly through the slides. Um, so the first uh slide is just our agenda where we're going to review the benchmark data and the summit of data. Um, we're going to delve into efficiency and growth. And then we're also going to kind of talk about, you know, as you have been looking at the data over time, what are you noticing and what are you wondering about the data? And then we're going to talk about successes and opportunities. Um, the next slide, please. We're going to first look at the Ready data. Um, and this shows the comparison uh for all three diagnostics from the first through the third. We're going to look at that uh that third that far right column in each color. But my focus is

003really going to talk about the green is what reflects our students that are are proficient that are on grade level. So is is what you're looking at there. Uh just a quick snippet in terms of what I looked at is that we had um K3 had strong gains especially in kindergarten. And if you look at the bottom it's the chart that we looked at back at the middle of the year in terms of I already proficiency for reading. What if we had no growth from middle of the year to end of the year? What if we had typical growth? And what if we had stretch growth? The one I want to focus on is that annual target. That annual target is the target that was the expected target for us to reach for um 2025

004on the West Virginia General Summit of Assessment and that was at 48% set by the state and uh we were at 42% if I round up. The next slide is looking at the map. Once again, it reflects everything uh like what it did for the reading. Um just as with the reading, we had the strongest gains in in K3 in our math. However, there were steady gains across most grade levels with the math. And if I take your eyes to that far right target, our target was uh 37.7% if we want to round that up to 38. And for us in terms of our GSA scores, we were at 34% in math. Um the next slide, I know that this is a slide that that you all typically like to look at because it shows

005our comparison and and to um the the national the nation and and to West Virginia. That very first bar reflects when they did their their norming and that's the sample group um in that very first bar. But if you look at this overall in terms of looking at this, we are above both um uh the nation and we're above the state for for reading um with our I Ready data in math. The next slide once again um we are once again higher than um nationally and the state in in the math. So we're going to shift and go to our eyes so we can s get through the map. Uh once again what what you're looking at here is very the the graph is very similar to what I put together for the um ready

006data. The green represents proficiency. Um and the one difference is the far right with this the gray that gray reflects students that may have started an assessment or or didn't take an assessment. So that's just the incomplete students um in the uh once again in terms of just a really quick glance, sixth grade shift show the most increase from 27% to 40% um all grade level which is a 13 percentage point gain. Next slide. Um then this is the this is the picture with math with math specifically the middle schools took a different assessment with ISL than the high schools. they took their new what is called level up benchmark. It's a true benchmark. It's a time test. Um and and then with the is the flex diagnostic. It's more of a diagnostic which it

007changes over time and and with with the data there to for instructional change. Um and so overall then this is just the picture in terms of where we were with math which the high school with the maths are they're relatively stagnant in terms of of their data over time. If we turn to the next slide, this is our goal that we set for ourselves this year um in our strategic plan. And um we set a very aggressive goal in terms and a half worth of growth. And so you can sort of look down here with our our I Ready K5 and north. Um but this is 38% of our students met stretch growth in reading and 25% of our students met stretch growth in math. Um overall it's na nationally the typical range in terms

008of what we see on the national level for stretch growth. Typically it's 25 to 35% of students do make stretch growth. So we have um an aggressive goal towards that. that we need to have an aggressive goal because we want our students if they need that stretch growth two years consecutively if it it moves them closer to closing that gap and being on grade level. And then the data over on the um other side is reflecting the the data in terms of did they meet that 150 point growth for for them in with so you can see the data there. Um the next slide please go ahead. Um now moving into the um PSAT data. We as the district choose to do the PSA in the fall and the spring so that we have two

009data points for our nth grade or 10th grade and then at 11th grade they have the fall data point but then that usually comp that then is compared to the SAT school day school day. So um I apologize but you're kind of looking at the data backwards but so you're going from left to right instead of right to left when you're looking at the data though. Apologize for that. Um but you can sort of see then overall in terms of the of the total average that we gained four points and then at uh the for the reading and writing we gave four points and for math we gave gave one point in terms from fall to spring and 12% of our students met both benchmarks. That means they met the reading and writing benchmark and

010the math benchmark. And there was moderate growth in terms of all of our data with PSAP. there was moderate growth shown across fall strength comparisons. The next slide once again very much similar to setup just like the 89. Um the district had 17 um points and gains for the overall average. We had four uh point gains for reading and writing and we had 12 point gains for math. And overall as a district we had 14% of our test takers meeting both benchmarks. When we look at the um next set of data, this is the fall SAT data in SQT data compared to how our students then did on the SAT school day. The overall average we had 53 points gain um for the overall total average. We have 29 points um in gains for reading

011and writing and we had 23 points gains for math and 15% of that. The next slide, please. could ask a question. I apologize. The PSAT and the SAT obviously have similar scoring metrics, correct? Yes, all all of them do or they're all in this. Does the uh on the SAT school day, does the metric that determines proficient, whatever that scale score is? Yeah. Is it does it reflect the same as what the PSAT would? So, for example, does the PSAT um tell us how many students are considered proficient as if they were to take the 11th grade SAT? It tells them. I've never asked that question. They could be proficient. They could be deficient. It gives you a what's the mesh word? I'm trying to Well, I'm trying to think in terms of this when

012I look when I look at it in terms of of scores in in one of the skills insight document in the very back. If you score at this range on PSAT, you um 89, you might be at the 25th percentile. And then if you scored that same well, you might be at the 50th percentile, but then if you're scored that same range at the PSAT 10, you would be at the 25th percentile. So, it kind of adjusts in terms of being able to equate it as percentiles, not necessarily, you know, in terms of what you're talking about with the proficiency. It tells you you're on track. you're on track doing uh college level work. Yes, correct. During a C or better that could be AP, that could be Thank you. Um and when I sort

013of look at this in terms of and when I'm trying to look at this data and I'm looking at in terms of proficiency, I'm looking at the students that were proficient in what what was the percent proficient in reading, what was the percent on grade level in in math and looking at at it that way in terms of the the data of the scores with that. Um or if you want to look at it this way, the com combination of both test takers that that that met the benchmark for reading and math, those would be kids which most likely would be proficient. Um the next slide, this is the cohort data that we we tend to look at. And what you're looking at here is that these current 11th graders in fall of 2024, this

014past fall, we looked at where they were in fall 2023. Yeah. So when you're looking at that, so when in in fall of 2023, you can see their their total score, their total average score, and then comparing it to fall of 2024, they gained 53 points. In looking at it, then the reading and writing game is 36 points. And in the fall, they gained 17 point. The comparison with that same word is 17 points. When we say they gained, I mean, that's good, but how good is that? I well I think I mean that might be a stupid question. No, it's a great it's great. It's it's a great question, Jackie. It's it's not a stupid question. And I just know I kind of think back to the trainings and when we've had um like

015college board and and talking to our students and they sort of talk about it, they have multiple opportunities to practice that typically you're willing to look at maybe a 100 points w with that. Is that typically what you've understood from that information? So, you're you're typically looking at 100 points. Okay. So, we're we're making strong progress, but we're not where we need to be. Do do we know and I apologize if I may missed it in any of these. Do we know where where the national average is for, you know, like the 9th, 10th, and 11th grade versus where we are? I I can't I can't give you that. I will explain. I did not really provide that to you for the PSAP just because not everyone across nationally choose to give the PSAPS the

016way we choose to get PSATS and even within the state there are not all districts within the state choose to give the PSAT so the data would be skewed if we would look at that but I have that information I can provide that to you yeah I guess I maybe maybe what maybe what I'm going to maybe let me rephrase this okay do we have the ability yes to Say it say it this way. We have the ability to from a national perspective, I don't even know if this exists. Um, of all the states, counties that that do test all kids, what that average we do. And and what and the way they break it down now, they even changed it this year. They show it to you by West they show you by your

017district. They show it by West Virginia public. They show it Sorry. You're fine. They you're show it by by by the district. They show it by West Virginia public and then they show it by all West Virginia which I think probably includes the private schools that are participating in it. And then I think they show it by um U US US and then they show it by globally in terms of the way they break it down where they used to just show it to us by district by state and then uh internationally at that. Wouldn't that still be skewed? Because like you said, we we test everybody and some it's only the percent, right? Right. And I and my my question was very specific to for those counties that test everybody, right? Do we have

018the ability to ground those? Well, I would have to check. I know that Jefferson usually does the fall one county. I think does fall in and spring. So, it would be a matter of just collecting data from the county setting, even if it was just for one, just so that we get an idea of what where our kids are. So, one of the things I've the the conversations I've started having with the team is um and it kind of hits on what both of y'all are saying. There's uh 10 states that actually test everybody. Okay. And that's what I've actually said to Robin like I actually want to now when we start looking at our data actually compare it to those states where that same variable like they're testing all their kids like we are

019to get a solid snapshot of how do we rank against them and then start to that's the only way you could get an accurate picture if you have provided exactly what u the areas uh in the nation or the state or whatever that test that's exactly how we do otherwise I said it'll be all over and that is with the SAT school day. The data that we were just looking at is is is PSAT. So I would have to do some digging to see what other states are actually doing it similar to what we were doing. I don't think that our college board rep could help us with that too. Yeah. Also the the name compared to those 10 C 10 states. You can compare your 10 states which you will see and then compare

020them to the nape school only a sampling of students but you could do that and typically n is eight fourth and 12th and we do not the problem with that is is that we test 11 and not 12 I mean just an overall ranking yeah well what I don't want you to do is digging dig and dig for information that's rolled out, but it's not going to be of any very Okay, that's a lot of work. And my only thing thinking was there's got to be something somewhere that that has some level of these 10 states that test everybody. This is their average, right? That that that's that's I don't want you to go digging digging digging. I have reports for the 10 state. Yeah, that's that's primarily where my where my thinking is because

021I'd love to know where we line up. Okay. And I do have reports for the 10 states. So, I'll see what I can put together for you all. When you're looking at this, do any of the states make the test results, skin in the game, u you know, there's there's some there's some relationship. If you don't pass this test, you don't move on or Yeah, that would that Well, if if you could find that out, that would be important because then that would Yeah, you would think there would be higher scores and in every state, even though that those 10 nine states, we make the 10th. Um, even though that they use it as their senative, everybody's accountability system, right, is different is different, right? So I would have and it just depends on what

022they would be willing to share right with that. So but I I will see what I can find out for you all. This next section that we we're moving into is all our our summit of assessment data. So this is this is then this is the data that we will be looked at will be looked at and will then determine our accountability. Everything prior to this is what we sort of consider our formative data. Um, just a reminder, and I just need to do this as as a disclosure for you all. This is the all data. This is every student in grades 3 through 8 and 11 that tested. So, this is all data. The accountability data will possibly change our picture. it may shift our picture in terms of the numbers that we're looking

023at tonight because with the accountability data the state metric is a students that were with us for 130 equal to or more than 135 days. So students that were here with us less than that number those students are removed from the data in terms of accountability. So, what you're looking at tonight is all data and that accountability data according to to the West Virginia Department of Ed will probably be available to us maybe the second week of August. So, the numbers that we're looking at tonight could change and most likely will change. So, I just really need to give you that disclaimer so that you're not thinking, well, why did Mrs. Lopez present this and now I'm seeing this with with that. Um, so that and then the other caveat to this is is that

024even though the state lifted the embargo because parents now have the availability to see their their child's test data in real time and their results in real time, this is still data that really we sort of want to make sure we're kind of keeping it in-house for our conversation because once again for the media, the data is going to shift and look different in August with the accountability. So, I just feel like I needed to give you all that that disclaimer as we as we move forward. And then over to the other side, I'm not going to go through this. This is was just a reminder in terms of of what the tests are, what grade levels are tested, and what's provided. I just want to go back. It it could look different. Yes. But

025it could look better. It could look better. So, just wanted to make sure you know because you know more likely they're the students aren't as proficient. But yeah, it it could change for the better. So you know looking on the positive side of things. So I think that these charts have been shared with you. So I won't spend a lot of time on them. But this has been our ELA and literacy in terms of the very first line you'll see across is is the district in terms of our our overall gains. And then you can then see it by grade level. Um and then the next piece is then the math. And if it's green that means we had a gain. If it's red we we had a loss. So once again you can then

026see overall in terms of our gains as the district and then by grade level or if we have any losses. Next slide please. This this is just our SAT school day data. This is the data that there are 10 add nine additional states that also use it as the SAT school day. Those states are Connecticut, Colorado, Delaware, Indiana, Michigan, New Mexico, Ohio, and Rhode Island. The closest for us would be Delaware. So, we might I might be able to make a connection there just to see. Um, so you can see overall we uh our total score is 8.93. Um, our reading and writing is 470 and our math is 423. overall students that met both benchmarks is 15% and then in terms of students being promise eligible we have 211 students across the district that

027are promise eligible. Um this was a slide specifically put in for you guys in terms of as you were looking at the data if you had time to look at the data prior to the meeting. um what do you what did you notice about the data? And when you're thinking through this lens, it's just the facts. Kind of like if you're if you're growing up with my era, it's kind of like um drag head, throw Friday, just the facts, man, you know. Um and then the other side is then what do you wonder? So, if we just kind of click through both of those. I went ahead and I didn't share these with you when I when it was printed, but these were some guiding thoughts or some guiding questions that if you were struggling

028with this or you didn't have time to write anything down, but we really want you to take some time to kind of, you know, process this and and look through the questions so that it really was not about me talking about the numbers because you've looked at the numbers. Um, but the key that I've always been taught when we're you're looking at data, the answers are not in the numbers. They're in the questions you have about the numbers that that lead us to where we need to be. I just have a question about the the SAT data. Okay. Um when it says um like 893 and it's between 400,600 and poster in reading and math reading and writing is 470 and math is 423. And I know the districts is um you met both benchmarks,

029but actually how good is that? Um I would say in term in terms of that when you're looking at an 8.93 that might slightly be a little bit lower. I think on average is Holly is around in the 900s that they typically look at as as as kind of the typical range or the atmosphere average if you're going if you're going to college. But that um if if you're looking to get a perfect score, for a student to have a perfect score on the SAT, it's 1,600. So that means they would have to get it score an 800 in the reading and writing and an 800 in the math to have a perfect score. So then kids that score within that within the these ranges then also determine I think you know whether or not

030they're going to hit promise and I don't really remember what that is. It's 1080 1080 for for promise. So that so that's that's what they would have to score and typically they'd have to have a higher Yeah. And the benchmarks that they they the college board benchmarks are different than the promise benchmarks. Um so that when we're looking at it just strictly from the college board data, it's the what the expectation is for promises is slightly different. And I only remember from when I was in school what the college board was and it was I don't know if it was 1600 then but it was high and I remember what he made and I just thought that seemed it's a it's a little low if for if you're for when you're considering kids going to

031for the collegebound student. If it was just the collegebound student, it would be interesting to see that better. Yeah. Compared to all of that. How many years have we taken SAT? I think five. I think it's been five. Yes. Um but don't that last year we've had a shift. Last year was the first year it moved to digital and the structure of the test changed where there was two segments for the for their reading and two segments for the math. So what happens is that first segment all students start out taking the the the same um the same and then it adjusts and then based on how they perform in that first to- determine what their second part looks like and and Michael what's changed from you remember probably those really long reading passages that

032you had to then you'd have to refer from one part to the next part to kind of come up with your answers. they are now very just short um passages for them to refer to to use and it's only isolated to that question. You don't have to refer back and forth to from one question to the next. So there's been some some change with the design of the test as well as moving to being digital. So are they saying like like this looking at historical data the past five years it wouldn't be fair to judge this year? Would you necessarily say that? I'm just saying that the structure has changed and it's moved to digital. So, it might make a a a a small difference, but I don't know if it would be statistically significant.

033Yeah. So, the the That's a great question. The the format of the assessment has changed a little bit, but the actual skills they're assessing the students on hasn't changed, right? So, it's just the delivery method, but the but the skills the the skill or the skills are all still the same. It's just the format looks a little bit different. So you could still compare and look at the actual skills and say like where have our students progressed or where they have they actually progressed then. Yeah, that's what we're still looking at. I say you haven't looked at it yet, but it probably just came in, right? No, it's been in we've looked at it. But it's still those skills. It's the same skills. It's the same skills. uh the students that uh all students take

034the SAT, right? Yes. Uh all but if you're not wouldn't put as much into it if I would think if as someone going to college. So the more those students that don't put as much into it bring our test results down. I think that that could be a fair assessment. But I would say this though is this long. I think what we have to keep in mind and you know taking it back to our you know work session the other day. So when we're talking about all these different skills, all of these skills are just a combination of the different standards that all of our kids are learning to to make a skill. Um so it doesn't matter if we're talking about the GSA all the way up to the SAT. Those same standards are

035built within those skills. It's just the rigor starts increasing on them over time. So that's like for example the difference between the PSAT and the SAT. It's the same skills to an extent, but now the rigor is just starting to go up. Really still kind of coming back to how are we actually unpacking those skills and that we're addressing those standards the way they should be at grade level across the board. And on the flip side of that, we have actually had kids get stopped full ride scholarships that weren't planning to come to college because they did so well in the assessment. Oh wow. And we have our schools our schools, you know, we had one specifically that I think they all did their own version of it, really doing test talks with the kids

036and bringing them in and talking to them about the importance of doing well and and I think, you know, showing them, you know, this is where you scored last year, you know, this is a gold for this year. So I think that I think it's a combination of things and we saw some very good um growth in in um some of some of our schools that join with it but a safety school. Is there any way to break down like I'm not sure when they take the test is there a box they check for uh if they're planning to go to college or not? What I wanted is that's a way to break down. They do a survey. They do a survey where the kids show what they're interested in doing and what their aspirations

037are are. So they they do that. I just it's not something that comes back to me because I will get it back. Yeah. I was wondering if there was a way to sort of break down, you know, those because they're about going to to go to trade school and you know, or if you're going in the military or Yeah. I mean it might be something that then we would create a survey in house to typically it's done. Yeah. And I again for my friend kids that take remedial courses when they go to college um and you know even in the military they've got remedial they've got a remedial class you know that can go up to three months. So there's like there there are remedial places in each segment of our you know after high

038school experience. So what how does how does breaking that up and trying to see you know are we doing right for by our kids are we doing well enough for our kids and they're in their thinking and I know that there's been some segments of population where the kids you know weren't planning to go to college but then get full bright scholarship and then go perfect that's wonderful I'm glad but are we doing right in each segment in each section of the of the student body that's Other questions, Mr. Murphy? Yeah, I got one. Do I need to stay up here? Mr. Okay. Okay. He must be sick. He has No, he just doesn't have his sticky notes. Go ahead. Careful. Okay. On slide six, go back to the It's got down there at the

039bottom. Yeah, it's your reading. It's the reading um the the place comparison. Yes, slide six and seven. Okay, I'm looking at the national one and we're a point I'm just looking at the dark green part and and the light light green and uh we're doing very well there compared to the national norm but yet we Berkeley County last time I looked at it ranking and everything we were in the 40s compared to the 55 counties of the state and yet in West Virginia it's always on the bottom uh in academic performance. So I was just wondering how can we be doing so well against the national and I already and still have such low performance within the state of West Virginia. Now, I know we're on a improvement trendy right now, but but I'm just

040sitting there thinking, if we're doing so great in the national norm, why aren't we way above in West Virginia? And uh Yes, sir. That's a great um that's a great takeaway and and you're you're spot on. Um it's because of the the assessments, how they're designed. So like I already it's it's measuring growth but like the the examples that you're referring to that's like mastery. So did I like meet the mark or not? So I can actually be growing but if the standard is here and even though I grew 30% if I'm supposed to be here at the end of the year I could have grown this much but I didn't actually meet the standard. So, um, those have been great conversations that the team and I have been having and then thinking about how

041we're going to have those conversations with the principles and then they can lead those conversations with their teachers because, you know, we always want to see growth, but we have to grow to where that standard is. So, even though we showed that growth, if we didn't meet the mark, like you're saying spot on, we have to acknowledge we didn't meet that mark and figure out how we can get there. Is can I chime in there also? you you should expect out of us moving it forward to see additional growth add so additional green in the future. I know that's something I have a hard time with and Dr. Sax has helped me with is I want it fixed. I want it done now. He's like now hold up. This is not a magic bullet. It

042is progression over time. But again, I know I just feel like the sense of urgency we don't have time to wait. But it's that you should expect from us and as we go through these things and try and try to get better and improve that we see more and more green. So we want to exceed this expectation. So then next year we want to see higher than 37%. We want to exceed the state and then that'll be closing that gap and hopefully you see the change in the GSA which would be master. Let me ask my second question in the other the other test. Uh how congruent are the preparatory evaluation beginning year, middle year, end of year tests compared to the West Virginia general assessment test? Are are you seeing a a close fit

043that what you see on the real does give you a prognosis of what the others want to uh indicate? Well, I think that's that projected proficiency that that we looked at. And you know, for the most part, when we break it down by schools, some schools are are are spot on in terms of what their projected proficiency was and at the middle of the year for I Ready to the the West Virginia General Summit Assessment, somewhere within two to three percentage points. Um, and there's usually always one or two that that are kind of outliers that that don't necessarily hit that. But um and then also there's a component of the irony which is the the the standards u standards mastery the standards mastery that are that are the West Virginia standards that are aligned

044to to the work that that's done there and I think uh probably one of our schools I think it was Winchester Avenue that did that work with the standards mastery this year and they had some really significant improvement um but and because they have our standards there and at the end of the day whether we're looking at I Ready or the West Virginia General Summit of Assessment it goes back for our standards as Dr. everyone said and unpacking our standards and making sure our teachers know our standards and at what level we should be teaching our standards to to work towards it to gain towards mastery and that's where we're at right now with our ready you you don't want to overwhelm teachers in the very beginning it it it's it's slow to get better

045we we we've rolled this out actually we followed the C county model before Dr. saxs even got here because they had rolled it out ahead of us. If you look at where we're at, that's the level that we're at where we are going to train our teachers this year looking at after they give the diagnostic for the kids, you can print out a report and it will show them who has mastered that content standard and it's the West Virginia standard and who has not. And so when you print that report and look at it, then as a teacher, you know, this kid has not mastered this skill. So you give that diagnostic in December, you're looking at it. Hey, this kid still has not mastered this skill in the state of West Virginia based on

046our criteria. So you you could see that as you're going along. And so more we we're going to learn to use that report this school year. So we've rolled it out when we rolled it out. Like last year we were really focused on making sure our students were hitting that sweet spot and the number of minutes that they should be working on on the platform. This year was about making sure that they were passing two buses. We every week we gave sent out a report that I already put together that I really feel also created a sense of urgency that really um helped our principles to to monitor attemp to to navigate that next year. We're taking on probably districtwide even though some of our schools have already used the standards mastery report but that's

047sort of our next layer. But the key to this is with this data they have to change. They have to use the data to change their instruction or to drive their instruction because you can have all the data you want but if they don't do anything with that change that data to do something differently especially where we need to have the the most intervention and most differentiation occurring we're not our results are going to change. So we have to really use the data to drive our instruction. And I think that's something we're we're working towards and and moving forward and couples with what we were talking about yesterday specifically with the the standards. Are we teaching to standards? Yes. Because it where where the confusion comes in is if someone says like if if we

048say like um we look at the data and we say hey we're lacking in this skill and we say we're teaching this skill. One thing that we've talked about this year is actually helping folks go deeper. So when you say you're teaching that skill, what you're actually saying is I'm going to unpack that skill to see which standards are actually need to be addressed and then how did I actually teach those standards because when I've taught those standards and the kids have mastered those standards by virtue they've mastered the skill. So this year, like I said, the the teachers and principles have already done a great job as they've started to look at it and we've seen those gains, but we're excited because now as we can help them go deeper, then they'll have a

049very like rich understanding of okay, what exactly what exactly now do I need to dive into to get the kids where I need to be? Part of that work goes back to I think something that that Dr. was did with our principles and they all felt very positive about it just defining those verbs within those standards. That was a that was a big part of that yesterday. Yeah. Yeah. That a ton. the uh are you tracking the the class results of the teachers who are uncertified and following the impact whether I mean I'm sure you're going to have some outstanding results from some people who are uncertified but I'm just wondering are you looking overall at the classroom level of the thing and I I've asked that question because the other day I was I

050was at the uh what do you call the Skillshare skill year and and u a teacher somebody I think it was not a classroom teacher but she was an administrator either but she was doing a presentation on do what's the word she was she was saying now beg your principal for your roster she was asking say get your roster for your students oh can be can be Mr. Sorry, I don't know why I keep your body. There's somewhere in New Jersey called so close to camping, but anyway, I think my trigger word is New Jersey and I'm trying trying to bring it up. But anyway, I was listening to the lady and she was talking about, well, you can get your roster. I thought, well, you can get the the administration can get the class

051to say, well, this class is dropping the ball here that these three classes are carrying the ball and so you can focus now down on the classroom. I just wondering if you ever did that and u and just focus on the teacher to make, you know, look, you need to cover these areas as your goal and we're going to see how you do at the end of the year. So, take that one step further. You should be monitoring the uncertified teachers and see where they're working and performing and and see are we is this another expense to the or cost to the system that we have all these people but they don't have the preparation to do the do the job. But the Cambium platform for grades three through eight we we can we see

052the data by teacher. So, so and we can drill down and some schools roster it multiple ways. They'll they'll mult roster by their special ed teachers. They want roster by title one. They'll roster by their LS and so they can create as many rosters as they want. The key for me would be then to know, you know, the principles would have if they wanted me to put it together, I'd have to know who those uncertified people were in their building. I'm I'm not necessarily I don't necessarily have that information, but they have that information and they can go in and look by teacher and know which ones in their building were certified versus non-certified and how how they did in terms of students being proficient versus nonproficient. That's in three through eight. We don't necessarily

053have that capability at for college board with rate 11. But in our in our argument with our legislators in the locality pay issue, we're still sitting with Santa Claus left pay, but that would be another argument. This is a measurable result of not being able to recruit certified teachers in this area by simply just looking at what your certified people are doing and what your uncertified people are doing. U let me ask you another question with this. You've been in this position. You and I have been doing this dance for years. We have for almost 24 years, Mr. Murphy. Yeah. We've been doing I didn't know that long. Yeah, when they call I have an age, right? [Music] You you still still bat the ball across the net every time I try to send it

054over there, but you've been watch you've been seeing this process for years and you're watching with the new system. What are we doing now? And whether it's a strength or weakness or what you can, what are we doing now that we didn't do in the past with testing? Well, I think in in my 12 years, I've been in the board office for 24. In my 12 years of having this position, the assessment has changed, I think, at three or four times. So, we went from West Test to West Test 2 to Smarter Balanced to the West Virginia General Summit of Assessment. And I think the rigor of the assessments changed over time. And and probably Dr. Saxs can support me on this. Like when we were doing West Test One, um Dr. Payne was the

055state superintendent at the time and because our NAE scores were so low, he did not feel West Test one was rigorous enough and that's how we ended up with West Test 2, which then it did increase the rigor. So at that time, we started to see our scores drop some from what we were used to with West Test one. And then we went then I think we had that for several years. I'm not sure. And then we went into like the smarter bounce and I think Dr. Sax do you remember were you still at the state at that point maybe two years and then you know with um the controversy with 4 and A to F and all of that then we had then we went to the West Virginia General Summit of Assessment. Now

056with that being said with the four tests since I've been in this position we also had three accountability systems. We had No Child Left Behind. We had A to F and then did we go to smarter balance doctors? Was there one between was between smarter balance then A to F to F. A to F is last. Okay. And now now it's the balance score card. So So I think in terms of of your question I I don't necessarily know if I have a direct answer. Dr. Saxs may have a better answer than I do, but we've he was actually asking is what do you see different over the past year? Oh, just a year for over time. He's started out with five time in this position. Oh, I'm sorry. I do think that that as

057a school district, we're paying more attention to the details of the data across across all grade spans. Yeah. Um, I think we probably have a little bit more work to do at the high school level. Um, to dig into that SAT data, um, and preparing our students to be successful on the SAT, even though we know that not all students are are are destined for college because that's not what they want to do. They want to go into the workforce immediately. And so, an assessment like the NOCDI or uh some other performance-based assessment might be something they would find more value in. It is the metric at which we are assessed. Right. One of the one of the things just tonight in the past we would be working we wouldn't be doing this until probably

058fall. Yeah. Correct. After you got the embargo or whatever the cleaned up test results and and one of the issues that were you left the devices out over the summer. Why? Well, they the students may use them, but the key is at the beginning of the year for the boy test, beginning of the year test, um the students will have their devices and we'll start off very early. Yes. and and the boy in the beginning of the year test results next year will probably be lower than this year because the teachers will have been teaching for six weeks or something like that for the uh for the students because they'll be they'll be higher. We hope that the building high. Well, you're Well, I I'm sitting there thinking they'll be lower because the students will

059not uh they will not have five to six weeks of instruction before they're taking the early diagnostic test. Mr. But we didn't have six weeks this year. I mean, we when Dr. Sax came aboard, we we did the assessments earlier. I think we were assessing late August, weren't we doing late August to maybe midepptember? Uh we I mean it we didn't have that much time in the classroom this year um like we have in the past. We we were it was still it was still significantly delayed. I thought it was in September. Yeah. It was the early part of September. The early part of September. Okay. And that was one of the issues was is that we wanted to be able to start the diagnostics like the first week but we couldn't do that. But

060the thing but the the anticipation would be then then we should see Rose by the time we get to our middle of the year and our end of the year. And just like I always remind you guys at the beginning, it's okay to see the yellow at the beginning. You know, I was going to say I think we're actually going to get a little bit better accuracy with the testing being done in that first week or two of school. Um, as as far as growth that we'll see over the course of the year versus, you know, five, six weeks in. There's a report also that already been run for us, which I just discovered this in the last couple weeks is that the summer slide report. So they'll they'll use the end of the year

061this this year and then they'll take that beginning of the year and then they'll actually tell us which kids slid the most and and why and then they can project like you know extra support that they might need. I just wanted to say one thing. I feel overall that we're using data in a way that as even as a teacher being in this county for 30 years no one's ever presented data. I'm going to give you a success story without using names. There's a principal that had a teacher that said take a look at your data. And last year this teacher which was a wellloved appreciated teacher and certified but said this is unacceptable and this teacher is is good. Am I working hard at the wrong thing? And said I will do better job

062for you next year and knocked the test out of the park this year because did a better job of focusing on instruction. Still a love teacher said I'm going to spend more time focusing on exactly what I'm asking my kids to do. and did a phenomenal job this year compared to last year by just having that conversation. Now I hope that happens more and more and it also shows us where we Dr. Saxs say we have academic specialists where we can then strategically place people to support teachers that maybe might you know maybe will help with the curriculum might be a new person might be somebody who's on the off track where they're there to support and it gives us more of a focus whenever we have these individuals. So that's some of the conversations

063that I've had with some principles during evaluation meetings and looking at their data that they brought with them of where they're strategically going to need extra support in their school. But Mr. Murphy ju since I gave our history together but if you were asking just one question I think I I said it earlier in my my my information this the sense of urgency there's been a sense of urgency that's created about around the data and about where we what we need to do to for our students to improve and to to gain those that that outcome for our students and and being very focused on our students and where our students are and differentiating what our students need. our principles with us. We had the monitoring report weekly for the 8 6 through uh 11

064and then weekly and then we had the weekly report for um our grades three through five and then north. But I feel like that that report that information that added a layer of that um urgency and monitoring and accountability. U two questions for you. One, uh the board looks at the at graduation. We look at the list of students and all the Latin words talking about what they've accomplished. I think that requirement should have a performance standard from their their SAT scores whatever the 1600 perfect I think there should be some relationship of what they scored on that test to qualify for that type that goes by strictly that's strictly GPA but we could certainly come up with something for the assessment I I know you'd have to tell your freshman. It's be unfair to

065tell a senior safer, well, we're changing the rules on you in your senior year. Uh, but I mean, I I would consider that. I think I think in order to have a a correlation because of the between SAT and actual grades is we would have to look at some sort of a policy, I think. that at a certain in a certain course the SAT would count for a certain proportion of the grade. Now, that that would only have a a small impact on a student's GPA unless you were to take a a a much more um comprehensive look and change to the grading system at in high school altogether. So for example, you would move more toward a standardsbased grading than a performance-based grading system where the it takes a little bit of the arbitrary

066nature out. The other thing is is um end of course exams. So, and of course exams, you know, for your core, for example, that are district created, not teacher created. And those district exams are based upon again the standards that that are should be taught for English 9, English 10, English 11, English 12. And then again, a proportion of the grade in all of those classes has to be based upon the end of course exam. that I think changes a mindset for more accountability for students and greater assessment of the standards that are being taught. And it and again I think that the magic is is that well I shouldn't say it's magic the um quality control of it is that it's a district level pre assessment that all ninth graders would take for example

067or all 10th graders would take and it would not be created at the school level because again you know the depth of questioning and the type of uh questions aligned to what standards. So, um I think that that would be the way that we would have to move into that into that to make what I think the real concern is is that we have great inflation at the high school. Um and that and it puts more uh puts more skin in the game, so to speak, for students taking the SAT. Um and uh and so I think that would really that's it that would take some time um and uh and work, but it would require some board approval. I think on certain certain policies to in order to do that, but we could definitely

068I think we could definitely start thinking about how to accomplish that. Well, I think it's mindboggling for this board and I hope that I'm not speaking out of term but when we see uh at graduations the magnet and and the um the number of students and then we sit down here and look at this and I know it's GPA versus this but there is a correlation there somewhere. There's something not right here. It's just mindboggling. It's not just the fact that we're testing every kid. It's not just that. And I and I I and I I think it goes back to that. Are we grading according to the standard or are we grading according to another method and we'll just I I I'm not necessarily going to say that it's the same one that every

069single teacher uses. So it's I I I have I think one thing we got also because I was noticing that too and I students that get those remember some of those students are special special needs students and so they're yes they got the they did according to what their level so that's might be why we have so many we have one we have a huge amount of special need students and so if these percent of those meet their abilities and versus gened students then maybe we'll have a few more well I think that there's though there there is though the concern of of you know and not everything you read online is true. I'm I'm going to just preface it by saying that. But when you have parents who are posting online, how did my

070child get an A and they never submitted in an assignment? Oh, yeah. Yeah. In English, right? How did they get an A? And I'm sitting there going, "Yeah, I'd love to know how they got an A, too." And, you know, and and does is that student are we floating them through high school? Are we floating them? And that's not that's not fair. you got outside ask that parent they were getting a report card called this time they turn I would say in the example they gave yeah in the example that I gave I did I did reach out to that one parent and they had been communicating and they were just flat out frust I realize that probably does happen in some cases however that's not every case but it's just a curiosity question because

071as of we're sitting there oh there's so many super good laws and magnificent laws and I don't understand and and like you said there are special needs students in there, but they are not as many when you have 399 students graduating and 380 or 300 of them are what I mentioned and the one it was it was a huge if you looked at the one at the one um program um I I I can tell you there was one program that we received from one of the high schools didn't have any mention of who who was Magna, who was Suma, who was didn't matter. Well, they know. But then there was another one that I sat there. I sat there and I opened it up and I went, "Holy cow, how how are your numbers?

072How is this? How are your feeder schools so bad in numbers?" And yet when you get into high school at the end of the end of four years, you're it it's mindboggling. It's hard. And that's this is a different subject. We're all you know how we all are. There you go. See Robin's for the red on here. Yeah. Uh which is very concerning for high school and then you we get a a program for graduation and you would think that's not right. I think that we ought to really estab what we should really do is we should establish a task force to be able to assess the the quality of grading at the high school and to make recommendations to how how we can improve and maybe even some draft some policies for us to

073review. And we could we could do this through a workshop, you know. Um I'll be honest with you, maybe you know, we had a great workshop yesterday. We did. maybe we we could, you know, form a task force to bring up some things and then do something similar. Um, but I think that, you know, this is u been something that's continued to come up. Um, and I think that we after now having this first year of data since I've been here, I think that now is the time to be able to say, "Okay, let's let's develop a a task force made up of teachers, administrators, and and maybe um, you know, obviously some some experts and to really take a hard look at it, say, how can we improve this so that our our students

074are challenged that um that there is a metric that a uniform metric across at least the core um at the high school level of of grading. Um and that uh it we attempt to make make sure it's more reflective of our true performance on our state assessment. Um and whether that be through into course exams or changing the way that we do that then then I think we can do something in that regard. And exactly how exactly how is the teacher determining the grade they're getting? I mean that's a It's different. I will promise you it's different. We all different in some in some classes it should be different math versus exactly correct. But there should be a standard between all math classes. And I think right now there is I'm saying for English art

075and things like moreive classes. But I think that there is some I think if you go into two different English classes, you're gonna get two different grades and you've submitted the same paper for the same subject for the same that that's what I think we're talking about. There needs to be the standard across the board that nth grade English. It doesn't matter if you're in Hedgesville High School or or Springville or Musleman, wherever you and sorry I didn't I didn't mean to leave Martsburg out. Um you know, we we need to have that standard. We we need to have something that that teachers foundationally can fall back to. I mean I I think there are some teachers are probably sitting there going probably screaming going yes we need this because there is no if they

076didn't have any expectations for them on on teaching. Do I do we know if there's any expectations on how they grade? Well, there's a grading scale, but that's for elementary, is there? Why don't we Why are we No, we do, but we So, and you know, our grading scale um is, you know, uh it's a percentage base. So, if you have a a 92, you know, then that means that you're getting is everybody still 90 to 100? So, 90 to 100 is an A. 80 to 90 80 to 89 is a B. And but the metrics in which a teacher uses to to say, "Okay, here's how you earn your 92, the group, you know, um you know, they in their grade book, they may have a I hate I hate participation uh grades, but

077they may do one on participation. They may do one on a on a team group activity. They may do one on lesson assignments that have been submitted. They may do one on on tests." And so when you have 20 different grades, then that's how that grade is calculated. But then in the neighboring classroom, that teacher's grading system may be much different. Uh maybe it's 50% participation, 20% homework, you know, and so there's no uniformity. Yeah. Now, at the elementary level, at the primary level, we do have stand standardsbased grading, but I would say that that even needs some work because one of the things that I've been able to flesh out is that how some schools um provide feedback on those standards. Um they some schools are assessing these standards at certain times and these

078at different times. Um, Lewis could probably speak more more in depth on that one, but I I think our grading system districtwide could probably use a good just reflection. We have a middle school that actually did that this year. Um, and change the the waiting of grades. That was that was at middle and it showed in his scores. Yeah, the scores jumped up incredibly, but he he was seeing the same thing, the grades versus the the GSA scores, and he got a little push back at first, but in the end, it was proven. Mhm. And if you if the test was way, let's say the all tests were weighed at 50%. any test you take was 50% of your overall grade um and you uh failed that test, you had to go in and get

079that those standards retaught and then you were allowed to retake the test because the whole the bottom line is you want the kid to to get yeah to master the standard. So it it took it took time from the teacher, it took time from the student, they had to they had to adjust to that. But overall for a first year trying that I was going to say at the end of the day. Wow that's great. Yeah. I wonder I'd love that. Our last question page or slide 10. Okay. First will continue to use next year. Okay. Well, that's the short answer is no, but it's also pending board approval on Monday. The recommendation is not to use that feedback in the middle of the year. you all so many things coming at on this testing

080I sometimes get over and this is what I'm this is what my point is here but Randy yeah it's point I'm just Could you blow it up please on this computer I'm sorry that's all right well I'm I'm just looking at it got it we're sitting there looking and this column is is labeled two or more grade levels below. And we're seeing the third. We're seeing improvement. The numbers are going down um from the beginning of the year to the end of the year. But you still have that some of those number they're all I'm saying close to or at 70% of the kids are soups. Excuse me. our students are two or more years later in math there and and I mean and then then a lot of these a lot of our students

081who go off to college have to pay for a nonacredited class for remediation. Yes. And we have the results right here. And I I think we don't even need to think inside or outside the box. We need to get rid of the box we're using and start doing something else. And I've suggested hire people who have a math background, who are retired, they have no experience teaching, and let's try doing something because what we're doing here is 70% of the kids are well and I understand absolutely and I totally agree. I think that what we have been doing is is clearly um uh not working. Um but I think if we think about the challenges that we've had with literacy and ELA, the same conversations we had, you know, over the past day, um we

082we've had an implementation problem, too. um we've had an implementation problem of of not just the resources that we have provided but I also think the expectation that we are teaching grade level content and we we continue to go back to where we're teaching to the lowest students and what happens is is then our students are never receiving grade level content and so um I know that you know you know that we had skills you you the past two days, but what you may not be aware of is that we've also had 50 teachers enrolled in content mathmies for middle school. Um, and these are very specific contentmies that are focusing on very specific skills that we continue to be deficient in. that is really holding our students back, a majority of the students, 70%

083of the students from being able to um acquire those next level skills that's going to to help this. So I I think that part of it has been also making sure that as we have for lack of a a better term either dug into the data or not dug in the data, we've not done anything with it that has been used to strategically improve classroom instruction and that's what we're trying to change now with the structures and the supports that we're putting in place. And then Dr. Woods, you had I'm sorry. Yeah. No, I was just going to echo what Dr. Sag said. Totally. U Mr. Mur, I'll go ahead and tell you. So the conversation the team and I are going to start having principles. We're actually going to stop saying skill deficit. We're

084actually going to start saying standards, a standard deficit. And what I mean by that is we want them to say like, okay, you've told me the skill, but what are the standards like Dr. Sax is saying that's in that skill? Because when we hone hone in on those standards, that's when we can really now start capturing those kids. Because if we keep saying like we have a skill deficit, well then what are those standards that are in there? What should the fourth, fifth, sixth, and seventh grade teachers all be working towards when they know they're getting back coming up and they know I'm two or three grade levels behind? What is that same standard that's in all these skills like Dr. Bax is saying? Like how do we really start honing in on that? So

085that's some of the conversations that we're going to start digging deep with the principles in July and then those are the conversations we expect them to leave with their uh teachers for the school year. you, but even with the middle school approach, you have to have the intermediate primary schools. And that was one of my other questions that I you you have to have the the children, the students coming prepared for whatever metal inter you can't you can't go back and say, well, we're going to focus on the middle school if the students don't know their multiplication facts or addition and subtraction. I can remember students learning their multiplication facts in my classroom. They still when they did their multiplication problem, they're still adding the columns of numbers or subtracting when they were doing the

086division and because they, you know, they they just keep the approach that um I think too you need to move beyond the number and put the faces on the data. Who are these kids that are in the red? start making sure we're identifying these kids and knowing who they are. It's so that we can provide the interventions to provide the differentation. So I think that it's you got to take it away from just being a number. We have to make it personal and identify these kids and know who these kids are. But when I look at the numbers there I I think I'm reading this right. I'm looking looking at the ninth grade and I see there that we have at the at the third test on the third test we had 5% of the

087students were on grade level 9% were one year be one and then 68% 68% so that's not just special ed kids are 68% that's the regular students who are in that two years or more and I I don't I absolutely hate when people do this so not not what you're doing, what I'm getting ready to do. I hate when people do what I'm getting ready to do, but I will also say this is Il and I promise you our high schools and they did a better job throughout the year because we try to, but Holly, Mr. Clinton will probably back me on this our our administration, they when we were starting to say, hey, look, your usage is not where it should be. we started pushing back and what but one of the things that

088they pushed back on is is that is not aligned to the SAT. L is not aligned to the SAT. So the question is why are we doing right and so I I think that there was a lack of ownership in the resource. So this is just data. we were putting more more focus on um the PSAT and using Con Academy and those sort of things. And so I I'm not trying to use this as an excuse. I just want to put it in context that some of these are are these scores are not going to be I think as high level because again the value and the um importance of doing your best on this was definitely not there. At least that's my opinion. That could be wrong. I think we have a perfect storm.

089Quite honestly, if I'm listening to everybody's conversation here, there's issues of standard. There's in issues of implementation. There's issues with LL diagnostic testing and the actual usage of it. Like there's several different things here and it's coming to bear on 68% for 9th grade that is two or more grade levels below. I so I I I would echo back to what we heard yesterday where literacy is not just in ELA. Literacy spans across and if we're not able to help our teachers understand what h how to take this data how to drive it and and you and towards the standard that needs to be taught. There's a there could be a literacy issue there for just that aspect that we need to address. And then you start like peeling back the layer of the onions

090and and you're you're going to end up getting to a place where you'll get to the answer. You'll get to what drives for for lasting change. But I think it's a perfect storm. Kind of like it was with North. It was a perfect storm. It all happened all at one time. That's almost like what we're dealing with with the data. But but at least uh that we realize it was a perfect. That's a correct. That's a better We're getting it before we're getting it beforehand. The teachers and the administrators said the same thing. So we all got together and they have chosen this con economy goat that I think will be brought up Monday as well and they're ditching this at the high school level. So don't hate me for this don't hate me for

091this question. You said like they're not teaching to the SAT but 12%. Yeah. 15 Yeah. Yeah. met both benchmarks. So I mean it's kind of it's kind of similar. It's Yeah, that's fair. It's fair. Family. Yeah. And and and really I think that the LL I think there was less usage on a on the pract I guess the um the skill building through EXL. Um this was obviously the diagnostic, right? So it may be it may be a true reflection. I mean absolutely. I know that there was some implement I know we definitely had some implementation gaps. The teachers the teachers complain because if you did the amount of work on that they wanted you to do every week they would lose an entire class period once a week. Wow. Jeez. Yeah. But I think

092but we're but we're shifting especially at the high school to go more toward the con and coningo. Oh man. So we'll see how that how that works. But that is not on Monday's schedule. So it must be on the next one. Does does the SAT like does it break down how many like percentage of the grades behind grades below level? It does not. So just whoever that's they have a new scoring component but performance level performance bands and you can see which kids are in which performance band from one through seven. So that would be as close to breaking down and within those performance band each performance band just kind of identifies what the student knows and is able to do as they move up through the I have a question is rigor in the

093elementary levels K through five is there more rigor in those in K through five than there is in 6 through 11 because as I'm looking at this at the scores I'm looking at six the the diagnostic three and on grade level sixth grade is 19 then it jumps to 21 but then it's all downhill from there 15 5 3 2 like is there some level of rigor issue I know we've talked about that yes but like that's a ginormous deficiency from 19 to two from sixth grade down to run like that's huge am I am I No you're no you're you're spot on goes back to what Dr. Sax said. When you're when you're teaching at grade level and you're teaching at that standard, if all those all those standards build on each other. So

094if I'm always teaching that standard, I'm always at the rigor that I'm supposed to and even if I have a child who's behind by virtue, I'm I'm almost forcing that expectation on like so I'm I'm going to build I'm I'm going to have to scaffold and build them up to that. Unfortunately, if we're not doing that consistently, then you are going to see these unfortunately these these crazy dips where then you have to really start diving into the data because I think a question came up and I wanted to say it earlier. So, one thing is as I've dived into it and I did some walkthroughs before the school year went out, there were certain teachers I actually wanted to see myself to see like, okay, how does it seem like you're a little higher

095than some of your your colleagues? Every one of them when I started a conversation, the first thing they said is looking at my standards. Every single one of them when I started a conversation say, "Hey, I just want to know what you doing in class. What's going on?" Yeah, you know the standard d and I don't even think they realized that was the first thing that came out their mouth and that is something that really stuck with me because it it validates what we're seeing but it also validates some of those practices that that we need to see universally right here. Look at slide four. And when you look at slide four here, I think part of the question is u when we split the primary schools up into front and intermediar I apologize that's

096sliding. Okay. Well, I can't see but uh Rosemont right now is grades one through three. The other primary schools would be one and two, but in the past I think a lot of schools had grade three in the interf and and you had more primary schools then you had we had six intermediates. So what do we have 12 primary? back up again. Uh we had six, we had 32, you had six intermediate, six middle schools, four high schools. Half of your schools are primary schools, smaller. And then when we fit the students into the big metropolitan area of these schools with 300 plus students per grade level, we're seeing the scores drop and and and I know Rosemont has been uh lobbing or whatever. I've been talking to the principal. They want to go K5.

097They want to stay with the kids. Now you'd have to redistrict. you'd have to move out half the kids and the you'd have to cut the grade levels down and stuff like that, but I think we we had this and we had to do it. I I don't want to badmouth the administration at time, Mr. Har, because we went to full day kindergarten and we had we had to we had to reconfigure the schools. But I think we're seeing the harm that was done by doing that. when you lose the total picture of the child. We're also losing instructional time. I think when you have buses running from the intermediate school to the primary school, you're losing time and and u I think I think we need to uh try to go back to a

098pilot program to try to see what problems we have before you did a countywide. Well, I don't know that we're losing time because they all have to have their minutes. I know, but we but you you had the kids longer when you had them at the school all day. They they still got out at 3:30 and it started at 8. I think that was the old adage of one time we did start start school when we don't but now we bank time. But I just think the total focus on I think the total we thought we've been saying we thought there was something but Yeah. Yeah. We right I think you the the families got to know the the school and the school got to know the families and now uh with the change and

099I know we we're going to move third grade to the intermediate schools but I think I I believe that the total child and that nurturing that the child some people want to put the sixth grade back in rather than the middle school. Uh but I just feel that when you look at these test results, you you see the decline between the primary and the intermediate and and that those intermediate schools, the kids are too small to be in too big a school. I just believe we're losing something when you keep the schools smaller. Now, efficiency, you you can't go back to Winchester having to have two classrooms because then you won't have enough students year to year and you can plug in 25 kids. But I I definitely believe that if you look at this

100at your intermediate, you see the numbers uh you see the negativity going from primary to intermediate. And the other thing is we are so preoccupied with graduation rate that I think we're dropping the standards there trying to keep it up around 95%. I'm glad to hear us not talking about graduation rate because I I heard high school teachers tell me they were pressured to give busy work to to students just to have them graduate and they sat on their dump the whole year and didn't do anything. And they said I'm not going to do it. And you know they they had to fight back. Now they have the law on their side but a lot of them don't know that. But I just think that we should go back to K5. We should pilot it.

101See what kind of problems we have and because we're losing that those those children are getting lost in those big schools and those big grades. It used to be you could go out for the choir. Now you have to try out the require because you have so many things the kids could do for more things in smaller clusters or groups and I just believe that it's reflected here in the in the numbers and just ask administration to do it. Don't consider the source or I'm dead. Nothing to think about as far opening up new schools. Maybe that's something as they're doing that we need to have a conversation about that. What what does that look like? How what work? Because there's going to be a ton of work that would need to go into doing

102something like that. I think there's exploring needs to be done before you have to you do it or shoot it down. Well, I mean that goes back to one of the reasons why we would have liked to have wars take photo which it will be. Which it will be. Yeah. Yes, but I feel like that's a little like like if we even said that that was our pilot, that's too far off for us to do a pilot. That's really far off. We don't have we don't have an opportunity to do so anywhere else. Um I don't know how can I share something? Yes. So we actually have a special guest in the audience today. We were wondering who that was. Scott Leupold is with HPM. Um and uh I've actually worked with Scott on several

103different um uh sever in several different areas uh Florida and West Virginia. Uh but but Scott is a um a partner that looks in with his firm. They will help facilitate conversations with the community around your facilities plan. So, we just literally met uh here this afternoon with some of our our uh staff um as just sort of a kickoff to uh start a process of reflecting upon our CFP. We're in year five, but to start engaging the community and our uh teachers and our principles and our families and our businesses around here's what we've accomplished so far and you know, here's what we've said we wanted to do over the next next five years, but does it still align with where our priorities are and and part of the kickoff is also this coming

104fall as an educational futures conference that we want to invite businesses and community leaders and families and parents and kids And we want everybody to come together to tell us um sort of what in in in a nutshell what do you want Berkeley County schools to look like in the next 50 years? What what do you think it should look like from a educational perspective, from a learning perspective, from a facilities perspective and literally one of the conversations we had just a little bit ago was the con the the the challenge of do we move back toward more K5? you know, we we're investing in these these early um learningmies uh for preK. Um and you know, we have made strides to move the third grade so that all of our districts are either primary,

105intermediate based upon their because one of the struggles we've had um and and Mr. Mullen said it well is that you have some schools that they still have a third grade in. And so, but the other this other school, the third grade's out, it's at the intermediate school. And so, this third grade comes in at the intermediate school and they're bonding and they're building relationships with the school and they finish the third grade year and they go to fourth grade and all of a sudden here's this other influx of new fourth graders that were never there in the third grade. And so one of the things that we're changing with the with staffing and facility moves this coming this coming fall is is that we only do have Rosemont at this point. Um and so

106I think that we're in a really prime time to have those conversations to see what is it that the community hopes to see and also what is it they can get behind because maybe as we know we need an intermediate school um near the Valley View area. Maybe the conversation is instead of just an intermediate school, it's another K5, you know. So, I I think that uh I just want to introduce Scott real quick and let him know that's why he's here today. He's gonna be meeting with operations and instructional tomorrow. Just begin the process where he's going to start building some data and then we're going to start the process of involving the community. We're going to involve board members. This will be a very integrated process over the next probably six six to

107seven months. Well, you know, since we are going to uh the early learning centers on prek going to the centers be a great time to think about um KS because we will have definitely have much we'll have more room in the U schools because those kids are the empty classrooms that I don't know near enough but uh with a lot of redistricting but definitely something that Let's talk. Yeah. So, thank you, Mr. Murphy. I appreciate you continuing to bring that up because I think I I mean that I mean that with all sincerity because it is a very different model from what a lot of school districts have have um implemented across the country. And um so Scott, do you want to say anything while you it's efficient operationally because you're you're we've got more

108kids per grade. It just you're gonna struggle those transitions. Yeah. So, oh gosh. Give you a pop quiz. What's the ideal number of bathroom receptacles per classroom? That's right. Per classroom. Zero. Per wing. Per wing. Oh, per wing. Yeah. Recept the toilet. Eight. Number of stalls. Number stalls per curve. Oh. Oh, close. Oh, wow. Well, he wants 10. So, 7% 7%. And the first bathroom they build to my specifications, I want to add their bathroom. Oh my gosh. Okay. Mr. Martin has a question. I had a question about prek access. Um looking at the ready for reading for um you got first grade diagnostic three grade below one grade below one grade level below apparently 15% oh for first grade or for kindergarten right so it's like 30% already are when they're in first grade

109after they've been the third diagnostic. Oh, they're 30% behind. Are we looking prek? Like what are we doing prek? Have you got to look at our prek and what's the standards? What obviously the standards were what being the standard and what we're doing there? We don't really have an assessment that is correct for me if I'm wrong. We don't have an end of year assessment on prek. There are pre-K standards and um they're a little more holistic like but Lewis do you want to go ahead Louis go ahead they do ELRS which is they do that have three windows for that and so they do have that assessment and then that ELRS in kindergarten is also done but just in the at the end of the year once so in prek as three benchmarks in

110kindergarten it is done once at the end of the year I'd like Uh, I just know that it's based on their their skills or the that they should know and be able to do within that and I would have to look a little bit more deeply into it because I don't really delve into it, but I do know that it is tracking their progress on specific things. I don't know necessarily broken out like reading standards. They get the result early they're early learning readiness standards. It's like I can count one to 10. I get off if you want them to. No, I think exclusively speaking like for answering that purposes like that's one of the things where they get it globally. They get the information back globally not individual student. Okay. So after they assess,

111they don't get it back as like okay this kid is this and this. They get like an overall general information back on whether we're performing or not. Like think about yesterday like science or grading. If their first grade 30% are already a year behind, like that's a pretty good jump. Like if we tackle that, this compounding year when they progress like just sewing the seeds for the students their entire career, we start to tackle that. Well, that's how you look at that. Yeah, absolutely. Well, and that's exactly why we set that year and a half worth of growth goal is because if you're a year if you're a year behind, you're going to always be a year behind if you're only making a year's worth of growth. And so that is part of it. But

112I also think that it comes back to what we've been talking about, you know, yesterday is is that when we talk about that uh grade level instruction was was lacking uniformly across the district, that was not just for 3, four, and five. that was also for K1 and two. So, we've got to be able to do a better job of grade level instruction. And when we do that, I think you'll I I feel confident that what you're going to see is you're going to see that almost doubling of a one year behind, you're going to see that go down. Well, I also think when you can get the discipline issues of kindergarten and prek under control, you will see a difference in this. Yeah. It's hard to teach a classroom of kindergarteners when many of

113them are out of control from like an outside perspective looking in like that's looks like a very low hanging fruit if we like tackle that. Yes. And it helps you won't snowball in a sense spot on because the um I'm going to keep going back to so the standards for that you don't have that many standards. So if you think of it from that lens, like if you're, you know, kindergarten or first grade, I only have so many standards that I need to cover, but so many I need to catch you up on. If you're a high school teacher like me, you have to think about over time if this child has come to me and you know, I taught sophomores, but then I assessed you at fifth grade reading level. Well, then I'm essentially

114working with you on helping you try to read. Plus, I'm trying to help you understand world history, too. So, you like you're saying, if you catch it earlier, it really is low hanging fruit because by the time that child gets all the way up there, you just kind of compounded that kind of growth that you're trying to make up. if you if you like looking at our data like so really truly being strategic and and looking closely and I I've taught fourth grade for years but I never taught phonics. So now when we look at our data right now, way the way I already breaks it down, we know that going into third grade, a third of our kids have not mastered phonics, but when they do enter that intermediate school, we don't teach it

115at all. So we're missing them completely and we know that's the foundation of reading. So we have to change maybe some of the curriculum that we're using in order to meet their needs. Um, so again, where are we going to invest our money or resources, whatever? or we might need to look at that specifically because looking at the data that we're receiving, we know right there we've got to hit that. And we're we're going to see this compound year after year if we don't plug that hole with those third grade teachers. And I know I never taught phonics. I shouldn't say that. Marty Grove did give me some phonics books a couple of times that we had to we had to utilize years ago. I'm dating myself there. But it's not something we found during

116co that the teachers that are in the third, fourth, and fifth when those kids got to them, it wasn't something they even felt comfortable teaching. we didn't we don't have any resources to even utilize to to teach that. The other thing too is when you drill deeper into the standards as we've delved deeper in at the office base level. Um especially in our our reading K5 when we're looking at areas where we have room to grow. It's really been providing focus around the standards that focus on non-fiction text and also our standards that focus on vocabulary. And so sometimes that that helps us to build the background knowledge of students that may not come in with prior knowledge with some related content area skills and strategies. But it all really does go back in terms

117of looking at our weakness K5 in terms of vocabulary and that non-fiction text. It's really helping our teachers understand those standards and break those standards apart to help drive that instruction with those two areas because that is a weakness. KP other questions for Dr. Yeah. [Music] I don't have that many. Um that's because the the pages had the PSAT and SAT SAT school day. Um you had the part where percent test takers met benchmarks. What what do you mean by benchmark? What that means? They met they the two component the two test components the evidence based reading and writing. So they met they met their benchmark for that and then they met their benchmark what the benchmark is set by SAP as a college board for math set by them. Yeah. So they met the

118benchmark for math and reading. So they met both and then it does break it down into some other like the percent that meant no benchmarks the percent that met the evidence based reading and writing and then the percent that met that. So it does break it down a little more granularly, but that's just the overall picture in terms of what in terms of we are meeting in terms of the reason I was asking because I was passing I was wondering if there was a specific number like I see the 893 841 was the benchmark a 790 or it should be it should be at the it should be around but it has the range up there it doesn't know if this was um but on the SAT school that 400 to 800 and then So

119the 400 to 800 uh for reading and writing and then 400 to 800 for math. And so the absolute benchmark I I know it's 4 something. I can't think off the top of my head. It might be 4 something in reading and Paul you know what the I thought it was I thought it was higher than was it 480 or 520. Yeah. Yeah. I think it was 520. 520 because I think it's actually higher than promise. Yeah. So I know that you told us one time in the middle is 510 and 510 and I swear it's higher. It's higher. I think it I think it is hard. I can get that information. So, just just re email me so I can send that to you. Anything if you want any additional information, any additional data,

120just email me so I know what you're requesting and I can do my best to get it to you. That's what I'm going to do. I'm like, okay, 15% for them. 15 15% of my go. What was it? Because honestly, and there there's a chart like if you go on the West Virginia Department of Ed website for for SAT school day, it'll show you what the benchmarks are college board. It'll show you what the West Virginia state benchmarks are and then it will show you what the promise benchmarks are. So when you're looking at that SAT data and depending on what purpose you're looking for, there are three different levels just depending the teachers were commenting on that this year that the they couldn't believe the promise was less than than he that never happened.

121Okay. Um another one um page 19 for example I know in many of them um where we have the school years and then we go third fourth fifth sixth seventh eighth etc. Um why do we tend to not use the cohorts but we use yearbyear for example um 23 24 went from third grade went from 41.12 to 42.07 07 and we say the game was 0.95 but in actuality um it was 41.12 to 42.49 42.59 for those same students. just honestly it's just been there there is no there is no specific reason other than we're just we are trying to provide um for that grade level to change because a lot of times um you're going to you're going to be assessed by third fourth and fifth for your elementary actual schoolwide grade sixth seventh

122and eighth even though those students have have transcended. So, but at the same token, it doesn't mean that if the board would prefer to see it a different way, we can absolutely provide it. Well, not that I want to see it a different way. I would just like it the focus to be more on those same students because if we focus so much on third, oh, wow, that looks great. But it's maybe not that great how we may be failing those same students. I think I think there's two ways we can look look at it. I think I think I would love to see both. I'd love to see the cohorts, but I think something I got a different perspective yesterday from um one of the administrators um Miss Ferguson that was in our group.

123um she was looking at it from the perspective of um you know for her her school she's like okay well I can look at third grade and if I'm going across I'm going okay now I can see that third grade they're understanding how to implement the standards more because now I'm seeing there's there's massive growth here than maybe what there was the previous year. Um that's that was her take on from from that that little third grade level straight across the board. I I didn't understand that completely until I heard her say it and you might have said it. So, I apologize. It took it took maybe different words, something or maybe I'm just now starting to really understand because that's what happens. Um, and now I'm able to swallow that piece and I'm like,

124"Oh, okay. I can understand where from her perspective she's looking at it going, okay, my third grade teachers got it. My fourth grade teachers are starting to get it." You know, that from that perspective. But I I do understand from Mr. Wright's perspective. I'm looking at it from cohorts and I'm I'm drawing arrows. I know Dr. Woods had already done the same thing with his worksheet um yesterday before we went into our group. So, I mean, it's just it's one of those things where I think there's there's benefits to both sides. Yeah. Yeah. We can definitely do that. I think the No, I'm not I can do the error, but I mean we could add it up. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Any other questions? I just because I want to go back. That's what I do.

125You know, I'll look at I'll say, "Okay, well, here was the grade level." But I immediately go back over to to that to the diagonal and I'm like okay well that you know from I'm sorry from third grade to let's see here like from sixth grade to 7th grade they went from you know 40.6 to 42.3. So that's you know two two percentage points. Well okay how that how did that and sometimes it looks better you know sometimes it does sometimes it does look better. Yes. Excuse me. Yeah. And I think it gives a in my opinion when I'm looking at this I think it gives a good clear impression when we're looking at from the cohort's perspective because It's consistently the same learners. I think we need to look at it both ways so

126that perspective of exactly what I like I like I liked hearing what said yesterday. So kudos to her. staff. Uh will we have any schools added to what they call the list watch list or something? We don't know until um I think October is when the state will release those. So, and that's when they take all of the scores with all the schools in the state and then they'll look at the bottom 5%. Well, there's that's for the priority schools. I'm not sure what the on the title they look at all the title one schools and rank for title one schools they take. Correct. But I don't know what the there's priority and then there's the comprehensive support. I'm not sure what the metric is for comprehensive support or any of our existing schools you

127think. I think I would be surprised if Winchester doesn't come off. Um I don't know about Orchard View or North or South. Yeah. But South M South Yeah. They are and that was the state gives you a goal and so if the school doesn't reach the goal they're they're given the red score actually yet their score may be higher than all the other schools schools in that category like intermediate or middle school and and I just thought that some people get a red score but yet they're the high they're performing at the highest level. Well, it depends on what they're on the original. It could be it could be different subgroups. It could be their special education. It could be their adult subgroups. So, it could offer special special education, but I was just looking

128at the general assessment scores and some schools had high scores, but they had a red box up there because they didn't reach the state's goal. Oh, they did. Yeah, they didn't reach. Oh, they didn't reach the target. And it was just red because we put red there, by the way. It was just saying this this is lower than a green that met the target. So, that was a that color coding was on our side. That was a Brooklyn County. Okay. This I just felt sorry for the principles that you know they were maintaining or gaining but they didn't reach their same target. Well, and here and here is the thing is that one of the things that is really important is that if you if you have a I don't want to say high performing,

129but you have a a um adequate performing uh school and you have a let's say uh demographic of of student population that has less students of of of poverty or or or certain subgroups. one of the ch and so let's say let's say you are at 50 or 60 70% deficient we don't want you to let up and relax because you're like oh we're we're we're high performing and so when you don't meet that metric we want you to just be aware of it and um so I do I hear what you're saying and I I apologize I actually want to stand corrected Winchester Avenue is absolutely off of the list um but I learned that the reason they're off the list is that they've lost their funding for next here because they're not going

130to have third. Yes. And so the federal government doesn't allow you to be served when the metric by which you were used to be identified is no longer there. I had no idea that was the case because we were hoping to have that have that funding and to be able to continue that work for that school. But I think you'll find that they earned it. No, they did. They absolutely I mean they had they earned 35% proficiency. It's not better based off the numbers that we saw recently. Yes. are better than prepandemic. So any other questions for Dr. Holly Lewis motion to so move second favor. [Music] Thank you.