001probably talking. Has anyone seen Lar Grown? Oh, sometimes he be out there. Larry. Okay. Anybody seen Larry? Back up. Shirley. Shirley. Shirley. Oh, sorry. He back here. [Music] I'm ready to go home and binge watch something on Netflix to clear my mind. Amen. Amen. [Music] I'm glad he's here. I'm glad he's here. Yeah. He's keeping an eye on He looks like it's you and his I He's been real stern. I know. He's hardly [Music] cring Connor. Mr. Connor, Mr. Connor Ben Connor, where you going? Larry. Oh, cat. Did you see her picture? Come on, Larry. Larry taking sweets to his sweetheart. Have a seat. Sorry. I just like to hide behind trying to go home and finish the bed. Me, too. Don't drink. Okay. I'll call our regular session to order. Roll call, please. Chairman
002Smith here. Mrs. Black here. Mr. Connor here. Mr. Dardy here. Mr. Groan here. Mrs. Haden here. Mrs. Jones here. Mr. Keane here. Mrs. Schaefer here. Mr. Mr. Slater here. Miss Thomas here. Superintendent Dr. Robertson here. Okay. Before we uh approve our agenda, just a a couple of small changes under uh uh Roman numeral 5, exemplars of excellence. Uh Dr. Rice could not be with us tonight. So, we're going to postpone uh that recognition uh until our next meeting. And then also just a reminder, uh we're going to pick up the items that we didn't get to under our work session and the the committee chair updates will come under information only and then those discussion items will come right after budget discussion under board matters. So with those changes in mind, I'll entertain a motion
003to approve the agenda. So moved. I need a second. Second. Roll call. Mrs. Black. Yes. Mr. Connor? Yes. Mr. Dy? Yes. Mr. Grown? Yes. Mrs. Haden? Yes. Mrs. Jones? Yes. Mr. Keane? Yes. Mrs. Schaefer? Yes. Mr. Slater? Yes. Mrs. Thomas? Yes. Chairman Smith? Yes. Okay. Miss Reynolds from Udawa Elementary School. Brought some. Good evening. I have with me two outstanding uh student ambassadors from UDA Elementary School. I'm going to allow them to introduce themselves. Good evening. My name is Jay Holder and I'm in fifth grade. Good evening. My name is Jezene Presbury and I am also from fifth grade. Please stand for the pledge of attention salute pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice
004for all. Please remain standing for a moment of silence. Thank you. You may now have a nice quiet seat. Very good. All right. Nice job, guys. Good evening, Dr. Robertson, Dr. Stewart, the school board members, school community, and all of Hamilton County. Um, my name my name is Bethany Reynolds. I'm the proud principal at Udawa that gets to serve Udawa Elementary School. And Udawa is a truly a beautiful place filled with joy, belonging, high expectations, and unwavering commitment to our students. Our school community includes students who speak 22 different languages and exceptional staff dedicated to excellence, incredibly involved families who partner with us and every step of the way. One of my favorite things about our school is our sense of community, a shared belief that every child deserves to to thrive. We are now
005currently in the final stretch of the school year. We're in a season full of energy, urgency, and at times uncertainty. State testing is underway. Big decisions are being made. And for many of us, it's also a sacred time of year, a time of worship, reflection, and um renewal. In moments like this, it's important to pause and remember why we do what we do. In Hamilton County Schools, we are driven by a bold and unifying clause that all cause, pardon me, that all students thrive and experience a future without limits. That's not just a slogan. It's a promise, a commitment, a shared purpose that keeps us grounded and guides our every step, even when, especially when the path is difficult. I was recently reminded of a story that speaks to this kind of perseverance. In 1968,
006a marathon runner named John Steven Aquari represented Tanzania in Olympic Games in game in Mexico City. The altitude proved to be a serious challenge for all runners as 18 marathoners out of 75 dropped out of the marathon before finishing. Aquari fell badly during the race, significantly injuring his knee. Most assumed that he too would quit, but instead he wrapped his leg and kept on going. Due to his injuries, he had to walk much of the race and arrived at the stadium long after the medal ceremony had ended. As he arrived in last place, those who remained stood and applauded, astounded and moved by his determination. When asked later why he didn't stop, he simply said, "My country did not call me to go, excuse me, my country did not send me 5,000 miles to start
007a race. My country sent me 5,000 miles to finish one." That story reminds us of something powerful. Sometimes the most important thing that we can do is just keep going. with courage, grace, and with our eyes fixed on what matters most. It also brings to mind a verse from the book of Hebrews chapter 12. Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles, and let us run with perseverance, the race marked out for us. A simple sacred reminder that we are not alone, and that our calling is not just to begin, but to finish with faithfulness. Thank you for your hard work, and thank you for your time. [Applause] [Music] Thank you, Mr. Reynolds, and young people. Thank
008you. So, it takes us down to our disclaimer statement. We'll start over there with Larry. Uh, Mr. Ron does not apply. It's just me. Just you. Okay. Go ahead. Then I declare that I have a relative who works for the school system and that the board's vote on budget policies, etc. may have an effect on my relatives employment. Even so, I hereby certify that I will cast my vote in the best interest of the school system. Okay. I'll uh entertain a motion to approve our consent agenda. So moved. Second. A motion and a second. Any items to be pulled? Awesome. Roll call. Mrs. Black. Yes. Mr. Connor. Yes. Mr. Dy. Yes. Mr. Gro, yes. Mrs. Haden, yes. Mrs. Jones, yes. Mr. Keane, yes. Mrs. Schaefer, yes. Mr. Slater, yes. Mrs. Thomas, yes. Chairman Smith, yes.
009Very good. Takes us down to administrative business matters and our HCC, HCDE, MOA regarding construction of school facilities. A motion to approve. So moved. Second discussion. See no lights. Roll call. Mrs. Black. Yes. Mr. Connor? Yes. Mr. Dardy? Yes. Mr. Grown? Yes. Mrs. Haden? Yes. Mrs. Jones? Yes. Mr. Keane? Yes. Mrs. Schaefer? Yes. Mr. Slater? Yes. Mrs. Thomas? Yes. Chairman Smith? Yes. Gateway Technical School Education Building Architect Selection. And just uh for the record, uh Dr. Robertson, tell us who that is if you would. Uh after committee sent uh three options to the mayor and myself, we're recommending Tinker Ma. I believe that uh the commission may have approved this yesterday. I'm not 100% sure, but the recommendation is for Tinker Ma to be that architect. Okay, we have a motion to second. Any discussion?
010Mr. Can you explain real quick, Dr. Robertson, what exactly um it is that we are voting to do? What action? You're approving the architect to design um the renovation of the bottom level and part of the second level of gateway. Okay. And it's not yet approving the actual construction. It's simply getting the plans. Yeah, this is under the old um design bid process where the architect will design um we'll put it out to bid. We'll have to come back to this body and the commission to approve um a contractor to to build that out. I wanted to make sure and say that on the record. We've had a lot of emails uh over the past week and a few of them have talked about funding building things that may not necessarily be an exact need
011for our community right now when we're talking about cutting things that are absolutely a need. as I see seat coaches sitting in the front. Yeah. Super super important also to to separate. I've gotten this question a lot. Got it at a community meeting last night at CSAS that um these are completely separate funds. Even if this body wanted to take these funds to balance the budget, you couldn't do it. So like I said, um lots of emails about it. Wanted to make sure that that was on the record. So for clarity, the money that would is being proposed for Gateway, even if we wanted to recommend usage of it for budget, it cannot because it is from a I want to make sure. Yes, ma'am. Okay. Because it is from a completely different set of
012funding. It's from a bond issue. You're right. Okay, Mr. King. Mr. King. Yeah. Real quick. Uh, so we got a motion. No, not on this one. Not Go ahead. Go ahead, Mr. King. All right. Motion to approve. Second. So, we discussion. Oh, no. No. Go ahead, Mr. King. All right. Uh just wanted to point out it's also a local firm which a lot of the big schools and stuff sometimes go to big companies but this one uh has been working with our FRRI programs and so that's kind of neat to see. We actually have a ex student that works for Tinkerm that was in our Harrison Bay uh architectural design and engineering company. Okay. Thank you Mr. Kee. Miss Thomas. Yes. I like to say that I participated in in this process when it came
013to selecting of uh the architect for this and then submitting the three names that came up. I enjoyed the process. It was very good learning experience for me. But I do have some questions in regards to the process and how that works and how people are selected. And so I just want to say for the record that I hope we look at that process and how that works and when we're selecting um architects and just kind of what that should look like to in my opinion to be fair to to to to everyone. Uh I did want to state that for the the record uh in regards to that. Okay. Thank you Miss Thomas. No more lights. Roll call. Mrs. Black. Yes, Mr. Connor. Yes, Mr. Dardy. Yes, Mr. Grown. Yes, Mrs. Haden. Yes, Mrs.
014Jones. Yes, Mr. Keane. Yes, Mrs. Schaefer. Yes, Mr. Slater. Yes, Mrs. Thomas. Uh, yes. Chairman Smith, yes. Science, adoption, recommendations. Need a motion to approve. So moved. Second. No lights. Roll call off. Mrs. Black. Yes. Mr. Connor. Yes. Mr. Dardy. Yes. Mr. Grown. Yes. Mrs. Haden? Yes. Mrs. Jones? Yes. Mr. Keane? Yes. Mrs. Schaefer? Yes. Mr. Slater? Yes. Mrs. Thomas? Yes. Yes. Chairman Smith? Yes. Science adoption recommendations for high school courses. So move. Second. Any questions? No. No likes, no hands. Roll call. Mrs. Black? Yes. Mr. Connor? Yes. Mr. Dhy? Yes. Mr. Grown? Yes. Mrs. Haden? Yes. Mrs. Jones? Yes. Mr. Keane? Yes. Mrs. Schaefer? Yes. Mr. Slater? Yes. Mrs. Thomas? Yes. Chairman Smith? Yes. Uh, facility name change. Before I ask for a motion, Dr. Robertson, just for the record so the public understands
015what we're talking about here. Yes, sir. I'm going to ask Dr. Bagby to come up. Uh, she's been working really hard on this uh with with her team and kind of signals a shift uh towards a larger investment in CTE education. So, I don't want to take this away from her. Wonderful. Thank you, board. So we are expanding the future ready centers network. Future ready centers is giving the opportunity for more access to CTE programs without having to add more programs to individual high schools. In our first instincts of a future ready network, we had Harrison Bay Future Ready Center where we uh changed the building to uh move forward as a future ready center and began busing half-day program students from Central and Udawa High School and now have expanded it also to East
016Hamilton High School. Our movement is to move what is currently Sequoia High School into that same model. And so we are moving to go forward with uh changing SEOA's current name to the Future Ready Center, excuse me, North River Future Ready Center. I'd also like to note that for the next three years of graduating classes, the current full day students will continue to graduate from Sequoia High School and it will only be after that that graduating class has completely phased out that the school will solely be recognized as the North River Future Ready Center. Dr. Bagy, can you uh provide uh updated enrollment information compared to last year for all three? Yes. Put you on the spot. I thought you would know. I I don't want to get it wrong. At North River Future Ready
017Center, uh we currently have 75 half-day students and 165 full day students. Next year in the freshman half-day program alone, we have accepted 175 freshman students only. So we are making major expansions there. At the construction career center, we are currently at 67 students. We have 86 students confirmed, but are expecting 120 to 130 students at that location. And at Harrison Bay, we have 222 students. This year we have 220, excuse me, 286 students that have confirmed and have 14 spots open that we hope to fill by the end of the season. Okay. Motion to approve. So move. Second. Got a motion and a second. Uh no lights, no questions. I I would just like just a comment. Uh and just Dr. Robertson and I talked about this. We're getting ready to build a a
018new elementary school out there that's often referred to as the North River Elementary School, a North River now future ready. So, I hope when that time comes uh for that new elementary school that we'll look at some creative names other than having two schools up there named North River. Just a thought. We got Harrison and Harrison B. I know we do. Joe wants it to be Joe wants it to be called Joe Smith Elementary. For the record, I tried to change Harrison's name. Just for the record. No more lights. So, roll off. Mrs. Black, yes. Mr. Connor, yes. Mr. Dy, yes. Mr. Gro, yes. Mrs. Haden, yes. Mrs. Jones, yes. Mr. Keane, yes. Mrs. Schaefer, yes. Mr. Slater, yes. Mrs. Thomas, yes. Chairman Smith. Yes. So, we got Mr. BS here. Thank you for being
019here. We have a I need a motion to uh uh to approve some applications here. Do we need to do these uh together or probably one at a time, do we not? I think you need to do them one at a time. Uh got Fine Moore and Jim BS with us from school choice that can answer questions and kind of give us an update. Yeah, why don't we do do that and then I'll ask for a motion to approve. So, thank y'all for being here. Miss Moore actually has a PowerPoint that has a break in it for the vote. So, that's perfect. So, I just want to introduce our charter coordinator again, Phen Moore. Uh she has led a team of 13 of our application review team, 14 with legal counsel, uh through a very
020thorough process of the charter school applications. So, I'm going to turn it over for me and we'll both be here for any questions you may have. Good evening again. My name is Phen Moore and I am the charter school coordinator for the district. Over the past several months, I've had the pleasure of working with the review team as we have conducted a thorough review of two new charter school applications. Before we begin, it is important to review a few laws so that you understand the impact of your vote. If a charter school is approved, the charter school office will work alongside the school to ensure compliance and a smooth opening. However, when a charter school application is denied, state board rule requires the local board of education to provide written notice of the denial within
02110 calendar days outlining specific objective reasons and a deadline for submitting an amended application. Per the rule, the charter school sponsor then has 30 calendar days from receipt of the denial to revise the submission um the application addressing the the identified deficiencies. The local board then has 60 days from receipt to approve or deny an amended charter application. If no action is taken within that time frame, the application is automatically approved. Amended applications submitted in 2025 would likely be reviewed at the July board meeting. If the 60-day window does not align with the regular meeting, a special session may be necessary. A comprehensive review was conducted by leveraging the expertise from different departments within Hamilton County to form an evaluation team. We also worked with Michelle Don who is the owner and principal consultant of
022Don Consulting. In the 2425 application cycle, two new proposed charter schools submitted applications. Little Kings and Queens Charter Academy, which would serve grades K3 with a full enrollment capacity of 43 students, and Tennessee Wildflower Public School, which would serve preK5 with a full capacity of 140 students. The TDOE new charter application is made up of four sections. The four sections are academic plan and design, operations plan and capacity, financial plan and capacity and portfolio review and performance record. Only applicants who score meet standard in all major areas of the evaluation rubric should be considered for recommendation based on the rigorous standards set forth in Tennessee law. The application review team used the following rubric to evaluate the application. A rating of meets or exceeds standards, partially meet standards, or does not meet standards was used
023for each section of the application. The application review team conducted a comprehensive process beginning with an independent evaluation of each application during which members completed ratings for all subsections. This was followed by capacity interviews with each proposed school. The team then developed a consensus summary which has been presented to you in the preparation for your vote. The first school up for vote is Little Kings and Queens Charter Academy proposed to be located in district 8 in Eastridge. The plan is open. The plan is to open with 15 kindergarten students, gradually expanding to serve grades K through in the following years. At full capacity, the school would serve 43 students. In the academic plan and design evaluation section, Little Kings and Queens Charter Academy does not meet the standard due to the lack of a strong
024compelling academic plan. The application and interview did not present a measurable mission or show alignment with the needs of the proposed student population. The mission was not clearly integrated into the school's model including curriculum instruction operations or financials. While the team mentioned various focus areas such as early literacy and numeracy, social emotional growth, dual language immersion, nature-based learning, and more. They provided no detail, rationale, or connection to the students needs. The academic plan lacked specificity with no measurable or ambitious goals. Instead, it listed vague outcomes such as achieving full enrollment. Plans for serving special populations were minimal and lacked clarity, including inadequate staffing strategies. The team also failed to show evidence of community engagement demand for the school or justification for the small school size and K3 grade band. Additionally, the projected enrollment starting with
025only 15 kindergarteners and capping at 43 students raises further concern. Little Kings and Queens Charter Academy operations does not meet standard as well. The application and interview failed to demonstrate the board's capacity to effectively launch and operate the school. The organizational structure is unclear with limited staffing and no compelling professional development or recruitment plans. Proposed salaries fall below the $50,000 minimum required by law for school year 2627. The plan to colllo locate and share staff with the private for-profit Little Kings and Queens Child Development Center raises legal and operational concerns, especially as public funds would support roles like art and music teachers. Additionally, key operational areas such as transportation, food service, health and safety, and technology are insufficiently addressed, and the overall plan does not instill confidence in the school's ability to operate effectively. The
026financial plan does not meet standard. The application and interview revealed incomplete and unreasonable budget assumptions with key areas like facilities, transportation, benefits, staffing, and technology being underfunded or omitted. Revenues and expenses are not aligned. The school's purpose proposed financial relationship with the private for-profit Little Kings and Queens Child Development Center is highly problematic. The center would fund staff positions and services and serve as a contingency source of funds raising legal and operational concerns for a public charter school. Overall, the applicant team showed a lack of understanding of charter school finances and the review team lacks confidence in the school's financial viability and sustainability. The portfolio review and performance evaluation was not assessed during the review process. After a thorough review of the application by the a team of specially trained reviewers and a capacity interview
027with the applicants that answered questions from that team, the review team has concluded that Little Kings and Queens Charter Academy has not met the rigorous standards set forth in Tennessee law in all areas. Overall, the review team found that Little Kings and Queens Charter Academy did not present a clear and comprehensive school model and were deficient in their plans for academics, operations, and finance. The review team does not have confidence that Little Kings and Queens Charter Academy will open successfully and be able to establish and sustain a strong learning environment for all students. At this time, we will pause for your vote on this specific charter or question. Or questions. Yeah. Okay. Uh Mr. King. Yeah. So, as I look at your indicators uh here on what you graded them on, I see the ones
028where you're saying, you know, either met, didn't meet, but a lot of these different indicators have been lined out. And so, explain to me what the lined out ones are. Strike. So it depends if they are working with the CMO and this specific charter proposal does not work with the CMO. So some some indicators are not going to be assessed for this specific one. All right, can you uh give what CMO means for the newer board members? Charter management organization. Sorry, you put me on the spot there for a second. I'm sorry. Just new or two. Is that anything else, Mr. King? Yeah. Uh, and who was the I don't know what the anacronym for the sponsoring organization is. What? Uh, so they were their own sponsoring organization. Correct. Correct. Okay. So they and just
029for reference uh until recently we have not had any chartering management organizations. They they have been homegrown if you will. Okay. because I know a lot of charter schools have a set organization that pushes for them nationally. Correct. Yes. Thank you, Mr. Gome. Um, this was is proposed to be in my district and all you had to do is stop by the facility that they were planning for this and there is no way I would allow my child to be instructed there. It it it just blew me away that that we had to go through this on an organization that had no clue what they were doing in a very very poor location. Thank you, Mr. Ro. Mr. Dry. Thank you, Chair. Um just out of curiosity, h have have this feedback been u given
030to these applicants by chance? The feedback will be provided following your vote so that if they choose to amend their application and resubmit it, they have the specific areas of concern. So they do have an option to resubmit and correct reply for the for next calendar year or uh so that's what we were reviewing at the beginning. They have 30 days to after receiving the notice um a letter will be sent out to them next week. We have 10 days to send out a letter. um 30 days from receiving that notice, then they have that that period of time to resubmit if they so choose. We then have 60 calendar days to review that and the vote would we would present again to the vote for the vote to board for the board to vote
031again. Understood. Thank you. Yeah, Mr. Con. Thank you, Chair. So, just real quick, I want to make one note and ask one question. So, the note exactly zero of the things that they put in here even comes close to meeting expectations per the per the per the review committee. Yes. Um I I just want to be clear like you've delivered it wonderfully. There was no emotion to it, but that's amazing that there's not a single one that have come up. Um and then following up on Mr. DHY's question. Um if they do submit again and then we have the 30 days and the 60 days and we again vote not to, they can still appeal to the state board and then they would not be under our purview. Correct. They can um submit their application
032to the state charter board um and they would go through their process. And can can you lay out not I'm not asking for a dissertation on it, but can you lay out a little bit of what the charter schools how we have them? Sorry, what am I trying to say? how what dictation we have over charter schools that we have approved and what we wouldn't have if we if they went through the state and I say that because there's obviously a lot of conversation right now about one of our charter schools that has had some issues with teacher lensure so I just want to make sure the general public understands the difference between what we have a little jurisdiction over kind of and what we have no jurisdiction over so if I'm understanding your your
033question are you asking for a comparison between what we what what it would look like under our jurisdiction versus the state charter commission. So, so the difference would be that if we were to approve the charter, we serve as not only their authorizer, but in the state of Tennessee, you also serve as their LEA. Um, if the the state charter commission is to approve their charter because we deny, they resubmit, we deny again, and they choose to to apply with them, then they serve as their authorizer and their LEA. That that's the difference. Now, is there any way that if that second situation happens, how would that be in any way a detriment to us? Do their numbers still come up to us? How do they count against us? Yes, it they would then fall
034under the charter commission's numbers because they serve as their LEA. Um and and just for further reference, just because they apply to the charter commission doesn't mean that the charter commission is going to approve them either. They would have to go through their own process. Thank you for clarifying that for the public. Appreciate it. Okay. So, your recommendation to us, if I'm understanding, is that we reject this this request, this application. That is your recommendation to this body. So per the review committee, they did not meet the requirements set out by this by state law. Okay. So I will entertain a motion. So moved. Okay. Second. Got a motion and second. No lights, no hands. Roll call. What? Scott, are you clear what we're voting on here? Well, it's motion is to reject. Yes, that
035needs to be said. Okay, so my understanding is that the committee was recommending denial. That's right. I heard so move in and a second. So denial. So a yes vote means a denial to the charter. Okay. Committee said that they didn't meet standards. They were not recommending to reject. They just told us that it's already been stated. So you need to clarify that. They don't mean they ain't got to tell me. I know that's what I'm saying, but that's not exactly what they said. So that's why I wanted to clarify recommended denial based upon the reasons stated in memorandums submitted to the board. I heard a motion to to sustain that that recommendation. I heard a second. And so the written notice that will go out to the applicant subject to this board's approval will
036reflect that these are the reasons it's being denied. Okay. Okay. Roll call. Mrs. Black. Yes. Mr. Connor. Yes. Mr. Dy. Yes. Mr. Groan. Yes. Mrs. Haden? Yes. Mrs. Jones? Yes. Mr. Keane? Yes. Mrs. Schaefer? Yes. Mr. Slater? Yes. Mrs. Thomas? Yes. Chairman Smith? Yes. Tennessee Wildflower Charter School. Tennessee Wildflower Public Charter is the second one we will be discussing this evening. While an exact location has not been finalized, the proposal outlines two potential areas. East Side ranging from Woodmore to East Ridge or West Side, College Hill to the Bend. The proposal reflects a gradual growth model. The school plans to open with 60 students in grades preK through 2 grade and expand annually to serve grades preK through five. At full capacity, it would enroll students. The Tennessee Wildflower Public Charter does not meet the
037standard due to a weak academic plan. The mission is broad, lacks measurability, and is not clearly embedded across the school model. The team did not explain how state standards will be met, especially in mixed aged classrooms. Nor did they provide evidence supporting the model's fit for the student population. The academic plan lacks detail, specific goals, and a clear strategy for serving all students, including special populations. There was also no compelling evidence of community engagement or demonstrated need. Additionally, the small projected enrollment raises concerns about financial sustainability, and the team did not justify how the school would remain viable long term. Their operations plan also did not meet the standard. While the proposed board includes individuals with relevant expertise, the team did not demonstrate the board's capacity to effectively oversee the school. One board member's dual
038role with the Wildflower Foundation, the proposed CMO, raises conflict of interest concerns. The organizational structure is unclear. Staffing appears insufficient and plans for recruiting and retaining high quality teachers lack detail. Compensation was described only as competitive with no specifics provided. The role and accountability of the CMO were not clearly defined, including how support would be delivered or how performance would be measured. Overall, the operations plan does not instill confidence in the school's ability to serve students effectively. Their financial plan also did not meet the standard. The budget and narrative are incomplete with unrealistic assumptions and misalignment misaligned revenues and expenses. Key financial systems and controls such as accounting, payroll, and auditing were clearly outlined or I'm sorry, were not clearly outlined, raising concerns about oversight and accountability. The budget relies on voluntary pre kindergarten funding,
039but the team did not present a compelling contingency plan if those funds are not secured. Overall, the financial plan lacks the clarity and viability needed to support and sustain the school. The Wildflower Foundation um the proposed CMO for Tennessee Wildflower does not meet the standard. While the CMO operates a small network of schools across several states and has no record of closures or litigation, the applicant team did not provide sufficient EV evidence of the CMO's success in improving academic outcomes, particularly for special populations. Additionally, the team did not submit audited or recent financial statements for their CMO or its schools, leaving the fiscal health of the organization unclear. After a thorough review of the application by a team of specially trained reviewers and a capacity interview with the applicants that answered questions from that team,
040the review team has concluded that Tennessee Wildflower Public School has not met the rigorous standards set forth in Tennessee law in all areas. Move to deny charter based on committee review. Second. Got a motion and a second to deny. Any questions, comments? So, I got one line. It looks like Mr. King. Yeah. Just publicly, they as I look through it, they did not meet expectations on a single item. Correct. A single section. Not necessarily a single item. Yes. On a single section. Okay. No more lights. Roll call. Mrs. Black. Yes. Mr. Connor. Yes. Mr. Dardy. Yes, Mr. Groan. Yes, Mrs. Haden. Yes, Mrs. Jones. Yes, Mr. Keane. Yes, Mrs. Schaefer. Yes, Mr. Slater. Yes, Mrs. Thomas. Yes, Chairman Smith. Yes. Thank you all very much. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, takes
041us down to board matters and uh Shannon Moody, everybody's favorite person. Uh, it feels like we we've got a a couple items just for I think discussion announcement. These aren't for vote tonight as I understand. Correct. Okay. So, uh, so you have the floor. Just make sure that everybody absolutely [Laughter] we don't have to do. Um, so you have two items in front of you on first read. So there's no vote for these tonight. The first u they're both calendars. The first is the calendar for next year. So, we're bringing that back to you to make amendments to the calendar for next year. Um, your memo outlines exactly what those things are, but for clarity for everybody here, we're changing PD dates. Um, there's originally a PD date on Wednesday, September 17th. We're going to
042be moving it to Monday, September 22nd. Um, this PD day move from Wednesday to Monday is based on both feedback from staff and from families um that it's better to have a PD day aligned, not in the middle of the week. Um, we also have another PD date change. Monday, April 6th is moved to Monday, December 1st. That change is to align to the two benchmark schedule. So, there's a data review day, a PD day align to when benchmark comes back on a two schedule. That's where we go versus the three schedule as it was built for. Um, and then we have a half day change. Originally that was set for Wednesday, February 25th. We're moving it to Friday, March 13th to have uh a half day not on a Wednesday. So, that's for you
043guys to review. We will be sending that out through the pulse check for the community um for our staff to be able to give any feedback on the calendar and you'll have that feedback in your memo before it comes to vote next time. So, the goal would be to if we want to approve this would be at our next at the next board meeting. Yes. Okay. All right. So, I got several lights here. Uh sure, Mr. King. Yes. So as we discuss benchmarks for our budget, if we change benchmarks, how will that so we're going to be flexible on those P PD days? This calendar reflects a change from 3 to two. The PD days were built in to to support the three benchmark schedule. This calendar reflects that two change. Okay. So, I'll say
044again, uh, so as we discuss the benchmarks for the budget, we'll still have flexibility on the PD day depending on how the benchmarks go on the vote. Yes. But but I think even even if something different were done, what we were hearing from the community and even many of you is that those days that we have built in should be on Mondays, right? And so we've done it to reflect that. But if any changes, the benchmarks happen, this calendar also would support those changes. Okay, that's one to be clear on. Thank you. Okay, Miss Schaer, I just want to say of all the things I've advocated for, this was the easiest for you guys to agree to. So I wanted to say thank you and I wanted um the public to know that we are
045putting families first, students first. and it is an overarching theme that I know I as a board member am looking at. So the administration was gracious and agreed and I want to say thank you. Okay, Mr. Slater. Okay, I don't like that. Okay, all across district one, here's what I've heard. The professional learning day at the first of the year is a total waste of time and money. And we're talking about budget. Um, every person I talked to said this was a waste a waste of time and money. So, um, I think we need to look at that. I don't know what what does it cost to rent that and and handle all this on the on that first day. Yeah, they it doesn't cost nearly as much as you think because the convention center
046worked with us, city of Chattanooga worked with us, the busing company worked with us, but I mean there it's as similar to expense as if we did it across the district. Could you not zoom it and just save whatever we pay? No. No. No. I've also learned that teachers couldn't get in the rooms and they had to go to some other place and it just wasn't helpful. the the first time we've done it, it it's first time we did it last year, right? And we heard from teachers in previous years that they wanted a just professional style learning conference instead of going spread out across the district where we usually would send K through two I see Mr. Dr. Freeman getting worked up behind me. Uh K through two one direction and and middle school
047up math this direction. And um you know, we heard at times that that wasn't helpful either. Um, and so we tried this last year. There are some things we learned. A lot of what we learned was around um sessions that we uh didn't think would be very popular were more popular. And so there were times that uh you know things filled up before everyone got there. I don't know if if you've ever been to a a any kind of conference, whether it's an education conference or a restaurant conference or social worker conference. I had to do those for 34 years. Oh, I was about to I was just going to make sure I wasn't picky on you throwing out the insurance conference. Um, there are often times where things get filled up before you can
048sign up and and that happens in a lot of locations. We're open to adjusting it. I I don't think the adjustment is a is a budget conversation because as we go across the county, there are expenses um with that. But I I do think the opportunity for us to come together as a district um and to be there and to see the collective impact that we have um was meaningful. I I know a couple of you came. I know Miss Schaefer spent probably two or three hours there uh walking around and and we're open to feedback, but we do think it's important. Well, I promised my constituents I would bring that up. Yeah. Okay. And if it'd be helpful, we could also we always do a survey after any any uh PD day of everyone
049that attended. We we'll be happy to provide that and show some adjustments that we're already planning to make. The cost of the cost of funding. Thank Mr. Slayer, Miss Jones. So, um Dr. Robertson actually took a lot of what I was going to say um when he stated that that was the first time that we had done it and I did attend that morning. Um, and there were some sessions that were very popular just as I mean I experienced that all the time in my my professional group. There were sessions that were very popular and there were teachers they were like, "Oh, now I got to do this or I'm just going to pop a squat right here till the next session opens or whatever." Right? But what I did see that morning in the
050opening session was um an enthusiasm and an energy that I have not seen in a very long time. Um because honestly I don't think I've ever been in a space where all of Hamilton County staff from the secretary to the principal was in a building at the same time and people were like girl I didn't even know you still worked here. Oh, what are you doing now? Oh, you're coaching? Oh my god, let's go to I mean it was like this big reunion. It really was like a family reunion. And I know that's not what we were paying for, but I I do feel like they were learning as well, but I do think that that did something for them as staff and employees to see one another. Like they may have started out in
051one school together at their first year of teaching and didn't see each other again for 5 years. So, I just want to share that I have not heard that from district five um or any other district, honestly. And they they've been talking to us about a whole lot of stuff and they don't care who district they in right now. Um, but I just want to share that because I do think there were some opportunities for logistics. Um, but you you learn and you debrief and do whatever. But I I see a lot of value in that and a and offering things that maybe your school community might not offer you, but the district offered you and you're able to do that at a different level. And from what I understood, it was pretty much costneutral.
052It wasn't like we were spending an astronomical amount of money to go to the trade center um and do that. And I do know that in a lot of spaces in within our city as they try to partner with our school system, they make um I don't want to say concessions, but they work with our district sometimes and do inkind things to support the need um because they believe in public education. So I just want to say that I personally am advocating to keep that um because I don't think that it it it makes up the deficit that we have um for the needs that we have. But I I I can say that I've heard people say um staff I don't want to keep saying people, but the staff and the um employees of
053Hamilton County say that they benefited from that if nothing more than just for their um morale. King. Yeah. And so I'm going to ask a question because I don't know if it still exists, but uh teachers that had bachelor of science degrees were responsible for doing and again I'm going to date myself back when I was a principal. They were responsible for doing 81 hours of professional development or 81 points of some type of professional development uh to get their reertification. Now, I know they uh they got rid of that if you had a master's or above, but do they still do the PD requirements to reertify? Yes, sir. To renew your license, there's still a PDP development points. Now, that's a uh you know, of course, as educator, they're responsible for maintaining their license.
054So, but we work with all of educators to make sure they know exactly where they're at. A great job. I can get you that information. Well, no. This particular day, if I'm not mistaken, counts towards seven points out of that 81. Or I'm not sure we I think it's a good point. I think we need to research it. We hadn't used to years ago. If we could get those points, it would be So that was always the benefit of doing a a not a schoolwide professional development, but a district county districtwide. You got points for your reertification. We'll investigate. That's a good point, Mr. Connor. Thank you, Chair. So, u I appreciate uh Mr. Slater bringing it up because I I saw that through a few different things and it's good. I think it's always
055good to remember that as elected officials, part of our job is to help to educate the the public on things that we do behind the scenes. And so I think it's really good to bring that up and have the conversation. Um, as mentioned, I've I've gotten a lot of uh conferences in the past and there's there's always some parts that's not good, some parts that are really good. I would make the suggestion to open up the signups for them earlier so we get a chance to see which ones are going to fill up um and potentially double up on the offerings there. But um but again with that being the first time um seeing a lot of positives about it, I'm I'm confident that we can only exceed next time. So thank you. Um I
056do have to ask one more question though because on these half days, Shannon, we're calling them uh the PD days for personal development on a half day. Formally these days were used for teacher planning. Where in the calendar are we accessing in for for specific planning? And you are frowning at me, so I'm in trouble. No, I'm going to answer your question very carefully. Okay. Um the the three half days uh by the state are not something we have to use our our inclement weather days on. Okay. They are for professional development. Um we can define what the professional development is for those days but we have to submit a plan of professional development that happens. So I'm hearing the state requires it to be there to be a professional development day that has a
057submitted plan. Okay. Okay. And that's something that that's something that's changed. So, we our hands are tied for that. We have to submit a plan. Okay. I think I hear you. Yeah. Okay. Now, we're turning into the part where I need to be educated. And the blue days that are our inclement weather days, um those are for us to to determine. It's it's they're not state given days. We are allowed the three half days that are in the calendar at no penalty to us. Okay. The blue days are the inclement weather days that we choose to use for professional development and there's more flexibility. Okay. Okay, I hear you on that. Let's say this then. Um, when we come back to vote on this, I'll probably ask a similar question. So, let's make sure that
058when we're presenting, we have a place that we're putting teacher planning to be in there because as you know, uh, follow it so well and I appreciate you for that. The we just uh, the state sensed a new law talking about the amount of playtime, exercise time that children will be having during the day. So, we are going to be in a time crunch of um the ability to educate our kids and get them the exercise that's now required by law and let the teachers plan for their days. So, I'm preparing you. Thank you. I'll just comment that we always provide guidance. They can't do more than two hours of PD on a full day. The rest needs to be planning. So, that's the guardrails that we give to the principles. I'll also just say
059because you've gotten some questions. We did do a survey on the PD day for the August PD day. It was very very high on the learning. So close to 90% satisfaction on the learning and it was low on logistics. So we've taken all that feedback and made significant changes to the logistics. But the learning experience itself, what they got to do, what they're learning about there was very positive. So we've made adjustments. Restaurant logistics things. That's their biggest. It's true. Okay. Leia grown. Um, I'm just going to urge uh you to really um look at last year and the recommendations you get from those who are supposed to be getting information that they could walk away from and use in the classroom. Uh I I also was around there. I happened to sit at a
060table and of course teachers from all the same school and their comments were all negative and I know that's just one table but I was really surprised by that reaction. So I think it's important for you to look at what sort of information is going to be useful. And I can only use my personal experience of 18 years of teaching and 106 professional development days. There are only three three that I walked out of that professional development thinking I learned something that I could use to help me in my classroom. So that's an enormous amount of wasted time during my career that I could have used for something that was actually productive. And I want us at all cost to not fall into that situation. So I think it's incumbent on this board and us
061as individuals to know when these are happening, what is being instructed. We need to know because for me to learn things on the pulse after something has happened is useless to me as a board member. And that's being dead frank with you. So we I want to know what's happening in our schools before it happens. So, if I want to participate and observe and be there for our students and all of our staff, I want to be there. And I think there's several members of the board that might also, but I've got the luxury of being retired and this is fulltime for me. Yeah. So, I would say two things. The conference is actually in response to feedback that we got itself. So it is part of like the continuous improvement that day was part
062of they wanted more choice and more time to kind of cross-pollinate and so that was that was a continuous improvement move and we got feedback on things that we need to improve and are absolutely doing that. And then as far as the sessions we will be we'll link out the entire portfolio once we have it. We're right now you know creating the sessions. We are going to get it out earlier. or somebody said to get it out earlier. So, I think it was Ben to get it out earlier so they can they can tell us what they're interested in and we can put it in the right size places. But we'll absolutely send you the catalog of what um they can choose. Two of the sessions are required generally connected to the content they teach
063and two are choice sessions and they really liked that choice part last year. Yes, I know. Thank you. Okay. Anything on the 26 at least let me state you have the 2627 calendar too. So, they look very similar. they are two different calendars that we'll ask you to vote on next month. Um I just draw your attention on the 26th 27th to the week of spring break. That's always the thing we get the most feedback on. So to to kind of prep you all for that, um this year it does start to align again to Easter. It gets off balance a little bit in the way that we have to do our semesters. Um going into 2627, which isn't next year, but the next it aligns back to Easter in the March month. Okay. Anything
064else for Miss Moody? Thank you for all you do and I know it's a bunch. Thank you so much. Uh the next item is a voting item and it's it's our our sessions for proposed schedule of our sessions for 25 26. Motion to approve. So moved. Second. Second of course. Okay. I have one light Mr. King. So in that session uh the May meeting is May the 19th which also right right at graduation time. What? It's like it's like May 21st or May 21st. I think that we looked at that and it's it's not around gradu it's avoiding graduations. I think it's the last the issue is it is the last day of school but I didn't think that that would matter for this board. Oh, so that one is the last day. Well, I
065just come to say I have a group uh this year 8th grade promotion that's at night on this Thursday after I don't I don't think May we can put it any date that we're going to avoid everything you know. Okay, we can skip May next year. Mr. You would love that. Yeah, I it's if that is the really the last day, I'll be coming in here in field day closed as a room parent. But um quick question because that I did want to ask the same thing basically that Gary. So we we always move that up. How is that's the week if you move it up. It's the graduation. Yeah. The graduation graduation if we move it up the week before. Okay. I'm May 16th and whatever week that May 16th is in is graduation
066week because that's my birthday and it's always in graduations. Okay. Okay. That's because I'm That's all that's that's the way I I think why it's probably throwing you off. I didn't hit it. Sony just pointed out this year we just bumped it up to the eighth instead of bumping it back, you know, to the whatever. Yeah. I mean, last year for this calendar for our sessions, we have five that we had to move for holidays and spring break and fall break and yada yada yada. So, I looked through and that was the one that I had marked. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Roll call. Mrs. Black. Yes. Mr. Connor? Yes. Mr. Dy? Yes. Mr. Groan, yes. Mrs. Haden, yes. Mrs. Jones, yes. Mr. Keane, yes. Mrs. Schaefer, yes. Mr. Slater, yes. Miss Thomas, yes. Chairman Smith,
067yes. Okay, that takes us down to cons uh consideration of resolution. Is uh Sarah, I hope I say this right. Uh Mareski, are you here, Miss Sarah? Uh Miss Sarah, welcome. Uh, Miss Mareski, did am I saying that right? Is Margowski. Call me Sarah. Okay. Thank you, Miss Sarah. Miss Sarah is all the way from Franklin County and is on the board up there and is visiting us tonight. And, uh, boards, we we're kind of students one from another. And, uh, so, welcome and, and thank you for coming. So, uh, consideration of of resolution, uh, before I ask for a motion to approve, uh, I'm going to ask, uh, Miss Black if you would just make sure everybody understands what this resolution is. And, uh, since you helped, uh, author it. Sure. Um, first I
068want to say thank you to the community members for showing up um, in support of this resolution. Um, prior to my submission of my resolution for the agenda, teachers and staff were so concerned about this legislation that they got together and drafted their own resolution. Um, and then didn't have to submit it because they saw mine was on the agenda. They also collected about 500 signatures from teachers, staff, parents, and other community members um in support of a re resolution opposing current legislation, House Bill 0793 and Senate Bill 0836. Um, first I'm gonna read the resolution all the way through. And I'm sorry if that upsets people, but this is important enough that I want you to understand what we're voting on and hear the resolution as written and then I have things to say.
069Um whereas House Bill 0793, Senate Bill 0836 as introduced authorizes LEAs and public charter schools to refuse to enroll students who are unlawfully present in the United States. And whereas the 14th amendment to the Constitution of the United States includes equal protection clause and the due process clause which through court cases has been shown to include public education as a property right the fifth amendment for all. And article two, section 12 of the Tennessee constitution, the education clause states that the ta state of Tennessee recognizes the inherent value of education and encourages its support. Whereas recognizing the inherent value of education implies duty to educate all. Whereas the Tennessee Department of Education website website states that the Tennessee Department of Education serves over 900,000 students in 147 districts with both significant urban and rural populations.
070As a state agency, we are dedicated to improving student academic achievement and committed to the belief that children from all backgrounds can succeed when given the opportunities they deserve. Tennessee K- through2 education operates with a common goal to provide the best for all students. When we say when we say for all students and from all backgrounds, we must mean all and not just some. Whereas the Hamilton County Board of Education is charged with governing the school district so that all students regardless of background needs or ability receive the best possible education educational opportunities in order to think critically and to graduate prepared to enter a post-secary institution or the workforce. And whereas the just cause of the Hamilton County schools is that all children thrive and experience a future without limits. Whereas we believe it
071is important to educate all students who come to us in order to fulfill that mission. Whereas House Bill 0793 and Senate Bill 0836 is in conflict with the fifth and 14th amendments to the Constitution of the United States, the Tennessee Constitution, and the Tennessee Department of Education as well as the Hamilton County Board of Education. Now therefore, be it resolved that Hamilton County Board of Education expresses its opposition to House Bill 0793, Senate Bill 0836, and urges the Tennessee General Assembly to vote to oppose the passage of this bill. [Applause] So, um, today I'm I'm going to I'm going to Thank you. Uh, Miss Black, I'm going to give you the I'm going to ask for a motion to approve your resolution. So, move. So, move. Second. Sorry, Clar. So, I was going to give
072you that. I think the second Please let Sorry. Please let Larry be the motion. Julie, I put forward the motion that we support this res [Applause] and then after after Miss Black, I have a comment to make and I will happily and gladly so properly motioned and seconded now discussion. So, Mr. Grump, wait a second. Miss Black is Mr. Black is supposed to Okay, go ahead. Okay. Um, we got a deal going. Yeah, we do. Okay. Um, many people have thanked me for bringing forth this resolution in support of all children in Hamilton County attending in support of all children in Hamilton County attending school for free without the barriers of fear or financial burden. I've shrugged off their remarks because to me I had no choice but to bring this resolution. I've said many
073times in conversation because in conversation, but in case I have not said it behind the deis, the 40 plus thousand students in Hamilton County schools are my most important constituents. Whether they or their parents can cast a vote for me or not, I represent the students in Hamilton County schools first. [Applause] Ultimately, we are accountable to them to provide the best educational experiences and support we can. Every child in this county deserves a chance to thrive and experience a future without limits. I honestly cannot believe that we are having this conversation tonight. Thank you. This proposed legislation is outside what I believe is our moral responsibility to each other as friends and neighbors who live in community together. The idea of looking into the bright shining face of a child eager to learn and denying
074them the opportunity is disgusting to me. I know that some of my colleagues do not see the this resolution as necessary because of the unconstitutional nature of this legislation. However, this legislation does in fact pose a question that we as a school board must answer. Will we provide a free and accessible education to every child in our community? Or will we be a barrier to their future that they must overcome? [Applause] Okay, Mr. I I didn't know y'all had a had an agreement there, so I apologize. Go ahead, Mr. Gr. Okay. You would think that being one of the most conservative people on this board, I would I would be for this, but having been blessed uh by my Army wife's career of teaching in four different states, four different school districts, and they always
075moved me in September. They moved her in September, August, and January once. So the blessing was that I got to substitute at all the school districts in the area. So it just so happens that Eastridge High School almost mirrors the high school I retired from in Colorado. We had 275 illegal kids out of 400,450 students. And I got those kids on airplanes to compete in national chess tournaments with birth certificates from Mexico and school IDs. I did this for seven years and went out and raised almost $40,000 by myself to do this. I can not I've taught at schools that were that over 80% of the property within that school district was not US territory. It was we got our funds from the Bureau of Indian Affairs. I taught at schools where over 20% of
076the student population were Native Americans, registered Native Americans. So, I've taught at schools where I've had a student watch as someone drove up, started an argument, and shot and killed their brother. So, I just can't see. I understand what Senator Watson's motivation is. As stated in this document, they want the Supreme Court to revisit Plyier versus Do. Okay, that's fine. But you're not going to come to me as an educator and now as you know fulfilling my desire to to be as helpful as I can to my community. You cannot expect me to violate federal law and I have to oppose this. Okay. So, you know, when for something to go on the agenda, you have to have a second. So, um, Mrs. Black reached out to me and I told her I would be
077glad to because we don't agree on everything. We're in some cases we totally disagree ideologically, but this is no place for that. Let this be thought out at the federal level. and let's reduce all this anxiety and consternation that is being caused by this. And all it's doing is creating exactly what I said. We we're supposed to make school safe for our students, not encourage fear. So that's why I am supporting this and wanted to second this. So thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Slater, thanks. Um, Miss Black, I'm probably one of those that thinks this is useless uh because of the it's already been settled by the Supreme Court. Um, I think when the vote comes I'll I'll probably abstain. Mr. King. Well, I'd like to remind people that even though
078I am going to support the resolution, uh, don't think bad about Senator Watson. This, uh, Senator Watson is a huge proponent of education. He's working hard right now to try to get more prek classes and thing. Uh he might have missed the mark on this one, but he is for who? He he is a I didn't interrupt I didn't interrupt you, Miss Black, when you were reading your resolution. Uh so uh just remember he does look out for Hamilton County, Tennessee. Uh but yes, I will support this resolution. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, Michelle, I was just going to say that um well, clearly I'm supporting this bill. I mean, I had a whole I I I became viral for this two years ago, but um I just want to say to those who may
079feel like it's useless is that um yes, there are things in place, but we clearly see that a lot of things that are that have been in place are being undone and unraveled. And even and even if it's not particularly the the case with this particular um case that has set precedents years back, you have to stand for something and you have to be able to show people that I mean it might be useless, it might matter, it may not. The bill may pass, it may not, but at the end of the day, the children of Hamilton County and the the residents of Hamilton County, the parents and teachers um that were once these children that have been successful products of our system will know that you stood for them and their right. And so
080I'm we're living in a day and time where I feel like a lot of things are useless, but I still fight for them and I stand for them because you have to stand for something or in the words of my granny, you'll fall for anything. And I don't want to fall for just anything. So you have to stand for something. And if I don't stand for anything else, I'm going to stand for children who do not have the capacity to go and stand for themselves. [Applause] Thank you, chair. So it's important to point out um a continuence of what uh my illustrious co-board member just said. As a legislative chair, I spent a lot of time in Nashville um advocating for our schools. And this bill in Nashville by the folks that are supporting it
081is called the Plyer Bill. Make no mistake, the goal is to overturn what we just said is is law, the law of the land. The goal of this bill is to overturn the law of the land and to continue down that road. It's also to put that bill for overturning the law to us. They want us to have to defend ourselves when we have to do this stupid law and deny children an education. It's not fair to anybody and it needs to go away. And we need to take a hard stance to say that we want it to go away. Every day I have four little children that look up to me and to need me to get them to school, need me to get them taking Well, obviously we're noticing that one of them
082is quickly on her way to being self-sufficient, but three at least that that need my care. But there are also more than 40,000 children that depend on the 11 members of this board. And not every one of those 40,000 children is a documented child. And some of the children that we're thinking about that I'm saying documented are also some of our poorest community members that I have tried my damnedest to stand up for because they can't afford to get their birth certificate that they have no idea where it was because it was in the Oldsmobile that they lived in last month. Those children will be affected too, citizens next to us because of how poorly this bill is written. We owe it to the children to the future of our community to stand up for
083what is right, to stand up for those children, and to vote because they can't. [Applause] No more lights. Roll call. Mrs. Black, yes. Mr. Connor, vehemently yes. Mr. Dy, yes. Mr. Groan, yes. Mrs. Haden, abstain. Mrs. Jones, yes. Mr. Keane, yes. Mrs. Schaefer, abstain. Mr. Slater, abstain. Mrs. Thomas, yes. Chairman Smith, yes. Shall that count? Eight. Eight. Yes. Three abstensions. Okay. Very good. Thank you, Miss White. [Applause] Okay, thank you very much. Let's move on. It takes us down to uh yes uh creation of positions and lines of authority. I'm going to recognize our policy chair uh Jodie Schaefer. Thank you, Chair. As the policy chair in these budget discussions, it is my duty to make sure the board is aware of our policies and our duties. And this one is very um important as
084it comes to the budget. So I'm gonna I'm gonna read the first few lines. The first portion of creation of positions. All existing staff positions shall be approved from year to year through the annual budget process and in accordance with an organizational plan submitted by the directors of schools and approved by the board. Before any new or additional position is created, the board must specifically approve it. If the appro if the proposed position is new to the district, the director of schools must first present a job description and a compensation package for the board's consideration. While the director of schools has the authority to reorganize the operational structure of the school system from time to time, no such reorganization shall have any impact on the budget without prior approval of the board. The superintendent provided
085us today with a draft organizational chart. Um, he emailed that to us today. I did not print you all copies, but he emailed it today. I want to bring the board's attention to there are some new positions on this chart that the board needs to review. We do not have the job description or the additional um compensation package as the policy requires. I'm sure that he will provide that. But it is some new titles at least, whether you call them new positions, they are at least new titles with some different compensation that are line item in the new proposed budget. So I want to bring all of that to the board's attention. It is my understanding. I have consulted with Ben Torres of the Tennessee um schoolboard association how this policy plays out. So, this
086is what he emailed us if you want to look at it. I was like, you have something I don't have. No, he came into It's in your email. I did not print you a copy. Um, Mr. Torres has helped walk me through this process so that I can explain it to you and Mr. Bennett has graciously also advised me um as we're reviewing positions because I know many of you have heard from constituents just like I have concerns about some positions in the organizational chart and as we are bringing those to the superintendent and I personally have brought some to the superintendent already and I encourage board members to have those discussions as well. we also have to have them as a board. Um, but as we're having these discussions, if particular positions come up
087that we want to discuss, if as discussions go, the board a board member decides to make a motion, I want to advise you how to make that motion. So, it's a two-fold motion. We have to first make a motion to eliminate the position from the organizational chart. And with that, you have to make a joining motion to also eliminate or strike all the funding for that position in a line item budget and all the supporting funding. And before I I go forward, I do want to say more. Will you be typing this sentence to us? Mr. B and I can get together and just so that if you could send me that email from Mr. Torres. It was a phone conversation. Yeah. Um but that is how he explained to me the process of how
088to do this. And I want to say to all administration, this is a hard time. We are making we're having discussions. We've have been for weeks and people are on the edge of their seats of whether or not they're going to have a job or not. And I feel that and I know that you feel it. And so I want to say that any discussion of a position is not personal. These are business discussions that we have to have. Unfortunately, we are in this position that we're going to have to make cuts. I, as a board member, want to make an overarching theme of what's best and right for children and a customer service approach. As I look at this, I can't speak for my other board members and I've heard from many constituents that
089they want me to look at non- studententf facing cuts first and I am promising to do that as this board member. I can't speak for the rest. But as we're having these discussions in the days and meetings to come, I don't want anyone to think it's personal. It is merely a business decision. We have a job to do and it's difficult but that's what we're here to do. It's what we're elected to do. Um I also want to reference the statute of the superintendent authority. So Tennessee code annotated 492301. If you go down to B subsection CC, it reads as such. This is the authority of the director of schools. Within the approved budget and consistent with existing state laws and board policies, the superintendent employs, transfers, suspends, non-renews, and dismisses all personnel license or
090otherwise. So that means the board, the superintendent gives us his organizational chart and that is him telling us this is what he thinks he needs to run the district effectively. He also gives us a proposed budget. The board shall according to our policy review each position in the org chart from year to year whether it's new or an existing. That's our duty. When we approve the org chart and the budget or when we remove positions and funding in the budget, once it's set, we can't tell the superintendent who to hire and put in those positions. That is his authority under state law. The Tennessee General Assembly is who sets this system up. That is who gives the board our authority and that's what we operate under. We've set this policy. I did not draft this
091policy. This has been on the books for quite some time before me. We followed state law and we follow policy and the state law sets out what we do and it sets out what superintendent does and we are meant to work together in this process. Um in reading that the superintendent does get to set the organizational chart. We have discussed it. I know he and I have spent many hours and I want to thank you for spending the many hours that we have talked. Um I will say that the org chart you gave me is not quite as flat as I would want and I I've provided everybody the county's org chart and the superintendent has it but I understand that you have the authority to do that to set that. And as we go
092forward, I'm going to say there are some positions that I want to discuss that I have questions about and I've had constituents have questions about. One of the first ones is community superintendent. And I understand that in the past we maybe had three. They were called directors. They were high school, middle school, elementary, but we've elementary two two elementary. Okay. But there were less than the community superintendents we have now. But prior to that we had prior to that we had similar to what we have now. Just saying I we don't have to open all that up tonight for discussion. I'm I want to be clear that I've had these communications with the superintendent and those are discussions that I will want to continue to have with this board whether that's tonight or we decide
093to do that at the next finance committee meeting. Another one that I want to bring forward because I've had this discussion and I've been asked from constituents to have this discussion is the deputy superintendent position. This is a position I have talked to attorney Ben Torres about and again he's the Tennessee School Board Association attorney. He has advised me that I'm not the first school board member to have this conversation this year. There are some talks across the state that school boomers are looking at this position. In the words of attorney Ben Torres, it is the most powerful position with no oversight from the board in the org chart. And when I'm told that, I have to take a step back and consider is that the case and how do we remedy that? Can we
094remedy that with some oversight of the board, but the board has one employee? So, those are the two top positions. There are some others that we may get into, but because I want to be transparent with my constituents of the conversations I've been having with the superintendent. It has been around the organizational chart and has been around some of these top positions that carry a high dollar amount in the budget. From there, I'll open it up to anyone else. Chairman Smith. Uh, yes. Go ahead. Go ahead. So, I appreciate bringing this topic and and being transparent with conversations we have. So, I want to make sure that I'm transparent with the conversations that that we've had. Um, we've done a lot over the last three years to uh be transparent. Uh, it started with any
095change in a job description, bringing it, getting it approved, electronic files on copy, talked to Dr. Brown about putting those online so they're available for anyone to see. Um, so the transparency piece is something that I think previous board uh in this administration has been very on top of. Uh, I also want to make sure that my team hears the conversations that I've heard had with Miss Schaefer because uh, when when you name specific positions, I I want the five community superintendent that we have for them to know exactly how they important they are. They oversee a bigger body of work than 90% of the superintendent in Tennessee. Uh if you look at most of the community superintendent, they're overseeing anywhere from 8 to 12,000 kids. Uh which is a larger responsibility than every single
096surrounding county that we uh are next to. Uh they they do get compensated uh I wouldn't say what they deserve, but well um and that's because of the body of work that they carry. I think it's also important to look at the results that each of them have been getting and and make sure that we're we're uh judging them by the work they've done. But I want them to hear me say publicly that we couldn't do this work without them uh and that they are super important to our organization. Uh deputy superintendent uh in in that position, Miss Schaefer is right, it's the most powerful position that you don't have direct oversight of. If you take that position out, then there's going to be another position that's the most powerful uh position that you don't
097have oversight of because she is correct. You have one employee. It's me. It's been very clear with Miss Schaefer that if accountability is the worry, put it in my evaluation. The reason our deputy superintendent is sitting here is because I have more respect and trust for her in this position than anyone I've ever worked with. So, I'm not worried about putting it in my evaluation. So, if accountability is the issue, we'll figure out accountability. And I'm open to any suggestions that that you have to make sure that you feel like you've got accountability through me as a superintendent to Dr. Stewart, who again have more trust and more admiration for as a educator than anyone I've ever worked with. I've also said to to Miss Schaefer, I this is a tough relationship, right? I mean,
098the the board uh one employee, 11 bosses, like uh what what we've got to figure out is trust and and I know I'm not there with uh you know, all of our newer board members, but I I'm working towards that. I I pointed out to her the other day in three years, three years as superintendent, three different boards and 18 individually different board members. Put that up against any superintendent in the state. There's no way that that anyone's matching that. Uh at some point, we've got to have the trust. What I ask from you is uh when we look at these positions that you you trust me to put the right people in the right place to keep moving this district forward and doing it in a way that um is supporting kids across this
099county. Uh we we are going to bring some positions to you with with uh different job descriptions. The ones that are on here, they have different titles. They're not different job descriptions. we can bring uh the old job descriptions and the one that's currently posted to to point that out. The I think the one that we're talking about is the chief of student supports. It is uh almost identical. I think it is actually identical to the uh chief equity officer. It's just a different name. That chief equity position had had kind of contracted in what um was overseeing and it's said but we've made cuts and as I point out on this uh we're going to have to look at this more as we go into May 8th. uh a lot of these physicians author
100like what they're overseeing has expanded. Um but but I do I I do want to publicly say like Miss Schaefer, we have spent a ton of time talking about this, probably more time than either one of us would want to. I'm open to the same conversations with the rest of this board. Ultimately ultimately you uh do only have one employee. Um, and and we've got to get to a place where uh you trust me to do this work because I 100% trust the team that we've put together. Miss Jones. So, um, what Mrs. Schaefer has pointed out about policy and code annotated and the laws and all of that, that's been a thing that I've lived since 2014. And um I don't think that there was ever a time that any board and I'm I'm
101starting to kind of feel like Justin because I feel like I have sat on the several boards with several people as well. Um I four superintendent three superintendent searches and bus tragedies, child maltreatment tragedies. I've sat through a lot and I um I've seen the org chart look a couple of different ways since I've been here. Um and I would probably argue well debate anybody currently on this day is that as the org chart has evolved it gets it improves every time from when I got here. Um, I have mixed emotions about what I just heard from my colleague to to to my left because um, personally as a board member, I've taken time since the first time I ever said it this day is right over there where Mr. is to learn and to
102build relationships with several different employees that some have retired, some are still here, some have moved into different positions. I've watched some of them grow career-wise. Uh Dr. Brown, I'm looking at him now. I remember when I came, he was a principal and here he is. Um but I built relationship and I was able to build rapport and relationships because um in doing that well let me say I built trust because I was able to build relationships and rapport and get to know people in their roles. Um Dr. Stewart is deputy, Dr. Towns is deputy. Um Jill Levine is chief academic. Neie is instructional um director. Robert Sharp has been in several positions since I've been here. Um, Dr. Sharp has. Um, and I'm saying all that to say that um, in my role professionally,
103I employ four directors. I have a deputy administrator position that reports directly to me and that person is like my right hand because in the event that I ever hit the lottery, that person needs to be able to step up cuz I'm out of there. Second. Um, and aside from that, even with my directors, I build relationship because in the event that both of us hit the lottery, they going to have to step up. Um, but I'm saying all that to say that trust is very important and it goes both ways. It go what I've learned in this role is that you trust your employee to do his job because that is who you hired to do the job. They trust you as their supervisor to support them in feeling that they are um able
104to do the job you have hired them to do, that they hold the skill set to do that. And then because we only have one um employee, and I say this across the district all the time, you know, they'll see me coming in school and say, "Oh, here come the boss." And I'm like, "Uh-uh, Justin Robinson your boss. Brian Johnson your boss, Rick Smith your boss. I'm not your boss. I'm Justin's boss." Um one of now 11 used to be one and nine. I liked it a little better at nine. just no no pun to my new people, but it was it's a lot with with two more people. But saying all that to say, you have to build trust. And I just do not believe as an employee and an employer that it's good
105culture and climate for us to even be here right now. I just I'm not sure what this is going to do for the culture and climate that I know Hamilton County Schools has worked so hard to improve. Um, that's just a concern I have. Aside from that, we keep talking about cuts. And maybe it's just me and I'm really big on manifesting, but I'm not manifesting cutting anything. I'm manifesting this somewhere, the universe or whomever you believe in, God for me, is going to work it out and it's going to be money because the narrative needs to be funding, not cuts. Because as we continue to talk cuts, we will continue to invade upon the culture and climate that we have worked so hard to create. It's going to cause division. It's going to cause
106angst. And if you have never seen an exodus, step on the anthill. People will start to move like never before. And you talking about cuts. we not going to have to cut cuz they going to go right across the state line, right across the county line, make more money, and not have to deal with us. Not us, but us. And so I'm saying that because we are in a very delicate dance right now as it relates to public education. I don't want to cut a social worker. I don't want to cut a community superintendent cuz they save my life on a daily basis. They probably say justice too cuz sometimes I I'm able to call them and they can nip it in the bud and never probably even make it to justice or Dr. Stewart
107or Sonia. But I'm saying that to say we really need to think about I'm not saying we shouldn't review but we really need to think about how we handle this just as with another employee another time. I just I don't believe that it's good culture and climate too. You have to have tough conversations. I understand it. to sit in front of someone just like with the teachers and the seed coaches and the nurses and have a conversation. That's hard for me too. I don't believe I don't I don't like that to sit in front of somebody and talk about alleviating their jobs. Even though it is our job to look at budget, we employ him to do this. And I will say this, having live for superintendent, I've seen some leave for less. But if
108I was Dr. Robinson, when you going to start to tell me who I need to support me in a second time in a second contract with a district doing what we doing, I tell you how to kick rocks because I'm marketable and we've seen it with other superintendent. They will leave us, go somewhere else, knock it out the ballpark, and we somewhere over here dwindling our twiddling our thumbs. And I will tell you, I'm glad I don't have to sit through another superintendent search because we not the employee that people run around here looking for. Let's be clear. Justin is here because he loves his hometown. I just want to be clear. People can take it however they want to take it. I just want to be clear. If you ever go back and sit
109through some boy means I sit through for the last 10 years, you will see we are not the best thing since sliced brick. We're striving to get there. I want to say to Dr. Robertson as the only person I'm responsible for and he and I go back and forth many a days. I trust you to do your job. I trust you to know what you need and who you need to surround yourself with to make Hamilton County successful. And while I will do my due diligence as I have for the last 10 years in reviewing this org chart that come in the big old book y'all give us and all the pay scales and all those other things, I still trust you to hire the staff that you need to do what I have tasked
110you to do. And I have to say that because sometimes people get I don't know it's a learning curve. But I just want to say if you ever are concerned, anybody on this day is that peer mine and you have a learning curve and you have questions, I am always here to provide the historical context. I can lead you straight to certain meetings, tell you what date, time, provide you the packets. I have three Rubbermaid toes and I'mma leave with y'all next year of paperwork. But I just wanted to say that I trust Justin just as I trusted Dr. Johnson, Dr. Kelly, and Rick Smith to do their jobs. That is what we have been empowered to do as we advocate for the community and follow Tennessee co-editing and everything else. I trust that because
111I'm pretty sure there's some people out there that probably voted some for some of us that feel like uh oh I made the wrong choice. Speak for yourself. Thank I voted for myself so I made the right choice. Boo for yourself. Thank you Matt. All right. Um, I appreciate us being able to have this conversation publicly. Um, because you're right, I have, you know, had people talk about the structure of central office to me and a lot of people don't understand the structure of central office. Um, just to be clear, but specifically these two positions, the community superintendent and the deputy superintendent. Um, I'm trying to imagine what it would be like if we eliminated these positions and Justin, Dr. Robertson had to personally oversee D 72 direct reports from our 72 school principal. 72
112is it 72? 76. I can't ever get the count right. Too many. I can't imagine being in any other corporate or private or public setting having 72 direct reports that are responsible for over 40,000 children with no help. That doesn't make any sense to me. Um, our community superintendent are there's five of them. They're organized by communities. Um, and I know that they have personal relationships with their direct reports, 10, 12 each, um, however many they have, but a manageable number of direct reports. And then those superintendent report directly to our deputy superintendent who works with our superintendent in tandem on everything. culture decisions, organizational decisions. I know that you rely on your deputy deputy s superintendent um very heavily. Um I think you'll work very well together as a team. Um, but I'm just
113trying to imagine what it would be like if we did during budget discussions eliminate these positions and put our poor superintendent in charge of 72 direct reports that oversee 40,000 children and 72 individual school budgets. That doesn't that I it doesn't compute. I I can't even imagine asking a single human being to do that. So, I appreciate the organization that we have. I appreciate the people that we have in our um in those positions and I just wanted to kind of paint a picture for those um who maybe not don't understand the the organization of central office very well um what that might be like. Okay, Miss Fel. Yes. Okay. Um, if the sky was the limit and money was no issue, it would be great to keep everybody every employee is valued. But that's
114not the reality. Uh, everyone knows we have to make cuts and for me it was very disappointing that the first places we chose were exceptional education students with disabilities. Then we had to make a few more and it was nurses and magnet transportation. um in just those areas and not enough at the top. And I do have some facts um as far as central office staff and this was uh anyway I showed that we have 499 at central office. Okay, tell me how many 417 in last year's budget. 417. Okay. I was trying to see where some of these came. some proposed maybe they miscalculate 417 um Rutherford County and I did talk to a school board member there that is a friend of a friend um their size is larger 52,000 um employees and
115this says 215 as the central office but I think she said 240 and so close to 200 fewer employees at the central office and they are a level five school. Well, that's what I was told by a board member at you. You've got to just when you when you talk about central operations, it's important with other districts to make sure we're talking about the same thing. So, for example, um Rutherford County and and I I can confirm this, but uh I'm almost 100% positive they don't include their maintenance team in central operations. So our maintenance team which is um I think 111 people uh also things like transportation staff IT staff oftentimes don't get um computed in it. Um and I hear you I want to I want to just correct one thing like the
116first things we we cut weren't actually special ed. I mean we we made some decisions even before we brought uh the budget to you guys. Um and and we've talked about them like even in our staffing model and the projections that was done before um you know we've cut over $3 million from central operations uh that that we said from the beginning we were going to do. So, we're we're open to to continuing to look at this. Not, you know, had a had multiple conversations with the chairman and with chairman of the finance committee about what we're doing over the next few days to get us ready for that next finance meeting. Uh, and and confident that we'll we'll have some options, but um just want to make those two. Okay. And I'll check with
117the Rutherford um uh school board member and ask about those other things. I was doing a comparison as far as financing. Um I have some budgets from previous years. Uh I'll just start with 2021. Our school budget was 456 million approximately. And so in just a few years we've grown to 635 million. So close to 200 million more. What years are you looking at the um let's see is the Hamilton County let's see revenues by source funds general source let's see it was provided by the county commission what I know I'm asking what FY what it's oh um 2021 was 456 in general and you can so and that's one thing that mayor wamp has voiced is that, you know, we're coming to them for more money and our budget has ballooned, you know, over
118a hundred million, close to 200 million in recent years. Another thing that I understand and was given this information is that um Hamilton County uh we've given to the schools or the commission 43% of their budget which 151,000 151 million approximately. Um, as far as Knoxville, if we're comparing, 33% of theirs goes and theirs was only 100 million. Knoxville, a much larger school system. Um, and Montgomery County only 19% of theirs and 33 million approximately to the school board. So, you know, they're 50,000 50 million more than Knoxville as far as county commission giving the money to the school system. Um, they also made the point that we're not getting money from the city, you know. So, um, but however you want to look at that, the county commission is saying that they're doing their
119part um and that our budgets balloon by hundreds of millions. So, you know, I think sometimes we have to be reasonable because the next thing we'd have to do is raise taxes to be able to cover everything we want to fund. And it just seems like, you know, there's no limit to positions and things that we can do in the school system. But when we're talking now about cutting nurses and magnet schools, let alone what about teacher pay? teachers need an increase. They need a raise. They are not feeling valued. I guarantee that. And exceptional education teachers and um you know uh the sky's is not the limit. And I think a lot of people are looking at central office as the place we really need to make steep cuts to as far as the
120increases. And maybe if we do that, the teachers will get a raise that they so deserve. But after this, I'm just saying I know we have a budget meeting in a couple weeks. I know we have more to cover um then. So, you know, I'm hoping that we can postpone the rest of budget talks until then. Mad and I uh sent out a memo along with Chairman Smith earlier today. A lot of I think what you're getting is from that county commission meeting yesterday and u sent a memo back to the county commission in response to some of the concerns that they raised and there's there's a lot of things that um you know super important to uh point out. Um a lot of that budget increase had to do with er funds questions about
121how we spent er funds put in that memo exactly how we did it. How many positions carried over into GP? How many have been cut since then to show that we've actually cut more positions than carried over into GP? Uh also got TISA funding, right? 67 million um from the state that corrected BEP, which this uh sorry, not this board, previous board was in a lawsuit over uh because BEP was not properly funding large urban districts. Tissa has corrected that. Um and and you know I had a really good conversation with uh chairman of the commission this morning and I want to make it clear to him like this doesn't have to be pointing at fingers at at them or pointing fingers back at us. But at some point we do have to ask ourselves
122questions about as a community what do we want from a public school system and what are we willing to pay for that public school system. Uh the reason so many people were here tonight honestly has nothing to do with budget cuts. It has to do with what we are having to cut. We've cut plenty. If you go back two years ago when we first got TISA, we actually cut 12 million from central operations and sent it directly to schools. You didn't see anybody show up at the meeting. reason they're showing up now is because we're not cutting into flesh and we're not cutting into fat. We're cutting muscle and we're cutting bones. And I told you at the state of the system that we're going to have to make cuts that hurt outcomes. And the
123reason 150 people showed up is because those are the cuts that we're having to consider. and we're gonna have to keep considering those until as a community we decide what we want to do with a public school system. I I think the city and and you know I've reached out to the city and going to continue to have those conversations with them. I think we do need to have cordial conversations as a community even with the municipalities of saying how do we invest in public education the right way? But the narrative that always comes up, and I'm a little I'll be honest, I'm a little bit frustrated right now, and I'm trying not to be. The narrative that always comes up is that it's central office. Regardless of the number of positions, it's 8%. It's
124going to be less than that because we cut already 7 and a half% from central office. It's 8% of an organization that employs 5,500 people. So it will be under 400 even when you count those maintenance employees uh for next year. So the the idea that we can fix this budget by cutting central office, you could cut the entirety of central office and it wouldn't generate as enough money uh that would that would fix the entirety of this budget, right? the outcomes we've been getting over the past five years, past six years, it's hard to argue against them. And part of that is because the investment that came from Esser and the investment that came from TISA and and again um I think reading that memo would be really helpful to to better understand I've
125looked over it, but we have recommended other ways though too like getting rid of benchmark testing. benchmark testing $600,000. It's not going to fix the budget. Well, I'm just saying other places and giving principles more strategic funds and you know, keeping mud and most positions and uh given principles discretion and how they um in how they staff their own buildings. I think we need to trust principles more in how they staff their own buildings. They know what they need, which is most of the positions and the but I still feel like they need more discretion. All right, Miss Thomas. Thank you. having to be one of the five new board members on this board. I sit and I listen and I observe and I have interacted with um through my other job I interact often
126with central office and I've looked at some of the things they have still looking however I've only been on this board for several months and not making excuses but I don't quite understand the process of the school and all its interworkings when it comes to us looking at this and saying, "I want to cut this, I want to cut that," or whatever. But what I do know is that every successful organization has a chair, a vice chair. When you're looking at uh county commissioners, city councils, when you're looking at nonprofits, they have a president, a vice president. They may have a CEO, they have a CFO. You can't one single person can't do it alone. what that looks like, I don't know. But I know they cannot be successful and build strong foundations alone. So
127my opinion, and I've told Dr. Robertson this, I don't know enough. So I have to trust who the one person is that I do supervise. Now, does can there be some cuts in central office? Sure. I'm pretty sure there is because when I look at this budget that's kind of confusing because it's right here, some is over here, some stuff is over there. So when I look at this budget, I see positions like I give you an example, coordinator. It's like you get a coordinator, you get a coordinator, you get a coordinator or you get a direct you and and for me I want to clearly understand and that's a question I have. So but that'll be a conversation I have. explain to me cuz I often ask explain to me how this works because
128for me things can be simple. Oh, we can just take money from here. But that's not the reality of it. So I need someone to if I'm asking Dr. Robertson to explain this to me. He doesn't have time to keep explaining everything to me and do everything else with those however many principles, however many schools, however many students we truly do have. Now, I've had principles to tell me that actually they benefit from their area superintendent person. I've asked that question. I've had people also tell me it's too many of them. So, I don't know truly what that looks like and how that process really truly works. But can some people possibly be cut from central office? Sure. But I'm going to trust I'mma ask the question now just like Dr. Robinson proposed to to
129us. This is what he's proposing to possibly cut. We can propose as well. Well, what about this? Well, tell me how this works before I cut it. Just like the board needed to understand how social workers work, how nurses work, how all of that intertwines, how you fit the pieces together. I think as a new board member to represent my community effectively, I need to learn exactly what I'm supposed to do, how everything's supposed to work and hold Dr. Robinson accountable if it does not work out because I don't know all of the inner workings and assure you're going to hurt someone. So, anytime it comes to direct service to children, I'm not really for cutting that. anytime it comes to safety for children, that's a non-negotiable for me. But I also want to see
130how it works. And I think it's fair of of of Jod to say, "Hey, I want to see what this person does." I don't I don't question that because I think we need to know what how all the inner workings work. But to possibly suggest we just have one person because we we have Dr. Robinson. He's the only person we supervise. And for me to suggest now Dr. Stu uh Stewart, I mean we work together. We don't always agree. However, to suggest that we don't have someone to assist or to help or to work all of that out, whether her expertise is in data, whether her expertise is in something else, you can't have a all for one person doing everything. And I don't think that would be fair of us to even look at
131possibly cutting the organizational chart based on what Rutherford County does. They they don't have our needs. They don't know what our needs are, what Memphis does, what Shelby does, what Knox County does. It's so many inter interworkings within their their process and what they do have and what they don't have. And maybe Hamilton County doesn't have that. I think we need to look at our own needs. You can compare always, but you can't really truly compare because you don't know their county. They're going to tell you the good things and some may tell you the bad things. So, I think it's fair for us to look at what Jod may be recommending. Doesn't hurt to look at it, but we also need to respect as board members that we do need a process. We do
132need an organizational type chart. And I don't make that kind of money. I don't have that kind of time. I'm just telling you all to be doing Dr. Robinson's job. I'm going to hold him accountable for doing that job and making some of those decisions where cuts need to be. I don't have a problem voting yay or nay at the end of the day on anything. But I just don't want the court to dismantle something. We truly don't even understand the interworkings of all of what we have gotten ourselves into. And I just want to say just please look at that and consider that and and we go from there. That's all. Thank you, Miss Thomas. Um I've been uh I spent 40 years working with tough kids. I mean a lot of throwaway kids
133and kids that that have been labeled in school. That kid right there, he's troublemaker and that's what everybody feels about him. But every kid that I've ever taken into one of my programs and I work with, I always say this, uh, I'm going to trust you, young man, until you give me a reason not to. I tell every one of them that, and a lot of times it ain't very long till they give me a reason not to. Uh, Dr. Robertson, you've never given me a reason not to. You've never given me a reason not to. Uh, I agree with Miss Schaefer. We need to understand. We need to ask questions. We need to understand. Uh, but I appreciate your work and I trust you and you're you know a whole lot more about this
134than I'll ever know. And uh I don't always enjoy boxing with you like we box back there in that back room sometimes. And sometimes I win, sometimes you win. Uh but I but I trust the work. I appreciate Miss Schaefer wanting clarity. There's nothing wrong. Absolutely nothing wrong with that. But I'm I'm uh I'm like uh my friend Chrisa. We we've been through uh several superintendent. I don't want to go through that again. Uh and at least in my 10 years. I've never trusted one more. And I I appreciate your work. Uh Ben Doy. Thank you, Chair. Uh Dr. Robertson, there's no doubt you have a hard job. Uh, and the reality is is in my mind, one of the biggest facets when you look at responsibility is balancing the budget, right, year-over-year. Because when
135you don't, and I'm not saying we're not, but when you don't, you end up in situations like we're in today. And that's when you got to have difficult conversations. And um, we pay you well. Should we pay you more? I'd love to be paying you more if you continue to do a great job and deliver balanced budget and do, you know, good outcomes with the kids. I have no problem with that. And I think the board would agree with me on that. we want to keep the right guy on the job. Um, I know we're all talking about a couple different things, talking about Jod's policy that she discussed. Um, just one note on that. Um, at the end of the day, we've got a responsibility as a board to provide oversight and there's no
136one single person that has all the answers for public education. It's a collective work of people and that's why we have a board and that's why we went from 9 to 11 and and that's why we have the opportunity to come and speak once a month and share our ideas and input. We don't always agree but we're having healthy discussion. That's what makes a good board a good board is to act act as a governing body. And part of that's oversight. Um and the reality is is we are in a challenging situation. And I hate saying that phrase because I feel like I've said it so many freaking times and I've lost sleep over this thing because I know there's hard decisions as is evident with all the people that were here tonight. Um I
137I I would just encourage the board not to get super granular on the budget right now because we do have that finance committee on the 30th and we could spend all night talking about uh different ways to to go about this thing. But at the end of the day, I just want to say this and I'll and I'll I'll give my time back is uh I think we all can agree that when it comes to the duty of education, educating kids, u when it comes to boots on the ground, meaning teachers and staff that are in the schools that are actually doing the work, that are working with these kids, whether it's a seed coach, a counselor, social worker, a teacher, an RTI, those are the people that we really need to prioritize with these
138decisions. Um and that's the lens that I'm I'm making as a finance chair. some of these decisions and discussions that we're having and I would just want to encourage Dr. Robertson to continue to have that lens. I think he is and um anyway, Mr. Dog, Mr. Rome, thank you, Mr. Chair. Um Dr. Rob, I I don't know. Have you and I had more conversations together in the last three years than maybe only two other people on this board? and we don't agree all the time. Miss Schaefer may be coming close to you. She's going to have to work hard to catch up, but we're we're still having to address issues that you and I have talked about before, but um and I think I've shared with this with you before, uh as you know, I
139reach out all over the district, not just my district. I may be elected by my district, but every vote that every board member makes on on this board affects every single parent and every single student and every single staff member in the entire district. So, we represent more than just one district. So I I have to tell you that as as individuals or groups of teachers at schools approach me and want to meet privately with me, they almost never want to meet me at their school. Uh that's a failure of leadership in my when when we say that every employee is valued but I have groups of teachers coming to me saying that there there are so many mandates coming down from the central office that they might get might get one day of planning
140time. We we've got to do better than that. Uh and I don't know who these mandates are coming from, but you're ultimately responsible. So, what in the heck is going on when I mean I had a group of teachers meet with me and it was like deep throat, you know, and then at the end one of the four teachers backed out because they didn't want me to know their name, but they sent a very long text message to be shared with me. So, I've got to tell you, and I who knows, it may just be a minority of teachers, but we need to have every employee feel valued. And the more we throw on our teachers without compensation and expecting them to pick up, you know, shortages or whatever somewhere else that reduces their planning
141time has a definite impact, you know, in their classroom. So, the egenuity thing, you know, I've had so many conversations with Mr. Fuller, it's ridiculous. And and I've spoken with you before. We had a a big to-do when I first got on the board about this. And it's all public knowledge, but we got to do something different than credit recovery. And when, as someone said, when I have two apps on my phone that were specifically designed by people to cheat on egeneuity, we've got a problem. And yeah, I've done the research with the company to see what they've done and it still hasn't worked because AI is ahead of it. So, do we need to change to credit ac cruel? I think so. No. I had a student that finished a class a year ago
142in eight days. Made up an entire course that they had failed in their sophomore year in eight days. Made up seven courses in the spring semester. So when we're evaluating you on graduation rates and we have policies that inflate that or what procedures that inflate that that becomes a meaningless evaluation. So there are at least three or four your evaluation points that I want to eliminate next year. because what I'm hearing from teachers goes against some of those points. So, and I don't know whether that's coming from you or who it's coming from, but when when I'm told that it's just like East Hamilton Middle School dumpster fire of 2022 when you and I were out there and Joe Windgate was out there and we had a a cafeteria filled with really angry students because
143they had a bad RTI and we can disagree, but their RTI tier 2 didn't happen until after a student was a battery the second time. That's what kicked that off. So, we we've got to take a look at how we're handling discipline. I remember a time when almost every time you got up in public or spoke to this board, we have discipline issues. Well, we still got those discipline issues. And unfortunately, state law says that there are certain offenses that don't have to be reported unless there's serious bodily injury. Now, who defines serious bodily injury? Apparently, it's staff at at our schools. So, teachers have been battered in the last school year. I mean, battered to where they're bruised. And we've got kids, sorry about equity and inclusion and diversity, but we have kids destroying
144classrooms and that impacts the education of every other single student in that room. So what are my question to you and we can continue this later is what are we going to do about these issues and what does it take for you and your staff to hear what some of us are hearing? Are we hearing good stuff? Well, absolutely. We're doing great in some cases, but unfortunately there are areas that we're not doing so good. So, and we can point right to TCAPS on that. And it doesn't make any difference how we reszone the schools and what students we put where. But this district is showing some improvement. But we have totally not done a good job in closing the achievement gap between white and black students. We just haven't done it. So, we're doing
145something wrong because Are you bringing up a DEI issue right now? Let me let me uh It's just No, wait a minute. Yes, it is. I'm just messing with you. I I think you bring up some good points and and I think Larry, from where you and I were two and a half years ago to where we are now, uh it's been a long process. It it 100% has. But I I think that we've gotten to a place where you know that I listen. Some of the things that you're hearing I hear too. I We're not You're never going to hear me say that we're perfect. I've been doing coffee chats all all year and I hear a lot of things that that are concerning that we've got to do. I hear a lot of
146things of Dr. Robertson said that Dr. Robertson never said. Um, and so I I recognize like as a district we've got to we've got to improve and and our team is working towards it. At the beginning of this year, we recognized our our focus this year has been on closing those achievement gaps, right? Um, and and we are working towards that. We've got discipline issues. Are they getting better? Yes. Are they where they need to be? No. We've got staff morale problems. Is it getting better? Yes. Is it where it needs to be? No. I I I wake up every single day and I know that everyone sitting right here behind me does the same thing. Dr. Brown just spent two days looking at new data on staff morale that hopefully in a month and
147a or so we'll be able to share from you. Some of it's good. Some of it's areas that man, we we really need to dig in and figure out why that's happening. Um what I'm committed to is doing that with you. I mean, it took us a minute to get there. Uh, but but you know, we've gotten to a good place where I think I think think I hear your concerns and and we we work through them. But, uh, district of 45,000 kids, I mean, the the just cause I remind people all the time, this is an aspirational goal that we will never achieve. Well, I understand that. Let me I want to move on. I'm gonna try to redirect this a little bit. Uh, Miss Schaefer brought up a a very good point. Somehow
148we kind of got off in the weeds a little bit. So, um, Steve Slater, uh, if you want to comment to to Miss, uh, Miss Schaper's introduction here and then and then we we need to move on. We've got a lot of other discussion items that we got to recover. We got to cover budget questions. Okay. All right. So, we're we're getting ready to get there. Okay. Can can can you hold that for a minute? One minute. Okay. All right. All right. Okay. That takes us down to uh to our uh testing programs. And I'm going to ask uh ask my friend Ben Do again to to speak to that. Not a voting item, a discussion item. Yeah. Thank you, Chair. Um Dr. Robertson, I appreciate what you guys have done with the benchmarks. um
149with the ability to to consider reducing them and eliminating K through two. I think that's a wellreceived option for many many many families in uh in Hamilton County. As I said, I continue to view the lens or I try to through the lens of customer service, right? And I think fundamentally our job as a board and then the job as central office should be to support principles and teachers and uh every decision is made through that and I think for the most part we do a pretty good job on that. Uh where I would argue is obviously with the benchmarks and I've kind of made my position clear on that and how I feel about it just through the dozens and dozens of conversations had with teachers and parents. Um, and I know that sentiment's
150shared uh, across probably majority of this board up here and it's it's not so much a budgetary concern, although you take for example the money we spend even taking account the reductions that you guys have proposed. Um, I mean, I look at that line item and I say, man, that's that's PRN nurses right there. You know, that's over it's over $600,000 that we could be reallocating in different areas. So, what I what I would like to do and I wanted to have this conversation public and and because I think it's important that the board participates in it is um I really would like to see what it looks like to do one next year and have the have the board the ability to have the conversation because end of the day obviously this is a
151board policy. Um we have the ability to spend it but I do want to work with you just to have the conversation just to have a discussion and what it looks like. Um so I'll yield right there. Okay. So, um, let's talk about testing. Can we do that? M, I have a question about we create the pacing guide in house. So, I've been asked um, why can we not also create the benchmark in house and save that contract cost if and it maybe could line up better with the pacing guide. So, so the the basic answer to why we don't design the benchmark is just assessment design. It's kind of just the quality. We are not trained in assessment design. There's a lot of kind of science behind that case though. We do build the
152the curricular guides and we give it to them. So, they build their bench their benchmark based on our standards and how and how we're progressing. So the benchmarks do match where we are in in the year. Now every classroom can be a little bit different just based on reteing and those kind of things. So there are certainly times where certain classroom certain grade grade levels are behind where the benchmark is and they're still being assessed on a standard that they would have been. But the benchmarks are aligned to our pacing guides. They they adapt them based on what we say we're doing. And the feedback I got because I gave that answer was We should be able to create those. We are trained. We have education. We take courses on creating tests. You know, we
153are in education. We should be able to create those inhouse. So, that is the I'm just giving you exactly what I'm hearing and I'm asking for, you know, an answer. Well, historical context, we actually did used to create um some we didn't call them benchmarks, but some assessments in house. And I mean I was a principal at the time and push back was like we're not doing these because of the quality of the assessment. There's a difference between creating a uh formative assessment um by a teacher and an actual like assessment that uh will give you accurate data on a standard. Um, I mean it's an interesting conversation I had with some teachers the other day is they were they didn't like the benchmarks but they like the uh warehouse storage within I just went
154blank on mastery connect um that has all the questions and I'm like we're that's just old benchmarks right if we if we do away with it we we lose all of that and So I I I I hear I hear the question of why do we why are we not trained? We've done them in the past. They weren't effective. Our data showed it. Um and so that's how I would answer it. We also did a little bit of benchmarking in K2. We built our own assessments around math for a minute and got a ton of critique from the field because they just weren't very good. You know, now we've eliminated the K2. So then there was there were problems with cases benchmarks too in K2. But when we have built some in-house benchmarks, they just
155we've gotten critique and they haven't given us what we needed. That's just a micro example for the last few years. Why aren't we good at creating tests? I'm really hard having a hard time following that. Well, we're not I mean, even if even if you go like I've got a doctorate, I probably took maybe nine hours on ter in terms of like assessment design. There's a difference between saying here are the standards I'm teaching. I'm going to do a a quick formative assessment to make sure the kids are on track rather than designing a an assessment that says these three questions assess this standard to an accuracy of, you know, standard deviation of point whatever, right? to to say that we know if a kid gets these three right, they're in the 99th percentile or
156if they get two of these three right, they're in the 70th percentile. That that is like I that's highlevel stuff, right? I mean I I don't would love to make a comparison to your profession. I just don't know one. Um but it's like the difference of of going to like Turboax and going to a corporate tax attorney. It's a good analogy, was it? It's a good analogy. You mean legal zoom? Okay. As a former math teacher, I created many standard tests and in the earlier years, midterms of mine. I remember when we first got benchmarks and all. Um, I want to say about Mastery Connect. Honestly, I think that's a very good tool for keeping track. of the standards that students are learning because it does track um by student which concepts they get and
157they don't. So actually I think the mastery connect part is a very valuable tool I think that a lot of teachers use as far as creating our own tests. Um I feel like we should just like the old midterm we got to say end of course at the end. Um, you know, I really didn't like a lot of the benchmarks cuz it wasn't really a lot of it didn't seem like it was teaching to the standards or teaching in a way that or questioning in a way that they were familiar with the content and I don't think it adequately I don't know it was a lot more complicated maybe you know but I feel like we could even do something like that with the talent that we have in our system a lot you know,
158lead teachers, a lot of experienced teachers, a lot of great personnel. I really don't see why we cannot do our own tests. Okay. Um I I think I heard Mr. Daughter to say, uh maybe let's look at one. You know, we we ask you to look at and you come back with two, maybe two, and and he's suggesting, can we look at one? So, uh let's let's move on. But but I think the the ask was can we look at one? That was the ask. What I just want to make sure we're clear. So we've kind of got marching orders. What what's we've got the two talk about one, but maybe get some more information about the questions around like assessments and and why we can't just do them. I I just you're shaking your
159head. Yeah, it's a fair question. No, no, I'm I'm with you. We're throwing a lot at you tonight and uh it's tough. Uh yeah, I think to have a worthwhile, healthy discussion as a board, it'd be we we'd like to see one, right? And I'm not saying we go one, I'm just saying let's have a discussion. If we're going to have a discussion this season, let's actually have it in totality and and see what it is. And to Mrs. Had's point, I mean, it may not be possible. You're the expert in that respect is like, hey, can we do this or not? Um, so I you had go Well, I do have a comment. I did hear from a very experienced longtime Hamilton County Upper School math teacher today and and he said no benchmarks.
160I think one is a good place to start and I think two is too many. Okay. Budget discussion. You just keep talking there. You're doing a good job. Yeah. Thank you, chairman. Um, yeah. So, so I've been thinking about this a lot and and as a finance chair, my head is this is constantly where my head is this season. Um, you know, candidly, I probably didn't know what I was getting myself into when I accepted this thing, but here we are. Um, and you know, I'm trying trying to do my best here, but the as we've all said, there's this is a difficult card that we've been dealt. Um I I do think though that in terms of the way the board is interacting with our superintendent, we're doing him a disservice due to the
161fact that we have not given him clear direction as to whether or not to deliver the board a balanced budget. And many of you guys have been paying attention to the news. Mr. Connor, I know you were at the county commission meeting on Wednesday. Uh from my perspective, it seems that um the ability to get funding beyond what's already been promised to us through the maintenance of effort is a very slim chance. And Karice, I heard you loud and clear. Let's let's pray. I understand that. I'm a man of prayer. Faith is a mustard seed. But the end of the end of the day, faith and hope is a pretty poor strategy. So, with that being said, in order for Justin Robertson to do a do his job right now as it pertains to this
162budget, I would like to make a motion to direct the superintendent to deliver the board a balanced budget so that we're not wasting time going back and forth. I second. So, uh, to make sure I understand, we have a motion on the floor to ask our superintendent to bring to us a balanced budget. And, uh, it's been duly seconded, I think. Uh, you got that, Mr. Bennett? Okay. So, now let's, uh, have a conversation. So, Mr. Connor, you're up first. Thank you. Uh, and thank you. Yes, Mr. Jordy. I'm called to to light up here because uh just like at the commission meeting, it wasn't on the agenda, but they decided to recognize us. I've reached out to all the commissioners, tried to have some one-on-one conversations, and I meant what I said uh from
163the lect turn to their DAS is this is a commitment to work together. It's to get to the right choices for the community. Um they elected the 22 of us and collectively we do a budget together is the best way to put it. We we put together a budget. We give it to them and they approve or deny it. Um there was a lot of conversations also about when the right time to reach out to your county commissioners are and I've told them all frankly I think that that is part of their job description is to listen to people's interest in the school board since they are our funding body. Um and at the end of the day they push back on a lot of them. U the one part though that I would uh
164push back on you Mr. majority actually as as I felt uh at the end of the conversation there that that the message from the commission was to bring the right budget not necessarily just balanced and cutting everything out. I really felt that they said bring this the right budget bring us the budget specifically the words were used where where the rubber meets the road uh don't cut studenting uh positions uh make sure that we're taking care of the people that are touching the lives of our children every day. Um, and so I I do think that they asked us to bring them a budget that we can educate the kids on. Now, I'm not saying we need to have, you know, the the sky's the limit. There is no uh money. We need to make
165sure that we're being uh very good stewards of taxpayer dollars, but I do think we need to bring a correct budget that we can educate the children properly. So, forgive me. I I don't think balanced is the right word. I think that the the word that we need to do is proper funding. Okay. M Mr. Slater. Um, thanks. Um, I have a proposal, a budget proposal. Okay. Um, I was in my schools this week and I saw with my own eyes importance of a social worker. Um, so what I'm I would like you guys to consider this. have the principal of each school decide whether or not they want in the base model the social worker or the seed coach. That way that's one of those is in the base out of their strategic funds.
166If they think they need this the second one, they can get it out of their strategic funds. But it's still that principal's choice to have both or one. I'm going to trust the principles to do that. Um, I think this proposal leaves both of those positions up up to the principal. So, they could they could have one or the other in the base model and if they need the second one, then they can put it in their strategic funds. Now, I know it's late, but um I I think that's a decent proposal coming from district one from what I've seen and heard. Um are you are you recommending putting the money back in strategic or just cutting a position across the board? Cutting it. I mean, we have to we have to make some cuts.
167I I know that would you be open to ev every position that's not required such as librarians RTI teachers um probably not I'm just I'm just looking at those two positions right now because let me explain the social I know where you're coming from. I'm just saying like we've heard this. I think I'm trying to make the point of there there we could get I could bring a proposal to get us to a balanced budget tomorrow, but but it's the only way there right now that I can see fully without anticipating some things that we're not quite sure about revenue is literally a position across every school. Well, that's you know that's that's up to you to bring us the budget. I'm I'm I'm throwing that idea out as as a proposal to look at
168cutting some money. Um I I do know one of the schools um had this little girl, the social worker took her, cleaned her up, braided her hair, gave her some clothes, and that's kind of opened my eyes a little bit. They do that every day. I know this the social workers I I think are essential. Times have changed. It wasn't essential when I went to school, but I think it is now, but I would still leave that up to the principal. Just so my idea. So the motion that's on the floor is asking our superintendent to come to come back to us with a with a balanced budget. So let let's kind of uh instead ofstead happening balance it, let's let's talk to the motion. So, uh, Miss Young, you took the words right out
169of my mouth. I was about to say, can we get back to the motion and then have these conversations um at the finance meeting and or with the county commission when we whatever? Like, I don't know. I think we're all running on low fumes and I'm not really sure if we're going to be making the best decisions anymore at this point given the dynamics of the night. So, You need to vote on the motion. Can we vote on the motion? Whenever people get through talking, but I'm ready to vote on the motion. Me, too. All right. I' I've got I want to respect everybody, so I've got two or three more lights and then then I'll call for the question. So, uh uh Mr. King, I was just git car hit on it. Uh we
170have on the 28th a meeting between the commissioners verse and the the board and we can uh decide what's proper funding verse balance budget. Hopefully uh we know a lot of the board will be there. Hopefully a lot of the commissioners will be there also. We haven't had one of these in a couple years. So uh it's good that we're all meeting together. Okay. Uh, Miss Black, I'm I'm gonna wait on you last, Ben. You've already spoke, so we're going to hear from Miss Black. Um, as I've said before earlier tonight, um, my most important constituents are the 45,000 kids in Hamilton County schools. Um, I believe it's my job as a school board member to advocate for what is best for them. Um, I agree that it's my I agree with Mr. Connor. It's
171my job to send the best budget. Um I know that over the last two years in one way or another um 11 million has been kept out of our maintenance of effort um through whatever strategies. Um and I know time and time again I'm out in the community and they beg me and I have no control over this. Let us vote to fund the schools. Let us vote. Put it on the ballot. Let us vote. We want to. But nobody, they don't listen to us. They don't believe us. We want to fund the schools. Let us vote on a measure that adds to the maintenance of effort through whatever special tax, whatever. Let us vote. We live in a democracy. I don't know why it hasn't come up. I don't know why we haven't had
172the political courage to put that on the ballot. We don't have any control over that as a school board. But we do have the opportunity and the responsibility to make a decision as a community. Um it is our responsibility to advocate. This board is focused on schools. Um and it is my I feel like it's my responsibility to vote for the right budget and not just the balance budget and make sure that our kids are getting what they need. I know that since the investment in the diff in realignment of the staffing model two years ago, I know that chronic absenteeism is down. I know that um discipline instances are down. Uh daily attendance is up. We are finally making progress on metrics that we've struggled with since I've lived here, moved here 20 years
173ago with chronic absenteeism. Our graduation rates are up. It what we're doing is working. Why in the world would we try and cut it when our responsibility as a school board is to advocate for what's best for children in Hamilton County? My job, I'm sorry, and this may be ugly. My job is not to make the county commission's job easier. My job is to stand up for kids. So I if if and people are asking to be able to vote for whatever funding that adds to the magnus of effort, then they should be able to do it. But I don't have any I don't have any control over that. But what I do have control over is what I vote for. And I want to vote for vote for the best budget budget, not just
174a balanced budget. Mr. Con. Thank you, Chair. So, as uh Miss Black said, $6 million two years ago, $5 million last year, representing $1 million shortage in the maintenance of effort with without which we would not be having this conversation. Hamilton County schools represent 63% of the county budget, but only 43% of the military. Without that, getting anywhere close even up to 48% means that we're not having this difficult conversation. That's why I cannot support the motion on the floor to say balanced budget because we are already working from an 11 million hole and we need to give the right amount of money to be able to educate our students. So, it's not that I don't want to see our budget in a good one. I just don't want to I don't want to handcuff
175the superintendent into not giving us the best budget. Okay, no more lights. Roll call. Does everybody understand the motion? Repeat it. Repeat it. The the motion on the floor is to ask our superintendent uh to bring back to us a balanced budget. That's the motion's on floor. Duly seconded. Ro call. Mrs. Black. No. Mr. Conor. No. Mr. Dy. Yes. Mr. Gro. Yes. Mrs. Hatton. Yes. Mrs. Jones. No. Mr. Keith. Yes. Mrs. Schaefer. Yes. Mr. Slater. Yes. Mrs. Thomas. Yes. Okay. But that was a balanced budget. Just send everybody home and zero it out. It could be balanced. Okay. You don't spend no money. It's balanced. XED staffing and placement is our next item for discussion. Okay. I have a statement to make sure I don't leave anything out. Um I'll read it quickly. Um I'm
176deeply concerned that your administration is continuing with plans to relocate exceptional education programs and eliminate 23 exceptional education assistant positions along with multiple exceptional teaching roles. Over the last weeks, we have heard from families and staff across the county who made it clear they want exceptional education children to continue receiving the same level of support in their zone schools from the current ratio of qualified exceptional education teachers and assistants. Instead of honoring those voices, the district has proceeded with layoffs and program relocations. Let me be clear. Deciding to relocate programs is an administrative choice, not an IEP team decision. And while you've stated that students can stay in their zone schools, that option becomes meaningless if the supports they rely on are removed. But you are also not giving them the support they need at
177the relocated programs. A staffing ratio of one teacher to 20 exceptional education students with no more than two assistants is simp simply unsustainable and does not meet the needs of these students. You shared that this new model could save 1.6 million but cost savings were not the reason for this change. If staffing adjustments are needed to comply with the new hourbased model then I urge you to use that 1.6 6 million to increase, not decrease, support from our most vulnerable students. While I understand you are adding BCBAs and RBTs to support behavior, it's important to acknowledge that those rules roles do not replace the daily embedded academic support provided by exceptional education assistance. Behavioral staff assist with behavior. Exceptional education assistants support the learning process. Helping students engage with the curriculum, access instruction, and make
178academic progress. Shifting the focus from education to behavior sends a message that these children cannot benefit from academic support. It tells our families we are less interested in their academics and more focused on simply managing behavior. That is not the purpose of public education and it is not what our exceptional education students deserve. We must also ensure they receive the same level of academic and behavioral support that made their progress possible in the first place with the staff and the ratios they deserve. Our job is to educate children, not manage their behavior. We must ensure they are met with the same level of support they've had all along. Anything less is not an option. We also have around a thousand signatures to keep IDs in all schools. And and that's my statement. Be clear, we
179never had IDs in all schools, among other things in that statement, but I'll leave it right there. Okay. Well, we want to retain what we've had. Okay. Washington alternative staffing. I'll speak to that. Um, you know, Washington Alternative's been a around a long time and I visited when they were actually located at Washington Hills. And Washington alternative is for students who have um serious behavioral infractions. [Music] um truency threats released from penal or medical facilities, violence, weapons, drugs, extreme disruptive behaviors, or at risk of academic failure. Um Washington alternatives been around and it works well and the goal is to have them there 60 days and go back. I visited with the principal and you this past season and um at their new location at Hillrest Elementary. It's a very structured and wellrun operation. They
180have to they're very strict because of the behaviors and threats. They have to like check them every day um to make sure they're not carrying weapons. Um, and they're managed really well. Um, it's a small population of students, but the goal is to get them back, but some of them are out for, I guess, a year. Um, but they have been they had some staffing reductions last year, like 30%. And with more proposed staffing reductions this year, it'll be like half of what they have needed. So that's another place where this is not where we need to be making cuts. um especially with the serious level of behaviors that we have is a safety risk. But for the teacher sake as well, it's it's asking teachers to teach across six different grade levels and maybe
181have six different preps because of the students are there. if they're if the number of teachers are smaller, they're having to teach more and more subjects, you know, teaching two or three a semester, you know, especially three is a lot. I was a teacher. I did it. It's challenging, but with further reductions, they could be teaching five or six preps. That is not sustainable. They need our support. We do not need to be cutting staff at the alternative school. If anything, increasing it. A lot of lots. Mr. King, I was just going to bring up the last thing she said about uh certification and f, you know, cutting and finding the right teachers that have the right certifications to be able to teach sixth grade. So, that's that's a definite concern. Okay. and been up
182again. Just kind of a little reminder. Let's talk about we're talking about Washington altern um how many students right now are actually physically attending the alternative school. I I don't know like today um but we we haven't had more than I could change it but uh we haven't had I think the highest that we've been at this year 61 and there's a number of reasons for that. Uh you know there was a time 10 years ago probably 120 um but we've made some pretty significant adjustments. Number one reason why kids go to Washington alternative alternative is not for like a violent act. It's actually for vaping. Um and we instituted a program this year through Dr. Drake's office. I think it's one of the best programs that that we've done in a long time. Um,
183it's your first defense vaping kid and a parent or their guardian sign up for a Saturday class. We started running it once a month. They're up to two times a month now. And if they go to that class, it's like a four and a half hour class together. Parent and the kid, they're a first offender, they can go back to school. Now, repeat, that's different, but stuff like that has reduced the number. Um we as we sent strategic dollars to schools, more schools are doing stuff in house to to help prevent kids from going to Washington. Um so the number of kids is just low. Uh and and we have to to Mr. Keane's point, made decisions. Dr. Brown's been very strategic about talking to Mr. Callaway to make sure we have the right certifications
184and and do it properly. Well, I actually when I was on city council actually have been in that school and spoke to staff there. Um, and there were times when we had over 700 students listed there, but again only had maybe 80 physically there. Yeah. You're you're probably talking about AC across the course of the entire year. Yeah. Well, I think that I think the number we had issues here and a lot of that are covered now because uh we've gone to uh virtual school. Virtual school, you're right, is definitely decreased it too. Yeah. And really cut into it. So, um I can't remember the number off hand. How many do we have doing virtual school right now? I think it's like 350 or four. We can find it real quick. my computer remember virtual
185school uh been here so long your computer in um that's not a program anymore it's now a actual school yeah um so okay Miss Jones is is Washington still one of the um is their budget still one like it's a program budget right because they don't actually Okay so if if in the event that we have to eliminate other positions that are pivotal in sustaining children or students in their home schools. Um, and they there's an increased need for Washington like they won't be able to buy back positions, right? Like they they don't they it's not the same thing like supplemental and strategic, right? Like it's not I'm trying to remember and I was I was like I feel like there's there's something different with their budget. We do give them a little bit, but
186to your point, I mean, we all we always for that 20th day especially have um positions that we know we're going to have to move places and Washington would be on if we get to a place where, you know, 200 kids show up at Washington. Obviously, we're going to have to push more staff that direction. Okay. And I I was just asking that considering the the vote has been for um the majority vote tonight was for you to present a balanced budget. And so I'm thinking if you present if you were to do that I mean in doing that what that looks like with potential eliminations, what that looks like with the schoolbased budgeting and people already eliminating. What does that mean? Um I mean I hope the population don't increase but I don't know
187what that means. So just was wondering and and once again trying to share to the to the board as well um that their budget is not like our our budget at all and it's really like under like 10 10 10 le less than 10k right or right at 10k. Okay. I was trying to remember that from from a while back. But y just something to think about y'all that they service all the district not just one particular space. Miss Black, my concern um I agree with my colleague u to my right, Miss Baden. Um my concern with cutting the staff at Washington is um not only um the message we're sending to the teachers who are already there doing hard work, but also the message that we send to students and families. Um because a
188lot of things I hear when a child student leaves their home school uh for any reason, suspension, Washington, whatever, leaves their classroom and comes back that they're behind. And if we don't have enough staff to teach content to the kids who are at Washington while they are there to keep them academically on the path we're picking and choosing whose paths we want to invest in. And I don't like that very much. Um it doesn't feel good to me um to say that like if you struggle with whatever behaviors or whatever situation that not only like we're not investing in your educational path the way we are in the kids who are at their zone schools. No matter how long you're there, whether it's 15 days, 30 days, 60 days, it doesn't matter. um if we're
189not investing in enough teachers to be able to actually teach and oversee content, we're telling the kids that end up at Washington that their educational path isn't worth as much. And I have a problem with that. So, just to be clear, we're talking about, you know, going from 10 and a half to eight and a half staff. So, I mean, we're still like well under a 10 to1 ratio. Um, it's going to be hard to bring a balanced budget when everything we talk about is a no-go. Yeah. I mean, two teachers when you're talking about six subjects, uh, I mean, six grades and many subjects, you know, that's a small amount of I don't see how we can actually do that at all if we don't have enough teachers because they they have to have
190the different subjects covered, the different grades, plus, you know, all those preps. was almost, you know, I don't I don't see how you can keep a teacher if you expect them to teach six subjects. Dawn school staffing. I originally put that in, but I meant to withdraw that. I kind of thought I had. So, um there are issues, but I don't think it's for this um public discussion. Okay. Sunday's wait room. Steve, I think we've already worked that out, but it's in horrible shape. And I wouldn't want to Central High School. I wouldn't want to uh let my child go in there lift weights. Let's just put it that way. But I think we've already worked that out. Okay. And finally, benchmark testing. Mr. daughter. Have we already have we already done everything we need
191to say there? I think we're there. Okay. All right. We already talked about committee chair updates. Mr. K. Thank you, chair. So, um I mentioned already the exercise bill that passed. That's one of many. It's something that has that we're going to need to figure out how to effectively work into the day. Um just a reminder, next week's probably the last week of the legislative session. After that, once the bills are signed and the budget is worked through, um I will hold a meeting to discuss everything that's changed. Um the budget has passed. We don't know how everything's been allocated. And I have to call myself out. I was uh uh Mr. Dohy, forgive me. Uh specifically, I was focused very much on the comments that I was about to make where I might may
192or may not have um uh uh spiked the mic a couple times. Um when you asked about a bill and I just heard SRO, I wasn't thinking. It was obviously in the budget. Um that is something that uh is in the budget. We do not have a number for it yet. That's what is one of the things that needs to be figured out in allocation. We have conservatively said that it's going to be around $2 million for the grant, but again, we won't know that until the budget has been sought sought out. I uh I didn't realize it until I was re-watching because Mapry wanted to watch about the buses and I went, "Oh crap, I did that wrong." So forgive me, but uh again just to say next week should be the last week
193of the bud of the legislative session and I will recap everything as I always do at the end of it. Okay. Thank you. Yes, sir. Policy. Our next policy meeting is June 8th at 5:00 pm. June 8th. June 8th. June 8th is a Sunday. Shannon, I'm sorry. I'll check it. I do have it as June 8th, but um that would not be right. June 9th. No, 10th is the Tuesday. More likely it's June 10th. I mean, at this point, nobody's That's Reagan's birthday. Let's not do it. June. Oh, no. No, that's not okay. You're a mom. Okay. Okay. We We will get back to you, Mr. Dolly. Budget. Yes, sir. finance. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Uh this the this month on the 30th at 5:30 p.m. we will have a finance committee meeting. Hope all
194can join. Okay, Mr. King. Well, it was going to be June the 9th, but it will probably which is a Monday. That's why I knew that. Uh but it will be a short meeting. So what we might do is just combine it with uh the policy meeting but not June 10th. Yeah. So so if she sets that date as the 10th instead of the Sunday then we'll join you. Okay. Anything transportation down there? Well, it's all wrapped around, you know, things we've already talked about. So Okay. All right. We're good. I've just had lots of conversations with a lot of different people. So, uh, Miss Shirley, a lot of things in the next few days. Would you, if for nobody else, for me, uh, get to all of us, all these dates that that we've
195got coming up over the next few weeks. And, uh, I think we we've pretty well covered everything. I hope everybody has a has a great Friday and a great Easter celebration. Oh, wait. Someone's got their hand up. Mr. Smith, you can't No, Mr. Smith. Yeah, I I am, sir, but it's very late. I Yes, it is. Uh we're we're you know, we're having a having a community meeting uh that we would absolutely invite you to. Uh but but I think we're going to adjourn this meeting. I'll be glad to talk to you privately, okay? But we're going to adjourn this meeting. Brooks, I presented you with the blue folk. Just want you to have a face with the folk. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.