001foreign education today is Monday April 12th it is 3 o'clock P.M and we are in hearing room 229 this meeting including the audio and video of remote participants is being streamed live on YouTube you'll find links to viewing options for all Senate meetings on the live and On Demand video page at the legislature's website this Zone meeting and YouTube live stream event will include the three o'clock cam agenda for the committee on education in the unlikely event that we must abruptly end this hearing due to Major technical difficulties the committee will reconvene to discuss any outstanding business on Monday April 12 2023 at four o'clock P.M in this room 229 and a public notice will be posted on the legislature's website I'd like to take this time to remind our testifiers that due to time
002restrictions on our hearings we will be limiting testimony to one minute per testifier per bill for people participating remotely please remain muted and video disabled until shortly before it is your turn to testify when I call your name unmute yourself and your time will begin after your minute is completed staff will mute you so that we can move this hearing along in an orderly and efficient manner thank you okay first on our agenda is GM 552 submitting for consideration and Confirmation to the school facilities Authority gubernatorial nominee Lindsay ball who I turned to expire 6 30 2024. let's see Lindsay here I am sorry please thank you good afternoon Do you have a something you'd like to say or just want us to ask you questions and well you can ask me questions but uh
003I'd like to hear a little bit about this yeah so again I'm Lindsay ball I uh was asked to do an interim position uh last year about this time one of the big reasons I would like to do it and have been doing it because my passion for education I know we need to do a better job of reaching out and finding and locating kids and putting them in preschools at an early age but the other one is I'm really passionate about improving the housing for our teachers because the areas that I oversaw as an educator or as a superintendent teacher housing is a real issue we lost teacher teacher applicants they would accept jobs but then try to find housing specifically in Hana and on Lanai and not be able to find housing and
004even the house we have on OluKai has been negative collected it'd be nice to make it so teachers want to live in those facilities that we have the same is true on on Lanai and some of the housing that we had on online for teachers it was refurbished by by students so but that's that's probably not the right thing we should be doing I mean housing so teachers want to be there and they can accept jobs when they've been offered jobs and those remote locations thank you Lindsay um so your background is you have you have been currently temporarily on the school facilities agency since June of last year 2022. correct right okay are you still employed with the deal it says currently a chance for the Honolulu no sorry I'm not I've been retired
005for almost two years I do some work with them I Mentor new principles and uh a little bit of work with our Alternative Learning programs okay so you retired to win June 2021 [Music] thank you for that and members questions thank you before before serving and your willingness to continue to serve you talked about housing and I think we all agree that housing is certainly a concern and um can be a obstacle for people or teachers but the amount of housing that we need just mentioning [Music] do you think that we have a state has a resources and the funding to be able to provide housing for all of the areas of the state that lacks teacher housing want to know if you have the funding to reach out to all the locations but I
006think there needs to be so it would be nice if there is consideration from for those remote locations that are more isolated that they don't have the option to drive um two hours for housing like to get to Haiku or or Central Maui or Lanai they're just simply nothing available if you don't you've got to live there if you're going to teach you can't take the ferry in every day um so no the answer is probably not we need to do something and and find ways and different methods to to increase the housing so we can recruit and retain the teachers I mean right now we we're losing teachers right so is that is this something that the sfas should be taking the lead on and that's something that you'll be looking into I think
007we work collaboratively I don't know about taking the league but I think that's part of what we can do yes well what things have you been undertaking during the time that you've already been serving with SFA so we just had a meeting recently with a department of land natural resources about um working on getting some land so we could build teacher houses on campus or right off campus at Hana school and we started looking into this this is before retire we had a partnership I don't know if that partnership is still there but to build those houses we've we've had good Partnerships in LA in Hana um also been a part of trying to increase the number of classroom facilities and spaces for preschool kids to attend and get started and what what's your goal
008at the end of your term other than trying to find housing well I think the big one is increasing the number of classrooms and spaces of facilities for Quality preschool for three and four year olds I think that's so that's a priority you know I I support providing preschools early kindergarten but the costs for that is huge and already education takes up a huge portion of our budget and um it's mandatory that we provide Public public education from 1 1 through 12 but it's usually K-12 to add on three years four-year-olds I think is is something but where do you think that we're going to be able to get the funding to do that that will sustain us providing that kind of three-year-old four-year-old preschools across the board why I mean that's a hard question
009you're asking me as an individual um sitting on a board if if if if the board is going to have that authority to um find financial resources and funding um I guess and that would have to be up to us to figure out how to do that but I I don't know that that's really art as a board or a responsibility to find all the funds to uh get every child in preschool preschool age to get into school I understand I'm not asking you the responsibility to get the funds but I think it's everybody's concern as to how do we fund all of these Services because the money gotta come from something I agree right I mean and so the question becomes where does it come from and in most cases I I imagine it's
010got to come from K-12 because you're going to take it from Universe away I'm going to take it from the seniors and you're going to take it from Human Services are you going to take it for you know so it's got to come from somebody which it looks like it's going to come from K-12 and I think the public needs to understand while it's so meritorious that we we want to do all of that at some point something has to give and uh if parents are aware and people are aware that it's going to come from K-12 and that they might not get some of the services that they have now or that will sustain us because if we go forward and times get bad and we're going to try to cut off some of
011the services that people feel entitled to because once you give something you cannot take it away and so I'm just like getting trying to get people to understand that these are all good services that we striving to do but at some point how do we sustain this and where would that funding come and if the funding comes from K-12 if that's the area that's going to have to cut back is that what people really want and I just think that these are things that we should be thinking about yeah I don't know if I have that exact answer if that's what people want I don't know if if we need to scale back then obviously uh we would look at what needs to be looked at do we bring in three-year-olds did we just stay
012with four-year-olds and the five-year-olds but when you you know what prompted me to ask you this because that's what it goes for the future you said you know providing the facilities and classrooms for three and four years and we provide the classrooms but it's not just the classrooms are we going to be able to get teachers I agree the funding to get you know Health nurses because it's no longer just a teacher in a classroom there's so much more of that parents want schools to provide unlike before in the past now they have to be nurses School aides they have to do medication there's so many things that teachers are required to do and so I have come to the conclusion that it's not just teacher housing or care it's like my team my sister's
013a teacher on the mainland it's like all the things that they have to do is also part of and I don't think that conversation takes place it's part of why it's very difficult to get teachers yeah 100 yeah I I agree with you and I I know that firsthand it's hard to get teachers because I went out personally recruited teachers and we still have um a large gap in certified teachers in our classrooms and the same thing is true yes we can possibly have facilities ready for preschool kids but we still have to have teacher and an educational assistant in those classrooms as well yeah and then we have to deal with it and those are the unintended consequences that we don't often times look into the office but thank you thank you for the
014questions sure [Music] thank you chair um you've been involved in the system here in the state for quite some time and being a cast that also brings a perspective from and then serving on the school facility Authority from your perspective of working with teachers the system the facilities give me the top two or top three priorities coming from the facilities perspective that what you think you could contribute to move the needle for the whole educational process well I think the board of being a part of the board um trying to move the needle I think the priorities that I my understanding is when I joined the board was one preschool getting preschools up and running um having the facilities ready for preschools and teacher housing so the two things that I've been introduced to and
015have been working on and being a part of meetings and they have those collaborative conversations and how to improve those things and neither one or easy so but that's been our task for the task that I've been shared since my time on that board okay and I get it from the time on the board but from when you were actually within the system do you agree with those priorities I do I think our we need exposure our kids need exposure to education um and some of our families as you know are disadvantaged and those are kids we really need to reach out to and make sure that we get those kids and touch points with kids so they can come to a preschool and have adequate facilities to be taught in um honestly in the
016areas that I taught or taught it excuse me that I oversaw some of those facilities are have been pretty neglected um but again I'm not sure if that's the school facility's Authority and to work with the Department of Education and getting some of those facilities upgraded um I think you'd be surprised some of the things you saw at some of our campuses as far as um how old they are and how neglected they've been but that's a that's a whole nother subject I think okay and teach your attention talked about housing um when you were a Cavs what do you think would have been the best thing you could do for Teacher retention because I know we get them and then we lose them pretty quickly from that sitting in that chair what would have
017been the best thing you could have done for Teacher retention so some of the things that we did do that helped our teacher retention um was having a program that was cultural based that gave them a sense of place where they're teaching so they understood where their students and their families came from um and that that definitely helped us the other thing that helped us is that we literally went out and recruited for our schools versus the state you know the state doesn't like a job they go out but we would go intentional places to recruit um we actually recruited to places like South Dakota why did go to South Dakota well a couple reasons one their pay was worse than ours but more importantly we went there because they understood remote rural Hunting Fishing
018those types of things and we had good success with that so um but doing the cultural piece was really important for us and so that helped us retain and we did it not just for the new teachers to retain a bit the teachers ever have been there as well again then from the facility standpoint housing is this is a recurrent theme comes up it's not just education it's across the state so um do you see like teacher cottages specifically dedicated him from Big Island and we have lands that belong to the school it's right there it could be available for developing do you see that as something because I'm thinking it's or federal money that may be able to tap in to get some of this done is that something I would think that would
019be impossible and I think it depends on different areas I mean again my experiences with Rural and remote locations and so our some of our schools were similar to what you're talking about again I'll go back to Hana because Hannah's got a lot of land on the um state land for the school and so there is property and land that we talked about putting teacher housing on um there is teacher housing on Lanai right next to campus but it's totally neglected um Hannah's got what they call the long house um it's only a 50 capacity because it's so neglected the roof leaks so bad that you can't house anybody there Molokai the same thing you've got some Cottages over there but they're neglected so it's not that we have to build new but it's like
020we have to maintain and take care of what we have to show the respect of the teachers that that should be living in there and unfortunately when we when we treat teachers like that you know that it's still not a priority why stay yeah okay and I appreciate what you're saying because I have koala because yeah um and so we have regions that are similar so I appreciate that thank you chair thank you you brought up a really good point about the school facilities deteriorating our you know we both graduated from Farrington High School and some of those buildings are falling apart we we went there and they weren't in that good condition and they're still there um but that brings up another point because it's like okay what do I pre-prioritize so I would
021be interested in hearing your priorities as far as fix the current school facilities for your current students build new facilities for preschool Early Education do student teacher housing do teacher housing or in repair what we have so how would your priorities what's your priorities be if we had to pick you know I put in an order we'll need to clarify it I don't know if we need to build new facilities for all the preschools there's things that can probably be recaptured some of those for the first elections yes yes but I'm just saying because there's only so much funding right I mean so and I always feel that we need to take care of our foundation before we start going up because then we let the foundation go so yeah so there's a process with
022the doe about prioritizing and that rests with the principals and and the facilities people so they make those decisions but but unfortunately sometimes because it takes so long to get that list and the tank the things on that list that you know a year from now something else pops up and that that takes its place and so I think those those things have to be in conversations not just by Lindsey Ball but others about what those priorities are and how we attack those priorities uh do you know that the doe has over a billion dollars worth of CIP that has been on the books for years I I do and then there's another billion that's ready to to lapse because they haven't encumbered it I mean so you know we talk about the funding and
023and the priorities again it makes you wonder the money is there they've encumbered it but they've not five six years the Project's not completed I mean what do we do how do we I mean it's not necessarily New York but that's all of our problem right yes as going forward the other area is that we put in and you're going to see with this year's budget we've got you know millions of dollars going into CIP but do we see any money for the upkeep and repairing maintenance you know we build these facilities and we don't put in building monies for repairing maintenance and so now there's a backlog of repair and maintenance as these buildings age there's no funding for it and I and I yes I do understand that that but that's a loaded
024question yes answer in front of all these people so well I think part of it is you know making people aware because everybody seems to be a very narrow Vision or inside of those things we just need more housing oh we just need more early Ed we take pictures because some something suffers right right there's got to be priorities and then when you find out there's billion dollars on the books that the buildings and the things are being taken care of then something's wrong with that picture and I don't know if we keep throwing more money we're going to give millions of dollars more for CIP to to education and they've got over a billion dollars that's sitting there and another billion that's gonna last and we're still gonna give them new money this year
025well I'm sure that SFA would love to get their hands it is separate but but they can also speak up and go to the Board of Ed and make these things happen so I just hope that's something that you guys and that is a good point Senator and I I just made a note to myself to to see um if there can be some conversation between us if they and the Board of Education and possibly doe it's at some point to try and see if we can uh take some of the CIP you know um I think that would be a great idea to give it back to our Wham budget and then you know redo it again or something I mean we know it's there we know some of the housing needs on the
026neighbor Islands but right now that has not been the focus and this is uh you know under sfa's Authority as to where we are going to put those uh classrooms or buildings or teacher housing and while we have a few on this island of schools that you know would not mind having the housing there on their campus because they have the the land to do it it's it's still something that needs to be looked at for um plan for all of the state of Hawaii and yes it does take up between 22 and 25 of the state's budget to operate the daily schools and unlike the mainland schools we are proud of the only state in the Union that the counties do not support us in any way which makes it even more difficult for
027us to budget for the things that we need for our daily schools I do have testimony from the Department of Education in support of this harmony is someone here from the Department thank you um Alan did you want to testify yet within testimony only to correct my error in his previous responsibility but it doesn't detract with this small applications it was primarily in Molly parts of Maui County thank you and also written support from Harold Edwards foreign is there anyone else here wishing to testify for this nominee I will call on you but I'm going to tell you again please register you come here every meeting and you never register on Angela you're and you're here all day long so you could easily walk into the office Aloha chair Vice chair and the committee actually
028I registered for the next testimony but that I didn't know I was gonna that survive with this oh I heard that before just okay okay I'm holding you to one minute I would testify I won't send in the testimony right after um so um because of Mr Lindsay's testimony I um will show support for the nominee and um you know SFA is responsible for all public school development planning and construction related to Capital Improvement projects assigned by the legislature executive branch or the board and there was a recent measure about the Maui housing pilot program um to have appropriate infrastructure to develop the housing um and it looks like the measure was redrafted a few times because of the concerns about the administering of the pilot program because SFA does not have the statutory authority
029to administer um the housing program so um going forward I'd like to just point out that there could be some um work to do um so that the either there can be statutory requirements to authorize SFA as the entity to administer the pilot program or maybe some other logistical flexibility thank you for that this this GM is in support of Lindsey ball for SFA but thank you for your testimony um is there anyone else wishing to testify thank you next on the agenda we have HCR urging the Department of Education to prioritize funding for the English learner program and public schools to address the increasing population of English learning students and this was a uh to testify Department of Education please good afternoon chair Vice chair and committee members Yvonne Humboldt director of student services
030branch and testifying today on behalf of the Department of Education the department stands on this written testimony offering comments on this measure thank you members questions of questions thank you thank you put in support Lori yes actually I do have a question sorry so part of so part of this English learner students but this program is funded through weighted student formula all of it or some of it some of it the what what portion the the way to student formula is what helps them be able to purchase teachers it's a way to students want to pay someone for the teachers that's the bulk of it is used for yes the problem that we have is is that the weight and student formula does not allow for every school to be able to purchase a teacher
031based on the student population so part of our request was to try to increase the weighted Zoom formula this year so that every school could at least purchase a part-time teacher 0.5 FTE for their El students so that they can get the sheltered design instruction they need within their content area does every school need English learner teachers every school that has a yeast up to 10 students should have a teacher and even if the 10 we have schools that if they have 20 or less students they don't have enough money to purchase a teacher okay and if they don't have the qualified teacher or a teacher that can and a lot of schools will use part-time teachers to come in to help support the Els they miss that quality obstruction that they need to understand
032in their content areas every school or do you know now if every school has or needs an English language yes not every school has this teacher every school needs it yes if they have English students yes I know that's criteria but I'm wanting to know yes if all the schools have that yes need no yes [Music] in our department the schools um I don't have the number of actual schools that need that have English Learners um obviously a majority of our um so we will have to go back and get that exact number we pulled it up about a month ago just to know exactly where we were at but it fluctuates so I can get that and give it to you yeah about that yeah with students is it 20 is it 50 is
033it 100 because the one teacher is not going to be able to turn around correct so it would be interesting to know if we have the breakdown we can do it by teacher to student ratio we can do it by the school population also for El students did you have one teacher for that school you're not going to have kids coming from from their school no they have to be at their own schools we do have teachers that need travel between some of the smaller schools if the spaces or the travel time is close enough so we do have some complexes that have used one full-time teacher and they might split between three schools like North Shore so how many students our students students you need to have before a warrant a teacher on that
034campus so um the weighted student formula is based upon the proficiency level of the English learner um so those are the lower proficiency levels do receive a higher weight and amount in addition to the base um so depending upon your student proficiency levels um that could range so it could be from around 20 students to 30 students to to be able to fund I believe a half-time teacher is six that is that is the difficulty with the current weight of student formula and and how we fund our our teacher positions I'm not sure how you measure where they are as far as English Learners go but those that are really in need and understand their English at all and if you have two of those but another school has English Learners that can speak English
035but need help and how do you how do you you know determine that provide appropriate Services right correct so how are you said it's weighted differently it is weighted differently right um so if you're interested the weight does not happen after enrollment the latest student formula isn't that correct I don't know when they do it but I would have to randomly want to answer um so the way to tune formula it's something that's determined every other year by the committee on weights so they are going to be meeting again this this actually starting May to start this is part of my language yeah crappy way to do it because the next year you could have 25 English language Learners in the year before you went ahead two yeah yeah it is I can see where
036uh yeah the way it's done is probably not appropriate for the needs it can and what the one thing too though all teachers are well the El teacher when I was a teacher at Stevenson one of the things is we were required to have um training uh English language training as well so although we're not an expert you are required at a certain base level to have the skill set to help those students are part of your classroom so your our teachers aren't without any sort of understanding but it is um you do want to have that professional there who has um the ability to look at those um they call them the Widow spores so you can see their different levels and really provide the right supports there so when we're not leaving students
037out to dry in that sense but you're right having that professional will be so what committee education would handle this issue and the Board of Education um that would actually be that determination right right yeah to the board to determine which you're asking which group on the board to determine that which committee yeah I would I would say it's probably the student um uh SRC the student gosh I'm just having a brain fart the student uh it's the sack a student achievement committee and how often do they meet as often as determined by the the sitting chair of that Community they can have um when do they meet last push the board is here I don't know I can't remember the next independent meeting yeah well my staff is writing the questions down here and
038we'll send it to the board because I think it's probably been a while thank you thank you further questions yes wow so submitted such testimony some Civic support on this resolution I'm sorry your testimonies so it says here be a result uh that the Department of Education is requested to prioritize funding for the Greenwood English learner program and public schools so how would you do that so we've actually put in for divine request in three areas that supports our English Learners and the three areas that we're looking at that's needed is one is the way to student formula so that schools can provide a teacher and that a teacher can work with um in the sheltered content area for the English Learners to increase their ability to understand to understand the academic context but if
039there's no change and the budget is already doing that so you need a resolution to grow your power I mean we need the money is what we need right in order to move it forward and in the areas we have is so we try to we we reached out for Esther funds to help support initiate some of this that we're trying to produce to support our English Learners vulnerable population we also um put in a biennial request for the three areas of teacher to increase the teachers background and qualifications and to obviously the way to student formula and then also to request a teacher for every school so that they're able to do that this resolution doesn't matter this resolution only requires asking results to prioritize it which you prioritize it in the sense that
040you're going through asking for something that's correct and it's the original friendly menu and what is the what what is your definition or interpretation of prioritize is it just asking for the positions now it's it's also trying right it's also um having to think out of the box if we don't have the money how do we increase the bishop position so that we can do family engagement so families come into us especially if they're the level ones families that don't speak English or don't have the community awareness how do we get those families enrolled how do we get a person that's there to attach to them that's a huge priority newcomers they don't have that ability so it's our responsibility to figure out how we're going to do that so we try to think very
041clearly as much as we can out of the box how do we increase with what we have we work very closely with the complex areas and the cases and how do we support their schools in that Arena when looking at um for teachers to get qualified teachers we have um I believe it's been five years now because of cobit we had the extended timeline to ask every teacher that does any instruction or planning for students to become siq which means they need 72 hours of Education or three years of college that they get that basic knowledge that Brandon was talking about so you in every class at least they know how to do the different strategies instructions for English Learners I'm just saying folks already prior ity the siq was started five years ago the
042B shots has been a while that we've been working on that to increase the capacity and the numbers of those positions and then as for the funding for the PDS we as the department have picked up everything for the teachers from anything the cost Etc prioritize that are equipped because it seems as though you're supporting this resolution as though you're not doing it sorry I would do something we don't need the resolution center we we are prioritizing as um as Dr humble is saying so yes we don't need the result to continue to do what we're doing yeah yeah for any questions around those natural did you wish to testify it thank you thank you chair Vice chair in the committee Angela Melody young testifying on behalf of cares and strong support although they said
043it's unnecessary I was part of an ESL program at my email and I was taught by representative Corrine Chang a republican member um she was my ESL teacher and then she was just volunteering during that time um and then there was another teacher and then um so two teachers and then five students yeah for first grade and then by the by like second grade everyone is already powered with the program I don't know if it got ADC dealers I think um yeah so you know the um El program supports the Department's mission to provide standards-based education through supplementary instructional and I'll I'll go through a culturation activities Services provided through the El program implement the requirements of the title fee title IV of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and its regulations and the equal
044educational opportunities Act of 1974. uh with regard to students with limited English proficiency title IV and its regulations require that students are able to meaningfully participate in and benefit from regular or special education instructional programs services for students and immigrant Children and Youth also implement the requirements of title III of the elementary and secondary education Acts title III requires El program students attain English proficiency and meet the same challenging academic standards that all students are expected to meet so that's why I'm in support thank you thank you so members I don't think we need to go into the chair is going to recommend that um for GM 552 we're getting ready the question was so members for GM 552 to advise and consent on the gubernatorial nominee Lindsay ball the chair is recommending that we
045do advise and consent on this nominee any questions any comments Vice chair for the vote okay the chair hold side press your hold size Center Canal Center Richardson shoes four recommendations for advising consent thank you thank you very much Lindsay for your willingness to serve and good luck to you that's meant in a video uh for HCR 59 urging the Department of Education to prioritize funding for English learner program in public schools to address the increasing population of English learner students and for the Department I think it would be um important for us to know which languages that you know these English language Learners are coming from I'd be interested to know that too uh chair comments okay chair is recommending that we pass as is HCR 59 any women's present voting opposition voting with
046reservation year none four members present one excuse recommendations thank you that concludes our meeting