School Board Briefing Meeting: February 21, 2024

001good afternoon it's Wednesday February 21st 2024 welcome this is the Schoolboard briefing and the time is 2:31 p.m. Sergeant in- arms has the lobby been cleared thank you board members as we begin today's discussions I just want to remind everyone of our protoc call that each board member will have four minutes for initial comments and 2 minutes for follow-up comments per the agenda items I'd like to also remind everyone that today's comments will need to reflect what is on today's agenda today's agenda includes quarterly reports for Schoolboard advisory committees in the first and second quarter construction change order report for January 2024 Estero High School athletic facilities and the village of Estero leas shared use agreements policy legal update public comment good of the order and board member comments we're going to begin with our

002quarterly reports for Schoolboard I'm changing the list around just because the gentleman who is going to give us these comments needs to leave a little early so do we have a representative for the finance advisory committee with us today thank you Vice is that make sure our microphone is on no sorry just one moment we want make sure we get this on record n now okay hi good afternoon I'm Ken Boyd I'm the vice chairman of the finance committee I guess this is a first report for the for the year or for me anyway so we had a meeting in September we elected officers verie Ryan was nominated chairperson and Samantha bold was vice was elected vice chairman October meeting we presented we were presented information on the 24 budget during the presentation we had

003a number of questions regarding student funding allocations Property Insurance employee insurance benefits student transportation and the capital plan I'd probably make a comment that we've been talking about the U employee insurance benefits for a number of years and so we were pretty happy that was enhanced last year so that's a really great start we have some concerns about ongoing funding for competitive salaries and benefits going forward so those are one of the initiatives that we'd like to start looking at in the next couple meetings November Kelly lecher presented the capital plan for the 24 budget we had a number of questions one of them was the rate on the cops I'm not sure we got an answer on that so we'll have to ask about that I know they're probably varying rates on them additionally

004we're interested in talking about the district's approach to addressing the issue of teacher salaries and competitive pay competitive pay for bus drivers as I mentioned January meeting we had a couple visitors from the public from Alva Cons with some concerns about where the new school in Alva is being located they had a number of issues regarding proximity to neighborhoods they felt it was a little far away from some of the neighborhoods the we also I was elected the vice chairman in that meeting because like the previous Vice chairman resigned and then Dr Malloy presented an update on the capital plan and the 10year Outlook I would say that one of the main things we've been talking about in the committee as well is the interest in getting schools closer to neighborhoods and we've been talking

005a while about having the developers chip in for some land use to to build schools closer you know as a personal comment I think if you look to the Future we're looking toward a future with way fewer cars which is great I just took me half hour to get here and I it was a five-minute Drive normally so you know to the extent we can look at getting schools within these neighborhoods similar to a Babcock Ranch type scenario I think that would be a really great way to alleviate traffic these lines you know the pickup lines and things of that nature so that's what had for the report that ver put together for me I don't know if you have questions or comments board members and superintendent do you have any questions or comments at

006this time Miss Patria I just comment when I walked on the board R and saw you here I was thrilled I'm just you do a really really good job for us on finance advisory and I also have to point out I don't remember the year and I'm hoping that I'm remembering this correctly but your wife was nurse of the year one oh yeah yeah that was about yeah 3 or four years ago and I don't know that I had the opportunity back then to say it publicly but now that you're standing in front of me I will congratulate you publicly which I couldn't do back then CU you weren't in the boardroom so your commitment to the district is not just through your volunteerism but through your family and your support of her work in

007our schools so thank you oh yeah thanks very much appreciate that yes Miss Morgan and thank you for the report and thank you for stepping in to your role I do want to comment that the finance advisory committee has pushed very hard to get the budget amendments put on the District website and that has been done thanks to Kelly Lecter so one of their initiatives has been approved and operationalized so thank you Miss ganelli thank you Mr Boyd I actually would agree with you regarding the more neighborhood schools however Lee County is kind of not that like like River Hall we have the school in River Hall which is wonderful I wish we had more collaboration with developers and had more of that but unfortunately I don't think I don't see it in the cards

008that much that takes some more collaboration with the County Commissioners and so but I agree with you wholeheartedly I think it's it would behoove us I personally live in Tanglewood and we have the Tanglewood school and it's a great Community neighborhood school and I just wish we had more of those but I thank you for bringing that up because it's important and maybe we can get some more schools spotty like that I mean throughout the county so but thank you for bringing that up yeah we recognize it requires a lot of coordination and with the County Commissioners so that's you know major issue yeah but thank you all right seeing no other comments thank you so much for your time and your service all right thank you're welcome do we have a representative today from

009the construction advisory committee she is good afternoon I'm Clarisa parodi I'm the chair for the cic committee construction advisory committee I have a quick report although there's a lot going on in construction right now for all of the schools we had a first meeting in September and a chair person he was elected and a new Vice chair Thomas Mayo and we had a brief with I want to thank the attorneys we had a brief briefing on the new rules for all the Committees so thank you very much for that and a b member update on the capital plan and it was shocking to learn about all the the new population in Lee County and all of the seats that are needed for the county specifically the five new elementary schools four new middle schools 2K8

010and the rals and high schools in November we have revised a capital plan we are still analyzing it and it's a lot to take in but we agree that LE County needs more schools and that the county needs to be able to remove the relocates out of the campuses and the last me meeting we have a very interesting topic that was regarding the project management program and the job order Contracting and Mr Ross gave us an update on these new programs that the board wants to implement regarding construction and we are still analyzing them and we'll we'll be glad to be give an input on that's about it thank you thank you members do you have any comments questions superintendent all right thank you so much thank you're welcome do we have a representative for

011the curriculum advisory committee today yes Brian De graio chair of the curriculum committee all right so in September we had our first meeting board attorney Miss Bruno reviewed parliamentary procedures and explained the board policies and state legislation should be considered and implemented during our meetings we elected a chair and vice chair of course myself the chair and our vice chair Mr Eric griffins or griffi October 30th was our second meeting the committee received information from the curriculum directors on media legislation and the district response and actions to date to meet the legislative requirements the committee engaged in discussion protocol determined which topics were of the highest priority for their work this year the committee determined their first topic would be Mis learning due to covid and hurricane Ian and the and Reed The District's plan

012to accelerate learning so the students are on target for graduation board member Patria reported on the district's plan to improve busting and shared how the board has been working to update policies and meet new legislative new legislative requirements on the 27th we were unable to have our meeting due to a lack of Quorum thank you board for allowing us to go hybrid it's pretty important now especially with traffic it's a big County it's tough to get everyone together sometimes January 29th we did meet Quorum and adopted a hybrid meeting also we focused on the toping of Mis learning intervention and acceleration opportunities the curriculum directors presented information on adjustments the scope and sequence and assessments gave information on targeted interventions drill down plans and Spiral Review to support learning gaps due to the hurricane in

013addition progress monitoring to data was reviewed in comparison to State data dat the committee wants to explore the resiliency opportunities offered for students during Mis learning that may happen at a future meeting the next meeting will will be tackling social studies adoptions and changes or approval of media media access form the committee let's see and School Board member patri encourag members to view the accountability presentation on the 23rd and that's it so far on a side note I just want to thank you and appreciate this opportunity and certainly encourage you to keep our schools and curriculum as politically neutral as we can going forward all right that's it thank you board members do you have any questions or comments at this time all right okay thank you so much have a great afternoon do we

014have a representative for the district advisory council with us today good afternoon Gabe denim the chairman of the district advisory Council we've had three meetings in the first quarter September October and November and the first one I was like to chair which was great I'm happy to sit and stand before you today and help represent the folks that we're seeing we adopted a virtual model there was a lot of discussion about it a lot of back and forth some people definitely believe in the necessity for in-person meetings and while I understand that and just as the previous gentleman mentioned it's a huge District I work fully remote remote is we can do remote just fine and with that we've seen a lot of participation we're meeting quot quot excuse me we're meeting Quorum every every

015time we get together which is important and at one meeting I think we had 96 folks dialed in we had quite a few members of the public as well so with all the downsides of not being able to phys you know physically be with somebody read that body language see how people are seeing or maybe feeling it is far superior when it comes to Total involvement of the community to have that virtual option so I'll be as long as I get to serve on the board I'll I'll be pushing for that pretty hard so first meeting you know was basically who wants to be chairman in each committee and Miss G vanelli mentioned that you know give her give her speech on it but other than that not too much substantive for to report for

016the Dak meeting in October we had a briefing on the purpose and function of the sack which is obviously needed because it seems like there's a disperate participation across the district in elementary middle and high school levels as far as whether or not there is a sack how involved those folks are and what kind of Outreach is happening you know you can only do so much with parents I understand that I'm a parent myself I'm not an administrator and I know everyone's doing the best they can to get that participation but it continues to be a challenge and it's definitely disperate across the district the other thing in October we pulled each the DC members to see what they would like to discuss pending anything pending inputs from you all that you'd like to hear

017from us one of the biggest things that came up was Transportation continues to be a huge concern I don't need to tell you all any more than that because you're far more intelligent on it than I am but it remains to be a major concern for everyone on the sack you have students getting to school very late and getting home much later and as we look forward to high school starting later which ultimately is better because you have kids going to school way too early before they you know before Mo most research has shown that teenagers can effectively learn they're showing up at 6:40 in the morning and earlier unfortunately there is a deadline that the state has set and I don't know that transportation is there and that has come up in every DAC

018meeting so far which is why I feel like compelled to share that here finally in November we had our last meeting of the quarter due to the winter holidays there was a briefing on the Middle School proximity plan generally well received from from all I think it was a testimony to the efforts of this board and all the members of the district to how well the elementary proximity plan went all things considered change management being what it is I think that was very well done and well received and people are excited to see the changes and what they ultimately can do for all the students of Lee County you know with notable exceptions of folks who were like well I got to move to this school versus that school but really those were the only

019levels of concerns that were there with that's what we did in the first quarter we're looking forward to the second quarter here and I'm happy Service at your leisure thank you so much all right board members and superintendent do you have any questions or comments just want to thank you very specifically for the import on transportation to the board members to the community and other people who may be watching the transportation task force is underway started before the holiday they had their meeting following the winter break their follow-up meeting is coming this Wednesday this coming Wednesday and they're actually heading out to one of the bus transportation yard so there are people who work Logistics in our community that are helping better understand and what the hope is that the hope and the plan is

020to receive four to eight recommendations from the task force as to how we can how we can plan and approach Transportation Elementary proximity was stage one Middle School is stage two both of those are reducing miles and should help us continue to get buses more on time been sharing with all of you the metric of on time percentage in the morning which is getting better our afternoon is still our afternoons and we have good weather right now all it's going to take is an afternoon thunderstorm and that'll get middle schoolers home around 8:00 at night so we continue to work continue to move forward and since it was mentioned the deadline and the approach for the flip of the schedule with high schools starting after 8:30 in the morning I believe is the requirement after

0218 and middle school is not starting before 8 well flip I don't want to try to get it read read wrong into the record but high school is going later that's not in the plans until 2026 so the fall of 26 so we have one more year in my mind for us to begin to work with our transportation system now to get that right and then begin the process of figuring out how we're going to make that transition so that all of our elementary middle and high schools in 2026 are able to start on time it's just consistent every time I say this if there's anybody listening who would like to drive a bus we are still about 75 bus drivers short Elementary proximity will reduce sorry Middle School proximity will reduce some of the

022required routes we still need all the bus drivers we have and we'd like to fill in those 75 that are currently empty we know that even moving into the proximity changes we can keep all those individuals gainfully employed and moving our students about the community and it would be helpful if we had bus drivers in reserve so if somebody was absent or out or on Family Medical Leave Act we'd have somebody to step in and handle those situations thank you for continuing to point that out to us it's an area where we've got to continue to improve sir thank you thank you have a great afternoon you all as well we appreciate you okay moving along do we have a representative this afternoon for equity and diversity advisory committee good afternoon Chris Blakeley the chairperson

023for the equity diversity advisory committee and our report is as follows September 2023 the equity diversity advisor committee met with Quorum on September 11th where School Board attorney and general counsel Miss Kathy dpri Bruno call for the election of chair and vice chair myself and Dr Paula Porter Paula Porter were elected unanimously as chair and vice chair respectively additionally our school board attorney general Council provided update about board policy and parliamentary procedure Dr Adam Malloy our director of planning growth and capacity provide updates regarding enrollment and capacity the eedc committee held selection of Representatives for the site selection committee edat committee members rashik Fuller Stephanie house and Vanessa tavino were selected as representatives to the site selection committee and Mr car Baxter was selected as alternative our school board liaison Debbie Jordan provide updates about

024the new Communications Chief our staff liaison Jer Ed provided updates regarding scheduling topics of interest for the year after October's meeting about Middle School proximity in October we met on October 9th where Dr Adam Malloy provided an overview of the considerations for the Middle School proximity plan committee members offered feedback and Dr Malloy would provide proposed maps and updates during November's meeting our school board liaison provided updates about the advisory committee meeting modalities and upcoming presentations about proximity and our staff leaon provide updates regarding scheduling topics of interest for the year as a committee we did move to a modality of inperson with the option for Zoom or teams due to extenda circumstances and that was decided by the committee the committee made a formal recommendation to the board to consider an exception to the

025current committee's attendance policy to allow for exception of an absence due to exing circumstance there was some discussion related to the September absence of committee members due to the delay in notice of their committee appointments and then the scheduled U time of that meeting and caused some scheduled conflict so there was a formal recommendation U made to the board in November the committee met to discuss our virtual presentation with Dr booy and we offer strategies to better communicate and release of the Middle School proximity plan the committee share concerns regarding the potential segregation due to community makeup with the proximity schools addition to the presentation we participate in an activity which we do annually to identify topics of interest to present to the committee throughout the academic calendar what was sent out prior to the

026meeting was a Google form and on this form the committee members had the ability to provide two topics of interest for the 23 24 year for example those topics could have been proximity plan Community engagement the communication plan Recruitment and Retention of of Staff restorative practices and positive prevention once all committee members completed the survey the topics of interest would be grouped by affinities for final selection Affinity grouping involves sorting topics based on themes so those topics of Interest were placed on chart paper in our November meeting and each member were provided with three stickers with their initials to place on the topics they were most interested in learning about to create a bank of committee topics for the calendar year topics were tallied after each Committee Member was given the opportunity to select topics

027and the topics of Interest selected for the balance of the year in January we were looking to receive presentation related to legislation and governmental impacts as it relates to diversity equity and inclusion in February we had presentation regarding student conduct as well as our non-discrimination ation policy title 6 title 7 and Title 9 investigation process we will discuss Recruitment and board recommendations in our April meeting there was also discussion during the good of the order regarding new books for elementary CL classroom libraries and a Committee Member wanted to take the opportunity to recognize the chair board liaison School Board liaison and the Dei office for all the work they have been doing this year and previously and our January meeting we met and received updates from Angel Gomez Chief Communications and government relations leaon and

028provided information about the 24 legislative session and future proposals made on behalf of the Lee County School District the school board leaz on provide information regarding upcoming conversations on the proximity plan the leg legislative plans in bashore elementary school and our district Le aison updates regarding the meeting schedule with Chuck Bradley to cover February and March topics and then we met in February and our draft amendments will be voted on in our March meeting and that will conclude our quarter one and Quarter Two report all right thank you so much board members superintendent do you have any questions or comments Miss Jordan I just want to thank Dr Blakeley for this is his second year maybe third being the chair and you continue to to keep everybody together and I really do appreciate the robust

029conversations that we always have in that because it is my second time serving this committee so I just wanted to thank you oh thank you appreciate your support all right thank you so much and the last one we have is strategic planning and accountability advisory committee do we have a representative here today I appreciate Chris pulling that back down good afternoon board members and superintendent berer I'm Michelle St and I am the chair of the strategic planning and accountability advisory committee since our last update to the board the CSI advisory committee officially became strategic planning and accountability advisory committee otherwise known as Spa at our first meeting of the year in September we received the procedural training elected officers and established our meeting schedule for the year addition Ally we reviewed the newly refreshed District

030strategic plan in our October meeting we reviewed data from the Strategic plan as well as the Strategic priorities objectives and kpis to consider our committee priorities for this year we utilized a quality tools activity to identify the most critical priorities based on the performance data as a result of the activity the committee selected key areas of focus in the district's strategic plan to examine more deeply and those were OB objective five and objective six for objective five which is for the district to promote a safe learning and working environment our first staff presentation was from Dr Jessica Duncan and Tammy Scott from The District student services department they presented information about student discipline and cizer incidents cessor incidents which are defined by the state to be serious incidents of student crime violence and disruption and

031to review Trends in our schools over the last few years and what types of strategies the district is deploying to address the trends the committee had some discussion but felt a deeper dive was necessary before making any recommendations to the board so the student services team is coming back to our meeting tomorrow for a follow-up presentation in January the committee received the presentation on objective six which is to increase employee Recruitment and Retention for that presentation a consultant hired by the school district Miss Hillary mlan presented the human resource division outcomes and also the primary strategy which was an organizational redesign of not only the HR division but also a major technology project the PeopleSoft Enterprise update the committee had many questions about this very large scope of change in a short period of time

032and the need for change management both on the technology side but also on the process and human side of the equation the committee did not see or hear a level of detail in the plan that allowed for formal recommendations to be made so the committee did make a motion to ask for a more detailed project plan for the HR transformation with more of a focus on the people and processes that require re-engineering and less on the technology to better understand how the district intends to achieve the transformation in such an expedited timeline additionally what ongoing support will be offered to reinforce this ambitious organizational change management and how does the district intend to measure the success or impact of the strategy while the committee has made two advisory motions so far this year the one

033that I just read to you but also the first motion the committee made was to rekindle a previously made suggestion by the board advisory to look into the opportunity for businesses to be able to voluntarily sign up their staff members to serve as substitute teachers as a function of a partnership I'm aware that this recommendation was already shared directly with the board by board Sheriff Fischer at a prior board meeting but I wanted to be sure we shared it as well during formal update we as a committee decided that we would prefer to have a more in-depth review and discussion before making recommendations to the board so after these reviews we do anticipate making some additional recommendations at that time as I mentioned our next board meeting is scheduled for tomorrow evening and finally on

034behalf of the committee I'd like to thank Dr Savage for his assistance with facilitating the good work of our committee and for chair Fischer for his contributions as well excellent thank you board members superintendent yes Mr fiser thank you and thank you Dr St I do want to let let you know that just the prior Workshop I did read the motion you had described in there and I will have a followup once I talk to Administration about that so just want to say thank you for running some great meetings and thank you for your service you yes thank you have a great afternoon youo all right next on the agenda for today is the construction change order report for 2024 January 2024 we welcome Frederick Ross executive director operational planning and project management good afternoon

035board members Dr berer s Bruno this is your January 2024 change order report the very first page you can see a recap we provided direct material purchases in the amount of 1 million $382,900 non-direct material purchase change orders equated to $884 3067 that is a credit coming back from value engineering for the amount of 67 contingencies adjustments this month were $424,990 183 No Return of contingency this month if you go to the following backup page it gives a breakout of all the various projects the we had three dmps this month that we were reporting direct material purchases we had four change order propers one was a DM a DMP reconciliation the other was a no cost time extension on a project and the other was a ve which I just meant the 8 $80,000 ve

036deduction change order we had 11 contingency adjustments part of the adjustments were for Expediting our projects we're having to provide Expedition money for generators long-term construction materials fire pumps switch gear so those contingency adjustments which are embedded in the total project cost you approve we utilize some of those funds for that and we had 11 contingencies are there any questions board members do you have any questions superintendent do you have any any comments or questions all right thank you so much have a great afternoon I if I make superintendent and next month we'll be bringing a change over report where we returned with DMP savings and deductive change ERS for the cost of construction $7.4 million back to the district so that'll you'll see that next month I was just going to clap I'm glad

037I saw me that was the team effort but thank you thank you next on the agenda is the Estero High School athletic facilities and the village of Estero Le shared use agreements we welcome to the podium Dr Adam Malloy director of planning growth and capacity Madam chair yes if I may to set Dr Malloy up this is a ongoing project and idea that was brought forth by the village of Estero regarding specifically the athletic facilities for Estero High School while the village of Estero has moved forward in its plans and talking about this I want the board members and the community to understand this would really be the first opportunity other than in private one-on ones for us to discuss this issue clearly it's still an open an open issue for this board and it

038would take board action before we could enter into any agreements with the village of Estero and to our larger community so they understand it will take board action in order to move forward with any of these ideas Dr malloy's presence here today is to give us one of the first looks at what this potentially could look like for our high school and its athletic facilities and to certainly entertain your questions and comments as it relates to this specific project Dr Malloy thank you and good afternoon today I'm pleased to present a collaborative effort between our school district and the village of Estero over several months we've worked diligently to establish agreements for a shared Sports Complex on the current site of Aero High School's athletic fields this initiative highlights our commitment to maximizing resources and

039enhancing athletic opportunities for both the stero high school students and the broader Community the following slides will outline the details of the athletic facility's lease the village of estero's capital commitment to the complex's development and maintenance and the shared use agreement that prioritizes Estero High School athletics the agenda focuses on four key aspects of the Estero athletic facilities project the background section provides context outlining the need and motivation behind the shared Sports Complex development we'll then discuss the key key documents including lease and shared use agreements highlighting significant terms and conditions next we'll examine some precedents from similar projects in Lee County reinforcing the feasibility and benefits of our initiative finally we'll review the decision analysis process evaluating factors like cost benefit and Community impact that guided our pursuit of the project for for background

040the village of Estero has expressed a keen interest in revitalizing the Estero High School athletic facilities aiming to transform them into a Vibrant Community Sports plex representing a best inclass for both for the district as well as the community members in Estero throughout negotiations the primary focus has been on how to balance the needs of Aero High School athletics with The Village's desire to provide recreational space for the broader Community as a result the village of Estero has committed to both developing and maintaining the athletic facilities with a firm agreement in place to ensure that Aero High Sports programs receive guaranteed Priority Access this collaboration underscores a shared commitment to enhancing athletic opportunities for both the school and The Wider Estero Community while recognizing the importance of preserving recreational spaces for our residents slide four

041reviews some macro level aspects of the lease with the village of Estero the lease with the village of Estero entails a 99-year agreement with a base rent set at $10 the village of Estero assumes responsibility for the capital costs associated with all improvements as well as the ongoing management and maintenance of the facilities Additionally the village has a requirement to contribute $10 million toward modernization and expansion efforts for Estero High School in the first 5 years of the lease in expectation to have the football field enhanced and completed this summer with bidding already underway through collaborative efforts both the school district and the village will work together to ensure that the construction timeline aligns with the prioritization of Aero High School's athletic schedule Slide Five provides an overview of the shared use agreement which governs

042the use and priority of Aero High School athletics this agreement ensures that Aero High School's inter Scholastic athletic programs have Priority Access to the facilities additionally it grants Village residents access to recreational amenities when the facil fa ities are not in use for school events as part of the agreement The Village has committed again to significant Improvement obligations over the initial 5 years investing a minimum of 10 million into facility enhancements these enhan enhancements include installing Turf on the football field renovating the tennis courts and upgrading the two basketball courts this collaborative effort aims to optimize facility usage for both educational and Community purposes enhancing opportunities for athletic engagement and recreational enjoyment the latest rendering presents an Innovative design concept for the shared athletic facilities depicting a distinctive Community Sports plex equipped with multiple Fields

043football soccer lacrosse baseball Etc this is for use by both the stero high school and the wider community community notably the rendering illustrates the boundary with the school positioned at the bottom which will be demarcated by a perimeter fence this fence will ensure controlled access to the school and complex during designated hours and times the scale and intensity of the development have been carefully orchestrated to accommodate a stero High School's athletic schedule seamlessly numerous meetings have been convened to comprehensively address project Logistics including coordination between the school Village Athletics planning legal and other pertinent stakeholders slide seven provides an overview of shared facility precedents within the school district these precedents Encompass a range of agreements including local agreements or ilas memorandum of understanding M us shared use agreements and leases with various entities and stakeholders

044across Lee County the planning department does oversee these agreements in collaboration with departments across the central office regarding specifically the agreements with the village of Estero particular attention was given to ensuring the school district's protection through mechanisms like indemnification termination Clauses and conting and contingency planning for various scenarios in terms of remedial action if the village fails to fulfill obligations the board May undertake necessary work billing the village for cost incurred this is generally considered self-help remedies protecting the district in terms of non-compliance the board May perform per perform necessary work in case of Village default billing The Village accordingly right to terminate would be potential for failure to comply and not fulfilling obligations of the lease this slide presents a list of opportunities related to the shared use project with the village of Estero

045the project offers numerous benefits beginning with the introduction of modern recreational facilities aimed at improving the overall quality of life for both residents and students it exemplifies the strength of community collaboration as both the school district and the village of Estero have jointly work to ensure that the project meets the needs and aspirations of the local community additionally the initiative is anticipated to yield substantial cost savings through shared resources and efficient facility utilization specifically tailored to support Estero High School athletic atics the project underscores the commitment to providing highquality athletic opportunities for students notably challenges and considerations are not listed here as the as the legal documents address most potential issues with remaining hypothetical scenarios primarily centered around trust and collaboration the school district owns the land while the village of Estero will finance and

046maintain the Redevelopment of the parcel into a community Sports plex with a stero High School receiving Priority Access for all athletic activities I would now like to turn the presentation over to the superintendent and board for comments and questions the only comments I have to offer is first thank you to Dr Malloy that with everything else he's already doing with the capital plan and helping the maintenance and Operations Division and construction divisions Middle School proximity he's found the time to be involved in this project as well he talks about agreements that are complete we have agreements that are in draft they're not necessarily complete at this point but it's really an opportunity for us to look creativity creatively with our community to increase the ability for Estero High School to have first class facilities while

047at the same time provide for the Estero Community a place to recreate that primarily as he stated we still own and yet we can utilize as the right of first refusal so they really are our fields and our chance to really do some amazing things but also an opportunity for the community also to get its needed Green Space as they look towards a different future for the Estero community so in very interested in your comments questions and Dr Malloy and I would stand ready to answer anything we possibly can or to get back with you with any further clarifications board members do you have any questions or comments yes Mr persons this is just a classic win-win so especially when it said renovation of the tennis courts you had me right there but no I

048think it's a great idea for both the community and for the school district saves us a lot of money on maintenance of some top-notch facilities Miss Patria thank you my one concern is AO high schools inter Scholastic athletic programs have priority of use I'm wondering if we could expand that to include other area high schools or schools you talked about hypothetical scenarios Dr Malloy what if we have a hurricane and Bonita Springs High School field is rendered unusable where are they going to play logically at a stero High School but if if we don't have that written into the agreement where other facilities can use I'm sorry other schools can use the facility should an emergency arise or should the need arise then they can say no now so I'm wondering if we couldn't think

049about that we certainly can bring that sort of amendment forward Amendment forward and have a discussion about it with the village of Estero and then we you mentioned indemnities but I'm and I'm I'm sure that legal is all over this concerned about liability for work done by another entity where do we stand in terms of that please yeah to work with legal to get your response to that okay otherwise I agree with Mr person's win-win all around my final comment will be a concern about equity and I understand that we have this we have M or ilas for facilities in other parts of the county but this really is going to be amazing and it's not available to every kid in our County so the whole purpose of creating the initiative in the village of

050Aero was to get the municipal government involved with the school district to improve facilities and education outcomes not just for kids but for the people who live in that municipality and the point was to scale it up and eventually get it in all parts of the county because of whatever reasons that kind of fell through but this is moving forward and I wonder about the fairness to students in other parts of the county those are my comments thank you any other comments questions Miss giovanelli first of all do we have anything like this in our district that would compare to this I think the closest thing we would have would be Lexington Middle specifically it was well Lexington was built it was built as a joint use project which added the community center which which

051created that big giant gym du to Hurricane and we had to replace the entire floor but I think there are some other unique experiences you know you have Bayshore with its ilas with soccer fields so there's always been sort of Partnerships throughout our district where the physical facility and these types of improvements can be made but this is certainly the probably the largest upgrade to any type of facilities athletic facilities we've ever attempted to into a agreement with right that's what I thought too so I mean okay yeah sorry I just wanted to add on to Dr bernier's comment so our biggest I guess Ila partner would typically be the county and the I think the major difference so he mentioned Lexington we have Veterans Park there's agreements at a lot of our schools in

052terms of shared use and shared cost the unique nature of this one is the large capital investment by the municipality and Miss patria's comment that certainly opens the door in the school district as a willing partner for any other municipality if they would if they were interested in putting the capital dollars for for shared use so I think that's really the unique part but yes we do with the county we do have a lot of ilas that share the cost of the of the I guess the development and maintenance so thank you I think the complexity of this is like L like you like Dr berer said it's it's probably going to be the biggest facility that we have I see this as like an event center where there would be like sports competitions and

053Sport sporting events and athletic rentals now who gets the revenue for that who would would that fall under the school district or would that fall under the Estero so the village of Estero in the draft agreements that we have would be able to would be able to access I guess the capital from those events now we are we are outside of any of the fees that would be charged for the use based on the school district status but you you are correct they would be able to generate Revenue out of the events based on the leasing of the of the property right so that's what I thought because I've gone to a few cheerleading competitions and that's I see this in the you know and maybe in the future but anyways the other question and

054Miss patrika brought it up but regarding she mentioned the liability but I was thinking on the safety side then like how do we how do we separate that off from our like school if there's an activity you know how do is there is that going to be you know where does that fall under is our responsibility for safety or is it our safety is just during school act you know during the school activity I mean how does that work yeah and that was a major that was a major priority in the in the draft process is really that fencing the demarcation with the perimeter fence has to be step one so that they can block the Sports plex from where students will be during school hours and really that's very specific in the draft language

055that has to be separated both the community from you know from the students when they are using it for school activities so in the renderings you'll see kind of two perimeter fences that are that are going to be used to I guess to to separate and to ensure the safety and security because that was a big in talking with other administrators in districts that have that have done things like that was key and that collaboration to to make sure that was Secure at different times was a was a key piece of personnel collaborating within the school and then within the municipality right thank you one more question so back to the revenue what if the School District decided to have some kind of competition annually there and wanted to like you know just a track

056competition for example or a baseball one or whatever would we be able to have those revenues you know back to the school district or you know that specific fundraiser for whatever means correct yeah so think of like a high school football game which generates a lot of Revenue that still maintains this part of the school great thank you so much I love it Miss Jordan thank you along with what Miss G Jen ell was saying so the facilitron is managed by whom us or the Lee County CU it us us so we are actually the ones who are booking these events through facilitron yeah through yeah so how how then do we send them the information saying that okay XYZ wants to rent this now we submit it and I'm doing this as events in

057my head so now I'm going to send forward this to you now you are now that person and I'm going to ask you require you to have insurance that will cover not only them but us as well as like writers putting that or amendments on that so that's one thing how do we how does that work the facilitron and the scheduling piece or the facilitron facilitron and us saying because right now we have facilitron and a lot of times if we someone comes on and they want to put something on facilitron and they said no well the next person can go well you know what I think I'm going to let you do it I'm going to make a judgment call and change that so now you have how does that work because it happens

058every it does happen here yeah I think facilitron will take on kind of like a it will be a little unique in terms of the scheduling and availability of the stero high school facilities because they'll be they'll be a little bit more in use and they'll still be you know under the same requirements that facilitron normally is and then we'll also any sort of written agreement has to be double checked by both school district and the village so we can certainly look into how those would be reviewed and approved and what the specific requirements are for I guess their their insurance and liability and then yeah because good I mean if if we have a double book in that it would not be good either just saying so Dr Malloy correct me where I get

059this wrong because I may but you and I have had a number of discussions about this I think most important thing to tell the board in the community is the first thing that would be collected is all of the athletic schedules in needs for a sterile High School those would be placed in facilitron that's not normally done in our high schools for each event but that would be placed since this is a joint use agreement those would be placed in facilit facilitron in order to hold on to these particular periods time in these particular pieces of these athletic fields so that they are available for our students and our youth to miss Gianelli's idea if some Aero wants to run a baseball tournament yes they could use the baseball field to run that tournament that

060would also go into facilitron other people approaching the village of Estero looking to use the fields when not in use they would still have to interact with us so we could schedule it in facilitron so that we know who's using them when to avoid some of those conflicts that might help a little bit more Dr Malloy I hope I didn't overp speak way more concise I think than what I was saying well no well because I know like my grandsons play over there you know the stero Mustangs so it's like okay so you have these kids that are all over the fields over there and then other people as well and then even with the funding when the 99 years and if they the X amount of millions of dollars that they're going to be

061putting into that if they do not have if they run out of money they do not have that money I know they just put a brand new sign on Three Oaks but if they don't have the funds for that then we go after them for the funds in the meantime we then are responsible for the maintenance of that until such time that we can get that money or they go to the Village the residents the community and say here we're going to raise whatever to meet those doc Dr Malloy can you speak to the board about some of the actions have been taken down in the village of Estero in order for them to secure the funding specifically even also their bond if if you're eligible to talk about that so it's actually a just

062a straight budget item and that commitment of 10 million in the first 5 years was approved at the Village meeting I believe January 24th of this year really the protection for the district is that if anything in the lease is terminated so like let's say a hypothetical like you mentioned Down the Road Leadership change or funds if that changes any remediation that we have to do to return to to to to use we charge we charge the village and legally through the documents in draft form now they are responsible to pay for the remediation of that so really what we wanted to protect was those what if scenarios and what they wanted to protect through the 99 year lease was their capital investment and so that's where we were we had to go back and

063forth a number of times just to make sure that both sides you know had recognition of what was happening which we all thought was a as Mr persons mentioned a win-win but there were so many different things that we had to that we had to look into in terms of protection okay thank you I appreciate it Miss Patria two more things super quickly in terms of scheduling how do we know when we're going to have a home playoff game how does the sto know that we don't know going into the season it's not scheduled I assume you've addressed that you would address that by knowing that's when home playoff games are eligible it's a lot like renting a facility for some professional sports team that may go into the playoffs those dates are already reserved

064in their calendar and only made available once they know what their playoff schedule is okay and then my last question is can we just do a super quick search on the safety of turf fields it's my understanding that the anvl has moved away from tur fields and move toward that fake fake dirt stuff I don't know what it's called but thank you because tur fields are causing such significant injuries to knees and ankles the turf field that we currently have in Fort Myers the state the art it's the same type of turf that the NFL will will and does play on the former turf fields which turn into concrete are not what we're suggesting here they will be state-of-the-art fields and there is a requirement for something called a bounce test with a field every

065so often you have to drop a very specific weight inside it or measurements to determine whether there's the right amount of flexibility in given the field which is why in the fort Meers project we were so focused on the continual maintenance of a field like that in this particular case the village of EST stero will take on that maintenance cost whereas Fort Meers high school has to find a way to continue that maintenance project on their own and my last question we get to keep the name of the field or the stadium je that's Jeff summer correct correct it'll actually be in the rendering in the draft document it has it in two places on the turf field great thank you okay I will go ahead and go I don't have any questions but I

066have comments having athletes at home I am incredibly excited for our County to have something like this I know our neighboring counties do and it's not everywhere in the county so being a mom that has to travel to sports my kids get really excited when they get to go to the specific Park in one of the close counties and I feel like this is going to be the same for us and I could see something like this even in the north part of our County something similar for those folks so great Point mrri about making sure that with with the equity piece but thank you so much no other questions all right thank you Dr Malloy next item on the agenda is public nope excuse me one more thing next item on the agenda we

067welcome Kathy dupe Bruno Schoolboard attorney and general counsel Corey Huffman assistant Schoolboard attorney to give us policy legal update good afternoon board members Dr berer in December the board requested that either a policy be created or amended to solidify the expectation from The District's civil rights and Equity guides requirement that classrooms be Viewpoint neutral the board has pre-brief had its first reading and move four policies to Second reading that would address Viewpoint neutrality in the classroom namely an update to the definition section of board bylaws an update to the pre-existing political activities policy an update to the pre-existing use of personal property policy and a new policy to address controversial issues in the classroom a request was made that the legalities of these policies be explained for the benefit of the public prior to the

068second reading public hearing which brings attorney Huffman and I here today the legalities are complex and are interwoven among various issues and bodies of Law and attorney Huffman and I cannot be exhaustive in this presentation but we will do our best to explain hopefully in a digestible way some of the key legal elements that align with the policies the agenda today will focus on the proposed policies that I will go over in the next slide we will briefly address how policies are drafted we will discuss a more in-depth look at the language and the proposed policies also we will go into the concept of District speech and then we look forward to your comments and we'll Avail ourselves to any questions you may have the board has broad latitude in creating policies that comes from

069Florida statute 101.32 subsection 2 which states that in accordance with the provisions of the State Constitution District School Board shall operate control and supervise all free public schools in their respective districts and may exercise any power except that which is expressly prohibited by the state constitution or general law in addition Florida statute states that school boards May adopt policies and procedures necessary for the management of all Personnel of the school system the board here has a policy book that is broken down by chapter as you can see here there are 10 books that the board has in our policy book the policies are numbered based on the chapter that it belongs to so you will note that some of our policies may have separate but mirrored policies in multiple books like our political activities policy

070the policies here start with U the bylaws of the board we have the section 1000 for administration 2,000 for our programs 3,000 as it relates to instructional staff 4,000 as it relates to support staff and 5,000 for students we also look at 6,000 for finances 7,000 for property 8,000 for operations and 9,000 for community relations policies that have a statutory reference will have those references as added to the policies however some policies may be created or adopted based on case law or other analyses that are at play and you will not see a statutory reference in those policies the policies that we will be focusing on today specifically are 100 as a relates to definitions political activities which as I mentioned earlier you will find in our 1,000 3,000 and 4,000 Books use of employees

071personal property at school again in our 1,000s 3000s and 4,000 books and controversial issues which is found in our program section and that's policy 2240 the policies were amended or created to further discuss that classrooms should be Viewpoint neutral as requested by the board you will note that we will be reading policies word for word because it is important that the public know the actual content of these policies as this presentation is for the benefit of the public there will be key terms and Concepts at the board and some members of the public may be familiar with however in order for this presentation to have its full benefit we ask your Indulgence as we review some basic concepts for public Clarity and you can see how the puzzles pieces fit together the school board is

072created by the Florida Constitution and is a political subdivision of the state and thus it is a government entity the school board has multiple functions that sometimes finds itself in an executive role sometimes in a quasi judicial role and at times in a legislative role as the county and City create ordinances the school board creates policies to provide for the operation control and supervision of the school district when there are new or updated federal and state laws a change in the legal landscape or request to strengthen and clarify the school board will adopt policies to reflect those changes which can occur throughout the year policy considerations are primarily based on law it is important to note however that the law is multifaceted intricate and complex the United States Constitution is a supreme law of the

073land there is also the Florida state constitution which governs the state at both the federal level and the state level you have three branches that create laws the legislative branch creates statutes the executive branch enforces and provides ways to effectuate the statutes by creating rules and regulations and the judicial branch interpet the laws with the appellant courts providing case law which are sometimes precedent on how a particular law should be applied to a particular set of facts often called a legal test similar to your doctor who is reviewing the latest study or the American Journal of Medicine to find the latest treatment options for an illness legal monitors legal Trends the legal Landscapes legal interpretation and finds legal best practices the legal department reviews laws case law rules regulations we have tools such as wesla

074and Neola to assist we are also connected with other school board attorneys from across the Nate the state and nationally for continued Dialogue on various laws and their impacts on our clients the statutes case law rules regulations legal tools and conversations with colleagues form the basis of our examination of legal sufficiency for board policies in addition to the big umbrella of law that Kathy discussed we also look to see how our other policies Ina impact each other we also look to a historical context prior guidance and our traditional practices and processes that are already in effect for example regarding these four policies we looked at our current policies current practices federal law and state law to include regulations and state standards when there are policies that affect our staff we also look to review the

075collective bargaining agreement and there are two Provisions that we notice in the collective bargaining agreement that went to the question that was posed for the modifications to the policies that are being presented to the board the first being that in article one which is the definition of workplace the definition of workplace in article one of the collective bargaining agreement is defined as the site for the performance of work done in connection with the duties of the employee of the school board of Lee County that term includes any place where the work of the school district is performed including a building or other school premises any school-owned vehicle or other school approved vehicle that is used to transport students to and from school or school activities and off school property during any school sponsored or School

076approved activity event or function such as a field trip Workshop or athletic event the workplace does not include duty-free time at conventions or workshops at which students are not present we also looked at article two where there's personal and academic freedom each employer each employes citizenship right to exercise or support their political preference on their own time and away from school premises shall not be impeded providing such activities do not violate any state or federal ordinance or law it is the intent of the district that employees shall have academic freedom which outlines within the outlines of the course content and the curriculum adopted by the board we looked at these two things from the collective bargaining agreement because we thought they were pertinent in reviewing these policies and providing recommended modifications in understanding that the

077district supports and encourages personal and academic freedom in line with federal and state law state standards and board policy we also looked to the Civil Rights and Equity guide which has been in place for a few years now that states that Personnel are able to bring in some personal items and reemphasizes that their classrooms and offices should be Viewpoint neutral as to prevent any unintentional violations of law or policy we will now delve into each of the policies that are proposed with the modifications the first one is current policy 100 which are definitions reviewing our current policies we noted that there was a definition for work place in the collective bargaining agreement but not in our policy we wanted to ensure that our policies were in Conformity with other legal instruments that dictate how the

078district provides services so we updated this policy to in include a definition for workplace and workspace and it states workplace and workspace are defined as the site for the performance of work done in connection with the duties of an employee of the board the term includes any place where the work of the school district is performed including a building or other school premises such as a classroom any school-owned vehicle or other vehicle approved or other school approved vehicle used to transport students to inform school or school activities and off school property during any school sponsored or School approved activity event or or function such as a field trip Workshop or athletic event workplace and workspace also includes all property belonging to the board to help facilitate the duties of the employee the workplace and workspace

079does not include duty-free time at conventions or Workshop when students are not present the second policy that has the most modifications that are being proposed for the board to review today is political activities and political activities is straight from Florida statute 106113 and 1.23 233 and while reviewing the policies with the board's guidance to clarify Viewpoint neutrality we also look to address case law and the proposed amendments as well as Provisions in our current practices under instruments like our civil rights and Equity guide and the collective bargaining agreement it's important that this policy is in place because as I said it is from State Statute and so there are prohibitions that the statute requires as we get close to campaigning season and political season This legal department regularly sends out reminders to staff what these

080policies and statutes state to ensure that all of our staff are following State Statute regarding their political activities while they're serving as an employee of the school district and not in their off-duty time the proposed amendments to this policy we're meant to clarify some of those distinctions between what is political activity and what are acceptable practices for staff while providing state approved curriculum in it states the board recognizes the right of an employee student or member of the board to assume their full responsibilities as Citizens living in a democracy including such citizen rights as voting discussing the social political and economic issues of the day in public meeting meetings supporting candidates accepting appointive or elective public office or holding office and political parties administrative staff's citizenship right to exercise or support their political preference on

081their own time and away from school premises shall not be impeded providing such activities do not violate any local state or federal ordinance or law further administrative staff shall exercise reasonable care to show that they are acting in the capacity of a private citizen when exercising said rights as such administrative staff shall not conduct political and social action activities on any District facility during normal operating hours pursuant to state law administrative staff members who are employed by the school board shall not participate in any political campaign for an elective office while on duty it is the intent of the board that employees shall have academic freedom within the outlines of course content in the curriculum pursuant to State Standards adoption by the board and in compliance with law notwithstanding classroom shall be Viewpoint neutral except

082as otherwise provided by the approved curriculum law and board policy nothing in this policy shall prevent one the discussion and study of political social and moral issues when such discussion and study are appropriate to the subject matter of a course that meet the state standards and abide by law said discussion and study shall also abide by the board policy 2240 controversial issues two the dissemination of information concerning schools hacks and or Bond elections in so far as authorized by law and policy three the conducting of student elections and campaigning connected therewith as stated earlier the intent of the amendment is really to clarify for staff that the statute primarily looks to on duty time as a staff member of a school district which is a governmental entity and to further clarify that staff are able

083to participate in their civic duty and privileges when off duty lastly it was meant to clarify that specific political activities such as advocating or coursing individuals to vote for a specific issue or candidate is prohibited under the law but that there is still academic freedom to discuss political topics and compliance with law through state standards and approved curriculum and you will note that this theme is throughout the proposed modifications to the next policy that Kathy will go over as well as the addition of the controversial issues policy thank you Corey the next policy that we'll be looking at today is the use of employees personal property 1281 3281 and 4281 this policy has been in place for a while and part of our Neola conversion the policy always had an expectation regarding the use of

084personal property note that the prior language stated that staff members may wish to bring personal property to to the school either for reasons associated with professional responsibilities or for use during off-duty time the policy now adds language from the Civil Rights and Equity guide that states employees shall not display in plain view or in line of sight of students personal items that are not part of an approved curriculum or in accordance with board policy that reflects politics religion social movements and or personal ethics a small personal item such as a 5x7 frame family picture is acceptable the display of any items in workplaces and workspaces may be considered District speech and may be regulated in accordance with this policy the intention of adding approved Cor or in accordance of board policy is to link this

085policy back to both the political activities policy and the controversial issues policies allowing these discussions in the classroom as Allowed by law state standards and board policy this policy aligns with case law and Florida admin code 6 a-108 which is the principles of professional code of conduct for the education profession that states that a teacher shall take reasonable precautions to distinguish between personal views and those of any educational institution or organization with which the individual is Affiliated we will provide additional information on District speech later in the presentation next we will look at controversial issues policy 2240 as we are discussing District speech and the desire of the board for Viewpoint neutrality it is very important to understand that the board is not curtailing the discussion of important topics related to politics religion and social

086movements indeed the first part of the policy states the school board believes that the consideration of controversial issues has a legitimate place in the instructional program of schools properly introduced and conducted the consideration of such issues can help students learn to identify important issues explore fully and fairly all sides of an issue weigh carefully the values and factors involved and develop techniques for formulating and evaluating positions for purposes of this policy a controversial issue is a topic on which Oppo opposing points of view have been promulgated by responsible opinion or likely to arouse both support and opposition in the community the board will permit the introduction and proper educational use of controversial issues provided that their use in the instruction program is a introduced in compliance with State Standards laws and board policies B is

087related to the instructional goals of the course of study and level of maturity for the students C does not tend to indoctrinate or persuade students to a particular point of view or D encourages open-mindedness and is conducted in a spirit of scholarly inquiry further the policy states controversial issues related to the program may be initiated by students themselves provided they are presented in the ordinary course of classroom instruction and it is not substantially disruptive to the educational setting controversial issues may not be initiated by a source outside of the school system unless prior approval has been given by the principal I'll pause here to say that the above language is important due to the fact that we have various laws in place that limit what and how certain topics can be taught in Florida schools

088these laws are also noted in the code of principles of professional code of conduct for Education professions and can impact a teacher certification or lure thus this policy provides guidance and ensures compliance for the protection of our teachers the next paragraph is important due to the parents Bill of Rights the board recognizes that a course of study or certain instructional materials may contain content Andor activities that some parents find objectionable if after careful personal review of the program lessons and or materials a parent indicates to the school that either the content or activities conflict with his or her religious beliefs or more or value system the school will consider a written request for his or her child to be excused from a particular class for specified reasons the student however will not be excused from

089participating in the course and will be provided alternate learning activities during times of such parent requested absences District speech I will tell you that I drew the Short Straw on this topic and will address District speech in applicable cases as that is really a creature of case law we realize that case law can be heavy and not easy to understand but it is important to recognize and go through some of these cases as they are part of the legal analysis regarding the legal sufficiency of the policies as we know the United States Supreme Court is the highest court of the land in addition there are 13 federal circuit court of appeals which are directly under the Supreme Court most cases are not heard heard by the Supreme Court but rather are resolved in the applicable

090Circuit Court of Appeals we are in the 11th circuit which includes Alabama Georgia and Florida so District speech what is it where does it come from and what does the law say about it also as an individual how does it impact My First Amendment right to freedom of expression and freedom of speech I quote in addition to being private citizens teachers and coaches are also government employees paid in part to speak on the government's behalf and convey its intended messages unquote Kennedy versus burmington from the United States Supreme Court in 2022 therefore District speech is government speech made by an employee of the school district when they are on duty and promulgating their professional responsibilities the next question is how does District speech impact My First Amendment rights as a private citizen this is the

091million-dollar question with significant guidance from the courts there are three United States Supreme Court cases that we will touch upon today by no means are these all of the cases that may be applicable but they will provide the basic foundation on this topic we will start with tinker tinker versus de Mo Independent Community School schools is the United States Supreme Court where the ruling was issued in 1969 it is a very important Landmark decision by the US Supreme Court this case involved five students in De Moine Iowa who decided to wear black armbands with a PE signed to school in protest of the Vietnam War the principls of the De Moine schools learned of the plan and met before The Incident to create a policy that stated that school children wearing an armband will be

092asked to remove it immediately or risk being suspended so the students decided to test the waters and some were suspended in its landmarked decision the United States Supreme Court recognized the first amended rights of students in public schools the Tinker legal test also known as the substantial disruption test is used to determine whether a school's interest to prevent disruption and fr fringes upon a student's First Amendment rights in addition it offered a very famous quote which I hear all of the time the court said quote it can hardly be argued that either students or teachers shed their constitutional rights to freedom of speech or expression at the schoolhouse gate unquote Tinker however is not the main case that addresses First Amendment rights for staff a year before Tinker the United States Supreme Court issued a

093ruling in a case called Pickering versus the Board of Education in 1968 this case involved a teacher who was dismissed after writing a letter to a local newspaper criticizing how the school board and superintendent had handled past proposals to raise new Revenue Justice Thurgood Marshall writing for the majority observed that in public employee cases one must quote arrive at a balance between the interest of the teacher as a citizen and commenting upon matters of public concern and the interest of the state as an employer and promoting the efficiency of the Public Services it performs through its employees unquote this is often referred to as the pinkery balancing test this legal test has withstood the test of time and is part of the analysis when addressing public employees First Amendment rights versus the interests of the

094state another important United States Supreme Court decision was issued in 2007 I'm sorry 2006 in Garcetti versus Zas the plaintive in that case was a district attorney who claimed that he had been passed up for a promotion for criticizing the legitimacy of a warrant the Court ruled that because his statements were made pursuant to his position as a Public Employee rather than as a private citizen his speech had no first amendment protection put another way speech that owes its existence to a public employees professional responsibility does not implicate the employees rights under the First Amendment sweet versus town of Bargersville now moving to our federal circuit court of appeals we will look at some of those cases to begin with our circuit which is the 11th circuit Bishop versus aronov was issued in 1991 Bishop

095was a physiology professor at the University of Alabama the professor would Infuse his personal beliefs while teaching physiology and also offered an additional class for a deeper understanding of his beliefs the professor was asked by the university to separate his personal beliefs from his professional beliefs and that he not impart his personal belief during instructional time this is the 11th circuit it's our circuit it is President it is interesting to note that the case the 11th in that case 11th circuit said I quote while Tinker deals with inclass conduct and reiterates the belief that such conduct cannot be entirely unfettered the case involves students not teachers we do not believe that the material and substantial interference test applies that applied to student expression can control this case that's really important because it is a distinction

096in the 11th circuit the court further said a teacher speech can be taken as direct and deliberate representation of of the school hence where the in-class speech of a teacher is concerned the school has an interest not only in preventing interference with the day-to-day operations of the classroom such as Tinker but also in scrutinizing the Expressions that the public might reasonably perceive to Bear its imprator meaning its approval as a place of schooling with a teaching Mission the court recognized the University's authority to reasonably control the content of its curriculum especially during class time however the court take it a step further and said tangential to the authority over its curriculum there lies some authority over the conduct of its teachers that significantly Bears appearance of endorsement by the university meaning that in addition to

097the curriculum being able to be controlled by the university certain statements made by the teacher if it could be linked back to the University is also can be controlled by the school district or the university the Court ruled that in the present case and in other school cases raising similar First Amendment challenges these principles translate into a degree of deference to school officials who seek to reasonably regulate speech and campus activities in furtherance of the school's educational Mission it is important to when you're looking at these cases that this was a university case in the 11th circuit and University cases normally have a little bit more latitude than you'll find in terms of academic freedom than you'll find in the K through 12 educational system next we're going to look at Lee versus York which

098is a case from Virginia came out in 2007 Virginia is the fourth circuit this teacher taught Spanish Lee taught Spanish at a high school in Virginia and was an employee of the school board when an employee of the school board received a complaint from a private citizen who expressed concern over certain materials that were posted in Le's bulletin boards in his classroom after receiving the complaint the school board asked the principal to go and investigate the principal proceeded to Lee's classroom Lee was absent that day however the principal examined the materials posted on the board and he discovered that some of the items in his view should not have been posted in a compulsory classroom setting and so he removed them the principal placed the items on Lee's desk in the teacher lounge and left

099a note explaining we filed suit based on a violation of his first amendment and addressing the matter unlike our circuit the 11th circuit the fourth circuit acknowledged that teachers do not shed their constitutional rights to freedom of speech or expression at the schoolhouse gate like Tinker however it further stated that certain limitations are placed on the Free Speech rights of school teachers due to the nature of their employment by government operated schools in its review the court applied the Supreme Court's Pickering conic test and determined that public schools possess the right to regulate speech that occurs within a compulsory classroom setting and that a school SCH board's ability in this regard exceeds the permissible regulation of speech even than what other governmental workplaces may have in addition even though the items were not part of

100the curriculum they were not taught the court found that LE speech was curricular in nature the court found that it plainly constituted School sponsored speech bearing the imprator of the school as students were constantly present and would see the items in a compulsory classroom setting furthermore the court noted that were they not posted on a PRI that they were not posted on a private bulletin board that was owned by Lee but on the school owned bulletin board in the classroom in those circumstances the court said it would be reasonable for students and parents alike to perceive that the materials posted on the classroom bulletin boards were closely connected to the school or had been approved by its administrators and thus the school's interest outweighed Lee's first amendment rights Johnson V Poway Unified School District is

101a case from the ninth circuit which would issued in 2011 11th circuit has a reputation of being pretty conservative the ninth circuit has a reputation of being a little bit liberal it's the California circuit in 2006 a teacher question a principle about two very large banners prominently displayed in a math classroom one had red white and blue stripes and stated in large block later letters and God We Trust one nation under God God Bless America and God shed his grace on Thee the other Banner said all men are created equal and they are endowed by their creator with Creator and big block letters these words come from patriotic songs The Pledge and other government documents but there was concern about the size of the banner and the emphasis on God the principal discussed the concern

102with the teacher and asked that the banner be made smaller and utilize the full text which he refused so he was then asked to take it down and he complied but then filed his first amendment lawsuit Tinker unlike the 11th circuit was again acknowledged and it was the teacher's main legal argument however the court applied the Pickering based analysis the court said that this was speech in the classroom and the teacher did not act as a private citizen when he went to school and taught class took attendance supervised students or regulated their comings and goings he acted as a teacher a government employee the Court held that the First Amendment did not protect a teacher's classroom displays because they constituted a speech on a matter of public concern decorating a classroom with speech as part

103of the teachers official responsibilities not speech in his private capacity finally mayor versus Monroe county is a case from Indiana 7th circuit and this order was issued in 2007 a teacher brought forward an action against the school district alleging retaliation for her taking a political stance in violation of the First Amendment mayor was told told that she could teach the controversy about the policy toward the Iraq War drawing out arguments from all perspectives as long as she kept her opinions to herself however in class she shared that she passed a demonstration against military operations in Iraq and saw a placard saying honk for peace so she honked her car's horn to show support for the demonstrators parents complained and the school's principal told all teachers not to take sides in any political controversy mayor believes

104that this incident led the school system to dismiss her like Le and Johnson the court found that education is compulsory and children must attend public schools unless the parents are able to provide an alternative such as private school or home school the court further found that the First Amendment did not entitle teachers to present personal views to captivating audiences against the instructions of elected officials the First Amendment does not entitle primary and secondary teachers when conducting the education of captive a audiences to cover topics or Advocate viewpoints that depart from the curriculum adopted by the school system in addition to the cases we discuss today there are other cases that are often cited for example Hazelwood versus Colm which is a United States Supreme Court which talks about students sponsored new papers and what the

105district can and can't control with regards to that as well as conik versus Meers which is another US Supreme Court which adds time Manner and place to the Pickering analysis again this was not an exhaustive presentation but it does provide the legal landscape I would need an entire either a semester or a whole year to really go through First Amendment rights in the public education School setting attorney Huffman and I hope that this present ation provides some explanation as to the legal sufficiency of the policies and that the board that the board is considering we look forward to the board's discussion and comments board members do you have any comments or questions Mrs Patria super quickly what was the name of that last case after Lee I'm sorry after Johnson mayor versus Monroe County Community

106School Court my comments will come later I just wanted that for my questions or comments from the board Mr persons yeah I think these policies are not only legal I think they're they're needed when I ran for my campaign and almost everybody else I've talked to said we need to get back to basics and education so I thought back to when I went to school we never had any displays that were controversial or political I had no idea if any of my teachers were a Republican or a Democrat or independent if they were voting for George Wallace or or whoever was running at the time and I believe right now I actually went and looked at several classrooms I could not find one classroom that had anything that would be objectional you know in my

107grandson school that's the only one I went to so it's not an exhaustive look but I would guess because every time something is objectional it comes before this board and there's been less than a handful so if you think of 6,000 teachers and less than a handful out there that been brought to my attention anyway that's probably I could easily say 99.99% of our teachers are in compliance with these policies and so I just all I think it's a good policy that's all any other board comments Mrs Patria I have comments about the three that I'm going to pull tonight but they are separate and apart from the conversation we're having right now so I'll get to those later my concern is providing the superintendent with the appropriate guidance in terms of processes so I

108agree with you Mr person but I also know as a teacher and granted I've never taught K12 but I've taught postsecondary as a teacher sometimes you need to take aside in order for the class to get both sides right so if I'm in a classroom and I'm teaching I'm teaching about what did I used to teach I can't even think of some legal topic and the the class is on one side of the issue that is all they're talking about that's all they're discussing they're in complete agreement it is my responsibility to bring up the other side and sometimes I pretend to believe things that I don't really believe like I remember moderating a debate in one of my classes when Bush was running against Gore I was in Upstate New York and everybody loved

109Gore I had to come out in favor of bush otherwise there would have been no discussion about why Bush was a good candidate does that mean that I was indoctrinating my class no that means I was providing a robust classroom environment where an issue could be discussed thoroughly so I get concern for the superintendent when we have these policies in place that really put some rules out there that don't allow teachers to have any discretion and don't allow teachers to to take the temperature of the class that's in front of them them and to really exercise their professionalism in determining whether a side of an issue is being ignored am I making sense that's my comment for now Mr persons I think you would have been perfectly within the policy because that was part of

110the curriculum we say that controversial subjects conversation is allowed if it is part of the curriculum and yours obviously was you were just bringing out both sides so I don't think again I don't think this restricts Any teacher in that aspect as long as they're using it for a curriculum now if you had a Kindergarten class or something that had nothing to do with either of those I think that would not be as part of the curriculum and it shouldn't be taught I mean you should be bringing up subjects like that so that's that's just my opinion on that I think again I think it's a good policy Mr fiser thank you and I was actually agree with Mr persons on that I don't see how that would be restricting anyone's discussion based on these

111current policies I mean teachers as we know especially within you know certain High School subjects now have those debates that's I don't think anyone is trying to stop that at least I would hope not so and I don't see how that policy I mean we're talking about personal property we're talking about something separate of that and I mean really these policies are already the guidelines that we're following for the equity guide anyway so I mean it's really nothing much different with that so that's my take on it Mrs fiser Miss fiser Miss Fischer's not here but Miss Morgan is so essentially and this is what I learned in our one: one essentially public sector employees have no First Amendment rights in the workplace why don't we just say that and why don't we just quote

112the cases that make that law effectively and then the second part of that is state laws determine what neutrality is by spelling out what is personal politics religion social movements and ethics and quote those policies laws and forget about all I mean basically that's the bottom line that's what you're saying there are no First Amendment rights for teachers in the classroom and the state has determined what neutral is based on the woke act the anti-gay parents rights Etc my concern is that I don't know how the superintendent can enforce this there is going to be disperate treatment and the disperate treatment is going to create risk for principles and risk for staff because nobody will know what's neutral a principal is a principle expected to walk is every principal expected to walk every classroom and

113look for something that they think is neutral or is every principal supposed to respond to a criticism raised by another staff member or a student and then look at the issue is a principal in one high school going to see something on a teacher's desk and say that's unacceptable and there's a principal in another school going to say eh you know that's not a that's not a statement that's not a personal point of view how does the superintendent direct principles to enforce this PO to effectuate this policy I just well that's those are my thoughts for now thank you Mrs Patria so I'm looking at 2240 C does not tend to indoctrinate or persuade students to a particular point of view sometimes it's my job as a teacher to present the other side and if

114I'm presenting the other side I could be accused of indoctrinating or persuading students persuading students to a particular point of view so I I hear the dismissal from some of my colleagues that would never be an issue but it is literally written in the policy so you know we're talking about Bush and Gore and everybody loves Gore and Jack goes home and says you know what I really like Bush but my teacher wouldn't let me talk about that or it was obvious that my teacher really loved Gore too because she never talks about Bush or I talk about Bush and then that's the only thing I talk about because that side has not been presented by students and Jack goes home and complains to his mom while she tried to get us to vote for

115Bush like how do I win as a teacher and the bush Gore thing is a stupid example but you get the point how how do I do my job as a teacher and really instill critical thinking skills if I can't indoctrinate or persuade students to a particular point of view when sometimes there's only one point of view being discussed in a classroom it's my job to make sure both sides are viewed so I fear that this I fear this is confusing for teachers and I don't know perhaps through the chair we could ask the superintendent do you know how to implement this I think when it comes to curriculum issues and having discussions with my Deputy superintendent related to the potential of this policy passing I can tell you in an 11th grade US History

116classroom or in a 9th grade algebra 1 classroom what's curriculum related and what's not the question becomes and Mr person you said it so I'm going to ask you directly you walk classrooms and and you said you know the ones you got a chance to go into and it's not a full study of all the classrooms but you found nothing that was objectionable I'm wondering what you were looking for and I'm not asking you to answer the question I'm just asking you to understand from my point of view how do I direct 118 principles as to what to look for you that's that's the translation that's going to be critical in making sure that his superintendent I have a responsibility to enforce your policies you pass this I'll enforce it I just want to make

117sure it's done fairly and that it's not arbitrary or capricious to use great legal terms thank you for nodding your head because I think if all seven of us walked a classroom with me we might see very different things how on Friday when I have my principles together what I'm struggling with is how on Friday do I direct them what to be looking for and what's acceptable and what's not with only Viewpoint neutral I have a poster in my office that says I'm not going to be judged based upon the value of my paycheck and other things but that I made children a priority that's a message that I put children first I believe that aligns with our values mission and vision so as a superintendent I'm okay with that poster hanging I'm I'm not

118sure with this wide openen piece that we're not Michael Jordan's photograph of just do it doesn't belong in any classroom except maybe a PE coach's area in in a locker room do we do we take down Michael Jordan's photograph or Lebron James photograph who has a message about character or has a message about other things I think we can work this out but I need more of a dialogue between us so I can better understand what you want me to be looking for I'll build the procedure based upon your Visions but I need a little bit more of what's in your what what's in all of your heads out for us thank you Mr person thank you for letting me ask you that question I'll go to yes go ahead Mr person says Miss ganelli

119has a question I don't I think we sort of spell it out can we pull up the policy again where it says political social I mean when I was looking I was looking to say okay were there any flags for instance for any kind of gender identity I did not see any were there any signs or flags that said I'm a Republican or I'm a Democrat were there any Maga signs or or were there any Biden Harris signs type thing were there any black lives of flags or were there any Confederate flags those kind of things because those to me are social and different issues and it says that in there trying to oh yeah board policy reflects politics religion social movements and or personal ethics so I I'm not sure about the personal ethics

120that's a little which which policy please that's 1281 3281 and 4281 what we added to it okay but I'm really are thaning politics religion social movements you know and personal ethics so if I could ask the attorney her definition of personal eth I this also goes towards everybody's value system is really what it's talking about so a reflection of whatever my personal value system is what personal ethics would be versus professional ethics okay well would that be to the superintendent's thing that he's putting children first that's his value or ethics or I don't I mean if there's anything vague in there to me that's the the vague issue so that's the one that could get us into trouble so that's all I basically have to say there because I don't even know a good example

121of personal ethics other than intertwines with religion morality values that's really what it's it's referencing but it if board directs me to take it out we'll take it out Mr persons I'm going to move to miss G okay Miss chanelli so for me I think it's pretty simple I think this is a guidance for good judgment and it's about making a good judgment and when in doubt leave it out I feel like that I would I would I would think that if you had the Tim 10 command ments or the Lord's Prayer up on the wall somebody would take offense to that it might be one's religion but on another person's might be offensive so that would be something that would not be would not be should not be up there because it and actually

122praying for somebody is actually good but not everybody thinks that way so I think it's just being respectful good judgment and I if you do have a question why not say hey Mr principal here's what I was thinking about putting in my classroom what do you think is this going to be is this going am I going to violate policy and I mean I don't think it's that hard and that just becomes you know it's it's being held accountable and not necessarily micromanaging but I think people making good judgments and if they really have to question it then when in doubt leave it out I think it's that simple for me I think the policies we have to have some cuz OB obviously not everybody has the same judgment and that is going to have

123to it may come back up here to us if that so be it that's what we're here for so it's part of our job and you know I'll be the first to let's do our job it's what we're elected to do to help run the district oversight and this is the this is that thank you Miss Jordan thank you and I apologize I had to step out second so I'm not sure which policy that we're on but just if I may doing our job we are doing our job I sat here and I heard two of our members say there everybody's following the guides the teachers are in compliance so if they're following the guides and teachers are all in compliance there has not been any new laws that have come out that we have

124to now come out and do a new policies because we've already done that and right now I'm so I'm wearing the Blessed Mother I don't know if that's going to offend anybody I was going to wear my mother's cross today I looked for a rainbow lanyard I didn't have all those things but I do that for me and then when I just heard about personal ethics that refers to a person's identities what they identify with in respects to people and situations that they deal with in everyday life and even the controversial issues which I have a hard time saying that so I excuse me on that is very subjective I mean we all as we as Dr B said we can all walk into a classroom or we can walk down the street walk out

125in the hallway we're going to see things in a different lens from everyone and so I just I don't want to be that person to have policies just to say that we have policies we have policies that are in place right now that we use and we have been using those I don't see how they're going Dr B is goingon to be able to instruct his principles to police because we don't even know what the heck they're policing and you know so we have to give them this guideline go in and try to see if this is taking place or that's taking place neutral views if as long as we're showing both sides that's being neutral if Mr Patria is speaking about one thing and showing one side and you're showing both sides and I

126know that the school's papers are required to do that to show both views so that way it's neutral and it's not one-sided that's what it's about it's about being inclusive to everyone so I don't know why we're just coming and creating things that we already have in place and I know that I had mentioned this with the equity guide or and I know that Miss depri brunno said that she would have to update that but you know we're saying that personal items in the Equity guide is different than the personal personal items that we have on our 12 81s coffee cups are in there but coffee cups are out we can't have coffee cups in here so now we have to take coffee cups out of everything and I just you know it's to me

127this is a lot and I still am having a hard time understanding this and here I am or we are trying to make decisions for how many teachers and how many people in the district that's all I have to say at this point thank you Mr fiser thank you a couple things miss patrio you had reference to different policy that's why I was in regards to our discussion so and also I mean there is a difference between K through 12 and postsecondary when you're having discussions I mean we've been there with that so it's a little bit different also with I mean you know ones that are adults versus mostly that are not so there are different constitutional standards we know for that in regards to some of the other things up here I'm treating

128it I look policy wise is it related to the education of our children in the curriculum I treat it like the acknowledgement so neutral I don't I don't legally neutral is not showing both sides like that it's sticking staying out of it stay in the middle so I mean I'm not trying to over complicate this but I mean that's the fairest way of see it is it related to our curriculum is it related to the education of our children so outside of that I don't think it belongs so that's I think that's the fairest way to look at it but so and we're also not talking about you know what's on our person as well Miss Jordan I know that was brought up in some of the one-on ones but that is not being addressed

129as part of this policy so thank you Miss Patria and then I just want to note it's 4:30 we still have public comment to get through okay so I don't I think that I confuse you because 42 3281 and 2081 or 2281 I wanted to discuss separately so that was why I referenced those what I was really talking about was the controversial issues so it feels like if if we look at Slide Five collective bargaining agreement article two essentially each employee has a right to exercise support or political preference and it's the intent of the district that we teachers shall have academic freedom as long as it both of those things don't cause a distraction is that a fair assessment through the board chair to the attorneys present as long as you're saying academic freedom

130as long as there's no disruption is that what you're saying Mr Right no disruption no distraction as long as that's not so I would I would say that the language from the collective bargaining agreement says academic freedom with within the outlines of the course content and the curriculum that's been adopted by the board understood no I I hear that but I thought that in our one-on-one discussion there there was talk about the fact that if something causes a distraction it is no longer permitted under the law or under our policies so when when you're looking at First Amendment rights one of the things that the court and looking at that Pinker ring balancing P where as a citizen I'm a private citizen I'm going to speak on a matter of public concern versus the state's

131legitimate interest one of the things they're going to look at is whatever is happening the disruption affecting the operation of the school so yes you're absolutely correct that is something that would be considered when you're doing that analysis so essentially I think what happened was we had a flag hanging in a school that was considered political by some parts of the community or some people in the community and that was brought to our attention and now in my opinion we're responding with a political policy like it's a political response to a political issue instead of looking at what we've been doing all along which is taking things on a case-by casee basis and empowering the superintendent and the professionals that work for us to determine whether all of the things that we have in place

132are being followed it you said it Mr person's this is just not an issue it this is just not an issue it's an issue because it was a distraction based on one thing in one classroom in a massive District but we're sitting here spending all this time talking about it when we could be talking about academic outcomes and you know how to improve classroom environments for teachers and work environments for employees and instead we're talking about this so that's it I will be quiet until we're ready to move on to 4281 3281 and 1281 because I do have real issues with the wording of those policies so I do I do want to just add one thing Mr Patria on behalf of the board so the board cannot make a decision based on one particular

133flag or Banner that was in a classroom the board has to be non-discriminatory when it is applying its policies it has to be Viewpoint neutral when it's applying its policies and it would have to ensure that any application policies is not based on one particular characteristic so I just want to make sure that the public understands that when we are looking at these policies is not to Target or try to get one particular group or anything like that this would be something that would be applied across the board in a neutral manner a agreed but this the introduction of this policy was born out of the existence of a flag in a classroom in our district so that's my point my point isn't about how it's applied my point isn't about being discriminatory my point

134is where did this policy come from it came from that Miss Morgan yeah so I guess that's my question so what was wrong with our policy what was I mean why did we why was all of this done in December the board requested that policy be drafted or a policy be amended to address classroom Viewpoint neutrality and that came out of an incident and I absolutely understand now what Miss Patria is saying that incident could have been handled without any amendments to the policy because the policies as as were in place were appropriate in terms of managing the situation I just don't I I have to agree I well let me go back and say all of these policies we had oh no we didn't have the political activities policy but that's not really the

135one we're talking about we had these policies in place why did we why are we amending them the board may have wanted something that was Viewpoint neutral is was it not Viewpoint neutral before well there was civil rights and Equity guide that required Viewpoint neutrality but again the board directed that policies be reviewed for either creating or amending a policy for Viewpoint neutrality okay well my vote would be that we simply go with what we had but because I don't think what's the amendments are something that the superintendent can create best practices for with respect to oversight by his School leadership I just I just don't see how I mean Viewpoint neutral okay those are my comments for now Mr persons then miss ganelli yeah I sort of brought this forward because it's a Statewide

136issue there were bills being brought up in in the state and there were examples from all over the school districts within Florida there's been everything from what we had here to gay flag Pride Flags in certain rooms or trans Flags or or I don't know stickers all sorts of things that were brought up and it was not just in school districts it was in all sorts of government buildings and they wanted them to remain neutral it was you know was basically the flag Bill and it basically said the only inclusive flags are the United States flag and the Florida flag that should be in any of these rooms so whenever you put all these other things up it just sort of separates people into groups this is the way it is and that's why this

137is being done not only here but in other districts so it's not because of one instance here that was brought forward yes obviously we had a huge meeting last time and our policy because it was not clear I mean because all we're doing is clarifi clarifying what political activity is and nothing was being done so I think there's a need for not only here but in other districts that's all m anelli so I will give you all examples cuz it's not just the flag that was done in December I have brought this to several things to the superintendent's attention this particular superintendent so there would be his short tenure of a year and a half one one School a math teacher algebra to be exact at a school at sent had the te students watch

138a police brutality video that I had a parent contact me they sent me the video that they were asked to watch and said next next month there would be another video so there was two videos that were attempted to do for students to watch another one was the equity guide poster this would have been maybe prior to this superintendent was the equality Florida poster after it was supposed to be taken down I went to one of my schools and it was outside like literally the week of the school starting it was outside on the wall on the what door that poster that was supposed to be had been T should have been taken down then I've get several calls numerous this has been going on happened recently where parents have complained to me about that

139their student in a math class watches CNN all day that the CNN is on all day long so what that principle I that outcome of that was the principal said you should have you know give Fair time for other radio movies you know other stations like fox or whatever you should give you know Equitable time that was the outcome of that so that is not neutrality that really isn't that's poor judgment and so it sometimes people need guidance and that's exactly what I believe this is doing unfortunately we all don't make you know we are P we make mistakes and sometimes we need a little little guidance and all these teachers got guidance on this I can assure you and because they felt that they could do that and I know there's more but I

140can give you ex that these are these are exact examples that has happened in this District thank you okay Miss Morgan yep so and that's the point though is Miss ganelli that the policy as we had dealt with these things that you're talking about the fact that I was here for the equity Florida people were told to take it down the fact that it didn't go down was a was a responsibility of the principal and the superintendent changing the policy doesn't make any difference at all the policy in place dealt with the equity Florida situation it deals with the others you don't need more policy to get people to make better decisions you just need people to make good decisions with the policy we have in place I will say in response to Mr persons

141I don't think we have an obligation to be proactive ahead of the state legislature with respect to creating policy in the district and then totally off topic but I did send the board attorney an email just asking her to provide citations because most of our policies have citations in federal law state law or whatever and I think it's important that for issues like these that are so controversial that we have some reference point back to federal or state law or Court decisions or whatever those are my comments I don't think we need to revise the policy thank you board members any other comments Miss Patria so should I move on now to the well first of all if I may through the chair to Dr Bernie are you any clearer on what the board wants

142because that was the purpose discussion yes I mean there have been some helpful comments made in in the process but I will I will caution us and I'll use a different version of what Miss Chief velli said what you're asking for is the application of common sense you can't let I will for the first time invoke the memory of my mother who used to say if Common Sense was more common more people would have it that type of application could result in one of two things it could result in someone seeing it through a lens that might be seen by others as being overzealous and I worry about the legal implic ations of some being told to take something down that later on is determined doesn't meet the requirement I can also some see someone

143being unze and then getting reports of items or things that are hanging in a classroom without without some additional guidance I just need the board if you pass these policies I need you to be aware that there will be growth pain points in this process and I do believe if we're not if it's just a pain point we're fine if it's a violation of law then we're in a whole another situation so that guidance from from the superintendent to the staff is it is vital I mean I will based upon the conversation if this passes I will do my best to develop a set of procedures we have our principles coming on Friday for curriculum meetings related to student achievement but we will have to carve out time during those meetings to give them explicit

144Direction because upon passage of these policies they go in effect tomorrow so the best I can do by tomorrow is to tell my all my principles that these policy have passed you know put your put your viewing glasses on and wait for further advisement on Friday for some walks of some classrooms and then I guess send us pictures of questionable items I just I see what staff is going to be doing over the next several weeks when we're not focused on student achievement right that's but if you pass these policies I will enact them that's my responsibility as your superintendent all right so moving on to let's use 4281 as an example because 4281 3281 and 1281 all have the same essentially the same language the wish to was Chang to only and to me

145that's confusing because if you take that first first of all let me take a step back and say I believe that we have tried to fit a square peg into a round hole here I believe that the purpose of this policy was for the teacher who's teaching geography that's Maps right geography they got a map for their birthday and now they're bringing in into class to teach from that map that was the purpose of the use of an employe personal property policy that was the purpose of it and then we had a teacher in a building who brought a flag that had some arguably objectionable material on it and from there we're trying to ban the use or the hanging of that material in a classroom by fitting that into a policy where it doesn't

146fit so in my opinion number one use of employee personal property at school should be a separate policy from from an employee being permitted to have personal property in their workspace to me those are two separate policies now let's pretend we don't want to separate the policies let's turn to the language employees may only bring personal property to school either for reasons associated with classified responsibilities or for use during off duty time now let's skip to the second to the last sentence a small personal item such as a 5x7 framed family photo is acceptable how can we have a small family photo as acceptable personal property in a classroom or in a workspace if employees are only allowed to bring personal property in for the purpose of fulfilling their classified responsibilities or for you stirring

147off duty time the two sentences completely contradict each other and if we're trying to provide Clarity to the superintendent and to our employees this ain't the way this ain't the way to do it I can't I can't approve the policies based on that language alone those are my comments for now any other board comments Mr fiser Thank you And in regards to what board member Patria said I understand that was why I asked for the coffee mug out of there I mean I'd be fine removing that entire line keeping an example out of the policy and then following that up with whatever guidance or protocol from the administration teams with legal on that so that' be my suggestion Miss Patria so if we do that Mr fiser then a frame photo is not allowed if

148we do that if we just have this policy the way it's written employees may only bring personal property to school either for reasons associated with classified responsibilities or or for you during off duty time no 5x7 picture of my family is allowed in my classroom no know anything that makes my workspace personal and frankly I like to have some personal items in my workspace to make it feel like it's a place I want to be we're really taking away the ability for employees to express anything about themselves as being human you know so I hear I hear what you're saying but I think that if we take out an example we leave an example in it's contradictory it doesn't make sense we take out an example then we're really stripping employees of the ability to

149have personal items in their workspace Mr fiser so then leave it as a small personal item it's still contradictory if I may it's still contradictory you can't you can't say an employee may only bring personal property for those those two reasons and then say a small personal item is allowed they're it Con the two sentences contradict each other what are they looking at the personal item during their Duty they're teaching class I don't I don't know what that means it says off duty I mean during the teaching during the teaching of their class are they looking at the item is that their focus I don't think that's what this policy says but based on that's how is that any different I don't even understand question okay I'm going to go ahead and make my comments

150then if anybody has followup okay I understand where both of you are coming from and there have been some great robust conversations up here I agree with Miss Gianelli that was a great statement when in doubt leave it out and the examples that Miss ganelli gave I have seen similar items such as that just in my first 18 months of being on the board so obviously something tighter needs to be in place and what we have is not suffice my problem comes with when the PO if if we were to say use the policy we have why is it that like Miss ganelli stated a poster was asked to be taken down it hasn't been taken down a postcard on a door has been asked to be taken down it's not being taken down we've

151asked not to share news sources like CNN and fox during instructional time but yet you're still showing CNN and so what are what are we doing about that why are we allowing it to continue in certain classrooms that's just a question I have as far as what the argument between a personal item such as a 5x seven frame I do feel as though as a former teacher I mean I look at our desk right here and I think three or four of you have a 5 by7 of your family in front of you just because it's who you are and you want to remind yourself why you're up here right so I understand taking that out might be just like we removed the coffee item and maybe personal you know small personal items I don't

152know now small subjective so Define small and but I do understand the contradict or the the hypocrisy between employees may only bring I don't know why we need to have only I'm not an attorney clearly I don't know why we need to have only or wish to I don't know why it can't just say employees may bring personal property to school either for reasons associated with classroom responsibilities or use during off time I don't know why only or wish to necessarily needs to be in there but I like I said I'm not an attorney you would have better advice there I will say that when legal was reviewing the policy to tighten it up that's why only was added but I don't think there's any issues with removing only and just saying employees may I

153mean I feel like that gives you a little bit of flexibility to have a family picture on my desk that my students aren't going to see or I know that Miss GI of nelli is an example of the Lord's Prayer and maybe I have that tucked under my desk calendar for me to refer to and it's small but that th those are just those are my comments I do feel if we are going to use the policy if if the policy that passes tonight is the one we have currently in place I think we need to do extreme D diligence if the policy is not followed there needs to be repercussions and if that doesn't seem to be working I feel like we need to add more verbiage in to make make it just a

154little more specific to possibly give Dr berer and our principles a little more clarity but Mrs patri you said something earlier about empowering our superintendent to make those decisions and his experts so if these words are here I do trust that he is going to use his best judgment and the principles that he has hired at the heads of our ship are also going to use their best judgment but having just some of these few specific wordings I think are necessary since policy we have in place has not been followed with examples that we've probably all seen that's all I have any followup or any other board comments or questions Mr superintendent I'm sorry I'm not a board member comment okay Dr berer thank you madam chair for recognizing me first step thank you for

155continuing to debate talk about this issue I would tell you that the congruence between the first sentence and one of the middle sentences is important and it our esteemed attorney's discretion the removal of the word only really does help the congruency between the two sentences and then rather than talk about small personal items since they can bring since they may bring personal property to school if I'm reading your intent correctly in this policy as a board whether you agree with it or not but the intent of this policy really comes down to employees shall not display in plain view or in the line of sight of students personal items that are not part of the approved curriculum or in accordance with board policy that reflects politics religion social movements Andor personal ethics if you were

156then to strike a small personal item such as a 5x7 just take the examples out if you're going to give me the latitude to utilize common sense and discretion related to things hanging in the classroom then I think we can get there with a mix between my Deputy superintendent and others if you pass this policy I do want to come back though just briefly with one sentence that some of the items that have been mentioned about teachers watching CNN Equity guide posters again prior to me CNN all day those matters are addressed as they arise we address them with the principal we address them with the teacher and if necessary disciplinary action is taken what we're opening here is an opportunity potentially to expose an employee to disciplinary action based upon what's hanging in their

157classroom I think the fact that you tell me it's approved curriculum and that it can't violate politics religion social M movement of personal ethics therefore the two photographs of I have of the Appalachian Trail and me hiking that doesn't violate that my priorities poster that just says it's not going to matter when I die where I made what car I drove but I made a difference in the life of a child that aligns to District speech we believe in putting our students first I'm nodding towards legal I'm looking for a nod back you know Michael Jordan's photograph of just do it she didn't give you I know not yet so those are those are the types of questions the principal are going to ask me so I guess I could V that out more with

158our attorney over the next 24 hours before I lo lose her to The Experts that she is one of to the Florida school board's Attorney's Conference the only thing I would say is that we have to be careful because this is Case by case basis in the past even when these things have come up it's been individually handled analyzed and reviewed so it's you'll have the policy but the application has to be delicately and very specifically handled and consistent across the School District go ahead Mr fiser may I ask the superintendent a question through your chair yes would it help if we set a future effective date 2 weeks 30 days something like that would that help with the application or is that going to make a difference no I don't think it's going to

159make a difference sir I think I think we always put policies into a place the next day I don't want to change that and I but but you do realize it's going to take me some time I mean I think by Monday we can have principes walk in classrooms but I need some time with them I need time for them to express and vocalize talk with us I'm going to need some time before we can effectuate classroom walkthroughs for this type of material that are effective and aligned Miss Patria so I don't know how we can vote on this tonight if we're taking the word only out if we're taking personal item such as a 5x7 frame family picture out and I would argue the personal ethics should be taken out as well because my

160as I looked up a definition of personal ethics what did I find I found way at the top Integrity loyalty selflessness transparency ethical standards respect empathy responsibility how many of our classrooms have those words hanging in the classrooms so I would argue that we have to take that out as well and those are substantive changes to this policy so that means they would have to go through the public notice process again so I don't see how we vote on them tonight anyways if we're going to take that stuff out those are my comments Miss Jordan I just want to make a quick comment just listening to Dr berer speaking about you know if this were to pass tomorrow or Monday all of us will you know the principls will get with them the principes will

161start walking indoors what does that look like what does that say to our teachers and how much time is that taken away from their job to and student outcome so now going to go and start looking in every single room observing checking to see what's hanging what's not and as he has already stated that when things come up and I know for a fact that if I've ever brought anything to Dr berer Dr Savage or whoever was in that place regarding a situation that was violating a policy it was taking care of so again I am I keep going back to if we know that this is already happening and we and he has heard here very clearly that you know we want that tightened up the policies that we already have in place then

162why are we going through and even why are we even having this conversation I know we have to have it and I'll thank you okay with respect of time and our citizens that still need to make public comment and the time are there any more comments at this time I know that we have further discussion tonight at the board meeting for items being pulled possibly okay we're going to go ahead and move on to public comment thank you both of you the next item is public comment it's on I I thought the board had agreed to make some changes like to take out the May and to take out the personal did the board was that not the direction we were leaning that was the sense I got from the conversation no so we need

163to decide as a board do we want to have these words removed changed revised and then brought back this evening no they can't be brought back this evening those are substantive changes when you make substance changes you have to go through the correct we're still in the rul making process so public hearing second reading is this evening if if it's changing the word may I don't think that's a major change but what was the other change was to take out personal ethics that's I would see more as a significant change and what was the other third one it's not changing the word may it's changing it's removing the word only oh taking out the personal 5x7 frame which is really just an example it's really to the board I if we I think the personal

164ethics is the one that would cause me the most concern that would require us to go through the full rule making process again of the 28 days May and just removing an example it's not I'm sorry removing only so it just says may that's big change I that one I would feel comfortable with in the removing of the example I would feel comfortable with but if the board wants to completely remove personal ethics I think we would have to I would advise that we go through the ru making process board discussion yes Mr persons if we remove that could the first one be tonight if we are going to go through the rule making process we have to read advertise so remember the policies the language and the policies are not advertised it's just notice

165that we're going to be creating or amending these policies and we have to do it within 28 days with the first reading and the second reading so this has been already advertised and as you can recall as you're going through the policy rul making process you're making changes along the way so this policy really has not been approved or adopted yet that's why you go into public hearing second reading this evening and of abundance of caution I would say if you're going to remove that section I do think that's a little bit more of a substantive change I would start the rle making process again so that would not be tonight we would have to read vertise and it would go through the full 28 day process may I ask quickly the policy in place

166though stays as is until the 28 days that's so the policy that we have does not have that language it's it's more in line with the liability affiliated with use of personal property also in line with what the CBA says in terms of liability and then the only other thing that would be still in place will be the Civil Rights and Equity guide that already has the request or the requirement that classrooms be Viewpoint neutral okay miss ganelli the personal ethics that came from Neola or the law the personal ethics not that language is not Neola language this is law this is language that's based on case law as I said in the in the meeting believe it or not I had conversations with some of my colleagues with regards to all of these policies

167the controversial issues one is definitely from Neola and many districts do have that but this particular one was actually a conversation that I had with a general Council in California they had something very similar and that we had discussions about how that impacted their district and Etc so I personally think that it should stay in because I when I when I Googled personal ethics I've got person person personal ethics refers to the ethics that a person identifies within respect to people and situations that deal with an everyday life that word respect is a big deal for me because I think that we as a nation have forgot who that to respect others and whether we like what they do we should res we still should respect them and treat them with the same respect as

168we would do someone that we did like so I would not want to take it out the May versus only that was in the only or the May was in the prior prior one so we've talked about that already we're just putting it back and put in to way it was so I don't think that is a big deal I believe in leaving the personal ethics in there based on the law thank you okay Miss Patria thank you so respect is a personal ethic so if you leave it in there you can't have the word respect hanging in a classroom first of all second of all the word only was added by the board of attorney and the legal team between the last time we discussed this policy and this discussion of the policy so

169it is not a word that we have discussed publicly until now my final point is that I don't understand how removing the word only is not a substantive change it completely changes the meaning of the policy it makes it so that the first sentence and the second to the last sentence make sense together whereas before they didn't make sense together so I'm not I'm not clear on how that's not substantive but I will defer to the board attorney's judgment on that but by leaving personal ethics in there I think it's kind of the opposite of what you were trying to accomplish Miss ganelli unless I misunderstood your comments that's it I'm I'm not going to talk anymore I'm going to double check cuz I I recall that the change was actually brought during the first

170reading but let me just double check that in our one on1 you introduced it as a change that you had made with the legal team in between meetings thank you miss patri this is thank you it's from the first it is not from the first reading so we just double check that it said may wish to in the first reading Mr P Bruno can you clear up something Miss ganelli brings up a good point about the personal ethics regarding respect but and maybe I'm reading this wrong but if it reads administrative staff members shall not display in plain view or in the line of sight of students personal items that are not part of an approved curriculum or in accordance with B policy that reflects politics religion social movements and or personal ethics we're saying

171you cannot have that on display those in the list right unless it's part of the curriculum or board approved policy for example the word respect I do believe that is one of the words that comes up when we do our acknowledgements it's one of the words from the Department of Education so long as it's within the curriculum or it's within the policy there's no issues with that this personal ethics is more in lines of my personal values and my personal morals okay the code Education Code has all kinds of other language that it uses that we will have to abide by to include the word respect to include the word non-discrimination I mean there's just various things that's already in the code that this would not apply to right I just I was a little

172confused as to the definition and then what was being asked about believing in taking out and I do know that you know we have a student up here that reads A word every month character word and I know I've heard respect and at least one of those so that word is okay in the classroom because even though I mean hopefully we all have respect as our personal ethic I just wanted to clear that up okay thank you miss you andell I was just a little confused cuz I knew exactly what you were saying but I wanted to make sure that was meshed the right way thank you're welcome Dr No okay Miss Jordan sorry but and I've read that I have that same definition that you had Miss jelli but however it says identifies with

173respect to people and situations that they deal with in everyday life so that could be multitude of things I mean what I see in people's everyday lives or what my life is like your life I mean we have different lives so that is that could be a problem that word could be a problem Dr berer I'm going to try to help I may not and I may be overstepping Minds that if I do please Madam chair tell me I'm out of order but the debate alone currently around those two words of personal ethics tells me you need to have more conversation about what this is about so that we can say that because to the point of view I'm going to go back to your experience as classroom teacher we have successory posters everywhere they

174speak to Integrity they speak to teamwork they speak to respect and we have to have some the fact that there's so much debate going on reflects that it probably is best to come back have another Workshop or briefing where this can be more deeply explored I'm just putting my two cents in now I'm going to turn off my microphone and turn the other way okay Bard so I think we need to decide if we want to table this or not for this evening's meeting especially with not only confusion but also with moving some words around that I mean we have to do what we have to do so how about a thumbs up for tabling this for fur discussion yes Miss Jordan can we table it here at a briefing we cannot table here does

175that not have to be tonight at a Action meeting so it would be board direction to pull it okay and then basically we pull it and take it off the agenda I just want to make sure I just okay so we'll determine that this evening is that fair yeah to move on to public comment or can we pull it now yeah we can pull it pull it now have to wait till tonight reg basically you'd be giving direction to pull it this evening so we just remove it from the agenda yes is that what we would like to do you got to do a thumbs up thumbs up thumbs up if you would like to pull it okay that's only three three to pull it 3 to I'm so sorry so we're not pulling it

176basically okay thank you do you want the only and the small personal example taken out board thumbs up for only an small example to be taken out that's four okay and then are we cuz if we're going to take out the personal ethics it's going to go through rule making again so is the direction from the board to leave that in at this point do you want to leave personal ethics in at this point yeah okay that oh that's four okay thank you thank you madam chair now can we move on I have my direction okay thank you so now we will move on to the next agenda item which is public comment and our attorney we're going to give her a few minutes to walk over is going to address public comment time while

177attorney dupay Bruno is getting prepared for public comment I just wanted to remind the board we do have a student performance they're already here in the hallway ready to set up so I just wanted to respect the time of the students as well I'm not sure where we are Madam chair do you want me to move forward with please make your read your script for public comment thank you madam chair School Board policy provides the opportunity at this point in the meeting to address the board concerning any matter on this meeting's agenda if you completed a public comment card please provide it to the staff public comment will be held at the podium in the center aisle and front please be advised that the board will not respond during public comment to remarks made by

178speakers however at the conclusion of public comment the chair or superintendent May respond speakers who fail to follow proper decorum in the chambers will be ruled out of order any speaker continuing with such remarks will be required to relinquish the microphone for board policy 01691 and may be removed from the chambers there will be one warning for board policy 01691 the time per speaker is 3 minutes if there are 20 speakers or less you will find the countdown on the big screens in the front of the room once your time has elapsed the microphone will automatically shut off please state your name when you approach the microphone I will call your names five speakers at a time please follow staff's Direction when lining up Madame chair there are seven individuals who wish to address the

179board at this briefing okay please proceed with public comment thank you for the following individuals please line up Dr Paula Porter Dr mine Stewart Jen Jill pelis Marge Cox Michael andasio at the timer good evening afternoon I'm Dr Paul Porter from Lehigh acers first of all I want to thank you guys for this very Lively conversation discussion it's very important that we hear that as Citizens but I like to play Devil's Advocate a little bit and there are some things in this policy that are a concern to me that could be another issue for example this display of personal items does this involve clothing I could wear a t-shirt does this involve wearing jewelry like a cross or a star of David what about tattoos that are visible to the students and that have a

180personal view or maybe something that could be considered offensive what about dying one's hair in rainbow colors how far is this going to go we already know in the state of Texas with a with a student in that has his hairo do in ethnic Styles has been kicked out of school several times what's going to happen with this you know we also have the polic how's this police how's this policy going to be Poli policed will there be daily inspections to make sure you're not wearing anything offensive what are the consequences to the teachers and you know you talked about good judgment I would throw in the concept of professional judgment and you also talked about the possibility of what could be determined offensive in my literature classes and college when I was teaching Mark

181Twain I would always say how could a guy that's been dead for over a hundred years possibly offend anybody today when he had no idea his stuff was going to be read for that long period of time so having having passionate teachers is vital to educating students in Lee County we need to stop reacting to the rhetoric of indoctrination grooming or being woke these words are harmful manipulations that serve only to destroy the desire and passion of a teacher who lives in fear of losing a job or their certification more importantly it impacts their mission to bring up a new generation that are not only critical and creative thinkers but are productive members of society I for one having taught fifth grade in the 80s in Little Old Council blessing Iowa am so thankful to

182a higher being spirit Power whoever he sheit they are that I did not have to go through any of these things in those days we are becoming a little bit too personalized about being offended thank you hello meline Stewart my first I have a question the I cuz I'm I don't know if this is a common occurrence but Mr persons told us that he was the one who suggested to attorney Bruno I believe this is what you said that there were things happening across the state and that we had to get on top of this so that's a question to you secondly please professional conduct professional ethics and professional judgment Dr Bernier has just explained to you the difficulty this kind of policy is going to create in a school we already have teachers who

183are fearful they're confused these policies do not clarify anything all they do is make more policy and that's not the point of how you create a culture of learning and a culture of respect the whole concept of we have to faret out these offenders and punish them just flies in the face of what a school district is supposed to be about and you say in your we say that we are personal passionate and Progressive and I am sitting here listening to this wondering how in the world this discussion could really be described as as Progressive Progressive meaning faith in the future going forward developing new knowledge and imparting that to students so please I completely agree this policy is unnecessary and what you there's no law for this yet so what you're doing is you're

184putting yourselves in Jeopardy we also know that the people who made the laws in Tallahassee are now turning around and saying oh my goodness what's going on in these school districts they're going overboard and what do they do they blame the teachers they blame the principles how in the world is this going to create a worldclass school system it cannot it will not the legislature those in power in Tallahassee are not going to back you up they're going to blame you the way they blame the principls and the teachers and that's completely wrong so I urge you do not pass this policy do not pass any of these policies you have them in place and they're doing fine and maybe what you need to do is spend more time on inservice education but who has

185time for that because you'll be policing in the classrooms if teachers are confused about about what they are and are not allowed to do then they need some more inservice education they don't need a policeman thank you I'm Marge Cox I live in Bonita Springs I'm a retired educator I when I knew this was going to be a topic I tried to look up cuz I'm librarian we do research and I found a site from the Middle Tennessee State University free speech center that spoke to the Pickering Hazelwood and Garcetti I hope I'm saying that right and was very informational I've sent it to your email so you will have copies of it but I thought the last paragraph the first sentence really spoke to what all of the pages had to say the area

186of teacherfree speech rights is still evolving and I thought yes it is let it let it evolve we don't have to be the Forerunner of it I appreciate so much the time you spend in your jobs and trying to make a difference for kids and trying to to make us truly a worldclass school system unfortunately you've had to spend a lot of time on policies and other kinds of what I would consider busy work instead of really laying open the ground for there to be the world class school system that we want to have to to encourage teachers and students in them leading their education and being where we want them to be I also looked up the Florida doe just for Teachers Community and the teachers Bill of Rights and I could find nothing

187in it that said this policy needed to be approved tonight or within the next 30 days it was like please you've got a policy maybe it needs to be enforced better but you've got the policy in place let it be don't add more to it just so that we've got more to it so thank you again for your work the time you spend as board members is mindboggling to me and I want you to know how appreciated you are as a superintendent and as boards and as our legal representative thank you so much have a good evening well the following individuals line up Brian De graio Harrison to my name is Jill pis I'm a resident of Fort Meyers I wouldn't be in your seat for all the money in the world you have everybody

188throwing darts at you and threatening you including our legisl lers no matter what you do you're you're getting the arrows so I respect what you do but I think that the three policies that you're talking about today are so totally restrictive and they're targeting marginal communities really that's what it's about and I think that was brought up marginally here tonight even the governor has changed and made a huge about face on his book Banning message and now he's blaming you and the teachers and the administrators for it's a hoax and you're overreacting so my plea tonight is or this afternoon is to say to you stop take your time don't rush into decisions nobody is forcing you to make a decision tonight it's an important decision it's a vital decision take the necessary time to

189talk it through don't feel pressured don't feel angry you're discussion I'm really impressed with it was open it was honest you said what you wanted I as a building principle for over 30 years could hardly fit in what I was supposed to do and now you're talking about having a principal police the classrooms and make sure everything is that's right and that coffee cup is okay what if that teacher's family photo is of two fathers or two mothers or a black mother and a white father whatever it is and it's doesn't meet your definition of neutral or the norm what's going to happen then would I be sent home for my t-shirt today do we really want principles policing or do we want principles to be instructional leaders of the building because that's what we're

190hired to do we are hired to be instructional leaders to make sure that there is effective efficient open honest instru instruction Based on data based on good teaching policies I hate to use the word policies based on good teaching or do we want them to go into and make sure that children are learning and that all children are learning at the same time that it's not just question and answer oneon-one that all children are actively engaged in the process of learning or do we want principles merely to go into different class rooms and look and see what's on the wall and look and see what's on your coffee cup I don't think you want that I think you want if I were your principal I think you would want me to make sure to maintain

191the highest quality of instruction that I possibly could because my children were in school your children are in school and I'm hired to Ure thank you ma'am your time is up thank you good luck Michael loosha Fort Meers former the county school teacher and I'm I had some really well prepared remarks and I have discarded all of them based on what I've heard so far I'm trying to think I'm trying to imagine what it would be like to spend eight plus hours a day in a Viewpoint neutral environment and I can't imagine what that would be like this room is not a Viewpoint neutral environment I have a I think about my former classroom I used to have a poster of the Declaration of Independence on the wall we hold these truths to be self-evident

192the Declaration of Independence is many thing I think we can all agree on the principles of the Declaration of Independence but it's not Viewpoint neutral if you read it actually defines the terms by which you should overthrow your government it's not Viewpoint neutral so do I as a teacher keep that on my board on my wall I don't know if I think I'm going to get in trouble and could possibly lose my job I'm taking it down and I was here a couple weeks ago and I was talking to you about why I left the Lee County school district and the constraints and the well the constraints that have been placed on me the autocratic constraints that are placed on me as a teacher and I told you that we can't police ourselves the way

193the law is expecting us to police ourselves in any reasonable way and it looks like many of you have taken that and drawn exactly the wrong conclusion and it looks like what you're doing with these policies is putting the policing power into the hands of our administrators and they don't want it they don't want you I guarantee our principles do not want to go around the classroom and look at all of our posters and look at all of our stuff and make a determination as to whether or not all of those things a Viewpoint neutral they have better things to do with their time they do not want to do that and I'm kind of I keep getting reminded of one of my favorite books which was Inherit the Wind in which the main character

194says you cannot impartially administer a wicked law and a wicked law will like ca destroy everything it touches and I think that a lot of you and it's not an enviable position by any stretch of the imagination are trying to shape policy around just bad laws and we know they're bad laws cuz the people who made the laws are walking them back now I strongly recommend if you want to have a policy that's going to help I would strongly recommend a policy that says before parents can complain about anything going on in the classroom they have to demonstrate that they have reached out to the teacher first and talked to the teacher first to see if they can resolve their problems I've taught many controversial topics and have had to talk to many parents and

195have never had an occasion where a parent talked to me and did not walk away satisfied with what I was trying to do that would be a better policy thank you before our next speaker just out of respect with our students that are waiting for us is the board okay if we move good of the order comments and reports to our Action meeting this evening yeah is that okay all right thank you go ahead okay thank you I appreciate the service that you all provide and because of your care for students I've already sent a letter to the board which has been accepted also as a letter to the editor in the two local papers so I'm not going to repeat in detail My Views in position I've lived in Lee County for the last

196three years and I just retired after a 48-year career in the nonprofit for-profit and Consulting sectors I've served on Boards of nonprofits in education and in healthcare in Philadelphia where I lived for most of my adult life I'm also a first generation immigrant twice came to the us as a 13-year-old and for all my successes I credit my family my parents had a very phenomenal public education system in New Jersey in the mid-60s and the library system and places that supported teachers to teach and students to learn versus fearfully and ideologically limiting their exposure to views and ideas different from their own group in my work life which was all in Human Resources but that special branch that is Talent acquisition finding the best people for our clients and my employers I saw the products

197of our educational system and I judge them and I can tell you that the best candidates at all levels from entry level to se street that I've dealt with are the ones that have the broadest that are most broadly exposed to issues and views learn critical thinking skills and who had the intellectual curiosity to go with their book learning and their Ambitions none of these skills are develop or encourage by limiting debate or censoring access to information Marketplace of ideas John Stewart Mill but actually Oliver wend Holmes who talked about it's one of our strongest and greatest assets and all this fear-driven limitations of the exchange of ideas is horrible and so this is not the first or last time that someone's going to push a policy that's counter to your mission and your objective

198to have a worldclass school district in the aggregate these kinds of policies limit the opportunities of children you're supposed to be educating and preparing for the world they face this particular policy is ill-considered in substance and in timing we could see that in that discussion and in enforcement and it's not necessary at this time thus I urge that there be no rush to passage and it be studied further lastly I would find some of this Miss micromanagement I think is the word Miss janelli use of the marketplace of ideas a bit more credible and sincere about it being to protect and educate the children if we didn't see how ideologically driven some of them are thank you sir thank you parent and Community member we all have things to do it's getting late no one

199wants to be having this conversation but unfortunately we need to have this conversation anyone who sends their children to school this day and age cannot feel comfortable that they're not going to be put in some pretty awkward situations so you have the number numbers you are doing the right thing I wouldn't blow it out of proportion these are really minute changes the community wants them if you have to tighten it up at a later date so be it but I think it's time to get this done you know anything that reiterates I had problems in my own child School in pinewoods in a stero great school no issue you know usually no issues and it was an inappropriate video that was shown it was addressed and it was address but luckily I'm I'm on the

200curriculum committee I went to one of the Chiefs who who then had the okay to to act further but a lot of us don't have that frankly I'm pulling back from a lot of extracurricular things I have to work just to keep up inflation I want to be able to trust when I send my kids to school that it's staying neutral and we're getting a little absurd we're talking about blatant things you know however you have to write that policy when when I think about it's blatant it's it's these these flags that aren't the American flag it's it's pretty outspoken just frankly inappropriate things that shouldn't be in the classroom you know where I'm from New Jersey it we're about 20 years ahead of Florida when I say ahead it's in a negative way about

201what's happening in the classroom and I saw the very Beginnings when I was leaving high school and so I would say just it's not easy when people are pushing back of you particular if it's staff but just stay the course it's it's not a as big a dumpster fire it sounds like those are pretty reasonable changes and a just incremental approach that hopefully so parents can have some peace when they go to school certainly there's no book Banning there's no anti-gay law that's more propaganda that's all some of those things are basic things but you could call the law do things how we did them 10 years ago and it would be a reasonable statement and actually I appreciate these folks at least they get up and and act on their beliefs we may disagree

202but they're they're in these curriculum committee meetings and they know we're not paying books I think Lee Lee County maybe maybe one book was taken out of commission most of them the Miller test kept us from doing it and you know I'm not sure what else is coming out at the Tallahassee cuz there's certainly other books that are way too appro inappropriate I'm not really approved by any stretch of the imagination you know but that concludes public comment Dr berer or attorney dupe Bruno is there anything you would like to address regarding public comment just to thank people for coming out and participating in the process thank you for the emails and the constant communication we're sending notes back to you sharing that information with the board and trying to help make the best informed

203decision possible and very briefly Madam chair just to remind everybody we still have laws title two addresses religion title seven will address race and color and national origin title six as well so these laws are still in place and the Civil Rights and Equity guide actually addresses wearing religious necklaces Garb and those types of thing and dresses so it is covered in our civil rights and Equity guide and the only thing I want to really correct very quickly is that no no one can direct the board attorney not one board member can give direction to the board attorney it really has to come up on the dayis and there's a discussion amongst the board members on the day to provide both me and the superintendent Direction and that's what happened in December thank you madam

204chair thank you we are going to postpone good of the order and comments for this evening's Action meeting we will have a student performance tonight starting at 5:45 followed by our Action meeting at 6:00 at this Point having no other business to come before the body and seeing no objection this meeting is adjourned the time is 5:35 p.m. have a great afternoon