001Thank you for joining us in this committee on public safety, intergovernmental and military affairs. Uh we have we're in room 225 on this Wednesday, February 15th. Um, this meeting is being streamed live on YouTube. In the unlikely event that we have any kind of technical difficulties, uh, we will post a notice and let you know when we will reconvene. Um, those who have, uh, indicated they want to testify, we're going to limit all testifiers, both Zoom as well as live, to two minutes. Um, and we're going to first actually take care of a decision making for a bill that we heard uh last week. And this is Senate Bill 498 relating to fireworks. U members, you may recall we had a really good hearing, but there were some issues that had to be kind of
002cleared up and uh Vice Chair Elephante did a fantastic bangup job, you could say, on this fireworks bill and we are going to pass it with these amendments. We're going to change the appropriation to general general funds for a million dollars. Um, no increase in fees. Off-site inspections must be at final container drop off location and within 24 hours or in a non-active harbor area at the director's discretion. Contraband will be under the jurisdiction of law enforcement. And we're going to add in language. Any person who tampers with secure container seals shall be sub date to July 1st, 2015. Senator Fukad, I was just mentioning the amendments to the fireworks bill that we heard last week. Yeah. The ones regarding container inspections. Members, any discussion on the suggested amendments? If not, Senator Elephant, I vote
003yes. Okay. Chair's recommendation is to pass SB 498 with amendments. Chair votes I. Vice Chair votes I. Senator Fukunaga. I. Senator McKelie is excused. Senator Owen, no. Mr. Chair, the measure passes with amendments. We're going to this public hearing and Thank you for your patience. We're convening the joint committees on public safety, intergovernmental and military affairs and our good friends from the committee on higher education. We are currently in room 225. It's about 3:00 on this February 15th. We have three items on this joint agenda. The first being Senate Bill 710 relating to incarcerated women. First on our testifier's list is Tommy Johnson from Department of Public Safety. Uh hello chair, vice chair, committee members. Um Mr. Johnson apologizes he couldn't be here today. A family matter he tend to. Um Michael Hoffman um the
004acting deputy director for corrections at this time. Um, for the sake of brevity, we'll stand on our testimony. However, we're here and if you have any questions, I have brought also our theme on education. Thank you, Mr. H. You're welcome. Candace Park from the Attorney General's office. time members of the committees just want to point out that um oh we made corrections uh we recommended corrections to the appropriation language and also if the bill is intended to authorize the university to administer grants then the you would need to include standards for those grants. Thank you Helen SE from can be ca a principal committee school for adults. We stand on our testimony as submitted and are available for questions if you have thanks for joining us. So um um Kamo Hali from the Winward Community
005College Sorry, your first name has 25 letters. I didn't want to butcher it. Welcome. 27. It's okay, good. I'm glad I did try to welcome. Um, sorry, it's my first time. I'm super nervous. Um, so chair, um, vice chancellor, chair, and members of the committee. As a representative of women community college and trio student support services at WCC, we actively support um SB710. You folks have my written statement, but I would just like to speak from my heart right now. As a former incarcerated woman at Women's Community Correctional Center, I did not have a chance to have tutors or anyone to help me with my GED. I did it all on my own and it was very hard. um with this program that they have now. I understand they were able to help a lot
006of women. I was the only one that graduated in year 2019 and they had 20 women graduate prior. So I truly submit this bill to help the women in there like myself to come out and continue um your educational career. I'm currently now u my bachelor's degree and I graduated from community college and like I said my support system was at Winward Community College. people there but women coming out it's really hard for us to trust people and to have a support system. So I do feel that if they have it inside then they can come outside and continue that together. Thank you for sharing your story. Just a reminder that we're going to limit testifiers to two minutes. Uh Dela Teroka from the University of Hawaii. Good afternoon chairs, vice chairs, and members of
007the committees. Um, so I'm representing the University of Hawaii Community Colleges. I'm the interim associate vice president for academic affairs. Um, we stand on our testimony in support of this program. Thank you for joining us. Lauren Walker from the Hawaii Friends of Restorative Justice. Aloha. Thank you for allowing me to testify. Uh, I'm testifying on behalf of Lauren Walker today of Hawaii Friends of Restorative Justice. My name is Diana Bethl, PhD. I'm an anthropologist by training and my dissertation research is on the dehumanizing impact of institutionalization and the way people counteracted its effects. I serve as coordinator of the Hawaii friends instructors who support the peer tutors in this higher and continuing education pilot project at WC. We strongly support SB710. We're an educational nonprofit that joins with community partners to develop, implement, and measure
008the outcomes of our projects. Uward Community College has been an invaluable partner in this pilot program. Our goal is to help women uh go to college and uh chart a different course in their life for themselves and their families. But one important thing to know is that it's a pilot program and it's about developing a model. And so we currently are drafting a guide book to help other correctional institutions implement the program. The reason our program is so successful, I believe, is based on a cooperative learning model of education that's interactive and though the peer and through the peer tutoring program stimulates the desire to serve and gives many of the women a sense of meaning and purpose. And this motivation to learn and help others isn't necessarily found in a traditional um model of
009education. And this is precisely why we wanted to do this project. It seems that simply duplicating the traditional model in a prison context doesn't inspire the same transform transformative lifechanging experience the way a cooperative learning model does. In any case, finding the meaning and purpose seems to be the key to feelings of empowerment and hope that may sustain the women when they encounter the challenges of re-entering society. And so we urge you to pass SB710 to keep this innovative program going for its third year of implementation. Thank you. Perfect. Thank you, Miss Bethl. Uh, Linda Rich from the Women's Prison Project. Aloha. Thank you for the opportunity to testify. Um, you have my written testimony. I just like to emphasize a couple of uh items in it. One is I want to clarify what this
010program is because it's been characterized as being a duplication of the GED testing program, which it is not. The testing has always been done by the state and will continue to be. What this program is is includes educational counseling provided by Winrook Community College, the very successful peer tutoring program you've heard about, access to college courses leading to an associate degree for Winward Community College, academic advising for women transitioning out of WOPC, and facilitation of their post incarceration enrollment in community college or the University of Hawaii. And that's what the program is. Um the results have been incredible. Um the program um in its first 10 months had 20 of its um students pass the GED while the prison averaged only two women uh a year previously. Um you know I just want to say
011that this is what rehabilitation looks like. We know that education is the pathway to better employment. It's also a pathway to learning more critical thinking, how to decision making, this is what rehabilitation looks like. And it's being successful. Um, and if we really want to have a system like we say we do that's going to be re rehabilitation, this is the kind of program that needs to be supported. So, Women's Prison Project urges you to pass this bill and to um ensure an appropriation to Winward Community College to run this program. Thank you so much. Thank you, M. Rich. Cat Brady from the Community Alliance on Prisons has submitted testimony in support of Simone Camu. So, I submitted my testimony, but I'd like to read it to you also. Says a we teach and we
012learn. My name is Simony Kamu, and I'm sharing on how this program has helped me as a person, built my confidence, and helped me further my education. I have been trying to get my GED for about 17 years. I tried books, taking classes in and out of prison, online, in-person testes, but I just couldn't get it. While incarcerated recently at WC, the Women's Community Correctional Center, I heard about a program that will have tutors helping with GEDs. I thought to myself, hey, why not? I tried everything else. So, I signed up and it was one of the best choices I've ever made. The first day, I was kind of surprised at how many other others signed up, too. I walked into this class not knowing how much this would change my life. I was a
013part of the first group of tuties. The tutors were other inmates, so it kind of made me feel comfortable to be okay with not knowing things. It's a little bit more difficult when you don't know how to you don't want to seem dumb in front of strangers, but for me, it is. That day, I also met Lauren Walker. Lauren Walker. She had a plan and a way of how the tutors would work with us, and it was definitely different. We broke into groups um to where I needed to fit in, and I got help. It was personal. My tutor didn't do judge me on how little or how much I knew. After about a month of working with my tutor, I felt I was ready to take my test. And again, I failed. But this
014time, I knew I had it in me. My my tutor broke down exactly where I was missing. And I focused on that area. Again, I tried again and I got it. I passed. The team of tutors kept cheering me on and didn't let me give up on myself when I could have. I passed with my GED within a two and a half months time of starting this program. Getting my GED opened doors for me to be a part of cohort 2. So, I became a tutor. The styles and methods of teaching and learning were working and I had the had the opportunity of helping one of my ties get her GED. That felt awesome to be able to give back what was given to me and that sparked something in me. I wanted to further
015my education and I wasn't and now I was able to do so by signing up for college classes. taking classes, getting certified, teaching, helping others, and training cohort three and four have lit a fire in me that made me feel good. My confidence was boosted. I believed in myself and others. My family was proud and everything was falling into place. I didn't want to go back to my old lifestyle and I found a way that I didn't have to. Education. Being a part of this program just didn't help me with my GED. I had a job inside. It helped me set goals, rebuild my relationship with my family through huahi circles. I left the prison with six college credits and two different certifications. Um, helped me set a foundation and helped me reintegrate into society.
016Now that I have reintegrated back into society, I'm a full-time student at Winward Community College, pursuing my degree in Hawaiian language. I'm also a Hawaiian study student assistant at Winward. My family relations are healthy. I'm clean and sober, living my best life, and this is all because of a program that believed in me. This has definitely been a life-changing experience. Mahalo Noah for taking my testimony into consideration. And lastly, I ask you to pass SP 710. Mahalo. Thank you. Thank you for sharing your story. That's all I have is individuals indicating they'd like to testify on 710. Is there anyone else that would like to join us? Please. Aloha. Akayaka chairs, vice chairs, and the committees. My name is Angela Melody Young. testifying in strong support. Um I just want to applaud the women who
017testified and their strength. Um and um I just want to say that um yeah, they're so strong. So um you know, the purpose of this act is to appropriate funds to support the counseling program for incarcerated women. Um recidivism rates of Hawaii proves the inefficiency of our criminal justice system. Incarcerated women are some of the most vulnerable and marginalized of our society and um they experience socioeconomic disparities and inaccessibility to resources and it can be addressed through legislation by creating equity in the system. Um, you know, there's been a lot of talk about transformative approaches um in the criminal justice reform system and rethinking how to address um systemic flaws. Um so instead of just um going through legal proceedings or um you know jail um there should be resources provided so that people can
018be given a fair chance to um correct their behavior and be given opportunities um and so that they can um also be positive contributors to society. Um, thank you for the opportunity to testify. Is there anyone else wishing to testify on 710? Yes. We're on this side. Okay. Good. Good. Good. Okay. So, my name is Tammy Wilcox. I'm currently an instructor and counselor at Winter Community College, but I'm not here representing the college. I'm representing myself. So I currently am with the Puhanoa program. Um I am in the prison at women's facility in Kyua approximately 22 hours a week. So I see firsthand these are my students. So it's kind of like I got choked up when not to give her speech. But um I see firsthand the difference it's making. The GED is such
019a great program. How they've put it together in clusters. how they tutors are actually prisoners themselves who are encouraging these girls that they can do it no matter what. Um, just an example, the other day I was having a class. I teach IS- 103 in there. And one girl kept pacing and pacing because she had failed her science area for like four times. And the instructor came out to give her her score. And he said, "Okay, everybody quiet." And I said, "Okay, wait. What's going on?" And he said, "We're going to say her score." She passed and she only missed one question. She almost had a perfect score. and seeing how it made a difference in her whole outlook um on life that it can give them. They're using this education path as a way
020to have this self-confidence that they were never given from parents, family, friends, or anybody else in society. So, taking it away would be so detrimental. And so, that's why I'm here just to tell you firsthand. I see it every day. It's a wonderful, wonderful program. Please keep it going for bill 710. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, T. Uh, anyone else wishing to testify on 710? Members, questions of those who have joined us. We have a question for uh, let's see, McKinley High School or Community School for adults. Helen, so Helen, you um says you support the intent. However, important to know each year Kenny school for adults department received the federal workforce right organization and opportunity. So you folks are the ones that help with the community. Correct. You guys provide counseling too. Um we
021don't provide counseling within the facility itself as the um friends the white friends for justice does but um we have other partners within the correctional facility that does the counseling. Okay. So you can work should this measure pass um you folks can work hand in hand with um correct them as far as the counseling areas in which they can assist in the G as well as other areas. Yes. Yes. Okay. The program is um I think is delivered well. We have the funding from the um federal government to support the program and that would be at no cost to the ledge. So we could partner with this nonprofit organization. In fact, we received funding from the Senate this past year, but they had requested that we um purchase staff positions, but we could not use
022DOE funds to purchase a staff position for over I think it was about 120,000. So, the monies still have not been spent. Um but it's almost we're almost there and so the monies will be transferred to the University of Hawaii. Okay. So in this bill it asks for about 225,000 and that it'll um be administered by the Hawaii friends for the school of justice. Correct. So but also administered by the University of Hawaii Woodward Community. Correct. So you're saying that you folks get federal monies, right? And you have monies to cover those costs. We have monies not for the staffing because we're already using our we we have in place. We have our vice principles. We have our secretaries. We have all of those staff members in place to manage the program and we could
023pay for their instructors. Okay. What about for the counseling? We could we could fund that also. Yeah. But we could not fund a regular staff. That's um like too much monies for us. But you said you don't need regular staff because you have that. Correct. But you can we do have transition counselors and um in fact we have them because we we handle corrections statewide. So it's on all of the islands and not only um the women's correctional facility. So on the neighbor islands we have transition counselors also. So you can do this program. I just want to make it clear. You can do this program with the funding you have but you cannot provide a permanent staff person. I'm not sure. ask um but you can provide the cost me and the programs that
024they're running through now with the funds that you we could pay. Correct. We could because we we pay our employees a PTT rate. This is aside from the regular employees that we have that are full-time employees. Oh, we're going to need some kind of memorandum of understanding to make sure that this happens. No, because currently we we pay for the staff that are at other correction facilities like our PTTs, our teachers, our tutors. We pay them. Okay. [Music] Okay. Let's see who would be the person administering this. Is it friends for um friends for restorative justice or is it Wick Community College or is it corrections? Which which of you could answer? Okay. And this is W. Okay. Good afternoon. My name is Jennifer Brown. I'm the vice chancellor for students at Winberg Community College.
025Thank you, Jennifer. I'm here in place of our chancellor who could not be today. Um So, a couple of points. Um, one, the Winward and HFRJ are not administering or paying for the GED. That's not the intent, right? So, the intent, um, PSD proctors the GED and McKinley School for adults gives the vouchers to pay for the test for students. The fact that the program supports but doesn't proctor helps in removing potential conflicts of interest. Yeah. Um, it's not just GED tutoring as it has been described through the other um, testimonies. It's more about the counseling and the life skills and the moving on, transitioning. Um, so we feel this program is really important to help with that transition out and back into society. Um, there was a piece about this being awarded as a
026a grant and we actually would go through the regular procurement processes as mandated by the state of Hawaii to do this. So, I'm not trying to award grants in competition with anybody else. Does that help? Okay. So you're saying that yes there's tutors and counseling from the adult education with the federal funds but it's not for counseling of other in other areas. My my understanding is that counseling does not occur in the facility but it can so this occurs in the facility but it can if monies are available or if um the school decides they have funding to the counseling can that happen I cannot answer that question okay um so she asked let me let me go ahead and say So I'm saying that she says counseling did not occur in the facility, right?
027As far as I understand, right? But if in fact McKinley has funds to be able to fund counsel counselors, not just in the GED but in other areas that you know for your college college prep courses or college whatever it is that you folks need. Um would that be would that work? Yes. Come, come forward. I think there's a significant difference between what they say is possible and what has been happening. Um the services that are being provided by this project have not been being provided. Um last year there was money appropriated by the legislature for this project. It went to the McKinley school and as you heard it earlier um it has still not made its way to this project. So this project continued to be funded by people just cutting corners other places
028and making donations to keep it alive. Um I there is not an equivalency between what adult education provides and what this project provides. This project provides a pathway for women not only to do the learning to get their GED, but then to engage in college courses while they are in the prison and to have a um transition a guidance of a transition then into a college program when they leave leave the prison. I I understand that um and but it's not necessarily mean that that McKinley or adult school cannot have a program like that and funding come from them but they have to we have to prescribe it. We have to be the ones to say you know this should happen. I'm just saying if that you know yeah I think um I understand what
029you're saying. I think that it would not be the same program. Um I think the cooperative learning strategies that are being implemented are not the same thing that is provided by adult education. Um so I think it would be um a very different kind of tutoring for the get period is my understanding. Yeah. So thank you. It's it's different now but nothing to say that it could be what we want it to be in the future. It also depends on how we do this. So, thank you. You're more hopeful than I am. Members, any further questions on seven? Okay. Okay. We're going to move on to the next bill. That's 71. On our testifiers list, we have Candace Park from the Attorney General's office. Good afternoon. Just want to point out that the um statewide
030concern language would be um helpful in this bill. Thank you. Michael Gou from Stonewall Caucus of the Democratic Party of Hawaii has indicated he was going to join us via Zoom. It do we have Michael? Not present on Zoom. Chair, thank you. Uh Linda Rich from the Women's Prison Project. Okay. Um, so Women's Prison Project strongly supports this um, bill, Senate Bill 711. Um, what this bill would do would be to determine what the state's level of compliance is with section 367D-1 of Hawaii Revised Statutes, which requires that incarcerated women shall be provided a range and quality of program substantially equivalent to the range and quality of program afforded to male prisoners who are similarly situated. Um to date we have no um data that no reports that verify that. Um the statute goes on
031to say that the program should specifically address the psychosocial developmental needs of women um and is not required to be identical to but substantially equivalent to the programming for men. Um this bill would have a um team of experienced researchers from the University of Hawaii study the programming actually across the system because they have to look at the men's prison programming in order to make the comparison. We believe that this would be um an incredibly valuable valuable tool um in looking at the process of transforming our whole correction system into being or um rehabilitative because it would give us solid information across the system of what programming is there, what program is needed and what program is being affected and might be duplicated in other settings. So, we urge you to make this appropriation to
032the University of Hawaii to allow this valuable data to be collected. Any questions? Thank you. You might want to sit there because you're the last to indicate you want to testify. Is there anyone else wishing to testify? Well, I'm sorry. Um, we'll have Angela speak and I'm going to call you up in a second. Um, Angela. Aloha. Payaka chair, chairs, vice chairs, and the committees. My name is Angela Melody Young testifying in strong support. Um so programs that integrate restorative justice. Um it provides um the mental health resources to develop um the um offenders or incarcerated individuals so that they can be provided things that they weren't provided to begin with. Right? So um uh I think that's very necessary because restorative justice also addresses amending harm and building positive connections um after wrongdoing. And
033so getting to the heart of the concern um the behavioral health um um concerns it will really truly transform um the system. Thank you for the opportunity to testify. Thank you Angela. Anyone else wishing to testify on 711? Members, any questions? Mitch, I understand this bill really wants to elevate services for incarcerated women. But part I don't understand is why would you make a comparison to what Hawaii's male population has a services? I mean, it's not as if Hawaii is the gold standard. No, there's a parody law and so the parody law says it um does compare the two men and women's programming. Um so beneficial we compared it to I don't know where the best prison services are across the nation but have your your services compared to that gold standard versus what the
034men are getting locally? Well, that would be effective for the women, but if you want to um elevate the entire system, it's good to know what's really happening across the entire system. So, um that's why we we have it in the way that we have it. Yeah. And um mostly, you know, our biggest concern is that we have one of the highest recidivisms rates in the country um both for women and for men. And it's just not acceptable. And so we believe that this would facilitate giving information that would lead to change not only for the women but across the board. I mean I see that this could be incremental improvement. Yeah. Shouldn't we be seeking vast improvements for women? So very we're happy to have vast improvements for women. We've been begging for that.
035So could we change the language here to have it not be compared to how men are treated in Hawaii, but whatever the gold standard is. Sure. For the way I think we could agree to that. Yeah. Yes. So, um I pretty much concur. However, I feel that Well, don't you don't you already kind of know that the women's programs are not far and we already know that there's gaps. Well, we know there's gaps across the system. Um what we don't know what we don't know is if there are things that um are being implemented in some of the men's prisons that would be beneficial for women. For example, some of the work training things that might have to do more with the trades in addition to what we have for college entrance. I understand that.
036Yeah. I'm coming from the point where you know we know that women have different needs from men. Absolutely. And if we get more programs than men, I'm all for it because women have so much more different needs. Okay, great. I'm not going to argue with that. Senator Kim, you can give us everything you want to. Are the childers are the That's right. That's right. There's so many things. So that's why I also feel that you're going to compare against you know the range and quality of what men get. I think we're shortch changing our women. We're short changing ourselves. We should identify what are the needs of our women in the prisons and we need to go after that program whether the men have it or not. Yeah, we should identify those programs and not
037try to make it comparable to what the men are getting. And if we get more, then they better come and fight us and give them equals of the women instead of the women trying to get equal to the men. Yeah. You know, there actually is a wonderful report um the uh I'm sorry. Yes, there was a a report made actually to the house um in 2019 that is a wonderful blueprint for what should be happening to uh change things um in the prison system both for women and for men. Um so one of the things that passed last year was the implement the women's um prison corrections implementation commission. Um, but I agree with you that I would love for us to look at what's the gold standard across the country and then the trick
038is then to make it happen. I think that the reason the wording is as it is is because it was based on the parody statute. But despite of what the gold standard might be across the country, you know, Hawaii is unique. Maybe it maybe might have to exceed that. We want to be in different areas. So, I really think that we need to identify what it is that the women need and then we need to go ahead and implement that. Um, I couldn't agree with you more. It it seems to be getting implemented. That's the issue. And there's less women that are incarcerated, so we can afford to spend more money on them because per per inmate what it costs to to programs for the men, they might not have it. And so, to compare
039it against that, whereas because it's a smaller number, we can provide more and and tailor it to what So, are you saying that you would like to um change the language to have it address um studying? Uh well, I don't even want it to be studied. I think we kind of know. I think if you sat down with the women, we could almost identify what are the programs, where are the gaps, and I rather take this $120,000 for more and utilize it right away to start filling in that instead of waiting for a study and then talking about the study and then trying to that's another couple years. So, what would be the vehicle for making that happen to make that funding be used to improve um programming in the women's prison? I would like
040us to put in what are some of the kinds of programs we've already started with the bill prior to this. Yes. Counseling and so forth. You know, that needs to be We could certainly give you a list. Yeah. I can't begin to say what the need, right? I think it's, you know, you can almost tell what are some of those, right? And we do have a report that was made in 2019 that outlines that. So, I don't know that we have to wait for another. Yeah. All right. Thank you. for any questions? Okay, thank you. We're going to move on to the last measure on this agenda. That is Senate Bill 712 relating to corrections. We have Tommy Johnson. Yes. Chair Wai, um Vice Chair Ricardo Kim, and members of the committee. Again, um Tommy
041Johnson apologizes. He had a family matter today. I'm here in his place. Michael Hoffman, acting deputy director for corrections at this time. Um you know, and again, for um sake of brevity, we'll we'll stand on our testimony and we're here to stand by if you have any questions. Thank you, Mr. Kristen Johnson from the Correctional System Oversight Commission. Hello, chair, vice chair, and members of the committee. My name is Kristen Johnson. I'm the oversight coordinator for the Hawaii Correctional System Oversight Commission. The commission um strongly supports this bill and stands by the written testimony. But if I can just throw in a couple additional notes, um I think it's important to highlight that um the vast majority of people who are in custody um have really horrific trauma histories and trauma can uh manifest in
042many many different ways based on the environment that they're in. And so it's really really important for officers to be aware of this, to know what to look for. Um and then just be more prepared so that if an incident does occur, you know, they can take a more therapeutic uh approach. Um and which the commission is of course all for. So I just wanted to add that little tidbit and of course I am here if there's any questions. Thank you. Delera Oka from the University of Hawaii. Good afternoon. I am Delata Okoga representing the uh community colleges and we stand in support of our with our written testimony and we can answer questions like Kamakana from UPW has submitted testimony in support. Linda Rich from the women's prison project. So, Women's Prison Project strongly
043supports um Senate Bill 12. Um and again, I referenced the uh 2019 HCR task 85 task force report um which did uh recommend that there be trauma-informed corrections uh training, trauma-informed training for all corrections officers, especially at the women's community correctional system. Um, as you've heard, there's a high prevalence of trauma among incarcerated women. Um, and one of the things we know about trauma responses, we all know about the fight orflight response. What happens when um, traumainformed education goes into the prisons and um, trains the staff to respond in a traumainformed way. Acts of aggression goes go down, self harm goes down. Um it it makes a better environment for everyone. Um in fact, I suspect that if there were truly traumainformed environments, we wouldn't have as much difficulty keeping people working there. You know,
044I think it would be a safer environment both for the inmates and for the staff who work there. It also would be a much more humane um system because women are repeatedly traumatized, retraumatized. So many of them have um histories of sexual assault and as we know we've all recently heard about the amount of sexual assault that has occurred in the women's prison. Uh um we also know that um we have some excellent ACOs and we also have some who are um harsh with the people in the prison. Yeah. So, um, we urge you to pass this bill and to ensure that trauma-informed care training is available. Thank you, Miss Rich. Christian Fern from Uba has submitted testimony in support. Lauren Walker, Hawaii, Friends of Restorative Justice. Thank you. Um I just want to mention
045a few points. Um I think it'd be important for Winward Community College to um offer the trauma trauma informed informed care certificate program. Um, it would also be important for all C ACOs to have a certain level of understanding on how to treat the people in their care who have experienced trauma. But, but the program offered um by Winward Community College would be more specialized and the ACOs would learn more and they would become a valuable resource for other ACOs. Also, it's it's important that the certificate program be voluntary. uh re research has shown that when a person engages in a voluntary program, they're motivated to learn more and are able to apply their knowledge more competently and um also the certificate program from the community college would help raise the standard of professionalism among
046the ACOs. Thank you, Diane. Well, Katherine Sani Wong might be joining us via Zoom. Yes. And I am strongly in support of SB712. Um I myself was incarcerated at the Women's Community Correctional Center for over 5 years. And you know, it's true, a lot of us women in there, we've experienced extensive trauma and we've never really talked about it. We don't really share about it. And then I myself had an experience where I was finally opening up about a situation that I had been in and firsthand this the the staff member that was there disrespected me and um put me down and blamed me for the situation that I was trying to discuss. Um, and you know, that incident already set back my not so good mental health at the time. You know, being incarcerated,
047um, not having control of my surroundings or anything has an effect on your mental health and that definitely felt like it set me back. Um, I was able to work through that, but not everybody has. And in the time that I was there at Women's, there were at least five reported suicide attempts. Two of those attempts were from the same woman and her last attempt she didn't survive and she had been through a lot of trauma and had felt like when she would ask for help the other staff and you know would kind of chalk it up to her as just being a drama queen. So, I mean, I I really believe in this because I think that if if the women's prison was more of a healing grounds, then the women we would be
048able to be rehabilitated. You know, it wouldn't take us multiple times of in and out and trying to get things right. And I think if we could get it to where it was a healing place, most of us would be able to be successful once we entered back into the community because we were able to use that time to heal from the trauma and and all the things that we had been through. So I I strongly support it. Thank you. Thank you, Katherine. Is there anyone else wishing to testify on Senate Bills 712? Aloha kayaka chairs, vice chairs, and the committees. My name is Angela Melody Young. testifying in strong support and I um I'm gonna try to I was speaking in like technical jargon so I'm gonna try to simplify what I'm trying to
049say so that there won't be any like miscommunications um because it does sound harsh when I speak it in the technical language. So um you know as we're talking about kind of like transforming the system um there previously in like the previous generation there's a lot of focus on like from just like schools and in society um about achievement and production instead of focusing on providing um resources and mental health um you know resources to people. And as the previous testifiers were saying, you know, a lot of it is because people experience um trauma and then they don't have support from mental health resources. Um so and then um things happen, right? They offend the system. Um and so there is an emphasis for nurture care um and mental health awareness because trauma is inevitable.
050um you know, domestic drama, bullying um and all these um traumas are things that people can't process on their own, but they need counseling and mental health resources um to address the um inequitable um situation. So, thank you for the opportunity to testify. Thank you, Angela. Is there someone else? Yes. Hi, my name is Sony Kam and I strongly support this and I ask that you pass this SB712. Um, I have been incarcerated in and out of prison for such a long time and I do have trauma. So, when you get hurt, you go to the doctor. So, the doctor was kind of my prison. I did something, I got hurt, I went to prison. You can't go to a doctor and get help from somebody who's a gardener. You need a doctor. So if
051in that way, if the ACOs have got training to be able to help us because it's a correctional facility, there's needs to be correction, you know, and and can't help when you don't you lack the knowledge. So I just ask that you pass this and I strongly support it. Thank you. Is there anyone else wishing to testify? 712. Yes, here again. Um, I would like to support this bill because I too have suffered trauma and in 2018 I attempted suicide which kept me back from being released into a treat that did but it didn't um necessarily help me to heal and there were some facials that was not very respectable or sensitive enough to deal with a lot of us girls that just needed um someone to talk to and shoulder to cry on. So
052I would definitely support this. Thank you. Thanks for sharing. Is there anyone else wishing to testify? members questions. Okay. Um we are going to take a brief recess prior to taking the vote. Thank you for your patience. We're reconvening the committee on public safety and intergovernmental and military affair affairs and our friends from the committee on higher education for decision- making on three bills. The first being Senate Bill 710. The chairs have confirmed and we'd like to make a number of amendments to this measure. uh taking into account the attorney general's suggestions of adding in an appropriation for funds for a grant of $225,000 for fiscal year 23 to 24 to the Hawaii friends of restorative justice for the education and re-entry program for incarcerated women. The second recommendation from the AGS was to have
053uh uh since the bill doesn't currently authorize WCC to award administrative grants, we'd like it to be amended to insert standards for those administrative grants. And also um require that the McKinley High School program work with the groups in providing counseling services. Those are the three suggested amendments. Members, any discussion? If not, Senator, I vote. Yes. Okay. Chair's recommendation is to pass SB 710 with amendments. Chair votes eye. Vice chair volts eye. Senator Fukunaga. Senator McKelby. Yes. Senator Awa. Yes. Mr. Chair, the measure passes with amendments. And for the committee on higher education, same recommendation to pass Senate Bill 710 with amendments I chair. Senate bill 710 with amendments for higher education. Chair votes I. Vice chair votes I. Senator Fukunaga I. Senator Keith Agaran. Yes. Senator Favlla I. Measures adopted. Madam Chair, thank you.
054On Senate Bill 711, um we're going to make a number of other uh amendments to this to this measure. The first is that we're not going to ask we're not going to require uh to do the study. We'd like to change that to have the Hawaii Friends of Restorative Justice and the Women's Prison Project do this comparative study. Um like to also include that this comparison include the model programs in the United States for women, not just compared to uh the boys in Hawaii. uh also indicate that the DP Department of Public Safety's proposed amendments to insert additional language regarding the comparative study as well as the AG's suggested amendments to add a statement identifying this bill as a law of statewide concern and also um asked that the the uh two two groups Hawaii
055Friends for Restorative Justice as well as the uh women's prison project we look at their HCR85 which was a task force that had numerous recommendations and uh use that as a model in which to provide some substantive recommendations to improve outcomes for women who are incarcerated. Can I make some clarifications? Sure, Mr. Chair. Um I kind of want to say that it's not so much a comparative study across the country but a to convene a group along with the women the current women incarcerated women or past cons women that have been incarcerated to come up with what are some of the programs um that is needed by the women and what are the gaps and to look at and you know we're not asking to do this scientific study across the board but to do
056something Yes. Yes. and then um and then hopefully this money can help to start it and then come back to us and then we can look at what are some of the other things that might have come out from this program uh the next session. So I think is that okay that's very clear it can also be put in the committee members any discussion on those amendments if not senator leante vote yes chair's recommendation is to pass SB 711 with amendments of the five members present from PSM are there any no votes any votes with reservations hearing none Mr. Mr. Chair, the measure passes with amendments for higher education. Same recommendations. Um, Senate Bill 712 with amendments. Chair Volai 71, I'm sorry, 7-Eleven. Lucky 7-Eleven. Senate bill 7-Eleven to pass with amendments. Chair Volzai, Vice
057Chair Bai, Senator Gaga. Hi, Senator Keith Agaran. Senator Favlla, I measures adopted. Madam Chair, on to our last bill on this agenda, Senate Bill 712 relating to corrections. The chairs have confirmed. We'd like to pass this measure that provides a certification program for trauma care for incarcerated women, but would like to make technical non-s substantive amendments to the measure. Members, any discussion? If not, Senator Alante, I vote yes. Okay. Chair's recommendation is to pass SP712 with amendments of the five members present. Are there any no votes? Any votes with reservations? Hearing not, Mr. Chair, the measure has passed with amendments. and the committee on higher education and same recommendation to pass Senate Bill 712 with technical amendments. Chair Volzai, Chair Volzai, Vice Chair Boltzai, Senator Fukanaga, Hi, Senator Kagar, Senator Favlla. Hi. Measures adopted Madam
058Chair. Thank you. Richard. Oh, aloha. We are convening our triple joint committee with the committee on energy, economic development and tourism, committee on public safety. Oh, actually I'm sorry. I'm not the lead. Sorry about that. Okay. Continuing from where he left off on the committee, uh, the three committees, public safety, intergovernmental, and military affairs. Uh, 310 hearing. We have one bill on agenda. This meeting is being streamed live on YouTube. In the unlikely event that we abruptly end this hearing, we'll reconvene on 1 p.m. on Thursday, February 16, this room 229. Uh please note that we have a one minute limit protest of fire. Uh first first off is University of Hawaii vice president in support. Okay. Don Chang, Danar. Good morning, chairs, vice chair, members of the committee, Ki Chang. On behalf of Don
059Chang, I'm chief engineer for DNR. We recognize the intent of this measure is to promote geothermal exploration development hour. We oppose this measure as written for the following reasons. We do not agree that the diversion of funds away from protecting this public trust resource which we're charged with DNR is good. We also do not agree with the cap this measure imposes on the amount of royalties that the department can collect and also that would also reduce the percentage that is given to DNR. So, as you as you know, DNR is charged with all costs for processing, negotiating, and managing geothermal leases, including the safe operations and regulating the well drilling. DNR only retains 50% of the royalties. 30% goes to the counties and 20% goes to OHA. And we did an analysis how much royalties
060we received over the last 15 years. And on the average or cumulative average basically the amount of royalties that DMR retains basically washes the amount that okay thank you uh your time is I appreciate it. Um sorry I do want to also include that higher education is part of this joint committee that we're having this afternoon. Um, uh, next up, Mark Glick, chief energy officer on Zoom. All here, present on Zoom. Chair, he's here alive and well. Alive at least. Good afternoon, Senators. Cameron Black on behalf of uh the Hawaii State Energy Office. We offer comments on this bill. We support uh funding for uh, but we share I think DNR's concerns about diverting funds from existing regulatory programs. Thank you. Thank you. Uh, next up, Office of Hawaiian Affairs with comments. Uh, County of
061Hawaii with comments. In person, Hawaii Center for Advanced Transportation and Technologies. Good afternoon, Senator. Good afternoon, chairs, vice chairs, members of the committee. David Molinro, the director for the Y Center Transportation Technologies. um standing in in support of Senate Bill 458. I'll be available answering questions. Thank you. Next up, uh Peter Sternich in support with Sustainable Energy of Hawaii. Uh and I have three others in support. Anybody in the room wishing to testify? I see none. Members, any questions? Yeah, I do have question. Senator Kim. Yes. Oh my chain. So currently you said that 50% goes to DLNR 30% to economies 20% to OHA. So under this measure, what portion would go to university innovation and commercialization initiative special fund? Basically any excess that exceeds the $1 million cap. And also I think the cap
062the county is also capped at 600,000 in this measure. So essentially anything above that would be diverted to this new special fund or not new special but the special uh fund. And how and in the past how much overage did we did we get and where did that overage go? the overage whatever royalties you receive goes into the special land development fund and it's dispersed from there to pay for the geo geothermal mineral resources program as well as many other programs within DNR. But I'm saying that if if this was in effect would the state still get the 50%. essentially we'll still get the 50% up to whatever and then so what what was left over all of that is going to support how much has been left over with the caps in it well
063there was no cap per se this is imposing a cap yeah so what do you anticipate the amount of money that might be going or royalties might be going to well if you look at the last cumulative average over the last 15 years We the 50% that DLR retain not OHA now because when we talk about state there's two different entities we're just looking at DNR share we received on average 822,000 82323,000 let's just round it up our geothermal program only and this doesn't include the leasing and all the other important programs within DLR we expended on the average $759,000 so basically it's a wash so there's not a whole lot of royalties that come in and then there's good years and bad years during the lava event bend we got zero and we still
064have to fund the program and there's good years when oil prices are high so it's it really fluctuates so we thought it'd be fair to just take a cumulative average over the past 15 years to give you guys a better idea of really what it is it's not $1 million it's not zero but on average it's about 822 that we receive and do you know what the UA should be using these monies for and how much they have in the special fund I'm just reading the bill it says to further the discovery and development of geothermal resour this anybody here from uh to answer that. So I'm just curious because they have so many funds I can't keep track of all the funds that they have. Okay. Thank you. Any other questions? The money is
065going into exploratory trading. Okay. This is for decision making. Um, you're ready to decision make for 301 p.m. with ET PSM and HRE. Um, Senate Bill Senate Bill 458. We are going to take um the breakout of the percentage to do it as 20% to uh to do more exploratory wells. The 50% with DLNR will stay there as well as the 10% to the counties and 20% to OHA um for the geothermal royalties and also take away the cap. Yeah. And removal of the cap. Uh members, any discussion? retail. They got the be company to use that money for fix their roads. I'm not going to tell them what for do. Hopefully they can figure it out. Any other question? Just checking here. Okay. I guess they heard what you guys said. So, any other
066discussion? Okay. Uh so, uh vice chair for the vote, please. Chair Dory, I I vote yes. Senator Fukunaga, I. Senator Kim. Hi. Senator Fabella. Hi. Chair, your recommendation is adopted. For PSM, same recommendation. Any discussion? Chair. Uh, I'll be voting in support. However, with reservations, uh, with the reduction to the county. Um, I didn't see any OA county testimony, so I'd be curious to see what their position is, but to support the discussion going forward, I'll be in support with reservations. Thank you. Thank you. Similar concerns. I also like to more comfortable legislators weigh in. I know they're not on the panel. So right now yes. Okay. Chair's recommendations to pass SB 458 with amendments. Chair votes I. Vice chair votes I with reservation. Senator Fukunaga I. Senator Mckelby. Okay. Senator Awa. No. Mr. the
067chair. The measure passes with amendments for the committee on higher education. Same recommendation to pass Senate Bill 458 with amendments. Any discussion members? Vice Chair resator. [Music] Thank you. Thanks. and meeting. Thank you. Uh thank you for your patience. We're finally convening the committee on public safety, intergovernmental, military affairs and our friends from the committee on education for one for a 302 agenda on this February 15th. We have one measure on this agenda that is Senate Bill 124 relating to the prohibition of firearms on school property. Our testifiers this we have Kurt Ouro with Department of Education. Hello, Chair Okai, Chair Kani, Vice Chair Leonte, and Vice Chair Kim, members of the committee. Keith Aayashi, superintendent, testifying on behalf of the Department of Education. The department stands on its written testimony in support of this
068measure. Thank you for the opportunity to testify. Thank you for saying all this time to say that. Todd Yukotake might be joining us via Zoom. Todd, there isn't on Zoom chair. Okay, members, that's all I have for those indicating they'd like to testify. Is there anyone else in the room or in Zoom? Oh, yes. Did you turn it back? Good afternoon, chairs, committee. Again, I'm um Major Joseph Trindad of the Records and ID division of the home police department. Again, I'm responsible for firearms obction. The home police department supports Senate Bill 124 um relating to prohibition of firearms on school property and we stand by submitted written testimony. Thank you, Mr. Is there anyone else wishing to testify on Senate Bill 124? Members questions. Okay, we're going to take a very brief recess prior to
069taking Thank you for your patience. We're reconvening the committee on public safety, Intergovernmental, and Military Affairs and our friends from the Committee on Education to discuss and actually take the vote on Senate Bill 124. The two chairs have conferred and we'd like to pass this measure out as is. Members, any discussion? not senator vote yes. Okay. Chair's recommendation is to pass SB124 as is. Chair votes I. Vice chair votes I. Senator Fukunaga I. Senator McKelie. Senator Alwalk. No. Mr. Chair, the measure passes as is. Thank you. And for the committee on education, the chair has the same recommendation to pass out Senate Bill 124 relating to prohibition of firearms on school property. Senate Bill 124. Chair votes I to pass as is. Senate bill 124 pass as is. Chair votes eye. Vice chair votes eye.
070Senator I senator Richards. Hi. Senator for four recommendation. Okay. Uh thank you for everyone's patience. We are convening the joint committees on public safety, intergovernmental and military affairs and our really good friends from the committee on labor and technology. It is almost 4:00 and we have two bills on this agenda. The first being Senate Bill 1158 uh relating to employees retirement system. We have Louis Salivia from budget and finance. We'd like to ask everyone to keep their testimonies under a minute please. Okay. Hi chair, vice chair, members of the committee. Sabrina Nasser, deputy director for Department of Budget and Finance. We stand on our written testimony in opposition and we're here to answer any questions you may have. Thank you very much. Thank you, Sabrina. Diane Wong from the AG's office. Chairs and vice chairs,
071we've have submitted written comments. We're concerned that the bill as written would violate uh article 3 section 14 of the Hawaii Constitution um or the one subject requirement. The title of the bill is relating to the employees retirement system. Section one of the bill does not relate to the ERS. Section one relates to the EUTF. We recommend that the section be removed from the bill. Thank you. I'm available for questions. Thank you, Diane. Thomas Williams from the Employees Retirement System. Good afternoon, chairs, vice chairs, members of the committee. I'm Tom Williams of the Employees Retirement System. Appreciate the opportunity to testify. We stand on our testimony and strong opposition to Senate Bill 1158. We think if implemented, this would uh reverse about a decade worth of progress that we've made in reducing our unfunded liability
072and and decreasing the period to full funding. We respectfully ask that the bill be deferred. Thank you. And I'm available to answer questions. Thank you, Mr. Williams. Nicholas Krauss from Chopo might be joining us via Zoom. It is Nicholas there. Um, he's here, but he's hasn't started his video or audio yet. Okay. Is there anyone in this audience that would like to testify on 11:58? Yes. While we wait for Nicholas, I will welcome you. Good afternoon, Chair Wai, Vice Chair Elephante, Chair Morawaki, and Vice Chair Lee. My name is Robert Kavako, president of Chopo uh State of Hawaii Organization of Police Officers. I'm here to testify in strong support of Senate Bill 1158. This bill will restore retirement benefits that were taken away from police officers in 2012 to those who become police officers after
073June 30th of 2023. We respectfully ask that the bill be amended to go one step further and restore retirement benefits for all police officers who became members between July 1st of 2012 and June 30th of 2023. The passage of this bill will provide a muchneeded incentive to recruit and retain more police officers. As you probably already know, each of the four county police departments statewide are suffering from a critical off officer shortages and are struggling to fill vacancies which is compromising public safety. As it currently stands, the reduced retirement benefits do not attract a sufficient number of qualified police officer recruits. Turnover is constant. New recruits enlist and soon leave for other jurisdictions that offer higher compensation and take our training with them. The ERS has submitted testimony in opposition. While we respect their duty
074to protect the assets of the fund and to reduce the unfunded liability, we look at this bill as investing in our police officers and the safety of our communities. The ERS is not projected to be fully funded until 20 years from now, and we can't wait in order to take action. On behalf of the 2600 police officers statewide, I urge and respectfully ask that you amend and pass Senate Bill 1158. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. KCO. Is Nicholas Cra ready to Oh, hi, Nicholas. Welcome. Welcome. Hi. Good afternoon. Can you hear me? Yes, we can. Okay. Uh Nicholas Carlson, the Maui chapter chairman for the State of Hawaii Organization of Police Officers. Uh the Maui Police Department currently has 106 police officer vacancies out of our 400 positions. We are currently in a staffing crisis
075and this crisis will not solve itself. Uh staffing shortages mean longer shifts for our police officers and increased overtime pay for taxpayers, slower response times to 911 calls, mental health crisis, and our communities could ultimately be underserved by their police. We need to take major steps to retain the qualified police officers we already have and stop the mainland police departments from hiring them away from us by enticing them with cheaper cost of living, higher pay, and better benefits. Reinstating the retirement benefits once afforded to police officers will stop the exodus of police officers and will help us attract new police officer candidates that we are currently losing to other jobs that that do not require overnight shifts and mandatory overtime. uh we must invest in our police officers if we expect uh them officers to
076invest their lives in a career serving our communities. I understand this creates a burden to the state ERS, but we're talking about public safety and that impacts everyone. I'm sure there's a way to reinstate the police officer retirement system that was afforded to police officers prior to 2012 and 2001 without bankrupting the ERS system. Thank you very much. Thank you, Nicholas. Is there anyone else on Zoom or in person that would like to testify on Senate Bill 1158? Members questions? Questions for Mr. Williams from ERS. [Music] Hi, good afternoon. Thanks for sticking with us. Um, you heard Chopo's testimony. So, what would be the projected cost if we were to backfill and fund what they're requesting going back to 2012? uh if we were to um amend a plan to provide uh benefits for police
077and fire because police and fire are the same program and they've not been separated. It would either result in uh an increase in contributions if we're going to cont retain the current funding period. There are 23 years to full funding at present. Uh if we don't keep the current funding period, it goes to 30 years. So the annual contributions we make would have to be continued for an additional seven years. In the alternative, we would increase the contribution rates from 41% I believe to about 45% uh per year for each police officer. So it would be substantial. And the unfunded liability I believe increases by about hund00 million from 2.2 2 billion for just the police and fire units to about 2.3 billion. The total unfunded liability is now at 13.5 billion for the IRS.
078Thank you, Mr. Williams. Thank you, Chair Senator. Perhaps um could I also ask um the representative from Department of Budget and Finance to come up because I I would really appreciate you know if your um agencies could provide the committees with kind of a breakdown you know on your calculations and how you arrived at your um um conclions in your testimony. I think, you know, having served on the city end, I think for, you know, all of the police departments that are experiencing severe recruitment and retention issues. I think you know if there is a need to revisit the kinds of benefit that are offered it would be very beneficial if your departments could at least provide your uh calculations and how you arrived at your statements and then that would help the legislature perhaps
079re-examine you know how we might better uh approach this issue. I'm sure there will have to be a lot more discussion among the committee chairs, but I can tell you I think from uh the Honolulu um standpoint, you know, having 200 and 300 vacancies at uh a time when we had severe emergency conditions is just not acceptable. It's, you know, it's we're in a very severe um shortage condition. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. We're happy to provide more information on that. Can I follow up with a question? Senator, if I might also respond that uh our numbers were developed by our actuaries. We employ a firm Gabriel Motor and they have the entire census of our police and they have developed these numbers. So the numbers that I share with you today were developed by our actuarial.
080I'm I'm not disputing that. I'm I'm just saying that given the number of vacancies and difficulties that the police departments are experiencing in recruiting new officers, we should be also looking at the numbers of officers that we currently have and what you know the uh costs of overtime and excess kinds of coverage are also costing us because cost not only the counties but also the state as well. So, you know, as a first step in getting more information before the committees. Yes. And additional overtime obviously translates at least for tier one employees into additional retirement benefits. And I'm no expert in recruitment of police or other groups. But my sense is that retirement plan alone is not the solution for the challenges that are being faced. I think we have a very strong retirement plan
081compared to others nationwide. But could it be changed? Surely it could be changed but at a cost and that's obviously the discretion of this committee and the legislature to do it. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Sure. I think the general testimony from budget finances employer contributions will go up but which employers are we talking about here? I mean generally county firefighters, county police, it would be the counties that would be taking the brunt of the cost, right? That's correct. And so when it comes to health, well, yes, the the cost that we're talking about, it's only that attributable to uh the police and fire. U there is a separate pool for general employees. Uh and those rates are determined separately. Uh they currently in about 24% it's 41% for police at five.
082We anticipate it would go up to 45.1% for police and five. So about 4% more 4.1% 4.1 and that's something for and hopefully we'll get some testimony from the counties as we go forward as bill goes forward so that we know whether or not they value being a having a recruiting tool for their police departments is useful. because they're the ones that are going to have to decide whether they need to, you know, whether they're willing to take on the additional cost going forward. Well, Senator, if I might add, one of the concerns that the RS has is that the plans were changed in 2012 applicable to all new hires for the general employees or police and fire. And we're concerned that this reversion to pre202 benefits is something that all of our members would
083like to see. I mean uh and there's as I said earlier moratorium I understand that and I think that the um retroactive application I don't think it's in the bill. I think they're requesting as an amendment. That is correct. I I I have one one question to add on to that. So if in fact it's it's a county is it shred out? So when you say the contribution rate increases. Is that for the counties and not the state or how do you calculate that? Well, thank you Senator. We calculated by employer and so the counties are the employers. They we build them or they contribute to us on a county bycounty basis. So I believe the state only has a very few handful of officers. Uh but largely they are employed by the counties to
084the counties would pay the county contribution rate and not necessarily the states or that's correct. Thank you. Y so um going forward we already was talking about the recruitment how important that is and I I I beg to differ. I think if we have a very uh comparable package of uh for law enforcement um officers in the field then we wouldn't be getting our officers taken by the mainland the packages that they have and the signing bonuses that they have. If you look at the overtime on firefighters and police and you add up and calculate that and play that into effect in having officers that would come in for uh the retirement um put them back in um and calculate those numbers. I I I kind of pretty sure that it would not be as
085high in the percent of you talking about because these officers is not just working 12 hours over time. They're working way over 12 12 hours overtime. So this is why I'm I like you guys go back to the drawing board because you guys going on a regular eight hour schedule. None of our police officers can as little as you say they have, you know, um they work extremely overtime and and that's the reason why they quit. They find new job and I hate to say we have they don't advertise it because it's not advertised. We have the highest in suicide rates because of that divorce, right? Parallel, family, all these kind of place all in effect. you're thinking because this one thing is not playing an effect but having this not having this benefits it
086does play an effect on so what I like you guys both do go look ask the city whatever the overtime contributions and how much money we spend every day on overtime on our law enforcement officers then you guys come back and tell us that um it's not needed because I think it's really needed and I think you guys got to relook at that or you guys going to take a run around and spend 18 hours of the day riding around an officer in the car, then you can understand why they need these certain things and even more than what we're trying to give now. Thank you. Thank you, chair. Okay, members, any further questions? If not, I'm going to hand it over to my co-chair to take on the next bill. Thank you. Thank you.
087Uh we are going into SB696 relating to workers compensation authorizing wages of other employees and comparable employment to be considered when computing the average weekly wage of an injured public board member, reserve public officer, police chaplain, sheriff's chaplain, volunteer firefighter, volunteer boating enforcement officer, or volunteer conservation and resources enforcement officer. and it clarifies the uh computation of average weekly wages of an injured volunteer firefighter for workers compensation benefit purposes. So we have um the department of labor. Aloha chair Mari chair wai vice chairante and committee members Jai or D. Uh we stand on our testimony and support. Thank you. Thank you. Uh and we have two written Oh, do we have anyone else on Zoom or in the room would like to testify on this bill? Okay, we've got uh two written testimonies. One from
088uh two from individuals Alan Urasaki in support and Michael Oakland in support. questions. We take a brief recess taking the vote. We are reconvening our joint committee with the public safety and intergovernmental affair military affairs committee and our friends from the committee on labor and technology for decision-m on two measures. The first being Senate Bill 1158 relating to the employees retirement system. We had a very lengthy discussion on how to hopefully improve recruitment and retention of our police officers throughout the state. like to pass this measure out with um one amendment that being what was suggested by the attorney general's office uh which was would be to take out section one which was in conflict with all the other sections of the bill. Um and in the committee report we're going to ask that budget
089and finance and ERS uh provide us more information on the impact of of this particular measure on the retirement system. So um suggestions to pass with amendments with discussion chair I'll be voting with reservations understanding what our law enforcement does but noting the concerns from ERS and BNF but for further discussion. Thank you. Any further discussion? If not Senator Alfante I vote yes. Chair's recommendation is to pass SB 1158 with amendments. Chair votes I. Vice chair votes I with reservation. Senator Fukunaga I. Senator McKelie. Yes. Senator Awa. Mr. Chair, the measure passes with amendments. Thank you. The labor and technology committee. Same recommendation. Chair vai. So this is um we're voting on Senate Bill 11 1158 to pass with amendments. Chair is I uh Senator Har's I. Senator Keith Agaran. Senator Favilla. I recommendations adopted.
090Thank you. Uh for Senate Bill 696 relating to workers compensation. Uh uh and this is uh for volunteers uh workers compensation uh benefit um comparables uh uh chair is going to recommend that we pass this uh with amendment with a defective effective date. Chair Volai. So of the members, four members present on the committee on labor and technology, any reservations or no votes for chair's recommendation to pass Senate bill 696 with amendments. Hearing none, recommendations adopted. Same recommendation for public safety. Any discussion? Senator, I vote yes. Okay. Chair's recommendations to pass SB 696 with amendments of the five members present from PSN. Are there any no votes? Any votes with reservations? Hearing none, Mr. Chair, the measure passes with amendments. Thank you everyone for your time. Your turn. Thank you.